2022 NFL Thread (Chiefs win Super Bowl 57)

[El Barto]

Bench clearing brawl. I can understand that San Francisco is frustrated, but that was just so classless.

Reminded me of the Seahawks after Malcolm Butler's interception. Seriously, I considered Pete Carroll's inability to control his team a more egregious blunder than the quick slant. That's what locked the game. 

[El Barto]

Patrick Mahomes is a better Quarterback than Tom Brady ever was and those who can't accept it simply have trouble discerning between "ability" and "accomplishment".

Mahomes is certainly more athletic, and it's easy for athleticism to make QB play look all the better. I have no reason right now to assume that Mahomes can actually do what Brady was doing for most of his career, which is adjusting every single play on the fly, from blocking assignments to route trees based on what he's seeing out there. It's also what made Manning great. What made Brady so fearsome in the 4th quarter was that he'd seen what you were up to for the first three, and he's learned how to exploit what you'd done. It's certainly possible that PM reaches a level where he can do that, but it's just as, if not more likely that his ability to morph plays stops at turning every play into a rollout and off-balance left handed miracle.

This isn't a knock on Mahomes, BTW. He's very definitely got playmaking ability beyond anything TB ever had, but in the long run I think TB's skillset was better and more productive.

[billboy73]

If Johnson is out, McCaffrey might be an upgrade at QB 

As soon as Purdy demonstrated that he couldn't grip a ball, much less throw one, McCaffrey was an easy call that they whiffed on. Just having Purdy out there to hand off every single play made them completely predictable. While nobody wants to have to do it, at least having a RB as your starting QB provides some unpredictability. There's at least the possiblity that he tries to throw the ball downfield, and he can probably complete 10 yard passes. Purdy with no hand strength was never going to.

That said, they clearly wanted their two best offensive weapons remaining at their positions. That's very understandable. That's also a failure of planning. It wouldn't have occurred to me before, but you shouldn't have one of your weapons as your E-QB. Live and learn.

I think they should have done this just to have an extra blocker on the field.  Purdy wasn't going to throw or do anything but hand the ball off.  They should have just gone with CMC as the wildcat if they were going to run the whole time, as the Eagles had stacked the box anyway.  Yeah, he could've thrown some too, what do you have to lose.  I don't think they were coming back anyway.

[El Barto]

If Johnson is out, McCaffrey might be an upgrade at QB 

As soon as Purdy demonstrated that he couldn't grip a ball, much less throw one, McCaffrey was an easy call that they whiffed on. Just having Purdy out there to hand off every single play made them completely predictable. While nobody wants to have to do it, at least having a RB as your starting QB provides some unpredictability. There's at least the possiblity that he tries to throw the ball downfield, and he can probably complete 10 yard passes. Purdy with no hand strength was never going to.

That said, they clearly wanted their two best offensive weapons remaining at their positions. That's very understandable. That's also a failure of planning. It wouldn't have occurred to me before, but you shouldn't have one of your weapons as your E-QB. Live and learn.

I think they should have done this just to have an extra blocker on the field.  Purdy wasn't going to throw or do anything but hand the ball off.  They should have just gone with CMC as the wildcat if they were going to run the whole time, as the Eagles had stacked the box anyway.  Yeah, he could've thrown some too, what do you have to lose.  I don't think they were coming back anyway.

Good point about the extra blocker.  I think there was a failure to recognize when it was time for desperation, and therefore a move into the wildly unconventional. I'm not suggesting that they could have won that way, but Phili really wasn't playing all that well, and they may have been able to move the ball a little bit. They were completely inept with number 4 in there, and it only got worse when he was replaced by Mr. Handoff. They needed to try something different. 

[Skeever]

Yeah, that was disappointing. There was really no contingency for, "what if Purdy goes down?"
Even the Jets, who were on QB2 or 3 depending on how you looked at it, had that in the wretched TNF game against the Jags. The came out in the 4th Quarter with the Streveler package. It didn't work, but it did provide some kind of spark. The Niners just seemed like they'd been defeated mentally long before Johnson even went out.

