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General => General Discussion => Topic started by: KevShmev on March 23, 2022, 10:49:38 AM
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Let's start the new one.
Tyreek Hill getting traded to the Dolphins.
And away we go!!
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Let's start the new one.
Tyreek Hill getting traded to the Dolphins.
And away we go!!
Well poop, I just put this in the other thread.
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Not a fan. Of course, now we're starting to move into the next era of Mahomes, and we're going to start seeing if his deal is as real as some claimed.
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Was Hill looking to leave KC?
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This is still my favorite moment of the Bucs SB win
(https://s.hdnux.com/photos/01/16/41/32/20584121/3/1200x0.jpg)
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Not a fan. Of course, now we're starting to move into the next era of Mahomes, and we're going to start seeing if his deal is as real as some claimed.
This. It'll be interesting to see how he does.
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Was Hill looking to leave KC?
From what I read, yes. He requested a trade. Kev told me for money. Asking a ton.
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Sounds like Hill wanted crazy money once he saw what D Adams got from the Raiders, and once the Chiefs realized they couldn't pay him what he wanted, they allowed him to seek a trade, and there we have it. I am just happy to have that guy and his scary speed out of the AFC West.
And it feels like the Chiefs will go down as another would-be dynasty. It is hard to see them being as good or better right away, and despite all of their fireworks of the last four years, they only got one Super Bowl win out of it.
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I am just happy to have that guy and his scary speed out of the AFC West.
:sadpanda:
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For what Miami gave, which is basically an entire draft, I'm glad the Jets didn't get him. That's a "we're one piece away" trade, which is not the Jets (or the Dolphins, for that matter).
Wilson + Hill could have been an electrifying combo, though. With a QB like Tua not sure how much it'll even make a difference.
Hadn't been keeping tabs on the old thread, but plenty of interesting moves being made all around. Quite the offseason this has been so far.
Who's gonna start in Seattle? Geno???
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Not a fan. Of course, now we're starting to move into the next era of Mahomes, and we're going to start seeing if his deal is as real as some claimed.
This. It'll be interesting to see how he does.
And how good Hill does with an 'average' QB in lieu of a higher tier one.
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Not a fan. Of course, now we're starting to move into the next era of Mahomes, and we're going to start seeing if his deal is as real as some claimed.
This. It'll be interesting to see how he does.
And how good Hill does with an 'average' QB in lieu of a higher tier one.
Hill should give a portion of that contract to Mahomes as a thank-you.
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Not a fan. Of course, now we're starting to move into the next era of Mahomes, and we're going to start seeing if his deal is as real as some claimed.
This. It'll be interesting to see how he does.
And how good Hill does with an 'average' QB in lieu of a higher tier one.
Not to mention playing in a defensively tougher division. The Patriots learned how to minimize him 3 years ago, and Buffalo has contained him whenever they've played. I think he's gonna miss playing SD and Oakland twice a year.
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He is a gonna miss Andy Reid as much as Mahomes, as Reid is a terrific play designer and play caller, and who knows if the Dolphins will have someone who will be able to scheme plays to where Hill is open as offense as he was in KC.
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So the Fins made some decent moves but they still have Tua as their QB. :(
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For what Miami gave, which is basically an entire draft, I'm glad the Jets didn't get him. That's a "we're one piece away" trade, which is not the Jets (or the Dolphins, for that matter).
Wilson + Hill could have been an electrifying combo, though. With a QB like Tua not sure how much it'll even make a difference.
Hadn't been keeping tabs on the old thread, but plenty of interesting moves being made all around. Quite the offseason this has been so far.
Who's gonna start in Seattle? Geno???
Miami currently has two first round picks in next years draft, if they want they recoup picks in this draft they certainly can.
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As per Ben Volin, the Pats have re signed Malcolm Butler.
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As per Ben Volin, the Pats have re signed Malcolm Butler.
I wonder why. I would have bet good money on him telling Bill to fuck off after that whole superb owl thing.
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Honestly, I think Malcolm Butler is kind of a psycho. I don't understand this move at all. He must need the money bad. Of course there's no way he sees all $9m of this. I'd be surprised if he saw half of it.
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As per Ben Volin, the Pats have re signed Malcolm Butler.
I wonder why. I would have bet good money on him telling Bill to fuck off after that whole superb owl thing.
Yeah, the big secret. I wonder if we will ever know?
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Does anyone have a breif summery about what's going on with Baker Mayfield? I thought the browns were happy with him.
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Does anyone have a breif summery about what's going on with Baker Mayfield? I thought the browns were happy with him.
Mayfield isn't that good and doesn't act like an adult.
The Brown looked to upgrade and did so.
That is the shortest way I can put it. :lol
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That's all I needed :lol
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It is sad that most players are in it for the money and not championships. That much money to Hill from the Fins is stupid for both parties. For one, Miami DOESN'T THROW THE BALL DOWNFIELD. So Hill is reduced to end-arounds to take advantage of his speed. LOL
For those who think this is somehow Mahomes' demise, you might want to look up his stats for games in which Hill has been out.
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One of the benefits of having Hill in KC was that he scared the bejeezus out of opposing Ds. He forced a significant change in the secondary that Mahomes and Reid were able to exploit. Their offense simply cannot be as good as it was without that terror factor. At the same time Miami now has a scarry-fast target in the secondary, but I don't see the rest of them really being able to exploit other teams because of it. In KC you had to strike a balance between disrupting Hill and still defending against Mahomes et al. In Miami you do whatever it takes to lock Hill down because nobody else scares you.
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It is sad that most players are in it for the money and not championships.
Well, they are ALL professional football players, but most won't win championships.
They SHOULD be in it for the money. They have to put food on the table and a roof over the heads of their families. But there are 32 teams in the league, and if their only goal is championships, then each year, in this whole profession, there is only one success and 31 failures, and that's ridiculous.
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It is sad that most players are in it for the money and not championships.
Well, they are ALL professional football players, but most won't win championships.
They SHOULD be in it for the money. They have to put food on the table and a roof over the heads of their families. But there are 32 teams in the league, and if their only goal is championships, then each year, in this whole profession, there is only one success and 31 failures, and that's ridiculous.
I agree. But in the case of deciding between 75 million and 100 million, wouldn't having a chance to compete for a trophy be a deciding factor?
Since I'm sure no one will bother to look it up, in games without Hill Mahomes has averaged 363 yards per game, a 109 passer rating and thrown 8 TDs with no picks. I'm sure he'll be in the soup line soon.
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Everyone's goal is championships. Why do you think they play the game? They already got the money. Even the lowest paid NFL player has plenty of money to put food on the table...please. We all know that not everyone can win, but that doesn't mean it isn't their goal.
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It is sad that most players are in it for the money and not championships.
Well, they are ALL professional football players, but most won't win championships.
They SHOULD be in it for the money. They have to put food on the table and a roof over the heads of their families. But there are 32 teams in the league, and if their only goal is championships, then each year, in this whole profession, there is only one success and 31 failures, and that's ridiculous.
Where I disagree is that very few of these people are trying to keep a roof over their head. While disappointed by his departure, I said I couldn't blame Jakob Johnson for leaving NE. He's a bubble player in a position that's not hugely valued. Going from 850k to 1.5 million is huge to him and his. The players we tend to talk about aren't in that category, though. Their goal isn't to provide for their family, but rather to make more than some other guy. As DT said, given the choice between 75 million and a ring or 100 million and mediocrity, I don't want the 100m guy on my team. He's not in it for the right reason. From what I can tell Hill refused an 80 million offer from a perennial contender, after he'd already played most of a 54m contract, to play for a highly unstable organization. It's a shame for KC, but if that's his attitude they're probably better off doubling their draft stock and moving on.
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Everyone's goal is championships. Why do you think they play the game? They already got the money. Even the lowest paid NFL player has plenty of money to put food on the table...please. We all know that not everyone can win, but that doesn't mean it isn't their goal.
Yeah, I don't think that's really it. Having played sports most of my life, I firmly believe that there are some people that are just never going to be able to win on their own. I don't know what the exact term would be, but it's one thing to run fast, or catch a football. It's another thing entirely to be able to in real time determine what will be necessary to win in that moment against another very good team that wants to win as bad as we do.
I love Mike Mussina (baseball pitcher), and he has something like four ONE-hitters; he's come within ONE PITCH of a perfect game, and within two outs of a perfect game two other times. To me, as much as I love him, he's a Hall Of Famer, but that tells me there is a lack of killer instinct there. Sport, performance, is not a "black" and "white" or "good"/"bad" exercise. There are degrees.
Some of the guys going for the money might as well; they're never going to get the alternative, unless they can latch onto a team like the Pats or the Rams or the Bucs, who have a legit shot to win a champeenship. Other guys - the Brady's of the world - can instantly MAKE a team a champeenship team, and so it makes a little more sense for them to balance the money. Tom Brady is not going to ever be known for the money he made, he will be known for the championships he has won. I fear that Deshaun Watson will never be known for the championships he won, but for the size of his salary (assuming that his off-the-field antics aren't his defining moment). Same with Aaron Rodgers.
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Since I'm sure no one will bother to look it up, in games without Hill Mahomes has averaged 363 yards per game, a 109 passer rating and thrown 8 TDs with no picks. I'm sure he'll be in the soup line soon.
I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm not looking it up for the same reason El Barto said. He's gone now. Just like in the stock market, past performance is no indicator of future performance. We're already seeing the rest of the league catching up to the Chiefs, and now that defenses don't have to scheme for the POSSIBILITY of Tyreek, it is not sufficient to look at a scenario that doesn't exist any longer as a blue print for the future.
And I'm not saying he's GOING to "be on the soup line", just that it's going to be interesting to see how he responds. I actually hope he does, because I despise Tyreek Hill, and would be pleased to see Patrick Mahomes achieve previous levels of success without him. I'm just not willing to annoint him without playing the games.
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Yeah, I doubt anyone thinks Mahomes is going to fall of a cliff now, although his prolonged midseason slump and then the way he melted down in the AFCCG does make me question if he was already tailing off a little bit, but he could simply end up being another very good QB rather than being one who put up crazy numbers due to having the fastest WR ever (and the best TE in the game).
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Everyone's goal is championships. Why do you think they play the game? They already got the money. Even the lowest paid NFL player has plenty of money to put food on the table...please. We all know that not everyone can win, but that doesn't mean it isn't their goal.
Yeah, I don't think that's really it. Having played sports most of my life, I firmly believe that there are some people that are just never going to be able to win on their own. I don't know what the exact term would be, but it's one thing to run fast, or catch a football. It's another thing entirely to be able to in real time determine what will be necessary to win in that moment against another very good team that wants to win as bad as we do.
I love Mike Mussina (baseball pitcher), and he has something like four ONE-hitters; he's come within ONE PITCH of a perfect game, and within two outs of a perfect game two other times. To me, as much as I love him, he's a Hall Of Famer, but that tells me there is a lack of killer instinct there. Sport, performance, is not a "black" and "white" or "good"/"bad" exercise. There are degrees.
Some of the guys going for the money might as well; they're never going to get the alternative, unless they can latch onto a team like the Pats or the Rams or the Bucs, who have a legit shot to win a champeenship. Other guys - the Brady's of the world - can instantly MAKE a team a champeenship team, and so it makes a little more sense for them to balance the money. Tom Brady is not going to ever be known for the money he made, he will be known for the championships he has won. I fear that Deshaun Watson will never be known for the championships he won, but for the size of his salary (assuming that his off-the-field antics aren't his defining moment). Same with Aaron Rodgers.
Yeah, I get it. But my point was basically that NFL players aren't hurting for money unless they're living beyond their means; buying private jets and mansions with 10 car garages. Any NFL player good enough to get a multi-million dollar deal is already in contention (even if they never see a championship in their career). In other words, if a player wants to be good enough to get a championship, the money will always be there to a certain degree.
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Everyone's goal is championships. Why do you think they play the game? They already got the money. Even the lowest paid NFL player has plenty of money to put food on the table...please. We all know that not everyone can win, but that doesn't mean it isn't their goal.
Yeah, I don't think that's really it. Having played sports most of my life, I firmly believe that there are some people that are just never going to be able to win on their own. I don't know what the exact term would be, but it's one thing to run fast, or catch a football. It's another thing entirely to be able to in real time determine what will be necessary to win in that moment against another very good team that wants to win as bad as we do.
I love Mike Mussina (baseball pitcher), and he has something like four ONE-hitters; he's come within ONE PITCH of a perfect game, and within two outs of a perfect game two other times. To me, as much as I love him, he's a Hall Of Famer, but that tells me there is a lack of killer instinct there. Sport, performance, is not a "black" and "white" or "good"/"bad" exercise. There are degrees.
Some of the guys going for the money might as well; they're never going to get the alternative, unless they can latch onto a team like the Pats or the Rams or the Bucs, who have a legit shot to win a champeenship. Other guys - the Brady's of the world - can instantly MAKE a team a champeenship team, and so it makes a little more sense for them to balance the money. Tom Brady is not going to ever be known for the money he made, he will be known for the championships he has won. I fear that Deshaun Watson will never be known for the championships he won, but for the size of his salary (assuming that his off-the-field antics aren't his defining moment). Same with Aaron Rodgers.
Yeah, I get it. But my point was basically that NFL players aren't hurting for money unless they're living beyond their means; buying private jets and mansions with 10 car garages. Any NFL player good enough to get a multi-million dollar deal is already in contention (even if they never see a championship in their career). In other words, if a player wants to be good enough to get a championship, the money will always be there to a certain degree.
Most of them aren't hurting, but at that level there's certainly a desire to make sure your kids are well taken care of. Lower tier players might be making a million or two a year, which sounds huge to most of us, but after taxes that doesn't necessarily mean good schools for your kids. Not to mention that any player could be a play away from forced retirement. I'm not sympathetic to someone like Tyreek Hill, who's now made upwards of 110m, but there are plenty of players that need to be making the most they can and I don't fault them for that. To me it comes down to whether or not you're motivated by necessity or ego.
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Everyone's goal is championships. Why do you think they play the game? They already got the money. Even the lowest paid NFL player has plenty of money to put food on the table...please. We all know that not everyone can win, but that doesn't mean it isn't their goal.
Yeah, I don't think that's really it. Having played sports most of my life, I firmly believe that there are some people that are just never going to be able to win on their own. I don't know what the exact term would be, but it's one thing to run fast, or catch a football. It's another thing entirely to be able to in real time determine what will be necessary to win in that moment against another very good team that wants to win as bad as we do.
I love Mike Mussina (baseball pitcher), and he has something like four ONE-hitters; he's come within ONE PITCH of a perfect game, and within two outs of a perfect game two other times. To me, as much as I love him, he's a Hall Of Famer, but that tells me there is a lack of killer instinct there. Sport, performance, is not a "black" and "white" or "good"/"bad" exercise. There are degrees.
Some of the guys going for the money might as well; they're never going to get the alternative, unless they can latch onto a team like the Pats or the Rams or the Bucs, who have a legit shot to win a champeenship. Other guys - the Brady's of the world - can instantly MAKE a team a champeenship team, and so it makes a little more sense for them to balance the money. Tom Brady is not going to ever be known for the money he made, he will be known for the championships he has won. I fear that Deshaun Watson will never be known for the championships he won, but for the size of his salary (assuming that his off-the-field antics aren't his defining moment). Same with Aaron Rodgers.
Yeah, I get it. But my point was basically that NFL players aren't hurting for money unless they're living beyond their means; buying private jets and mansions with 10 car garages. Any NFL player good enough to get a multi-million dollar deal is already in contention (even if they never see a championship in their career). In other words, if a player wants to be good enough to get a championship, the money will always be there to a certain degree.
Dubla, I hear you and I'm not arguing with you, but I will point out that many players DO live beyond their means, and while some players have long, productive careers, most only last a couple seasons or so. A "million dollars a year!" sounds like a lot, but when that's ALL you make over your career, not so much.
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@ Stads & Barto. I agree with you both and not really arguing anything. All I'm saying is, none of these players are hurting for money. You don't need to be a millionaire to take care of your family and put a roof over your head. Even if they have a short NFL career, most of them still have college degrees to fall back on. I have no sympathy for players (or anyone for that matter) who live beyond their means. No amount of money can cure that problem.
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Some of the guys going for the money might as well; they're never going to get the alternative, unless they can latch onto a team like the Pats or the Rams or the Bucs, who have a legit shot to win a champeenship. Other guys - the Brady's of the world - can instantly MAKE a team a champeenship team, and so it makes a little more sense for them to balance the money. Tom Brady is not going to ever be known for the money he made, he will be known for the championships he has won.
Well, that was my point, which I may not have made clearly enough. Except I would change "Some" to "Most". It's just a numbers game. Of course the goal is to be the best player you can be, and to help make your team to be the best that it can be. But every year, there are only a relative handful of teams whose realistic goals should include championships. For all the other players on all the other teams, their goals should include things like "hit all my bonus marks in my contract" and "don't get injured", because their team is going to be average at best.
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I see both sides of the coin here.
As fan, we usually judge players by championships and success, so in our minds, once they are already making millions, we think, "Chase rings, not money," but as players who have a short window to maximize their earnings, many want that super big payday when they can get it, and it is hard to blame them, especially since I am guessing many players are not frugal, so it's a safe bet that many players spend the money as fast as they make it, so they are always wanting more, not even for savings in some cases, but to spend.
Even though I am hard wired to hate the Raiders, I have to give them props as their acquisition of D. Adams had a double pronged effect. One, it made their team better, and two, it made Tyreek Hill want crazy money which led to his departure from the AFC West.
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So I think that Baker will stay in Cleveland until DeShawn gets on the field. It would make sense from a lot of different perspectives one being that he could increase his stock around the league.
But if that doesn't happen, what about the Fins as a landing spot? Baker could be had for cheap and would be good insurance in case Tua flops.
Opinions??
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So I think that Baker will stay in Cleveland until DeShawn gets on the field. It would make sense from a lot of different perspectives one being that he could increase his stock around the league.
But if that doesn't happen, what about the Fins as a landing spot? Baker could be had for cheap and would be good insurance in case Tua flops.
Opinions??
Respectfully, Baker is not going to Miami. They have Teddy Bridgewater already in reserve.
I'm of two minds on him staying until Watson gets on the field; if I'm Baker, "WHY?" Are you going to show your maturity then? I don't think that changes any minds on that level, but on the downside, you're a lame duck QB, they are not going to "scheme" for you and if you take a helmet to the knee, you're fucked. And on the browns side, they lose any leverage or value they have in him. I think he goes sooner rather than later, frankly. The wild card will be the draft and the lead up to the draft. If you're, say, Seattle, do you go with a Baker Mayfield and see if Pete Carroll can whack some sense into him, or do you start fresh with the draft?
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BTW - I read an article earlier in the week where Pete Carrol wants Gino Smith back because he thought he did a good job in relief of Russell last year.
We'll see........
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The Browns need to know sooner rather than later what the league is going to do to Watson. People are expecting he will be suspended. The question is for how long. Based on the sheer number of allegations, I could see Goodell giving him a whole year even though he sat last year. Difference is, he got paid last year.
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BTW - I read an article earlier in the week where Pete Carrol wants Gino Smith back because he thought he did a good job in relief of Russell last year.
We'll see........
They faired about the same with Geno as they did with Russell.
So, why not? Trading Russell Wilson means you've got problems that can't be fixed anytime soon. Seahawks are officially rebuilding, Geno's just as good as anyone else on the market currently.
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Respectfully, Baker is not going to Miami. They have Teddy Bridgewater already in reserve.
When Tua gets hurts, Tyreek Hill is really gonna miss Mahomes when he is 10 yards down field past the deepest corner and Checkdown Teddy is throwing it to the RB for 2-yard loss.
The Browns need to know sooner rather than later what the league is going to do to Watson. People are expecting he will be suspended. The question is for how long. Based on the sheer number of allegations, I could see Goodell giving him a whole year even though he sat last year. Difference is, he got paid last year.
Sure, they need to know, but the NFL should not hurry their decision to make it easier for the Browns to prepare. That is not their job. If the Browns have to sit and wait to see what punishment gets handed down, that is the price you pay for giving that kind of money to a QB accused of being a serial sexual creep (to put it nicely).
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Respectfully, Baker is not going to Miami. They have Teddy Bridgewater already in reserve.
When Tua gets hurts, Tyreek Hill is really gonna miss Mahomes when he is 10 yards down field past the deepest corner and Checkdown Teddy is throwing it to the RB for 2-yard loss.
They're BOTH known for that. The knock on Tua is his less-than-elite arm strength. He's had some success throwing downfield, but he's no Brady, Rodgers or Mahomes.
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Well one thing for sure I’m looking forward to this season because we just had the wackiest off-season ever. QB carousel like never before. Some divisions are SO STACKED like the AFC West that it’s impossible to project standings. Kinda sucks for Carr, Herbert, Wilson, and Mahomes but makes for must-see viewing for those inter-division games.
That makes me think of a fun discussion topic, what were some of those most stacked divisions of all time? NFC East must be in there somewhere - early to mid 90s maybe.
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https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/33617341/nfl-says-all-teams-add-minority-offensive-coach-expands-rooney-rule-include-women
All 32 NFL teams will hire a minority offensive assistant coach for the 2022 season, part of a series of policy enhancements announced Monday to address the league's ongoing diversity efforts.
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It'll do more for women than it does for minorities. :dunno:
Is there any team in the league that doesn't already have at least 5 minority assistant coaches? Looks to me like the Patriots already have 6/14 black guys plus a Cabrera, and of the remaining 7, two of those guys are Belichicks. This is actually more meaningless than the original Rooney Rule.
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It'll do more for women than it does for minorities. :dunno:
Is there any team in the league that doesn't already have at least 5 minority assistant coaches? Looks to me like the Patriots already have 6/14 black guys plus a Cabrera, and of the remaining 7, two of those guys are Belichicks. This is actually more meaningless than the original Rooney Rule.
I hate these initiatives. Placating, is all it is. There was just an article in the local news about how "Connecticut college sports is not hiring the best!". And how do we know? Because only 8% of Division I head coaches are black, and 44% are female. I'm confused by that leap of logic. We've had Jim Calhoun, Hall of Famer, his successor was Kevin Ollie, African American (who won a national title as coach, but was also run out of town for ethics scandals). We currently have the greatest coach in college basketball history, Geno Auriemma, whose legendary assistant (who has been offered countless head coaching jobs in her career, and turned them down to be part of one of the greatest programs in college sports) is Chris Dailey, female. Both programs have generated a significant number of coaches and assistant coaches; Shea Ralphs, former WNBA player and Uconn athlete just took a head coaching job at Vanderbilt, and Patrick Sellers, former NBA player and Uconn athlete is now the head coach at Central Connecticut. Only 10.5% of the state is African American, so I'm not sure what the "target" here is. I'd love to see how many women are applying for Uconn football positions (we're not a football power) in order to assess how that 44% (the state is 51% female) is playing out.
We're not that big a community; it's not necessarily true that "the best" will lead to pure demographic numbers. So we go through the motions and tell ourselves that concentrating MORE on race than ever before, in fact, making it the predominant reason for decision-making, is going to end the divisiveness and make us true to the "not the color of our skin, but the content of our character". Seems counter-intuitive to me, but what do I know. I know for me, I rarely if ever thought of race growing up, and through college. I am FAR more conscious of race in my day-to-day life than I ever was, and it's not a good thing.
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Sean McVay on his reaction to Tom Brady's un-retirement: “I was thinking, ‘Shit, man, can we get this guy the hell out of this league?’ ”
I'm sure he's not the only one.
Additionally the owners have agreed to a change in OT rules for Playoffs that ensure each team has a possession before moving to sudden death.
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With the new NFL playoff OT rule, I know one thing: if I'm the HC and win the toss, and this is not deferring, but I am defending a specific goal line (dome or no dome). I know I'm getting the ball, so then I'll know what I have to do. The big plus, if it's outdoors, I'll have the wind at my back.
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Something I feel like almost everyone is ignoring about the new OT rules: without the first TD being sudden death, the extra point/two point conversion decision comes into play. If you’re getting possession first, do you kick the extra point and risk the opposing team going for two to win it, or do you go for two and risk not converting, making it so the opposing team can win with an extra point? And on the flip side, if you’re getting possession second and the opposing team kicked the extra point, do you go for the tie and risk the opposing team getting into field goal range, or do you go for two and the win, but risk not converting and losing the game?
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Arians retires and moves to the front office?
Sounds like Brady won.
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Well that came out of nowhere.
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Arians retires and moves to the front office?
Sounds like Brady won.
First thing I thought of.
Well that came out of nowhere.
Er...not really.
Brady was hell bent on not playing for Arians.
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Well that came out of nowhere.
Er...not really.
Brady was hell bent on not playing for Arians.
Not sure why that rumor keeps coming up.
There's no real merit to it, I follow a lot of local reporters and they would've sniffed it first if there was any legitimacy to that.
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Do you really think Brady retired.....thought about it a bit more...and decided he just wasn't quite ready?
Why do you think he "retired"? Do you really think there's no correlation to Brady unretiring and Arians stepping aside?
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LOL where is that coming from? I have no way of knowing one way or the other, all I'm saying is this last year I've been following the Bucs like I've never done before and didn't hear any kind of chatter that Brady was unhappy with anyone in the coaching staff. The front office has been really cool with him and the relationship has been pretty much solid throughout.
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Well, if it's anything like here, a lot of the media is in the bag with the team.
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For all of these years we kept hearing that Brady was the embodiment of the Patriot way. No player is as important as the team. Over the last year or so King has convinced me that he's actually a whiny little bitch, though. So be it. What I wonder is when that became the case. He couldn't have always been like that. It has to have been a gradual shift. Clearly he's been of the mindset that he deserved preferential treatment for some time. Now he's of the mindset that he's more important than the GM, and he'll personally determine who the next head coach is. Man, I'm really starting to hate the guy.
Also, who wants to sign on as HC only to be Brady's yes man?
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LOL where is that coming from? I have no way of knowing one way or the other, all I'm saying is this last year I've been following the Bucs like I've never done before and didn't hear any kind of chatter that Brady was unhappy with anyone in the coaching staff. The front office has been really cool with him and the relationship has been pretty much solid throughout.
I've been hearing rumbles about it for at least a year. They put on a happy face, but they don't really get along all that well.
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For all of these years we kept hearing that Brady was the embodiment of the Patriot way. No player is as important as the team. Over the last year or so King has convinced me that he's actually a whiny little bitch, though. So be it. What I wonder is when that became the case. He couldn't have always been like that. It has to have been a gradual shift. Clearly he's been of the mindset that he deserved preferential treatment for some time. Now he's of the mindset that he's more important than the GM, and he'll personally determine who the next head coach is. Man, I'm really starting to hate the guy.
Also, who wants to sign on as HC only to be Brady's yes man?
It makes you wonder if he was always like this and hid it well given how stone faced he usually was with the Patriots (because that was the "Patriot Way"), or if success has gone to his head so much that it has blown up to mammoth proportions. Either way, I agree with you. He seemed more likable when he first got to Tampa, but he has really shown his ass in the last year and change. It could be the Michael Jordan thing where the drive and personality that makes him such a great player is also makes him not that good of a person off the field/court.
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Eh I don't know. Maybe it's true he's a grade A asshole and too stuck up his own ass. It just didn't appear that way in all the press conferences and interviews with all the staff and players and coaches and reporters that he's been here so far. I would think these reporters pick up on all these as that's the bread and butter for them and they have reported on issues they've found.
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For all of these years we kept hearing that Brady was the embodiment of the Patriot way. No player is as important as the team. Over the last year or so King has convinced me that he's actually a whiny little bitch, though. So be it. What I wonder is when that became the case. He couldn't have always been like that. It has to have been a gradual shift. Clearly he's been of the mindset that he deserved preferential treatment for some time. Now he's of the mindset that he's more important than the GM, and he'll personally determine who the next head coach is. Man, I'm really starting to hate the guy.
Also, who wants to sign on as HC only to be Brady's yes man?
It makes you wonder if he was always like this and hid it well given how stone faced he usually was with the Patriots (because that was the "Patriot Way"), or if success has gone to his head so much that it has blown up to mammoth proportions. Either way, I agree with you. He seemed more likable when he first got to Tampa, but he has really shown his ass in the last year and change. It could be the Michael Jordan thing where the drive and personality that makes him such a great player is also makes him not that good of a person off the field/court.
His image started tanking long before he left for Tampa, in my book. It's starting too look pretty clear that he tried to pull this with Belichick, and Kraft quite reasonably told him to bugger off (he wanted O'brien as HC). As for when, I think it's both. Players from the early days were pretty clear that even when he was playing at an elite level he was still super down to Earth. He was picking people up at the airport, and introducing himself to all of the new players. "Hi, I'm Tom. I play quarterback. Good to meet you." By all accounts he was pretty sincere. If I had to guess, I'd say rather than just his ego growing with his success, like Mahomes, it was the gradual realization that he really was better than everybody else and he wasn't supposed to realize it. I don't get the feeling that he's caught up in his own hype.
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I'd assume as he got older and dealing with BB when going through Deflategate and his mom having cancer chamged him. Add the struggles of getting a contract with his pedigree he decided to take control of his career and now we see him leaning more to how Rodgers acts.
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So who does he want now? Leftwich?
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For all of these years we kept hearing that Brady was the embodiment of the Patriot way. No player is as important as the team. Over the last year or so King has convinced me that he's actually a whiny little bitch, though. So be it. What I wonder is when that became the case. He couldn't have always been like that. It has to have been a gradual shift. Clearly he's been of the mindset that he deserved preferential treatment for some time. Now he's of the mindset that he's more important than the GM, and he'll personally determine who the next head coach is. Man, I'm really starting to hate the guy.
Also, who wants to sign on as HC only to be Brady's yes man?
This is why, stats and records aside, Peyton will always be my personal GOAT. He just embodies the position, the game, and the best of the off-the-field character that you hope to see from a player. For me, he is up there with John Madden in terms of people who are just synonymous with the game. I'm sure part of it's just an extremely polished public persona, and marketing. But still. To me Peyton is legendary. I fully expect Brady's records to be broken in another decade or so. I don't expect anyone to like him or his awful personality or look forward to seeing him on TV from then on. Meanwhile, I expect Peyton to be something like the next Madden. Someone who adults remember and love about the game, but also who even kids too young to remember look forward to seeing as a marquee game broadcaster or whatever else he decides to do going forward.
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For all of these years we kept hearing that Brady was the embodiment of the Patriot way. No player is as important as the team. Over the last year or so King has convinced me that he's actually a whiny little bitch, though. So be it. What I wonder is when that became the case. He couldn't have always been like that. It has to have been a gradual shift. Clearly he's been of the mindset that he deserved preferential treatment for some time. Now he's of the mindset that he's more important than the GM, and he'll personally determine who the next head coach is. Man, I'm really starting to hate the guy.
Also, who wants to sign on as HC only to be Brady's yes man?
This is why, stats and records aside, Peyton will always be my personal GOAT. He just embodies the position, the game, and the best of the off-the-field character that you hope to see from a player. For me, he is up there with John Madden in terms of people who are just synonymous with the game. I'm sure part of it's just an extremely polished public persona, and marketing. But still. To me Peyton is legendary. I fully expect Brady's records to be broken in another decade or so. I don't expect anyone to like him or his awful personality or look forward to seeing him on TV from then on. Meanwhile, I expect Peyton to be something like the next Madden. Someone who adults remember and love about the game, but also who even kids too young to remember look forward to seeing as a marquee game broadcaster or whatever else he decides to do going forward.
I like this. Everything you said here comes out in one form or another in the Monday Night Football broadcasts he does. He's got a genuine love of the game, he's got a genuine appreciation and respect for those that play it at a high level, and he seems to have a genuine interest in those guests that DON'T have a connection to football, but love the game themselves. As you noted, it may be carefully crafted, but it FEELS real. It FEELS honest.
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So who does he want now? Leftwich?
Todd Bowles the Defensive Coordinator is the head coach now, they signed him up for five years.
From the Tampa reporters I follow, they're saying Bruce Arians had already informed the front office and Brady around his un-retirement announcement that he was stepping down.
I think this move was coming regardless of who was going to be at QB.
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So who does he want now? Leftwich?
Todd Bowles the Defensive Coordinator is the head coach now, they signed him up for five years.
From the Tampa reporters I follow, they're saying Bruce Arians had already informed the front office and Brady around his un-retirement announcement that he was stepping down.
I think this move was coming regardless of who was going to be at QB.
So Leftwich got hosed again for a HC job, in favor of a guy who has failed one (Jets) and a half (Dolphins interim) times as a head coach in the past. So much for the Rooney Rule, eh? :)
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I'm willing to give Bowles the benefit of doubt on this, I'm sure he's learned from that experience with the Jets. The front office is very different too as were the players.. Time will tell how it goes, right now the Bucs team is talented and once Brady moves on, getting a replacement QB again might be the missing piece for that team.
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So who does he want now? Leftwich?
Todd Bowles the Defensive Coordinator is the head coach now, they signed him up for five years.
From the Tampa reporters I follow, they're saying Bruce Arians had already informed the front office and Brady around his un-retirement announcement that he was stepping down.
I think this move was coming regardless of who was going to be at QB.
So Leftwich got hosed again for a HC job, in favor of a guy who has failed one (Jets) and a half (Dolphins interim) times as a head coach in the past. So much for the Rooney Rule, eh? :)
Stads, you know Bowles race right? :lol
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So who does he want now? Leftwich?
Todd Bowles the Defensive Coordinator is the head coach now, they signed him up for five years.
From the Tampa reporters I follow, they're saying Bruce Arians had already informed the front office and Brady around his un-retirement announcement that he was stepping down.
I think this move was coming regardless of who was going to be at QB.
So Leftwich got hosed again for a HC job, in favor of a guy who has failed one (Jets) and a half (Dolphins interim) times as a head coach in the past. So much for the Rooney Rule, eh? :)
Stads, you know Bowles race right? :lol
Yes. That was the point. :) :) :)
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They didn't need it though. :lol No process needed. LOL
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Based on what I've read about this latest lawsuit, Jerry Jones is a despicable individual. I suppose that is already known. Kind of in-line with most NFL owners I suppose.
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They didn't need it though. :lol No process needed. LOL
Just to be clear, where I was going was, during the hoopla over the hiring of minority coaches Byron Leftwich was often paraded out as the prime example of someone getting the shaft because of his race, and there was a lot of hay made about "white" coaches being given second and third chances while black coaches couldn't even get to the table. Well, Leftwich isn't even the first choice on his OWN TEAM, in favor of a guy that's had chances already and didn't deliver. I'm saying this is a valuable piece of evidence that "color" isn't the deciding factor in a majority of hiring decisions.
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Actually, isn't Brady on record as stating "90% of what I say is a lie"? So who knows when you're being played.
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You and I know, now that he was under Arians shadow just like Eric Bieniemy is looked at working with Reid. Now that he is free, maybe owners will look differently at him.
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Actually, isn't Brady on record as stating "90% of what I say is a lie"? So who knows when you're being played.
“I would say 90% of what I say is probably not what I'm thinking. Which is challenging, you know? And I really admire people that actually can do that, and say what they think, because they invite a lot of other things into their life. And I think there's part of me that doesn't like conflict." - Tom Brady.
We all know this is meant as under Belichick, no info was to be given out so he answered with a non answer. Lie, sure but that was to not give info, not because it's what he does all the time.
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For all of these years we kept hearing that Brady was the embodiment of the Patriot way. No player is as important as the team. Over the last year or so King has convinced me that he's actually a whiny little bitch, though. So be it. What I wonder is when that became the case. He couldn't have always been like that. It has to have been a gradual shift. Clearly he's been of the mindset that he deserved preferential treatment for some time. Now he's of the mindset that he's more important than the GM, and he'll personally determine who the next head coach is. Man, I'm really starting to hate the guy.
Also, who wants to sign on as HC only to be Brady's yes man?
This is why, stats and records aside, Peyton will always be my personal GOAT. He just embodies the position, the game, and the best of the off-the-field character that you hope to see from a player. For me, he is up there with John Madden in terms of people who are just synonymous with the game. I'm sure part of it's just an extremely polished public persona, and marketing. But still. To me Peyton is legendary. I fully expect Brady's records to be broken in another decade or so. I don't expect anyone to like him or his awful personality or look forward to seeing him on TV from then on. Meanwhile, I expect Peyton to be something like the next Madden. Someone who adults remember and love about the game, but also who even kids too young to remember look forward to seeing as a marquee game broadcaster or whatever else he decides to do going forward.
Some of Brady's records will fall, but not all of them. What won't is the seven rings with two different teams. The guy's the GOAT and that isn't going to change in the next 50 years. I'll call him a petty little bitch, but that doesn't change what he's done on the field. And to be clear, I don't disagree with a word you said about Peyton. GOAT-lite, and a far more likeable person and ambassador for the game. At this point I'm certainly more of Peyton fan than TB12. Brady justsimply better for longer.
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Based on what I've read about this latest lawsuit, Jerry Jones is a despicable individual. I suppose that is already known. Kind of in-line with most NFL owners I suppose.
Yeah, he's not exactly a pillar of human decency. :lol At the same time, from what I gather he's actually got a legit grievance here. He paid a ton of money to keep this quiet, and now it's out and people on prog music forums are calling him despicable. This can't be the first time NDAs regarding paternity have been violated, so I'm curious how this is supposed to play out. Or, for that matter, if it's even legal to have an NDA for that purpose.
edit: Oh, and when it comes to sleazeballs, Jerry's got nothing on Rich Dalrimple. Most people outside of Dallas wouldn't know of him, but he's been Jerry's/Dallas's longtime spokesman, and he's got his own problems going on right now.
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I do think Todd Bowles can be a good coach, though. The year he had Fitzpatrick, Brandon Marshall, and Eric Decker to work with on offense, the Jets went 10-6, and only barely missed the playoffs. The following year, Fitz could not stop throwing interceptions and they started something like 1-5. Also it was becoming apparent that McCaggnan's GM moves were not good ones. And then the third and final year of Bowles' tenure was Sam Darnold's rookie year. Enough said about that.
Bowles is no Arians, but he's had HC experience, some of it good, is already part of the org, and holds one of the most qualified resumes of assistant coaches in the league. Tampa Bay is 24-9 over the last two years and a sure shot to win the division again this year. And Arians is departing on his own terms. This is not a blow it up and build from scratch situation, especially now that Brady is back. If I were in charge of the Bucs, I'd be wanting to retain continuity as much as possible. This is no way a "rule" hiring. Bowles is the next man up in the organization.
Sure, it's by no means a sexy hiring. But that's something I've noticed from fans of winning teams, as a fan of a losing one. They are just like us, constantly complaining when their teams make smart, logical, un-sexy moves, undervaluing the continuity that makes their teams great.
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Look "I would say 90% of what I say is probably not what I'm thinking" doesn't mean that 90% is a lie. Any human living in a communal society does this on a daily basis. I can't necessarily go up to every woman I see and say "Wow, lookin' fine today, mama!"; I may lead with "Hi, it's nice to see you", though. Not a lie. Not what I was thinking, but not a lie.
Her: "Honey, do I look fat in this dress?" Me: "Well, it's hard to tell; that color doesn't work with your eyes." Not a lie. Not what I was thinking, but not a lie.
My kid: "Dad, I'm a total failure; I failed my test and I suck at field hockey." Me: "Well, sweetie, there's always next time; let's get ahead of that math before the next test, and as the pros say, you've got to focus only on the next play, the next game." Not a lie. Not what I was thinking, but not a lie.
Dream Team: "Tom Brady is the losingest loser to ever have lost. I hate him and want to see him dead. On the other hand, I want Patrick Mahomes to be my best friend and live in my basement." Me: "Your obvious bias towards Brady is both fascinating and intriguing. It's almost as if you NEED players like Mahomes to be successful to minimize Brady's accomplishments and justify your hatred of him." Not a lie. Not what I was thinking, but not a lie. No, actually, that WAS exactly what I was thinking. :)
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I'd assume as he got older and dealing with BB when going through Deflategate and his mom having cancer chamged him. Add the struggles of getting a contract with his pedigree he decided to take control of his career and now we see him leaning more to how Rodgers acts.
His resentment over deflategate just makes him a dumbass. He simply didn't understand what was happening. As for any difficulty "getting a contract," taking less for the benefit of the team was always one of the things that made him special. And it's not something that changed when he moved to Tampa. He's making less now than he was in NE. I don't see how that could really be a factor.
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I'd assume as he got older and dealing with BB when going through Deflategate and his mom having cancer chamged him. Add the struggles of getting a contract with his pedigree he decided to take control of his career and now we see him leaning more to how Rodgers acts.
His resentment over deflategate just makes him a dumbass. He simply didn't understand what was happening. As for any difficulty "getting a contract," taking less for the benefit of the team was always one of the things that made him special. And it's not something that changed when he moved to Tampa. He's making less now than he was in NE. I don't see how that could really be a factor.
Not taking less but having to take a deal laced with incentives and for 1 year with options. The way he was playing and winning SB's, no other QB with that pedigree would have to go through that. Look at the playoff failings of Rodgers but at his age, he got a long term huge deal. Brady was never afforded that with BB.
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I'd assume as he got older and dealing with BB when going through Deflategate and his mom having cancer chamged him. Add the struggles of getting a contract with his pedigree he decided to take control of his career and now we see him leaning more to how Rodgers acts.
His resentment over deflategate just makes him a dumbass. He simply didn't understand what was happening. As for any difficulty "getting a contract," taking less for the benefit of the team was always one of the things that made him special. And it's not something that changed when he moved to Tampa. He's making less now than he was in NE. I don't see how that could really be a factor.
Not taking less but having to take a deal laced with incentives and for 1 year with options. The way he was playing and winning SB's, no other QB with that pedigree would have to go through that. Look at the playoff failings of Rodgers but at his age, he got a long term huge deal. Brady was never afforded that with BB.
Which is exactly what he's playing under in Tampa. One year incentive-laden deal with voidable option years. Also, while he turned out to be correct, if he can't recognize that a team would lock him up years beyond the point where all other QBs have gone over the ledge, he's a dumbass for that, too.
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Based on what I've read about this latest lawsuit, Jerry Jones is a despicable individual. I suppose that is already known. Kind of in-line with most NFL owners I suppose.
Yeah, he's not exactly a pillar of human decency. :lol At the same time, from what I gather he's actually got a legit grievance here. He paid a ton of money to keep this quiet, and now it's out and people on prog music forums are calling him despicable. This can't be the first time NDAs regarding paternity have been violated, so I'm curious how this is supposed to play out. Or, for that matter, if it's even legal to have an NDA for that purpose.
Well, this is an interesting case for me. Generally, you can contract for most things, unless they are prohibited by statute, but one thing you can't do is contract such that performance would require one to break the law. So, here, her example is a response to an FBI inquiry about her parentage, with a penalty of perjury if she knowingly and with intent falsely represented her parentage. The contract can't prevent her from disclosing that, but the court will have to decide if it CAN give Jerry the right to respond accordingly, including by stopping the payment.
There are also requirements for there even to be a contract; generally minors cannot enter into a contract, and while a parent can bind their children to contracts, many jurisdictions have limits on that the YOUNGER the child is (the idea being that the younger the child, the less knowledge the child would have about the contract to begin with). It's my understanding that it's a jurisdictional question - meaning, it depends on the law controlling the dispute - whether a minor can disavow their obligations once they reach maturity. I would certainly question whether that agreement is binding on the then-one-year-old child to maintain confidentiality. That, of course, is the child's position in the lawsuit.
Most of the NDA's I've dealt with (and there are 100's) have a clear clause that removes the necessity for confidentiality once the information itself is publicly available and through no fault of the party meant to keep the secret. The key question is going to boil down to whether Jerry is still obligated to pay if the information is known for any reason. It's an NDA, so that's a real possibility; it does matter that the money was intended for another's wellbeing and care.
One thing I hate, though, is the sensationalist media calling this "hush money" as if this is a bad thing. It's perfectly legal to pay someone to refrain from disclosing information. We do this all the time. KFC. Coke. Any company that submits pricing or intellectual property as part of a bid or proposal. I think some people bristle when the concealment of the info is more about "brand" or "image" than something substantial, but it's not really that different. Don't you think Coke's brand would suffer if the "secret ingredient" was found out to be Old Bay Seasoning, or something like that? There are 100's of reasons for "discretion", and not all of them are bad. Paying for that discretion is not a crime and shouldn't be treated as one.
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I'd assume as he got older and dealing with BB when going through Deflategate and his mom having cancer chamged him. Add the struggles of getting a contract with his pedigree he decided to take control of his career and now we see him leaning more to how Rodgers acts.
His resentment over deflategate just makes him a dumbass. He simply didn't understand what was happening. As for any difficulty "getting a contract," taking less for the benefit of the team was always one of the things that made him special. And it's not something that changed when he moved to Tampa. He's making less now than he was in NE. I don't see how that could really be a factor.
Not taking less but having to take a deal laced with incentives and for 1 year with options. The way he was playing and winning SB's, no other QB with that pedigree would have to go through that. Look at the playoff failings of Rodgers but at his age, he got a long term huge deal. Brady was never afforded that with BB.
It's an interesting conundrum, though. What will people remember in 25 years? That Brady won 7, or Rodgers made $70M? I think to some degree they are related, in the sense that with the cap, the resources to staff a team are not infinite. I kind of view this as part of the trade-off for players to win. I've long written that not every skilled player is a "winner", and not every winner is necessarily the highest skilled player. There's a trait, there's a characteristic of winners. Look at a Brady, or a Joe Burrow, and compare that to a Warren Moon, a Dan Marino, or any of 100 other players who were good, but could never get over the hump. And there are those that have degrees of each, and it becomes a perfect storm when the gold ring is reached.
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I'd assume as he got older and dealing with BB when going through Deflategate and his mom having cancer chamged him. Add the struggles of getting a contract with his pedigree he decided to take control of his career and now we see him leaning more to how Rodgers acts.
His resentment over deflategate just makes him a dumbass. He simply didn't understand what was happening. As for any difficulty "getting a contract," taking less for the benefit of the team was always one of the things that made him special. And it's not something that changed when he moved to Tampa. He's making less now than he was in NE. I don't see how that could really be a factor.
Now he is but not back in 2016.
2016 - 2 year deal.
2019 - 1 year deal (his call because he wanted out) but because they again wouldn't give him a long term deal. No elite QB has to fight to get deals they want. No one.
Not taking less but having to take a deal laced with incentives and for 1 year with options. The way he was playing and winning SB's, no other QB with that pedigree would have to go through that. Look at the playoff failings of Rodgers but at his age, he got a long term huge deal. Brady was never afforded that with BB.
Which is exactly what he's playing under in Tampa. One year incentive-laden deal with voidable option years. Also, while he turned out to be correct, if he can't recognize that a team would lock him up years beyond the point where all other QBs have gone over the ledge, he's a dumbass for that, too.
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I'd assume as he got older and dealing with BB when going through Deflategate and his mom having cancer chamged him. Add the struggles of getting a contract with his pedigree he decided to take control of his career and now we see him leaning more to how Rodgers acts.
His resentment over deflategate just makes him a dumbass. He simply didn't understand what was happening. As for any difficulty "getting a contract," taking less for the benefit of the team was always one of the things that made him special. And it's not something that changed when he moved to Tampa. He's making less now than he was in NE. I don't see how that could really be a factor.
Not taking less but having to take a deal laced with incentives and for 1 year with options. The way he was playing and winning SB's, no other QB with that pedigree would have to go through that. Look at the playoff failings of Rodgers but at his age, he got a long term huge deal. Brady was never afforded that with BB.
It's an interesting conundrum, though. What will people remember in 25 years? That Brady won 7, or Rodgers made $70M? I think to some degree they are related, in the sense that with the cap, the resources to staff a team are not infinite. I kind of view this as part of the trade-off for players to win. I've long written that not every skilled player is a "winner", and not every winner is necessarily the highest skilled player. There's a trait, there's a characteristic of winners. Look at a Brady, or a Joe Burrow, and compare that to a Warren Moon, a Dan Marino, or any of 100 other players who were good, but could never get over the hump. And there are those that have degrees of each, and it becomes a perfect storm when the gold ring is reached.
Here's the thing, I don't think Brady wanted Rodgers money, he wanted 25 mil for 2. They couldn't even give that, plus he had incentive to get to 21 mil. Belichick did not want to go long term with Brady.
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Based on what I've read about this latest lawsuit, Jerry Jones is a despicable individual. I suppose that is already known. Kind of in-line with most NFL owners I suppose.
Yeah, he's not exactly a pillar of human decency. :lol At the same time, from what I gather he's actually got a legit grievance here. He paid a ton of money to keep this quiet, and now it's out and people on prog music forums are calling him despicable. This can't be the first time NDAs regarding paternity have been violated, so I'm curious how this is supposed to play out. Or, for that matter, if it's even legal to have an NDA for that purpose.
Well, this is an interesting case for me. Generally, you can contract for most things, unless they are prohibited by statute, but one thing you can't do is contract such that performance would require one to break the law. So, here, her example is a response to an FBI inquiry about her parentage, with a penalty of perjury if she knowingly and with intent falsely represented her parentage. The contract can't prevent her from disclosing that, but the court will have to decide if it CAN give Jerry the right to respond accordingly, including by stopping the payment.
There are also requirements for there even to be a contract; generally minors cannot enter into a contract, and while a parent can bind their children to contracts, many jurisdictions have limits on that the YOUNGER the child is (the idea being that the younger the child, the less knowledge the child would have about the contract to begin with). It's my understanding that it's a jurisdictional question - meaning, it depends on the law controlling the dispute - whether a minor can disavow their obligations once they reach maturity. I would certainly question whether that agreement is binding on the then-one-year-old child to maintain confidentiality. That, of course, is the child's position in the lawsuit.
Most of the NDA's I've dealt with (and there are 100's) have a clear clause that removes the necessity for confidentiality once the information itself is publicly available and through no fault of the party meant to keep the secret. The key question is going to boil down to whether Jerry is still obligated to pay if the information is known for any reason. It's an NDA, so that's a real possibility; it does matter that the money was intended for another's wellbeing and care.
One thing I hate, though, is the sensationalist media calling this "hush money" as if this is a bad thing. It's perfectly legal to pay someone to refrain from disclosing information. We do this all the time. KFC. Coke. Any company that submits pricing or intellectual property as part of a bid or proposal. I think some people bristle when the concealment of the info is more about "brand" or "image" than something substantial, but it's not really that different. Don't you think Coke's brand would suffer if the "secret ingredient" was found out to be Old Bay Seasoning, or something like that? There are 100's of reasons for "discretion", and not all of them are bad. Paying for that discretion is not a crime and shouldn't be treated as one.
The FBI never would have outed her, though. I'm guessing it would have been illegal for them to do so. I get that this is far more complicated than what a layperson would make it out to be, but it sure seems like she just wanted to renegotiate the deal, and used the FBI obtaining the info as an excuse to do so. To that end, sleazy though the whole thing is, I've kinda gotta take Jerry's side on this one.
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I'd assume as he got older and dealing with BB when going through Deflategate and his mom having cancer chamged him. Add the struggles of getting a contract with his pedigree he decided to take control of his career and now we see him leaning more to how Rodgers acts.
His resentment over deflategate just makes him a dumbass. He simply didn't understand what was happening. As for any difficulty "getting a contract," taking less for the benefit of the team was always one of the things that made him special. And it's not something that changed when he moved to Tampa. He's making less now than he was in NE. I don't see how that could really be a factor.
Not taking less but having to take a deal laced with incentives and for 1 year with options. The way he was playing and winning SB's, no other QB with that pedigree would have to go through that. Look at the playoff failings of Rodgers but at his age, he got a long term huge deal. Brady was never afforded that with BB.
It's an interesting conundrum, though. What will people remember in 25 years? That Brady won 7, or Rodgers made $70M? I think to some degree they are related, in the sense that with the cap, the resources to staff a team are not infinite. I kind of view this as part of the trade-off for players to win. I've long written that not every skilled player is a "winner", and not every winner is necessarily the highest skilled player. There's a trait, there's a characteristic of winners. Look at a Brady, or a Joe Burrow, and compare that to a Warren Moon, a Dan Marino, or any of 100 other players who were good, but could never get over the hump. And there are those that have degrees of each, and it becomes a perfect storm when the gold ring is reached.
Here's the thing, I don't think Brady wanted Rodgers money, he wanted 25 mil for 2. They couldn't even give that, plus he had incentive to get to 21 mil. Belichick did not want to go long term with Brady.
Nobody would. That's the point.
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I like this. Everything you said here comes out in one form or another in the Monday Night Football broadcasts he does. He's got a genuine love of the game, he's got a genuine appreciation and respect for those that play it at a high level, and he seems to have a genuine interest in those guests that DON'T have a connection to football, but love the game themselves. As you noted, it may be carefully crafted, but it FEELS real. It FEELS honest.
Yep, people in general, I think, just gravitate towards what feels real and honest, and I will usually two examples, the first of which I know you will like. ;)
Taylor Swift - for as many who roll their eyes about her writing about exes back in the day or her personal life, she puts it all out there. Everything she puts into her songs is real, is honest. It never feels fake or contrived. She never feels fake. And people get that, why is one reason people are drawn to her.
Scott Hall and Kevin Nash and the nWo - when they arrived in WCW in 1996, there was a "this is real" feel to it, and that sucked wrestling fans in. For as scripted as pro wrestling is, it felt like what they were doing was real and not just part of the script.
With Tom Brady, it often feels like he is saying one thing when you know he is thinking another. He comes off as fake. And I don't think that was just him doing the Patriots Way thing. He still comes off as a guy who you imagine says something while laughing to himself about what is really thinking.
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In 2016 someone would. Funny how the league in 2020 would only go 2 years with Brady but others....
Ryan Tannehill - Re-signed with Titans (4 years, $118 million)
Teddy Bridgewater - (3 years, $63 million)
You telling me that these 2 are better than Brady?
I find if funny how it all worked out. Maybe most thought Brady was a product of BB. I find that hard to believe.
Not a big deal El Barto but it is weird how in that 4 year period, it shook out that was for Brady.
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I like this. Everything you said here comes out in one form or another in the Monday Night Football broadcasts he does. He's got a genuine love of the game, he's got a genuine appreciation and respect for those that play it at a high level, and he seems to have a genuine interest in those guests that DON'T have a connection to football, but love the game themselves. As you noted, it may be carefully crafted, but it FEELS real. It FEELS honest.
Yep, people in general, I think, just gravitate towards what feels real and honest, and I will usually two examples, the first of which I know you will like. ;)
Taylor Swift - for as many who roll their eyes about her writing about exes back in the day or her personal life, she puts it all out there. Everything she puts into her songs is real, is honest. It never feels fake or contrived. She never feels fake. And people get that, why is one reason people are drawn to her.
Scott Hall and Kevin Nash and the nWo - when they arrived in WCW in 1996, there was a "this is real" feel to it, and that sucked wrestling fans in. For as scripted as pro wrestling is, it felt like what they were doing was real and not just part of the script.
With Tom Brady, it often feels like he is saying one thing when you know he is thinking another. He comes off as fake. And I don't think that was just him doing the Patriots Way thing. He still comes off as a guy who you imagine says something while laughing to himself about what is really thinking.
Do you feel like that for the 2 years he's been in Tampa minus the retirement thing? I felt he became a blabbermouth once he left NE. :lol
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In 2016 someone would. Funny how the league in 2020 would only go 2 years with Brady but others....
Ryan Tannehill - Re-signed with Titans (4 years, $118 million)
Teddy Bridgewater - (3 years, $63 million)
You telling me that these 2 are better than Brady?
I find if funny how it all worked out. Maybe most thought Brady was a product of BB. I find that hard to believe.
Not a big deal El Barto but it is weird how in that 4 year period, it shook out that was for Brady.
No, I'm telling you that they're younger. Bridgewater is never going to be as good as Brady when Brady's playing well, but one of them is in his prime years and one is a statistical outlier. Keep in mind all of this came up shorty after we saw Peyton completely break down. For how long have we all been speculating that Brady will hit the wall? Just because we were wrong and he hasn't doesn't mean that investing in him long-term would be a sensible decision.
If TB told you he could play for four more years would you offer him 130 million for 4 years right now? If he's correct he'd be an absolute bargain. If he's not then you just screwed your team for years to come. There's also the injury aspect. Teddy Bridgewater was able to come back from a devastating injury, in large part because of his age. The next time Brady misses time will quite possibly be the last time he plays. TB is a high risk/high reward investment, and the further the two separate the less sense it makes to commit.
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Oh, I get that El Barto. Let's talk 2016 though, it was Jimmy G that make BB think he didn't have to pay Brady. Once they traded Jimmy G, they "should" have locked up Brady to a long term deal. That's what was confusing to us Pats fans. Once you make a decision to trade one QB it should mean the franchise QB is here for the long run. That was perplexing. Not the 2019 deal. Once you saw that Brady got the no franchise tag on the contract, we knew he was probably gone.
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Oh, I get that El Barto. Let's talk 2016 though, it was Jimmy G that make BB think he didn't have to pay Brady. Once they traded Jimmy G, they "should" have locked up Brady to a long term deal. That's what was confusing to us Pats fans. Once you make a decision to trade one QB it should mean the franchise QB is here for the long run. That was perplexing. Not the 2019 deal. Once you saw that Brady got the no franchise tag on the contract, we knew he was probably gone.
Garoppolo was traded in 2017. Specifically because TB12 felt threatened by the presence of a younger QB on the roster. (Remember, no player is more important than the team!) 2018 would have been the time to sign him to a long term deal. He'd have been 40, and a little older than the Peyton Manning who couldn't throw the ball more than 20 yards, and could barely hold off Brock Osweiler for the starting job. There might have been GMs that had sold the farm for him, and in retrospect they'd have been right, but that doesn't mean it would have been a good move.
Also, part of the reason I don't much care for the guy is because of the JG deal. He forced NE to unload him, and then bailed himself. He should have just demanded a trade and gotten out of town. I think he handed it poorly.
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I'm not sure if he handled it poorly at all. He never brought it to the public like most players or their agents do. It was like a marriage gone wrong. I still lay blame more on BB. How he handled Brady towards the end is why the player left. His #'s were MVP caliber with no neck surgery like Peyton. Peyton fell off because of the injury. Which is too bad because his mind was still sharp as a nail. Guys like him and Brady know what's going on from the reads which is a talent like no other in the NFL.
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Based on what I've read about this latest lawsuit, Jerry Jones is a despicable individual. I suppose that is already known. Kind of in-line with most NFL owners I suppose.
Yeah, he's not exactly a pillar of human decency. :lol At the same time, from what I gather he's actually got a legit grievance here. He paid a ton of money to keep this quiet, and now it's out and people on prog music forums are calling him despicable. This can't be the first time NDAs regarding paternity have been violated, so I'm curious how this is supposed to play out. Or, for that matter, if it's even legal to have an NDA for that purpose.
Well, this is an interesting case for me. Generally, you can contract for most things, unless they are prohibited by statute, but one thing you can't do is contract such that performance would require one to break the law. So, here, her example is a response to an FBI inquiry about her parentage, with a penalty of perjury if she knowingly and with intent falsely represented her parentage. The contract can't prevent her from disclosing that, but the court will have to decide if it CAN give Jerry the right to respond accordingly, including by stopping the payment.
There are also requirements for there even to be a contract; generally minors cannot enter into a contract, and while a parent can bind their children to contracts, many jurisdictions have limits on that the YOUNGER the child is (the idea being that the younger the child, the less knowledge the child would have about the contract to begin with). It's my understanding that it's a jurisdictional question - meaning, it depends on the law controlling the dispute - whether a minor can disavow their obligations once they reach maturity. I would certainly question whether that agreement is binding on the then-one-year-old child to maintain confidentiality. That, of course, is the child's position in the lawsuit.
Most of the NDA's I've dealt with (and there are 100's) have a clear clause that removes the necessity for confidentiality once the information itself is publicly available and through no fault of the party meant to keep the secret. The key question is going to boil down to whether Jerry is still obligated to pay if the information is known for any reason. It's an NDA, so that's a real possibility; it does matter that the money was intended for another's wellbeing and care.
One thing I hate, though, is the sensationalist media calling this "hush money" as if this is a bad thing. It's perfectly legal to pay someone to refrain from disclosing information. We do this all the time. KFC. Coke. Any company that submits pricing or intellectual property as part of a bid or proposal. I think some people bristle when the concealment of the info is more about "brand" or "image" than something substantial, but it's not really that different. Don't you think Coke's brand would suffer if the "secret ingredient" was found out to be Old Bay Seasoning, or something like that? There are 100's of reasons for "discretion", and not all of them are bad. Paying for that discretion is not a crime and shouldn't be treated as one.
The FBI never would have outed her, though. I'm guessing it would have been illegal for them to do so. I get that this is far more complicated than what a layperson would make it out to be, but it sure seems like she just wanted to renegotiate the deal, and used the FBI obtaining the info as an excuse to do so. To that end, sleazy though the whole thing is, I've kinda gotta take Jerry's side on this one.
Well, I didn't get any of that from the one article I read (and I'm pointing fingers at the the one article I read, not you; I trust that you know more about this than I do), so if that's the case, then I certainly agree with you on this. Whatever you think about him, in the most simplistic of terms, if he entered into a deal of cash for silence - nothing illegal about that - if he's paying the cash, he ought to get the silence. And if the other party doesn't want to keep silent, they ought not keep the cash.
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I like this. Everything you said here comes out in one form or another in the Monday Night Football broadcasts he does. He's got a genuine love of the game, he's got a genuine appreciation and respect for those that play it at a high level, and he seems to have a genuine interest in those guests that DON'T have a connection to football, but love the game themselves. As you noted, it may be carefully crafted, but it FEELS real. It FEELS honest.
Yep, people in general, I think, just gravitate towards what feels real and honest, and I will usually two examples, the first of which I know you will like. ;)
Taylor Swift - for as many who roll their eyes about her writing about exes back in the day or her personal life, she puts it all out there. Everything she puts into her songs is real, is honest. It never feels fake or contrived. She never feels fake. And people get that, why is one reason people are drawn to her.
Scott Hall and Kevin Nash and the nWo - when they arrived in WCW in 1996, there was a "this is real" feel to it, and that sucked wrestling fans in. For as scripted as pro wrestling is, it felt like what they were doing was real and not just part of the script.
With Tom Brady, it often feels like he is saying one thing when you know he is thinking another. He comes off as fake. And I don't think that was just him doing the Patriots Way thing. He still comes off as a guy who you imagine says something while laughing to himself about what is really thinking.
Do you feel like that for the 2 years he's been in Tampa minus the retirement thing? I felt he became a blabbermouth once he left NE. :lol
Yeah, but even as a fan, there's a... smarminess to him now that wasn't always there. I don't know if it's the "celebrity" factor or what, but once the man "Tom" turned into the brand "TB12" it sort of got... sterile.
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Based on what I've read about this latest lawsuit, Jerry Jones is a despicable individual. I suppose that is already known. Kind of in-line with most NFL owners I suppose.
Yeah, he's not exactly a pillar of human decency. :lol At the same time, from what I gather he's actually got a legit grievance here. He paid a ton of money to keep this quiet, and now it's out and people on prog music forums are calling him despicable. This can't be the first time NDAs regarding paternity have been violated, so I'm curious how this is supposed to play out. Or, for that matter, if it's even legal to have an NDA for that purpose.
Well, this is an interesting case for me. Generally, you can contract for most things, unless they are prohibited by statute, but one thing you can't do is contract such that performance would require one to break the law. So, here, her example is a response to an FBI inquiry about her parentage, with a penalty of perjury if she knowingly and with intent falsely represented her parentage. The contract can't prevent her from disclosing that, but the court will have to decide if it CAN give Jerry the right to respond accordingly, including by stopping the payment.
There are also requirements for there even to be a contract; generally minors cannot enter into a contract, and while a parent can bind their children to contracts, many jurisdictions have limits on that the YOUNGER the child is (the idea being that the younger the child, the less knowledge the child would have about the contract to begin with). It's my understanding that it's a jurisdictional question - meaning, it depends on the law controlling the dispute - whether a minor can disavow their obligations once they reach maturity. I would certainly question whether that agreement is binding on the then-one-year-old child to maintain confidentiality. That, of course, is the child's position in the lawsuit.
Most of the NDA's I've dealt with (and there are 100's) have a clear clause that removes the necessity for confidentiality once the information itself is publicly available and through no fault of the party meant to keep the secret. The key question is going to boil down to whether Jerry is still obligated to pay if the information is known for any reason. It's an NDA, so that's a real possibility; it does matter that the money was intended for another's wellbeing and care.
One thing I hate, though, is the sensationalist media calling this "hush money" as if this is a bad thing. It's perfectly legal to pay someone to refrain from disclosing information. We do this all the time. KFC. Coke. Any company that submits pricing or intellectual property as part of a bid or proposal. I think some people bristle when the concealment of the info is more about "brand" or "image" than something substantial, but it's not really that different. Don't you think Coke's brand would suffer if the "secret ingredient" was found out to be Old Bay Seasoning, or something like that? There are 100's of reasons for "discretion", and not all of them are bad. Paying for that discretion is not a crime and shouldn't be treated as one.
The FBI never would have outed her, though. I'm guessing it would have been illegal for them to do so. I get that this is far more complicated than what a layperson would make it out to be, but it sure seems like she just wanted to renegotiate the deal, and used the FBI obtaining the info as an excuse to do so. To that end, sleazy though the whole thing is, I've kinda gotta take Jerry's side on this one.
Well, I didn't get any of that from the one article I read (and I'm pointing fingers at the the one article I read, not you; I trust that you know more about this than I do), so if that's the case, then I certainly agree with you on this. Whatever you think about him, in the most simplistic of terms, if he entered into a deal of cash for silence - nothing illegal about that - if he's paying the cash, he ought to get the silence. And if the other party doesn't want to keep silent, they ought not keep the cash.
I wouldn't trust that. :lol
My understanding of it is that the FBI was doing a simple FS-86 background check for her so she could access the White House as a congressional aide. Those are understandably confidential. You want people to be truthful. According to Jerry, who's obviously not a reliable source, she (via her attorney) approached him a couple of times to get more money out of him. When he (via his attorney) declined she went public. Obviously we don't know if that's true, but it does seem like there's no reason to go public unless you're looking to get a raise. Like I said, the FBI wasn't going to out her.
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I like this. Everything you said here comes out in one form or another in the Monday Night Football broadcasts he does. He's got a genuine love of the game, he's got a genuine appreciation and respect for those that play it at a high level, and he seems to have a genuine interest in those guests that DON'T have a connection to football, but love the game themselves. As you noted, it may be carefully crafted, but it FEELS real. It FEELS honest.
Yep, people in general, I think, just gravitate towards what feels real and honest, and I will usually two examples, the first of which I know you will like. ;)
Taylor Swift - for as many who roll their eyes about her writing about exes back in the day or her personal life, she puts it all out there. Everything she puts into her songs is real, is honest. It never feels fake or contrived. She never feels fake. And people get that, why is one reason people are drawn to her.
Scott Hall and Kevin Nash and the nWo - when they arrived in WCW in 1996, there was a "this is real" feel to it, and that sucked wrestling fans in. For as scripted as pro wrestling is, it felt like what they were doing was real and not just part of the script.
With Tom Brady, it often feels like he is saying one thing when you know he is thinking another. He comes off as fake. And I don't think that was just him doing the Patriots Way thing. He still comes off as a guy who you imagine says something while laughing to himself about what is really thinking.
Do you feel like that for the 2 years he's been in Tampa minus the retirement thing? I felt he became a blabbermouth once he left NE. :lol
Yeah, but even as a fan, there's a... smarminess to him now that wasn't always there. I don't know if it's the "celebrity" factor or what, but once the man "Tom" turned into the brand "TB12" it sort of got... sterile.
TB12 is another example of him being a bit of a douche. You're right. His tantrum over his own trainer being denied access is a good example of that. That might be an example of the beginning of his decline.
And this is more a question for King/TAC, but wasn't there a similar problem with his repaired knee? My recollection is that his insistence on using his own guy rather than the team's guy resulted in a significant infection and a delay in his recovery. I think they may have actually had to go back in and repair something they'd bungled. Again, not necessarily the behaviour of a team player.
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Bruce Arians is so chill with the cigar in his pocket during the press conference. Brady was there in the conference too and anyone watching that press conference can tell how chill the whole vibe is between them all. He did end with a mic drop moment thanking all the press across the country and saying how much of a pleasure it was. Then ended with "Florio, you can write what you want, It's ok"
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I like this. Everything you said here comes out in one form or another in the Monday Night Football broadcasts he does. He's got a genuine love of the game, he's got a genuine appreciation and respect for those that play it at a high level, and he seems to have a genuine interest in those guests that DON'T have a connection to football, but love the game themselves. As you noted, it may be carefully crafted, but it FEELS real. It FEELS honest.
Yep, people in general, I think, just gravitate towards what feels real and honest, and I will usually two examples, the first of which I know you will like. ;)
Taylor Swift - for as many who roll their eyes about her writing about exes back in the day or her personal life, she puts it all out there. Everything she puts into her songs is real, is honest. It never feels fake or contrived. She never feels fake. And people get that, why is one reason people are drawn to her.
Scott Hall and Kevin Nash and the nWo - when they arrived in WCW in 1996, there was a "this is real" feel to it, and that sucked wrestling fans in. For as scripted as pro wrestling is, it felt like what they were doing was real and not just part of the script.
With Tom Brady, it often feels like he is saying one thing when you know he is thinking another. He comes off as fake. And I don't think that was just him doing the Patriots Way thing. He still comes off as a guy who you imagine says something while laughing to himself about what is really thinking.
Do you feel like that for the 2 years he's been in Tampa minus the retirement thing? I felt he became a blabbermouth once he left NE. :lol
Yeah, but even as a fan, there's a... smarminess to him now that wasn't always there. I don't know if it's the "celebrity" factor or what, but once the man "Tom" turned into the brand "TB12" it sort of got... sterile.
TB12 is another example of him being a bit of a douche. You're right. His tantrum over his own trainer being denied access is a good example of that. That might be an example of the beginning of his decline.
And this is more a question for King/TAC, but wasn't there a similar problem with his repaired knee? My recollection is that his insistence on using his own guy rather than the team's guy resulted in a significant infection and a delay in his recovery. I think they may have actually had to go back in and repair something they'd bungled. Again, not necessarily the behaviour of a team player.
If I remember correctly there were infection issues. That was the worry after the surgery. We didn't know much about Guerrero until the 2010's as fans.
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Actually, isn't Brady on record as stating "90% of what I say is a lie"? So who knows when you're being played.
“I would say 90% of what I say is probably not what I'm thinking. Which is challenging, you know? And I really admire people that actually can do that, and say what they think, because they invite a lot of other things into their life. And I think there's part of me that doesn't like conflict." - Tom Brady.
We all know this is meant as under Belichick, no info was to be given out so he answered with a non answer. Lie, sure but that was to not give info, not because it's what he does all the time.
Thanks for the correction, couldn’t remember the context it was said in.
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I think another interesting question is this: does anyone think Brady would have unretired to play for an AFC team?
I don't. I think he saw how soft the NFC had gotten (Packers lost D Adams, Rams are the champs and could very well have a letdown like many SB winners do, 49ers QB situation is still a question mark, Cowboys are always paper champs, etc.), and figured he would have an easy path to another Super Bowl appearance.
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The Bucs schedule is still very loaded this year. Granted they could very easily take the division thus getting into the playoffs, but nothing is guaranteed. I seriously doubt Brady comes back to go to another team, it means another reset in getting familiar with a new set of players, coaches, schemes, planning etc.. I mean sure it can be done, but if he's looking to win another SB, I would think the chances are higher when going back to the team you won with one year and got close in the other.
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I think it's as much the duration as well. I was sort of - well, not sort of, I WAS - confused why he retired one year before he sets all kinds of longevity records. Correct me if I'm wrong, this season he becomes the oldest QB to start a game, the only QB to start a game at 45, and then all the things that flow from that (oldest to throw a TD, oldest to do this, oldest to do that...)
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I still maintain that he never really intended to retire. In retrospect the talk may have been a way of gaining leverage. I think he always intended to play with Tampa, just not necessarily under the [then] current regime.
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Arians has largely been a hands off type of coach, he's said so many times and always credits the coordinators and assistant coaches with the successes. With him gone, the coaching staff is still the same, he's just not going to be the one making the top level decisions. He still will be involved with the front office in some capacity.
I think at this point, most reporters and people in Tampa are scratching their heads with the Brady-Arians conflict that they now just joke about it. A few podcasts that I listen to of these guys were joking that Brady was there in conference room to make sure Arians quit.
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from the outside it seems that there was issues with play calling. The staff would call a play, Brady would see something else on the field and change the play so there was conflict going on there. With who in the coaching staff we can guess.
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From what I understand, Arians was an 8 to 5 head coach leaving the defensive game plan to Bowles and the offensive plan to Leftwich and Brady. When Arians came in on Tuesday he would dog-cuss the plan Leftwich and Brady came up with and began making changes. This really grated on Brady and was the supposed reason why he retired. He had already put up with BB's shit and he certainly wasn't going to put Arians bs.
The reason why they waited after March 1st was because there is an apparent loophole in the Rooney-Rule where you can hire the coach you want a without interviewing a black candidate. (This is what I heard in a podcast and I haven't fully researched it) The Bucs get a pass on this rule because they hired a black head coach.
Now, Arians will get a front office job, a salary and probably insurance so my guess is that he will probably be in the office a couple of hours a week and for the games OR he spearheads a wider foundation of getting women and black coaches in the pipeline. The coaching staff of the Bucs is half black (most in the league) and they have 2 women coaches on the coaching staff. You can thank Arians for that as he deserves a round of applause for especially seeing the potential for women as pro football coaches AND giving them the chance.
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If you're referring to the rumor put out by that one guy who was a former Patriot who knew a guy who heard from another guy that Arians would cross out Brady and Byron's plans with a red pen, I believe Bruce was befuddled by that. I don't think their relationship was hunky-dory and it definitely had tense moments but I doubt there was a falling out. Bruce said as much he would cuss everyone out, so no surprise there.
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If you're referring to the rumor put out by that one guy who was a former Patriot who knew a guy who heard from another guy that Arians would cross out Brady and Byron's plans with a red pen, I believe Bruce was befuddled by that. I don't think their relationship was hunky-dory and it definitely had tense moments but I doubt there was a falling out. Bruce said as much he would cuss everyone out, so no surprise there.
That guy had it right from the start.
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If you're referring to the rumor put out by that one guy who was a former Patriot who knew a guy who heard from another guy that Arians would cross out Brady and Byron's plans with a red pen, I believe Bruce was befuddled by that. I don't think their relationship was hunky-dory and it definitely had tense moments but I doubt there was a falling out. Bruce said as much he would cuss everyone out, so no surprise there.
That guy had it right from the start.
(https://forums.massassi.net/vb3/attachment.php?attachmentid=11668&stc=1&d=1146625413)
Saw that even Rich Eisen is addressing the Brady-Arians rumor
Rich Eisen’s Message to Everyone Who Still Thinks Tom Brady Forced Bruce Arians to Retire - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j13CS_NleSk&ab_channel=TheRichEisenShow)
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Based on what Eisen is saying, it almost makes more sense that Arians didn't want to go but retired so Brady could come back, but actually WANTED to go for other reasons and only retired BECAUSE Brady came back and Arians could know his legacy was solid.
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Browns might want to hold onto Baker.
https://people.com/sports/deshaun-watson-to-answer-whether-he-had-sex-with-massage-therapists-who-supported-him/
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Browns might want to hold onto Baker.
https://people.com/sports/deshaun-watson-to-answer-whether-he-had-sex-with-massage-therapists-who-supported-him/
They were so fucking crazy to guarantee that contract.
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Browns might want to hold onto Baker.
https://people.com/sports/deshaun-watson-to-answer-whether-he-had-sex-with-massage-therapists-who-supported-him/
Not that I am a Mayfield fan, but after the ridiculous contract the Browns gave Watson, a man who appears to have a lot of sexually deviant behavior, I hope Baker tells them to go spit if they hold on to him.
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Browns might want to hold onto Baker.
https://people.com/sports/deshaun-watson-to-answer-whether-he-had-sex-with-massage-therapists-who-supported-him/
Not that I am a Mayfield fan, but after the ridiculous contract the Browns gave Watson, a man who appears to have a lot of sexually deviant behavior, I hope Baker tells them to go spit if they hold on to him.
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Browns might want to hold onto Baker.
https://people.com/sports/deshaun-watson-to-answer-whether-he-had-sex-with-massage-therapists-who-supported-him/
Not that I am a Mayfield fan, but after the ridiculous contract the Browns gave Watson, a man who appears to have a lot of sexually deviant behavior, I hope Baker tells them to go spit if they hold on to him.
I'm sure there's more to it, like the variety is part of the attraction, and I'm sure there's an argument that these people are so self-centered that it never occurs to them that someone WOULDN'T want them, but I read stories like this and it just feels like they are so DUMB. Find one or two, maybe three, therapists that WILL give you the handy, the happy ending, and stick with it. Why flirt with disaster like that?
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Anyone catch that interview with Arians where he stated that Brady gets "way too much credit" for the plays Leftwich designs? Uh oh stirring the pot. But Florio and Simms commented on it and Simms made the correct point that QBs always get too much credit when things go right. The defense is playing really well? Must be because of the Quarterback.
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Anyone catch that interview with Arians where he stated that Brady gets "way too much credit" for the plays Leftwich designs? Uh oh stirring the pot. But Florio and Simms commented on it and Simms made the correct point that QBs always get too much credit when things go right. The defense is playing really well? Must be because of the Quarterback.
I am sure the point Arians is trying to get across is, "Teams win championships, not one man," but, as usual, he does it in way that makes him look like an ass.
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Anyone catch that interview with Arians where he stated that Brady gets "way too much credit" for the plays Leftwich designs? Uh oh stirring the pot. But Florio and Simms commented on it and Simms made the correct point that QBs always get too much credit when things go right. The defense is playing really well? Must be because of the Quarterback.
I think the only justifiable response to this is to suspend Tom Brady 8 games minimum.
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Anyone catch that interview with Arians where he stated that Brady gets "way too much credit" for the plays Leftwich designs? Uh oh stirring the pot. But Florio and Simms commented on it and Simms made the correct point that QBs always get too much credit when things go right. The defense is playing really well? Must be because of the Quarterback.
I am sure the point Arians is trying to get across is, "Teams win championships, not one man," but, as usual, he does it in way that makes him look like an ass.
In this case, the one man made the team better because of his leadership.
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Anyone catch that interview with Arians where he stated that Brady gets "way too much credit" for the plays Leftwich designs? Uh oh stirring the pot. But Florio and Simms commented on it and Simms made the correct point that QBs always get too much credit when things go right. The defense is playing really well? Must be because of the Quarterback.
Did anyone catch that Tom Brady was going to buy the Miami Dolphins AND become the starting QB with Sean Payton as the head coach? Then the Flores lawsuit was filed and Brady unretired.
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He would have to be traded. He was still under contract with the Bucs.
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He would have to be traded. He was still under contract with the Bucs.
Plenty of ways around that. As an owner, all he would have to do is trade for his own rights.
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Sure, if the other side agrees. Wouldn't you think Tampa might be upset?
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I am sure Brady could have strong armed the Bucs in to trading him, but it seems obvious now that he never had any intention of retiring and this was all just a ploy. He really is the new Brett Favre. :lol :lol
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Minus the interceptions. :lol
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Anyone catch that interview with Arians where he stated that Brady gets "way too much credit" for the plays Leftwich designs? Uh oh stirring the pot. But Florio and Simms commented on it and Simms made the correct point that QBs always get too much credit when things go right. The defense is playing really well? Must be because of the Quarterback.
I think the only justifiable response to this is to suspend Tom Brady 8 games minimum.
I feel like Dream Team would have no problem with that. He's also blaming Brady for talking Putin into invading Ukraine, and for egging on Will Smith at the Oscars. I'm pretty sure he'd support you if you called for international economic sanction against Brady, as well as banning Brady from the Oscars for ten years. ;) :) :)
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Anyone catch that interview with Arians where he stated that Brady gets "way too much credit" for the plays Leftwich designs? Uh oh stirring the pot. But Florio and Simms commented on it and Simms made the correct point that QBs always get too much credit when things go right. The defense is playing really well? Must be because of the Quarterback.
But Brady also covered up a bad team for example in 2019 where the team went 12-4 but were not that good of a team. Lost in the last week to Miami when they could have had a bye and then got clobbered in the wildcard game at home.
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Minus the interceptions. :lol
and the fun personality, or even being fun to watch in anything but the 4th quarter ;)
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Minus the interceptions. :lol
and the fun personality, or even being fun to watch in anything but the 4th quarter ;)
And no dick pics sent. :lol
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Anyone catch that interview with Arians where he stated that Brady gets "way too much credit" for the plays Leftwich designs? Uh oh stirring the pot. But Florio and Simms commented on it and Simms made the correct point that QBs always get too much credit when things go right. The defense is playing really well? Must be because of the Quarterback.
But Brady also covered up a bad team for example in 2019 where the team went 12-4 but were not that good of a team. Lost in the last week to Miami when they could have had a bye and then got clobbered in the wildcard game at home.
The 2019 Patriots had the number 1 defense in the league, and they pitched a shutout in the 2nd half of a playoff game in which they trailed by 1 point at the half, and Brady was unable to get a single score in the second half of the game to get them the win. Brady's greatness is unquestioned, but 2019 was not a shining moment for him.
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Brady had an average year. He obviously was frustrated with Bill but they wouldn't have been 12-4 without him.
Also, look who they had on offense. Belichick blew it in free agency and they tried Nutjob for one game at receiver and a 2nd round pick for Sanu who got injured and played through it and wasn't good.
The offensive was injured and not staffed correctly. David Andrews the starting center out all year. Edelman and Sanu playing injured, Goskowski (sp?)
Even with Brady's attitude, they still won 12. BTW, how were the Pats #3 D at the end of the season and the playoff game against the Bills? Lol
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Brady had an average year. He obviously was frustrated with Bill but they wouldn't have been 12-4 without him.
Also, look who they had on offense. Belichick blew it in free agency and they tried Nutjob for one game at receiver and a 2nd round pick for Sanu who got injured and played through it and wasn't good.
The offensive was injured and not staffed correctly. David Andrews the starting center out all year. Edelman and Sanu playing injured, Goskowski (sp?)
Even with Brady's attitude, they still won 12. BTW, how were the Pats #3 D at the end of the season and the playoff game against the Bills? Lol
That is different. The 2019 Patriots didn't have to face the beast that is Josh Allen in the playoffs. :P :P
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Still were the 4th best D in the league. Soooooooo...
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How about the 2007 Patriots offense? 1st in total offense. How did that work out in the Super Bowl? :biggrin: :biggrin:
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I always tip my hat to the Giants. What can you do. Though Brady did score the game winning drive, only to have the D blow it. :biggrin:
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I always tip my hat to the Giants. What can you do. Though Brady did score the game winning drive, only to have the D blow it. :biggrin:
14 points, dude. 14 points.
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Oh the O definitely sputtered at the end of the season.
I was at the Indy game where Moss made that one handed catch over the middle. That old stadium was so damn loud. It was earpeircing.
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Can you guys STFU?
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Shut it Needles.
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Tim has grand designs for this thread and intends to bring it to the promised land.
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(https://c.tenor.com/zXmuq4KvVDUAAAAC/yall-weird-kanye-west.gif)
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Bottom line is this; for all the debating and bickering and flat out hate, if you're a GM and you're starting a team and you can have any ONE QB and their career on your team, you're taking Brady and if you think about it, you shouldn't be in that job.
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Bottom line is this; for all the debating and bickering and flat out hate, if you're a GM and you're starting a team and you can have any ONE QB and their career on your team, you're taking Brady and if you think about it, you shouldn't be in that job.
You speak from the luxury of hindsight........
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Minus the interceptions. :lol
and the fun personality, or even being fun to watch in anything but the 4th quarter ;)
And no dick pics sent. :lol
haha yeah, touche
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Bottom line is this; for all the debating and bickering and flat out hate, if you're a GM and you're starting a team and you can have any ONE QB and their career on your team, you're taking Brady and if you think about it, you shouldn't be in that job.
You speak from the luxury of hindsight........
Of course.
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I am sure Brady could have strong armed the Bucs in to trading him, but it seems obvious now that he never had any intention of retiring and this was all just a ploy. He really is the new Brett Favre. :lol :lol
The only question now is, will we get to see him cry when he finally does retire? :lol
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Derek Carr sure as hell cashed in.
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Derek Carr sure as hell cashed in.
Wow. He’s way better than people realize so probably a smart move by LV.
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More Brady off-season drama! (https://sports.yahoo.com/sale-tom-brady-last-td-ball-for-518-k-voided-qb-unretires-005649060.html)
Looks like the buyer of Brady's "last TD football" has settled with the auction site and won't be paying the half million they bid for the ball. From the article it says the ball was returned to the owner, who I imagine is not very thrilled about Brady un-retiring. Maybe TB will send an NFT and bitcoin his way.
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Ugh. Not all is well in Niners land.
Jimmy G, who I like, is still on the team. If the team knows Lance is the guy this year I would have hoped they resolve that by now.
And now, the far bigger issue, is Deebo Samuel has requested a trade. HUGE blow. If he does get traded, this entire Niners offseason success will hinge on who they get for him, or, if draft picks, who they draft and how they do.
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I saw that, he is a huge piece of that offense, wonder what makes him ask for a trade now?
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Ugh. Not all is well in Niners land.
Jimmy G, who I like, is still on the team. If the team knows Lance is the guy this year I would have hoped they resolve that by now.
And now, the far bigger issue, is Deebo Samuel has requested a trade. HUGE blow. If he does get traded, this entire Niners offseason success will hinge on who they get for him, or, if draft picks, who they draft and how they do.
Deebo is seeing all the money being handed out to WR’s and I’m guessing he doesn’t think he should be used as a RB/WR hybrid anymore.
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Yeah, it's is exactly that. He doesn't want to run out of the backfield an average of 4 times a game which he is averaging.
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Ugh. Not all is well in Niners land.
Jimmy G, who I like, is still on the team. If the team knows Lance is the guy this year I would have hoped they resolve that by now.
And now, the far bigger issue, is Deebo Samuel has requested a trade. HUGE blow. If he does get traded, this entire Niners offseason success will hinge on who they get for him, or, if draft picks, who they draft and how they do.
Deebo is seeing all the money being handed out to WR’s and I’m guessing he doesn’t think he should be used as a RB/WR hybrid anymore.
He'd still get WR money. He's not even negotiating for his next contract with SF because he doesn't like his hybrid role. And considering the life expectancy of an NFL RB vs WR, he's actually got a decent point.
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Yeah, it's is exactly that. He doesn't want to run out of the backfield an average of 4 times a game which he is averaging.
His carries increased as the season went on and he had 27 carries in the playoffs (3 games).
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Feels like the days of finding players (who greatly outperform their draft spot) for cheap in the draft and keeping them for the duration of that rookie contract are coming to an end as players have figured out that they can get paid elsewhere.
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Something for any team wanting to trade for Deebo to think about: there are rumblings that he wants to be strictly a WR and not used a RB/WR hybrid the way he was last year. Well, eight of his 14 touchdowns came from running the ball, plus 365 rushing yards, so if you trade for Deebo and give him the big money he wants, you probably have to do it knowing that you cannot use his talents in the way the 49ers did in 2021. Obviously, he can still be a great WR being just a WR, as he had over 1,400 receiving yards last year - only 6 receiving TDs, but TDs are wildly unpredictable from one year to the next with WRs unless you're Jerry Rice in his prime - but it's something to consider.
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Something for any team wanting to trade for Deebo to think about: there are rumblings that he wants to be strictly a WR and not used a RB/WR hybrid the way he was last year. Well, eight of his 14 touchdowns came from running the ball, plus 365 rushing yards, so if you trade for Deebo and give him the big money he wants, you probably have to do it knowing that you cannot use his talents in the way the 49ers did in 2021. Obviously, he can still be a great WR being just a WR, as he had over 1,400 receiving yards last year - only 6 receiving TDs, but TDs are wildly unpredictable from one year to the next with WRs unless you're Jerry Rice in his prime - but it's something to consider.
For me, Deebo went from a great player to a good player, without having played a down. I'm a "put me in, coach" kind of guy, a Troy Brown kind of guy. He's a weapon, and you're paying for that weapon. This "I don't wanna this", "I don't wanna that" is billshot, IMO. Put me in, coach.
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Deebo... seen this show before... AB 2.0
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Something for any team wanting to trade for Deebo to think about: there are rumblings that he wants to be strictly a WR and not used a RB/WR hybrid the way he was last year. Well, eight of his 14 touchdowns came from running the ball, plus 365 rushing yards, so if you trade for Deebo and give him the big money he wants, you probably have to do it knowing that you cannot use his talents in the way the 49ers did in 2021. Obviously, he can still be a great WR being just a WR, as he had over 1,400 receiving yards last year - only 6 receiving TDs, but TDs are wildly unpredictable from one year to the next with WRs unless you're Jerry Rice in his prime - but it's something to consider.
For me, Deebo went from a great player to a good player, without having played a down. I'm a "put me in, coach" kind of guy, a Troy Brown kind of guy. He's a weapon, and you're paying for that weapon. This "I don't wanna this", "I don't wanna that" is billshot, IMO. Put me in, coach.
I get this, but I think the days of players just doing whatever coaches want them to do are coming to an end, and I am not sure that is a bad thing. Teams love to run players (RBs for example) into the ground knowing that they have a limited window to be highly productive, so they run them to death with no regard for their future to get as much as they can out of them. And if players figure out that that strategy is not for the greater good of their longtime health and productivity and push back, I can't blame them.
Deebo... seen this show before... AB 2.0
That seems unfair. I have seen of heard of zero behavior out of Deebo that indicates he is another Antonio Brown. A WR being a diva, if that is what you want to call Deebo, is nothing new.
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Players are keen to their shelf life, maximizing their payday and how long they can play these days. Deebo is that player.
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Something for any team wanting to trade for Deebo to think about: there are rumblings that he wants to be strictly a WR and not used a RB/WR hybrid the way he was last year. Well, eight of his 14 touchdowns came from running the ball, plus 365 rushing yards, so if you trade for Deebo and give him the big money he wants, you probably have to do it knowing that you cannot use his talents in the way the 49ers did in 2021. Obviously, he can still be a great WR being just a WR, as he had over 1,400 receiving yards last year - only 6 receiving TDs, but TDs are wildly unpredictable from one year to the next with WRs unless you're Jerry Rice in his prime - but it's something to consider.
For me, Deebo went from a great player to a good player, without having played a down. I'm a "put me in, coach" kind of guy, a Troy Brown kind of guy. He's a weapon, and you're paying for that weapon. This "I don't wanna this", "I don't wanna that" is billshot, IMO. Put me in, coach.
I get this, but I think the days of players just doing whatever coaches want them to do are coming to an end, and I am not sure that is a bad thing. Teams love to run players (RBs for example) into the ground knowing that they have a limited window to be highly productive, so they run them to death with no regard for their future to get as much as they can out of them. And if players figure out that that strategy is not for the greater good of their longtime health and productivity and push back, I can't blame them.
Exactly.
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Something for any team wanting to trade for Deebo to think about: there are rumblings that he wants to be strictly a WR and not used a RB/WR hybrid the way he was last year. Well, eight of his 14 touchdowns came from running the ball, plus 365 rushing yards, so if you trade for Deebo and give him the big money he wants, you probably have to do it knowing that you cannot use his talents in the way the 49ers did in 2021. Obviously, he can still be a great WR being just a WR, as he had over 1,400 receiving yards last year - only 6 receiving TDs, but TDs are wildly unpredictable from one year to the next with WRs unless you're Jerry Rice in his prime - but it's something to consider.
For me, Deebo went from a great player to a good player, without having played a down. I'm a "put me in, coach" kind of guy, a Troy Brown kind of guy. He's a weapon, and you're paying for that weapon. This "I don't wanna this", "I don't wanna that" is billshot, IMO. Put me in, coach.
I get this, but I think the days of players just doing whatever coaches want them to do are coming to an end, and I am not sure that is a bad thing. Teams love to run players (RBs for example) into the ground knowing that they have a limited window to be highly productive, so they run them to death with no regard for their future to get as much as they can out of them. And if players figure out that that strategy is not for the greater good of their longtime health and productivity and push back, I can't blame them.
Well, I can't blame them either on one level. But we'll wait a few years and tally the number of trophies that the Deebo's and Tyreek's have versus the number of trophies the Gronk's and the Edelman's have. It's all a matter of what your priorities are. I don't root for Deebo to get 1,000 yards or 100 catches. I root for my team to win the Super Bowl. I don't tune in on Sunday to see what Tyreek gets in yards after catch; I tune in to see someone beat the Chiefs. It's all a matter of your perspective.
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Okay, but all of that is a false equivalency. You can tune in wanting to see both. One does not diminish the other.
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Okay, but all of that is a false equivalency. You can tune in wanting to see both. One does not diminish the other.
I don't disagree that the one doesn't diminish the other, but as for false equivalency, it is and it isn't. Out of 100 fans of, say, the New York Giants, how many became Browns fans when OBJ went west, and how many said "The hell with him" and rooted for the next guy on the depth chart? I tend to think that outside of huge names like Brady, most people are beholden to the team not the player.
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Okay, but all of that is a false equivalency. You can tune in wanting to see both. One does not diminish the other.
To some degree, you can certainly strike a balance, but one can, in some circumstances diminish the other.
If Deebo plays for the 49ers next year, but with the understanding he is only to be used as a WR, he can do well and the team can do well. But I think it would be hard to argue that the offense can be just as dynamic like that as compared to the staff playing Deebo however they please.
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Okay, but all of that is a false equivalency. You can tune in wanting to see both. One does not diminish the other.
I don't disagree that the one doesn't diminish the other, but as for false equivalency, it is and it isn't. Out of 100 fans of, say, the New York Giants, how many became Browns fans when OBJ went west, and how many said "The hell with him" and rooted for the next guy on the depth chart? I tend to think that outside of huge names like Brady, most people are beholden to the team not the player.
Including big names. I've decided that Brady's a whiny little bitch. Fuck that guy. Not because he left, but because of how and why he left.
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Okay, but all of that is a false equivalency. You can tune in wanting to see both. One does not diminish the other.
To some degree, you can certainly strike a balance, but one can, in some circumstances diminish the other.
If Deebo plays for the 49ers next year, but with the understanding he is only to be used as a WR, he can do well and the team can do well. But I think it would be hard to argue that the offense can be just as dynamic like that as compared to the staff playing Deebo however they please.
That isn't really what Stadler and I were talking about. But I'm not so sure. A big part of why they started using him the way they did is because their starting lineup was so depleted, Jimmy wasn't at full strength, and Aiyuk was not performing up to standard. Shanahan was looking for options to try to make the offense start clicking when it was bogged down. And although I think it is still perhaps premature to call him an offensive "genius" as many do, he's definitely an above-average talent in that regard. I think they can and will be highly effective whether or not they employ Deebo the way they did last season.
As far as Stadler's and Barto's posts, I and a lot of other fans don't necessarily look at it that way. I take teams and players on a case by case basis. The 49ers will always be my team, but that doesn't mean I'll always root for every player they get. For players that leave and go elsewhere, it depends. Wherever Jimmy goes (unless it's the Rams or Seahawks), I'll root for him because I like him as a player. If Deebo goes, it depends. If it turns out that he in fact is a diva douchbag, then screw that guy. But unless that revelation comes out, as it stands now, I like the guy, and I would root for him too. On the flip side, when it comes to teams, 2 of my favorite teams since childhood, the Packers and Broncos, are almost unwatchable now. Rodgers and a couple of others on that team have become insufferable, and it makes it hard to root for them for me. And the Broncos...as long as they have Wilson on their roster, I will actively root against them.
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Well, I can't blame them either on one level. But we'll wait a few years and tally the number of trophies that the Deebo's and Tyreek's have versus the number of trophies the Gronk's and the Edelman's have. It's all a matter of what your priorities are. I don't root for Deebo to get 1,000 yards or 100 catches. I root for my team to win the Super Bowl. I don't tune in on Sunday to see what Tyreek gets in yards after catch; I tune in to see someone beat the Chiefs. It's all a matter of your perspective.
Okay, but the greatness of receivers, whether it be a WR or TE, is not measured in rings. They aren't QBs. Sure, Edelman having some rings is why some have deluded themselves into thinking he should receive serious HOF consideration, but I suspect most voters will have a good laugh about it in four years and he will fall of the ballot quickly. I know, I know, priorities and objectives are different ;), but if we are start looking at just rings, then that makes Antowain Smith and L Blount better than Adrian Peterson and Barry Sanders.
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Look, as I say in many of the P/R threads, nothing is black and white and same here. I'm not saying there are ABSOLUTES in anything. It IS, as Bosk says, case by case. Certainly I became a Pats fan because of Bill Belichick, and there are players I've followed - Kurt Warner for one - and others I've disliked even as they played for "my" team - Cam Newton. But GENERALLY, I feel the stats are in service of the wins. I think you ask any player - do you want Bradshaw's numbers, including rings, or do you want Marino's numbers, including rings? I feel like most would take Bradshaw. But I'm not really trying to relitigate the merits of Super Bowls over stats; it's really a different conversation. It's "individual stats" over "team accomplishments". Remember that Seahawks game when DK Metcalf didn't get any touches in the first half, he pouted like a whiny little bitch and Carroll acquiesced and tried to get him the ball and... pick six (or whatever it was; I don't remember the deets). That's not a team player. It's a team sport. If Deebo plays half his game, and the Niners don't make the playoffs, or go home in the early rounds, are you fans really going to tell me you won't feel like you left something on the table?
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Draft begins tonight. One of the most drawn out, boring events to ever be televised.
Can’t wait to watch all night!
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Draft begins tonight. One of the most drawn out, boring events to ever be televised.
Can’t wait to watch all night!
Looking like one of the more interesting ones. I can't recall a draft where nobody had any clue whatsoever what even the first three picks looks like. For once this seems like a draft where everybody's going to be flying blind and winging it as best they can. I can see a lot more trades than usual this time around, but they'll also be impossible to predict. There may be a supply and demand problem with teams wanting to trade back.
Insofar as NE goes, either an elite guard or DB falls to them or they trade back. In this case trading back is a great option. The middle rounds are particularly deep this year, and Bill does better with mid to late round picks than he does with early ones.
edit: Longshot draft prediction: NE trades up in the 4th round to draft a punter.
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edit: Longshot draft prediction: NE trades up in the 4th round to draft a punter.
Yeah, upon further consideration may they trade up in the second round to take a punter. :lol
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The Jets basically said fuck you to the later rounds and then had what might be the best draft of their entire existence.
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edit: Longshot draft prediction: NE trades up in the 4th round to draft a punter.
Yeah, upon further consideration may they trade up in the second round to take a punter. :lol
Well, the Ravens drafted the first punter, from Penn State, in the 4th round. Last time they drafted a punter was in 2004, also in the 4th round. Sam Koch has been with the team ever since.
Now that the names are in place, I’ll spend some time looking things over. I spend zero before and during the draft.
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edit: Longshot draft prediction: NE trades up in the 4th round to draft a punter.
Yeah, upon further consideration may they trade up in the second round to take a punter. :lol
Well, the Ravens drafted the first punter, from Penn State, in the 4th round. Last time they drafted a punter was in 2004, also in the 4th round. Sam Koch has been with the team ever since.
Now that the names are in place, I’ll spend some time looking things over. I spend zero before and during the draft.
And NE picked up an undrafted guy. Probably for the best. I figured they'd go for that Punt God kid because he's left footed.
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I'm not an NFL Draft nut at all. I hate the hype and speculation, and most years I typically just ignore the build-up and hear after-the-fact who my team ended up with and go "Cool, we'll see how they pan out over the next few years" and get back to looking forward to Week 1.
BUT- this weekend was brutal for Titans fans...
The Titans franchise wandered the wide receiver wilderness for about 20 years, finally found an absolute STUD in AJ Brown, and then cut him loose after just 3 years at age 24. WHAT?!?!?!?!? I understand the cap situation, I understand the market situation, etc. But still- AJ wanted to be a Titan, the Titans wanted him to be a Titan, and they couldn't between them make it work?!?!?
I'm understanding (rationally) what the Titans did, and why they felt they had to do it. Sounds like AJ was ultimately just asking for more than they could actually do. I don't think AJ foresaw that they'd actually cut him loose if he couldn't come down a lot further in his ask. And the Titans realized the bridge was gonna be too far and immediately went with "Plan B" in the draft so as not to be left completely empty-handed beyond 2022.
But still, sometimes it just sucks to love the team that you do, because the stomach punches just never stop... I'm sure some other fans of some of the other franchises can relate, but it doesn't make it any easier. What a crappy weekend.
Are the Titans the only team to come out of the 2022 Draft genuinely worse off (for THIS season) than they were going into it? Anyone else feeling that pain too?
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I'm not an NFL Draft nut at all. I hate the hype and speculation, and most years I typically just ignore the build-up and hear after-the-fact who my team ended up with and go "Cool, we'll see how they pan out over the next few years" and get back to looking forward to Week 1.
BUT- this weekend was brutal for Titans fans...
The Titans franchise wandered the wide receiver wilderness for about 20 years, finally found an absolute STUD in AJ Brown, and then cut him loose after just 3 years at age 24. WHAT?!?!?!?!? I understand the cap situation, I understand the market situation, etc. But still- AJ wanted to be a Titan, the Titans wanted him to be a Titan, and they couldn't between them make it work?!?!?
I'm understanding (rationally) what the Titans did, and why they felt they had to do it. Sounds like AJ was ultimately just asking for more than they could actually do. I don't think AJ foresaw that they'd actually cut him loose if he couldn't come down a lot further in his ask. And the Titans realized the bridge was gonna be too far and immediately went with "Plan B" in the draft so as not to be left completely empty-handed beyond 2022.
But still, sometimes it just sucks to love the team that you do, because the stomach punches just never stop... I'm sure some other fans of some of the other franchises can relate, but it doesn't make it any easier. What a crappy weekend.
Are the Titans the only team to come out of the 2022 Draft genuinely worse off (for THIS season) than they were going into it? Anyone else feeling that pain too?
I think we're in the midst of a seismic shift in the way NFL teams operate. We're already seeing the incremental fantasy football approach playing out, with teams spending huge on short term free agent acquisitions to win super bowls now, at the expense of future cap troubles. I think that's effecting the wide receiver market. Some teams are happy to blow 30m on a WR. Others are taking the exact opposite approach and trying to draft solid guys to keep them on rookie contracts. Thankfully, this is an experiment we'll watch playing out in the short term. We'll know how the two approaches work in a couple of years. Either way, I think this is another nail in the coffin of trying to build dynasties.
It's worth noting that the Patriots have been employing this strategy for a while with some success. NE hasn't kept very many players at all after their rookie contract ended, and the result is either a trade a year early or letting them split and getting a comp draft pick for them. Either way they trade experience and skill for affordable youth, an element of risk, and an extra draft pick or two. Losing JC Jackson and Joe Thuney hurts, but so would spending the 160 million to keep them both for a few more years. Their respective replacements are only guaranteed 52m, and if there's one thing NE has been consistent about it's grooming OL and DBs into studs. Ideally they both work out and in 4 years (maybe five for Strange) they repeat the process with a couple of added picks.
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Barto - I agree with you in that we are seeing a shift. I think that clubs are seeing that, depending on the circumstances, many players aren't going to see that second contract.
Many players are NFL ready because of the schemes they play in college, and I think NFL teams are recognizing this. QBs are a perfect example. I think the days of drafting a QB and trying to stick with him for 10 years are gone. If they haven't proven themselves within 3 or 4 years then it's time to move on. Big Ben and Russell Wilson are perfect examples. They both won SBs in their early careers but Big Ben hadn't won a playoff game in 10 years and Wilson hasn't done a thing in the past 6 years. Time to move on or was it "about time"?
I was going to get rid of my NFL Sunday Ticket but not now! :corn
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Barto - I agree with you in that we are seeing a shift. I think that clubs are seeing that, depending on the circumstances, many players aren't going to see that second contract.
Many players are NFL ready because of the schemes they play in college, and I think NFL teams are recognizing this. QBs are a perfect example. I think the days of drafting a QB and trying to stick with him for 10 years are gone. If they haven't proven themselves within 3 or 4 years then it's time to move on. Big Ben and Russell Wilson are perfect examples. They both won SBs in their early careers but Big Ben hadn't won a playoff game in 10 years and Wilson hasn't done a thing in the past 6 years. Time to move on or was it "about time"?
I was going to get rid of my NFL Sunday Ticket but not now! :corn
I think better examples of that QB thing are Baker Mayfield and Marcus Mariotta. Hot prospects out of college, but is anyone going to build a franchise around them now? Don't think so. But they will around that guy in Jacksonville, or the guy in Chicago. Or Mac.
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Barto - I agree with you in that we are seeing a shift. I think that clubs are seeing that, depending on the circumstances, many players aren't going to see that second contract.
Many players are NFL ready because of the schemes they play in college, and I think NFL teams are recognizing this. QBs are a perfect example. I think the days of drafting a QB and trying to stick with him for 10 years are gone. If they haven't proven themselves within 3 or 4 years then it's time to move on. Big Ben and Russell Wilson are perfect examples. They both won SBs in their early careers but Big Ben hadn't won a playoff game in 10 years and Wilson hasn't done a thing in the past 6 years. Time to move on or was it "about time"?
I was going to get rid of my NFL Sunday Ticket but not now! :corn
I think better examples of that QB thing are Baker Mayfield and Marcus Mariotta. Hot prospects out of college, but is anyone going to build a franchise around them now? Don't think so. But they will around that guy in Jacksonville, or the guy in Chicago. Or Mac.
I don't disagree at all with your examples but I guess my mindset was thinking about the old paradigm of finding a franchise QB and build around that for 10 years or more. Russ and Ben got to Super Bowls early in their careers and then their were many years of nothing. Should those franchises have moved on many years ago?
So Stadler, the examples you give show the evolution of Franchises treading lightly or even abandoning previous choices in a quicker fashion. First it was the running backs and now it's the QBs. Are the wide receivers next? Is this the owner's version of cost control?
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I don't know if it's the owner's version of cost control, but I think it is the owner's version of "it's no one player, we're bigger than the sum of our parts". The NBA is a star-driven sport; you CANNOT win with any consistency if you don't have a marquee player that can take over a game and carry his team on his back for a SERIES (not just one game). LeBron. Curry. Duncan.
Football, with a 55-man roster and 25 unique players at any given time (11 offense, 11 defense, kicker, punter, holder) can't be that on a consistent basis (and they haven't been; the Chiefs and Bucs prove that).
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So Brady is going into the Fox booth upon retirement for a lot of $$. Wonder how long before his minions declare him The Greatest Broadcaster of All Time.
On a serious note, can't wait for this season to start. So much intrigue with marquee players shuffling around. Schedule is announced tomorrow!
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So Brady is going into the Fox booth upon retirement for a lot of $$. Wonder how long before his minions declare him The Greatest Broadcaster of All Time.
On a serious note, can't wait for this season to start. So much intrigue with marquee players shuffling around. Schedule is announced tomorrow!
Well, he is. Duh. Let me guess: Oh, I forgot; Patrick Mahomes called one game back in high school for an assignment, and so it should be HIM that's the greatest broadcaster of all time. Got it. Can't wait to hear HIM on the marquee team with Joe Buck...
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It's crazy that Brady will be making more in the broadcasting booth than his total career NFL earnings.
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So Brady is going into the Fox booth upon retirement for a lot of $$. Wonder how long before his minions declare him The Greatest Broadcaster of All Time.
On a serious note, can't wait for this season to start. So much intrigue with marquee players shuffling around. Schedule is announced tomorrow!
In think he's going to fail miserably. The last thing Brady wants to do is go "on record" on anything. I suspect he's going the be just another stuffed shirt.
Greatest stuffed shirt ever though!! :metal :lol
In fact, just having Brady in the booth will no doubt cause Tony Romo to develop a stutter. :lol
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Considering Brady and Fox, I think there is a whole lot of shenanigans going on here with a few people being hung out to dry.
First, there was the whole Fox vs. Aikman negotiating fiasco. Aikman actually had to approach Fox about a new contract and after they gave him a low-ball offer, Aikman reminded them of where the market was for analysts (thank you Tony Romo) and Fox went radio silent. I think this was because there were already in negotiations with Brady for him to be their number 1 analyst or at the very least, they had had approached him.
I think the Fox gig was Brady's 3rd option because I think his first option was to become a minority owner in the Dolphins, play starting QB for the Fins with Sean Payton as the head coach which is why he retired from the Saints.
But then came the Brian Flores lawsuit putting the kibosh on the ruse.
So Brady decides to unretire citing some BS line of "unfinished business", Aikman goes to MNF and now Fox is left out to dry. What do they do now, go up to Greg Olsen, slap him on the back and say 'you know you were always our #1 didn't you'?
Then, Fox announces the Brady news of #1 broadcaster and Fox still doesn't have a number one announcer for the upcoming 2022 season.
On a side note, if Brady prepares for calling games in the booth as he does for playing football games then he'll be an outstanding analyst.
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The trick with Brady (as with any analyst) is whether he will be Troy Aikman - and call the game as they see it, including throwing some players under the bus if need be - or whether he will be Jon Gruden - and call the game in a manner that makes every player out to be a "fine young man" no matter what atrocity they just committed on the field. I love Jon Gruden, but that was the one thing that kept him from being A-list in the booth. Romo is somewhere in between, for me, as is Collinsworth (probably my two favorites, though). I think it's beyond debate that Brady has the intellect, the knowledge, and the media-sense to do the job; it's whether it's going to be real or not.
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Maybe it's just me, but never got any sense that Brady was interesting to listen to. Understanding the game is half the gig, but being able to talk knowingly about it is another, and I'm not sure if he's the right guy for it. Presumably FOX did their vetting and think he is, but we've also had some legendary misses in that department, with Whitten being the worst, and Talib not too far behind him.
Interestingly, announcers will always go and sit down with key personnel for the game they're covering that week. Romo was so sought after because every announcer that sat down with him walked away thinking he was born for the job, being highly knowledgeable and personable. I wonder if they've thought the same of Brady over the years. Honestly he's always seemed kind of boring to me.
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It’s also important that he has chemistry with his broadcast partner. If it sounds like the commentators are in two completely different time zones it creates an awkward listening experience. Commentators need to be able to play off each other, and Tom’s ability to do that with whoever he’s paired up with is crucial. Or FOX could give Peyton Manning a call and problem solved as Brady is never more entertaining than when he’s paired with Peyton.
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It’s also important that he has chemistry with his broadcast partner. If it sounds like the commentators are in two completely different time zones it creates an awkward listening experience. Commentators need to be able to play off each other, and Tom’s ability to do that with whoever he’s paired up with is crucial. Or FOX could give Peyton Manning a call and problem solved as Brady is never more entertaining than when he’s paired with Peyton.
I don't disagree with El Barto; he is boring. But I can come up with enough reasons why that might be beyond just his incapacity to be exciting, that I'll wait until I hear the broadcast. I never in a million brazillian years thought Tony Romo would be the top three announcers on football today, but there you go.
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It’s also important that he has chemistry with his broadcast partner. If it sounds like the commentators are in two completely different time zones it creates an awkward listening experience. Commentators need to be able to play off each other, and Tom’s ability to do that with whoever he’s paired up with is crucial. Or FOX could give Peyton Manning a call and problem solved as Brady is never more entertaining than when he’s paired with Peyton.
I don't disagree with El Barto; he is boring. But I can come up with enough reasons why that might be beyond just his incapacity to be exciting, that I'll wait until I hear the broadcast. I never in a million brazillian years thought Tony Romo would be the top three announcers on football today, but there you go.
I'd seen and heard more of him than you, being from Dallas and all. I wasn't surprised from a personality standpoint, but his understanding of the game is far better than I would have predicted. My thinking on Tom is the exact opposite. He's spent the last 15 years reading and carving up defenses. His understanding of what 22 people are doing on every play will be unsurpassed. Just not sure he'll be fun to listen to.
I will say that my only real problem with Romo is his enthusiasm, which is often times over the top to the point of being distracting as hell. Plenty of times I just want him to STFU. So maybe TB12 could be an improvement in that regard.
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Romo's lazy. He was great his first couple of years because he knew the players but as the years have passed and new players come and go, his lack of preparation became obvious and he looks like he just rolled out of bed sleeping in his wrinkled suit and no shave.
He did set the market for announcers though. ;D
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Have to say the Chargers' media team made a pretty good anime release of their schedule. Tons of nuggets in there, with references to Urban Meyer, Pat McAfee, etc.. They sure did their homework
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74KhDM9Z1Xk&ab_channel=LosAngelesChargers (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74KhDM9Z1Xk&ab_channel=LosAngelesChargers)
The Seahawks messed with their players by giving them the wrong schedule ahead of time and they were under the impression that's how the season was going to play out.
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It’s also important that he has chemistry with his broadcast partner. If it sounds like the commentators are in two completely different time zones it creates an awkward listening experience. Commentators need to be able to play off each other, and Tom’s ability to do that with whoever he’s paired up with is crucial. Or FOX could give Peyton Manning a call and problem solved as Brady is never more entertaining than when he’s paired with Peyton.
I don't disagree with El Barto; he is boring. But I can come up with enough reasons why that might be beyond just his incapacity to be exciting, that I'll wait until I hear the broadcast. I never in a million brazillian years thought Tony Romo would be the top three announcers on football today, but there you go.
I'd seen and heard more of him than you, being from Dallas and all. I wasn't surprised from a personality standpoint, but his understanding of the game is far better than I would have predicted. My thinking on Tom is the exact opposite. He's spent the last 15 years reading and carving up defenses. His understanding of what 22 people are doing on every play will be unsurpassed. Just not sure he'll be fun to listen to.
I will say that my only real problem with Romo is his enthusiasm, which is often times over the top to the point of being distracting as hell. Plenty of times I just want him to STFU. So maybe TB12 could be an improvement in that regard.
The knowledge is important; I think the Manning MNF broadcast is the best thing on sports television today. Listening to both Mannings dissect a play is for me, like seeing Kiss play in my living room.
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It’s also important that he has chemistry with his broadcast partner. If it sounds like the commentators are in two completely different time zones it creates an awkward listening experience. Commentators need to be able to play off each other, and Tom’s ability to do that with whoever he’s paired up with is crucial. Or FOX could give Peyton Manning a call and problem solved as Brady is never more entertaining than when he’s paired with Peyton.
I don't disagree with El Barto; he is boring. But I can come up with enough reasons why that might be beyond just his incapacity to be exciting, that I'll wait until I hear the broadcast. I never in a million brazillian years thought Tony Romo would be the top three announcers on football today, but there you go.
I'd seen and heard more of him than you, being from Dallas and all. I wasn't surprised from a personality standpoint, but his understanding of the game is far better than I would have predicted. My thinking on Tom is the exact opposite. He's spent the last 15 years reading and carving up defenses. His understanding of what 22 people are doing on every play will be unsurpassed. Just not sure he'll be fun to listen to.
I will say that my only real problem with Romo is his enthusiasm, which is often times over the top to the point of being distracting as hell. Plenty of times I just want him to STFU. So maybe TB12 could be an improvement in that regard.
The knowledge is important; I think the Manning MNF broadcast is the best thing on sports television today. Listening to both Mannings dissect a play is for me, like seeing Kiss play in my living room.
You could always book mini-kiss to play at your house. They'll probably fit in the living room...
Back to the topic at hand, I'm not sure if any of you other guys around my age (cough...nearing 50...cough) can remember, but Joe Montana tried to do some broadcasting work in the mid 90's after he retired. It was painful to watch. Obviously, he had an amazing mind for the game, but it did not translate to TV in the least.
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There's a sports axiom that the best players don't make the best coaches and teachers because it comes so easy for them it's hard to translate that. You tend to find - at least in baseball, for example - the utility players, the guys that had to work hard at the little aspects of the game - tend to do better as coaches and managers.
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NFCW vs. AFCW!! I'm going to LOVE this season!!!
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There's a sports axiom that the best players don't make the best coaches and teachers because it comes so easy for them it's hard to translate that. You tend to find - at least in baseball, for example - the utility players, the guys that had to work hard at the little aspects of the game - tend to do better as coaches and managers.
Perfectly true. Ted Williams, arguably the greatest hitter in baseball history, was a terrible manager in contrast to all the scrub players you mentioned. Dusty Baker is probably the best former player that also became an excellent manager but he was no superstar, just a really solid player.
One of the challenges for Tom will be how far to go with critique - but as Florio and Simms brought out last week, no one could really give him any pushback. So I'm hoping he'll call out bad decisions when he sees them.
Chiefs have the #1 hardest schedule, and the Steelers are up there also. Gonna be another nail-biting season for me. :lol
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So Dwayne Haskins was .20+ BAC and had drugs in his system, plus had a woman in the car who was not his wife. Some people just DO NOT ever learn anything, and you can understand why GMs are so reluctant to sign players with checkered pasts.
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Bumping this thread just to say that Deshaun Watson is a vile piece of trash, and also . . .
LOL at the clown franchise that the Browns continue to be. :lol. Well spent 230 million.
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There's always more timely dirt waiting to be released. Lol
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I know I'm a horrible person and all, but "he used Instagram to solicit massages from random strangers." And?
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I know I'm a horrible person and all, but "he used Instagram to solicit massages from random strangers." And?
Dude. Have you read any of the complaints from the 24 who are pressing charges?
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I've generally stayed out of this conversation (I wasn't in the room, and so I have nothing to offer; I don't know if he's a scumbag piece of shit, or telling the truth, and I don't know if they are strong, courageous heroes, or looking for a payday) but as much as I want this to be based on the facts of the matter, and as much as I am adamant that if they weren't consenting, his behavior was unacceptable, it's bothersome that so many innocuous facts are deemed "proof" simply because of their lasciviousness.
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As a person who regularly gets massages and has for years, I can safely say I believe that most are like me and are pretty monogamous when it comes to massage therapists. They are like a good barber or stylist: when you find one you like, you stick with him or her. You don't bounce from one to the other on a weekly/monthly basis. So yeah, there is no way I believe that Watson is innocent here. There is just too much smoke for there not to be a forest fire.
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66 masseuses in 17 months. Sure, totally innocent. ::) Most of the sexual assault complaints are disgusting; in addition to a LENGTHY suspension he needs to agree to extensive therapy.
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As a person who regularly gets massages and has for years, I can safely say I believe that most are like me and are pretty monogamous when it comes to massage therapists. They are like a good barber or stylist: when you find one you like, you stick with him or her. You don't bounce from one to the other on a weekly/monthly basis. So yeah, there is no way I believe that Watson is innocent here. There is just too much smoke for there not to be a forest fire.
Agreed to this; my best friend's wife is a masseuse, and she has a stable of clients; it's a structure that's almost identical to the woman that cuts my hair. Having said that, does travel fit in here anywhere? Again, I'm not looking to absolve this guy; I'm not on a "side" here, just looking to see what the strength is of what is largely circumstantial (albeit compelling) evidence.
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It has been reported that when the Texans went through their background checks, Watson came back squeaky clean. No issues, no red flags nothing. I doubt that one becomes a sexual predator overnight so that's an angle to pay attention to.
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It has been reported that when the Texans went through their background checks, Watson came back squeaky clean. No issues, no red flags nothing. I doubt that one becomes a sexual predator overnight so that's an angle to pay attention to.
I'm not sure I understand what you are getting at. Are you saying that the background check weighs in favor of his innocence? Are you saying the Texans organization is closing ranks to protect themselves because of a bad investigation? Or something else?
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It has been reported that when the Texans went through their background checks, Watson came back squeaky clean. No issues, no red flags nothing. I doubt that one becomes a sexual predator overnight so that's an angle to pay attention to.
I'm not sure I understand what you are getting at. Are you saying that the background check weighs in favor of his innocence? Are you saying the Texans organization is closing ranks to protect themselves because of a bad investigation? Or something else?
It seems Watson was squeaky clean in high school and college and he was deemed by scouts as a franchise quarterback capable of being the face of the organization. (And yes, NFL security goes back to at the very least high school investigating players) So I am thinking that something is amiss. The questions I have are:
- How did a squeaky clean player harass 66 women since he entered the league?
Did this behavior suddenly begin when he entered the NFL or is this part of a pattern that goes back to his college days and possibly further?
Was there indeed a cover up by Houston? (as I understand, the Texans have been named in one of the newer lawsuits)
Will Watson ever play a down in the NFL again? (serious question)
I am not accusing him of anything but this latest news makes me wonder.
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it's bothersome that so many innocuous facts are deemed "proof" simply because of their lasciviousness.
And the number of tangential elements that may or may not be meaningful, but necessarily equal guilt when lumped together.
Also, am I the only one that looks at these sorts of things crooked when one lawyer comes up with 24 complainants? Kind of seems to me that 24 women seeking attorneys to sue him is one thing. One attorney seeking 24 women to allege wrong-doing is very different.
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it's bothersome that so many innocuous facts are deemed "proof" simply because of their lasciviousness.
And the number of tangential elements that may or may not be meaningful, but necessarily equal guilt when lumped together.
Also, am I the only one that looks at these sorts of things crooked when one lawyer comes up with 24 complainants? Kind of seems to me that 24 women seeking attorneys to sue him is one thing. One attorney seeking 24 women to allege wrong-doing is very different.
It's a factor to be sure. That attorney is almost certainly working on contingency, and having 24 bites at the apple is better than having one.
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I don’t pooh-pooh 24 accounts of sexual assault. But that’s just me, I’m used to being on an island.
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I don’t pooh-pooh 24 accounts of sexual assault. But that’s just me, I’m used to being on an island.
Nor should you. I don't. I pooh-pooh some of them, though, and I don't use those to prop up the presumption of guilt for the others. I just try to look at these things objectively in the interest of fairness.
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Just popping in to say that I found myself thinking today that I can not wait for NFL season to begin. Less than 3 months away :metal
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Just popping in to say that I found myself thinking today that I can not wait for NFL season to begin. Less than 3 months away :metal
I'm with ya brutha! :metal :metal
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I don’t pooh-pooh 24 accounts of sexual assault. But that’s just me, I’m used to being on an island.
Nor should you. I don't. I pooh-pooh some of them, though, and I don't use those to prop up the presumption of guilt for the others. I just try to look at these things objectively in the interest of fairness.
I get what you are saying in your various posts on this.
And as someone who hates the "people are guilty nowadays until they prove their innocence" mob mentality of today, I just find his credibility sorely lacking for the reasons I stated the other day (no one goes to that many massage therapists in that span of time if their intentions are totally pure).
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I don’t pooh-pooh 24 accounts of sexual assault. But that’s just me, I’m used to being on an island.
Nor should you. I don't. I pooh-pooh some of them, though, and I don't use those to prop up the presumption of guilt for the others. I just try to look at these things objectively in the interest of fairness.
I get what you are saying in your various posts on this.
And as someone who hates the "people are guilty nowadays until they prove their innocence" mob mentality of today, I just find his credibility sorely lacking for the reasons I stated the other day (no one goes to that many massage therapists in that span of time if their intentions are totally pure).
While I get what people are saying about innocent until proven guilty - don't the innocent have the duty to bring forth proof that they ARE innocent. A person does not get the right to claim harm to them without proof. One does not claim an election was stolen with any credibility without proof.
So far, there has been no proof on either side but Watson still has an uphill battle.
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Deshaun Watson should've just went to the Orchids Of Asia.
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I don’t pooh-pooh 24 accounts of sexual assault. But that’s just me, I’m used to being on an island.
Nor should you. I don't. I pooh-pooh some of them, though, and I don't use those to prop up the presumption of guilt for the others. I just try to look at these things objectively in the interest of fairness.
I get what you are saying in your various posts on this.
And as someone who hates the "people are guilty nowadays until they prove their innocence" mob mentality of today, I just find his credibility sorely lacking for the reasons I stated the other day (no one goes to that many massage therapists in that span of time if their intentions are totally pure).
His intentions don't have to be totally pure, though. They just have to be something other than predatory. He went to that many masseurs because he was looking for hot chicks to jerk him off. While we don't need to debate the purity of shopping around for hand jobs, we do need to understand that's a far cry from assaulting women (and also tacitly legal). To be clear, some of the allegations are highly problematic, and if he's guilty of them he needs to be nailed to a tree. I'm not on his side here. Most of them all kind of sounded kind of samey, and weren't really what I'd view as predatory. Based on what I've read here he saw something like 66 women during the time span in question. Twenty four are suing him. Of those, only a small fraction of the allegations seemed to me like assaultive behavior. We should be making sure he's held accountable for those, and the others are mostly there to cloud the waters and frame public opinion.
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While I get what people are saying about innocent until proven guilty - don't the innocent have the duty to bring forth proof that they ARE innocent. A person does not get the right to claim harm to them without proof. One does not claim an election was stolen with any credibility without proof.
So far, there has been no proof on either side but Watson still has an uphill battle.
No.
His intentions don't have to be totally pure, though. They just have to be something other than predatory. He went to that many masseurs because he was looking for hot chicks to jerk him off. While we don't need to debate the purity of shopping around for hand jobs, we do need to understand that's a far cry from assaulting women (and also tacitly legal). To be clear, some of the allegations are highly problematic, and if he's guilty of them he needs to be nailed to a tree. I'm not on his side here. Most of them all kind of sounded kind of samey, and weren't really what I'd view as predatory. Based on what I've read here he saw something like 66 women during the time span in question. Twenty four are suing him. Of those, only a small fraction of the allegations seemed to me like assaultive behavior. We should be making sure he's held accountable for those, and the others are mostly there to cloud the waters and frame public opinion.
Fair points. :tup :tup
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Deshaun Watson should've just went to the Orchids Of Asia.
Old people understand the value of discretion. I've said it before and I'll say it again: when privacy matters and money doesn't, deal only with professionals. DeShaun should have learned from Tiger Woods.
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I don’t pooh-pooh 24 accounts of sexual assault. But that’s just me, I’m used to being on an island.
Nor should you. I don't. I pooh-pooh some of them, though, and I don't use those to prop up the presumption of guilt for the others. I just try to look at these things objectively in the interest of fairness.
I get what you are saying in your various posts on this.
And as someone who hates the "people are guilty nowadays until they prove their innocence" mob mentality of today, I just find his credibility sorely lacking for the reasons I stated the other day (no one goes to that many massage therapists in that span of time if their intentions are totally pure).
While I get what people are saying about innocent until proven guilty - don't the innocent have the duty to bring forth proof that they ARE innocent. A person does not get the right to claim harm to them without proof. One does not claim an election was stolen with any credibility without proof.
So far, there has been no proof on either side but Watson still has an uphill battle.
No, actually, they do not, with very, very few exceptions (usually around the validity of defenses). I don't mean this personally, but that's a stunning statement right there. It is BEDROCK to our system of jurisprudence that the defense doesn't have to say a WORD in trial if it thinks the prosecution didn't make it's case.
And don't muddy the waters here with election stuff; Trump is not Watson and Watson is not Trump. They are on opposite sides of the table, so to speak.
I'm honest-to-god floored by that. How many other people here believe that the innocent have to prove their innocence? That certainly explains a lot of what is seen on social media, I'll give you that. I thought that was one of the basic things that all people just "knew".
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I don’t pooh-pooh 24 accounts of sexual assault. But that’s just me, I’m used to being on an island.
Nor should you. I don't. I pooh-pooh some of them, though, and I don't use those to prop up the presumption of guilt for the others. I just try to look at these things objectively in the interest of fairness.
I get what you are saying in your various posts on this.
And as someone who hates the "people are guilty nowadays until they prove their innocence" mob mentality of today, I just find his credibility sorely lacking for the reasons I stated the other day (no one goes to that many massage therapists in that span of time if their intentions are totally pure).
While I get what people are saying about innocent until proven guilty - don't the innocent have the duty to bring forth proof that they ARE innocent. A person does not get the right to claim harm to them without proof. One does not claim an election was stolen with any credibility without proof.
So far, there has been no proof on either side but Watson still has an uphill battle.
No, actually, they do not, with very, very few exceptions (usually around the validity of defenses). I don't mean this personally, but that's a stunning statement right there. It is BEDROCK to our system of jurisprudence that the defense doesn't have to say a WORD in trial if it thinks the prosecution didn't make it's case.
And don't muddy the waters here with election stuff; Trump is not Watson and Watson is not Trump. They are on opposite sides of the table, so to speak.
I'm honest-to-god floored by that. How many other people here believe that the innocent have to prove their innocence? That certainly explains a lot of what is seen on social media, I'll give you that. I thought that was one of the basic things that all people just "knew".
I did a double take when I read that as well. I didn't chime in because I don't think that's how he really meant it. It's kind of contradictory with the next sentence.
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I can see how that sentence could be confusing so my bad for that.
I guess what I am asking is this - does a person have the right to sue someone for damages and receive compensation without evidence?
And the election example is valid - 60 cases - no proof - cases tossed.
I am not trying to be contentious and if Watson did these deeds then he should definitely be punished.
Also, I am not a lawyer so I am willing to be corrected on my stance.
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I can see how that sentence could be confusing so my bad for that.
I guess what I am asking is this - does a person have the right to sue someone for damages and receive compensation without evidence?
And the election example is valid - 60 cases - no proof - cases tossed.
I am not trying to be contentious and if Watson did these deeds then he should definitely be punished.
Also, I am not a lawyer so I am willing to be corrected on my stance.
Anybody can sue for damages. If there's no evidence you'll probably not make it to trial, though, and you'll almost certainly lose once you get there. However, in a case like this testimony is evidence. It'll be up to a jury to determine who's credible. I suspect that's why you've got 24 plaintiffs right now (more will show up).
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I can see how that sentence could be confusing so my bad for that.
I guess what I am asking is this - does a person have the right to sue someone for damages and receive compensation without evidence?
And the election example is valid - 60 cases - no proof - cases tossed.
I am not trying to be contentious and if Watson did these deeds then he should definitely be punished.
Also, I am not a lawyer so I am willing to be corrected on my stance.
Well, one thing that might help is if you keep your plaintiff and defendant's straight. The burden of proof is on those MAKING the allegations. Trump has to prove the election was a fraud if he brings suit (he's the PLAINTIFF). The women have to prove Watson assaulted them (they are the PLAINTIFFS). If I sue you for damages, I am the PLAINTIFF and I have to prove you did or didn't do what I allege. You needn't lift a finger to prove anything if you don't feel it is warranted, and you - the DEFENSE - can still win.
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I can see how that sentence could be confusing so my bad for that.
I guess what I am asking is this - does a person have the right to sue someone for damages and receive compensation without evidence?
And the election example is valid - 60 cases - no proof - cases tossed.
I am not trying to be contentious and if Watson did these deeds then he should definitely be punished.
Also, I am not a lawyer so I am willing to be corrected on my stance.
Well, one thing that might help is if you keep your plaintiff and defendant's straight. The burden of proof is on those MAKING the allegations. Trump has to prove the election was a fraud if he brings suit (he's the PLAINTIFF). The women have to prove Watson assaulted them (they are the PLAINTIFFS). If I sue you for damages, I am the PLAINTIFF and I have to prove you did or didn't do what I allege. You needn't lift a finger to prove anything if you don't feel it is warranted, and you - the DEFENSE - can still win.
OK - based on your explanation, I can definitely see why you guys were scratching your heads based on my of my previous comments.
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OK - I heard a few hours ago that of the 24 cases against Watson, all but four have been settled.
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Seems the Cleveland Browns paid them off..
