Star Wars Discussion Thread v. Rise of Skywalker / Mandalorian (merged)

[lordxizor]

Went to see the 25th anniversary of The Phantom Menace in the theater last night with my two oldest sons. I actually always liked that movie. Not perfect by any means, but still really enjoyable. The lightsaber fight with Maul is the best lightsaver fight in any Star Wars film or show. Also, every time I watch TPM, I am sad that we didn't get three films of Maul being Palpy's apprentice. Such a shame they "killed" him off. Dooku was a stupid replacement.

[TheOutlawXanadu]

Went to see the 25th anniversary of The Phantom Menace in the theater last night with my two oldest sons. I actually always liked that movie. Not perfect by any means, but still really enjoyable. The lightsaber fight with Maul is the best lightsaver fight in any Star Wars film or show. Also, every time I watch TPM, I am sad that we didn't get three films of Maul being Palpy's apprentice. Such a shame they "killed" him off. Dooku was a stupid replacement.

Can you believe it's been 25 years? I remember going to see it as part of a school trip when I was just a kid.

I watched it a few years ago and thought it had its merits but is still ultimately quite dull overall. I feel like it got too much hate originally but the pendulum has perhaps swung a bit too far in the other direction now. I sometimes hear the term "Misunderstood Masterpieces" with regards to the prequels, which I think is a bit much. My opinion is that Phantom Menace has a lot of good ideas but generally mixed execution.

[MirrorMask]

Went to see the 25th anniversary of The Phantom Menace in the theater last night with my two oldest sons. I actually always liked that movie. Not perfect by any means, but still really enjoyable. The lightsaber fight with Maul is the best lightsaver fight in any Star Wars film or show. Also, every time I watch TPM, I am sad that we didn't get three films of Maul being Palpy's apprentice. Such a shame they "killed" him off. Dooku was a stupid replacement.

That was one of my thought as well, as cool was Christopher Lee, it should have been kinda natural that Darth Maul would be the "second bad guy" of the prequel trilogy, the face of the Sith the Jedi would see while Palpatine was working both sides behind everyone's back; they still could have had an awesome duel in Phantom Menace with Maul suffering a tactical defeat and escaping somehow, and eventually he could have been the one to be killed at the beginning of Revenge of the Sith.

I understand that, for the political side of the story, a more refined character like Dooku was needed, Maul was just a thug and a brute enforcer, but there could have been ways to tell that kind of story and have Maul survive. It would be a natural progression - Anakin defeats Maul, one of the villains of the prequel trilogy, and then takes his place as Palpatine's apprentice and becomes the villain of the prequel trilogy.

[gmillerdrake]

That was one of my thought as well, as cool was Christopher Lee, it should have been kinda natural that Darth Maul would be the "second bad guy" of the prequel trilogy, the face of the Sith the Jedi would see while Palpatine was working both sides behind everyone's back; they still could have had an awesome duel in Phantom Menace with Maul suffering a tactical defeat and escaping somehow, and eventually he could have been the one to be killed at the beginning of Revenge of the Sith.

I understand that, for the political side of the story, a more refined character like Dooku was needed, Maul was just a thug and a brute enforcer, but there could have been ways to tell that kind of story and have Maul survive. It would be a natural progression - Anakin defeats Maul, one of the villains of the prequel trilogy, and then takes his place as Palpatine's apprentice and becomes the villain of the prequel trilogy.

Especially given that the lore has now changed a bit with the content from TCW's where we've learned that Dooku wasn't really 'all in' on the Sith thing anyway. He was using the Emperor as much as the Emperor was using him.

[hefdaddy42]

We watched Star Wars and The Empire Strikes Back on the Fourth.  So good.

[gmillerdrake]

I'm sure some or most of you have seen that SC38 Reimagined duel between Kenobi and Vader.....if not, the link is below. It's really well done.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=to2SMng4u1k

[lordxizor]

Especially given that the lore has now changed a bit with the content from TCW's where we've learned that Dooku wasn't really 'all in' on the Sith thing anyway. He was using the Emperor as much as the Emperor was using him.

All that certainly makes Dooku a more interesting character, but none of that was in the movies. He was fairly dull in what we got.