[bosk1]

I get what you both are saying, but the thing is, there just weren't really a lot of other options.  Most teams just don't have more than 3 QBs on roster.  SF was down to #3 with Purdy and had to made a late season acquisition to pick up Johnson.  The fact that it was Johnson should indicate that the available options weren't great. 

As far as whether to put CMC in as a QB, I can't really knock the decision they made.  Yeah, he's the emergency QB.  But taking a guy who isn't used to taking plays at the QB position and putting him there against a ferocious Philly D that has already knocked out two QBs in that game could have put CMC in an unnecessary position of vulnerability to a long-term injury.  I get pulling out all the stops to try to get the championship game win.  But with the deck stacked against them that badly, choosing to not put a longterm superstar at risk for almost no possibility of a good outcome isn't really wise. 

[Dublagent66]

I've always despised the Eagles as a division rival for years.  However, Jalen Hurts is the epitome of leadership, class and humility.  He doesn't even need to put up monster stats for his team to dominate.  They sure have rallied around this kid and it shows.

[bosk1]

Just watched the "bench clearing brawl" (I had tuned out by that point, so didn't see it live).  Can't agree at all with the "classless thug" comments.  Not even a little.  There were a few things going on that led up to that.  First was Aiuk getting slammed to the ground after the whistle by Johnson (which wasn't called), and then Johnson dives on top of him as well (also wasn't called).  Then Juszczyk and Samuel come over to separate the two, and then Wallace comes flying in, grabs Samuel's facemask, and starts swinging him around.  Like it or not, a lineman in those situations is coming to step and in try to defend his guys.  That's clearly what Williams was doing.  Yeah, he eventually crosses the line when he slams Wallace, and while that's wrong, it wasn't unprovoked or done in a vaccuum at all.  And he didn't slam him head first, dive on him, or do anything to indicate he was looking to injure or to prolong the confrontation after tossing Wallace off of his guy.  I don't disagree with Williams' ejection, but I don't lose even a little bit of respect for Williams in that situation.  That was not a "thug move" by any stretch. 

I've always despised the Eagles as a division rival for years.  However, Jalen Hurts is the epitome of leadership, class and humility.  He doesn't even need to put up monster stats for his team to dominate.  They sure have rallied around this kid and it shows.

Agreed.  (well, mostly--I wouldn't necessarily agree that he is the epitome of humility, but I'm right with you on the rest of it)

[Skeever]

A guy who has on several occasions quoted John 13:7 in reference to himself is definitely not the picture of "humility" that comes to my mind.

[El Barto]

I get what you both are saying, but the thing is, there just weren't really a lot of other options.  Most teams just don't have more than 3 QBs on roster.  SF was down to #3 with Purdy and had to made a late season acquisition to pick up Johnson.  The fact that it was Johnson should indicate that the available options weren't great. 

As far as whether to put CMC in as a QB, I can't really knock the decision they made.  Yeah, he's the emergency QB.  But taking a guy who isn't used to taking plays at the QB position and putting him there against a ferocious Philly D that has already knocked out two QBs in that game could have put CMC in an unnecessary position of vulnerability to a long-term injury.  I get pulling out all the stops to try to get the championship game win.  But with the deck stacked against them that badly, choosing to not put a longterm superstar at risk for almost no possibility of a good outcome isn't really wise.

The lack of foresight I referred to was not having a viable option as your emergency quarterback if you're not willing to play McCafferty.

And I don't buy the risk thing. Was having him run into an 8 man box every single play good for his health? Assuming you don't have Tom Tupa as your punter you can still look for better options. Or, they could have just taken a knee every down and bowed out gracefully with no risk to anybody.

[King Postwhore]

I get what you both are saying, but the thing is, there just weren't really a lot of other options.  Most teams just don't have more than 3 QBs on roster.  SF was down to #3 with Purdy and had to made a late season acquisition to pick up Johnson.  The fact that it was Johnson should indicate that the available options weren't great. 

As far as whether to put CMC in as a QB, I can't really knock the decision they made.  Yeah, he's the emergency QB.  But taking a guy who isn't used to taking plays at the QB position and putting him there against a ferocious Philly D that has already knocked out two QBs in that game could have put CMC in an unnecessary position of vulnerability to a long-term injury.  I get pulling out all the stops to try to get the championship game win.  But with the deck stacked against them that badly, choosing to not put a longterm superstar at risk for almost no possibility of a good outcome isn't really wise.