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Twenty out of twenty-four sounds about right. I'm guessing the four remaining are the original complainants with serious beefs with the guy.
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I saw an interesting idea for what Watson's suspension should be: he gets 1 regular season game for every settlement. And he is ineligible to play in the postseason until he has served all of the games he is suspended for in the regular season.
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I saw an interesting idea for what Watson's suspension should be: he gets 1 regular season game for every settlement. And he is ineligible to play in the postseason until he has served all of the games he is suspended for in the regular season.
And if my last name is Rooney, I'm rounding up every woman I can find to make baseless accusations about him, knowing that it'll still be cheaper for him to settle than to defend against them. That's the problem with settlements. The complaints need not have any merit whatsoever, so long as the desired settlement amount is less than the cost of disproving the allegation, and I suspect any lawyer worth a damn knows what that magic number is.
That's exactly why I said 20/24 sounded about right. The four with legitimate grievances are hanging tight.
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I saw an interesting idea for what Watson's suspension should be: he gets 1 regular season game for every settlement. And he is ineligible to play in the postseason until he has served all of the games he is suspended for in the regular season.
And if my last name is Rooney, I'm rounding up every woman I can find to make baseless accusations about him, knowing that it'll still be cheaper for him to settle than to defend against them. That's the problem with settlements. The complaints need not have any merit whatsoever, so long as the desired settlement amount is less than the cost of disproving the allegation, and I suspect any lawyer worth a damn knows what that magic number is.
That's exactly why I said 20/24 sounded about right. The four with legitimate grievances are hanging tight.
Agreed.
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The WSJ has an article (https://www.wsj.com/articles/deshaun-watson-nfl-suspension-contract-11656194645)where they mention the NFL is getting ready to dole out Watson's punishment, going to be interesting after all said and done what the actual number of games the suspension will be.
The NFL is pushing for an indefinite suspension that would last no shorter than one year for Watson, people familiar with the matter said. That would mean he would be out for one season, at least, before he could apply to be reinstated.
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The WSJ has an article (https://www.wsj.com/articles/deshaun-watson-nfl-suspension-contract-11656194645)where they mention the NFL is getting ready to dole out Watson's punishment, going to be interesting after all said and done what the actual number of games the suspension will be.
The NFL is pushing for an indefinite suspension that would last no shorter than one year for Watson, people familiar with the matter said. That would mean he would be out for one season, at least, before he could apply to be reinstated.
That's what I am seeing today after the hearings have started. I predicated at least 1 year some time ago. The Browns did the only Browns thing they could do by signing a guy almost certainly to get a lengthy suspension while completely alienating the guy that had been doing a decent job for them for the last few years. If I were Baker, I'd tell them to pound sand if they came groveling to him to handle the next season knowing it was a fill in spot only.
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I heard on the radio that they're pushing for an indefinite suspension because something like the statute of limitations of these claims expires in March of 2023. The NFL doesn't want to be in a position where they suspend him for a year, and then new allegations or evidence is introduced. They only want to suspend once, and an indefinite suspension guards against that.
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Didn't the Browns already sign some other QB? I think they also made Watson's 1st year contract for just a million dollars so he's not losing much of that $230 mil. Either way Browns just hosed themselves me thinks.
I think I read Seattle has some interest in Baker if the Browns eat some of his contract.
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So looks like the Seattle interest for Baker was a dud story, it was the Panthers all along that wanted Baker Mayfield. Interesting that the first game the Panther play this season are the ...Browns. lol
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The more I think about it, on the one hand, I'll give the Browns credit for bailing on a QB they knew wasn't that good, but on the other hand, bailing on him by giving the money they did to a guy accused of serial sexual misconduct is a really bad look. The Browns bad reputation was slowly fading, and in one fell swoop, they seem like the same clown franchise they've always been.
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The Browns are a clown show.
My Panthers aren't really all that far behind. *weeps*
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The more I think about it, on the one hand, I'll give the Browns credit for bailing on a QB they knew wasn't that good, but on the other hand, bailing on him by giving the money they did to a guy accused of serial sexual misconduct is a really bad look. The Browns bad reputation was slowly fading, and in one fell swoop, they seem like the same clown franchise they've always been.
Is Baker really not that good, or is he a victim of playing for a bunch of clowns? I honestly never paid all that much attention to the kid, other than cursing him for all of his bad commercials.
Also, it seems to me that by the time Deshaun likely plays again there will have been two years and nine months since he last threw a pass in the NFL. Has anybody ever missed that much time and come back to be worth a damn?
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Plus he played injured last year. I would give him the benefit of the doubt and see how he responds with this opportunity.
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The more I think about it, on the one hand, I'll give the Browns credit for bailing on a QB they knew wasn't that good, but on the other hand, bailing on him by giving the money they did to a guy accused of serial sexual misconduct is a really bad look. The Browns bad reputation was slowly fading, and in one fell swoop, they seem like the same clown franchise they've always been.
Is Baker really not that good, or is he a victim of playing for a bunch of clowns? I honestly never paid all that much attention to the kid, other than cursing him for all of his bad commercials.
What? I loved those commercials! I thought they were clever.
Wasn't Baker banged up last year too? I think he's decent enough and if healthy and not playing for a bunch asshats, he could be ok.
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Mayfield was average/middle-of-the-pack two years ago but the Panthers would love a guy with a 26/8 TD to INT ratio. They would probably win 9 or 10 games with that performance and a healthy D-Mac.
I like Mayfield in the underdog role and think he'll work hard to prove he's better than he showed last year, especially considering how hurt he was.
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What? I loved those commercials! I thought they were clever.
Clever insofar as it relates to commercials is the difference between somebody calling you a snotty-faced pile of parrot droppings instead of simply dick. They're offensive, even if one does manage to distinguish itself above another.
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The more I think about it, on the one hand, I'll give the Browns credit for bailing on a QB they knew wasn't that good, but on the other hand, bailing on him by giving the money they did to a guy accused of serial sexual misconduct is a really bad look. The Browns bad reputation was slowly fading, and in one fell swoop, they seem like the same clown franchise they've always been.
Is Baker really not that good, or is he a victim of playing for a bunch of clowns? I honestly never paid all that much attention to the kid, other than cursing him for all of his bad commercials.
Count me in with the folks who dig the commercials. Hope they do some more when he gets to Carolina.
Some guys filling in for Dan Patrick this morning were pointing out that, in the two seasons before Mayfield got to Cleveland, the team had a collective record of 1-31. Then, in Mayfield's first two years, they were 7-8-1 and 6-10. Not great, but a seismic improvement. Then, in his third year, they went 11-5, qualified for the playoffs (for the first time in 18 years and only the second time since the new version of the team entered the league) and won a playoff game. They regressed last year, but he was injured the entire season.
So...is he "really not that good"? Seems to me he was a catalyst for MASSIVE improvement for a bad team, which suggests to me he's not bad at all and that, given the right circumstances, he could be great.
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When healthy, I think he's "good not great".
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Right, he's not that good. Yes, the Browns organization is a bunch of clowns, but Mayfield has had great talent around him on offense. A top o-line, a beastly 1-2 punch at RB, and good receivers. From an on the field standpoint, he will never have it as good as he did in Cleveland.
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I don't think Mayfield is elite or anything like that, but I think he's a QB that can take a team to the Super Bowl, unlike 80% of the QBs in the league right now. I think that trade just shows how inept the Browns really are. The only real question is, given the choice, do you take Baker Mayfield in that system, or Deshaun Watson and all that baggage (in which I include that ridiculous contract).
And on an unrelated note, I'm selling my BMW for $8 and a concert shirt, and I'm trying to buy a Les Paul for $6 and a pack of bubble gum cards. Hopefully I'll get as lucky as the Panthers.
P.S. The commercials are amusing. Some are better than others, but they are entertaining for what they are.
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The biggest knock on Baker was that he wasn't very coachable. He was more relying on his instincts than making good reads and he was always trying to go by his instincts too much. After a bad play he would be pointing fingers at his teammates (receivers) blaming them for the bad play and then going to the sideline and pout. He would likely not look at his computer and review any of the plays that most QBs do after an offensive series.
Also, I heard that he would have frequent disagreements with Stephanski and would tell him "let me be myself" so Stephanski finally said OK and Baker went out and had one of his worst outings and that's when the Browns said 'we're done'. I realize that Baker was playing hurt but he was not really liked by his teammates and was a cocky SOB in college and a cocky SOB in the Pros. All of this adds up to little or no market for his services.
He goes from a team that is ready to take the next step to a team that's about to fire its head coach.
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The biggest knock on Baker was that he wasn't very coachable. He was more relying on his instincts than making good reads and he was always trying to go by his instincts too much. After a bad play he would be pointing fingers at his teammates (receivers) blaming them for the bad play and then going to the sideline and pout. He would likely not look at his computer and review any of the plays that most QBs do after an offensive series.
Also, I heard that he would have frequent disagreements with Stephanski and would tell him "let me be myself" so Stephanski finally said OK and Baker went out and had one of his worst outings and that's when the Browns said 'we're done'. I realize that Baker was playing hurt but he was not really liked by his teammates and was a cocky SOB in college and a cocky SOB in the Pros. All of this adds up to little or no market for his services.
He goes from a team that is ready to take the next step to a team that's about to fire its head coach.
I'm not privvy to all that, but if it's true, then it explains everything. Above all things, you need to be in the system and not winging it. The "winging it" QBs aren't the ones that are repeatably successful.
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The biggest knock on Baker was that he wasn't very coachable. He was more relying on his instincts than making good reads and he was always trying to go by his instincts too much. After a bad play he would be pointing fingers at his teammates (receivers) blaming them for the bad play and then going to the sideline and pout. He would likely not look at his computer and review any of the plays that most QBs do after an offensive series.
Also, I heard that he would have frequent disagreements with Stephanski and would tell him "let me be myself" so Stephanski finally said OK and Baker went out and had one of his worst outings and that's when the Browns said 'we're done'. I realize that Baker was playing hurt but he was not really liked by his teammates and was a cocky SOB in college and a cocky SOB in the Pros. All of this adds up to little or no market for his services.
He goes from a team that is ready to take the next step to a team that's about to fire its head coach.
I'm not privvy to all that, but if it's true, then it explains everything. Above all things, you need to be in the system and not winging it. The "winging it" QBs aren't the ones that are repeatably successful.
If you can improvise to extend a broken play (like a Rodgers, Mahomes, or Wilson) then great, but that should be the last resort not the original plan. I like Baker, and I hope he uses this as a learning experience, but if what was said above is true, he’s in trouble without the talent that surrounded him in Cleveland.
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To be a successful "wing it" QB, you have to either be crazy talented and/or have been given an arm from the gods (see: Brett Favre). Baker Mayfield is neither crazy talented nor a notable arm talent. He is one of those guys where everything around him has to be just right for him to succeed, like it was in Cleveland with that o-line and skill position talent, but it seemed like nearly every time at the end of a game where he had to throw it and the running game was a non-factor, he would fail miserably. If you are down 5 with 2 minutes left and the ball at your own 20 with no timeouts, he is one of the last starting QBs you'd want trying to lead your team down the field.
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Don't like Baker but he DOES make the Panthers better, if he goes there. Maybe even "good enough" - the best team in the division is QB'd by Ryan Tannehill.
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Did I miss the memo where the Panthers got moved to the AFC South? ??? ???
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Did I miss the memo where the Panthers got moved to the AFC South? ??? ???
:facepalm:
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Don't like Baker but he DOES make the Panthers better, if he goes there. Maybe even "good enough" - the best team in the division is QB'd by Ryan Tannehill.
Even with your mix up, your point still stands. He’s still the second best QB in his division, as I trust him more than Jameis Winston and Marcus Mariota. Brady must feel like he’s back in the AFC East with the lack of QB talent in his division.
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(https://i.postimg.cc/rsdH610x/FB-IMG-1657572679143.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
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No idea who this dude is, but his mom's BFF must be a smoke show for him to choose her over this:
(https://nypost.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2021/11/abby-giles.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&w=754)
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No kidding.
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Than again, dude went to his prom with 2 smoke shows. So I think he has carte blanche.
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(https://i.postimg.cc/rsdH610x/FB-IMG-1657572679143.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
This is the most the Jets will score all year (and yes it really hurt to make that joke).
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No idea who this dude is, but his mom's BFF must be a smoke show for him to choose her over this:
(https://nypost.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2021/11/abby-giles.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&w=754)
Wait, what?
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As they said about Tiger Woods, Show me a beautiful woman and I’ll show you a guy who’s tired of fucking her.
Also, that's a terrible picture of the girl. She looks like she's made of plastic. The first thing I thought was that in a few years the mother's BFF will have aged 10x better. If she's already getting work done her future looks pretty bleak. Here's what she once looked like.
(https://pagesix.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/3/2021/04/abbey-gile-zach-wilson-main.jpg?quality=75&strip=all)
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Is that the new Ken and Barbie?
Seriously, who are these people?
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That is Jets QB Zach Wilson and his ex, who is blasting him for having sex with his Mom's best friend, or something.
It's always the Mormons.
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That is Jets QB Zach Wilson and his ex, who is blasting him for having sex with his Mom's best friend, or something.
It's always the Mormons.
I usually don't condone cheating in a relationship at all, but if this is what makes him play better...
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That is Jets QB Zach Wilson and his ex, who is blasting him for having sex with his Mom's best friend, or something.
It's always the Mormons.
So.. the girlfriend is cute, sure, and Mom is a looker, as well. But the other woman - who is herself a handsome woman - looks YOUNGER than the girlfriend. Do I have the players (pun very much intended) straight here?
I don't know; I feel like in the rough and tumble world of the NFL, there is more than one defensive lineman/linebacker that wants to muddy that pretty face of his on a down-by-down basis.
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That is Jets QB Zach Wilson and his ex, who is blasting him for having sex with his Mom's best friend, or something.
It's always the Mormons.
So.. the girlfriend is cute, sure, and Mom is a looker, as well. But the other woman - who is herself a handsome woman - looks YOUNGER than the girlfriend. Do I have the players (pun very much intended) straight here?
Wilson's mom (whom I'm guessing is in her mid- to late 40s) is hot. The ex-GF is also, but I don't think any photos of the mother's friend have been made public.
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That is Jets QB Zach Wilson and his ex, who is blasting him for having sex with his Mom's best friend, or something.
It's always the Mormons.
So.. the girlfriend is cute, sure, and Mom is a looker, as well. But the other woman - who is herself a handsome woman - looks YOUNGER than the girlfriend. Do I have the players (pun very much intended) straight here?
Wilson's mom (whom I'm guessing is in her mid- to late 40s) is hot. The ex-GF is also, but I don't think any photos of the mother's friend have been made public.
So Nicolette Dellanno is not Mom's friend?
Sidebar, EVERY one of these people has "Influencer" as their job title. WTF? If everyone is an influencer, who is being influenced? And with the state of America circling the bowl in so many ways, what exactly are they influencing?
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Sidebar, EVERY one of these people has "Influencer" as their job title. WTF? If everyone is an influencer, who is being influenced? And with the state of America circling the bowl in so many ways, what exactly are they influencing?
The country turning to shit?
The Wilson memes are hilarious, but this is probably one of those cases where "young hot girlfriend wants to either wait for marriage or isn't very exciting with the lights out" while the hot older woman is offering him oral delights on the side, and he couldn't resist.
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The Wilson memes are hilarious, but this is probably one of those cases where "young hot girlfriend wants to either wait for marriage or isn't very exciting with the lights out" while the hot older woman is offering him oral delights on the side, and he couldn't resist.
What girl dating a multi-million dollar athlete is waiting for marriage?!
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That is Jets QB Zach Wilson and his ex, who is blasting him for having sex with his Mom's best friend, or something.
It's always the Mormons.
So.. the girlfriend is cute, sure, and Mom is a looker, as well. But the other woman - who is herself a handsome woman - looks YOUNGER than the girlfriend. Do I have the players (pun very much intended) straight here?
Wilson's mom (whom I'm guessing is in her mid- to late 40s) is hot. The ex-GF is also, but I don't think any photos of the mother's friend have been made public.
So Nicolette Dellanno is not Mom's friend?
Sidebar, EVERY one of these people has "Influencer" as their job title. WTF? If everyone is an influencer, who is being influenced? And with the state of America circling the bowl in so many ways, what exactly are they influencing?
Welcome to late stage capitalism. The children of the wealthy don't even really pretend to be useful at anything anymore.
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Not arguing with you (we can both be right here), but I think there's also an element of that massive insecurity I talk about so much, as well as our reliance on Celebrity culture. What better way to self-bolster your value and self-worth by being tasked with nothing less than INFLUENCING others? It might be rooted in capitalism as well, but I think this is really all about not having the fortitude to put in the hard work like a Bruce Springsteen or John Lennon did (both of whom could rightly be termed "influencers" if there weren't better and more apt titles for them) but still have to find affirmation for their place in the world.
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The Wilson memes are hilarious, but this is probably one of those cases where "young hot girlfriend wants to either wait for marriage or isn't very exciting with the lights out" while the hot older woman is offering him oral delights on the side, and he couldn't resist.
What girl dating a multi-million dollar athlete is waiting for marriage?!
I imagine every single one of them, right? You don't get paid for being the girlfriend. You make bank for being the [soon to be ex-] wife.
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Not arguing with you (we can both be right here), but I think there's also an element of that massive insecurity I talk about so much, as well as our reliance on Celebrity culture. What better way to self-bolster your value and self-worth by being tasked with nothing less than INFLUENCING others? It might be rooted in capitalism as well, but I think this is really all about not having the fortitude to put in the hard work like a Bruce Springsteen or John Lennon did (both of whom could rightly be termed "influencers" if there weren't better and more apt titles for them) but still have to find affirmation for their place in the world.
I think a lot of this stuff is just like backwash from all the money not knowing where to go.
A generation or so ago, if you came from a family wealthy enough not to thrust you out on your 18th birthday to fend for yourself, you might at least put the privilege toward stepping up in the family business, going to law/med school, competing to be an Olympian, doing a Fine Arts PhD, even entering the military (as an officer, of course)... really, any number of any number of things (I could day dream things I'd have done with a trust fund all day). There was a certain pride in working and having a devotion, even if you didn't really need the money to have a nice life. Maybe it was just optics, but you couldn't just have a scion of the investor class sitting around doing nothing.
When I see these "Influences" posting from their big mansions with their all their expensive wardrobes and cars and cosmetics, all I can think is "damn, having millionaire parents just means you become part of reality TV these days."
Sure, not the rule. Wilson himself seems to be putting the family's JetBlue money to good use, but the trend of Influencer types does seem to be growing.
By the way - all the women he's dated, his Mom, and all his sisters, look like the exact same person to me.
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That is Jets QB Zach Wilson and his ex, who is blasting him for having sex with his Mom's best friend, or something.
It's always the Mormons.
So.. the girlfriend is cute, sure, and Mom is a looker, as well. But the other woman - who is herself a handsome woman - looks YOUNGER than the girlfriend. Do I have the players (pun very much intended) straight here?
Wilson's mom (whom I'm guessing is in her mid- to late 40s) is hot. The ex-GF is also, but I don't think any photos of the mother's friend have been made public.
So Nicolette Dellanno is not Mom's friend?
She's the ex-GF.
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Not arguing with you (we can both be right here), but I think there's also an element of that massive insecurity I talk about so much, as well as our reliance on Celebrity culture. What better way to self-bolster your value and self-worth by being tasked with nothing less than INFLUENCING others? It might be rooted in capitalism as well, but I think this is really all about not having the fortitude to put in the hard work like a Bruce Springsteen or John Lennon did (both of whom could rightly be termed "influencers" if there weren't better and more apt titles for them) but still have to find affirmation for their place in the world.
I think a lot of this stuff is just like backwash from all the money not knowing where to go.
A generation or so ago, if you came from a family wealthy enough not to thrust you out on your 18th birthday to fend for yourself, you might at least put the privilege toward stepping up in the family business, going to law/med school, competing to be an Olympian, doing a Fine Arts PhD, even entering the military (as an officer, of course)... really, any number of any number of things (I could day dream things I'd have done with a trust fund all day). There was a certain pride in working and having a devotion, even if you didn't really need the money to have a nice life. Maybe it was just optics, but you couldn't just have a scion of the investor class sitting around doing nothing.
When I see these "Influences" posting from their big mansions with their all their expensive wardrobes and cars and cosmetics, all I can think is "damn, having millionaire parents just means you become part of reality TV these days."
Sure, not the rule. Wilson himself seems to be putting the family's JetBlue money to good use, but the trend of Influencer types does seem to be growing.
By the way - all the women he's dated, his Mom, and all his sisters, look like the exact same person to me.
Perhaps this should be a new thread, but this interests me. I believe we had a thread a while back, or at least a discussion, about celebrities who weren't going to leave anything to their kids. There are plenty of them--Kutcher/Kunis, Sting, Gordon Ramsey, Anderson Cooper, Gene Simmons (imagine that), to name a few. I still think they're major assholes, but this might be a consideration. And it might not. I think the original intention was to make sure they didn't turn into one of these influnencer-type people, but they may well be having the same effect regardless.
A recurring theme is that these kids are still growing up privileged. Gordon Ramsey's kids might not get a trust fund, but I bet they're still seeing the world, eating at the best restaurants, being driven around in the coolest cars, going to the best schools, and playing the best game consoles. If I were one of those kids, making some money from Youtube while I was still living the dream would be an obvious move.
I think the trick is to not raise children that are self-absorbed morons. Some of these people pull it off and some don't, and I don't think the future trust fund is part of that. Bill Gates' kids seem to be pretty well adjusted. Obama's kids aren't living on Ticktock. Seems like good parenting makes more of a difference than money.
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Not arguing with you (we can both be right here), but I think there's also an element of that massive insecurity I talk about so much, as well as our reliance on Celebrity culture. What better way to self-bolster your value and self-worth by being tasked with nothing less than INFLUENCING others? It might be rooted in capitalism as well, but I think this is really all about not having the fortitude to put in the hard work like a Bruce Springsteen or John Lennon did (both of whom could rightly be termed "influencers" if there weren't better and more apt titles for them) but still have to find affirmation for their place in the world.
I think a lot of this stuff is just like backwash from all the money not knowing where to go.
A generation or so ago, if you came from a family wealthy enough not to thrust you out on your 18th birthday to fend for yourself, you might at least put the privilege toward stepping up in the family business, going to law/med school, competing to be an Olympian, doing a Fine Arts PhD, even entering the military (as an officer, of course)... really, any number of any number of things (I could day dream things I'd have done with a trust fund all day). There was a certain pride in working and having a devotion, even if you didn't really need the money to have a nice life. Maybe it was just optics, but you couldn't just have a scion of the investor class sitting around doing nothing.
When I see these "Influences" posting from their big mansions with their all their expensive wardrobes and cars and cosmetics, all I can think is "damn, having millionaire parents just means you become part of reality TV these days."
Sure, not the rule. Wilson himself seems to be putting the family's JetBlue money to good use, but the trend of Influencer types does seem to be growing.
By the way - all the women he's dated, his Mom, and all his sisters, look like the exact same person to me.
I see your point. I think this phenomenon transcends class, though. There's a lot of kids who aren't coming from money thinking that "YouTube" is the way to go. Some of what I'm seeing - parents putting their 8, 9 and 10 year olds on YouTube as "influencers" is potentially disastrous on a societal level.
Agreed on the looks; they all seem so generic to me.
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Kyler Murray got a huge contract extension with the Cardinals with $160 million guaranteed. The QB contracts are really getting huge, wonder how large Herbert and Burrows get their contracts when it's time.
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What's wrong with this picture? :lol
(https://a4.espncdn.com/combiner/i?img=%2Fphoto%2F2022%2F0721%2Fr1038940_576x324_16%2D9.jpg&w=570&format=jpg)
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1 ring to rule them all. Lol
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1 ring to rule them all. Lol
And that number isn't going to change by more than one, or maybe two. I'm calling it right now: Kyler Murray will NEVER win a Super Bowl.* I don't see Aaron Rodgers winning another one at this point. Too early to predict on Deshaun Watson; he HAD the capability before he shit in his own Cheerios; we'll see if he can regain that mojo (but Magic Eight Ball says "Chances Aren't Good" in Cleveland). Josh Allen might get one in Buffalo.
* Ignoring the scenario where he latches on as a backup and rides the pine while a more well-rounded, mature QB leads the team to glory.
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Murray seems like another Kaepernick situation: QB who comes out red hot and catches lightning in a bottle for a season or 2, and then cools down and can't live up to the hype. But we'll see. Too early to tell for sure.
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Very few double-threat QBs have won a SB. Steve Young.
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Very few double-threat QBs have won a SB. Steve Young.
But because he was first and foremost a decent pocket passer, and knew how to use his weapons. And even he wasn't consistently as good as the legend who came before. I'm really sour on these, what you call "double-threat", QBs. I know I'm a sort of iconoclast in this way, but I'd never start a franchise with a QB like that. It's too easy - well, not EASY, but you know what I mean - to scheme them. A Wade Phillips or Bill Belichick will beat a Cam Newton 8 times out of 10.
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Very few double-threat QBs have won a SB. Steve Young.
But because he was first and foremost a decent pocket passer, and knew how to use his weapons.
This 100%. The best dual threat quarterbacks are the ones who only use their legs to either evade pressure in the pocket or extend a play that’s breaking down. Someone like Patrick Mahomes, Russell Wilson, or Josh Allen, all who have legs but only use them as a last resort. Aaron Rodgers and Ben Roethlisberger in the first half of their careers fall into this category as well. Having a QB who can keep a play alive and get yards on their own if need be is great, but a pocket passer will always be better than a scrambler/runner in the long run, especially since running quarterbacks are more susceptible to injury (look at what happened to RGIII). I’ll take a Joe Flacco over a Michael Vick any day.
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Very few double-threat QBs have won a SB. Steve Young.
But because he was first and foremost a decent pocket passer, and knew how to use his weapons.
This 100%. The best dual threat quarterbacks are the ones who only use their legs to either evade pressure in the pocket or extend a play that’s breaking down. Someone like Patrick Mahomes, Russell Wilson, or Josh Allen, all who have legs but only use them as a last resort. Aaron Rodgers and Ben Roethlisberger in the first half of their careers fall into this category as well. Having a QB who can keep a play alive and get yards on their own if need be is great, but a pocket passer will always be better than a scrambler/runner in the long run, especially since running quarterbacks are more susceptible to injury (look at what happened to RGIII). I’ll take a Joe Flacco over a Michael Vick any day.
Ooh, I dunno about all that. I'm right there with you on your overall point. I'll take a pocket passer over a runner, too, but that is not a good comparison. Dog-Killer's passing numbers were comparable to Flacco's, and occasionally far better. Flacco never came close to a season like DK's 2010 year with the Eagles. Based strictly on passing they're similar, and factor in DK's running ability he's the better QB by far.
Also, Tarkenton is being left out of the discussion. He never won a SB, but he took his team to 3 in 4 years.
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Tark is a weird bird, though. He's not Yngwie Malmsteen he's Alvin Lee. Meaning, he was a scrambler/runner for the time, but he wouldn't compare now. He only averaged about 200 yards rushing a season, never rushed for more than 375 yards in a season, and at the time of his retirement was the career leader in pass attempts, completions, yardage, touchdowns, and wins by a starting quarterback (stole that from Wikipedia). I think he's still top ten, or close enough, in yards and TDs.
As for Vick and Flacco... I get your point, and that is a bad example, but I think you have to look at the big picture: Vick never took a team that deep into the playoffs; closest he came was one NFC Championship game and the Eagles shut him down. He might have better numbers, but is that style conducive to winning? It's taxing on your receivers to run a route then have to improvise in response to your QB improvising.
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It's important to remember that the difference in mobile QBs then and now is that back in the day, mobile QBs were running for their lives whereas now they are part of the scheme. Lamar Jackson is asked to be the runner that he is because that's what the scheme requires. Did anyone else notice that Lamar's backup is a carbon copy of himself? He's not long for this NFL if he keeps this up.
This season I think you will see more activity out of the backfield from wide receivers which is why that financial market has been reset. If they are going to take that kind of beating, then they need mo money.
Watch what the Phins do this year. I think McDaniel is going to be fascinating to watch.
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It seems to me that the QBs who can run, but are pass-first guys (Elway, Young, Rodgers, Mahomes, etc.) are always far more successful than the ones who are known more for running. The jury is still out on Lamar Jackson as a passer, but he seemed to regress last year, and it remains to be seen how good he will be once his running isn't as prolific, which is inevitable.
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Completely agree Kev. I like Cunningham as well in his prime.
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I assume everyone heard about what was put in Kyler's contract? Not sure who looks worse in that scenario, but props to Murray for fleecing the Cardinals.
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I assume everyone heard about what was put in Kyler's contract? Not sure who looks worse in that scenario, but props to Murray for fleecing the Cardinals.
You mean besides the cash? What else is in there?
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Some weird language about how Kyler needs to watch at least 4 hours of film a week and not play video games. I have to find the actual wording, apparently, details of the contract got leaked out and on the surface, it appears bizarre. Though I'm not sure what language typically goes in a contract and if this is out of the ordinary.
The 4 hour film study is an addition to the required mandatory film study it was clarified (https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/1551662127726878724?s=20&t=lbcdUWApj6GraH_GtLs6Pg)
Kyler Murray does 4 hours of game studying on his own, anyway. And similar to the team wanting him around for the offseason as the face of the franchise, AZ wanted a commitment in writing while going to a certain place money-wise. Thus, the clause
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I have no idea how they can possibly enforce that, but the fact that Murray and his agent agreed to a contract that treats him like a 6-year old is unreal. I guess once he saw the dollar signs, he didn't care.
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I have no idea how they can possibly enforce that, but the fact that Murray and his agent agreed to a contract that treats him like a 6-year old is unreal. I guess once he saw the dollar signs, he didn't care.
If this is the case then this explains a lot. Kyler, in my eyes, falls into the category with Baker, RG3 and Michael Vick - uber talented mobile QBs that were lazy in the classroom and I have a hunch that this was the sticking point in negotiations. Successful QBs excel because they watch videos, understand defensive tendencies etc..
Also, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if the Cardinals organization were the ones to leak this information. Either the information is accurate or the Cardinals are trying to flush out a mole.
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He IS a 6-year-old. Watch him on the sidelines; he's a petulant child as soon as things don't go his way. IMO, the Cardinals just "elevated" themselves into the Browns/Jerry Jones tier of team management. OUTSTANDING athlete, one of the best in the league. slightly ABOVE AVERAGE quarterback, and BELOW AVERAGE leader.
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I have no idea how they can possibly enforce that, but the fact that Murray and his agent agreed to a contract that treats him like a 6-year old is unreal. I guess once he saw the dollar signs, he didn't care.
I heard today that he is a big time gamer and has around 700,000 followers online. They did that because he could make big money in that business as well. Still, you know the Cardinals talked to him before this all came out about his professionalism and he still acted like a petulant child.
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I have no idea how they can possibly enforce that, but the fact that Murray and his agent agreed to a contract that treats him like a 6-year old is unreal. I guess once he saw the dollar signs, he didn't care.
I heard today that he is a big time gamer and has around 700,000 followers online. They did that because he could make big money in that business as well. Still, you know the Cardinals talked to him before this all came out about his professionalism and he still acted like a petulant child.
I'm not going to guess what the Cardinals were thinking; I know for me, I don't really care if he games. I might rather he do that than risk his body in some other way. But there's the notion of "screen time" and there's the dynamic between me and my youngest step son: I'll sit down after work and before dinner for a half hour of Battlefront; he can sit in front of his PC for nine, ten hours at a run playing Call Of Duty. "Hey M---, did you take the dogs out?" "Oh, no, let me do that now" (while there's a big turd on the floor). Big difference.
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From what I remember he's one of those high level video game players. I think he's in a professional group or something. And it becomes a competing monetary interest, those gamers that are part of some 'Video game Team' earn millions too so I'm guessing it's to try and not compete with that.
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Just posting that I agree with the above comments that a QB who needs a clause in his contract to mandate watching video of the opponent will never win a championship. What a clown.
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Julio Jones signed a one year deal with the Buccaneers. Tom Brady is gonna win his eighth Super Bowl this year isn’t he…
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Has Julio been any effective since leaving the Falcons? I recall him last being impressionable during the superbowl but nothing much after.
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Lamar Jackson is asked to be the runner that he is because that's what the scheme requires.
Wait, what? I'm pretty sure you have that backwards. Harbaugh is on record as saying that the reason they run the offensive scheme they do is to fit it into Jackson's skillset. They built the offense around him, not the other way around.
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Lamar Jackson is asked to be the runner that he is because that's what the scheme requires.
Wait, what? I'm pretty sure you have that backwards. Harbaugh is on record as saying that the reason they run the offensive scheme they do is to fit it into Jackson's skillset. They built the offense around him, not the other way around.
Yeah - because that skillset is a runner. We all know he can't throw with the same acumen as the top QBs in this league and Hollywood Brown even wanted to leave because of the run first "scheme". If Brown had stayed with the Ravens, there's no way he could maximize his career earning potential because he is catching 10 to 20 yards outs. He wants to catch 30 yards plus because that's where the real money is (Tyreek Hill). Who knows, maybe Lamar is thinking the same thing - 'do I want put my body through this'?
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Lamar Jackson is asked to be the runner that he is because that's what the scheme requires.
Wait, what? I'm pretty sure you have that backwards. Harbaugh is on record as saying that the reason they run the offensive scheme they do is to fit it into Jackson's skillset. They built the offense around him, not the other way around.
Yeah. Defenses put 7 and 8 in the box begging him to throw. He's too dangerous when he runs against regular sets.
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Lamar Jackson is asked to be the runner that he is because that's what the scheme requires.
Wait, what? I'm pretty sure you have that backwards. Harbaugh is on record as saying that the reason they run the offensive scheme they do is to fit it into Jackson's skillset. They built the offense around him, not the other way around.
Yeah - because that skillset is a runner. We all know he can't throw with the same acumen as the top QBs in this league and Hollywood Brown even wanted to leave because of the run first "scheme". If Brown had stayed with the Ravens, there's no way he could maximize his career earning potential because he is catching 10 to 20 yards outs. He wants to catch 30 yards plus because that's where the real money is (Tyreek Hill). Who knows, maybe Lamar is thinking the same thing - 'do I want put my body through this'?
I know it's really easy for a 54-year-old short fat white guy to say this, but if your main focus is "maximizing your earning potential" then go to another team. There are 32 teams in the league and plenty of them will take you; and the up shot is, you'll be done by early January so you can hit the sun in Florida.
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Has Julio been any effective since leaving the Falcons? I recall him last being impressionable during the superbowl but nothing much after.
He's only played one season so far since leaving the Falcons, and it was an injury-plagued one with the Titans, but he was still pretty great on a per game basis two years ago with Atlanta. There are too many mouths to feed on TB for him to be the target monster he was in his prime, but I would guess the attitude with him will be what it was with Gronk in TB in that you just hope he is healthy for the playoffs and can make a difference there.
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There's also talk about Julio being used in case Godwin isn't able to return in the first few weeks. Excited to see how this WR corps does in the season. Injuries is the biggest concern at this point.
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As much of a fan of Brady as I am, you still have to play the games.
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First day of training and Jensen the Bucs probowl center goes down, doesn't look good for him. Had to be carted off and the whole team was looking on . Local sports reporters speculating maybe ACL and MCL injury by the way he went down. Jensen is a tough guy played last season with a torn hip muscle but this time he was in pain.
Sucks because practice was supposed to be light the first 4 days without any pads. At least it happened prior to starting of the season.
And apparently the Cardinals removed Kyler Murray's film study clause after the heat it generated.
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^^^ Weak; if it mattered enough to them to offer it up, and Murray accepted it, why remove it because a bunch of people who were not part of the negotiations and aren't involved in the relationship get their panties in a wad?
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^^^ Weak; if it mattered enough to them to offer it up, and Murray accepted it, why remove it because a bunch of people who were not part of the negotiations and aren't involved in the relationship get their panties in a wad?
There’s rumors that Murray bitched about it which is why they removed it. If that’s the case, it’s a bad look for him. One, the fact that the Cardinals felt the need to put that clause in the contract in the first place speaks volumes. Then, for Murray to complain about being forced to watch game film shows he isn’t willing to put in the work that it takes to be an elite NFL quarterback. On top of that, the question here is why would he sign the contract if he really didn’t like that clause? It’s either he signed so he could get his payday and always intended to try to get that clause removed, which paints the picture of him being selfish, or he didn’t read the entire contract and found out about the clause after the fact, which presents him as someone who goes into things unprepared, which would then go back to explaining why Arizona felt the need to write a film study clause into his contract in the first place. I don’t want to talk bad about the guy, but this whole situation makes both Kyler and the Cardinals front office look pretty bad.
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^^^ Weak; if it mattered enough to them to offer it up, and Murray accepted it, why remove it because a bunch of people who were not part of the negotiations and aren't involved in the relationship get their panties in a wad?
There’s rumors that Murray bitched about it which is why they removed it. If that’s the case, it’s a bad look for him. One, the fact that the Cardinals felt the need to put that clause in the contract in the first place speaks volumes. Then, for Murray to complain about being forced to watch game film shows he isn’t willing to put in the work that it takes to be an elite NFL quarterback. On top of that, the question here is why would he sign the contract if he really didn’t like that clause? It’s either he signed so he could get his payday and always intended to try to get that clause removed, which paints the picture of him being selfish, or he didn’t read the entire contract and found out about the clause after the fact, which presents him as someone who goes into things unprepared, which would then go back to explaining why Arizona felt the need to write a film study clause into his contract in the first place. I don’t want to talk bad about the guy, but this whole situation makes both Kyler and the Cardinals front office look pretty bad.
I'm not a fan, as some of you might tell. But to me, that part is the one part that is most important and to me speaks to the immaturity of Murray. It's only a problem when public opinion makes it a problem? And why - when your work ethic is already in question - would you highlight it and take a position that only reinforces the stereotype? If it bothers you, make a statement: "I note the distrust the Cardinals have in my work ethic, but my work ethic is strong, and the contract is only the bare minimum. I plan and fully expect to put in the work necessary to be an elite NFL QB regardless of what Clause 32 says."
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If I'm an owner, and paying that much money on an investment -- I'll put whatever damn clause I want in there.
the "Pay attention to video" clause sounds perfectly fine to me.
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There may also be a kernel of truth to the fact that subtle, subconscious racism is still alive and well in the NFL. Who are the QBs that get criticized for supposedly not studying enough or learning how to read defenses? Jackson, Murray, Mahomes even . . . when was the last time it was said about a white guy?
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Jackson and Murray have. Don't think I've read that Mahomes had issues reading defenses.
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There may also be a kernel of truth to the fact that subtle, subconscious racism is still alive and well in the NFL. Who are the QBs that get criticized for supposedly not studying enough or learning how to read defenses? Jackson, Murray, Mahomes even . . . when was the last time it was said about a white guy?
I have no doubt that many rich owners still have that backwards "white QBs are the smart ones who study, black QBs are the more athletic ones who don't study as much" attitude, and I doubt that is going away any time soon with those rich a-holes, but with the sports media this week, the reaction was sad and predictable. They acted like poor Kyler was the poor victim, even though there have been reports out of Arizona about his attitude. Heck, is was widely whispered that the main reason Larry Fitzgerald didn't come back and decided to retire was that he hated Kyler's attitude. But there has to be a reason why the Cardinals insisted on that being put in the initial contract, and Kyler and his agent did agree to it originally. But, back to the sports media, had that been put in the contract for, say, Kirk Cousins or Joe Burrow, is there much doubt that the media would have crushed those guys for not studying more and needing to be babysat?
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There may also be a kernel of truth to the fact that subtle, subconscious racism is still alive and well in the NFL. Who are the QBs that get criticized for supposedly not studying enough or learning how to read defenses? Jackson, Murray, Mahomes even . . . when was the last time it was said about a white guy?
I guess if you go looking to find racism, you will imagine you see it everywhere you look. But as to this instance, I don't see it. They aren't being criticized because of their race. They are being criticized because of their actions (or lack thereof), work ethic, and attitude toward said actions and work ethic. As Dr. King put it, they are being judged by their character, not the color of their skin.
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Personally, I read big-time sarcasm into Dream Team's post. My friends and I used to joke (back in the day) that when announcers called them an "athletic QB" then they were referring to black QBs and when they referred to "pocket passers" then they were referring to white QBs and in all honestly there was a modicum of truth in that.
Fast forward - most QBs for the better part of the last 2 decades are athletic and has an arm for a cannon. It seems that TB is the last of his breed as a pocket passing QB. So I don't think that this is black vs. white issue anymore (that of studying video).
And to be clear, we're not talking about studying the scheme of the other offense or defensive necessarily (they do that during the week). We're talking about studying tendencies of different individual players. How a defensive back does this or that or how fast a linebacker gets from sideline to sideline. At least that's how I understand it.
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Bill Burr on Black vs. White athletes. We all need to laugh.
https://youtu.be/fUu0GuW1WYQ
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Bill Burr on Black vs. White athletes. We all need to laugh.
https://youtu.be/fUu0GuW1WYQ
That is a classic bit.
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Bill Burr can pretty much say anything in that high-pitched animated voice of his and I'll be laughing.
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Bill Burr on Black vs. White athletes. We all need to laugh.
https://youtu.be/fUu0GuW1WYQ
Love that clip. I could listen to his rants all day.
Word is that the Judge in Watson's case is ready to announce her judgment. The NFLPA sorta appear to be at peace with it, which people have commented it might mean a lighter suspension than speculated. Not sure if it's correct but I read that if the Judge announces no suspension, Goodell can't overrule it. If however Judge says suspension for a certain number of games, Goodell can override that.
We shall see tomorrow.
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So six games is the judgment, I guess we shall see if it stays the same number by Goodell.
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I'll bet a dollar that Goodell doesn't change a thing just to make this go away.
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Personally, I read big-time sarcasm into Dream Team's post. My friends and I used to joke (back in the day) that when announcers called them an "athletic QB" then they were referring to black QBs and when they referred to "pocket passers" then they were referring to white QBs and in all honestly there was a modicum of truth in that.
Fast forward - most QBs for the better part of the last 2 decades are athletic and has an arm for a cannon. It seems that TB is the last of his breed as a pocket passing QB. So I don't think that this is black vs. white issue anymore (that of studying video).
And to be clear, we're not talking about studying the scheme of the other offense or defensive necessarily (they do that during the week). We're talking about studying tendencies of different individual players. How a defensive back does this or that or how fast a linebacker gets from sideline to sideline. At least that's how I understand it.
And it's not like that wasn't leveled at some white QBs: Ryan Leaf was drummed out of town in large part because he didn't put in the effort. There have been those accusations about Carson Wentz. Brett Favre is always on the "Top 10 laziest NFL Players" lists. Matt Leinhart was accused of that. Mark Sanchez. I even saw one list that had Todd Marinovich on there, because for all his "programming", when he got to the NFL, he didn't put in the "brain" work to be a great quarterback.
Look, I get the accusation, but I think Bosk is right.
And of course, Tom Brady delivers yet again (https://www.sportskeeda.com/nfl/news-tom-brady-laments-lack-work-ethic-today-s-america-urges-people-stop-blame-game). I happen to think he's right.
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He is totally right.
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Someone with a bit of patience, please explain it to me.
Why are we upset that Watson is ONLY getting 6 weeks? I'm confused as to why he's getting anything at all.
Last I checked, he hasn't been found guilty of anything. Most of the women have settled, with civil cases outstanding and no end in site.
Do I think this guy's a dirtbag? Yeah, probably.
Do I, personally, think he's guilty? Absolutely.
But where do we draw the line? We're saying a workplace should be able to punish someone for theoretical or assumed guilt.
Most of us chattle without organized labor behind us have to deal with at-will employment and potential firings based on "code of ethics" violations (i.e., the company doesn't like what you post on facebook, so you could get canned). What am I missing? Where do we draw the line?
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Someone with a bit of patience, please explain it to me.
Why are we upset that Watson is ONLY getting 6 weeks? I'm confused as to why he's getting anything at all.
Last I checked, he hasn't been found guilty of anything. Most of the women have settled, with civil cases outstanding and no end in site.
Do I think this guy's a dirtbag? Yeah, probably.
Do I, personally, think he's guilty? Absolutely.
But where do we draw the line? We're saying a workplace should be able to punish someone for theoretical or assumed guilt.
Most of us chattle without organized labor behind us have to deal with at-will employment and potential firings based on "code of ethics" violations (i.e., the company doesn't like what you post on facebook, so you could get canned). What am I missing? Where do we draw the line?
You mean "likely more than not" or "We have no proof that the air was taken out of the balls."
Yeah, it's a shame in the NFL. Dan Snyder should be gone if the owners were held to their standards. But we know how the owners work.
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Wow! Pre-season starting this week already. Time flies. Funny, during the off season I hardly ever thought about football. I guess watching all the overpaid, infantile ego maniacs is getting rather old.
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There’s no way you could sell to the public a 0 game suspension with all those graphic accounts of his actions out there. PR suicide. Personally I’m still hoping for 17 games.
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There’s no way you could sell to the public a 0 game suspension with all those graphic accounts of his actions out there. PR suicide. Personally I’m still hoping for 17 games.
I agree. They had to do something. Let's see about Snyder though.
Also, suspensions never go up, they get reduced.
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There’s no way you could sell to the public a 0 game suspension with all those graphic accounts of his actions out there. PR suicide. Personally I’m still hoping for 17 games.
I was going to type up a reply disagreeing with you, but I stopped in my tracks. Fact is I don't know what it would cost to not suspend him at all, doubt any fans would stop watching and buying merch because of him, but what about endorsements and other things like that from the whole wing of corporate America that have bought into the idea that corporations can be good influences on the world? I think it's a total load of BS, but I'm sure somebody did some kind of risk analysis somewhere and said " here's what could happen if there are boycotts from sponsors and whatever else if we don't do anything about DeSaun".
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https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2022/8/1/23287884/deshaun-watson-cleveland-browns-suspension-roger-goodell
Food for thought for those who would enable this scumbag.
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Someone with a bit of patience, please explain it to me.
Why are we upset that Watson is ONLY getting 6 weeks? I'm confused as to why he's getting anything at all.
Last I checked, he hasn't been found guilty of anything. Most of the women have settled, with civil cases outstanding and no end in site.
Do I think this guy's a dirtbag? Yeah, probably.
Do I, personally, think he's guilty? Absolutely.
But where do we draw the line? We're saying a workplace should be able to punish someone for theoretical or assumed guilt.
Most of us chattle without organized labor behind us have to deal with at-will employment and potential firings based on "code of ethics" violations (i.e., the company doesn't like what you post on facebook, so you could get canned). What am I missing? Where do we draw the line?
If it matters, I'm with you 100%. And I think it has ramifications beyond the league; I think it reinforces the message that one CAN be "guilty until proven innocent". I think it's ultimately dangerous. And in a real sense, this IS cancellation, even if temporary.
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There’s no way you could sell to the public a 0 game suspension with all those graphic accounts of his actions out there. PR suicide. Personally I’m still hoping for 17 games.
I was going to type up a reply disagreeing with you, but I stopped in my tracks. Fact is I don't know what it would cost to not suspend him at all, doubt any fans would stop watching and buying merch because of him, but what about endorsements and other things like that from the whole wing of corporate America that have bought into the idea that corporations can be good influences on the world? I think it's a total load of BS, but I'm sure somebody did some kind of risk analysis somewhere and said " here's what could happen if there are boycotts from sponsors and whatever else if we don't do anything about DeSaun".
No, and in fact, the REACTION would actually COUNT ON people not "stopping watching". There would be protests and what not, but that requires someone to see your protest, and so the presumption would be that there were still millions and millions watching each week (as there would be). And there's the whole region "problem". Meaning, as a Pats or Giants fan, do I REALLY care what nonsense is going on in Cleveland or Washington? Not really, just two less teams I have to worry about come December.
I think overall, the word "sham" doesn't go far enough; this is a national case of "hey, we're DOING SOMETHING!" being a placebo for something more substantial or long-term meaningful.
EDIT: And while I was a fan of Deshaun Watson - before the scandal, I was a big supporter of the "hey, bring him to New England after Brady!" idea, though in hindsight, I think Belichick knows better than I do - NONE of this is to support HIM. I don't give a rat's ass about Deshawn Watson personally.
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https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2022/8/1/23287884/deshaun-watson-cleveland-browns-suspension-roger-goodell
Food for thought for those who would enable this scumbag.
It is food for thought, but I have deep problems with that article. Why should I be "horrified" and "feel outrage" over AN ACCUSATION? El Barto can articulate it better than I can, but all - well, most, I think - of these complaints all came through the same attorney, and none of them - NONE - that I know of had any shred of proof other than their word.
The author compares this - unfavorably - to the DeAndre Hopkins case in terms of punishment, asking whether PED usage is comparable to 27 cases of sexual assault. The problem is, it's one case of PROVEN PED usage, versus 27 cases of ALLEGATIONS of sexual assault. I don't really care if Susan L. Robinson feels like he probably did do those acts. I do too. But that's not the standard we use in our system, and we shouldn't be expanding that simply to make an organization "look good".
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Someone with a bit of patience, please explain it to me.
Why are we upset that Watson is ONLY getting 6 weeks? I'm confused as to why he's getting anything at all.
Last I checked, he hasn't been found guilty of anything. Most of the women have settled, with civil cases outstanding and no end in site.
Do I think this guy's a dirtbag? Yeah, probably.
Do I, personally, think he's guilty? Absolutely.
But where do we draw the line? We're saying a workplace should be able to punish someone for theoretical or assumed guilt.
Most of us chattle without organized labor behind us have to deal with at-will employment and potential firings based on "code of ethics" violations (i.e., the company doesn't like what you post on facebook, so you could get canned). What am I missing? Where do we draw the line?
I'm not really upset. I recognize that the NFL's disciplinary policy is absurd and this is just another example of it. It's like getting mad at the gods because you called heads and it was tails. The truth is, and this is my answer to your question, there's never any rhyme or reason to the NFL's actions on pretty much anything. It's annoying to me because regardless of whether or not he's guilty or not, he might have gotten a lifetime ban, or no punishment at all, and one has zero to do with the other. They just make these things up as they go, and typically get it wrong.
I was going to type up a reply disagreeing with you, but I stopped in my tracks. Fact is I don't know what it would cost to not suspend him at all, doubt any fans would stop watching and buying merch because of him, but what about endorsements and other things like that from the whole wing of corporate America that have bought into the idea that corporations can be good influences on the world? I think it's a total load of BS, but I'm sure somebody did some kind of risk analysis somewhere and said " here's what could happen if there are boycotts from sponsors and whatever else if we don't do anything about DeSaun".
Not suspending him at all, or far too leniently as we're seeing, can cost the league dearly. It might also prompt Herr Goodell to revise the sentence dramatically, a la Ray Rice. The Michael Vick thing certainly cost the league some support; I have a friend who completely gave up her interest in football because of it. The Ray Rice Slugging did the same thing, which is why the league went from 2 games to lifetime ban. As for DeShaun, he'll never get a single dollar from endorsements, but Cleveland made sure that will never matter. At the same time Cleveland is the entity most likely to suffer from a result of this. They will loose fans and they will loose advertising revenue. And if it turns out that he can't play anymore, a very real possibility, they won't have winning to fall back on. They'll have a black purple hole in their salary cap, will have angered a massive segment of their fan base, and will have forced a great deal of the corporate sponsors to run for cover. Way to go Haslam and Berry.
It is food for thought, but I have deep problems with that article. Why should I be "horrified" and "feel outrage" over AN ACCUSATION? El Barto can articulate it better than I can, but all - well, most, I think - of these complaints all came through the same attorney, and none of them - NONE - that I know of had any shred of proof other than their word.
The author compares this - unfavorably - to the DeAndre Hopkins case in terms of punishment, asking whether PED usage is comparable to 27 cases of sexual assault. The problem is, it's one case of PROVEN PED usage, versus 27 cases of ALLEGATIONS of sexual assault. I don't really care if Susan L. Robinson feels like he probably did do those acts. I do too. But that's not the standard we use in our system, and we shouldn't be expanding that simply to make an organization "look good".
Can't comment on the article, but I also have a different problem with this. When it comes to meting out punishment half measures are bullshit. If the guy's guilty you stick him with appropriate punishment. If he's not guilty you cut him loose. What you cannot and should not do is decide "well, he's probably guilty so we'll give him a reduced sentence," which seems to be the outcome here. Judge Whatshername flat out said that he committed sexual assault. I don't know if that's true or not, but that's what you paid her to determine. If he did what he's accused of, and the arbitrator said he did, then that's what you proceed with. But, as I said before, the NFL's disciplinary policy is an outright sham.
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The article Dream Team posted reveals something I did not actually know - that the NFL conducted their own internal investigation, which basically concluded that the dude was a serial abuser. And then gave him 6 weeks suspension. In what world does this make sense?
Yeah, that's just totally silly. The NFL deserve to take heat for it, but similar to Barto, I expect nothing but this kind of thing from the organization.
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The article Dream Team posted reveals something I did not actually know - that the NFL conducted their own internal investigation, which basically concluded that the dude was a serial abuser. And then gave him 6 weeks suspension. In what world does this make sense?
Yeah, that's just totally silly. The NFL deserve to take heat for it, but similar to Barto, I expect nothing but this kind of thing from the organization.
Unfortunately, the owners negotiated it with the Players Union. Gives the owners supreme power. It was never used until Goodell became the owners puppet.
'
https://overthecap.com/collective-bargaining-agreement/article/46
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The article Dream Team posted reveals something I did not actually know - that the NFL conducted their own internal investigation, which basically concluded that the dude was a serial abuser. And then gave him 6 weeks suspension. In what world does this make sense?
Yeah, that's just totally silly. The NFL deserve to take heat for it, but similar to Barto, I expect nothing but this kind of thing from the organization.
Unfortunately, the owners negotiated it with the Players Union. Gives the owners supreme power. It was never used until Goodell became the owners puppet.
'
https://overthecap.com/collective-bargaining-agreement/article/46
This case is not indicative of the owners using supreme power. It's more indicative of the owners caving to the NFLPA.
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It was more for Skeever. He's saying it's a joke for them to suspend him without proof but the league negotiated the clause so they have the power to do what they want. You and I know there's no rhyme or reason to the # of games suspended. Seems all arbitrary.
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The article Dream Team posted reveals something I did not actually know - that the NFL conducted their own internal investigation, which basically concluded that the dude was a serial abuser. And then gave him 6 weeks suspension. In what world does this make sense?
Yeah, that's just totally silly. The NFL deserve to take heat for it, but similar to Barto, I expect nothing but this kind of thing from the organization.
The funny thing is that I'm not actually sure he did anything wrong at all. But the NFL and the arbitrator are. They're convinced that he's guilty of this, and essentially let him off the hook. That's why this bugs me. They could have banned him for life or cut him loose scot-free I'd be fine with it either way. The half-measure here is just silly and sends the message that the official penalty for being a serial sexual abuser is a six game suspension.
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The article Dream Team posted reveals something I did not actually know - that the NFL conducted their own internal investigation, which basically concluded that the dude was a serial abuser. And then gave him 6 weeks suspension. In what world does this make sense?
Yeah, that's just totally silly. The NFL deserve to take heat for it, but similar to Barto, I expect nothing but this kind of thing from the organization.
The funny thing is that I'm not actually sure he did anything wrong at all. But the NFL and the arbitrator are. They're convinced that he's guilty of this, and essentially let him off the hook. That's why this bugs me. They could have banned him for life or cut him loose scot-free I'd be fine with it either way. The half-measure here is just silly and sends the message that the official penalty for being a serial sexual abuser is a six game suspension.
Big Ben was never suspended for his incident though if I remember it was only 1 female from the report.
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The article Dream Team posted reveals something I did not actually know - that the NFL conducted their own internal investigation, which basically concluded that the dude was a serial abuser. And then gave him 6 weeks suspension. In what world does this make sense?
Yeah, that's just totally silly. The NFL deserve to take heat for it, but similar to Barto, I expect nothing but this kind of thing from the organization.
The funny thing is that I'm not actually sure he did anything wrong at all. But the NFL and the arbitrator are. They're convinced that he's guilty of this, and essentially let him off the hook. That's why this bugs me. They could have banned him for life or cut him loose scot-free I'd be fine with it either way. The half-measure here is just silly and sends the message that the official penalty for being a serial sexual abuser is a six game suspension.
Yeah this is where I'm at. He hasn't been found guilty by a court, but the NFL seem to think he is, and did their own investigation to determine it so. And then let him off with almost nothing. That's crazy to me.
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The article Dream Team posted reveals something I did not actually know - that the NFL conducted their own internal investigation, which basically concluded that the dude was a serial abuser. And then gave him 6 weeks suspension. In what world does this make sense?
Yeah, that's just totally silly. The NFL deserve to take heat for it, but similar to Barto, I expect nothing but this kind of thing from the organization.
The funny thing is that I'm not actually sure he did anything wrong at all. But the NFL and the arbitrator are. They're convinced that he's guilty of this, and essentially let him off the hook. That's why this bugs me. They could have banned him for life or cut him loose scot-free I'd be fine with it either way. The half-measure here is just silly and sends the message that the official penalty for being a serial sexual abuser is a six game suspension.
And this is where El Barto and I aren't really talking apples and oranges. I don't give a rat's ass what Susan L. Robinson said, regardless of her title. She's not god. The NFL? If they conduct investigations the way they handle other matters in their organization, I can only IMAGINE what that report looks like (I can imagine in large part it was googling "Did Deshawn Watson rape those women?"). They botched several investigations before this, no reason to assume they finally got it right. I do agree that we can't do it halfway, but I'm less concerned with the "cut him loose" side of the equation. I don't have to LIKE it for it to be just.
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The article Dream Team posted reveals something I did not actually know - that the NFL conducted their own internal investigation, which basically concluded that the dude was a serial abuser. And then gave him 6 weeks suspension. In what world does this make sense?
Yeah, that's just totally silly. The NFL deserve to take heat for it, but similar to Barto, I expect nothing but this kind of thing from the organization.
The funny thing is that I'm not actually sure he did anything wrong at all. But the NFL and the arbitrator are. They're convinced that he's guilty of this, and essentially let him off the hook. That's why this bugs me. They could have banned him for life or cut him loose scot-free I'd be fine with it either way. The half-measure here is just silly and sends the message that the official penalty for being a serial sexual abuser is a six game suspension.
And this is where El Barto and I aren't really talking apples and oranges. I don't give a rat's ass what Susan L. Robinson said, regardless of her title. She's not god. The NFL? If they conduct investigations the way they handle other matters in their organization, I can only IMAGINE what that report looks like (I can imagine in large part it was googling "Did Deshawn Watson rape those women?"). They botched several investigations before this, no reason to assume they finally got it right. I do agree that we can't do it halfway, but I'm less concerned with the "cut him loose" side of the equation. I don't have to LIKE it for it to be just.
Aren't really talking apples and oranges? What does that mean? :lol
For my part I don't really trust them to get the correct answer, either. However, by their own account they did and they need to act on the answer they arrived at. If they act on their assessment that he actually did do it and he actually did not, then he can appeal on that basis. Much like Brady did (though this one actually did go through the agreed upon procedure in the CBA).
Also, I've got no problem with Robinson. So long as she's acting as an impartial arbiter then I'm fine with her verdict. A private organization isn't going to conduct itself with the same standards as the CJ system, and I can accept that.
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The article Dream Team posted reveals something I did not actually know - that the NFL conducted their own internal investigation, which basically concluded that the dude was a serial abuser. And then gave him 6 weeks suspension. In what world does this make sense?
Yeah, that's just totally silly. The NFL deserve to take heat for it, but similar to Barto, I expect nothing but this kind of thing from the organization.
The funny thing is that I'm not actually sure he did anything wrong at all. But the NFL and the arbitrator are. They're convinced that he's guilty of this, and essentially let him off the hook. That's why this bugs me. They could have banned him for life or cut him loose scot-free I'd be fine with it either way. The half-measure here is just silly and sends the message that the official penalty for being a serial sexual abuser is a six game suspension.
And this is where El Barto and I aren't really talking apples and oranges. I don't give a rat's ass what Susan L. Robinson said, regardless of her title. She's not god. The NFL? If they conduct investigations the way they handle other matters in their organization, I can only IMAGINE what that report looks like (I can imagine in large part it was googling "Did Deshawn Watson rape those women?"). They botched several investigations before this, no reason to assume they finally got it right. I do agree that we can't do it halfway, but I'm less concerned with the "cut him loose" side of the equation. I don't have to LIKE it for it to be just.
Aren't really talking apples and oranges? What does that mean? :lol
Shut up. Work with me, here! :) :) :) :) :)
For my part I don't really trust them to get the correct answer, either. However, by their own account they did and they need to act on the answer they arrived at. If they act on their assessment that he actually did do it and he actually did not, then he can appeal on that basis. Much like Brady did (though this one actually did go through the agreed upon procedure in the CBA).
Also, I've got no problem with Robinson. So long as she's acting as an impartial arbiter then I'm fine with her verdict. A private organization isn't going to conduct itself with the same standards as the CJ system, and I can accept that.
Seriously, though, that's where the apples and oranges come in. I DON'T think it's as simple as that, because while you and I know this is a private organization coming to their own conclusion, it's playing out on a public stage, and for many - including, perhaps, some of the women at stake here - this IS a part of the larger CJ system. This goes back to the conversation I've been having with Chad since perhaps the day I met him: he always asks me, "do you ALWAYS have to think like a lawyer?" and I ALWAYS answer him, it's not that I'm thinking like a lawyer, it's that the legal system is the ONE THING we can DEMAND of others, everything else is an "ask" at best. Here, the CJ system, by many accounts, "failed" these women, so the NFL is sort of standing in for that for many. I kind of wish more organizations would not presume to play judge - even going so far as to hire one to do their dirty work - and make the bold but inconvenient statement of "hey, you see the facts as we do, and we know this doesn't look good, but the highest criminal tribunal in the land opted not to pursue this case and we have no choice but to abide by that decision. We are an organization that stages football games for our collective pleasure, not one that engages in criminal investigations, tribunals, and punishment. As such, Deshawn Watson will be eligible for full duty effective immediately."
I don't like that, I don't want that, I WOULDN'T want that if my daughter was one of the 27, but it's the only one with any effective long term consequences that don't end up ultimately rotting the system from the insides.
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Sorry if this was already addressed, but my beef with the ruling was the judge specifically calling Watson a "first offender."
Um, what?
If we can assume for the sake of argument that Watson is guilty, even in just some of these cases, the instant he pulled this crap with a second massage therapist, he became a multiple offender.
Now, I get that lumping them together for the sake of this ruling makes that it a bit fuzzy from a legal standpoint, and I am sure the lawyers here can break down the semantics of it, but that just rubbed me the wrong way (no pun intended).
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Sorry if this was already addressed, but my beef with the ruling was the judge specifically calling Watson a "first offender."
Um, what?
If we can assume for the sake of argument that Watson is guilty, even in just some of these cases, the instant he pulled this crap with a second massage therapist, he became a multiple offender.
Now, I get that lumping them together for the sake of this ruling makes that it a bit fuzzy from a legal standpoint, and I am sure the lawyers here can break down the semantics of it, but that just rubbed me the wrong way (no pun intended).
I didn't pick up on that; by that measure, some of the biggest serial killers in history were "first offenders"!
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I didn't pick up on that; by that measure, some of the biggest serial killers in history were "first offenders"!
Exactly.
The NFL is in a tough spot here, as they finally agreed to let an outside arbitrator make a ruling, but if they come back and overrule it, some sentiment will be "see, Goodell is still the ultimate judge and jury." However, the optics of it if they let the 6-game suspension stand as is are so bad that they almost have to appeal it. The PR hit from this, given the current climate where women already think the deck is stacked against them because of RvW being overturned, is something they do not need or can afford.
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I now live in a world where a dude rubbing his junk without consent on a woman is not wrong, and ejaculating on her without her consent is not wrong. Cool! Can’t wait to be enlightened further.
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I now live in a world where a dude rubbing his junk without consent on a woman is not wrong, and ejaculating on her without her consent is not wrong. Cool! Can’t wait to be enlightened further.
See, this is what I was trying to say to El Barto; that's NOT accurate, but that's the perception and that's what entities like the NFL now have to deal with when they opt to put their toes in the "punishment" waters. I can't help but feel that they're better off with the statement I wrote above: "WOW, we'd love to get involved here, but we're not a criminal justice organization."
The NFL is struggling so hard to be hip and current, and there's no real way to win here.
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What's wrong with this picture? :lol
(https://a4.espncdn.com/combiner/i?img=%2Fphoto%2F2022%2F0721%2Fr1038940_576x324_16%2D9.jpg&w=570&format=jpg)
Everything. Especially the fact that the decimal is one number too far to the right. >:(
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I now live in a world where a dude rubbing his junk without consent on a woman is not wrong, and ejaculating on her without her consent is not wrong. Cool! Can’t wait to be enlightened further.
See, this is what I was trying to say to El Barto; that's NOT accurate, but that's the perception and that's what entities like the NFL now have to deal with when they opt to put their toes in the "punishment" waters. I can't help but feel that they're better off with the statement I wrote above: "WOW, we'd love to get involved here, but we're not a criminal justice organization."
The NFL is struggling so hard to be hip and current, and there's no real way to win here.
That may be true, but trying to find a way to insure that somebody who, by their own admission, sexually assaulted multiple women can't play for their league is hardly trying to be hip and current.
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Tom Brady is involved in another scandal. I’m shocked.
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Tom Brady is involved in another scandal. I’m shocked.
Explain to me how he is involved? Do you wait to be fired before looking for a new job or do you start working on your departure from a job you are not wanted?
He's a clue, he signed a one year deal with a no franchise clause written in. Know why? He was out after 2019. No one was shocked by the way he was treated by his GM on one yard deals even after Jimmy G was traded.
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Tom Brady is involved in another scandal. I’m shocked.
Explain to me how he is involved? Do you wait to be fired before looking for a new job or do you start working on your departure from a job you are not wanted?
He's a clue, he signed a one year deal with a no franchise clause written in. Know why? He was out after 2019. No one was shocked by the way he was treated by his GM on one yard deals even after Jimmy G was traded.
Brady wasn't waiting to be fired. He was waiting to GTFO because he's a whiny little bitch.
In any case, it was the Dolphins who were tampering. Brady and Payton haven't done anything except answer the phone, and that's not against the rules.
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Tom Brady is involved in another scandal. I’m shocked.
Explain to me how he is involved? Do you wait to be fired before looking for a new job or do you start working on your departure from a job you are not wanted?
He's a clue, he signed a one year deal with a no franchise clause written in. Know why? He was out after 2019. No one was shocked by the way he was treated by his GM on one yard deals even after Jimmy G was traded.
Brady wasn't waiting to be fired. He was waiting to GTFO because he's a whiny little bitch.
In any case, it was the Dolphins who were tampering. Brady and Payton haven't done anything except answer the phone, and that's not against the rules.
Of course I know that. Free Agency in sports is different in real life work but how many real life employees in a situation wait to look for a new job until they are let go? It's nonsense to think that all players or at least the agents talk behind the scenes before free agency.
Beside the tampering rules are only made for the owners, not the players/agents. But Brady cheats. AMIRITE?!
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I now live in a world where a dude rubbing his junk without consent on a woman is not wrong, and ejaculating on her without her consent is not wrong. Cool! Can’t wait to be enlightened further.
See, this is what I was trying to say to El Barto; that's NOT accurate, but that's the perception and that's what entities like the NFL now have to deal with when they opt to put their toes in the "punishment" waters. I can't help but feel that they're better off with the statement I wrote above: "WOW, we'd love to get involved here, but we're not a criminal justice organization."
The NFL is struggling so hard to be hip and current, and there's no real way to win here.
That may be true, but trying to find a way to insure that somebody who, by their own admission, sexually assaulted multiple women can't play for their league is hardly trying to be hip and current.
Well, read my post in context with the others. I don't know why they are making that admission. I don't think it's to do the right thing, I think it's to maintain an image.
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Tom Brady is involved in another scandal. I’m shocked.
Explain to me how he is involved? Do you wait to be fired before looking for a new job or do you start working on your departure from a job you are not wanted?
He's a clue, he signed a one year deal with a no franchise clause written in. Know why? He was out after 2019. No one was shocked by the way he was treated by his GM on one yard deals even after Jimmy G was traded.
Brady wasn't waiting to be fired. He was waiting to GTFO because he's a whiny little bitch.
In any case, it was the Dolphins who were tampering. Brady and Payton haven't done anything except answer the phone, and that's not against the rules.
Of course I know that. Free Agency in sports is different in real life work but how many real life employees in a situation wait to look for a new job until they are let go? It's nonsense to think that all players or at least the agents talk behind the scenes before free agency.
Beside the tampering rules are only made for the owners, not the players/agents. But Brady cheats. AMIRITE?!
And then you think about the NBA, where players openly court other players onto teams all the time.
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For sure. My poor analogy is about those unhappy in work situations. Everyone looks for the next job. It was obvious with a 1 year deal with him getting the no franchise clause after winning his 6th SB, that he was gone. I had hope, but it was foolish because of my blind love of our football team.
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I now live in a world where a dude rubbing his junk without consent on a woman is not wrong, and ejaculating on her without her consent is not wrong. Cool! Can’t wait to be enlightened further.
See, this is what I was trying to say to El Barto; that's NOT accurate, but that's the perception and that's what entities like the NFL now have to deal with when they opt to put their toes in the "punishment" waters. I can't help but feel that they're better off with the statement I wrote above: "WOW, we'd love to get involved here, but we're not a criminal justice organization."
The NFL is struggling so hard to be hip and current, and there's no real way to win here.
That may be true, but trying to find a way to insure that somebody who, by their own admission, sexually assaulted multiple women can't play for their league is hardly trying to be hip and current.
Well, read my post in context with the others. I don't know why they are making that admission. I don't think it's to do the right thing, I think it's to maintain an image.
I think there comes a point where the league (or any business entity) has to assume a certain role relating to law enforcement. Image is part of it. Liability is part of it. Decency is a part of it. If a guy kept being investigated by the cops for sexual assault but managed to beat the rap every time would you simply say "it's not our place to punish him" and let him keep on working? What happens if DeShaun gets all Zeek Mowatt on a reporter or a trainer?
Also, if the league were particularly concerned about image they'd do a whole lot more than the recommended 6 game suspension.
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I think only Stads and I will get that Zeek Mowatt reference.
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(https://media2.giphy.com/media/pPhyAv5t9V8djyRFJH/200w.gif?cid=82a1493brfjdzoky167s6oqzo6roc2t0sohjxrbg4wk1p0tx&rid=200w.gif&ct=g)
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Oh, and Tim. :lol
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Of course I know that. Free Agency in sports is different in real life work but how many real life employees in a situation wait to look for a new job until they are let go? It's nonsense to think that all players or at least the agents talk behind the scenes before free agency.
Beside the tampering rules are only made for the owners, not the players/agents. But Brady cheats. AMIRITE?!
I agree that this kind of tampering/talking behind the scenes goes on all the time, it's just a matter of who gets caught, but as to the bolded, how many real life employees have a signed contract with their employee (like Brady did with the Patriots)?
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Many bug wigs do. Jobs I wouldn't have. Then again, aren't we blinded by their money?
If you found out that a guy that dies the same job make 20 grand more than you do snd you are an exemplary employee putting the company 1st would you feel slighted ?
You know how much money someone makes doesn't stop the feeling of being slighted.
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Well, sure, but in the case of Brady, we were always told that he was a team guy who took less money so they could put a better team around him, but now it was a problem because he didn't get special treatment because of it? Come on, now. What's amazing is that he still doesn't probably realize that Belichick always treating him the way he did is likely what helped keep that fire lit inside him to do want to do better, rather than getting the royal treatment and resting on his laurels.
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He wasn't asking for the world. 2 years, 50 million. 5 time SB QB shouldn't have to have incentives on his contracts. Especially with the stats in 2016 & 2017. Add that they traded Jimmy G. Once you make that decision, you say you choose Brady.
I blame BB the GM. In2019 he said they couldn't afford to buy. Who's fault it that GM. Your drafts sucked and you had to spend to be competitive.
It's all on Bill.
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bug wigs
(https://i.pinimg.com/736x/c3/73/59/c373594c636ee48b0dc29d977f60bbd3--the-giant-peach-costume-design.jpg)
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Where's my typo? :lol
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Yep, all Bill's fault, Tom is never wrong, ever.
You are nothing if not consistent, Joe. :tup :tup
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Yep, all Bill's fault, Tom is never wrong, ever.
You are nothing if not consistent, Joe. :tup :tup
Kev, Joe is right. If the Pats just gave Brady what Brees was getting, he'd have stayed.
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Boston sports fans unite!! :metal :metal
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Kev, Brady is the greatest QB ever. He was putting up numbers like no other in 2016, 2017.
2017 - 4,577 yards, 32 Td's, 8 Intd's, PR - 102.8
2016 - 3,554 yards, 28 Td's, 2 Intd's, PR - 112.2 (12 games)
1 SB and 1 SB Loss.
So yeah. I'm on his side. 2 years $25 million is not mind blowing. Especially with no backup plan.
How was Cam Newton?
The hate outside N.E. is ridiculous.
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Leaving aside the fact that Cam was washed, are we really gonna bag on him for not doing well when he was a late signing and during a season where teams were ravaged by COVID? Really?
How did Tom do in 2019? Ya know, the season where even many Pats fans concede that he wasn't all-in, which seems like conduct unbecoming for the alleged GOAT, but then again maybe playing with Randy Moss taught him a thing or two about quitting on a team when you decided you didn't care anymore.
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I'll crap on Cam because it was a terrible call to sign him in the 12th hour.
You think Brady would be that bad if he wasn't shit on by his GM/coach? He checked out. And let's add the crap offense weapons he had. Julian was injured. Look who he had? Don't give me the "Brady should make everyone better" line. Even great QB's need playmaker
Oh, and in his 40's.
(https://i.postimg.cc/rwY6v2wf/20220803-220251.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/zyWPgMWh)
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I'm willing to bridge the gap here. Tom and Bill both deserve 100% of the blame.
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I don't. Brady took less. After they traded Jommy G, they should have extended Brady. They did not. Doing 1 year deals with incentives.
Incentives? Did you know after the 2017 season he told Kraft he wanted out and Kraft said no. Once you trade Jimmy G, you can at least give the QB who puts up insane numbers a 2 year deal.
So no. I blame BB.
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Oh, and in his 40's.
(https://i.postimg.cc/rwY6v2wf/20220803-220251.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/zyWPgMWh)
Meaningless stats for $800, Alex!! (since we all know that passing numbers are off the charts now, so comparing anyone's nowadays to those who played last century is pointless)
Besides, Brady looked done in 2019, and while he has still been really good since, he has needed a Bucs offense absolutely loaded with weapons in order to do so. He can no longer elevate an offense with average or below average skill position players, which is why the Patriots were smart to not pay him, as, yes, they had crap weapons (Bill's fault since he was the GM, sure). Ultimately, smart GMs almost never overpay players for what they did in the past, especially aging ones. Brady was showing decline in 2018 and 2019 (in both the numbers and the eye test), and I am not sure how anyone can dispute that.
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I'm willing to bridge the gap here. Tom and Bill both deserve 100% of the blame.
Same, and I look forward to watching their mutual decline :lol
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I'm willing to bridge the gap here. Tom and Bill both deserve 100% of the blame.
Same, and I look forward to watching their mutual decline :lol
Brady will probably play till he's 50, so get ready for more teases, as I am sure he has a few more "I'm retiring...oops, no, I'm not!" dramatic turns in him. :lol
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I'm willing to bridge the gap here. Tom and Bill both deserve 100% of the blame.
Same, and I look forward to watching their mutual decline :lol
Brady will probably play till he's 50, so get ready for more teases, as I am sure he has a few more "I'm retiring...oops, no, I'm not!" dramatic turns in him. :lol
He is turning into Favre. :lol
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I'm willing to bridge the gap here. Tom and Bill both deserve 100% of the blame.
Same, and I look forward to watching their mutual decline :lol
Brady will probably play till he's 50, so get ready for more teases, as I am sure he has a few more "I'm retiring...oops, no, I'm not!" dramatic turns in him. :lol
Just give me one season with the wheels completely off. That's all I want to see.
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(https://i.postimg.cc/mZp7v1sv/FB-IMG-1659619500987.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
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I now live in a world where a dude rubbing his junk without consent on a woman is not wrong, and ejaculating on her without her consent is not wrong. Cool! Can’t wait to be enlightened further.
See, this is what I was trying to say to El Barto; that's NOT accurate, but that's the perception and that's what entities like the NFL now have to deal with when they opt to put their toes in the "punishment" waters. I can't help but feel that they're better off with the statement I wrote above: "WOW, we'd love to get involved here, but we're not a criminal justice organization."
The NFL is struggling so hard to be hip and current, and there's no real way to win here.
That may be true, but trying to find a way to insure that somebody who, by their own admission, sexually assaulted multiple women can't play for their league is hardly trying to be hip and current.
Well, read my post in context with the others. I don't know why they are making that admission. I don't think it's to do the right thing, I think it's to maintain an image.
I think there comes a point where the league (or any business entity) has to assume a certain role relating to law enforcement. Image is part of it. Liability is part of it. Decency is a part of it. If a guy kept being investigated by the cops for sexual assault but managed to beat the rap every time would you simply say "it's not our place to punish him" and let him keep on working? What happens if DeShaun gets all Zeek Mowatt on a reporter or a trainer?
Also, if the league were particularly concerned about image they'd do a whole lot more than the recommended 6 game suspension.
I go both ways on that; Zeke was part of a crowd, there were witnesses (and maybe even tape). That was stupid. If the guy DOES beat the rap in a court room, I feel like we don't have a choice in the matter. Don't hire him if you don't want to, but in terms of punishment, no. Innocent until proven guilty. I get that this is the hot button issue right now, and I get that you want to have an environment that is welcoming to all people, but there's the sticking problem of due process.
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Leaving aside the fact that Cam was washed, are we really gonna bag on him for not doing well when he was a late signing and during a season where teams were ravaged by COVID? Really?
How did Tom do in 2019? Ya know, the season where even many Pats fans concede that he wasn't all-in, which seems like conduct unbecoming for the alleged GOAT, but then again maybe playing with Randy Moss taught him a thing or two about quitting on a team when you decided you didn't care anymore.
I am. Cam Newton is one of my three least favorite players in any pro sport, EVER. I despise that guy. Or should I say, "! D#$#&$pi$E ThAt G39834578!!!Y!"
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(https://i.postimg.cc/mZp7v1sv/FB-IMG-1659619500987.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
HAHAHA, side note, a friend of mine's kid is currently dancing between AAA and the major leagues in baseball (he just had a drink of water with the Yankees, a dream come true for him and his dad!) and he's been traded TWICE now for $1. :) :)
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Crazy isn't it?
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Besides, Brady looked done in 2019, and while he has still been really good since, he has needed a Bucs offense absolutely loaded with weapons in order to do so. He can no longer elevate an offense with average or below average skill position players, which is why the Patriots were smart to not pay him, as, yes, they had crap weapons (Bill's fault since he was the GM, sure). Ultimately, smart GMs almost never overpay players for what they did in the past, especially aging ones. Brady was showing decline in 2018 and 2019 (in both the numbers and the eye test), and I am not sure how anyone can dispute that.
Yep. And this is why King convinced me that he's a bitch. All we've heard is that he's the chief buy-in of the "team first" mentality that defined the Patriots. This is one of many things he should have understood and recognized. Instead he packed up his toys and left when management actually put the team first.
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He left management because he wasn't given fair value. Most all great players are Divas. I'm sorry but BB did him wrong. you either trade, him, or let him go and go with Jimmy G. Once Jimmy G was gone you stay with Brady. Brady wasn't the GM who messed up the Draft and the Cap. BB did that. Bill dropped the ball.
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He left management because he wasn't given fair value.
Sounds like a "me" problem. How many players has Brady watched come and go because they weren't given "fair" money? Hundred? It's been the Patriots way of doing things for the last 20 years, and he had no problem with it until he got old and became one of them.
I'm sorry but BB did him wrong. I'm sorry but BB did him wrong.
Bill would have been all over that. Brady wanted to stay in NE and get rid of Bill (or more precisely, swap Bills, Belichick for O'Brien). He didn't want to be traded and Kraft gave him a couple of more years without having Jimmy G looking over his shoulder. Bill didn't do him wrong. If anybody did it was Kraft by keeping him around in an unpleasant [for him] situation. In the end they gave Brady the deal he wanted with an escape route which he took.
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Brady asked out in 2017. Kraft said no. 2018 Bill gave him a one year deal with incentives. His #'s were top of the league. All he wanted was a 2 year deal like Brees at $25 mil a year. He didn't get that. after wining the SB in 18, he asked for another 2 year deal and Bill wouldn't do it. So Brady got Kraft to sign on that they couldn't Franchise him and he was gone.
So yeah, Bill did him wrong. He wasn't asking for the moon. These are facts from the local reporters and is well known in N.E.
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I don't know if that's all true about Brady being loaded with weapons with the Bucs. Last season Godwin, Fournette, Gronk and AB were out for large chunks of the season esp during the tail end of the seaon. He had to make do with scraps from Practice squad players and yet played out of his mind and lead an amazing comeback in the playoffs coming back from 27-3 to tie the game. Defense helped sure, but still had to rely on an injured center, no Wirfs, replacement players for the most part. I think he did alright.
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Besides, Brady looked done in 2019, and while he has still been really good since, he has needed a Bucs offense absolutely loaded with weapons in order to do so. He can no longer elevate an offense with average or below average skill position players, which is why the Patriots were smart to not pay him, as, yes, they had crap weapons (Bill's fault since he was the GM, sure). Ultimately, smart GMs almost never overpay players for what they did in the past, especially aging ones. Brady was showing decline in 2018 and 2019 (in both the numbers and the eye test), and I am not sure how anyone can dispute that.
Yep. And this is why King convinced me that he's a bitch. All we've heard is that he's the chief buy-in of the "team first" mentality that defined the Patriots. This is one of many things he should have understood and recognized. Instead he packed up his toys and left when management actually put the team first.
Agreed.
And I didn't need Joe to accidentally convince me about Brady. He always seemed like a good guy in NE, even if many of us were tired of seeing them win, but he has really showed himself to be a pompous douche since leaving the Patriots. Now that he doesn't have to be stoic and live the "Patriot Way," he is free to let his inner douche out, and let it out he has.
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Besides, Brady looked done in 2019, and while he has still been really good since, he has needed a Bucs offense absolutely loaded with weapons in order to do so. He can no longer elevate an offense with average or below average skill position players, which is why the Patriots were smart to not pay him, as, yes, they had crap weapons (Bill's fault since he was the GM, sure). Ultimately, smart GMs almost never overpay players for what they did in the past, especially aging ones. Brady was showing decline in 2018 and 2019 (in both the numbers and the eye test), and I am not sure how anyone can dispute that.
Yep. And this is why King convinced me that he's a bitch. All we've heard is that he's the chief buy-in of the "team first" mentality that defined the Patriots. This is one of many things he should have understood and recognized. Instead he packed up his toys and left when management actually put the team first.
Agreed.
And I didn't need Joe to accidentally convince me about Brady. He always seemed like a good guy in NE, even if many of us were tired of seeing them win, but he has really showed himself to be a pompous douche since leaving the Patriots. Now that he doesn't have to be stoic and live the "Patriot Way," he is free to let his inner douche out, and let it out he has.
Yeah. Truth be told, getting sloshed and reckless at the Tampa SB flotilla was the first likeable thing I'd seem him do in ages. It actually made him seem halfway human. But he really does look like a massive hypocrite at this point. I'm happy to see him enjoying himself, and he's earned the right to be happy in his final years in the league. This notion that he's been wronged simply by being treated in accordance with his own supposed values doesn't sit well with me, though.
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Brady asked out in 2017. Kraft said no. 2018 Bill gave him a one year deal with incentives. His #'s were top of the league. All he wanted was a 2 year deal like Brees at $25 mil a year. He didn't get that. after wining the SB in 18, he asked for another 2 year deal and Bill wouldn't do it. So Brady got Kraft to sign on that they couldn't Franchise him and he was gone.
So yeah, Bill did him wrong. He wasn't asking for the moon. These are facts from the local reporters and is well known in N.E.
In 2018 terms 25/yr would have put him in the top 5, and was only 3.5 mil more than he was earning. I call that ego money. Did he deserve top five money? Of course. That applied to a ton of Patriots players before him, though, and none of them got it. He wanted to be treated special, and that is not the mentality that he presented for the first 15 years of his career, nor the manner in which NE has conducted itself in that same period.
Also, trying to oust Belichick (and presumably succeeding in ousting Ariens) was rotten. That is not a "team first" mentality. There are countless other examples, too.
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He left management because he wasn't given fair value. Most all great players are Divas. I'm sorry but BB did him wrong. you either trade, him, or let him go and go with Jimmy G. Once Jimmy G was gone you stay with Brady. Brady wasn't the GM who messed up the Draft and the Cap. BB did that. Bill dropped the ball.
So wait... King convinced El Barto that Brady is a bitch, and El Barto convinced King that he was right and unappreciated? This is like those Call of Duty skirmishes where you both empty your clips into the other guy and you both die. :) :) :)
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He left management because he wasn't given fair value.
Sounds like a "me" problem. How many players has Brady watched come and go because they weren't given "fair" money? Hundred? It's been the Patriots way of doing things for the last 20 years, and he had no problem with it until he got old and became one of them.
Vince Wilfork, Wes Welker, and Danny Amendola for three. There are more.
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It was the 2 years that was the big deal.
El Barto, if you were elite at you job but had to fight to get a 2 year contract with incentives, you'd take that as a slap in the face. That's a human response.
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Also, trying to oust Belichick (and presumably succeeding in ousting Ariens) was rotten. That is not a "team first" mentality. There are countless other examples, too.
And that's the thing that doesn't sit well with me, the ousting of coaches. Both Belichick and Arians have proven records of winning, and both espouse methodologies that players don't always love. Brady IS at the end of his career, but I don't know that I dig the "cake and eat it too" mentality. Does he want to show that "his way" can win too? Then go play for Ted Lasso.
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It was the 2 years that was the big deal.
El Barto, if you were elite at you job but had to fight to get a 2 year contract with incentives, you'd take that as a slap in the face. That's a human response.
The one wildcard is Brady's age; had Brady been even five years younger, I think we MIGHT have seen a different response. Forget about money, Belichick was ALWAYS about getting rid of guys BEFORE they faded, not after. He never would've put up with Roethlisberger's last year in Pittsburgh, for example.
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It was the 2 years that was the big deal.
El Barto, if you were elite at you job but had to fight to get a 2 year contract with incentives, you'd take that as a slap in the face. That's a human response.
Seven years ago Brady would have been on my side. Brady was old enough that risk had to be taken into account, and he had to know this. Moreover, as I said, Brady had always appreciated that business aspect of this, including cutting people loose before they start to decline, and before they have to be paid top money. My problem isn't that Brady felt it was a slap in the face. My problem is that Brady spent most of his career supporting the mentality of slapping players in the face until it became his turn.
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Completely get that but in any one sided relationship, it can sour.
This is speculation on my part but the weight of his mom's cancer, BB not backing him on Deflategat, (remember ask Tom?) & though his owner backed him, he succumbed to the other 31 owners, the suspension, fighting for 2 year deals, getting 1 with incentives and lastly, the big thing, his trainer and the issues with him and Belichick (can't blame Bill there) he just had enough.
Me personally, you bend a little for one of the greatest players ever. I still love BB as a coach but do lay blame on him as the GM.
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Completely get that but in any one sided relationship, it can sour.
This is speculation on my part but the weight of his mom's cancer, BB not backing him on Deflategat, (remember ask Tom?) & though his owner backed him, he succumbed to the other 31 owners, the suspension, fighting for 2 year deals, getting 1 with incentives and lastly, the big thing, his trainer and the issues with him and Belichick (can't blame Bill there) he just had enough.
Me personally, you bend a little for one of the greatest players ever. I still love BB as a coach but do lay blame on him as the GM.
In this case bending was continuing to sign him to one or two year deals rather than outright jettisoning him (which is what I'd have done).
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Completely get that but in any one sided relationship, it can sour.
This is speculation on my part but the weight of his mom's cancer, BB not backing him on Deflategat, (remember ask Tom?) & though his owner backed him, he succumbed to the other 31 owners, the suspension, fighting for 2 year deals, getting 1 with incentives and lastly, the big thing, his trainer and the issues with him and Belichick (can't blame Bill there) he just had enough.
Me personally, you bend a little for one of the greatest players ever. I still love BB as a coach but do lay blame on him as the GM.
In this case bending was continuing to sign him to one or two year deals rather than outright jettisoning him (which is what I'd have done).
Interesting thing is, Bill had been through this before, with LT.
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Though, LT had his demons, Brady didn't.
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Completely get that but in any one sided relationship, it can sour.
This is speculation on my part but the weight of his mom's cancer, BB not backing him on Deflategat, (remember ask Tom?) & though his owner backed him, he succumbed to the other 31 owners, the suspension, fighting for 2 year deals, getting 1 with incentives and lastly, the big thing, his trainer and the issues with him and Belichick (can't blame Bill there) he just had enough.
Me personally, you bend a little for one of the greatest players ever. I still love BB as a coach but do lay blame on him as the GM.
In this case bending was continuing to sign him to one or two year deals rather than outright jettisoning him (which is what I'd have done).
If BB doesn't produce playoffs every year, Kraft may can him. You heard last year what he said about spending all that money on free agency and what his expectations for BB & the team were?
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Looks like the league has appealed the 6 game suspension, and my hunch is that they're hoping to lose. That's their best case scenario. It ends the whole thing, and Goodell gets to say he disagreed with the outcome, but the process played out fairly.
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Jared Stidham...3 straight scoring drives!
Er..make that 2, and the guy that took over for him on the 3rd drive.
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Tom Brady is involved in another scandal. I’m shocked.
The Globe absolutely unloaded on him for this. And correctly, in that it wasn't about any scandal or wrongdoing, but simply that he's an asshole. :lol
https://www.bostonglobe.com/2022/08/05/sports/this-time-tom-brady-shouldnt-get-any-slack-other-thoughts/
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Tom Brady is involved in another scandal. I’m shocked.
The Globe absolutely unloaded on him for this. And correctly, in that it wasn't about any scandal or wrongdoing, but simply that he's an asshole. :lol
https://www.bostonglobe.com/2022/08/05/sports/this-time-tom-brady-shouldnt-get-any-slack-other-thoughts/
El Barto, the writer Dan Shaughnessy (Known as Shank but other media members) is a known troublemaker who loves to stir the pot. I like him. He does go this route with all his stories. Tim can back me up on on this. I actually bumped into him at a rest stop heading into Foxborough for a game after 2 feet of snow was dropped the night before. It was against the Dolphins.
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LOL TB. He's always gonna be known as the goat who didn't know when to say when. Always has something more to prove when the proof is already there. People get tired of that shit dude. Get a clue. :lol
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From that article...
"You have to be a true sycophant/fanboy to dismiss this one."
Hey, Joe. (https://media3.giphy.com/media/xT9IgG50Fb7Mi0prBC/giphy.gif?cid=ecf05e477myu59fct22ixcu4velczlr8kpoquc7hyog2xaa2&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g)
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LOL TB. He's always gonna be known as the goat who didn't know when to say when. Always has something more to prove when the proof is already there. People get tired of that shit dude. Get a clue. :lol
I sorta get that, but I don't. We are a nation that claims to be obsessed with excellence, and yet we shit on it whenever we can when it doesn't fit with our other competing notions (whatever it is they are). :) :). He's LITERALLY going where no player in the NFL has ever gone in history. Sure players have played at older, but not at his level and not as every day players. I can't imagine why people can't admire that aspect of his career. You don't have to like him as a man to admire his skills.
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I can't read the article. It's paywalled.
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I can't read the article. It's paywalled.
https://archive.ph/hSz9d
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Oh, ok. He doesn't really say anything.
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From that article...
"You have to be a true sycophant/fanboy to dismiss this one."
Hey, Joe. (https://media3.giphy.com/media/xT9IgG50Fb7Mi0prBC/giphy.gif?cid=ecf05e477myu59fct22ixcu4velczlr8kpoquc7hyog2xaa2&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g)
You have to know the writer. He's been crapped on around here because he's always ruthless. He's a great writer with an attitude and doesn't back down from athletes. Problem most have it's his only shtick.
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Well, he's outlasted 99% of those athletes so that ought to say something.
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Well, he's outlasted 99% of those athletes so that ought to say something.
He's been called out for not attacking the Red Sox on certain subjects. Why? The Globe is owned by John Henry. Who owns the Sox.
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Well, he's outlasted 99% of those athletes so that ought to say something.
He's 100 fucking years old. Of course he's outlasted them. :lol
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I wonder when the end for a physical newspapers will happen? I don't think my generation buys them anymore. Most read electronically.
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LOL TB. He's always gonna be known as the goat who didn't know when to say when. Always has something more to prove when the proof is already there. People get tired of that shit dude. Get a clue. :lol
I sorta get that, but I don't. We are a nation that claims to be obsessed with excellence, and yet we shit on it whenever we can when it doesn't fit with our other competing notions (whatever it is they are). :) :). He's LITERALLY going where no player in the NFL has ever gone in history. Sure players have played at older, but not at his level and not as every day players. I can't imagine why people can't admire that aspect of his career. You don't have to like him as a man to admire his skills.
Going? He's already been there. Over and over again. Time to pack it in and quit rubbing it in. Your last sentence pretty much summed it up anyway. I can admire the guy and be sick of him at the same time. Whaddaya think? All good?
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No way. I want to see haters lose their mind as he still excels another 5 years.
Unless it's the Dolphins. Lol
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LOL King :lol
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I see it every day on social media. I soak it all up. lolololol
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I'm on social media too...
...it's called DTF!
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That's like using a rotary phone. Lol
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Who doesn't have a rotary phone?
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I rest my case.
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Speaking of rotary phones, why did they make emergencies 911? It takes forever to dial a 9. Shouldn't it have been 111?
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You have to know the writer. He's been crapped on around here because he's always ruthless. He's a great writer with an attitude and doesn't back down from athletes. Problem most have it's his only shtick.
I remember seeing Shaughnessy on ESPN a few times many years ago. He struck me as a rather smug, self-important wanker, but I figured it was just a Boston thing. :P
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Lol. So many fans hate him. It's hilarious.
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LOL TB. He's always gonna be known as the goat who didn't know when to say when. Always has something more to prove when the proof is already there. People get tired of that shit dude. Get a clue. :lol
I sorta get that, but I don't. We are a nation that claims to be obsessed with excellence, and yet we shit on it whenever we can when it doesn't fit with our other competing notions (whatever it is they are). :) :). He's LITERALLY going where no player in the NFL has ever gone in history. Sure players have played at older, but not at his level and not as every day players. I can't imagine why people can't admire that aspect of his career. You don't have to like him as a man to admire his skills.
What the Brady zealots don’t get is that it’s never enough - you wanna say he’s the most successful QB of all time? Got it. The best of all time? Sure, but I could throw peak Peyton or Marino or Montana or Rodgers at you. But it doesn’t end there - you also have to agree that he’s the smartest, the hardest worker, the most clutch, the best leader, the best teammate, the toughest (lol), the best looking, the best at the 2-minute drill, the most accurate, the most altruistic, etc etc ad nauseum. Don’t people see how ridiculous that gets? And I guarantee you all those arguments have been made at Patsfans forum.
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As a zealot, my goal is to see Brady continue to be that thorn in any fans side. To see him inside fans head. I bet he feeds off that thought process too.
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As a zealot, my goal is to see Brady continue to be that thorn in any fans side. To see him inside fans head. I bet he feeds off that thought process too.
Yeah, and he's the best at it too. :lol
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Damn straight he is.
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Too bad about N'Keal Harry. I was kind of rooting for the guy, so long as his interests don't conflict with mine. Seems like every time he finds himself in a new situation looking to establish himself he winds up injured. Once again he's going to start off with a "what if" year. I would have liked to have seen him make a case for himself.
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I didn't even know about that. Damn.
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Just watched the Richard Seymour HOF speech. Wow, that was impressive.
Would've been more impressive if he could've fucking dragged Eli down.
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Just watched the Richard Seymour HOF speech. Wow, that was impressive.
Would've been more impressive if he could've fucking dragged Eli down.
And the world thanks him for it.
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LOL TB. He's always gonna be known as the goat who didn't know when to say when. Always has something more to prove when the proof is already there. People get tired of that shit dude. Get a clue. :lol
I sorta get that, but I don't. We are a nation that claims to be obsessed with excellence, and yet we shit on it whenever we can when it doesn't fit with our other competing notions (whatever it is they are). :) :). He's LITERALLY going where no player in the NFL has ever gone in history. Sure players have played at older, but not at his level and not as every day players. I can't imagine why people can't admire that aspect of his career. You don't have to like him as a man to admire his skills.
What the Brady zealots don’t get is that it’s never enough - you wanna say he’s the most successful QB of all time? Got it. The best of all time? Sure, but I could throw peak Peyton or Marino or Montana or Rodgers at you. But it doesn’t end there - you also have to agree that he’s the smartest, the hardest worker, the most clutch, the best leader, the best teammate, the toughest (lol), the best looking, the best at the 2-minute drill, the most accurate, the most altruistic, etc etc ad nauseum. Don’t people see how ridiculous that gets? And I guarantee you all those arguments have been made at Patsfans forum.
But he is, though. :)
I think the point is less about the absolute answer than the fact that whatever the conversation - most wins, most TDs, most years played, most great seasons, hardest working, biggest penis - the other players may change, but Brady is the constant in ALL those conversations.
I was at dinner with some friends last night and we concluded that Bill Belichick likely coached the two greatest players of all time on each side of the ball (TB and LT).
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El Barto. I think you'll get a kick on how nuts Boston sports fans are and sports talk radio.
https://twitter.com/latimes/status/1558109875124592646?t=9snyNkX6PRq5ZM7H_0TJXw&s=19
(https://i.postimg.cc/vT45Pgxg/Screenshot-20220812-173528-Chrome.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/JHWy0hqM)
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Nice pic with Steven A with the F&M crew. That was a great segment.
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It was. Fun when they have guests on.
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I actually feel for the Jets. Wilson may have torn his ACL in the 1st pre season game. That's horrific.
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He could've wrapped his fucking stupid ass headband around it.
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I actually feel for the Jets. Wilson may have torn his ACL in the 1st pre season game. That's horrific.
I mean if he did I won’t have to waste my time watching football this season. This would be devastating. Wilson looked great in training camp this year and it looked like he was ready to take the next step.
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It is heartbreaking to have this happen in the 1st preseason game where he may play 2 series.
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I don't care about him, and fuck his team, but that really is awful. I hate to see that.
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Proof that sometimes people don't think before they speak...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVQtFkSDx5g
:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9DfUvLg7ao
Reminds me of the sheer brilliance of Barkley.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9DfUvLg7ao
Reminds me of the sheer brilliance of Barkley.
That clip is good and shows how great that show is. Most analysts would have shrugged off the reactions and continued with their analysis, but Chuck gave a "come on, now" and just gave up. :lol :lol
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Sadly it was before everybody was tevoing everything, but the guy calling a Stars game showed a replay of a goal said "he just spread him open and slid it right in." As cringeworthy as anything I've head from a commentator.
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Boston Bruins announcer in the 70's said, "The Bruins are playing shitty hockey right now."
I looked at my parents and they were laughing their asses off. I was 7. Lol
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No idea what's the worse sign - Zach Wilson coming out and throwing an INT immediately or him going down on a contactless play with a knee injury
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Sadly it was before everybody was tevoing everything, but the guy calling a Stars game showed a replay of a goal said "he just spread him open and slid it right in." As cringeworthy as anything I've head from a commentator.
:lol :lol :lol :lol
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Baker Mayfield got the first series for the Panthers Saturday.
It was only one series in the first preseason game, so you can't really tell much, but at least he didn't look like shit, or injure himself.
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Baker Mayfield got the first series for the Panthers Saturday.
It was only one series in the first preseason game, so you can't really tell much, but at least he didn't look like shit, or injure himself.
Sounds like you're a Panthers fan - I assume you strongly prefer him over Darnold?
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Baker Mayfield got the first series for the Panthers Saturday.
It was only one series in the first preseason game, so you can't really tell much, but at least he didn't look like shit, or injure himself.
Sounds like you're a Panthers fan - I assume you strongly prefer him over Darnold?
I don't know about "strongly" but honestly, I'm not thrilled about either one.
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Shame about Joejuan Williams. Distinct possibility that the shoulder injury ends his career. And while he certainly didn't pan out as a number two pick, it's another one of those what-if kind of things. He was oft-injured, and played in a star-studded secondary for his first couple of years. I would have liked to see him go someplace to start for a season, and it doesn't look like that'll happen.
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Shame about Joejuan Williams. Distinct possibility that the shoulder injury ends his career. And while he certainly didn't pan out as a number two pick, it's another one of those what-if kind of things. He was oft-injured, and played in a star-studded secondary for his first couple of years. I would have liked to see him go someplace to start for a season, and it doesn't look like that'll happen.
And there goes Malcolm Butler. His comeback season into a system in which he thrived could have worked out. Safe to say he's retired permanently now. Good day for Dream Team.
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11 games for Watson and a $5mm fine. Cool. But most importantly a mandatory treatment program.
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11 games for Watson and a $5mm fine. Cool. But most importantly a mandatory treatment program.
Well, let's hope it's something real - real treatment that he engages in - and not one of those touchy feely "diversity programs" which have been shown to be essentially useless (https://hbr.org/2012/03/diversity-training-doesnt-work). It's the NFL, so it could go either way.
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11 games for Watson and a $5mm fine. Cool. But most importantly a mandatory treatment program.
C'mon......I mean, this whole thing shouldn't even be a 'thing'. There is ZERO reason for him to be allowed to play at all. He's a serial sexual predator....period. One, two...heck even three girls come forward with a story then sure....maybe it's sour grapes or something like that. But the amount of women that accused him paints a pretty clear picture. And the fact that a team AND the league just ho hum through it is a joke.
Not to mention the dude isn't even all that good. Had a good season a few years back but what's he really done? Nothing.
The whole situation is a joke.
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Meanwhile, Tom Brady leaves camp out of nowhere, and now Todd Bowles basically says they don't know when he will be back. Given how much Brady has channeled his inner Brett Favre recently, I won't be surprised if re-retires here in the next few weeks, while giving some pithy reason.
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It's weird how the first said a date, now Bowles, who he wanted, says they don't have a date.
It would be a huge blemish if Brady has the coup only to screw them.
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Let's face it, he's old (in football terms), and I wouldn't be surprised if he really started to feel it as camp moved along, and with losing his center for the year, which is a big loss, it wouldn't surprise me if he is looking for an exit strategy. He can play the "I need to focus on my family" card, and the media, which generally genuflects to him already, will lap it up and give him a pass.
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Who the hell knows what he is thinking. Funny, he was better off under Belichick's thumb with the media.
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Who the hell knows what he is thinking. Funny, he was better off under Belichick's thumb with the media.
The funny thing is that as much as he whines about not being treated better in NE, Bill would have taken the same approach as Bowles with this. He and Kraft would have given him all the time he needed.
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Bill was light handed for days off so the arm got rest but not being there with the guys in preseason would be a no no.
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Bill was light handed for days off so the arm got rest but not being there with the guys in preseason would be a no no.
But probably not worth rocking the boat over. Bill's not dumb. He's not going to tell Brady to be there or he won't play. Besides, TB always had Kraft as an ally.
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He definitely did.
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Don't know if anyone checked out the Manti Teo doc on Netflix. I watched it last night, and came away feeling like the whole thing still does not quite add up...
One thing that keeps bothering me about this Untold documentary for Manti Teo is how I don't think they really ruled out one of the big theories suggested at the time: that Teo or someone close to him (if not multiple people) were in on the hoax.
Teo and his camp would obviously would never admit this, but there's no real scrutiny around the idea that he, the university, or someone in his camp could have been party to the whole thing.
Here's some initial issues I have: "Lennay's" explanations don't make total sense. How she got the "real" Lennay's picture to confirm her presence after being dead is never explained.
Also, the TV segment where she goes on Dr. Phil to do "the voice" while hidden behind a curtain is frankly, bizarre. Just because the Dr. Phil show accepted something they showed, doesn't mean I should accept it too.
The Deadspin reporters admit that they had thought about the idea of Teo or someone close ot him generating the Hoax, but that they never followed up because "owning" ESPN was their primary focus.
The Untold Doc shows us Teo and "Lennay" (speaking from an apologetic, forgiven state) of the event as if it's water under the bridge. It also seems easy enough for "Lennay" to take full credit for being an individual actor in her forgiven state.
Unfettered access to Teo was, I assume, granted contingent on the idea that the documentary would not take a serious probe into whether Teo, his family, or someone other than "Lennay" were involved in the hoax.
For that, we'd need full access to his texts, messages, etc., as well as "Lennay's", and with all parties (except for the public) seemingly more-or-less satisfied with how things have ended up, there's no reason why we should ever expect to get it.
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I saw the ad for documentary on Manti Teo, might check it out.
In Tom Brady news, there's an amusing take from this guy (https://old.reddit.com/r/DynastyFF/comments/ws2gb7/stop_freaking_out_about_brady_hes_just_off/)on TB's absence who thinks he's out because he's recording footage for the show The Masked Singer that's also on Fox.
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Whelp nobody's earned a longer leash as far as I'm concerned. Yeah I hate him forever, but the minute he steps on the field the Bucs, who would be a huge question mark without him, are instantly the best team in that division by a pretty wide margin.
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Whelp nobody's earned a longer leash as far as I'm concerned. Yeah I hate him forever, but the minute he steps on the field the Bucs, who would be a huge question mark without him, are instantly the best team in that division by a pretty wide margin.
I dunno - I was in this camp for awhile but now that I think about is - isn't this the perfect definition of 'quiet quitting'?
I have heard from one or two reporters that Tom looks miserable out there. I thought the same thing in camp highlights on the NFL network but I'm not a reporter.
I really think he wanted to go to Miami and it looks to me like he is just playing out his contract.
If I were the Bucs, I would be kicking the tires on Jimmy G.
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I'm missing something on Jimmy G. Why he's not a more desired commodity is beyond me. I guess this is why I'm sitting in my living room on Sunday and not in the Executive Box, but I think he's a top tier - not "elite", but top tier - quarterback who can take a team to the Super Bowl.
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I'm missing something on Jimmy G. Why he's not a more desired commodity is beyond me. I guess this is why I'm sitting in my living room on Sunday and not in the Executive Box, but I think he's a top tier - not "elite", but top tier - quarterback who can take a team to the Super Bowl.
Couldn't agree more!
He could instantly step in and take the right team to the playoffs but I heard that Trey Lance has not looked good in training camp. The Niners could be forced to keep Jimmy G.
On a side note, I heard an interview with Mike McDaniel a couple of weeks ago and when asked if Trey Lance was ready to take over the team, he went through a 2min "him-haw" before punting that 'he shouldn't comment on other team's players'. Interesting............
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I'm missing something on Jimmy G. Why he's not a more desired commodity is beyond me. I guess this is why I'm sitting in my living room on Sunday and not in the Executive Box, but I think he's a top tier - not "elite", but top tier - quarterback who can take a team to the Super Bowl.
It was (maybe still is) a big conversation here in SEA, with animated callers in to local sports talk radio on both sides, either saying we are idiots for not trying to bring in a guy who is miles better than the two we have (Drew Locke and Gino Smith), or saying there's no way they want this bum on our team.
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I'm missing something on Jimmy G. Why he's not a more desired commodity is beyond me. I guess this is why I'm sitting in my living room on Sunday and not in the Executive Box, but I think he's a top tier - not "elite", but top tier - quarterback who can take a team to the Super Bowl.
Me thinks you have blind spot when reading this post, sir. :)
Jimmy G isn't top tier or even close really, but he is not as bad as some think he is. I think he is an average starting QB, and there are teams that would die for an average starting QB right now. As a Broncos fan, I was begging for one from 2016-2021. lol
It does sound like Trey Lance has bust written all over him, so the 49ers could find themselves in no-man's land here sooner than they think with a Super Bowl team and the wrong QB. Not saying Jimmy G was the absolute right QB, but the 49ers record with him vs without him under Shanahan is significant. Maybe that says a lot about how bad the backups have been, but when Jimmy G starts for them, they win a lot of games, even when he isn't that great (see: his playoff record which is good, despite him having awful playoff numbers himself).
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Jimmy G's weakness is his inability to stay on the field.
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Jimmy G's weakness is his inability to stay on the field.
This, and questions about his toughness. The latter may very well be what keeps him out of the top tier. You've got to have a determination to win no matter what, and I'm not sure he's sporting such an attitude.
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Mariota looked great, albeit against the Jet's 2nd string. Mike White looked like total garbage. I know he had that HOF-worthy statistical anomaly of a game last year, but the dude just does not seem like someone who belongs on an NFL roster.
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Jimmy G's weakness is his inability to stay on the field.
This, and questions about his toughness. The latter may very well be what keeps him out of the top tier. You've got to have a determination to win no matter what, and I'm not sure he's sporting such an attitude.
In addition, I have heard rumblings about him being out of touch if not at a regularly scheduled team function. Several of his teammates and coaches have apparently said things like "I never know where he is, he won't return my texts/calls" or whatever. Not sure how much he is EXPECTED to be available, but it's certainly not a huge mark of leadership if he ghosts everyone like this. And word gets around to other teams. It could play into other teams not trying very hard to get him.
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Jimmy G's weakness is his inability to stay on the field.
This, and questions about his toughness. The latter may very well be what keeps him out of the top tier. You've got to have a determination to win no matter what, and I'm not sure he's sporting such an attitude.
In addition, I have heard rumblings about him being out of touch if not at a regularly scheduled team function. Several of his teammates and coaches have apparently said things like "I never know where he is, he won't return my texts/calls" or whatever. Not sure how much he is EXPECTED to be available, but it's certainly not a huge mark of leadership if he ghosts everyone like this. And word gets around to other teams. It could play into other teams not trying very hard to get him.
Maybe he is quiet quitting the 49ers.
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Jimmy G's weakness is his inability to stay on the field.
This, and questions about his toughness. The latter may very well be what keeps him out of the top tier. You've got to have a determination to win no matter what, and I'm not sure he's sporting such an attitude.
In addition, I have heard rumblings about him being out of touch if not at a regularly scheduled team function. Several of his teammates and coaches have apparently said things like "I never know where he is, he won't return my texts/calls" or whatever. Not sure how much he is EXPECTED to be available, but it's certainly not a huge mark of leadership if he ghosts everyone like this. And word gets around to other teams. It could play into other teams not trying very hard to get him.
Maybe he is quiet quitting the 49ers.
lol maybe
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They have done nothing but jerk him around.
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Yeah, in NE the questions were about his toughness. I don't think availability or checking out were ever an issue. Once SF made it spectacularly clear that they were done with him I could certainly see him half-assing it outside of game days.
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No. There is a story about his availability El Barto in N.E. When Brady was suspended for the 4 games, he got hurt in the second game. He was supposed to start the 4th game but backed out the last minute. Brissett had to play injured that game and they got blown out.
Teammates years later talked about it.
https://fansided.com/2022/06/27/julian-edelman-rips-jimmy-garoppolo/
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No. There is a story about his availability El Barto in N.E. When Brady was suspended for the 4 games, he got hurt in the second game. He was supposed to start the 4th game but backed out the last minute. Brissett had to play injured that game and they got blown out.
Teammates years later talked about it.
https://fansided.com/2022/06/27/julian-edelman-rips-jimmy-garoppolo/
No, that was the toughness thing. The availability that Hef referred to is a completely different thing. That wasn't injury but indifference.
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I would have liked Jimmy G to the Jets if Wilson was down with a longer term injury. And Jimmy G may very well be better than Wilson will turn out to be. I'd also like Jimmy G as a backup much better than Flacco. I'm guessing that the man wants to start somewhere though.
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Maybe he is quiet quitting the 49ers.
Hahahaha
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No. There is a story about his availability El Barto in N.E. When Brady was suspended for the 4 games, he got hurt in the second game. He was supposed to start the 4th game but backed out the last minute. Brissett had to play injured that game and they got blown out.
Teammates years later talked about it.
https://fansided.com/2022/06/27/julian-edelman-rips-jimmy-garoppolo/
No, that was the toughness thing. The availability that Hef referred to is a completely different thing. That wasn't injury but indifference.
I get what you are saying but I also look about him telling the team he is available to play then he pulled out last second. As they players said, back out Thursday so the team can prepare.
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I see that Matt Rhule announced Baker as the starting QB for the Panthers (not that I expected Sam to start) but I can't help but have a complete lack of confidence whenever Matt is talking. He seems like he has no idea what is happening with his team and organization.
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I see that Matt Rhule announced Baker as the starting QB for the Panthers (not that I expected Sam to start) but I can't help but have a complete lack of confidence whenever Matt is talking. He seems like he has no idea what is happening with his team and organization.
More truth here than I care for.
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I'm missing something on Jimmy G. Why he's not a more desired commodity is beyond me. I guess this is why I'm sitting in my living room on Sunday and not in the Executive Box, but I think he's a top tier - not "elite", but top tier - quarterback who can take a team to the Super Bowl.
Me thinks you have blind spot when reading this post, sir. :)
Jimmy G isn't top tier or even close really, but he is not as bad as some think he is. I think he is an average starting QB, and there are teams that would die for an average starting QB right now. As a Broncos fan, I was begging for one from 2016-2021. lol
It does sound like Trey Lance has bust written all over him, so the 49ers could find themselves in no-man's land here sooner than they think with a Super Bowl team and the wrong QB. Not saying Jimmy G was the absolute right QB, but the 49ers record with him vs without him under Shanahan is significant. Maybe that says a lot about how bad the backups have been, but when Jimmy G starts for them, they win a lot of games, even when he isn't that great (see: his playoff record which is good, despite him having awful playoff numbers himself).
Who's better: Joe Flacco or Jimmy Garoppolo?
I think this fascination in the league with "elite" QBs, or what I call the "NBA QBs" (i.e. walking highlight reels) is ridiculous. Mahomes has one SB (and one "almost") in the last six years, and Brady has three and one. The other two winning QBs - Foles and what's-his-name-from-Detroit - are more Brady-esque than Mahomes-esque. This isn't an indictment on Mahomes - he will likely win another at some point - but rather, you have more teams looking for the next Mahomes than you do the next Brady. That makes zero sense to me.
Jimmy G. is more than capable, more than talented enough to shepherd a team to the Super Bowl, and it awes me that some teams aren't more eager to give that colt a ride. Okay, that was creepy; but you get what I mean.
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Jimmy G is better than Joe Flacco IMO, but you are not going to mess with Zach Wilson like that.
Jimmy G very well may be better than Wilson, but right now Wilson's ceiling is way higher, he's the No. 2 overall pick in his 2nd year, and even though he looked atrocious as a rookie you do not mess him like that by bringing in a legit competitor to the starting role. You go with Flacco, someone who does not challenge Wilson as the long-term solution.
If Wilson goes down for the year, it's a different story. At that point, I think you bring in Jimmy G. But the Jet's biggest priority at this point is determining whether Zach Wilson is their guy or not. You don't even entertain another QB option until you know the answer to that question.
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Who's better: Joe Flacco or Jimmy Garoppolo?
Right now? Jimmy, of course. Not sure why that is relevant, however.
I think this fascination in the league with "elite" QBs, or what I call the "NBA QBs" (i.e. walking highlight reels) is ridiculous. Mahomes has one SB (and one "almost") in the last six years, and Brady has three and one. The other two winning QBs - Foles and what's-his-name-from-Detroit - are more Brady-esque than Mahomes-esque. This isn't an indictment on Mahomes - he will likely win another at some point - but rather, you have more teams looking for the next Mahomes than you do the next Brady. That makes zero sense to me.
Jimmy G. is more than capable, more than talented enough to shepherd a team to the Super Bowl, and it awes me that some teams aren't more eager to give that colt a ride. Okay, that was creepy; but you get what I mean.
It makes total sense because raw talent, especially in college, is usually far more easy to spot than intangibles. If the opposite were true, Tom Brady wouldn't have dropped to the 6th round. You go for the guys whose talent jumps off the screen, and do so in the hopes that the intangibles are there as well. If you take a guy with Brady's raw talent, which has never been anything special, the intangibles have to be off the charts for them to be a big star. Brady's ability to read defenses quickly and his work ethic is why he is Tom Brady, not because of his raw talent.
Back to Jimmy G, if what you said there was true, teams would be tripping over themselves to trade for him, especially since he has no off the field baggage, but since they are not, I have to think that teams know more than we do. Jimmy is a guy you can win with, but he will rarely be the reason why you win. There are not many QBs in the league we can say that about, and Jimmy is not one of them, IMO. :)
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Do you think SF is leaking info because they can't trade him? His salary is too high for him not being able to stay on the field.
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Given the reports of how bad Trey Lance has looked this summer, a part of me thinks that the 49ers are holding on to Jimmy because they think they may need him.
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Them treating him by not practicing with the team seems a poor choice in case they need him.
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Who's better: Joe Flacco or Jimmy Garoppolo?
Right now? Jimmy, of course. Not sure why that is relevant, however.
Well, my point was, Flacco led one of the best teams in the league for a decade, by working in the system, staying in his lane and not making egregious mistakes. I think the fans in Baltimore were quite happy with their team for a number of years, and while I think there is excitement for Lamar Jackson, you'd think with all the hype that there would have been better results.
I think this fascination in the league with "elite" QBs, or what I call the "NBA QBs" (i.e. walking highlight reels) is ridiculous. Mahomes has one SB (and one "almost") in the last six years, and Brady has three and one. The other two winning QBs - Foles and what's-his-name-from-Detroit - are more Brady-esque than Mahomes-esque. This isn't an indictment on Mahomes - he will likely win another at some point - but rather, you have more teams looking for the next Mahomes than you do the next Brady. That makes zero sense to me.
Jimmy G. is more than capable, more than talented enough to shepherd a team to the Super Bowl, and it awes me that some teams aren't more eager to give that colt a ride. Okay, that was creepy; but you get what I mean.
It makes total sense because raw talent, especially in college, is usually far more easy to spot than intangibles. If the opposite were true, Tom Brady wouldn't have dropped to the 6th round. You go for the guys whose talent jumps off the screen, and do so in the hopes that the intangibles are there as well. If you take a guy with Brady's raw talent, which has never been anything special, the intangibles have to be off the charts for them to be a big star. Brady's ability to read defenses quickly and his work ethic is why he is Tom Brady, not because of his raw talent.
Back to Jimmy G, if what you said there was true, teams would be tripping over themselves to trade for him, especially since he has no off the field baggage, but since they are not, I have to think that teams know more than we do. Jimmy is a guy you can win with, but he will rarely be the reason why you win. There are not many QBs in the league we can say that about, and Jimmy is not one of them, IMO. :)
Well, I'm with you; that's why I said I must be missing something, because I'm not being paid to evaluate this stuff, they are. But look, talent isn't enough. LT was not the greatest physical specimen (though he was better than people give him credit for in that department; he was FAST and he was TOUGH as NAILS) and neither is Brady, but they are respectively, the best in history at their side of the ball. Jerry Jones in Dallas is about as good as it gets in spotting raw athletic talent, and they are a perennial not-even-close when it comes to the Super Bowl.
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I think the problem with Jerry Jones, aside from being a buttinsky who wants a figurehead as a coach rather than someone the players actually respect and "fear" a little, is that he gets too stuck on his players. Once he drafts someone, they are "his guy," and he is far too willing to overpay him to stay. Once he falls in love, it is for life. And that hurts their cap and makes it difficult to bring in free agents who could get them to the next level.
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JJ is a fuckin' idiot. His only language is dollar signs. Absolutely no knowledge of what it takes to produce a winning team. Even back in the glory days, it wasn't really him at all. It was the other JJ. Once that was over, it definitely was over and has been ever since.
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JJ is a fuckin' idiot. His only language is dollar signs. Absolutely no knowledge of what it takes to produce a winning team. Even back in the glory days, it wasn't really him at all. It was the other JJ. Once that was over, it definitely was over and has been ever since.
JJ is one of the best owners in football but he sometimes lets the Johnny Walker Blue do the talking. Trust me, he hasn't been involved in player acquisition for at least 15 years or so. Do any of you actually follow the Cowboys like you do Tom Brady?
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I think the problem with Jerry Jones, aside from being a buttinsky who wants a figurehead as a coach rather than someone the players actually respect and "fear" a little, is that he gets too stuck on his players. Once he drafts someone, they are "his guy," and he is far too willing to overpay him to stay. Once he falls in love, it is for life. And that hurts their cap and makes it difficult to bring in free agents who could get them to the next level.
I don't really disagree with any of this, but I don't think it's the primary problem. Jerry also has some strengths, first and foremost is that he isn't afraid to spend money. I've always maintained that plenty of teams would love to have somebody like him who can spend money and manage the cap well. I still maintain that where he's failed is establishing a culture. This has simply never been a winning organization since he bought it. Jimmy managed to maintain enough of the Landry era's culture to keep them afloat, but that was over even before he left (look no further than Michael Irvin). It's just eroded ever since. That's why they play in a circus tent rather than a proper stadium.
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I think the problem with Jerry Jones, aside from being a buttinsky who wants a figurehead as a coach rather than someone the players actually respect and "fear" a little, is that he gets too stuck on his players. Once he drafts someone, they are "his guy," and he is far too willing to overpay him to stay. Once he falls in love, it is for life. And that hurts their cap and makes it difficult to bring in free agents who could get them to the next level.
I don't really disagree with any of this, but I don't think it's the primary problem. Jerry also has some strengths, first and foremost is that he isn't afraid to spend money. I've always maintained that plenty of teams would love to have somebody like him who can spend money and manage the cap well. I still maintain that where he's failed is establishing a culture. This has simply never been a winning organization since he bought it. Jimmy managed to maintain enough of the Landry era's culture to keep them afloat, but that was over even before he left (look no further than Michael Irvin). It's just eroded ever since. That's why they play in a circus tent rather than a proper stadium.
I agree with most of this, but I think that goes back to my earlier point a bit. They have drafted well for years now, yet cannot get over the hump. Take a guy like Zeke. He hasn't been worth what they are paying him for a while now, but Jerry paid him and is one of Jerry's loves, so he will keep him around as long as possible, even if means not being able to get other good players to help the team with the cap relief they'd get from cutting an overpriced and past-his-prime RB.
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Looking as if my Dolphins are going nowhere again this year … Mike McDaniel looks like Marc Anthony or a young computer nerd …and his demeanor on the field already looks like Joe Philbin , just standing around … No comparison to a coach like Sean McVey for example who is always involved , cheering , angered , whatever … a football coach ! Dolphins definitely don’t need another unmotivated drip standing on the sideline…
Not to mention I don’t think Tua is anywhere near an elite QB .. They should go for Jimmy G !
Maybe they’ll surprise me but I’m thinking the Bills will take the AFC EAST if not the whole thing !
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I think the problem with Jerry Jones, aside from being a buttinsky who wants a figurehead as a coach rather than someone the players actually respect and "fear" a little, is that he gets too stuck on his players. Once he drafts someone, they are "his guy," and he is far too willing to overpay him to stay. Once he falls in love, it is for life. And that hurts their cap and makes it difficult to bring in free agents who could get them to the next level.
I don't really disagree with any of this, but I don't think it's the primary problem. Jerry also has some strengths, first and foremost is that he isn't afraid to spend money. I've always maintained that plenty of teams would love to have somebody like him who can spend money and manage the cap well. I still maintain that where he's failed is establishing a culture. This has simply never been a winning organization since he bought it. Jimmy managed to maintain enough of the Landry era's culture to keep them afloat, but that was over even before he left (look no further than Michael Irvin). It's just eroded ever since. That's why they play in a circus tent rather than a proper stadium.
I agree with most of this, but I think that goes back to my earlier point a bit. They have drafted well for years now, yet cannot get over the hump. Take a guy like Zeke. He hasn't been worth what they are paying him for a while now, but Jerry paid him and is one of Jerry's loves, so he will keep him around as long as possible, even if means not being able to get other good players to help the team with the cap relief they'd get from cutting an overpriced and past-his-prime RB.
I suspect Zeke will be gone after this year. I think Jerry signed him big partly because he thought he was putting together the next triplets, and partly because Dak was pretty adamant about it. Dak gave him a lot of leverage and he used it. If Zeke has half a brain he'll recognize that he's essentially trying out for his next team right now. If Jerry has half a brain he'll use Pollard to put the iron to Zeke.
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LT was not the greatest physical specimen (though he was better than people give him credit for in that department; he was FAST and he was TOUGH as NAILS)
I have no idea what you mean by this. He wasn't lacking anything as an athlete, certainly not in the same way that Brady was. He was an All-American in college, and All-World in the pros, mostly because he was a freak with super intensity. Not sure how much more of a physical specimen he should have been or needed to be.
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So now we’re supposed to be drafting QBs with no obvious physical skills but who we suspect “might” become great at reading defenses? Sure. Are they also going to have the greatest defensive mastermind of all time behind them? Because just half of that equation isn’t enough to win Super Bowls.
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So now we’re supposed to be drafting QBs with no obvious physical skills but who we suspect “might” become great at reading defenses? Sure. Are they also going to have the greatest defensive mastermind of all time behind them? Because just half of that equation isn’t enough to win Super Bowls.
I'm not sure that's what I said. I said that drafting the best athlete at the position doesn't translate, necessarily, into the ultimate goal, winning the Super Bowl. I'm not prepared to say that the opposite is true or not. I would suggest you need at least a minimum amount of physical skills. That Brady can't run doesn't mean he doesn't have physical skills.
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Yeah, there's something to be said for recognition and decision making, especially at QB.
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Also, just one issue I have with your post Stads, totally friendly argument here, but since Mahomes got the starting gig in 2018 he’s won a SB and Brady’s won 2. Oh the horror. Mahomes was a coin toss or Dee Ford being a millimeter offsides in 2018 from getting to a third and I’m sure he would have put up more than Goff’s 3 points. And he had 21-3 lead in the AFC Championship last year - so like Florio and Simms mentioned today, he was REAL close to 4 in a row.
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Also, just one issue I have with your post Stads, totally friendly argument here, but since Mahomes got the starting gig in 2018 he’s won a SB and Brady’s won 2. Oh the horror. Mahomes was a coin toss or Dee Ford being a millimeter offsides in 2018 from getting to a third and I’m sure he would have put up more than Goff’s 3 points. And he had 21-3 lead in the AFC Championship last year - so like Florio and Simms mentioned today, he was REAL close to 4 in a row.
Then Brady was close to 10 in a row. I mean, at the end of the day, Mahomes won 1 in a row, and I don't say this to defend Brady. 6-3 is probably about right for his SB record. If Malcom Butler plays, the helmet catch, etc...
And KC is coming back down to earth, BTW.
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Also, just one issue I have with your post Stads, totally friendly argument here, but since Mahomes got the starting gig in 2018 he’s won a SB and Brady’s won 2. Oh the horror. Mahomes was a coin toss or Dee Ford being a millimeter offsides in 2018 from getting to a third and I’m sure he would have put up more than Goff’s 3 points. And he had 21-3 lead in the AFC Championship last year - so like Florio and Simms mentioned today, he was REAL close to 4 in a row.
Then Brady was close to 10 in a row. I mean, at the end of the day, Mahomes won 1 in a row, and I don't say this to defend Brady. 6-3 is probably about right for his SB record. If Malcom Butler plays, the helmet catch, etc...
And KC is coming back down to earth, BTW.
TAC's right on all counts. You can't just cherry-pick the almost's and the if's. As my grandfather used to say, "wish in one hand and shit in the other and see which one fills up first". Or something like that. :) End of the day, Ford was called offsides. Can't go back and change that. There were moments in that Eagles loss that had they gone the other way, we'd be talking 7-2.
I said since about day one, you had to wait to see if the league caught up, and they did. Andy Reid is a Hall of Fame coach, and Mahomes has the legs - literally and figuratively - to be a Hall of Fame QB. We'll see how they adjust and adapt.
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And Ford's offsides wasn't an iffy call. He was offsides.
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It is important to remember that many football games flip on one play, especially ones at the end of games.
If Scott Norwood hits that FG, the Bills win the Super Bowl, and then who knows how the next three play out.
If Butler doesn't break on the ball and intercept the Wilson pass, the Seahawks win two in a row, and then who knows how their trajectory as a team plays out.
And while I do not agree that the league caught up to Mahomes and the Chiefs (they did make it to the AFCCG last year and barely lost), I do think their offense is gonna miss Tyreek Hill a lot. Anyone just assuming that the Chiefs will just roll on like always and win that division again with easy is sorely mistaken. The AFC West could literally finish in just about any order, and it should surprise no one.
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If Scott Norwood hits that FG, the Bills win the Super Bowl, and then who knows how the next three play out.
They still get their ass kicked roundly by the 92 and 93 Cowboys; two of the most talented football teams to come about. :rollin
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If Scott Norwood hits that FG, the Bills win the Super Bowl, and then who knows how the next three play out.
They still get their ass kicked roundly by the 92 and 93 Cowboys; two of the most talented football teams to come about. :rollin
'92, probably, but I am not so sure about '93. They didn't get their ass kicked in that one. They led 13-6 at half and were driving in the 2nd half when Thomas fumbled which was returned for a TD, and you could see the air completely come out of the Bills balloon. and it was Cowboys domination the rest of the way, but maybe if Norwood hits that FG and they have one in their pocket already, they would have had the "we can still do this" attitude when the first thing went wrong, as opposed to the whole team's body language screaming "here we go again."
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Just for fun, I will spitball my predictions for each division and the playoffs (playoff teams bolded).
AFC East:
1 Buffalo
2 Miami
3 New England
4 NY Jets
AFC North:
1 Baltimore
2 Pittsburgh
3 Cincinnati
4 Cleveland
AFC South:
1 Indianapolis
2 Tennessee
3 Jacksonville
4 Houston
AFC West:
1 Denver
2 LA Chargers
3 Kansas City
4 Las Vegas
NFC East:
1 Philadelphia
2 Dallas
3 Washington
4 NY Giants
NFC North:
1 Green Bay
2 Minnesota
3 Detroit
4 Chicago
NFC South:
1 Tampa Bay
2 New Orleans
3 Carolina
4 Atlanta
NFC West:
1 Arizona
2 LA Rams
3 San Francisco
4 Seattle
Playoffs
1st round:
Byes to TB and Buffalo (the 1 seeds)
(2) GB over (7) NO
(3) Arizona over (6) Dallas
(5) LA Rams over (4) Philadelphia
(2) Baltimore over (7) Pittsburgh
(6) Kansas City over (3) Indianapolis
(4) Denver over (5) LA Chargers
2nd round:
(5) LA Rams over (1) Tampa Bay
(2) GB over (3) Arizona
(1) Buffalo over (6) Kansas City
(4) Denver over (2) Baltimore
Conference championship:
(2) GB over (5) LA Rams
(1) Buffalo over (4) Denver
Super Bowl:
Buffalo over GB
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I'll bite:
AFC East:
1 Buffalo
2 NY Jets
3 Miami
4 New England
AFC North:
1 Pittsburgh
2 Baltimore
3 Cincinnati
4 Cleveland
AFC South:
1 Indianapolis
2 Jacksonville
3 Tennessee
4 Houston
AFC West:
1 LA Chargers
2 Kansas City
3 Las Vegas
4 Denver
NFC East:
1 Philadelphia
2 Washington
3 Dallas
4 NY Giants
NFC North:
1 Green Bay
2 Minnesota
3 Detroit
4 Chicago
NFC South:
1 Tampa Bay
2 New Orleans
3 Carolina
4 Atlanta
NFC West:
1 LA Rams
2 Arizona
3 Seattle
4 San Francisco
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Already some disturbing trends: the lack of respect for Vegas and the Patriots (the latter not unfounded, mind you) and the respect for Tampa Bay and Philadelphia (both of which I think might be misplaced).