[ProfessorPeart]

Always wondered who voiced Hemlock in Bad Batch as the character has a voice you just want to punch. So smug. Looked it up and I cannot believe that Jimmi Simpson voices him. Talk about a surprise. Sounds absolutely nothing like him.

[gmillerdrake]

Watched ‘Tales of the Empire’. It was alright. Good to see Barriss Offee get a redemption arc and curious to see if there is anything further on that front moving forward either in animation or Live action.

But a massive eye roll in the second to last episode with the ‘choice’ of terminology when discussing a fallen Jedi. Disney just can’t help themselves….. got to get those PC and woke points.

[lonestar]

Acolyte time...

[gmillerdrake]

Acolyte time...

Yep…..will be doing this in about half hour.

[gmillerdrake]

Not bad at all. I’m digging the light saber-less fight scenes.

[faizoff]

That opening fight scene was awesome. I loved the fight choreography, it felt so natural and high stakes. It's got more Andor feel to it than Ahsoka. So far the two episodes have been great.

[lonestar]

Outstanding first two episodes... just love it.

[NoseofNicko]

Really liked the first 2 episodes.

Already seeing a lot of "woke garbage" comments most likely by people who haven’t even watched it unfortunately… 1/10 is also the most voted rating on IMDb.

[BlackInk]

Yeah, people making a whole career about complaining about everything being "woke" all the time (particularly on youtube) is really starting to get on my nerves. I even get it sometimes, it can be a bit silly, but then I get over it. Some people are just obsessed to the point where it seems like it's the only thing they can think about, and is the lense through which they filter everything they watch until they force themselves to see it everywhere.

I'm curious about The Acolyte. I'll start it later today.

[The Realm]

Watched first 2 episodes of The Acolyte. Really enjoyed it overall and will keep watching. I wouldn't say it was great but it was intriguing and did enough to get me interested in where the show is going to go. I hope it continues to build on this set up as the potential is there but I'm also a little worried it could go down hill fast...

[soupytwist]

Yeah, people making a whole career about complaining about everything being "woke" all the time (particularly on youtube) is really starting to get on my nerves. I even get it sometimes, it can be a bit silly, but then I get over it. Some people are just obsessed to the point where it seems like it's the only thing they can think about, and is the lense through which they filter everything they watch until they force themselves to see it everywhere.

Yeah I completely agree with this.

[gmillerdrake]

Yeah, people making a whole career about complaining about everything being "woke" all the time (particularly on youtube) is really starting to get on my nerves. I even get it sometimes, it can be a bit silly, but then I get over it. Some people are just obsessed to the point where it seems like it's the only thing they can think about, and is the lense through which they filter everything they watch until they force themselves to see it everywhere.

I'm curious about The Acolyte. I'll start it later today.

I liked the episodes so I refrained from ‘going there’ but there is an argument to be made toward the point. Especially when the director/show runner and lead actress for the series continue to make the comments they’re making.


You can’t look at the SW’s content from that past ten years and not see that there is a specific point and angle they are taking.

[BlackInk]

Yeah I totally get it. I roll my eyes at that stuff too, and it can affect immersion to varying degrees. I have no problem in principle with people taking issue with it, or even not wanting to watch or support it on the basis of it. What I just don't usually have any patience for are those people who really revel in hating the projects and who seem so genuinly and gleefully spiteful and bitter to the point that they actively celebrate setbacks in the project. Not liking that modern 21st century American social justice values are affecting the immersion of your ancient-alien-galaxy-fantasy franchise is fine in my opinion, but if ALL someone talks about is the behind-the-scenes politics of said franchise, and with a constant tone of pure spite, it just makes me not want to listen to that person.

On some level, I even understand those people. That bitter instinct can come out in all of us, me included, especially when you care. I just don't like when it happens, or like watching it happen in others.

[lonestar]

So what is supposedly 'woke' about The Acolyte?

[Adami]

So what is supposedly 'woke' about The Acolyte?

Haven't seen it yet, but I'd imagine, on some level, anything that isn't mostly starring white men is going to be labelled "woke."

[BlackInk]

Just saw the first two episodes and yeah that's about the only "woke" I detected 

Enjoyed the episodes, feels like the world of the prequels but with better writing. I also like that the force itself seems to be more of a presence and a focus in this show. That's interesting.

[gmillerdrake]

So what is supposedly 'woke' about The Acolyte?