The lack of foresight I referred to was not having a viable option as your emergency quarterback if you're not willing to play McCafferty.

And I don't buy the risk thing. Was having him run into an 8 man box every single play good for his health? Assuming you don't have Tom Tupa as your punter you can still look for better options. Or, they could have just taken a knee every down and bowed out gracefully with no risk to anybody.

You could have gone with Danny White as well.   

[Dublagent66]

A guy who has on several occasions quoted John 13:7 in reference to himself is definitely not the picture of "humility" that comes to my mind.

I'm not really interested in people's religious beliefs.  Personally, I'd rather players not mention the bible or God at all.  I'm talking about his demeanor in press conferences and interviews related to sportsmanship and the relationship he has with the team.  Humility in this context means he doesn't feel the need to boast about how good his team is.

[El Barto]

I get what you both are saying, but the thing is, there just weren't really a lot of other options.  Most teams just don't have more than 3 QBs on roster.  SF was down to #3 with Purdy and had to made a late season acquisition to pick up Johnson.  The fact that it was Johnson should indicate that the available options weren't great. 

As far as whether to put CMC in as a QB, I can't really knock the decision they made.  Yeah, he's the emergency QB.  But taking a guy who isn't used to taking plays at the QB position and putting him there against a ferocious Philly D that has already knocked out two QBs in that game could have put CMC in an unnecessary position of vulnerability to a long-term injury.  I get pulling out all the stops to try to get the championship game win.  But with the deck stacked against them that badly, choosing to not put a longterm superstar at risk for almost no possibility of a good outcome isn't really wise.

The lack of foresight I referred to was not having a viable option as your emergency quarterback if you're not willing to play McCafferty.

And I don't buy the risk thing. Was having him run into an 8 man box every single play good for his health? Assuming you don't have Tom Tupa as your punter you can still look for better options. Or, they could have just taken a knee every down and bowed out gracefully with no risk to anybody.

You could have gone with Danny White as well.   

Danny was a good quarterback who happened to also be a pretty good punter. He was always the backup QB, and started for eight seasons when Roger retired. Tupa was a punter who played QB in college. Danny is oft overlooked, which is a real shame. He was injury prone, but when he started he fared pretty well. He went 62-30, had 4 10+ win seasons, a trip to the pro bowl, and only had one losing season--his final, after the wheels had completely fallen off. He's known for the novelty aspect, which overshadows his career as a QB.

[bosk1]

The lack of foresight I referred to was not having a viable option as your emergency quarterback if you're not willing to play McCafferty.

OK, but "having a viable option" from where?  As I mentioned, I don't think there was a viable option from outside the organization.  And freeing up a roster spot to have picked up another backup QB in addition to Johnson wasn't really feasible because they had limited options for being able to designate players to IR to free up a roster spot, etc., due to earlier season injuries and moves they had to make earlier on, which used up a lot of those spots. 

And if you mean having someone else from within the organization being ready, that's also problematic for a number of reasons.  QB isn't just a "plug-and-play" position in today's NFL, obviously.  Players already devote an enormous amount of time to maximizing their abilities at their own positions (and for a select few, maybe some closely-related positions as well).  Learning to play QB competently is beyond the reach of most players who don't play that position regularly.  Yeah, maybe you get a back or a receiver that can come in and run a small handful of trick plays they have run in practice.  But running an offense for an entire game and all that entails?  I just don't think it's realistic to expect that and prepare for that contingency. 

In retrospect, it's easy to say that Kyle gambled and lost.  But CMC was their fifth QB on the season.  Having to choose to rely on him for a whole game in the QB role in the NFC championship and beyond is such a longshot, and if there are stats on such things, I would guess is pretty near unprecedented.  I can't call that a "lack of foresight." 

And I don't buy the risk thing. Was having him run into an 8 man box every single play good for his health? Assuming you don't have Tom Tupa as your punter you can still look for better options. Or, they could have just taken a knee every down and bowed out gracefully with no risk to anybody.