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Someone has to finish last in the AFC West. Notice that I had the AFC West teams as the 4, 5 and 6 seeds, as I think it will be similar to last year's NFC West where every team is good enough to where it will be hard for any to win enough games to secure one of the top seeds. Plus, the Raiders won a ton of super close games last year (6-1 in games decided by 3 points or less or in OT), and that often does not play out the same way two years in a row, so all it takes is losing a few of those close games they won last year and they are back down to 8 wins.
All indications are that Mac Jones has had a brutal summer, and he wasn't exactly a world beater last year. Feels like the Patriots have 9-8 or 8-9 written all over them (5-12 if a normal team, but BB will get them 3-4 extra wins).
The Bucs have a pretty easy schedule, so predicting them as a top seed was pretty easy for me.
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If the Pats are good this year, I will never pay attention to the offseason again. It will all be for nothing :lol
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Someone has to finish last in the AFC West. Notice that I had the AFC West teams as the 4, 5 and 6 seeds, as I think it will be similar to last year's NFC West where every team is good enough to where it will be hard for any to win enough games to secure one of the top seeds. Plus, the Raiders won a ton of super close games last year (6-1 in games decided by 3 points or less or in OT), and that often does not play out the same way two years in a row, so all it takes is losing a few of those close games they won last year and they are back down to 8 wins.
All indications are that Mac Jones has had a brutal summer, and he wasn't exactly a world beater last year. Feels like the Patriots have 9-8 or 8-9 written all over them (5-12 if a normal team, but BB will get them 3-4 extra wins).
The Bucs have a pretty easy schedule, so predicting them as a top seed was pretty easy for me.
By all accounts the brutality has come from the O-line rather than McCorkle. Traditionally that runs through the first few weeks of the season and then the line comes together. Seems to be an annual occurrence.
I'm not sure I totally get changing the offensive scheme right now. For a stretch they were an excellent team last year, only falling apart [spectacularly] after the bye. My hunch is that they're getting an early start for next year's O coordinator Bill O'Brien. Don't know if this will be a transitional year for them or not--hard to say. I do think that from a talent standpoint they're probably better than they were last year. They're not going to beat up on Buffalo, and their schedule is pretty tough, but I'd expect them to do about the same as last year (minus the wind game).
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All indications are that Mac Jones has had a brutal summer, and he wasn't exactly a world beater last year. Feels like the Patriots have 9-8 or 8-9 written all over them (5-12 if a normal team, but BB will get them 3-4 extra wins).
It's less about Mac than it is about the shitshow going on around him. They're changing the offence on him, and it seems the O-Line is really struggling with it, though I don't think Mac is still completely on board with the changes. It's also being installed by a couple of buffoons that the locker room seems to have no belief in, including Mac.
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All indications are that Mac Jones has had a brutal summer, and he wasn't exactly a world beater last year. Feels like the Patriots have 9-8 or 8-9 written all over them (5-12 if a normal team, but BB will get them 3-4 extra wins).
It's less about Mac than it is about the shitshow going on around him. They're changing the offence on him, and it seems the O-Line is really struggling with it, though I don't think Mac is still completely on board with the changes. It's also being installed by a couple of buffoons that the locker room seems to have no belief in, including Mac.
Matt Patricia is hardly a buffoon. The man's a rocket scientist, FFS. In any case, I think they're just setting things up for O'Brien in 2023. Mac's a smart kid. He'll survive it.
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Seems like the o line and Jones are struggling to pick up the new offense. My issue is, you wanted this new style, hire a offensive coordinator that knows it,and has implemented it before.
Not a guy who hasn't been on the offensive side of the ball that much.
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All indications are that Mac Jones has had a brutal summer, and he wasn't exactly a world beater last year. Feels like the Patriots have 9-8 or 8-9 written all over them (5-12 if a normal team, but BB will get them 3-4 extra wins).
It's less about Mac than it is about the shitshow going on around him. They're changing the offence on him, and it seems the O-Line is really struggling with it, though I don't think Mac is still completely on board with the changes. It's also being installed by a couple of buffoons that the locker room seems to have no belief in, including Mac.
Matt Patricia is hardly a buffoon. The man's a rocket scientist, FFS. In any case, I think they're just setting things up for O'Brien in 2023. Mac's a smart kid. He'll survive it.
Okay, but his smarts didn't prevent him from being a terrible head coach in Detroit, and he has zero experience calling plays on offense. Feels like Belichick wanted to stay in-house with play calling on offense once McDaniels went to Vegas.
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All indications are that Mac Jones has had a brutal summer, and he wasn't exactly a world beater last year. Feels like the Patriots have 9-8 or 8-9 written all over them (5-12 if a normal team, but BB will get them 3-4 extra wins).
It's less about Mac than it is about the shitshow going on around him. They're changing the offence on him, and it seems the O-Line is really struggling with it, though I don't think Mac is still completely on board with the changes. It's also being installed by a couple of buffoons that the locker room seems to have no belief in, including Mac.
Matt Patricia is hardly a buffoon. The man's a rocket scientist, FFS. In any case, I think they're just setting things up for O'Brien in 2023. Mac's a smart kid. He'll survive it.
Okay, but his smarts didn't prevent him from being a terrible head coach in Detroit, and he has zero experience calling plays on offense. Feels like Belichick wanted to stay in-house with play calling on offense once McDaniels went to Vegas.
Not to mention that he's being paid by the Lions, and Bill doesn't have to hire an actual OC, which of course means more money in his pocket.
Bart could be right about Bill O'B. He was committed to Alabama for this year. But honestly, I have no idea what this looks like next year.
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All indications are that Mac Jones has had a brutal summer, and he wasn't exactly a world beater last year. Feels like the Patriots have 9-8 or 8-9 written all over them (5-12 if a normal team, but BB will get them 3-4 extra wins).
It's less about Mac than it is about the shitshow going on around him. They're changing the offence on him, and it seems the O-Line is really struggling with it, though I don't think Mac is still completely on board with the changes. It's also being installed by a couple of buffoons that the locker room seems to have no belief in, including Mac.
Matt Patricia is hardly a buffoon. The man's a rocket scientist, FFS. In any case, I think they're just setting things up for O'Brien in 2023. Mac's a smart kid. He'll survive it.
Okay, but his smarts didn't prevent him from being a terrible head coach in Detroit, and he has zero experience calling plays on offense. Feels like Belichick wanted to stay in-house with play calling on offense once McDaniels went to Vegas.
Not to mention that he's being paid by the Lions, and Bill doesn't have to hire an actual OC, which of course means more money in his pocket.
Bart could be right about Bill O'B. He was committed to Alabama for this year. But honestly, I have no idea what this looks like next year.
As I understand it BOB wanted to jump ship this year, and Bill wouldn't have it out of respect for Saban. Next year Sabab will return the favor.
I have no idea why people would think money would factor into it. Bill's not signing the check, and Kraft certainly has no problem spending money to win. If Bill though there were an available OC that could do what he wanted he'd be there right now.
Lastly, I'm not entirely sure why we think coordinators can only work one side of the ball. MP has an impressive understanding of defenses. It sure seems like that would make him qualified to exploit them. Somebody, possibly Edelman, said essentially the same thing a few weeks ago. Part of what's made the Patriots coaching staff so good is that they work all over the team. Somebody who coaches receivers is in a unique position to transition to coaching DBs. Bill's never been one to roll with the conventional wisdom, and while I have no idea if this will work out, I think he's giving a shot to something unconventional that seems perfectly workable. Let's also keep in mind that Belichick has called offensive plays before, and he's done so from his vantage point as a defensive mastermind.
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As I understand it BOB wanted to jump ship this year, and Bill wouldn't have it out of respect for Saban. Next year Saban will return the favor.
I have no idea why people would think money would factor into it. Bill's not signing the check, and Kraft certainly has no problem spending money to win. If Bill though there were an available OC that could do what he wanted he'd be there right now.
I'm not exactly sure how it went down with Bill O'B. Next year Saban won't be returning any favors because O'B's contract will be up.
The understanding is that there's a Player's Budget and a Coaches Budget (which Bill controls the pie). So Bill keeps whatever is left over after the other coaches are paid. Bill has made a living of bringing back coaches and not giving them a title so the other team is on the hook for their salary.
Word on the street is that Josh's contract after they pulled him off the plane was actually being paid by Kraft, outside of the Coaches Budget, and with that, Bill felt a little loss of control over Josh.
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For for a 1st time OC to implement a new offensive system is asking a lot.
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I don't see Matt Patricia as the problem. I don't see why a defensive mind can't be a good offensive mind; I also am probably the leading proponent here of that idea that just because you are a world class O/ or D/ Coordinator doesn't mean you will be a world class head coach (and vice versa). They are different skillsets; not that some people don't have both skillsets, but they are not the same.
Maybe I'm spoiled after 20 years of this, but other than not having "Brady" (in quotes to mean not just the player, but all that entails) I don't see much difference this year from past, and in fact, I'm thrilled I have someone smart like Mac instead of CÅm~@#N3w+0n under center.
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I don't see Matt Patricia as the problem. I don't see why a defensive mind can't be a good offensive mind; I also am probably the leading proponent here of that idea that just because you are a world class O/ or D/ Coordinator doesn't mean you will be a world class head coach (and vice versa). They are different skillsets; not that some people don't have both skillsets, but they are not the same.
Maybe I'm spoiled after 20 years of this, but other than not having "Brady" (in quotes to mean not just the player, but all that entails) I don't see much difference this year from past, and in fact, I'm thrilled I have someone smart like Mac instead of CÅm~@#N3w+0n under center.
You have a QB 1 year into being acclimated. Losses his OC. How many high draft picks QB's have stunted their growth from changes early on their career? Most. If I'm changing the system all together I'd want an OC that has the grasp of implementing it before. Not a DC who hasn't been on the offensive side of the ball in over a decade and has never had this role.
I don't doubt over time Patricia will get it, but it's a bad combo that might stunt a young QB's growth. You want a second year QB to grow, not take a step back.
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Baker Mayfield has looked surprisingly good in the preseason. Perhaps the Panthers will have a shot at not quite making the playoffs, which is a sight better than nowhere close to making the playoffs.
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I don't see Matt Patricia as the problem. I don't see why a defensive mind can't be a good offensive mind; I also am probably the leading proponent here of that idea that just because you are a world class O/ or D/ Coordinator doesn't mean you will be a world class head coach (and vice versa). They are different skillsets; not that some people don't have both skillsets, but they are not the same.
Maybe I'm spoiled after 20 years of this, but other than not having "Brady" (in quotes to mean not just the player, but all that entails) I don't see much difference this year from past, and in fact, I'm thrilled I have someone smart like Mac instead of CÅm~@#N3w+0n under center.
You have a QB 1 year into being acclimated. Losses his OC. How many high draft picks QB's have stunted their growth from changes early on their career? Most. If I'm changing the system all together I'd want an OC that has the grasp of implementing it before. Not a DC who hasn't been on the offensive side of the ball in over a decade and has never had this role.
I don't doubt over time Patricia will get it, but it's a bad combo that might stunt a young QB's growth. You want a second year QB to grow, not take a step back.
Not an unfair position. I get that. But that's not Patricia's problem that's Belichick's. He's responsible for the overall direction of the team.
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I think you know I've expressed this issue with BB. Instead of him managing his team, being able to focus on the other coach in critical situations, (like the Seahawks SB) he now has to focus on the offensive side of the ball. Nevermind, he took over the D last year mid season. He's spreading himself too thin.
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Looks like Jimmy G is staying with the 49ers for a reduced price. Smart move, as Lance continues to struggle mightily according to reports. My pick of the 49ers the other day as a non-playoff team was based off Lance starting all season, but if he sucks and they go to Jimmy soon enough, they should be a playoff team.
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Looks like Jimmy G is staying with the 49ers for a reduced price. Smart move, as Lance continues to struggle mightily according to reports. My pick of the 49ers the other day as a non-playoff team was based off Lance starting all season, but if he sucks and they go to Jimmy soon enough, they should be a playoff team.
They'd have been fools to cut him loose. Whatever they could have gotten in exchange for him would have been a fraction of the value he brings to the Niners in his current role. Plus, if Lance magically turns out to be great they could get better value for him once a starter or two goes down in the regular season.
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Looks like Jimmy G is staying with the 49ers for a reduced price. Smart move, as Lance continues to struggle mightily according to reports. My pick of the 49ers the other day as a non-playoff team was based off Lance starting all season, but if he sucks and they go to Jimmy soon enough, they should be a playoff team.
They'd have been fools to cut him loose. Whatever they could have gotten in exchange for him would have been a fraction of the value he brings to the Niners in his current role. Plus, if Lance magically turns out to be great they could get better value for him once a starter or two goes down in the regular season.
Sounds like Jimmy has a No Trade clause, so Jimmy would have to waive it before they could trade him.
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Also, just one issue I have with your post Stads, totally friendly argument here, but since Mahomes got the starting gig in 2018 he’s won a SB and Brady’s won 2. Oh the horror. Mahomes was a coin toss or Dee Ford being a millimeter offsides in 2018 from getting to a third and I’m sure he would have put up more than Goff’s 3 points. And he had 21-3 lead in the AFC Championship last year - so like Florio and Simms mentioned today, he was REAL close to 4 in a row.
Then Brady was close to 10 in a row. I mean, at the end of the day, Mahomes won 1 in a row, and I don't say this to defend Brady. 6-3 is probably about right for his SB record. If Malcom Butler plays, the helmet catch, etc...
And KC is coming back down to earth, BTW.
Not to mention that the "what if"s could just as easily go the other way and Mahomes could VERY easily have none. We could argue about what could have been all day long, but the reality is, he won 1. OK, great. Not sure what else we can say about that that really proves anything.
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Also, just one issue I have with your post Stads, totally friendly argument here, but since Mahomes got the starting gig in 2018 he’s won a SB and Brady’s won 2. Oh the horror. Mahomes was a coin toss or Dee Ford being a millimeter offsides in 2018 from getting to a third and I’m sure he would have put up more than Goff’s 3 points. And he had 21-3 lead in the AFC Championship last year - so like Florio and Simms mentioned today, he was REAL close to 4 in a row.
Then Brady was close to 10 in a row. I mean, at the end of the day, Mahomes won 1 in a row, and I don't say this to defend Brady. 6-3 is probably about right for his SB record. If Malcom Butler plays, the helmet catch, etc...
And KC is coming back down to earth, BTW.
Funny, all the NFL analysts seem to think they’ll be better than ever. We’ll see. Of course, it goes without saying that Brady has never had to play in a division as tough as the AFC West. All that stuff matters.
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I am curious to see how much football I watch this year now that I have retired from playing fantasy football. I have said for years that the product had gotten worse and that FF was the main reason I still watched so much, and I guess now I will find out for sure.
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I am curious to see how much football I watch this year now that I have retired from playing fantasy football. I have said for years that the product had gotten worse and that FF was the main reason I still watched so much, and I guess now I will find out for sure.
You retired from FF?
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I am curious to see how much football I watch this year now that I have retired from playing fantasy football. I have said for years that the product had gotten worse and that FF was the main reason I still watched so much, and I guess now I will find out for sure.
You retired from FF?
Yep. It had gotten less fun in recent years, so I called it quits. I still have a handful of people asking me almost every day if I am ready to do a draft and I keep reiterating, "No, I am retired." Most think I will eventually cave and do a draft or two. I will not. Zero interest.
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I'm actually in 2 FF leagues this year for the first time ever. Had the second draft last night.
I finished second in a league last year. Nice little payout.
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I am curious to see how much football I watch this year now that I have retired from playing fantasy football. I have said for years that the product had gotten worse and that FF was the main reason I still watched so much, and I guess now I will find out for sure.
You retired from FF?
Yep. It had gotten less fun in recent years, so I called it quits. I still have a handful of people asking me almost every day if I am ready to do a draft and I keep reiterating, "No, I am retired." Most think I will eventually cave and do a draft or two. I will not. Zero interest.
Over the years, I've played both fantasy football and baseball. I had fun. I can't imagine playing now; it seems to have turned into such a business that from what I've seen, the fun has gotten sucked out of it. I like the Pick'em we do here, and will do that if we continue, but that's the extent of my involvement.
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I am curious to see how much football I watch this year now that I have retired from playing fantasy football. I have said for years that the product had gotten worse and that FF was the main reason I still watched so much, and I guess now I will find out for sure.
I found that I liked football more once I quit FF simply for the sake of watching good games. I stopped watching a game just to watch the running back and started watching whatever looked good. Big improvement. It also helps if you've got one team you always want to watch. Don't know if you're like that with Denver or not. I'll watch the Patriots game, whatever the best of the other Sunday game is, and maybe the PM games if they don't suck.
And seriously, I don't miss FF in the slightest. Once I realized how flawed the whole thing was I quit and never looked back.
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I am curious to see how much football I watch this year now that I have retired from playing fantasy football. I have said for years that the product had gotten worse and that FF was the main reason I still watched so much, and I guess now I will find out for sure.
I found that I liked football more once I quit FF simply for the sake of watching good games. I stopped watching a game just to watch the running back and started watching whatever looked good. Big improvement. It also helps if you've got one team you always want to watch. Don't know if you're like that with Denver or not. I'll watch the Patriots game, whatever the best of the other Sunday game is, and maybe the PM games if they don't suck.
And seriously, I don't miss FF in the slightest. Once I realized how flawed the whole thing was I quit and never looked back.
That's how I am. I'll watch the Jets game (which usually sucks), maaaaybe the PM games, but often I'll skip those just to be refreshed for what's usually a good SNF matchup. And then Monday and Thursdays.
I find I really enjoy the game itself, and the "plotlines" of each season. As a Jets fan, I know better than to get too invested in my time, so instead I take more of a "macro" interest in the league. Once I set my lineups, I don't even look at my Fantasy app until Monday, most times.
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I am curious to see how much football I watch this year now that I have retired from playing fantasy football. I have said for years that the product had gotten worse and that FF was the main reason I still watched so much, and I guess now I will find out for sure.
I found that I liked football more once I quit FF simply for the sake of watching good games. I stopped watching a game just to watch the running back and started watching whatever looked good. Big improvement. It also helps if you've got one team you always want to watch. Don't know if you're like that with Denver or not. I'll watch the Patriots game, whatever the best of the other Sunday game is, and maybe the PM games if they don't suck.
And seriously, I don't miss FF in the slightest. Once I realized how flawed the whole thing was I quit and never looked back.
That's how I am. I'll watch the Jets game (which usually sucks), maaaaybe the PM games, but often I'll skip those just to be refreshed for what's usually a good SNF matchup. And then Monday and Thursdays.
I find I really enjoy the game itself, and the "plotlines" of each season. As a Jets fan, I know better than to get too invested in my time, so instead I take more of a "macro" interest in the league. Once I set my lineups, I don't even look at my Fantasy app until Monday, most times.
That's me. I watch the Thursday, Sunday and Monday NIGHT games religiously, no matter who is playing. The ONLY thing that turns me off to those games is the ridiculous uniforms on Thursdays; if it looks too much like two highlighters battling in a school bathroom I turn it off, but I will watch any team any week if on at the right time. I don't really start watching Sunday afternoon games until probably Thanksgiving or so, when it gets colder up here.
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Something I'm curious about. By all accounts Bryan Hoyer is crucial to the NE offense. From what I gather he was as much a quarterback coach last year as he was the backup, and seemed to be a big part of McCorkle's development. I wonder why they don't just make him the QB coach and free up the roster spot, knowing that if the need arises they could resign him as an emergency QB? He seems to be a natural fit for that role, and it'd be beneficial to both him and the team.
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Well, he's still an actual capable backup when needed. Plus, they don't have anyone else. They kept the kid Zappie who they took in this year's draft. He's been getting killed in the media, but I didn't think he was that bad in the preseason games.
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Well, he's still an actual capable backup when needed. Plus, they don't have anyone else. They kept the kid Zappie who they took in this year's draft. He's been getting killed in the media, but I didn't think he was that bad in the preseason games.
Hard to tell what a kid can do in 3 partial games. I also think they can't go in for a rookie as a backup to the starter. Hoyer is a cheap backup as well.
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FF stopped being mostly fun for me years ago, but I stuck it out because I love doing the drafts and auctions. Once the season started is when the fun stopped, so getting through this period was the tough part and there is only eight days now till the first game, and I do not see myself caving between now and then, so the retirement will stick for this season.
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I was retired from FF for 10+ years because all I did was watch for the stats. I realized I was missing the fun of the actual game so I just told everyone I didn’t want to do it anymore. Then last year my friends were desperate to fill out their league so I got back into it.
Won $135.
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I quit playing once I realized that no matter how good a team I put together, it was the schedule that actually determined the winners and losers. Kinda stopped being fun after that. :lol
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Me following the NFL largely revolves around the Pick 'Em and the Survivor. I've never done fantasy anything.
Bronco fans (Kev?), what are your thoughts on Wilson at QB?
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Bronco fans (Kev?), what are your thoughts on Wilson at QB?
I thought he was great as soon as I saw him play as a rookie (his knack for usually playing great at the end of games jumped out at me right away), and nothing I have seen since has changed my mind. Even last year when he missed time and then came back too early, he still had a good season. He is a massive upgrade for the Broncos, but that division is so good that time will tell how big a difference he makes when it comes to wins and losses.
And if nothing else, I'd love to see him win a Super Bowl just to shut up the "he only won a Super Bowl because he had the Legion of Boom defense" peeps, most of whom love to overlook that the team couldn't get over .500 with that D and Marshawn Lynch until Wilson arrived.
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The ONLY thing that turns me off to those games is the ridiculous uniforms on Thursdays; if it looks too much like two highlighters battling in a school bathroom I turn it off
Oh God, you and me both. Those things are TERRIBLE.
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When are the cuts?
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When are the cuts?
Not sure if you're asking about roster cuts, or if there's a joke in there that I missed. If the former they were Tuesday.
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When are the cuts?
Not sure if you're asking about roster cuts, or if there's a joke in there that I missed. If the former they were Tuesday.
Former. I missed that; usually there's some notice about the more attention-grabbing moves, but I saw nothing so far.
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I didn't see much interesting. Cut day really isn't what it used to be, especially given how much of a checkbox event the preseason is. Most teams know pretty well what their 53 man is going to look like going in, and onboard an additional team's worth of players just so they can meet the requirement to play preseason.
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Just checking in to say...my Jets are still really bad. Better, but still bad.
And I know people are high on him, but I am not sold on Wilson at QB. I know he'll miss the first couple of games and Flacco will start for him, but Wilson...he needs to be better. A LOT better. QBs still win games in this league. You need a great one. And the Jets haven't had a guy who could get it done since pre-injury Chad Pennington. They won IN SPITE OF Mark Sanchez (one of the worst ever).
Here's hoping I am surprised, but I really don't see the Jets any better than 7-10 this year. And that's the high end. I really see it being more like 6-11. I would love to be totally wrong.
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Bronco fans (Kev?), what are your thoughts on Wilson at QB?
I thought he was great as soon as I saw him play as a rookie (his knack for usually playing great at the end of games jumped out at me right away), and nothing I have seen since has changed my mind. Even last year when he missed time and then came back too early, he still had a good season. He is a massive upgrade for the Broncos, but that division is so good that time will tell how big a difference he makes when it comes to wins and losses.
And if nothing else, I'd love to see him win a Super Bowl just to shut up the "he only won a Super Bowl because he had the Legion of Boom defense" peeps, most of whom love to overlook that the team couldn't get over .500 with that D and Marshawn Lynch until Wilson arrived.
Well, I sure hope you really like him, after the deal he just got :lol
Just checking in to say...my Jets are still really bad. Better, but still bad.
And I know people are high on him, but I am not sold on Wilson at QB. I know he'll miss the first couple of games and Flacco will start for him, but Wilson...he needs to be better. A LOT better. QBs still win games in this league. You need a great one. And the Jets haven't had a guy who could get it done since pre-injury Chad Pennington. They won IN SPITE OF Mark Sanchez (one of the worst ever).
Here's hoping I am surprised, but I really don't see the Jets any better than 7-10 this year. And that's the high end. I really see it being more like 6-11. I would love to be totally wrong.
Yup, Wilson is a ? at best, and it's the Bill's division to lose as far as I'm concerned.
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There was a bunch of noise with the Bills when allegations came out against their punter being involved with a gang rape so he got booted out, I think there were a couple of WRs and DBs traded which made it interesting. Other than that I don't think there was any significant cuts.
I am curious about the process that some players get cut and don't get put on waivers and then sign back with the team the next day. Bucs did that with the new S they got from the Pats Ryan Logan. Not sure what the legalese behind it is.
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There was a bunch of noise with the Bills when allegations came out against their punter being involved with a gang rape so he got booted out, I think there were a couple of WRs and DBs traded which made it interesting. Other than that I don't think there was any significant cuts.
I am curious about the process that some players get cut and don't get put on waivers and then sign back with the team the next day. Bucs did that with the new S they got from the Pats Ryan Logan. Not sure what the legalese behind it is.
I think whether or not you have to clear waivers is based on how many years you've got. Anybody that's cut and not claimed, or doesn't need to be, can be signed back or signed to the practice squad just like a FA. There are a few reasons why it happens, all somewhat technical. Sometimes you need to keep a player on your team so that you can put him on IR with the ability to return, for example. In that case you cut somebody to keep Mr. IR on the roster, and then resign the guy you cut as soon as Mr. IR gets moved over.
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There was a bunch of noise with the Bills when allegations came out against their punter being involved with a gang rape so he got booted out, I think there were a couple of WRs and DBs traded which made it interesting. Other than that I don't think there was any significant cuts.
I am curious about the process that some players get cut and don't get put on waivers and then sign back with the team the next day. Bucs did that with the new S they got from the Pats Ryan Logan. Not sure what the legalese behind it is.
I think whether or not you have to clear waivers is based on how many years you've got. Anybody that's cut and not claimed, or doesn't need to be, can be signed back or signed to the practice squad just like a FA. There are a few reasons why it happens, all somewhat technical. Sometimes you need to keep a player on your team so that you can put him on IR with the ability to return, for example. In that case you cut somebody to keep Mr. IR on the roster, and then resign the guy you cut as soon as Mr. IR gets moved over.
Actually you're right, now I remember reading that they did that to put Jensen on IR.
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...and the Titans' season is apparently going to start right where the last one started/stayed/ended: critical injuries to big-time (and big price-tag) players. This time, the biggest stand-out is star EDGE Harold Landry, who tore his ACL at practice today and is out for the year. Dude is a pressure machine, and until now he's been just about the only healthy/reliable Titan over the past couple years, playing about 90% of defensive snaps.
I realize no NFL team is ever truly 100% healthy, but the Titans sure seemed to have royally angered the football gods at some point, as they've lost multiple major players every year for several years now. Actually smashed the record last year for most players to ever play for the same team in a single season (91 different players saw game action).
In other Titans news...
Not sure if you follow this team, but there's a pretty unique situation with their punter.
Brett Kern has been amazing for the Titans for 13 years (since 2009). Spectacular punter, longest-serving Titan, only the 2nd full time Titans punter since 1998, and probably the most beloved guy on the team (with his teammates, the organization, and the fan base). The team brought in rookie Ryan Stonehouse to give Kern a little competition during camp and keep him sharp. Kern actually had a great camp... but rather surprisingly, so did Stonehouse. So much so, that the Titans knew that once they cut either guy, that guy was going to be snapped up by another team (most likely the Bills or Colts, who are both Titans rivals) and punting against them this season. Well, given that Kern is (slowly) nearing the end of his career and has an "expensive" (only $2M, but definitely expensive for a punter) contract, and that Stonehouse is just starting his career and may be great for years to come, the Titans ultimately made the very painful (but probably "correct," imo) decision to release Bret Kern. Cue tears from the fan base, heart-wrenching farewell Tweets from Kern, etc. The end of an era. Or so everyone thought...
So, the latest twist is that Bret Kern did NOT sign with Buffalo, nor with the Colts... the two obvious choices. It appears that, for now at least, he is intentionally remaining unsigned, and hanging out at home in Nashville. The talk is that he is remaining available for the Titans (possibly at their request), in case things do not go so well in actual games with the new punter. They may still have plans together.
Not a major story, sure. But still VERY unusual- 99% of the time the player almost immediately signs wherever is going to make the most sense for them and their family. The fact that Kern didn't leap at the chance to punt for a SB contender (Bills) or a competitive (but hated) team in Indy is very very curious. The fans, though, are thrilled. We want the best for Brett- but it would have been heartbreaking to see him on the field with Buffalo or Indianapolis. I hope he kills it for a few more years: either in Tennessee or with some other team that won't devastate Titans fans to see have success at that position.
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With a week to go until the season starts...who will be the last team to lose their "and-0" and how far into the season will it be?
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Is someone running the survivor? If not, I will.
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Go for it CC. We'll see if I can last longer than 2 fucking weeks this year. :lol :dunno:
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BREAKING:
New York Jets eliminated from the playoffs.
:facepalm: :tdwn :lol
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BREAKING:
New York Jets eliminated from the playoffs.
:facepalm: :tdwn :lol
:lol
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So, not counting this week's game, are Thursday Night football games NOT on TV?? You have to have Amazon Prime to watch?? Is this true?
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So, not counting this week's game, are Thursday Night football games NOT on TV?? You have to have Amazon Prime to watch?? Is this true?
Yup. Not lets say if the Pats are on, locally, you will still be able to watch it because it will be also on local TV but for games when other teams are playing, you need that streaming service.
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So, not counting this week's game, are Thursday Night football games NOT on TV?? You have to have Amazon Prime to watch?? Is this true?
Yup. Not lets say if the Pats are on, locally, you will still be able to watch it because it will be also on local TV but for games when other teams are playing, you need that streaming service.
So it's basically on channel WTF.
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So, not counting this week's game, are Thursday Night football games NOT on TV?? You have to have Amazon Prime to watch?? Is this true?
Yup. Not lets say if the Pats are on, locally, you will still be able to watch it because it will be also on local TV but for games when other teams are playing, you need that streaming service.
So it's basically on channel WTF.
You kids need to move out of the stone age. :biggrin:
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I have it. I'll text you the scores. :lol
El Barto. :lol
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I have Amazon Prime. But I'm gonna watch it on my computer?? Fuck that. I don't really watch the game intently, but I like to have it on while I DTF and stuff. I want to look up at my TV and watch when I want.
That blows!
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I have Amazon Prime. But I'm gonna watch it on my computer?? Fuck that. I don't really watch the game intently, but I like to have it on while I DTF and stuff. I want to look up at my TV and watch when I want.
That blows!
There is an app for smart TVs and other devices like consoles and Blu-ray players that may have the capability for streaming apps
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I have Amazon Prime. But I'm gonna watch it on my computer?? Fuck that. I don't really watch the game intently, but I like to have it on while I DTF and stuff. I want to look up at my TV and watch when I want.
That blows!
There is an app for smart TVs and other devices like consoles and Blu-ray players that may have the capability for streaming apps
Yeah, I have a TV where I could do that, but on a Thursday night in the fall, I'd likely be watching the Bruins, or playoff baseball, maybe an early season Celtics game, but if I want to check on the football game, I now have change my TV input, and well, it now becomes a giant pain in the ass.
Not that they care, as they have their money, but my TV had Thursday Night Football on every week last season, and this year...it won't be on once. I'm just one viewer so I know I don't matter, obviously.
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God you are old, man.
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Tim, what's your cable company?
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Tim, what's your cable company?
Xfinity I think.
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God you are old, man.
That doesn't make me old though. It's going to require too many extra steps to check in or watch the game. I probably have to sign in to my TV. Fuck all that.
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Yeah, I have a TV where I could do that, but on a Thursday night in the fall, I'd likely be watching the Bruins, or playoff baseball, maybe an early season Celtics game, but if I want to check on the football game, I now have change my TV input, and well, it now becomes a giant pain in the ass.
Not that they care, as they have their money, but my TV had Thursday Night Football on every week last season, and this year...it won't be on once. I'm just one viewer so I know I don't matter, obviously.
Maybe you're making more of this than it needs to be. I have cable, but usually watch it through an app on our TV rather than the actual cable input. If I wanted to still do that while watching Prime for Thursday Night Football, and wanted to check something else out, I would have to close Prime and then open the cable app.
But on Thursdays, I will watch cable through the cable input like most cable watchers do, and have the Prime app on through THAT input. Then whenever I want to toggle back and forth, I would just need to hit my TV's input button. Cable or Prime. No pain in the ass.
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Toggling my TV's input makes it a pain in the ass for me. I don't care about football enough to do this.
Like I said, they are losing a viewer here. I hope they're able to replace it online. But neither of my kids, who are online all the time care about football either, so it's not like it's transitioning to a younger demographic in my house anyway.
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If you upgrade to the X-1 series with the DVR, you don't have to toggle. There's an app section. It's real easy.
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I am with Tim on this. Spreading the games out over so many channels and streaming services is simply going to result in many fans not watching. I don't have Prime, and I am not getting it just to watch one football game a week. And I know, the NFL has so much money, so who cares, but it blows.
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I don't like it either but he has Amazon Prime. He just hates technology.
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But I get what he means about being able to flip back and forth quickly between that and something else, if you have to get Prime up and running every time you want to switch over.
I came to the realization a while back that the reason I rarely watch concert videos anymore is due to the advances in technology. Back in the day, I could leave one in the VCR, and if I were watching a ball game or something and wanted a break for a bit, I could just hit play and watch a few songs and then go right back to the game. Now, you have to click over to the app, start it up, go through the menu and then finally get to a song. It makes the flipping around process suck, so I just don't do it.
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It isn't that hard. Shit, Tim probably had to deal with rabbit ears sooooooo....
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I am with Tim on this. Spreading the games out over so many channels and streaming services is simply going to result in many fans not watching. I don't have Prime, and I am not getting it just to watch one football game a week. And I know, the NFL has so much money, so who cares, but it blows.
NFL need to get their act together, ditch DirectTV and just offer a season ticket package independently like every other league have. I think they are getting close, but not there yet. I've got hopes that next year is the year, as I believe their contract with DirectTV is up in 2023, and they've already launched their own "NFL+" app which is slowly encroaching on Sunday Ticket (though, only Preseason, thus far).
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Toggling my TV's input makes it a pain in the ass for me. I don't care about football enough to do this.
Whatever. No skin off my nose. If you don't care enough about football to hit a button, that's your business.
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I am with Tim on this. Spreading the games out over so many channels and streaming services is simply going to result in many fans not watching. I don't have Prime, and I am not getting it just to watch one football game a week. And I know, the NFL has so much money, so who cares, but it blows.
NFL need to get their act together, ditch DirectTV and just offer a season ticket package independently like every other league have. I think they are getting close, but not there yet. I've got hopes that next year is the year, as I believe their contract with DirectTV is up in 2023, and they've already launched their own "NFL+" app which is slowly encroaching on Sunday Ticket (though, only Preseason, thus far).
Agreed. Better still, renew with DTV but non-exclusively. Let them compete with a wired carrier. Looks like it's currently up to $293/yr, and that's getting real close to the point I'd rather go through the hassle of stealing it rather than paying for the convenience. At the same time, it's also possible that all of these lucrative broadcasting rights deals include a no-compete clause. It's entirely possible that the NFL's unwillingness to offer such a package has to do with the other services rather than DTV.
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I am with Tim on this. Spreading the games out over so many channels and streaming services is simply going to result in many fans not watching. I don't have Prime, and I am not getting it just to watch one football game a week. And I know, the NFL has so much money, so who cares, but it blows.
I more or less agree. We have two TVs. The living room TV is old and not "smart." There's a Fire stick, but it didn't work the last time I tried it. The bedroom TV is "smart," but the process of switching from the cable box to the home screen and then scroll down to the Amazon app and then click around to find the game is more effort than it's worth. If it's a game I really want to watch (e.g., if it's the Broncos), then I'll probably go there and leave it there. I guess the good part is that, in an average season, I MIGHT watch 1-2 TNF games, so it really won't matter much. As long as the Sunday and Monday games stay where they are.
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I already have Prime Video anyway, but the app is on my PS5 console (much faster streaming than my smart tv). All I have to do is switch back and forth. Piece O' cake. :tup
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What on earth is a PS5 console?
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What on earth is a PS5 console?
Listen, Triceratops, it's PlayStation 5. Which I, being a fellow Jurassic era guy, do not have.
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What on earth is a PS5 console?
Listen, Triceratops, it's PlayStation 5. Which I, being a fellow Jurassic era guy, do not have.
Ah gotcha. ;D
I never made it past Intellivision. My stepson played Nintendo when he was a kid. I also know of Atari and Colecovision.
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What on earth is a PS5 console?
Listen, Triceratops, it's PlayStation 5. Which I, being a fellow Jurassic era guy, do not have.
Ah gotcha. ;D
I never made it past Intellivision. My stepson played Nintendo when he was a kid. I also know of Atari and Colecovision.
God, we're so old. :lol
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What on earth is a PS5 console?
Listen, Triceratops, it's PlayStation 5. Which I, being a fellow Jurassic era guy, do not have.
Ah gotcha. ;D
I never made it past Intellivision. My stepson played Nintendo when he was a kid. I also know of Atari and Colecovision.
Owned all of them as well as the Atari 5200, 7800, 1200xl computer. Sega, Genesis, Dreamcast. Nintendo Nes, SNes, 64, Gamecube & Wii.
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What on earth is a PS5 console?
Listen, Triceratops, it's PlayStation 5. Which I, being a fellow Jurassic era guy, do not have.
Almost shit myself LMFAO!! :lol :rollin :lol
Tim, for a split second I wasn't sure if you were joking or not. I think you need a PS5 for xmas. It's a lot more than just a gaming device :biggrin:
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What on earth is a PS5 console?
Listen, Triceratops, it's PlayStation 5. Which I, being a fellow Jurassic era guy, do not have.
Ah gotcha. ;D
I never made it past Intellivision. My stepson played Nintendo when he was a kid. I also know of Atari and Colecovision.
God, we're so old. :lol
My sister's husband's family (with whom we became friends) had an Atari 2600, and a friend of mine from my neighborhood had n Intellivision. I though the Intellivision sucked. I got a Colecovision...I think as a combo birthday/Christmas gift in 1982. I thought it was really cool. There was a hardware add-on that let you play Atari 2600 games, and I think I ended up playing more of those than Colecovision games.
Sometime in the late '80s or early '90s I got an NES, and then I think my now-wife got me the Super NES in '93 or '94. I then got a PS3 for father's day in 2007, and that's as far as I went with video game consoles, although my kids have had a GameCube, a Wii and a PS4 (along with a couple of GameBoys).
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What on earth is a PS5 console?
Listen, Triceratops, it's PlayStation 5. Which I, being a fellow Jurassic era guy, do not have.
Ah gotcha. ;D
I never made it past Intellivision. My stepson played Nintendo when he was a kid. I also know of Atari and Colecovision.
God, we're so old. :lol
My sister's husband's family (with whom we became friends) had an Atari 2600, and a friend of mine from my neighborhood had n Intellivision. I though the Intellivision sucked. I got a Colecovision...I think as a combo birthday/Christmas gift in 1982. I thought it was really cool. There was a hardware add-on that let you play Atari 2600 games, and I think I ended up playing more of those than Colecovision games.
Dude, in my world only the rich kids had Intelivisions, and the rest of us were jealous.
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Huh? I thought my parents bought Intellivision because it was cheaper than Atari. I know that all the kids we knew had Atari, and we were the only ones that had Intellivision.
Here's an ad from 1982..
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/2e/78/ab/2e78abc576bc27280bfdde24dcf65f54.jpg)
(https://th.bing.com/th/id/R.29d7f690c2e3c02331b5e63aae017a1d?rik=%2fn9eqeyth52VRw&riu=http%3a%2f%2f4.bp.blogspot.com%2f-VIeiIHi8Q2c%2fUxkuDxC-UpI%2fAAAAAAAAtRA%2f4qiFnzwfJLM%2fs1600%2f1982_0034.jpg&ehk=tryZwp%2fxI373haBpSWokA%2fWPseYREsePkl6c2OSy51s%3d&risl=&pid=ImgRaw&r=0)
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That ad is right before the bottom fell out of the market. Introductory price for the Intellivision was about $275. By the time it came out the price of the 2600 had dropped quite a bit from its introductory price of $189 two years earlier. That two year delay was probably a bigger consideration. Parents who'd shelled out $150 for the 2600 weren't going to run out and buy a $250 console 2 years later. Except maybe this woman (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FgXxtgu76Ag). :lol
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That ad is right before the bottom fell out of the market. Introductory price for the Intellivision was about $275. By the time it came out the price of the 2600 had dropped quite a bit from its introductory price of $189 two years earlier. That two year delay was probably a bigger consideration. Parents who'd shelled out $150 for the 2600 weren't going to run out and buy a $250 console 2 years later. Except maybe this woman (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FgXxtgu76Ag). :lol
Bart, I have no idea how you're up on any of this. It's amazing actually.
I remember having Intellivision, but I grew out of it pretty quickly. Video games was never really my thing. If you told me that my parents shelled out more for Intellivision than my neighbor's parents shelled out for Atari, then that would blow my mind. My only guess would be that the salesman convinced my mother that Intellivision was FAR superior. We never went without, but we never had top of the line anything.
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I had an Intellivision. The sports games (mainly football) were the most realistic looking at the time. It also had a sold separately voice model for added realism for some of the games. However, those controllers and the little disc for a directional pad were god awful. Later on, it was NES and SNES which eventually led to PlayStation. The only PS console I didn't get was the PS3. Most of those games can be streamed on PlayStation Now anyway.
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I remember the disc wearing out. I think we bought something to put on them, a little joystick or something like that.
I remember the graphics being pretty terrible though.
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Bart, I have no idea how you're up on any of this. It's amazing actually.
I just googled their retail price on release. :dunno:
I remember the graphics being pretty terrible though.
Compared to the 2600? It was far superior in terms of graphics.
(https://techraptor.net/sites/default/files/styles/herobanner_desktop/public/2019-12/Atari%20vs%20Intellivision.jpg?itok=2tXM735G)
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Quite a conversation on the day of the first regular season game. :lol :biggrin:
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did I see that Ozzy is playing at halftime? Ive read hes doing well after the surgery but.....
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Bart, I have no idea how you're up on any of this. It's amazing actually.
I just googled their retail price on release. :dunno:
I remember the graphics being pretty terrible though.
Compared to the 2600? It was far superior in terms of graphics.
(https://techraptor.net/sites/default/files/styles/herobanner_desktop/public/2019-12/Atari%20vs%20Intellivision.jpg?itok=2tXM735G)
I remember that George Plimpton ad. To the 14/15 year old me, he came across as a pompous, insufferable ass - especially after I had played Intellivision with that horrible disc controller (which they tried to pimp up by pointing out that it had 8 points of contact, instead of the 2600's 4 points).
did I see that Ozzy is playing at halftime? Ive read hes doing well after the surgery but.....
"Playing" = (I assume) waddling about on stage while lip-syncing. I may have to tune in for that just for unintended entertainment value.
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Good first half. This could easily be the Super Bowl.
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Josh Allen is a special player. He has everything you could possibly want in a quarterback, including the will to win that a team can rally around. It’s hard to root against him and the Bills, even as a fan of a division rival.
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I remember how bad he looked early on. Once it clicked for him, he looks unstoppable now. He's fantastic.
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The Pats are in trouble. :lol
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Holy shit what a throw!! :omg: :omg:
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Duh.
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Amazing game to begin the season.
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They have 4 turnovers, yet the Bills are still beating the Rams 31-10 (no extra credit for the road thing since Rams home games in LA are never really home games :lol). It is always best to not overreact to week 1, but the Bills look fantastic. Their D looks much improved. I know it was number 1 last year, but they feasted on a lot of average to below average QBs. Shutting this Rams offense down like this is a statement.
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Good first half. This could easily be the Super Bowl.
This was my pick for the super bowl (and outcome). Which is funny because I've thought all along that LAR isn't a repeat kind of team. I've actually got them backing into the playoffs with a WC, and turning it on from there.
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Good first half. This could easily be the Super Bowl.
This was my pick for the super bowl (and outcome). Which is funny because I've thought all along that LAR isn't a repeat kind of team. I've actually got them backing into the playoffs with a WC, and turning it on from there.
Same here. IIRC, my pick was Buffalo over GB in the SB, with Rams getting in as a wild card team and then winning two road games before losing at GB in the NFCCG.
What's scary for the league is that a) Buffalo's number 1 D got even better, and b) Josh Allen looks better at pre-snap reads. He made a few mistakes (that 2nd INT was totally his fault as he threw behind the receiver), but the Rams D is legit, so those will happen. Most defenses they will face won't be as good as LA's, and they still put up 31 despite 4 TOs. If I am a Bills fan, Allen's health is my biggest concern. He looks to run and initiate contact, and I get that he's a big guy, but all it takes is one wrong hit to his shoulder or something, and their season tanks.
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What on earth is a PS5 console?
Listen, Triceratops, it's PlayStation 5. Which I, being a fellow Jurassic era guy, do not have.
Ah gotcha. ;D
I never made it past Intellivision. My stepson played Nintendo when he was a kid. I also know of Atari and Colecovision.
Owned all of them as well as the Atari 5200, 7800, 1200xl computer. Sega, Genesis, Dreamcast. Nintendo Nes, SNes, 64, Gamecube & Wii.
I use my PLayStation as a Blu-ray player.
The 5200 and the 7800 were holy grails for me. I had the 2600 and the Nintendo. I never got the advanced Atari consoles. I thought about going back and trying to find one, but never did.
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Good first half. This could easily be the Super Bowl.
This was my pick for the super bowl (and outcome). Which is funny because I've thought all along that LAR isn't a repeat kind of team. I've actually got them backing into the playoffs with a WC, and turning it on from there.
Same here. IIRC, my pick was Buffalo over GB in the SB, with Rams getting in as a wild card team and then winning two road games before losing at GB in the NFCCG.
What's scary for the league is that a) Buffalo's number 1 D got even better, and b) Josh Allen looks better at pre-snap reads. He made a few mistakes (that 2nd INT was totally his fault as he threw behind the receiver), but the Rams D is legit, so those will happen. Most defenses they will face won't be as good as LA's, and they still put up 31 despite 4 TOs. If I am a Bills fan, Allen's health is my biggest concern. He looks to run and initiate contact, and I get that he's a big guy, but all it takes is one wrong hit to his shoulder or something, and their season tanks.
Yup, even after the game was well in control (technically Buf controlled the game from the opening kickoff, even when they kept turning the ball over). In the 4th quarter of a game they were in complete control of he was still looking to initiate contact, and that idiot Collinsworth kept talking about it as a strength of Sean McDermott.
Another possibility, perhaps not this year, but soon, is that because he's so freakishly good Allen inherits Mahomes' messiah complex. Dude had an air of smugness about him, and I can see him becoming a bit too confident in himself.
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First of all, I thought this game was supposed to be on Amazon Prime. I got home and went to watch (since the Dodgers were off yesterday), but it was nowhere to be found. By complete happenstance, I saw that it was, in fact, on Peacock, so I was able to tune it in.
Unfortunately, I didn't get home in time to see Ozzy. How bad was he?
I also didn't see any of the game because my kid needed my help assembling the military grade gaming desk that he ordered. By the time we got it built, the game was over. :lol
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First of all, I thought this game was supposed to be on Amazon Prime. I got home and went to watch (since the Dodgers were off yesterday), but it was nowhere to be found. By complete happenstance, I saw that it was, in fact, on Peacock, so I was able to tune it in.
Unfortunately, I didn't get home in time to see Ozzy. How bad was he?
I also didn't see any of the game because my kid needed my help assembling the military grade gaming desk that he ordered. By the time we got it built, the game was over. :lol
Yeah, I was watching another group of geriatrics so I missed Oz. What's the what there?
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They said NBC showed 10 seconds of him only.
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Yeah, he sounded real good for ten seconds, and then they went back to silly people talking about pointless shit. Overall, the presentation of the game last night was a miserable failure. I know I'm a grumpy old man and all, but listening to those people drone on and on about what we just saw is nauseating. When I'm watching from home I'm going to start listening to the SAP in Spanish. I don't speak it, but that's why it'll work.
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Teams need to play for 60 minutes a game. Rams didn't get the memo. :loser:
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ARE YOU READY FOR SOME FOOTBALL!!!!!! :metal :metal :metal :metal :metal
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ARE YOU READY FOR SOME FOOTBALL!!!!!! :metal :metal :metal :metal :metal
Yes, but also no. Life as a Jets fan is confusing and often difficult.
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(https://res.cloudinary.com/teepublic/image/private/s--PDTvL6h1--/c_crop,x_10,y_10/c_fit,w_1071/c_crop,g_north_west,h_840,w_1260,x_-95,y_-110/co_rgb:115740,e_colorize,u_Misc:One%20Pixel%20Gray/c_scale,g_north_west,h_840,w_1260/fl_layer_apply,g_north_west,x_-95,y_-110/bo_0px_solid_white/t_Resized%20Artwork/c_fit,g_north_west,h_1054,w_1054/co_ffffff,e_outline:53/co_ffffff,e_outline:inner_fill:53/co_bbbbbb,e_outline:3:1000/c_mpad,g_center,h_1260,w_1260/b_rgb:eeeeee/c_limit,f_auto,h_630,q_90,w_630/v1601776858/production/designs/14663578_0.jpg)
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(https://i.postimg.cc/xjJ5Xvmq/20220911-132508.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/K4bBVgJy) (https://postimages.org/app)
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This Jets O-line is gonna be a problem yet again this season.
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TJ Watt and that Steelers D has Burrow and his team looking like the Bungals.
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Fucking Pats WTF?? This is going to be a long season.
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No surprise though.
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Fucking Pats WTF?? This is going to be a long season.
Perhaps, but not really based on anything we've seen today. The Pats D gave up one ugly play but have otherwise played decently. The offense has looked much better than expected, honestly, and were it not for a shitty call on the first drive the game's very different. That non-call was a 10 point swing. The only thing that's particularly concerning are the injuries to Duggar and Phillips.
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The Jets need to seriously consider putting Mike White in. The team actually looks pretty good but Flacco’s lack of mobility combined with the reshuffled O-line is killing them.
EDIT: Also the Bills must be licking their chops watching the other three AFC East teams play right now.
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Fucking Pats WTF?? This is going to be a long season.
Perhaps, but not really based on anything we've seen today. The Pats D gave up one ugly play but have otherwise played decently. The offense has looked much better than expected, honestly, and were it not for a shitty call on the first drive the game's very different. That non-call was a 10 point swing. The only thing that's particularly concerning are the injuries to Duggar and Phillips.
I agree Bart. But this is against Miami, and it's frustrating that today is gonna be not good enough.
Duggar was having a good game too.
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I think he was hit in the rocks.
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Patriots fans when they realize what life is like after TB12:
(https://c.tenor.com/8SJ7qYd5FusAAAAC/hulk-hogan-shock.gif)
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I think he was hit in the rocks.
First thing I thought, but he wasn't racked. He wasn't in enough pain, and the trainers were feeling around for a bruise to the abdomen.
Fucking Pats WTF?? This is going to be a long season.
Perhaps, but not really based on anything we've seen today. The Pats D gave up one ugly play but have otherwise played decently. The offense has looked much better than expected, honestly, and were it not for a shitty call on the first drive the game's very different. That non-call was a 10 point swing. The only thing that's particularly concerning are the injuries to Duggar and Phillips.
I agree Bart. But this is against Miami, and it's frustrating that today is gonna be not good enough.
Duggar was having a good game too.
Miami's an improved division rival. They're always going to be competitive. And at the moment McCorkle is 17/21-149 1-1 and the one pick was on the refs, not him. That could easily be 2-0. Like I said, they're not playing as bad as the score suggests, at all.
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New season, same shitty Panthers.
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@ Bart, I'm glad you're encouraged by today's game, but I did expect this game to be competitive. They are simply not making the plays that need to be made.
I'm quite discouraged by it, honestly.
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Patriots fans when they realize what life is like after TB12:
(https://c.tenor.com/8SJ7qYd5FusAAAAC/hulk-hogan-shock.gif)
Nah. It's been doom and gloom all preseason because of the coaching staff.
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@ Bart, I'm glad you're encouraged by today's game, but I did expect this game to be competitive. They are simply not making the plays that need to be made.
I'm quite discouraged by it, honestly.
All we've heard about the last six months is how terrible they're going to be, and how they're going to ruin Mac Jones. That's really not what we've seen. So long as Mac shows improvement and they haven't sank the ship there's reason to be encouraged.
edit: Also, Adam Archuleta is officially the dumbest guy calling games. He really doesn't have a clue about anything. Makes you miss Aquib Talib.
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Game of the year already in Cincy. Steelers/Bengals game was amazing.
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Live look at Sheldon impersonating Gisele's reaction to the latest sack on TB12:
(https://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m2lcqr7QJf1qihztbo1_500.gif)
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I think it was more like this..
(https://i.gifer.com/7Ape.gif)
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:lol :lol
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Well I have to eat crow, you naysayers were right about Mahomes sucking without Hill. Only 44 pts and 5 TD passes, pretty shitty overall. Get his bum ass out of town and bring back Alex Smith.
But in all seriousness, you guys who thought a generational talent was going to miss a receiver :rollin. Now Rodgers on the other hand . . .
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Bucs defense was solid, offense was shaky but didn't matter. Cool first game win for Coach Todd Bowles.
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There is lots of legit talent on this Jets team, and I enjoyed watching them. Some awful mistakes that cost the Jets the game, but some great moments too. DJ Reed will be good. Sauce Gardner will be good. Garret Wilson will be good. Many of the rookies were playing their first snap of NFL football, and all had shining moments. It's not the "same old Jets", but it's going to take time. Let alone we still need to see if Zach Wilson can step up, once he's healthy.
The Jets had more yards on offense than the Ravens, more first downs, and met them toe-to-toe on turnovers also. Too bad about the mistakes in the beginning and on special teams. This is a young team with a lot of promise that has many rough edges. I like Saleh as a player coach but I wonder if he's got what it takes to take the raw talent of young players and coaches into something that can win games.
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I didn’t really enjoy the Packers strategy of not covering Justin Jefferson.
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Well I have to eat crow, you naysayers were right about Mahomes sucking without Hill. Only 44 pts and 5 TD passes, pretty shitty overall. Get his bum ass out of town and bring back Alex Smith.
But in all seriousness, you guys who thought a generational talent was going to miss a receiver :rollin. Now Rodgers on the other hand . . .
Yep, one game, against the Cardinals. That should seal up Canton. ;)
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@ Bart, I'm glad you're encouraged by today's game, but I did expect this game to be competitive. They are simply not making the plays that need to be made.
I'm quite discouraged by it, honestly.
All we've heard about the last six months is how terrible they're going to be, and how they're going to ruin Mac Jones. That's really not what we've seen. So long as Mac shows improvement and they haven't sank the ship there's reason to be encouraged.
edit: Also, Adam Archuleta is officially the dumbest guy calling games. He really doesn't have a clue about anything. Makes you miss Aquib Talib.
I'm kind of with Bart. That drive was decent. The secondary seemed to be making good plays in open space. I don't know; it's one game, and I'm not ready to throw in the towel yet.
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@ Bart, I'm glad you're encouraged by today's game, but I did expect this game to be competitive. They are simply not making the plays that need to be made.
I'm quite discouraged by it, honestly.
All we've heard about the last six months is how terrible they're going to be, and how they're going to ruin Mac Jones. That's really not what we've seen. So long as Mac shows improvement and they haven't sank the ship there's reason to be encouraged.
edit: Also, Adam Archuleta is officially the dumbest guy calling games. He really doesn't have a clue about anything. Makes you miss Aquib Talib.
I'm kind of with Bart. That drive was decent. The secondary seemed to be making good plays in open space. I don't know; it's one game, and I'm not ready to throw in the towel yet.
My prediction for this season was as carbon copy of last season, and that's what I took away from yesterday's game. I wouldn't call this team a contender, but they'll have a stretch in the middle of playing very good football (people forget they were a top five team last year for a chunk of the season), and be not quite good enough to really go anywhere.
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The end of the season they got 3 rough games against teams that should be fighting for high seeds.
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The end of the season they got 3 rough games against teams that should be fighting for high seeds.
Buffalo won't be fighting for nothin come January 8.
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The end of the season they got 3 rough games against teams that should be fighting for high seeds.
Buffalo won't be fighting for nothin come January 8.
Maybe KC for the #1. Now that only the #1 gets a bye.
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The end of the season they got 3 rough games against teams that should be fighting for high seeds.
Buffalo won't be fighting for nothin come January 8.
Maybe KC for the #1. Now that only the #1 gets a bye.
Buffalo won't be fighting for nothin come January 8.
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The end of the season they got 3 rough games against teams that should be fighting for high seeds.
Buffalo won't be fighting for nothin come January 8.
Maybe KC for the #1. Now that only the #1 gets a bye.
Not with KC being in the AFC West and BUF being in the AFC East. The Chiefs are gonna have to battle for their division while the Bills are basically a lock to win theirs barring injury. Because of the quality of teams in their divisions, the Bills should have a few more wins than the Chiefs from those games.
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Dak Prescott being out with an injury doesn't even matter. Dallas' season was done before it even got started. Can't believe I was dumb enough to pick those fuckers last night. :loser:
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Dak Prescott being out with an injury doesn't even matter. Dallas' season was done before it even got started. Can't believe I was dumb enough to pick those fuckers last night. :loser:
That front 7 will keep them in close games, but without Prescott they're in deep shit. Their schedule isn't so terrible, they could conceivably come out of it 4-4 before his return. If they do that they'll still be in the hunt in a starkly mediocre NFC-E. Jerry needs to remind Zeek that he's auditioning for his next team right now.
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The end of the season they got 3 rough games against teams that should be fighting for high seeds.
Buffalo won't be fighting for nothin come January 8.
Maybe KC for the #1. Now that only the #1 gets a bye.
Not with KC being in the AFC West and BUF being in the AFC East. The Chiefs are gonna have to battle for their division while the Bills are basically a lock to win theirs barring injury. Because of the quality of teams in their divisions, the Bills should have a few more wins than the Chiefs from those games.
The #1 seed in the east. Not the AFC East. Bills will have that wrapped up no problem. EB is probably right but KC is the only team that could possibly keep up with the Bills win total.
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The end of the season they got 3 rough games against teams that should be fighting for high seeds.
Buffalo won't be fighting for nothin come January 8.
Maybe KC for the #1. Now that only the #1 gets a bye.
Not with KC being in the AFC West and BUF being in the AFC East. The Chiefs are gonna have to battle for their division while the Bills are basically a lock to win theirs barring injury. Because of the quality of teams in their divisions, the Bills should have a few more wins than the Chiefs from those games.
The #1 seed in the east. Not the AFC East. Bills will have that wrapped up no problem. EB is probably right but KC is the only team that could possibly keep up with the Bills win total.
I don't think they do. Buffalo will be 14-2 come the final week, and that will include a win over the Chiefs for the tie-breaker.
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p.s. the Jets were what I thought they were.
LOL.
There's no hope for this franchise. Literally none.
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The Jets scored 3 times as many points as Dallas. That's at least something.
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The end of the season they got 3 rough games against teams that should be fighting for high seeds.
Buffalo won't be fighting for nothin come January 8.
Maybe KC for the #1. Now that only the #1 gets a bye.
Not with KC being in the AFC West and BUF being in the AFC East. The Chiefs are gonna have to battle for their division while the Bills are basically a lock to win theirs barring injury. Because of the quality of teams in their divisions, the Bills should have a few more wins than the Chiefs from those games.
The #1 seed in the east. Not the AFC East. Bills will have that wrapped up no problem. EB is probably right but KC is the only team that could possibly keep up with the Bills win total.
I don't think they do. Buffalo will be 14-2 come the final week, and that will include a win over the Chiefs for the tie-breaker.
I'll say this again, I think they are the only team to have a shot. It doesn't mean they will be in position to do so.
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Lions lose again. Some things never change. Death, taxes, Lions losses.
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Dak Prescott being out with an injury doesn't even matter. Dallas' season was done before it even got started. Can't believe I was dumb enough to pick those fuckers last night. :loser:
That front 7 will keep them in close games, but without Prescott they're in deep shit. Their schedule isn't so terrible, they could conceivably come out of it 4-4 before his return. If they do that they'll still be in the hunt in a starkly mediocre NFC-E. Jerry needs to remind Zeek that he's auditioning for his next team right now.
Cooper Rush! :). They played a clip with Jerry Jones on Rob Dibble's show, and dammit, I almost felt bad for him. He was clearly distraught. I don't think for Dad the person, but for his team.
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Well I have to eat crow, you naysayers were right about Mahomes sucking without Hill. Only 44 pts and 5 TD passes, pretty shitty overall. Get his bum ass out of town and bring back Alex Smith.
Yep, one game, against the Cardinals. That should seal up Canton. ;)
I actually think Canton is sealed up, but the Cards suck. I said that I would expect KC to come back down to earth. I very well could be a year early with that prediction, but they started the season with a creampuff.
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Dak Prescott being out with an injury doesn't even matter. Dallas' season was done before it even got started. Can't believe I was dumb enough to pick those fuckers last night. :loser:
That front 7 will keep them in close games, but without Prescott they're in deep shit. Their schedule isn't so terrible, they could conceivably come out of it 4-4 before his return. If they do that they'll still be in the hunt in a starkly mediocre NFC-E. Jerry needs to remind Zeek that he's auditioning for his next team right now.
Cooper Rush! :). They played a clip with Jerry Jones on Rob Dibble's show, and dammit, I almost felt bad for him. He was clearly distraught. I don't think for Dad the person, but for his team.
Hey - at least Cooper has the right last name RUSH! :tup :tup
:metal :metal :metal :metal :metal :metal :metal
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Dak Prescott being out with an injury doesn't even matter. Dallas' season was done before it even got started. Can't believe I was dumb enough to pick those fuckers last night. :loser:
That front 7 will keep them in close games, but without Prescott they're in deep shit. Their schedule isn't so terrible, they could conceivably come out of it 4-4 before his return. If they do that they'll still be in the hunt in a starkly mediocre NFC-E. Jerry needs to remind Zeek that he's auditioning for his next team right now.
Oh, you mean close games of 3 points or less? :lol They were in deep shit before taking the field. I just didn't realize how much. Zeke ran pretty good (no thanks to the O-line) and Dak was high fiving pass rushers with his follow thru (no thanks to the O-line). Only one top receiver on the field doesn't get it done either. Zeke doesn't really need to audition for anyone as he has already established himself in that regard. Someone should remind JJ that he needs a substantial backup QB instead of promoting a guy from the practice squad behind Cooper Rush.
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KC won't be fighting for the 1 seed. They will be duking it out with the Chargers for 2nd place in the AFC West after the Broncos clinch the division. :hat :hat
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I'd love to see him fail. As a Brady fan. But, his worst year starting for them is 12-4 the last 4 years. I think it could happen but the % is small.
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I don't get why Patriots fans hate Mahomes. Oh, he is a threat to Brady's GOATness, right? And the way the media talks him up is his fault, right? :lol :lol :biggrin: :biggrin:
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Bullseye! Lol. Hey, I can be petty.
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Can't we all, when it comes to sports? :P :lol
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Lolol. For sure.
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KC won't be fighting for the 1 seed. They will be duking it out with the Chargers for 2nd place in the AFC West after the Broncos clinch the division. :hat :hat
While I expect the Broncos to win tonight, I feel like they are going into the season a tad overrated.
I don't get why Patriots fans hate Mahomes. Oh, he is a threat to Brady's GOATness, right? And the way the media talks him up is his fault, right? :lol :lol :biggrin: :biggrin:
I love Pat Mahomes. The guy is amazing.
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I don't get why Patriots fans hate Mahomes. Oh, he is a threat to Brady's GOATness, right? And the way the media talks him up is his fault, right? :lol :lol :biggrin: :biggrin:
I don't hate the guy. I just think we need to let him play out more than a quarter of his career before we anoint him the second coming. It's the same problem I had with St. Rodgers. I will add that the kid's definitely believing his own hype, as we saw when he knocked his team out of the playoffs last year thinking he really was Superman. That doesn't make me hate the kid, but it sure does make me chuckle when he folds up. Like I said last January, a dose of humility might do him good.
Cooper Rush! :). They played a clip with Jerry Jones on Rob Dibble's show, and dammit, I almost felt bad for him. He was clearly distraught. I don't think for Dad the person, but for his team.
Time's running out. Say what you will about the crazy old fuck, he really does love the team, and not all of the problems have been unforced errors. I think he's trying to do right, but he just can't understand the nature of the problem he's created. That actually does make him something of a tragic figure.
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To me, it's always the coverage. That's also why I rarely listen to a game when it's on.
I have zero issue with Mahomes on the field. I think he's incredible.
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Broncos D is a bit of a WTF so far. Geno f'ing Smith should not be looking this good.
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Broncos new coach is already the biggest dumbass in the league. Unreal.
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Broncos new coach is already the biggest dumbass in the league. Unreal.
They should have won that game with just one of those End Zone fumbles taken away but seriously, imagine spending big on getting a future Hall of Fame quarterback and then not even trusting them to get you five yards when the game is on the line.
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I am officially off the Broncos bandwagon. They are no longer my team. I cannot be a fan of a team with a coach this stupid. It was a good run.
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I am officially off the Broncos bandwagon. They are no longer my team. I cannot be a fan of a team with a coach this stupid. It was a good run.
Enjoy your multiple years of Wilson's diminished skills and weirdness!
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So weird to be hearing Tirico on SNF and then Joe and Troy on ESPN. Those last few minutes were whole WTF moments from the Broncos.
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Broncos new coach is already the biggest dumbass in the league. Unreal.
They should have won that game with just one of those End Zone fumbles taken away but seriously, imagine spending big on getting a future Hall of Fame quarterback and then not even trusting them to get you five yards when the game is on the line.
In all fairness he took three shots and they were all kind of ugly. I probably would have trusted my D and my K more than him, too, after seeing that. I kind of see it like standing on 19. It's almost always the smart move, and a lot of the time it'll still get you burned.
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Broncos new coach is already the biggest dumbass in the league. Unreal.
They should have won that game with just one of those End Zone fumbles taken away but seriously, imagine spending big on getting a future Hall of Fame quarterback and then not even trusting them to get you five yards when the game is on the line.
In all fairness he took three shots and they were all kind of ugly. I probably would have trusted my D and my K more than him, too, after seeing that. I kind of see it like standing on 19. It's almost always the smart move, and a lot of the time it'll still get you burned.
He looked pretty bad every time he hero balled. By the way, Geno got away with a lot of bad play too. I'm kinda shocked both QBs got out of that game without turning the ball over.
But I'm not saying he should have taken it to the endzone. I'm taking about the decision to run the clock down on 4th down and 5 from having almost a minute and 3 time outs left to 20 seconds. Shoulda had a play ready and trusted Russ to be able to get you at least 5 yards and the first down, making things a bit easier for the kicker.
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I agree. Having over a minute left and all your timeouts and yet CHOOSING to run down the clock for a 64 yard FG is nothing short of bafflingly stupid.
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Yeah, no shit. Denver's coach is almost as dumb as Jerry Jones and Geno Smith of all QB's is the evening's hero. Try not to get used to that Pete Carroll :lol
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Yeah, no shit. Denver's coach is almost as dumb as Jerry Jones and Geno Smith of all QB's is the evening's hero. Try not to get used to that Pete Carroll :lol
The Broncos flat-out disrespected Geno to start the game. Assuming he would not hit open guys down the field even if you left them totally open and put pressure on them. If Geno's got one thing I remember even from the Jets days, it's poise. Once he got a big head, he started to make some stupid decisions.
Also once the Broncos started respecting that Geno wasn't incompetent his productivity really tapered off. That said, the Seahawks have a pretty winnable schedule in the first half. Would not be surprised if they are in the hunt for a majority of the season.
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So the other things I enjoyed the most about opening week were of course my Steelers effing up that cocky, mouthy Joe Burrow and Russell Wilson losing in Seattle :lol.
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I don't get why Patriots fans hate Mahomes. Oh, he is a threat to Brady's GOATness, right? And the way the media talks him up is his fault, right? :lol :lol :biggrin: :biggrin:
I don't hate him, first. It has nothing to do with him as a person. Maybe it's something I have to overcome from my childhood, but there are just too many people willing to bestow "greatness" at the drop of a hat. The only thing - the ONLY thing - I don't like about Mahomes is when he tries his fandango underhanded overhand sidearm bullshit and it doesn't work and he looks like a petulant kid. But that's a me problem, and I've never once ever voiced that here, until now.
My only beef is in general the bestowing of greatness before he's actually ACHIEVED that greatness. The "annointing" as Bill Parcells says. And since you brought up Brady, do you think there might be one or two people - not saying here, but maybe :) - that are OVER-celebrating Mahomes so we DON'T have to keep talking about Brady (he says impishly and with a big smile)? :) :) :)
ED: Ninja'd, perfectly, by El Barto. What he said. :)
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Yeah, no shit. Denver's coach is almost as dumb as Jerry Jones and Geno Smith of all QB's is the evening's hero. Try not to get used to that Pete Carroll :lol
The Broncos flat-out disrespected Geno to start the game. Assuming he would not hit open guys down the field even if you left them totally open and put pressure on them. If Geno's got one thing I remember even from the Jets days, it's poise. Once he got a big head, he started to make some stupid decisions.
Also once the Broncos started respecting that Geno wasn't incompetent his productivity really tapered off. That said, the Seahawks have a pretty winnable schedule in the first half. Would not be surprised if they are in the hunt for a majority of the season.
If Pete Carroll can keep Geno in his zone, they can be decent. He looked very good at times. I don't think it will take much for his head to inflate - he was preening a bit during the post game interview: "Were you upset that Seattle fans wrote you off at the start of the pre-season?" "Yeah, they wrote me off, but I didn't write back!" - but until it does, and he can get the ball to Penny and Metcalf, you have to respect him.
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Typical week 1 reactions both good and bad, but it's still the first week. Nobody knows much of anything...yet.
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Typical week 1 reactions both good and bad, but it's still the first week. Nobody knows much of anything...yet.
Dublagent for the win! :tup
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:lol Just trying grasp a shred of sanity in an insane league. ???
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I don't get why Patriots fans hate Mahomes. Oh, he is a threat to Brady's GOATness, right? And the way the media talks him up is his fault, right? :lol :lol :biggrin: :biggrin:
I don't hate him, first. It has nothing to do with him as a person. Maybe it's something I have to overcome from my childhood, but there are just too many people willing to bestow "greatness" at the drop of a hat. The only thing - the ONLY thing - I don't like about Mahomes is when he tries his fandango underhanded overhand sidearm bullshit and it doesn't work and he looks like a petulant kid. But that's a me problem, and I've never once ever voiced that here, until now.
My only beef is in general the bestowing of greatness before he's actually ACHIEVED that greatness. The "annointing" as Bill Parcells says. And since you brought up Brady, do you think there might be one or two people - not saying here, but maybe :) - that are OVER-celebrating Mahomes so we DON'T have to keep talking about Brady (he says impishly and with a big smile)? :) :) :)
ED: Ninja'd, perfectly, by El Barto. What he said. :)
I know we have been over this before, but I don't see anything wrong with gushing over greatness in real time rather than waiting 15 years to how a career plays out and then thinking, "Damn, I wish I would have enjoyed that more in the moment." Now, the premature GOAT is talk was annoying of course, but there will always be those who love to bloviate when it comes to sports. I just pray I am not one of those people. :biggrin:
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I don't get why Patriots fans hate Mahomes. Oh, he is a threat to Brady's GOATness, right? And the way the media talks him up is his fault, right? :lol :lol :biggrin: :biggrin:
I don't hate him, first. It has nothing to do with him as a person. Maybe it's something I have to overcome from my childhood, but there are just too many people willing to bestow "greatness" at the drop of a hat. The only thing - the ONLY thing - I don't like about Mahomes is when he tries his fandango underhanded overhand sidearm bullshit and it doesn't work and he looks like a petulant kid. But that's a me problem, and I've never once ever voiced that here, until now.
My only beef is in general the bestowing of greatness before he's actually ACHIEVED that greatness. The "annointing" as Bill Parcells says. And since you brought up Brady, do you think there might be one or two people - not saying here, but maybe :) - that are OVER-celebrating Mahomes so we DON'T have to keep talking about Brady (he says impishly and with a big smile)? :) :) :)
ED: Ninja'd, perfectly, by El Barto. What he said. :)
I know we have been over this before, but I don't see anything wrong with gushing over greatness in real time rather than waiting 15 years to how a career plays out and then thinking, "Damn, I wish I would have enjoyed that more in the moment." Now, the premature GOAT is talk was annoying of course, but there will always be those who love to bloviate when it comes to sports. I just pray I am not one of those people. :biggrin:
I don't even mind a little gushing. Admire good play when you see it. But our society now is OBSESSED with absolutes; he can't be just "a good player", he's got to be "the GOAT". Patriots can't just lose a game, it's got to be "Belichick is an ass and he's done!". We do nothing in moderation in our country, and it's annoying is all. :) :) :) :) :)
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I don't get why Patriots fans hate Mahomes. Oh, he is a threat to Brady's GOATness, right? And the way the media talks him up is his fault, right? :lol :lol :biggrin: :biggrin:
I don't hate him, first. It has nothing to do with him as a person. Maybe it's something I have to overcome from my childhood, but there are just too many people willing to bestow "greatness" at the drop of a hat. The only thing - the ONLY thing - I don't like about Mahomes is when he tries his fandango underhanded overhand sidearm bullshit and it doesn't work and he looks like a petulant kid. But that's a me problem, and I've never once ever voiced that here, until now.
My only beef is in general the bestowing of greatness before he's actually ACHIEVED that greatness. The "annointing" as Bill Parcells says. And since you brought up Brady, do you think there might be one or two people - not saying here, but maybe :) - that are OVER-celebrating Mahomes so we DON'T have to keep talking about Brady (he says impishly and with a big smile)? :) :) :)
ED: Ninja'd, perfectly, by El Barto. What he said. :)
I know we have been over this before, but I don't see anything wrong with gushing over greatness in real time rather than waiting 15 years to how a career plays out and then thinking, "Damn, I wish I would have enjoyed that more in the moment." Now, the premature GOAT is talk was annoying of course, but there will always be those who love to bloviate when it comes to sports. I just pray I am not one of those people. :biggrin:
I don't even mind a little gushing. Admire good play when you see it. But our society now is OBSESSED with absolutes; he can't be just "a good player", he's got to be "the GOAT". Patriots can't just lose a game, it's got to be "Belichick is an ass and he's done!". We do nothing in moderation in our country, and it's annoying is all. :) :) :) :) :)
That’s fair. I think it’s fair to say “Patrick Mahomes and Josh Allen are the two best quarterbacks in the league today” but they haven’t played long enough to be in that all time great conversation yet.
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I would also add Justin Herbert to the conversation as one of the best in the league.
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I would also add Justin Herbert to the conversation as one of the best in the league.
Man, he is awfully good. He will be a fun one to watch over the next 5-10 years.
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I think Mahomes deserves all-time great status, even if he falls off a cliff. When someone is as indisputably "the man" as he was the year he went MVP and SBMVP, as well as a top player in the league 4 years in a row, that's enough for me. Greatness is not just a measure of longevity, but can also be something to a fixed time and place. I get the annoyance that we have with cannonizing new "best ever's", generally speaking. But to say that Mahomes isn't one of the greatest of all time is to say that Hendrix or Cobain aren't, and just get credited for it because they died. IMO, Mahomes has been "the Man" long enough. Whether he's an all-time great is not really a discussion anymore, we're just figuring out where he ranks in all-time greatness now, understanding that at least 2 all-time great QBs are active in the league currently, and may rank out way ahead of him when all's said and done (Brady and Rodgers).
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I would also add Justin Herbert to the conversation as one of the best in the league.
Man, he is awfully good. He will be a fun one to watch over the next 5-10 years.
Yeah, I can see him taking the Chargers to the SB within the next couple years. Wouldn't surprise me at all.
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Justin Herbert is getting the Mahomes treatment already even though he has yet to make the playoffs and still has a losing record as a starter. At least Mahomes has been the MVP, won a Super Bowl and mostly been a terrific playoff performer. I agree that Herbert looks fantastic, but can he maybe make a playoff game or *gasp" win one before we crown him?
Whew, sorry, that was my inner Stadler. :P :P
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Justin Herbert is getting the Mahomes treatment already even though he has yet to make the playoffs and still has a losing record as a starter. At least Mahomes has been the MVP, won a Super Bowl and mostly been a terrific playoff performer. I agree that Herbert looks fantastic, but can he maybe make a playoff game or *gasp" win one before we crown him?
Whew, sorry, that was my inner Stadler. :P :P
It’s fair though. I’m a fan of Herbert, but Philip Rivers was also a great QB who only took the Chargers past the second round of the playoffs once, and there’s been plenty of discussion about his legacy on here with most agreeing that he can’t be placed in the upper echelon of quarterbacks because of his inability to bring sustained success to the organization.
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There was a game Monday night?
I tuned in, and then instantly tuned out as soon as I saw the street crossing guard unis of the Seahawks.
I HATE THOSE FRICKIN' things! :censored
Can't we just go back to the old basics for all teams?
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I love the action green! They are my favorite uniforms of all time! I even bought a Seahawks action green shirt for game days!
Of course, I used to like the old Creamsicle uniforms that Tampa Bay used to have back in the day. So what do I know?
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I think Mahomes deserves all-time great status, even if he falls off a cliff. When someone is as indisputably "the man" as he was the year he went MVP and SBMVP, as well as a top player in the league 4 years in a row, that's enough for me. Greatness is not just a measure of longevity, but can also be something to a fixed time and place. I get the annoyance that we have with cannonizing new "best ever's", generally speaking. But to say that Mahomes isn't one of the greatest of all time is to say that Hendrix or Cobain aren't, and just get credited for it because they died. IMO, Mahomes has been "the Man" long enough. Whether he's an all-time great is not really a discussion anymore, we're just figuring out where he ranks in all-time greatness now, understanding that at least 2 all-time great QBs are active in the league currently, and may rank out way ahead of him when all's said and done (Brady and Rodgers).
I don't necessarily disagree with your opinion, but this is the Kurt Warner issue. He did it twice, and when the Hall Of Fame came calling, it was a rather vigorous debate, since he DIDN'T have the career numbers. It's fine to say that someone had the greatest SEASON of all time, but I think whatever body of work you have, it should be viewed in the totality. Hendrix and Cobain (and Rhoads) died; that's a big point. What they did was great, but they didn't have the chance to put out their own version of "Music... From The Elder" or "Black Clouds and Silver Linings". I don't really think it will happen, but if defenses catch up, and he has ten seasons of average, you can't compare him to Hendrix any longer. It's the average that is now the defining metric. At this point, Mahomes isn't even Dan Marino, who had some monster seasons, but ended up with a 17-year career of monster seasons (more or less).
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Justin Herbert is getting the Mahomes treatment already even though he has yet to make the playoffs and still has a losing record as a starter. At least Mahomes has been the MVP, won a Super Bowl and mostly been a terrific playoff performer. I agree that Herbert looks fantastic, but can he maybe make a playoff game or *gasp" win one before we crown him?
Whew, sorry, that was my inner Stadler. :P :P
It feels good, buddy, doesn't it? Let it out! :)
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Justin Herbert is getting the Mahomes treatment already even though he has yet to make the playoffs and still has a losing record as a starter. At least Mahomes has been the MVP, won a Super Bowl and mostly been a terrific playoff performer. I agree that Herbert looks fantastic, but can he maybe make a playoff game or *gasp" win one before we crown him?
Whew, sorry, that was my inner Stadler. :P :P
:lol
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Should be a great game tonight. Herbert is scary good. We all know Andy Reid hates to run the ball but the running game would be a good strategy to slow down that great pass rush of Bosa and Mack. We'll see what he does.
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Justin Herbert is getting the Mahomes treatment already even though he has yet to make the playoffs and still has a losing record as a starter. At least Mahomes has been the MVP, won a Super Bowl and mostly been a terrific playoff performer. I agree that Herbert looks fantastic, but can he maybe make a playoff game or *gasp" win one before we crown him?
Whew, sorry, that was my inner Stadler. :P :P
Nobody is crowning Herbert yet. We're just acknowledging his incredible athleticism and the potential for his success as a Charger. It was the same with Mahomes before he did everything we thought he could do.
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Justin Herbert is getting the Mahomes treatment already even though he has yet to make the playoffs and still has a losing record as a starter. At least Mahomes has been the MVP, won a Super Bowl and mostly been a terrific playoff performer. I agree that Herbert looks fantastic, but can he maybe make a playoff game or *gasp" win one before we crown him?
Whew, sorry, that was my inner Stadler. :P :P
Nobody is crowning Herbert yet. We're just acknowledging his incredible athleticism and the potential for his success as a Charger. It was the same with Mahomes before he did everything we thought he could do, once.
Corrected for accuracy. ;) :) :) :)
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Championships are a TEAM accomplishment, they are far from the only way to measure how good someone is in ANY team sport - and you know this. How would Brady do one-on-one vs Herbert, Allen, or Mahomes?
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Brady is a leader. How many examples do you need to hear veterans talk about his example? I'll help you.
https://www.foxnews.com/sports/james-harrison-wanted-hate-tom-brady-when-joined-patriots
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Watching a game on my fucking computer sucks.
Wait...Asante Samuels is still playing??
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Watching a game on my fucking computer sucks.
Wait...Asante Samuels is still playing??
If you weren't a curmudgeon, you'd watch it on TV you old fuck.
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Watching a game on my fucking computer sucks.
Wait...Asante Samuels is still playing??
Get one of these (https://www.amazon.com/fire-tv-stick-with-3rd-gen-alexa-voice-remote/dp/B08C1W5N87/ref=sr_1_2?keywords=fire+stick&qid=1663290174&sprefix=fire%2Caps%2C101&sr=8-2) Fire TV Stick and plug into your TV, sign into your amazon account and boom NFL on TV.
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I'm not paying $25 for that. I need that to watch on TV?
If you weren't a curmudgeon, you'd watch it on TV you old fuck.
How are you doing it?
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I bought Amazon Prime. I have Xfinity. You can add your account info on Comcast app and watch it on your TV.
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Is it just me, or does it feel really strange to listen to KH call an NFL game?
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That TD catch by Mike Williams was ridiculous. Intense concentrations in those eyes.
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Justin Herbert is getting the Mahomes treatment already even though he has yet to make the playoffs and still has a losing record as a starter. At least Mahomes has been the MVP, won a Super Bowl and mostly been a terrific playoff performer. I agree that Herbert looks fantastic, but can he maybe make a playoff game or *gasp" win one before we crown him?
Whew, sorry, that was my inner Stadler. :P :P
It feels good, buddy, doesn't it? Let it out! :)
:lol :lol
Championships are a TEAM accomplishment, they are far from the only way to measure how good someone is in ANY team sport - and you know this. How would Brady do one-on-one vs Herbert, Allen, or Mahomes?
Wait, you are asking how one QB would do vs another QB? That is like asking how would one goalie in hockey does vs another goalie. Not sure even sure what point you are trying to make. Yes, championships are a TEAM accomplishment, but you really went off the rails with that last comment.
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Do announcers even go to the games anymore? I kind of assumed that Troy was a lazy fuck, and he jumped ship specifically so he could call the games from his basement, but it looks like Al Michaels did the same thing, too. That I did not see coming. Not sure what it is, but there's something wrong with watching a game and hearing the commentary from people watching it the same way you are. The experience is lacking. They should be there taking in the big picture.
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Do announcers even go to the games anymore? I kind of assumed that Troy was a lazy fuck, and he jumped ship specifically so he could call the games from his basement, but it looks like Al Michaels did the same thing, too. That I did not see coming. Not sure what it is, but there's something wrong with watching a game and hearing the commentary from people watching it the same way you are. The experience is lacking. They should be there taking in the big picture.
I didn't realize that they weren't going to the games now, but while it was hard to hear all of the commentary for last night's game, as I was at a BWW with my cousin for most of it, the lack of excitement in Michaels' call of the tackle on Kelce was glaring. That was one of those WOW defensive plays, but you'd never have known it if you were just listening to the game.
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Championships are a TEAM accomplishment, they are far from the only way to measure how good someone is in ANY team sport - and you know this. How would Brady do one-on-one vs Herbert, Allen, or Mahomes?
He'd beat every one of them. Maybe not now at 45, but he'd beat every one of them in his prime.
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Is it just me, or does it feel really strange to listen to KH call an NFL game?
It's a bummer to me; I was a big fan of Collinsworth and Michaels. They were a good team. I like Herbstreit, but it's not the same.
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Championships are a TEAM accomplishment, they are far from the only way to measure how good someone is in ANY team sport - and you know this. How would Brady do one-on-one vs Herbert, Allen, or Mahomes?
Wait, you are asking how one QB would do vs another QB? That is like asking how would one goalie in hockey does vs another goalie. Not sure even sure what point you are trying to make. Yes, championships are a TEAM accomplishment, but you really went off the rails with that last comment.
It's any argument possible to denigrate what Brady has accomplished and build up what Mahomes has accomplished. Just let it happen; Mahomes might get there; they won last night against a good team while not playing great. That's a good sign for KC, especially in the division. But why this incessant need to rush things? Let it play out. Mahomes is either going to be the greatest of all time or he's not. Right now he's not. It's not a bad thing, I'm not tearing him down, it's just the way it is on the continuum of time. When the career is done - or at least winding down - we'll know. It'll be like Brady, there won't be any question.
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The people pimping Mahomes as the future GOAT, or even asking if he could be that one day, are only setting him up for failure as that puts him in that "GOAT or bust" box, so to speak.
I will say this, though: the longer Andy Reid is his coach, the better. I see a lot of Favre in Mahomes (the player, not the POS Favre is off the field), and with the sorry state of coaching in today's NFL, Mahomes' gun-slinging could easily result in a lot of INTs in the future if he gets a coach who isn't as good as Reid, just like Favre threw a lot more of them once Holmgren left GB.
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Do announcers even go to the games anymore? I kind of assumed that Troy was a lazy fuck, and he jumped ship specifically so he could call the games from his basement, but it looks like Al Michaels did the same thing, too. That I did not see coming. Not sure what it is, but there's something wrong with watching a game and hearing the commentary from people watching it the same way you are. The experience is lacking. They should be there taking in the big picture.
I didn't realize that they weren't going to the games now, but while it was hard to hear all of the commentary for last night's game, as I was at a BWW with my cousin for most of it, the lack of excitement in Michaels' call of the tackle on Kelce was glaring. That was one of those WOW defensive plays, but you'd never have known it if you were just listening to the game.
I'm not certain, but whenever Al and that other guy were shown they were in front of the same studio background that Troy and Buck have. I'm assuming they're in a similar, if not the same studio.
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Is it just me, or does it feel really strange to listen to KH call an NFL game?
It's a bummer to me; I was a big fan of Collinsworth and Michaels. They were a good team. I like Herbstreit, but it's not the same.
I thought Herbstreit was knowledgeable and very well spoken, but you're right. He's no Collinsworth.
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What happened with Collinsworth? Al and Collinsworth were my favorite to listen to.
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What happened with Collinsworth? Al and Collinsworth were my favorite to listen to.
Collinsworth is still on SNF, but with Tirico calling the plays.
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You want coaching stupidity?
How about not playing your starters AT ALL during the preseason especially if you have new personnel at key positions! :tdwn
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How about not having an Offensive Coordinator?
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How about not having an Offensive Coordinator?
While implementing a new system on offense, with no experience with the style and not from the offensive side of the ball for a decade plus?
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I'll try to do this a better way. See, the problem is that in these arguments people always move the goal posts. The question at hand wasn't "which team won the most championships" it was "is Justin Herbert as good as Patrick Mahomes?". The answer is, while Herbert is great and may yet end up being better he isn't right now. Even leaving out the fact that Mahomes has the highest WINNING percentage of all time, both regular season or adding in post-season; even leaving that out Mahomes has statistically been better than Herbert. A better career passer rating and TD-Int ratio. He's been more clutch in big games. He has the best regular season and 2nd best post season passer rating of all time. Herbert hasn't made the playoffs yet. This is comparing them head-to-head without contaminating the argument with team accomplishments.
Mahomes as a rookie had one of the greatest seasons of all time, winning MVP. Herbert has never one won. Herbert, with Keenan Allen and Mike Williams and Austin Ekeler can't claim the "no weapons" argument. Neither he nor Mahomes has ever benefitted from a great defense or great running game. So that's the answer to that question, no he's not as good yet.
Now if we gave just one of those guys years and years of clean pockets, always solid running games, great defenses and the greatest coach of all time which resulted in great team success and then asked "who was better" that's moving the goal posts.
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How about not having an Offensive Coordinator?
While implementing a new system on offense, with no experience with the style and not from the offensive side of the ball for a decade plus?
Y'all need to stop listening to so much sports radio. That shit make you ignernt.
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How about not having an Offensive Coordinator?
While implementing a new system on offense, with no experience with the style and not from the offensive side of the ball for a decade plus?
Y'all need to stop listening to so much sports radio. That shit make you ignernt.
Just have to listen to Mac. He's been telling us all off season.
And it's not sports RADIO. It's the simulcast on TV! ;D
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I'll try to do this a better way. See, the problem is that in these arguments people always move the goal posts. The question at hand wasn't "which team won the most championships" it was "is Justin Herbert as good as Patrick Mahomes?". The answer is, while Herbert is great and may yet end up being better he isn't right now. Even leaving out the fact that Mahomes has the highest WINNING percentage of all time, both regular season or adding in post-season; even leaving that out Mahomes has statistically been better than Herbert. A better career passer rating and TD-Int ratio. He's been more clutch in big games. He has the best regular season and 2nd best post season passer rating of all time. Herbert hasn't made the playoffs yet. This is comparing them head-to-head without contaminating the argument with team accomplishments.
Mahomes as a rookie had one of the greatest seasons of all time, winning MVP. Herbert has never one won. Herbert, with Keenan Allen and Mike Williams and Austin Ekeler can't claim the "no weapons" argument. Neither he nor Mahomes has ever benefitted from a great defense or great running game. So that's the answer to that question, no he's not as good yet.
Now if we gave just one of those guys years and years of clean pockets, always solid running games, great defenses and the greatest coach of all time which resulted in great team success and then asked "who was better" that's moving the goal posts.
Mahomes is great. I think we all realize that.
The problem is the people trying to talk him up as the GOAT already. There is zero point in comparing him to Tom Brady at this point. Zero.
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The problem is the people trying to talk him up as the GOAT already. There is zero point in comparing him to Tom Brady at this point. Zero.
Damn straight! ;D
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Is it just me, or does it feel really strange to listen to KH call an NFL game?
It's a bummer to me; I was a big fan of Collinsworth and Michaels. They were a good team. I like Herbstreit, but it's not the same.
I thought Herbstreit was knowledgeable and very well spoken, but you're right. He's no Collinsworth.
I'm a Ohio native somewhat close in age to KH (basically a 4 year age difference give or take), and I didn't mean to imply that he did a bad job. It just felt out of place. I've watched him as a college player and all through his career. I guess that I've just grown accustomed to him in a specific setting for all of these years.
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I'll try to do this a better way. See, the problem is that in these arguments people always move the goal posts. The question at hand wasn't "which team won the most championships" it was "is Justin Herbert as good as Patrick Mahomes?". The answer is, while Herbert is great and may yet end up being better he isn't right now. Even leaving out the fact that Mahomes has the highest WINNING percentage of all time, both regular season or adding in post-season; even leaving that out Mahomes has statistically been better than Herbert. A better career passer rating and TD-Int ratio. He's been more clutch in big games. He has the best regular season and 2nd best post season passer rating of all time. Herbert hasn't made the playoffs yet. This is comparing them head-to-head without contaminating the argument with team accomplishments.
Mahomes as a rookie had one of the greatest seasons of all time, winning MVP. Herbert has never one won. Herbert, with Keenan Allen and Mike Williams and Austin Ekeler can't claim the "no weapons" argument. Neither he nor Mahomes has ever benefitted from a great defense or great running game. So that's the answer to that question, no he's not as good yet.
Now if we gave just one of those guys years and years of clean pockets, always solid running games, great defenses and the greatest coach of all time which resulted in great team success and then asked "who was better" that's moving the goal posts.
Says the man moving the goal posts. :) :) :) :) :) :)
I was responding to the post asking how Brady would do against all the so-called future GOATS. As for Mahomes v. Herbert, you're 100% correct.
Not for nothing, though, Michaels and Herbstreit DID say that the "Mahomes v. Herbert" matchup will be the premier QB rivalry for the next decade. Write it down, it's official (whether it actually happens or not). Fucking Michaels knows better too; he must be getting old.
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Maybe the hyperbole gene is air born now, and Michaels caught it after years of working with Collinsworth.
Mahomes vs Herbert should be a great matchup for years, especially since they are in the same division, meaning they play will play twice a year (and maybe even three times if they get matched up in the playoffs). Mahomes vs Josh Allen, which has happened three times already since the start of 2021, seems like the more likely stud QB matchup of the immediate future, but there can certainly be more than one. The media just loves the hype and to hear themselves talk.
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Am I the only one that hated listening to Collinsworth? He was so cringeworthy most of the time.
But that guy could break down a play literally as soon as there was a tackle. His insightfulness was off the charts.
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Insightful, yes, but he is a bit too forceful with a narrative at times (see: not shutting up about Seattle throwing at the 1).
I do think his call of the Odell Beckham catch was perfect, though. The way he talks about it and then laughs and utters, "That's ridiculous." Even Michaels, who is usually not prone to hyperbole like that, finally chuckled a little and agreed with him and let out a soft, "That is ridiculous."
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I just thought it was amazing how in an instant he'd have the play broken down, who did what right or wrong.
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Insightful, yes, but he is a bit too forceful with a narrative at times (see: not shutting up about Seattle throwing at the 1).
Pete Carroll would probably agree.
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I really don't want to litigate it again :lol, but throwing in that situation was fine. Wilson just shouldn't have thrown it out in front of the WR like that. That works if you want to have your WR catch it in stride and run after the catch, but when you need 1 yard and the space is that tight, you throw it low and inside so the WR either catches it or no one does.
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So the Browns are just gonna feed the ball to Chubb and the Jets are gonna let him run all over them? Cool. >:(
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HOLY SHIT THEY FUCKING WON!!!
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What a comeback by the Dolphins.
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What a comeback by the Dolphins.
Oh yeah them, too.
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Chubb goes down at the 1, the game is over and the Browns win (Jets were out of timeouts with under two left).
Instead, he scores, they miss the XP so the lead stays at 13 and the Jets then score twice in the last two minutes to win. That is nuts.
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Trey Lance carted off field in an air cast.
Man, keeping Garapalo looks really good right now.
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Chubb goes down at the 1, the game is over and the Browns win (Jets were out of timeouts with under two left).
Instead, he scores, they miss the XP so the lead stays at 13 and the Jets then score twice in the last two minutes to win. That is nuts.
I’m sure his fantasy owners are happy though. :yeahright
Seriously, he’s a great running back, but make the smart play, even if it isn’t the flashy one. As soon as he got in the endzone, my first thought was “we have a chance”.
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The Saints gave him FIVE turnovers?!?! :lol
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What a comeback by the Dolphins.
Just as I predicted. :hat
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Trey Lance carted off field in an air cast.
Man, keeping Garapalo looks really good right now.
Indeed.
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The Raiders are exhibiting a truly astounding level of stupid to finish out this game against the Cards.
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The Raiders are exhibiting a truly astounding level of stupid to finish out this game against the Cards.
Commitment to ExcrementTM
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The Raiders are exhibiting a truly astounding level of stupid to finish out this game against the Cards.
Commitment to ExcrementTM
A buddy of mine is a hardcore Denver fan, and that's what he used to call his fantasy teams. :lol
Nothing more entertaining than watching the Raider Nation meltdown on Facebook as their team collapses
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Watching the Cards/Raiders game and wondering about the following hypothetical situation:
Let's say the team that wins the coin toss and receives the opening kickoff in OT keeps the ball for the entirety of OT* and either scores a touchdown or kicks a field goal as time expires. Keep in mind that the OT period is now 10 minutes, not 15 as it always used to be. Given the new rule that each team must possess the ball in OT, does the receiving team win, or does the score not count and the game end in a tie?
* - Yes, it's possible. There have been numerous times in NFL history where one team has possessed the ball for more than 10 minutes.
Nothing more entertaining than watching the Raider Nation meltdown on Facebook as their team collapses
(https://c.tenor.com/YX2wDo9H6J0AAAAC/phil-hartman-ed-mc-mahon-snl.gif)
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Love seeing the Raiders gag it away like that. :metal :metal
Despite my abandonment of the Broncos as a fan, my dislike for the Raiders remains strong. :hat :hat
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HOLY SHIT THEY FUCKING WON!!!
Joe Flacco is the GOAT. ;)
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What a comeback by the Dolphins.
Just as I predicted. :hat
You made two REALLY good calls this weekend that I never saw coming. I had a couple of picks I kind of wish I had more balls to make - the Colts game was one - but I can't say I ever would have picked either New England in Pittsburgh, or Miami against Baltimore.
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Love seeing the Raiders gag it away like that. :metal :metal
Despite my abandonment of the Broncos as a fan, my dislike for the Raiders remains strong. :hat :hat
It's an odd feeling watching McDaniels on the sideline. All the genius in the world, and football comes down to basic blocking and tackling. Renfrow puts the ball on the ground TWICE in the OT (I think he fumbled the earlier fumble that the Raiders recovered). All the X's and O's in the world don't matter if you turn the ball over, or if you don't make the plays.
It galls me to see Kyler Murray pout his way to a victory though. Week Two; let's see where the Cardinals are on Week 17.
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The Saints gave him FIVE turnovers?!?! :lol
Still have to make the plays; that throw to Perriman was text book. There are 30 year olds that couldn't make that throw.
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Lions win. Amazing.
I know Brady doesn't like to lose but his temper was quite a sight to see. Maybe something heavy duty going on at home, hence the time off.
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Lions win. Amazing.
I know Brady doesn't like to lose but his temper was quite a sight to see. Maybe something heavy duty going on at home, hence the time off.
Temper is a fine line in a sport; you can't lose your cool to the point it hurts your team, you can't get angry to the point you're pouting on the sideline, but a little fire is always a welcome sight for me in the teams I watch. The Steelers do that so well, usually.
And at the end of the day, as I understand it, Brady's temper led to Lattimore not being on the field any more. Just another reason he's the GOAT (I'm being precocious, here). Sure, the Bucs lost Evans, too, but they have more weapons than just Evans. I think Lattimore is their best DB.
EDIT: I found this article on the incident. (https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/nfl/bradys-temper-flares-as-bucs-snap-skid-vs-saints-20-10/2022/09/18/b0064376-3791-11ed-b8af-0a04e5dc3db6_story.html) HAHA, even I find this language funny: "Brady’s frustration was clear when he was caught on camera forcefully throwing a tablet to the turf with a healthy turn of his torso and full follow-through of his prolific right arm.". Haha, that's some flowery language; do I sense a man-crush happening here? :)
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HOLY SHIT THEY FUCKING WON!!!
Joe Flacco is the GOAT. ;)
LOL...I didn't realize he was still in the league!
Go Broncos! On a pace to score 17 touchdowns this season! Woo hoo!
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Don't give a damn about the Niners, and I don't know if Lance was every going to be any good, but it's a shame he's done. There's a lot of potential there that might never develop. The odds of him living up to expectation just took a big hit.
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Just catching up on the highlights from this weekend and no surprised Charlotte loses again, I bet they get at least 10 losses under their belt this year.
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Brady's temper is a little concerning to me.
The time off for something personal, the off-the-field erratic behavior, screaming at players and throwing tablets. Even how completely blitzed Brady got at the SB boat parade had me thinking twice.
I get that the NFL is a violent, intense, emotional sport. At the same time, the behavior DOES seem to be an outlier, and Brady sells an image of himself that he's this enlightened health nut who has overcome nature with his holistic health program. It just makes me wonder if I'm missing something, and if this might not be an example of a human being who seems perfect on the outside while a lot of red flags are being dismissed behind the scenes.
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Brady's temper is a little concerning to me.
The time off for something personal, the off-the-field erratic behavior, screaming at players and throwing tablets. Even how completely blitzed Brady got at the SB boat parade had me thinking twice.
I get that the NFL is a violent, intense, emotional sport. At the same time, the behavior DOES seem to be an outlier, and Brady sells an image of himself that he's this enlightened health nut who has overcome nature with his holistic health program. It just makes me wonder if I'm missing something, and if this might not be an example of a human being who seems perfect on the outside while a lot of red flags are being dismissed behind the scenes.
Brady is still a human being with emotions that all human beings experience. And these can seep into the work place.
And that's my issue with idolizing anyone to the point where people seem to forget they're still humans, and not gods just because they're considered the GOAT. The idea of presenting an image for the public does not help ones mentality either, also the media bombarding one with headlines and stories about your personal life doesn't do much to help.
Apparently, his wife didn't want him to play anymore and now those issues are starting to be revealing as he begins to react this way during his job. These are things that can unfortunately lead to a fall from grace.
But that's his decision and he must now face the consequences of the path he has chosen.
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Brady's temper is a little concerning to me.
The time off for something personal, the off-the-field erratic behavior, screaming at players and throwing tablets. Even how completely blitzed Brady got at the SB boat parade had me thinking twice.
I get that the NFL is a violent, intense, emotional sport. At the same time, the behavior DOES seem to be an outlier, and Brady sells an image of himself that he's this enlightened health nut who has overcome nature with his holistic health program. It just makes me wonder if I'm missing something, and if this might not be an example of a human being who seems perfect on the outside while a lot of red flags are being dismissed behind the scenes.
You've never see him lose it on N.E. sidelines before? 1st that comes to mind was a shouting match with Josh McDaniels.
Edit: I just remembered his fight with Bill O'Brien as well.
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I would expect that tempers are going to continue to flare. Brady isn't doing this just to while away his fall/winter. Knowing him he came back specifically to achieve a milestone (well, two: oldest ever to start a game, and to win another Super Bowl). The more things stand in the way of that second goal, the more you might see those tempers flare, since I can imagine that might have been part of the "negotiation" with Giselle.
Pure speculation, though.
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Love seeing the Raiders gag it away like that. :metal :metal
Despite my abandonment of the Broncos as a fan, my dislike for the Raiders remains strong. :hat :hat
It's an odd feeling watching McDaniels on the sideline. All the genius in the world, and football comes down to basic blocking and tackling. Renfrow puts the ball on the ground TWICE in the OT (I think he fumbled the earlier fumble that the Raiders recovered). All the X's and O's in the world don't matter if you turn the ball over, or if you don't make the plays.
It galls me to see Kyler Murray pout his way to a victory though. Week Two; let's see where the Cardinals are on Week 17.
Eh, McDaniels and the word genius should never be used in the same sentence. He has done nada without TB12 to show he is anything close to a genius. Just like he failed in Denver quickly, I suspect the Raiders will learn fast that he is just another OC when he doesn't have Brady.
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This Bills team is crazy good so far, I know it's just two games but if they maintain this momentum they will go deep.
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Don't give a damn about the Niners, and I don't know if Lance was every going to be any good, but it's a shame he's done. There's a lot of potential there that might never develop. The odds of him living up to expectation just took a big hit.
Mixed feelings. With Jimmy, they are a better team this year than without him. They are a shoe-in for the playoffs this year now, whereas with Lance, hard to say how far he could have taken them this year. But as you pointed out, this year was going to be crucial for Lance's long term development, so this is a problem for him and potentially the team for the long haul.
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Vikings with their typical post Super Bowl (beating the Packers) hangover.
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Because it's fun to overreact (!!), here is my confidence level after two weeks of the 14 teams I picked to make the playoffs.
Buffalo - Very Confident (they appear to be the juggernaut we all expected them to be)
Baltimore - Confident (despite that collapse on Sunday, I still think they win their division)
Pittsburgh - Not Confident (the injury to TJ Watt + the lackluster QB play does not = a playoff berth)
Indianapolis - Shaky Confidence (they have looked awful, but their division is so bad that they could easily turn it around)
Denver - Not Confident (new head coach is a clueless dope, and that division is too tough)
LA Chargers - Somewhat Confident (not confident about the coach, and Herbert's ribs are a concern, but I think their overall talent will get them there)
Kansas City - Very Confident (I already feel silly for having doubted them at all)
Philadelphia - Confident (it's early, but Hurts looks great so far, and their D looks improved as well)
Green Bay - Confident (another ugly week 1, but their D is good, and Rodgers will figure it out enough with those receivers enough to get them to the playoffs)
Minnesota - Confident (ugly loss last night, but Cousins inexplicably never plays well in prime time, and a favorable schedule will get them there)
Tampa Bay - Very Confident (top 3 defense, and despite their issues and Brady's age, I don't see defenses continuing to hold the offense to 16 points a game)
New Orleans - Not Confident (could still eke in given how weak the NFC looks, but Winston is still the turnover machine he always was)
Arizona - Not Confident (despite the awesome comeback, they look like a team that has regressed)
LA Rams - Confident (despite some issues, they have enough talent to still win 10+)
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Vikings with their typical post Super Bowl (beating the Packers) hangover.
I didn't watch every snap - we had the Bills on; man are they good - but what I did see, they made the Eagles look like a good team. ;)
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The Bills are fantastic, and are making my FF teams very good.
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I think Josh Allen might be the GOAT. He's so good. He had two throws to Diggs that were worthy of their own highlight reel. And while Tannehill isn't great, he's not nearly as bad as the Bills' D made him look last night.
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His 3rd year everything clicked upstairs for him. He had ungodly talent all ready but now he sees the field in slow motion.
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I think Josh Allen might be the GOAT. He's so good. He had two throws to Diggs that were worthy of their own highlight reel. And while Tannehill isn't great, he's not nearly as bad as the Bills' D made him look last night.
Whoa, whoa, whoa. If we're not supposed to rush to judgement on Mahomes, we shouldn't rush to judgement on Allen, either. ;). Allen hasn't won anything yet.
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I think Josh Allen might be the GOAT. He's so good. He had two throws to Diggs that were worthy of their own highlight reel. And while Tannehill isn't great, he's not nearly as bad as the Bills' D made him look last night.
Whoa, whoa, whoa. If we're not supposed to rush to judgement on Mahomes, we shouldn't rush to judgement on Allen, either. ;). Allen hasn't won anything yet.
:tup :tup :tup
I thought "green" would make it too obvious. Rest easy, I think Josh is good, but he's a LOOOOOOOONNNNNNNGGGGGG way from the GOAT. And he, maybe moreso than Mahomes - for reasons that El Barto has put forth previously about his almost maniacal need to sacrifice his body - should have to prove he can do it for the long haul.
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THE JETS ARE GOING TO THE SUPER BOWL!
FLACOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
Okay, I'm done. I got my one win this year. I'm good. :lol
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:lol
I was kinda scratching my head at predictions before the season began about the '9ers being a 13 win (or so) team this year and taking the division. With a QB playing his first full season since college, that seemed laughable to me, no matter how much talent they have around him. But with Garroppolo in, I can see them clearing that bar easily this year.
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:lol
I was kinda scratching my head at predictions before the season began about the '9ers being a 13 win (or so) team this year and taking the division. With a QB playing his first full season since college, that seemed laughable to me, no matter how much talent they have around him. But with Garroppolo in, I can see them clearing that bar easily this year.
It think with Jimmy G, the NFC West is the 49ers division to lose.
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That's if he stays healthy. That a major part to why the 49ers moves up to get a QB.
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Not if the Hawks and Cards continue to suck. The 9'rs are obviously better with JG than without.
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The 9'rs are obviously better with JG than without.
Agreed. But still have mixed feelings. The hope and overall feeling is that right now, Jimmy is the better QB, but that Lance has a higher ceiling once he develops, and this season was going to be his time to develop. So Jimmy as QB right now is awesome on the short-term gain side of the coin, but will most likely be detrimental to the long-term plan. How much remains to be seen.
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The 9'rs are obviously better with JG than without.
Agreed. But still have mixed feelings. The hope and overall feeling is that right now, Jimmy is the better QB, but that Lance has a higher ceiling once he develops, and this season was going to be his time to develop. So Jimmy as QB right now is awesome on the short-term gain side of the coin, but will most likely be detrimental to the long-term plan. How much remains to be seen.
Funny how that ended up working out. Dak goes out last week and there was speculation about possibly acquiring JG in Dallas. I'm like, "not gonna happen" and then Lance goes down for the season in week 2. The NFC is a lot more concerned about the 9r's now then they were a week ago for sure.
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Speak for Yourself on FS1 has been rebranded to being Speak, and now has Emmanuel Acho, Joy Taylor, LeSean McCoy and some Dallas writer I've never heard of until now.
McCoy is surprisingly good as an analyst. They talked today about Steve Young saying Dak Prescott could learn a few things about fundamentals by watching Cooper Rush, and naturally the two non-athletes were all bent out of shape. The former players, McCoy and Acho, totally understood what Young meant and explained well why it was fine, while Joy was all in her feelings because she's a Dak fanboy and the Dallas writer totally misconstrued what Young said. Right, because two talking heads who never played a lick of football in their lives know more about football than one of the greatest QBs ever (Young). :lol :lol
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Speak for Yourself on FS1 has been rebranded to being Speak, and now has Emmanuel Acho, Joy Taylor, LeSean McCoy and some Dallas writer I've never heard of until now.
McCoy is surprisingly good as an analyst. They talked today about Steve Young saying Dak Prescott could learn a few things about fundamentals by watching Cooper Rush, and naturally the two non-athletes were all bent out of shape. The former players, McCoy and Acho, totally understood what Young meant and explained well why it was fine, while Joy was all in her feelings because she's a Dak fanboy and the Dallas writer totally misconstrued what Young said. Right, because two talking heads who never played a lick of football in their lives know more about football than one of the greatest QBs ever (Young). :lol :lol
Nothing about this surprises me at all.
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Speak for Yourself on FS1 has been rebranded to being Speak, and now has Emmanuel Acho, Joy Taylor, LeSean McCoy and some Dallas writer I've never heard of until now.
McCoy is surprisingly good as an analyst. They talked today about Steve Young saying Dak Prescott could learn a few things about fundamentals by watching Cooper Rush, and naturally the two non-athletes were all bent out of shape. The former players, McCoy and Acho, totally understood what Young meant and explained well why it was fine, while Joy was all in her feelings because she's a Dak fanboy and the Dallas writer totally misconstrued what Young said. Right, because two talking heads who never played a lick of football in their lives know more about football than one of the greatest QBs ever (Young). :lol :lol
I'm a HUGE fan of Steve Young; he is very smart, his observational skills are second to none, and is not afraid to speak his mind. He was, if memory serves, the guy to call out Cam Newton early on about not being aware enough of what he has to do to become, and maintain being, a champion. And Cam never figured it out on his own (even with the help of the greatest coach in football history, though by then it was probably too little too late).
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Christian McCaffrey is hurt again with an ankle injury. He must have the best pay to games played ratio in the league right now. What a joke.
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I FIGURED IT OUT!!!!!!!!!
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I have an NFL pet peeve.
Why do we get the shot of the owner during the game? Like I give a fuck who the owner is or what he's doing.
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Yea I don't really care either. You're the owner, you should be at least a few games.
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Christian McCaffrey is hurt again with an ankle injury. He must have the best pay to games played ratio in the league right now. What a joke.
To be fair, he is going to play Sunday.
He gets put on the injury report if he has to blow his nose.
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Serious question: How did Sean Payton get this rep as being this supposed super awesome head coach? It seems clear that he will return to coaching next season and will be cherry picking a great landing spot, and I get the impression that teams will be tripping over themselves to hire him. I don't get it. I mean, he had Drew Brees for 15 years and got to 1 whopping Super Bowl. What an amazing accomplishment, right?
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Serious question: How did Sean Payton get this rep as being this supposed super awesome head coach? It seems clear that he will return to coaching next season and will be cherry picking a great landing spot, and I get the impression that teams will be tripping over themselves to hire him. I don't get it. I mean, he had Drew Brees for 15 years and got to 1 whopping Super Bowl. What an amazing accomplishment, right?
Kev, I've been preaching this for YEARS. Up until the last couple of years with Brees, which were excellent, the two together only averaged a 9-7 season record with ONE SB appearance. I think off the top of my head, they were 1-3 in NFC CGs.
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Serious question: How did Sean Payton get this rep as being this supposed super awesome head coach? It seems clear that he will return to coaching next season and will be cherry picking a great landing spot, and I get the impression that teams will be tripping over themselves to hire him. I don't get it. I mean, he had Drew Brees for 15 years and got to 1 whopping Super Bowl. What an amazing accomplishment, right?
Kev, I've been preaching this for YEARS. Up until the last couple of years with Brees, which were excellent, the two together only averaged a 9-7 season record with ONE SB appearance. I think off the top of my head, they were 1-3 in NFC CGs.
I still put the full blame on him for the NFCCG loss to the Rams a few years ago. Yes, it was a bad missed call on the PI, but Payton completed melted down after that and his team followed his lead.
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Serious question: How did Sean Payton get this rep as being this supposed super awesome head coach? It seems clear that he will return to coaching next season and will be cherry picking a great landing spot, and I get the impression that teams will be tripping over themselves to hire him. I don't get it. I mean, he had Drew Brees for 15 years and got to 1 whopping Super Bowl. What an amazing accomplishment, right?
It’s because of the team he coached and their history prior to his arrival. The Saints were one of the doormats of the league for their entire existence, and after Hurricane Katrina, there was talk about them potentially having to permanently relocate from New Orleans. Sean Payton arrives, and in his first season as head coach, the Saints make it to the NFC Championship for the first time. Three years later, they’re hoisting a Lombardi. While they never got back there, they’ve been a perennial contender, making the playoffs more during Payton’s tenure than they did in their entire history before him. If he had coached, say, the 49ers, a team that had already won five Super Bowls and been a major contender from the 80’s through the 90’s, the discussion around him would be much different.
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Pats/Ravens game is very entertaining today.
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Pats/Ravens game is very entertaining today.
That interception was just butt ugly. :lol Mac was clearly looking for a Davante Parker jump ball, but he needed to throw that ball into the 12th row of the stands. NE's front 7 has looked very good. Against a normal quarterback they'd have 8 sacks today.
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Definitely El Barto. No Mac is hurt. Doesn't look good.
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It'd be a damn shame if McCorkle is out longterm. Partly because I'm a Patritos fan, and partly for the same reason as Trey Lance. A major blow during a period of huge growth potential is a terrible thing. I really hate seeing great potential stifled needlessly.
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Someone has to finish last in the AFC West. Notice that I had the AFC West teams as the 4, 5 and 6 seeds, as I think it will be similar to last year's NFC West where every team is good enough to where it will be hard for any to win enough games to secure one of the top seeds. Plus, the Raiders won a ton of super close games last year (6-1 in games decided by 3 points or less or in OT), and that often does not play out the same way two years in a row, so all it takes is losing a few of those close games they won last year and they are back down to 8 wins.
All indications are that Mac Jones has had a brutal summer, and he wasn't exactly a world beater last year. Feels like the Patriots have 9-8 or 8-9 written all over them (5-12 if a normal team, but BB will get them 3-4 extra wins).
The Bucs have a pretty easy schedule, so predicting them as a top seed was pretty easy for me.
Quoting myself to say I feel smart so far this year. :biggrin: :biggrin:
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So very nice to see both the Chiefs and Bills exposed as nothing special. Pretty wild series of events the last couple of minutes of that Miami/Buffalo game.
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Do we now think Mahomes misses Tyreek Hill a little? The offense scored 20 vs the Chargers last week and 17 against the Colts today.
Also, the Bills have the same problem they did last year. They can blow out teams just like that, but in a close game, they find ways to lose.
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Makes the NFL fun doesn't it?
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Xrays on Mac Jones's ankle were negative, which might actually be a bad thing. Recovering from a broken ankle is a lot faster than a high ankle sprain, which is a distinct possibility here. Hopefully it's a minor sprain, but that kid was in a ton of pain leaving the field. Definitely not something he's gonna walk off in a couple of days.
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Yup. So right El Barto. I have so many pals on Facebook asking to start Zappe. Yeah, let's start this kid with an offensive coaching staff who are newbs.
Are they that stupid?
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What an incredible game in Miami. I can't stand the Dolphins but it must feel special to be a fan right now.
Consolation prize for the Jets poor performance against the Bengals is now there will be no controversy when it comes to starting Zach Wilson next week.
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The AFC West, which everyone thought would be the best division by far this season, has a collective record of 4-7 thus far.
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I could wind up eating these words as they mesh down the line, but man am I tired of seeing the Broncos in primetime slots. They are apparently going to be getting a Thursday night game in week five and then a Monday night game in week 6 before getting another Sunday night game toward the end of the season. I guess it looked better before the season started but now we're going to have to spend a third of the weeks of this season watching a lousy team. In primetime slots.
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Yeah, what we need are more prime time games featuring Mitch Trubisky and Jacoby Brissett as the starting QBs. :lol :lol
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Pretty sure even with Jacoby Brissett at QB the Browns aren't going three and out as often as the Broncos
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If we knew a QB was going to run backwards in a safety today, deep down didn't we all know it would be Jimmy G? That play summed him up in a nutshell. :lol :lol
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Hope tonight's game is a lot better than last night's punt-fest. At least there's a Manningcast, so that should keep things interesting.
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If JG doesn't step out of the back of the endzone, they win the game. :lol My image of you is totally blown dude.
:clap:
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The best part was that he threw a pick-6 on the same play (that didn't count), so stepping out of bounds for the safety was the better result for them at the time. Funny how that happens. :P
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Yeah, I remember Tirico commented on that. He said something like, this is probably the only time when a safety is a good thing. :lol
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Hope tonight's game is a lot better than last night's punt-fest. At least there's a Manningcast, so that should keep things interesting.
Has the Manningcast gotten better than when they first started it? I checked out one of the first few, and it was one of the most annoying things ever.
The best part was that he threw a pick-6 on the same play (that didn't count), so stepping out of bounds for the safety was the better result for them at the time. Funny how that happens. :P
I was all over the map on that play. I saw him go out the back and was cheering...then he threw the pick and I cheered even louder for a second before realizing that the play was already over.
As long as the Raiders remain winless, I'll be happy.
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As long as the Raiders remain winless, I'll be happy.
You and me both. Despite by abandonment of the Broncos, my hate for the Raiders as a team is still strong.
With no allegiance to a specific team now and no fantasy football, watching the games has actually been a lot more fun. I am just rooting for good games. :tup :tup
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So very nice to see both the Chiefs and Bills exposed as nothing special. Pretty wild series of events the last couple of minutes of that Miami/Buffalo game.
Loved watching the oh-so-Brady-Esque chick fight between Mahomes and Bieniemy; Andy Reid needed to escort Patrick away.
Other observations: ESPN is calling the Eagles the best team in the NFC; I think you have to beat better than Detroit, Washington and Minnesota for that but that’s just me.
Mike McDaniel at a press conference looks like he’s at ComicCon announcing the next StarTrek installment.
Prediction: Neither the Eagles or the Dolphins make it past the first round of the playoffs.
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Hope tonight's game is a lot better than last night's punt-fest. At least there's a Manningcast, so that should keep things interesting.
Has the Manningcast gotten better than when they first started it? I checked out one of the first few, and it was one of the most annoying things ever.
I love it. I watch it over the game every week (except tonight; I’m in Florida at a bar).
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Loved watching the oh-so-Brady-Esque chick fight between Mahomes and Bieniemy; Andy Reid needed to escort Patrick away.
Other observations: ESPN is calling the Eagles the best team in the NFC; I think you have to beat better than Detroit, Washington and Minnesota for that but that’s just me.
Mike McDaniel at a press conference looks like he’s at ComicCon announcing the next StarTrek installment.
Prediction: Neither the Eagles or the Dolphins make it past the first round of the playoffs.
McCoy said on FS1 today that Bieniemy argues with all of his players and doesn't even call the plays despite his OC title, so it makes me wonder why Reid keeps him around. Sounds like other ex-Chiefs have had similar complaints about Bieniemy.
If I had to bet on which team makes a deeper playoff team between Miami and Philly, I'd probably go with the Eagles right now. Part of that is because they play in the NFC, which appears not as strong as the AFC, but another part is that I am buying Hurts more than I am Tua going forward, and we all know the difference a QB can make. The Tyreek Hill factor, though, can never be overlooked.
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Loved watching the oh-so-Brady-Esque chick fight between Mahomes and Bieniemy; Andy Reid needed to escort Patrick away.
Other observations: ESPN is calling the Eagles the best team in the NFC; I think you have to beat better than Detroit, Washington and Minnesota for that but that’s just me.
Mike McDaniel at a press conference looks like he’s at ComicCon announcing the next StarTrek installment.
Prediction: Neither the Eagles or the Dolphins make it past the first round of the playoffs.
McCoy said on FS1 today that Bieniemy argues with all of his players and doesn't even call the plays despite his OC title, so it makes me wonder why Reid keeps him around. Sounds like other ex-Chiefs have had similar complaints about Bieniemy.
And yet… it’s racism as to why he’s not a head coach.
If I had to bet on which team makes a deeper playoff team between Miami and Philly, I'd probably go with the Eagles right now. Part of that is because they play in the NFC, which appears not as strong as the AFC, but another part is that I am buying Hurts more than I am Tua going forward, and we all know the difference a QB can make. The Tyreek Hill factor, though, can never be overlooked.
I hate the Iggles, but that sounds about right. Tough I think Hill was a bigger part of Mahomes’ success than we thought. He looked lost trying to “create” without Hill.
By the way, I could have - and I would have - caught that ball Lamb just dropped in NY.
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The Manning cast tonight shows you how the two of them and their guests can make a really bad Prime Time game into something fun and watchable. That said they just brought on Tracy Morgan so it's time for me to go to bed, easily one of the most annoying people on the planet right there.
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It was a bad primetime game for Giants fans. :lol
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I thought Cooper Rush looked alright? Passes weren't great, but he DOES seem to grasp the offense well enough to keep Dallas in games. I guess that's the advantage to having even a mediocre backup who has been with the team for awhile a'la Geno Smith. They can run the playbook and system better than a perhaps more talented player who is coming in at the 11th hour.
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Cooper Rush played an excellent game and is better than most people think. The numbers don't jump out at you, but they didn't need to. 2-0 as a starter going into a hostile environment. He held his own and complimented a great defense. I knew the D would show up, but wasn't totally sure about the offense. It was a rare pleasant surprise.
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^Along those lines, Russell Wilson is 2-1 despite not scoring more than 16 points. QBs getting too much credit as usual.
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Cooper Rush played an excellent game and is better than most people think. The numbers don't jump out at you, but they didn't need to. 2-0 as a starter going into a hostile environment. He held his own and complimented a great defense. I knew the D would show up, but wasn't totally sure about the offense. It was a rare pleasant surprise.
Only a Cowboys fan would understand that Rush is more of an asset than a liability. But how about the Dallas "D"? They have a lot of beasties that can get after you! Starting with Parsons! :metal
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Cooper Rush played an excellent game and is better than most people think. The numbers don't jump out at you, but they didn't need to. 2-0 as a starter going into a hostile environment. He held his own and complimented a great defense. I knew the D would show up, but wasn't totally sure about the offense. It was a rare pleasant surprise.
Only a Cowboys fan would understand that Rush is more of an asset than a liability. But how about the Dallas "D"? They have a lot of beasties that can get after you! Starting with Parsons! :metal
MP is great, but he wasn't 100%. That left the door wide open for Lawrence. He had a monster night! Those 2 guys are the smash bros on D! :hefdaddy
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^Along those lines, Russell Wilson is 2-1 despite not scoring more than 16 points. QBs getting too much credit as usual.
Someone is giving Russell Wilson credit for something? Broncos fans certainly aren't.
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^Along those lines, Russell Wilson is 2-1 despite not scoring more than 16 points. QBs getting too much credit as usual.
Someone is giving Russell Wilson credit for something? Broncos fans certainly aren't.
I’m talking about the QB WINZ! crowd.
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I am not saying this is a Blesode/Brady situation, because Dak is not as good as Bledsoe was and I don't see Cooper Rush turning into Tom Brady, the QB situation in Dallas does feel a bit like that. For whatever reason, the team plays better with Rush in there. And with that defense becoming a top one thanks to Micah Parsons, who is a beast, an efficient QB like Rush is what you need, not a Prescott who wants to sling it to show that he is as good as the top pass throwers in the league when it's obvious that he isn't.
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The top 5 MVP candidates section is still a few weeks away, but the power rankings are back!
Pre-Week 4 Power Rankings
01 Philadelphia Eagles - lost in the offensive fireworks is the fact that their defense is a top 5 so far
02 Miami Dolphins - hard to not take them seriously after wins at Baltimore and vs Buffalo
03 Buffalo Bills - still has the best knockout punch in the NFL, but 0-7 in close games since the start of the 2021 season is concerning
04 Kansas City Chiefs - their defense has been quite good, which could be key over the long haul as the offense struggles to find consistency in the post-Tyreek Hill era
05 Tampa Bay Bucs - offense has been bad so far, but even an aging Tom Brady will eventually get it together, and that defense is scary good
06 Jacksonville Jaguars - no clue if it will last, but shutting out the Colts and dismantling the Chargers was impressive as hell
07 Dallas Cowboys - McCarthy will eventually hold them back, but that defense is legit, led by the beast that is Micah Parsons
08 Baltimore Ravens - their defense looks like a mess, but Lamar Jackson is all-world so far this season
09 LA Rams - the defending champs get the respect, but there are major cracks in their foundation
10 Green Bay Packers - talks of their demise were greatly exaggerated, as their defense has been very good so far, and you know Rodgers will get on the same page with his receivers sooner rather than later
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Cooper Rush played an excellent game and is better than most people think. The numbers don't jump out at you, but they didn't need to. 2-0 as a starter going into a hostile environment. He held his own and complimented a great defense. I knew the D would show up, but wasn't totally sure about the offense. It was a rare pleasant surprise.
I think I agree with this; I'm not writing off Dallas at this point, at least not because of Cooper Rush.
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Cooper Rush played an excellent game and is better than most people think. The numbers don't jump out at you, but they didn't need to. 2-0 as a starter going into a hostile environment. He held his own and complimented a great defense. I knew the D would show up, but wasn't totally sure about the offense. It was a rare pleasant surprise.
Only a Cowboys fan would understand that Rush is more of an asset than a liability. But how about the Dallas "D"? They have a lot of beasties that can get after you! Starting with Parsons! :metal
Parsons is turning into the defensive Patrick Mahomes; my god, listening to the announcers on Monday talk about him you'd think Lawrence Butkus just came back out of retirement. My god. He's played a season and a half for fuck's sake, and his team hasn't won dick. When he dominates a Super Bowl - like Aaron Donald did - or makes teams restructure their entire offense - like LT did - then we can talk.
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Cooper Rush played an excellent game and is better than most people think. The numbers don't jump out at you, but they didn't need to. 2-0 as a starter going into a hostile environment. He held his own and complimented a great defense. I knew the D would show up, but wasn't totally sure about the offense. It was a rare pleasant surprise.
Only a Cowboys fan would understand that Rush is more of an asset than a liability. But how about the Dallas "D"? They have a lot of beasties that can get after you! Starting with Parsons! :metal
Parsons is turning into the defensive Patrick Mahomes; my god, listening to the announcers on Monday talk about him you'd think Lawrence Butkus just came back out of retirement. My god. He's played a season and a half for fuck's sake, and his team hasn't won dick. When he dominates a Super Bowl - like Aaron Donald did - or makes teams restructure their entire offense - like LT did - then we can talk.
Teams don't need SB wins for talent to be recognized. The league is much more complex than that.
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Cooper Rush played an excellent game and is better than most people think. The numbers don't jump out at you, but they didn't need to. 2-0 as a starter going into a hostile environment. He held his own and complimented a great defense. I knew the D would show up, but wasn't totally sure about the offense. It was a rare pleasant surprise.
Only a Cowboys fan would understand that Rush is more of an asset than a liability. But how about the Dallas "D"? They have a lot of beasties that can get after you! Starting with Parsons! :metal
Parsons is turning into the defensive Patrick Mahomes; my god, listening to the announcers on Monday talk about him you'd think Lawrence Butkus just came back out of retirement. My god. He's played a season and a half for fuck's sake, and his team hasn't won dick. When he dominates a Super Bowl - like Aaron Donald did - or makes teams restructure their entire offense - like LT did - then we can talk.
Teams don't need SB wins for talent to be recognized. The league is much more complex than that.
I understand that; I admit I lean towards wins a lot, but I do get there's more to it. But where I was really going is where I went with Patrick too: The first time or two through the league isn't indicative. For me, to be considered one of the "greats" you need:
- To be great;
- To do it after you've given the Shanahans, the Belichicks, the Tomlins a couple three or four times through to get a read on what you do;
- To do it after you've gone through at least one, maybe two, iterations of the team around you. The average career of an NFL player is about 3.5 years. So maybe at least four or five years of greatness?
- To do it in games where everything is on the line, where everyone is focused on you, and the other team has spent two straight weeks of scheming for YOU.
Mahomes - just by way of example - has covered most of these, but not all. He's living in a post-Hill world, and I've seen him struggle with that "creativity" phase, without Hill being there to get free with his speed. Parsons has only really accomplished the first line. He's got a long way to go.
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Cooper Rush played an excellent game and is better than most people think. The numbers don't jump out at you, but they didn't need to. 2-0 as a starter going into a hostile environment. He held his own and complimented a great defense. I knew the D would show up, but wasn't totally sure about the offense. It was a rare pleasant surprise.
Only a Cowboys fan would understand that Rush is more of an asset than a liability. But how about the Dallas "D"? They have a lot of beasties that can get after you! Starting with Parsons! :metal
Parsons is turning into the defensive Patrick Mahomes; my god, listening to the announcers on Monday talk about him you'd think Lawrence Butkus just came back out of retirement. My god. He's played a season and a half for fuck's sake, and his team hasn't won dick. When he dominates a Super Bowl - like Aaron Donald did - or makes teams restructure their entire offense - like LT did - then we can talk.
Teams don't need SB wins for talent to be recognized. The league is much more complex than that.
I understand that; I admit I lean towards wins a lot, but I do get there's more to it. But where I was really going is where I went with Patrick too: The first time or two through the league isn't indicative. For me, to be considered one of the "greats" you need:
- To be great;
- To do it after you've given the Shanahans, the Belichicks, the Tomlins a couple three or four times through to get a read on what you do;
- To do it after you've gone through at least one, maybe two, iterations of the team around you. The average career of an NFL player is about 3.5 years. So maybe at least four or five years of greatness?
- To do it in games where everything is on the line, where everyone is focused on you, and the other team has spent two straight weeks of scheming for YOU.
Mahomes - just by way of example - has covered most of these, but not all. He's living in a post-Hill world, and I've seen him struggle with that "creativity" phase, without Hill being there to get free with his speed. Parsons has only really accomplished the first line. He's got a long way to go.
Of course Parsons has a long way to go. That's only gonna make him better. That goes for any of the young, talented players. You can't compare a QB's success to a LB's success. Two entirely different animals on opposite sides of the ball. So, what's your point beyond what we already know?