If you're really wanting to dig into it just google the showrunner/director and read any of her interviews and comments.....and I guess the lead actress is now making interesting comments as well. I'd go into it but honestly don't have the energy for the conversation. You and I and Adami and the others could probably write each others sentences on it all at this point. 

As for the show....first two episodes were cool so I'm fine with it....but even this last series....Tales of the Empire....had a few scenes that had dialogue that was eye rolling with the force fed agenda crap. If it doesn't get to Star Trek Discovery level I can ignore it but Disney is no stranger to 'woke'.

[countoftuscany42]

Saw the first two episodes on the big screen at the El Capitan in Hollywood on Monday, really fun experience.  Great reaction from the crowd; applause when Carrie-Anne Moss appeared, cheering at moments during fights, nice loud "woo!" when they dropped the classic "I've got a bad feeling about this"

Plus it was a free event to rsvp for, with free popcorn and soda included, and everyone was handed a poster on the way out 

Going into these episodes felt the most like it did when Mando season 1 was first starting compared to the shows that have followed: uncharted territory for the franchise (first live action series vs first live action high republic).  I've enjoyed all of the live action series even when moments or creative decisions are underwhelming, but this is a show where I feel they could really surprise us with something unique by the time it's done since it's an era of Star Wars I've had zero connection to until now

[Cool Chris]

Haven't seen it yet, but I'd imagine, on some level, anything that isn't mostly starring white men is going to be labelled "woke."

True, just like anything that features an all-white cast is labelled "racist."

The creative forces behind this have made their intentions clear. Whether that affects anyone's enjoyment of it is obviously up to them.

[lonestar]

I have never seen a show with all white cast called racist, and I hang around some really granola crunching circles. That's gotta be some purely made up shit man.

[Cool Chris]

I may have overstepped myself, but I distinctly remember Friends taking heat a few years back, and that popped in to my head when I posted earlier.

https://www.latimes.com/entertainment-arts/tv/story/2022-06-29/friends-diversity-marta-kauffman-brandeis-university

“As a fan myself, I know how frustrating some Star Wars storytelling in the past has been.

Maybe I am out of line, but it seems clear she isn't just talking about poor screenwriting.

[jingle.boy]

Haven't read any of the behind the scenes comments, but if the content of the show (diverse races, and reference to Osha/Mae's "mothers"), people ought to give their head a shake.

[Stadler]

Yeah, people making a whole career about complaining about everything being "woke" all the time (particularly on youtube) is really starting to get on my nerves. I even get it sometimes, it can be a bit silly, but then I get over it. Some people are just obsessed to the point where it seems like it's the only thing they can think about, and is the lense through which they filter everything they watch until they force themselves to see it everywhere.

I'm curious about The Acolyte. I'll start it later today.

Sorry for the non-Star Wars intrusion here, but that's not just "woke"; that's the majority of issues in the socio-political realm, at least in America.   [Some celebrity] ordered an English muffin instead of a bagel? ANTI-SEMITE!   [Another celebrity] hailed a taxi with his right arm raised?  FASCIST NAZI! Those are the things that get a reaction on social media.

[Stadler]

I have never seen a show with all white cast called racist, and I hang around some really granola crunching circles. That's gotta be some purely made up shit man.

Friends is WIDELY criticized for just that.

[lonestar]

Friends is WIDELY criticized for just that.

Never seen it once myself, granted Friends is a stupid show so I avoided anything about it to begin with.


You would think, with the amount of time I spend in highly biased liberal social media I would've seen some of this WIDE criticism....

[Stadler]

Haven't read any of the behind the scenes comments, but if the content of the show (diverse races, and reference to Osha/Mae's "mothers"), people ought to give their head a shake.

Did you skip over the "then"?   If what?


So what IS the relationship to the Star Wars universe here?  I read this thread diligently, but honestly, I checked out long ago with the actual content (that's nothing to do with "woke", by the way).  The season of the Mandalorian with Luke's appearance is the last fresh Star Wars content I've watched. 

[Stadler]

Never seen it once myself, granted Friends is a stupid show so I avoided anything about it to begin with.

If we meet, we at least have another non-controversial topic to talk about. Except for having a massive crush on Lisa Kudrow, I'm right there with you for the most part.   

[lonestar]

Cheers was the last sit Com I enjoyed in any fashion. They're all just dumb to me.