Not trying to persuade you, but just to explain why I think that way:  I think having someone who isn't used to playing QB is much worse than having him run into an 8 man box every play.  When you've played a given position all your life and instinctively know what the hits feel like, where they are coming from, etc., you know instinctively how to protect yourself as best you can.  That goes out the window when you are suddenly thrust into a completely different position and now have those defensive lineman coming at you from different angles, coming from your blind side, coming at you when you are standing in the pocket as opposed to running at them full speed and delivering a hit yourself, and any number of other issues.  So, yeah, I think he is "safer" running the ball than being the play caller, if given the option.  And that's the thing--they had the option.  The calculus is different if, say, Purdy gets taken out on a stretcher and they don't actually have a play caller.  Who knows?  Maybe Kyle gets asked that very same question and says, "Nah, the risk factor wasn't really an issue--I just thought this gave us a better chance than the other way around."  That's fine.  I'm just throwing it out there that, to me, that seems like it would be a valid consideration.

[King Postwhore]

El Barto. Oh I remember. I'd say 77 was my NFL awakening at 9 years old. Dallas vs. Denver.  Staubach vs. Morton.

[El Barto]

The lack of foresight I referred to was not having a viable option as your emergency quarterback if you're not willing to play McCafferty.

OK, but "having a viable option" from where?  As I mentioned, I don't think there was a viable option from outside the organization.  And freeing up a roster spot to have picked up another backup QB in addition to Johnson wasn't really feasible because they had limited options for being able to designate players to IR to free up a roster spot, etc., due to earlier season injuries and moves they had to make earlier on, which used up a lot of those spots. 

And if you mean having someone else from within the organization being ready, that's also problematic for a number of reasons.  QB isn't just a "plug-and-play" position in today's NFL, obviously.  Players already devote an enormous amount of time to maximizing their abilities at their own positions (and for a select few, maybe some closely-related positions as well).  Learning to play QB competently is beyond the reach of most players who don't play that position regularly.  Yeah, maybe you get a back or a receiver that can come in and run a small handful of trick plays they have run in practice.  But running an offense for an entire game and all that entails?  I just don't think it's realistic to expect that and prepare for that contingency. 

In retrospect, it's easy to say that Kyle gambled and lost.  But CMC was their fifth QB on the season.  Having to choose to rely on him for a whole game in the QB role in the NFC championship and beyond is such a longshot, and if there are stats on such things, I would guess is pretty near unprecedented.  I can't call that a "lack of foresight." 

And I don't buy the risk thing. Was having him run into an 8 man box every single play good for his health? Assuming you don't have Tom Tupa as your punter you can still look for better options. Or, they could have just taken a knee every down and bowed out gracefully with no risk to anybody.

Not trying to persuade you, but just to explain why I think that way:  I think having someone who isn't used to playing QB is much worse than having him run into an 8 man box every play.  When you've played a given position all your life and instinctively know what the hits feel like, where they are coming from, etc., you know instinctively how to protect yourself as best you can.  That goes out the window when you are suddenly thrust into a completely different position and now have those defensive lineman coming at you from different angles, coming from your blind side, coming at you when you are standing in the pocket as opposed to running at them full speed and delivering a hit yourself, and any number of other issues.  So, yeah, I think he is "safer" running the ball than being the play caller, if given the option.  And that's the thing--they had the option.  The calculus is different if, say, Purdy gets taken out on a stretcher and they don't actually have a play caller.  Who knows?  Maybe Kyle gets asked that very same question and says, "Nah, the risk factor wasn't really an issue--I just thought this gave us a better chance than the other way around."  That's fine.  I'm just throwing it out there that, to me, that seems like it would be a valid consideration.

It's certainly an interesting thing to speculate. And to be fair, I'm not saying they would have won. You never really know, though. I didn't really think the Eagles D played all that well, save for the play that knocked Purdy out. What I do think is that at some point you have to plan for the what-ifs, and one of those is that you might need to plug in your emergency quarterback some day.* Obviously that's where you dumb things down a lot, but you still have some plays and some schemes you can run. Plays and schemes, mind you, that the D will also be completely unfamiliar with. Of course their number 5 receiver isn't going to be able to run the whole playbook. They should have made sure that he could run some plays, though. Hell, go nuts and run the wishbone. Make their D play against something they haven't seen since Pop Warner. You at least open the door for freak occurrences that up until then had only gone Phili's way. And at that point they really didn't have anything at all to lose.