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^^^ I don't know that "we" DO "already know it". I keep having to have this conversation over and over. There are still people that either think Mahomes is the GOAT, or is so far along the road to it that it's a fait accompli. He is neither. He is a great player now, that has a lot to prove to show he is a great player over time. And if Mahomes is just on the highway, then Parsons isn't even on the on-ramp yet. He's only played against Belichick once, and barely won in OT, with the defense giving up I think 26 points to the rookie Mac Jones. He's played against TB (and TB) twice, and lost both times. He's played against SF (in the playoffs) and lost. He's played against KC once, and lost. He's never played against the Rams. Let's see what happens when he goes through the rotations a couple more times, no?
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As if we didn't know already, but the NFL couldn't give a flying crap about concussions. Tua was clearly concussed last week and allowed to re-enter the game...and then look what happened tonight. Two concussions in five days could be damaging to his long term health. The NFL and the Dolphins both really shit the bed on this one.
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Good lord, his hands!
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My wife was a ER nurse for almost a decade and when she saw that and she saw his hands she told me it's usually a reaction to a severe brain injury. She mentioned the term for it which I can't remember but it didn't look good.
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Yeah, that was pretty hard to watch.
I hate to think about it but that could be career threatening. :(
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My wife was a ER nurse for almost a decade and when she saw that and she saw his hands she told me it's usually a reaction to a severe brain injury. She mentioned the term for it which I can't remember but it didn't look good.
It's called a fencing response (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fencing_response) usually indicative of a concussion. That did not look good.
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I only saw the replay later on. That was harsh. Did the defender get flagged for roughing the passer?
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I only saw the replay later on. That was harsh. Did the defender get flagged for roughing the passer?
No, he didn't and frankly I thought it was a pretty clean tackle. Of course, I am assuming that the concussion he took last night was compounded by the hit he took 5 days ago.
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The tackle was fine. I was surprised at the injury, until I remembered last week.
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Can I just say that I don't like watching streaming sports? :tdwn
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Can I just say that I don't like watching streaming sports? :tdwn
Yeah, no shit. Rewinding and FF is a joke.
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Insanity. If there's one thing that can make the league change, it's saying high profile National incident like this. Tua might have just had his career ended right as it look like he was finally putting it together. 100% of the fan base of the league want Justice for him
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Insanity. If there's one thing that can make the league change, it's saying high profile National incident like this. Tua might have just had his career ended right as it look like he was finally putting it together. 100% of the fan base of the league want Justice for him
Go look up Tom Savage. Video is on YouTube. The exact same thing happened to him in 2017. Looks like he's out of the league now.
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I wouldn't blame Tua if he retired tomorrow, but football players are different from the rest of us. Odds are, he will shake it off and try to play as soon as he can, at a great risk to his own self and his future. This is why protocols need to be in place and used, as most players will always try to play and usually need to be protected from themselves.
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He's in a contract year needing to prove himself. That's why he's made poor decisions this year.
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Everybody seems so certain that he was knocked out against Buffalo. Maybe he was, but maybe he wasn't, in which case the Cinci thing takes on a very different status. He was evaluated by several layers of people against Buffalo, and presumably they all cleared him. The only thing actually pointing towards concussion was his stumbling, and that could certainly have been, as he said, his back. Honestly, falling backwards as he did looked harder on the back than the noggin. After the game and during the week he was presumably evaluated again my multiple layers of people, and they all cleared him. Whole lot of second guessing the experts going on.
I really don't know what happened, but I wouldn't be so quick to assume that he suffered a concussion the first time around. Thursday night there's no question about what happened. The posturing made that pretty clear to everybody. At the same time that was clearly a violent hit to the head, and need not have been any different were there no previous concussion.
Also, fuck London games. I hate those stupid damn things.
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Also, fuck London games. I hate those stupid damn things.
x 1 billion
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J-E-T-S JETS JETS JETS!
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Should be fun to see the analytics nerds defend that decision by Harbaugh today. Huge win for the Bills, not just in the standings, as that win could help determine home field, but to gut out a close win (finally).
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After Tua I suspect that just looking at a player's head too hard will be enough to get him into the protocol.
As a big fan of seeing emergency QBs (and kickers) part of me wouldn't mind seeing something minor happen to Zappe, but NE doesn't even have their emergency quarterback active today. :lol Actually, that might make it even more interesting.
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J-E-T-S JETS JETS JETS!
2-2 against the AFC North to start the season isn’t bad, even if they have yet to play a complete game. If they can stay competitive and even steal a couple of wins through this murderous stretch of games before their bye in week ten, the second half of their schedule potentially opens things up to them being a fringe playoff contender, although that’s still a long stretch.
EDIT: An interesting stat from this game, this was only the second times the Jets have won a game not just in Pittsburgh, but in the entire state of Pennsylvania (the Jets are 0-12 all time against the Eagles).
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McDaniels defeats Hackett in the battle of the two worst head coaches in football.
Bucs getting ready to lay the smackdown on the Chiefs again tonight.
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Much to Stadler's chagrin I'm sure, Mahomes is ridiculous tonight. I've blurted 'WOW!" out loud a few time tonight already.
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Much to Stadler's chagrin I'm sure, Mahomes is ridiculous tonight. I've blurted 'WOW!" out loud a few time tonight already.
...and Dream Team's delight.
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Much to Stadler's chagrin I'm sure, Mahomes is ridiculous tonight. I've blurted 'WOW!" out loud a few time tonight already.
I came here to say essentially the same thing. Wow!
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Yeah, but he needs to do it for 11 more years before we can say he is great. :P (I kid, I kid)
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Pacheco is very impressive tonight!
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I went to bed early last night. Tampa's running game was non existent.
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J-E-T-S JETS JETS JETS!
2-2 against the AFC North to start the season isn’t bad, even if they have yet to play a complete game. If they can stay competitive and even steal a couple of wins through this murderous stretch of games before their bye in week ten, the second half of their schedule potentially opens things up to them being a fringe playoff contender, although that’s still a long stretch.
EDIT: An interesting stat from this game, this was only the second times the Jets have won a game not just in Pittsburgh, but in the entire state of Pennsylvania (the Jets are 0-12 all time against the Eagles).
Let's see...
Bridgewater-led Dolphins - this should be winnable, but let's say its a loss.
Packers - they look like shit, but count on this to be the game where they put it together. Loss.
Broncos - Bad team who barely beat a worse team in the Texans, but let's call it a winnable loss for argument's sake.
Patriots - I think this is a win. Jets are, simply, the better team.
Bills - this is a loss.
Patriots - Again, I think this is a win.
So my worst case scenario has the Jets going in to week 11 vs the Bears at 4-6. But I could easily see them being 5-5, if not 6-5, by that time. And no, I don't think the Jets are a playoff team, but it will be nice to still be "in the hunt" and playing meaningful games in November (which we should be).
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Much to Stadler's chagrin I'm sure, Mahomes is ridiculous tonight. I've blurted 'WOW!" out loud a few time tonight already.
I came here to say essentially the same thing. Wow!
I didn't see much of the game - I watched about the fourth quarter - but listening to the sideline announcer basically scream "I want to have your children!" about the flip to Edwards-Helaire was all I needed to see. My god.
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2 WINS?!
Jets are SUPER BOWL BOUND BABY!
:lol :lol :lol :lol
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2 WINS?!
Jets are SUPER BOWL BOUND BABY!
:lol :lol :lol :lol
That's about right.... :) :) :) :) :)
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What? No more Baker Mayfield commercials? I guess he's not feeling so much at home in Carolina these days huh?
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Yeah, but he needs to do it for 11 more years before we can say he is great. :P (I kid, I kid)
So I'm going to take a stab at this. The problem isn't entirely the incessant anointing of the kid the second coming, though that is annoying. The problem is the overt branding, and attempt to create a mythos. Listening to Collinsworth last night it sounded exactly like I was listening to Morning Joe or Tucker Carlson (just without the hatred). It's the same media nonsense of telling the narrative rather than telling the facts. The angle here was the old guy passing the baton to his heir apparent. The pupil surpassing the master. A battle between good and evil, old and young, potential and success. It makes perfect sense, and nobody's surprised that this is what they're doing. They make money by talking about nonsense, and more they suck you into the nonsense the better they do. Like I said, it's just like political infotainment in that regard. It's also annoying as all fuck if you're the sort of person that doesn't like your ideology spoon-fed to you.
For my part, and Stadler's going to be right there with me on this, I find it annoying, and on a certain level offensive. I don't need Chris Fucking Collinsworth telling me fairy tales, and in honesty I think the fact that people need to be told what they're supposed to think is indicative of a major flaw in our society.
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Preach, brother; I am in fact right there in the canoe with you on all of that, including your analogy with political infotainment.
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I'm late to this discussion, but I mean, if you watch these telecasts, as El B said, they get paid to talk about nonsense.
Is Tom Brady a legend? Absolutely. (Fuck him, though. Go Jets.)
Will Mahomes become a legend? He's trending that way for sure. But again, you need time. Bo Jackson would have been a HOFer in both football and baseball had he stayed healthy. Everyone was comparing him back in the day to the greatest of all time. Then what happened? He got hurt, his careers ended, and no one talks about him in the same breath as they do the legends of the game any longer. Because he never made it.
Mahomes could get clobbered next Sunday and his career over. I'm tired of the media anointing people. But that drives traffic to websites, eyes to screens, etc. I totally get it. The key is not to buy into the hype. I think Mahomes is immensely talented and a new generation of QB that follows in the footsteps of Young, Cunningham, etc., that really set the tone for a mobile QB. He's had a great start to his career. But his decision making is certainly questionable. Good defenses get him confused. Collinsworth makes excuses. My eyes tell me what I need to see. Will Mahomes overcome that? I believe he will, and for his sake, I hope he becomes everything he is being lauded as.
But again, as El B says, this whole generation of people needing to be told what to think is just plain dumb. I hate being the old guy, but Christ, come on already, ya know?
p.s. Collinsworth is an idiot anyway...
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Funny enough, Collinsworth, as bad as he is, isn't even the worst. Jim Nantz is far and away the worst at that. Nantz lets it get in the way of his calling the game.
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Wow, the Panthers are bad. Hopefully, they fire the coach soon.
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Wow, the Panthers are bad. Hopefully, they fire the coach soon.
Sucks that Sam Darnold is still out on IR, too. Not that he'd be much of (if any) improvement.
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Wow, the Panthers are bad. Hopefully, they fire the coach soon.
Didn't they invest a Brazilian dollars in him? Wasn't he the next coming of Belichick?
And also, don't they have like five potential starting QBs on the roster? :) :) :)
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Wow, the Panthers are bad. Hopefully, they fire the coach soon.
Didn't they invest a Brazilian dollars in him? Wasn't he the next coming of Belichick?
And also, don't they have like five potential starting QBs on the roster? :) :) :)
Trust me, there are zero starting QBs on this roster.
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I can imagine if this forum existed when Images and Words came out.
"Yeah, it's good, but let's pipe down the talk about it being great until DT does it over and over for the next 15 years."
:biggrin: :biggrin: :lol :lol
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At what point are you allowed to gush about a player? Only after he’s won 3 Super Bowls? 5? How about if he has the highest winning percentage and highest passer rating in history? You guys are amusing for sure.
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I can imagine if this forum existed when Images and Words came out.
"Yeah, it's good, but let's pipe down the talk about it being great until DT does it over and over for the next 15 years."
:biggrin: :biggrin: :lol :lol
With all the respect in the world, comrade, I made it crystal clear why that was not the problem I have with it. Either you didn't bother reading it or you're being intentionally obtuse with your reply. As Dream Team put it, I don't care if you gush all over the guy. Shoot giant wads at your TV while watching videos of him being a badass for all I care. He's a great QB. My issue is with creating mythologies around the guy so brain-dead simpletons will know what they're supposed to think about him. I'd love to think that we're better than that, but your reply tells me that we're not.
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I can imagine if this forum existed when Images and Words came out.
"Yeah, it's good, but let's pipe down the talk about it being great until DT does it over and over for the next 15 years."
:biggrin: :biggrin: :lol :lol
With all the respect in the world, comrade, I made it crystal clear why that was not the problem I have with it. Either you didn't bother reading it or you're being intentionally obtuse with your reply. As Dream Team put it, I don't care if you gush all over the guy. Shoot giant wads at your TV while watching videos of him being a badass for all I care. He's a great QB. My issue is with creating mythologies around the guy so brain-dead simpletons will know what they're supposed to think about him. I'd love to think that we're better than that, but your reply tells me that we're not.
I was being cheeky with my post, but I get what you are saying. I just think that we, as fans, ought to be able to enjoy great moments, well, in the moment instead of always taking the "yeah, but let's see him do it over and over for the next x-number of years," and I know that you specifically were not pushing back on that. I have thought the media was awful for as long as I can remember, and amazingly it feels like the sports media has caught up to the level of the news media when it comes to awfulness.
Collinsworth himself is a narrative machine, and I feel like everything he says is geared towards starting a new one or reinforcing an already-existing one. When they showed Brady's stats the other night from games 1-3, Tirico quickly mentioned how he wasn't playing up to his usual standards and then stopped talking to allow Collinsworth his usual input, and there was literally five seconds of dead silence as he said nothing, because, ya know, TB12 is the GOAT who can do no wrong, and for Collinsworth to even suggest that he hasn't been playing great or that, gasp, maybe Father Time was catching up to him would go against his internal narrative.
A similar thing happened with knucklehead Romo (whose terrible advice during 2-minute drills is a constant reminder of why Tony Romo the QB was often really good for 58 minutes and then gagged at the end of games) where the Packers got the ball back with like 3 and change and he basically said, "Now, the Packers don't want to get this FG too quickly and leave the Patriots any time." They had the ball at their own 35 or 40 and he was just assuming that Aaron Rodgers was going to drive them down the field, which of course he didn't, but I can see why he'd think that, given that Rodgers has fewer 4th quarter comebacks in his career than Andy Dalton and Ryan Tannehill.
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Also, that catch and run for a score by Deebo Samuel last night was awesome.
Glad I plunked down $50 on the 49ers -2 last night. :hat :hat I didn't want to say it and jinx myself, but I knew I was betting that a week ago. Shanahan's 49ers almost always beat McVay's Rams, and with the state of the Rams o-line, I figured the 49ers pass rush would have a field day. I just needed Jimmy G to not screw it up. :lol :lol
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I guess the basketball analogy to this is that whenever anyone wants to talk about how great Player X was/is, some old guys in the balcony immediately start shouting them down. Hey, remember how great Wilt was - Shut up! Wilt was a choker in big games! Michael Jordan! Wow Kareem was amaz - Shut up! He had a gimmick shot, that's all! Michael Jordan! Hey did you see Kobe last night - Shut up about Kobe! He's no MJ! Wow this Lebron guy sure is amaz - (fingers in ears) nyaaah nyaaah I'm not listening! Not enough rings! Michael Jordan! Michael Jordan!! It's like you can't ever talk about how great Peyton or Marino or Steve Young was for more than 2 seconds before some Brady jock-sniffers come flying in. You shut up about them, they're not the goat! What a ridiculous ham-stringing way to enjoy a sport. The Bucs had been allowing 9 points a game before Mahomes dropped 41 on them but don't you dare say anything positive about it, especially you Chris Collinsworth!
So sick of this . . . how about a much more fun topic?
GENO SMITH. What a great story so far. Stuck on a clown organization for years, finally gets another legit shot at a starting job and so far he's 3rd passer rating and has the highest completion percentage of all time through a team's first 4 games. Really rooting hard for this guy.
Any other redemption stories in the NFL you guys are noticing?
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I'm amazed that you guys listen to football announcers at all. Uh, turn the volume down, or off, and just watch the game.
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I'm amazed that you guys listen to football announcers at all. Uh, turn the volume down, or off, and just watch the game.
This.
I can’t remember the last time I actually “listened” to an announcer on a tv broadcast. It’s fairly easy to tune them out.
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I'm amazed that you guys listen to football announcers at all. Uh, turn the volume down, or off, and just watch the game.
That's weird. Can't watch an athletic event in silence. At the very least, you need to hear the crowd.
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I'm with Hef. I find it easy to tune announcers out.
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I can imagine if this forum existed when Images and Words came out.
"Yeah, it's good, but let's pipe down the talk about it being great until DT does it over and over for the next 15 years."
:biggrin: :biggrin: :lol :lol
I would have absolutely said that. :) :) :) :)
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Whining about announcers, whatever. :\ Matthew Stafford kind of reminds me of Trent Dilfer following his SB season. Now, the defense isn't there to bail him out and his O-line sucks. Hey Matt, is that you? Didn't recognize you standing up. :lol
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I guess the basketball analogy to this is that whenever anyone wants to talk about how great Player X was/is, some old guys in the balcony immediately start shouting them down. Hey, remember how great Wilt was - Shut up! Wilt was a choker in big games! Michael Jordan! Wow Kareem was amaz - Shut up! He had a gimmick shot, that's all! Michael Jordan! Hey did you see Kobe last night - Shut up about Kobe! He's no MJ! Wow this Lebron guy sure is amaz - (fingers in ears) nyaaah nyaaah I'm not listening! Not enough rings! Michael Jordan! Michael Jordan!! It's like you can't ever talk about how great Peyton or Marino or Steve Young was for more than 2 seconds before some Brady jock-sniffers come flying in. You shut up about them, they're not the goat! What a ridiculous ham-stringing way to enjoy a sport. The Bucs had been allowing 9 points a game before Mahomes dropped 41 on them but don't you dare say anything positive about it, especially you Chris Collinsworth!
Good thing none of those things are happening here, though. WTF?
GENO SMITH. What a great story so far. Stuck on a clown organization for years, finally gets another legit shot at a starting job and so far he's 3rd passer rating and has the highest completion percentage of all time through a team's first 4 games. Really rooting hard for this guy.
Any other redemption stories in the NFL you guys are noticing?
Daniel Jones, maybe.
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Talking about announcers, last night I tried the Manning Cast for the first time. I enjoyed some of the insights of the Manning brothers for sure, but the way they did the show was awful. If they had themselves and guests in the same room I feel it would be 10x better. After halftime I went back to the normal broadcast.
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GENO SMITH. What a great story so far. Stuck on a clown organization for years, finally gets another legit shot at a starting job and so far he's 3rd passer rating and has the highest completion percentage of all time through a team's first 4 games. Really rooting hard for this guy.
Any other redemption stories in the NFL you guys are noticing?
He was bad his rookie year because he sucked, not because of the Jets. The Jets org at that time was actually decent (tail end of the Ryan era, many pieces of the team that'd gone to the AFC Championship twice still in place). It'd be very easy for him to blame the Jets, of course, and all the people out there who let the media think for them would just buy it without scrutiny. The fact is, the Jets went 8-8 Geno's rookie year (which he wasn't even supposed to start, except Sanchez was hurt in the preseason), and they would have been a playoff team if he'd not thrown 21 interceptions. Seriously, how many teams have gone 8-8 with their starting QB throwing twice as many interceptions as touchdowns? He was still bad the following year, and then the Jets benched him and went 10-6 with Ryan Fitzpatrick at the helm the year after that. So, sorry to burst your bubble, but Geno's suckage early on isn't on the Jets.
In fact, I'd say Geno is doing well now specifically because he DOESN'T buy into the idea that the Jets are to blame for his failure. Rather than blame the Jets, or the Giants, he takes fully accountability, says "I wasn't good enough." And he's right. He wasn't. He still might not be. But he's put the work in, and improved greatly. I'm delighted that he's proven his worth in the league, and carved out a nice career for himself. He's not the immature brat who walked out the NFL Draft with a pouty face when he wasn't taken in the first round anymore. He's come a long way, and if he can keep it together, I think he will continue to be an asset.
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I feel the opposite. I really enjoy hearing them gab. It's like friends hanging out talking football on a Sunday.
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I like the Manning Cast, but not for a whole game. I'm glad ESPN does it the way they do, so when I want to go to a more traditional watch, I can just flip the channel.
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I prefer it but there are some hiccups. Often they've got a preplanned segment that they are trying to force in that comes at the expense of covering the game. And guests can be hit or miss. Sometimes the guests are way louder than the Mannings, which is unfortunate. And other times, they're people like Tracy Morgan, some of the most annoying on the planet. I find that I enjoy when they have guests on who seem to just be in on the fun, but so far this year, most guest are there to shill products.
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Maybe TB12 should have stayed retired and he would still have his family together. With how not great Tampa has looked, it just can't be worth it unless he wanted out and this is how he made that happen.
Either way, looks like they're done.
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Maybe TB12 should have stayed retired and he would still have his family together. With how not great Tampa has looked, it just can't be worth it unless he wanted out and this is how he made that happen.
Either way, looks like they're done.
He never needed a pretense in the past when skipping out on a baby-mama. :dunno:
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I'm amazed that you guys listen to football announcers at all. Uh, turn the volume down, or off, and just watch the game.
That's weird. Can't watch an athletic event in silence. At the very least, you need to hear the crowd.
I wasn't saying that's what I do. I was suggesting it to the forum members who seem so focused on it. I mean, hating on Jim Nance of all things...the guy's so completely inoffensive.
I love the sound of football on when I watch, I just don't pay attention to announcers. Life's too short for such concerns.
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Maybe TB12 should have stayed retired and he would still have his family together. With how not great Tampa has looked, it just can't be worth it unless he wanted out and this is how he made that happen.
Either way, looks like they're done.
It's not like he's said for a decade that he wants to play until he's 45. Well, this would be his last year.
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I agree that it is nice to have the regular broadcast and the Manning Cast. I wouldn't want to listen to the Mannings every week from start to finish, but it is entertaining to flip over to here and there, if for no other reason than to witness Peyton's non-stop frustration with bad play calls and coaching decisions. His reactions crack me up.
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Listening to a sporting event with no sound is just weird. I like having the announcers on, but I can't say I actively listen to them much.
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GENO SMITH. What a great story so far. Stuck on a clown organization for years, finally gets another legit shot at a starting job and so far he's 3rd passer rating and has the highest completion percentage of all time through a team's first 4 games. Really rooting hard for this guy.
Any other redemption stories in the NFL you guys are noticing?
He was bad his rookie year because he sucked, not because of the Jets. The Jets org at that time was actually decent (tail end of the Ryan era, many pieces of the team that'd gone to the AFC Championship twice still in place). It'd be very easy for him to blame the Jets, of course, and all the people out there who let the media think for them would just buy it without scrutiny. The fact is, the Jets went 8-8 Geno's rookie year (which he wasn't even supposed to start, except Sanchez was hurt in the preseason), and they would have been a playoff team if he'd not thrown 21 interceptions. Seriously, how many teams have gone 8-8 with their starting QB throwing twice as many interceptions as touchdowns? He was still bad the following year, and then the Jets benched him and went 10-6 with Ryan Fitzpatrick at the helm the year after that. So, sorry to burst your bubble, but Geno's suckage early on isn't on the Jets.
In fact, I'd say Geno is doing well now specifically because he DOESN'T buy into the idea that the Jets are to blame for his failure. Rather than blame the Jets, or the Giants, he takes fully accountability, says "I wasn't good enough." And he's right. He wasn't. He still might not be. But he's put the work in, and improved greatly. I'm delighted that he's proven his worth in the league, and carved out a nice career for himself. He's not the immature brat who walked out the NFL Draft with a pouty face when he wasn't taken in the first round anymore. He's come a long way, and if he can keep it together, I think he will continue to be an asset.
Look, I'm happy for Geno, and I was thrilled to see him do well in the opener. He is his own worst enemy, though. He's going to be good up until he starts to believe the hype, which has happened before.
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I prefer it but there are some hiccups. Often they've got a preplanned segment that they are trying to force in that comes at the expense of covering the game. And guests can be hit or miss. Sometimes the guests are way louder than the Mannings, which is unfortunate. And other times, they're people like Tracy Morgan, some of the most annoying on the planet. I find that I enjoy when they have guests on who seem to just be in on the fun, but so far this year, most guest are there to shill products.
I agree with this, especially the last part. When they had The Rock on, he kept sort of "posing" with his tequila, and he kept taking these exaggerated sips like it was a Coke commercial. I'm not even sure he liked what he was drinking, to be honest. I much prefer when it's a friend of theirs, and like King says, it's three guys shooting the shit while watching the game. That's the best part of the Manning cast (that and when Peyton takes not-so-subtle digs at his brother).
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I'm amazed that you guys listen to football announcers at all. Uh, turn the volume down, or off, and just watch the game.
That's weird. Can't watch an athletic event in silence. At the very least, you need to hear the crowd.
I wasn't saying that's what I do. I was suggesting it to the forum members who seem so focused on it. I mean, hating on Jim Nance of all things...the guy's so completely inoffensive.
I love the sound of football on when I watch, I just don't pay attention to announcers. Life's too short for such concerns.
I'm the recognized Nantz hater here and I am unapologetic about it. I despise that guy, and whether he's "inoffensive" or not - he is VERY offensive to me! - I can't stand him. He's an arrogant prick that can't read a (sports event) room, IMO.
(For the record, this grudge goes back to March of 1999, by the way. I'm nothing if not consistent.)
But to your last point, I'm not losing a minute's of sleep over this; this is a minor thing, in the context of this thread; I don't watch or not watch games because of him (though I will turn the sound down at times).
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Stads, what happened in March of ‘99 that started your grudge?
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Stads, what happened in March of ‘99 that started your grudge?
Uconn whipped Duke's ass for their first NCAA National Championship. Nantz and Packer called the game and it was SO obviously in favor of Duke it was absolutely disgusting. Packer was downright upset that Duke lost, and Nantz called it like it was a fluke or an abnormality. It was a Cinderella season, it was Uconn's first real moment on the national scene, but it was neither a fluke or an abnormality (Uconn beat Duke again for the National title I think four years later). For a period there about ten years after that first championship, Uconn had the most active players in the NBA, even over Duke. They were an elite program for at least 15 years, if not more, and Nantz (and Packer) treated them like they were a Division II school, all in the service of the "narrative".
Yes, I'm bitter. :) :) :)
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Yeah, we've heard that story before. Get over it Stads. :p
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Yeah, we've heard that story before. Get over it Stads. :p
Go Huskies!!!
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Stads, what happened in March of ‘99 that started your grudge?
Uconn whipped Duke's ass for their first NCAA National Championship. Nantz and Packer called the game and it was SO obviously in favor of Duke it was absolutely disgusting. Packer was downright upset that Duke lost, and Nantz called it like it was a fluke or an abnormality. It was a Cinderella season, it was Uconn's first real moment on the national scene, but it was neither a fluke or an abnormality (Uconn beat Duke again for the National title I think four years later). For a period there about ten years after that first championship, Uconn had the most active players in the NBA, even over Duke. They were an elite program for at least 15 years, if not more, and Nantz (and Packer) treated them like they were a Division II school, all in the service of the "narrative".
Yes, I'm bitter. :) :) :)
Carolina fans know all about Packer's pro-Duke bias. It's legendary down here.
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J-E-T-S JETS JETS JETS!
2-2 against the AFC North to start the season isn’t bad, even if they have yet to play a complete game. If they can stay competitive and even steal a couple of wins through this murderous stretch of games before their bye in week ten, the second half of their schedule potentially opens things up to them being a fringe playoff contender, although that’s still a long stretch.
EDIT: An interesting stat from this game, this was only the second times the Jets have won a game not just in Pittsburgh, but in the entire state of Pennsylvania (the Jets are 0-12 all time against the Eagles).
Honestly, if you told me before the start of training camp that we'd be 2-2 coming out of the AFC North portion of our schedule I'd have taken it. If you then told me that Zach Wilson would miss most of the preseason and the first three regular season games and we'd also lose four different starting OTs to injury (seriously, it's reached Spinal Tap drummer status) in that time, I can't really ask for more than 2-2.
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J-E-T-S JETS JETS JETS!
2-2 against the AFC North to start the season isn’t bad, even if they have yet to play a complete game. If they can stay competitive and even steal a couple of wins through this murderous stretch of games before their bye in week ten, the second half of their schedule potentially opens things up to them being a fringe playoff contender, although that’s still a long stretch.
EDIT: An interesting stat from this game, this was only the second times the Jets have won a game not just in Pittsburgh, but in the entire state of Pennsylvania (the Jets are 0-12 all time against the Eagles).
Honestly, if you told me before the start of training camp that we'd be 2-2 coming out of the AFC North portion of our schedule I'd have taken it. If you then told me that Zach Wilson would miss most of the preseason and the first three regular season games and we'd also lose four different starting OTs to injury (seriously, it's reached Spinal Tap drummer status) in that time, I can't really ask for more than 2-2.
We might get Duane Brown back within the next few weeks, so there’s hope for the offensive line still. Alijah Vera-Tucker is the clear team MVP through the first month, but the Jets need more than him holding down the fort if they hope to sustain any semblance of success.
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Stads, what happened in March of ‘99 that started your grudge?
Uconn whipped Duke's ass for their first NCAA National Championship. Nantz and Packer called the game and it was SO obviously in favor of Duke it was absolutely disgusting. Packer was downright upset that Duke lost, and Nantz called it like it was a fluke or an abnormality. It was a Cinderella season, it was Uconn's first real moment on the national scene, but it was neither a fluke or an abnormality (Uconn beat Duke again for the National title I think four years later). For a period there about ten years after that first championship, Uconn had the most active players in the NBA, even over Duke. They were an elite program for at least 15 years, if not more, and Nantz (and Packer) treated them like they were a Division II school, all in the service of the "narrative".
Yes, I'm bitter. :) :) :)
Kind of how someone I know treats Mahomes. ;D
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Stads, what happened in March of ‘99 that started your grudge?
Uconn whipped Duke's ass for their first NCAA National Championship. Nantz and Packer called the game and it was SO obviously in favor of Duke it was absolutely disgusting. Packer was downright upset that Duke lost, and Nantz called it like it was a fluke or an abnormality. It was a Cinderella season, it was Uconn's first real moment on the national scene, but it was neither a fluke or an abnormality (Uconn beat Duke again for the National title I think four years later). For a period there about ten years after that first championship, Uconn had the most active players in the NBA, even over Duke. They were an elite program for at least 15 years, if not more, and Nantz (and Packer) treated them like they were a Division II school, all in the service of the "narrative".
Yes, I'm bitter. :) :) :)
Kind of how someone I know treats Mahomes. ;D
Who? He's a dick, then! :) :) :)
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Hopefully Russ can cook us up a decent game tonight after all the stinking up the two other primetime games the Broncos have already got this year. If not, it looks like we won't have to see them until a SNF game they'll possibly get flexed out of late in the season.
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Stads, what happened in March of ‘99 that started your grudge?
Uconn whipped Duke's ass for their first NCAA National Championship. Nantz and Packer called the game and it was SO obviously in favor of Duke it was absolutely disgusting. Packer was downright upset that Duke lost, and Nantz called it like it was a fluke or an abnormality. It was a Cinderella season, it was Uconn's first real moment on the national scene, but it was neither a fluke or an abnormality (Uconn beat Duke again for the National title I think four years later). For a period there about ten years after that first championship, Uconn had the most active players in the NBA, even over Duke. They were an elite program for at least 15 years, if not more, and Nantz (and Packer) treated them like they were a Division II school, all in the service of the "narrative".
Yes, I'm bitter. :) :) :)
Hold on...wait a minute.
1999 was not only CT's first national title; it was also the team's first time making a Final Four, so, AT THE TIME, it WAS an abnormality. The fact that the team won two more titles IN THE FUTURE doesn't mean it wasn't an abnormality at the time.
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I feel like I've seen the Broncos play every week so far. I'm honestly sick of Russel Wilson. It's not that I don't like him, but it seems like they're shoving him down my throat.
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I can remember watching UM/UNC in 1993, and thinking "Boy, the broadcaster is really pissed Webber got away with a travel... oh wait, now he's ecstatic Webber called a TO."
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I feel like I've seen the Broncos play every week so far. I'm honestly sick of Russel Wilson. It's not that I don't like him, but it seems like they're shoving him down my throat.
The problem there is that the Broncos were projected by many to be one of the better teams in the league this year, especially with the addition of a big name QB in Wilson, so putting them on a bunch of prime time games made sense, but no one could have predicted that their offense would be this anemic or that their coach would be such a clueless wanker.
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Thanks for the image Tim.
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Kirk Herbstreit has the exact same voice as Kenny Blankenship from MXC. Now that I've noticed I can't unhear it. I keep expecting to hear "Oohh, he tried to go deep, choked, and coughed up a ball!"
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I feel like I've seen the Broncos play every week so far. I'm honestly sick of Russel Wilson. It's not that I don't like him, but it seems like they're shoving him down my throat.
The problem there is that the Broncos were projected by many to be one of the better teams in the league this year, especially with the addition of a big name QB in Wilson, so putting them on a bunch of prime time games made sense, but no one could have predicted that their offense would be this anemic or that their coach would be such a clueless wanker.
Totally agree. What are we? 5 weeks in and I am sick of the Broncos, something seriously wrong there. the fans know it too, they all left before OT.
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I was ahead of the curve in abandoning the Broncos after week 1. The franchise is totally screwed now. Firing the wanker coach in the next year or two will be easy, but they traded the farm and gave tons of money to a QB who, quite frankly, looks like he got blindsided by Father Time. Wilson looks nothing like the QB he was for most of his time in Seattle.
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Couldn't be happier. Well, actually, I have mixed feelings. Couldn't be happier than to see Wilson losing and being exposed. But it's a shame it's happening on the Broncos. I still kinda love that team, even though...well, all the stuff Kev's been saying.
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He wasn't exposed in the sense that this is who he always was and now he is showing it. He was a very good/great QB for most of his career. Never in the top tier with Brady, Peyton, Brees, Rodgers, Mahomes, etc., but always in that 2nd tier. He just doesn't look like the same guy. When he used to have to break the pocket to throw from out of the pocket or run for a first down, he was pretty quick. Now, when he tries that, he looks old and slow. Not sure if he simply got lazy as he got older or after getting paid, but the decline in his play has been both sudden and rapid. That INT he threw late last night, when they had a chance to go up 12-6 with two minutes left, was atrocious.
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Even if the Broncos were living up to the hype, 3 outta 5 weeks in primetime is overkill. I never have a problem with flexing to games that matter on SNF late in the season, but early on its much more fun to see a variety of teams throughout the league.
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Even if the Broncos were living up to the hype, 3 outta 5 weeks in primetime is overkill. I never have a problem with flexing to games that matter on SNF late in the season, but early on its much more fun to see a variety of teams throughout the league.
This is where I am. I don't care how good the Broncos were supposed to be, mix it up. They're not the only good team in the league.
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Stads, what happened in March of ‘99 that started your grudge?
Uconn whipped Duke's ass for their first NCAA National Championship. Nantz and Packer called the game and it was SO obviously in favor of Duke it was absolutely disgusting. Packer was downright upset that Duke lost, and Nantz called it like it was a fluke or an abnormality. It was a Cinderella season, it was Uconn's first real moment on the national scene, but it was neither a fluke or an abnormality (Uconn beat Duke again for the National title I think four years later). For a period there about ten years after that first championship, Uconn had the most active players in the NBA, even over Duke. They were an elite program for at least 15 years, if not more, and Nantz (and Packer) treated them like they were a Division II school, all in the service of the "narrative".
Yes, I'm bitter. :) :) :)
Hold on...wait a minute.
1999 was not only CT's first national title; it was also the team's first time making a Final Four, so, AT THE TIME, it WAS an abnormality. The fact that the team won two more titles IN THE FUTURE doesn't mean it wasn't an abnormality at the time.
Well, the Championship was an abnormality, but they weren't an unknown quantity. They were in the Sweet Sixteen two out of the previous three years, they won the Big East (one of the best conferences in the country at that time) tournament two out of the past three years (and four times in the '90s) as well as the regular season title six times in the '90s. Famously, it took a Christian Laettner buzzer-beater for Duke to beat Uconn in overtime in the tournament in '90 to go to the Final Four. By that time, Dick Vitale had called Storrs "the basketball capital of the world" since the women were on the rise, and there was at least one season where both teams were undefeated late into the season (they are still the only program in NCAA history to have the men and women win the title in the same season, 2004).
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That game last night should've ended in a tie. Worst. TNF game. Ever.
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That INT he threw late last night, when they had a chance to go up 12-6 with two minutes left, was atrocious.
I couldn't believe it was Russel Wilson making that throw. Atrocious is generous. But I agree completely with your greater point. You can't call him exposed for only his most recent play. He looked an awful lot like final season Peyton, as I'm sure you recall, and we don't use that season to say Peyton was overrated.
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I feel like I've seen the Broncos play every week so far. I'm honestly sick of Russel Wilson. It's not that I don't like him, but it seems like they're shoving him down my throat.
So are most of us Bronco fans....
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Well I do have to say that the people in Seattle who were criticizing Seattle for trading him have completely shut up.
I’m still not completely sold on Geno Smith, but right now Seattle is coming out smelling like a rose. We got all these draft picks that we’re sitting on, and now because of Wilson’s performance, that decision actually seems a bit genius.
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I was telling a friend yesterday, is it any wonder why Tom Brady keeps coming back? Indy and Denver were projected by many to be among the two best teams from the AFC, the superior conference, and both look putrid on offense this week. Brady has to see that and think, "I can play till I'm 50 and keep winning." :lol :lol
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(https://i.postimg.cc/hvPj6kHJ/FB-IMG-1665273078735.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/qhS4C5B0)
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Hate these overseas games, but I'm so happy and shocked to see how the Giants have been so gutsy this season. A credit to the coach.
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Yep, Brian Daboll might already be the coach of the year. Getting a team with Daniel Jones at QB to 4-1 is a minor miracle.
Meanwhile, the Packers are still the Packers. The body language of both Rodgers and LaFleur in the whole last half of the 4th quarter was downtrodden, like, "I can't believe we are going to lose this game." Great works, fellas. I fully expected the Packers to not score on that drive that took up most of the last few minutes of the game simply because Rodgers has too poor of a track record in those situations.
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Dan Campbell has cost the Lions 10 points today.
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NFL officiating is such a joke at this point. And what a shock that TB12 is the beneficiary yet again.
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NFL officiating is such a joke at this point. And what a shock that TB12 is the beneficiary yet again.
That was an awful call.
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NFL officiating is such a joke at this point. And what a shock that TB12 is the beneficiary yet again.
In other news, the sun rose this morning.
That was one of two iffy calls to extend that drive. Nothing to see here.
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Sorry, Hef. *hugs*
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NFL officiating is such a joke at this point. And what a shock that TB12 is the beneficiary yet again.
That was an awful call.
The funniest part was that not only did Brady got a bogus roughing the passer call in his favor, but he threw his foot up and tried to kick the guy who sacked him (clear unsportsmanlike) and that was perfectly okay.
Seems like every NFL talking head/analyst is railing on Twitter today about awful that call is, but I am sure the NFL will ignore it and while laughing and counting their money while their overall product continues to decline.
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Poor little Tommy always acts like a little bitch when a defender has the nerve to touch him. Never forgot him going at Ed Reed with his spikes aimed at his groin. Guy is 100% douche while his fans bury their faces in the sand.
Seen some hilarious posts on Twitter. One example: Brady fought harder to get that flag than he did for his marriage :lol :lol
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I agree it was the worst call ever but I do love that he's still in your heads. It pleases me.
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Commenting on something means it is in our heads? Let's get real.
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Actually yes. Not that I have a horse in this race with Tampa but he dominated for 2 decades and it bothers so many.
It's like none of you get that superstars get preferential treatment. So to see the outrage online is hilarious. To mecits funny how most respond. They take it so personally and respond poorly to a player.
To me, he's grating on fans.
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It’s more than the superstar getting preferential treatment. Obviously that happens in all sports. It’s how Brady carries himself that infuriates me. You never saw Peyton Manning throwing shit on the sideline when things weren’t going his way. Sure he may have had some heated conversations, but there were no temper tantrums. Tom Brady acts like a child when he doesn’t get his way, and when you’re a fan who has watched him get his way constantly, especially if you grew up a fan of the Bills, Dolphins, or Jets in the 2000’s and 2010’s, you grow tired of him crying his way to victory.
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Yep, he is the MJ of football: great player, miserable human being. As noted before, he has shown his ass since leaving NE.
Oops, I just commented on him again. That must mean he is in my head. :lol :lol :\ :\
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It's funny. You guys hated him when he didn't act this way in N.E. Not that he's away from Belichick and his discipline, you are all over it. So it really isn't how he acts buy your tired of his winning.
When is this guy going to retire?!
You don't have to admit it. I read it first hand.
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NFL officiating is such a joke at this point. And what a shock that TB12 is the beneficiary yet again.
That was an awful call.
The funniest part was that not only did Brady got a bogus roughing the passer call in his favor, but he threw his foot up and tried to kick the guy who sacked him (clear unsportsmanlike) and that was perfectly okay.
Seems like every NFL talking head/analyst is railing on Twitter today about awful that call is, but I am sure the NFL will ignore it and while laughing and counting their money while their overall product continues to decline.
That call was horrendous. From how I saw it, the DE actually tried to tackle him to the ground 'gently' instead of putting all his force into it. And what if Brady actually connected with his kick into the air. What a joke.
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Jerome 'Booger' is easily the worst ref in the NFL right now. How he regularly got high-end games is crazy to me. He's been at the center of 2 ridiculous roughing calls this year already.
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It absolutely baffles me that in "America", greatness is so readily and steadily scorned. At that level, you do what you have to do to win. So what Brady cried at the call? He got it, and his team won. What do you expect him to do? "Oh, no, ref, you really blew that one; you should give them the sack and we'll turn the ball over. Give them a chance to continue their comeback and maybe win the game." GTFO. He - and Belichick - have always done what they had to do to win. Sure it was a bad call; that's on the ref, though, not Brady. He didn't make anyone do something they didn't want to do. Yeah, not really a fan of the kick; at the angle I saw it looked like it should be a penalty too, but again, it wasn't.
On a positive note, the Pats looked good; held Detroit to what, 0-for-6 on 4th downs? Matthew Judon is a beast.
Also, Cooper Rush is the GOAT. He's never lost a start. Not even the great Tom Brady, or Johnny Unitas did that. ;) ;)
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Matt Rhule is gone in Carolina. Thank god.
The rebuilding effort will still be a challenge. Rookie QB is hurt, too many bad QB trades there. Defense should be really good moving forward but who knows which direction Tepper goes...
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Sorry, Hef. *hugs*
Nah, it's cool. You got our coach fired, so thank you!
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It absolutely baffles me that in "America", greatness is so readily and steadily scorned. At that level, you do what you have to do to win. So what Brady cried at the call? He got it, and his team won. What do you expect him to do? "Oh, no, ref, you really blew that one; you should give them the sack and we'll turn the ball over. Give them a chance to continue their comeback and maybe win the game." GTFO. He - and Belichick - have always done what they had to do to win. Sure it was a bad call; that's on the ref, though, not Brady. He didn't make anyone do something they didn't want to do. Yeah, not really a fan of the kick; at the angle I saw it looked like it should be a penalty too, but again, it wasn't.
On a positive note, the Pats looked good; held Detroit to what, 0-for-6 on 4th downs? Matthew Judon is a beast.
Also, Cooper Rush is the GOAT. He's never lost a start. Not even the great Tom Brady, or Johnny Unitas did that. ;) ;)
The Brady roughing call was probably only the 3rd worst I saw yesterday. It's the one that matters because it's Brady, though. Nobody's talking about how the refs are coddling the great Jarred Goff. :lol
Roughing the passer has become far too difficult to avoid, though. I don't like the call{s}, but they are what they are.
I picked NE yesterday because they had improved every single week of the season. Yesterday was the first time I didn't see any improvement from the week before, but that likely has more to do with McCorkle being out. The D still looks very good. Having Jacobi Meyers back definitely helps. Davante Adams drawing a flag every time he's thrown to is quite a boon. Jack Jones is looking like a badass. Biggest issues I'm seeing right now are Isiah Wynn and Nelson Agholor. Nelson at least has some moments here and there, but overall they're both liabilities when they're on the field.
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Just heard El Barto that Agholor played 7% of the snaps yesterday. He grabbed his hamstring so he may be week to week. The Thornton kid was in 42% of the snaps. 49% for for Parker and 54% for Bourne.
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It absolutely baffles me that in "America", greatness is so readily and steadily scorned. At that level, you do what you have to do to win. So what Brady cried at the call? He got it, and his team won. What do you expect him to do? "Oh, no, ref, you really blew that one; you should give them the sack and we'll turn the ball over. Give them a chance to continue their comeback and maybe win the game." GTFO. He - and Belichick - have always done what they had to do to win. Sure it was a bad call; that's on the ref, though, not Brady. He didn't make anyone do something they didn't want to do. Yeah, not really a fan of the kick; at the angle I saw it looked like it should be a penalty too, but again, it wasn't.
On a positive note, the Pats looked good; held Detroit to what, 0-for-6 on 4th downs? Matthew Judon is a beast.
Also, Cooper Rush is the GOAT. He's never lost a start. Not even the great Tom Brady, or Johnny Unitas did that. ;) ;)
The Brady roughing call was probably only the 3rd worst I saw yesterday. It's the one that matters because it's Brady, though. Nobody's talking about how the refs are coddling the great Jarred Goff. :lol
Roughing the passer has become far too difficult to avoid, though. I don't like the call{s}, but they are what they are.
I picked NE yesterday because they had improved every single week of the season. Yesterday was the first time I didn't see any improvement from the week before, but that likely has more to do with McCorkle being out. The D still looks very good. Having Jacobi Meyers back definitely helps. Davante Adams drawing a flag every time he's thrown to is quite a boon. Jack Jones is looking like a badass. Biggest issues I'm seeing right now are Isiah Wynn and Nelson Agholor. Nelson at least has some moments here and there, but overall they're both liabilities when they're on the field.
Is it just me, or are they one of the better tackling teams in the league? There were about three or four really nice, open-field, one-on-one tackles that shut down what could have been big plays.
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Just heard El Barto that Agholor played 7% of the snaps yesterday. He grabbed his hamstring so he may be week to week. The Thornton kid was in 42% of the snaps. 49% for for Parker and 54% for Bourne.
Wasn't it Agholor that coughed up that pick?
Is it just me, or are they one of the better tackling teams in the league? There were about three or four really nice, open-field, one-on-one tackles that shut down what could have been big plays.
I think it might just look that way because of how absolutely awful they were last year. :lol They're definitely majorly improved, and I saw some good open field tackling yesterday. Over the course of the season I've seen some sloppy tackles, too, though. Still, big improvement from last year.
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Yes it was.
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Brady and the penalty: wow, what BS! How else is one supposed to tackle the QB? And good ol' Tom's leg kick....certainly reminded me of this bush league play
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yiKrSVLYujY
against Ed Reed of all people....a player that both Tom and Bill mentioned in an interview as being the smartest player they ever faced.
Saving grace....the Ravens winning that game in Foxborough and moving on to beat the 'Niners in the SB.
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Yes it was.
I'd love to see Thornton get Agholor's snaps during practice this week.
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I'd bet he will. Myers was sorely missed. So damn reliable. Gets open. Doesn't drop passes. Knows to get a 1st down. He does everything the right way.
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Brady and the penalty: wow, what BS! How else is one supposed to tackle the QB? And good ol' Tom's leg kick....certainly reminded me of this bush league play
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yiKrSVLYujY
against Ed Reed of all people....a player that both Tom and Bill mentioned in an interview as being the smartest player they ever faced.
Saving grace....the Ravens winning that game in Foxborough and moving on to beat the 'Niners in the SB.
I forgot about that play, but just more proof that Brady has always been a little bitch.
Careful, though, you talking about him in a negative way at all means he is in your head!!! :lol :lol :lol
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I'll send you personal pictures I took of Brady. :lol
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Mahomes hit after the pass and pushed hard to the ground. No flag.
BUT ALL SUPERSTARS GET PREFERENTIAL TREATMENT.
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I'm not watching. Brady isn't on. :lol
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Mahomes hit after the pass and pushed hard to the ground. No flag.
Didn't realize Stadler was an NFL Ref.
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How do the Raiders even allow Kelce off the line at the goal line?
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No other bad roughing the passer calls you say? Lololol
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That was worse than the Brady call. Just horrendous. I hate the Chiefs though so there is that! haha
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I missed it. I think I was DTFing when whatever happened.
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That kick was legit!
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I didn't see it as I had to run a few errands, but just saw it. That was actually worse than yesterday's roughing call on Bitch Boy Brady. The NFL has officially jumped the shark. I can't take the league seriously anymore.
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(https://i.imgflip.com/6wgfq0.jpg)
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Mahomes trips, falls, gets up…and then is legitimately tackled and sacked at the LV 12 with 3 minutes left in the 3rd quarter…much worse than Brady yesterday. No flag!
Why? Because it simply a good tackle. Didn’t see Patrick whine or try to kick Perriman afterwards
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Josh McDaniels is now 6-21 in his last 27 games as an NFL head coach.
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Why someone gave Hoodie Jr another shot at being a head coach is beyond me. He'll be back on the Pats sidelines next year, most likely.
Feel bad for the team, they deserve a real head coach.
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Great win by the Jets yesterday. Not feeling too good about winning against another team's 3rd String QB (and I hope Teddy is OK - I've always liked him, and he seems like a class act), but I'll take scoring 40 points against that Miami Dolphins.
Anyway.... Guess what. I took a look at the Monday Night Football schedule for next week, and who do we have but the Charges and the effin Broncos. The Broncos and Russel Wilson are going to be the most hated team/player in the league by the end of the season (which is saying something, since Brady's still in the league).
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Great comeback last night. After watching the game I realized Chris Jones has been the #1 recipient of terrible flags. Never forget the nothing-the-passer against Brady (of course) in 2018 which cost the Chiefs the AFC Championship; then the taunting call against the Colts a couple weeks ago which gave them their only loss, and then last night. I'm probably wrong but I can't recall this happening to another player so often in such egregious fashion but I suppose it's recency bias.
As to what DragonAttack just posted, yes there's a reason why Pat never reacts that way - he's not a whiny bitch.
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He will be. They all do. Look at Marino at the end of their careers. They become impatient with players, coached and refs because they see the game that many others don't.
Add that it's easier to get a call these days so make a fuss and the refs crumble.
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Mahomes hit after the pass and pushed hard to the ground. No flag.
BUT ALL SUPERSTARS GET PREFERENTIAL TREATMENT.
Don't start; I watched about six minutes of that game and saw TWO gimme penalties against the Raiders, including one after a missed field goal that gave them first down and led to Kelce's fourth TD. (Though there was one against them too; Carr got brought down and while I didn't see the play, Scott Van Pelt was complaining about the flag on that one too).
From what I saw, the Raiders LOST that game as much as the Chiefs won it. Adams has to make that catch. That two point conversion looked closer than the refs made it out to be. The Raiders have the right idea, they just aren't executing to the level of a NFL-level team college-level team Pop Warner-level team. I'm no McDaniels fan, but I think their point differential is what, negative five points?
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Why someone gave Hoodie Jr another shot at being a head coach is beyond me. He'll be back on the Pats sidelines next year, most likely.
Feel bad for the team, they deserve a real head coach.
Not sure he'll be welcome in New England next time. Partly because I think Bill wants O'Brien back as OC, and mostly because JMD poached several of NE's assistants when he left, and that's the sort of thing Bill will hold a grudge over. Also not sure he won't turn out to be alright in LV.
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But he wins. I'll take "Whiny Bitch for seven rings, Alex" all day long. That call against Brady wasn't the only really questionable roughing the passer call even just this week. This is a league problem, not a Brady problem.
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He will be. They all do. Look at Marino at the end of their careers. They become impatient with players, coached and refs because they see the game that many others don't.
Add that it's easier to get a call these days so make a fuss and the refs crumble.
Honestly, if I was a Chiefs fan - and I'm not really, though I've come to respect Reid as a coach - I'd actually want him trying harder for the edge. I want guys on my team that will do just about anything to win, short of seriously hurting another player or themselves.
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Why someone gave Hoodie Jr another shot at being a head coach is beyond me. He'll be back on the Pats sidelines next year, most likely.
Feel bad for the team, they deserve a real head coach.
Not sure he'll be welcome in New England next time. Partly because I think Bill wants O'Brien back as OC, and mostly because JMD poached several of NE's assistants when he left, and that's the sort of thing Bill will hold a grudge over. Also not sure he won't turn out to be alright in LV.
The team is bought in to his system, and he has decent players. The execution problem is fixable; if he fixes it, he will get the last laugh. I agree with you; I think Bill wants O'Brien in there. That's the next step, not Josh McDaniels.
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Yeah, that bad call almost cost KC the game. Loved it when the two Raiders receivers ran into each other on that last play. I think I remember that happening to the Raiders several years ago. :lol
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31 other fan bases: Tom Brady gets all the roughing the passer calls!
Facts:
(https://i.postimg.cc/qB2L3r8y/20221011-173813.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
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Here's my take on it. Going back to the Tua incident when he was slammed to the ground last week. They didn't call that when I think they should've. How is hitting a QB in the head and neck area an obvious penalty but unnecessarily slamming him to the ground isn't a penalty until it happens to TB a week later? Oh no! We can't have a concussed TB now can we? The tackles of Tua and Brady happened the exact same way. I think the refs try way too hard to compensate for previous mistakes. It was pretty damn obvious last night after the Derek Carr incident which was a perfectly executed sack/fumble recovery by KC and the penalty almost cost them the game.
:dunno:
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Mahomes hit after the pass and pushed hard to the ground. No flag.
BUT ALL SUPERSTARS GET PREFERENTIAL TREATMENT.
Don't start; I watched about six minutes of that game and saw TWO gimme penalties against the Raiders, including one after a missed field goal that gave them first down and led to Kelce's fourth TD. (Though there was one against them too; Carr got brought down and while I didn't see the play, Scott Van Pelt was complaining about the flag on that one too).
From what I saw, the Raiders LOST that game as much as the Chiefs won it. Adams has to make that catch. That two point conversion looked closer than the refs made it out to be. The Raiders have the right idea, they just aren't executing to the level of a NFL-level team college-level team Pop Warner-level team. I'm no McDaniels fan, but I think their point differential is what, negative five points?
No, I am gonna start. The play I referenced in the quote above was a nothing-burger just like the one on BBB Sunday. Later in the game, Mahomes was flung to the ground way worse than BBB...no flag. Consistency is the issue, yes, but not every QB is wearing diapers and going to cry to the officials every time he gets touched. You can dress it up as BB and BBB doing whatever it takes to win, and I get that most athletes and coaches at the level will do it, but it's about the optics. I think it's annoying as hell when a receiver throws his arms up in the arm for a flag every time a DB makes a good play on a pass, and it's just as annoying when QBs beg for calls. Do we really want (American) football to turn into soccer where everyone is flopping and begging for calls?
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It's annoying in any sport.
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31 other fan bases: Tom Brady gets all the roughing the passer calls!
Facts:
(https://i.postimg.cc/qB2L3r8y/20221011-173813.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
Nothing like longevity to make the law of averages really work out for you. :lol
Also, roughing the passer calls are way down this year. Relative to the last 5 years it's kind of been open season on QBs as far as the zebras are concerned.
As was suggested, it's just the inconsistency of it. And in something like RtP that is necessarily subjective you're not going to get steady, predictable calls. The Brady chart shows just that. The problem is that you get into a trough like this and people demand change. As Stadler the Lawyer would say, great cases make terrible laws. Look no further than the Saints no-call in the NFC championship game for the best example. That saddled us with a worthless review system for a year because something, anything, needed to be done. A few shitty calls this year combined with the public's appetite for delicious, satisfying outrage now have the NFL second guessing itself, and that never turns out well. And if the NFL is foolish enough to try and come up with some procedural remedy, advising the refs differently, the vultures will eat them alive. There's nothing really that can be done.
And truthfully, that's fine. That outrage is just as compelling as the product they're selling. Kev can lament the death of the NFL and how silly it's become, but he'll still watch it, in part because of how silly it's become.
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31 other fan bases: Tom Brady gets all the roughing the passer calls!
Facts:
(https://i.postimg.cc/qB2L3r8y/20221011-173813.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
Those may be facts, but they don't prove what you think they prove. The relevant fact is not how many RtP penalties were called against either side, but how many were called that shouldn't have been called. A game can be called perfectly fairly and 100% consistent with the rules, and you still wouldn't expect the penalties to necessarily be equal because some teams just commit more penalties. There isn't really a stat to measure what you are trying to show.
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It proves that people that scream that Brady gets all the calls are wrong. It proves that in his career, the other QB's got roughing the passer calls 10 more times in the games he has played.
That is a fact.
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El Barto, wouldn't you say the real problem is the Rules Committee? The more they add, the more convoluted it is for referees?
Too many rules left for interpretation.
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31 other fan bases: Tom Brady gets all the roughing the passer calls!
Facts:
(https://i.postimg.cc/qB2L3r8y/20221011-173813.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
Those may be facts, but they don't prove what you think they prove. The relevant fact is not how many RtP penalties were called against either side, but how many were called that shouldn't have been called. A game can be called perfectly fairly and 100% consistent with the rules, and you still wouldn't expect the penalties to necessarily be equal because some teams just commit more penalties. There isn't really a stat to measure what you are trying to show.
This is really nerd territory isn't it? I mean, all the nerd stats in sports are things like "Expected Hits", Expected Catch Rate", etc..
Do we start rating teams on "Expected Super Bowls"?
My post isn't to support anything Brady, but what Joe posted are actual results.
I feel like over time, sure Brady got some questionable calls, but you'd have to assume that the Pats D were whistled for some questionable ones as well. Those things even out, unless blind Brady hatred just won't accept it.
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As was suggested, it's just the inconsistency of it. And in something like RtP that is necessarily subjective you're not going to get steady, predictable calls. The Brady chart shows just that. The problem is that you get into a trough like this and people demand change. As Stadler the Lawyer would say, great cases make terrible laws. Look no further than the Saints no-call in the NFC championship game for the best example. That saddled us with a worthless review system for a year because something, anything, needed to be done. A few shitty calls this year combined with the public's appetite for delicious, satisfying outrage now have the NFL second guessing itself, and that never turns out well. And if the NFL is foolish enough to try and come up with some procedural remedy, advising the refs differently, the vultures will eat them alive. There's nothing really that can be done.
And truthfully, that's fine. That outrage is just as compelling as the product they're selling. Kev can lament the death of the NFL and how silly it's become, but he'll still watch it, in part because of how silly it's become.
Habit is why I will still watch, to be honest, but I'd think a lot more of the NFL if they just came out and said, "Football is a brutal sport and injuries happen," but they can't do that because they are scared of lawsuits now because of CTE and all that comes with it, so they have to pretend like they care when it's obvious that they don't. I mean, if they really did, RBs wouldn't still be allowed to put their heads down and crash into defenders helmets first when running through the gap, but QBs sell tickets and get ratings, so they get protected and everyone else is fair game to get knocked the fuck out.
Not that I root for injuries, but I'd almost like to see a defender absolutely drill a QB this weekend with a late hit and then after the game say, "Well, you are going to throw a flag on me if I breathe on the QB, so I might as get my pound of flesh." It won't happen, because I don't believe most defenders want to head hunt, not to mention the league would hammer them with a fine and suspension, but it would send a message that defenders are tired of getting shit on.
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It proves that people that scream that Brady gets all the calls are wrong. It proves that in his career, the other QB's got roughing the passer calls 10 more times in the games he has played.
That is a fact.
Yeah, but like bosk said, the totals don't necessarily prove everything. It's not about how many times roughing the passer was called, but how many times it was called when it shouldn't have been. Let's take a fictional game between the Jets and Patriots (and you know it's fictional because I'm going to say the Jets won this game handily :lol). If the Patriots get flagged for roughing the passer 5 times, but all were legitimate penalties and the Jets were flagged three times, but only two should have been called, then Brady get the benefit of the doubt even though the Patriots got more total roughing the passer flags.
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This is really nerd territory isn't it? I mean, all the nerd stats in sports are things like "Expected Hits", Expected Catch Rate", etc..
Do we start rating teams on "Expected Super Bowls"?
My post isn't to support anything Brady, but what Joe posted are actual results.
I feel like over time, sure Brady got some questionable calls, but you'd have to assume that the Pats D were whistled for some questionable ones as well. Those things even out, unless blind Brady hatred just won't accept it.
Well, facts without context are fun, especially when they come from a Twitter (always reliable when it comes to facts :lol :lol :lol :lol) handle whose entire account is dedicated to slurping BBB.
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31 other fan bases: Tom Brady gets all the roughing the passer calls!
Facts:
(https://i.postimg.cc/qB2L3r8y/20221011-173813.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
Those may be facts, but they don't prove what you think they prove. The relevant fact is not how many RtP penalties were called against either side, but how many were called that shouldn't have been called. A game can be called perfectly fairly and 100% consistent with the rules, and you still wouldn't expect the penalties to necessarily be equal because some teams just commit more penalties. There isn't really a stat to measure what you are trying to show.
This is really nerd territory isn't it? I mean, all the nerd stats in sports are things like "Expected Hits", Expected Catch Rate", etc..
Do we start rating teams on "Expected Super Bowls"?
My post isn't to support anything Brady, but what Joe posted are actual results.
I feel like over time, sure Brady got some questionable calls, but you'd have to assume that the Pats D were whistled for some questionable ones as well. Those things even out, unless blind Brady hatred just won't accept it.
That's where my money is riding. There is literally no fact in the world that will slake the hate. And again I have to ask: why is it that in a country that professes to be the "greatest in the world", is "greatness" so readily mocked and shunned?
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This is really nerd territory isn't it? I mean, all the nerd stats in sports are things like "Expected Hits", Expected Catch Rate", etc..
Do we start rating teams on "Expected Super Bowls"?
My post isn't to support anything Brady, but what Joe posted are actual results.
I feel like over time, sure Brady got some questionable calls, but you'd have to assume that the Pats D were whistled for some questionable ones as well. Those things even out, unless blind Brady hatred just won't accept it.
Well, facts without context are fun, especially when they come from a Twitter (always reliable when it comes to facts :lol :lol :lol :lol) handle whose entire account is dedicated to slurping BBB.
What's the "BBB" reference? Who is that?
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Tim, that's my point. People are blinded by there ties to the teams they love and the hate they have. I put one fact out. Brady gets less roughing the passer calls then the other QB's he's face off against. People will twist themselves to dismiss hard data because of their hate of a player they are tired of him dominating. Does he bitch more than the past? 100% Is he getting more rouging the passer calls? Doesn't seem so.
Using the last 3 regular seasons for this example, he had 5 called for him while the other QB's have received 11 of those calls. That is a fact.
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I heard a stat this morning where roughing penalties are down by around 40% compared to this time last year. I also think we're seeing an over correction from the refs because of the Tua debacle.
I will concede though, Brady knows how to work the refs......
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I will concede though, Brady knows how to work the refs......
I'm sure there's truth to this. But what does that mean exactly?
Not directing this at Hunnus...
If Joe's stats are correct, RtP calls on Brady are significantly less than against his opponent.
You don't have to be a Brady Bobo to see that. A quick glance tells me that they are less in 13 of the 20 years.
Are some of those calls iffy? Sure. But are some of the calls against the Pats D iffy then? Only a fool would say no and that they are 100% legit.
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El Barto, wouldn't you say the real problem is the Rules Committee? The more they add, the more convoluted it is for referees?
Too many rules left for interpretation.
No, I think the problem is with the fans. Fans egged on by talking heads (and in this case disembodied voices) who trade in uproar. Application of some rules will necessarily be subjective. Them's just the breaks. Subjective calls will neither be consistent nor predictable, and sometimes they'll seem ridiculous. As I've always said, it all evens out in the end. It's shitty when it happens at a point where there's no time left for it to work itself out, but that's typically the exception.
The trick here will be for the league to ignore all of the bitching and moaning and not overreact.
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I get that too. The advent of HD instant replay has added ten fold to what you're talking about.
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I get that too. The advent of HD instant replay has added ten fold to what you're talking about.
And it's the same conversation we've been having for decades. Mostly PI calls, but also bad spots, and that whole thing about what actually is a catch. As soon as a delay of game non-call costs a team a game we'll see the same thing. I'm pretty sure that'll be the next uproar.
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That's where my money is riding. There is literally no fact in the world that will slake the hate. And again I have to ask: why is it that in a country that professes to be the "greatest in the world", is "greatness" so readily mocked and shunned?
I will remember this the next time you question the greatness of Mahomes, who, by the standards set in this thread this week, is clearly in your head. :)
What's the "BBB" reference? Who is that?
Bitch Boy Brady. It saves me keystrokes. :P
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I will concede though, Brady knows how to work the refs......
I'm sure there's truth to this. But what does that mean exactly?
Not directing this at Hunnus...
If Joe's stats are correct, RtP calls on Brady are significantly less than against his opponent.
You don't have to be a Brady Bobo to see that. A quick glance tells me that they are less in 13 of the 20 years.
Are some of those calls iffy? Sure. But are some of the calls against the Pats D iffy then? Only a fool would say no and that they are 100% legit.
What I mean is that Brady has been around for eons and has developed a rapport or even friendships with the refs. I wouldn't be a bit surprised if a ref or two asked him for an autographed jersey or football or whatever. Do you think he's going to get a favorable call or spot of the football?1
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I heard a stat this morning where roughing penalties are down by around 40% compared to this time last year. I also think we're seeing an over correction from the refs because of the Tua debacle.
I will concede though, Brady knows how to work the refs......
And I'll say again: as a fan, I want my players to be doing everything they can within the rules (and maybe even without) to win, including lobbying the refs. If Mahomes isn't doing that, and I'm a Chiefs fan, I'm wondering why he's not giving that little extra. None of this is a character flaw or an indication of their moral fibre, and it's ridiculous that so many people want to make it so.
I'm the nicest guy on the planet in real life. I haven't been in a real fight in over three decades. I think that - except for TAC, because we weren't drinking, and except for Adami who doesn't drink - I think I've bought a beer for every person on this board that I've met in real life. But when I was playing hockey? Come into the crease and you're getting the butt end of my stick in your balls. It's just what happens when you're scrapping in front of the net in hockey. I want that other player thinking twice before they come into the crease when I'm on the ice. Playing softball; am I faking that the throw is going to another base so you stand up into third instead of sliding? Of course I am. Am I pointing to the mark on the ground where the ball landed (out of the strike zone) after the ump called a strike? Of course I am. I want every one of my teammates to know that I will do anything in my power to help the team win. I'm not really interested in what the girlfriend of the other team's player has to say about what I'm doing.
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What I mean is that Brady has been around for eons and has developed a rapport or even friendships with the refs. I wouldn't be a bit surprised if a ref or two asked him for an autographed jersey or football or whatever. Do you think he's going to get a favorable call or spot of the football?1
That's certainly a reasonable deduction. So I have never said it wouldn't or hasn't happened, but I think people tend to overstate it, that's all.
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That's where my money is riding. There is literally no fact in the world that will slake the hate. And again I have to ask: why is it that in a country that professes to be the "greatest in the world", is "greatness" so readily mocked and shunned?
I will remember this the next time you question the greatness of Mahomes, who, by the standards set in this thread this week, is clearly in your head. :)
I'll say again: I have no beef with Mahomes. He is a great player; right this second, he's probably the best active QB in the league right now. I don't have pet names for him; he's not "my bitch boy". My SOLE BEEF with anything to do with Patrick Mahomes is the anointing. My SOLE BEEF with him is putting him in the echelon of greats based on what he MIGHT do, not what he's done (and that includes not just A great season, but a run of a DECADE OR MORE of great seasons).
VERY VERY VERY different than the very personal hatred for Brady the MAN, where not only are his amazing on-field exploits down-played and minimized, but also his character and personality are judged as if they matter in terms of playing football.
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I will concede though, Brady knows how to work the refs......
I'm sure there's truth to this. But what does that mean exactly?
Not directing this at Hunnus...
If Joe's stats are correct, RtP calls on Brady are significantly less than against his opponent.
You don't have to be a Brady Bobo to see that. A quick glance tells me that they are less in 13 of the 20 years.
Are some of those calls iffy? Sure. But are some of the calls against the Pats D iffy then? Only a fool would say no and that they are 100% legit.
What I mean is that Brady has been around for eons and has developed a rapport or even friendships with the refs. I wouldn't be a bit surprised if a ref or two asked him for an autographed jersey or football or whatever. Do you think he's going to get a favorable call or spot of the football?1
I count fairness as one of my stronger qualities. To that end, I'm more likely to err on the side of "you're wrong!" with my friends, and give my "enemies" the benefit of the doubt. BBB has worked with these refs for a long time, and I'm sure they do know him. I also think these guys are capable of calling him out when need be, and in a judgement call, those same guys that know him will probably go the opposite direction. Partly for appearance, and partly because they can.
Something that I've always assumed is that refs are football fans. I couldn't be a side judge and not appreciate a spectacular sideline catch, or a player tiptoeing along the sideline without stepping out. Their job doesn't allow them to shout "holy shit, what a catch!" They've got work to do. During a lull in the action a few minutes later I suspect they probably will sneak over to tell him "that was a hell of a catch." I know I certainly would. "Helluva throw, Tommy" probably comes up a lot. Shouldn't really effect anything.
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Overlooked this week in lieu of roughing calls was Davante Adams shoving a cameraman down when leaving the field. He's now been charged with assault in the matter. This certainly ups the odds of the league suspending him. More interesting to me is JMD's stance on this. Seems like it would have been a good opportunity to assert some authority, and a team first attitude. And it would have been a freebee. Announce immediately afterward that it was unacceptable and suspend him for a game, knowing that the league is going to suspend him anyway. Essentially saying "yeah, not our problem, let the league sort it out" isn't a very good look.
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Overlooked this week in lieu of roughing calls was Davante Adams shoving a cameraman down when leaving the field. He's now been charged with assault in the matter. This certainly ups the odds of the league suspending him. More interesting to me is JMD's stance on this. Seems like it would have been a good opportunity to assert some authority, and a team first attitude. And it would have been a freebee. Announce immediately afterward that it was unacceptable and suspend him for a game, knowing that the league is going to suspend him anyway. Essentially saying "yeah, not our problem, let the league sort it out" isn't a very good look.
Don't disagree. Adams apologized in the post-game interview, so he's taking responsibility, but that only goes so far.
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Overlooked this week in lieu of roughing calls was Davante Adams shoving a cameraman down when leaving the field. He's now been charged with assault in the matter. This certainly ups the odds of the league suspending him. More interesting to me is JMD's stance on this. Seems like it would have been a good opportunity to assert some authority, and a team first attitude. And it would have been a freebee. Announce immediately afterward that it was unacceptable and suspend him for a game, knowing that the league is going to suspend him anyway. Essentially saying "yeah, not our problem, let the league sort it out" isn't a very good look.
Don't disagree. Adams apologized in the post-game interview, so he's taking responsibility, but that only goes so far.
You see the apology? More than a little half-assed. :lol
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Was there more than the twitter thing he wrote? He was like 'hey cameraman hope you see this I'm sorry bro'.
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"I want to apologize to the guy, there was some guy running off the field, and he ran, like jumped in front of me coming off the field, and I bumped into him, kind of pushed him, and he ended up on the ground. So I wanted to say sorry to him for that because that was just frustration mixed with him literally just running in front of me. I shouldn't have responded that way, but that's how I initially responded. So, I want to apologize to him for that."
Seriously, this is why you talk to your agent and have a proper apology written out for you. :lol
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:lol
Classic!
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Dang that is something.
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He might as well have said "I'm sorry for you running into me."
What El Barto posted is what I heard/saw in the post-game interview.
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The reaction by the sports media to the Adams thing is so bizarre, but not at all surprising.
If that had been a fan who pushed a player, everyone would be calling for the fan to be banned from the stadium and arrested for assault. And both things would have been more than justified.
But Adams pushes a cameraman and he is getting the "he shouldn't have done it, but no way should he be charged with anything" pass from many.
Not sure we can have it both ways.
Odds are, Adams will get a slap on the wrist and pay court costs and a fine, and then have to pay the cameraman a nice wad of cash to make him go away, and all will be fine. He made a big mistake, which he will, and should, pay for, but I don't think this is a major indictment on him, as he seems like a good dude who has had no issues prior.
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That's where my money is riding. There is literally no fact in the world that will slake the hate. And again I have to ask: why is it that in a country that professes to be the "greatest in the world", is "greatness" so readily mocked and shunned?
I will remember this the next time you question the greatness of Mahomes, who, by the standards set in this thread this week, is clearly in your head. :)
I'll say again: I have no beef with Mahomes. He is a great player; right this second, he's probably the best active QB in the league right now. I don't have pet names for him; he's not "my bitch boy". My SOLE BEEF with anything to do with Patrick Mahomes is the anointing. My SOLE BEEF with him is putting him in the echelon of greats based on what he MIGHT do, not what he's done (and that includes not just A great season, but a run of a DECADE OR MORE of great seasons).
VERY VERY VERY different than the very personal hatred for Brady the MAN, where not only are his amazing on-field exploits down-played and minimized, but also his character and personality are judged as if they matter in terms of playing football.
Okay, but how many are really putting him in the GOAT conversation already based on what he might do? This feels like one of those things someone said once and then boneheads on Twitter love to spout and now all of a sudden it is a narrative being pushed by many, when that really isn't the case. I find it best to not put much stock into what the mob is saying on Twitter. I suspect you know this as well. :)
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BIG +1 to Kev.
There are A LOT of avenues where the dialog is a mile wide and an inch deep…and often made to sound as if it’s more popular than it actually is.
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BIG +1 to Kev.
There are A LOT of avenues where the dialog is a mile wide and an inch deep…and often made to sound as if it’s more popular than it actually is.
(https://media.tenor.com/2cj5umkSaswAAAAd/ted-lasso-tedlassogifs.gif)
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The reaction by the sports media to the Adams thing is so bizarre, but not at all surprising.
If that had been a fan who pushed a player, everyone would be calling for the fan to be banned from the stadium and arrested for assault. And both things would have been more than justified.
But Adams pushes a cameraman and he is getting the "he shouldn't have done it, but no way should he be charged with anything" pass from many.
Not sure we can have it both ways.
Odds are, Adams will get a slap on the wrist and pay court costs and a fine, and then have to pay the cameraman a nice wad of cash to make him go away, and all will be fine. He made a big mistake, which he will, and should, pay for, but I don't think this is a major indictment on him, as he seems like a good dude who has had no issues prior.
But they are not really on the same level, though. I don't know; I think I have to stew on this a bit, but I see differences between the cameraman and the player, and a fan who inserts themselves into the conversation.
What about that guy that lit off a smoke bomb in his shorts and was tackled on the field by one of the Rams players (https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/priscos-nfl-week-6-picks-bills-avenge-playoff-heartbreak-vs-chiefs-eagles-survive-cowboys-to-stay-perfect/)? He filed a police report after the incident... I'm the cops or the DA, I'm laughing in that guys face. You were where you CLEARLY didn't belong, doing things you CLEARLY shouldn't have been doing. That doesn't justify EVERYTHING that could happen, but still. I imagine that as a "protestor" he'd be the first to whine about "consequences", but when it's on him, all bets are off apparently.
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Feature piece on Danny Snyder and the owner's mafia.
Sources: Commanders boss Snyder claims 'dirt' on NFL owners, Goodell (https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/34778123/washington-commanders-owner-dan-snyder-claims-dirt-nfl-owners-roger-goodell)
The stuff about Snyder isn't all that new, or even interesting (though I wasn't aware of the trainer dealing oxy). He was a well known scumbag ever since he came aboard. It provides more insight into the inner workings of the owners, though, and that does interest me. They really are somewhat akin to the mafia. They're all quite friendly while being competitive with each other, but they're also acutely aware that any one of them could get figuratively gunned down at a toll plaza. What they're reporting sounds like exactly the same backbiting that was going on around deflategate, with the owners divided into factions. Except that in this case Snyder is a faction of 1.
"The NFL is a mafia," he recently told an associate. "All the owners hate each other."
"That's not true," one veteran owner says. "All the owners hate Dan."
Probably true that the owners don't hate each other. Vito and Michael both understood that you didn't take these things personally. It's just business. Sonny took things personally and we all know how that turned out.
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There is a pettiness to the owner like children, jealous of the other child that has the ice cream cone. It amazes me the lengths they will go through to tarnish each other.
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That's where my money is riding. There is literally no fact in the world that will slake the hate. And again I have to ask: why is it that in a country that professes to be the "greatest in the world", is "greatness" so readily mocked and shunned?
I will remember this the next time you question the greatness of Mahomes, who, by the standards set in this thread this week, is clearly in your head. :)
I'll say again: I have no beef with Mahomes. He is a great player; right this second, he's probably the best active QB in the league right now. I don't have pet names for him; he's not "my bitch boy". My SOLE BEEF with anything to do with Patrick Mahomes is the anointing. My SOLE BEEF with him is putting him in the echelon of greats based on what he MIGHT do, not what he's done (and that includes not just A great season, but a run of a DECADE OR MORE of great seasons).
VERY VERY VERY different than the very personal hatred for Brady the MAN, where not only are his amazing on-field exploits down-played and minimized, but also his character and personality are judged as if they matter in terms of playing football.
Okay, but how many are really putting him in the GOAT conversation already based on what he might do? This feels like one of those things someone said once and then boneheads on Twitter love to spout and now all of a sudden it is a narrative being pushed by many, when that really isn't the case. I find it best to not put much stock into what the mob is saying on Twitter. I suspect you know this as well. :)
No, I already (largely) ignore the Twitter-verse. There's some really whack people on there. But it's not just limited to Twitter; it's people here (if I'm reading them right), the announcers, and some of the analysts as well. I've heard announcers that know better saying shit they shouldn't be saying. The "baton passing" between Brady - who is the greatest offensive player to ever have played the game - and Mahomes. Mahomes is not the next on the list of "greatest offensive players of all time" still active in the league. YET. That's not the baton. YET. It might well be. But it's not yet.
Look, Bill Parcells should know; he's been in football his entire life on both sides of the mic. If he's lamenting "the anointings" (not just of Mahomes, but in general) then it's a good bet there's SOMETHING to it. We are a "super size", "extreme", "deluxe" society with zero patience. It shouldn't surprise anyone that what sells is not waiting for nature to take it's course, but to move to the next generation NOW, like it's an f-ing iPhone for shit's sake.
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Honestly, Bill Parcells not liking something isn't reason for anything. He's a sourpuss who doesn't like ANYTHING. He's not crazy about the forward pass rule being adopted.
Say what you want about Mahomes, he's one of the greatest offensive players I've ever seen, and I see no reason for that not to continue, barring some devastating injury.
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Honestly, Bill Parcells not liking something isn't reason for anything. He's a sourpuss who doesn't like ANYTHING. He's not crazy about the forward pass rule being adopted.
Say what you want about Mahomes, he's one of the greatest offensive players I've ever seen, and I see no reason for that not to continue, barring some devastating injury.
There was no reason that Don Gullett shouldn't have had 300 wins and 3,000 strikeouts, baring some devastating injury. Oh wait...
Bo Jackson, Gale Sayers, Priest Holmes...
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Don Gullett?! That's a next level pull! Also, his number don't bear that out, even if you extrapolate over a 20 year career.
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Honestly, Bill Parcells not liking something isn't reason for anything. He's a sourpuss who doesn't like ANYTHING. He's not crazy about the forward pass rule being adopted.
Say what you want about Mahomes, he's one of the greatest offensive players I've ever seen, and I see no reason for that not to continue, barring some devastating injury.
Well, one can dream, right?
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Hey Denver, how are you liking Russell Wilson going full Russ mode? Apparently he is launching a new line of clothing, and in a Tweet referred to his fans (I guess...?) as the 3s. You know... like fans of the Seahawks were the 12s.
I am thankful for all he did for the Seahawk fans and franchise, and equally happy we are through with this clown.
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I know the game last night was awful, but has anyone else tried watching the Thursday night games in Prime Vision?
Or was that discussed and I missed it?
Anyway, I think it's a cool option to have, and therefore only possible on a streaming service like Prime. I definitely wouldn't want to be forced to watch every game, or even an entire individual game, like that, but it's neat.
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I know the game last night was awful, but has anyone else tried watching the Thursday night games in Prime Vision?
Or was that discussed and I missed it?
Anyway, I think it's a cool option to have, and therefore only possible on a streaming service like Prime. I definitely wouldn't want to be forced to watch every game, or even an entire individual game, like that, but it's neat.
Yes I have mentioned this and yes I think it sucks! :tdwn
There are plenty of times when I want to surf, especially during a boring game and I can't easily do it. I dunno, maybe it's my setup but if they start streaming on Saturday or Sunday, I will definitely be out except for my team.
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There's been buffering issues with it Hef. Not the end of the world but with what we all pay for TV and streaming I expect better.
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What about that guy that lit off a smoke bomb in his shorts and was tackled on the field by one of the Rams players (https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/priscos-nfl-week-6-picks-bills-avenge-playoff-heartbreak-vs-chiefs-eagles-survive-cowboys-to-stay-perfect/)? He filed a police report after the incident... I'm the cops or the DA, I'm laughing in that guys face. You were where you CLEARLY didn't belong, doing things you CLEARLY shouldn't have been doing. That doesn't justify EVERYTHING that could happen, but still. I imagine that as a "protestor" he'd be the first to whine about "consequences", but when it's on him, all bets are off apparently.
I saw something that said he actually might have a case, but I really hope not. If that guy gets anything other than a fine it sets a bad precedent. I feel like there's already so many more incidents these days of people running onto the fields of various sports. I may be wrong, it just seems like this wasn't so common.
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I know the game last night was awful, but has anyone else tried watching the Thursday night games in Prime Vision?
Or was that discussed and I missed it?
Anyway, I think it's a cool option to have, and therefore only possible on a streaming service like Prime. I definitely wouldn't want to be forced to watch every game, or even an entire individual game, like that, but it's neat.
Yes I have mentioned this and yes I think it sucks! :tdwn
There are plenty of times when I want to surf, especially during a boring game and I can't easily do it. I dunno, maybe it's my setup but if they start streaming on Saturday or Sunday, I will definitely be out except for my team.
I'm not talking about just watching the game on Prime, but using the extra option there called Prime Vision. It incorporates stats and different views, reminiscent of football video games.
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Don Gullett?! That's a next level pull! Also, his number don't bear that out, even if you extrapolate over a 20 year career.
Certainly not the strikeouts; I'll give you that, he wasn't an overpowering pitcher. But he won over 75% of his games in that four year run where the Reds and Yankees won four straight championships between them (Gullett was on all four teams). You extrapolate that out over 12 more years and there you go. But this is precisely my point; he DIDN'T. He slipped on a wet mound early in his Yankee career, spraining his ankle and straining his neck. He was never really the same and after the next season, retired at age 27 with chronic shoulder problems. Because man plans and God laughs.
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I know the game last night was awful, but has anyone else tried watching the Thursday night games in Prime Vision?
Or was that discussed and I missed it?
Anyway, I think it's a cool option to have, and therefore only possible on a streaming service like Prime. I definitely wouldn't want to be forced to watch every game, or even an entire individual game, like that, but it's neat.
Yes I have mentioned this and yes I think it sucks! :tdwn
There are plenty of times when I want to surf, especially during a boring game and I can't easily do it. I dunno, maybe it's my setup but if they start streaming on Saturday or Sunday, I will definitely be out except for my team.
I'm not talking about just watching the game on Prime, but using the extra option there called Prime Vision. It incorporates stats and different views, reminiscent of football video games.
I didn't know that. I'll check it out next week.
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I know the game last night was awful, but has anyone else tried watching the Thursday night games in Prime Vision?
Or was that discussed and I missed it?
Anyway, I think it's a cool option to have, and therefore only possible on a streaming service like Prime. I definitely wouldn't want to be forced to watch every game, or even an entire individual game, like that, but it's neat.
I'd actually be all for watching the game in an All 22 format. Seems like they'd go overboard with the graphics, though. Clearly they're trying to make it look like Madden to draw the kids into it more. Honestly, give me an All 22 view, with closeups for the replays, and give me a proper stadium announcer, and I'd dig the shit out of it.
Sadly, stadium announcers have become the worst part of the game. I can't not hear that idiot in LA calling Rams games and he annoys me to know end.
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I know the game last night was awful, but has anyone else tried watching the Thursday night games in Prime Vision?
Or was that discussed and I missed it?
Anyway, I think it's a cool option to have, and therefore only possible on a streaming service like Prime. I definitely wouldn't want to be forced to watch every game, or even an entire individual game, like that, but it's neat.
I'd actually be all for watching the game in an All 22 format. Seems like they'd go overboard with the graphics, though. Clearly they're trying to make it look like Madden to draw the kids into it more. Honestly, give me an All 22 view, with closeups for the replays, and give me a proper stadium announcer, and I'd dig the shit out of it.
Sadly, stadium announcers have become the worst part of the game. I can't not hear that idiot in LA calling Rams games and he annoys me to know end.
That and if you're going to stream then it takes up a bunch more bandwidth if you're going to show the crowd in the background.
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What about that guy that lit off a smoke bomb in his shorts and was tackled on the field by one of the Rams players (https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/priscos-nfl-week-6-picks-bills-avenge-playoff-heartbreak-vs-chiefs-eagles-survive-cowboys-to-stay-perfect/)? He filed a police report after the incident... I'm the cops or the DA, I'm laughing in that guys face. You were where you CLEARLY didn't belong, doing things you CLEARLY shouldn't have been doing. That doesn't justify EVERYTHING that could happen, but still. I imagine that as a "protestor" he'd be the first to whine about "consequences", but when it's on him, all bets are off apparently.
I saw something that said he actually might have a case, but I really hope not. If that guy gets anything other than a fine it sets a bad precedent. I feel like there's already so many more incidents these days of people running onto the fields of various sports. I may be wrong, it just seems like this wasn't so common.
There is less than zero chance of any criminal prosecution. He can make all the police reports he wants, but there's no way that the cops will make an arrest or the DA will file charges (although it's the SF Bay area, so never say never, I guess).
On the other hand, he's got enough that he might be able to get a nuisance settlement if he files a civil lawsuit. There's no question that the player committed battery under CPC 242, so it's just a matter of whether the player (whose job isn't to apprehend trespassers) had a justification to do it, and the argument will be that he used more than reasonable force. He's likely got enough to get past a summary judgment, which means a cost of defense settlement probably gets put on the table.
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Oh - and little Danny Snyder?
I'm looking forward to this! :corn
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The Washington Whatevers sure pulled one outta their butt...oh wait...the Bears actually pulled it out and handed it over. Hey Snyder, you might want to wash that first. Nothing like watching two horrible teams doing everything in their power to lose the game.
I feel sorry for Al Michaels. He's in the twilight of his career and gets demoted to the basement of primetime play calling. He deserves better than that.
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I feel sorry for Al Michaels. He's in the twilight of his career and gets demoted to the basement of primetime play calling. He deserves better than that.
Demoted? Pretty sure he just went where he was offered the most. Same with Troy, and at the end of the day Troy will have it far, far worse.
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Oh - and little Danny Snyder?
I'm looking forward to this! :corn
I'm no Daniel Snyder fan - except when my team is playing his inevitably shitty team - and I certainly don't condone any bad behavior he might have done, but the notion of forcing someone to sell their asset like that because you don't like them is inherently uncomfortable for me.
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Oh - and little Danny Snyder?
I'm looking forward to this! :corn
I'm no Daniel Snyder fan - except when my team is playing his inevitably shitty team - and I certainly don't condone any bad behavior he might have done, but the notion of forcing someone to sell their asset like that because you don't like them is inherently uncomfortable for me.
I agree. At the same time, forcing somebody to sell their assets because they're a detriment to the cartel doesn't. After all, it's not the league who's forcing him out, Goodell seems to be backing him on this, but rather the other 31 owners.
Also, I suppose they'd probably be fine with him putting the team into a trust so that he has no strings to pull.
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He also has destroyed their brand. Remember how revered that Franchise was? Ever since he bought the team it's been scandal after scandal.
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I feel sorry for Al Michaels. He's in the twilight of his career and gets demoted to the basement of primetime play calling. He deserves better than that.
Demoted? Pretty sure he just went where he was offered the most. Same with Troy, and at the end of the day Troy will have it far, far worse.
Oh yeah, I'm sure they offered him a lot to go call shitty TNF games, but I wasn't really referring to money. He went from MNF to SNF and eventually to TNF. There's a drop off...
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For a couple of years, John Riggins hosted a radio show in the DC area, that was telecast on a local Comcast TV station. I watched it a couple of times a week back in the mid 00's to around 2011. Him and his cohort tore the absolute stuffing out of 'Danny Snidely' (as they called him repeatedly). Sadly, Riggins was finally forced out. I don't care for brash sportscasting for the sake of being brash, but Riggins was smart and professional in his approach, which made all of those little knives he stuck in Snidely cut even deeper. :tup
And that was in the 'sidelined' owner's good days. Sexual harrassment from top to bottom, financial spreadsheet shenanigans, the BS about the tradition of the 'Potato' nickname, and everything else in between. He's run Fed Ex and the team into a dump, but will benefit somehow in the hundreds of millions while being a totally unlikeable and unmitigated jerk. Will probably run for office soon. ;)
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I feel sorry for Al Michaels. He's in the twilight of his career and gets demoted to the basement of primetime play calling. He deserves better than that.
Demoted? Pretty sure he just went where he was offered the most. Same with Troy, and at the end of the day Troy will have it far, far worse.
Oh yeah, I'm sure they offered him a lot to go call shitty TNF games, but I wasn't really referring to money. He went from MNF to SNF and eventually to TNF. There's a drop off...
Yeah, I just think it was his choice. Like Troy. I'm not going to feel sorry for them. In fact, I lost a fair amount of respect for Aikman. He went from calling the best game of the week to whatever crappy game they picked before the season even started. It'd be like Blackmore taking a gig playing rhythm guitar for LA Guns because the money was good.
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I feel sorry for Al Michaels. He's in the twilight of his career and gets demoted to the basement of primetime play calling. He deserves better than that.
Demoted? Pretty sure he just went where he was offered the most. Same with Troy, and at the end of the day Troy will have it far, far worse.
Oh yeah, I'm sure they offered him a lot to go call shitty TNF games, but I wasn't really referring to money. He went from MNF to SNF and eventually to TNF. There's a drop off...
Yeah, I just think it was his choice. Like Troy. I'm not going to feel sorry for them. In fact, I lost a fair amount of respect for Aikman. He went from calling the best game of the week to whatever crappy game they picked before the season even started. It'd be like Blackmore taking a gig playing rhythm guitar for LA Guns because the money was good.
IDK, is it totally their choice or do these high profile announcers get pressure from the networks to be moved around for the sake of ratings? I'm thinking it's a little of both. You kind of lost me on the Aikman thing. Can you specify a little more?
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Sunday afternoon NFC was always a huge game between mostly teams with good and great records.
No he's doing games like this past Thursday which was putrid. A high % of Thursday night games suck.
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Everyone’s hyping up this Bills - Chiefs thing but the teams are really not evenly matched. Buffalo has a stellar defense and KC as usual . . . does not. Hopefully the game will be worth the hype.
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I'm actually enjoying Al Michaels and Troy, I think they make a good team.
Got to say, though, the panel that they have pre-gaming halftime is really annoying. I always kind of liked Ryan Fitzpatrick as a player but as a broadcaster or commentator I find him pretty hard to like.
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The bad news is the Broncos are on primetime again this week. The good news is they’re playing the Chargers so they should get their asses handed to them which is more entertaining than these abominations that we’ve been “treated” to.
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I'm actually enjoying Al Michaels and Troy, I think they make a good team.
Got to say, though, the panel that they have pre-gaming halftime is really annoying. I always kind of liked Ryan Fitzpatrick as a player but as a broadcaster or commentator I find him pretty hard to like.
Sorry really confused by this comment? Al is TNF and Troy is MNF? They aren't a team?
Also, I don't get the comments above in other posts seeming to bag out Troy for moving to MNF? Why?
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Ignore me, long day and getting loopy lol
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I feel sorry for Al Michaels. He's in the twilight of his career and gets demoted to the basement of primetime play calling. He deserves better than that.
Demoted? Pretty sure he just went where he was offered the most. Same with Troy, and at the end of the day Troy will have it far, far worse.
Oh yeah, I'm sure they offered him a lot to go call shitty TNF games, but I wasn't really referring to money. He went from MNF to SNF and eventually to TNF. There's a drop off...
Yeah, I just think it was his choice. Like Troy. I'm not going to feel sorry for them. In fact, I lost a fair amount of respect for Aikman. He went from calling the best game of the week to whatever crappy game they picked before the season even started. It'd be like Blackmore taking a gig playing rhythm guitar for LA Guns because the money was good.
IDK, is it totally their choice or do these high profile announcers get pressure from the networks to be moved around for the sake of ratings? I'm thinking it's a little of both. You kind of lost me on the Aikman thing. Can you specify a little more?
Troy and Joe Buck were the A team of FOX. They were always guaranteed the best NFC game of the week. And if they weren't offered it they could probably demand to get it. There are always 5-7 games to choose from. Jumping to MNF they have no choice. They get whatever game was scheduled way back before the season, and they're as often as not terrible games. To me that just seems like a shitty decision. Could they really have offered him that much more money? I ain't Troy and I don't know what he's thinking, but from the outside it looks kinda dumb.
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After the ridiculous amount Romo was paid, a lot of the decisions simply came down to $$$$.
I’ll bet Aikman and Buck weren’t happy doing two games a week for a couple of years
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Troy and Joe Buck were the A team of FOX. They were always guaranteed the best NFC game of the week. And if they weren't offered it they could probably demand to get it. There are always 5-7 games to choose from. Jumping to MNF they have no choice. They get whatever game was scheduled way back before the season, and they're as often as not terrible games. To me that just seems like a shitty decision. Could they really have offered him that much more money? I ain't Troy and I don't know what he's thinking, but from the outside it looks kinda dumb.
Agreed. I thought it was odd as well for Buck and Aikman to jump from being Fox's A team to doing whatever game happens to fall on Monday night. Maybe they were tired of doing 12 Dallas games a year since Jerry always makes the Cowboys game THE main Fox game of the week more often than not. :lol I am sure ESPN paid them well to make the jump, but, again, I agree that it seemed odd, especially since the Manning Cast thing took off last year, so every game, there will be a portion of fans watching the game and not even watching the channel with them.
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Troy and Joe Buck were the A team of FOX. They were always guaranteed the best NFC game of the week. And if they weren't offered it they could probably demand to get it. There are always 5-7 games to choose from. Jumping to MNF they have no choice. They get whatever game was scheduled way back before the season, and they're as often as not terrible games. To me that just seems like a shitty decision. Could they really have offered him that much more money? I ain't Troy and I don't know what he's thinking, but from the outside it looks kinda dumb.
Agreed. I thought it was odd as well for Buck and Aikman to jump from being Fox's A team to doing whatever game happens to fall on Monday night. Maybe they were tired of doing 12 Dallas games a year since Jerry always makes the Cowboys game THE main Fox game of the week more often than not. :lol I am sure ESPN paid them well to make the jump, but, again, I agree that it seemed odd, especially since the Manning Cast thing took off last year, so every game, there will be a portion of fans watching the game and not even watching the channel with them.
OK, fair enough. I just presumed this was totally money related. I have no idea of the salaries of Joe and Troy but I am just presuming they both received a huge payrise to make the jump and whatever game they call doesn't really matter.
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I just looked it up and while Joe/Troy only did three Sunday afternoon Dallas games last year, the numbers show how Jerry always makes sure his team gets favorable TV coverage. And I get it, ratings, because Dallas is both the most beloved and hated team.
Last year:
1 MNF game
1 Saturday game
3 Sunday night football games
3 Thursday games
Of the nine games on Sunday afternoon (at noon or 3, CST), Fox had eight of them, and in six cases, it was the number 1 Fox team on the game (Joe and Troy three times, someone else three teams where Joe/Troy didn't do a Sunday game because they did the Thursday game on Fox or Joe was doing baseball playoffs that week). The one Dallas game on CBS had their number 1 announcing team.
In other words, in the 17 Dallas Cowboys game in 2021, they either had a standalone game on Thursday, Sunday night or Monday night or the number 1 announcing team doing their game in 15 of them.
That makes Denver being on so much early this season look like nothing.
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For what it's worth, I'm really hoping Russell Wilson balls out on Monday night. Everyone's dunking on the guy and it is much deserved but I'm starting to feel like I should root for him because he's being made out to such a underdog. Of course once they start winning he will become the most annoying person and professional sports so...
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(https://i.postimg.cc/59KmY21q/FB-IMG-1665881446860.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/3WpGz7kd)
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:lol
I could sniff that ending a mile away. :lol
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For the record, Fox did not want Troy and that's why he accepted the MNF offer. (I've posted about this before)
Fox probably thought they had Brady boy onboard before he unretired.
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They clearly took the reigns off off Zappe in the second half and he's responded very well. Dude's looking pretty good for a 5th round pick. Any talk of him supplanting McCorkle right now is just silly, but I'm pretty happy to let Mac take all the time he needs for his ankle. Kinda reminds me of Cooper Rush in Dallas. It's nice when you can take your time bringing a player back from injury.
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He has played well today.
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That’s a statement win for the Jets.
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Good, bad and good today for the Pats. They need to button up all these self induced penalties.
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That was a great play call on the handoff to Thornton.
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Jets and Giants both looked legit.
The two future Hall of Fame QBs both look like they'd rather be somewhere else than playing football.
Fun season, officiating awfulness aside.
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Jets remind me a bit of the Rams for the end of their St Louis stint. Tons of young Talent on the team and all they need is the quarterback. They might have that, we just don't know for sure yet. If Wilson can go beyond just making a few big plays here and there and start winning games for them, then they could be a real contender.
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Jets and Giants both looked legit.
The two future Hall of Fame QBs both look like they'd rather be somewhere else than playing football.
Fun season, officiating awfulness aside.
Zach Wilson has not convinced me. He holds the ball way too long. Daniel Jones is getting there.
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HUGE win for the Bills. They are the team to beat now in the NFL this year.
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That lived up to the hype. Good game. And I still think Mahomes needs to learn that you can pull off the impossible some of the time, but not all the time. That last pick was an ill-advised throw that he thought he could force in there.
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That lived up to the hype. Good game. And I still think Mahomes needs to learn that you can pull off the impossible some of the time, but not all the time. That last pick was an ill-advised throw that he thought he could force in there.
To be fair, Von Miller, who can still disrupt an offense as much as anyone not named Aaron Donald or Micah Parsons, forced that throw.
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It was a hell of a game. Even though they are in the division of my team, their fan base is awesome. They deserve this. I found myself rooting for the Bills.
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Yes, the Bills are the team to beat now. The Packers are gone, have looked terrible all season and can't seem them coming back now.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8yX9bw2TrkQ
Yes, Collinsworth really said that on live TV. :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8yX9bw2TrkQ
Yes, Collinsworth really said that on live TV. :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
I chuckled.
Yeah, the Bills/Chiefs game was great. Two legit teams.
Meanwhile, in Panther land, possibly the worst team in the league. If there is anyone worse, I don't want to see them.
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Still shocked the Giants pulled off another gritty comeback win. I really don't think this team is "5-1" good and is lacking a lot of talent compared to the top teams in the leage, but there's something special about how they play. I said it last week and I'll say it again, this all completely feels like a coaching miracle and as long as Barkley can stay healthy (he may have a shoulder issue all season based on what I've seen the last couple games) they will have a chance to win. But you can't win every game from behind. It'll catch up to them when the bounces don't always go their way.
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You all know what I am here to say...
J-E-T-S JETS JETS JETS!
What a surprising and unexpected victory. Still not sure this team is for real. Breece Hall is legit. Defense is legit. But still not impressed with the QB play and I'm worried about a backslide the last 11 games. Still, I'll take 4-2 to start the year. :metal
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You all know what I am here to say...
J-E-T-S JETS JETS JETS!
What a surprising and unexpected victory. Still not sure this team is for real. Breece Hall is legit. Defense is legit. But still not impressed with the QB play and I'm worried about a backslide the last 11 games. Still, I'll take 4-2 to start the year. :metal
Yeah - your QB is not balling out on the field but he IS balling out with his mom's best friend so revel in that. :tup
Seriously, it's nice to see Jet's fans having something to root for. I also like the head coach Saleh. I always felt he is a good coach and he just needed the personnel (like most coaches). :metal
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Yeah, I've never hated the Jets as a Giants fan, so I'm pretty happy for them too. It's really just a shock to everyone here whether you like the Jets or Giants. It feels, to me at least, like both fan bases are happy and surprised for each other.
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Not to rain on the parade but does anyone remember when Josh McDaniels started 6-0 with the Broncos? ;D
Anyways I don't think the Bucs can beat either team with the way they've been playing lately. Just mediocre to awful these last 3-4 games. Even though the record is 3-3, their playing has not been anything to write home about. We shall see how they continue, if it's more of the same then well I guess it truly was Arians who kept things in line.
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I feel sorry for Al Michaels. He's in the twilight of his career and gets demoted to the basement of primetime play calling. He deserves better than that.
Demoted? Pretty sure he just went where he was offered the most. Same with Troy, and at the end of the day Troy will have it far, far worse.
Oh yeah, I'm sure they offered him a lot to go call shitty TNF games, but I wasn't really referring to money. He went from MNF to SNF and eventually to TNF. There's a drop off...
Yeah, I just think it was his choice. Like Troy. I'm not going to feel sorry for them. In fact, I lost a fair amount of respect for Aikman. He went from calling the best game of the week to whatever crappy game they picked before the season even started. It'd be like Blackmore taking a gig playing rhythm guitar for LA Guns because the money was good.
I'd go see that. :)
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Everyone’s hyping up this Bills - Chiefs thing but the teams are really not evenly matched. Buffalo has a stellar defense and KC as usual . . . does not. Hopefully the game will be worth the hype.
But if Mahomes is the GOAT, that shouldn't matter. (Nice INT when the game was on the line.)
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That lived up to the hype. Good game. And I still think Mahomes needs to learn that you can pull off the impossible some of the time, but not all the time. That last pick was an ill-advised throw that he thought he could force in there.
To be fair, Von Miller, who can still disrupt an offense as much as anyone not named Aaron Donald or Micah Parsons, forced that throw.
Who distrupted no one in Philly last night...
If he's the GOAT, it shouldn't matter. I don't mean to bag on Mahomes; from what I saw he played well, but we're on the second iteration around the league, and we're on an iteration without Tyreek Hill. This is the time where we separate the men from the boys. Now, all is not lost; Buffalo will likely have to do it again in December, but still.
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Not to rain on the parade but does anyone remember when Josh McDaniels started 6-0 with the Broncos? ;D
Anyways I don't think the Bucs can beat either team with the way they've been playing lately. Just mediocre to awful these last 3-4 games. Even though the record is 3-3, their playing has not been anything to write home about. We shall see how they continue, if it's more of the same then well I guess it truly was Arians who kept things in line.
If you're talking the Eagles, I'm with you 100%. Lions, Vikings, Commanders, Jaguars, and Cowboys is not the road to the Super Bowl. They're playing well, but they are not a GREAT team, yet. Cooper Rush was overhyped to begin with - "Has never lost a game he has started!" - but your bellwether is never going to be the Dallas Cowboys.
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Not to rain on the parade but does anyone remember when Josh McDaniels started 6-0 with the Broncos? ;D
Anyways I don't think the Bucs can beat either team with the way they've been playing lately. Just mediocre to awful these last 3-4 games. Even though the record is 3-3, their playing has not been anything to write home about. We shall see how they continue, if it's more of the same then well I guess it truly was Arians who kept things in line.
If you're talking the Eagles, I'm with you 100%. Lions, Vikings, Commanders, Jaguars, and Cowboys is not the road to the Super Bowl. They're playing well, but they are not a GREAT team, yet. Cooper Rush was overhyped to begin with - "Has never lost a game he has started!" - but your bellwether is never going to be the Dallas Cowboys.
If he's talking about the Giants, hey, no one expected this team to be 5-1 and I honestly didn't even expect them to be competitive. If they lose a bunch of games and falter to miss the playoffs or have a losing record, I'd kind of feel like that's probably where they should have been all along. But for now, I'm enjoying the comeback wins and new swag the team has. I don't even know what the future of this team is. If Jones and Barkley have good years overall, I don't know if the Giants could even keep them in free agency. Just got to enjoy the wins since it's been awhile since we were able to.
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Cooper Rush overhyped? No - he did his job as a backup. :tup
Now Blackmore? He's overhyped! :tdwn
:)
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Not to rain on the parade but does anyone remember when Josh McDaniels started 6-0 with the Broncos? ;D
Anyways I don't think the Bucs can beat either team with the way they've been playing lately. Just mediocre to awful these last 3-4 games. Even though the record is 3-3, their playing has not been anything to write home about. We shall see how they continue, if it's more of the same then well I guess it truly was Arians who kept things in line.
If you're talking the Eagles, I'm with you 100%. Lions, Vikings, Commanders, Jaguars, and Cowboys is not the road to the Super Bowl. They're playing well, but they are not a GREAT team, yet. Cooper Rush was overhyped to begin with - "Has never lost a game he has started!" - but your bellwether is never going to be the Dallas Cowboys.
If he's talking about the Giants, hey, no one expected this team to be 5-1 and I honestly didn't even expect them to be competitive. If they lose a bunch of games and falter to miss the playoffs or have a losing record, I'd kind of feel like that's probably where they should have been all along. But for now, I'm enjoying the comeback wins and new swag the team has. I don't even know what the future of this team is. If Jones and Barkley have good years overall, I don't know if the Giants could even keep them in free agency. Just got to enjoy the wins since it's been awhile since we were able to.
Right I meant the Giants and the Jets.
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https://www.foxnews.com/sports/panthers-trade-robbie-anderson-cardinals-following-confrontation-coaches
Holy shit
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That lived up to the hype. Good game. And I still think Mahomes needs to learn that you can pull off the impossible some of the time, but not all the time. That last pick was an ill-advised throw that he thought he could force in there.
To be fair, Von Miller, who can still disrupt an offense as much as anyone not named Aaron Donald or Micah Parsons, forced that throw.
Who distrupted no one in Philly last night...
If he's the GOAT, it shouldn't matter. I don't mean to bag on Mahomes; from what I saw he played well, but we're on the second iteration around the league, and we're on an iteration without Tyreek Hill. This is the time where we separate the men from the boys. Now, all is not lost; Buffalo will likely have to do it again in December, but still.
Okay, now you are just being silly for the sake of being silly. No one has called Parsons the GOAT already (and if they did, who cares?), and besides, since when does a GOAT have to be great and/or dominant in every game? Not even your beloved BBB has been that. :P
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(https://i.postimg.cc/59KmY21q/FB-IMG-1665881446860.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/3WpGz7kd)
Well, we had two more of these last night. It's getting ridiculous
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Yeah, WAY too many flags last night in general and as you say both roughing the passer calls were ridiculous.
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https://www.foxnews.com/sports/panthers-trade-robbie-anderson-cardinals-following-confrontation-coaches
Holy shit
I like this:
"Honestly, I was confused because I have never been told get out of the game. And, you know, upset by that. Nobody that is a true competitor would be OK with that."
But this speaks louder to me:
"It's third down, it's a money down."
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That lived up to the hype. Good game. And I still think Mahomes needs to learn that you can pull off the impossible some of the time, but not all the time. That last pick was an ill-advised throw that he thought he could force in there.
To be fair, Von Miller, who can still disrupt an offense as much as anyone not named Aaron Donald or Micah Parsons, forced that throw.
Who distrupted no one in Philly last night...
If he's the GOAT, it shouldn't matter. I don't mean to bag on Mahomes; from what I saw he played well, but we're on the second iteration around the league, and we're on an iteration without Tyreek Hill. This is the time where we separate the men from the boys. Now, all is not lost; Buffalo will likely have to do it again in December, but still.
Okay, now you are just being silly for the sake of being silly. No one has called Parsons the GOAT already (and if they did, who cares?), and besides, since when does a GOAT have to be great and/or dominant in every game? Not even your beloved BBB has been that. :P
Well, I AM being silly, but making a point. No, the GOAT doesn't have to be great and/or dominant in every game, but over the TOTALITY of the games. When you've got a guy that's only been around the league once (Parsons) or twice (some others), some of the accolades being heaped on some of these players is just as silly as what I'm doing. That's the point.
(And yes, I heard talk - Collinsworth, maybe? - that Parsons was "one of the greats". And then they put the fancy graphic up of all the positions he's played this season.)
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Yeah, WAY too many flags last night in general and as you say both roughing the passer calls were ridiculous.
Why was Brady playing?
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The League seems to be overcorrecting for the Tua thing.
I noticed lots of roughing the passer in several games over the weekend. Once where they blew the whistle on Trevor Lawrence before he'd even been able to break out of the tackle.
Seems like the league desperately needs to clarify the rules here. If the QB is "sacked" as soon as the linemen wraps their arms around him, what about QBs who traditionally have been known for their ability to break out of tackles, like Big Ben? What about runners?
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The League seems to be overcorrecting for the Tua thing.
I noticed lots of roughing the passer in several games over the weekend. Once where they blew the whistle on Trevor Lawrence before he'd even been able to break out of the tackle.
Seems like the league desperately needs to clarify the rules here. If the QB is "sacked" as soon as the linemen wraps their arms around him, what about QBs who traditionally have been known for their ability to break out of tackles, like Big Ben? What about runners?
In the grasp has always been a thing. Every once in a blue moon it pisses people off, but such is life. It's just another subjective call that usually works out and occasionally misses terribly. People need to get over it.
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https://www.foxnews.com/sports/panthers-trade-robbie-anderson-cardinals-following-confrontation-coaches
Holy shit
I like this:
"Honestly, I was confused because I have never been told get out of the game. And, you know, upset by that. Nobody that is a true competitor would be OK with that."
But this speaks louder to me:
"It's third down, it's a money down."
Robbie Anderson is a doofus and I'm glad he's gone from the Panthers. Hopefully he and the Cardinals will be better fits for one another.
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That lived up to the hype. Good game. And I still think Mahomes needs to learn that you can pull off the impossible some of the time, but not all the time. That last pick was an ill-advised throw that he thought he could force in there.
To be fair, Von Miller, who can still disrupt an offense as much as anyone not named Aaron Donald or Micah Parsons, forced that throw.
Who distrupted no one in Philly last night...
If he's the GOAT, it shouldn't matter. I don't mean to bag on Mahomes; from what I saw he played well, but we're on the second iteration around the league, and we're on an iteration without Tyreek Hill. This is the time where we separate the men from the boys. Now, all is not lost; Buffalo will likely have to do it again in December, but still.
Okay, now you are just being silly for the sake of being silly. No one has called Parsons the GOAT already (and if they did, who cares?), and besides, since when does a GOAT have to be great and/or dominant in every game? Not even your beloved BBB has been that. :P
Well, I AM being silly, but making a point. No, the GOAT doesn't have to be great and/or dominant in every game, but over the TOTALITY of the games. When you've got a guy that's only been around the league once (Parsons) or twice (some others), some of the accolades being heaped on some of these players is just as silly as what I'm doing. That's the point.
(And yes, I heard talk - Collinsworth, maybe? - that Parsons was "one of the greats". And then they put the fancy graphic up of all the positions he's played this season.)
That's just Collinsworth doing his "look how I smart I am" routine so if/when Parsons does turn out to be one of the greats, he can say he saw it earlier than most.
Besides, Parsons is one of the greats already. Easily a top 5 defender of all-time already. :)
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That lived up to the hype. Good game. And I still think Mahomes needs to learn that you can pull off the impossible some of the time, but not all the time. That last pick was an ill-advised throw that he thought he could force in there.
To be fair, Von Miller, who can still disrupt an offense as much as anyone not named Aaron Donald or Micah Parsons, forced that throw.
Who distrupted no one in Philly last night...
If he's the GOAT, it shouldn't matter. I don't mean to bag on Mahomes; from what I saw he played well, but we're on the second iteration around the league, and we're on an iteration without Tyreek Hill. This is the time where we separate the men from the boys. Now, all is not lost; Buffalo will likely have to do it again in December, but still.
Okay, now you are just being silly for the sake of being silly. No one has called Parsons the GOAT already (and if they did, who cares?), and besides, since when does a GOAT have to be great and/or dominant in every game? Not even your beloved BBB has been that. :P
Well, I AM being silly, but making a point. No, the GOAT doesn't have to be great and/or dominant in every game, but over the TOTALITY of the games. When you've got a guy that's only been around the league once (Parsons) or twice (some others), some of the accolades being heaped on some of these players is just as silly as what I'm doing. That's the point.
(And yes, I heard talk - Collinsworth, maybe? - that Parsons was "one of the greats". And then they put the fancy graphic up of all the positions he's played this season.)
That's just Collinsworth doing his "look how I smart I am" routine so if/when Parsons does turn out to be one of the greats, he can say he saw it earlier than most.
Besides, Parsons is one of the greats already. Easily a top 5 defender of all-time already. :)
No. :)
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I feel sorry for Al Michaels. He's in the twilight of his career and gets demoted to the basement of primetime play calling. He deserves better than that.
Demoted? Pretty sure he just went where he was offered the most. Same with Troy, and at the end of the day Troy will have it far, far worse.
Oh yeah, I'm sure they offered him a lot to go call shitty TNF games, but I wasn't really referring to money. He went from MNF to SNF and eventually to TNF. There's a drop off...
Yeah, I just think it was his choice. Like Troy. I'm not going to feel sorry for them. In fact, I lost a fair amount of respect for Aikman. He went from calling the best game of the week to whatever crappy game they picked before the season even started. It'd be like Blackmore taking a gig playing rhythm guitar for LA Guns because the money was good.
IDK, is it totally their choice or do these high profile announcers get pressure from the networks to be moved around for the sake of ratings? I'm thinking it's a little of both. You kind of lost me on the Aikman thing. Can you specify a little more?
Troy and Joe Buck were the A team of FOX. They were always guaranteed the best NFC game of the week. And if they weren't offered it they could probably demand to get it. There are always 5-7 games to choose from. Jumping to MNF they have no choice. They get whatever game was scheduled way back before the season, and they're as often as not terrible games. To me that just seems like a shitty decision. Could they really have offered him that much more money? I ain't Troy and I don't know what he's thinking, but from the outside it looks kinda dumb.
Ok yeah, I get that part of it but don't think money is the compelling factor unless you're talking about ratings. I mean, how much more money do these guys really need? They already get paid astronomical amounts anyway. Don't the networks have some influence here? Didn't Joe and Troy go to TNF for a season to help boost ratings? Isn't that why they are doing MNF now? Troy has said that MNF is kind of a dream come true for him. So, I really don't think these guys are moving around just because of the money. There seems to be more to it than that.
That lived up to the hype. Good game. And I still think Mahomes needs to learn that you can pull off the impossible some of the time, but not all the time. That last pick was an ill-advised throw that he thought he could force in there.
To be fair, Von Miller, who can still disrupt an offense as much as anyone not named Aaron Donald or Micah Parsons, forced that throw.
Who distrupted no one in Philly last night...
Is that just an uninformed opinion? Because the facts say otherwise. Parsons is disruptive on every single play regardless of where he is or what he's doing. The Eagirls probably had to rearrange their entire game plan around him. Just because Dallas lost the game doesn't mean he isn't a disruptive force and he certainly can't win the game all on his own. But, he was a major factor in their 17-0 comeback in the 2nd half after trailing 20-0.
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I feel sorry for Al Michaels. He's in the twilight of his career and gets demoted to the basement of primetime play calling. He deserves better than that.
Demoted? Pretty sure he just went where he was offered the most. Same with Troy, and at the end of the day Troy will have it far, far worse.
Oh yeah, I'm sure they offered him a lot to go call shitty TNF games, but I wasn't really referring to money. He went from MNF to SNF and eventually to TNF. There's a drop off...
Yeah, I just think it was his choice. Like Troy. I'm not going to feel sorry for them. In fact, I lost a fair amount of respect for Aikman. He went from calling the best game of the week to whatever crappy game they picked before the season even started. It'd be like Blackmore taking a gig playing rhythm guitar for LA Guns because the money was good.
IDK, is it totally their choice or do these high profile announcers get pressure from the networks to be moved around for the sake of ratings? I'm thinking it's a little of both. You kind of lost me on the Aikman thing. Can you specify a little more?
Troy and Joe Buck were the A team of FOX. They were always guaranteed the best NFC game of the week. And if they weren't offered it they could probably demand to get it. There are always 5-7 games to choose from. Jumping to MNF they have no choice. They get whatever game was scheduled way back before the season, and they're as often as not terrible games. To me that just seems like a shitty decision. Could they really have offered him that much more money? I ain't Troy and I don't know what he's thinking, but from the outside it looks kinda dumb.
Ok yeah, I get that part of it but don't think money is the compelling factor unless you're talking about ratings. I mean, how much more money do these guys really need? They already get paid astronomical amounts anyway.
I've asked that about athletes a gazillion times. I don't think it's the case here, but often times the answer is simply "more." It's also worth noting that Troy is going through his [I think] third divorce right now. An extra few million over the next 5 years may well be quite important.
Don't the networks have some influence here? Didn't Joe and Troy go to TNF for a season to help boost ratings? Isn't that why they are doing MNF now? Troy has said that MNF is kind of a dream come true for him. So, I really don't think these guys are moving around just because of the money. There seems to be more to it than that.
I don't know about ratings, but if so it was probably to meet certain incentives. In any case, after Hunnus suggested that FOX didn't want them I looked into it. I wouldn't go quite that far. FOX honestly seemed kind of indifferent, to the point that they weren't interested in negotiating. According to Troy they offered him a perfectly fair amount of money that he'd have been happy with, but he wanted an option after 1 year and they refused to even talk to him or his agent.
I just can't help but think that money aside, this was a massive downgrade.
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That lived up to the hype. Good game. And I still think Mahomes needs to learn that you can pull off the impossible some of the time, but not all the time. That last pick was an ill-advised throw that he thought he could force in there.
To be fair, Von Miller, who can still disrupt an offense as much as anyone not named Aaron Donald or Micah Parsons, forced that throw.
Who distrupted no one in Philly last night...
Is that just an uninformed opinion? Because the facts say otherwise. Parsons is disruptive on every single play regardless of where he is or what he's doing. The Eagirls probably had to rearrange their entire game plan around him. Just because Dallas lost the game doesn't mean he isn't a disruptive force and he certainly can't win the game all on his own. But, he was a major factor in their 17-0 comeback in the 2nd half after trailing 20-0.
Seriously? Because I don't agree with you I'm uninformed? No need for that. Especially since the facts tend to support me; Parsons had no sacks, no hits on the QB, and only three pressures (https://phillysportsnetwork.com/2022/10/17/eagles-offense-micah-parsons/). He was effectively neutralized by the Eagles and even he so much as acknowledged that.
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That lived up to the hype. Good game. And I still think Mahomes needs to learn that you can pull off the impossible some of the time, but not all the time. That last pick was an ill-advised throw that he thought he could force in there.
To be fair, Von Miller, who can still disrupt an offense as much as anyone not named Aaron Donald or Micah Parsons, forced that throw.
Who distrupted no one in Philly last night...
Is that just an uninformed opinion? Because the facts say otherwise. Parsons is disruptive on every single play regardless of where he is or what he's doing. The Eagirls probably had to rearrange their entire game plan around him. Just because Dallas lost the game doesn't mean he isn't a disruptive force and he certainly can't win the game all on his own. But, he was a major factor in their 17-0 comeback in the 2nd half after trailing 20-0.
Seriously? Because I don't agree with you I'm uninformed? No need for that. Especially since the facts tend to support me; Parsons had no sacks, no hits on the QB, and only three pressures (https://phillysportsnetwork.com/2022/10/17/eagles-offense-micah-parsons/). He was effectively neutralized by the Eagles and even he so much as acknowledged that.
Yeah seriously. He doesn't just play 1 position. They move him around a lot and he's not always pass rushing. Not to mention what he can do in pass coverage. You said he disrupted no one. 3 pressures alone says he disrupted someone. I was just going by what you said. If you're Micah Parsons, you disrupt things. It's what you do. If you want to describe MP one dimensionally, that doesn't work.
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That lived up to the hype. Good game. And I still think Mahomes needs to learn that you can pull off the impossible some of the time, but not all the time. That last pick was an ill-advised throw that he thought he could force in there.
To be fair, Von Miller, who can still disrupt an offense as much as anyone not named Aaron Donald or Micah Parsons, forced that throw.
Who distrupted no one in Philly last night...
Is that just an uninformed opinion? Because the facts say otherwise. Parsons is disruptive on every single play regardless of where he is or what he's doing. The Eagirls probably had to rearrange their entire game plan around him. Just because Dallas lost the game doesn't mean he isn't a disruptive force and he certainly can't win the game all on his own. But, he was a major factor in their 17-0 comeback in the 2nd half after trailing 20-0.
Seriously? Because I don't agree with you I'm uninformed? No need for that. Especially since the facts tend to support me; Parsons had no sacks, no hits on the QB, and only three pressures (https://phillysportsnetwork.com/2022/10/17/eagles-offense-micah-parsons/). He was effectively neutralized by the Eagles and even he so much as acknowledged that.
Well, because they made their entire gameplan about neutralizing this one guy. Which says a lot about how effective THEY thought he was.
He's a hell of a player. After all, he's the GOAT.
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That lived up to the hype. Good game. And I still think Mahomes needs to learn that you can pull off the impossible some of the time, but not all the time. That last pick was an ill-advised throw that he thought he could force in there.
To be fair, Von Miller, who can still disrupt an offense as much as anyone not named Aaron Donald or Micah Parsons, forced that throw.
Who distrupted no one in Philly last night...
Is that just an uninformed opinion? Because the facts say otherwise. Parsons is disruptive on every single play regardless of where he is or what he's doing. The Eagirls probably had to rearrange their entire game plan around him. Just because Dallas lost the game doesn't mean he isn't a disruptive force and he certainly can't win the game all on his own. But, he was a major factor in their 17-0 comeback in the 2nd half after trailing 20-0.
Seriously? Because I don't agree with you I'm uninformed? No need for that. Especially since the facts tend to support me; Parsons had no sacks, no hits on the QB, and only three pressures (https://phillysportsnetwork.com/2022/10/17/eagles-offense-micah-parsons/). He was effectively neutralized by the Eagles and even he so much as acknowledged that.
Well, because they made their entire gameplan about neutralizing this one guy. Which says a lot about how effective THEY thought he was.
He's a hell of a player. After all, he's the GOAT.
He is a hell of a player. He is not the GOAT; Lawrence Taylor is.
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That lived up to the hype. Good game. And I still think Mahomes needs to learn that you can pull off the impossible some of the time, but not all the time. That last pick was an ill-advised throw that he thought he could force in there.
To be fair, Von Miller, who can still disrupt an offense as much as anyone not named Aaron Donald or Micah Parsons, forced that throw.
Who distrupted no one in Philly last night...
Is that just an uninformed opinion? Because the facts say otherwise. Parsons is disruptive on every single play regardless of where he is or what he's doing. The Eagirls probably had to rearrange their entire game plan around him. Just because Dallas lost the game doesn't mean he isn't a disruptive force and he certainly can't win the game all on his own. But, he was a major factor in their 17-0 comeback in the 2nd half after trailing 20-0.
Seriously? Because I don't agree with you I'm uninformed? No need for that. Especially since the facts tend to support me; Parsons had no sacks, no hits on the QB, and only three pressures (https://phillysportsnetwork.com/2022/10/17/eagles-offense-micah-parsons/). He was effectively neutralized by the Eagles and even he so much as acknowledged that.
Yeah seriously. He doesn't just play 1 position. They move him around a lot and he's not always pass rushing. Not to mention what he can do in pass coverage. You said he disrupted no one. 3 pressures alone says he disrupted someone. I was just going by what you said. If you're Micah Parsons, you disrupt things. It's what you do. If you want to describe MP one dimensionally, that doesn't work.
You're really not arguing apples to apples. I was the one that pointed out that he played multiple positions (from Collinsworth). I never said he was one-dimensional. I never said he might not one day BE the greatest. But he's not now. The greatest of all time does more than just draw focus. The greatest of all time DOES win by himself (LT used to do that on the regular). Let the guy play more than two seasons. Let the guy play more than one playoff game. Let the guy beat even ONE quarterback that is in the conversation for "greatest of all time" himself (maybe Stafford, but he's never beat Mahomes, Brady, Allen, Rogers, or Wilson, for example).
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That lived up to the hype. Good game. And I still think Mahomes needs to learn that you can pull off the impossible some of the time, but not all the time. That last pick was an ill-advised throw that he thought he could force in there.
To be fair, Von Miller, who can still disrupt an offense as much as anyone not named Aaron Donald or Micah Parsons, forced that throw.
Who distrupted no one in Philly last night...
Is that just an uninformed opinion? Because the facts say otherwise. Parsons is disruptive on every single play regardless of where he is or what he's doing. The Eagirls probably had to rearrange their entire game plan around him. Just because Dallas lost the game doesn't mean he isn't a disruptive force and he certainly can't win the game all on his own. But, he was a major factor in their 17-0 comeback in the 2nd half after trailing 20-0.
Seriously? Because I don't agree with you I'm uninformed? No need for that. Especially since the facts tend to support me; Parsons had no sacks, no hits on the QB, and only three pressures (https://phillysportsnetwork.com/2022/10/17/eagles-offense-micah-parsons/). He was effectively neutralized by the Eagles and even he so much as acknowledged that.
Yeah seriously. He doesn't just play 1 position. They move him around a lot and he's not always pass rushing. Not to mention what he can do in pass coverage. You said he disrupted no one. 3 pressures alone says he disrupted someone. I was just going by what you said. If you're Micah Parsons, you disrupt things. It's what you do. If you want to describe MP one dimensionally, that doesn't work.
You're really not arguing apples to apples. I was the one that pointed out that he played multiple positions (from Collinsworth). I never said he was one-dimensional. I never said he might not one day BE the greatest. But he's not now. The greatest of all time does more than just draw focus. The greatest of all time DOES win by himself (LT used to do that on the regular). Let the guy play more than two seasons. Let the guy play more than one playoff game. Let the guy beat even ONE quarterback that is in the conversation for "greatest of all time" himself (maybe Stafford, but he's never beat Mahomes, Brady, Allen, Rogers, or Wilson, for example).
I don't even know what fuck you're arguing half the time. LT didn't win games "by himself". Football is a team sport. He played with his defensive unit as a team, was great at it, and also made his teammates great. That's what Parsons does, hence the comparison. If someone wants to say that he's headed in the same direction as LT, I can't fault them for that. They have a valid point. I personally wouldn't call him the GOAT (just yet), but he's well on his way and will be a force to be reckoned with if he stays healthy, no matter where he's playing.
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Yeah, we have seen games where Aaron Donald has had paltry stats simply because a game plan was entirely devised around neutralizing him, and that always frees up other players to make plays.
Bill, I know you love a good discussion, but it feels like you are being a contrarian just to be a contrarian, as no one actually thinks Parson is the GOAT already or even in the convo for being such.
And yeah, no one player in a team sport wins games by themselves. Ever. Take Ray Lewis. As great as he was at his peak, he wouldn't have been that same all-world guy in the 2000 playoffs if he wasn't surrounded by great talent (three other players from that D were All-Pro that same year).
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That lived up to the hype. Good game. And I still think Mahomes needs to learn that you can pull off the impossible some of the time, but not all the time. That last pick was an ill-advised throw that he thought he could force in there.
To be fair, Von Miller, who can still disrupt an offense as much as anyone not named Aaron Donald or Micah Parsons, forced that throw.
Who distrupted no one in Philly last night...
Is that just an uninformed opinion? Because the facts say otherwise. Parsons is disruptive on every single play regardless of where he is or what he's doing. The Eagirls probably had to rearrange their entire game plan around him. Just because Dallas lost the game doesn't mean he isn't a disruptive force and he certainly can't win the game all on his own. But, he was a major factor in their 17-0 comeback in the 2nd half after trailing 20-0.
Seriously? Because I don't agree with you I'm uninformed? No need for that. Especially since the facts tend to support me; Parsons had no sacks, no hits on the QB, and only three pressures (https://phillysportsnetwork.com/2022/10/17/eagles-offense-micah-parsons/). He was effectively neutralized by the Eagles and even he so much as acknowledged that.
Yeah seriously. He doesn't just play 1 position. They move him around a lot and he's not always pass rushing. Not to mention what he can do in pass coverage. You said he disrupted no one. 3 pressures alone says he disrupted someone. I was just going by what you said. If you're Micah Parsons, you disrupt things. It's what you do. If you want to describe MP one dimensionally, that doesn't work.
You're really not arguing apples to apples. I was the one that pointed out that he played multiple positions (from Collinsworth). I never said he was one-dimensional. I never said he might not one day BE the greatest. But he's not now. The greatest of all time does more than just draw focus. The greatest of all time DOES win by himself (LT used to do that on the regular). Let the guy play more than two seasons. Let the guy play more than one playoff game. Let the guy beat even ONE quarterback that is in the conversation for "greatest of all time" himself (maybe Stafford, but he's never beat Mahomes, Brady, Allen, Rogers, or Wilson, for example).
I don't even know what fuck you're arguing half the time. LT didn't win games "by himself". Football is a team sport. He played with his defensive unit as a team, was great at it, and also made his teammates great. That's what Parsons does, hence the comparison. If someone wants to say that he's headed in the same direction as LT, I can't fault them for that. They have a valid point. I personally wouldn't call him the GOAT (just yet), but he's well on his way and will be a force to be reckoned with if he stays healthy, no matter where he's playing.
It's pretty simple, if you care to follow. LET THESE PLAYERS PLAY. STOP WITH THE ANNOINTING. It's that simple. Micah Parsons is a very good player, with the potential to be very VERY good. That's all. It's linear and straightforward. We don't have to justify their spot in Canton just yet. We don't have to find ever more hyperbolic adjectives to describe them. Parsons is not yet in LT's league and it's not even close. That's not bagging on Parsons, that's not denigrating him. It's just a simple fact of life.
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Micah Parsons is definitely on a Aaron Donald/TJ Watt path. He's got an excellent chance of being one of the greats. Perhaps even another Ray Lewis or Seau. Donald, Watt (either of them), Seau, and Lewis would all be embarrassed to be compared with LT. LT was a different breed of animal, and knowing how much so from experience they'd be the first to tell you that.
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That lived up to the hype. Good game. And I still think Mahomes needs to learn that you can pull off the impossible some of the time, but not all the time. That last pick was an ill-advised throw that he thought he could force in there.
To be fair, Von Miller, who can still disrupt an offense as much as anyone not named Aaron Donald or Micah Parsons, forced that throw.
Who distrupted no one in Philly last night...
Is that just an uninformed opinion? Because the facts say otherwise. Parsons is disruptive on every single play regardless of where he is or what he's doing. The Eagirls probably had to rearrange their entire game plan around him. Just because Dallas lost the game doesn't mean he isn't a disruptive force and he certainly can't win the game all on his own. But, he was a major factor in their 17-0 comeback in the 2nd half after trailing 20-0.
Seriously? Because I don't agree with you I'm uninformed? No need for that. Especially since the facts tend to support me; Parsons had no sacks, no hits on the QB, and only three pressures (https://phillysportsnetwork.com/2022/10/17/eagles-offense-micah-parsons/). He was effectively neutralized by the Eagles and even he so much as acknowledged that.
Well, because they made their entire gameplan about neutralizing this one guy. Which says a lot about how effective THEY thought he was.
He's a hell of a player. After all, he's the GOAT.
He is a hell of a player. He is not the GOAT; Lawrence Taylor is.
I was being a little facetious.
LT was certainly awesome. Hard to say who the best ever was, but he is definitely on the (extremely) short list.