*One of my favourite YT channels is a gun guy. In a video about shooting under stressful situations he made the point that you cannot train for every single scenario; there are simply too many of them. Repeatedly training to cross draw and chamber a round with your non-dominant hand isn't really feasible. You at least learn how to do it, though, even if you're far from proficient. If somebody shoots your right hand off, knowing what to do next and sucking at it is far better than not having a clue what to do next. It just seemed like dumping the playbook to accommodate an emergency QB is something they'd never even considered before.

[Nick]

Been feeling since yesterday I got so excited for an NFC Championship game and it never happened. Got a quarter of football and then just had to watch a slow moving inevitable trainwreck that ended with the Eagles in the Super Bowl. Even if the Niners lost, I was hoping for a good game between two great teams. Instead, two injuries later it was just over.

Eagles are in a pretty interesting situation. They haven't in my mind played a real game since Jan. 1. After that we had...

Final game of the regular season where Giants played as few starters as possible.
Bye week
First game of the playoffs where the Giants played their starters but were still awful by comparison and the game was a blowout.
NFC Championship quarter where they could sit back after the QB injuries.
And then another week off.

On one hand, they might be a bit rusty, on the other it should be one of the overall healthiest and well rested squads to ever see a Super Bowl.

[pg1067]

El Barto. Oh I remember. I'd say 77 was my NFL awakening at 9 years old. Dallas vs. Denver.  Staubach vs. Morton.

Norris Weese FTW!  That game was a depressing ending to the first season I followed football (around the same age).

[bosk1]

Been feeling since yesterday I got so excited for an NFC Championship game and it never happened. Got a quarter of football and then just had to watch a slow moving inevitable trainwreck that ended with the Eagles in the Super Bowl. Even if the Niners lost, I was hoping for a good game between two great teams. Instead, two injuries later it was just over.

Eagles are in a pretty interesting situation. They haven't in my mind played a real game since Jan. 1. After that we had...

Final game of the regular season where Giants played as few starters as possible.
Bye week
First game of the playoffs where the Giants played their starters but were still awful by comparison and the game was a blowout.
NFC Championship quarter where they could sit back after the QB injuries.
And then another week off.

On one hand, they might be a bit rusty, on the other it should be one of the overall healthiest and well rested squads to ever see a Super Bowl.

Either way, it isn't a Super Bowl I am interested in watching.  Just bought my ticket to Cancun. 

[Samsara]

Such a shame about Purdy. I think the kid is going to be the Niners' starting QB for a long time. If he gets surgery in the next couple of weeks, he should be back up to full strength by the end of training camp. Trey Lance has an opportunity to step back in and reclaim the job. Niners fans are no doubt feeling down about what happened, but the future is bright.

As for me, I'm treading the QB talk. I hate everyone mentioned not named Lamar Jackson, Mike White, or Gardner Minshew.

[KevShmev]

I blame the first TD on Shanahan (you have to throw the flag once you see the WR who made the "catch" signaling for them to get to the line quickly), but the officials not seeing the ball dropped in real time is egregious.  Tough to see, I get it, but that's their f'ing job.

Seriously, dude? The fucking networks with their 27 cameras didn't even get us a decent angle until after the commercial break. And a referee's job is to monitor a dozen things on every single play. When the NFL R&D department provides all of their refs with X-Ray specs then maybe I'll agree with you, but at this point the harping on referees is just getting silly.

Turns out that one of the electives in the DISD curriculum is "group sports officiating." That's a marvelous idea. Given the percentage of people who grow up up to be sports fans I'm starting to wonder if it shouldn't be a required course.  Aside from the valuable life lessons of fairness, deescalation, multitasking, and countless others, it'd be good for people to get an idea of how tough it must be.

Is it possible that I am so jaded by awful officiating overall that I do not feel like giving them the benefit of the doubt when they miss a big call?  Of course.  That said, yes, they have a dozen things to monitor every play, but I would think one of them close to the play is watching the ball when the receiver is attempting a catch it and going to the ground.  Consider this: the official who called a catch must have seen it as a catch, right?  You can't call it a catch if you think he caught it; you need to be sure.  And if he got a good enough look, that means he totally missed it coming loose and hitting the ground and moving before Smith regained control of it.

Now, I will repeat that I think Shanahan has to wear the clown hat on that one, though.  You have to throw a challenge flag there.  The fact that the Eagles were hurrying to the line to get a play off just screamed, "We are not sure if our guy caught the ball," so Shanahan doing nothing meant his team went down 7-0 shortly thereafter instead of getting a big stop and getting the ball around midfield early in the game following a big 4th down stop.  It was the first half, when timeouts are less valuable, so you have to throw the challenge flag there.

[pg1067]

Is it possible that I am so jaded by awful officiating overall that I do not feel like giving them the benefit of the doubt when they miss a big call?  Of course.  That said, yes, they have a dozen things to monitor every play, but I would think one of them close to the play is watching the ball when the receiver is attempting a catch it and going to the ground.  Consider this: the official who called a catch must have seen it as a catch, right?  You can't call it a catch if you think he caught it; you need to be sure.  And if he got a good enough look, that means he totally missed it coming loose and hitting the ground and moving before Smith regained control of it.

Now, I will repeat that I think Shanahan has to wear the clown hat on that one, though.  You have to throw a challenge flag there.  The fact that the Eagles were hurrying to the line to get a play off just screamed, "We are not sure if our guy caught the ball," so Shanahan doing nothing meant his team went down 7-0 shortly thereafter instead of getting a big stop and getting the ball around midfield early in the game following a big 4th down stop.  It was the first half, when timeouts are less valuable, so you have to throw the challenge flag there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=igf91J_jy48

The catch took place on the left sideline.  The closest official was the field judge, who was positioned out of bounds.  He was the guy who initially made the call because, from his viewpoint, it appeared to be a catch.  The camera that showed the ball hitting the ground was on the opposite side of the field - i.e., a completely different point of view.  The initial replays, which showed what the field judge saw, showed nothing that would indicate it wasn't a catch because that point of view was screened by the receiver's body (and the fact that the bobble happened in real time and the FJ had no ability to slow-mo the play).  Even the endzone camera replay (shown around the 50-second mark of the video) didn't show any issue.  It took a minute and a half to find the replay that showed the ball hitting the ground.

The only official who had a chance of seeing the ball touching the ground was the back judge.  The back judge is positioned in the middle of the field about 30 yards downfield.
 In this case, the back judge would have been right around the 5-yard line at the start of the play.  In this case, Smith first got his hand on the ball around the 10-yard line.  If you pause the video around the 5-second mark, you'll see that the field judge is in perfect position, and he's the only official in the picture.  You can see all the way to the hashmarks, which are about 25 yards from the sideline, and the back judge is not in the picture.  Where is he?  His job, once he reads that it's a pass play is to go to the #2 or #3 receiver,* which, in this case, was not Smith.  Once the ball is in the air, the back judge runs toward where the pass is thrown.  In this case, he obviously was not close enough to see the ball hit the ground (coupled with the fact that he was probably running at the time of the catch).

Bottom line is that the officials did exactly what they're supposed to do, and there are just some plays that are going to squeeze through the cracks.  Maybe put a second back judge on the field?

As far as Shanahan, I guess you could throw the challenge flag, but are you really going to do that based on a receiver doing something that Shanahan didn't necessarily know the meaning of?  Rushing to the line to hurry up could mean any number of things.  Shanahan was WAY too far away to have seen the ball hit the ground, and no one in his ear was telling him it wasn't a good catch.  The safety (#29) signaled no catch and pointed to the ground, but he was hardly emphatic.  Defensive backs do that sort of thing on virtually every play.  Obviously, in hindsight, he should have done it, but potentially burning one of his two challenges on what, at the time, seemed like a non-controversial catch, five minutes into a scoreless game doesn't make a ton of sense to me.