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LT was certainly awesome. Hard to say who the best ever was, but he is definitely on the (extremely) short list.
No, it's really not.
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LT was certainly awesome. Hard to say who the best ever was, but he is definitely on the (extremely) short list.
No, it's really not.
OK.
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“Do you know what Bruce Smith would do to me if he caught me with this shoe?
(Shudders)
Baaaaad things, man…”
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The two best players I have ever seen are Jerry Rice (still the GOAT IMO) and Lawrence Taylor.
In the minds of many, the GOAT has to be a QB, which is why it was Montana for many for a while and now is BBB in the minds of most, but Rice and Taylor dominated far more than any QB I have seen.
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I seem to recall growing up whenever they did a top xx players in NFL history it was usually Rice and Jim Brown at the top. Rice's legend still endures, while Brown has dropped off a bit as others have passed his numbers due to having longer careers, and due to the evolving nature of the game.
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Reports breaking that McCaffrey has been traded to the Niners.
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Reports breaking that McCaffrey has been traded to the Niners.
Yup. Wow. I did not expect that. It's a great pickup. But, really, when it comes to the offense, their biggest need right now is O-line.
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Congrats, bosky! You got a great player! I will miss him.
The implosion is on!
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Considering Ed McCaffrey played under Mike Shanahan and won two Super Bowls, this has to be a dream for Christian to now be coached by Mike's son. He has had trouble staying healthy, but considering the 49ers are set up to win now, they'd be smart to wrap him in bubble wrap until January. :P :lol
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I get why they are doing what they are doing, but jeez, it's hard to be a Panthers fan right now. Unless some other team really shits the bed, we aren't going to win another game.
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I get why they are doing what they are doing, but jeez, it's hard to be a Panthers fan right now. Unless some other team really shits the bed, we aren't going to win another game.
Is this a result of having gone all-in on Rhule, or is this a result of bad (or impatient) decision-making at the top? (I'm not close enough to the team to really know).
It's easy to say this in hindsight, but I think the track record bears it out: those glitzy, big-dollar contracts to young college coaches that have had a modicum of success at mid-level college programs (I don't think Rhule beat one ranked team while at Baylor) are almost always a head-scratcher to me.
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The two best players I have ever seen are Jerry Rice (still the GOAT IMO) and Lawrence Taylor.
In the minds of many, the GOAT has to be a QB, which is why it was Montana for many for a while and now is BBB in the minds of most, but Rice and Taylor dominated far more than any QB I have seen.
I recall when watching "The Two Bills" documentary - which is required watching, IMO - that whenever the clips of LT came on, they were breathtaking. Even now, with the speed of the game and the change in the players size and conditioning, you know by watching that LT was something special. He's in an echelon of players - Jordan, Gretzky - that have transcended the game.
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I get why they are doing what they are doing, but jeez, it's hard to be a Panthers fan right now. Unless some other team really shits the bed, we aren't going to win another game.
Is this a result of having gone all-in on Rhule, or is this a result of bad (or impatient) decision-making at the top? (I'm not close enough to the team to really know).
It's easy to say this in hindsight, but I think the track record bears it out: those glitzy, big-dollar contracts to young college coaches that have had a modicum of success at mid-level college programs (I don't think Rhule beat one ranked team while at Baylor) are almost always a head-scratcher to me.
All of the above. And I agree completely about college coaches. The NFL is a completely different animal.
Their biggest remaining offensive asset is WR D.J. Moore, about whom I am indifferent because of his inconsistency, but they are apparently only willing to part with him if someone offers a ridiculous trade. And they apparently don't want to trade any of their defensive assistants.
I'm a little surprised that Steve Wilks accepted the interim coach position. They said that they will consider him for the HC job if he does a great job, but he has NOT been set up for success, kind of like his last HC job in Arizona.
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Carolina won the trade on paper.
CMC is an injury waiting to happen and SF isn’t what I’d call a Super Bowl contending team at the moment, so it’s odd they’d give away that much draft capital.
Then again I’m not sure anyone in the NFC is a Super Bowl contending team right now so why not make the trade and hope for the best.
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Carolina won the trade on paper.
CMC is an injury waiting to happen and SF isn’t what I’d call a Super Bowl contending team at the moment, so it’s odd they’d give away that much draft capital.
Then again I’m not sure anyone in the NFC is a Super Bowl contending team right now so why not make the trade and hope for the best.
Their 3-3 record would indicate that they are not, especially with ugly losses at Chicago and Atlanta, but their defense is top notch and they are loaded now at the skill positions. Jimmy G is who he is, but they win a lot of games when he starts, so you never know. I won't be surprised to see them playing the Eagles in the NFCCG.
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Man, call me a hater all you want, but I’m thoroughly enjoying the self-destruction of Tom Brady and the Bucs this season.
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Crazy right?
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The two NFC teams with future Hall of Fame QBs are now 3-4. Crazy. Hard to count either out since they both play in the weaker conference and neither in a strong division, but both have culpability in their teams being where they are.
Meanwhile, the officiating just went in hard and dry on the Browns. I never think games are fixed or any of that silliness, but the end of the Browns/Ravens game sure looked* like the fix was in.
*it wasn't, but it just looked bad.
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I would die for Breece Hall.
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That INT Jimmy G just threw is why it feels like the 49ers upside is limited. They are loaded everywhere, but when you have a QB who has a knack for throwing a bad INT at the wrong time on a regular basis, it is hard to see them winning it all. That was atrocious.
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That INT Jimmy G just threw is why it feels like the 49ers upside is limited. They are loaded everywhere, but when you have a QB who has a knack for throwing a bad INT at the wrong time on a regular basis, it is hard to see them winning it all. That was atrocious.
That was atrocious.
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I would die for Breece Hall.
Might have to, out for the year.
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I would die for Breece Hall.
Might have to, out for the year.
An absolutely devastating injury. It feels like the Jets lost even though they won.
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As a Packers fan, I'm really not used to a losing record. Not even playoff contenders this year, because I'm banking on the wildcard teams coming out of the NFC East.
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Yeah, can't see the Packers making the playoffs this year and it isn't so much because of the win loss record, it more because of the way they are playing. Just terrible, really should have lost to the Patriots as well.
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Yeah, can't see the Packers making the playoffs this year and it isn't so much because of the win loss record, it more because of the way they are playing. Just terrible, really should have lost to the Patriots as well.
Oh I agree completely. I guess I don't view the record itself as a reason, just an indicator of things to come. No way they win 9 or 10 more games this season. I'm betting they win fewer than half of their upcoming games.
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Man, call me a hater all you want, but I’m thoroughly enjoying the self-destruction of Tom Brady and the Bucs this season.
Deep-sixing his family to lose to Mitch Trubisky and PJ Walker in back-to-back weeks.
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Absolute shit show from the Bucs this year so far. Winning those 3 games was a miracle. I don't see them making the playoffs.
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Man, call me a hater all you want, but I’m thoroughly enjoying the self-destruction of Tom Brady and the Bucs this season.
Deep-sixing his family to lose to Mitch Trubisky and PJ Walker in back-to-back weeks.
Because that's what it's all about, really. Making sure he doesn't just lose on the field, but suffers too. Funny, I'm the Mahomes hater here, and I've never once ever wished bad things on him.
The funny thing is... not a word about Todd Bowles. He's not even a .400 head coach in his entire career and people are wondering what happened to Brady?
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Man, call me a hater all you want, but I’m thoroughly enjoying the self-destruction of Tom Brady and the Bucs this season.
Deep-sixing his family to lose to Mitch Trubisky and PJ Walker in back-to-back weeks.
Because that's what it's all about, really. Making sure he doesn't just lose on the field, but suffers too. Funny, I'm the Mahomes hater here, and I've never once ever wished bad things on him.
The funny thing is... not a word about Todd Bowles. He's not even a .400 head coach in his entire career and people are wondering what happened to Brady?
Brady did pick him though. Forced Arians out. That dropped bomb took the wind out of them right away. That's not a mentally tough team.
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Eh, I'm not counting the Packers or the Bucs out just yet. IMO, this year is wide open. Both of those teams are underperforming, but should easily be in contention to win their divisions.
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Unless some other team really shits the bed, we aren't going to win another game.
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Unless some other team really shits the bed, we aren't going to win another game.
Hefradamus.
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Man, call me a hater all you want, but I’m thoroughly enjoying the self-destruction of Tom Brady and the Bucs this season.
Deep-sixing his family to lose to Mitch Trubisky and PJ Walker in back-to-back weeks.
Because that's what it's all about, really. Making sure he doesn't just lose on the field, but suffers too. Funny, I'm the Mahomes hater here, and I've never once ever wished bad things on him.
The funny thing is... not a word about Todd Bowles. He's not even a .400 head coach in his entire career and people are wondering what happened to Brady?
Brady did pick him though. Forced Arians out. That dropped bomb took the wind out of them right away. That's not a mentally tough team.
I'm not doubting you at all, but has that whole story been confirmed?
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It's never been said but I think you know how things work there. That was a dignified way to let the coach look like he left on his own.
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Eh, I'm not counting the Packers or the Bucs out just yet. IMO, this year is wide open. Both of those teams are underperforming, but should easily be in contention to win their divisions.
Completely agree. As a Vikings fan, I love to see the Packers lose. But I won't count them out being only 2.5 games behind with 10 weeks to go. The Packers need a pretty large change in how they're playing to turn things around, but crazier things have happened. And I'm not very confident in the Vikings to run away with the division.
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I read Rogers's lips after a particularly awful play yesterday when he said "What are we doing?" I don't ever remember him doing that before.
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The funny thing is, when you get passed the Eagles, it's very easy to imagine the rest of the higher-up teams in the Power Rankings ending the year something like 9-8, 8-9, etc. The Jets? Check! Giants? Check! Vikings? Check! Cowboys? Check!
That leaves things wide open for even teams that are underperforming now, like the Packers and Bucs. That's what makes this season so interesting, though. Not even halfway in yet, but usually by now, we start to see a lot more separation in the league that what we've seen thus far. And after the Eagles, Bills, and Chiefs, it's a hodgepodge of teams that are significantly flawed in at least one area of the ballgame.
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We lost our star in the making RB, but got the win. JETS ARE 5-2! Holy shit! LOL. I mean, we have the Patriots next weekend, which probably means a big fat "L", but these days, you never know!
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The funny thing is, when you get passed the Eagles, it's very easy to imagine the rest of the higher-up teams in the Power Rankings ending the year something like 9-8, 8-9, etc. The Jets? Check! Giants? Check! Vikings? Check! Cowboys? Check!
That leaves things wide open for even teams that are underperforming now, like the Packers and Bucs. That's what makes this season so interesting, though. Not even halfway in yet, but usually by now, we start to see a lot more separation in the league that what we've seen thus far. And after the Eagles, Bills, and Chiefs, it's a hodgepodge of teams that are significantly flawed in at least one area of the ballgame.
I think it's premature to include the Eagles in the same realm as the Bills and the Chiefs.
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The funny thing is, when you get passed the Eagles, it's very easy to imagine the rest of the higher-up teams in the Power Rankings ending the year something like 9-8, 8-9, etc. The Jets? Check! Giants? Check! Vikings? Check! Cowboys? Check!
That leaves things wide open for even teams that are underperforming now, like the Packers and Bucs. That's what makes this season so interesting, though. Not even halfway in yet, but usually by now, we start to see a lot more separation in the league that what we've seen thus far. And after the Eagles, Bills, and Chiefs, it's a hodgepodge of teams that are significantly flawed in at least one area of the ballgame.
I think it's premature to include the Eagles in the same realm as the Bills and the Chiefs.
I think 6-0 needs to be respected no matter what. They handed the Vikings their lone loss this season so far and the Cowboys one of their two. It’s not like they’re only beating up on bottom dwellers. They’re winning against teams with playoff aspirations. Sure the NFC isn’t as good as the AFC, but the Eagles are clearly the class of that conference so far this season, and I think writing them off when they’re the lone undefeated team is a mistake. And to be clear, I hate the Eagles and all things Philadelphia besides cheesesteaks, but they have been impressive so far.
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The funny thing is, when you get passed the Eagles, it's very easy to imagine the rest of the higher-up teams in the Power Rankings ending the year something like 9-8, 8-9, etc. The Jets? Check! Giants? Check! Vikings? Check! Cowboys? Check!
That leaves things wide open for even teams that are underperforming now, like the Packers and Bucs. That's what makes this season so interesting, though. Not even halfway in yet, but usually by now, we start to see a lot more separation in the league that what we've seen thus far. And after the Eagles, Bills, and Chiefs, it's a hodgepodge of teams that are significantly flawed in at least one area of the ballgame.
I think it's premature to include the Eagles in the same realm as the Bills and the Chiefs.
I think 6-0 needs to be respected no matter what. They handed the Vikings their lone loss this season so far and the Cowboys one of their two. It’s not like they’re only beating up on bottom dwellers. They’re winning against teams with playoff aspirations. Sure the NFC isn’t as good as the AFC, but the Eagles are clearly the class of that conference so far this season, and I think writing them off when they’re the lone undefeated team is a mistake. And to be clear, I hate the Eagles and all things Philadelphia besides cheesesteaks, but they have been impressive so far.
I won't argue that at all. All reasonable points.
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I still can't believe how the Giants keep pulling out these come from behind wins. I thought for sure they were going to lose on that last pass play, but somehow just managed to keep the WR out of the endzone. Just another gutsy performance.
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I still can't believe how the Giants keep pulling out these come from behind wins. I thought for sure they were going to lose on that last pass play, but somehow just managed to keep the WR out of the endzone. Just another gutsy performance.
But it shows how tenuous it is; Barkley should have gone down sooner, thus cutting the time in half, and the Jags had NO BUSINESS being on the 12 yard line, or whatever it was, to begin with.
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I still can't believe how the Giants keep pulling out these come from behind wins. I thought for sure they were going to lose on that last pass play, but somehow just managed to keep the WR out of the endzone. Just another gutsy performance.
But it shows how tenuous it is; Barkley should have gone down sooner, thus cutting the time in half, and the Jags had NO BUSINESS being on the 12 yard line, or whatever it was, to begin with.
That entire last possession was very odd and the refs were all over the place at the end of that game. I think the refs actually really were giving the Giants the calls all game long until that last drive, like they were trying to even things up. I do agree, it should have never come down to that, but they still held up.
Also, loved how the Jaquars stadium was filled with Giants fans. I guess all those NYers who moved to Florida came out yesterday.
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Two things.
1) Is anyone gonna tell the Jaguars that they got absolutely fleeced in that trade?
2) I’m ready to form a religious around Joe Douglas.
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3:30 wake up call and the Pats are making it easy to go to bed early.
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3:30 wake up call and the Pats are making it easy to go to bed early.
I can relate. It's still early though.
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7am flight to Washington DC.
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7am flight to Washington DC.
Conference?
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Bill Burr is supposed to be the 2nd guest on the Manning Cast tonight. I may have to turn it on just to see that. I wasn't watching this game, but Burr is awesome, so that will be good.
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Bill Burr is supposed to be the 2nd guest on the Manning Cast tonight. I may have to turn it on just to see that. I wasn't watching this game, but Burr is awesome, so that will be good.
Oh I'll have to see that. What channel is that on?
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ESPN2.
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Cool. I found it.
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Bill Burr is supposed to be the 2nd guest on the Manning Cast tonight. I may have to turn it on just to see that. I wasn't watching this game, but Burr is awesome, so that will be good.
I got a 3:30 am call and now I have to watch. I've got to admit. The Manningcast is better than the regular game cast.
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I can't watch the Manningcast. Seems awful.
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It's amazing. What are you talking about Willis?
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What time is Bill Burr coming on?
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2nd half. Right at the beginning.
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Oh OK. Thank you. Now I can stop flipping over.
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Peyton: I love you giving advice on the RPO.
Eli: I can coach it, I can’t do it.
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Bill Burr: I've got to admit Peyton that it pisses me off that you are so funny in your commercials.
:lol
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Burr in the Mannigcast has been a painful segment to watch, honestly.
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What are you talking about? That was funny
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Not really.
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You have no funny bone dude.
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Is it just me, or are they one of the better tackling teams in the league? There were about three or four really nice, open-field, one-on-one tackles that shut down what could have been big plays.
I think it might just look that way because of how absolutely awful they were last year. :lol They're definitely majorly improved, and I saw some good open field tackling yesterday. Over the course of the season I've seen some sloppy tackles, too, though. Still, big improvement from last year.
This was a regression to last year's tackling and the obvious ramification.
My initial inclination was that switching to Zappe was a disastrous move. BZ has the hot hand right now, but we all know that McCorkle is the horse you put your money on. That might change, but Mac has the pedigree. Right now Bill's taking a very big risk that he crashes the kid and he has to be euthanized right there on the side of the field. If he comes through this he'll be better for it, but the messaging is that NE is real close to moving on from him already. That's not good. Interestingly, somebody who's been in this exact situation is Troy Aikman. Shame he didn't have the balls to bring up the impact Steve Walsh had on his trajectory. It would have been excellent insight.
In any case, the game demonstrated quite well that BZ's not the wunderkind Patriots fans are making him out to be. Circumstances have been quite different for both QB's, and looking to start BZ over McCorkle is just silly. Great grist for the talking heads, though.
That said, the pick McCorkle threw to get himself benched was butt ugly. Christ. Seems that changing systems on the kid really did put the zap on his head.
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This might be the first time in years that the Jets will be favored against the Pats. I can’t wait to be in attendance next Sunday.
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Pre-Week 8 Power Rankings
01 Buffalo Bills - the team to beat, as they are loaded everywhere, but need to not falter like last year after winning at KC in the regular season
02 Kansas City Chiefs - what Mahomes and the offense just did to that great defense in SF was scary
03 Philadelphia Eagles - 6-0 and the schedule is not difficult, so the 1 seed is theirs if they continue to play well
04 New York Giants - considering Daniel Jones is the QB, what Brian Daboll has done with this team is unreal
05 Cincinnati Bengals - 4-1 after a tough start, they are looking like the team that went to the Super Bowl last year
06 Dallas Cowboys - top notch D, but need to say run-heavy on offense, even with Prescott back
07 New York Jets - losing Breece Hall is big and there are still questions about their QB, but 5-2 is 5-2
08 Minnesota Vikings - Kirk Cousins continues to be the most unfairly disrespected QB in the league
09 Baltimore Ravens - this feels like a team that could win a playoff game and be a tough out in their second, but it's hard to see this team making a deep run
10 Tennessee Titans - they were a mere afterthought for many, but Vrabel continues to show what a good head coach he is
Top 5 MVP candidates
01 Josh Allen
02 Patrick Mahomes
03 Micah Parsons
04 Saquan Barkley
05 Jalen Hurts
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Is it just me, or are they one of the better tackling teams in the league? There were about three or four really nice, open-field, one-on-one tackles that shut down what could have been big plays.
I think it might just look that way because of how absolutely awful they were last year. :lol They're definitely majorly improved, and I saw some good open field tackling yesterday. Over the course of the season I've seen some sloppy tackles, too, though. Still, big improvement from last year.
This was a regression to last year's tackling and the obvious ramification.
My initial inclination was that switching to Zappe was a disastrous move. BZ has the hot hand right now, but we all know that McCorkle is the horse you put your money on. That might change, but Mac has the pedigree. Right now Bill's taking a very big risk that he crashes the kid and he has to be euthanized right there on the side of the field. If he comes through this he'll be better for it, but the messaging is that NE is real close to moving on from him already. That's not good. Interestingly, somebody who's been in this exact situation is Troy Aikman. Shame he didn't have the balls to bring up the impact Steve Walsh had on his trajectory. It would have been excellent insight.
In any case, the game demonstrated quite well that BZ's not the wunderkind Patriots fans are making him out to be. Circumstances have been quite different for both QB's, and looking to start BZ over McCorkle is just silly. Great grist for the talking heads, though.
That said, the pick McCorkle threw to get himself benched was butt ugly. Christ. Seems that changing systems on the kid really did put the zap on his head.
In the postgame with Scott Van Pelt, Aikman missed another opportunity to make that point you raised (while talking about Fields). He was clear though, that Mac Jones will be starting next week and no mistake. I think that's right. It depends on how Bill fronts it in the clubhouse. I think Jones is probably a LITTLE better prepared to handle this given where he comes from.
I will say this; I like Jones, I like his skills, I love how he moves in the pocket, but there's an intangible with him that I haven't got past yet; he's still thrown too many goofy balls (some intercepted) that I get a Carson Wentz vibe from him that he HAS to shake if he's going to be even very good, let alone great.
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The two NFC teams with future Hall of Fame QBs are now 3-4. Crazy. Hard to count either out since they both play in the weaker conference and neither in a strong division, but both have culpability in their teams being where they are.
Meanwhile, the officiating just went in hard and dry on the Browns. I never think games are fixed or any of that silliness, but the end of the Browns/Ravens game sure looked* like the fix was in.
*it wasn't, but it just looked bad.
There were two big calls at the end: the offensive PI (legit). If you are talking of the motion on the FG attempt, the center certainly moved the ball and bobbed his head. 'That's what the call should have been.' Not the confusing BS afterwards. I'm not being a 'homer', as the Ravens had the same exact call made against them last year. But, of course, the five yards meant nothing to Justin Tucker and his resulting attempt in that instance. ;) :tup
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYrrS95cuvk
Mike Florio as usual doing the best job in all the media of unpacking the recent Mike Evans controversy. Shady as hell. The NFL cooked up a story that Evans couldn't repeat with a straight face. Now I know why Evans never gets called for all the push-offs he does, and gets so may PI calls. Him, Gronk, and Michael Irvin were the 3 worst push-off artists of all time. Guess who got to play with 2 of them.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYrrS95cuvk
Mike Florio as usual doing the best job in all the media of unpacking the recent Mike Evans controversy. Shady as hell. The NFL cooked up a story that Evans couldn't repeat with a straight face. Now I know why Evans never gets called for all the push-offs he does, and gets so may PI calls. Him, Gronk, and Michael Irvin were the 3 worst push-off artists of all time. Guess who got to play with 2 of them.
What Leonard Fournette has to do with this conversation escapes me at the moment.
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Don't know much about it, but it's exactly what I said a couple of weeks ago. I'm not sure how you could be an NFL referee and not be a fan of the game, and thus many of the players. If he hit him up for an autograph I don't care. So long as there's no favoritism it doesn't matter to me (and yeah, I know, the whole thing is as rigged as WWE). As I also said, if it's clear that a ref is buddy-buddy with a player, he's probably going to come down on the other side when questions arise.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYrrS95cuvk
Mike Florio as usual doing the best job in all the media of unpacking the recent Mike Evans controversy. Shady as hell. The NFL cooked up a story that Evans couldn't repeat with a straight face. Now I know why Evans never gets called for all the push-offs he does, and gets so may PI calls. Him, Gronk, and Michael Irvin were the 3 worst push-off artists of all time. Guess who got to play with 2 of them.
I have no clue what the real story is behind the Evans/officials thing, but I did think it was funny that no one mentioned how on the play last week where Evans dropped that bomb early on, he was only so wide open because he was shoved the DB to the ground and wasn't flagged for it.
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All joking and funny acronyms aside, Brady looks about cooked. His overall stats looked okay last night, thanks to a lot of garbage yards and a garbage TD in the last minute, but he looks like a shell of himself. He still made some good throws, but he made a ton of "what was he doing?" throws. The Ravens dropped at least three easy interceptions otherwise his final stat line would have looked way worse. His body language was even worse than his passing. He looked all night like a depressed person who wanted to be anywhere else but on a football field. Mad props to him (seriously) for playing at the level he did for as long as he did, but it looks like Father Time is finally winning its long-fought battle with Tom Brady.
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All joking and funny acronyms aside, Brady looks about cooked. His overall stats looked okay last night, thanks to a lot of garbage yards and a garbage TD in the last minute, but he looks like a shell of himself. He still made some good throws, but he made a ton of "what was he doing?" throws. The Ravens dropped at least three easy interceptions otherwise his final stat line would have looked way worse. His body language was even worse than his passing. He looked all night like a depressed person who wanted to be anywhere else but on a football field. Mad props to him (seriously) for playing at the level he did for as long as he did, but it looks like Father Time is finally winning its long-fought battle with Tom Brady.
Giselle is going as Father Time for Halloween?
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/10/27/report-gisele-bundchen-tells-tom-brady-to-retire-or-shes-gone-for-good/
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While I'm sure he doesn't want to be "that guy," Gisselle is giving him an easy out here. Like Kev said, he's not enjoying this anymore, and "I've got to look out for my family" is about the only excuse that can let him off for bailing on his team. He'll still be a douche, but it'd be hard to fault him for choosing his wife and kids over 10 more weeks of football. I've said all along that the one thing I really didn't want to see was for his final game to end with him getting carted off the field. That might be the optimal situation for him now.
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Doesn't it seem like these types of people - driven to succeed beyond measurement- often end up paying such a huge price in other areas of their life? In the business world they often die young too. Yes you get the records and fame, or the CEO who made himself and the company billions, but there's no balance.
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All he had to do was retire after winning a SB with the Bucs. Perfect ending to a stellar career. Some people just don't know when to say when. :justjen
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Giselle does: https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/28/entertainment/tom-brady-gisele-bndchen/index.html
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Giselle does: https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/28/entertainment/tom-brady-gisele-bndchen/index.html
Good for her.
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Giselle does: https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/28/entertainment/tom-brady-gisele-bndchen/index.html
Good for her.
Ya know; having gone through an odd divorce myself, I've learned that of all the things we can speculate on, a marriage isn't one of them. I steadfastly stayed away from the "Hillary should have left Bill" nonsense, and the "well, Melania's look is clear that she's disgusted by him" nonsense... but here, I think it's sort of fundamental that this was a test for Tom and he failed. Think about what emtee said about driven people; it's pretty clear that when he's committed to something, the fam is not going to be able to withstand that. Now, it's football, but what's it going to be in five years? He's going to be out of football, but I think it's a fair guess that she realized that that doesn't mean he's going to be home, full time, with the fam. What happens when the ultimatum comes about Fox Sports broadcasting and the family.
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Funny thing is, the very qualities that are driving her away from him were probably the same ones that attracted her to him in the beginning and for many years after. Hell of a thing, eh?
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Funny thing is, the very qualities that are driving her away from him were probably the same ones that attracted her to him in the beginning and for many years after. Hell of a thing, eh?
And were quite possibly qualities she possessed, as well. Being a supermodel ain't easy.
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Funny thing is, the very qualities that are driving her away from him were probably the same ones that attracted her to him in the beginning and for many years after. Hell of a thing, eh?
And were quite possibly qualities she possessed, as well. Being a supermodel ain't easy.
She had to grow resentful because she gave up her career and he will not.
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Funny thing is, the very qualities that are driving her away from him were probably the same ones that attracted her to him in the beginning and for many years after. Hell of a thing, eh?
That happens in a relationship. :(
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Funny thing is, the very qualities that are driving her away from him were probably the same ones that attracted her to him in the beginning and for many years after. Hell of a thing, eh?
And were quite possibly qualities she possessed, as well. Being a supermodel ain't easy.
She had to grow resentful because she gave up her career and he will not.
This is something that I feel like a lot of people are ignoring. She made more money as a supermodel than Tom ever made as a quarterback, and she gave it all up to raise their family, but he’s not willing to do the same for her.
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Bucs Shaq Barrett out for the season. Season is sealed signed done.
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Funny thing is, the very qualities that are driving her away from him were probably the same ones that attracted her to him in the beginning and for many years after. Hell of a thing, eh?
And were quite possibly qualities she possessed, as well. Being a supermodel ain't easy.
She had to grow resentful because she gave up her career and he will not.
This is something that I feel like a lot of people are ignoring. She made more money as a supermodel than Tom ever made as a quarterback, and she gave it all up to raise their family, but he’s not willing to do the same for her.
Eh, I am on Brady's side there. If she gave up her career, that was her choice. She knew he was a football player when she met and married him, so expecting him to retire before he is ready is unfair, and the minute you start throwing out "retire or I'll divorce you" ultimatums, it's pretty much done anyway.
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There is too much that we don't know to make any informed opinion much less take sides. Marriages don't just dissolve overnight, they unravel over many years and there is more that we don't know than what we do know.
However, couples make sacrifices for each other all the time and a healthy relationship is give and take and given that Tom was occupied 6 or 7 months out of the year, I can see where this is a strain on the relationship.
Back to sports - he really looked bad in the Ravens game and I don't think his skills have diminished too much, he just looks distracted and disinterested.
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He can still make some great throws, but also throws more worm-burners and air balls than he used to and really struggles in the red zone. I really don't think he's used to playing without a great O-Line, he's always had one. Still, it's a crappy division so they'll probably still make the playoffs.
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Kev, I think she's selfish for making the decision then regretting it and taking out her frustration on a husband who has said for over a decade that he wanted to play until 45.
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My guess is that this was one of those "he says this, but I will talk him out of it" situations, and she is just pissed that she wasn't able to talk him into retiring sooner. And it's not like he can take a few years till the kids grow up and resume his career. It's football. He has already played longer than anyone thought he would, and if he feels like he still has a few years left, that is his right to keep playing. I can't imagine still doing well at a job, one where many think I have done it better than anyone ever, and having someone yapping in my ear, "You need to retire!!"
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My guess is that this was one of those "he says this, but I will talk him out of it" situations, and she is just pissed that she wasn't able to talk him into retiring sooner. And it's not like he can take a few years till the kids grow up and resume his career. It's football. He has already played longer than anyone thought he would, and if he feels like he still has a few years left, that is his right to keep playing. I can't imagine still doing well at a job, one where many think I have done it better than anyone ever, and having someone yapping in my ear, "You need to retire!!"
In fairness, you left out the part where every year in your job significantly increases the possibility that you won't be able to walk worth a damn, or wind up blowing your brains out because of all of the concussions you took. Also, he can't put his career on hold, but he can't put his kids on hold, either.
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I would say he has more time with his kids than the normal shlub. Plus, Tom has the most protected position in football and probably the top 3 most protective. Plus he's not a runner either.
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So is it true about the rumblings that Russell Wilson is a total diva? I heard that he has an office as a requirement of his contract?
Is he THAT much of a dick?
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So is it true about the rumblings that Russell Wilson is a total diva?
YES
Glad the rest of the country is finally catching on.
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So is it true about the rumblings that Russell Wilson is a total diva? I heard that he has an office as a requirement of his contract?
Is he THAT much of a dick?
Don't know if he's a dick or not. Not my kind of guy, really, but that doesn't mean a whole lot. What's wrong with having an office, though? He should have an office, and I'd make the team pay for a secretary/personal assistant, too.
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So is it true about the rumblings that Russell Wilson is a total diva? I heard that he has an office as a requirement of his contract?
Is he THAT much of a dick?
Don't know if he's a dick or not. Not my kind of guy, really, but that doesn't mean a whole lot. What's wrong with having an office, though? He should have an office, and I'd make the team pay for a secretary/personal assistant, too.
Optics. It's just not a a good idea when you have a reputation as a difficult player. Maybe it would be different if he were performing better.
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My guess is that this was one of those "he says this, but I will talk him out of it" situations, and she is just pissed that she wasn't able to talk him into retiring sooner. And it's not like he can take a few years till the kids grow up and resume his career. It's football. He has already played longer than anyone thought he would, and if he feels like he still has a few years left, that is his right to keep playing. I can't imagine still doing well at a job, one where many think I have done it better than anyone ever, and having someone yapping in my ear, "You need to retire!!"
In fairness, you left out the part where every year in your job significantly increases the possibility that you won't be able to walk worth a damn, or wind up blowing your brains out because of all of the concussions you took. Also, he can't put his career on hold, but he can't put his kids on hold, either.
All true, but athletes, and especially football players, are hard-wired different than the rest of us. I don't think it's realistic to expect or ask an athlete of his caliber to retire early if he still feels like he still has a lot left in the tank.
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A lot of McCorkle's interceptions haven't been his fault. Receivers tip balls. Receivers get tackled. The ones that are his fault, though, are usually butt ugly, and that wannabe pick six was the ugliest I've ever seen. That's one of the ugliest picks I've ever seen from any QB. I have no idea what he was thinking was supposed to happen.
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Bailed out by a Jets D player launching at him.
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Zach Wilson is looking like a Rosen-tier QB. How demoralizing it must be for this defense to be playing their asses off and be undermined by not only one of their own players but also Zach Wilson several times.
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He makes the worst decisions when under pressure. Throw it away!
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Mac Jones ain't great but Zach Wilson is a disaster. That headband makes him look even more like a pussy.
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I'd rather have Russell Wilson
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That ain't saying much.
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Nope but if this is how it's going to be I would not mind them putting out some serious draft capital for a veteran. The rookies on this team are way too good to be anchored to a failure.
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It’s always the same.
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what an insane ending to falcons/panthers
falcons division leaders at 4-4 lmao
RISE UP
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I can't believe the guy took his helmet off and basically cost them the game after that hail Mary. :lol
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It’s always the same.
No way, even if we lose the next two games, which is likely, we are still going in to be a .500 team on Thanksgiving day. That's right, the worst case scenario for the Jets is going into December a team that is still in the Wild Card hunt. When is the last time we have known that as Jets fans? It has been a long time, at least since 2015. It's not the same, the clown car ever is officially over, even if the team totally collapses the building blocks for it an actual football organization have been set.
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Another one score win for the Vikings. I'll give them credit for finding a way to win, but I still have no confidence in them going far in the playoffs.
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Doofus McDaniels' Raiders get shut out by a Saints defense that had given up 132 points in their previous four games. :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
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So is it true about the rumblings that Russell Wilson is a total diva? I heard that he has an office as a requirement of his contract?
Is he THAT much of a dick?
Don't know if he's a dick or not. Not my kind of guy, really, but that doesn't mean a whole lot.
I also wouldn't say he's a dick. His personal life coach and close friend died last year* and it appears that really altered his course.
*he went to school with a good friend of mine, who spoke very highly of him. I met him on a couple occasions; his father was also a life coach/motivational speaker who worked in my area. Once as a kid I went to a basketball camp he worked at.
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Funny thing is, the very qualities that are driving her away from him were probably the same ones that attracted her to him in the beginning and for many years after. Hell of a thing, eh?
And were quite possibly qualities she possessed, as well. Being a supermodel ain't easy.
She had to grow resentful because she gave up her career and he will not.
This is something that I feel like a lot of people are ignoring. She made more money as a supermodel than Tom ever made as a quarterback, and she gave it all up to raise their family, but he’s not willing to do the same for her.
Eh, I am on Brady's side there. If she gave up her career, that was her choice. She knew he was a football player when she met and married him, so expecting him to retire before he is ready is unfair, and the minute you start throwing out "retire or I'll divorce you" ultimatums, it's pretty much done anyway.
And honestly, at that level, I don't think it's about the money at all. WE think it is, because we don't have it, but like Phil Simms said of Belichick - "It amazes me how much he loves the PROCESS, even after all these years. He STILL LOVES the draft. He LOVES training camp. He just loves FOOTBALL."
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So is it true about the rumblings that Russell Wilson is a total diva? I heard that he has an office as a requirement of his contract?
Is he THAT much of a dick?
Don't know if he's a dick or not. Not my kind of guy, really, but that doesn't mean a whole lot. What's wrong with having an office, though? He should have an office, and I'd make the team pay for a secretary/personal assistant, too.
Phillip Rivers "demanded" an SUV equipped with satellite technology and a workspace in the back seat so he could watch film and study on his two-hour (whatever) drive to and from the stadium each day.
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Mac Jones ain't great but Zach Wilson is a disaster. That headband makes him look even more like a pussy.
Or Corey Feldman. Oops, sorry, ninja'd by TAC. :) : )
By the way, for all the celebrating about the "new Jets", if they lose to Buffalo - and they will - and Pats beat Indy - which they should - then they are tied in the division.
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So is it true about the rumblings that Russell Wilson is a total diva? I heard that he has an office as a requirement of his contract?
Is he THAT much of a dick?
Don't know if he's a dick or not. Not my kind of guy, really, but that doesn't mean a whole lot. What's wrong with having an office, though? He should have an office, and I'd make the team pay for a secretary/personal assistant, too.
Phillip Rivers "demanded" an SUV equipped with satellite technology and a workspace in the back seat so he could watch film and study on his two-hour (whatever) drive to and from the stadium each day.
Perfectly reasonable. A new Cadillac for each game is frivolous. Something that makes you professional life easier to manage is a fine thing to ask for (and I'd happily give the guy a car with an office in the back). If you're negotiating a contract worth 100 million you can probably expect some perks to be flying about, I reckon.
I was reading a few weeks ago about a contentious contract negotiation with Leonard Nimoy between the first and second season of TOS. One of the "demands" was an office with a secretary. Didn't make a lot of sense at first, but it turns out the guy was getting 500 fan mail letters a week, and was spending a big chunk of time doing public appearances on behalf of the network. Suddenly it seemed quite reasonable (and the network was happy to provide it). That's what made me ask about RW. Given the number of appearances he's on the hook for, and that does benefit the team, it makes perfect sense.
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That Panthers game was the most Panthers it could have been. SMH
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That Panthers game was the most Panthers it could have been. SMH
I loved the guy seemingly trying to put Moore's helmet back on (or at least keep him from taking it off). I mean, not for a Carolina fan, but generally, that's hilarious.
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That Panthers game was the most Panthers it could have been. SMH
I loved the guy seemingly trying to put Moore's helmet back on (or at least keep him from taking it off). I mean, not for a Carolina fan, but generally, that's hilarious.
Ruined an unbelievable pass from PJ Walker, too.
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Another one score win for the Vikings. I'll give them credit for finding a way to win, but I still have no confidence in them going far in the playoffs.
I'm with you, but I have a good friend whose a lifelong Bills fan and has wanted to see a Vikings vs Bills Super Bowl, so then finally 1 of them will have won a Title.
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Sheesh, the Steelers just traded Claypool to the Bears. Sucks. Guy is a freakish talent but they couldn't get him the ball and now they have Pickens, so . . .
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Kev, can we do a top 25 NFL teams ranking thread sometime soon?
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Kev, can we do a top 25 NFL teams ranking thread sometime soon?
:lol
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Sheesh, the Steelers just traded Claypool to the Bears. Sucks. Guy is a freakish talent but they couldn't get him the ball and now they have Pickens, so . . .
Well at least the Bears have a good bass player now. 🤪
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Trap game for the Eagirls tonight. Well...not really. :\
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No, not really at all. :lol Hope they lose, but I'm not seeing it.
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Looking forward to seeing how the '9ers play in their next 2 games after the bye. I am tempted to overreact after the HUGE win over the Rams, added to the fact that they will have almost all of their injured starters back for the first time. But even though all signs point in a positive direction, I don't want to prematurely overreact. Those first two games should be a good indicator of where the season will go. If they go well, I don't think it is overstating the case to predict them as division winners, probable #2 or #3 seed, and serious SB contender. If not, their floor is probably a low wildcard spot and early out from the playoffs.
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Ray Guy RIP..
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Ray Guy RIP..
If you asked me to name 10 punters, he's the only one I would, with absolutely certainty, remember (and I'm not sure I could actually think of 10). Absolute legend.
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A quick google of Super Bowl XI, that Oakland won over Minnesota 32-14, and which, of course
The Raiders took the opening kickoff and advanced all the way to the Vikings’ 12-yard line, but came up empty after kicker Errol Mann hit the left upright on his 29-yard field goal attempt. Later in the quarter, after the teams exchanged punts, the Vikings had a great opportunity to score, when linebacker Fred McNeill blocked a punt from Ray Guy and recovered the ball on the Raiders' 3-yard line. The Vikings' special teams unit was known for blocking kicks, but this was the first time it had happened to Guy. (He had only three of his punts blocked in his 14-year Pro Football Hall of Fame career.) However, two plays later, Minnesota running back Brent McClanahan fumbled the ball while being tackled by Raiders linebacker Phil Villapiano, and linebacker Willie Hall recovered the ball for Oakland.[10] The Raiders then marched 90 yards to the Vikings' 7-yard line, with a 35-yard run by Clarence Davis around left end from the Oakland 6-yard line breaking through Minnesota's front. On the drive's sixth play, quarterback Ken Stabler completed a 25-yard pass to tight end Dave Casper, with Casper breaking through what Stabler called "10 tackles."[7]
and
Although Guy rarely kicked for distance, his punts often left opposing offenses pinned deep in their own end of the field. The statistic for hang time was instituted in the NFL during his career, reportedly because of him.[12] Pro Football Hall of Fame historian Joe Horrigan once said of Guy, "He's the first punter you could look at and say: 'He won games.'"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ray_Guy
and...
During the early part of his career, he was the Raiders' emergency QB, replacing kicker–quarterback George Blanda in this position.[16] He also occasionally did kickoffs for the Raiders because the aging Blanda no longer had great range.
The form this man had!!!
I punted my freshman year of HS, would have my sophomore year except for a broken bone a week before opening week.... and this 'guy' ;) became one of my most admired pros when I could not continue on my junior year. So gol damn envious of his talents.
I also believe they changed the rules on kick coverage during his career, due to the length and height of his kicks.
Well deserved HOF induction.
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It’s always the same.
No way, even if we lose the next two games, which is likely, we are still going in to be a .500 team on Thanksgiving day. That's right, the worst case scenario for the Jets is going into December a team that is still in the Wild Card hunt. When is the last time we have known that as Jets fans? It has been a long time, at least since 2015. It's not the same, the clown car ever is officially over, even if the team totally collapses the building blocks for it an actual football organization have been set.
I was more referencing their performance against the Patriots. No matter what the two teams’ records are, the Patriots have the Jets number. The first two years with Rex Ryan was the only time that the teams felt even. The Jets are better this year than they have been in the last ten years, but it just seems like they’ll never get the better of the Pats, although in three weeks maybe I’ll change my tune. For now though, we just have a beating at the hands of the Bills to look forward to.
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A quick google of Super Bowl XI....
Gotta love Wikipedia. The statement that "The statistic for hang time was instituted in the NFL during his career, reportedly because of him" is supported by a citation to this article: https://southernmiss.com/news/2022/11/3/football-southern-miss-mourns-the-passing-of-golden-eagle-great-ray-guy.aspx . That article's only reference to "hang time" is that Guy's "majestic punts helped coin the phrase 'hang time.'" I did some googling and found nothing to support either the assertion in the Wikipedia article or the article cited by Wikipedia. Also, as far as I can tell, hang time isn't an official NFL statistic: https://www.nfl.com/stats/player-stats/category/punts/2022/reg/all/puntingaverageyards/desc . Last, during the time he played, he was among the all-time leaders in punting average and routinely punted 50+ yards. It was his combination of distance and hang time that made him lethal, and the dude was a true weapon.
Also...
kicker Errol Mann hit the left upright on his 29-yard field goal attempt.
It's funny to remember how tenuous kicks that are now considered gimmes used to be. Scott Norwood was shamed out of the league for missing a 47-yard kick, which even now isn't a gimme. Back in the mid-70s, anything more than 25 yards was iffy.
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A quick google of Super Bowl XI....
Gotta love Wikipedia. The statement that "The statistic for hang time was instituted in the NFL during his career, reportedly because of him" is supported by a citation to this article: https://southernmiss.com/news/2022/11/3/football-southern-miss-mourns-the-passing-of-golden-eagle-great-ray-guy.aspx . That article's only reference to "hang time" is that Guy's "majestic punts helped coin the phrase 'hang time.'" I did some googling and found nothing to support either the assertion in the Wikipedia article or the article cited by Wikipedia. Also, as far as I can tell, hang time isn't an official NFL statistic: https://www.nfl.com/stats/player-stats/category/punts/2022/reg/all/puntingaverageyards/desc . Last, during the time he played, he was among the all-time leaders in punting average and routinely punted 50+ yards. It was his combination of distance and hang time that made him lethal, and the dude was a true weapon.
<snip>
Maybe they erred, I can agree on that.
But.... for those that weren't around at that time.... his form and the results were, can we say, ...'majestic'. He had 'it'. :tup
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Another one score win for the Vikings. I'll give them credit for finding a way to win, but I still have no confidence in them going far in the playoffs.
I'm with you, but I have a good friend whose a lifelong Bills fan and has wanted to see a Vikings vs Bills Super Bowl, so then finally 1 of them will have won a Title.
It would be the Bills and then us Vikings fans would have no one to commiserate with. :lol
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Tonight is a good example of why the game being on Prime is annoying.
The Blues are on.
The World Series is on.
Even though the football game is a meh one, I'd like to check it out here and there...but I can't just flip to the stupid Prime for 30 seconds and flip back.
Thus, I am not watching any of the football game.
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Tonight is a good example of why the game being on Prime is annoying.
The Blues are on.
The World Series is on.
Even though the football game is a meh one, I'd like to check it out here and there...but I can't just flip to the stupid Prime for 30 seconds and flip back.
Thus, I am not watching any of the football game.
This is 💯
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Kev, at least you can watch the Blues. The Bruins game is on fucking ESPN+ tonight. I can't even watch them.
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I already shut the Blues off. Up 1-0 after the 1st, they are now down 1-4 late in the 2nd. They suck swamp water.
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Tell me about it Tim. I pay cable to watch sports and now they are trying to extort more money out of us. Pisses me off.
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Tell me about it Tim. I pay cable to watch sports and now they are trying to extort more money out of us. Pisses me off.
I pay for the Hulu bundle with Disney+, ESPN+, and live television. It costs me 80 bucks a month where cable would cost me over 100 a month in addition to having to pay for streaming services. The only thing I can’t watch is when the Rangers are on MSG.
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Tell me about it Tim. I pay cable to watch sports and now they are trying to extort more money out of us. Pisses me off.
I pay for the Hulu bundle with Disney+, ESPN+, and live television. It costs me 80 bucks a month where cable would cost me over 100 a month in addition to having to pay for streaming services. The only thing I can’t watch is when the Rangers are on MSG.
And it shouldn't be like that. You shouldn't be penalized by your hometown teams. Cable/streaming is a monopoly.
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Tell me about it Tim. I pay cable to watch sports and now they are trying to extort more money out of us. Pisses me off.
I pay for the Hulu bundle with Disney+, ESPN+, and live television. It costs me 80 bucks a month where cable would cost me over 100 a month in addition to having to pay for streaming services. The only thing I can’t watch is when the Rangers are on MSG.
And it shouldn't be like that. You shouldn't be penalized by your hometown teams. Cable/streaming is a monopoly.
That’s James Dolan for you. The greediest owner in both the NHL and NBA. And the Hulu package made me cut cable for good and I’m saving money, so outside of Dolan being a prick I have no complaints.
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Tonight is a good example of why the game being on Prime is annoying.
The Blues are on.
The World Series is on.
Even though the football game is a meh one, I'd like to check it out here and there...but I can't just flip to the stupid Prime for 30 seconds and flip back.
Thus, I am not watching any of the football game.
I have Prime on my PS5. All I have to do is hit the source button on the remote to flip back and forth. Piece O' cake. ;)
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I run everything through my computer. I'd have all three games on. If one of them suddenly becomes interesting just drag it to the big screen and turn the volume up. :lol
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The Panthers should be dissolved as a team, this is just embarrassing
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Wow. The Pats have won the last two weeks because they played 2 QB's that actually sucked worse than Mac Jones. He ain't the answer.
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Wow. The Pats have won the last two weeks because they played 2 QB's that actually sucked worse than Mac Jones. He ain't the answer.
We saw last year Mac Jones is capable of playing very good football. Far better than what he's shown this year. I know you're going to say he sucks, and Joe's going to blame Belichick and the other coaches, but it's honestly a little premature to be drawing conclusions about his long-term viability. Personally, I hope he runs screaming from NE and goes on to have a great career with somebody else. He's getting a shit deal there, particularly from the fans.
Objectively, it might be the weight he put on, dunno, but something screwed up his mechanics. Last year he had superb touch with the ball. He was placing the ball nearly perfectly most of the time. That's been absent this year. He's throwing behind his receivers now. His accuracy has gone from superb to shit. That's something he can work out.
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Adam Achelletta was dead on today during the game. If Mac's first read isn't there, he turtles. If because of the change in coaching staff, we look at this as his rookie year, then fine.
But I'm just calling him extremely average, and I don't think his ceiling will be very high. I hope he gets enough experience to attain the knowledge needed but I can also see time running out on him. We'll see I guess.
And "very good football" is an exaggeration, no? He faded pretty hard down the stretch.
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Well God damn the Jets are real
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Adam Achelletta was dead on today during the game. If Mac's first read isn't there, he turtles. If because of the change in coaching staff, we look at this as his rookie year, then fine.
But I'm just calling him extremely average, and I don't think his ceiling will be very high. I hope he gets enough experience to attain the knowledge needed but I can also see time running out on him. We'll see I guess.
And "very good football" is an exaggeration, no? He faded pretty hard down the stretch.
The rest of the team faded more than he did last year. Mostly the D. While he wasn't airing it out last year, he was making very good reads, very good decisions, and throwing the ball with superb accuracy.
Also, within 3 minutes of Archelletta saying that Mac checked down and hit Jonnu Smith for a long gain. In truth, part of the issue is that the patchwork O-line might give him time, or it might not. Hard to be consistent when you don't know what you got. I'll be curious to see how he looks next year after they bring in a decent tackle to block for him. Assuming, that is, that Patriots fans don't burn his house down and ride him out of town tarred and feathered. Starting to look kind of likely.
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It's not really a patchwork O-line. Ferentz (a veteran) was in for Andrews. This biggest issue for the O-line is that there's no O-line coach.
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Aaron Rodgers should just retire tomorrow. He looks awful.
Nice win for the Jets. Bills looking a bit too arrogant again after that win over KC.
Rams/Bucs game already unwatchable due to Romo constantly slurping TB12.
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I blame the coaching staff because they are obviously not playing to Mac's strengths.
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I blame the coaching staff because they are obviously not playing to Mac's strengths.
His strengths are having great protection and having his first read wide open.
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I do agree about the o line not playing well at all.
I blame the coaching staff because they are obviously not playing to Mac's strengths.
His strengths are having great protection and having his first read wide open.
That's not true. They had multiple replays when he had time you could see him scanning the field.
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I do agree about the o line not playing well at all. I blame the coaching staff because they are obviously not playing to Mac's strengths.
His strengths are having great protection and having his first read wide open.
That's not true. They had multiple replays when he had time you could see him scanning the field.
He's not decisive.
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That's a problem with the coaching staff. They need to adjust to his strengths. He's a play action guy and also like El Barto said, the o line is Swiss cheese.
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Patriots are sitting at 5-4, so I would say, be happy, eh?
Meanwhile, the doofus otherwise known as John McDaniel took over a playoff team with an above average QB and was handed a top 3 NFL WR as an addition...and is 2-6. I love it. :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
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That's a problem with the coaching staff. They need to adjust to his strengths. He's a play action guy and also like El Barto said, the o line is Swiss cheese.
He's never going to be more than average, but I'm the yahoo I guess. ;D
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That's a problem with the coaching staff. They need to adjust to his strengths. He's a play action guy and also like El Barto said, the o line is Swiss cheese.
He's never going to be more than average, but I'm the yahoo I guess. ;D
I generally agree with your take on Jones. How he looked at his best last year is probably as good as he will ever be in the NFL, and he looks like the kind of QB you don't want if the game goes off script. He basically has to be coached up to the max to be good as an NFL QB.
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That's a problem with the coaching staff. They need to adjust to his strengths. He's a play action guy and also like El Barto said, the o line is Swiss cheese.
He's never going to be more than average, but I'm the yahoo I guess. ;D
I generally agree with your take on Jones. How he looked at his best last year is probably as good as he will ever be in the NFL, and he looks like the kind of QB you don't want if the game goes off script. He basically has to be coached up to the max to be good as an NFL QB.
I mean, he's awesome if you need a FG. The only TD the O scored was thanks to a ST play on a punt.
I don't think this was the first game either that the D has scored as many TD's as the O.
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Meanwhile, the doofus otherwise known as John McDaniel took over a playoff team with an above average QB and was handed a top 3 NFL WR as an addition...and is 2-6. I love it. :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
After poaching several assistants I've got no sympathy for the guy. Honestly not sure what the problem is there, but I picked JAX today on the basis that the team was falling apart, and that does seem to be the case. It's not quite '10 Cowboys level yet, but I could see it going that way. It's getting close to him being out, regardless of Davis's assurances.
I generally agree with your take on Jones. How he looked at his best last year is probably as good as he will ever be in the NFL, and he looks like the kind of QB you don't want if the game goes off script. He basically has to be coached up to the max to be good as an NFL QB.
His best last year will be pretty good on most teams. In NE and its traditionally strong D and run games he'd be great. That doesn't mean HOFer, of course, but far from the bust people are making him out to be.
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Mac Jones is 5th in the league in INTs despite only playing 5 games and getting bailed out on a RTP penalty last week.
Also...3 TDs 7 Int 73.1 QBR
8 Offensive TD's in 5 games.
Not. Good.
It's not all Mac's fault as the coaching staff should be embarrassed. But he's not helping in any way. That's all I'm saying. Again, his rookie year, as I look at it. But I am concerned.
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Meanwhile, the doofus otherwise known as John McDaniel took over a playoff team with an above average QB and was handed a top 3 NFL WR as an addition...and is 2-6. I love it. :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
After poaching several assistants I've got no sympathy for the guy. Honestly not sure what the problem is there, but I picked JAX today on the basis that the team was falling apart, and that does seem to be the case. It's not quite '10 Cowboys level yet, but I could see it going that way. It's getting close to him being out, regardless of Davis's assurances.
I picked the Raiders to win today, simply because of how atrocious the Jags have been lately, and they couldn't even win that one.
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Mac Jones is 5th in the league in INTs despite only playing 5 games and getting bailed out on a RTP penalty last week.
Also...3 TDs 7 Int 73.1 QBR
8 Offensive TD's in 5 games.
Not. Good.
It's not all Mac's fault as the coaching staff should be embarrassed. But he's not helping in any way. That's all I'm saying. Again, his rookie year, as I look at it. But I am concerned.
At a minimum 3 of those picks weren't on him. Receivers and referees own a few of those. As I said 2 weeks ago, a couple of the picks have been shockingly bad, though. Definitely not good, but fair is fair.
Presumably they get O'Brien next year and I'm quite curious to see how that works out. I suppose the return of JMD is a possibility, but I'm not betting on it.
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Mac Jones is 5th in the league in INTs despite only playing 5 games and getting bailed out on a RTP penalty last week.
Also...3 TDs 7 Int 73.1 QBR
8 Offensive TD's in 5 games.
Not. Good.
It's not all Mac's fault as the coaching staff should be embarrassed. But he's not helping in any way. That's all I'm saying. Again, his rookie year, as I look at it. But I am concerned.
At a minimum 3 of those picks weren't on him. Receivers and referees own a few of those. As I said 2 weeks ago, a couple of the picks have been shockingly bad, though. Definitely not good, but fair is fair.
Presumably they get O'Brien next year and I'm quite curious to see how that works out. I suppose the return of JMD is a possibility, but I'm not betting on it.
Unless the players revolt, I can't see JMD being fired.
Is it possible to form an opinion?
Do you think he's good enough to be the long term solution for the Patriots at QB?
If the answer is I don't know or we'll see, then I actually think that's telling.
If you think he's the guy, that's fine.
I don't though.
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It is amazing how bad the Bucs' O is. Lots of drops today.
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It is amazing how bad the Bucs' O is. Lots of drops today.
Tony Romo, is that you? :lol :lol
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Mac Jones is 5th in the league in INTs despite only playing 5 games and getting bailed out on a RTP penalty last week.
Also...3 TDs 7 Int 73.1 QBR
8 Offensive TD's in 5 games.
Not. Good.
It's not all Mac's fault as the coaching staff should be embarrassed. But he's not helping in any way. That's all I'm saying. Again, his rookie year, as I look at it. But I am concerned.
At a minimum 3 of those picks weren't on him. Receivers and referees own a few of those. As I said 2 weeks ago, a couple of the picks have been shockingly bad, though. Definitely not good, but fair is fair.
Presumably they get O'Brien next year and I'm quite curious to see how that works out. I suppose the return of JMD is a possibility, but I'm not betting on it.
Unless the players revolt, I can't see JMD being fired.
Is it possible to form an opinion?
I think we might be seeing the beginnings of the revolution. I'm not in the lockerroom so I obviously don't know, but once a team gives up on a coach it's all over. We saw that in Dallas, and that may be happening there. As he showed in Denver, JMD isn't the most inspiring guy in the world, so holding on to them might be difficult. The team's got some talent, they can't win, and he doesn't have any answers. "Them's the breaks" only takes you so far.
Do you think he's good enough to be the long term solution for the Patriots at QB?
If the answer is I don't know or we'll see, then I actually think that's telling.
If you think he's the guy, that's fine.
I don't though.
I don't know and we'll see, though I have no idea what that says. He is not Tom Brady, and if anybody thought that they were silly. The thing is, 49 teams have won superbowls without having Tom Brady playing QB. He doesn't need to be. In NE it's a very different metric. NE has always been about executing on all three phases of the game, which is something most teams can't/don't do. Mac just has to be the guy who has the offense playing well, not great, and he's likely to have a fair amount of help along the way. He might be that guy.
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I have no idea who this Jets team is, all I know is that they’re 6-3 and firmly in the playoff race.
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Jeesh, who is Romo rooting for? He looked like his dog died on the previous possession.
Seems quite happy now.
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Jeesh, who is Romo rooting for? He looked like his dog died on the previous possession.
Seems quite happy now.
Yeah, he reacted like a 17-year old who just got the first head of his life when the Bucs scored there at the end.
Hope Kroenke enjoyed that loss, that asshole. :biggrin: :biggrin:
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Packers need to flush their front office. Believing Rodgers was worthy of such a large extension has put them in cap hell and they have done a real poor job of drafting the last few years.
Feels like the 70’s and 80’s all over again.
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Holy moly are the Titans a tough team to play. Not a single pass completed to a WR, nothing on offense the entire 2nd half and it still took 500 yards from Mahomes (passing + rushing) plus overtime to beat them. First player ever with 400 passing yards, 60+ rushing yds plus a rushing TD. Also threw in a rush for a 2-pt conversion. But yeah I want no part of the Titans in a playoff game. Their D is scary good.
LOL Rodgers and LOL Bills. Congrats to Brady for 100K yards.
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Yeah, the officials played a hard fought game to stop the Titans offense on key third down plays.
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Mac Jones is 5th in the league in INTs despite only playing 5 games and getting bailed out on a RTP penalty last week.
Also...3 TDs 7 Int 73.1 QBR
8 Offensive TD's in 5 games.
Not. Good.
It's not all Mac's fault as the coaching staff should be embarrassed. But he's not helping in any way. That's all I'm saying. Again, his rookie year, as I look at it. But I am concerned.
At a minimum 3 of those picks weren't on him. Receivers and referees own a few of those. As I said 2 weeks ago, a couple of the picks have been shockingly bad, though. Definitely not good, but fair is fair.
Presumably they get O'Brien next year and I'm quite curious to see how that works out. I suppose the return of JMD is a possibility, but I'm not betting on it.
Unless the players revolt, I can't see JMD being fired.
Is it possible to form an opinion?
I think we might be seeing the beginnings of the revolution. I'm not in the lockerroom so I obviously don't know, but once a team gives up on a coach it's all over. We saw that in Dallas, and that may be happening there. As he showed in Denver, JMD isn't the most inspiring guy in the world, so holding on to them might be difficult. The team's got some talent, they can't win, and he doesn't have any answers. "Them's the breaks" only takes you so far.
If McDaniel loses Carr, it's all over. Carr wasn't the first one on the bandwagon and he was candid about the fact that they were just hitting their stride and had to start over.
Some guys aren't meant to be No.1; they are solid, maybe even extraordinary, No. 2's, but aren't cut out to be No. 1.
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Holy moly are the Titans a tough team to play. Not a single pass completed to a WR, nothing on offense the entire 2nd half and it still took 500 yards from Mahomes (passing + rushing) plus overtime to beat them. First player ever with 400 passing yards, 60+ rushing yds plus a rushing TD. Also threw in a rush for a 2-pt conversion. But yeah I want no part of the Titans in a playoff game. Their D is scary good.
LOL Rodgers and LOL Bills. Congrats to Brady for 100K yards.
Love how you patently ignore the referee factor with Mahomes, but can't wait to point out every rules infraction missed throughout the entire league back through the Halas era, if it even possibly hints at affecting Brady. Comical. At this point, I don't even see the Chiefs making the CHAMPIONSHIP game, let along the Super Bowl.
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Congrats to Brady for 100K yards.
Now we know why he didn't retire. :lol
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Reich fired from Indy. Why isn't Matt Ryan QB'ing this team? They also have Folds as the backup and yet, the rookie QB started the last 2 games.
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Reich fired from Indy. Why isn't Matt Ryan QB'ing this team? They also have Folds as the backup and yet, the rookie QB started the last 2 games.
He deserved better. That's not Reich's fault, IMO.
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Was he forced to play the rookie or not play their backup that could be a starter on other teams? I'm just confused by them.
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Reich fired from Indy. Why isn't Matt Ryan QB'ing this team? They also have Folds as the backup and yet, the rookie QB started the last 2 games.
He deserved better. That's not Reich's fault, IMO.
I'd love to see him here as the OC.
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Funny how TB12 said the end of that game was "fucking awesome"! Something he's been able to do in his sleep for most of his career and he acts like it's the 1st time. :lol What's even funnier is, the Bucs are in 1st place at 4-5. :eek
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Funny how TB12 said the end of that game was "fucking awesome"! Something he's been able to do in his sleep for most of his career and he acts like it's the 1st time. :lol What's even funnier is, the Bucs are in 1st place at 4-5. :eek
I think what he was calling "fucking awesome" was the blowjob he got from Tony Romo.
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Funny how TB12 said the end of that game was "fucking awesome"! Something he's been able to do in his sleep for most of his career and he acts like it's the 1st time. :lol What's even funnier is, the Bucs are in 1st place at 4-5. :eek
I think what he was calling "fucking awesome" was the blowjob he got from Tony Romo.
Tim, if you saw Steve Harris in a small club you would blow him. You know it to be true.
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Intriguing choice to go with Jeff Saturday as the interim head coach for the Colts. Very curious how that will work out.
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No one on the Colts coaching staff has ever called a play in the NFL before.
Sunday against the Raiders should be a hoot.
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Funny how TB12 said the end of that game was "fucking awesome"! Something he's been able to do in his sleep for most of his career and he acts like it's the 1st time. :lol What's even funnier is, the Bucs are in 1st place at 4-5. :eek
I think what he was calling "fucking awesome" was the blowjob he got from Tony Romo.
Tim, if you saw Steve Harris in a small club you would blow him. You know it to be true.
:lol You guys are fuckin' killin' me! :rollin
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Funny how TB12 said the end of that game was "fucking awesome"! Something he's been able to do in his sleep for most of his career and he acts like it's the 1st time. :lol What's even funnier is, the Bucs are in 1st place at 4-5. :eek
I think what he was calling "fucking awesome" was the blowjob he got from Tony Romo.
Tim, if you saw Steve Harris in a small club you would blow him. You know it to be true.
(https://assets-in.bmscdn.com/iedb/artist/images/website/poster/large/steve-harris-11860-23-08-2018-05-31-40.jpg)
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He's have to with that actor. He'd manhandle him.
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What actor is that?
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What actor is that?
Per your friend Google Lens, it's an actor named Steve Harris who, according to Wikipedia, "has played Eugene Young on the legal drama The Practice, Detective Isaiah 'Bird' Freeman on the NBC drama Awake and Charles McCarter in Tyler Perry’s Diary of a Mad Black Woman."
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3 shows I've never heard of. :lol
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My wife and I watched all nine seasons of 'The Practice', so that's why that Steve Harris popped in my head right away. btw, it was filmed in Boston!
(back to the NFL after we attempt to watch the Ravens game tonight. It'll be hard to stay awake right after the time change)
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I've heard of The Practice but not the other two.
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My wife and I watched all nine seasons of 'The Practice', so that's why that Steve Harris popped in my head right away. btw, it was filmed in Boston!
(back to the NFL after we attempt to stay away for the Ravens game tonight. It'll be hard to stay awake right after the time change)
Tim could have a movie production in his neighborhood and he would be oblivious.
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My wife and I watched all nine seasons of 'The Practice', so that's why that Steve Harris popped in my head right away. btw, it was filmed in Boston!
(back to the NFL after we attempt to stay away for the Ravens game tonight. It'll be hard to stay awake right after the time change)
Tim could have a movie production in his neighborhood and he would be oblivious.
I'd ask them if they filled the part of the crabby guy.
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You'd kill it.
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Reich fired from Indy. Why isn't Matt Ryan QB'ing this team? They also have Folds as the backup and yet, the rookie QB started the last 2 games.
I can't recall the specifics, but Ryan is owed a big amount of money if he plays x-number of snaps, and I think they have realized that he is done and they won't want to pay him that money, so they are going with the rookie in a season they figure is dead in the water anyway. I am just surprised Reich took the hit so soon.
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That's why it's puzzling. Evermind their backup not starting.
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That's why it's puzzling. Evermind their backup not starting.
(https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/forumavatars/avatar_7856_1589635868.jpeg)
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Lolol. Nevermind. Lol
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(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/b7/NirvanaNevermindalbumcover.jpg)
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Looking forward to seeing how the '9ers play in their next 2 games after the bye. I am tempted to overreact after the HUGE win over the Rams, added to the fact that they will have almost all of their injured starters back for the first time. But even though all signs point in a positive direction, I don't want to prematurely overreact. Those first two games should be a good indicator of where the season will go. If they go well, I don't think it is overstating the case to predict them as division winners, probable #2 or #3 seed...
That would be a fair assessment, if you weren't overlooking one thing...
(https://media.tenor.com/NqX1fk-VnsAAAAAM/seattle-seahawks-mascot-seattle-seahawks.gif)
:biggrin:
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Looking forward to seeing how the '9ers play in their next 2 games after the bye. I am tempted to overreact after the HUGE win over the Rams, added to the fact that they will have almost all of their injured starters back for the first time. But even though all signs point in a positive direction, I don't want to prematurely overreact. Those first two games should be a good indicator of where the season will go. If they go well, I don't think it is overstating the case to predict them as division winners, probable #2 or #3 seed...
That would be a fair assessment, if you weren't overlooking one thing...
(https://media.tenor.com/NqX1fk-VnsAAAAAM/seattle-seahawks-mascot-seattle-seahawks.gif)
:biggrin:
I mean, the fact you don’t even MENTION them is a bit hurtful, bosky…
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Overall, pretty happen with how these first 8 games went for KC. First of all, they had the toughest opening 8-game schedule in NFL history (all playoff teams from the previous year) and went 6-2, losing the 2 by a combined 7 points. They should roll most of the remaining teams with the Chargers and Bengals being the toughest matchups and potential losses.
Tua so far has been pretty amazing considering he still constantly underthrows Hill and Waddle. Great job being done by McDaniel in a division that is suddenly very good due to finally having 4 good coaches and 4 good or up-and-coming QBs. Going to be interesting seeing how they jockey for playoff spots.
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Looking forward to seeing how the '9ers play in their next 2 games after the bye. I am tempted to overreact after the HUGE win over the Rams, added to the fact that they will have almost all of their injured starters back for the first time. But even though all signs point in a positive direction, I don't want to prematurely overreact. Those first two games should be a good indicator of where the season will go. If they go well, I don't think it is overstating the case to predict them as division winners, probable #2 or #3 seed...
That would be a fair assessment, if you weren't overlooking one thing...
(https://media.tenor.com/NqX1fk-VnsAAAAAM/seattle-seahawks-mascot-seattle-seahawks.gif)
:biggrin:
I mean, the fact you don’t even MENTION them is a bit hurtful, bosky…
OK, my short take relating to Seattle: They are better than expected, but not as good as their record would suggest. Tying that back to my post, it comes down to how legit the 49ers are. The next 2 games coming out of the bye should be an indicator, primarily because (1) they will have had more time to integrate McCaffrey and (2) they will be a healthy team for the first time this season and will finally have most or all of their starters available. If they look good those two games, I think they handle the Seahawks a second time and should easily take the division. If they do NOT look good those two games, that is an indicator of bigger problems, and likely means they either limp into the playoffs with a wildcard or miss the playoffs entirely. Which means evil prevails in the world and Seattle wins the division. Simple.
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Reich fired from Indy. Why isn't Matt Ryan QB'ing this team? They also have Folds as the backup and yet, the rookie QB started the last 2 games.
I can't recall the specifics, but Ryan is owed a big amount of money if he plays x-number of snaps, and I think they have realized that he is done and they won't want to pay him that money, so they are going with the rookie in a season they figure is dead in the water anyway. I am just surprised Reich took the hit so soon.
I really am; that benching of Ryan - for that reason - can't be only on Reich's shoulders. And two games is not enough to really assess a rookie like that, especially when the system has largely been built around old, experienced, immobile, standup passers (Rivers, Ryan). not untested rookies.
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Right; Irsay is one of those Jerry Jones type owners that can never get their egotistical fingers out of the pie.
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Well, to be fair, JJ is the owner/GM. That isn't the case in Indy.
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Fun fact: Justin Herbert has now started 40 games in the NFL and has never, at any point, had a winning record as a starter.
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Fun fact: Justin Herbert has now started 40 games in the NFL and has never, at any point, had a winning record as a starter.
?
The Chargers are 5-3.
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Fun fact: Justin Herbert has now started 40 games in the NFL and has never, at any point, had a winning record as a starter.
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The Chargers are 5-3.
I think Kev meant that Herbert's career record has never been above .500.
He lost his first 4 starts and 8 of his first 10 starts in 2020. He finished that season with a 6-9 record (he didn't start the Chargers first game that season). He won 4 of his first 5 starts in 2021 to push the career record to 10-10. He then lost 4 of his next 6 to move the career mark to 12-14. He evened things up at 14-14 before losing 3 of 4 to end the 2021 season at 15-17. He lost 2 of the first 3 this season to move to 16-19, then won 3 straight to even things at 19-19 before losing and then winning in his 2 most recent starts. If he and the Chargers beat the 49ers on Sunday, he'll move to 21-20 for his career.
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Correct.
I am not always crazy about considering wins and losses a QB stat, but I just find it interesting how everyone drools over Herbert like he's the second coming, yet he has never had more wins than losses as an NFL starter.
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I'm fairly confident (barring any career ending injuries) that 5 years from now Herbert will be just fine, and no one will even remember his first 40 games. ;)
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I'm fairly confident (barring any career ending injuries) that 5 years from now Herbert will be just fine, and no one will even remember his first 40 games. ;)
Except Kev.
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I'm fairly confident (barring any career ending injuries) that 5 years from now Herbert will be just fine, and no one will even remember his first 40 games. ;)
Except Kev.
And Stadler. How many rings does he have? Hmm? HMMMM?
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I'm fairly confident (barring any career ending injuries) that 5 years from now Herbert will be just fine, and no one will even remember his first 40 games. ;)
Except Kev.
And Stadler. How many rings does he have? Hmm? HMMMM?
Dan Marino would like a word with you.
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I'm fairly confident (barring any career ending injuries) that 5 years from now Herbert will be just fine, and no one will even remember his first 40 games. ;)
Except Kev.
And Stadler. How many rings does he have? Hmm? HMMMM?
Dan Marino would like a word with you.
I'm fine with that. I've given my opinion on Dan Marino here before.
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I'm fairly confident (barring any career ending injuries) that 5 years from now Herbert will be just fine, and no one will even remember his first 40 games. ;)
Except Kev.
And Stadler. How many rings does he have? Hmm? HMMMM?
Dan Marino would like a word with you.
I'm fine with that. I've given my opinion on Dan Marino here before.
SB rings aren't the only measure of greatness.
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I'm fairly confident (barring any career ending injuries) that 5 years from now Herbert will be just fine, and no one will even remember his first 40 games. ;)
Except Kev.
And Stadler. How many rings does he have? Hmm? HMMMM?
Dan Marino would like a word with you.
I'm fine with that. I've given my opinion on Dan Marino here before.
SB rings aren't the only measure of greatness.
Unless you have 7 and stats to back it.
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Still isn't. There are plenty of greats out there that aren't named Tom Brady.
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Still isn't. There are plenty of greats out there that aren't named Tom Brady.
No one said it was the ONLY stat, but it's a factor. That's why we play the games. The objective isn't to throw for 400 yds a game or five TDs, it's to win games, ultimately to the point that you win the Super Bowl.
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It's the combo of the 2 that makes him the goat. Marino is great for sure but he's not better than Joe Montana in most peoples eyes because he doesn't have rings. Though his stats are light years better than Joe's.
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It's the combo of the 2 that makes him the goat.
Exactly (although it's more than just the rings and the stats, but you are on the right track about it not just being about rings).
Marino is great for sure but he's not better than Joe Montana in most peoples eyes because he doesn't have rings. Though his stats are light years better than Joe's.
No, he's not better than Montana AND he doesn't have rings, not because he doesn't have rings. Stats are helpful, but there's also a level of performance that doesn't show up in just comparing some (not ALL) isolated stats. Marino was a great QB. Montana was a better QB. His skill set was more broad than Marino's and he got results, aside from the rings. And while some (NOT ALL) of Marino's stats might be better, they aren't anywhere near "lightyears better."
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It's the combo of the 2 that makes him the goat.
Exactly (although it's more than just the rings and the stats, but you are on the right track about it not just being about rings).
Marino is great for sure but he's not better than Joe Montana in most peoples eyes because he doesn't have rings. Though his stats are light years better than Joe's.
No, he's not better than Montana AND he doesn't have rings, not because he doesn't have rings. Stats are helpful, but there's also a level of performance that doesn't show up in just comparing some (not ALL) isolated stats. Marino was a great QB. Montana was a better QB. His skill set was more broad than Marino's and he got results, aside from the rings. And while some (NOT ALL) of Marino's stats might be better, they aren't anywhere near "lightyears better."
It's an example of how people look at stats. They look at the total stats. They don't look at the clutch stats like Montana. I agree Montana is better but most people don't look at it like you and I do.
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I mean, I don't know anyone that thinks Marino is better than Montana.
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My issue with championships playing into it is that one player can ride a great team to a title. Obviously someone like Brady, who has five Super Bowl MVP awards in addition to his seven Super Bowl rings, played a huge factor in most of his team’s title wins, but then you have guys like Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson who rode all time great defenses to a ring, while guys like Dan Marino and Jim Kelly never reached the summit for various reasons, some having nothing to do with them (wide right anyone?). I definitely put Brady and Montana above Marino and Kelly because they have the stats as well as the rings, but to diminish these players’ amazing accomplishments simply because those incredible careers didn’t include a championship is ridiculous especially in football which is the ultimate team game where one player can’t really win a game essentially by themselves like in baseball, hockey, and especially basketball.
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My issue with championships playing into it is that one player can ride a great team to a title. Obviously someone like Brady, who has five Super Bowl MVP awards in addition to his seven Super Bowl rings, played a huge factor in most of his team’s title wins, but then you have guys like Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson who rode all time great defenses to a ring, while guys like Dan Marino and Jim Kelly never reached the summit for various reasons, some having nothing to do with them (wide right anyone?). I definitely put Brady and Montana above Marino and Kelly because they have the stats as well as the rings, but to diminish these players’ amazing accomplishments simply because those incredible careers didn’t include a championship is ridiculous especially in football which is the ultimate team game where one player can’t really win a game essentially by themselves like in baseball, hockey, and especially basketball.
I agree. Ring snobs.
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Still isn't. There are plenty of greats out there that aren't named Tom Brady.
No one said it was the ONLY stat, but it's a factor. That's why we play the games. The objective isn't to throw for 400 yds a game or five TDs, it's to win games, ultimately to the point that you win the Super Bowl.
Oh look, the goal posts just moved (pun intended). You certainly made it seem like it was the ONLY stat that matters and you were referring to a QB that has only started 40 games compared to someone who's played over 360 games. Not really a fair comparison.
My issue with championships playing into it is that one player can ride a great team to a title. Obviously someone like Brady, who has five Super Bowl MVP awards in addition to his seven Super Bowl rings, played a huge factor in most of his team’s title wins, but then you have guys like Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson who rode all time great defenses to a ring, while guys like Dan Marino and Jim Kelly never reached the summit for various reasons, some having nothing to do with them (wide right anyone?). I definitely put Brady and Montana above Marino and Kelly because they have the stats as well as the rings, but to diminish these players’ amazing accomplishments simply because those incredible careers didn’t include a championship is ridiculous especially in football which is the ultimate team game where one player can’t really win a game essentially by themselves like in baseball, hockey, and especially basketball.
Thank you.
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My issue with championships playing into it is that one player can ride a great team to a title. Obviously someone like Brady, who has five Super Bowl MVP awards in addition to his seven Super Bowl rings, played a huge factor in most of his team’s title wins, but then you have guys like Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson who rode all time great defenses to a ring, while guys like Dan Marino and Jim Kelly never reached the summit for various reasons, some having nothing to do with them (wide right anyone?). I definitely put Brady and Montana above Marino and Kelly because they have the stats as well as the rings, but to diminish these players’ amazing accomplishments simply because those incredible careers didn’t include a championship is ridiculous especially in football which is the ultimate team game where one player can’t really win a game essentially by themselves like in baseball, hockey, and especially basketball.
I agree. Ring snobs.
When your favorite player gas 7 by himself, yeah. I'm a snob.
I mean, I don't know anyone that thinks Marino is better than Montana.
I've heard many say that in the 90's. Not as much today. Mostly they thought the regular season stats meant more
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No one gets a ring by themselves in a team sport. You know this. :P
The ring stuff seems to play out in real time, but over time, not as much. I remember in the 90s when Barry Sanders and Emmitt Smith were the unquestioned top 2 RBs, and the debate always seemed pretty even about who was better. But now, unless you are a Cowboys honk, the answer is Sanders, and it seems to be not even close anymore.
Circling back to Herbert, let's look at him and another QB from his draft class:
Justin Herbert: 20-20 as a starter, 82 TDs, 30 INTs, 7.2 career YPA, 8 rushing TDs
Tua Tagovailoa: 19-9 as a starter, 42 TDs, 18 INTs, 7.2 career YPA, 6 rushing TDs
Herbert has a slight edge in stats due to a better TD-INT ratio, but Tua has a far better W/L record. Wins and losses supposedly matter more when it comes to QBs, but apparently not, as every time I see a football talking head do a list of the best QBs in the league right now, Herbert is either in the top 5 (usually at 4 or 5) or close to it, while Tua is not even in many top 10s.
I think Herbert IS really good, and will have a very good NFL career, but he is being put in a conversation with proven commodities already, which seems more than a bit premature. Can he get a winning record as a starter first? Can he win a playoff game? Heck, can he MAKE the playoffs first??
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My issue with championships playing into it is that one player can ride a great team to a title. Obviously someone like Brady, who has five Super Bowl MVP awards in addition to his seven Super Bowl rings, played a huge factor in most of his team’s title wins, but then you have guys like Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson who rode all time great defenses to a ring, while guys like Dan Marino and Jim Kelly never reached the summit for various reasons, some having nothing to do with them (wide right anyone?). I definitely put Brady and Montana above Marino and Kelly because they have the stats as well as the rings, but to diminish these players’ amazing accomplishments simply because those incredible careers didn’t include a championship is ridiculous especially in football which is the ultimate team game where one player can’t really win a game essentially by themselves like in baseball, hockey, and especially basketball.
It's case by case. But here's the thing: there's an argument - and a good one - that Marino wouldn't have those numbers if he DID have a ring. How many games did the 'fins lose 48-45? How many games did Brady finish with 175 yards, because the last 20 minutes were the Pats running the ball to keep the clock moving? I'm a system guy, a team guy; if I'm playing the best pass defense in the league, I'm not throwing it down their throat; I'm doing what I can to WIN, and sometimes that means NOT throwing for 350 yards and 4 TD. Look at Peyton Manning; for my money, his greatest season - well, not GREATEST, but most impressive - was the SB win in Denver because he did everything that the sort of stereotypical "Peyton Manning" WOULDN'T do. That showed me everything I needed to know about Peyton Manning and elevated him in my mind to one of the three or four best QBs to ever play the game.
NO, Trent Dilfer is not better than Dan Marino because he has a ring; that's just stupid. But when you start to have QBs that are similar in numbers, that's the differentiator for me for sure, because that's the ONE THING that most of the players are all united on.
Oh look, the goal posts just moved (pun intended). You certainly made it seem like it was the ONLY stat that matters and you were referring to a QB that has only started 40 games compared to someone who's played over 360 games. Not really a fair comparison.
No, the goal posts DIDN'T move; you were trying to pin on me some absolute black and white standard that doesn't exist. You pointed to Dilfer and Johnson, but the best example is Jeff Hostetler in NY for Parcell's second Super Bowl. C'mon; he's in NO ONE'S conversation for "greatest QB", even on his own team. BUT when you start getting to the level of "Elite" QBs, I think SB's count a lot, and not just because of the team; as I said before, I'm a "team" guy; ask any Patriot from the past 20 years and they will tell you: "We could have been down 15 points with 15 seconds on the clock and with Brady, I really did honestly believe we still had a shot to win". Even the defense knew; "I just need to step up for one more play, stuff these fuckers, and Tom Terrific is going to carry us home". That's greatness, and the greatest players - even in team sports - had that: Gretzky, Messier, Bird, Montana, Brady... I'd love to hear what King and Bart and TAC say, but I know for me, it's a real feeling of disappointment now in New England knowing that reality has set in; we're down 14 with even 10 minutes to go and it's not a given anymore.
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DC taking Commanders to court. Wow.
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A QB's defense should never be a factor in considering whether he's better than another. Ever. Marino had shit defenses his entire career. If QB A "wins" 17-16 but QB B "loses" 36-34 who really played better?
Or this scenario: Peyton Manning gets his team into Field Goal range at the end of the game, trailing Tom Brady 21-20. If Vanderjagt (eff him forever) makes the field goal, the next day's headline is "Manning outduels Brady". If he misses it's "Brady outduels Manning". I think we can all see how intellectually dishonest this is. No QB wins a game by himself, and never will. All a QB can do to help his team win is to PLAY THE BEST HE CAN. And how do you measure who played best? With numbers, not "gut feeling" or hyperbole.
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I don't overly disagree with a lot of that, but I do disagree that it's not that black and white. There are things "numbers" alone don't necessarily capture. I think something like this was already mentioned, but what about the situation where the coach dials up a big pass play for a touchdown, the offense comes up to the line, and the QB recognizes that the defense that lines up is a BAD matchup for that play and will likely squash it, so the QB audibles out of it, calls a run, and that run play goes for a touchdown? The QB loses out on the completion, the yards, and the TD. The runner gets all of that. That doesn't show up in the QB's stats at all, but he gets a TON of the credit for recognizing and calling the correct play on the fly. And that says nothing about all the other plays the team later completes successfully because the other players have more confidence in their QB than if he was just a gunslinger that can complete the impossible pass every now and then. That doesn't necessarily directly show up in the stat line either. Nor to the scenarios Stadler just laid out. Stats are great. But they don't paint the whole picture. There are any number of scenarios we can come up with that illustrate why.
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A QB's defense should never be a factor in considering whether he's better than another. Ever. Marino had shit defenses his entire career. If QB A "wins" 17-16 but QB B "loses" 36-34 who really played better?
Or this scenario: Peyton Manning gets his team into Field Goal range at the end of the game, trailing Tom Brady 21-20. If Vanderjagt (eff him forever) makes the field goal, the next day's headline is "Manning outduels Brady". If he misses it's "Brady outduels Manning". I think we can all see how intellectually dishonest this is. No QB wins a game by himself, and never will. All a QB can do to help his team win is to PLAY THE BEST HE CAN. And how do you measure who played best? With numbers, not "gut feeling" or hyperbole.
Exactly. Perfect. Beautiful. SEVEN Super Bowl rings. More than any other QB in history. GOAT.
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A QB's defense should never be a factor in considering whether he's better than another. Ever. Marino had shit defenses his entire career. If QB A "wins" 17-16 but QB B "loses" 36-34 who really played better?
Or this scenario: Peyton Manning gets his team into Field Goal range at the end of the game, trailing Tom Brady 21-20. If Vanderjagt (eff him forever) makes the field goal, the next day's headline is "Manning outduels Brady". If he misses it's "Brady outduels Manning". I think we can all see how intellectually dishonest this is. No QB wins a game by himself, and never will. All a QB can do to help his team win is to PLAY THE BEST HE CAN. And how do you measure who played best? With numbers, not "gut feeling" or hyperbole.
Not necessarily. Numbers can be skewed based on game situation. Check out the Dallas/Denver game last year. Prescott and the Cowboys were horrible for most of the game, but Prescott stayed in the game despite being down 30-0 in the 4th quarter, threw 2 late garbage scores, and ended up with around 230 passing yards and 2 TDs. Sounds like a good game, right? The numbers say it was, but it wasn't. And there are many examples like that.
Also, QB A outdueled QB B is just media nonsense since the two QBs are never on the field at the same time. The people who think Eli should be in the HOF because he beat Tom Brady in the Super Bowl twice are just dumb. Leaving aside the fact that the Giants offense scored 17 and 19 points in those games (woah, stand back!!), the Giants defense shutting down the Patriots offense in both games is why they won, but all some remember are the drives at the end of each to win.
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I am extremely worried about the officiating in Germany this Sunday. For some bizarre reason, instead of trying to promote star young players who are the future of the sport, the NFL wants to use a fading legend to pump up interest in the game. So you KNOW they would really like Brady to come out on top. If there are blatant questionable calls you saw the prediction here first; if not I’ll be back here to eat crow. But I’m pretty confident that the NFL will not care one iota about hosing Geno Smith who’s been the best story in the league this year.
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This fading legend had 800,000 fans in Germany trying to get tickets. You sound like a conspiracy theorist..
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/34996579/why-800k-fans-vied-see-brady-bucs-face-seahawks-germany
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Is that really a thing? Officiating agendas by the league to intentionally skew the results toward one team over another? Uh, wow...
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Only in conspiracists minds.
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And in the NBA.
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I have never thought that there was an actual organized conspiracy to play favorites in the NFL. But having said that, I do believe that it is impossible for all officials everywhere to be 100% objective. Whether consciously or subconsciously, I have a feeling that refs are people to and their feelings get involved.
The short version: they play favorites.
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You had an NBA ref, who owed money to the mob tanking games. Tom Brady doesn't have that worry.
Well, how much did Gisele get? :lol
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That game was a good example of how you can't always look at numbers to determine who played well or better. Geno Smith was bad for most of the game, but ended up with good numbers overall thanks to two late scores after they were down by 18 in the 4th quarter.
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I know he's competitive and all, but Josh Allen has no business trying to tackle anybody. That was a terrible decision.
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Vikings/Bills was nuts!! What an ending!!
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Was? It still is!
Game of the year.
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Vikings/Bills was nuts!! What an ending!!
(https://media4.giphy.com/media/tEWzonmW4YqKWc5SJs/giphy.gif)
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Yup! I haven't yelled at the TV like this in a long time!
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Vikings/Bills was nuts!! What an ending!!
And FUCKING Fox switched me over to the START of the FUCKING Rams game just as OT was starting.
FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK!!!!!
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Justin Jefferson :hefdaddy :hefdaddy :hefdaddy
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Vikings/Bills was nuts!! What an ending!!
And FUCKING Fox switched me over to the START of the FUCKING Rams game just as OT was starting.
FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK!!!!!
Still seeing the plays on Red Zone. Totally worth the money.
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Vikings/Bills was nuts!! What an ending!!
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Now it rings true. Jostradamus.
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Christ, what a game. That was great.
And FUCKING Fox switched me over to the START of the FUCKING Rams game just as OT was starting.
First game I watched on broadcast TV all year, and they pulled that shit. Thankfully I'd been stealing broadcasts all year so it was an easy enough switch to get back to it. But man, I'd be furious if I were stuck with that nonsense. Sports broadcast rules are ridiculous.
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As great as Josh Allen is, he turns it over too much.
With all due respect to Tyreek Hill and Cooper Kupp, Justin Jefferson might be the best WR in football now.
And maybe Kirk Cousins will finally get some respect, but I doubt it.
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I watched that Vikings-Bills all the way until the Vikings turned it over on downs with like 30-40 seconds left. I thought, tough luck Vikes, Bills got it in the end. Had no clue Vikings would win it in the end. That will teach me to not turn off the game until the finale whistle is blown..
At least the Bucs played competently today. They almost lost it in the end but got a good momentum going. Hopefully the bye week doesn't derail them again.
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As great as Josh Allen is, he turns it over too much.
With all due respect to Tyreek Hill and Cooper Kupp, Justin Jefferson might be the best WR in football now.
And maybe Kirk Cousins will finally get some respect, but I doubt it.
You know they BOTH threw two interceptions. Just saying both QBs seemed equal in that department today.
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Kev is commenting on Allen snd his status. Not at the game in hand.
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Lifelong Vikings fan here. I finally think the Vikings are for real this season. Probably not Super Bowl real, but deep run in the playoffs real at least.
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Vikings/Bills was nuts!! What an ending!!
Yes, that game was insane!
And the Packers are back! (well not really but always great to beat Dallas)
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Lifelong Vikings fan here. I finally think the Vikings are for real this season. Probably not Super Bowl real, but deep run in the playoffs real at least.
they have more comeback in them, than maybe any other Vikings team I recall. However, I'm not convinced yet that they can translate that to a run to the Super Bowl. Also the fact Philadelphia also has a 2-game edge on them still given they are still 8-0 and beat them, pretty handily.
If the Vikings had to play in Philadelphia in the playoffs, I would assume they would lose. 2017 and Nick Foles?..nuff said.
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Here to eat crow, the game was decided not by penalties but by Geno fumbling in the red zone and Brady getting 161 yards of rushing support compared to 17 for Geno ::). A couple uncalled pushoffs but nothing egregious. Gotta laugh though at Brady’s chutzpah wanting to try the Philly special again and failing miserably again :lol.
Bills fall to 3rd place, KC now the #1 seed. Who could’ve seen that coming? And great wins for a couple guys who get crapped on way too much, Cousins and Goff.
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Update:
Josh McDaniels is now 7-24 in his last 31 games as NFL head coach, and today's was a good one, losing a home game to a team that had been in freefall and whose interim head coach had zero coaching experience in the NFL prior today. :rollin :rollin :rollin
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Update:
Josh McDaniels is now 7-24 in his last 31 games as NFL head coach, and today's was a good one, losing a home game to a team that had been in freefall and whose interim head coach had zero coaching experience in the NFL prior today. :rollin :rollin :rollin
Insofar as this season goes, I have no idea how much of it is him sucking and how much is just bad breaks. At this point, though, it no longer matters. Davis probably wants to give him until the end of the season to see if he can turn things around, but that's unlikely to happen. In all likelihood he's a black Monday casualty. If the team completely implodes, like 2010 Dallas, he won't last that long, but it seems like they really want to try for him (unlike 2010 Dallas :lol).
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Update:
Josh McDaniels is now 7-24 in his last 31 games as NFL head coach, and today's was a good one, losing a home game to a team that had been in freefall and whose interim head coach had zero coaching experience in the NFL prior today. :rollin :rollin :rollin
Insofar as this season goes, I have no idea how much of it is him sucking and how much is just bad breaks. At this point, though, it no longer matters. Davis probably wants to give him until the end of the season to see if he can turn things around, but that's unlikely to happen. In all likelihood he's a black Monday casualty. If the team completely implodes, like 2010 Dallas, he won't last that long, but it seems like they really want to try for him (unlike 2010 Dallas :lol).
I think I said it here last year that the Raiders should have held on to Rich Bisaccia, the interim head coach who took over last year once Gruden took the fall. Bisaccia did a great job in keeping the team together considering all the turmoil and even got them to the playoffs, but, no, the Raiders wanted a big name and a splash. Well, they got one, and this is the result.
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It's so weird to see a very good OC that can't translate to a good head couch but Josh may be that prime example.
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Update:
Josh McDaniels is now 7-24 in his last 31 games as NFL head coach, and today's was a good one, losing a home game to a team that had been in freefall and whose interim head coach had zero coaching experience in the NFL prior today. :rollin :rollin :rollin
Insofar as this season goes, I have no idea how much of it is him sucking and how much is just bad breaks. At this point, though, it no longer matters. Davis probably wants to give him until the end of the season to see if he can turn things around, but that's unlikely to happen. In all likelihood he's a black Monday casualty. If the team completely implodes, like 2010 Dallas, he won't last that long, but it seems like they really want to try for him (unlike 2010 Dallas :lol).
I think I said it here last year that the Raiders should have held on to Rich Bisaccia, the interim head coach who took over last year once Gruden took the fall. Bisaccia did a great job in keeping the team together considering all the turmoil and even got them to the playoffs, but, no, the Raiders wanted a big name and a splash. Well, they got one, and this is the result.
The Raiders were 7-1 last year in games decided by three points or less, with three of those wins in OT. The NFL more often than not is 'cruel' and likes to even things out over time. I'm simply talking about the breaks. That said, they've given three games away, and aren't coming up big in the clutch. And, yes, Bisaccia should have been the HC this year, no argument there.
As great as Josh Allen is, he turns it over too much.
With all due respect to Tyreek Hill and Cooper Kupp, Justin Jefferson might be the best WR in football now.
That 4th down catch was amazing! Yet, all the defender had to do was swipe it away, not try to intercept. btw, that Diggs' one hander was pretty good too :tup
Josh Allen: the INT on 4th down when it was 27-17 was 'turn about fair play'. John Harbaugh made that same decision against the Bills, and Lamar threw a 4th and goal at the 2 INT in a tie game with around four minutes to go. Take the damn points!!!!
The Bills would have been up 30-17 with ten minutes to go. All you need is another FG to basically put the game away, or to take the lead if you give up two consecutive TDs.
There's a reason Brandon Staley and the Chargers are what their record actually is, and it's this type of mostly illogical thinking.
Yup....ANALytics :facepalm:
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It's always a good Sunday when the Giants win and the Cowboys lose.
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Interesting stat: before yesterday, the Cowboys had been 195-0 all time when leading by 14 at the start of the fourth quarter.
Oh well.
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Christ, what a game. That was great.
And FUCKING Fox switched me over to the START of the FUCKING Rams game just as OT was starting.
First game I watched on broadcast TV all year, and they pulled that shit. Thankfully I'd been stealing broadcasts all year so it was an easy enough switch to get back to it. But man, I'd be furious if I were stuck with that nonsense. Sports broadcast rules are ridiculous.
Fortunately, my kid has taken to watching games this year...on his computer, and he shares his screen with his video gaming friends. He pulled up the game on his phone so we could watch to the end.
As great as Josh Allen is, he turns it over too much.
With all due respect to Tyreek Hill and Cooper Kupp, Justin Jefferson might be the best WR in football now.
Both of the interceptions that Allen threw to Patrick Peterson were inexcusable. And there were three catches in that game that were absolutely ridiculous.
Also, Russell Wilson is making me pine for Brock Osweiler.
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I'm disagree with those calling this the "game of the year," "game of the week," etc. Yeah, the unpredictability of it all made it kind of interesting. But when the game is unpredictable just because the two teams are committing game-changing mistakes at a record pace, that doesn't make it a great game.
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Interesting stat: before yesterday, the Cowboys had been 195-0 all time when leading by 14 at the start of the fourth quarter.
Oh well.
Yeah, Dallas always seems to find new ways to fuck themselves. I think it's a staggering stat that they were actually leading by that much in the 4th qtr for that many games.
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(https://i.imgur.com/n95W6jL.jpg)
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Is that really a thing? Officiating agendas by the league to intentionally skew the results toward one team over another? Uh, wow...
It's not even close to a thing. It's sour grapes about the greatest offensive player to ever play the game.
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Is that really a thing? Officiating agendas by the league to intentionally skew the results toward one team over another? Uh, wow...
It's not even close to a thing. It's sour grapes about the greatest offensive player to ever play the game.
And never responds to me when I refute the statement.
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Is that really a thing? Officiating agendas by the league to intentionally skew the results toward one team over another? Uh, wow...
It's not even close to a thing. It's sour grapes about the greatest offensive player to ever play the game.
Wait, did I miss a crack about Jerry Rice?
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Is that really a thing? Officiating agendas by the league to intentionally skew the results toward one team over another? Uh, wow...
It's not even close to a thing. It's sour grapes about the greatest offensive player to ever play the game.
Wait, did I miss a crack about Jerry Rice?
Tee Hee.
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And the thing is, I am not screwing around or trolling. I have said for a long time that I think Jerry Rice is the football GOAT, and I still think that.
My short list of the best football players I've ever seen is Jerry Rice, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, Lawrence Taylor, Joe Montana, Patrick Mahomes and Micah Parsons.
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I was with you up until the last two. But otherwise, solid list.
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I think it's perfectly fine to say that Patrick Mahomes is one of the best players I've ever seen.
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Micah Parsons is one of the best, but he can always get better and by that, I mean he "better" get his clan up to speed on defending the run.
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I was just needling Stadler a little with those little two picks :), but to channel my inner Bill for a moment, while I agree that Mahomes has looked like one of the best players we've ever seen, we could have said the same thing about Brett Favre in the late 90s, and then he turned into a turnover machine, so let's see how things play out a little more first, (turning off Stadler mode ;) )while still enjoying his greatness in the moment. :P
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I was just needling Stadler a little with those little two picks :), but to channel my inner Bill for a moment, while I agree that Mahomes has looked like one of the best players we've ever seen, we could have said the same thing about Brett Favre in the late 90s, and then he turned into a turnover machine, so let's see how things play out a little more first, (turning off Stadler mode ;) )while still enjoying his greatness in the moment. :P
Favre was always a turnover machine because he believed he could make any throw at any time.
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Yeah, hence the nickname "Gunslinger" and when I thought no one could top the Favre drama machine, TB12 proves me wrong.
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Mahomes is not that dissimilar from Favre, though, as he also has that gunslingers mentality that he thinks he can make any throw. Holmgren was able to reign Favre in for the most part when it came to turnovers, and I think Reid, who has always done a good job at coaching his QBs to not turn it over, has done the same with Mahomes.
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I was just needling Stadler a little with those little two picks :), but to channel my inner Bill for a moment, while I agree that Mahomes has looked like one of the best players we've ever seen, we could have said the same thing about Brett Favre in the late 90s, and then he turned into a turnover machine, so let's see how things play out a little more first, (turning off Stadler mode ;) )while still enjoying his greatness in the moment. :P
It feels good, brother, doesn't it?
I'll say this, though: if Micah Parsons is NOW one of the best football players you've ever seen, you haven't watched a lot of football. He's a great player, no DOUBT, but he's not in the top 15 all time yet. YET.
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Mahomes is not that dissimilar from Favre, though, as he also has that gunslingers mentality that he thinks he can make any throw. Holmgren was able to reign Favre in for the most part when it came to turnovers, and I think Reid, who has always done a good job at coaching his QBs to not turn it over, has done the same with Mahomes.
Andy Reid has gone up like 90 levels in my estimation being coach of the Chiefs. I always thought he was good not great, a choker and a poor game manager (clock, etc.) but he's really shown deeper skills in KC. Granted, he doesn't have to be a great game manager with the team he has, but that's good coaching in and of itself. Cover your weak spots. But his ability to design plays to get players open is about as good as it gets.
He - Mahomes - doesn't throw a ton of picks, but he's also throwing to guys that are open (what was it, last game or the game before he threw a TD to a guy that was 20 YARDS from the closest defender; I could make that throw). You're seeing more and more that with the game on the line, with the defense stepping up pressure, he's throwing slightly more picks. That trend is only going to continue.
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I was just needling Stadler a little with those little two picks :), but to channel my inner Bill for a moment, while I agree that Mahomes has looked like one of the best players we've ever seen, we could have said the same thing about Brett Favre in the late 90s, and then he turned into a turnover machine, so let's see how things play out a little more first, (turning off Stadler mode ;) )while still enjoying his greatness in the moment. :P
It feels good, brother, doesn't it?
I'll say this, though: if Micah Parsons is NOW one of the best football players you've ever seen, you haven't watched a lot of football. He's a great player, no DOUBT, but he's not in the top 15 all time yet. YET.
:biggrin: :biggrin:
Mahomes is not that dissimilar from Favre, though, as he also has that gunslingers mentality that he thinks he can make any throw. Holmgren was able to reign Favre in for the most part when it came to turnovers, and I think Reid, who has always done a good job at coaching his QBs to not turn it over, has done the same with Mahomes.
Andy Reid has gone up like 90 levels in my estimation being coach of the Chiefs. I always thought he was good not great, a choker and a poor game manager (clock, etc.) but he's really shown deeper skills in KC. Granted, he doesn't have to be a great game manager with the team he has, but that's good coaching in and of itself. Cover your weak spots. But his ability to design plays to get players open is about as good as it gets.
He - Mahomes - doesn't throw a ton of picks, but he's also throwing to guys that are open (what was it, last game or the game before he threw a TD to a guy that was 20 YARDS from the closest defender; I could make that throw). You're seeing more and more that with the game on the line, with the defense stepping up pressure, he's throwing slightly more picks. That trend is only going to continue.
Time will tell. It's wild that neither Mahomes nor Tyreek Hill seems to miss the other a lot, at least based on the numbers. Hill could have more TDs if Tua didn't underthrow him on every deep pass where he's open by a mile, but he is still putting up absurd numbers. And while the Chiefs aren't getting the frequency of quick scores that they did with Hill, they are still scoring a ton.
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I was just needling Stadler a little with those little two picks :), but to channel my inner Bill for a moment, while I agree that Mahomes has looked like one of the best players we've ever seen, we could have said the same thing about Brett Favre in the late 90s, and then he turned into a turnover machine, so let's see how things play out a little more first, (turning off Stadler mode ;) )while still enjoying his greatness in the moment. :P
It feels good, brother, doesn't it?
I'll say this, though: if Micah Parsons is NOW one of the best football players you've ever seen, you haven't watched a lot of football. He's a great player, no DOUBT, but he's not in the top 15 all time yet. YET.
:biggrin: :biggrin:
Mahomes is not that dissimilar from Favre, though, as he also has that gunslingers mentality that he thinks he can make any throw. Holmgren was able to reign Favre in for the most part when it came to turnovers, and I think Reid, who has always done a good job at coaching his QBs to not turn it over, has done the same with Mahomes.
Andy Reid has gone up like 90 levels in my estimation being coach of the Chiefs. I always thought he was good not great, a choker and a poor game manager (clock, etc.) but he's really shown deeper skills in KC. Granted, he doesn't have to be a great game manager with the team he has, but that's good coaching in and of itself. Cover your weak spots. But his ability to design plays to get players open is about as good as it gets.
He - Mahomes - doesn't throw a ton of picks, but he's also throwing to guys that are open (what was it, last game or the game before he threw a TD to a guy that was 20 YARDS from the closest defender; I could make that throw). You're seeing more and more that with the game on the line, with the defense stepping up pressure, he's throwing slightly more picks. That trend is only going to continue.
Time will tell. It's wild that neither Mahomes nor Tyreek Hill seems to miss the other a lot, at least based on the numbers. Hill could have more TDs if Tua didn't underthrow him on every deep pass where he's open by a mile, but he is still putting up absurd numbers. And while the Chiefs aren't getting the frequency of quick scores that they did with Hill, they are still scoring a ton.
Kelce is as open as a 24-hour highway truckstop on most plays. That's on him and Reid.
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I would have gone with Waffle House, but point taken.
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Kelce is as open as a 24-hour highway truckstop on most plays. That's on him and Reid.
Okay, but do we really want to open that Pandora's Box as certain QBs who wear the number 12 are constantly throwing to receivers that are wide open. The good QBs are the ones who can read the defenses quickly and find the open man right away, ala Peyton, Brady, etc.
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Drawn up by your favorite head coach this year :lol
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Kelce is as open as a 24-hour highway truckstop on most plays. That's on him and Reid.
Okay, but do we really want to open that Pandora's Box as certain QBs who wear the number 12 are constantly throwing to receivers that are wide open. The good QBs are the ones who can read the defenses quickly and find the open man right away, ala Peyton, Brady, etc.
No, we don't. I only ask that the standard be the same. There are conversations here that sound very much like Brady is a product of Belichick times Gronkowski - even though he's proven he's not - and Mahomes is a god among men suffering the fools that are his coaching staff and his plebeian teammates. If it's a combination of the two in New England, then it's a combination of the two in KC, is all.
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Mahomes is definitely high-risk very high-reward, but you can't argue the results. His career interception % is actually very low. But the thing the "haters" don't realize is that he's going to get BETTER, not worse. It took Brady until age 30 to be as good as Mahomes is now. Mahomes is 27, he'll continue to learn defenses and such because he works very hard at it, in this way he's very different from Favre.
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Mahomes is definitely high-risk very high-reward, but you can't argue the results. His career interception % is actually very low. But the thing the "haters" don't realize is that he's going to get BETTER, not worse. It took Brady until age 30 to be as good as Mahomes is now. Mahomes is 27, he'll continue to learn defenses and such because he works very hard at it, in this way he's very different from Favre.
I don't argue the results. What he does next year or when he's 35 are not results. They are dreams. And so that's the phrase I object to most. LET HIM GET BETTER before you celebrate that he IS getting better. Let him PLAY. You have zero idea where he will be when he's 30, only your wildest dreams. Brady's success is far less dependent on pure athletic ability; it made sense that he got better over time. It made sense that his numbers from 30 to 39 are better than his numbers from 23 to 29. Mahomes blows out a knee - as Brady did at age 31 - it's not a given at all that he comes back at the same level.
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Yeah, I could see it going either way with Mahomes. His INT % both last season and this season is higher than it was any of his first three years as a starter, so his tendency to turn the ball over is actually on a slightly upward trajectory, not a downward one. I don't think he will suddenly turn into the turnover machine that Favre did, but I do find it fascinating that he gets a pass for almost everything.
I have never seen a QB get as many excuses as he did after the SB loss to the Bucs. Yes, his O-line was a mess and blah blah blah, but he's not the first QB in SB history to have certain things going against him, yet others never got the pass that he did.
People still talk like the Chiefs are the kings of the AFC until someone knock them off their throne? Hmmm, did I imagine that AFCCG last year where Mahomes imploded and played like ass in the entire second half and OT and they lost to the Bengals? I don't think I did, but I guess for many to acknowledge that that happened would be to admit that Sir Patrick made mistakes.
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I'll say this now....the Buffalo Bills management are a bunch of maroons. :facepalm:
Why the team didn't leave before that massive storm hit is beyond me. Their airport is close to opening...now they just have to hope the players get there today. Or manage somehow to get there tomorrow to fly to Detroit.
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I bet they're regretting not flexing this Patriots/Jets game to TNF.
Zzzzz.....
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The fucking Bruins scored twice as many points as the Pats offense last night. WTF??
I'm not going to rag on Mac this week. I think he actually played pretty good.
But coming out of a bye week, the best the Pats O could draw up is three FG attempts?? That's fucking embarrassing.
Maybe Patricia is a one year place holder for Bill O'B, and maybe that's the plan. The O-line is atrocious, as is the offence in general. As long as Patricia is there, it ain't gonna get better.
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The fucking Bruins scored twice as many points as the Pats offense last night. WTF??
I'm not going to rag on Mac this week. I think he actually played pretty good.
But coming out of a bye week, the best the Pats O could draw up is three FG attempts?? That's fucking embarrassing.
Maybe Patricia is a one year place holder for Bill O'B, and maybe that's the plan. The O-line is atrocious, as is the offence in general. As long as Patricia is there, it ain't gonna get better.
Remember Matt Patricia's first year as DC? I do.
Losing Andrews, again, is rough. Normally they've got the pieces to patch together a solid line regardless of what happens. This year they don't. That's been by far their biggest issue, and I don't see it getting any better.
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Daboll has done an unbelievable job with the Giants, but it feels like your upside is limited with that QB, and today was likely the start of their move back to the pack. They have 10-7 and a 1st round loss written all over them.
As for the Jets, that is a legit contender with the right QB, but Zach Wilson is terrible. Losing on a punt return with seconds to go is such a Jets win to lose, even if it was a bit brutal because of the block in the back that wasn't called.
Jeff Saturday is looking like a good interim head coach thus far.
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It won't surprise me at all if Stafford announces his retirement in the next couple of days. His wife was scared shitless after the first one. If he's back in the concussion protocol he might well do the sensible thing. He's not a dumbass, and he's not the douchebag Brady is.
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I’m not discussing the atrocity that occurred this afternoon in Foxborough…
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The fucking Bruins scored twice as many points as the Pats offense last night. WTF??
I'm not going to rag on Mac this week. I think he actually played pretty good.
But coming out of a bye week, the best the Pats O could draw up is three FG attempts?? That's fucking embarrassing.
Maybe Patricia is a one year place holder for Bill O'B, and maybe that's the plan. The O-line is atrocious, as is the offence in general. As long as Patricia is there, it ain't gonna get better.
Remember Matt Patricia's first year as DC? I do.
Losing Andrews, again, is rough. Normally they've got the pieces to patch together a solid line regardless of what happens. This year they don't. That's been by far their biggest issue, and I don't see it getting any better.
They've been very predictable on play calls where multiple teams have admitted to knowing the plays. I think that's one of the larger issues with the offense.
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No O-line coach either.
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Not a block in the back. He's absolute allowed to make that bock. People need to read the damn rulebook. Easier just to say it's the league favoring NE, though.
(Might shoulda been flagged for helmet to helmet, though :lol)
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Are we talking about the Slater block at the end of the run? If so....not a penalty.
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No O-line coach either.
Definitely. Plus there was film this week showing relievers not having separation in their routes and not even looking back for the ball when Mac needed to get rid of the ball. I complete mess of an offense.
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No O-line coach either.
Definitely. Plus there was film this week showing relievers not having separation in their routes and not even looking back for the ball when Mac needed to get rid of the ball. I complete mess of an offense.
This guys was probably the best them.
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/36/Mariano_Rivera_allison_7_29_07.jpg)
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Are we talking about the Slater block at the end of the run? If so....not a penalty.
Yeah. Jets fans are in an uproar about the refs protecting NE again.
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Receivers silly. Lol
Are we talking about the Slater block at the end of the run? If so....not a penalty.
Yeah. Jets fans are in an uproar about the refs protecting NE again.
Even if. They line up and kick the short field goal and they still lose.
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7 spots in the AFC and 9 teams have what I feel are a good chance:
All four East teams
Balt and Cincy
Tennessee
KC and LA Chargers
I think KC and Tennessee (who should win their division easily) are gimmes.
I feel pretty comfortable with saying Buffalo and Miami will make it as long as their QBs stay healthy.
That leaves 3 spots:
I think the Jets will miss largely because their QB is trash.
NE has the edge of the rest due to Belichick. They are like the opposite of the Chargers. Patriots: great head coach/iffy QB. Chargers: Very good young QB/iffy coach.
The Bengals are good, but will likely have to fight to win a lot of close games to make it.
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Well, so much for believing the Vikings were a different team this year. Following a big win with a fall on your face horrible loss is a very Vikings thing to do.
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7 spots in the AFC and 9 teams have what I feel are a good chance:
All four East teams
Balt and Cincy
Tennessee
KC and LA Chargers
I think KC and Tennessee (who should win their division easily) are gimmes.
I feel pretty comfortable with saying Buffalo and Miami will make it as long as their QBs stay healthy.
That leaves 3 spots:
I think the Jets will miss largely because their QB is trash.
NE has the edge of the rest due to Belichick. They are like the opposite of the Chargers. Patriots: great head coach/iffy QB. Chargers: Very good young QB/iffy coach.
The Bengals are good, but will likely have to fight to win a lot of close games to make it.
Sorry, I just can't get excited about a 9-8 record and a 1st round loss in the Playoffs. I'd still be shocked if the Pats made it though.
Pats schedule..
@ Minn.....L
Buff....L
@ AZ....?
@ LV...?
Cin....L
Mia....L
@ Buff....L
Best case scenario is 8-9.
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I would never assume all of those games are automatic Ws or Ls. With Belichick, there is always a chance to win any game.
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Tim, Las Vegas? OK Felger/Mazz
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Patriots will win at Minnesota Thanksgiving evening, I am calling it now. Book it.
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I hope you're right but I'm not happy they got blown out by Dallas. They will play better Thursday night.
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Patriots will win at Minnesota Thanksgiving evening, I am calling it now. Book it.
They might win the coin toss. That's about it.
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Tim, Las Vegas? OK Felger/Mazz
I have the Cards and the Raiders as ?, as they're the only winnable games left on the schedule.
Also, I reserve the right to change my pick against the Bills the last game in case the Bills are resting Allen and others.
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I reserve the right to mock your picks above after the Patriots win the Super Bowl with some guy named Zappe.
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Then put a W there.
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I reserve the right to mock your picks above after the Patriots win the Super Bowl with some guy named Zappe.
Yeah, that'd be the same Super Bowl where you bang Taylor Swift at halftime.
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A man can hope for both Tim. :lol
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It's always a good day when the Giants lose and the Cowboys win! :metal
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Cleveland Clowns as always. Brissett outplays Allen but they lose anyway :tdwn.
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Fox screwed me out of seeing the Lions finish off their 3rd consecutive win. Oh well, at least they won!
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I think people are slightly overreacting to the Zach Wilson performance.
Yes, he looked liked shit. It was also freezing, with high winds, in Foxborough, against BB. And the Jets couldn't get anything going on the run game, either.
Wilson is probably not the guy, and hopefully they can address this in Free Agency next year (Derek Carr, maybe?), but they can still win games.
Jets remaining schedule is as follows:
Bears - W
Vikings - L
Bills - L
Lions - W
Jags - W
Seahawks - W
Dolphins - L
Final predication is 10-7 with an outsider's chance at a wildcard appearance.
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Wilson not taking responsibility for the offensive problems are not sitting well with the other players from what I read. How they ever gave Wilson the C on his chest is beyond me.
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Wilson not taking responsibility for the offensive problems are not sitting well with the other players from what I read. How they ever gave Wilson the C on his chest is beyond me.
I've been reading how toxic he is in the locker and that he's difficult to coach and that's a bad recipe for success. The call him the Johnny Manziel Jr.
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Fox screwed me out of seeing the Lions finish off their 3rd consecutive win. Oh well, at least they won!
Same here. I live in Mid-MO and they were showing the Cowboys before they cutover to the Bengals game mid-third quarter. Now I understand that the networks do this with non-competitive games in other markets but it's never happened to me before.
I wanted to scream until I remembered that I kept the NFL ticket package for this season.
Crisis averted! :tup
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Of the three teams I follow (states I've lived in basically) the Lions are turning out to be... decent? Maybe? They're going to have a real tough task keeping their winning streak going against the Bills next week.
The Steelers are abysmal on defense and it's beyond time that Matt Canada (OC is gone). They have some really good young pieces with Pickett, Pickens, Harris and Muth' but need more help on the OL too.
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Wilson not taking responsibility for the offensive problems are not sitting well with the other players from what I read. How they ever gave Wilson the C on his chest is beyond me.
Agreed. You score 3 points, and when asked if you feel like you let the defense down by only scoring 3 points, your answer is no? What an idiot. He sucks.
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I don't really give a shit about the "no". He was angry, and it was the final question of the interview when he just wanted off of the podium.
These reporters (and fans) want to see players crying and begging forgiveness of the fans for their performance and frankly I think it's kind of ridiculous.
As Jets fans, we already had 3 years of Sam Darnold looking like he needed to be hugged on the podium, it's refreshing to see a bit of anger and drive from the QB and hopefully that will fuel him getting better.
But honestly I do agree with majority here, that it just doesn't seem quite there. It's not all on Wilson - the Jets had no run game, either, so there's something other than just poor QB play to the dysfunction. But it sucks to be rooting for someone only to see their opportunities to put things together disintegrating and quite quickly I would add.
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I'm so glad I don't buy into any of the conspiracy theories about the refs and the league wanting certain teams to succeed. I don't have to spend any time complaining about the lack of an offensive pass interference on KC on that last drive, nor the intentional grounding as Mahomes heaved it to the sideline rather than take the sack, or the timely and clutch defensive pass interference on third down. ;) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
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I'm so glad I don't buy into any of the conspiracy theories about the refs and the league wanting certain teams to succeed. I don't have to spend any time complaining about the lack of an offensive pass interference on KC on that last drive, nor the intentional grounding as Mahomes heaved it to the sideline rather than take the sack, or the timely and clutch defensive pass interference on third down. ;) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
I've given up on trying to figure out intentional grounding. Considering it's a loss of down penalty, and one that can result in a safety, it should really be better defined. The more physical plays you describe are subjective enough that I just take them as they come and assume it'll all even out. For IG it's a whole lot simpler than that. Shouldn't be so damn flaky.
That said, the final drive was a hoot to watch. I share your opinion about Mahomes being beatified way too early, but that drive was exactly what great quarterbacks do. Moreover, there have always been certain quarterbacks where you just know "one minute and down by 6, yeah, they got this." I think pretty much everybody knew KC would win the game when SD scored too early. I think that's also the mark of a great QB.
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I'm so glad I don't buy into any of the conspiracy theories about the refs and the league wanting certain teams to succeed. I don't have to spend any time complaining about the lack of an offensive pass interference on KC on that last drive, nor the intentional grounding as Mahomes heaved it to the sideline rather than take the sack, or the timely and clutch defensive pass interference on third down. ;) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
I've given up on trying to figure out intentional grounding. Considering it's a loss of down penalty, and one that can result in a safety, it should really be better defined. The more physical plays you describe are subjective enough that I just take them as they come and assume it'll all even out. For IG it's a whole lot simpler than that. Shouldn't be so damn flaky.
That said, the final drive was a hoot to watch. I share your opinion about Mahomes being beatified way too early, but that drive was exactly what great quarterbacks do. Moreover, there have always been certain quarterbacks where you just know "one minute and down by 6, yeah, they got this." I think pretty much everybody knew KC would win the game when SD scored too early. I think that's also the mark of a great QB.
No doubt. It was methodical and precise. Fun to watch (unless you are a Chargers fan).
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I don't really give a shit about the "no". He was angry, and it was the final question of the interview when he just wanted off of the podium.
These reporters (and fans) want to see players crying and begging forgiveness of the fans for their performance and frankly I think it's kind of ridiculous.
As Jets fans, we already had 3 years of Sam Darnold looking like he needed to be hugged on the podium, it's refreshing to see a bit of anger and drive from the QB and hopefully that will fuel him getting better.
But honestly I do agree with majority here, that it just doesn't seem quite there. It's not all on Wilson - the Jets had no run game, either, so there's something other than just poor QB play to the dysfunction. But it sucks to be rooting for someone only to see their opportunities to put things together disintegrating and quite quickly I would add.
It's not the writers or the fans he needs to worry about. It's his teammates who are upset with him.
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Wilson not taking responsibility for the offensive problems are not sitting well with the other players from what I read. How they ever gave Wilson the C on his chest is beyond me.
Agreed. You score 3 points, and when asked if you feel like you let the defense down by only scoring 3 points, your answer is no? What an idiot. He sucks.
I don't remember the exact words, but Nate Burleson had a nice take on that in the post-game. He was saying basically that if you're the defense, you're part of the team so you don't point fingers, but you could ride the bus home knowing you did everything you were asked to do and then some. I agree with Skeever that a little fire and vitriol is not the worst thing, but you DO have to read the room (in this case, the locker room).
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I don't really give a shit about the "no". He was angry, and it was the final question of the interview when he just wanted off of the podium.
These reporters (and fans) want to see players crying and begging forgiveness of the fans for their performance and frankly I think it's kind of ridiculous.
As Jets fans, we already had 3 years of Sam Darnold looking like he needed to be hugged on the podium, it's refreshing to see a bit of anger and drive from the QB and hopefully that will fuel him getting better.
But honestly I do agree with majority here, that it just doesn't seem quite there. It's not all on Wilson - the Jets had no run game, either, so there's something other than just poor QB play to the dysfunction. But it sucks to be rooting for someone only to see their opportunities to put things together disintegrating and quite quickly I would add.
It's not the writers or the fans he needs to worry about. It's his teammates who are upset with him.
Of course they are. He could also be update with Mims, Matt LaFleur's playcalling, and others who made some big mistakes.
Including the Special Teams.
I'm NOT apologizing for his performance. He sucked, and has been, at his best moments, mediocre there year. Just saying that the "no" doesn't bother me. I care about the results moving forward, not how much people are willing to fall on their sword in front of the press.
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I'm not talking about the press. He's losing his teammates. That's the worst think that can happen. All he has to do is say, I let down our D today who had an outstanding game. We need to play better and that starts with me.
Edit:
https://www.si.com/nfl/jets/news/new-york-jets-players-unhappy-with-how-zach-wilson-acted-after-new-england-patriots-loss
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I'm sure he is losing the team, but we don't know that for sure. Also, if he's losing them, it's because he sucks, not because he failed to say so in front of the press.
I just don't care as much about the symbolic genuflecting and would rather see my QB pissed off. I take it as a sign that maybe he does have what it takes to get better. That's all.
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I don't think his actions are symbolic. If the players are complaining about him and the way he acted after the loss, it's an issue.
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Crazy stat after last night’s game, Mahomes is 14-0 in division ROAD games.
Agreed with the above takes about Wilson - in fact, most great QBs after a game in which their D holds the opposition to TWENTY points or less, let alone 3, will say “yeah it’s on me, the D did its job”.
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Saleh was late 1& 1/2 hours for his press conference. Late night he said demonstrative, that Wilson is the QB going forward. Today after being late, he said that Wilson is not guaranteed to start.
I think the players had a meeting with him. The kid messed up and lost his D last night.
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Good for him. Wilson is not a hill to die on for any coach.
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I can't speak for anyone else, but when the Chargers took the lead last night late, I thought, "you just know Mahomes is going to drive them down for the win." And he did. That is what I used to think about Montana, and Elway, and Peyton, and Brady. He is in that rarified air of guys who get the ball late and you just know they are going to find a way to get it done most of the time.
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He's definitely building a case for sure. You can't deny his early years are better than all of them. He just needs the longevity now and a ring or 2 more to stay in that group.
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Trending on Seattle sports talk radio today... Russell Wilson could finish the season with fewer TD passes (he currently has 7) than bathrooms he has in his house (12).
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Trending on Seattle sports talk radio today... Russell Wilson could finish the season with fewer TD passes (he currently has 7) than bathrooms he has in his house (12).
Wow, that's shitty. Sure to be pissed.
OK, I'm done.
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I honesty don't get the love for Mahomes at all. Luckiest player ever. I wish someone would just separate his legs from his body and shut him up for good.
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My way too early playoff seeding predictions:
AFC:
1. Buffalo (14-3)
2. Tenn. (14-3)
3. Balt. (14-3)
4. KC (14-3)
5. Miami (13-4)
6. LAC (10-7)
7. NYJ (10-7)
NFC:
1. Dallas (13-4)
2. Minn. (13-4)
3. SF (12-5)
4. Tampa (10-7)
5. Phil. (13-4)
6. NYG (11-6)
7. Seattle (10-7)
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Niners looked really solid tonight, hope that's a sign of things to come. Arriba Mexico!!
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They looked good. But aside from these two INT's, they were really getting picked apart in the passing game on defense. They couldn't stop the passing game to save their lives. But thankfully, even though they gave up a ton of passing yards, they managed to get stops at key times. But if they can clean up just a few things and stay healthy, I don't see anyone stopping them. I think they end up winning a close super bowl against the Titans.
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I think your emotions are effecting your objectivity.
As a loyal Seahawks fan since 1976, I’ve never been overly hopeful about their chances. But maybe I’m so used to disappointment that it keeps me pleasantly surprised when they catch a break. Even the year we won…ya, I really was routing for them. I was hoping for a tight win. I would have never imagined the blow out we got. (It did feel good) ;D
Short version…never let the love of your team overly blind you to the reality.
The Niners will be fortunate if they win the division, and if they do, they will make a quick exit in the playoffs. But considering the way the West was projected to go at the beginning of the season, I would consider that scenario to be a HUGE moral victory if I were a Niners fan.
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I honesty don't get the love for Mahomes at all. Luckiest player ever. I wish someone would just separate his legs from his body and shut him up for good.
I don't know about "lucky"; the truth is somewhere in between that and DreamTeam's fanboy obsession. But at a MINIMUM, he needs to do some level of this without Kelce. Kelce doesn't even have to make the challenging catches like Gronk did; there are crucial plays where he is open by five, six yards. How do you plan a defense that needs a stop and yet allows the best tight end in the game right now to get five yards open?
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I honesty don't get the love for Mahomes at all. Luckiest player ever. I wish someone would just separate his legs from his body and shut him up for good.
I don't know about "lucky"; the truth is somewhere in between that and DreamTeam's fanboy obsession. But at a MINIMUM, he needs to do some level of this without Kelce. Kelce doesn't even have to make the challenging catches like Gronk did; there are crucial plays where he is open by five, six yards. How do you plan a defense that needs a stop and yet allows the best tight end in the game right now to get five yards open?
I'm going to play devil's advocate here. Maybe Mahomes is setting up Kelce better or Kelce gets open easier than Gronk.
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I honesty don't get the love for Mahomes at all. Luckiest player ever. I wish someone would just separate his legs from his body and shut him up for good.
I don't know about "lucky"; the truth is somewhere in between that and DreamTeam's fanboy obsession. But at a MINIMUM, he needs to do some level of this without Kelce. Kelce doesn't even have to make the challenging catches like Gronk did; there are crucial plays where he is open by five, six yards. How do you plan a defense that needs a stop and yet allows the best tight end in the game right now to get five yards open?
I'm going to play devil's advocate here. Maybe Mahomes is setting up Kelce better or Kelce gets open easier than Gronk.
Of course; it's a combination of things. It's never "one piece" like many fans want to believe. But it's also like testing an electrical circuit; you don't change 1000 things all at once and try to find out what works; you remove one variable at a time to see what makes what impact. I'm saying that at this point it's premature to elevate Mahomes into the stratosphere when you haven't eliminated any of the variables from the equation. You take out EVERY COMPONENT that's ever been around Brady - Belichick, McDaniel, Gronk, Moss, New England (the geography), Viniateri, Giselle, whatever - and he's won. The only variables taken from Mahomes so far is Hill and he's not won anything yet in that scenario.
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Well that's why that combo won 6 rings. I'll give Mahomes time. His start is better than any QB I've seen. Can he continue and get better over the years with different OC's, different teammates? That's the question.
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I honesty don't get the love for Mahomes at all. Luckiest player ever. I wish someone would just separate his legs from his body and shut him up for good.
I don't know about "lucky"; the truth is somewhere in between that and DreamTeam's fanboy obsession. But at a MINIMUM, he needs to do some level of this without Kelce. Kelce doesn't even have to make the challenging catches like Gronk did; there are crucial plays where he is open by five, six yards. How do you plan a defense that needs a stop and yet allows the best tight end in the game right now to get five yards open?
Oh come on, last year it was that he had to do it without Hill.
What's next? Can he do it with with only 4 guys on his OL?
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I honesty don't get the love for Mahomes at all. Luckiest player ever. I wish someone would just separate his legs from his body and shut him up for good.
I don't know about "lucky"; the truth is somewhere in between that and DreamTeam's fanboy obsession. But at a MINIMUM, he needs to do some level of this without Kelce. Kelce doesn't even have to make the challenging catches like Gronk did; there are crucial plays where he is open by five, six yards. How do you plan a defense that needs a stop and yet allows the best tight end in the game right now to get five yards open?
Oh come on, last year it was that he had to do it without Hill.
What's next? Can he do it with with only 4 guys on his OL?
That's the point, though; he didn't do anything. The Bengals (who got there after an overtime interception thrown by Mahomes) and Rams did. He didn't do anything the year before, either, if you want to put a fine point on it. 31-9 they got blown out by Brady and his squad. Point proven.
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FFS Stadler
You mean like Montana did without Rice all those times?
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I'm in the twilight zone. According to this logic, Brady choked 9 years in a row from 2005-2013. It's the only way you can explain it, right?
The level-headed, non-crazy take at this moment is we don't have any idea how many Super Bowls Mahomes will have been in until his career is over. The only data-based info we have at the moment is his playing is far above anyone else in the league, especially when you look at advanced stats like points per drive or per dropback which are the only things a QB can control. But it's not necessary for me to go to this trouble, just go to any NFL show that features capable analysts like ex-players or ex-coaches (such as Sean Payton this week) and you'll hear the same things. I'm not doing revolutionary work here :lol.
And everyone knows that in the Super Bowl against the Bucs the O-Line was in shambles, he was playing on a foot that required surgery, and his teammates dropped 2 TD passes. But sure that proves a point I guess, I'm just not sure which one.
The take on Mahomes being "lucky", I don't even know where to begin . . . the 2020 Bucs got to play a 7-9 team the first round, then had Drew Brees gift them 3 interceptions the next game, then the D stepped up and bailed Brady out of 3 second-half interceptions against Green Bay. Talk about a string of luck.
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I honesty don't get the love for Mahomes at all. Luckiest player ever. I wish someone would just separate his legs from his body and shut him up for good.
I don't know about "lucky"; the truth is somewhere in between that and DreamTeam's fanboy obsession. But at a MINIMUM, he needs to do some level of this without Kelce. Kelce doesn't even have to make the challenging catches like Gronk did; there are crucial plays where he is open by five, six yards. How do you plan a defense that needs a stop and yet allows the best tight end in the game right now to get five yards open?
With all due respect, Bill, his fanboy obsession with Mahomes is no worse than yours with Brady.
Using the standards you are setting here today, because they won zero rings together, the Tom Brady/Randy Moss combo was an utter and total failure. Correct?
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Big Ben was bad in the game where he got his ring.
Peyton Manning was bad in his first SB run and quite honestly most of the year of his 2nd SB run/SB MVP win.
I guess both of them are bad QBs who "did nothing" too.
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I think your emotions are effecting your objectivity.
As a loyal Seahawks fan since 1976, I’ve never been overly hopeful about their chances. But maybe I’m so used to disappointment that it keeps me pleasantly surprised when they catch a break. Even the year we won…ya, I really was routing for them. I was hoping for a tight win. I would have never imagined the blow out we got. (It did feel good) ;D
Short version…never let the love of your team overly blind you to the reality.
The Niners will be fortunate if they win the division, and if they do, they will make a quick exit in the playoffs. But considering the way the West was projected to go at the beginning of the season, I would consider that scenario to be a HUGE moral victory if I were a Niners fan.
Yeah...It's bosk though...he has these moments every year. :lol
They looked good. But aside from these two INT's, they were really getting picked apart in the passing game on defense. They couldn't stop the passing game to save their lives. But thankfully, even though they gave up a ton of passing yards, they managed to get stops at key times. But if they can clean up just a few things and stay healthy, I don't see anyone stopping them. I think they end up winning a close super bowl against the Titans.
True, the connection between McCoy and Hopkins was just too easy, too often. I missed a good deal of the second half for a meeting, and when I returned McCoy was on the sidelines with a green jersey, so it seemed the figured something out :lol
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I honesty don't get the love for Mahomes at all. Luckiest player ever. I wish someone would just separate his legs from his body and shut him up for good.
I don't know about "lucky"; the truth is somewhere in between that and DreamTeam's fanboy obsession. But at a MINIMUM, he needs to do some level of this without Kelce. Kelce doesn't even have to make the challenging catches like Gronk did; there are crucial plays where he is open by five, six yards. How do you plan a defense that needs a stop and yet allows the best tight end in the game right now to get five yards open?
With all due respect, Bill, his fanboy obsession with Mahomes is no worse than yours with Brady.
Nah, not really. Other than DeflateGate, which I thought was a sham and a joke, I'm under no illusions about Brady. Now Belichick, that's a different story....
Using the standards you are setting here today, because they won zero rings together, the Tom Brady/Randy Moss combo was an utter and total failure. Correct?
No. That's a black and white standard. There are no absolutes here; it's not like there's only two choices: GREATEST OF ALL TIME!! or UTTER AND TOTAL FAILURE!! Is Brady/Moss the greatest tandem of all time? NO; they did it one year, put up silly numbers, but went home in February like everyone else except for one team: losing their last game. All I'm saying, all I've EVER said, is stop annointing Mahomes. Why this obsession that he be recalled as the greatest of all time? What does it matter? Brady - and several others, Montana, Manning, etc. - did great things REGARDLESS of who was around them. Let Mahomes be Mahomes. Let him cycle through a generation (which in the NFL is, what, five years, more or less) of players around him. A generation of coaches that are targeting him.
He's very good; he's one of the two or three best QBs in the league, and probably the guy you'd pick RIGHT NOW to build your team around. No question. But that's enough for now. The obsession isn't with "Brady" or "Mahomes", it's our culture's obsession with these absolute and unattainable standards. Everything has to be "Greatest" this or "Extreme" that. Let it play out.
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The Niners will be fortunate if they win the division, and if they do, they will make a quick exit in the playoffs. But considering the way the West was projected to go at the beginning of the season, I would consider that scenario to be a HUGE moral victory if I were a Niners fan.
??? I have no idea where you are coming from on that take. I mean, nobody can say how far a team is ultimately going to go in the playoffs, regardless of the odds. Last season's Cowboys are a great example of that. But the 49ers being "fortunate" to win the division? ??? That makes zero sense. They are the odds on favorite by a landslide. And it doesn't take much imagination to see how that is true. They are currently in first place and have a VERY favorable schedule for the remainder of the season, in terms of the strength of the teams they face, the fact that 5/7 of those games are at home, and in terms of ALL of them being in the same time zone. They VERY realistically win at least 5 of those games and could very easily run the table and rattle of 7 in a row. But even in the worst case scenario, who wins more games than them and takes the division? The Rams? :lol The Cardinals? :lol The Seahawks? :lol The 49ers have already beaten all of those teams soundly. And all of them have harder schedules. Yeah, anything can happen. But viewing the 49ers as anything but the favorites to win their division and saying they would be "fortunate" to do so is just ignoring the standings and the remaining schedules of the NFC west. The ONLY team with a halfway realistic shot at challenging them for the division is Seattle, and the standings and remaining schedules (let alone the gap between the two rosters) make them a longshot. Not an extreme long shot. But a long shot by a decent margin.
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The 49ers had no business making it to the NFC title game last year either but it happened. If a team does enough at the beginning of the season to stay in the playoff race they always have a chance to make a deep playoff run. We saw it last year with both the 49ers and Bengals, the Buccaneers in 2020, the Titans in 2019, the Jaguars in 2017, the Broncos in 2015, the Giants in 2011, the Packers in 2010, the Jets in both 2009 and 2010, the Cardinals in 2008…you guys get the point. There’s no reason that the 49ers can’t make a run again, especially in the overall weaker NFC.
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Yeah. But I again come back to current standings and remaining schedule. The 49ers are clearly the best team in the NFC west, and I don't know anyone who would dispute that. They currently hold the division lead. Their remaining games are as follows:
-NOLA
-Miami
-Tampa
-@Seattle
-Washington
-@ Vegas
-Arizona
Pretty easy schedule. I see challenging games against Miami and maybe Tampa. Who else on that schedule even challenges them?
Seattle's remaining schedule is:
-Vegas
-@LAR
-Carolina
-SF
-@KC
-Jets
-LAR
They probably beat the Raiders and Panthers, and probably split the two games against the Rams. What other games on that schedule do they have a prayer of winning? ???
I'm not even going to bother with the Rams and Cardinals, because I doubt either of those teams will break .500 at season's end. Unless either has a massive unexpected turnaround, they are both effectively out of contention.
Again, just not seeing Jammin's point at all.
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Great game last night, was fun to see the Niners really run up a game, which I feel does not happen very often at all. But they've been far too inconsistent for me to be talking about a super bowl. This is the same team that found ways to lose to Chicago and Denver and neither should have happened. They win those, maybe lose to a better team, but show strength game in and game out on both sides of the ball I'd be much more excited. All it takes is one half of the team to have a bad half of football in the playoffs and they are out.
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^Yup. Agreed with all of that. But the things I will say that have me looking at them as a real contended despite those "shoulda won" losses (as well as getting SOUNDLY beaten by KC) are: (1) those early losses were with an inexperienced QB that hadn't yet started in the regular season, (2) they did not have anywhere near a healthy roster on either side of the ball, and (3) McCaffrey. And on #3, I don't want to look at a single player as a gamechanger for a team's ultimate fortunes. But he is one of few players in the league that defenses cannot afford to ignore. And that factor alone opens up so many more opportunities for the offense. Even when plays aren't going to him, the attention he commands opens things up for Kittle, Aiuk, Samuel, Mitchell, etc. They all benefit from having less attention and more space, and that's often all it takes for a big play. But those 3 factors as a whole allow me to look at those losses earlier in the season as cautionary tales while still having confidence that this team should still be a very legit contender.
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The rest of the season will be very telling on the offensive side of the ball. Because frankly even with Lance and without McCaffery I feel like they were underperforming. I think it's far past time for Shanahan to prove he's the genius that the pundits seem to always credit him with being. It's been awhile since we've seen regular evidence of that.
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I think it's important to remember that SF was flaky with their QB situation this off season. Jimmy G did NOT get any participation OTA's much less training camp. He was thrust into action when Tery Lance went down and I think he's done an admirable job but their schedule is not that favorable.
BTW - look out for Washington.
Ron Rivera to me at this point is Head Coach of the Year!
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I think it's important to remember that SF was flaky with their QB situation this off season. Jimmy G did NOT get any participation OTA's much less training camp.
He didn't get any participation because (1) he was recovering from shoulder surgery initially and (2) was supposed to have been traded and not on the roster. They were expecting the trade right up until the season started. That isn't "flaky"--that's the reality of the situation he was in.
He was thrust into action when Tery Lance went down
Yes. That's how being a backup works.
...but their schedule is not that favorable.
It isn't? How so? There is one team on their remaining schedule that has more than 1 game above .500. How is that not a favorable schedule?
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Hunnus means he wasn't really participating with the team in the off season. They had him on the other field while the team practiced. Only after he signed that one year deal did he work with his teammates.
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Hunnus means he wasn't really participating with the team in the off season. They had him on the other field while the team practiced. Only after he signed that one year deal did he work with his teammates.
Yes, but as I said, that isn't "flaky." There were legitimate reasons for that.
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^Yup. Agreed with all of that. But the things I will say that have me looking at them as a real contended despite those "shoulda won" losses (as well as getting SOUNDLY beaten by KC) are: (1) those early losses were with an inexperienced QB that hadn't yet started in the regular season, (2) they did not have anywhere near a healthy roster on either side of the ball, and (3) McCaffrey. And on #3, I don't want to look at a single player as a gamechanger for a team's ultimate fortunes. But he is one of few players in the league that defenses cannot afford to ignore. And that factor alone opens up so many more opportunities for the offense. Even when plays aren't going to him, the attention he commands opens things up for Kittle, Aiuk, Samuel, Mitchell, etc. They all benefit from having less attention and more space, and that's often all it takes for a big play. But those 3 factors as a whole allow me to look at those losses earlier in the season as cautionary tales while still having confidence that this team should still be a very legit contender.
They are STACKED on the offensive side of the ball. I'm a fan of Jimmy G. too (I was one of the few that would have loved him to come back to New England) so while I'm not invested in the Niners, I'm not taking them for granted either.
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Hunnus means he wasn't really participating with the team in the off season. They had him on the other field while the team practiced. Only after he signed that one year deal did he work with his teammates.
Yes, but as I said, that isn't "flaky." There were legitimate reasons for that.
The front office WAS flaky. They could have cut him but they were hedging on his loyalty to the club and he signed an agreement far below his worth. But they kept him off the field. If he were involved in all aspects of the offseason program then SF would be in a much better position today.
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I think it's important to remember that SF was flaky with their QB situation this off season. Jimmy G did NOT get any participation OTA's much less training camp. He was thrust into action when Tery Lance went down and I think he's done an admirable job but their schedule is not that favorable.
BTW - look out for Washington.
Ron Rivera to me at this point is Head Coach of the Year!
On Bart and Hahn this afternoon the question was raised: "who is better, the Commanders or the Giants?". There are a lot of people that think like you do.
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Hunnus means he wasn't really participating with the team in the off season. They had him on the other field while the team practiced. Only after he signed that one year deal did he work with his teammates.
Yes, but as I said, that isn't "flaky." There were legitimate reasons for that.
The front office WAS flaky. They could have cut him but they were hedging on his loyalty to the club and he signed an agreement far below his worth. But they kept him off the field. If he were involved in all aspects of the offseason program then SF would be in a much better position today.
Why would they cut a player that has trade value? Teams don't do that unless there are extenuating circumstances, like the player being a problem child that the team just needs to get rid of at all costs and cut their losses (e.g. an Antonio Brown situation). They didn't cut him for the same reason he wasn't included in the offseason program with the starters: they (as well as Jimmy) were fully expecting a trade. That's what teams do in that situation almost all the time. Having been a Jimmy G. supporter from day one and a fan that has wanted him to play over Lance, I didn't like it. But it was far from "flaky." The decision was made to trade him, and ALL parties involved acted consistently with that stance throughout the process. It's just that a trade never materialized.
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Hunnus means he wasn't really participating with the team in the off season. They had him on the other field while the team practiced. Only after he signed that one year deal did he work with his teammates.
Yes, but as I said, that isn't "flaky." There were legitimate reasons for that.
Yeah, no one wanted to trade for him. His injury history is the reason why. If he goes deep into the playoffs it will help them trade him next year.
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Using the standards you are setting here today, because they won zero rings together, the Tom Brady/Randy Moss combo was an utter and total failure. Correct?
No. That's a black and white standard. There are no absolutes here; it's not like there's only two choices: GREATEST OF ALL TIME!! or UTTER AND TOTAL FAILURE!! Is Brady/Moss the greatest tandem of all time? NO; they did it one year, put up silly numbers, but went home in February like everyone else except for one team: losing their last game. All I'm saying, all I've EVER said, is stop annointing Mahomes. Why this obsession that he be recalled as the greatest of all time? What does it matter? Brady - and several others, Montana, Manning, etc. - did great things REGARDLESS of who was around them. Let Mahomes be Mahomes. Let him cycle through a generation (which in the NFL is, what, five years, more or less) of players around him. A generation of coaches that are targeting him.
He's very good; he's one of the two or three best QBs in the league, and probably the guy you'd pick RIGHT NOW to build your team around. No question. But that's enough for now. The obsession isn't with "Brady" or "Mahomes", it's our culture's obsession with these absolute and unattainable standards. Everything has to be "Greatest" this or "Extreme" that. Let it play out.
Okay, but who here, specifically, has called Mahomes the greatest of all time already?
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Using the standards you are setting here today, because they won zero rings together, the Tom Brady/Randy Moss combo was an utter and total failure. Correct?
No. That's a black and white standard. There are no absolutes here; it's not like there's only two choices: GREATEST OF ALL TIME!! or UTTER AND TOTAL FAILURE!! Is Brady/Moss the greatest tandem of all time? NO; they did it one year, put up silly numbers, but went home in February like everyone else except for one team: losing their last game. All I'm saying, all I've EVER said, is stop annointing Mahomes. Why this obsession that he be recalled as the greatest of all time? What does it matter? Brady - and several others, Montana, Manning, etc. - did great things REGARDLESS of who was around them. Let Mahomes be Mahomes. Let him cycle through a generation (which in the NFL is, what, five years, more or less) of players around him. A generation of coaches that are targeting him.
He's very good; he's one of the two or three best QBs in the league, and probably the guy you'd pick RIGHT NOW to build your team around. No question. But that's enough for now. The obsession isn't with "Brady" or "Mahomes", it's our culture's obsession with these absolute and unattainable standards. Everything has to be "Greatest" this or "Extreme" that. Let it play out.
Okay, but who here, specifically, has called Mahomes the greatest of all time already?
Many; go back through the thread here, we've recounted the examples. Even people here are acting as if that's the case. Even if not singularly "the greatest", even putting him in the top five or ten at this point is premature.
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Mahomes is the greatest State Farm spokeperson of all time. There, I said it. Fight me.
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Mahomes is the greatest State Farm spokeperson of all time. There, I said it. Fight me.
And yet he's still godawful compared to Whiplash guy and Mayhem. He probably beats out Flo, can't stand the girl, but definitely not her uber-talented sidekick. The only company spokesman he surely beats out is the guy with the emu, and I'm not even sure if they're selling insurance.
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Mayhem is awesome.
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Mayhem is awesome.
I wouldn't go that far. They're all annoying pricks. Most of them are just less annoying than Mahomes (and now Reid).
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Mayhem is awesome.
Sidebar: big Dean Winters fan.
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Mahomes is the greatest State Farm spokeperson of all time. There, I said it. Fight me.
Unfortunately, he's not even that. The guy arguing with his wife at three am - "Well, she's a guy, so..." - is better.
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Mayhem is awesome.
Sidebar: big Dean Winters fan.
Love him in 30 Rock.
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So much for Zach Wilson.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35091901/sources-jets-players-told-qb-zach-wilson-start-sunday
On the one hand, getting massacred by a stout Patriots D, twice, shouldn't be how you evaluate your QB. It happens to a lot of quarterbacks. At the same time his refusal to accept any responsibility just looks terrible. Wouldn't be surprised if his teammates were calling for his head on platter.
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So much for Zach Wilson.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35091901/sources-jets-players-told-qb-zach-wilson-start-sunday
On the one hand, getting massacred by a stout Patriots D, twice, shouldn't be how you evaluate your QB. It happens to a lot of quarterbacks. At the same time his refusal to accept any responsibility just looks terrible. Wouldn't be surprised if his teammates were calling for his head on platter.
I watch pretty much every Jets presser, because I'm that much of a masochist.
Saleh was 2 hours late for the one on Monday, coming from team meetings. It was also there that he announced that they were "evaluating everything, including Zach".
I think it's exactly that. Saleh has done a wonderful job creating a culture in NY. Problem is, a single player seems to be above/outside that culture, and that player is Zach Wilson.
I think it helps Saleh in two ways, really. For one, it all but guarantees he'll get Year 3 - he's done wonderful things with this team, and can pin, right or wrong, all failures on the lack of a QB, instead of any issues he or his wingman LaFleur may have. Then, next year, they'll get him who he wants. I'd prefer Carr, but Saleh probably wants Jimmy G. Then, when the Jets win only 8-9 games next year, we'll be having the same conversations all over again.
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I sure hope that wasn't Von Miller's last play. I'd just as soon see him miss the two Patriots games, but it's sad when legends end their careers on a cart.
Good game so far.
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Didn't see it. Was out on a 20-mile bike ride, got back later than planned (had to reroute because I started late and they changed the route for our local Thanksgiving morning walk/run race, so I had to alter my route unexpectedly. Got back and started prepping some food we'll be cooking up later, and finally tuned in to find it pretty close at halftime.
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Wow, too bad for Detroit. They made some mistakes on that last drive that cost them.
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Wow, too bad for Detroit. They made some mistakes on that last drive that cost them.
And the RTP was a fucking stupid penalty to make on a 3rd and 10 the previous drive.
Such a Lions way to lose.
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So far, so good for the Pats.
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Wow, that Madden Tribute was so much better than the two fucking shitty ass halftime shows earlier today.
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Jones played great until that final abortion of a drive. Taking a sack there was the worst possible thing he could do. Really, though, it was stupid penalties that killed them. Pierre Strong is lucky he's a rookie. He might not play again this season, but he's too young to cut for a bonehead mistake.
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That was a huge mistake. That conversation on the sideline with BB did not look good.
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Punts are something that can make me a bit anxious when watching games with a rooting interest. I always think (for the team I am rooting for), "Don't jump offsides or don't run into the kicker." I get "trying to make a play," but you have to be smart in that situation.
On a somewhat related note, because it also special teams, I am still baffled as to why ANY kick returner catches a kickoff in the end zone and runs it out. Idiots. They almost never get it back to the 25, and then you run the risk of a block in the back and all of a sudden your offense is starting off at their own 5.
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I'd like to point out as well how hilariously bad Tony Dungy is at times at being an analyst. Him acting at one point last night that he knew more about situational football than Bill Belichick was straight comedy. And he does a terrible job at hiding how much he clearly dislikes the Patriots. He almost always picks against them.
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I'd like to point out as well how hilariously bad Tony Dungy is at times at being an analyst. Him acting at one point last night that he knew more about situational football than Bill Belichick was straight comedy. And he does a terrible job at hiding how much he clearly dislikes the Patriots. He almost always picks against them.
I didn't pick up on that at all. I thought he was quite praiseful of Belichick.
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It looks like with Mike White the Jets have found, at least, their Mac Jones. Can look extremely good at times, can also look pretty bad. But he at least runs the offense instead of trying to play around it. And he has now shown to flashes in four starts that are much better than any games that Zach Wilson has put together his entire career so far.
Great win seeing the Jets take care of business and establish themselves as a still worthy contender.
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Ravens: ten straight games with ten+ point leads. Make that eleven straight with at least a nine point lead, and yet their record falls to 7-4. The past three years have been quite abysmal when opponents go to a hurry up offense, especially with the talent in their defensive backfield.
And yet......darnit.....their most exciting and reliable offensive weapon would have made that 67 yarder if it was about two yards shorter. It is crazy to see Justin Tucker walk out and try a kick from that distance, and then be in semi disbelief when he comes up short (barely).
I was hoping Baltimore could go at least 10-7 and have a first round home game. That's no longer a given.
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This Packers/Eagles game is crazy.
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Third generation Mongo. How close to the tree did this guy fall? :lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IOfl-576IZ8
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Mad the Packers lost again… but I’m wondering if I witnessed the beginning of the Jordan Love era. I’m
Hoping so.
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Just great. This is the face of the Ravens franchise
https://www.si.com/nfl/ravens/news/ravens-lamar-jackson-unnecessary-headache-for-himself
As to the Jordan Love era: if so, we might see more of these pictures in the future for Nazareth fans :D
(https://i.imgur.com/MLvSIrO.jpg)
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And just like that, the Panthers are just one game out of first place in their division.
WTF
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Bucs leading that division at 5-6. Even more of a :wtf:
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Washington is 7-5. WTF?? ???
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Last night before the game starts:
Me: "It's kind of pointless watching the Packers since their season is already shot."
Mom: "Well, they could still make it as wild cards?"
Me: "Uhhh... lolnop"
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Jones played great until that final abortion of a drive. Taking a sack there was the worst possible thing he could do. Really, though, it was stupid penalties that killed them. Pierre Strong is lucky he's a rookie. He might not play again this season, but he's too young to cut for a bonehead mistake.
That was horrible. And Hunter not going out of bounds. I get it, you're fighting for yards, but be smart.
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One thing that really struck me when the Pats played the Jets is how many times Mac took a sack on what woulda been a game-ender for the Pats against any other offense but once helmed by Zach Wilson. He's not a statue, but the awareness does not seem to be there.
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If the Packers don’t get OT wins over the Patriots and Cowboys, they’d have the second worst record in the league.
I’m all for the tank!
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Yeah, and those wins were flukes anyway. I guess that's what happens when your QB is taking up nearly 25% of the cap space.
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Yeah, and those wins were flukes anyway. I guess that's what happens when your QB is taking up nearly 25% of the cap space.
Yup. I hope they see how Love plays next week. If he plays consistently well, discuss possibly trading Aaron to free up the cap space.
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Referring to OBJ:
His overall team compatibility, his judgment, his behavior is not an issue with him. It is with many. It isn't with him.
This is why the Cowboys are a joke. Team compatibility doesn't matter? Judgement doesn't matter? As long as he's talented nothing else matters. Why not just sign AB? I'll bet they could get him for dirt cheap. And to be fair, the plane incident probably is a bunch of nothing. I probably wouldn't hold it against him, either. You can't just say things like this don't matter, though.
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I reallly do hope OBJ lands with the Cowboys and they still get eliminated in the first round.
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I reallly do hope OBJ lands with the Cowboys and they still get eliminated in the first round.
With him opposite Lamb it's conceivable that they just brute force their way through the playoffs. I think they're a typically soft Cowboys team, but there comes a point when you've got enough options that you can win without being particularly good overall.
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Dallas has a better chance without OBJ. They've been down this road before with drama queen players who think they aren't getting the ball enough. Seems like a no-brainer. Of course executive decisions don't take a lot of brains anyway. :\
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The Cowboys really don't need OBJ. If OBJ were signed, it would be for a playoff push because in the Cowboys system, a new player has a 21 day routine to get into game shape which means he would only be available for 1 or 2 games. The signing doesn't make sense.
As far as Jerrah goes, remember, he's constantly on JW Blue. :lol
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I reallly do hope OBJ lands with the Cowboys and they still get eliminated in the first round.
With him opposite Lamb it's conceivable that they just brute force their way through the playoffs. I think they're a typically soft Cowboys team, but there comes a point when you've got enough options that you can win without being particularly good overall.
Oh no doubt they would be amazing with his talents, I would just hope he rots the team from the inside and they implode which I feel is entirely possible as well. I mean, I'm a Giants fan so one could see why I would root this way. The reality is also, the Giants need him WAY more than the Cowboys, but there's no reason for him to join the Giants.
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I reallly do hope OBJ lands with the Cowboys and they still get eliminated in the first round.
With him opposite Lamb it's conceivable that they just brute force their way through the playoffs. I think they're a typically soft Cowboys team, but there comes a point when you've got enough options that you can win without being particularly good overall.
Oh no doubt they would be amazing with his talents, I would just hope he rots the team from the inside and they implode which I feel is entirely possible as well. I mean, I'm a Giants fan so one could see why I would root this way. The reality is also, the Giants need him WAY more than the Cowboys, but there's no reason for him to join the Giants.
Daniel Jones couldn't get a simple screen pass to his running back so what makes you think he can get the ball to OBJ?
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I reallly do hope OBJ lands with the Cowboys and they still get eliminated in the first round.
With him opposite Lamb it's conceivable that they just brute force their way through the playoffs. I think they're a typically soft Cowboys team, but there comes a point when you've got enough options that you can win without being particularly good overall.
Oh no doubt they would be amazing with his talents, I would just hope he rots the team from the inside and they implode which I feel is entirely possible as well. I mean, I'm a Giants fan so one could see why I would root this way. The reality is also, the Giants need him WAY more than the Cowboys, but there's no reason for him to join the Giants.
Daniel Jones couldn't get a simple screen pass to his running back so what makes you think he can get the ball to OBJ?
Because OBJ can catch bad throws. The Giants only have one WR and he's not really a #1. The Giants severely lack talent at WR. OBJ would make Jones better. I don't think that's so hard to see.
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I think what's hard to see is OBJ going back to the NYG causing controversy like he did there once before. I don't see it happening and I'm pretty sure he doesn't want to go back there anyway.
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Yeah, and those wins were flukes anyway. I guess that's what happens when your QB is taking up nearly 25% of the cap space.
Yup. I hope they see how Love plays next week. If he plays consistently well, discuss possibly trading Aaron to free up the cap space.
I hear the Broncos need some help at the QB position.
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I doubt Odell wants to go back to playing for a mediocre QB, ala Baker, so I don't see him going back to the Giants.
I agree that Dallas would be better without him, as adding him will make them want to throw more to keep everyone happy, and they are obviously better when they run it more.
You can already see the Dallas playoff loss coming, where they end up with 14 penalties because McCarthy is an undisciplined doofus and everyone will be asking why they threw it so much.
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Broncos flexed out of their SNF game and we'll get to see Chargers and Dolphins instead.
Thank God.
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I'm not a vindictive guy, and I don't really have the schadenfreude gene, but I see what's happening in Denver, and to a lesser extent in Indianapolis, and I can't help but think that true colors win out more often than not, and this is EXACTLY why I say "cool your jets" with respect to Mahomes. It's not like Wilson is just having a bit of an off year, but is still the "Wilson" we know and love; he's ATROCIOUS. He had a good coach and some very strong weapons in Seattle, and without that, it's looking like he's naked and afraid. I'm not saying that would happen with Mahomes (I certainly never saw it coming with Wilson) but in the spirit of "Any Given Sunday", you got to let these guys play the games.
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I can see them bringing OBJ into Dallas as a decoy for Ceedee Lamb and Michael Gallop, but he'll never go for that. In the end like Kev said, they'll just end up beating themselves as usual. Of course, they can prove me wrong anytime they like, I've hated being right for the last 25 fucking years.
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I'm not a vindictive guy, and I don't really have the schadenfreude gene, but I see what's happening in Denver, and to a lesser extent in Indianapolis, and I can't help but think that true colors win out more often than not, and this is EXACTLY why I say "cool your jets" with respect to Mahomes. It's not like Wilson is just having a bit of an off year, but is still the "Wilson" we know and love; he's ATROCIOUS. He had a good coach and some very strong weapons in Seattle, and without that, it's looking like he's naked and afraid. I'm not saying that would happen with Mahomes (I certainly never saw it coming with Wilson) but in the spirit of "Any Given Sunday", you got to let these guys play the games.
I'm not ready to shut the book on Wilson. I know that many are, but there have been far more problems in Denver than just his play. The coaching is a major one.
Wilson has not been "great", actually, but I think many are forgetting that he rarely has been. He was above average on a great team with a great coach. We know he can play, and he has a strong, winner mentality. The Broncos need to get everything around their $200M QB right. Wilson will be fine until they do.
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Carson Wentz has more passing TD this season than Russell Wilson.
Wentz hasn't played since week 6.
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Carson Wentz has more passing TD this season than Russell Wilson.
Wentz hasn't played since week 6.
And Wentz isn't exactly a superstar to begin with either.
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Arrest warrant issued in Tampa for Antonio Brown (https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35156115/arrest-warrant-issued-tampa-antonio-brown)
WTF
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Carson Wentz has more passing TD this season than Russell Wilson.
Wentz hasn't played since week 6.
So you'd take Wentz over Wilson on the Panthers.
Got it ;)
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Carson Wentz has more passing TD this season than Russell Wilson.
Wentz hasn't played since week 6.
So you'd take Wentz over Wilson on the Panthers.
Got it ;)
If that were my only two available choices? Maybe.
But that's a shitty choice.
Of course, we're a shitty team. :lol
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I'm not a vindictive guy, and I don't really have the schadenfreude gene, but I see what's happening in Denver, and to a lesser extent in Indianapolis, and I can't help but think that true colors win out more often than not, and this is EXACTLY why I say "cool your jets" with respect to Mahomes. It's not like Wilson is just having a bit of an off year, but is still the "Wilson" we know and love; he's ATROCIOUS. He had a good coach and some very strong weapons in Seattle, and without that, it's looking like he's naked and afraid. I'm not saying that would happen with Mahomes (I certainly never saw it coming with Wilson) but in the spirit of "Any Given Sunday", you got to let these guys play the games.
I'm not ready to shut the book on Wilson. I know that many are, but there have been far more problems in Denver than just his play. The coaching is a major one.
Wilson has not been "great", actually, but I think many are forgetting that he rarely has been. He was above average on a great team with a great coach. We know he can play, and he has a strong, winner mentality. The Broncos need to get everything around their $200M QB right. Wilson will be fine until they do.
Funny enough, the bold is the part I'm struggling with the most. I'm not watching the Broncos closely, but what I've seen he's not really even bringing the leadership.
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Carson Wentz has more passing TD this season than Russell Wilson.
Wentz hasn't played since week 6.
So you'd take Wentz over Wilson on the Panthers.
Got it ;)
I would take Wentz over Wilson too.
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Carson Wentz has more passing TD this season than Russell Wilson.
Wentz hasn't played since week 6.
So you'd take Wentz over Wilson on the Panthers.
Got it ;)
I would take Wentz over Wilson too.
Fuck both of them - I'd trade for Cooper RUSH!!!!! :metal
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El Barto. Can I critique Bill Belichick now? He is the gm that built this team. Who put together this coaching staff. Ugh. Welcome to .500 ball watch 4 years to see him beat Shula's record for wins.
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The good news is the Patriots are wearing their awesome unis tonight, complimented by the greatest helmet in NFL history. Why they ever changed from that is a total mystery.
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I do love the Pat Patriot helmet.
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The good news is the Patriots are wearing their awesome unis tonight, complimented by the greatest helmet in NFL history.
This is the truth.
The Pats went 3 and out after the Bills' TD drive and put their D back on the field?? They can't draw up three fucking plays to get 10 yards???
I knew they were losing tonight, but this is pathetic.
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First punt by the Bills vs the Patriots since Bush Sr was in the White House. Or something like that.
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And then 3 and out. Oof.
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El Barto. Can I critique Bill Belichick now? He is the gm that built this team. Who put together this coaching staff. Ugh. Welcome to .500 ball watch 4 years to see him beat Shula's record for wins.
Yeah, he sucks. They should fire him. Who'd he blow to get this job?
Man, it took me until recently for me to figure out that Kev was right all along. Patriots fans really are awful. :lol
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Yes! Barto has seen the light!!
Six Super Bowls wins should keep any fanbase happy for life. Should.
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And then 3 and out. Oof.
Shocker.
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El Barto. Can I critique Bill Belichick now? He is the gm that built this team. Who put together this coaching staff. Ugh. Welcome to .500 ball watch 4 years to see him beat Shula's record for wins.
Yeah, he sucks. They should fire him. Who'd he blow to get this job?
Man, it took me until recently for me to figure out that Kev was right all along. Patriots fans really are awful. :lol
:lol
So frustrating seeing the offensive struggle 90% of the games and the D so porous against good offensive teams.
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Man, it took me until recently for me to figure out that Kev was right all along. Patriots fans really are awful. :lol
I don't consider myself a "Patriots fan" per se, but is Belichick in your eyes above critique?
He drives Brady out.
Believes he only needs an average QB to be successful.
Pads his staff with his kids and kids of his friends.
Hasn't developed any successful coaches.
Puts his offence in the hands of people that have no clue what they're doing.
I think Bill is a brilliant coach in that he can dissect and teach a game better than anyone.
And while his last two drafts have been decent, he's over his head with his recent history of awful drafting, spending on FAs that don't contribute, and an inadequate and inexperienced coaching staff.
They're going 7-10 this year, and Kraft cannot be happy.
I'm not clamoring for him to be fired, but there are going to have to be some changes going forward.
He and Mac are still not seeing eye to eye.
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Man, it took me until recently for me to figure out that Kev was right all along. Patriots fans really are awful. :lol
I don't consider myself a "Patriots fan" per se, but is Belichick in your eyes above critique?
Of course not. The criticisms should be legit, though, and as you wonderfully demonstrate, as often as not they aren't.
He drives Brady out. Nonsense. Brady's a whiny little bitch. He was gone no matter what.
Believes he only needs an average QB to be successful. Just because you think MacCorkle is average doesn't mean that's how Belichick sees things.
Pads his staff with his kids and kids of his friends. Who've typically done pretty well within the organization.
Hasn't developed any successful coaches. Are you fucking nuts? I guess you mean head coaches after they leave NE. So what? How's that on him? His coaches have typically been excellent.
Puts his offence in the hands of people that have no clue what they're doing. Perhaps, but the verdict's still out for me. I wouldn't rule Patricia out as a decent OC at some point, nor would I rule out a return to O'Brien.
Don't confuse pushing back on your interpretations as me being unwilling to criticize Belichick. There are definitely areas he should be handling better. I just don't see the doom and gloom that you, Joe, and apparently Boston talking heads do.
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Finally the Dolphins are looking respectable and New England have settled down ….and now The Bills are killing everybody !
I don’t see Miami beating the Niners, Chargers , Or the Bills in the next few weeks …
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Disagree El Barto. He offers a 1 year deal with incentives to your 5 time SB QB after winning in 2018. Never mind the offer with incentives in 2018 with a 5 time SB where the QB works with the owner to take less to block the ability for the team to franchise him.
That says it all.
People want to say they couldn't get the players to help Brady thst year if he stayed. Who's fault is that? We know the answer.
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Man, it took me until recently for me to figure out that Kev was right all along. Patriots fans really are awful. :lol
I don't consider myself a "Patriots fan" per se, but is Belichick in your eyes above critique?
Of course not. The criticisms should be legit, though, and as you wonderfully demonstrate, as often as not they aren't.
He drives Brady out. Nonsense. Brady's a whiny little bitch. He was gone no matter what.
Believes he only needs an average QB to be successful. Just because you think MacCorkle is average doesn't mean that's how Belichick sees things.
Pads his staff with his kids and kids of his friends. Who've typically done pretty well within the organization.
Hasn't developed any successful coaches. Are you fucking nuts? I guess you mean head coaches after they leave NE. So what? How's that on him? His coaches have typically been excellent.
Puts his offence in the hands of people that have no clue what they're doing. Perhaps, but the verdict's still out for me. I wouldn't rule Patricia out as a decent OC at some point, nor would I rule out a return to O'Brien.
Don't confuse pushing back on your interpretations as me being unwilling to criticize Belichick. There are definitely areas he should be handling better. I just don't see the doom and gloom that you, Joe, and apparently Boston talking heads do.
Yeah, but you are a definite "In Bill We Trust" guy.
The thing about the average QB wasn't about Mac. Hell, Bill didn't even want him. It was from a book, I can't remember, where a Pat's coach said that Bill believes he can win with an average QB.
Bill was not willing to give Brady the Drew Brees contract. That's what Brady wanted. Brady also held the Malcolm Butler SB benching against Bill. In Brady's mind, Bill put himself above the team. It was only after that that Brady started to be more selfish.
You're Belichick guy. I don't expect you to take Brady's side on it. I don't have a dog in the race. Brady was a dick at the end, I'll give you that. But people not named Cam Newton stopped taking discounts to play here once Brady left.
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What cracks me up is that Belichick apparently gets no credit for having his coaching staff coach Brady up to the level he got. He was drafted in the 6th round for a reason, and while he always had ice in his veins in crunch time from the start, he wasn't a consistently elite QB until his late 20s, so the idea that he walked into the league as this stud and that Belichick was lucky to get him is crap. Belichick's staff did a great job in coaching him up (and Brady, to his credit, is a guy who wants to be coached), and Brady, being an intelligent guy and hard worker, has gotten the most out of his abilities.
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What cracks me up is that Belichick apparently gets no credit for having his coaching staff coach Brady up to the level he got. He was drafted in the 6th round for a reason, and while he always had ice in his veins in crunch time from the start, he wasn't a consistently elite QB until his late 20s, so the idea that he walked into the league as this stud and that Belichick was lucky to get him is crap. Belichick's staff did a great job in coaching him up (and Brady, to his credit, is a guy who wants to be coached), and Brady, being an intelligent guy and hard worker, has gotten the most out of his abilities.
There were great coaches. Weiss, McDaniels, Scar, Ivan Fears for sure. Weiss was a Parcells guy. Scar had been with the Pats organization long before Bill ever got here.
What's Bill's record without Brady again?
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A lot better than Bill Walsh's was without Joe Montana.
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That's a fallacy. All great coaches need a great QB to win.
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3rd and Goal....from the 21!! :lol
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3 timeouts and no fight. You made this team Bill.
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Yeah, but you are a definite "In Bill We Trust" guy.
I really appreciate the way he approaches the game, and I think he's a far, far better coach than most teams can dig up. True enough. I also think that the Patriots fans that are turning on him are fools. Who are you going to get that's better? That goes for GM, too. You want to roll the dice on a new guy?
Bill was not willing to give Brady the Drew Brees contract. That's what Brady wanted. Brady also held the Malcolm Butler SB benching against Bill. In Brady's mind, Bill put himself above the team. It was only after that that Brady started to be more selfish.
Brady held a helluva lot of things against him. Here's the thing, though. Bill and TB were both always team first guys from the very beginning. By all accounts TB 12 was thoroughly vested in what we call the Patriot Way. And yet after 15 years of success he decided he wanted more and more. He didn't like the salaries. He didn't like his receivers (and therefore wouldn't try to utilize them). He didn't like being treated like he wasn't the MVP. All things contrary to the way the organization had been running for so long. Yeah, fuck that guy. I won't say I'm glad he's gone, obviously, but I don't blame Bill for not selling his soul to keep him there, either.
Remember when Brady and his wife went to Kraft to try and get Bill fired and replaced with O'Brien? Yeah, real team player. That's why I think he's a whiny little bitch, and frankly, he's earned the hell he's stuck in right now.
But people not named Cam Newton stopped taking discounts to play here once Brady left.
Absolutely. On this we agree. This might be a bigger loss to the Patriots than Brady himself, I think. Not just his ability to attract aging veterans looking for a ring, but maintaining the team culture that Brady used to buy into. I don't blame Bill for that, though.
As for the coaching staff (your and Kev's discussion) that's part and parcel with losing Brady and the culture buy in. Bill hired/kept/promoted from within to maintain that culture and way of doing things. It's getting harder and harder to maintain, which is why (I think) we're seeing missed tackles. Stupid penalties. Sloppy special teams. Still, he's trying to keep the right guys around, and bringing back former players to try and maintain that, and I think that's the right thing to do. The good news is that former players are getting to the point where they might want to be position coaches, and NE is where they'll want to be.
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I'm no Patriots fan, but it was great to see the old uniforms last night.
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Brady was pissed he couldn't have his witch doctor, Guerrero on the sidelines and went to Kraft. Not to fire him but to get his guy back on the sidelines. It did cause waves with the coaching staff because some of the players were listening to Guerrero over the training staff. And I don't think a 2 year deal is unreasonable for the best QB in the league at that time. $25 million wasn't the highest paid per year in 2017.
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Brady was pissed he couldn't have his witch doctor, Guerrero on the sidelines and went to Kraft. Not to fire him but to get his guy back on the sidelines. It did cause waves with the coaching staff because some of the players were listening to Guerrero over the training staff. And I don't think a 2 year deal is unreasonable for the best QB in the league at that time. $25 million wasn't the highest paid per year in 2017.
There were accounts of a meeting with Kraft where Budchen was highly vocal about the goings on, and the upshot was that they wanted to swap Bills. Perhaps one of those SI feature stories (which they're surprisingly good at). In any case, none of these accounts suggest that Brady was maintaining the team first attitude that made the organization work.
Like I said, Brady had grown resentful of a very long list of things.
And to be fair, I don't hold Bill blameless in this, but at least he was being what he'd always been. BBB was being a whiny little [hypocritical] bitch.
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Brady was pissed he couldn't have his witch doctor, Guerrero on the sidelines and went to Kraft. Not to fire him but to get his guy back on the sidelines. It did cause waves with the coaching staff because some of the players were listening to Guerrero over the training staff. And I don't think a 2 year deal is unreasonable for the best QB in the league at that time. $25 million wasn't the highest paid per year in 2017.
There were accounts of a meeting with Kraft where Budchen was highly vocal about the goings on, and the upshot was that they wanted to swap Bills. Perhaps one of those SI feature stories (which they're surprisingly good at). In any case, none of these accounts suggest that Brady was maintaining the team first attitude that made the organization work.
Like I said, Brady had grown resentful of a very long list of things.
And to be fair, I don't hold Bill blameless in this, but at least he was being what he'd always been. BBB was being a whiny little [hypocritical] bitch.
I'd still put up with the bullshit with the greatest QB ever. Right now, I'm more worried about how pedestrian the Pats O is and how predictable. Players now speaking openly about how the other teams know what they are going to run a play.
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Oooh Pats fans foolishly calling for the end of the BB era :biggrin:
As a Jets fan, I freaking love this. Good. Run BB out of town. Then, welcome you to the field of potential NFL Head Coaches. It's pretty dark and grim, not sure you can handle it what the next decade or more would look like.
Pats fans, please. STFU. It's December and you're playing for playoffs. You were 10-7 last year. You have enjoyed the warmth of summer for so long you have no idea what winter is really like. For the love of God I hope you get what you want.
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Brady was pissed he couldn't have his witch doctor, Guerrero on the sidelines and went to Kraft. Not to fire him but to get his guy back on the sidelines. It did cause waves with the coaching staff because some of the players were listening to Guerrero over the training staff. And I don't think a 2 year deal is unreasonable for the best QB in the league at that time. $25 million wasn't the highest paid per year in 2017.
There were accounts of a meeting with Kraft where Budchen was highly vocal about the goings on, and the upshot was that they wanted to swap Bills. Perhaps one of those SI feature stories (which they're surprisingly good at). In any case, none of these accounts suggest that Brady was maintaining the team first attitude that made the organization work.
Like I said, Brady had grown resentful of a very long list of things.
And to be fair, I don't hold Bill blameless in this, but at least he was being what he'd always been. BBB was being a whiny little [hypocritical] bitch.
I'd still put up with the bullshit with the greatest QB ever.
I'm not sure I would. You risk losing the rest of the team, and as great as Brady was, he wasn't great enough to cover for 51 other guys. He's always needed a good team around him to succeed, just like any other QB.
Right now, I'm more worried about how pedestrian the Pats O is and how predictable. Players now speaking openly about how the other teams know what they are going to run a play.
This is a valid concern. It's not the greatest of them, though. I'm more concerned about the O-line, the mental lapses, and the spectacular drop off in MacCorkle's accuracy. Perfect touch was his strongest suit last year, and this year it's totally gone. The first two are absolutely on the coaching, but the third is on MJ.
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The good news is the Patriots are wearing their awesome unis tonight, complimented by the greatest helmet in NFL history. Why they ever changed from that is a total mystery.
They wore old Broncos helmets? How truly odd.
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Brady was pissed he couldn't have his witch doctor, Guerrero on the sidelines and went to Kraft. Not to fire him but to get his guy back on the sidelines. It did cause waves with the coaching staff because some of the players were listening to Guerrero over the training staff. And I don't think a 2 year deal is unreasonable for the best QB in the league at that time. $25 million wasn't the highest paid per year in 2017.
There were accounts of a meeting with Kraft where Budchen was highly vocal about the goings on, and the upshot was that they wanted to swap Bills. Perhaps one of those SI feature stories (which they're surprisingly good at). In any case, none of these accounts suggest that Brady was maintaining the team first attitude that made the organization work.
Like I said, Brady had grown resentful of a very long list of things.
And to be fair, I don't hold Bill blameless in this, but at least he was being what he'd always been. BBB was being a whiny little [hypocritical] bitch.
I'd still put up with the bullshit with the greatest QB ever.
I'm not sure I would. You risk losing the rest of the team, and as great as Brady was, he wasn't great enough to cover for 51 other guys. He's always needed a good team around him to succeed, just like any other QB.
Right now, I'm more worried about how pedestrian the Pats O is and how predictable. Players now speaking openly about how the other teams know what they are going to run a play.
This is a valid concern. It's not the greatest of them, though. I'm more concerned about the O-line, the mental lapses, and the spectacular drop off in MacCorkle's accuracy. Perfect touch was his strongest suit last year, and this year it's totally gone. The first two are absolutely on the coaching, but the third is on MJ.
I think it's because of the scheming. 4 of the O-line returned this year so I'd have to look at the OC and line coach. That's Patricia & Judge. There is a distinct difference from last year. It's affecting a young QB. His accuracy is off because he's hearing footsteps these days. BB should have gotten a real OC. Look at Bourne. He was great last year and now, a 3rd down, 3rd receiver.
Something is not right and you have to look at Bill who put this staff together.
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El Barto. Just written today. This is being asked by man fans in N.E.
https://www.audacy.com/weei/sports/patriots/the-patriots-have-a-problem-and-its-spelled-b-i-l-l
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The good news is the Patriots are wearing their awesome unis tonight, complimented by the greatest helmet in NFL history. Why they ever changed from that is a total mystery.
WORD.
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El Barto. Just written today. This is being asked by man fans in N.E.
https://www.audacy.com/weei/sports/patriots/the-patriots-have-a-problem-and-its-spelled-b-i-l-l
Proving once again that Boston sports fans are the worst. :lol :P
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Man, it took me until recently for me to figure out that Kev was right all along. Patriots fans really are awful. :lol
I don't consider myself a "Patriots fan" per se, but is Belichick in your eyes above critique?
Of course not. The criticisms should be legit, though, and as you wonderfully demonstrate, as often as not they aren't.
He drives Brady out. Nonsense. Brady's a whiny little bitch. He was gone no matter what.
Believes he only needs an average QB to be successful. Just because you think MacCorkle is average doesn't mean that's how Belichick sees things.
Pads his staff with his kids and kids of his friends. Who've typically done pretty well within the organization.
Hasn't developed any successful coaches. Are you fucking nuts? I guess you mean head coaches after they leave NE. So what? How's that on him? His coaches have typically been excellent.
Puts his offence in the hands of people that have no clue what they're doing. Perhaps, but the verdict's still out for me. I wouldn't rule Patricia out as a decent OC at some point, nor would I rule out a return to O'Brien.
Don't confuse pushing back on your interpretations as me being unwilling to criticize Belichick. There are definitely areas he should be handling better. I just don't see the doom and gloom that you, Joe, and apparently Boston talking heads do.
I kind of was going to write this same post. I think the coaches one in particular is important; rag on McDaniels all you want as a HEAD COACH, but he's one of the best OC's in the game. I've long said - and anyone in management knows this - that just because you're a good TACTICAL person doesn't mean you're a good STRATEGIC person and vice versa. Two of Jack Welch's number two's are LEGENDARY in the business world for their work at GE and yet failed miserably, repeatedly, as CEOs themselves (Larry Bossidy most notably). Just because you're good at one thing doesn't mean you're good at EVERYTHING.
Belichick - even under Brady - was always playing the long game while the PLAYERS played the short game. He's building something. That defense is pretty good, overall (led by Belchick's son, go figure). I didn't watch the whole game - phone died; Amazon blows - but holding the Bills offense to 24 points isn't something to sneeze at. The jury is out on Mac so far, but I don't think he's "average" in terms of his ceiling.
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El Barto. Just written today. This is being asked by man fans in N.E.
https://www.audacy.com/weei/sports/patriots/the-patriots-have-a-problem-and-its-spelled-b-i-l-l
Proving once again that Boston sports fans are the worst. :lol :P
Love you too! :lol
I don't want to get rid of BB. I'd like him to make better decisions with the coaching staff. The regression of Mac & the offense is proof enough. When you hear the players complaining in the BB world, something is wrong.
Bill, BB was able to play the long game with the D because he had Brady to cover the inconsistencies in the D and even the O. He doesn't have that luxury now.
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Brady was pissed he couldn't have his witch doctor, Guerrero on the sidelines and went to Kraft. Not to fire him but to get his guy back on the sidelines. It did cause waves with the coaching staff because some of the players were listening to Guerrero over the training staff. And I don't think a 2 year deal is unreasonable for the best QB in the league at that time. $25 million wasn't the highest paid per year in 2017.
There were accounts of a meeting with Kraft where Budchen was highly vocal about the goings on, and the upshot was that they wanted to swap Bills. Perhaps one of those SI feature stories (which they're surprisingly good at). In any case, none of these accounts suggest that Brady was maintaining the team first attitude that made the organization work.
Like I said, Brady had grown resentful of a very long list of things.
And to be fair, I don't hold Bill blameless in this, but at least he was being what he'd always been. BBB was being a whiny little [hypocritical] bitch.
I'd still put up with the bullshit with the greatest QB ever.
I'm not sure I would. You risk losing the rest of the team, and as great as Brady was, he wasn't great enough to cover for 51 other guys. He's always needed a good team around him to succeed, just like any other QB.
Right now, I'm more worried about how pedestrian the Pats O is and how predictable. Players now speaking openly about how the other teams know what they are going to run a play.
This is a valid concern. It's not the greatest of them, though. I'm more concerned about the O-line, the mental lapses, and the spectacular drop off in MacCorkle's accuracy. Perfect touch was his strongest suit last year, and this year it's totally gone. The first two are absolutely on the coaching, but the third is on MJ.
I think it's because of the scheming.
I don't. Even when he's got time he's putting the ball high or a tad behind them. There's something off with his mechanics. Last year receivers were getting hit in the hands with balls. Now they're having to adjust for them.
4 of the O-line returned this year so I'd have to look at the OC and line coach. That's Patricia & Judge. There is a distinct difference from last year. It's affecting a young QB. His accuracy is off because he's hearing footsteps these days. BB should have gotten a real OC. Look at Bourne. He was great last year and now, a 3rd down, 3rd receiver.
Something is not right and you have to look at Bill who put this staff together.
Two of those guys are playing decidedly worse, though. Part of it is scheming, but not the incessant penalties they're committing. I didn't think Isaiah Wynn could get worse, but he's taken a huge step back. Trent Brown has also been week, which concerns me a great deal. And yet Onwenu and Andrews (when healthy) are still doing just fine. Strange is just learning, and he'll eventually be fine. I'd be more inclined to put this solely on Judge because he's the position coach.
El Barto. Just written today. This is being asked by man fans in N.E.
https://www.audacy.com/weei/sports/patriots/the-patriots-have-a-problem-and-its-spelled-b-i-l-l
I'll read the article in a bit, but frankly, I really don't care about what Patriots fans are asking. I wasn't kidding last night. You guys have been so spoiled you've forgotten how bad things can get, and you don't recognize the assets you've got.
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For sure. If Bill isn't here it looks like Denver. But, he's making glaring mistakes with the 2 coaches on the offensive side, with no experience there with a 2nd year QB. How many young QB's have we seen never prosper because the go through OC's like water? Consistency is extremely important to a young QB. That's the fuss around here all year.
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Man, it took me until recently for me to figure out that Kev was right all along. Patriots fans really are awful. :lol
I don't consider myself a "Patriots fan" per se, but is Belichick in your eyes above critique?
Of course not. The criticisms should be legit, though, and as you wonderfully demonstrate, as often as not they aren't.
He drives Brady out. Nonsense. Brady's a whiny little bitch. He was gone no matter what.
Believes he only needs an average QB to be successful. Just because you think MacCorkle is average doesn't mean that's how Belichick sees things.
Pads his staff with his kids and kids of his friends. Who've typically done pretty well within the organization.
Hasn't developed any successful coaches. Are you fucking nuts? I guess you mean head coaches after they leave NE. So what? How's that on him? His coaches have typically been excellent.
Puts his offence in the hands of people that have no clue what they're doing. Perhaps, but the verdict's still out for me. I wouldn't rule Patricia out as a decent OC at some point, nor would I rule out a return to O'Brien.
Don't confuse pushing back on your interpretations as me being unwilling to criticize Belichick. There are definitely areas he should be handling better. I just don't see the doom and gloom that you, Joe, and apparently Boston talking heads do.
I kind of was going to write this same post. I think the coaches one in particular is important; rag on McDaniels all you want as a HEAD COACH, but he's one of the best OC's in the game. I've long said - and anyone in management knows this - that just because you're a good TACTICAL person doesn't mean you're a good STRATEGIC person and vice versa. Two of Jack Welch's number two's are LEGENDARY in the business world for their work at GE and yet failed miserably, repeatedly, as CEOs themselves (Larry Bossidy most notably). Just because you're good at one thing doesn't mean you're good at EVERYTHING.
I don't know what they teach you in business school, but I've always regarded the Peter principle as a failure of management rather than personnel. In this case it reflects on the people who hire Patriots assistants to be head coaches, failing to recognize their respective strengths and weaknesses. I have no Earthly idea how this is a reflection on Belichick.
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For sure. If Bill isn't here it looks like Denver. But, he's making glaring mistakes with the 2 coaches on the offensive side, with no experience there with a 2nd year QB. How many young QB's have we seen never prosper because the go through OC's like water? Consistency is extremely important to a young QB. That's the fuss around here all year.
Was that the case when those assholes at Foxboro chanted Zappe and booed MacCorkle off the field? :lol
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Those are the moron fans. Every City has them. :lol I have buddies screaming that on Facebook. It's like the plague. :lol
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El Barto. Just written today. This is being asked by man fans in N.E.
https://www.audacy.com/weei/sports/patriots/the-patriots-have-a-problem-and-its-spelled-b-i-l-l
Proving once again that Boston sports fans are the worst. :lol :P
Raiders fans would like a word with you.
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El Barto. Just written today. This is being asked by man fans in N.E.
https://www.audacy.com/weei/sports/patriots/the-patriots-have-a-problem-and-its-spelled-b-i-l-l
Proving once again that Boston sports fans are the worst. :lol :P
Raiders fans would like a word with you.
Wait, I thought Philly held that undisputed crown?
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El Barto. Just written today. This is being asked by man fans in N.E.
https://www.audacy.com/weei/sports/patriots/the-patriots-have-a-problem-and-its-spelled-b-i-l-l
Proving once again that Boston sports fans are the worst. :lol :P
Raiders fans would like a word with you.
Philly fans will fight you for who gets a word with him first.
EDIT: @jammin: :hifive:
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I have no personal experience with Philly fans, but I have severe PTSD from Raiders fans. :yarr
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Sniping at particular fanbases aside (except for Seattle fans--from personal experience, a lot of those people are the worst and make me not want to even revisit that city ever again), I have to agree with Joe's "every fanbase has 'em" comment. I think that's pretty much true everywhere. When I go to 49ers games, I'm appalled at the way fans of other teams are treated, even those that just quietly show up in their team's jersey just to root on and support their team and aren't being rude to anyone. Pretty sure that happens everywhere.
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I'm gonna agree to disagree on one count - Jets fans. IDK why. Maybe it's because we've got nothing to brag about. Maybe it's because we're used to tourists in our stadium. But I've never known a tourist to not have an amazing time at MetLife.
Other than that, though, Jets fans are just as dumb in all the usual ways.
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That's cool to hear. If someone had said that about, say, Green Bay or Minnesota (because midwest politeness), or Carolina (because southern hospitality), it wouldn't really surprise me. It does surprise me a bit about New York, a town that kind of has a reputation for being surly toward outsiders. But it's cool to hear that that's not the case.
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I haven't been to enough games to make a qualified opinion, but I'd be quite surprised if visiting fans at Jerry World didn't have a good time. In our case it's partly Southern hospitality, and partly that Dallasites just don't care all that much. Comes with not having much of a football culture. I've long maintained that most Texans wouldn't tolerate visitors being harassed like that, and a person on the bad side of it would quickly have a whole lot of allies on their side. That said, mob mentality and overpriced nasty beer are definitely variables that might change the math a bit.
Also, the game I saw at Foxboro had plenty of Texans fans, and they seemed to be alright.
In both cases it's likely to be nothing more than a good-natured ribbing, and that's exactly how it should be. I suspect visiting fans probably want a little bit of razzing, so long as it's done in a good-natured manner.
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Always a few bad apples but I love good natured ribbing. Many times it lead to great conversations about football
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Been meaning to post this, kudos to Bosk for knowing what Russell Wilson really was years before the rest of us realized it.
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Jimmy G carted off the feild. That pretty much fucks our season.
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Shanahan didn't want him anyway.
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Wow, Kansas City on the national game with Nantz and Romo. Nantz just called KC a “dynasty in the making”. Okay. Couldn’t be rooting harder for Cincinnati if I was banging one of their cheerleaders. Looks like another game I watch and listen to Christmas music. ;)
For the record, no beef with the scheduling; this is a possibile AFC Championship game. It’s the Nantz/Romo Mahomes fellating that I’m bummed about.
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Wow, Kansas City on the national game
All I know is that when I looked to see what games were on TV again, I was like WTF when I saw it was the Chiefs. Every fucking week, they're on.
I will admit that this should be a good matchup though.
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Guys. All good teams play national games. That's a big part to why so many fans hated the Pats. They were always on their TV for 2 decades.
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I will say that I love the Chiefs' white uniforms.
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Wow, Kansas City on the national game with Nantz and Romo. Nantz just called KC a “dynasty in the making”. Okay. Couldn’t be rooting harder for Cincinnati if I was banging one of their cheerleaders. Looks like another game I watch and listen to Christmas music. ;)
For the record, no beef with the scheduling; this is a possibile AFC Championship game. It’s the Nantz/Romo Mahomes fellating that I’m bummed about.
For those two, I'd have the volume up just loud enough to hear the crowd, so they can fellate away all they want. I've done the same for years for SNF as well. But I'm going to watch SF-Miami instead. I don't need to see close ups of Mahomes yet another 300 times, or Reed 75 times.
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Jimmy G carted off the feild. That pretty much fucks our season.
Switched over to watch Mr. Irrelevant. Hard not to root for the guy, and he's sure trying to make a name for himself.
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Guys. All good teams play national games. That's a big part to why so many fans hated the Pats. They were always on their TV for 2 decades.
No, I get that. It’s a great matchup. They deserve to be on that spot. It’s all that goes with it (Nantz, really; Romo is just the puppy dog that follows him).
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I heard Nantz gave Romo a picture of exactly how he likes to have his ass kissed.
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He likes his asses #4.
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I heard Nantz gave Romo a picture of exactly how he likes to have his ass kissed.
Maybe he would send a Polaroid Bosk’s way along with a DTF donation😉
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I heard Nantz gave Romo a picture of exactly how he likes to have his ass kissed.
Maybe he would send a Polaroid Bosk’s way along with a DTF donation😉
There's a slantz in Nantz' pantz.
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Jimmy G carted off the feild. That pretty much fucks our season.
Switched over to watch Mr. Irrelevant. Hard not to root for the guy, and he's sure trying to make a name for himself.
As long as he has time he's OK, can't handle the pass rush too well though
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That's called a rookie.
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That's called a rookie.
No shit man.. He's putting points on the board though.
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That's called a rookie.
No shit man.. He's putting points on the board though.
Yup. Given how much pressure Miami is throwing at him, his composure is incredible. Wish they could have converted one of those INT's into a TD rather than just a couple of field goals, but still. Hope he/they can keep it up for one more quarter.
Really hope Jimmy is OK. Unless I've missed it, they haven't said anything beyond "foot injury." Hope it's something he can come back from.
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He looked composed to me as a rookie.
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That's called a rookie.
No shit man.. He's putting points on the board though.
Yup. Given how much pressure Miami is throwing at him, his composure is incredible. Wish they could have converted one of those INT's into a TD rather than just a couple of field goals, but still. Hope he/they can keep it up for one more quarter.
Really hope Jimmy is OK. Unless I've missed it, they haven't said anything beyond "foot injury." Hope it's something he can come back from.
Haven't heard anything either
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Greenlaw has been SO impressive on this drive! Along with Purdy, he should get a game ball if they hang on and win this.
EDIT: Really nice job by the offense to run the clock all the way down to just over the 2-minute warning, get some points, and force Miami to burn all its timeouts.
EDIT2: WOW! And just like that, the defense seals it. Bosa and Greenlaw win it!
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San Fran's D steps up. He'll of a game.
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San Fran's D steps up. He'll of a game.
Huge win for the team
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Jimmy G carted off the feild. That pretty much fucks our season.
Switched over to watch Mr. Irrelevant. Hard not to root for the guy, and he's sure trying to make a name for himself.
Who’s Mr. Irrelevant?
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Jimmy G carted off the feild. That pretty much fucks our season.
Switched over to watch Mr. Irrelevant. Hard not to root for the guy, and he's sure trying to make a name for himself.
Who’s Mr. Irrelevant?
Brock Purdy, Mr irrelevant is the moniker given to the last player selected in the draft
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I heard Nantz gave Romo a picture of exactly how he likes to have his ass kissed.
So Burrow takes the sack on 2nd down, CBS shows Mahomes and Romo is all “this game ain’t over!” Burrow, cool as Robert Plant on the ‘75 tour, throws for the first down, game over, Tone.
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Jimmy G carted off the feild. That pretty much fucks our season.
Switched over to watch Mr. Irrelevant. Hard not to root for the guy, and he's sure trying to make a name for himself.
Who’s Mr. Irrelevant?
Brock Purdy, Mr irrelevant is the moniker given to the last player selected in the draft
Oh! Learn something new!!!
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Bengals are now 3-0 against the Chiefs in 2022.
I think it is very possible that Hurts moved ahead of Mahomes today in the MVP race.
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Jimmy G carted off the feild. That pretty much fucks our season.
Switched over to watch Mr. Irrelevant. Hard not to root for the guy, and he's sure trying to make a name for himself.
Who’s Mr. Irrelevant?
Brock Purdy, Mr irrelevant is the moniker given to the last player selected in the draft
Oh! Learn something new!!!
He's now the second greatest Mr. Irreverent in NFL history. :lol No other QB had even completed a pass, and aside from hometown homers none of the others are even recognizable by name, save for Ryan Succup.
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Bengals are now 3-0 against the Chiefs in 2022.
Good. I hope they never win another game until Mahomes is gone.
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Jimmy will be having season ending foot surgery.
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Jimmy will be having season ending foot surgery.
Oof. There goes the season. :sadpanda:
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That guy just can't ever stay healthy. Solid player when he is healthy, but it's clear why the 49ers drafted Lance and wanted to move off of him. Hard to rely on an injury-prone player who is solid at his very best.
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Oh well. Basketball season is starting to ramp up, so there's that.
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That guy just can't ever stay healthy. Solid player when he is healthy, but it's clear why the 49ers drafted Lance and wanted to move off of him. Hard to rely on an injury-prone player who is solid at his very best.
And then who they draft gets injured.
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That guy just can't ever stay healthy. Solid player when he is healthy, but it's clear why the 49ers drafted Lance and wanted to move off of him. Hard to rely on an injury-prone player who is solid at his very best.
And then who they draft gets injured.
They better get Purdy an armed detail.
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Mr. Irrelevant just became incredibly relevant. I hope he does well.
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I've been impressed with the Lions of late. They seem to have bought in and believe. They play hard.
With a few high draft picks They may be a force to reckon with next year.
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I've been impressed with the Lions of late. They seem to have bought in and believe. They play hard.
With a few high draft picks They may be a force to reckon with next year.
I had the exact same thought.
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Im not a fan of ties. What a lackluster way to end that Giants/Washington game yesterday.
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Panthers release Baker Mayfield.
*shrugs*
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Normally I would post a tongue-in-cheek comment about "yup Garopollo gets hurt right before Brady has to play them, horseshoe still firmly embedded" but of course injuries can happen any time and I just feel bad for Jimmy G. He was playing GREAT this year. Just seems to be a brittle guy. Anyway I think the Niners can kick the crap out of the Bucs even without Jimmy. That defense is nasty.
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I am really intrigued to see how the 49ers end up finishing the season. Part of me is inclined to write them off and fall back on "no team can win it all with a third string QB." But part of me thinks what they have could still plausibly be enough, with a defense that is #1 in just about every stat and has just gotten one of their biggest playmakers back, and an offense that is still filled with playmakers. I guess I'm just trying to not be overly optimistic or pessimistic and just hold in "wait-and-see" mode. For a third-string rookie drafted so low and with no NFL starting experience, he looked pretty amazing against a really good team that was going all out to pressure him into mistakes. He did make some mistakes. But not costly ones. And bottom line is, while his numbers may not have been even close to dazzling, he remained calm and poised--much moreso than I would have expected. I expect that he will have some good games, and possibly some disasters where his inexperience is his undoing. But they have so many playmakers around him that they may be able to insulate him from too many of those, and they could end up being just fine. I can't think of another team where this kind of scenario wouldn't spell complete disaster for the team. Interesting times to be a 49ers fan.
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I am really intrigued to see how the 49ers end up finishing the season. Part of me is inclined to write them off and fall back on "no team can win it all with a third string QB." But part of me thinks what they have could still plausibly be enough, with a defense that is #1 in just about every stat and has just gotten one of their biggest playmakers back, and an offense that is still filled with playmakers. I guess I'm just trying to not be overly optimistic or pessimistic and just hold in "wait-and-see" mode. For a third-string rookie drafted so low and with no NFL starting experience, he looked pretty amazing against a really good team that was going all out to pressure him into mistakes. He did make some mistakes. But not costly ones. And bottom line is, while his numbers may not have been even close to dazzling, he remained calm and poised--much moreso than I would have expected. I expect that he will have some good games, and possibly some disasters where his inexperience is his undoing. But they have so many playmakers around him that they may be able to insulate him from too many of those, and they could end up being just fine. I can't think of another team where this kind of scenario wouldn't spell complete disaster for the team. Interesting times to be a 49ers fan.
The one thing we got going for us is that our D will keep us in any game. I think the biggest potential problem is Purdy making mistakes, Its going to be interesting not only to see how the team develops around him, but also how opposing teams target him, trying to pressure him into said mistakes.
Like you said, interesting times.
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I don't much like the guy, but seeing Tom Brady be clutch will never get old. It's as good as it gets. And having to do it twice was all the better.
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I don't much like the guy, but seeing Tom Brady be clutch will never get old. It's as good as it gets. And having to do it twice was all the better.
It was hilarious when there was a flag on the PAT and the ref goes over to Bowles and says, "Do you want to rekick it?" and laughs. :lol
The Bucs' OL might actually be worse than the Pats'!
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TB is clutch at crunch time more often times than not but that Saints team could've easily wrapped it up. Being a big fan of your team is not good for one's blood pressure.
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I didn't see the game, but I guess it's an indicator that standards for even TB12 fans have dropped when they are taking victory laps over beating a 4-9 team by 1 point at home. :lol :lol
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I am really intrigued to see how the 49ers end up finishing the season. Part of me is inclined to write them off and fall back on "no team can win it all with a third string QB." But part of me thinks what they have could still plausibly be enough, with a defense that is #1 in just about every stat and has just gotten one of their biggest playmakers back, and an offense that is still filled with playmakers. I guess I'm just trying to not be overly optimistic or pessimistic and just hold in "wait-and-see" mode. For a third-string rookie drafted so low and with no NFL starting experience, he looked pretty amazing against a really good team that was going all out to pressure him into mistakes. He did make some mistakes. But not costly ones. And bottom line is, while his numbers may not have been even close to dazzling, he remained calm and poised--much moreso than I would have expected. I expect that he will have some good games, and possibly some disasters where his inexperience is his undoing. But they have so many playmakers around him that they may be able to insulate him from too many of those, and they could end up being just fine. I can't think of another team where this kind of scenario wouldn't spell complete disaster for the team. Interesting times to be a 49ers fan.
Jeff Hostetler.
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I didn't see the game, but I guess it's an indicator that standards for even TB12 fans have dropped when they are taking victory laps over beating a 4-9 team by 1 point at home. :lol :lol
Yeah, but El Barto is right; it's still a pleasure to watch. That Bucs team is just not good, and Bowles just looks confused on the sidelines. He might be a coordinator genius, but he's a horrible head coach. Whine about racism all you want, but you're barely .500 with the greatest QB in the history of the game and a useful set of offensive weapons around him. If I'm Leftwich, I'm kicking the crap out of my dog every time I go home. They need a new head coach amid the periodic screams about racism in the league, and THAT'S is the guy they pick? When I just coordinated one of the best offenses in the league to a Super Bowl win? Mofo, please.
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Well, it could be that they didn't want to upset the Brady/Leftwich tandem on the Offensive side, plus Bowles had head coach experience.
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I didn't see the game, but I guess it's an indicator that standards for even TB12 fans have dropped when they are taking victory laps over beating a 4-9 team by 1 point at home. :lol :lol
It is one of those teams that's had his # since joining Tampa. Like the Pats looking to Miami even through there were not good the past 2 decades. They just know each other well.
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After Brady's meltdown on the sideline, they end up winning anyway. Not everyone can be as good as you, buddy. :\ Just fucking go!
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After Brady's meltdown on the sideline, they end up winning anyway. Not everyone can be as good as you, buddy. :\ Just fucking go!
Or it lit a fire under them... not everything has to be a negative.
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After Brady's meltdown on the sideline, they end up winning anyway. Not everyone can be as good as you, buddy. :\ Just fucking go!
Or it lit a fire under them... not everything has to be a negative.
Nah, they just got tired of him whining like a little bitch.
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After Brady's meltdown on the sideline, they end up winning anyway. Not everyone can be as good as you, buddy. :\ Just fucking go!
Or it lit a fire under them... not everything has to be a negative.
Nah, they just got tired of him whining like a little bitch.
Sounds like projecting to me. :) :) :) :)
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It sucks for the 49ers that Garropolo got hurt, but if a third string rookie has to step into a situation, this guy is stepping into the best one possible. With that defense on the other side, and skill position players like McCaffrey, Kittle, Samuel, and Aiyuk, he should feel pretty good, all things considered.
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I didn't see the game, but I guess it's an indicator that standards for even TB12 fans have dropped when they are taking victory laps over beating a 4-9 team by 1 point at home. :lol :lol
NOLA had been outplaying them the entire game. With <5 minutes left Brady absolutely carved them up by doing what Brady has always done: read Ds and make plays. Not only that he had to score 3 TDs to win after one was called back. If you can't appreciate that you're not much of a football fan. It was thrilling to watch, regardless of their respective records.
Also, since when am I a TB12 fan?
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After Brady's meltdown on the sideline, they end up winning anyway. Not everyone can be as good as you, buddy. :\ Just fucking go!
Or it lit a fire under them... not everything has to be a negative.
Nah, they just got tired of him whining like a little bitch.
Sounds like projecting to me. :) :) :) :)
I got your projection right here buddy boy. :p :lol
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I didn't see the game, but I guess it's an indicator that standards for even TB12 fans have dropped when they are taking victory laps over beating a 4-9 team by 1 point at home. :lol :lol
NOLA had been outplaying them the entire game. With <5 minutes left Brady absolutely carved them up by doing what Brady has always done: read Ds and make plays. Not only that he had to score 3 TDs to win after one was called back. If you can't appreciate that you're not much of a football fan. It was thrilling to watch, regardless of their respective records.
Also, since when am I a TB12 fan?
To be clear, I was speaking in general, not referencing you as a Brady fan, and to reiterate, there is nothing for me to appreciate since I didn't see the game.
This thread is darn near unreadable now, though. When just about any other QB is awesome, it's shhhhh, let's not overreact, but Brady comes back and beats a bad team at home and were supposed to drop to our knees and genuflect. It's ridiculous.
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I didn't see the game, but I guess it's an indicator that standards for even TB12 fans have dropped when they are taking victory laps over beating a 4-9 team by 1 point at home. :lol :lol
NOLA had been outplaying them the entire game. With <5 minutes left Brady absolutely carved them up by doing what Brady has always done: read Ds and make plays. Not only that he had to score 3 TDs to win after one was called back. If you can't appreciate that you're not much of a football fan. It was thrilling to watch, regardless of their respective records.
Also, since when am I a TB12 fan?
To be clear, I was speaking in general, not referencing you as a Brady fan, and to reiterate, there is nothing for me to appreciate since I didn't see the game.
This thread is darn near unreadable now, though. When just about any other QB is awesome, it's shhhhh, let's not overreact, but Brady comes back and beats a bad team at home and were supposed to drop to our knees and genuflect. It's ridiculous.
Well tell Mahomes to stop losing to Burrow then.
I KID! I KID!!! :lol
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Brady’s game winner last night put a dent in my fantasy playoff hopes. It allowed a guy I was tied with to win his matchup by one point.
I hate Brady.
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I didn't see the game, but I guess it's an indicator that standards for even TB12 fans have dropped when they are taking victory laps over beating a 4-9 team by 1 point at home. :lol :lol
NOLA had been outplaying them the entire game. With <5 minutes left Brady absolutely carved them up by doing what Brady has always done: read Ds and make plays. Not only that he had to score 3 TDs to win after one was called back. If you can't appreciate that you're not much of a football fan. It was thrilling to watch, regardless of their respective records.
Also, since when am I a TB12 fan?
To be clear, I was speaking in general, not referencing you as a Brady fan, and to reiterate, there is nothing for me to appreciate since I didn't see the game.
This thread is darn near unreadable now, though. When just about any other QB is awesome, it's shhhhh, let's not overreact, but Brady comes back and beats a bad team at home and were supposed to drop to our knees and genuflect. It's ridiculous.
Agreed. It is ridiculous. I mean, it's one thing to be the GOAT. It's quite another to keep throwing it in everyone's face and expect the rest of the team to play up to his standard. It's not about the team anymore at that point. It's more about the team making the GOAT look bad on national television. Regardless, of what it actually is, that's how it looks when he loses his shit on the sidelines.
Oh yeah, and Buck said something pretty stupid while introducing Troy at the beginning of the broadcast. "I'm Joe Buck and this is the 3-time SB champion hall of famer, which pales in comparison to..." whatever he said after that (referring to TB12). I'm sure Troy appreciated that little dig. :\
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I didn't see the game, but I guess it's an indicator that standards for even TB12 fans have dropped when they are taking victory laps over beating a 4-9 team by 1 point at home. :lol :lol
NOLA had been outplaying them the entire game. With <5 minutes left Brady absolutely carved them up by doing what Brady has always done: read Ds and make plays. Not only that he had to score 3 TDs to win after one was called back. If you can't appreciate that you're not much of a football fan. It was thrilling to watch, regardless of their respective records.
Also, since when am I a TB12 fan?
To be clear, I was speaking in general, not referencing you as a Brady fan, and to reiterate, there is nothing for me to appreciate since I didn't see the game.
This thread is darn near unreadable now, though. When just about any other QB is awesome, it's shhhhh, let's not overreact, but Brady comes back and beats a bad team at home and were supposed to drop to our knees and genuflect. It's ridiculous.
Stadler and I both gave props to Mahomes last week for doing the exact same thing. A great QB carving up a D for a come from behind win is always an exciting thing to watch if you're a football fan. It doesn't have to be any more than that.
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Oh yeah, and Buck said something pretty stupid while introducing Troy at the beginning of the broadcast. "I'm Joe Buck and this is the 3-time SB champion hall of famer, which pales in comparison to..." whatever he said after that (referring to TB12). I'm sure Troy appreciated that little dig. :\
I'm not positive, but I think I recall Troy owning up to that very thing after the game last night. The guy's never lacked for humility, and he knows very well he's not Tom Brady.
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Or is he pointing out how nuts it is for someone to win 7 SB's? Hard enough for 1. Nevermind 3, or 7! The problem is, Brady keeps pulling games like this out of his ass that adds to his crazy history of excellence. Mahomes is on a killer path. In the end he will be up there with the greatest QB's ever. One thing people overlook with great QB's is there ability to stay on the field. That's why SF went out and got QB while they still had Jimmy G. We'll never know how good Jimmy could be because he can't play a full season.
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Oh yeah, and Buck said something pretty stupid while introducing Troy at the beginning of the broadcast. "I'm Joe Buck and this is the 3-time SB champion hall of famer, which pales in comparison to..." whatever he said after that (referring to TB12). I'm sure Troy appreciated that little dig. :\
I'm not positive, but I think I recall Troy owning up to that very thing after the game last night. The guy's never lacked for humility, and he knows very well he's not Tom Brady.
But that is the thing: Aikman has nothing to own up to or be ashamed of. He won three Super Bowls (!!), and in the history of the NFL, only three have won more than that, so Buck poking fun at him, even cheekily, because he didn't win seven is just stupid. But that is where we are now.
And the funny thing is that early in his career, Tom Brady WAS Troy Aikman. I made that comparison numerous times back then, that Brady was like Aikman: a good (not great) QB winning Super Bowls with a great head coach and a loaded roster. Brady didn't become a great QB till his late 20s (he was 30 when he won first MVP and when he finally was 1st team All-Pro), while Aikman (who was never All-Pro) saw his career cut short due to health issues, and of course he didn't have the luxury of being protected like QBs have been for the last 15+ years.
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This thread is darn near unreadable now, though. When just about any other QB is awesome, it's shhhhh, let's not overreact, but Brady comes back and beats a bad team at home and were supposed to drop to our knees and genuflect. It's ridiculous.
Yup. And if it's not that, it's whining about announcers. :)
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I didn't see the game, but I guess it's an indicator that standards for even TB12 fans have dropped when they are taking victory laps over beating a 4-9 team by 1 point at home. :lol :lol
NOLA had been outplaying them the entire game. With <5 minutes left Brady absolutely carved them up by doing what Brady has always done: read Ds and make plays. Not only that he had to score 3 TDs to win after one was called back. If you can't appreciate that you're not much of a football fan. It was thrilling to watch, regardless of their respective records.
Also, since when am I a TB12 fan?
To be clear, I was speaking in general, not referencing you as a Brady fan, and to reiterate, there is nothing for me to appreciate since I didn't see the game.
This thread is darn near unreadable now, though. When just about any other QB is awesome, it's shhhhh, let's not overreact, but Brady comes back and beats a bad team at home and were supposed to drop to our knees and genuflect. It's ridiculous.
Some of that is directed at me, and that's not accurate. That's an extremist version of... at least the conversations I'm part of. I don't think I've ever said anything about talking about a good performance. And I'm not asking for anyone to genuflect. I just thought it was neat to watch him do something, yet again, that he's done 1,000 times before but with far less weaponry around him, and with far more miles on the odometer. The reality is, his season is kind of shit and there's no need to genuflect in the direction of Tampa unless we agree this is a victory lap of sorts.
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Oh yeah, and Buck said something pretty stupid while introducing Troy at the beginning of the broadcast. "I'm Joe Buck and this is the 3-time SB champion hall of famer, which pales in comparison to..." whatever he said after that (referring to TB12). I'm sure Troy appreciated that little dig. :\
I'm not positive, but I think I recall Troy owning up to that very thing after the game last night. The guy's never lacked for humility, and he knows very well he's not Tom Brady.
But that is the thing: Aikman has nothing to own up to or be ashamed of. He won three Super Bowls (!!), and in the history of the NFL, only three have won more than that, so Buck poking fun at him, even cheekily, because he didn't win seven is just stupid. But that is where we are now.
I don't think it was simply ribbing him about the rings. I think it was pointing out that Brady is the GOAT, which pretty much everybody recognizes at this point. Troy definitely recognizes it, and his is a qualified opinion. So what, we're allowed to talk about Mahomes being Jesus Christ Jr, but still considering TB the GOAT is out of line?
This thread is darn near unreadable now, though. When just about any other QB is awesome, it's shhhhh, let's not overreact, but Brady comes back and beats a bad team at home and were supposed to drop to our knees and genuflect. It's ridiculous.
Honestly, Kev, if the thread is unreadable I'd say it's because of people taking things far too seriously, and reading into them things that aren't there. All I did was say that watching Brady pick apart a D is still a great thing to watch, and you make it out to be something bigger than that. If Baker Mayfield managed to pull that off at some point I'd say the exact same thing about him and you wouldn't have any commentary to add. I did say that about His Majesty Sir Patrick Mahomes and, aside from Stadler, crickets. You share a chunk of responsibility if the thread is as bad as you think it is.
And the funny thing is that early in his career, Tom Brady WAS Troy Aikman. I made that comparison numerous times back then, that Brady was like Aikman: a good (not great) QB winning Super Bowls with a great head coach and a loaded roster. Brady didn't become a great QB till his late 20s (he was 30 when he won first MVP and when he finally was 1st team All-Pro), while Aikman (who was never All-Pro) saw his career cut short due to health issues, and of course he didn't have the luxury of being protected like QBs have been for the last 15+ years.
I agree with a big chunk of that. Something I will say is that Aikman was very definitely on the decline. Big time. He wasn't heading down Brady's path and fell short because of injuries. While I have no doubt that he retired because of the concussions, I also have no doubt that he knew he couldn't play like he used to and it was his time either way.
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Oh yeah, and Buck said something pretty stupid while introducing Troy at the beginning of the broadcast. "I'm Joe Buck and this is the 3-time SB champion hall of famer, which pales in comparison to..." whatever he said after that (referring to TB12). I'm sure Troy appreciated that little dig. :\
I'm not positive, but I think I recall Troy owning up to that very thing after the game last night. The guy's never lacked for humility, and he knows very well he's not Tom Brady.
Everybody knows he's not TB. Nobody is. Buck didn't have to rub it in. That was just classless man.
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This thread is darn near unreadable now, though. When just about any other QB is awesome, it's shhhhh, let's not overreact, but Brady comes back and beats a bad team at home and were supposed to drop to our knees and genuflect. It's ridiculous.
Yup. And if it's not that, it's whining about announcers. :)
And as the only one that really complains about the announcers, jeez. Just block me if it's that fucking bad.
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Nothing but love and respect for Kev, but Barto nailed it here:
Honestly, Kev, if the thread is unreadable I'd say it's because of people taking things far too seriously, and reading into them things that aren't there. All I did was say that watching Brady pick apart a D is still a great thing to watch, and you make it out to be something bigger than that. If Baker Mayfield managed to pull that off at some point I'd say the exact same thing about him and you wouldn't have any commentary to add. I did say that about His Majesty Sir Patrick Mahomes and, aside from Stadler, crickets. You share a chunk of responsibility if the thread is as bad as you think it is.
Anyhow, as far as Brady, it's...complicated. And both the media's overreaction to everything he does, as well as how he carries himself, make it so. His performance at the end of last night's game is typical of what makes him so great. And his overall demeanor in game and on the sidelines are typical of why a lot of people dislike him. He just comes across as self-centered and entitled. When things aren't going well, he's impatient and comes across like he's blaming everyone else for making him look bad. It almost feels like he's just thinking, "I'm amazing and I don't have time for substandard performance. If you can't make that play, you're hurting my legacy and don't belong on a team with me." Even if that's NOT what he's thinking, that's how it comes across, and that's a bad look. Part of me loves seeing him have continued success because it's mindblowing that he can still achieve greatness this long in the league, and that is itself praiseworthy and enjoyable to watch. But the attitude that comes with it, whether real or perceived, is also incredibly offputting.
And no problem praising others when they do similar things. Mahomes doing something similar was pretty awesome to see. No problem acknowledging that. On the other hand, I can still think he is overrated, and I can still intensely dislike him for being such an awful human being. Those aren't mutually exclusive.
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So.... Baker Mayfield to San Francisco? Could be a good fit....
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So.... Baker Mayfield to San Francisco? Could be a good fit....
I doubt it. Doesn't seem like a good fit from a team chemistry standpoint. Here's what Shanahan said about it:
"We look into everything, but that would surprise me right now," Shanahan said, via ESPN. "We've got to discuss more this afternoon. I've always been a fan of his, but I feel really good about our players. We'll look into everything, but I feel pretty good with where we're at."
I don't want to overreact to Purdy's performance against Miami. But honestly, he seems like the perfect fit as a replacement. He knows the system, the players like him, and as Fred Warner said, he's been practicing against the best defense in the league week in and week out this season, so he isn't as untested as people might tend to assume. I don't see any potentially available QBs in the league stepping in and doing any better than him.
That said, I guess there could potentially be value in having Mayfield compete for the backup spot, or becoming the practice squad QB. (I think the organization is satisfied with picking up Johnson to be Purdy's backup, so the latter role would make more sense for Mayfield)
EDIT: But I will say I give Mayfield better odds of being added to the roster than Kaepernick. :P I'm actually surprised he and his supporters haven't crawled out from under a rock to whine about him not immediately being signed when Jimmy went down.
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I also noticed something that none of analysts even mentioned (that I know of). Some were questioning if the Saints defense let up or the Bucs offense ponied up. I think it was probably both. Obviously, the Bucs were in hurry up mode being down by 2 scores. The Saints didn't adjust to that very well. Maybe the Bucs should've tried a hurry up offense earlier on. Didn't seem like they had much of a game plan until the final 6 mins or so.
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^I don't disagree with any of that.
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I also noticed something that none of analysts even mentioned (that I know of). Some were questioning if the Saints defense let up or the Bucs offense ponied up. I think it was probably both. Obviously, the Bucs were in hurry up mode being down by 2 scores. The Saints didn't adjust to that very well. Maybe the Bucs should've tried a hurry up offense earlier on. Didn't seem like they had much of a game plan until the final 6 mins or so.
The Bucs Offensive line has had problems from the get go this season. With the Center Jensen out, Marpet retiring, Alex Cappa signing with the Bengals, they haven't adjusted well at all. With Wirfs now out it makes it even worse. How they've managed to even win these many games is probably a lot to do with Brady being himself and Defense showing up at times.
That said the coaching has been abysmal this season and they don't have the 'No risk it, no biscuit' mentality that Arians had. They don't make proper adjustments to the porous O-line. The local reporters have been making fun of it on twitter. The most success they've had has been when they go no huddle and Brady's dialing up the calls and tearing apart the defense during crunch time.
They will win the group due to how even more shittier everyone else is playing. They'll make the playoffs and be a one and done team and will probably go back to the bottom of the division again. With that talent of a team they really should be better coached.
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So.... Baker Mayfield to San Francisco? Could be a good fit....
I doubt it. Doesn't seem like a good fit from a team chemistry standpoint. Here's what Shanahan said about it:
"We look into everything, but that would surprise me right now," Shanahan said, via ESPN. "We've got to discuss more this afternoon. I've always been a fan of his, but I feel really good about our players. We'll look into everything, but I feel pretty good with where we're at."
I don't want to overreact to Purdy's performance against Miami. But honestly, he seems like the perfect fit as a replacement. He knows the system, the players like him, and as Fred Warner said, he's been practicing against the best defense in the league week in and week out this season, so he isn't as untested as people might tend to assume. I don't see any potentially available QBs in the league stepping in and doing any better than him.
That said, I guess there could potentially be value in having Mayfield compete for the backup spot, or becoming the practice squad QB. (I think the organization is satisfied with picking up Johnson to be Purdy's backup, so the latter role would make more sense for Mayfield)
EDIT: But I will say I give Mayfield better odds of being added to the roster than Kaepernick. :P I'm actually surprised he and his supporters haven't crawled out from under a rock to whine about him not immediately being signed when Jimmy went down.
Hard to bring a guy in that doesn't know the terminology of the team and get up to snuff quickly. Unless the player was once in Shanahan's system before.
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I also noticed something that none of analysts even mentioned (that I know of). Some were questioning if the Saints defense let up or the Bucs offense ponied up. I think it was probably both. Obviously, the Bucs were in hurry up mode being down by 2 scores. The Saints didn't adjust to that very well. Maybe the Bucs should've tried a hurry up offense earlier on. Didn't seem like they had much of a game plan until the final 6 mins or so.
The Bucs Offensive line has had problems from the get go this season. With the Center Jensen out, Marpet retiring, Alex Cappa signing with the Bengals, they haven't adjusted well at all. With Wirfs now out it makes it even worse. How they've managed to even win these many games is probably a lot to do with Brady being himself and Defense showing up at times.
That said the coaching has been abysmal this season and they don't have the 'No risk it, no biscuit' mentality that Arians had. They don't make proper adjustments to the porous O-line. The local reporters have been making fun of it on twitter. The most success they've had has been when they go no huddle and Brady's dialing up the calls and tearing apart the defense during crunch time.
They will win the group due to how even more shittier everyone else is playing. They'll make the playoffs and be a one and done team and will probably go back to the bottom of the division again. With that talent of a team they really should be better coached.
Can't argue with the abysmal coaching aspect. Bowles was never really a good HC anyway. However, Arians is a general consultant for the team. You'd think some of that would trickle down or across, or whatever. Even though Brady praised Bowles for the decision to punt on 4th down, it was all Brady calling the shots on the last 2 drives. TB might be the one who actually saves Bowles job...or not.
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I also noticed something that none of analysts even mentioned (that I know of). Some were questioning if the Saints defense let up or the Bucs offense ponied up. I think it was probably both. Obviously, the Bucs were in hurry up mode being down by 2 scores. The Saints didn't adjust to that very well. Maybe the Bucs should've tried a hurry up offense earlier on. Didn't seem like they had much of a game plan until the final 6 mins or so.
The Bucs Offensive line has had problems from the get go this season. With the Center Jensen out, Marpet retiring, Alex Cappa signing with the Bengals, they haven't adjusted well at all. With Wirfs now out it makes it even worse. How they've managed to even win these many games is probably a lot to do with Brady being himself and Defense showing up at times.
That said the coaching has been abysmal this season and they don't have the 'No risk it, no biscuit' mentality that Arians had. They don't make proper adjustments to the porous O-line. The local reporters have been making fun of it on twitter. The most success they've had has been when they go no huddle and Brady's dialing up the calls and tearing apart the defense during crunch time.
They will win the group due to how even more shittier everyone else is playing. They'll make the playoffs and be a one and done team and will probably go back to the bottom of the division again. With that talent of a team they really should be better coached.
Can't argue with the abysmal coaching aspect. Bowles was never really a good HC anyway. However, Arians is a general consultant for the team. You'd think some of that would trickle down or across, or whatever. Even though Brady praised Bowles for the decision to punt on 4th down, it was all Brady calling the shots on the last 2 drives. TB might be the one who actually saves Bowles job...or not.
I'm not a Bowles fan; he was a washout in New York with the Jets, and I think he's going to be a washout in Tampa Bay. Behind the scenes everyone seems to praise him, but the results aren't there.
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Rams claim Baker Mayfield
Good luck to both
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Rams claim Baker Mayfield
Good luck to both
I'm surprised at that, frankly. That does not seem to be a good fit, IMO.
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Rams claim Baker Mayfield
Good luck to both
I'm surprised at that, frankly. That does not seem to be a good fit, IMO.
I agree. That's why I wish them luck. They're gonna need it.
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Rams claim Baker Mayfield
Good luck to both
I'm surprised at that, frankly. That does not seem to be a good fit, IMO.
MUCH better fit than S.F.
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I agree with a big chunk of that. Something I will say is that Aikman was very definitely on the decline. Big time. He wasn't heading down Brady's path and fell short because of injuries. While I have no doubt that he retired because of the concussions, I also have no doubt that he knew he couldn't play like he used to and it was his time either way.
I agree with that.
I find the Aikman and Emmitt Smith legacies fascinating as in real time, there were definitely thought who thought Aikman was better than Steve Young (John Madden frequently called Aikman the best QB in football), and many who thought E. Smith was better than Barry Sanders, yet here we are decades later and it seems pretty commonly accepted that Sanders > Smith and Young > Aikman. Just goes to show ya how skewed thinking can be in real time because of WINNING. Hindsight and letting things marinate a bit often gives different and better perspective.
And as a sidebar, there are few old coaches or players I'd rather listen to talk about the game than Jimmy Johnson. I was trained as a kid to hate the Cowboys, so I could never full appreciate him when he and the Cowboys had their run, but whenever he is on The Herd (which I don't watch, but I catch clips on YT) and talks football, it is like a football savant speaking and spitting knowledge. It's easy to see why he was so successful as a head coach.
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I'm President of the Troy Aikman is underrated fan club. He threw the best ball I've ever seen.
And I'm not say he was better or worse than Steve Young. But just because Aikman was surrounded by a team of studs does not make him not a stud himself.
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I agree with a big chunk of that. Something I will say is that Aikman was very definitely on the decline. Big time. He wasn't heading down Brady's path and fell short because of injuries. While I have no doubt that he retired because of the concussions, I also have no doubt that he knew he couldn't play like he used to and it was his time either way.
I agree with that.
I find the Aikman and Emmitt Smith legacies fascinating as in real time, there were definitely thought who thought Aikman was better than Steve Young (John Madden frequently called Aikman the best QB in football), and many who thought E. Smith was better than Barry Sanders, yet here we are decades later and it seems pretty commonly accepted that Sanders > Smith and Young > Aikman. Just goes to show ya how skewed thinking can be in real time because of WINNING. Hindsight and letting things marinate a bit often gives different and better perspective.
Young and Aikman are fundamentally different players. Hard to really compare them. I suppose I'd probably give the edge to Young based on how dynamic he was, but with the right offense Aikman can easily be better. As for Emmett vs Barry, also very different. Emmett will never be the pure runner that Sanders was; nobody is. Sweetness is similarly different. Different styles and different capabilities. Factor in Big Jim Brown, too. Emmett was as good a running back as any of them, though, even if he wasn't the best at dodging tackles, or steamrolling tackles, or running through tackles like Barry, Walter, and Jim. Dude had vision I don't think any of them possessed, and that counts for a helluva lot.
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Update on Jimmy G: MRIs show that the foot injury is NOT the type of injury they first thought it was, and he could return in 6-8 weeks. Which means he could be back for a playoff run.
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Update on Jimmy G: MRIs show that the foot injury is NOT the type of injury they first thought it was, and he could return in 6-8 weeks. Which means he could be back for a playoff run.
...only to sprain a knee. ;D
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I'm President of the Troy Aikman is underrated fan club. He threw the best ball I've ever seen.
And I'm not say he was better or worse than Steve Young. But just because Aikman was surrounded by a team of studs does not make him not a stud himself.
Aikman was the perfect QB for that team. A loaded team with a beast of a line, a stud RB and a stud WR, and Aikman had no problem handing it off and being unselfish when it came to stats.
Young and Aikman are fundamentally different players. Hard to really compare them. I suppose I'd probably give the edge to Young based on how dynamic he was, but with the right offense Aikman can easily be better. As for Emmett vs Barry, also very different. Emmett will never be the pure runner that Sanders was; nobody is. Sweetness is similarly different. Different styles and different capabilities. Factor in Big Jim Brown, too. Emmett was as good a running back as any of them, though, even if he wasn't the best at dodging tackles, or steamrolling tackles, or running through tackles like Barry, Walter, and Jim. Dude had vision I don't think any of them possessed, and that counts for a helluva lot.
Agreed, Emmitt had awesome vision. For as amazing as Sanders was (he was literally a human highlight reel), when his dancing didn't work, he was eating it for a loss. We used to joke that he could have a game where he had 15 rushes for 95 yards, with one 77-yard run and 18 yards on the other 14 rushes.
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I'm President of the Troy Aikman is underrated fan club. He threw the best ball I've ever seen.
And I'm not say he was better or worse than Steve Young. But just because Aikman was surrounded by a team of studs does not make him not a stud himself.
Troy had a strong arm, excellent accuracy, and perfect touch. Just as important, he had all of those things no matter what was happening in the pocket around him. He threw just as pretty a ball when LT or Reggie White was in his grill. Combine that with sky high competitiveness, and a tendency to never make stupid decisions and you've got a stud. I'm actually not a huge fan. I thought he was a little too clinical as opposed to some of the more entertaining quarterbacks, including Young. His studliness speeks for itself, though.
And Randall Cunningham probably threw a prettier ball than anybody I've ever seen.
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Brady is currently enjoying his 10th consecutive season with a top 10 scoring defense, more than Peyton Rodgers Brees Mahomes combined in their entire careers. Good thing too, imagine if he had to score more than 17 points to win a game. Number of times scoring 20+ points this year:
Brock Purdy 1
Tom Brady 1
Wonder how much Mark Ingram got paid to run out of bounds short of the sticks so that we had to go through another jerkoff session about a guy who led his offense to 3 points during the first 55 minutes against a 3-8 team so he could finally get to .500 in a shit division. Can’t wait until that Niners-Bucs game.
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Well at least you're not bitter about it. Some people might let resentment like that turn them in to an angry bastard. Glad you're not one of them.
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Well at least you're not bitter about it. Some people might let resentment like that turn them in to an angry bastard. Glad you're not one of them.
:lol :lol :lol :lol
I look like a TB12 fan compared to Dream Team.
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So does Gisele.
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What a great game winning late drive he had. He deserves any and all accolades thrown his way....
Talkin' about Tyler Huntley, and the 91 yard, 16 play drive at the end to beat the Broncos. :tup
(a pity that Denver has such an inept offense. Their Top Five defense deserves better).
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Even though I am not a Broncos fan anymore, their defense does deserve a little blame for their record. In three games now this season, the other team had the ball in the last two minutes and trailing, and the Denver defense let them come down to score to either win it or tie it. Gotta get those stops.
As for Wilson, yes, he has been terrible this year, but keep in mind he has a terrible coach, a horrific o-line, little to no running game and no WRs (Sutton hasn't been good since 2019 and Jeudy is unproven as a pro). I think he could turn it around next year if all or most of those issues get resolved.
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I agree with a big chunk of that. Something I will say is that Aikman was very definitely on the decline. Big time. He wasn't heading down Brady's path and fell short because of injuries. While I have no doubt that he retired because of the concussions, I also have no doubt that he knew he couldn't play like he used to and it was his time either way.
I agree with that.
I find the Aikman and Emmitt Smith legacies fascinating as in real time, there were definitely thought who thought Aikman was better than Steve Young (John Madden frequently called Aikman the best QB in football), and many who thought E. Smith was better than Barry Sanders, yet here we are decades later and it seems pretty commonly accepted that Sanders > Smith and Young > Aikman. Just goes to show ya how skewed thinking can be in real time because of WINNING. Hindsight and letting things marinate a bit often gives different and better perspective.
And as a sidebar, there are few old coaches or players I'd rather listen to talk about the game than Jimmy Johnson. I was trained as a kid to hate the Cowboys, so I could never full appreciate him when he and the Cowboys had their run, but whenever he is on The Herd (which I don't watch, but I catch clips on YT) and talks football, it is like a football savant speaking and spitting knowledge. It's easy to see why he was so successful as a head coach.
This times 100.
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I'd put Jimmy's success on two things, really. One is an understanding of the fundamentals, which begin with the lines. His winning teams had top-end O and D lines, and that's where it all begins. The other was being a good manager of personnel. He was situated as the bad cop, vs Jerry's good cop, and he knew how to make the best of it. Players were terrified of the guy, and to reinforce that he always seemed to cut somebody a few weeks into the season after they make a mistake. To that end, I suppose the difference between him and Belichick is that Jimmy was pretty clear that rules didn't apply to everybody, and Bill makes sure that they do. Bill isn't afraid to hold people accountable. That's why 88 can attempt to murder somebody in the lockerroom (by his own admission) and still start the next game. :lol
I'm honestly not sure how Bill would handle a stabbing perpetrated by a star player. My hunch is that he'd quietly bar the lockerroom doors and let the players sort it out amongst themselves like Major Riceman in the Dirty Dozen. :lol
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You got to think he had some kind of experience with personalities on the Cowboys during the JJ era with the likes of Lawrence Taylor. That man himself was a 53 man whirlwind. :lol
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You got to think he had some kind of experience with personalities on the Cowboys during the JJ era with the likes of Lawrence Taylor. That man himself was a 53 man whirlwind. :lol
Well, Parcells was famously of the Jimmie Johnson school. He made no bones about treated LT different; Simms carried a grudge for a long time about that, and only after he retired did he realize that whatever success he had was because Parcells handled him the way he did, and that wasn't the same as the way he handled LT.
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Pretty good explanation for why Garoppolo is a top 5 QB and is underrated: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hvVGVt9VBKc&list=TLPQMDcxMjIwMjIOmyVHfpbJZw&index=6
Pretty hard to argue with the hard facts and data. But I know people love to try because reasons.
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Yep, nothing shows your objectivity better than starting off your argument with, "No matter how bad he plays, I defend him." :lol :lol :P :P
Good chatter above about Jimmy Johnson. He and Belichick are definitely cut from the same cloth, except like Barto said, BB doesn't give special treatment to anyone, while Jimmy did. I think having a head coach that instill a little fear in players, like "Oh shit, I could get cut if I don't do this or that," is a good thing, and it seems like coaches like that are a dying breed.
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Belichick gives plenty of special treatment.
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Belichick gives plenty of special treatment.
Give them examples Tim.
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Belichick gives plenty of special treatment.
Give them examples Tim.
That's too much thinking. I just think it's a fallacy that Bill isn't like that.
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That won't hold up in court, Mr. Prosecutor. ;)
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I am not prepared to go to court tonight. :lol
I just think that is all part of the national narrative.
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I'd disagree with Tim. He's punished guys for being late to practice after a blizzard. He benched Welker for a quarter in a playoff game for saying feet many times durring press interview. You know, the Jets.
I could go on.
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I'd disagree with Tim. He's punished guys for being late to practice after a blizzard. He benched Welker for a quarter in a playoff game for saying feet many times durring press interview. You know, the Jets.
I could go on.
And he benched Malcolm Butler in the SB because he was disrespectful to his son. I just think that Bill is way more inconsistent than he is given credit for.
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Granted, Brady never stabbed anybody in the neck, so Bill never actually had to be in Jimmy's shoes. I think the thing is, his star players don't need that because he runs a tight enough ship that nobody's getting into those situations. Despite Jimmy's hardass demeanor, it was a real circus behind the scenes. He'd cut somebody for fumbling, but drunken coke-fueld orgies after hours weren't a problem. Hell, I wouldn't rule out him showing up to one or two. I don't gather there's a whole lot of that going on in NE. Probably a little, but sitting out and missing a game check for arriving late to practice probably keeps people on the straight and narrow, and he probably doesn't sign too many players like that anyway. Aaron Hernandez was the exception, and he was cut before he even made bail. If that had been Alvin Harper or Mark Tuinei Jerry would have sent his limo to bail him out, hired the best lawyers in Texas, and "settled" with the family and witnesses to make the thing go away. :lol
Belichick gives plenty of special treatment.
Ask Bitch Boy Brady about that.
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One of the all time best Belichick moments was his presser after the Aaron Hernandez thing. he was...human.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZASRlp0Cp9Y
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One of the all time best Belichick moments was his presser after the Aaron Hernandez thing. he was...human.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZASRlp0Cp9Y
"Our players are generally highly motivated and gifted athletes". "Generally"? Hahaha. "Except the kickers!"
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Brady is currently enjoying his 10th consecutive season with a top 10 scoring defense, more than Peyton Rodgers Brees Mahomes combined in their entire careers. Good thing too, imagine if he had to score more than 17 points to win a game. Number of times scoring 20+ points this year:
Brock Purdy 1
Tom Brady 1
Wonder how much Mark Ingram got paid to run out of bounds short of the sticks so that we had to go through another jerkoff session about a guy who led his offense to 3 points during the first 55 minutes against a 3-8 team so he could finally get to .500 in a shit division. Can’t wait until that Niners-Bucs game.
Jesus, man. You've got to let that shit go.
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Baker Mayfield = MVP!
My Broncos suck hard, but I can take solace in the Raiders losing to a guy who just signed with the team 2 days ago! :lol
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Raiders kind of beat themselves on that, but what else is new.
Don't know why nobody ever considered that playing on such short notice might have benefited Mayfield. It was taking him out of a complex NFL offense and letting him play more of his own game. I briefly considered picking LA for that reason, and didn't really consider QB play to be a factor against the Rams. I just figured that the Raiders should be able to put up more than 16 points out of LA's abysmal D. Stupid of me, I suppose.
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Raiders kind of beat themselves on that, but what else is new.
Don't know why nobody ever considered that playing on such short notice might have benefited Mayfield. It was taking him out of a complex NFL offense and letting him play more of his own game. I briefly considered picking LA for that reason, and didn't really consider QB play to be a factor against the Rams. I just figured that the Raiders should be able to put up more than 16 points out of LA's abysmal D. Stupid of me, I suppose.
Herbstreit alluded to that near the end. He had the dumbed down version of the playbook, but then they went into the hurry-up and Kirk noted that this allowed Baker to not think but just PLAY. I mean, he looked really good most of the game, but that last 10 minutes or so, he looked like the GOAT. ;)
But even with that, the Raiders absolutely beat themselves. That stupid ball-slap penalty was a killer, in particular. I honestly feel bad for Derek Carr. He's a really good QB, and in the right - read: stable, which the Raiders are not - environment, he could excel. If I was a San Francisco fan, I'd be drooling at two seasons of Derek Carr in SF. They'd win the Super Bowl with the weapons they'd have around him.
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That was more of a Raiders collapse than anything else. What initially looked like a microcosm of the Rams season, ended being a microcosm of the Raiders season. 7 losses by one possession. Josh McDoofus HC of the year! :lol
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That was more of a Raiders collapse than anything else. What initially looked like a microcosm of the Rams season, ended being a microcosm of the Raiders season. 7 losses by one possession. Josh McDoofus HC of the year! :lol
Yeah, but those two throws by Mayfield on the last drive (and they weren't the only ones) weren't luck.
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He doesn't get those throws if the Raiders don't give up 30+ yds in penalties and play solid defense. Mayfield just took what the defense gave him.
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Tom Brady: "I just helped lead a double-digit 4th quarter comeback, LET'S GOOOOO"
Baker Mayfield: "Hold my beer Tom, I'll do it after knowing the playbook for 2 days. LET'S GOOOOOOOOOOOOO"
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Tom Brady: "I just helped lead a double-digit 4th quarter comeback, LET'S GOOOOO"
Baker Mayfield: "Hold my beer Tom, I'll do it after knowing the playbook for 2 days. LET'S GOOOOOOOOOOOOO"
Clearly Mayfield is the GOAT. I said that above. Who cares if he's been on three teams in three years and hasn't won squat?
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Tom Brady: "I just helped lead a double-digit 4th quarter comeback, LET'S GOOOOO"
Baker Mayfield: "Hold my beer Tom, I'll do it after knowing the playbook for 2 days. LET'S GOOOOOOOOOOOOO"
Tom Brady: 44 Fourth Quarter Comebacks, 56 Game-Winning Drives
Baker Mayfield: 7 Fourth Quarter Comebacks, 8 Game-Winning Drives
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Tom Brady: "I just helped lead a double-digit 4th quarter comeback, LET'S GOOOOO"
Baker Mayfield: "Hold my beer Tom, I'll do it after knowing the playbook for 2 days. LET'S GOOOOOOOOOOOOO"
Tom Brady: 44 Fourth Quarter Comebacks, 56 Game-Winning Drives
Baker Mayfield: 7 Fourth Quarter Comebacks, 8 Game-Winning Drives
Boy, Brady sure does get down early a lot. ;D
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Tom Brady: "I just helped lead a double-digit 4th quarter comeback, LET'S GOOOOO"
Baker Mayfield: "Hold my beer Tom, I'll do it after knowing the playbook for 2 days. LET'S GOOOOOOOOOOOOO"
Tom Brady: 44 Fourth Quarter Comebacks, 56 Game-Winning Drives
Baker Mayfield: 7 Fourth Quarter Comebacks, 8 Game-Winning Drives
Boy, Brady sure does get down early a lot. ;D
Like against Atlanta. :lol
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Baker is the only QB in the Super Bowl era to lead TWO DIFFERENT TEAMS to a 13+ point comeback in his first game with them (Browns, Rams). He's the GOAT.
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As a Rams fan and after the crap year we've had I was shocked at the results and performance by Baker. Well done! Let's see how he does in the last 4 weeks. I knew coming into this season that Wolford wasn't the answer at QB2, and Perkins was a bit of a question mark. After seeing him play I would say he's not the solution either. One of the only positives with this injury riddled season is we're getting a real good look at a lot of our depth players. Gotta look for the positives right? :lol
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Tom Brady: "I just helped lead a double-digit 4th quarter comeback, LET'S GOOOOO"
Baker Mayfield: "Hold my beer Tom, I'll do it after knowing the playbook for 2 days. LET'S GOOOOOOOOOOOOO"
Clearly Mayfield Brock Purdy is the GOAT.
ftfy :biggrin:
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Lions look good!
49'ers look good.
Texans = joke.
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Deebo Samuel hurt, and I will be shocked if he plays again this season. The way he grabbed his knee and how inconsolable he was when being carted off looked like a guy who knew he tore something. Huge loss for the 49ers. Sucks to see, as he is one of the most exciting players to watch in the entire league.
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Deebo Samuel hurt, and I will be shocked if he plays again this season. The way he grabbed his knee and how inconsolable he was when being carted off looked like a guy who knew he tore something. Huge loss for the 49ers. Sucks to see, as he is one of the most exciting players to watch in the entire league.
Yeah, not good.
But Brock Purdy is looking fantastic! Tom Brady is looking terrible. Then again the 49ers have the best defense in the league, so...
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The entire Bucs team looks terrible today, and that includes Brady. This is a drubbing.
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The Bucs' O-line is awful. Brutal.
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Looks like Brady is just going to make a bunch of short passes. I say the niners let him do that. All they need to do at this point is let the clock run out and not give up any big plays.
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Looks like Brady is just going to make a bunch of short passes. I say the niners let him do that. All they need to do at this point is let the clock run out and not give up any big plays.
Or just intercept him again :rollin
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See, this is why I push back on the "what is BB's record without Tom Brady" silliness. Good coaching is like good QB play: sometimes, you can just smell it, even if the numbers don't totally tell the tale. Kyle Shanahan will be 2 games above .500 as an NFL head coach assuming they do not blow this game, yet I think most acknowledge that he is one of the top coaches in football. Imagine what his record would be over six years if he had consistently above average QB play (any post saying Jimmy G was that is nonsense; W/L record is the only thing in his favor, and that can be skewed).
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See, this is why I push back on the "what is BB's record without Tom Brady" silliness. Good coaching is like good QB play: sometimes, you can just smell it, even if the numbers don't totally tell the tale. Kyle Shanahan will be 2 games above .500 as an NFL head coach assuming they do not blow this game, yet I think most acknowledge that he is one of the top coaches in football. Imagine what his record would be over six years if he had consistently above average QB play (any post saying Jimmy G was that is nonsense; W/L record is the only thing in his favor, and that can be skewed).
Oh, I think Jimmy G is average at best.
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If Jimmy G could stay healthy they might have a run. That's why they drafted. He can't stay on the field.
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any post saying Jimmy G was that is nonsense
Well, you're allowed to have terrible opinions. The stats, win record, and playoff success speak for themselves. And along those lines, there's a reason he was top 3 in most, and top 5 in several other, stats this season before going out.
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He has been terrible in the playoffs, which the stats show, if we want to talk those. He has a good W/L record in spite of himself.
But, you do you.
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And...the 49ers bring in their 4th string QB. Would have been nice if the starters could come out earlier, especially since they play again on Thursday. But better late than never.
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And...the 49ers bring in their 4th string QB. Would have been nice if the starters could come out earlier, especially since they play again on Thursday. But better late than never.
Yep, gotta protect the new GOAT! :metal
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Now it's just getting sad for Tampa Bay. Almost feel sorry for them :sadpanda:
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Hard to celebrate a game in which Deebo goes down.
But holy fucking hell was that an absolute treasure of a game on all sides of the ball. Go Niners.
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Hard to celebrate a game in which Deebo goes down.
But holy fucking hell was that an absolute treasure of a game on all sides of the ball. Go Niners.
Figures. I hate seeing injuries in blowouts. Debo should have been out of the game. :sadpanda:
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Handicapping the NFC is interesting.
The Eagles look like the class of the conference, but this roster has never done it in the playoffs, so it is "I'll believe it when I see it" situation.
The Vikings will be a tough out, but their defense is not very good, so it is hard to see them winning three playoff games to get to the Super Bowl.
The Cowboys are legit, but you just know that in big spots in the playoffs, they will commit a ton of penalties and find a way to beat themselves.
The Bucs, despite the shellacking today, are obviously the only team from the South that could maybe win a game or two, largely because of their defense and Brady's ability to still channel his younger self in certain spots ala 2015 Peyton Manning.
The 49ers have an awesome defense, great coaching and stars all over the place at the skill positions on offense, but QB is the wild card. Purdy is great story so far, but teams will get a book on him sooner rather than later, and we'll see how he does then.
It is hard to imagine the Giants, Commandeers or Seahawks making any real noise in the playoffs. The Giants and Seahawks were great stories early, but both are fading. Washington's upside seems limited.
Not that I think they are going to win out and make it, but the Lions could be a tough out if they did make it in. Dan Campbell has that team competing big time.
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I think it's the Eagles and Cowboys. Vikings a distant third. Everyone else is a pretender.
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Ya. When the Seattle D had a mid-season surge, I thought they had solved their early season issues. If that D would have come together, we could have been dangerous. But the defense I saw today killed all hope. No team with a defense that bad deserves to make the playoffs. That was just flat out embarrassing. The 30 points Carolina scored doesn’t do justice to how bad the Seahawks D looked giving it to them.
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Vikings are frauds, they’ve been outscored on the season and the close game luck will regress to the mean.
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Brady looked a few times like he wished he had stayed retired.
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The Cowboys are the Toronto Maple Leafs of the NFL.
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Tom Brady: "I just helped lead a double-digit 4th quarter comeback, LET'S GOOOOO"
Baker Mayfield: "Hold my beer Tom, I'll do it after knowing the playbook for 2 days. LET'S GOOOOOOOOOOOOO"
Clearly Mayfield Brock Purdy is the GOAT.
ftfy :biggrin:
I came in here to write just that. We can't let Purdy play even a full season, let's just crown him now! Canton here we come!!! ;) :) :) :) :)
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Tom Brady: "I just helped lead a double-digit 4th quarter comeback, LET'S GOOOOO"
Baker Mayfield: "Hold my beer Tom, I'll do it after knowing the playbook for 2 days. LET'S GOOOOOOOOOOOOO"
Clearly Mayfield Brock Purdy is the GOAT.
ftfy :biggrin:
I came in here to write just that. We can't let Purdy play even a full season, let's just crown him now! Canton here we come!!! ;) :) :) :) :)
No need. It's obvious. Schedule the induction ceremony for the week between the NFCCG and the Superb Owl.
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How about those Panthers?
I'm only half joking.
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How about those Panthers?
I'm only half joking.
You kiddin' me? I LOVE the Panthers! They gave us Christian McCaffrey a few weeks ago, and they gave us the NFC West this week (well, we still have to clinch it on Thursday, but you know). Love that team!
And what's crazy is, they're still VERY alive to win the NFC South.
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How about those Panthers?
I'm only half joking.
You kiddin' me? I LOVE the Panthers! They gave us Christian McCaffrey a few weeks ago, and they gave us the NFC West this week (well, we still have to clinch it on Thursday, but you know). Love that team!
And what's crazy is, they're still VERY alive to win the NFC South.
I think technically everyone is still alive in the NFC South :lol
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Brady signing the ball Greenlaw picked off him is the most awesome thing ever...
(https://scontent-sjc3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/319639174_576395804492720_2022229820371262492_n.jpg?_nc_cat=1&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=23meAUGuLqsAX-8MCY2&_nc_ht=scontent-sjc3-1.xx&oh=00_AfAA2mdF8GO9P-DVeclKlTmlX6BQVIkPscF_kKDI_oJF_A&oe=639BCB10)
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Kraft's people have made a lot of noise behind the scenes this week. Now that the Cards have lost Kyler, the Pats have no excuse.
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The media made the noise. I don't believe big boy.
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The media made the noise. I don't believe big boy.
You're a sucker. It didn't just come from Bedard. Peter King had it, as did Phil Perry, or was it Curran.
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So this game is the hill to stand on? Not the whole fucking season? Lololol.
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The media made the noise. I don't believe big boy.
You're a sucker. It didn't just come from Bedard. Peter King had it, as did Phil Perry, or was it Curran.
Also known as: The Media!
And is your point that now with Murray out the NE offense will play better? :dunno:
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The media made the noise. I don't believe big boy.
You're a sucker. It didn't just come from Bedard. Peter King had it, as did Phil Perry, or was it Curran.
Also known as: The Media!
And is your point that now with Murray out the NE offense will play better? :dunno:
No, but this was a must win before Kyler went out. Not it's a must must win.
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Lots of players going down in this game.
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Bill Simmons on the Manningcast now.
The brothers are too funny. In the first Q, they showed a play where Eli had a pass batted back, he caught it and tried to run with it and got stripped, and Peyton quipped, "Eli was so slow that they called that a football move." :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
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I love the Manningcast.
(https://i.postimg.cc/HxdFcbcr/20221212-210924.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/2q90gbxY)
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Holy shit! TWO offensive touchdowns??
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Holy shit! TWO offensive touchdowns??
They can best up bad teams. I need to see a win against a good team.
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When talking to Vinatieri about the Tuck Rule game, Peyton asks him about the 45-yarder in the blizzard, "What was going through your mind? And was it distracting knowing that Brady had just fumbled?" (and he said it in a way that was meant to be cheeky)
:rollin :rollin :rollin
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I love watching them.
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Brady signing the ball Greenlaw picked off him is the most awesome thing ever...
(https://scontent-sjc3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/319639174_576395804492720_2022229820371262492_n.jpg?_nc_cat=1&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=23meAUGuLqsAX-8MCY2&_nc_ht=scontent-sjc3-1.xx&oh=00_AfAA2mdF8GO9P-DVeclKlTmlX6BQVIkPscF_kKDI_oJF_A&oe=639BCB10)
I don't know if you mean that ironically or not, but I think it IS awesome. Tom knows his place in the game and despite what many say about his attitude and him being a dick (and by the way, not all of it is wrong; I think El Barto is largely right, for example), he's still got an awareness that that means something to that guy. Quality, classy, IMO.
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Kraft's people have made a lot of noise behind the scenes this week. Now that the Cards have lost Kyler, the Pats have no excuse.
What noise? What excuse, to not lose?
Interesting listening to Troy Aikman - who I like more and more every week - who said he doesn't know even ONE defensive coordinator that would make a good offensive coordinator.
I think Bill is holding out for Bill O'Brien, and I also think that Bill is not worrying about coddling Mac Jones in order to avoid another Brady scenario where a player gets SO tied to the assistants around him that he cannot adapt. Whether Bill is right or not, we'll see as it plays out, but I do think Bill knows (as in "is aware") of what he's doing and has a reason for it, whether we agree or not.
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I love the Manningcast.
(https://i.postimg.cc/HxdFcbcr/20221212-210924.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/2q90gbxY)
Peyton said that he went back and counted all the forehead jokes over the past year and that's how many pictures of Eli without a shirt we're going to get.
I thought the Manning-cast was excellent last night. Viniateri was great too.
Both of them, but mostly Eli, has taken to saying "right after this play, where McCoy throws a slant down the seam, I have another picture and a question for you..." and boom, McCoy throws a slant down the seam. These guys both know football at such a high level; it's amazing to me that the players on the field don't have that same level of comprehension. I know it's real time, and I know they have angles and what-not, but they predict the plays so frequently, it's amazing to me.
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Only reason I watched last night was because I had some coinage on the Patriots -2.5, which worked out nicely. Thanks again to the Hoodie and his squad. :tup :tup
(you are telling me I get BB minus only 2.5 against a doofus coach and a young QB whose play is regressing? Sign me up! I actually felt less confident when Murray got hurt and McCoy had to play QB)
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Only reason I watched last night was because I had some coinage on the Patriots -2.5, which worked out nicely. Thanks again to the Hoodie and his squad. :tup :tup
(you are telling me I get BB minus only 2.5 against a doofus coach and a young QB whose play is regressing? Sign me up! I actually felt less confident when Murray got hurt and McCoy had to play QB)
I didn't have money on the game, but I felt the same way.
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Brady signing the ball Greenlaw picked off him is the most awesome thing ever...
(https://scontent-sjc3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/319639174_576395804492720_2022229820371262492_n.jpg?_nc_cat=1&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=23meAUGuLqsAX-8MCY2&_nc_ht=scontent-sjc3-1.xx&oh=00_AfAA2mdF8GO9P-DVeclKlTmlX6BQVIkPscF_kKDI_oJF_A&oe=639BCB10)
I don't know if you mean that ironically or not, but I think it IS awesome. Tom knows his place in the game and despite what many say about his attitude and him being a dick (and by the way, not all of it is wrong; I think El Barto is largely right, for example), he's still got an awareness that that means something to that guy. Quality, classy, IMO.
I mean it in the best of ways... Greenlaw was actually hesitant about asking, but when he approached Brady he was more than glad to do it.
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Dallas signs T.Y. Hilton WR. Good move. OBJ definitely wasn't the guy.
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Only reason I watched last night was because I had some coinage on the Patriots -2.5, which worked out nicely. Thanks again to the Hoodie and his squad. :tup :tup
(you are telling me I get BB minus only 2.5 against a doofus coach and a young QB whose play is regressing? Sign me up! I actually felt less confident when Murray got hurt and McCoy had to play QB)
I didn't have money on the game, but I felt the same way.
Absolutely. That's why I kind of scoffed when TAC suggested they had no excuse. They may well have played better had Murray not gotten hurt, but McCoy represented a different game than they'd planned for, and the team was going to play for him. It could just has easily have been better for AZ for both of those reasons.
Also, holy shit, Josh Ushe! Dude went slap wild last night. Patriots now have two of the top ten sack leaders.
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I think the BB vs TB discussions are missing a couple key points. Currently BB has a better record in a MUCH tougher division. Last year BB went 10-7 with a rookie QB. Brady got out of the AFC East just as Josh Allen was ascending and before Dolphins/Jets were vastly improving due to McDaniel/Tua/Saleh. The division Tom went to was imploding due to the retirement/decline of Brees/Ryan/Newton. It's really not apples to apples. Of course the Bucs won a Super Bowl but that team was stacked on both sides of the ball.
I was wondering why Tom was still in game late in the 4th quarter down 35-7? There's no logic to it. Blaine Gabbert needs reps once in awhile if he's ever needed due to injury or something. I mean, the Niners sat Brock Purdy because the game was out of hand. I just don't think it's a team first decision at all.
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I was wondering why Tom was still in game late in the 4th quarter down 35-7? There's no logic to it. Blaine Gabbert needs reps once in awhile if he's ever needed due to injury or something. I mean, the Niners sat Brock Purdy because the game was out of hand. I just don't think it's a team first decision at all.
I was wondering the same thing, but I think it might come down to Bowles picking and choosing his battles. Kind of looks like Brady is already trying to be co-head coach. Pulling him would have sent him over the rails, and that might have been a hill Bowles didn't want to fight on.
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I was wondering why Tom was still in game late in the 4th quarter down 35-7? There's no logic to it. Blaine Gabbert needs reps once in awhile if he's ever needed due to injury or something. I mean, the Niners sat Brock Purdy because the game was out of hand. I just don't think it's a team first decision at all.
I was wondering the same thing, but I think it might come down to Bowles picking and choosing his battles. Kind of looks like Brady is already trying to be co-head coach. Pulling him would have sent him over the rails, and that might have been a hill Bowles didn't want to fight on.
Which says everything you need to know about Todd Bowles, in my view, and none of it is good (I'm not a fan).
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He's always fought not to come out. No surprise for me there. People always want to pit Brady and BB against each other. You don't win 6 without both.
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He's always fought not to come out. No surprise for me there. People always want to pit Brady and BB against each other. You don't win 6 without both.
I was thinking the same thing; I remember having the argument about how Bill was dumb for keeping Tom in late in games. The dude wants to play. Imagine that that's a dumb thing. ;)
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He's always fought not to come out. No surprise for me there. People always want to pit Brady and BB against each other. You don't win 6 without both.
I was thinking the same thing; I remember having the argument about how Bill was dumb for keeping Tom in late in games. The dude wants to play. Imagine that that's a dumb thing. ;)
The problem with the "Dude" these days is that he's not playing well. Keeping him in the game these days, has more risk so yeah, it's probably dumb to keep him in a game that's not going well.
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I was wondering why Tom was still in game late in the 4th quarter down 35-7? There's no logic to it. Blaine Gabbert needs reps once in awhile if he's ever needed due to injury or something. I mean, the Niners sat Brock Purdy because the game was out of hand. I just don't think it's a team first decision at all.
I was wondering the same thing, but I think it might come down to Bowles picking and choosing his battles. Kind of looks like Brady is already trying to be co-head coach. Pulling him would have sent him over the rails, and that might have been a hill Bowles didn't want to fight on.
Someone might have to end TB's career for him. He obviously doesn't have enough sense to get off the field.
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Why are so many wanting him to sit down? If he wants to play, he plays.
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Why are so many wanting him to sit down? If he wants to play, he plays.
And while he's not playing to 2007 standards, he's still one of the better QBs in the league.
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I don't get why TB has to retire.
He's doesn't have "it" anymore, but he's still a top-half QB in this league.
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I was wondering why Tom was still in game late in the 4th quarter down 35-7? There's no logic to it. Blaine Gabbert needs reps once in awhile if he's ever needed due to injury or something. I mean, the Niners sat Brock Purdy because the game was out of hand. I just don't think it's a team first decision at all.
I was wondering the same thing, but I think it might come down to Bowles picking and choosing his battles. Kind of looks like Brady is already trying to be co-head coach. Pulling him would have sent him over the rails, and that might have been a hill Bowles didn't want to fight on.
Someone might have to end TB's career for him. He obviously doesn't have enough sense to get off the field.
As much as I don't like the guy as a person, that's really the last thing I want to see. Great players' careers ending as they're being carted off is a sad thing for anybody, much less the GOAT. It was bad enough just with Janikowski. I don't want to see it with Brady.
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I was wondering why Tom was still in game late in the 4th quarter down 35-7? There's no logic to it. Blaine Gabbert needs reps once in awhile if he's ever needed due to injury or something. I mean, the Niners sat Brock Purdy because the game was out of hand. I just don't think it's a team first decision at all.
I was wondering the same thing, but I think it might come down to Bowles picking and choosing his battles. Kind of looks like Brady is already trying to be co-head coach. Pulling him would have sent him over the rails, and that might have been a hill Bowles didn't want to fight on.
Someone might have to end TB's career for him. He obviously doesn't have enough sense to get off the field.
As much as I don't like the guy as a person, that's really the last thing I want to see. Great players' careers ending as they're being carted off is a sad thing for anybody, much less the GOAT. It was bad enough just with Janikowski. I don't want to see it with Brady.
Maybe he meant the someone as in the coach? Reminds me of when Ben McAdoo benched Eli manning ending his streak of consecutive starts. Basically a coach ending his career.
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Why are so many wanting him to sit down? If he wants to play, he plays.
He is the Ric Flair of the NFL. He will likely play till he has to be dragged off the field. :lol :lol
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:lol
WOOOOOOT!!
LOL
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I was wondering why Tom was still in game late in the 4th quarter down 35-7? There's no logic to it. Blaine Gabbert needs reps once in awhile if he's ever needed due to injury or something. I mean, the Niners sat Brock Purdy because the game was out of hand. I just don't think it's a team first decision at all.
I was wondering the same thing, but I think it might come down to Bowles picking and choosing his battles. Kind of looks like Brady is already trying to be co-head coach. Pulling him would have sent him over the rails, and that might have been a hill Bowles didn't want to fight on.
Someone might have to end TB's career for him. He obviously doesn't have enough sense to get off the field.
As much as I don't like the guy as a person, that's really the last thing I want to see. Great players' careers ending as they're being carted off is a sad thing for anybody, much less the GOAT. It was bad enough just with Janikowski. I don't want to see it with Brady.
He's the only one putting himself at risk. If it happens, it's all on him. I'm sure all the golden boy fans would rather see him retire than be carted off the field.
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In his 21 years, he's been only carted off once. I was there. Cheap ass play by Bernard Pollard tackling him at the knee in the 1st game of 2008.
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Couple of random thoughts for the little I saw Monday night.....
So often, the NFL is a game of inches. One play after McCoy gets hit which causes an INT, the Pats turn the ball over and it's returned for a TD by the Cards, tying the game. Except...upon review, the TO is overturned (correctly) because the ball just barely touched the ground. Five plays later, the Pats score to take a two TD lead.
Matt Judon: a shame the Ravens couldn't afford to resign him (we met him at a trivia night of all things at a nice bar in Towson years ago). He's been lights out for NE.
Speaking of the Ravens: their 3rd string QB takes the field for the first time ever late Sunday in Pittsburgh at their own 1 yard line. Brown proceeds to lead them down for a FG. TE Mark Andrews is their current backup (for now). I've been trying to work the kinks out of my arm, in case they need me down the road.......
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Aaaaaaaaaand we got the division.
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Man, after those games against the Bears, Broncos, and Chiefs, I thought there was no way I could get super hyped for this season.
And then Jimmy G and Deebo get injured.
And yet I'm am the most hyped I've been all season.
Let's
Fucking
Gooooooooooooooooooooooo
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I want to offer my sincere congratulations to the Niners and all their fans here on the forum.
I sincerely hope you choke in the first round. :lol
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I want to offer my sincere congratulations to the Niners and all their fans here on the forum.
I sincerely hope you choke in the first round. :lol
Technically there's still no guarantee we have to play in the first round. ;)
But honestly I can't see the Birds losing two games in their final slate.
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Yeah, top 3 seeds are very much in play. If it comes down to a tie at the end of the season, SF has the tiebreaker over Philly, Dallas, and MN. I think #2 is the most likely, but #1 is still not a huge longshot.
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Yeah, top 3 seeds are very much in play. If it comes down to a tie at the end of the season, SF has the tiebreaker over Philly, Dallas, and MN. I think #2 is the most likely, but #1 is still not a huge longshot.
I feel great about #2, but I do feel like #1 is a huge longshot. Again, mainly because of the Eagles.
They just made the Giants their bitch and I can't see them losing the second match. Saints and Bears should be easy wins. Cowboys are always wild games for the Eagles and so that's the one solid potential loss. But even if they lose to the Cowboys and one other, that still leaves no margin of error for the Niners. Assuming the Niners drop 1 game I can't imagine the Eagles lose 3 under any circumstance.
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It could be that the Vikings and the Niners both win out. Both have very easy schedules. But I just can’t help but think that the new quarterback is going to make some sort of rookie mistake that costs his team one game. He will learn from it, But I just don’t think the defense is going to be able to protect him forever from all the things a rookie must go through.
But we’ll see
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Vikings probably lose 2 more games. That gives the 49ers a bit of a cushion. But if they beat Washington at home next week, which I think they will, they have a GREAT shot at winning out. I don't disagree that a rookie QB can likely blow a game. That's a VERY real possibility. But to go into Seattle and win on the road in that environment in his second start, especially on a short week after a Sunday afternoon game, makes me VERY optimistic.
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Philly has to keep winning the secure the division alone. They are two games ahead of Dallas, but let's say for the sake of argument that the Cowboys win that game between the two in Dallas next week. If Dallas wins out, Philly then cannot lose another game since Dallas would have the tiebreaker to win the division (head to head would be even, and Dallas would then win it due to better division records thanks to Philly's loss to Washington). Of course, Dallas nearly lost at home to Houston last week, so they could pretty much lose any game left on their schedule, and with three of their last four being on the road, I expect them to falter in one of them.
To circle back to the AFC, the Tua fans this week are predictably all defensive about their guy having played like ass the last two weeks, but let's be honest, he was never and is not the MVP of that offense; Tyreek Hill is. I have lost track of how many deep balls I have see Tyreek catch this year where Tua underthrew him and Hill had to slow down and wait for the ball. I think the last few weeks have shown that Tua is still the QB most thought he was before this season (ya know, the guy the last coaching staff in Miami wanted to move off), but a great new coach and crazy talent at the skill positions have enabled him to have a mostly really good season. With nasty weather in Buffalo this weekend, let's see how that Miami team does in a nice cold weather December game on the road.
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Philly has to keep winning the secure the division alone. They are two games ahead of Dallas, but let's say for the sake of argument that the Cowboys win that game between the two in Dallas next week. If Dallas wins out, Philly then cannot lose another game since Dallas would have the tiebreaker to win the division (head to head would be even, and Dallas would then win it due to better division records thanks to Philly's loss to Washington). Of course, Dallas nearly lost at home to Houston last week, so they could pretty much lose any game left on their schedule, and with three of their last four being on the road, I expect them to falter in one of them.
To circle back to the AFC, the Tua fans this week are predictably all defensive about their guy having played like ass the last two weeks, but let's be honest, he was never and is not the MVP of that offense; Tyreek Hill is. I have lost track of how many deep balls I have see Tyreek catch this year where Tua underthrew him and Hill had to slow down and wait for the ball. I think the last few weeks have shown that Tua is still the QB most thought he was before this season (ya know, the guy the last coaching staff in Miami wanted to move off), but a great new coach and crazy talent at the skill positions have enabled him to have a mostly really good season. With nasty weather in Buffalo this weekend, let's see how that Miami team does in a nice cold weather December game on the road.
So, a quarterback hyped because he's got all world receivers and great coaching? That NEVER happens. Please.
;). :) :) :) :)
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I don't see Mr. Irrelevant blowing a game for SF. Kid really does seem to be fairly unflappable, and I haven't seem him making stupid mistakes. Where SF might lose a game is when the rest of the team plays a bit flat and he's not enough to beat a team on his own. He's getting a ton of help right now. If a team manages to overpower that D, and any given Sunday and all that, he might struggle in a shootout. Or if Kittle can't concentrate because of a nasty case of crotch-rot and his biggest weapon becomes a liability, we'll see how good he really is, and it might not be enough for a decent NFL team.