* - https://operations.nfl.com/officiating/the-officials/officials-responsibilities-positions/

[El Barto]

So the refs are ass-clowns because they missed something 10' away when they had a band angle, and Shanahan is an ass-clown because he didn't challenge something that happened 30 yards away, from the same bad angle?

Also, now that you mentioned it, if I'm some clever bastard head coach always looking for ways to gain an advantage, I'm training my players to only haul ass to get the play off if they're certain it's a catch. I'm looking to make some lesser coach burn a challenge/timeout for no damn reason so I can laugh at him from the other side of the field. 

[KevShmev]

Exactly. 

[Skeever]

So the refs are ass-clowns because they missed something 10' away when they had a band angle, and Shanahan is an ass-clown because he didn't challenge something that happened 30 yards away, from the same bad angle?

Also, now that you mentioned it, if I'm some clever bastard head coach always looking for ways to gain an advantage, I'm training my players to only haul ass to get the play off if they're certain it's a catch. I'm looking to make some lesser coach burn a challenge/timeout for no damn reason so I can laugh at him from the other side of the field. 

Something they talk about on Around the NFL seems to be resonating.
Guys up in the booth are watching the broadcast, and on more than a few occasions, it seems like they coach has gone with whatever the commentator says. In this case, Greg Olsen said it was a "great catch". You gotta wonder if, instead he says, "I don't know about that one", Harbaugh decides to throw the red flag.

Anyway, not enough props to Philly for how damn quick they got that next play off. That was skill. I've seen teams with way more to lose hussle way less.

[King Postwhore]

I think that's silly.  The only reason they can't fully review is time constraints which leads to my point, replay is useless.  HD TV has made fans insane. 

[hefdaddy42]

I think that's silly.  The only reason they can't fully review is time constraints which leads to my point, replay is useless.  HD TV has made fans insane.

A sizable portion of the fanbase has always been insane.

[King Postwhore]

I think that's silly.  The only reason they can't fully review is time constraints which leads to my point, replay is useless.  HD TV has made fans insane.

A sizable portion of the fanbase has always been insane.

It's like throwing a match on gasoline.

[Skeever]

I think that's silly.  The only reason they can't fully review is time constraints which leads to my point, replay is useless.  HD TV has made fans insane.

What's silly about it?

Coach is on the field. Coordinators are up in the box, with the game on TV. Coach doesn't get a good look at the play. Coach asks the coordinators up in the box, "what are you seeing on TV?" The right angle - or statement - on TV could easily make the difference in the decision on whether the coach throws that flag or not.

It's very similar to those jumbotron replays.

[King Postwhore]

I was not clear enough.  An announcer says its a great catch so it influences the coaching staff in the box?  No coach would be influenced by the announcers.  The just didn't have the time to see different angles. You're not silly, the talking heads saying that are. 

[Dream Team]

Non-controversial commentary!

I really do feel bad for the Niners players and their fans. Such a great, complete team but constantly snakebit by QB injuries. But Kyle Shanahan can get bent; may he be forever cursed to get close but never get a ring as penance for the 28-3 debacle.

The Chiefs were driving with about 2:30 left in the 4th quarter when they got called for Offensive Holding. That should have cost them the game right there. There's NO WAY the refs call that if there is some kind of fix in for KC. Come on. Fortunately Burrow sucked again when he got the ball back and then the Bengals bungled as they tend to.

Here's a weird trend that I'm sure Burrow will break at some point, but going back to the 1994 season no QB who lost his first Super Bowl ever got back. Burrow I think will break that curse, he's just too good. But of course, he's gonna get paid soon and so that means the team will have to make decisions with their roster.

Cowherd with the best, honest take as usual on Pat's game. He referred quite a bit (along with Sean Payton) to Pat's intelligence but of course as a black quarterback he'll never be given credit for that. But talent, resilience, leadership, he's got it all. No run game. Three of his receivers knocked out. Kelce limited with back spasms. Going against a better D on a gimpy leg. Not bad.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55YniVJ_654

As he points out again so people understand the difference, greatest talent doesn't mean he'll have the greatest career. Brady's had the greatest career and that will unlikely ever be challenged. But come one, 5 years as a starter, 5 years at home in the Championship Game with 3 wins, 2 MVPs, always dragging average or below average Ds. The kid deserves a little credit for that.