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I don't see Mr. Irrelevant blowing a game for SF. Kid really does seem to be fairly unflappable, and I haven't seem him making stupid mistakes. Where SF might lose a game is when the rest of the team plays a bit flat and he's not enough to beat a team on his own. He's getting a ton of help right now. If a team manages to overpower that D, and any given Sunday and all that, he might struggle in a shootout. Or if Kittle can't concentrate because of a nasty case of crotch-rot and his biggest weapon becomes a liability, we'll see how good he really is, and it might not be enough for a decent NFL team.
This.
Though I see the team letting him down to be unlikely; he and Kittle were on the TNF after show and it's pretty clear the team loves this guy and is doing everything they can to make him successful.
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Football is a team sport. There are no successful individuals. You're either successful as a team or you're not.
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Philly has to keep winning the secure the division alone. They are two games ahead of Dallas, but let's say for the sake of argument that the Cowboys win that game between the two in Dallas next week. If Dallas wins out, Philly then cannot lose another game since Dallas would have the tiebreaker to win the division (head to head would be even, and Dallas would then win it due to better division records thanks to Philly's loss to Washington). Of course, Dallas nearly lost at home to Houston last week, so they could pretty much lose any game left on their schedule, and with three of their last four being on the road, I expect them to falter in one of them.
To circle back to the AFC, the Tua fans this week are predictably all defensive about their guy having played like ass the last two weeks, but let's be honest, he was never and is not the MVP of that offense; Tyreek Hill is. I have lost track of how many deep balls I have see Tyreek catch this year where Tua underthrew him and Hill had to slow down and wait for the ball. I think the last few weeks have shown that Tua is still the QB most thought he was before this season (ya know, the guy the last coaching staff in Miami wanted to move off), but a great new coach and crazy talent at the skill positions have enabled him to have a mostly really good season. With nasty weather in Buffalo this weekend, let's see how that Miami team does in a nice cold weather December game on the road.
So, a quarterback hyped because he's got all world receivers and great coaching? That NEVER happens. Please.
;). :) :) :) :)
Yes, but I am pretty sure you are astute enough to understand the difference between Tua, who has a 2-month sample size of being above average, and, to pull a name out of a hat :P, Patrick Mahomes, who has a near 5-year sample size of being very good to great (great for 85% of it). :D
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Football is a team sport. There are no successful individuals. You're either successful as a team or you're not.
While an individual can definitely lift a team, this is very true, and at the moment as a team, the Niners are firing on all cylinders.
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Football is a team sport. There are no successful individuals. You're either successful as a team or you're not.
While an individual can definitely lift a team, this is very true, and at the moment as a team, the Niners are firing on all cylinders.
You don't say....
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Hey Bronco fans, are you ready for the official start of the Brett Rypien era this Sunday?
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Hey Bronco fans, are you ready for the official start of the Brett Rypien era this Sunday?
:rollin :rollin :rollin
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Where the Niners are concerned (and I don't want to take away anything from Purdy) but the Niners are relying on McCaffery and their D. The Niners are in deep doo-doo if they lose McCaffery.
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Where the Niners are concerned (and I don't want to take away anything from Purdy) but the Niners are relying on McCaffery and their D. The Niners are in deep doo-doo if they lose McCaffery.
Definitely key....that's why they need Deebo back ASAP, he can keep the opposing D off of McCaffery and open up the offense a bit more. Honestly though, as long as the D keeps stuffing opponents, we are in every single game we play. 7 games in a row with allowing under 17 points, and 7 wins.
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Where the Niners are concerned (and I don't want to take away anything from Purdy) but the Niners are relying on McCaffery and their D. The Niners are in deep doo-doo if they lose McCaffery.
Not really. I mean, McCaffrey has been huge. But they've been "relying" on different players every week. Every game, somebody new has a huge game. I think they likely need him to have any legitimate SB hopes. But even he went down next week (perish the thought!), I still think they are in good shape to make a decent playoff run. [And Deebo is currently projected to be back in 2-3 weeks, for those who may not know]
Speaking of which, assuming the Colts don't blow a 33 point halftime lead, the 49ers will hold the #2 seed in about 90 minutes.
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:rollin Well, maybe I spoke too soon. The effort out of the Colts is off the charts. I don't know that I've ever seen a team work so hard to give up a 5 score lead.
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Getting screwed out of that fumble return TD was a killer. You don't want the 2pc to be the final play of the game. They could have had the try and 3 minutes left if they didn't succeed.
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Matt Ryan deserves better than for this to be his legacy.
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Matt Ryan deserves better than for this to be his legacy.
I mean, I guess so??
I mean, the play of both QBs kind of was below average and the game reflected that.
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Wow, Indy. Just wow. :lol
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I didn't bother with the game after seeing it was 20-0...simiar to the game against Buffalo. I started watching Silicon Valley.
Then I see on twitter the greatest comeback in the history of the NFL and I just rolled my eyes.
I think this game or the game against Buffalo was a bit of a mirage..but when you get trounced 40-3 at home just a couple of weeks ago, and fail to comeback against Detroit last week.
I don't think the Vikings defense is good enough to beat good teams that have good offenses.
I'd love to be wrong and see this run of comeback after comeback will eventually not happen against good teams that have good defenses especially.
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I literally just found out they won, last score I saw was 30-0 and blew it off. Fucking A.
On a side note, my kid and her bf are at the Buffalo game today, pray for their collective warmth please. :lol
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Depends on who they are rooting for.
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Depends on who they are rooting for.
They're pretty hardcore Buffalo fans. She group up just south of Buffalo, which I guess countered my Niner influence, and that of her grandfather who not only grew up Niner, but played for Dallas in the late 60s. She probably knows more about football from him than most guys I'd bet.
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Also...
(https://scontent-sjc3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/320656348_681990613489442_3832183051341929548_n.jpg?stp=dst-jpg_s960x960&_nc_cat=102&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=QbC-s1_ln5MAX_1mmpk&_nc_ht=scontent-sjc3-1.xx&oh=00_AfDGmwUieMjhrgNhe7CvgOqHidsZrtslAbcNFmxJwgXAWQ&oe=63A41CB8)
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:lol
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Ha!
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I dozed off at 23-0 on the couch and woke up to 36-34. Crazy.
The Vikings have one and done written all over them come playoff time; their defense is absolute trash.
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Depends on who they are rooting for.
They're pretty hardcore Buffalo fans.
Well, since it's you, I'll only wish a mild case of frostbite on them.
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I literally just found out they won, last score I saw was 30-0 and blew it off. Fucking A.
On a side note, my kid and her bf are at the Buffalo game today, pray for their collective warmth please. :lol
That stadium is so much fun. I love going there.
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I literally just found out they won, last score I saw was 30-0 and blew it off. Fucking A.
On a side note, my kid and her bf are at the Buffalo game today, pray for their collective warmth please. :lol
That stadium is so much fun. I love going there.
She swears they're not the ones throwing snowballs. :lol
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I dozed off at 23-0 on the couch and woke up to 36-34. Crazy.
The Vikings have one and done written all over them come playoff time; their defense is absolute trash.
Agreed. And yet...the Colts couldn't manage to drive down and get a field goal for almost the entirety of the second half and overtime.
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This is a bad look for Bills fans. Throwing snowballs at players and the Miami sideline is neanderthal behavior.
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They are usually better except for dildos.
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I knew there was a reason I was getting bad vibrations from those fans.
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I knew there was a reason I was getting bad vibrations from those fans.
Wow! Just. Wow!
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Tim is such a buzzzzzkill.
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Hey Bronco fans, are you ready for the official start of the Brett Rypien era this Sunday?
I mean...can Brett Rypien lead the team to at least a .231 winning percentage? Can't get much worse.
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I knew Miami would blow it (specifically that receiver that dropped the TD pass). Great game still.
Matt Ryan just cemented the fact that he will never sniff the Hall of Fame after another record-setting choke job.
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They are usually better except for dildos.
So they usually only throw dildos?
I guess it's not any weirder than throwing an octopus.
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Twice, dildos were thrown at Brady. Lol
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Twice, dildos were thrown at Brady. Lol
I believe one was attached to you at the time, right?
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I don't know. I was on my knees at the time.
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Matt Ryan just cemented the fact that he will never sniff the Hall of Fame after another record-setting choke job.
He wasn't making the Hall anyway, but while the memes about it are funny, you have to be a serious hater to blame that loss on him.
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Matt Ryan just cemented the fact that he will never sniff the Hall of Fame after another record-setting choke job.
He wasn't making the Hall anyway, but while the memes about it are funny, you have to be a serious hater to blame that loss on him.
That's what I keep trying to say elsewhere... you got a defense that coughed up 36 points in the second half, without any interceptions from Ryan. (full disclosure, I didn't watch the game, like most people I lost interest at 30-0)
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I just watched the play-by-play highlight reel of the Colts/Vikings game, and I have a few thoughts.
1. The Colts offense scored 1 TD and 5 FGs. That’s telling. It would not take much in the way of a second half adjustment to figure out what their game plan was and keep them from moving the ball as much as they were. And they weren’t moving it that much.
2. Minnesota probably should’ve won the game earlier than they did. There’s no way that fumble recovery for a touchdown should’ve been ruled down.
3. Having said all that, I think Matt Ryan was robbed of that fourth and one spot. It really looked to me like he had it. But then again, the highlight reel that I saw didn’t show the close-up. But the surge definitely appeared to cross the first down marker.
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Go Texans and Jaguars! :corn
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I just watched the play-by-play highlight reel of the Colts/Vikings game, and I have a few thoughts.
1. The Colts offense scored 1 TD and 5 FGs. That’s telling. It would not take much in the way of a second half adjustment to figure out what their game plan was and keep them from moving the ball as much as they were. And they weren’t moving it that much.
2. Minnesota probably should’ve won the game earlier than they did. There’s no way that fumble recovery for a touchdown should’ve been ruled down.
3. Having said all that, I think Matt Ryan was robbed of that fourth and one spot. It really looked to me like he had it. But then again, the highlight reel that I saw didn’t show the close-up. But the surge definitely appeared to cross the first down marker.
This brings up something I have noticed recently. I know that when a QB slides feet first, because he is giving himself up, the ball is spotted wherever he began his slide, but I have noticed recently that when a QB scrambles and finishes the play by diving head first, they are still marking the spot at where he began the head first slide. I thought on a head first slide that you are given the spot at wherever you stop and/or are touched down. Maybe that changed and I just didn't hear about it.
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I hate the fact that they can even slide in the first place. Behind the line of scrimmage, I have no problem with them being able to drop without being hit, but to me, once they pass the line of scrimmage, they should be fair game.
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I hate the fact that they can even slide in the first place. Behind the line of scrimmage, I have no problem with them being able to drop without being hit, but to me, once they pass the line of scrimmage, they should be fair game.
I don’t mind an open field slide on a bootleg to prevent getting smeared. But when you dive into the line, you should be treated the same as an RB.
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:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
WTF?? WTF?? WTF?? WTF??
:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
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How does a Belichick team make a blunder like that at the end of a game? Wow.
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I'm too hacked off at the referees fucking NE on that final TD to care much about them stupidly giving the game away. Dude's foot was out of bounds, and it wasn't as close as they were making it out to be.
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Dude's foot was out of bounds, and it wasn't as close as they were making it out to be.
100%
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Somewhere in the dark bowels of Gillette Stadium, the hydraulic ball vice is being test fired.
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Just saw what happened... What the actual fuck? :lol
"Stanfurd band nowhere in sight" :rollin :rollin
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(https://i.postimg.cc/Bv5q7w8W/6zc9vmf86k3a1.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
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Something amazing about that Colts game - they were the only team to hold KC to less than 20 pts this year AND the only team to hold Philly to less than 20 - yet they blew a 33 point lead. NFL football be CRAAZZEEE. Cousins was ballin’ huh?
Typical KC football, defense is hot trash and 2 fumbles by the O. Fortunately PM played mistake-free.
Of course the Steelers win when I want the Panthers to win and take the NFC South. ::)
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I have nothing against Mac Jones, but he has to make a better attempt than he did. That was basically the game, as he was the only one between the Raider and the end zone.
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I'm blaming the coaching staff. Players have complained that D'Souza know what plays are coming because they are predictable.
The also benched their best reciever last year (Kendrick Bourne) because he called out the offensecplay calls in pre season.
They did not put a second year QB in the best situation and you see his outbursts because he knows how poor the play calling is.
Once your shell shocked like Mac is, it's hard to blame him when your offensive minds use a tight end to block an opposing teans best pass rusher 1on 1.
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I'm blaming the coaching staff. Players have complained that D'Souza know what plays are coming because they are predictable.
The also benched their best reciever last year (Kendrick Bourne) because he called out the offensecplay calls in pre season.
They did not put a second year QB in the best situation and you see his outbursts because he knows how poor the play calling is.
Once your shell shocked like Mac is, it's hard to blame him when your offensive minds use a tight end to block an opposing teans best pass rusher 1on 1.
(https://media.tenor.com/OdF4oSHFRsUAAAAM/shocked-amazed.gif)
:P :P
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Hey Bronco fans, are you ready for the official start of the Brett Rypien era this Sunday?
LET'S RIDE!
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I have finally seen a stupider decision than Russell Wilson passing on the goal line.
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I'm blaming the coaching staff. Players have complained that D'Souza know what plays are coming because they are predictable.
Predictable like this? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ykp4-xXMUwA
Duggar sold out 110% to the play he knew was coming. Not a doubt in his mind. He never once looked at the receiver and he watched for the ball until he caught it and scored. This is what well coached teams can do. They anticipate what's coming because they've been reviewing it in film. No different than Butler picking off Seattle in the Super Bowl. I've yet to see somebody know with such certainty what NE was going to do.
I actually agree with you that coaching is a real problem. I also don't doubt that opposing D's are picking up on NE's O more than they used to (or should). I don't think it's their problem, though.
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Offensive players we saying to reporters after games that the other teams were calling out what they were doing.
This offense is doing a disservice to the defense. The D is tired from being on the field all the time. 33 to 26. That's happening week in and week out.
Kraft needs to force BB to get a real offensive coordinator. We'll see if that happens.
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Duggar sold out 110% to the play he knew was coming. Not a doubt in his mind. He never once looked at the receiver and he watched for the ball until he caught it and scored. This is what well coached teams can do. They anticipate what's coming because they've been reviewing it in film. No different than Butler picking off Seattle in the Super Bowl. I've yet to see somebody know with such certainty what NE was going to do.
Dugger knew the play. That was clear.
As to the bolded, whether you've seen it or not, multiple players have said after multiple games that the opposing D were calling out the Pats' plays.
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I guess where I disagree with you guys is that Norv Turner could be running New England's offense, and so long as they're tipping passes to defenders, false starting, allowing D-linemen in the backfield to disrupt screens, throwing behind receivers, running the wrong routes, etc, they're still going to be scoring 13 pts/gm.
If you want to find ways to put this on Patricia, go with not getting plays in quick enough, or taking too long to make substitutions. I'll be right there with you.
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They were a more disciplined offensive last year. So why not this year with basically the same players? It's coaching. Players mentally check out not liking the system and become less focused. Spoiled kids for sure but that's what a coach has to do. Get them prepared and focused so yes, I blame him.
Last year the offensive red zone was 63.08% This year they are last at 37.84%. So who's fault is that?
I have your answer for you.
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I guess where I disagree with you guys is that Norv Turner could be running New England's offense, and so long as they're tipping passes to defenders, false starting, allowing D-linemen in the backfield to disrupt screens, throwing behind receivers, running the wrong routes, etc, they're still going to be scoring 13 pts/gm.
If you want to find ways to put this on Patricia, go with not getting plays in quick enough, or taking too long to make substitutions. I'll be right there with you.
Obviously Patricia will be reassigned in the organization. It's not really his fault either. Bill put him in a position to fail. There's no doubt in my mind things would have been different if Scar and Ivan Fears were still part of the Offensive staff. But not only is Patricia unqualified, there's no real qualified positional coach anywhere on the offensive staff. Troy Brown has been kind of disappointing too, actually.
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I guess where I disagree with you guys is that Norv Turner could be running New England's offense, and so long as they're tipping passes to defenders, false starting, allowing D-linemen in the backfield to disrupt screens, throwing behind receivers, running the wrong routes, etc, they're still going to be scoring 13 pts/gm.
If you want to find ways to put this on Patricia, go with not getting plays in quick enough, or taking too long to make substitutions. I'll be right there with you.
Obviously Patricia will be reassigned in the organization. It's not really his fault either. Bill put him in a position to fail. There's no doubt in my mind things would have been different if Scar and Ivan Fears were still part of the Offensive staff. But not only is Patricia unqualified, there's no real qualified positional coach anywhere on the offensive staff. Troy Brown has been kind of disappointing too, actually.
Scar and Fears are gone. They're not coming back. Bill decided to promote from within, and I can understand that. As I said a while back he's trying to maintain a culture, and you don't do that by bringing in outsiders. I'll agree with you that he doesn't seem to be winning that battle, but I'm not sure it ever was winnable. To that end having former coaches and former players on the coaching staff is the best way to try. Mayo and Brown are probably more important in that regard than they are as position coaches.
And I want to make clear that I also put most of the blame on the coaching staff. I just don't see the same problems you guys do. Simply firing or reassigning MP doesn't solve their problems. I think establishing some consistency with their coaching, will, though. Ideally that begins with O'Brien, but I'm not sure that happens. Part of the reason he didn't bring O'Brien on last year is because he saw it as a temporary thing before BO got another HC gig.
Also, I made the point a while back. I'm surprised neither you or Joe remember MP's first season as DC. I wanted him fired sooner rather than later. It took him a season or so to get his shit together and then he was fine.
2012 Patriots D:
Total Defense (YPG): 381.1 (27th)
Passing (YPG): 275.5 (29th)
Rushing (YPG): 105.5 (12th)
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Looked like pass interference on that last play last night, but it went my way this time so I'm not going to complain. Giants avoided another tie with Washington :lol
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I guess where I disagree with you guys is that Norv Turner could be running New England's offense, and so long as they're tipping passes to defenders, false starting, allowing D-linemen in the backfield to disrupt screens, throwing behind receivers, running the wrong routes, etc, they're still going to be scoring 13 pts/gm.
If you want to find ways to put this on Patricia, go with not getting plays in quick enough, or taking too long to make substitutions. I'll be right there with you.
Obviously Patricia will be reassigned in the organization. It's not really his fault either. Bill put him in a position to fail. There's no doubt in my mind things would have been different if Scar and Ivan Fears were still part of the Offensive staff. But not only is Patricia unqualified, there's no real qualified positional coach anywhere on the offensive staff. Troy Brown has been kind of disappointing too, actually.
Scar and Fears are gone. They're not coming back. Bill decided to promote from within, and I can understand that. As I said a while back he's trying to maintain a culture, and you don't do that by bringing in outsiders. I'll agree with you that he doesn't seem to be winning that battle, but I'm not sure it ever was winnable. To that end having former coaches and former players on the coaching staff is the best way to try. Mayo and Brown are probably more important in that regard than they are as position coaches.
And I want to make clear that I also put most of the blame on the coaching staff. I just don't see the same problems you guys do. Simply firing or reassigning MP doesn't solve their problems. I think establishing some consistency with their coaching, will, though. Ideally that begins with O'Brien, but I'm not sure that happens. Part of the reason he didn't bring O'Brien on last year is because he saw it as a temporary thing before BO got another HC gig.
Also, I made the point a while back. I'm surprised neither you or Joe remember MP's first season as DC. I wanted him fired sooner rather than later. It took him a season or so to get his shit together and then he was fine.
2012 Patriots D:
Total Defense (YPG): 381.1 (27th)
Passing (YPG): 275.5 (29th)
Rushing (YPG): 105.5 (12th)
There was a ton of talk that Bill the GM blew it until the 10 season and the secondary was not good at that time. The difference here was he had a defensive background and his deficiencies could be covered up by Tom Brady and the offense. So Matt could grow. They don't have that luxury right now. Matt had one year on offense as an assistant. That's not enough. So it's different circumstances especially with a 2nd year QB.
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I think the criticisms are over-hyped. The refs get that call right in the endzone (his foot was out of bounds up to the ball of his foot, c'mon) and we're not having any of this conversation. The offense is not as good as the defense. But they scored when they needed to. I'm not complaining or whining - all this stuff evens out over the year, or the years - but the refs blowing that call and Jacoby Meyers doing god knows what are not on the coaching staff. Well, maybe the discipline part of Meyers, but we're apparently not talking about that.
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all this stuff evens out over the year, or the years
Well, sometimes it does, and sometimes it doesn't. But even so, there's no point dwelling on it because there's nothing anyone can do about it, which is close to your point.
Anyway, updated predictions regarding standings/playoffs (not too different from what I had two weeks ago ultimately, although some of the specifics for how we get there are):
NFC:
1. Philly (14-3)
2. SF (12-5; I have them clinching in week 17 and then resting their starters and losing in week 18)
3. Minn. (12-5)
4. Tampa (8-9; I could easily see this being Carolina instead, with the same record)
5. Dallas (12-5)
6. NYG (11-5-1)
7. Detroit (10-7)
First round: SF over Detroit; Giants over Vikings; Cowboys over Bucs.
Second round: Cowboys over Eagles; SF over Giants.
Third round: SF over Cowboys
AFC:
1. KC
2. Cin.
3. Buff.
4. Jax
5. LAC
6. Miami
7. Balt.
First round: Cin. over Balt.; Buff. over Miami; Jax over LAC
Second round: KC over Jax; Cin. over Buff.
Third round: Cin. over KC (this is a hard one to call)
Super Bowl: SF over Cin.
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NFC:
1. Philly (14-3)
2. SF (12-5; I have them clinching in week 17 and then resting their starters and losing in week 18)
3. Minn. (12-5)
4. Tampa (8-9; I could easily see this being Carolina instead, with the same record)
5. Dallas (12-5)
6. NYG (11-5-1)
7. Detroit (10-7)
You think the Giants will win out? (and a playoff game?) I guess if Minny and Philly start resting players (Philly seems likely for the last game, not sure if Minny would start doing that this week). Honestly could see the Giants going 0-3 the rest of the way, they really just aren't that good and have needed lots of luck and late game antics to win (and most of that winning was to start the season, they've been pretty poor lately).
I do think it would be sort of cool if Washington still got in at the 7th seed and you had all 4 NFC East teams make the playoffs.
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I think the criticisms are over-hyped. The refs get that call right in the endzone (his foot was out of bounds up to the ball of his foot, c'mon) and we're not having any of this conversation. The offense is not as good as the defense. But they scored when they needed to. I'm not complaining or whining - all this stuff evens out over the year, or the years - but the refs blowing that call and Jacoby Meyers doing god knows what are not on the coaching staff. Well, maybe the discipline part of Meyers, but we're apparently not talking about that.
There were several calls that screwed the Raiders also.
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NFC:
1. Philly (14-3)
2. SF (12-5; I have them clinching in week 17 and then resting their starters and losing in week 18)
3. Minn. (12-5)
4. Tampa (8-9; I could easily see this being Carolina instead, with the same record)
5. Dallas (12-5)
6. NYG (11-5-1)
7. Detroit (10-7)
You think the Giants will win out? (and a playoff game?) I guess if Minny and Philly start resting players (Philly seems likely for the last game, not sure if Minny would start doing that this week). Honestly could see the Giants going 0-3 the rest of the way, they really just aren't that good and have needed lots of luck and late game antics to win (and most of that winning was to start the season, they've been pretty poor lately).
I do think it would be sort of cool if Washington still got in at the 7th seed and you had all 4 NFC East teams make the playoffs.
I don't think the Giants are "that good" either, but they are REALLY hard to predict. And just going week by week on the playoff machine, I just see them having a realistic "more likely than not" winning scenario in each of those games, taken in isolation. And I think they are the type of team that will have the Vikings' number, and that the Vikings will implode. Could be very wrong on all counts, of course, but that's what makes this kind of thing fun.
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I'll certainly be happy with those results
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Here's what I came up with:
NFC
1. PHI (15-2)
2. MIN (14-3)
3. SF (11-6)
4. TB (9-8 or 8-9)
5. DAL (12-5)
6. DET (10-7)
7. NYG (9-7-1)
- Round 1: MIN, SF and DAL win
- Round 2: PHI and MIN win
- NFCCG: MIN wins
AFC
1. BUF (14-3)
2. KC (13-4)
3. CIN (12-5)
4. JAC (9-8)
5. BAL (11-6)
6. LAC (10-7)
7. MIA (10-7)
Round 1: MIA, CIN and JAC win
Round 2: BUF and CIN win
AFCCG: BUF wins
Superb Owl: MIN > BUF in OT
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I don't see how Bosky is so confident in Dallas winning those big games after the last two weeks, or how you feel good about the Vikings doing that well.
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I don't see how Bosky is so confident in Dallas winning those big games after the last two weeks
I'm not "confident" of anything relating to the Cowboys. But here's how I have their season playing out, to the extent any of this is anything more than a guessing game:
-Week 16: I have them beating Philly because (1) they are mad/embarrassed about this week, and even the Cowboys can pull it together and focus for a week, (2) they HATE Philly and will bring their best; and (3) combine 1 and 2 with the fact that it's a home game, which I don't think is much of an advantage for them, but does avoid the disadvantage of playing in Philly.
-Week 17: I have them beating the Titans because the Titans are a trainwreck.
-Week 18: I have them losing to Washington because, even after winning 2 games in a row, they're still the Cowboys, and Washington is decent.
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My playoff predictions.
AFC
1: BUF
2: KC
3: CIN
4: TEN
5: LAC
6: MIA
7: BAL
NFC
1: PHI
2: MIN
3: SF
4: TB
5: DAL
6: NYG
7: DET
Wild Card Round
2: KC vs 7: BAL
3: CIN vs 6: MIA
4: TEN vs 5: LAC
2: MIN vs 7: DET
3: SF vs 6: NYG
4: TB vs 5: DAL
Divisional Round
1: BUF vs 5: LAC
2: KC vs 3: CIN
1: PHI vs 7: DET
3: SF vs 5: DAL
Conference Championship
1: BUF vs 2: KC
1: PHI vs 3: SF
Super Bowl LVII
1: BUF vs 1: PHI
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I don't see any likely scenario where the Vikings hold onto the #2 seed.
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I'll certainly be happy with those results
To add:
-I think Minnesota is falling apart, and I can see the Giants winning in a dome game.
-I think they have enough to beat the Colts and that the Colts are likely to just give up on the season after the loss this past weekend.
-I think Philly has the #1 seed locked up by week 18 and that the Giants have enough in the tank to beat the second/third string, and will likely feel like they still need to win with Washington, Seattle, and/or Detroit nipping at their heels.
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I don't see any likely scenario where the Vikings hold onto the #2 seed.
They have no business being the 2 seed, but they also had no business beating Buffalo or coming back against Indianapolis but here we are. Their last three games are against the Giants, Packers, and Bears. All of those are winnable games with only one of those teams having a winning record atm.
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I don't see any likely scenario where the Vikings hold onto the #2 seed.
They have no business being the 2 seed, but they also had no business beating Buffalo or coming back against Indianapolis but here we are. Their last three games are against the Giants, Packers, and Bears. All of those are winnable games with only one of those teams having a winning record atm.
All very true, but I think the Giants just have to play good enough not to give it away like the Colts did, and that they are decent enough to do that. As for the Packers and Bears, the reason those games are question marks for me as opposed to "easy wins" for the Vikings is that, despite both teams having losing records, they have weapons, and physical teams, and the Vikings aren't really built to win against physical teams on the road in extreme cold outdoor environments, which both of those teams have going for them. The Vikings only have to lose 1 game to lose the #2 seed, and I see them VERY realistically losing 2 out of 3.
Super Bowl LVII
1: BUF vs 1: PHI
Ew. I probably wouldn't even watch that, aside from the aspect of hanging out at a social gathering where it happens to be on.
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I don't see any likely scenario where the Vikings hold onto the #2 seed.
The only team that could possibly take the second spot is SF.
MIN: NYG, @GB, @CHI
SF: WAS, @LV, ARI
I'd say the most likely result is that both teams go 2-1, with the week 17 games being the most likely losses.
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I think the most likely scenario is for SF to go 2-1 (I really don't see them losing any games, but 10 in a row just seems unlikely for ANY team) and MN going 1-2.
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Even if the Vikings hang on to the 2 seed, the 49ers, even with me at QB, would make mincemeat out of them in Minnesota in the 2nd round. The Vikings defense is complete trash. The 49ers just need their guys healthy at the skill positions, and I think they are on a collision course to meet the Eagles in the NFCCG, barring Hurts being more hurt than it sounds.
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Even if the Vikings hang on to the 2 seed, the 49ers, even with me at QB, would make mincemeat out of them in Minnesota in the 2nd round. The Vikings defense is complete trash. The 49ers just need their guys healthy at the skill positions, and I think they are on a collision course to meet the Eagles in the NFCCG, barring Hurts being more hurt than it sounds.
Yeah, if the Eagles are forced into their backup QB on a playoff run they are pretty much done.
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Even if the Vikings hang on to the 2 seed, the 49ers, even with me at QB, would make mincemeat out of them in Minnesota in the 2nd round. The Vikings defense is complete trash. The 49ers just need their guys healthy at the skill positions, and I think they are on a collision course to meet the Eagles in the NFCCG, barring Hurts being more hurt than it sounds.
Yeah, if the Eagles are forced into their backup QB on a playoff run they are pretty much done.
Except 2017. Ouch
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Even if the Vikings hang on to the 2 seed, the 49ers, even with me at QB, would make mincemeat out of them in Minnesota in the 2nd round. The Vikings defense is complete trash. The 49ers just need their guys healthy at the skill positions, and I think they are on a collision course to meet the Eagles in the NFCCG, barring Hurts being more hurt than it sounds.
Yeah, if the Eagles are forced into their backup QB on a playoff run they are pretty much done.
Except 2017. Ouch
Exactly. :p
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*shakes fist in the air* :lol
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(https://64.media.tumblr.com/37defcc4471a79d7f096af41221e53a7/f21215d82956770b-0f/s400x600/4702d56dd365c45bb94fcf2cdd8f80cb1d1d4d6e.gifv)
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Lol. Ready to laugh guys?
(https://i.postimg.cc/1RWckrdb/httpslive.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/4n99tVs1)
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:rollin :rollin :rollin
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Sounds like the biggest culprit in the NE disaster is the RB Stevenson. It is easy to dog Myers for the horrible lateral or Mac for his bad attempt at a tackle, but apparently the play call was to run the ball and go down, and Stevenson is the one who went rouge and tried to play hero ball. Myers simply panicked in the moment because he wasn't expecting a lateral, and, well, Jones is a QB and tackling is not their game (see: Teddy Bridgewater). Stevenson is the real doofus here.
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Jets are being written off, but I think Thursdays tells a lot.
If the Jets beat the Jags on Thursday (will be hard, but doable), and Miami to close out the season, they've got a 50/50 chance to make it in. If the Jets beat the Seahawks, they will almost be a sure shot to the wildcard.
I'm not sure how much faith I have, but hey, as a Jets fan, last time the season was meaningful in December was 2015. The team have problems that need to be addressed (QB, Offensive Coordinator, Linebacker), but there's a great young core team to build upon.
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Jets are being written off, but I think Thursdays tells a lot.
If the Jets beat the Jags on Thursday (will be hard, but doable), and Miami to close out the season, they've got a 50/50 chance to make it in. If the Jets beat the Seahawks, they will almost be a sure shot to the wildcard.
I'm not sure how much faith I have, but hey, as a Jets fan, last time the season was meaningful in December was 2015. The team have problems that need to be addressed (QB, Offensive Coordinator, Linebacker), but there's a great young core team to build upon.
That Week 17 MIA/NE game could mean everything for the Jets season. If the Dolphins win that game, it could potentially set up a Week 18 play-in game for the Jets and Fins. If the Patriots win that game however, the Jets are most likely screwed as the Pats already own the tiebreaker over them.
The fact that it could come down to the Jets’ two biggest rivals makes me very uncomfortable.
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Sounds like the biggest culprit in the NE disaster is the RB Stevenson. It is easy to dog Myers for the horrible lateral or Mac for his bad attempt at a tackle, but apparently the play call was to run the ball and go down, and Stevenson is the one who went rouge and tried to play hero ball. Myers simply panicked in the moment because he wasn't expecting a lateral, and, well, Jones is a QB and tackling is not their game (see: Teddy Bridgewater). Stevenson is the real doofus here.
I blame the coaching staff. This is the most undisciplined Pats team I've seen in the Belichick era. That 1st and goal from the 2 tells the whole story.
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Jets are being written off, but I think Thursdays tells a lot.
If the Jets beat the Jags on Thursday (will be hard, but doable), and Miami to close out the season, they've got a 50/50 chance to make it in. If the Jets beat the Seahawks, they will almost be a sure shot to the wildcard.
I'm not sure how much faith I have, but hey, as a Jets fan, last time the season was meaningful in December was 2015. The team have problems that need to be addressed (QB, Offensive Coordinator, Linebacker), but there's a great young core team to build upon.
After watching what I did last weekend, having your faith in Zack Wilson is a tough basket to put your family jewels in. He's just as likely to throw a lame duck straight into the hands of the linebacker as he is a perfect, tight spiral into the hands of his receiver downfield.
I also think we're missing something about the Vikings; they HAVE played great when there's nothing left to lose. I want to see them in a tight, grind-em-out 14-13 game with all the marbles on the line. Heaving it 45 yards downfield into traffic so Justin Jefferson can make a one-handed catch with his ass-cheeks is not a game plan, and yet that seems to be what the Vikes have. As bad as the NFC is, and it is bad, I can't see spotting the defenses in SF, Phi, NY or even Dallas 30 points and hoping to win in a playoff game.
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Sounds like the biggest culprit in the NE disaster is the RB Stevenson. It is easy to dog Myers for the horrible lateral or Mac for his bad attempt at a tackle, but apparently the play call was to run the ball and go down, and Stevenson is the one who went rouge and tried to play hero ball. Myers simply panicked in the moment because he wasn't expecting a lateral, and, well, Jones is a QB and tackling is not their game (see: Teddy Bridgewater). Stevenson is the real doofus here.
I blame the coaching staff. This is the most undisciplined Pats team I've seen in the Belichick era. That 1st and goal from the 2 tells the whole story.
Agreed.
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Genuine question for you New England fans: if the Pats miss the playoffs this year then miss it next year and this new trend of undisciplined play continues, what are the chances Robert Kraft makes a coaching change at the end of next season? And is this something you guys would be on board with if the Pats continue to struggle like this?
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I think Kraft will force Bill to make changes to the coaching staff. If Bill doesn't, that will be interesting. I think Bill will be amenable to changes though. He had roots here and change late in his career doesn't seem plausible. I think Bill wants to beat Shula's record for wins. There's no love loss between the two.
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Sounds like the biggest culprit in the NE disaster is the RB Stevenson. It is easy to dog Myers for the horrible lateral or Mac for his bad attempt at a tackle, but apparently the play call was to run the ball and go down, and Stevenson is the one who went rouge and tried to play hero ball. Myers simply panicked in the moment because he wasn't expecting a lateral, and, well, Jones is a QB and tackling is not their game (see: Teddy Bridgewater). Stevenson is the real doofus here.
I put it more on Myers. I'm sure the laterals were never on the table, risky and totally unnecessary, but Stevenson's was perfectly safe. I think once Meyers got the ball he figured they were trying to go full on Golden Bears. It might have been panic, but I suspect it was more being caught up in the moment and thinking that's what they were doing.
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Sounds like the biggest culprit in the NE disaster is the RB Stevenson. It is easy to dog Myers for the horrible lateral or Mac for his bad attempt at a tackle, but apparently the play call was to run the ball and go down, and Stevenson is the one who went rouge and tried to play hero ball. Myers simply panicked in the moment because he wasn't expecting a lateral, and, well, Jones is a QB and tackling is not their game (see: Teddy Bridgewater). Stevenson is the real doofus here.
I blame the coaching staff. This is the most undisciplined Pats team I've seen in the Belichick era. That 1st and goal from the 2 tells the whole story.
Agreed.
Discipline comes in many flavours. In some ways they are and in others they're much improved. Remember how bad their tackling was last year? I'm not sure, but I suspect they're also committing fewer penalties this year. The O-line is the only group that casts doubt on that.
As for the 1st and 2, that wasn't a lack of discipline from the players. That was the coaches screwing up.
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Genuine question for you New England fans: if the Pats miss the playoffs this year then miss it next year and this new trend of undisciplined play continues, what are the chances Robert Kraft makes a coaching change at the end of next season? And is this something you guys would be on board with if the Pats continue to struggle like this?
I say you stick with Belichick as long as he wants to do it. What are you going to do? Get one of those young kids in there that looks like he's playing Dungeons and Dragons instead of coaching a football team? Then ten years from now we win a playoff game? I don't want to be the Dolphins. He is putting out the best team he can right now. Is it perfect? No. Is it moving in the right direction? I think it is (see Bart's post). The discipline will come; he needs to put good, competitive athletes out there, and he's doing that. They are not getting blown out, and they are staying competitive. I'm not panicking, frankly.
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Genuine question for you New England fans: if the Pats miss the playoffs this year then miss it next year and this new trend of undisciplined play continues, what are the chances Robert Kraft makes a coaching change at the end of next season? And is this something you guys would be on board with if the Pats continue to struggle like this?
I say you stick with Belichick as long as he wants to do it. What are you going to do? Get one of those young kids in there that looks like he's playing Dungeons and Dragons instead of coaching a football team? Then ten years from now we win a playoff game? I don't want to be the Dolphins. He is putting out the best team he can right now. Is it perfect? No. Is it moving in the right direction? I think it is (see Bart's post). The discipline will come; he needs to put good, competitive athletes out there, and he's doing that. They are not getting blown out, and they are staying competitive. I'm not panicking, frankly.
Exactly. Like I said a few weeks ago, Patriots fans are so spoiled they've lost sight of how bad it can be. Just ask Rams fans about Wunderkind McVey.
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Only idiots want Belichick gone but he does need to add coaching. They are stretched too thin. This is the least amount of coaches on the staff this year than any other Belichick runned year.
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Sounds like the biggest culprit in the NE disaster is the RB Stevenson. It is easy to dog Myers for the horrible lateral or Mac for his bad attempt at a tackle, but apparently the play call was to run the ball and go down, and Stevenson is the one who went rouge and tried to play hero ball. Myers simply panicked in the moment because he wasn't expecting a lateral, and, well, Jones is a QB and tackling is not their game (see: Teddy Bridgewater). Stevenson is the real doofus here.
I put it more on Myers. I'm sure the laterals were never on the table, risky and totally unnecessary, but Stevenson's was perfectly safe. I think once Meyers got the ball he figured they were trying to go full on Golden Bears. It might have been panic, but I suspect it was more being caught up in the moment and thinking that's what they were doing.
Agree (except for the part about the first lateral being perfectly safe). Meyers didn't panic. He acted like he absolutely expected that stupid lateral. He calmly turned around and started running backwards for 8 yards and took 3 seconds before throwing the ball ANOTHER 10 yards backward. All this was happening on the Pats' sideline where his coaches were presumably screaming "get down!" He threw the ball to a guy on the other team. He did not throw it to Jones, who was standing a full five yards away from where the Raiders guy caught the ball and was TOTALLY unprepared for what was happening. If anyone panicked, it was Jones (and rightfully so). If what Meyers did was a result of panic, then he should be released immediately. This is 98% on Mr. law firm and 2% on Stevenson. To his credit, though, he owned up to it in postgame interviews.
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Sounds like the biggest culprit in the NE disaster is the RB Stevenson. It is easy to dog Myers for the horrible lateral or Mac for his bad attempt at a tackle, but apparently the play call was to run the ball and go down, and Stevenson is the one who went rouge and tried to play hero ball. Myers simply panicked in the moment because he wasn't expecting a lateral, and, well, Jones is a QB and tackling is not their game (see: Teddy Bridgewater). Stevenson is the real doofus here.
I put it more on Myers. I'm sure the laterals were never on the table, risky and totally unnecessary, but Stevenson's was perfectly safe. I think once Meyers got the ball he figured they were trying to go full on Golden Bears. It might have been panic, but I suspect it was more being caught up in the moment and thinking that's what they were doing.
Agree (except for the part about the first lateral being perfectly safe). Meyers didn't panic. He acted like he absolutely expected that stupid lateral. He calmly turned around and started running backwards for 8 yards and took 3 seconds before throwing the ball ANOTHER 10 yards backward. All this was happening on the Pats' sideline where his coaches were presumably screaming "get down!" He threw the ball to a guy on the other team. He did not throw it to Jones, who was standing a full five yards away from where the Raiders guy caught the ball and was TOTALLY unprepared for what was happening. If anyone panicked, it was Jones (and rightfully so). If what Meyers did was a result of panic, then he should be released immediately. This is 98% on Mr. law firm and 2% on Stevenson. To his credit, though, he owned up to it in postgame interviews.
I see what you did there.... :)
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When I first heard his name mentioned on a broadcast, I was like...wait...what?! :lol
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Interesting to read that some people think the Lions will get in. Would love to see it but winning out is tough. Especially the last game against the Packers in Lambeau.
IF they do make it, watch out. As long as the DB's can cover, which is their main weakness, they can compete with any team.
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Only idiots want Belichick gone but he does need to add coaching. They are stretched too thin. This is the least amount of coaches on the staff this year than any other Belichick runned year.
Yeah, they are probably all runned down from having to do all the extra coaching. :p
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Watched a report on ProfootballTalk confirming the Vegas oddsmakers have inside info the public does not. They were the first ones who knew of Jalen Hurts' injury and immediately changed the odds on the Cowboys game. The injury hadn't even been reported yet. Crooked crooked crooked; in addition to the consistently questionable officiating. You can see why the NFL officially bills its product as "entertainment" instead of "sporting competition". As Florio always says, nothing will change until congress gets involved. Until then the NFL is like "shut up and give me your money".
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Only idiots want Belichick gone but he does need to add coaching. They are stretched too thin. This is the least amount of coaches on the staff this year than any other Belichick runned year.
Yeah, they are probably all runned down from having to do all the extra coaching. :p
No, the attention to detail is slipping with so much on their plates. Nee ner, nee ner.
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Watched a report on ProfootballTalk confirming the Vegas oddsmakers have inside info the public does not. They were the first ones who knew of Jalen Hurts' injury and immediately changed the odds on the Cowboys game. The injury hadn't even been reported yet. Crooked crooked crooked; in addition to the consistently questionable officiating. You can see why the NFL officially bills its product as "entertainment" instead of "sporting competition". As Florio always says, nothing will change until congress gets involved. Until then the NFL is like "shut up and give me your money".
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EdX2v7yWsAYP6kF.jpg)
Oddsmakers knowing things the general public does not? Um, yeah, that's how they make their money. That's how they've always made their money. I guarangodamntee you that if Flavius Maximus had a sprained shoulder before his Saturni evening heat there were bookies that knew about it before the plebeians did. This isn't really news.
But once again I have to ask, why do you care? If you see it the same as the WWE you're probably better off watching that instead. They have writers, and if you're into amazonians hot chicks.
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One thing I really would like to see adopted is uniform camera placement at games. The ability to correctly review a play shouldn't be based upon how important the networks feel a particular game is. Playoff games get the full Matrix treatment. Low interest games get squat. Cameras in the pylons should be a given. Maybe instead of just micing them up so we can hear a satisfying THUNG when a goalpost gets hit we could put a couple of webcams on the silly things. This is a deficiency that's easily fixable, and at this point wouldn't even cost all that much. Hell, pay guys to sit on the corners with their stupid iPhones out and stream it to the replay booth, FFS.
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I love the NFL, and I find myself still enjoying most of the games. My only real beefs at this point are a) the officiating, and b) the way gambling has COMPLETELY overrun the game. Even the "official" broadcasts are now talking not in terms of whether Dallas is going to beat Washington on the field and whether Dak is capable of beating that secondary. They are talking in terms of covering the spread, and whether Dak can put up enough numbers to get the "Over". I don't give a rat's ass. The critique last night about Green Bay taking the knee at the 2-yard line; it wasn't the sportsmanship, or even the playoff tie-breaker, but whether Green Bay was going to beat the over/under.
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100% Bill. I completely agree and have almost posted a similar rant a number of times. I do not fucking care how this team or that team is against the spread. What's the Win-Loss record. Do we still care about that?
Or...The Patriots have a 30% chance of winning the game. WTF?? Expected points?? How about ACTUAL points?
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I love the NFL, and I find myself still enjoying most of the games. My only real beefs at this point are a) the officiating, and b) the way gambling has COMPLETELY overrun the game. Even the "official" broadcasts are now talking not in terms of whether Dallas is going to beat Washington on the field and whether Dak is capable of beating that secondary. They are talking in terms of covering the spread, and whether Dak can put up enough numbers to get the "Over". I don't give a rat's ass. The critique last night about Green Bay taking the knee at the 2-yard line; it wasn't the sportsmanship, or even the playoff tie-breaker, but whether Green Bay was going to beat the over/under.
I certainly agree about the gambling aspect. Not so much about the officiating. I expressed in an email to a friend last night that I actually like NFL referees. I think they do a surprisingly good job under difficult circumstances and bowling a 300 game simply isn't going to happen. Despite when there are obvious examples of calls going wrong, with the current blend of on the field and in the booth, officiating is probably better than it's ever been. We're the ones fucking it up by setting unrealistic expectations based on what the technology allows us to see after the fact.
Does anybody actually think that if we were go go back to a game from 1986 and watch it through the modern lens the officiating woudl be better? I think we'd be shocked at how much they got wrong.
As an aside, the reason I was pointing it out is because NFL referees, unlike most of the other sports, actually seem to really enjoy the game. I'd watched a video of refs getting knocked down, blocked, hit with passes, blocked from behind, and dog-piled, and with the exception of one or two who were really hurt, every one of them got up laughing about it. Despite being held to unrealistic expectations I think they really enjoy doing what they do.
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Amen, especially umpires. They’re commonly used as a natural pick by receivers, and are frequently in the action. Much respect!
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R.I.P. Mr. Immaculate Reception.
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Amen, especially umpires. They’re were commonly used as a natural pick by receivers, and are were frequently in the action. Much respect!
ftfy
The referee and umpire are positioned in the offensive backfield - behind the QB with one on each set of hashmarks. This has been the case since 2010 (except for the last five minutes of the second half from 2010-15).
R.I.P. Mr. Immaculate Reception.
I heard that on the way into the office. An absolute legend of my childhood. The timing sucks given that Friday is the 50th anniversary of the Immaculate Reception, and the NFL specifically scheduled the Raiders to play the Steelers on Saturday in celebration of the game. I'm sure Franco's Italian Army will be out in force.
(https://www.history.com/.image/c_fill%2Ccs_srgb%2Cfl_progressive%2Ch_400%2Cq_auto:good%2Cw_620/MTg1MzQ4MDU1NTAxOTA3NTgz/franco-harris-ap_19296636995336.jpg)
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I love the NFL, and I find myself still enjoying most of the games. My only real beefs at this point are a) the officiating, and b) the way gambling has COMPLETELY overrun the game. Even the "official" broadcasts are now talking not in terms of whether Dallas is going to beat Washington on the field and whether Dak is capable of beating that secondary. They are talking in terms of covering the spread, and whether Dak can put up enough numbers to get the "Over". I don't give a rat's ass. The critique last night about Green Bay taking the knee at the 2-yard line; it wasn't the sportsmanship, or even the playoff tie-breaker, but whether Green Bay was going to beat the over/under.
I certainly agree about the gambling aspect. Not so much about the officiating. I expressed in an email to a friend last night that I actually like NFL referees. I think they do a surprisingly good job under difficult circumstances and bowling a 300 game simply isn't going to happen. Despite when there are obvious examples of calls going wrong, with the current blend of on the field and in the booth, officiating is probably better than it's ever been. We're the ones fucking it up by setting unrealistic expectations based on what the technology allows us to see after the fact.
Does anybody actually think that if we were go go back to a game from 1986 and watch it through the modern lens the officiating woudl be better? I think we'd be shocked at how much they got wrong.
As an aside, the reason I was pointing it out is because NFL referees, unlike most of the other sports, actually seem to really enjoy the game. I'd watched a video of refs getting knocked down, blocked, hit with passes, blocked from behind, and dog-piled, and with the exception of one or two who were really hurt, every one of them got up laughing about it. Despite being held to unrealistic expectations I think they really enjoy doing what they do.
Fair enough; can't really argue that.
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I remember this play well from '72, watching at my neighbors, the ending of the 1PM Saturday divisional playoff game (how I miss those playoff kickoff times!).
To set it up, both defenses ruled that frigid day. The Raiders offense was abysmal with Darryl Lamonica at QB. Kenny Stabler came in late in the 3rd quarter when it was 3-0. At 6-0, he scored the go ahead TD on a 30 yard scramble with under two minutes to go (George Blanda kicked the go ahead PAT).
Here's the TV footage, with Curt Gowdy announcing, minus that 'interruptive' shot NFL films uses for this play.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H1l5aTUK228
This was also before they made the rule change regarding deflected passes in '78. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immaculate_Reception
Oh, and Franco was one class act. RIP.
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Oh, and Franco was one class act. RIP.
and a Penn State legend, RIP.
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I remember this play well from '72, watching at my neighbors, the ending of the 1PM Saturday divisional playoff game (how I miss those playoff kickoff times!).
To set it up, both defenses ruled that frigid day. The Raiders offense was abysmal with Darryl Lamonica at QB. Kenny Stabler came in late in the 3rd quarter when it was 3-0. At 6-0, he scored the go ahead TD on a 30 yard scramble with under two minutes to go (George Blanda kicked the go ahead PAT).
Here's the TV footage, with Curt Gowdy announcing, minus that 'interruptive' shot NFL films uses for this play.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H1l5aTUK228
This was also before they made the rule change regarding deflected passes in '78. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immaculate_Reception
The play was before my time, but I was around for -- and remember when they announced -- the rule change. I also recall when I first learned about this play that the big controversy was whether it had deflected off Jack Tatum (legal catch) or Frenchy Fuqua (illegal catch) and not whether Harris had caught the ball without it hitting the ground.
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Amen, especially umpires. They’re were commonly used as a natural pick by receivers, and are were frequently in the action. Much respect!
ftfy
The referee and umpire are positioned in the offensive backfield - behind the QB with one on each set of hashmarks. This has been the case since 2010 (except for the last five minutes of the second half from 2010-15).
You can tell I watch a lot more college football than pro, eh? :lol
I never noticed the change in official positioning. I'll pay closer attention.
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23 months before the Immaculate Reception, this happened in Super Bowl V (Unitas to Mackey, with the same 'debate' as to touches)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xrg6rhKq27w
or, at the 3 minute mark (Curt Gowdy again announcing....note his comments as it happened)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbHwjSF892k
As to Franco Harris, there were comments about how he'd run out of bounds to avoid making contact at times. Huh? Sometimes maybe, but he lived to play another day (and another, and another, and another......)
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Not that Pro Bowl rosters mean all that much, but I wonder would the odds in Vegas would have been that these three would be the three NFC choices:
Jalen Hurts, Philadelphia Eagles
Geno Smith, Seattle Seahawks
Kirk Cousins, Minnesota Vikings
It's wild to think that both Rodgers and Brady are in what most consider the weaker conference, especially when it comes to QBs, yet neither made it.
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The enduring thing from watching that catch over and over is what a beast Jack Tatum was. Man, that guy didn't have a lower gear.
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23 months before the Immaculate Reception, this happened in Super Bowl V (Unitas to Mackey, with the same 'debate' as to touches)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xrg6rhKq27w
or, at the 3 minute mark (Curt Gowdy again announcing....note his comments as it happened)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbHwjSF892k
As to Franco Harris, there were comments about how he'd run out of bounds to avoid making contact at times. Huh? Sometimes maybe, but he lived to play another day (and another, and another, and another......)
That first video pretty clearly shows it was first tipped by a Colts player and then a Cowboys player before Mackey caught it. Gowdy did a great job of explaining the rule. When I was around 10 or so, someone got me an encyclopedia style book about football, and it had individual articles about all 11 (up to that point) Super Bowls. I recall wondering why no one seemed to celebrate SB5 as a great game given that it was the first one to be decided by a last second score. From what I can surmise from game summaries, other than 5 and 10, the first 11 Owls were far less than superb.
Also, straight-ahead placekickers look so weird!
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Not that Pro Bowl rosters mean all that much, but I wonder would the odds in Vegas would have been that these three would be the three NFC choices:
Jalen Hurts, Philadelphia Eagles
Geno Smith, Seattle Seahawks
Kirk Cousins, Minnesota Vikings
It's wild to think that both Rodgers and Brady are in what most consider the weaker conference, especially when it comes to QBs, yet neither made it.
Both the development of Hurts and the renaissance of Smith have been incredible to watch this year. Very cool (and well-deserving) that they both were selected to the Pro Bowl.
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23 months before the Immaculate Reception, this happened in Super Bowl V (Unitas to Mackey, with the same 'debate' as to touches)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xrg6rhKq27w
or, at the 3 minute mark (Curt Gowdy again announcing....note his comments as it happened)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbHwjSF892k
As to Franco Harris, there were comments about how he'd run out of bounds to avoid making contact at times. Huh? Sometimes maybe, but he lived to play another day (and another, and another, and another......)
That first video pretty clearly shows it was first tipped by a Colts player and then a Cowboys player before Mackey caught it. Gowdy did a great job of explaining the rule. When I was around 10 or so, someone got me an encyclopedia style book about football, and it had individual articles about all 11 (up to that point) Super Bowls. I recall wondering why no one seemed to celebrate SB5 as a great game given that it was the first one to be decided by a last second score. From what I can surmise from game summaries, other than 5 and 10, the first 11 Owls were far less than superb.
Also, straight-ahead placekickers look so weird!
When the 49ers were making their first Super Bowl run, a lot of stores in the Bay Area had the official Super Bowl XVI program, which had a huge chunk of it devoted to full-page spreads of pics and articles of the first 15. Sounds similar to what you are describing. I don't even know how many times I read that thing cover to cover. But I don't have a specific recollection of V, or of a lot of the earlier ones, for that matter.
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From what I can surmise from game summaries, other than 5 and 10, the first 11 Owls were far less than superb.
Don't know the history that well, but sounds about right.
The first SB I have any memory of is 20, and other than Niners/Bengals and the Bills Wide Right game, my early experiences were a bunch of blowouts. But I was a kid watching with my dad, so didn't care one bit.
Also, straight-ahead placekickers look so weird!
And the single bar facemask!
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But I don't have a specific recollection of V, or of a lot of the earlier ones, for that matter.
The first SB I have any memory of is 20, and other than Niners/Bengals and the Bills Wide Right game, my early experiences were a bunch of blowouts. But I was a kid watching with my dad, so didn't care one bit.
The first one I watched was 12. It was great. My newly adopted team made the Super Bowl in my first year watching football! Woo hoo! Little did I know I was in for years of heartbreak. Until 32, the ONLY game won by the team I wanted to win was 16 (and that's only because, at the time, I liked both the 49ers and the Bengals), and most of that long run of NFC dominance were blowout games.
Also, straight-ahead placekickers look so weird!
And the single bar facemask!
Yup. Kickers, punters and Joe Thiesman. The last of a now dead breed:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EVH4WAjWsAA0V7P.jpg)
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But I don't have a specific recollection of V, or of a lot of the earlier ones, for that matter.
The first SB I have any memory of is 20, and other than Niners/Bengals and the Bills Wide Right game, my early experiences were a bunch of blowouts. But I was a kid watching with my dad, so didn't care one bit.
The first one I watched was 12. It was great. My newly adopted team made the Super Bowl in my first year watching football! Woo hoo! Little did I know I was in for years of heartbreak. Until 32, the ONLY game won by the team I wanted to win was 16 (and that's only because, at the time, I liked both the 49ers and the Bengals), and most of that long run of NFC dominance were blowout games.
Right, I meant I didn't have specific recollections of the write-ups on those early ones. The first one I watched was 15. Even as an east bay kid, I didn't really like the Raiders, so I was rooting for Philadelphia. My dad was a 49ers fan, so I adopted them as my team, even though they were pretty awful that year. What an amazing turnaround in year 2, with such moment as The Catch and winning their first ever SB! I'll always remember those. Lots of others that followed are a blur just because there have been so many, and I didn't watch them all (no interest in seeing the Bills vs. the Giants, for example. What an awful matchup)
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My 1st recollection of a SB was Dallas vs Denver. My neighbor was the type of kid that liked teams not from the area (Hi Nick!) so I wanted every team he liked to lose. I was petty as a kid. LOL So when the Steelers beat Dallas, I was thrilled. Then I pulled for SF vs Dallas (The Catch) I'd say that was when I was fully hooked by football.
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Adam Schefter reported today that YouTube has reached a deal with the NFL so that NFL Sunday Ticket will be available as an add-on to YouTube TV starting in 2023.
This is absolutely a reason to rejoice if you like an out of market team. It will still be overpriced, but absolutely better than having to be a DirecTV subscriber.
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But I don't have a specific recollection of V, or of a lot of the earlier ones, for that matter.
The first SB I have any memory of is 20, and other than Niners/Bengals and the Bills Wide Right game, my early experiences were a bunch of blowouts. But I was a kid watching with my dad, so didn't care one bit.
The first one I watched was 12. It was great. My newly adopted team made the Super Bowl in my first year watching football! Woo hoo! Little did I know I was in for years of heartbreak. Until 32, the ONLY game won by the team I wanted to win was 16 (and that's only because, at the time, I liked both the 49ers and the Bengals), and most of that long run of NFC dominance were blowout games.
Right, I meant I didn't have specific recollections of the write-ups on those early ones. The first one I watched was 15. Even as an east bay kid, I didn't really like the Raiders, so I was rooting for Philadelphia. My dad was a 49ers fan, so I adopted them as my team, even though they were pretty awful that year. What an amazing turnaround in year 2, with such moment as The Catch and winning their first ever SB! I'll always remember those. Lots of others that followed are a blur just because there have been so many, and I didn't watch them all (no interest in seeing the Bills vs. the Giants, for example. What an awful matchup)
Heh, I can relate to some awful 49er teams...
I was 8 when the Niners won the super bowl, and it's around then when I went against my local pressure and adopted them as my team.
That said, football wasn't really a big part of things for me for awhile, but I started taking a lot more interest going in the 00s. I still remember the 2002 playoffs and that huge win over the Giants in their first game.
But then I had like a decade of horrible/mediocre teams while I started being really interested.
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Zach Wilson is on my shit list.
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Zach Wilson is on my shit list.
Have to say I was very surprised to see you and Barto pick the Jets last night in our Pick 'em game. Every site I checked before the game said the poor lad was in for another mauling.
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Zach Wilson is on my shit list.
Have to say I was very surprised to see you and Barto pick the Jets last night in our Pick 'em game. Every site I checked before the game said the poor lad was in for another mauling.
I saw a late piece on our local (New England) sports channel that had the Jets getting a point; I think the idea was that while the Jax offense was better than the Jets, the Jets D was better than the Jags by more. I'm also steadfast about changing my picks once I made them; the two points you got on me a couple weeks ago were BOTH games I changed at the last minute - the only two this year. So while information came out late in the week for both the Jets versus Detroit and the Jets versus the Jags, I refused to change them. Superstition got the better of me.
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Zach Wilson is on my shit list.
Have to say I was very surprised to see you and Barto pick the Jets last night in our Pick 'em game. Every site I checked before the game said the poor lad was in for another mauling.
Jags D is nothing special, and I expected the wind and rain to neutralize Lawrence and both team's kicking games. If it were run game vs run game I favored NYJ at home rather than a team from the Wang playing in a monsoon. Unfortunately I woefully misunderestimated how terrible that fool Zach Wilson was going to be.
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Zach Wilson is on my shit list.
Have to say I was very surprised to see you and Barto pick the Jets last night in our Pick 'em game. Every site I checked before the game said the poor lad was in for another mauling.
Jags D is nothing special, and I expected the wind and rain to neutralize Lawrence and both team's kicking games. If it were run game vs run game I favored NYJ at home rather than a team from the Wang playing in a monsoon. Unfortunately I woefully misunderestimated how terrible that fool Zach Wilson was going to be.
Boom. Is this kid blowing it, or what? He's got a set of tools, but turns out the tool is him. Sad, really.
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Hef, what kind of draft capital can we expect to get from Carolina to take Zach Wilson off our hands?
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Hef, what kind of draft capital can we expect to get from Carolina to take Zach Wilson off our hands?
JFC :lol
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Zach Wilson is on my shit list.
Have to say I was very surprised to see you and Barto pick the Jets last night in our Pick 'em game. Every site I checked before the game said the poor lad was in for another mauling.
Jags D is nothing special, and I expected the wind and rain to neutralize Lawrence and both team's kicking games. If it were run game vs run game I favored NYJ at home rather than a team from the Wang playing in a monsoon. Unfortunately I woefully misunderestimated how terrible that fool Zach Wilson was going to be.
Boom. Is this kid blowing it, or what? He's got a set of tools, but turns out the tool is him. Sad, really.
Seems like he spends too much time putting his tool in his mom's friend instead of learning how to play football.
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So, were the cameras hoping to catch a picture of something like that happening on the sidelines Thursday night? :D I tuned in for the 4th quarter, where he didn't play a down, and they still showed him 25-30 times for no frickin reason (as they do other QBs, coaches, assistants, etc......makes it almost unbearable to watch when I do watch).
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Given his arm talent, Zach Wilson is probably used to always being able to hit the big play with long bombs, but in the NFL, those do not happen often, so you have to learn to manage the game and pick your spots when you want to go deep, and he looks like a guy who cannot figure it out. He is toast.
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So, Happy Festivus Maximus to the Baltimore Ravens. It'll be great to wear a similar shirt off and on for the next three weeks.
(https://media-photos.depop.com/b0/19268214/1029717226_20abec6231fc4215b2cc23f5b4e4fa03/P0.jpg)
That said, this has to be the worst 10-5 heading to the playoffs team I have ever followed. And, it might just be the worst 10-5 heading to the playoffs team ever.
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Trying to temper my excitement....but holy shit are the Niners firing on all cylinders, and to think we'll get Deebo back in a week or two.
They looked so damn good today.
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Trying to temper my excitement....but holy shit are the Niners firing on all cylinders, and to think we'll get Deebo back in a week or two.
They looked so damn good today.
They are definitely looking good. There toughest foe is going to be the Eagles in the playoffs, but it's looking more and more likely we will have a Bills-Niners superbowl. Then the Bills can lose their 5th superbowl :lol
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I would love to know if a Patriot player ever fumbled away a chance at a go-ahead TD late in the 4th quarter when TB was there. I bet it never happened. And that lateral last week?? Mac deserves better than this. Team should be 9-6.
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I would love to know if a Patriot player ever fumbled away a chance at a go-ahead TD late in the 4th quarter when TB was there. I bet it never happened.
Of course it never happened. Because Tom Brady willed it not to happen. ;D
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Trying to temper my excitement....but holy shit are the Niners firing on all cylinders, and to think we'll get Deebo back in a week or two.
They looked so damn good today.
They are definitely looking good. There toughest foe is going to be the Eagles in the playoffs, but it's looking more and more likely we will have a Bills-Niners superbowl. Then the Bills can lose their 5th superbowl :lol
I'm dearly hoping for that match up, my kid is a hardcore Bills fan.
On a side note, what does Bills stand for?
Boy
I
Love
Losing
Superbowls
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On a side note, what does Bills stand for?
Boy
I
Love
Losing
Superbowls
:)
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I would love to know if a Patriot player ever fumbled away a chance at a go-ahead TD late in the 4th quarter when TB was there. I bet it never happened. And that lateral last week?? Mac deserves better than this. Team should be 9-6.
You know, there had to be but I don't remember. I do remember in 2009 in a playoff game, there was a fumble against the Ravens when i was still trying to get to my seat. I left an hour before kickoff. It was nuts.
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I don't know why I never learn my lesson about changing my pick at the last minute. Every time I do it I get burned and I swear I'll never do it again. RLR. GB was an obvious pick here and I just didn't have the conjones to stick with it.
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I don't know why I never learn my lesson about changing my pick at the last minute. Every time I do it I get burned and I swear I'll never do it again. RLR. GB was an obvious pick here and I just didn't have the conjones to stick with it.
I loved GB and the points today, but didn't have the balls to bet it. Darn it.
Just think...a few weeks ago, Emmanuel Acho was arguing on FS1 that Tua was better than Justin Herbert. :rollin :rollin :rollin
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Goofed and picked the Broncos because I had it in my head Rypien would make the start. Wasn't following NFL news this week.
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I don't know why I never learn my lesson about changing my pick at the last minute. Every time I do it I get burned and I swear I'll never do it again. RLR. GB was an obvious pick here and I just didn't have the conjones to stick with it.
I loved GB and the points today, but didn't have the balls to bet it. Darn it.
Just think...a few weeks ago, Emmanuel Acho was arguing on FS1 that Tua was better than Justin Herbert. :rollin :rollin :rollin
Emmanuel Acho is a moron, much like most sports analysts.
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I don't know why I never learn my lesson about changing my pick at the last minute. Every time I do it I get burned and I swear I'll never do it again. RLR. GB was an obvious pick here and I just didn't have the conjones to stick with it.
Story of my (sports Pick’em) life. I’ve written about that a couple times.
Chris, if it matters, I thought he’d start too. Wilson’s worse than Ryan and he’s been benched twice!
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Man, the Broncos got wrecked! :lol
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For the first time ever, I’m getting the sense that Brady’s body isn’t doing what his brain is telling it to do. THREE bad downfield throws (the last for an INT). Underthrown and off target. It’s no crime; he’s 45 for God’s sake. I can’t really blame those on the routes being run.
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Bucs are not winning the division and not making the playoffs. Team is just not in sync with each other. Carolina is probably the division winner with the momentum they seem to be having of late.
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We’ll find out next week. That’s why Brady is the goat. The only play that matters is the next one.
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Emmanuel Acho is a moron, much like most sports analysts.
Acho is actually a really smart guy, but that was a terrible take on his part.
For the first time ever, I’m getting the sense that Brady’s body isn’t doing what his brain is telling it to do. THREE bad downfield throws (the last for an INT). Underthrown and off target. It’s no crime; he’s 45 for God’s sake. I can’t really blame those on the routes being run.
He looks about done, but while he has never looked this consistently bad in the regular season, I am still taking the "I will believe the Bucs are out of it when they lose in the playoffs" approach. I have seen this film too many times already.
If nothing else, it's gonna be hilarious when the Cowboys go 13-4 and lose in the 1st round to a 9-8 or 8-9 Tampa team. :lol :lol
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Also, Denver finally fired Hackett. Should have happened three months ago.
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Emmanuel Acho is a moron, much like most sports analysts.
Acho is actually a really smart guy, but that was a terrible take on his part.
For the first time ever, I’m getting the sense that Brady’s body isn’t doing what his brain is telling it to do. THREE bad downfield throws (the last for an INT). Underthrown and off target. It’s no crime; he’s 45 for God’s sake. I can’t really blame those on the routes being run.
He looks about done, but while he has never looked this consistently bad in the regular season, I am still taking the "I will believe the Bucs are out of it when they lose in the playoffs" approach. I have seen this film too many times already.
How many people thought the dude was done in 2014?
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Brady's 10 completions by air yards from down 16-6 to tied 16-16:
-6
-6
3
0
4
0
-1
6
4
-4
That's 0 air yards to gain 93 yards (YAC).
How many plays before Arizona realized they might need to cover the RB in the flat? ::)
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How many people thought the dude was done in 2014?
Maybe not done, but fading, yes, and the numbers backed it up, as I remember the stats on his deep passes getting less effective for example. I think that is when he started going to the fake doctor to stay in great shape and improve his overall body mobility and whatnot as he started to age, and the rest is history.
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How many people thought the dude was done in 2014?
Maybe not done, but fading, yes, and the numbers backed it up, as I remember the stats on his deep passes getting less effective for example. I think that is when he started going to the fake doctor to stay in great shape and improve his overall body mobility and whatnot as he started to age, and the rest is history.
Of course he's fading. I agree with you. I'm just suggesting that the guy seems to fade a whole lot slower than what we're accustomed to. It's hard to predict his trajectory, and numerous times he's looked done and leveled off for a while. Good quarterbacks can compensate for a loss of physical skills in other areas; particularly intelligence and experience. Peyton hung on a few more years by simply picking apart defenses in the shorter game. When TB12 has looked good this year that's what he's done. He's clearly coming up on the end of his career, but that doesn't mean he can't still be dangerous any given Sunday.
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How many people thought the dude was done in 2014?
Maybe not done, but fading, yes, and the numbers backed it up, as I remember the stats on his deep passes getting less effective for example. I think that is when he started going to the fake doctor to stay in great shape and improve his overall body mobility and whatnot as he started to age, and the rest is history.
He's used the fake doctor around 2006. Willie McGinest was working with Guerrero and that's how Brady was introduced to him.
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Trying to temper my excitement....but holy shit are the Niners firing on all cylinders, and to think we'll get Deebo back in a week or two.
They looked so damn good today.
I was there, and Levi's was ROCKIN'! From the moment they blared the beginning of For Whom the Bell Tolls when the team was coming out of the tunnel, right up until the end, you could just feel it. Although fans were getting a bit restless in the first quarter, when Ray Ray took off for that long TD run, the entire place came unglued.
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How many people thought the dude was done in 2014?
Maybe not done, but fading, yes, and the numbers backed it up, as I remember the stats on his deep passes getting less effective for example. I think that is when he started going to the fake doctor to stay in great shape and improve his overall body mobility and whatnot as he started to age, and the rest is history.
Of course he's fading. I agree with you. I'm just suggesting that the guy seems to fade a whole lot slower than what we're accustomed to. It's hard to predict his trajectory, and numerous times he's looked done and leveled off for a while. Good quarterbacks can compensate for a loss of physical skills in other areas; particularly intelligence and experience. Peyton hung on a few more years by simply picking apart defenses in the shorter game. When TB12 has looked good this year that's what he's done. He's clearly coming up on the end of his career, but that doesn't mean he can't still be dangerous any given Sunday.
And my post was, what, at halftime? Start of the third quarter? Brady did what all elite players do: found away to win, even if none of it will ever see a highlight film after the day after the game. I’m with Kev: I’ll count him out when he actually IS out.
On Hackett: I don’t know if the quote (about bathrooms in Wilson’s house versus his TDs) but it may as well be true. He’s taking one for the team there. I don’t really want either one, but I’d rather have Hackett next year than Wilson.
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I just saw an article that said that the Seahawks will get the number one overall pick if:
1. Denver loses out
2. Houston wins out
3. Chicago beats either Detroit or Minnesota
Now granted, that is a lot of things that have to happen. But looking at the given opponents, it doesn’t seem that unlikely either.
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Hef, what kind of draft capital can we expect to get from Carolina to take Zach Wilson off our hands?
Just saw this.
Not even the Panthers are this desperate.
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I'm not a neurologist or anything, but it kind of seems to me that if Tua is suffering mystery concussions he's in kind of sorry shape. I don't know how smart this kid is, but he's got the league over a barrel. My hunch is that the NFL would be thrilled to simply let him walk away with his guaranteed contract. He needs to skip out and settle down with his 30 million.
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Hef, what kind of draft capital can we expect to get from Carolina to take Zach Wilson off our hands?
Just saw this.
Not even the Panthers are this desperate.
No chance. But is Darnold playing his way back for another year? He's been highly efficient with a solid OL and running game behind him.
Maybe Sean Payton can help continue to rehabilitate him too. ;)
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I'm not a neurologist or anything, but it kind of seems to me that if Tua is suffering mystery concussions he's in kind of sorry shape. I don't know how smart this kid is, but he's got the league over a barrel. My hunch is that the NFL would be thrilled to simply let him walk away with his guaranteed contract. He needs to skip out and settle down with his 30 million.
I know this will sound kind of mean, but I think Tua simply isn't very good at protecting himself. Look at that play against GB the other day when his head hit the turf. We have seen Tom Brady get tackled 45,444 times over the years, and I've never seen him fall and his head hit the ground like that. Same with the play against the Bengals earlier this year when he swung down hard and his head smashed into the ground. He looked like a guy who had no clue how to protect himself when getting tackled. And both hits I am referencing were good, legal tackles. I agree with you in that the guy ought to be smart and take the money he has made and retire today. His long term health is at risk if he continues to play, if it isn't already.
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So Hoodie Jr benched Carr for the rest of the season, Carr essentially leaves the organization. I see Hoodie is taking responsibility for tanking the team and giving Carr his worst year in some time. Davante is not happy and I am guessing the locker room won't be too keen on this either.
My guess is Hoodie will get one more year there with a no name QB and get fired. Carr will go somewhere that could use a good QB and probably have a bounceback year further cementing Hoodie's failure.
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So Hoodie Jr benched Carr for the rest of the season, Carr essentially leaves the organization. I see Hoodie is taking responsibility for tanking the team and giving Carr his worst year in some time. Davante is not happy and I am guessing the locker room won't be too keen on this either.
My guess is Hoodie will get one more year there with a no name QB and get fired. Carr will go somewhere that could use a good QB and probably have a bounceback year further cementing Hoodie's failure.
Yep, it just shows that McDaniels is a bigger clown of a head coach than I had thought. He was handed a playoff team with a good QB who had been great at times AND the addition of one of the top WRs in football...and they are now at 6-9 and look to be moving off their QB whose played has declined under McDaniels, a supposed QB guru. What a joke. His entire rep is built off playing calls in NE for Tom Brady, but history has shown that he is a stooge whenever Brady is not his QB.
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The David Carr situation strikes me more as more of a management thing than a coaching thing. If you want to blame JMD for the 6-9 season that's cool, but I wouldn't put this on him. The only way benching him makes sense is from a financial perspective if you've decided to get rid of him--can't risk him being injured. One thing I'm confident on is that Josh McDaniels didn't walk into Mark Davis's office, pound on the desk, and demand that Carr be let go immediately. That's absurd.
Also, JMD is around for at least another season for financial reasons. If there's anything that might get him sacked this year it would be winning another game. I'd bet good money that he's got direct orders to lose out. Ownership has made clear their intentions.
An interesting thing to consider right now is who's got more clout, Ziegler or JMD? I think it likely that Mark Davis DGAF what either one of them think at this point.
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Just saw that Lazard was fined for his "taunting" celebration on the play where his block took out 3 Miami defenders. https://www.yahoo.com/sports/packers-wr-allen-lazard-fined-10-k-after-counting-to-3-for-each-miami-defender-he-toppled-with-one-block-190050463.html
What complete and utter idiocy by the NFL. It's a player celebrating having made a big play. There was nothing obscene or unsportsmanlike about it. It didn't hold up the game at all. I just don't get it. I suspect that most of the defenders that ended up on the ground after that play wouldn't have felt overly salty about it if asked and would have acknowledged that it was a great play. So we want to punish a player for being excited and celebrating making an outstanding play like this, while we allow entire games to grind to a halt every time there is a turnover and the entire defensive squad runs down the field to the endzone and poses for a picture? Seems really inconsistent to me.
And by the way, the latter type of celebration annoys me. I mean, honestly, I love player celebrations. I think it adds a lot of fun to the game, even when the celebrations are stupid. But the entire team running down the field and posing for a group pic for every turnover? Why? If it's a pick-six or a scoop-and-score, sure. But just a turnover by itself? That doesn't need the whole team and doesn't warrant a stoppage in play.
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Well, I hate to say it, but NFL officiating strikes again.
Did anyone see the end of Denver/KC? On the Broncos 4th down failed play, Chris Jones literally picked up Russell Wilson and slammed him to the ground. No flag. Based on the standard the NFL set all season, that should have been a no-brainer roughing the passer flag, which would have given the Broncos a 1st down inside the KC with a minute and change to go and three timeouts, down 3 with a chance to tie at worst and maybe win. Instead, the officials protect the NFL's new golden boy (Mahomes) and throw no flag and it's basically game over.
It is any wonder I don't watch the NFL as much as I used to?
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I try to keep officiating bitching to a minimum. But within a 5 minute stretch we had a no-call on some clear Raiders holding one a big touchdown pass and then got a holding call on Kittle in which there was nothing even close to it.
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It is an epidemic. I think replay is killing the game, slowly.
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That run by McCaffrey :omg:
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I don't see how that Adams catch was questionable. He's bobbling it and the ground pounds it into him. Clearly incomplete as far as I'm concerned.
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From 7-4 and firmly in control of their playoff destiny to 7-9 and eliminated from playoff contention. I’m so sick of this bullshit.
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I don't see how that Adams catch was questionable. He's bobbling it and the ground pounds it into him. Clearly incomplete as far as I'm concerned.
There was no clear shot of it actually on the ground, and I think they needed that to overrule it
Edit: Oh yeah!!!
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9 in a row! In control of the #2 seed, and the #1 is still in play.
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His lack of playoff success in the last 10 years is still glaring, but Mike Tomlin getting this Steelers team to 8-8 with a week to play seems like a minor miracle.
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I’m dumbfounded by the Packers turnaround. An absolute miracle they can still make the playoffs after being 4-8.
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I’m dumbfounded by the Packers turnaround. An absolute miracle they can still make the playoffs after being 4-8.
Yeah, that is crazy. Lots of pretty weak teams making it in the playoffs this year.
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I have thought for the last few weeks that the 49ers had become the team to beat in the NFC, but seeing their defense get taken to the woodshed by the Raiders backup QB makes me pause a bit now. I don't know who else I'd pick, though. I think Philly has one and done written all over them now.
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I have thought for the last few weeks that the 49ers had become the team to beat in the NFC, but seeing their defense get taken to the woodshed by the Raiders backup QB makes me pause a bit now. I don't know who else I'd pick, though. I think Philly has one and done written all over them now.
I like Philly if Hurts is healthy, they can score at will. I think the Niners game was an aberration, but hard to think Purdy can take them all the way. Minnesota’s O-line is decimated by injury and their defense stinks. Tampa Tom is the ultimate wildcard, just don’t know what team is going to show up.
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Yeah...yesterday was definitely a trap game for the Niners, I imagine the Raiders were putting everything into it to survive.
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My God, that Bills player that collapsed was so damn scary. Players are praying all around him.
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This is probably something really bad, Joe Buck just said they've been administering CPR for the last 9 mins now.
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It's shocking to see. I feel so bad for him and his teammates.
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What the heck happened? I got home from work and they were in the studio...and now they're back live, but I can't find any video or anything.
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Game has been temporarily suspended. Bills players crying, weeping and looking like ghosts right now. Don't know exactly what happened, maybe he got hit in the chest really hard and caused some heart attack or something.
Video (https://twitter.com/highlghtheaven/status/1610093779142299649?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1610093779142299649%7Ctwgr%5Ec182b4e437bda2eee1be2943659ebb963ecbae64%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2Fnfl%2Fcomments%2F101uzj8%2Finjury_demar_hamlin_injury_replay%2F)doesn't look too bad but the type of hit might be bad.
For the ambulance to come on the field after CPR for that long, not sure it's a good sign
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What the heck happened? I got home from work and they were in the studio...and now they're back live, but I can't find any video or anything.
I PM'd you. Didn't want to post it here.
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Very scary. I don't see any way they play again tonight. More importantly, hope Hamlin is okay.
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What the heck happened? I got home from work and they were in the studio...and now they're back live, but I can't find any video or anything.
I saw a brief replay on twitter, seemed like a totally run of the mill tackle.
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I am stunned as I wonder if I saw my worst nightmare playout on the field. I hope not but it doesn't look good.
Virtual hugs to his family and here's hoping for the best.
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That has to be the most bizarre thing I’ve ever seen on the field. The hit didn’t look that bad. Sure hope that he will be ok.
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Just heard what's going on, quite speechless. Even the guys in the studio are barely holding on.
He just went limp and down... Doesn't even seem like a heart attack.
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I removed the sarcastic subtitle from the title of this thread, as it felt just wrong to be talking about what is going on and leaving that silliness there.
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What the heck happened? I got home from work and they were in the studio...and now they're back live, but I can't find any video or anything.
I PM'd you. Didn't want to post it here.
Thanks...I found it. Just crazy. Like Dub said, it didn't look like anything out of the ordinary. Needless to say, I hope he's ok soon.
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Bills staff packing up equipment from the sideline right now, don't think the game will continue.
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Postponed. When was the last time a game was postponed like this?
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Hamlin is apparently in critical condition at the hospital.
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I missed the hit while walking my dog but I did see it on a sports doctors youtube, he claimed it might be commotio cordis. I really hope he is ok, just stunning how a hit can look run of the mill but do some damage.
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There were some games played on Tuesdays and Wednesdays during the 2020 season due to Covid. This is unprecedented though, I don’t know how this gets played this week though, even if Hamlin’s condition greatly improves quickly.
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It's really moving to see how people come together in an awful time like this. The hugs and prayers and all the responses have me a little choked up.
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Yeah, I saw that Hamlin's charity has gotten almost half a million dollars in donations in the last 90 minutes.
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Hopefully not equivalent, but brought to mind Hank Gathers.
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*opens twitter*
*sees someone blame his collapse on the COVID vaccine*
*closes twitter*
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*opens twitter*
*sees someone blame his collapse on the COVID vaccine*
*closes twitter*
I saw someone on Facebook say the same thing.
I fucking hate people.
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*opens twitter*
*sees someone blame his collapse on the COVID vaccine*
*closes twitter*
I saw someone on Facebook say the same thing.
I fucking hate people.
On the flip side of humanity, I have developed an immense respect for Ryan Clark after watching him talk to Van Pelt.
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*opens twitter*
*sees someone blame his collapse on the COVID vaccine*
*closes twitter*
I saw someone on Facebook say the same thing.
I fucking hate people.
On the flip side of humanity, I have developed an immense respect for Ryan Clark after watching him talk to Van Pelt.
Didn't see that, but I have seen some other solid displays including a few Bengals fans holding up signs of support. I guess I don't hate all people.
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Supposedly the NFL told the two teams to warm up and be ready to play in five minutes. Zach Taylor and Sean McDermott then came together, talked, told the league to fuck off, sent their players to the locker room, and said they won’t play.
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Supposedly the NFL told the two teams to warm up and be ready to play in five minutes. Zach Taylor and Sean McDermott then came together, talked, told the league to fuck off, sent their players to the locker room, and said they won’t play.
I've heard that as well...
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First off, all of the doctors on YT diagnosing this can run right off and go fuck themselves. They're awfully quick to rush out a diagnosis with no medical history and no idea what had gone on in the preceding two hours. And especially fuck the guys who managed to work in the word "vaccine". No rung of hell sufficient for those assholes.
Hope the kid's alright.
If anybody other than Goodell made the decision to scrub the game hat's off to them. Somebody somewhere made the decision to call off a game with billions of dollars worth of implications, probably with the understanding that there's no established path to take moving forward. That's some Gene Kranz level ownership right there. Admirable.
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On the flip side of humanity, I have developed an immense respect for Ryan Clark after watching him talk to Van Pelt.
I'd never seen more than the occasional 20 second soundbite of that guy, but fuck him too. Man, the media coverage of this has just been sickening. I'm as anxious for information as the next guy, but the way these people so desperately want to dish it out is repugnant.
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Wonder if the NFL has war-gamed these types of situations in advance, so they are not Vince McMahon-ing their way through a crisis.
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On the flip side of humanity, I have developed an immense respect for Ryan Clark after watching him talk to Van Pelt.
I'd never seen more than the occasional 20 second soundbite of that guy, but fuck him too. Man, the media coverage of this has just been sickening. I'm as anxious for information as the next guy, but the way these people so desperately want to dish it out is repugnant.
Agreed. Schefter is the worst. He tried to put on a "we hope Damar Hamlin is okay" front, but it looked so fake. He had kind of showed his ass the last couple years anyway, and ESPN should be ashamed for having their promo for MNF including that shot of a shirtless Shefter mocking Kirk Cousins, but I thought even less of him after last night. I thought the candor of both Buck and Aikman, all things considered, was good, though.
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I really hope he is OK. That was one of the most awful things I've ever seen.
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Terrible :'(. I hope he pulls through without life-changing after-effects. Exhibit A of why there are so many measures being taken to make the sport safer. All the knuckle-dragging fans who say the league is getting too "soft" can leave the room permanently, the NFL doesn't need that type of fan to thrive.
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Wonder if the NFL has war-gamed these types of situations in advance, so they are not Vince McMahon-ing their way through a crisis.
I don't know what's the worse answer, that A) With a game this violent they haven't war-gamed such scenarios, or B) They have and the end result was them trying to order play to resume after 5 minutes.
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CNN is saying it was a cardiac arrest...
https://www.cnn.com/us/live-news/damar-hamlin-collapse-bills-bengals-game-intl-hnk/index.html (https://www.cnn.com/us/live-news/damar-hamlin-collapse-bills-bengals-game-intl-hnk/index.html)
Radio report just said he's still in critical condition and sedated.
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No one, I mean NO ONE seems to be bringing up Chuck Hughes of the Detroit Lions, who died on the field against the Bears in 1971.
https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/chuck-hughes-only-nfl-player-to-die-in-game/114oyq1niwf5p15lxwuo62m1ma
radio broadcast https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lIlyvFg9-S4
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chuck_Hughes
(quite a career at Texas Western (UTEP). btw, how nice of the school to wait until 2006 to put him in their HOF. :tdwn Wonder if his parents or any family was still alive at that time)
I remember the day and the aftermath quite well. Trivial: he wore #85, because his request to wear #13 was refused...so he chose the '8+5'
******
This is a somewhat common type of 'injury' in lacrosse. Both sports need to start providing snap on protection for that area of the body.
Sorry for Damar Hamlin's family right now. Can only speculate on what is going on right now, and the decisions they are having to contemplate. :'(
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What are the chances this was really unrelated to football and was due to heart issue he otherwise had? I can't see a routine tackle directly causing a person's heart to stop without some sort of underlying condition. Scary stuff regardless. I hope he survives and makes a full recovery.
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What are the chances this was really unrelated to football and was due to heart issue he otherwise had? I can't see a routine tackle directly causing a person's heart to stop without some sort of underlying condition. Scary stuff regardless. I hope he survives and makes a full recovery.
I was just listening to a doctor on the radio talk about it, and he's speculating it was that freak happenstance of just the right hit at just the right time during the heartbeat to stop it. He said they happen less than a hundred times a year, usually to little league baseball players.
He also said that for every minute of the brain being deprived of blood, it's efficiency reduces 10% :'(
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I was just listening to a doctor on the radio talk about it, and he's speculating it was that freak happenstance of just the right hit at just the right time during the heartbeat to stop it.
This happened to Chris Pronger back in 1998 when he was hit with a puck
https://youtu.be/4S1Dfs8hgR4
And also to Jay Bouwmeester in 2020 had a cardiac incident that required paddles and CPR. This ended his career
https://youtu.be/8mlowENegl0
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What are the chances this was really unrelated to football and was due to heart issue he otherwise had? I can't see a routine tackle directly causing a person's heart to stop without some sort of underlying condition. Scary stuff regardless. I hope he survives and makes a full recovery.
I was just listening to a doctor on the radio talk about it, and he's speculating it was that freak happenstance of just the right hit at just the right time during the heartbeat to stop it. He said they happen less than a hundred times a year, usually to little league baseball players.
He also said that for every minute of the brain being deprived of blood, it's efficiency reduces 10% :'(
Yeah - I understand that there is a condition that is found in young kids 13 to 18 where there is a sack that develops around heart meant to protect it. Speculation is that his wasn't as developed and the heart just stopped. This can happen in kid sports and you're chances of survival drastically increases with a defibrillator on the sideline.
I too worry about his brain considering the amount of time his heart was stopped.
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What are the chances this was really unrelated to football and was due to heart issue he otherwise had? I can't see a routine tackle directly causing a person's heart to stop without some sort of underlying condition. Scary stuff regardless. I hope he survives and makes a full recovery.
I was just listening to a doctor on the radio talk about it, and he's speculating it was that freak happenstance of just the right hit at just the right time during the heartbeat to stop it. He said they happen less than a hundred times a year, usually to little league baseball players.
I knew a kid that died from it when I was younger. He was a goalie in Lacrosse and took one to the chest :(
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Well, I hate to say it, but NFL officiating strikes again.
Did anyone see the end of Denver/KC? On the Broncos 4th down failed play, Chris Jones literally picked up Russell Wilson and slammed him to the ground. No flag. Based on the standard the NFL set all season, that should have been a no-brainer roughing the passer flag, which would have given the Broncos a 1st down inside the KC with a minute and change to go and three timeouts, down 3 with a chance to tie at worst and maybe win. Instead, the officials protect the NFL's new golden boy (Mahomes) and throw no flag and it's basically game over.
It is any wonder I don't watch the NFL as much as I used to?
But Mahomes is the GOAT! And Brady is an NFL Stooge! Get your narratives straight! :) :) :) :)
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First off, all of the doctors on YT diagnosing this can run right off and go fuck themselves. They're awfully quick to rush out a diagnosis with no medical history and no idea what had gone on in the preceding two hours. And especially fuck the guys who managed to work in the word "vaccine". No rung of hell sufficient for those assholes.
Hope the kid's alright.
If anybody other than Goodell made the decision to scrub the game hat's off to them. Somebody somewhere made the decision to call off a game with billions of dollars worth of implications, probably with the understanding that there's no established path to take moving forward. That's some Gene Kranz level ownership right there. Admirable.
I think it's pretty clear from what I saw that Zach Taylor was instrumental in getting this game suspended. He went right over to McDermott - who was beside himself, that much was obvious - and said, as far as I can tell through lip-reading, "we're done". Then later in the space outside the locker room, it was clear they - the two coaches - were doing most of the talking on a call that was, according to ESPN, with the league office.
I was surprised to see how slow ESPN was with information; I don't know if they were being cagey because of the delicacy of the moment, but in hindsight, it was pretty clear what was happening on the field and there was a paucity of details from the people reporting on the game (and that includes SVP, who repeatedly said they had the same video feeds as those in Cincy).
On the flip side of humanity, I have developed an immense respect for Ryan Clark after watching him talk to Van Pelt.
I'd never seen more than the occasional 20 second soundbite of that guy, but fuck him too. Man, the media coverage of this has just been sickening. I'm as anxious for information as the next guy, but the way these people so desperately want to dish it out is repugnant.
What's the problem with Van Pelt? He's goofy, and not as funny as he thinks he is, but he runs a good show, more often than not. Ryan Clark is the gem, though; even on good (meaning, happy) days, his insight and knowledge of the game is pretty damn high.
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I was just listening to a doctor on the radio talk about it, and he's speculating it was that freak happenstance of just the right hit at just the right time during the heartbeat to stop it.
This happened to Chris Pronger back in 1998 when he was hit with a puck
https://youtu.be/4S1Dfs8hgR4
And also to Jay Bouwmeester in 2020 had a cardiac incident that required paddles and CPR. This ended his career
https://youtu.be/8mlowENegl0
I've heard of this a couple times in hockey (because of the blunt force of the puck hitting the chest).
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What's the problem with Van Pelt? He's goofy, and not as funny as he thinks he is, but he runs a good show, more often than not. Ryan Clark is the gem, though; even on good (meaning, happy) days, his insight and knowledge of the game is pretty damn high.
I just thought he was trying way too hard to be the star reporter. That wasn't a situation where his own personality needed to be the focus, and he was damn sure trying to make it so.
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No one, I mean NO ONE seems to be bringing up Chuck Hughes of the Detroit Lions, who died on the field against the Bears in 1971.
Greg Bedard mentioned it on Boston Sports Tonight last night.
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No one, I mean NO ONE seems to be bringing up Chuck Hughes of the Detroit Lions, who died on the field against the Bears in 1971.
Greg Bedard mentioned it on Boston Sports Tonight last night.
Yeah, the radio station I listen to talked about it this morning too.
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I was thinking this morning about the fact that CPR is successful restarting a heart only a very small percentage of the time (like around 5% of the time if I recall correctly), so the fact that he didn't die right there on the field is very encouraging. I haven't hear reports of a AED being used, which I'm curious about. Those greatly increase the chances of success, but they are only useful if a particular thing is happening with the heart. I assume the teams have one on the field.
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I was thinking this morning about the fact that CPR is successful restarting a heart only a very small percentage of the time (like around 5% of the time if I recall correctly), so the fact that he didn't die right there on the field is very encouraging. I haven't hear reports of a AED being used, which I'm curious about. Those greatly increase the chances of success, but they are only useful if a particular thing is happening with the heart. I assume the teams have one on the field.
He was zapped on the field. If the speculation about what happened is correct, the blow short-circuited his heart knocking it out of sinus rhythm, and setting it back right wouldn't have been too hard, I imagine. The CPR would have been to keep things moving during the time it took to defib him. And I'd bet a fair amount that there are 15 AEDs scattered all around that stadium for the occasional overweight football fan who goes too hard on the beer and chili dogs. The on the field medical team probably has the same gear you'd find in a first class ER.
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I was thinking this morning about the fact that CPR is successful restarting a heart only a very small percentage of the time (like around 5% of the time if I recall correctly), so the fact that he didn't die right there on the field is very encouraging. I haven't hear reports of a AED being used, which I'm curious about. Those greatly increase the chances of success, but they are only useful if a particular thing is happening with the heart. I assume the teams have one on the field.
My guess is that the general public understand CPR better than any other moniker. Besides, I think you perform CPR with and AED as an option.
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No one, I mean NO ONE seems to be bringing up Chuck Hughes of the Detroit Lions, who died on the field against the Bears in 1971.
https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/chuck-hughes-only-nfl-player-to-die-in-game/114oyq1niwf5p15lxwuo62m1ma
radio broadcast https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lIlyvFg9-S4
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chuck_Hughes
(quite a career at Texas Western (UTEP). btw, how nice of the school to wait until 2006 to put him in their HOF. :tdwn Wonder if his parents or any family was still alive at that time)
If you look at the edit history for the Chuck Hughes Wikipedia article, you'll see that, at some point yesterday evening, someone edited the end of the first paragraph to say he was one of only two people to die on the field, the second being Damar Hamlin.
I was just listening to a doctor on the radio talk about it, and he's speculating it was that freak happenstance of just the right hit at just the right time during the heartbeat to stop it.
This happened to Chris Pronger back in 1998 when he was hit with a puck
https://youtu.be/4S1Dfs8hgR4
And also to Jay Bouwmeester in 2020 had a cardiac incident that required paddles and CPR. This ended his career
https://youtu.be/8mlowENegl0
I've heard of this a couple times in hockey (because of the blunt force of the puck hitting the chest).
When my kid was still playing baseball (13-14 year olds), there was an incident where the pitcher took a line drive to the chest. The umpire immediately called dead ball and did whatever sort of rough analysis youth sports umpires are trained to do. The kid was fine and the game continued. Between innings, I talked with the umpire, and he said that he had been involved in another game where something similar happened and the kid had to be taken to the hospital afterwards. You get a projectile to the chest at 70+ mph (hockey slap shot or batted ball) or a helmet at 20+ mph with 200+ pounds of force at just the wrong time, and there's going to be trouble.
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I'm kind of fascinated by what the league does about this. This was/is a key matchup and it kind of keeps the rest of the AFC in limbo pending the outcome. Scrubbing the game would no doubt be the simplest option. Kind of sucks for both Cinci and Buff as they were still vying for the bye. Doesn't seem inconceivable that they could extend the season a week. I figure that week off between the championship games and the Superb Owl is there for a reason. The league has to have wargamed this scenario. One advantage of that is the week 19 game would be the only one, and it might very well be the game of the year.
Whatever they do they should probably figure it out quickly.
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Well, I hate to say it, but NFL officiating strikes again.
Did anyone see the end of Denver/KC? On the Broncos 4th down failed play, Chris Jones literally picked up Russell Wilson and slammed him to the ground. No flag. Based on the standard the NFL set all season, that should have been a no-brainer roughing the passer flag, which would have given the Broncos a 1st down inside the KC with a minute and change to go and three timeouts, down 3 with a chance to tie at worst and maybe win. Instead, the officials protect the NFL's new golden boy (Mahomes) and throw no flag and it's basically game over.
It is any wonder I don't watch the NFL as much as I used to?
It is interesting you saw it this way, but you are a Denver fan . . . I've seen it commented on quite a bit that several times when KC had Russell in the grasp the zebras swallowed their whistles almost as if they were baiting KC to slam him to the ground so they could throw a flag. Make up your mind refs! Either blow the stupid whistle asap to prevent injury to the QB or let them play, you can't have it both ways. But it's what you expect from incompetence.
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Money is the only reason the NFL will make them play the game. No way are the Bills going to be mentally engaged in playing not only this upcoming weekend but some may take weeks or longer to be comfortable to get back on the field.
Even Bengals players will have issues playing again.
It really is a a no win situation.
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I hope they call it a tie and don't make them replay it.
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Money is the only reason the NFL will make them play the game. No way are the Bills going to be mentally engaged in playing not only this upcoming weekend but some may take weeks or longer to be comfortable to get back on the field.
Even Bengals players will have issues playing again.
It really is a a no win situation.
The Bills could be emotionally scarred that way. Or they could take this, stride on and play the game the best they can for Darrell.
I can see them taking this to heart and playing even harder now because they have something they're playing for now.
I would rather have my team-mates continue playing and continue on to winning the super bowl, than worry about me and not accomplishing what the entire team worked hard for, including myself.
I hope they call it a tie and don't make them replay it.
I think this is the best possible solution for this. It doesn't screw with the playoff picture, and both teams are not technically taking a loss either. Honestly, in these situations, I think the only solution is to administer the game as a tie.
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Money is the only reason the NFL will make them play the game. No way are the Bills going to be mentally engaged in playing not only this upcoming weekend but some may take weeks or longer to be comfortable to get back on the field.
Even Bengals players will have issues playing again.
It really is a a no win situation.
In truth, there have been worse injuries to happen on the field and teams manage to continue. I'm not suggesting they should have played last night; I agree with the decision. You don't wear the black armband forever, though.
I think this is the best possible solution for this. It doesn't screw with the playoff picture, and both teams are not technically taking a loss either. Honestly, in these situations, I think the only solution is to administer the game as a tie.
It kind of does screw the playoff picture. I could be wrong, but I think under that scenario Buffalo no longer controls their own destiny, and the Bengals are knocked out of contention for the #1.
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What are the chances this was really unrelated to football and was due to heart issue he otherwise had? I can't see a routine tackle directly causing a person's heart to stop without some sort of underlying condition. Scary stuff regardless. I hope he survives and makes a full recovery.
I was just listening to a doctor on the radio talk about it, and he's speculating it was that freak happenstance of just the right hit at just the right time during the heartbeat to stop it. He said they happen less than a hundred times a year, usually to little league baseball players.
He also said that for every minute of the brain being deprived of blood, it's efficiency reduces 10% :'(
When I looked at the incident footage, I noticed that he got hit right in that area by the heart. I did wonder if he got hit there, and then it triggered something either his heart, nerves, arteries, which then caused him to collapse.
I know this is possible due to having the wind knocked out of me before. Depending on your physicality, certain amounts of force is all it takes to do some good damage to your organs. The shock from these hits is enough to cause damage or make your internal organs act out.
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NFL said the game won't be played/resumed this week.
I'm very curious how they handle it.
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Calling it a tie vs. just scrubbing it altogether have the same outcome, as far as playoff seeding. Buffalo, Cincy, and KC all locked up top 3 seeding and can't fall below #3 no matter what. It's just within that top 3 that things get interesting. Both Cincy and Buffalo hold tiebreakers over KC. If they had played the game and Buffalo won, they would be in the #1 spot. If Cincy had won, they would still be a game behind, but could claim the #1 if KC loses next week and Cincy wins. But most of that is moot if they don't replay the game.
If the game is either just scrubbed or dubbed a tie, what it means for seeding is this:
-If KC wins, they are the #1.
-If KC loses and Buffalo wins, Buffalo is the #1, KC is #2, and Cincy is #3 regardless what they do.
-If KC and Buffalo both lose and Cincy wins, KC is #1, Cincy is #2, and Buffalo is #3.
A tie or just having the game "missing" from the schedule has no impact.
So, to summarize: Not playing it at all or calling it a tie has an impact on playoff seeding for the top 3. But either of those options has the same impact.
Those above scenarios also bring me back to some of the negative comments about Goodell/the league initially saying the players should take a break, warm up, and resume the game. I don't have a dog in the fight of whether Goodell is evil incarnate, or something else. But giving him and the league the benefit of the doubt in this situation, since (1) we don't really know all the facts (I was hearing reports this morning that that "you have 5 minutes to warm up and then we will resume play" may not have actually happened, for example), and (2) even if we have all the facts, I don't think we know what the intent was. I could very much see a scenario where it played out something like:
-Goodell/NFL: "Uh...not sure how best to handle this. But both of these teams have a LOT on the line in terms of the playoffs, and it's not fair to all the other players, coaches, and others who have worked so hard this whole season to throw off the playoff seeding by making an executive decision rather than letting it be decided on the field. So I guess let's warm up and resume."
-Buffalo and Cincy coaches: "Yeah, we don't care about that at the moment. We can't go forward right now. Let the chips fall where they may."
-Goodell/NFL: "I'm good with that. Great call."
I could completely respect everything about that scenario without casting stones at anybody.
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(quite a career at Texas Western (UTEP). btw, how nice of the school to wait until 2006 to put him in their HOF. :tdwn Wonder if his parents or any family was still alive at that time)
FYI, the UTEP Athletics HOF didn't exist until 2002, so 2006 wasn't much of a wait.
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Those above scenarios also bring me back to some of the negative comments about Goodell/the league initially saying the players should take a break, warm up, and resume the game. I don't have a dog in the fight of whether Goodell is evil incarnate, or something else. But giving him and the league the benefit of the doubt in this situation, since (1) we don't really know all the facts (I was hearing reports this morning that that "you have 5 minutes to warm up and then we will resume play" may not have actually happened, for example), and (2) even if we have all the facts, I don't think we know what the intent was. I could very much see a scenario where it played out something like:
-Goodell/NFL: "Uh...not sure how best to handle this. But both of these teams have a LOT on the line in terms of the playoffs, and it's not fair to all the other players, coaches, and others who have worked so hard this whole season to throw off the playoff seeding by making an executive decision rather than letting it be decided on the field. So I guess let's warm up and resume."
-Buffalo and Cincy coaches: "Yeah, we don't care about that at the moment. We can't go forward right now. Let the chips fall where they may."
-Goodell/NFL: "I'm good with that. Great call."
I could completely respect everything about that scenario without casting stones at anybody.
If the actual conversations lined up in this manner, I think people can accept it without making anyone look callous.
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The entertainment business has a well known motto "the show must go on". While it seems most agree that the right call was to end the game, the NFL considering starting it back up shouldn't be a shock or surprise, and honestly, it sounds like even if they wanted to keep playing, the gave in pretty easily. I'm not really sure I can rip the NFL here. If anything, it sounds like maybe society as a whole has learned that sports/entertainment are not more important. I remember watching the WWE pay per view when Owen Hart fell and died, that show went on when it shouldn't have. Maybe we are getting better.
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Calling it a tie vs. just scrubbing it altogether have the same outcome, as far as playoff seeding. Buffalo, Cincy, and KC all locked up top 3 seeding and can't fall below #3 no matter what. It's just within that top 3 that things get interesting. Both Cincy and Buffalo hold tiebreakers over KC. If they had played the game and Buffalo won, they would be in the #1 spot. If Cincy had won, they would still be a game behind, but could claim the #1 if KC loses next week and Cincy wins. But most of that is moot if they don't replay the game.
If the game is either just scrubbed or dubbed a tie, what it means for seeding is this:
-If KC wins, they are the #1.
-If KC loses and Buffalo wins, Buffalo is the #1, KC is #2, and Cincy is #3 regardless what they do.
-If KC and Buffalo both lose and Cincy wins, KC is #1, Cincy is #2, and Buffalo is #3.
A tie or just having the game "missing" from the schedule has no impact.
So, to summarize: Not playing it at all or calling it a tie has an impact on playoff seeding for the top 3. But either of those options has the same impact.
Those above scenarios also bring me back to some of the negative comments about Goodell/the league initially saying the players should take a break, warm up, and resume the game. I don't have a dog in the fight of whether Goodell is evil incarnate, or something else. But giving him and the league the benefit of the doubt in this situation, since (1) we don't really know all the facts (I was hearing reports this morning that that "you have 5 minutes to warm up and then we will resume play" may not have actually happened, for example), and (2) even if we have all the facts, I don't think we know what the intent was. I could very much see a scenario where it played out something like:
-Goodell/NFL: "Uh...not sure how best to handle this. But both of these teams have a LOT on the line in terms of the playoffs, and it's not fair to all the other players, coaches, and others who have worked so hard this whole season to throw off the playoff seeding by making an executive decision rather than letting it be decided on the field. So I guess let's warm up and resume."
-Buffalo and Cincy coaches: "Yeah, we don't care about that at the moment. We can't go forward right now. Let the chips fall where they may."
-Goodell/NFL: "I'm good with that. Great call."
I could completely respect everything about that scenario without casting stones at anybody.
Yeah, I have no idea how this all went down. I put so little faith in how ESPN was reporting it in realtime that the narrative of "you've got five minutes from. . . . NOW!" never really factored into my consideration. What it comes down to is that somebody, somewhere made a decision to not finish the game, and given the consequences and chaos that would surely follow that was a monumental thing to do. The only knock I'd put on Roger, and it isn't really a knock, is that anybody else making that decision has a lot more riding on it, IMO. Roger is paid to be fireproof. He's the lightning rod for the owners, so there are no repercussions for any decision he makes. If it were the league overseeing the game who made the determination I'd regard it as a whole lot ballsier.
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The entertainment business has a well known motto "the show must go on". While it seems most agree that the right call was to end the game, the NFL considering starting it back up shouldn't be a shock or surprise, and honestly, it sounds like even if they wanted to keep playing, the gave in pretty easily. I'm not really sure I can rip the NFL here. If anything, it sounds like maybe society as a whole has learned that sports/entertainment are not more important. I remember watching the WWE pay per view when Owen Hart fell and died, that show went on when it shouldn't have. Maybe we are getting better.
Sometimes it takes a human to hit a brick wall, to fall from grace, to realize the humanity.
But let me tell you, Sports is more significant than most realize. The entire structure is centered around Sports. Sports is as close to competition and determining who is better than the other humans can achieve that doesn't go to the violent lengths of Warring over who is the GOAT. There are various reasons Sports has grown into the biggest spectacle mankind has ever witnessed.
My take is I hope more people are realizing that these players/athletes are human just like them. And that their entire life and career is basically to distract you from your lousy life. They don't have to play, but they do go out there in these conditions, train consistently, and are highly energized with adrenaline, and human bodies can only handle so much force and adrenaline before it starts to give.
It's like, if you know you have breathing issues, you don't go and start running a marathon. This is why it's fascinating to wonder just how healthy these athletes are and just how far they're pushing the limits of the human body all for the entertainment of us. This is a reason why I have respect for any athlete. Because they're out there pushing the limits of their body to the point where a single forceful blow to the chest area can have a devastating effect.
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My take is I hope more people are realizing that these players are human just like them. And that their entire life and career is basically to distract you from your lousy life. They don't have to play, but they do go out there in these conditions, train consistently, and are highly energized with adrenaline, and human bodies can only handle so much force and adrenaline before it starts to give.
It's like, if you know you have breathing issues, you don't go and start running a marathon. This is why it's fascinating to wonder just how healthy these athletes are and just how far they're pushing the limits of the human body all for the entertainment of us. This is a reason why I have respect for any athlete. Because they're out there pushing the limits of their body to the point where a single forceful blow to the chest area can have a devastating effect.
While it provides entertainment, these guys aren't in it to entertain us. Not at all.
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My take is I hope more people are realizing that these players are human just like them. And that their entire life and career is basically to distract you from your lousy life. They don't have to play, but they do go out there in these conditions, train consistently, and are highly energized with adrenaline, and human bodies can only handle so much force and adrenaline before it starts to give.
It's like, if you know you have breathing issues, you don't go and start running a marathon. This is why it's fascinating to wonder just how healthy these athletes are and just how far they're pushing the limits of the human body all for the entertainment of us. This is a reason why I have respect for any athlete. Because they're out there pushing the limits of their body to the point where a single forceful blow to the chest area can have a devastating effect.
While it provides entertainment, these guys aren't in it to entertain us. Not at all.
There's various reasons each one can give for why they chose to have a career in Sports. Money is one. Being famous is another. But in the grand scheme of things, they're only there in the NFL to play the game of Football for the people of America. And obviously, if they don't like playing for the League than they're free to walk out that door or be fined, penalized, for not being the player the league wants them to be.
Playing for fun is not the same as playing as a career. But as a player, you can still have fun with it. Because in the end the athlete is there because of their love and passion for playing the sport.
I guess, what I meant to say is that the entire point of the NFL and the other Major Sports leagues is to give the people a bone and let them have something that distracts them from how miserable the system is making them.
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No Ben, that's what we use for escapism. They play for a lifelong dream, money secondary and fame. All kids in sports grow up dreaming of playing in pro sports.
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My take is I hope more people are realizing that these players are human just like them. And that their entire life and career is basically to distract you from your lousy life. They don't have to play, but they do go out there in these conditions, train consistently, and are highly energized with adrenaline, and human bodies can only handle so much force and adrenaline before it starts to give.
It's like, if you know you have breathing issues, you don't go and start running a marathon. This is why it's fascinating to wonder just how healthy these athletes are and just how far they're pushing the limits of the human body all for the entertainment of us. This is a reason why I have respect for any athlete. Because they're out there pushing the limits of their body to the point where a single forceful blow to the chest area can have a devastating effect.
While it provides entertainment, these guys aren't in it to entertain us. Not at all.
Obviously they do it for the money and a passion to play the game, but I can't imagine they don't enjoy a pop from the crowd when they make a play. I can't deny getting attention (being entertaining) isn't apart of it. I mean, look at the linemen dancing in the endzone. It's entertainment.
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My take is I hope more people are realizing that these players are human just like them. And that their entire life and career is basically to distract you from your lousy life. They don't have to play, but they do go out there in these conditions, train consistently, and are highly energized with adrenaline, and human bodies can only handle so much force and adrenaline before it starts to give.
It's like, if you know you have breathing issues, you don't go and start running a marathon. This is why it's fascinating to wonder just how healthy these athletes are and just how far they're pushing the limits of the human body all for the entertainment of us. This is a reason why I have respect for any athlete. Because they're out there pushing the limits of their body to the point where a single forceful blow to the chest area can have a devastating effect.
While it provides entertainment, these guys aren't in it to entertain us. Not at all.
Obviously they do it for the money and a passion to play the game, but I can't imagine they don't enjoy a pop from the crowd when they make a play. I can't deny getting attention (being entertaining) isn't apart of it. I mean, look at the linemen dancing in the endzone. It's entertainment.
Well yeah I'm sure. But no kid starts playing sports because he wants to entertain Ben in Arizona.
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My take is I hope more people are realizing that these players are human just like them. And that their entire life and career is basically to distract you from your lousy life. They don't have to play, but they do go out there in these conditions, train consistently, and are highly energized with adrenaline, and human bodies can only handle so much force and adrenaline before it starts to give.
It's like, if you know you have breathing issues, you don't go and start running a marathon. This is why it's fascinating to wonder just how healthy these athletes are and just how far they're pushing the limits of the human body all for the entertainment of us. This is a reason why I have respect for any athlete. Because they're out there pushing the limits of their body to the point where a single forceful blow to the chest area can have a devastating effect.
While it provides entertainment, these guys aren't in it to entertain us. Not at all.
Obviously they do it for the money and a passion to play the game, but I can't imagine they don't enjoy a pop from the crowd when they make a play. I can't deny getting attention (being entertaining) isn't apart of it. I mean, look at the linemen dancing in the endzone. It's entertainment.
Well yeah I'm sure. But no kid starts playing sports because he wants to entertain Ben in Arizona.
Well, that's very specific, but generally, I disagree with this. There's lots of kids who want to entertain the general population, some via football. I've seen enough college sports to know kids want to entertain.
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When you're 10 years old you don't dream of entertaining people by playing football. You think of all the accolades you'd get from them cheering you on. There is a difference.
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Other than the general need of wanting attention, I'm pretty sure entertaining people if pretty low on the list for the players that go pro. Unless of course, that entertaining can lead to additional money streams.
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What's the problem with Van Pelt? He's goofy, and not as funny as he thinks he is, but he runs a good show, more often than not. Ryan Clark is the gem, though; even on good (meaning, happy) days, his insight and knowledge of the game is pretty damn high.
I just thought he was trying way too hard to be the star reporter. That wasn't a situation where his own personality needed to be the focus, and he was damn sure trying to make it so.
I'll give you that; he does have a schtick that he sticks to.
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I was thinking this morning about the fact that CPR is successful restarting a heart only a very small percentage of the time (like around 5% of the time if I recall correctly), so the fact that he didn't die right there on the field is very encouraging. I haven't hear reports of a AED being used, which I'm curious about. Those greatly increase the chances of success, but they are only useful if a particular thing is happening with the heart. I assume the teams have one on the field.
He was zapped on the field. If the speculation about what happened is correct, the blow short-circuited his heart knocking it out of sinus rhythm, and setting it back right wouldn't have been too hard, I imagine. The CPR would have been to keep things moving during the time it took to defib him. And I'd bet a fair amount that there are 15 AEDs scattered all around that stadium for the occasional overweight football fan who goes too hard on the beer and chili dogs. The on the field medical team probably has the same gear you'd find in a first class ER.
It's my understanding that - and this goes with the question above about "war-gaming" this scenario, that yes, the NFL DOES have a protocol for this, including knowing which medical centers with a full trauma unit are in the vicinity of the stadium (like the U of Cincinnati Medical Center where Damar was taken). That includes readily available defibrillators.
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Money is the only reason the NFL will make them play the game. No way are the Bills going to be mentally engaged in playing not only this upcoming weekend but some may take weeks or longer to be comfortable to get back on the field.
Even Bengals players will have issues playing again.
It really is a a no win situation.
In truth, there have been worse injuries to happen on the field and teams manage to continue. I'm not suggesting they should have played last night; I agree with the decision. You don't wear the black armband forever, though.
I think this is the best possible solution for this. It doesn't screw with the playoff picture, and both teams are not technically taking a loss either. Honestly, in these situations, I think the only solution is to administer the game as a tie.
It kind of does screw the playoff picture. I could be wrong, but I think under that scenario Buffalo no longer controls their own destiny, and the Bengals are knocked out of contention for the #1.
Um, at the risk of "too soon", knowing what we know now, I have zero doubt that Zach Taylor and Dylan McDermott can get their teams ready to play, using the events of January 2nd as a motivator. There will always be one or two (maybe more) players that will contemplate their place in the universe, but the gang mentality in a sport like football is STRONG, and it will only take one visit from Damar (god willing) or his family (more likely) to reinforce that this is a battle that not only has to be fought, but has to be WON.
I don't know if the calendar will allow them to play this game, but if it comes down to the players and coaches, I would be shocked, SHOCKED, I tell you, if they don't play this game.
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My take is I hope more people are realizing that these players are human just like them. And that their entire life and career is basically to distract you from your lousy life. They don't have to play, but they do go out there in these conditions, train consistently, and are highly energized with adrenaline, and human bodies can only handle so much force and adrenaline before it starts to give.
It's like, if you know you have breathing issues, you don't go and start running a marathon. This is why it's fascinating to wonder just how healthy these athletes are and just how far they're pushing the limits of the human body all for the entertainment of us. This is a reason why I have respect for any athlete. Because they're out there pushing the limits of their body to the point where a single forceful blow to the chest area can have a devastating effect.
While it provides entertainment, these guys aren't in it to entertain us. Not at all.
Obviously they do it for the money and a passion to play the game, but I can't imagine they don't enjoy a pop from the crowd when they make a play. I can't deny getting attention (being entertaining) isn't apart of it. I mean, look at the linemen dancing in the endzone. It's entertainment.
Well yeah I'm sure. But no kid starts playing sports because he wants to entertain Ben in Arizona.
Well, that's very specific, but generally, I disagree with this. There's lots of kids who want to entertain the general population, some via football. I've seen enough college sports to know kids want to entertain.
HAHA, I was thinking the same thing. "Oddly specific!"
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Other than the general need of wanting attention, I'm pretty sure entertaining people if pretty low on the list for the players that go pro. Unless of course, that entertaining can lead to additional money streams.
Low on the list is not the same as not being on the list which is what you seemed to be implying by "not at all". I agree, it's low on the list compared to the rest.
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Can't speak for anyone else, but for me, that was the specific reason I wanted a career in sports. Unfortunately for Ben, it turns out that I just wasn't good enough to make the pros.
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I was thinking this morning about the fact that CPR is successful restarting a heart only a very small percentage of the time (like around 5% of the time if I recall correctly), so the fact that he didn't die right there on the field is very encouraging. I haven't hear reports of a AED being used, which I'm curious about. Those greatly increase the chances of success, but they are only useful if a particular thing is happening with the heart. I assume the teams have one on the field.
He was zapped on the field. If the speculation about what happened is correct, the blow short-circuited his heart knocking it out of sinus rhythm, and setting it back right wouldn't have been too hard, I imagine. The CPR would have been to keep things moving during the time it took to defib him. And I'd bet a fair amount that there are 15 AEDs scattered all around that stadium for the occasional overweight football fan who goes too hard on the beer and chili dogs. The on the field medical team probably has the same gear you'd find in a first class ER.
It's my understanding that - and this goes with the question above about "war-gaming" this scenario, that yes, the NFL DOES have a protocol for this, including knowing which medical centers with a full trauma unit are in the vicinity of the stadium (like the U of Cincinnati Medical Center where Damar was taken). That includes readily available defibrillators.
My hunch is that it probably goes a lot further than just knowing where the good trauma units are. If you've ever caught any videos dealing with NFL League Operations it becomes kind of clear that those guys do not overlook details. My hunch is that no matter what medical emergency might come up they're very well situated to handle it effectively right then and there. The joke used to be that the best place to have a heart attack was the golf course. The exact spot where he kipped over was almost certainly as good a choice as any. I'd honestly be kind of surprised if an official league cardiologist wasn't on hand to minister to him. There are probably enough specialists on hand at every game to make up any number of good Vaudevillian jokes. A brain surgeon, a proctologist, and a podiatrist walk into a bar. . .
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Other than the general need of wanting attention, I'm pretty sure entertaining people if pretty low on the list for the players that go pro. Unless of course, that entertaining can lead to additional money streams.
Low on the list is not the same as not being on the list which is what you seemed to be implying by "not at all". I agree, it's low on the list compared to the rest.
So when I say low on the list, I actually mean it's so low that it may as well be not at all. :P
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I always think of Sammy Davis Jr. when it comes to pro football.
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I always think of Sammy Davis Jr. when it comes to pro football.
I think he did it for the chicks. ;D
(https://digitalscholarship.tnstate.edu/context/library-digital-collections/article/1185/type/native/viewcontent)
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A brain surgeon, a proctologist, and a podiatrist walk into a bar. . .
Now I'm just imagining an NFL proctologist.
"Sir, we successfully removed the football."
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A brain surgeon, a proctologist, and a podiatrist walk into a bar. . .
Now I'm just imagining an NFL proctologist.
"Sir Mr. Sanchez, we successfully removed the football."
Fixed.
And, yes, I realize it was technically Brandon Moore, but the joke works better this way.
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(quite a career at Texas Western (UTEP). btw, how nice of the school to wait until 2006 to put him in their HOF. :tdwn Wonder if his parents or any family was still alive at that time)
FYI, the UTEP Athletics HOF didn't exist until 2002, so 2006 wasn't much of a wait.
Thanks for that info. Apologies for my oversight. Just looked at their list of inductees, and so now it makes sense why Don Haskins and their '66 NCAA basketball title team didn't get in until '02.
No one, I mean NO ONE seems to be bringing up Chuck Hughes of the Detroit Lions, who died on the field against the Bears in 1971.
Greg Bedard mentioned it on Boston Sports Tonight last night.
That's why I said 'no one seems to be bringing up Chuck Hughes. Didn't hear his name on ESPN, NFL Network last night or this morning in the bits I watched I can't watch every minute. Our local radio sports station didn't mention him early this morning, until the better 10AM signed on.
Bills-Bengals 'tie': there are ramifications for the Ravens. Had the Bengals lost, Sunday's game between Balto and Cincy would have been for the division title, and playing at home in the first round. That said.......I could care less about that.
It's not like they haven't gotten around 'moved on' before: playing nine games in '82, and fifteen in '87 with three using replacement players. Everyone will get over any sort of butt hurt the cancellation causes.
Geez, and then there's this juvenile behavior Sunday in the Giants-Colts game https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9065F3mJCg
I always think of Sammy Davis Jr. when it comes to pro football.
I think he did it for the chicks. ;D
(https://digitalscholarship.tnstate.edu/context/library-digital-collections/article/1185/type/native/viewcontent)
:lol :lol :lol
Didn't work for me (guess chicks don't dig DBs or kickers....)
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Bills-Bengals 'tie': there are ramifications for the Ravens. Had the Bengals lost, Sunday's game between Balto and Cincy would have been for the division title, and playing at home in the first round. That said.......I could care less about that.
No, it still doesn't matter. Win or lose last night's game, Cincy would hold an tiebreakers over the Ravens. If Cincy lost last night and loses to the Ravens next week, Cincy still has the division.
EDIT: Actually, upon further research, you are correct and I was mistaken. They lost to the Ravens the first time (which is what I was mistaken about), so a second loss to them would give the Ravens the tiebreaker. My mistake.
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I don't think the league can FAIRLY decide not to play the Bengals-Bills game and declare it a tie or just leave those two teams with only 16 games. It impacts not only who gets the bye in the AFC but also who the 6/7 seeds play in the first round. Since the league has announced the game "will not be resumed this week," the only truly viable option is to play the week 18 games as scheduled and then to have the Bengals-Bills game as a stand-alone game the weekend of 1-14/15, start the playoffs the following week and nix the two week gap between the conference championship games and the Superb Owl. Not sure what they'll do with the "Pro Bowl Games," but I'm not sure that's a big concern (maybe push it to the weekend after the Owl).
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That may end up being the "least bad" option for the players themselves, but is still horrible for a lot of reasons, including the fact that a lot of fans of several teams on both conferences have already bought tickets and possibly made hotel/travel arrangements for what is supposed to be the first round. For example, let's say that Nick as a 49ers fan has already requested time off from work, booked his flight, booked his hotel, and bought tickets for the first round since the 49ers clinched the division and will be playing that round. What if he can't reschedule and take the following week off and travel from the east coast? Two teams that have nothing to do with his team and aren't even in the same conference have messed that up for him.
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I don't think the league can FAIRLY decide not to play the Bengals-Bills game and declare it a tie or just leave those two teams with only 16 games. It impacts not only who gets the bye in the AFC but also who the 6/7 seeds play in the first round. Since the league has announced the game "will not be resumed this week," the only truly viable option is to play the week 18 games as scheduled and then to have the Bengals-Bills game as a stand-alone game the weekend of 1-14/15, start the playoffs the following week and nix the two week gap between the conference championship games and the Superb Owl. Not sure what they'll do with the "Pro Bowl Games," but I'm not sure that's a big concern (maybe push it to the weekend after the Owl).
Agreed. Have them play in a "week 19," push all the playoff rounds back a week, and have only one week between the CGs and the Super Bowl. That is the only solution that seems fair.
I get that many fans will have to reschedule their plans for playoff rounds, but that's the breaks. Stuff gets cancelled or postponed all the time. It happens. And in this case, it would have happened because of a massive health issue. Perfectly understandable.
In the meantime & more importantly, Damar Hamlin remains in critical condition:
https://www.cnn.com/us/live-news/damar-hamlin-collapse-bills-bengals-game-intl-hnk/index.html
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I get that many fans will have to reschedule their plans for playoff rounds, but that's the breaks. Stuff gets cancelled or postponed all the time. It happens. And in this case, it would have happened because of a massive health issue. Perfectly understandable.
No it isn't. I'd be pissed, honestly.
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I get that many fans will have to reschedule their plans for playoff rounds, but that's the breaks. Stuff gets cancelled or postponed all the time. It happens. And in this case, it would have happened because of a massive health issue. Perfectly understandable.
No it isn't. I'd be pissed, honestly.
Okay, but nothing is set in stone yet. No games are scheduled yet for the 1st round of the playoffs, and if you know you are hosting a 1st round game, ala Minnesota or Tampa Bay, it could be on Saturday, Sunday or Monday. Now, in bosk's example, maybe you are flying to SF and plan to stay for 3-4 nights so you are covered for whichever day/night they play, but if the case of the 49ers for example, they could still get the 1 seed, meaning they wouldn't be playing in the 1st round at all.
Ultimately, this would be happening because of a human (near-)tragedy. Some things are bigger than plans to visit another city or go to a football game.
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I get that many fans will have to reschedule their plans for playoff rounds, but that's the breaks. Stuff gets cancelled or postponed all the time. It happens. And in this case, it would have happened because of a massive health issue. Perfectly understandable.
No it isn't. I'd be pissed, honestly.
Agreed. "That's the breaks" is all fine and dandy, but this impacts a LOT more people and creates a much, MUCH bigger logistical quagmire than simply applying a "that's the breaks" attitude toward Bengals and Bills and just leaving things as-is with the game never being played.
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Okay, but nothing is set in stone yet. No games are scheduled yet for the 1st round of the playoffs, and if you know you are hosting a 1st round game, ala Minnesota or Tampa Bay, it could be on Saturday, Sunday or Monday. Now, in bosk's example, maybe you are flying to SF and plan to stay for 3-4 nights so you are covered for whichever day/night they play, but if the case of the 49ers for example, they could still get the 1 seed, meaning they wouldn't be playing in the 1st round at all.
I can't try and figure out all of the permutations. I'll just see what the league schedules.
Ultimately, this would be happening because of a human (near-)tragedy. Some things are bigger than plans to visit another city or go to a football game.
Eh.. I can't think of the right choice of words so I'll leave it alone for now.
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Same here. We can agree to disagree as I really don't want to go round and round on this considering the situation. :)
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Same. Not really trying to argue about it, but just to point out that it's a LOT more complicated than just "hey, we have an extra week available on the calendar. Let's just bump everything a week."
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I wasn't really arguing about the logistics and all. I just think people are going way overboard to display their sensitivity. The whole nothing else matters or nothing else is important is a bit tiresome.
And I'm not pointing this at Kev. It's just a thing that's been bugging me all day.
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So very weird timing with what almost happened Monday night, but Monday morning I had the funeral for the mother of Louis Riddick, a current ESPN MNF analyst.
Didn't quite realize till after the fact how many football players there were in the extended family, had at least 4 as pall bearers alone.
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Wow!
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Can't speak for anyone else, but for me, that was the specific reason I wanted a career in sports. Unfortunately for Ben, it turns out that I just wasn't good enough to make the pros.
Absolutely. Me too. I remember being in the weight room, in high school, thinking, "one more rep, for Ben". Sadly, it was not to be. :lol
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:lol
Why do you think they call it the BENch press?
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So very weird timing with what almost happened Monday night, but Monday morning I had the funeral for the mother of Louis Riddick, a current ESPN MNF analyst.
Didn't quite realize till after the fact how many football players there were in the extended family, had at least 4 as pall bearers alone.
Big fan of Louis Riddick, for what it's worth. If I'm not mistaken, he's frequently mentioned as a candidate for front office positions when they come up.
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Add me to the group of people who think delaying the playoffs is not a good idea. I honestly don't see how they squeeze in a completion, or redo, of this game. If I were either team, I'm not sure I'd want to.
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I think things will slowly get back to normal. Damar Hamlin's recovery is going in the right direction which will be a relief everyone and as time goes by, we will understand what a rare event this is.
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Wish we could be sitting around a bar with a beverage or two and 'discuss', as some times the written word sounds a bit harsh.
First, simply as to a business decision, what is the NFL waiting for? I keep waiting for 'an announcement will be made at 1pm today' announcement.
Second, as to any rescheduling: having them play in two Sundays punishes the Bills and Bengals, while all the others get that week off. The #1 seed in the NFC would have two weeks off (and possibly the #1 AFC). That's why the 'tie' and move on seems most logical (to me anyway).
I know it's going to be hard enough for ALL the players this weekend. Call me somewhat callous, but I saw a fellow employee die, had to continue my work, and did a double shift the next day. The handful of us who were there were given a whopping 15 minute group counseling session two days later.
Lastly, as to any NFL consideration for the fans......nah. Flex scheduling proves that. Just take last Sunday's Ravens-Steelers game, and the amount of individuals who may have unwisely booked a hotel for New Year's night before the game, watch the next day, and then hit the road home at around 5pm. Well, you better cancel it or reserve another night, unless you want to drive 3-5 hours after the 1130pm ending. A few years ago they flexed the New Year's Eve game from 1pm to 425pm. Who really wants to be out on the roads after 8pm on that night?
Discussion (rant?) on my part over. ;) Barkeep.....give me another
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Yeah, I don't think the scheduling of things would or should take into account the fans. The NFL has already shown that's not too important and the fans have shown they will show up anyway (maybe not the same fans, but people will be there).
I wonder if the teams have any input here, like maybe the league will give some options and the teams can have a say because I'm curious if the teams even want to finish the game at this point.
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Bosk has covered the permutations better than I could so I won't bother. However, it seems to me that Buff/Cinci get screwed either way. Even if one of them were to get the bye it would be wasted by playing the week 19 game anyway. At the other end, though, there may well be some teams on the outside looking in who needed a specific outcome of the game, and they're the ones that'll get hosed by this.
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Hmmm... How about having them play in the first week of the playoffs for the right to move on?
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Can someone explain to me why the Seahawks have the tie breaker over the Packers as of today, but if both win next weekend, the Packers have the tiebreaker?
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Can someone explain to me why the Seahawks have the tie breaker over the Packers as of today, but if both win next weekend, the Packers have the tiebreaker?
Packers will have one more NFC conference win which would be the tiebreaker.
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Can someone explain to me why the Seahawks have the tie breaker over the Packers as of today, but if both win next weekend, the Packers have the tiebreaker?
Packers will have one more NFC conference win which would be the tiebreaker.
That's partly correct, I think. Right now conference wins don't matter because SEA has an earlier tiebreaker due to beating DET. If GB beats DET Sunday that one is negated and it will fall down to conference record.
Also, three-way tiebreaks in the NFL are bungled. You'll occasionally see ridiculous results.
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Seattle got screwed in the scheduling.
The Seahawks need to win and have GB to lose to make the playoffs, so they should have had Seattle/Rams and Det/GB playing at the same time. With GB/Det Sunday night, if the Seahawks win in the afternoon, that eliminates the Lions from playoff contention, which could result in them losing their motivation to win Sunday night. That's BS.
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Bills-Bengals 'tie': there are ramifications for the Ravens. Had the Bengals lost, Sunday's game between Balto and Cincy would have been for the division title, and playing at home in the first round. That said.......I could care less about that.
No, it still doesn't matter. Win or lose last night's game, Cincy would hold an tiebreakers over the Ravens. If Cincy lost last night and loses to the Ravens next week, Cincy still has the division.
EDIT: Actually, upon further research, you are correct and I was mistaken. They lost to the Ravens the first time (which is what I was mistaken about), so a second loss to them would give the Ravens the tiebreaker. My mistake.