In checking the various fan boards, I notice that NE fans are way over the top to a sociopathic level over Hitler Mahomes getting the W - WAY more vitriolic than the Bengals boards. Wrap your head around that. 90% or Cinci fans are like "yup we got beat, but we'll be back".

Burrow had been 3-0 "against" Mahomes. He owns him! Oh but wait Burrow is 1-4 "against" Mayfield/Brissett of the Browns. Pay no attention to that, it doesn't mean anything! So silly but the fact that that kind of "analysis" has legs tells you that the average NFL fan has no interest in deep thinking unfortunately.

Now of course as a reward Pat gets the Number 1 pass defense in the league with the 2nd most sacks in history and the best O-Line in the game. KC has the edge at QB and TE but is completely outgunned in all other facets of the game - so I expect that the Mahomes detractors are going to have a field day before it's over  .

Enjoy the game guys, you're all cool  .

[Skeever]

I was not clear enough.  An announcer says its a great catch so it influences the coaching staff in the box?  No coach would be influenced by the announcers.  The just didn't have the time to see different angles. You're not silly, the talking heads saying that are.

I think you're missing the chain of communication. It's the coach, listening to the coordinator in the box, who is watching the broadcast (among other things). There are many examples of where the broadcast team have a clearer picture (and, perhaps, theoretically, more objective perspective) than the coach on the sidelines. I don't think the coach makes that decision 100% based on the broadcast booth, obviously, but if the coach can and does get that information from the box over air while watching the game, he'd be foolish not to consider it.

In this case, though, again I think you have to give credit to Philly for getting a play off so fast. Suppose the broadcast DID show the other angle, right away? Had they shown the other angle before Philly got their play off, guarantee you see that red flag hit the turf.

[King Postwhore]

I was not clear enough.  An announcer says its a great catch so it influences the coaching staff in the box?  No coach would be influenced by the announcers.  The just didn't have the time to see different angles. You're not silly, the talking heads saying that are.

I think you're missing the chain of communication. It's the coach, listening to the coordinator in the box, who is watching the broadcast (among other things). There are many examples of where the broadcast team have a clearer picture (and, perhaps, theoretically, more objective perspective) than the coach on the sidelines. I don't think the coach makes that decision 100% based on the broadcast booth, obviously, but if the coach can and does get that information from the box over air while watching the game, he'd be foolish not to consider it.

In this case, though, again I think you have to give credit to Philly for getting a play off so fast. Suppose the broadcast DID show the other angle, right away? Had they shown the other angle before Philly got their play off, guarantee you see that red flag hit the turf.

Coaches do not have enough time to see the correct replay to tell the head coach to throw the red flag.  This is what exactly happened on that call. 

What should happen is the booth should stop paly, look at it and the booth makes the call.  That won't happen and in all honesty, the game was a lot better just going with the call on the field.

[Dublagent66]

The receiver of that (so-called) catch gave his team a signal that it may have been incomplete.  That's why they were in hurry up and it worked.  But yeah, had the coach seen that particular angle, he would've challenged it for sure.  It certainly is a game of inches and seconds.

[Stadler]

A guy who has on several occasions quoted John 13:7 in reference to himself is definitely not the picture of "humility" that comes to my mind.

I'm not really interested in people's religious beliefs.  Personally, I'd rather players not mention the bible or God at all.  I'm talking about his demeanor in press conferences and interviews related to sportsmanship and the relationship he has with the team.  Humility in this context means he doesn't feel the need to boast about how good his team is.

Well, don't look at the religiosity of it; the statement in "John 13:7" implies that the speaker is doing something otherworldly and beyond the comprehension of mere mortals.  He's throwing a fucking football.  Running it.  Jalen Hurts is very good, but he's not transformative.   He wins, I'll give him that, but this is really his first full time through.  He's got a solid defense, and good skill position players.  Yet again, let's let him earn his accolades.