Darnit, in my 'sitting at the bar' post, I forgot to mention this. :facepalm:
You did a great job of breaking all things down, but with the ten thousand possibilities, a person is going to 'miss one'. I saw the post above before the edit, and I was going to discuss (rant ;)) about me not knowing the Ravens details. Fortunately, I waited, and....I appreciate the correction. :tup
Baltimore is still 'one and done' regardless of what all transpires. A pity if they don't get a 1st round home game, but they only have five two plus score leads lost to blame (and even in the Bengals game, they had to come back after a blown ten point lead).
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Seattle got screwed in the scheduling.
The Seahawks need to win and have GB to lose to make the playoffs, so they should have had Seattle/Rams and Det/GB playing at the same time. With GB/Det Sunday night, if the Seahawks win in the afternoon, that eliminates the Lions from playoff contention, which could result in them losing their motivation to win Sunday night. That's BS.
This is a good point. I'm guessing they don't think about stuff like that when making the schedule.
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Seattle got screwed in the scheduling.
The Seahawks need to win and have GB to lose to make the playoffs, so they should have had Seattle/Rams and Det/GB playing at the same time. With GB/Det Sunday night, if the Seahawks win in the afternoon, that eliminates the Lions from playoff contention, which could result in them losing their motivation to win Sunday night. That's BS.
This is a good point. I'm guessing they don't think about stuff like that when making the schedule.
I mean, Seattle also had eight opportunities to win a game to not be in this position so…..
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Seattle got screwed in the scheduling.
The Seahawks need to win and have GB to lose to make the playoffs, so they should have had Seattle/Rams and Det/GB playing at the same time. With GB/Det Sunday night, if the Seahawks win in the afternoon, that eliminates the Lions from playoff contention, which could result in them losing their motivation to win Sunday night. That's BS.
I thought the NFL had started doing all of the final week games at the same time. Was that just a one time thing, or am I remembering it incorrectly?
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Seattle got screwed in the scheduling.
The Seahawks need to win and have GB to lose to make the playoffs, so they should have had Seattle/Rams and Det/GB playing at the same time. With GB/Det Sunday night, if the Seahawks win in the afternoon, that eliminates the Lions from playoff contention, which could result in them losing their motivation to win Sunday night. That's BS.
I thought the NFL had started doing all of the final week games at the same time. Was that just a one time thing, or am I remembering it incorrectly?
They weren't all at the same time, but they were all Sunday afternoon. No TNF/SNF/MNF. It'd been that way for a while, so when Saturday games were mentioned int he pick'em thread I was surprised.
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That sounds right. That said...
I mean, Seattle also had eight opportunities to win a game to not be in this position so…..
I get this, and I am almost always one of those "you control your own destiny all season, so if you need someone else to win or lose in the last week, it is your own fault" people, but it still would have made more sense to have the games at the same time.
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Seattle got screwed in the scheduling.
The Seahawks need to win and have GB to lose to make the playoffs, so they should have had Seattle/Rams and Det/GB playing at the same time. With GB/Det Sunday night, if the Seahawks win in the afternoon, that eliminates the Lions from playoff contention, which could result in them losing their motivation to win Sunday night. That's BS.
This is a good point. I'm guessing they don't think about stuff like that when making the schedule.
There's no way this was overlooked. Any novice fan could go to ESPN's playoff machine and figure out this issue in 60 seconds.
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Why assume these games weren't scheduled 8 months ago? Assuming that's the case, I can forgive the NFL for not predicting that DET would interfere with SEA's tiebreak scenario.
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Excellent news on Hamlin this morning. I think the breathing and neurological responses were the 2 major concerns. Although it may take a while, I think he'll come out of this just fine. Awesome! :tup
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Yup, love the update. Not out of the woods, but all signs are pretty positive, I'd gather a good deal of that is credit to the tremendous shape he's undoubtably in.
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Yup, love the update. Not out of the woods, but all signs are pretty positive, I'd gather a good deal of that is credit to the tremendous shape he's undoubtably in.
True, and kudos to the 1st responders on the field. Getting his heart beating again in a timely manner was crucial.
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Why assume these games weren't scheduled 8 months ago? Assuming that's the case, I can forgive the NFL for not predicting that DET would interfere with SEA's tiebreak scenario.
Big +1 to this. There was no way to predict this scenario when the schedule was released.
That being said, they’ve flexed games for lesser reasons.
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I took PTO today, so I watched a good chunk of the doctors' press conference. I think the single most important thing was that he asked who won the game. That demonstrates a lot in terms of neurological function. The doctors both went out of their way to praise the quality of care/treatment he received on the field and before reaching the hospital. They were rightly reluctant to speak about the likely end result, but they said the best case scenario is that he returns to where he was before the injury, which means they don't know anything at this point that would cause them to rule out a full recovery.
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That is very good news.
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I took PTO today, so I watched a good chunk of the doctors' press conference. I think the single most important thing was that he asked who won the game. That demonstrates a lot in terms of neurological function. The doctors both went out of their way to praise the quality of care/treatment he received on the field and before reaching the hospital. They were rightly reluctant to speak about the likely end result, but they said the best case scenario is that he returns to where he was before the injury, which means they don't know anything at this point that would cause them to rule out a full recovery.
I heard his next words were "What do you mean the NFL postponed the game? Fucking idiots".
I'd say he's recovering nicely. ;) :) :) :)
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I took PTO today, so I watched a good chunk of the doctors' press conference. I think the single most important thing was that he asked who won the game. That demonstrates a lot in terms of neurological function. The doctors both went out of their way to praise the quality of care/treatment he received on the field and before reaching the hospital. They were rightly reluctant to speak about the likely end result, but they said the best case scenario is that he returns to where he was before the injury, which means they don't know anything at this point that would cause them to rule out a full recovery.
I heard his next words were "What do you mean the NFL postponed the game? Fucking idiots".
I'd say he's recovering nicely. ;) :) :) :)
I would rather have my team-mates continue playing and continue on to winning the super bowl, than worry about me and not accomplishing what the entire team worked hard for, including myself.
Apparently, he felt the same way too. Which is that Sports is less about the player and more about the team, and what the team has accomplished to get closer to what every team desires....The Championship.
Now imagine how he feels knowing that they didn't continue playing and just postponed the game. Now that, to me, is what I find hilarious about life.
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You know Stads was kidding, right Ben?
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The doctors both went out of their way to praise the quality of care/treatment he received on the field and before reaching the hospital.
I heard a sports doctor on the radio the other night also praising the medical response from the moment he went down through the beginning treatment at the hospital. He pointed out various reasons why they basically did everything right from start to finish. He also pointed out that, to him, a VERY encouraging sign very early on was something small: the fact that the outgoing ambulance in the tunnel waited for Hamlin's mom to get onboard so she could ride with him. I hadn't thought about this, but the doc pointed out that if they weren't 100% convinced that things were going VERY well at that point, there's no way the ambulance waits even a few seconds--they are rushing him to the hospital without mom, period. Again, I hadn't thought about that, but it makes sense.
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^ :tup
Well, the game is cancelled, now the owners will vote on possible neutral sites for various Bills / Chiefs / Bengals matchups on Friday. Makes sense. Indy and Detroit are logical locations. And if the Ravens beat the Bengals, they'll do a coin flip for first round home field. Again, trying to making the best of things.
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Honestly, this is probably about the best solution possible, all things considered.
And excellent news about Hamlin, who seems to be getting better. :tup :tup
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Hamlin asking who won the game and not believing he was out for 2 days is a great sign of recovery. Amazing work indeed by everyone involved.
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This will probably be one of the greatest stories in NFL history if Hamlin will be able to return next season for the Bills. I really hope that happens for him and his team. :tup
Edit: Breathing tube out and talking to hospital staff, family and friends! That's just fucking awesome! :2metal:
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I'd be just happy to see him walk out of the hospital. A good life is what matters for him.
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Now all we need is for two AFC games to end in ties this week to really make a mess of things. :lol
The neutral site AFC-CCG thing is actually a decent compromise. It doesn't make up for the loss of a bye, but under the circumstances it's probably the best way to go about things.
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I'd be just happy to see him walk out of the hospital. A good life is what matters for him.
At this point, there's no reason to think that he won't walk out of there and eventually get back to living the life that he wanted. :tup
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A side note to this all.....that really is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.....but this F'd up a TON of Fantasy Football Leagues. I believe most of them the Championship game was last week and this game being cancelled messes with the scoring big time.
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A side note to this all.....that really is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.....but this F'd up a TON of Fantasy Football Leagues. I believe most of them the Championship game was last week and this game being cancelled messes with the scoring big time.
I suppose so, but such is life. We've all had our starting QB lay a big egg, or get injured early in a game before. This really isn't any different, other than the manner by which it happened. I'm sure there are people who needed X number of points from Burrow, or for Stefon Diggs to have a big night, but sometimes players have a bad game. Just the way things go. And if you happened to have multiple BUF or CIN players on your team, that's kind of on you.
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Can't say I care one bit about the impact of this on fantasy football, although I understand some people likely lost/won money due to the circumstances.
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Listening to the Bills coach talk about Hamlin addressing the team via zoom this morning seriously choked me up. So glad he's recovering quickly.
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A side note to this all.....that really is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.....but this F'd up a TON of Fantasy Football Leagues. I believe most of them the Championship game was last week and this game being cancelled messes with the scoring big time.
I suppose so, but such is life. We've all had our starting QB lay a big egg, or get injured early in a game before. This really isn't any different, other than the manner by which it happened. I'm sure there are people who needed X number of points from Burrow, or for Stefon Diggs to have a big night, but sometimes players have a bad game. Just the way things go. And if you happened to have multiple BUF or CIN players on your team, that's kind of on you.
yeah....I get it. I just know the two leagues I'm in there is a lot of talk of 'how' to handle this now. I'm like you.....my vote to the solution is that it is what it is.
Can't say I care one bit about the impact of this on fantasy football, although I understand some people likely lost/won money due to the circumstances.
In the big picture it's first world problems so who gives a crap. But, I know there are leagues out there where it's big money and there were a lot of big name players playing in that game that a lot of folks were 100% counting on.
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Can't say I care one bit about the impact of this on fantasy football, although I understand some people likely lost/won money due to the circumstances.
No offense to Gary, I get the point he was making (and it's valid) but as someone who is sick and tired of the gambling taking over pro football, I'm like "man plans and god laughs, you assholes". The idea that anyone can reliably predict these games with any sense of regularity is yet another example of man's hubris, and if even one person realizes "wow, this really IS random" then the cosmos win.
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Can't say I care one bit about the impact of this on fantasy football, although I understand some people likely lost/won money due to the circumstances.
No offense to Gary, I get the point he was making (and it's valid) but as someone who is sick and tired of the gambling taking over pro football, I'm like "man plans and god laughs, you assholes". The idea that anyone can reliably predict these games with any sense of regularity is yet another example of man's hubris, and if even one person realizes "wow, this really IS random" then the cosmos win.
Yeah, my comment wasn't meant to minimize the impact on fantasy players, because there is money at stake. But I generally don't like fantasy football so people getting upset about that just makes me laugh. Not only because there's a bigger picture here, but because shit happens. Your player could have broken their leg on the first play of the game and lost.
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Can't say I care one bit about the impact of this on fantasy football, although I understand some people likely lost/won money due to the circumstances.
No offense to Gary, I get the point he was making (and it's valid) but as someone who is sick and tired of the gambling taking over pro football, I'm like "man plans and god laughs, you assholes". The idea that anyone can reliably predict these games with any sense of regularity is yet another example of man's hubris, and if even one person realizes "wow, this really IS random" then the cosmos win.
After having my favorite talk radio station get dumped for a canned sports betting format, I'm all too happy to see massive monkey wrenches get thrown in the mix, though in this case, I think the bigger wrench was all the sports betting propositions going down in the Nov election.
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A side note to this all.....that really is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.....but this F'd up a TON of Fantasy Football Leagues. I believe most of them the Championship game was last week and this game being cancelled messes with the scoring big time.
I was in my leagues championship match. I had Ja’maar Chase and my opponent had Burrow and Dawson Knox. At the time of the injury I was up 15 points with a 66% of winning. We ended up splitting the first and second place money based on that. I won a little less, he won a little more. We were adults about it.
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A side note to this all.....that really is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.....but this F'd up a TON of Fantasy Football Leagues. I believe most of them the Championship game was last week and this game being cancelled messes with the scoring big time.
You're complaining about fucking fantasy football when a player could've died on the field? Get your priorities straight buddy.
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A side note to this all.....that really is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.....but this F'd up a TON of Fantasy Football Leagues. I believe most of them the Championship game was last week and this game being cancelled messes with the scoring big time.
You're complaining about fucking fantasy football when a player could've died on the field? Get your priorities straight buddy.
Dude.....give me a break and read my post. First 'I' am not complaining. I don't give a crap. Second, I stated.....it's irrelevant in the grand scheme of things, don't know how much more clear I could make it. The post was intended to bring attention to the insane amount of betting and money that does happen around these games and how it's been thrown into chaos.
I don't need a lecture or comment about priorities from someone who apparently can't read.
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Yeah, I think Gary was perfectly clear that he was not complaining about it. There's nothing wrong with observing any one of a number of ripple effects of this situation.
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Yeah, even with my response, I never thought that was Gary's intent. Really odd take to be so harsh.
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Can't say I care one bit about the impact of this on fantasy football, although I understand some people likely lost/won money due to the circumstances.
No offense to Gary, I get the point he was making (and it's valid) but as someone who is sick and tired of the gambling taking over pro football, I'm like "man plans and god laughs, you assholes". The idea that anyone can reliably predict these games with any sense of regularity is yet another example of man's hubris, and if even one person realizes "wow, this really IS random" then the cosmos win.
After having my favorite talk radio station get dumped for a canned sports betting format, I'm all too happy to see massive monkey wrenches get thrown in the mix, though in this case, I think the bigger wrench was all the sports betting propositions going down in the Nov election.
Oh yeah, I think after the results came in, there was an article that stated the Indian Gaming Association in California wanted not only for the Online Sports Betting bills to not pass, they want a decisive No which they got. Wasn't a pretty penny to spend on campaigning for it as well. Costed about half a billion to campaigning it passing in California. Didn't pass. Oh well. ;D
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Teams ranked in order of who I think will win the SB:
Buffalo - great offense, great defense
Cincy - great offense, really good defense
SF - really good offense, BEST defense
KC - BEST offense, bad defense, bad special teams
Philly - really good on offense, good defense
Dallas - really good on O and D
It’s happened about 8 times since the merger and this year is the 2nd time for Mahomes, dragging a team to 13+ wins despite the D giving up 350+ points. NONE of those teams won the SB, it can’t be done. You can’t win a SB with a bad defense. This is a primary reason why PM will win MVP again, the others (Allen, Burrow, Hurts) all have good defenses behind them - but you can’t win the SB with a D that bad, it can’t be done.
How do you guys rank the contenders? I didn’t bother with all 14.
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I agree that those are definitely the top 6, and mostly agree with your comments. I would add "really good special teams" to SF. Without looking at actual stats/rankings, I can't really comment on the other special teams units. Will give some thought to ranking the top 6.
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Can't say I care one bit about the impact of this on fantasy football, although I understand some people likely lost/won money due to the circumstances.
No offense to Gary, I get the point he was making (and it's valid) but as someone who is sick and tired of the gambling taking over pro football, I'm like "man plans and god laughs, you assholes". The idea that anyone can reliably predict these games with any sense of regularity is yet another example of man's hubris, and if even one person realizes "wow, this really IS random" then the cosmos win.
After having my favorite talk radio station get dumped for a canned sports betting format, I'm all too happy to see massive monkey wrenches get thrown in the mix, though in this case, I think the bigger wrench was all the sports betting propositions going down in the Nov election.
Oh yeah, I think after the results came in, there was an article that stated the Indian Gaming Association in California wanted not only for the Online Sports Betting bills to not pass, they want a decisive No which they got. Wasn't a pretty penny to spend on campaigning for it as well. Costed about half a billion to campaigning it passing in California. Didn't pass. Oh well. ;D
I definitely wasn't heartbroken about it. Bookies are a dime a dozen already, no need to institutionalize the process. Shit, last thing we need is for it to fuck up all the horse race betting venues. Love hitting those for the big races.
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Yep, I thought Gary's point was clear as well.
Dublagent66, me thinks you need to simmer down. :biggrin:
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There's been something kind of odd about the whole response to what happened on Monday night. Hamlin goes down, and while he is down, there's a resounding outcry online and in the media of, "how dare anyone even think about football when a man's life is on the line". Eventually, the coaches look at each other and say "no more football tonight" and everyone agrees with this. We spend the next 12 hours dragging Skip Bayless for saying what everyone is thinking in the back of their minds, "what now?". It's a rare instance of Skip Bayless being wrongly misinterpreted rather than being a complete clown. As a mob, we have decided it's inappropriate to talk about anything until Damar is okay. This makes sense, it feels right.
However, people can feel scared, be in mourning, and be interested in what is going to happen as a result of the game cancellation at the same time. Now, naturally, we are acknowledging the thoughts that have been going through people's minds since one minute after the ambulance left the field with Damar Hamlin in tow. This feels uncomfortable, because pretending we weren't thinking about this was what everyone was saying was "right".
Of course people care about playoff seeding. Of course they care about their fantasy leagues. Many people have probably not stopped thinking about these things since Monday night. Having these kind of thoughts doesn't mean someone doesn't care about Damar Hamlin. It's possible to care about all these things at the same time.
What I see is not so much genuine care for Damar as much as I see a demand for conformity to the symbolic gestures that some have determined are necessary to "demonstrate caring".
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I agree. It's not even that Bayless said anything all that offensive. Oh, and fuck Shannon Sharpe.
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Bayless is a liar, a troll and an asshole, so if he sees his career take a hit over something that maybe people took the wrong way, I am good with it.
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Bayless is a liar, a troll and an asshole, so if he sees his career take a hit over something that maybe people took the wrong way, I am good with it.
I don't listen to or pay attention to anything he says. I did see the tweet he made that caused all the hubbub and didn't think there was anything to it.
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Bayless is a liar, a troll and an asshole, so if he sees his career take a hit over something that maybe people took the wrong way, I am good with it.
I don't listen to or pay attention to anything he says. I did see the tweet he made that caused all the hubbub and didn't think there was anything to it.
I catch stuff on Twitter. I still get a kick out of Shannon Sharpe and will occasionally watch the clips from their show on Twitter if Sharpe is talking (I shut off as soon as the troll gets his turn to talk). I definitely think lesser of Sharpe for working with that liar for so long, although I am sure it's a good paycheck.
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I don't watch Twitter. ;D
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I don't watch Twitter. ;D
That's ok Archie Bunker.
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I don't watch Twitter. ;D
That's ok Archie Bunker.
(https://media.tenor.com/4xejRmgXHJEAAAAM/archie-bunker-archie.gif)
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Meathead. Lol
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(https://media.tenor.com/Z15ccgWJ4EsAAAAC/archie-bunker-kill-me-now.gif)
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I don’t witch Twatter…
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I don’t witch Twatter…
Is that the porn social media?
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I don't watch Twitter. ;D
I don't either. I have an account, but I only go on if there's something specific that someone mentions. From what I can tell, it's mostly a cesspool of idiocy, and I have little tolerance for that.
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I don't watch Twitter. ;D
I don't either. I have an account, but I only go on if there's something specific that someone mentions. From what I can tell, it's mostly a cesspool of idiocy, and I have little tolerance for that.
Eh, if you keep your feed curated it's pretty useful. I get most of my band announcements from it, especially the Japanese who use it heavily, and the few DTF knuckleheads I follow there are pretty entertaining.
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I don't watch Twitter. ;D
I don't either. I have an account, but I only go on if there's something specific that someone mentions. From what I can tell, it's mostly a cesspool of idiocy, and I have little tolerance for that.
I'm shocked. :lol
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I don't watch Twitter. ;D
I don't either. I have an account, but I only go on if there's something specific that someone mentions. From what I can tell, it's mostly a cesspool of idiocy, and I have little tolerance for that.
Eh, if you keep your feed curated it's pretty useful. I get most of my band announcements from it, especially the Japanese who use it heavily, and the few DTF knuckleheads I follow there are pretty entertaining.
'pparently I need to learn to curate. Mine sucks. I get all these notices on my phone every morning of all this stuff I don't give a rat's ass about.
(And by the way, what is it with all the swearing? I swear too, but it's like seasoning on a fine piece of meat; the substance still has to be there. There's this one guy, EVERY TWEET starts "Holy f******g shit!" and then some idiocy about Republicans that is either blatantly wrong, or close enough to be at least very misleading).
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The Titans-Jags game could be a good one tonight with a playoff spot on the line.
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Bills return the opening kickoff for a return. What an amazing moment. I literally said, "wow," out loud to myself.
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Bills return the opening kickoff for a return. What an amazing moment. I literally said, "wow," out loud to myself.
Yup, just amazing.
Already seeing peeps on social media saying it's scripted lol
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Are they insane RJ? :lol
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Patriots showing some very special special teams. :lol
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Patriots showing some very special special teams. :lol
Their special teams have been brutal this year. No way their ST coach comes back.
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Put Judge back as the Special Teams coach please.
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Put Judge back as the Special Teams coach please.
I doubt it will happen.
I can't listen to Nantz and Romo. The whole Hamlin thing is being so overplayed. The Bills will win because they are 10 times better than the Pats. WTF??
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Looks like the AFC seeding is now set. Glad Cincy won so that takes the AFC North uncertainty from last week's game off the table. Still a bit of a mess up at the top with the 1-3 seeds, but it is what it is, and I know Buffalo and Cincy accept it for what it is, so that's that.
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Put Judge back as the Special Teams coach please.
I was thinking that was the plan when they brought him back. It's not like Cam Achord was all that great as STC last year, either. The problem is that I'm not sure Judge would want the gig.
Honestly, ST aside it wasn't a bad game for NE. It was a respectable performance against the best team in the NFL.
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Honestly, ST aside it wasn't a bad game for NE. It was a respectable performance against the best team in the NFL.
True.
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Put Judge back as the Special Teams coach please.
I was thinking that was the plan when they brought him back. It's not like Cam Achord was all that great as STC last year, either. The problem is that I'm not sure Judge would want the gig.
Honestly, ST aside it wasn't a bad game for NE. It was a respectable performance against the best team in the NFL.
Agreed on this all.
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Let's assume Philly and SF won both win this afternoon.
Here is my prediction for which games are when next week.
Saturday late afternoon: Ravens at Bengals
Saturday night: Dolphins at Bills
Sunday early afternoon: Giants at Vikings
Sunday late afternoon: Seahawks/Lions/Packers at 49ers
Sunday evening: Cowboys at Bucs
Monday night: Chargers at Jags
Dallas/TB in one of the night games is a no-brainer.
While neither is a marquee franchise, Chargers/Jags works for Monday night with two of the best young QBs playing.
Bills and Bengals playing the same day makes the most sense, to keep it fair, that way if they both win and play the next week, neither has an extra days rest.
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I’ve been dealing with a monumental amount of drama the last few days. Did the cancelled game end up making any difference? Or did the way things shaked out today make it a moot point?
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I’ve been dealing with a monumental amount of drama the last few days. Did the cancelled game end up making any difference? Or did the way things shaked out today make it a moot point?
Yes. All three teams won (KC, Buff, Cincy), so KC is the 1, Buffalo the 2 and Cincy the 3 seed.
Had the Bills won last Monday, they would have been the 1 seed and KC the 2.
Had the Bengals won last Monday, they would have been the 2 seed and Buffalo the 3.
The neutral site deals with even it out a little, but the Chiefs getting the bye is a major advantage that they didn't totally earn, but like has been discussed prior, there is not much the league could do. The scenario they came up with was the best they could do.
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They figured it out with a reasonable solution if it comes down to those teams in the playoffs. Smarter people than I could take a stab at explaining it.
Meanwhile... GO LIONS! Seahawks dropped to 5th in the draft order thanks to Wilson actually playing a good game today. Let's not lose out on the playoffs too!
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The funny thing about this current game is that Rodgers would actually be doing his legacy a favor by losing tonight. People are so stupid with narratives now that if they win tonight and then get blasted by the 49ers next week, people will run with the stupid "OMG, RODGERS IS A POSTSEASON CHOKER" false narrative again (ignoring that he had been mostly a great postseason player until his last two playoff games). However, if they lose tonight, he misses the playoffs and won't have another playoff loss to give the internet mouths ammo.
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And I’m not buying that idea that the lions have nothing to play for. They can either play spoiler for the Packers, or spoiler for the Seahawks. Given a choice between the two, I am thinking they would rather be a spoiler for their division rivals.
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I like how the Packers and Seahawks are competing to get ass blasted by the 9ers next week. :biggrin:
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I like how the Packers and Seahawks are competing to get ass blasted by the 9ers next week. :biggrin:
I mean…I’m almost certain that you’re absolutely right. But as Boomer used to say, “That’s why they play the games!” :xbones
EDIT - I still remember when the Seahawks had their very first playoff run in 1983, and won the wild card game to line up in the Divisional round against the HEAVILY favored, Marino-led Dolphins in Miami…and shocked the crap out of everyone by beating them. Anything can happen.
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Well, I have to admit that at first I didn’t even really want Seattle to make the playoffs because they’re not good enough to get there, and I think it would just be embarrassing ourselves. However, then I heard Geno Smith say that it was a big dream of his to make the playoffs, and he had never done it before. So just because he had such a great season for us, I am really happy to see Geno achieve his dream of finally getting to the playoffs at least one time in his career.
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Random thought while watching the games earlier today: Is Matthew Slater a HOFer? And if he is, would he and his father be the first father/son combo in the HOF?
I have a semi-/tangentially personal interest in the matter. My wife taught Matthew in jr. high while I was in law school. It was a ritzy Catholic school (that paid its teachers for shit), and they had a fancy fundraising banquet that we attended, so I got to meet Jackie once.
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Random thought while watching the games earlier today: Is Matthew Slater a HOFer? And if he is, would he and his father be the first father/son combo in the HOF?
I have a semi-/tangentially personal interest in the matter. My wife taught Matthew in jr. high while I was in law school. It was a ritzy Catholic school (that paid its teachers for shit), and they had a fancy fundraising banquet that we attended, so I got to meet Jackie once.
The NFL-HOF has steadfastly ignored special teamers, so probably not. So long as Steve Tasker and Devin Hester aren't included it seems unlikely that they'd give MS the nod. In truth, all three of them should get in, but that seems a tall order. Add to that, Vinatieri should be coming up, and he'll fill their special teams quota up for a few more years. Probably until Tucker is eligible. Shame, though. I'd really like to see Slater get in.
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Hopefully the Packers have a new QB and Coach next year.
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Hopefully the Packers have a new QB and Coach next year.
Do you really think a newly drafted QB or free agent pick-up would be better than Rogers next year? Or is it more a of "it's just time to rebuild without Rogers" kind of thing even if it means not being as competitive next season?
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I'm just happy the Giants made it into the playoffs and maintained an overall winning record. I did not expect that this season and am also happy they get a winnable game in the first round, but even if they do win, they aren't beating the Eagles so the end is basically here for this team, but I think the season was a success and I hope coach Daboll continues to improve for next season (even with lots of questions about who's going to be QB and RB next year)
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It was a terrible start but ended up being a fun season for my Lions. With several high draft picks and a new culture...look out next season!
I love the playoffs. Sometimes even more so with no horse in the race because I just focus on watching great games.
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Hopefully the Packers have a new QB and Coach next year.
Do you really think a newly drafted QB or free agent pick-up would be better than Rogers next year? Or is it more a of "it's just time to rebuild without Rogers" kind of thing even if it means not being as competitive next season?
Jordan Love has been the backup for 3 years and I feel confident he could have led them to an 8-9 record this year as well. There is nothing to rebuild, the defense is young and just needs someone who isn’t dumber than a box of rocks to lead them. The offense couldn’t have looked much worse than it did this season and that’s on Rodgers as much as it was on LaFleur.
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Predicting where TB12 and St. Rogers will wind up is interesting. The logical assumption is that Brady would join JMD in Vegas. However, Denver is looking far more likely as he wants to play for Sean Payton. Seems like a good fit. He'd probably wind up in a similar situation to what Payton did in which to run out the clock. The problem with Rogers is his contract. He'd be a very good fit in Vegas with JMD, but I'm not sure they could absorb his contract, and there's no way GB can cut him outright (massive dead cap hit, as in nearly 100M). Unless he plays another 4 years or so his contract is pretty limiting no matter where he goes. I'm also not sure how GB would handle a trade.
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Does Brady even play after this season? I mean he's still personally playing at a high level though not as good as he was in previous years. I would think he'll hang up after the playoffs whether or not they go far.
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Predicting where TB12 and St. Rogers will wind up is interesting. The logical assumption is that Brady would join JMD in Vegas. However, Denver is looking far more likely as he wants to play for Sean Payton. Seems like a good fit. He'd probably wind up in a similar situation to what Payton did in which to run out the clock. The problem with Rogers is his contract. He'd be a very good fit in Vegas with JMD, but I'm not sure they could absorb his contract, and there's no way GB can cut him outright (massive dead cap hit, as in nearly 100M). Unless he plays another 4 years or so his contract is pretty limiting no matter where he goes. I'm also not sure how GB would handle a trade.
The JMD/Vegas thing is baffling to me; maybe my assessment of Carr isn't realistic, but this season isn't on him, IMO. That means there are other problems. Brady coming in would solve many of them, but does either one want that? Brady has already proven he can do it without Belichich, Inc., but McDaniels has certainly not shown ANYONE that he can do it without either Bill or Tom; why would he invite that back into his life?
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Predicting where TB12 and St. Rogers will wind up is interesting. The logical assumption is that Brady would join JMD in Vegas. However, Denver is looking far more likely as he wants to play for Sean Payton. Seems like a good fit. He'd probably wind up in a similar situation to what Payton did in which to run out the clock. The problem with Rogers is his contract. He'd be a very good fit in Vegas with JMD, but I'm not sure they could absorb his contract, and there's no way GB can cut him outright (massive dead cap hit, as in nearly 100M). Unless he plays another 4 years or so his contract is pretty limiting no matter where he goes. I'm also not sure how GB would handle a trade.
Here’s a good breakdown of the Rodgers cap situation, best case scenario for the Packers is he retires or is traded after June 1st…..
https://overthecap.com/looking-ahead-to-the-packers-options-with-aaron-rodgers
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Predicting where TB12 and St. Rogers will wind up is interesting. The logical assumption is that Brady would join JMD in Vegas. However, Denver is looking far more likely as he wants to play for Sean Payton. Seems like a good fit. He'd probably wind up in a similar situation to what Payton did in which to run out the clock. The problem with Rogers is his contract. He'd be a very good fit in Vegas with JMD, but I'm not sure they could absorb his contract, and there's no way GB can cut him outright (massive dead cap hit, as in nearly 100M). Unless he plays another 4 years or so his contract is pretty limiting no matter where he goes. I'm also not sure how GB would handle a trade.
Here’s a good breakdown of the Rodgers cap situation, best case scenario for the Packers is he retires or is traded after June 1st…..
https://overthecap.com/looking-ahead-to-the-packers-options-with-aaron-rodgers
If you don't have to give up much other than pay him, I'll take him as a Jet for a year, while drafting developmental projects (assuming that's not Wilson) behind him.
Jets still have several years before they'll have to pony up for Sauce Gardner, Garret Wilson, Breece Hall, etc... if there was a time to make a play like this, it's now.
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Predicting where TB12 and St. Rogers will wind up is interesting. The logical assumption is that Brady would join JMD in Vegas. However, Denver is looking far more likely as he wants to play for Sean Payton. Seems like a good fit. He'd probably wind up in a similar situation to what Payton did in which to run out the clock. The problem with Rogers is his contract. He'd be a very good fit in Vegas with JMD, but I'm not sure they could absorb his contract, and there's no way GB can cut him outright (massive dead cap hit, as in nearly 100M). Unless he plays another 4 years or so his contract is pretty limiting no matter where he goes. I'm also not sure how GB would handle a trade.
The JMD/Vegas thing is baffling to me; maybe my assessment of Carr isn't realistic, but this season isn't on him, IMO. That means there are other problems. Brady coming in would solve many of them, but does either one want that? Brady has already proven he can do it without Belichich, Inc., but McDaniels has certainly not shown ANYONE that he can do it without either Bill or Tom; why would he invite that back into his life?
Pretty sure TB has won a couple without JMD. Granted, those were with the D largely carrying him, but still. And I think he'd like to play somewhere where he can enjoy himself and contend for another Owl. And by all accounts Vegas was Brady's first choice a few years ago. As for JMD, word is he wants to train the next TB12, and he thinks he can. That's probably why they jettisoned Carr. As for that guy, this season probably wasn't on him, but the last 4 have been. JMD was probably seen as his last chance and it didn't work out.
Word is that Davis desperately wants TB12 in town. He did 3 years ago and Gruden wouldn't do it. Now he's got leverage, so if TB is interested it'll be a go. Vegas has a problem where they have no fan base. That takes time. He think Brady would speed the process up. Combined with the fact that Vegas is a great, cheap tourist destination and other teams are packing his shiny new stadium, he wants to sucker his own fans in.
I still think Denver might be a better match, though.
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There was rumors that Brady and Payton was a thing last year to the Dolphins but the plan to suck came out with Flores ratting out the owner asking to lose.
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There was rumors that Brady and Payton was a thing last year to the Dolphins but the plan to suck came out with Flores ratting out the owner asking to lose.
Yeah, but the takeaway was that Brady wanted to play with Payton, and that could come about in DEN. The problem there is cap space. Dumping Wilson wouldn't be too terrible, but they certainly wouldn't have any money left to do something about their O-line.
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Predicting where TB12 and St. Rogers will wind up is interesting. The logical assumption is that Brady would join JMD in Vegas. However, Denver is looking far more likely as he wants to play for Sean Payton. Seems like a good fit. He'd probably wind up in a similar situation to what Payton did in which to run out the clock. The problem with Rogers is his contract. He'd be a very good fit in Vegas with JMD, but I'm not sure they could absorb his contract, and there's no way GB can cut him outright (massive dead cap hit, as in nearly 100M). Unless he plays another 4 years or so his contract is pretty limiting no matter where he goes. I'm also not sure how GB would handle a trade.
Here’s a good breakdown of the Rodgers cap situation, best case scenario for the Packers is he retires or is traded after June 1st…..
https://overthecap.com/looking-ahead-to-the-packers-options-with-aaron-rodgers
If you don't have to give up much other than pay him, I'll take him as a Jet for a year, while drafting developmental projects (assuming that's not Wilson) behind him.
Jets still have several years before they'll have to pony up for Sauce Gardner, Garret Wilson, Breece Hall, etc... if there was a time to make a play like this, it's now.
If I was in charge Rodgers would be in Denver right now and Wilson wouldn’t be. The Jets can have him I guarantee they’ll hate him by mid season.
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Does Brady even play after this season? I mean he's still personally playing at a high level though not as good as he was in previous years. I would think he'll hang up after the playoffs whether or not they go far.
I'd be shocked if Brady didn't play next year. I don't think he sank his marriage just to come back and play one more season and then call it a day. He is pretty full of himself and likely thinks he can play another five years.
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Does Brady even play after this season? I mean he's still personally playing at a high level though not as good as he was in previous years. I would think he'll hang up after the playoffs whether or not they go far.
I'd be shocked if Brady didn't play next year. I don't think he sank his marriage just to come back and play one more season and then call it a day. He is pretty full of himself and likely thinks he can play another five years.
And even though he made the playoffs, I can see going out with his first losing record ever is not a pleasant thought.
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The way he even got into the playoffs is ridiculous. 8-9 and the worst point differential in the division and having to beat out all-time greats Andy Dalton, Sam Darnold, and Desmond Ritter. :facepalm:
What a crazy year this year for QBs. Top 10 in QBR:
Mahomes
Allen
Tua
Hurts
Goff
Geno
Daniel Jones
Brissett
Lamar
Burrow
So the Steelers could have made the playoffs if Joe Flacco could have scored more than 6 points in regulation. Bad thing to bet on it turns out.
Bummer we can't have Detroit in the playoffs, what a fun team.
Looking ahead to the playoffs, Dallas gave a good preview Sunday of how they're going to implode and lose 17-16 in the Wild Card round. I expect Buffalo and SF to have the easiest wins, the other games should be close and good (if Lamar is playing well).
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The way he even got into the playoffs is ridiculous. 8-9 and the worst point differential in the division and having to beat out all-time greats Andy Dalton, Sam Darnold, and Desmond Ritter. :facepalm:
What a crazy year this year for QBs. Top 10 in QBR:
Mahomes
Allen
Tua
Hurts
Goff
Geno
Daniel Jones
Brissett
Lamar
Burrow
So the Steelers could have made the playoffs if Joe Flacco could have scored more than 6 points in regulation. Bad thing to bet on it turns out.
Bummer we can't have Detroit in the playoffs, what a fun team.
Looking ahead to the playoffs, Dallas gave a good preview Sunday of how they're going to implode and lose 17-16 in the Wild Card round. I expect Buffalo and SF to have the easiest wins, the other games should be close and good (if Lamar is playing well).
Is Lamar playing at all? Last I heard, he wasn't progressing like expected.
Hey, Dream Team, I've been meaning to ask: want to go see "80 For Brady" with me this weekend? Should be a hoot! :) :) :). (By the way, one, I'd rather watch paint dry than see this movie, and two, this probably belongs in the "Movies and TV" section, but Rita Moreno is a freak of nature; she's 91 freakin' years old and looks 40 years younger than that. That woman is AGELESS.).
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I heard on the radio this morning that the last four teams to enter the playoffs with a 10 (or more) game winning streak are a combined 1-4 in the playoffs.
Also, for whatever reason, I find it amusing that folks refer to "Tua" and "Lamar" but not "Josh" and "Joe." :)
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I heard on the radio this morning that the last four teams to enter the playoffs with a 10 (or more) game winning streak are a combined 1-4 in the playoffs.
Also, for whatever reason, I find it amusing that folks refer to "Tua" and "Lamar" but not "Josh" and "Joe." :)
In fairness, nobody can pronounce Tagomonoplowa, much less pronounce it.
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And I've heard many say Lamar Jackson. Tua on the other hand..... Yeah, what El Barto said. LOL
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In fairness, nobody can pronounce Tagomonoplowa, much less pronounce it.
Isn't that a Polynesian potato vodka?
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The way he even got into the playoffs is ridiculous. 8-9 and the worst point differential in the division and having to beat out all-time greats Andy Dalton, Sam Darnold, and Desmond Ritter. :facepalm:
What a crazy year this year for QBs. Top 10 in QBR:
Mahomes
Allen
Tua
Hurts
Goff
Geno
Daniel Jones
Brissett
Lamar
Burrow
So the Steelers could have made the playoffs if Joe Flacco could have scored more than 6 points in regulation. Bad thing to bet on it turns out.
Bummer we can't have Detroit in the playoffs, what a fun team.
Looking ahead to the playoffs, Dallas gave a good preview Sunday of how they're going to implode and lose 17-16 in the Wild Card round. I expect Buffalo and SF to have the easiest wins, the other games should be close and good (if Lamar is playing well).
Is Lamar playing at all? Last I heard, he wasn't progressing like expected.
Hey, Dream Team, I've been meaning to ask: want to go see "80 For Brady" with me this weekend? Should be a hoot! :) :) :). (By the way, one, I'd rather watch paint dry than see this movie, and two, this probably belongs in the "Movies and TV" section, but Rita Moreno is a freak of nature; she's 91 freakin' years old and looks 40 years younger than that. That woman is AGELESS.).
Lamar isn't playing because he has no contract. When he went down with injury it was a huge wake-up call because he has no contract. There are those that say he will never play another down for the Ravens but I guess we will have to see.
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In fairness, nobody can pronounce Tagomonoplowa, much less pronounce it.
Isn't that a Polynesian potato vodka?
:lol
Seriously, best kept secret in clear liquors. I've usually got a bottle in my freezer, though I haven't drank vodka for years. My stepfather was a master of seeking out the best affordable wine and spirits, and that was a staple. Meyers dark rum and Friexenet Cordon Negro are the two other things I got from him and still swear by.
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Ok…let’s do this…
(https://i.imgur.com/E4qhiDH.jpeg)
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Ok…let’s do this…
(https://i.imgur.com/E4qhiDH.jpeg)
:lol :lol :corn :corn
It's gonna be a fun one for sure. If we win, I would be ecstatic.
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That's fucking amazing.
I'm going to restrain the shit talking for now... Been battling Seattle for way to many years to assume anything.
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Lamar isn't playing because he has no contract. When he went down with injury it was a huge wake-up call because he has no contract. There are those that say he will never play another down for the Ravens but I guess we will have to see.
The Ravens are out of their minds if they pay Jackson what he wants. It seems clear that Jackson has zero intention of rushing back this season since he doesn't want to re-injure himself before trying to get his payday, so if he doesn't play this week and they lose, that will now be three seasons in a row where he didn't finish the season because he was hurt. And as great as he was in 2019, his play hasn't consistently been close to that in the three seasons since. Moral of the story is that Jackson has likely already peaked as an NFL QB (and you have a single playoff win to show during his peak), and giving big money to a QB who is likely to give diminishing returns is the best way to see your franchise spiral downhill, and that doesn't seem to be the Ravens way.
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Lamar isn't playing because he has no contract. When he went down with injury it was a huge wake-up call because he has no contract. There are those that say he will never play another down for the Ravens but I guess we will have to see.
The Ravens are out of their minds if they pay Jackson what he wants. It seems clear that Jackson has zero intention of rushing back this season since he doesn't want to re-injure himself before trying to get his payday, so if he doesn't play this week and they lose, that will now be three seasons in a row where he didn't finish the season because he was hurt. And as great as he was in 2019, his play hasn't consistently been close to that in the three seasons since. Moral of the story is that Jackson has likely already peaked as an NFL QB (and you have a single playoff win to show during his peak), and giving big money to a QB who is likely to give diminishing returns is the best way to see your franchise spiral downhill, and that doesn't seem to be the Ravens way.
The Ravens are f-----d either way though; John Harbaugh went all in on Lamar, and that offense is basically his backing band.
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Lamar isn't playing because he has no contract. When he went down with injury it was a huge wake-up call because he has no contract. There are those that say he will never play another down for the Ravens but I guess we will have to see.
The Ravens are out of their minds if they pay Jackson what he wants. It seems clear that Jackson has zero intention of rushing back this season since he doesn't want to re-injure himself before trying to get his payday, so if he doesn't play this week and they lose, that will now be three seasons in a row where he didn't finish the season because he was hurt. And as great as he was in 2019, his play hasn't consistently been close to that in the three seasons since. Moral of the story is that Jackson has likely already peaked as an NFL QB (and you have a single playoff win to show during his peak), and giving big money to a QB who is likely to give diminishing returns is the best way to see your franchise spiral downhill, and that doesn't seem to be the Ravens way.
The Ravens are f-----d either way though; John Harbaugh went all in on Lamar, and that offense is basically his backing band.
Not to mention that they can only win by outscoring whatever their terrible D gives up any given Sunday. It's not just the offense that needs to be reworked minus Jackson.
Sounds like tag him and trade him might be the solution. I'll bet there's somebody dumb enough to send a high value pick their way for him.
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Yep, they will likely tag him and then the fun begins.
I agree that the Ravens are f'd either way. Jackson isn't great or durable enough to warrant the money he wants, but without him they will be in QB no-man's land, which sucks (just ask Jets fans :P :lol).
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Yep, they will likely tag him and then the fun begins.
I agree that the Ravens are f'd either way. Jackson isn't great or durable enough to warrant the money he wants, but without him they will be in QB no-man's land, which sucks (just ask Jets fans :P :lol).
Speaking of which, the Jets are just the sort of team that would make that move...
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In fairness, nobody can pronounce Tagomonoplowa, much less pronounce it.
Isn't that a Polynesian potato vodka?
:lol
Seriously, best kept secret in clear liquors. I've usually got a bottle in my freezer, though I haven't drank vodka for years. My stepfather was a master of seeking out the best affordable wine and spirits, and that was a staple. Meyers dark rum and Friexenet Cordon Negro are the two other things I got from him and still swear by.
Yeah, I don't partake either, but I always keep one around for occasional visits from my son.
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Yep, they will likely tag him and then the fun begins.
I agree that the Ravens are f'd either way. Jackson isn't great or durable enough to warrant the money he wants, but without him they will be in QB no-man's land, which sucks (just ask Jets fans :P :lol).
Speaking of which, the Jets are just the sort of team that would make that move...
I don't think he's leaving Baltimore, but if you did put him on the Jets current roster then I think it's reasonable to say we become Super Bowl contenders.
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Yep, they will likely tag him and then the fun begins.
I agree that the Ravens are f'd either way. Jackson isn't great or durable enough to warrant the money he wants, but without him they will be in QB no-man's land, which sucks (just ask Jets fans :P :lol).
Speaking of which, the Jets are just the sort of team that would make that move...
I don't think he's leaving Baltimore, but if you did put him on the Jets current roster then I think it's reasonable to say we become Super Bowl contenders.
If he plays at "Lamar JacksonTM" level, sure. With that defense...
Are you interested in Derek Carr? I think that might be a nice fit too. Would probably be better in the long term because I think if you're not going to bail entirely on Zach, Carr might be a good role model.
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Carr would be my top choice for the Jets. If Jimmy G could stay healthy then I would like him as well but he can’t stay on the field. Getting Carr for relatively cheap (especially compared to Lamar) would be the best option, especially because some guys on the roster (Quinnen Williams) have earned a new contract as well. I truly believe the Jets are a QB away from competing, and Carr would fill that roster spot without completing mortgaging our future.
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I'd be fine with the Jets paying big money to take a chance on somebody like Lamar. Give me a 2-year or 3-year deal that expires by the time you've got to pay talented rookies. Develop somebody in the meantime.
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https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35441956/nfl-officiating-scrutiny-seahawks-rams-controversy
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https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35441956/nfl-officiating-scrutiny-seahawks-rams-controversy
I will concede that the running into the kicker call was not warranted. That was huge.
But all the others are calls that I’ve seen fall this way or that way for decades. They are judgement calls on the field, and it’s not all as blatant as this article makes it out to be.
You’re seriously going to tell me that that this game was the “worst ever” as this article claims? Didn’t the Rams themselves benefit from a horrible call when playing the Saints years ago? One that had a bearing on the Super Bowl at the time IIRC.
We’ve both lost and won games on “horrible officiating” and that’s just the human nature of the game. So either make EVERYTHING reviewable and slow down the game, or live with the game for what it is.
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I was not making any assertions. I merely posted the article for the reading pleasure of fellow football fans. :) :)
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I was not making any assertions. I merely posted the article for the reading pleasure of fellow football fans. :) :)
Totally fair.
My post was meant to be more of a small soapbox than an irritated rant. Looking back at it, it reads like I was more annoyed than I actually was.
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I was not making any assertions. I merely posted the article for the reading pleasure of fellow football fans. :) :)
Totally fair.
My post was meant to be more of a small soapbox than an irritated rant. Looking back at it, it reads like I was more annoyed than I actually was.
Kev has that effect on people. ;D
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https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35441956/nfl-officiating-scrutiny-seahawks-rams-controversy
I will concede that the running into the kicker call was not warranted. That was huge.
But all the others are calls that I’ve seen fall this way or that way for decades. They are judgement calls on the field, and it’s not all as blatant as this article makes it out to be.
You’re seriously going to tell me that that this game was the “worst ever” as this article claims? Didn’t the Rams themselves benefit from a horrible call when playing the Saints years ago? One that had a bearing on the Super Bowl at the time IIRC.
We’ve both lost and won games on “horrible officiating” and that’s just the human nature of the game. So either make EVERYTHING reviewable and slow down the game, or live with the game for what it is.
Imagine how many games of the past would've been different if they had the capabilities to measure like we do now.
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It is absolutely fucking dumping rain where I'm at, and I'd say I live 15 miles from Levi's stadium. This game is gonna be a sloppy ass mess.
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Okay official prediction time that will undoubtedly be wrong.
Wild Card Round
BUF vs MIA
CIN vs BAL
JAC vs LAC
SF vs SEA
MIN vs NYG
TB vs DAL
Divisional Round
KC vs LAC
BUF vs CIN
PHI vs DAL
SF vs MIN
Conference Championship
KC vs BUF
PHI vs SF
Super Bowl LVII
SF vs BUF
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https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35441956/nfl-officiating-scrutiny-seahawks-rams-controversy
I will concede that the running into the kicker call was not warranted. That was huge.
But all the others are calls that I’ve seen fall this way or that way for decades. They are judgement calls on the field, and it’s not all as blatant as this article makes it out to be.
You’re seriously going to tell me that that this game was the “worst ever” as this article claims? Didn’t the Rams themselves benefit from a horrible call when playing the Saints years ago? One that had a bearing on the Super Bowl at the time IIRC.
We’ve both lost and won games on “horrible officiating” and that’s just the human nature of the game. So either make EVERYTHING reviewable and slow down the game, or live with the game for what it is.
Imagine how many games of the past would've been different if they had the capabilities to measure like we do now.
I’d be willing to bet the farm that the “immaculate reception” would have been called back if it happened today. Not just because of the question of the catch itself, but also because of the existing rule at the time that it could not bounce off a defensive player, making it a dead ball
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The quest for 14 in a row starts now!
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It is absolutely fucking dumping rain where I'm at, and I'd say I live 15 miles from Levi's stadium. This game is gonna be a sloppy ass mess.
I've been meaning to ask how you guys are doing with all the floods?
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It is absolutely fucking dumping rain where I'm at, and I'd say I live 15 miles from Levi's stadium. This game is gonna be a sloppy ass mess.
I've been meaning to ask how you guys are doing with all the floods?
Personally I'm good, our neighborhood is in a slightly higher area from the creeks. The other side of the freeway where I live, about 2 miles away, got hit good. My parents are in the most suspect area, they won't get hit, but every outlet road from where they live has been closed at least some of the time. They're in Rancho Murieta, bosk knows where it is, the Consumnes river runs right by it, and that's the one whose levee broke hard.
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It is absolutely fucking dumping rain where I'm at, and I'd say I live 15 miles from Levi's stadium. This game is gonna be a sloppy ass mess.
I've been meaning to ask how you guys are doing with all the floods?
Personally I'm good, our neighborhood is in a slightly higher area from the creeks. The other side of the freeway where I live, about 2 miles away, got hit good. My parents are in the most suspect area, they won't get hit, but every outlet road from where they live has been closed at least some of the time. They're in Rancho Murieta, bosk knows where it is, the Consumnes river runs right by it, and that's the one whose levee broke hard.
Hopefully they have continued good fortune.
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It is absolutely fucking dumping rain where I'm at, and I'd say I live 15 miles from Levi's stadium. This game is gonna be a sloppy ass mess.
I've been meaning to ask how you guys are doing with all the floods?
Personally I'm good, our neighborhood is in a slightly higher area from the creeks. The other side of the freeway where I live, about 2 miles away, got hit good. My parents are in the most suspect area, they won't get hit, but every outlet road from where they live has been closed at least some of the time. They're in Rancho Murieta, bosk knows where it is, the Consumnes river runs right by it, and that's the one whose levee broke hard.
Yeah, it's an interesting town, since it's in rolling hills with stuff all around that doesn't really give you good sight lines to tell how it would be with respect to flooding from the nearby river and the creeks. My understanding is that it is pretty safe. But, yeah, it is also isolated, and there aren't easy ways to get in or out of the main roads close off. Hope they stay safe, Chef. I don't remember whether your brother is still in the area, but I'm close enough that I might be able to help if they need anything. Let me know.
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I was not making any assertions. I merely posted the article for the reading pleasure of fellow football fans. :) :)
Totally fair.
My post was meant to be more of a small soapbox than an irritated rant. Looking back at it, it reads like I was more annoyed than I actually was.
Kev has that effect on people. ;D
(https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/2021-08/17/20/asset/b587487aa5ab/anigif_sub-buzz-6995-1629231430-37.gif)
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It is absolutely fucking dumping rain where I'm at, and I'd say I live 15 miles from Levi's stadium. This game is gonna be a sloppy ass mess.
I've been meaning to ask how you guys are doing with all the floods?
Personally I'm good, our neighborhood is in a slightly higher area from the creeks. The other side of the freeway where I live, about 2 miles away, got hit good. My parents are in the most suspect area, they won't get hit, but every outlet road from where they live has been closed at least some of the time. They're in Rancho Murieta, bosk knows where it is, the Consumnes river runs right by it, and that's the one whose levee broke hard.
Yeah, it's an interesting town, since it's in rolling hills with stuff all around that doesn't really give you good sight lines to tell how it would be with respect to flooding from the nearby river and the creeks. My understanding is that it is pretty safe. But, yeah, it is also isolated, and there aren't easy ways to get in or out of the main roads close off. Hope they stay safe, Chef. I don't remember whether your brother is still in the area, but I'm close enough that I might be able to help if they need anything. Let me know.
It all the outlets...H16, Dillard, Scott are all flooded, so in the heavy times their only outlet is going east on 16 which adds an hour. Thankfully they added a strip mall in Rancho with a Bel Air and a Starbucks, so they really don't need much. My brothers are in Roseville and Elk Grove, both are in good spaces though. Thanks for the concern bud.
Back to the topic at hand... Niners are looking so good.
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Yup! 2 drives; 2 scores. And looking pretty good overall doing it. It's funny because I find myself almost expecting perfect execution on every play, but despite some little misfires, they're looking pretty good.
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I loved SF -9.5 today, but the talk about heavy rains and whatnot scared me, so I stayed away.
For some weird feeling, I think the Ravens are going to give the Bengals much more of a game tomorrow night than some think. I won't be surprised if they pull the upset. John Harbaugh has a record 8 road playoff wins in his coaching career; he knows how to get his team up for a road playoff game.
Bills/49ers was my pick at work for the SB, but I won't be stunned if the Chiefs win it. They have both the best coach and the best QB in the playoffs.
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For some weird feeling, I think the Ravens are going to give the Bengals much more of a game tomorrow night than some think. I won't be surprised if they pull the upset. John Harbaugh has a record 8 road playoff wins in his coaching career; he knows how to get his team up for a road playoff game.
Under normal circumstances, I could see that happening. But they are really playing at a major disadvantage with their QB situation being so in flux. Harbaugh is great at coaching his team up and having them prepared and ready to fight, but I just don't see them being able to go the distance with Cincy for 4 quarters.
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Seahawks aren’t going quietly.
Whatever they figured out about the San Francisco defense, they pulled it off on that drive.
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They are such an embarrassment to the NFL and to humanity in general. I hope they lose so badly that the owners just give up the NFL franchise.
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Y’all should’ve taken the 10 pts. :xbones
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Never watched a Niner-Hawks game that meant something that wasn't an absolutely excruciating experience. Looks like this one will be more of the same.
Buckle in kids.
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49ers have the lead back, but Purdy is starting to look shaky. He is fine when guys are wide open or when he can throw a 3-yard pass to Kittle or Deebo who can take it for 20, but when the plays break down, it gets ugly; kind of like Jimmy G. One of those plays has a turnover written all over it in the second half.
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Fucking stupid penalty...just gave them 3.
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Wow, Ward is awful today. He got torched on the Metcalf TD and just committed a f'ing stupid penalty that gave Seattle 3 points. Brutal.
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So!!! How are you guys enjoying the game?? :angel:
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:lol
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As far as I’m concerned, all I wanted to do today was “make the gods bleed”. I want them to panic. Even if they win, we have won if we made them worry, and showed the league that they are vulnerable,
From that perspective, we’ve already won.
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(https://i.postimg.cc/NMcHwc4H/FB-IMG-1673737862229.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/XZsJwttj) (https://banks-nearme.com/bmo-harris-bank-near-me)
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:rollin
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I am headed out for the night here in a few, but I look forward to the reactions to this game once I am back online later tonight or tomorrow. :lol :lol
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I heard on the radio this morning that the last four teams to enter the playoffs with a 10 (or more) game winning streak are a combined 1-4 in the playoffs.
Hmmm...
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I’m gonna call it right now. This game is going to come down to a costly turnover by one side or the other.
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Great drive... Let's see if our D is back to form
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I’m gonna call it right now. This game is going to come down to a costly turnover by one side or the other.
And there you have it.
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I’m gonna call it right now. This game is going to come down to a costly turnover by one side or the other.
And there you have it.
Just came in here to say the same thing.
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I’m gonna call it right now. This game is going to come down to a costly turnover by one side or the other.
And there you have it.
Just came in here to say the same thing.
You guys are quick lol
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It’s still early enough that there *COULD* be an equalizing turnover…but that really really hurt.
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There’s the ball game! Congratulations to Bosk, and all the other Niner fans here!
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We'll see...if we can get another solid stop I'd feel a lot better
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Seattle taking penalty after penalty.... Holding to negate an almost first down and now a false start.
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Seeing Carrol's dejected face combined with "had a bad day" playing really makes me hot...
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God I love having Deebo back...having him and McCaffrey both healthy and killing it really opens that offense up so much.
Not gonna say it's over....but I definitely am breathing easier and looking forward to the ribs on the grill. On a side note, they seemed to have gotten lucky with the weather, I haven't seen a drop since the game started, and it looks to be fairly clear till when it's over. That's a rarity with how it's been lately.
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I like how the Packers and Seahawks are competing to get ass blasted by the 9ers next week. :biggrin:
Certainly looks like it's headed this way ;)
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I thought that either team would win 14-13, or the Niners would punch the Hawks in the face early and often, and it would be over by the middle of the 2nd quarter. Of course, it didn't play out either way.
Also, they had predicted heavy rain and winds. Looked glorious.
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I thought that either team would win 14-13, or the Niners would punch the Hawks in the face early and often, and it would be over by the middle of the 2nd quarter. Of course, it didn't play out either way.
Also, they had predicted heavy rain and winds. Looked glorious.
It just started dumping again.
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Are the Chargers actually good, or are the Jaguars bad?
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Are the Chargers actually good, or are the Jaguars bad?
Yes.
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I’m rocking my powder blue Antonio Gates jersey at the bar tonight. I’d definitely call myself a fan of the Chargers. Still, I don’t trust them yet and chalk up this early lead more to the Jaguars just being the best team from the abysmal AFC South.
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I wasn't expecting the Jags to just completely roll over in the playoffs....
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Living in Socal, I hear a fair amount about the Chargers, and the radio PBP guy for the team does my favorite afternoon drive talk radio show. It's not like they're playing a juggernaut today, but I kinda feel like the Chargers may be peaking at the right time.
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Living in Socal, I hear a fair amount about the Chargers, and the radio PBP guy for the team does my favorite afternoon drive talk radio show. It's not like they're playing a juggernaut today, but I kinda feel like the Chargers may be peaking at the right time.
It’s too bad they’re gonna run into the buzzsaw that is the Chiefs next week.
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And now a special teams breakdown. The Jaguars are completely outmatched tonight.
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Are the Chargers really gonna blow this lead?
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Missed chip shot FG?
Cough Cough!
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Missed chip shot FG?
Cough Cough!
Good thing I’m drunk or I’d be a lot angrier.
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Well this just got extremely interesting.
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I can't be angry. I have no akin in this game.
I know this will shock you but I am pulling for the Bills. Their fan base are amazing, welcoming and are so snake bitten I want them to win it all.
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I can't be angry. I have no akin in this game.
I know this will shock you but I am pulling for the Bills. Their fan base are amazing, welcoming and are so snake bitten I want them to win it all.
I'll give you my kids number, you can root them on to another SB disappointment together
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The Chargers sure look like they don't want to win :corn
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Look at this SF dick snagging. You are wagging at the wring bro RJ. Boston's Championship Dick is Long Dong Silver impressive.
RJ is so old, hell get this. Lol
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I’d definitely call myself a fan of the Chargers. Still, I don’t trust them…
As I said…
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Wow...
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Holy fucking shit.
The only response allowed.
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What a game, I was wondering who would screw it up more at the end there. There's no way Staley doesn't get fired. Also wasn't Al Michaels with thursday night football? is this a special arrangement with NBC?
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Well everyone wants to crown Herbert like they want to crown Burrow but wow is that a bad look for him. Spotted 27 points but was consistently shitting the bed in the red zone giving Jac the opportunity.
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Honest question, do you guys think the Bills will get favorable calls throughout the playoffs in light of the Damar Hamlin situation? I sure hope the refs aren’t tempted to go there.
A lot of talk about where Brady might play next year. It must be nice to be able to choose what loaded team you go to every other year. He should choose the Texans instead, that would be a real challenge.
Speaking of Brady, you hear a lot of “he makes everyone better!” “He elevates the team!” Well he sure as hell didn’t do it this year, 8-9 and in the playoffs by a miracle and horseshoe. You know who actually elevated his team the most this year? Mahomes. Defense ranked in the 20s, terrible kicking game, yet 14-3 and first round bye. Mahomes had a 4th quarter lead in EVERY game this year but the D blew 3 of them. So 3 losses by a combined 10 points. His skill position players outside of Kelce are a bunch of has-beens/never-weres/don’t-know-yets.
If that’s not elevating your team, what the hell is?
And again, LOL Chargers :lol.
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All the reports that I have heard have Brady going to the Raiders.
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49ers looked like the team I expected to see in the second half.
Chargers/Jags - wow, that was nuts. I swear, when the Jags got it to 27-14, I said to my buddy, "You just know the Jags are gonna win this now." And they did. Staley, who I've thought it was a bit of nitwit already, should not survive this. The Chargers cannot waste the rest of Herbert's early years with that clown as their coach. Brutal start for Lawrence, but what a finish.
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Dream Team, do you go to bed thinking of Brady? He really owns headspace with you. Why waste energy on him?
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I cannot believe that Jacksonville won, I tuned out of the game at half time thinking it was a wrap.
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I cannot believe that Jacksonville won, I tuned out of the game at half time thinking it was a wrap.
So did I, but only for a bit. I made a point to check the score frequently so I could turn it back on if JAX clawed their way back. I wouldn't have bet on that second half, but I wouldn't have bet against it, either. Everything I've heard is that TL has a good head on his shoulders. He doesn't choke and he handled pressure well. I never counted him out last night.
Seriously, the kid shook off a 4 pick first half and came back like a boss.
And yeah, SD needs to shake things up. That was butt ugly. :lol
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I had picked Jax, but gave up on them and didn't watch the second half. Really surprising outcome.
And speaking of surprising outcomes, Miami takes the lead in the 3rd quarter???? I expected them to be losing by double digits at this point! Pleasantly surprised at how this is going.
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Was listening in the car at the end of the 2nd quarter. One of the guys said something like "remember when we were younger and at the 2 minute warning we would think 'that might not be enough time to make a score?' Nowadays we seem more likely than not to get a couple scores in that amount of time."
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Yeah. I mean, it's still really hard. But what's different is that we've had a few decades of perfecting and refining 2-minute drills now, so it's expected that there are a few teams that can execute them at a high level and score quickly. It's like anything else. Back in the '80s, you'd listen to a Van Halen record, and hearing some of the stuff Eddie was doing, it was mindblowing to hear, and really difficult for less experienced players to figure out how to sound like that. Even if you could see him, it was like, "wait, he's tapping? That's insane!" But we've had so much time to analyze and figure it out, so now lots of people can do it more easily.
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Pleasantly surprised at how this is going.
My kid is at the game...part of me is wanting to see the upset, the other part doesn't want my kid to be sad :lol
(granted if it comes to Niner/Buffalo all that shit goes out the window lol)
My brother has Buffalo and the points on his parlay card, he just texted me saying he's gonna blame my kid if he loses it. :lol
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Ugly win, but a playoff win is a playoff win. Josh Allen better clean up that crap, though. 3 turnovers won't fly against Cincy or KC.
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Ugly win, but a playoff win is a playoff win. Josh Allen better clean up that crap, though. 3 turnovers won't fly against Cincy or KC.
It would not have even flown against Miami if receivers not named Hill could catch a fucking ball.
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The Vikings look terrible!
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The Bills lose that game if Tua OR Bridgewater was playing. Allen was ass, again. His D totally bailed him out.
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Are the Chargers actually good, or are the Jaguars bad?
Yes.
Living in Socal, I hear a fair amount about the Chargers, and the radio PBP guy for the team does my favorite afternoon drive talk radio show. It's not like they're playing a juggernaut today, but I kinda feel like the Chargers may be peaking at the right time.
Well...these posts obviously didn't age well! :lol
I can't be angry. I have no akin in this game.
I know this will shock you but I am pulling for the Bills. Their fan base are amazing, welcoming and are so snake bitten I want them to win it all.
Not quite the same history, but as a Broncos fan, I know how good it feels to finally win won after being considered a joke. Go Bills. Secondarily, I'd be ok with the Vikings or the Bengals.
Chargers/Jags - wow, that was nuts. I swear, when the Jags got it to 27-14, I said to my buddy, "You just know the Jags are gonna win this now." And they did.
My kid called it at halftime. I don't think he really believed it, but he absolutely called it. He wasn't watching the 2nd half, and when it got to 30-28, I had to leave to take the daughter to the airport to go back to school. I went into the son's room and told him the score and he started laughing.
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The Vikings look terrible!
Their defense has been trash all year, so they are playing on brand so far today. :lol
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They just showed Bud Grant at the game. He's still alive?! Damn! I thought he was really old when I started following football 45 years ago. <checks Wikipedia>...Dude is 95 years old, and he barely looks older than he did in 1977.
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Seriously.
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Wow. HUGE mistake by the Giants. This game should be all but over. Slayton literally dropped the ball on that play, and it could cost them everything.
Double wow at the refs giving the Vikings a free 15 yards.
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Giants hold on and will now play at Philly next week.
Dallas/TB winner now goes to SF.
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Not sure who I'd like us to face... Dallas in the playoffs is always fucking intense, and who knows when you're facing playoffs Brady.
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The Vikings losing should come as no surprise to anyone. They were probably the luckiest team during the regular season this year.
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Just needed to come in and laugh at the Vikings…..again.
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Got home just in time to see the Ravens fumble on the 1 inch line and have a lumbering DE return it to the house.
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Wow, yeah, saw that as well. Really surprised the Ravens almost won it. I thought it would be a blowout. I'm 5-0 on my picks so far, but a few of those have NOT gone how I thought they would. (I picked Dallas for tomorrow)
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Unless the Cowboys massively fuck up they're going to win tomorrow. The Bucs aren't that good this time round plagued with injuries to the O Line and mostly terrible coaching. If they somehow manage to win there is no way they're getting past the 49ers. I think the 9ers are going to the superbowl possibly even win it. I think it might be a repeat Chiefs-49ers game with the 9ers winning it all.
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Great games so far. Can't believe the Chargers lost...
Yes I am also on the 49s v Chiefs Superbowl with 49s winning.
TB have been very ordinary this year and so has Brady however, anything can happen now. Really looking forward to the game and seeing how it all plays out.
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Got home just in time to see the Ravens fumble on the 1 inch line and have a lumbering DE return it to the house.
That was one of the best things I've ever seen on a football field. Wondering if he was going to run out of gas and get caught by Andrews (who almost drew a block in the back).
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Seems like Burrow is destined to be the new LOAT. That goal-line fumble :facepalm: On offense he went punt-punt-punt in the 4th quarter but his D held every time.
How crazy was it that there were 2 playoff games in a row where the QB turned it over 4 times and still won? Lawrence, Allen
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As someone who had no real rooting interest in the game (although I did bet the Ravens +8.5 :P), I thought that was a clear block in the back on Andrews on the fumble runback, but the NFL can't let a pesky thing like a penalty get in the way of one of the most exciting plays of the year.
For some weird feeling, I think the Ravens are going to give the Bengals much more of a game tomorrow night than some think. I won't be surprised if they pull the upset. John Harbaugh has a record 8 road playoff wins in his coaching career; he knows how to get his team up for a road playoff game.
I was so close to nailing this. :facepalm: :facepalm:
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All in all they were entertaining games and fun to watch. I didn't come away from any of them thinking X or Y team was exceedingly superior. I underestimated the Giants. Tonight I expect Tampa to give Dallas all they can handle and eek out a victory.
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Eh... the Vikings just good enough bend but don't break defense turned just regular old bad by the end of the season partly due to injuries. I injuries on the O line really hurt as well. I full expected then to lose the game. Though I was hoping for a pleasant surprise, it was not to be.
The Vikings losing should come as no surprise to anyone. They were probably the luckiest team during the regular season this year.
Let's say the Vikings lost 3 or 4 of those close games. They still win the division and end up in the exact same place in the playoffs. I dont think anyone thought they were 13-4 good. But i think they were 10-7 good. They definitely were worse twoarf the end of the season than they were in the middle of the season though, and that's not the way to be successful in the playoffs.
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Tonight's match up might as well be an exhibition game. Either team will not have a chance at the 9ers. Frisco is one scary ass team right now.
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The AFC games this weekend are probably the greatest ever example about a fundamental truth in the NFL. Neither Allen nor Lawrence nor Burrow "deserved" to win those games. Allen had 4 turnovers and was going against a THIRD string quarterback and only won by 3 pts. Lawrence had 4 turnovers. Burrow was against a backup and only threw for 200 yards and won in ridiculous fashion. My point? Football is a TEAM game; don't get suckered in by all this dumb QB vs QB clickbait nonsense. The only kind of fan who disputes this is the kind that believes Lawrence "willed" his defense to play better than Herbert's ::).
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I think Mike Tirico deserves mad props for his call of the Bengals fumble return for a TD last night that flipped that game. Incredible call of a HUGE play.
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Honest question, do you guys think the Bills will get favorable calls throughout the playoffs in light of the Damar Hamlin situation? I sure hope the refs aren’t tempted to go there.
A lot of talk about where Brady might play next year. It must be nice to be able to choose what loaded team you go to every other year. He should choose the Texans instead, that would be a real challenge.
Speaking of Brady, you hear a lot of “he makes everyone better!” “He elevates the team!” Well he sure as hell didn’t do it this year, 8-9 and in the playoffs by a miracle and horseshoe. You know who actually elevated his team the most this year? Mahomes. Defense ranked in the 20s, terrible kicking game, yet 14-3 and first round bye. Mahomes had a 4th quarter lead in EVERY game this year but the D blew 3 of them. So 3 losses by a combined 10 points. His skill position players outside of Kelce are a bunch of has-beens/never-weres/don’t-know-yets.
If that’s not elevating your team, what the hell is?
And again, LOL Chargers :lol.
I thought it was a team game, though? You are remarkably consistent with your inconsistency in favor of Patrick M. :) :) :)
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Bucs center Jensen activated from IR l, not sure if I should get my hopes up because of that. Score might just end up being like 13-10.
Edit, they're also getting all their starting corners and safeties back so they might actually have a chance.
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So much for this being a good game. The Bucs look like they stopped giving a crap the second Brady threw that horrendous pick, and the Cowboys brought their A- game (they get a minus because their clown kicker has missed all three extra points :lol).
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That was a horrendous pick. He's been brutal all night. WTF? Can he not throw the ball anymore?
I have no idea what he has left or what team will pursue him. These owners are fucking stupid so someone might pay him.
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This is probably the worst I've seen Brady look. Making terrible throws almost every time. Not on the same page with the WRs, yeah this game was done long back.
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That was a horrendous pick. He's been brutal all night. WTF? Can he not throw the ball anymore?
I have no idea what he has left or what team will pursue him. These owners are fucking stupid so someone might pay him.
After such an amazing career, he really should have retired after the 2020 season just like MJ should have retired after the second Three-Peat. But these guys are wired to think they can do it forever. Going out on top is always better. Ask John Elway.
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Yay he made one!
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Wow Brady looks terrible. Is that Ryan Leaf in disguise?
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Alright, time to bounce dem boyz out of the playoffs again I guess.
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I watched lots of Bucs games this year and Brady looked the same tonight as he did in every other game. The Bucs fell into the playoffs, they really were not a good team this year. However, I was holding hope that Playoff Brady would miraculously appear but it wasn't to be.
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Niners are well coached and they're a well rounded team. I'd certainly bet on them this time around. I wouldn't discount the possibility of Dallas pulling off the upset, tough. Mr. Irrelevant has only faced bottom tier pass Ds thus far. Dallas can get after the quarterback and they can force turnovers. The best he's faced is SEA twice, and Dallas is better at just about every level. This will be a good test for him.
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It's funny I have more confidence in the Niners beating the Eagles than the Cowboys at this point.
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Niners are well coached and they're a well rounded team. I'd certainly bet on them this time around. I wouldn't discount the possibility of Dallas pulling off the upset, tough. Mr. Irrelevant has only faced bottom tier pass Ds thus far. Dallas can get after the quarterback and they can force turnovers. The best he's faced is SEA twice, and Dallas is better at just about every level. This will be a good test for him.
Agreed. Seattle's pass rush, which no one will confuse with Dallas', had Purdy rattled a bit in the second quarter the other day, and if Parsons and the other 'Boys can get to Purdy and force him into a turnover or two, Dallas can win the game for sure. As good as SF has been, Dallas at their best has been as good (see: their annihilation of Minnesota, winning at Cincinnati). Consistency is their issue, however, and no one will be surprised if they show up and commit a bunch of penalties, turn it over a few times and lose 37-20.
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Niners are well coached and they're a well rounded team. I'd certainly bet on them this time around. I wouldn't discount the possibility of Dallas pulling off the upset, tough. Mr. Irrelevant has only faced bottom tier pass Ds thus far. Dallas can get after the quarterback and they can force turnovers. The best he's faced is SEA twice, and Dallas is better at just about every level. This will be a good test for him.
Totally. Dallas can beat anybody if they play the way they did last night.
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Please let that be TB’s last game. Painful reminder of why he shoulda retired 2 years ago. :\
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Please let that be TB’s last game. Painful reminder of why he shoulda retired 2 years ago. :\
I don't get this. Did you actually look at his stats from the 2021 season? Why would of he retired 2 years ago?
If felt like Brady and his receivers were not on the same page at all last night. Plus add how good Dallas's front 7 are. The were disruptive all night.
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Please let that be TB’s last game. Painful reminder of why he shoulda retired 2 years ago. :\
I don't get this. Did you actually look at his stats from the 2021 season? Why would of he retired 2 years ago?
If felt like Brady and his receivers were not on the same page at all last night. Plus add how good Dallas's front 7 are. The were disruptive all night.
It wasn't ALL Brady; I know he didn't look good, but there were a couple really nice plays by Dallas, and a couple drops (I think Evans should have had that bomb with 3:00 left). Most of Brady's schtick is timing patterns and Dallas did a great job interrupting that. Plus, like on the first 2-point conversion attempt, they got away with some stuff. :). (Dream Team's head exploding in 3... 2... )
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Niners are well coached and they're a well rounded team. I'd certainly bet on them this time around. I wouldn't discount the possibility of Dallas pulling off the upset, tough. Mr. Irrelevant has only faced bottom tier pass Ds thus far. Dallas can get after the quarterback and they can force turnovers. The best he's faced is SEA twice, and Dallas is better at just about every level. This will be a good test for him.
Agreed. Seattle's pass rush, which no one will confuse with Dallas', had Purdy rattled a bit in the second quarter the other day, and if Parsons and the other 'Boys can get to Purdy and force him into a turnover or two, Dallas can win the game for sure. As good as SF has been, Dallas at their best has been as good (see: their annihilation of Minnesota, winning at Cincinnati). Consistency is their issue, however, and no one will be surprised if they show up and commit a bunch of penalties, turn it over a few times and lose 37-20.
Turnovers is where I suspect Dallas loses the game. They can get inside Purdy's head and force some errors. SF will do the same to Dak and negate that advantage, I think.
No matter how it goes I think we've seen this game before. Either in 93 or 95 minus the comeback.
Please let that be TB’s last game. Painful reminder of why he shoulda retired 2 years ago. :\
He's still better than Petyon was in his last two years, and he won an Owl. TB can do the same thing if he and Sean Payton wind up in Denver. If he goes to Vegas he can put up huge numbers all for naught. If he goes to Denver he can compete for another ring. I have no idea what the third option is people keep talking about.
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Sort of annoyed at the talk that Dallas' playoff woes are "behind them". They one one game against a team that didn't rise to the challenge of the playoffs. This is still a McCarthy-led team, after all, and they are not generally known for being a disciplined team. That will - at some point - come back to bite them. It's just a question of whether that will be in one game (in which case they are out) or five (in which case, they have their own Owl).
My gut says Dak Prescott is not a Super Bowl champeen quarterback.
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Sucks that Philly is going to end the Giants season (again). My most hated team in all sports. Oh well. It won't sting so hard this time though because the fact the Giants are even here is incredible. Hopefully they can be competitive though so the game is worth watching. Told my gf that if the Giants beat Minny, I would buy a Giants jersey, but I'm going to wait until next season to do that. I'd love to buy a Barkley jersey, but I'm not sure he'll be on the Giants next season.
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Sucks that Philly is going to end the Giants season (again). My most hated team in all sports. Oh well. It won't sting so hard this time though because the fact the Giants are even here is incredible. Hopefully they can be competitive though so the game is worth watching. Told my gf that if the Giants beat Minny, I would buy a Giants jersey, but I'm going to wait until next season to do that. I'd love to buy a Barkley jersey, but I'm not sure he'll be on the Giants next season.
Nothing says your jersey has to be a current player's. Pick a player you admire and go for it. Hell, I'd probably go with LT, myself.
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Sucks that Philly is going to end the Giants season (again). My most hated team in all sports. Oh well. It won't sting so hard this time though because the fact the Giants are even here is incredible. Hopefully they can be competitive though so the game is worth watching. Told my gf that if the Giants beat Minny, I would buy a Giants jersey, but I'm going to wait until next season to do that. I'd love to buy a Barkley jersey, but I'm not sure he'll be on the Giants next season.
Nothing says your jersey has to be a current player's. Pick a player you admire and go for it. Hell, I'd probably go with LT, myself.
I was literally thinking that exact point (even down to the player).
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My Red Sox shirt is Jim Rice.
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Sucks that Philly is going to end the Giants season (again). My most hated team in all sports. Oh well. It won't sting so hard this time though because the fact the Giants are even here is incredible. Hopefully they can be competitive though so the game is worth watching. Told my gf that if the Giants beat Minny, I would buy a Giants jersey, but I'm going to wait until next season to do that. I'd love to buy a Barkley jersey, but I'm not sure he'll be on the Giants next season.
Nothing says your jersey has to be a current player's. Pick a player you admire and go for it. Hell, I'd probably go with LT, myself.
I was literally thinking that exact point (even down to the player).
Yeah, being a fan of the overachieving troublemaker I went with Randy Moss for my Patriots jersey.
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Sucks that Philly is going to end the Giants season (again). My most hated team in all sports. Oh well. It won't sting so hard this time though because the fact the Giants are even here is incredible. Hopefully they can be competitive though so the game is worth watching. Told my gf that if the Giants beat Minny, I would buy a Giants jersey, but I'm going to wait until next season to do that. I'd love to buy a Barkley jersey, but I'm not sure he'll be on the Giants next season.
Nothing says your jersey has to be a current player's. Pick a player you admire and go for it. Hell, I'd probably go with LT, myself.
I was literally thinking that exact point (even down to the player).
Honestly, as a PSU alum, I'm a pretty big Barkley fan so he's actually who I would want. But I still don't want to buy a jersey for a guy who might be on his way to another team. If he re-signs, I'm going to get his jersey. If not, I will think longer about it. I already have a Giants jersey, for Osi Umenyiora. And while LT may be a legend with the team, he has no meaningful value to me personally. I wasn't really into the NFL when he was playing. I guess if I went with past player, Strahan or Manning would be who I'd want, but I feel like Osi also kind of represented that era of the team.
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Sucks that Philly is going to end the Giants season (again). My most hated team in all sports. Oh well. It won't sting so hard this time though because the fact the Giants are even here is incredible. Hopefully they can be competitive though so the game is worth watching. Told my gf that if the Giants beat Minny, I would buy a Giants jersey, but I'm going to wait until next season to do that. I'd love to buy a Barkley jersey, but I'm not sure he'll be on the Giants next season.
Nothing says your jersey has to be a current player's. Pick a player you admire and go for it. Hell, I'd probably go with LT, myself.
Totally. My most-worn 49er jersey is Ronnie Lott. Only thing I don't like about it is that it's cut like the jerseys from that era, so it's HUGE in the shoulders and really long because of those massive shoulder pads they used to wear.
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It doesn't fit me any more (Hopefully that changes soon!) but I love my John Hannah 70's red jersey.
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So... who would you get (some of these I have, some I don't):
Yankees: Catfish Hunter (29) or Thurman Munson (15)
Red Sox: Carlton Fisk (27) or Carl Yastrzemski (8)
Giants: LT (56
Patriots: Tom Brady (12) or Jim Plunkett (16) (though that last one is a problem, because I like the new jerseys and that implies Matt Cassells or Scott Zolak). I'm also partial to Edelman (11), Faulk (33), Harrison (37) and Vrabel (50).
Islanders: Billy Smith (1)
Bruins: Ray Bourque (77)
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One thing I like about the Penn State jerseys is they don't have a name on them. I can wear my 22 (in blue) and 1 (in white) forever and they'll always represent current and past players.
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Sort of annoyed at the talk that Dallas' playoff woes are "behind them". They one one game against a team that didn't rise to the challenge of the playoffs. This is still a McCarthy-led team, after all, and they are not generally known for being a disciplined team. That will - at some point - come back to bite them. It's just a question of whether that will be in one game (in which case they are out) or five (in which case, they have their own Owl).
My gut says Dak Prescott is not a Super Bowl champeen quarterback.
While on paper I agree, it's the intangibles of a Niner/Dallas playoff game that'll keep my shit talking to a minimum :lol
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I used to always wear my Terrell Davis jersey to my fantasy football drafts every year, but with my retirement from FF this past season combined with my months-long abandonment of the Broncos while Hackett was the coach, it has been a while since I have worn it. Maybe I will bust it out this weekend when rooting against the Chiefs. :coolio :coolio
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Sort of annoyed at the talk that Dallas' playoff woes are "behind them". They one one game against a team that didn't rise to the challenge of the playoffs. This is still a McCarthy-led team, after all, and they are not generally known for being a disciplined team. That will - at some point - come back to bite them. It's just a question of whether that will be in one game (in which case they are out) or five (in which case, they have their own Owl).
My gut says Dak Prescott is not a Super Bowl champeen quarterback.
While on paper I agree, it's the intangibles of a Niner/Dallas playoff game that'll keep my shit talking to a minimum :lol
I can do that for you; if one happens to favor the Gold Diggers, then one of your better scenarios is one where McCarthy has to manage the game, including the clock. ;) :) :) :)
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So... who would you get (some of these I have, some I don't):
Yankees: Catfish Hunter (29) or Thurman Munson (15)
Red Sox: Carlton Fisk (27) or Carl Yastrzemski (8)
Giants: LT (56
Patriots: Tom Brady (12) or Jim Plunkett (16) (though that last one is a problem, because I like the new jerseys and that implies Matt Cassells or Scott Zolak). I'm also partial to Edelman (11), Faulk (33), Harrison (37) and Vrabel (50).
Islanders: Billy Smith (1)
Bruins: Ray Bourque (77)
If I were a fan of the team, I'd go with the highlighted (my wife has a Patriots Brady jersey, and I used to have a Yastrzemski t-shirt (and I'd go with Steve Grogan over Jim Plunkett (unless it were for the Raiders))). I usually buy blank jerseys and would never get a jersey for an active player. The two I have with name/number are Terrell Davis (Broncos) and Luc Robitaille (LA Kings). I might get a Clayton Kershaw jersey when he's done.
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I don't buy jerseys as they're way to expensive. My wife bought me a Ray Bourque jersey many years ago.
I do buy the named t-shirts though.
I have :
Jim Rice
Patrice Bergeron
Terry O'Reilly
Mike Bossy
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I don't buy jerseys as they're way to expensive. My wife bought me a Ray Bourque jersey many years ago.
I do buy the named t-shirts though.
I have :
Jim Rice
Patrice Bergeron
Terry O'Reilly
Mike Bossy
.....what about the David Backes silk boxers? :biggrin:
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I don't buy jerseys as they're way to expensive. My wife bought me a Ray Bourque jersey many years ago.
I do buy the named t-shirts though.
I have :
Jim Rice
Patrice Bergeron
Terry O'Reilly
Mike Bossy
David Backes
.....what about the David Backes silk boxers? :biggrin:
:lol
I fixed my list. I forgot about that one.
Seriously, he was favorite non Bruins player and had he played in G7, the Bruins would've won. The worst thing in the world was Karson Khulman scoring in a G6 blowout, and staying in the lineup for G7.
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I only have one NFL jersey, a Niners Vernon Davis 85 jersey.
If they win it all this year I'll definitely get another. It would be cliche at that point, but I think it would have to be Purdy.
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Pats
Brian Cox
John Hannah
Richard Seymour
Bruins
Nevin Marquart
Joe Thornton
Cam Neely
Andy Moog
Celtics
Bird
Never owned a Red Sox jersey with a name on it. It would be Yaz for me.
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I only have one NFL jersey, a Niners Vernon Davis 85 jersey.
If they win it all this year I'll definitely get another. It would be cliche at that point, but I think it would have to be Purdy.
My now-17-year-old had a Davis jersey when he was a lot younger. He wasn't a big football fan, but he fell in love with that jersey after an incident at the Sac International Airport where Davis was right in front of us in the TSA line, my son was goofing around and bumped into him, and he turned around and flashed a friendly smile that made me bite my tongue and not give the lecture about respecting people's space and not goofing off in line at the airport. :lol
Yeah, if they win it, I might have to pick up a Purdy jersey as well. For the few that I have, I tend to go with players that are historically great (Ronnie Lott 49ers jersey, Frank Gore NFC Pro Bowl jersey, Peyton Manning Colts jersey). But even if Purdy were to flame out in ensuing years or have a short career for whatever reason, a SB winning run with him at the helm would be historic. Honestly though, if I were to pick up a jersey for the current lineup, they have so many players on the roster right now that are really likeable and really good. That's part of what makes this year so fun as a fan.
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I only have one NFL jersey, a Niners Vernon Davis 85 jersey.
If they win it all this year I'll definitely get another. It would be cliche at that point, but I think it would have to be Purdy.
My now-17-year-old had a Davis jersey when he was a lot younger. He wasn't a big football fan, but he fell in love with that jersey after an incident at the Sac International Airport where Davis was right in front of us in the TSA line, my son was goofing around and bumped into him, and he turned around and flashed a friendly smile that made me bite my tongue and not give the lecture about respecting people's space and not goofing off in line at the airport. :lol
Yeah, if they win it, I might have to pick up a Purdy jersey as well. For the few that I have, I tend to go with players that are historically great (Ronnie Lott 49ers jersey, Frank Gore NFC Pro Bowl jersey, Peyton Manning Colts jersey). But even if Purdy were to flame out in ensuing years or have a short career for whatever reason, a SB winning run with him at the helm would be historic. Honestly though, if I were to pick up a jersey for the current lineup, they have so many players on the roster right now that are really likeable and really good. That's part of what makes this year so fun as a fan.
Yeah, there are definitely other players who have done more and are more "deserving" of a purchase.
But I look at my home Eagles market. As far as history for the franchise, Nick Foles is a short blip in their history, and an average QB at best overall. But he will ALWAYS be remembered by every Eagles fan as the man who somehow got them to the promised land.
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Pats
Brian Cox
John Hannah
Richard Seymour
Bruins
Nevin Marquart
Joe Thornton
Cam Neely
Andy Moog
Celtics
Bird
Never owned a Red Sox jersey with a name on it. It would be Yaz for me.
Big Moog fan; I forgot he played for the B's.
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I do not have an NFL jersey but do have a Giannis Antetokounmpo jersey and a Robin Yount.
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Leftwich fired as the OC of Tampa.
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Leftwich fired as the OC of Tampa.
There's been no official word yet.
https://www.tampabay.com/sports/bucs/2023/01/17/bucs-todd-bowles-byron-leftwich-tom-brady-cowboys-offseason-2023/
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I don't know if Leftwich was the problem or not, but that offence looked like they never even practiced.
I guess Brady didn't want to play for Areans, so I'm happy he got the clownshow at HC that he wanted.
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Leftwich fired as the OC of Tampa.
There's been no official word yet.
https://www.tampabay.com/sports/bucs/2023/01/17/bucs-todd-bowles-byron-leftwich-tom-brady-cowboys-offseason-2023/
That's morning interview. The news came out later. We'll see. Either way, they were terrible offensively this year
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Leftwich is the fall guy, as I think everyone knows who called the shots on offense there once Arians was forced out. The problem is that Brady's body can't keep up with the speed of his mind anymore on a consistent basis. He stills looks like TB12 on some throws, and then on some throws he looks awful. That is age.
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Leftwich fired as the OC of Tampa.
There's been no official word yet.
https://www.tampabay.com/sports/bucs/2023/01/17/bucs-todd-bowles-byron-leftwich-tom-brady-cowboys-offseason-2023/ (https://www.tampabay.com/sports/bucs/2023/01/17/bucs-todd-bowles-byron-leftwich-tom-brady-cowboys-offseason-2023/)
That's morning interview. The news came out later. We'll see. Either way, they were terrible offensively this year
I don't think so, the only "official" word I can find on the firing is some facebook (https://www.facebook.com/ProFootballFocus/posts/pfbid035xdgFhSqwGDg6XLbmFGkKnGrj98Nc35e3TVqLiZWUgSPMEwBbpfcBigasWFUTFgvl)post by some weird page called Pro Football Focus that posted it like today morning or something.
That press conference/interview was from 4 pm today when Bowles was asked about it. He said they're evaluating players right now, coaches evaluation will happen later.
Either way, coaching I think was a big issue with that team. They were never in total sync and most of the times that they were effective was when they went no-huddle with Brady calling the plays.
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Seems to be trending with reputable sources.
(https://i.postimg.cc/5ygDcXds/Screenshot-20230117-223026-Google.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/LgqxL6sP)
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All those appear to be speculating articles sourced from Pewter Report. I don't doubt he'll be gone, just hasn't happened officially yet.
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Please let that be TB’s last game. Painful reminder of why he shoulda retired 2 years ago. :\
I don't get this. Did you actually look at his stats from the 2021 season? Why would of he retired 2 years ago?
If felt like Brady and his receivers were not on the same page at all last night. Plus add how good Dallas's front 7 are. The were disruptive all night.
Stats don't really mean anything to TB if they don't produce results. Personally, I don't care about individual player stats since it is a team sport. However, the most glaring stat I've seen from him is 66 pass attempts in what could possibly be his last game (which was a complete embarrassment btw). Only completing roughly half of those attempts. I think it's time for reality to start setting in. He's not getting back to the big dance. That's why I've said in the past that he should've quit while he was on top. Just sayin'...
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Do you know why they threw it so much? This year they had the worst running game in the NFL. Doesn't matter what QB you are, that affects your game.
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Please let that be TB’s last game. Painful reminder of why he shoulda retired 2 years ago. :\
I don't get this. Did you actually look at his stats from the 2021 season? Why would of he retired 2 years ago?
If felt like Brady and his receivers were not on the same page at all last night. Plus add how good Dallas's front 7 are. The were disruptive all night.
Brady and his receivers weren't on the same page all season. Like I said, it was if they didn't even practice.
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After giving the games time to gestate, I have a couple of comments:
Dallas was the better team top to bottom going into that TB game. Dallas had the better roster even the QB. Of course now we have to worry about the kicker. :\
With the exception of the Chargers and the Vikings all the teams that were expected to win, did win. I didn't have any faith in the Vikings and knew the Chargers were shaky at best.
Of the playing field left, I'm not sold on any of the teams including SF and the Cowboys.
The Cowboys and SF game should be fun. There are so many story lines to be had.
Think about it, if you're a head coach, do you want to sign a 46 year old in decline that will only give you 2 years at best?
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Do you know why they threw it so much? This year they had the worst running game in the NFL. Doesn't matter what QB you are, that affects your game.
Of course I do, but let's face it. He's not as accurate as he once was and it's not like he can move around and extend plays either. He really doesn't have much of a chance behind anything other than a stellar O-line and even that is no guarantee. It's a young man's game and he ain't young no more.
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Do you know why they threw it so much? This year they had the worst running game in the NFL. Doesn't matter what QB you are, that affects your game.
Of course I do, but let's face it. He's not as accurate as he once was and it's not like he can move around and extend plays either. He really doesn't have much of a chance behind anything other than a stellar O-line and even that is no guarantee. It's a young man's game and he ain't young no more.
All QB's that have a poor O line struggles in passing plays. Also, Look at how many running QB's are getting hurt.
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Joe, Brady sucked. All year.
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Again I'll point out that he's night and day better than Peyton was at the end, and he was successful in a system built to cover his weakness[es] and maximize his strengths. Old guys like them make up for what they lose in physicality with smarts and experience.
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Again I'll point out that he's night and day better than Peyton was at the end, and he was successful in a system built to cover his weakness[es] and maximize his strengths. Old guys like them make up for what they lose in physicality with smarts and experience.
Awesome. He still sucked.
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Joe, Brady sucked. All year.
I think he was less effective than previous years but he was the main reason the Bucs even made the playoffs. I think he had like 4 or 5 game winning drives.
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I think it's easy to say he should have retired after winning the SB a couple years ago when we see the end results, and maybe that also includes his marriage ending.
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Joe, Brady sucked. All year.
I think he was less effective than previous years but he was the main reason the Bucs even made the playoffs. I think he had like 4 or 5 game winning drives.
The Bucs were out of sorts all year. A clown for an HC, who may have been powerless to stop Brady from leaving in training camp to go on vacation or wherever. The Bucs season was doomed right there.
Going to Kraft's wedding a night before a game? WTF? He wasn't invested and it showed. The offence looked like they never practiced. Given autonomy, Brady can engineer a drive, sure. What did he do in those games up until that point?
How many open receivers did he miss this season, hell, even the other night?
I'm a huge Brady fan, trust me, but he blew chunks this season, and I would have no idea what to expect from him next season. He could bounce back I guess, but he seems to have lost the passion. That's just the way it looked.
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I don't think Brady "sucked". He was mid, with a bad line, and awful under pressure. He still played better than many current starts in the league, however.
However, I think he's definitely crossed the line from "blockbuster Free Agent acquisition" for whatever team gets him to "veteran bridge QB", at best. Maybe he's Tampa's bridge, or maybe he goes somewhere else. Wherever it may be, I don't think that place translates to a ready-to-win team.
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The main reason the Bucs made the playoffs is they had the best record in a shitty division. Now, if the NFL would fix their ridiculous seeding formula, teams with losing records would never make the playoffs or at least not be able to host a better team.
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Again I'll point out that he's night and day better than Peyton was at the end, and he was successful in a system built to cover his weakness[es] and maximize his strengths. Old guys like them make up for what they lose in physicality with smarts and experience.
Awesome. He still sucked.
That wasn't addressed to you. We already know where you stand. I was referring to whether or not he could still succeed somewhere, as DD and Joe were getting at.
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Again I'll point out that he's night and day better than Peyton was at the end, and he was successful in a system built to cover his weakness[es] and maximize his strengths. Old guys like them make up for what they lose in physicality with smarts and experience.
Awesome. He still sucked.
That wasn't addressed to you. We already know where you stand. I was referring to whether or not he could still succeed somewhere, as DD and Joe were getting at.
Ok gotcha. ;D
I think if he comes in focused and committed, two things he clearly was not this season, then I would agree that he could succeed elsewhere. But it's easy sitting on my couch trying to hedge my bets. Do I hand the guy $25-30m on a crapshoot?
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Joe, Brady sucked. All year.
I think he was less effective than previous years but he was the main reason the Bucs even made the playoffs. I think he had like 4 or 5 game winning drives.
I am thinking their defense, which was top 10, was the main reason (outside of playing in a bad division). Yeah, Brady could still come back and beat bad teams like the Rams and Saints at the end, but he wasn't good this past season.
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One year of average play and everyone says retire. I think the only reason you folks say that is your tired of Brady. Maybe if his is in full decline you could have your way with him for 1 or 2 more years.
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He absolutely could have success on the right team. If he decides to continue, I will definitely be interested in watching.
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One year of average play and everyone says retire. I think the only reason you folks say that is your tired of Brady. Maybe if his is in full decline you could have your way with him for 1 or 2 more years.
He was 45 this past season and didn't look like he wanted to ever get hit anymore. I doubt that is gonna feel any better at 46. If he goes to Vegas as rumored, it's not like they have a great o-line or a defense ready to win now or a winning coach. If he wants to go there to play for McDaniels and continue to stat whore, have at it. What other realistic destination is there where he could and think, "I could win with that team now"? I am ruling out SF because they don't need him, and if they wanted him, they would have signed him three years ago when he was still very good. Miami seems logical, but they seem to want to stick with Tua.
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Titans could also work.
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One year of average play and everyone says retire. I think the only reason you folks say that is your tired of Brady. Maybe if his is in full decline you could have your way with him for 1 or 2 more years.
He was 45 this past season and didn't look like he wanted to ever get hit anymore. I doubt that is gonna feel any better at 46. If he goes to Vegas as rumored, it's not like they have a great o-line or a defense ready to win now or a winning coach. If he wants to go there to play for McDaniels and continue to stat whore, have at it. What other realistic destination is there where he could and think, "I could win with that team now"? I am ruling out SF because they don't need him, and if they wanted him, they would have signed him three years ago when he was still very good. Miami seems logical, but they seem to want to stick with Tua.
My take is the divorce affected him like nothing before. He lost his focus. He's not a robot. :lol
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Does anyone care to discuss the attempt by Brady to kick-tackle the guy who was returning the fumble? Just turn a blind eye right? The video is easy to find. Giant effing asshole and dirty player. But I guess it’s a-ok.
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No, it was bad. I saw Mac Jones doing stuff like this as well.
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Because I have some OCDism I’m compelled to try to solve things, and I think I’ve figured out why Brady does that chickenshit dirty stuff. It’s not competitiveness. Lawrence Taylor wasn’t competitive? Jack Lambert wasn’t? It’s not because he’s considered the “goat” and thinks that gives him carte blanche. You won’t find video of Montana, Marino, or Elway doing that stuff and they were all in the “goat” conversation when active.
What it is, is Brady is/was a geeky buck-toothed wimpy momma’s boy and likely got his ass kicked on the playground a lot, or even more likely ran from every fight. His only way of getting back at the bullies is throwing a ball and kicking guys in the nuts while hiding behind the refs. Give me a better theory. Damn proud of the fact I don’t root for a douche like that.
What really needs to happen is the next time he tries that cowardly stuff is whatever player he kicks should rip his helmet off and just beat the shit out of him, knock a couple teeth out, break his nose. That should put an end to that behavior :lol.
A bunch of clickbait pundits last week: “the Bucs are the team NOBODY wants to face in the playoffs” :rollin
As far as game-related stuff, Buck and Aikman refused to point out that one reason the Bucs couldn’t score more is that Brady is afraid to hang in the pocket and take hits. Been doing it all year. Set another record, first QB ever to throw 65+ passes and score less than 17 points. Worst team since 1970 on 3rd and long. You’re washed Tom, go away.
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Can we assume you won't be seeing 80 For Brady this weekend?
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Brady likely towered over most kids in school height-wise and played football in high school. I doubt anyone was kicking his ass.
And it goes without saying that anyone who plays football is not a wimp. Even just about any punter or kicker would likely whip the ass of your average wannabe tough guy in a bar.
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He's bitchy and he's a sore loser.
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Are you talking about Tom Brady or Dream Team?
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(https://i.postimg.cc/VN2hxB4W/FB-IMG-1673830435139.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/t1tDP6Ks)
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This young lady is practically auditioning to be Brady's rebound (as if he likely already hasn't had a bunch :lol):
(https://i0.wp.com/www.whiskeyriff.com/wp-content/uploads/Brady-girl-3.jpg?fit=1916%2C1222&ssl=1)
Something tells me he is gonna be just fine despite the divorce.
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First thing he needs to do is buy her a sandwich.
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First thing he needs to do is buy her a sandwich.
So glad I’m not the only one.
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Cough...cough...skank...cough...cough....
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Is she Ben Affleck's nanny?
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Is she Ben Affleck's nanny?
No, Affleck's nanny is Jimmy Kimmel.
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Because I have some OCDism I’m compelled to try to solve things
I'm not sure that's your compulsion.
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Because I have some OCDism I’m compelled to try to solve things
I'm not sure that's your compulsion.
Yeah, I see very very little "OCD" in that jealousy screed. Man oh man. I just can't manifest that much hate for someone I've never met personally. :) :) :) :)
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He's bitchy and he's a sore loser.
Bitchy is probably an understatement. I've seen him acting like a fucking tyrant on the sidelines. A far cry from his politically correct press conferences. I guess that's what happens when 7 titles go straight to your head.
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He's bitchy and he's a sore loser.
Bitchy is probably an understatement. I've seen him acting like a fucking tyrant on the sidelines. A far cry from his politically correct press conferences. I guess that's what happens when 7 titles go straight to your head.
So did Dan Marino and Phillip Rivers. So?
Yawn. God forbid we demand the same level of greatness around us that we demand of ourselves. I'd rather be bitched out by the Greatest Of All Time, and take home the hardware, than coddled and joked around with by someone who couldn't win a game of solitaire.
And funny enough, most of the players who ACTUALLY PLAYED WITH HIM, speak highly of him. It's mostly keyboard warriors and opponents who have beef with him.
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TB12 fanboys getting all defensive. :lol
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I just like it that he's in your heads. :lol
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Something tells me he is gonna be just fine despite the divorce.
I think your criteria for "just fine" might just be a bit off.
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I just like it that he's in your heads. :lol
Exactly.
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Not anymore TG. Out of sight, out of mind.
(https://i.imgur.com/TRbN2HL.jpg)
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I don't get it.
But anyway, speaking of Prescott and the Cowboys, gonna be fun to watch the Cowboys get slaughtered worse on Sunday than in the final act of Tombstone. :corn
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2 great defenses. Which offense can make no errors will win that game.
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A lot of people want to see Brady gone. Just like a lot of people want to see Dallas gone. What's the big mystery?
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Haha. A few more pics and we will have our version of the Jennifer Aniston thread from MP's old forum.
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2 great defenses. Which offense can make no errors will win that game.
I'm not ready to make a call yet, but the more I think about it the more I like Dallas. Simply put, I like Dallas's offense against SF's D more than I like Purdy against Dallas's D. I really like Brock Purdy, the kid's done remarkably well, but he hasn't been tested yet, and he did seem a little flustered against a lesser defense. The only real reason to pick against Dallas is the expectation that they'll choke, and while that's certainly a distinct possibility, it's not really a good thing to bet on. If Dallas plays their game they win this.
Either way I don't expect a "slaughter."
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Leftwich fired as the OC of Tampa.
There's been no official word yet.
https://www.tampabay.com/sports/bucs/2023/01/17/bucs-todd-bowles-byron-leftwich-tom-brady-cowboys-offseason-2023/ (https://www.tampabay.com/sports/bucs/2023/01/17/bucs-todd-bowles-byron-leftwich-tom-brady-cowboys-offseason-2023/)
It's official now ;)
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I think it will play out similarly to the Seattle game, where SF jumps out to an early lead, Dallas claws back, and then SF turns it up a notch and puts the beatdown on them. But I think a final score of around 31-20 is more likely than the 41-23 we got last week.
My picks this week:
-Jax @ KC: Sorry, but I'm not giving the Jags much of a chance.
-NYG @ Phi: I think the Giants will stun the Eagles, but I wouldn't be shocked if I'm wrong.
-Cin @ Buff: This was basically a coin flip for me.
-Dal @ SF: If I were to go position by position, there are very few where I think it is arguable whether SF has more talent. And for the majority, SF clearly does. Add in better coaching as well, and unless there are a lot of unforced errors, Dallas winning doesn't make any sense.
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Leftwich fired as the OC of Tampa.
There's been no official word yet.
https://www.tampabay.com/sports/bucs/2023/01/17/bucs-todd-bowles-byron-leftwich-tom-brady-cowboys-offseason-2023/ (https://www.tampabay.com/sports/bucs/2023/01/17/bucs-todd-bowles-byron-leftwich-tom-brady-cowboys-offseason-2023/)
It's official now ;)
If it leaks it's 99.99% truth.
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Leftwich fired as the OC of Tampa.
There's been no official word yet.
https://www.tampabay.com/sports/bucs/2023/01/17/bucs-todd-bowles-byron-leftwich-tom-brady-cowboys-offseason-2023/ (https://www.tampabay.com/sports/bucs/2023/01/17/bucs-todd-bowles-byron-leftwich-tom-brady-cowboys-offseason-2023/)
It's official now ;)
If it leaks it's 99.99% truth.
He's a fall guy. One year ago, he was supposedly at the top of many lists to be a head coach around the league; either the intel was wrong and this is his true ability (I'm not buying it) or the team fears eating egg for the IMO disastrous hire of Todd Bowles.
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Haha. A few more pics and we will have our version of the Jennifer Aniston thread from MP's old forum.
One of the best threads on the old forum! ;D ;)
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Leftwich fired as the OC of Tampa.
There's been no official word yet.
https://www.tampabay.com/sports/bucs/2023/01/17/bucs-todd-bowles-byron-leftwich-tom-brady-cowboys-offseason-2023/ (https://www.tampabay.com/sports/bucs/2023/01/17/bucs-todd-bowles-byron-leftwich-tom-brady-cowboys-offseason-2023/)
It's official now ;)
If it leaks it's 99.99% truth.
He's a fall guy. One year ago, he was supposedly at the top of many lists to be a head coach around the league; either the intel was wrong and this is his true ability (I'm not buying it) or the team fears eating egg for the IMO disastrous hire of Todd Bowles.
With the talent the Bucs had on their roster, the coaching staff completely failed the team. Bowles, Leftwich the whole lot just didn't work out like they did under Arians. Bowles might be a good defensive coordinator but head coach he isn't.
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Haha. A few more pics and we will have our version of the Jennifer Aniston thread from MP's old forum.
Why DON'T we have one of those here?
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I can remember a game just last weekend when it didn't make much sense that the Jags would pull off the win with 5 turnovers and down 27 points at the half, but they still won. What does make sense is that any team can win on any given day in this league. The amount of talent only matters up to a certain point in which execution and discipline have to take over.
2 great defenses. Which offense can make no errors will win that game.
I'm not ready to make a call yet, but the more I think about it the more I like Dallas. Simply put, I like Dallas's offense against SF's D more than I like Purdy against Dallas's D. I really like Brock Purdy, the kid's done remarkably well, but he hasn't been tested yet, and he did seem a little flustered against a lesser defense. The only real reason to pick against Dallas is the expectation that they'll choke, and while that's certainly a distinct possibility, it's not really a good thing to bet on. If Dallas plays their game they win this.
Either way I don't expect a "slaughter."
This seems to me like uncharted territory for both teams. They're both facing the most difficult opponent so far and that's the way it should be in the playoffs. Not surprised at all that it's the game of the week. Difficult to call.
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Side topic since we're bashing former Patriots: Anyone else feeling pretty averse to Gronk?
I can't stand his "humor", and he's been pretty uninspiring any time he's tried to say anything serious on a panel or as a commentator.
I really hope Gronk the TV analyst does not happen.
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I would agree with that. Gronk is a goofball. :lol
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Not a fain, either. I don't like the way he left NE, and I find his commercials insufferable. As a TV analyst, the most I could see a network wanting to give him is part of a larger crew for a single broadcast, like what Fitzpatrick is doing.
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He's just to goofy to be an analyst.
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I can't picture him being a successful analyst on network TV. But this new media trend of current or former athletes doing podcasts and other Internet-based content is kind of a brave new world where I could see him maybe finding a niche. For example, Draymond Green and Richard Sherman have podcasts (you can find them pretty easily on YouTube) that are mostly very good. Both guys seem natural, and their perspectives and expertises shine though and make for interesting content. For Sherman, I contrast that with his appearances on TNF, where he often seemed a bit too scripted, stiff, and unnatural.
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I can't picture him being a successful analyst on network TV. But this new media trend of current or former athletes doing podcasts and other Internet-based content is kind of a brave new world where I could see him maybe finding a niche. For example, Draymond Green and Richard Sherman have podcasts (you can find them pretty easily on YouTube) that are mostly very good. Both guys seem natural, and their perspectives and expertises shine though and make for interesting content. For Sherman, I contrast that with his appearances on TNF, where he often seemed a bit too scripted, stiff, and unnatural.
There's no doubt in my mind Gronk has a place in social media or podcasts.
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The "Purdy hasn't seen a defense like the Cowboys yet" narrative is interesting. Yeah, he kinda has. Depending on what criteria you use to rank them, the 49ers have played a few teams that rank close to the Cowboys. But probably more importantly, as Fred Warner pointed out a few weeks ago, as the third string QB prior to climbing into the driver's seat, Purdy spent most of the season leading the practice squad against the starting 49ers defense in practice. In other words, he spent countless hours each week playing against the #1 defense in the NFL. And that #1 defense has had nothing but praise for him about how he would often light them up in practice. As Warner said a few weeks ago, I think he'll be just fine. This is nothing new.
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Not a fain, either. I don't like the way he left NE, and I find his commercials insufferable. As a TV analyst, the most I could see a network wanting to give him is part of a larger crew for a single broadcast, like what Fitzpatrick is doing.
Me too; that lovable goofball, big but not that bright teddy bear thing is wearing really thin, really quickly. I'm not really interested in that even in a larger group. Bradshaw is about as close as I get to that; and he knows when to stick to football and be serious (for all the knocks on Bradshaw for being dumb, I think he's a GREAT analyst.)
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The "Purdy hasn't seen a defense like the Cowboys yet" narrative is interesting. Yeah, he kinda has. Depending on what criteria you use to rank them, the 49ers have played a few teams that rank close to the Cowboys. But probably more importantly, as Fred Warner pointed out a few weeks ago, as the third string QB prior to climbing into the driver's seat, Purdy spent most of the season leading the practice squad against the starting 49ers defense in practice. In other words, he spent countless hours each week playing against the #1 defense in the NFL. And that #1 defense has had nothing but praise for him about how he would often light them up in practice. As Warner said a few weeks ago, I think he'll be just fine. This is nothing new.
Your unbridled optimism really takes the edge of the innate nervousness I feel before a SF/Dallas playoff game.
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The "Purdy hasn't seen a defense like the Cowboys yet" narrative is interesting. Yeah, he kinda has. Depending on what criteria you use to rank them, the 49ers have played a few teams that rank close to the Cowboys. But probably more importantly, as Fred Warner pointed out a few weeks ago, as the third string QB prior to climbing into the driver's seat, Purdy spent most of the season leading the practice squad against the starting 49ers defense in practice. In other words, he spent countless hours each week playing against the #1 defense in the NFL. And that #1 defense has had nothing but praise for him about how he would often light them up in practice. As Warner said a few weeks ago, I think he'll be just fine. This is nothing new.
Your unbridled optimism really takes the edge of the innate nervousness I feel before a SF/Dallas playoff game.
I think this game comes down to a little discussed intangible called toughness. SF can beat you up on both sides of the ball and last year Dallas wasn't ready for it - well - until the fourth qtr. This year, the Cowboys will come into the game ready for a street fight. I expect a tough hard fought game but I think it's going to be a higher scoring game to the tune of 30 to 23.
My gut tells me that Dallas is going to win but nothing in this league surprises me anymore.
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I'm taking all four home teams this weekend, but three are iffy. Is Hurts 'not', will the Bills abuse that replacement OL of the Bengals while Allen reduces his TOs, and will the penalty prone Cowboy team return?
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I expect close games all weekend, so I like all the dogs and the points. Not sure I will end up betting any, but if I do, the Giants +7.5 is the one I will likely do. I will decide shortly before game time.
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Ok, this week I'm going with Buffalo, SF, Philly, and Jax
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Would love to play spoilers to the arch rival Eagles today, I just don't see it, Jones will need to have back to back best games of his career. Hopefully a good game regardless!
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Would love to play spoilers to the arch rival Eagles today, I just don't see it, Jones will need to have back to back best games of his career. Hopefully a good game regardless!
I'm pulling for NY as well, I just don't see it happening. Little known lonestar fact, my last pro game I attended was a SF v Philly game at Candlestick. The Philly crowd were such assholes and the environment was such a drunken shit show that I decided it'd be my last pro game, and I've stuck to that
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Anybody remember when Donovan McNabb threw 4 touchdown passes on a broken ankle?
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I love how despondent Collinsworth sounded when Mahomes was getting checked and the Jags were driving. His depression over things not going the Chiefs way (at the time) was so obvious.
Then of course, the Chiefs drive 98 for a score with the backup. Nice work, Jags D. :lol :lol
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You mean the drive that was ‘a borderline miracle?’ Just shut the eff up.
His hyperbole (along with so many others) is why I do my best to tune these guys out, or listen with
the volume as low as possible
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2nd quarter: Jags get a good, clean hit on Henne as he is literally throwing the ball. 15 yard penalty for touching the QB (they called it roughing the QB). Leads to a KC TD.
3rd quarter: Chiefs get a good, clean hit on Lawrence as he is throwing the ball. No flag. Leads to a punt.
I guess the officials got the word from the league that they need Mahomes playing next week, by hook or by crook.
Note: I don't actually think the league told the officials that, but crap like that sure does look fishy.
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Officiating has been absolutely awful this postseason thus far.
They just need to start having New York reviewing all big plays/penalties.
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Update: it has been confirmed by insiders that Cris Collinsworth wants to have Patrick Mahomes next baby, and the word is that he wants to tell Patrick himself in person before telling the public in those exact words (if today's slurping hasn't made it obvious already).
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(https://scontent-sjc3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/326804786_422047176748030_2511143720799613777_n.jpg?stp=cp6_dst-jpg&_nc_cat=1&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=Co9jbCebcG8AX8T-Nxf&_nc_ht=scontent-sjc3-1.xx&oh=00_AfBu4DWm1ExfjQPU2757DzTLhaO9aDrsTS9hC5k8KfGHeQ&oe=63D0F3DF)
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Update: it has been confirmed by insiders that Cris Collinsworth wants to have Patrick Mahomes next baby, and the word is that he wants to tell Patrick himself in person before telling the public in those exact words (if today's slurping hasn't made it obvious already).
No kidding. Just brutal to have to listen to……it’s so over the top. Too bad that kid fumbled that pass…..the Jags were poised to upset them.
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Meanwhile, I guess Philly used their bye week well. After looking shaky in the last month of the season, even when Hurts was playing, they look tonight like the team we saw from September through November. If they are on their game next week, it will be a tall order for Dallas or SF to win there.
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Definitely getting nervous just following the score... Talk about putting an ass whooping
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Giants down 28 in the 3rd. Executes 2 running plays.
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All you dummies complaining about the big time announcers need to STFU.
Daryl Johnston and Joe Davis are boring AF.
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Wow, NY seems incapable of stopping anything. :lol
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Welp, bought my plane ticket to Philly. Anyone up for a meetup?
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I can't do a Philly trip next week, but Cowboys/Eagles in the NFCCG will be fun!
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:lol
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:rollin
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I didn't see the first half of the KC/JAX game. Then I noticed I could get live TV on plane. I turned it on when it was 17-14, but it was pretty much a dud after that.
The PHI/NY game was terrible. Completely non-competitive.
Same with the BUF/CIN game. I don't know if the weather caused or contributed to it, but CIN looked miles better, and Buffalo and Josh Allen looked completely outmatched.
Hoping that the DAL/SF game will salvage an otherwise fairly shitty weekend of football. Hoping it comes down to a last second field goal for a Cowboy win.
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I did not see the Bengals dispatching the Bills so easily. :o
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I did not see the Bengals dispatching the Bills so easily. :o
Yeah, that was a thoroughly convincing win. I really don't see the Chefs being up to that level of play, especially if Mahone isn't on a full tank, but we'll see
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OK, that may have been one of the greatest catches I’ve ever seen in my life!
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OK, that may have been one of the greatest catches I’ve ever seen in my life!
No kidding! That concentration! :metal
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Kittle is such a character, great catch and then moved away from getting pummelled during that catch.
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It's going to be something if the Cowboys score a TD in this drive with no time remaining and the kicker misses the extra point.
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Ya gotta dump that on Dak, but McCarthy kind of bungled the end of the game.
Phili is going to massacre SF.
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What ever in the world was that last play supposed to be with Zeke at center?
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That was a legit great football game. Love those defensive battles where it feels like every turnover or score is very impactful. Very old school. And Dallas lost, which made it even better. :metal :metal
I am not surprised the Bengals won today, but I thought the Bills would put up more of a fight. They are going backwards and may have missed their window to get to and win a Super Bowl. Joe Burrow is scary good.
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Wow, even when everything that could possibly go right for Dallas goes right for Dallas, SF is still too much for them. I don't give Philly a chance next week. Like the Cowboys learned today, Philly just hasn't faced a team this good that can find so many ways to beat you.
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Without a doubt I think we got the four best teams for the championship games. Just hope Mahomes injury doesn't mean a shadow of himself is going to be playing as I would like that to be a great game as last year.
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I'm so glad the Cowboys lost. Eagles/Cowboys would have been horrible. Go Niners!
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Mahomes can beat you from the pocket, but he definitely won't be able to run around and make busted plays like he normally does. I have to think the Chiefs will have extra motivation having lost three straight times to the Bengals, but how much difference that makes is hard to say. My early thought is that it feels like a game the Bengals should win, but the Chiefs find a way to win.
The Eagles front 7 is going to make life miserable for Purdy, who again looked for much of yesterday like a guy who was about to implode and commit THE turnover that flipped the game, but it never happened. The Eagles at home are a much more difficult task than the Cowboys at home. The 49ers defense can definitely flip the game by forcing a turnover or two. It feels like if the Eagles play a clean game, they will be difficult to beat.
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Anybody remember when Donovan McNabb threw 4 touchdown passes on a broken ankle?
Of course not. Everything Mahomes does is unique and special. :) :) :) :) :) :)
Phillip Rivers played on a torn ACL. Ben Roethlisberger played on a broken foot (and had a broken nose). The announcers were fawning over Mahomes - a gutty performance, no doubt, I'm just ragging on the HYPE, not the player - and I kept thinking, "Ben Roethlisberger did this every two weeks for about five years. He must be tired of saying "hold my beer"".
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Ya gotta dump that on Dak, but McCarthy kind of bungled the end of the game.
Phili is going to massacre SF.
Wow! How unusual! :) :) (Go back about a page or so, and you'll see I make that call. McCarthy is HORRIBLE at late-game management.)
SO much for the "Dak has found redemption with that win against Tampa Bay!" line of reasoning. Took exactly one game to fall back to form. I am so happy Dallas lost.
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That was a legit great football game. Love those defensive battles where it feels like every turnover or score is very impactful. Very old school. And Dallas lost, which made it even better. :metal :metal
I am not surprised the Bengals won today, but I thought the Bills would put up more of a fight. They are going backwards and may have missed their window to get to and win a Super Bowl. Joe Burrow is scary good.
I was literally thinking BOTH those things today. I am a big Josh Allen fan; I think he had the opportunity to be the best quarterback in the league, and I think that's slipping away now.
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Anybody remember when Donovan McNabb threw 4 touchdown passes on a broken ankle?
Of course not. Everything Mahomes does is unique and special. :) :) :) :) :) :)
Phillip Rivers played on a torn ACL. Ben Roethlisberger played on a broken foot (and had a broken nose). The announcers were fawning over Mahomes - a gutty performance, no doubt, I'm just ragging on the HYPE, not the player - and I kept thinking, "Ben Roethlisberger did this every two weeks for about five years. He must be tired of saying "hold my beer"".
Spot-on about Ben. Of course the haters accused him of playing up the injuries so enhance his "toughness" reputation which was BS. The guy took the biggest beating of any QB of his era and never backed down, never got in the fetal position during a pass rush. As you said, he was always playing banged-up.
Cincinnati is a complete team as was well demonstrated Sunday. KC is pure offense only, even a healthy Pat would have to play out of his mind to overcome that. I think Cinci wins easily. Already the 2nd post-season Pat's had to play with a significant injury, there sure as hell ain't no horseshoe up HIS ass.
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Anybody remember when Donovan McNabb threw 4 touchdown passes on a broken ankle?
Of course not. Everything Mahomes does is unique and special. :) :) :) :) :) :)
Phillip Rivers played on a torn ACL. Ben Roethlisberger played on a broken foot (and had a broken nose). The announcers were fawning over Mahomes - a gutty performance, no doubt, I'm just ragging on the HYPE, not the player - and I kept thinking, "Ben Roethlisberger did this every two weeks for about five years. He must be tired of saying "hold my beer"".
Emmett pounding the Giants with the dislocated shoulder still takes the cake, though.
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Cincinnati is a complete team as was well demonstrated Sunday. KC is pure offense only, even a healthy Pat would have to play out of his mind to overcome that. I think Cinci wins easily. Already the 2nd post-season Pat's had to play with a significant injury, there sure as hell ain't no horseshoe up HIS ass.
Average Joe football fan observation here:
If the Jags receiver doesn't cough that ball up as they were about to score there late in the game KC loses that game anyway. Pretty 'fortunate' bounce there for KC which they always seem to get. i don't think they can rely on such fortune against Cincy who from what my eye test tells me is the better, more complete team.
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Wow, even when everything that could possibly go right for Dallas goes right for Dallas, SF is still too much for them. I don't give Philly a chance next week. Like the Cowboys learned today, Philly just hasn't faced a team this good that can find so many ways to beat you.
No idea what you're talking about. What went right for Dallas? 9ers barely beat a team that played like shit with 2 turnovers, multiple penalties, and lost their star RB in the 2nd qtr.
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Wow, even when everything that could possibly go right for Dallas goes right for Dallas, SF is still too much for them. I don't give Philly a chance next week. Like the Cowboys learned today, Philly just hasn't faced a team this good that can find so many ways to beat you.
No idea what you're talking about. What went right for Dallas? 9ers barely beat a team that played like shit with 2 turnovers, multiple penalties, and lost their star RB in the 2nd qtr.
Yeah, everything going right for Dallas was simply the 49ers underperforming in the first half, in my book. Niners play that game like they've played some others recently and that final score is a blowout ala Eagles v. Giants.
Are you actually going to follow through and come out to Philly Bosk? I doubt I have the money to attend the actual game, assuming cost is going to be insane, but would gladly have you over before or after or find something to do one of those days. We also have a guest room you're free to use if you haven't already found accommodations.
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Wow, even when everything that could possibly go right for Dallas goes right for Dallas, SF is still too much for them. I don't give Philly a chance next week. Like the Cowboys learned today, Philly just hasn't faced a team this good that can find so many ways to beat you.
No idea what you're talking about. What went right for Dallas? 9ers barely beat a team that played like shit with 2 turnovers, multiple penalties, and lost their star RB in the 2nd qtr.
What went right for Dallas?? Um, let's see... Just off the top of my head:
-Holding the #1 scoring offense since week 11 to under 20 points--something that hardly any team has been able to accomplish.
-On 4 drives, holding the 49ers to field goals instead of touchdowns
-Stealing a turnover on special teams
-The 49ers dropping 2 interceptions
-Getting constant pressures and sacks against that offensive line
-The 49ers mismanaging the clock at the end of the second half
-The 49ers barely cracking 100 yards rushing
Nothing like that combination has happened to the 49ers all season. Even with ALL of that, the Cowboys couldn't overcome the 49ers.
As Nick said, if it doesn't play out exactly that way, the 49ers blow the Cowboys out as they have done to most teams they have played. I don't see any of the other 3 remaining teams getting such a lucky series of events going their way as the Cowboys did. I just can't come up with any good argument for giving any of the remaining 3 teams a legitimate chance.
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bosk1, your dedication over the years to the "no one has a real chance to beat the 49ers" shtick every time they make the playoffs is impressive.
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I just call it like I see it. And the fact that nobody this year has anything other than, "well, Purdy is only a rookie, so he has to crack sometime" or "well, any given Sunday, ya' know?" is telling.
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The official account of the Cowboys tweeting out some truth bombs
The 49ers had more weapons than the Cowboys going into the game, and with the loss of Tony Pollard, definitely had way more ammunition in the second half. (https://twitter.com/dallascowboys/status/1617411618714812417?s=20)
Dak Prescott gave away the ball twice in the narrow loss to the 49ers, in a matchup the Cowboys had a chance to win if they didn’t again generate self-inflicted wounds. (https://twitter.com/dallascowboys/status/1617383701226176512?s=20)
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Interesting little blurb I saw, seems the powers that be in Vegas stand to lose a shit ton of money if the Niners win it all based on betting that occurred right after Jimmy G went down.
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Interesting little blurb I saw, seems the powers that be in Vegas stand to lose a shit ton of money if the Niners win it all based on betting that occurred right after Jimmy G went down.
Good.
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Going forward, I think the Eagles will be tough. That should be a great game. It's a 50/50 game with two great teams and no huge advantages at any one time. I don't see how either teams fans should be treating that as easily tilted one way.
On the AFC side I'll be rooting hard for the Bengals. If the Chiefs win, Mahomes will get two weeks to recover, and between the regular season this year and the Super Bowl with them, he's just proven that if he gets in the zone with his offense, no defense is safe. Not to say I don't think the Niners can win, but I'd like my odds 10x better against the Bengals.
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IDK Nick. The Bengals seem to be playing better ball right now than KC. Their offense is dynamic right now.
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I think most probably see both as games that could go either way, and the lines reflect that, with Philly favored by 2 1/2, which the home team always gets, so that is basically an even matchup, and KC favored by only 1 because of the Mahomes injury (I suspect that would have been a 4 or 5 point spread if he were healthy).
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I think KC has lost their last 3 games against the Bengals.
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The official account of the Cowboys tweeting out some truth bombs
The 49ers had more weapons than the Cowboys going into the game, and with the loss of Tony Pollard, definitely had way more ammunition in the second half. (https://twitter.com/dallascowboys/status/1617411618714812417?s=20)
Dak Prescott gave away the ball twice in the narrow loss to the 49ers, in a matchup the Cowboys had a chance to win if they didn’t again generate self-inflicted wounds. (https://twitter.com/dallascowboys/status/1617383701226176512?s=20)
if that's coming directly from the Cowboys, how come it's different than the message that came out of the Cowboys after the previous game? Wasn't Jimmy pretty much saying (like he always does, fair play) that anything less than the big dance was unacceptable? And that if they play like that all the rest of the playoffs no one could touch them (not those words, but that idea)? This is why the Cowboys are never serious contenders.
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I think KC has lost their last 3 games against the Bengals.
Yes.
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Interesting little blurb I saw, seems the powers that be in Vegas stand to lose a shit ton of money if the Niners win it all based on betting that occurred right after Jimmy G went down.
Good.
I definitely don't have a problem with it either... It's a solid win-win for me :lol
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I assume having Elliott at center for that last play was so that they could have as many viable lateral options as possible. That said, it was hilarious seeing the defender just push him over after he just sat there doing nothing after snapping the ball. And WTF was that pass?
Anyway, if the 49ers team that played yesterday and the Eagles team that played Saturday both show up next week, the 49ers have ZERO chance. The first 10 playoff games have been generally blah, so I'm hoping for a good KC/CIN rematch.
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Anyway, if the 49ers team that played yesterday and the Eagles team that played Saturday both show up next week, the 49ers have ZERO chance. The first 10 playoff games have been generally blah, so I'm hoping for a good KC/CIN rematch.
:lol So. Cal. homers are so cute sometimes. Not sure what game you were watching yesterday, but if you are referring to the one where the 49ers held one of the most potent scoring offenses in the NFL to 12 points, I'll take that team showing up any time. It's going to be fun seeing the confusion and "what do we do now??" panic on the Eagles sidelines when their team suddenly can't score.
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Anyway, if the 49ers team that played yesterday and the Eagles team that played Saturday both show up next week, the 49ers have ZERO chance. The first 10 playoff games have been generally blah, so I'm hoping for a good KC/CIN rematch.
Couple of notes on this. On the surface, I completely get what you're saying and partially agree. That said, the Niners haven't had a half that sterile until now, and I gotta count that as a blip more than what to expect, so that Niners team is not the one I expect to show up next week. Next, the Eagles were clearly a better team than the Giants, and even in their first matchup of the year when the Giants were trying it looked like a scenario where the Eagles are just Giant kryptonite. So while I think this Eagles team is great, they aren't as magical as that playoff game against the Giants would suggest.
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It'll be a rough game for sure I think, but to write the Niners off after Saturday's ass whooping by Philly is just naive. The Niner D will keep them relevant in any game against any offense.
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Anyway, if the 49ers team that played yesterday and the Eagles team that played Saturday both show up next week, the 49ers have ZERO chance. The first 10 playoff games have been generally blah, so I'm hoping for a good KC/CIN rematch.
Couple of notes on this. On the surface, I completely get what you're saying and partially agree. That said, the Niners haven't had a half that sterile until now, and I gotta count that as a blip more than what to expect, so that Niners team is not the one I expect to show up next week. Next, the Eagles were clearly a better team than the Giants, and even in their first matchup of the year when the Giants were trying it looked like a scenario where the Eagles are just Giant kryptonite. So while I think this Eagles team is great, they aren't as magical as that playoff game against the Giants would suggest.
Sometimes blips have origins, and in that case the origin was a fairly stout defense. Phili's pass D is better than Dallas's (everybody's in fact), so I wouldn't just write it off as an aberration. Phili's offense is also more explosive than Dallas's, particularly after the better of their two RB's broke his damn leg. SF will need to play quite a bit better.
Honestly, this whole thing sucks. Normally I'd be rooting for anybody against the Eagles. Seriously, fuck Philadelphia. The rampant fanboyism is really turning me off of SF, though. This isn't the 85 Bears or the 93 Cowboys we're talking about here. Bosk would have us believe that they're somehow transcendent. They're a good, well-balanced team. They're not unbeatable, or even exceptional, though.
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Honestly, this whole thing sucks. Normally I'd be rooting for anybody against the Eagles. Seriously, fuck Philadelphia. The rampant fanboyism is really turning me off of SF, though. This isn't the 85 Bears or the 93 Cowboys we're talking about here. Bosk would have us believe that they're somehow transcendent. They're a good, well-balanced team. They're not unbeatable, or even exceptional, though.
Agreed. I won't be surprised if any of the four teams left win it, and anyone acting like any team is by far the favorite is just being a homer or taking the piss. The current odds are:
Philadelphia Eagles +240
Kansas City Chiefs +260
Cincinnati Bengals +270
San Francisco 49ers +320
That shows how close these four teams all are.
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Wow, even when everything that could possibly go right for Dallas goes right for Dallas, SF is still too much for them. I don't give Philly a chance next week. Like the Cowboys learned today, Philly just hasn't faced a team this good that can find so many ways to beat you.
No idea what you're talking about. What went right for Dallas? 9ers barely beat a team that played like shit with 2 turnovers, multiple penalties, and lost their star RB in the 2nd qtr.
What went right for Dallas?? Um, let's see... Just off the top of my head:
-Holding the #1 scoring offense since week 11 to under 20 points--something that hardly any team has been able to accomplish.
-On 4 drives, holding the 49ers to field goals instead of touchdowns
-Stealing a turnover on special teams
-The 49ers dropping 2 interceptions
-Getting constant pressures and sacks against that offensive line
-The 49ers mismanaging the clock at the end of the second half
-The 49ers barely cracking 100 yards rushing
Nothing like that combination has happened to the 49ers all season. Even with ALL of that, the Cowboys couldn't overcome the 49ers.
As Nick said, if it doesn't play out exactly that way, the 49ers blow the Cowboys out as they have done to most teams they have played. I don't see any of the other 3 remaining teams getting such a lucky series of events going their way as the Cowboys did. I just can't come up with any good argument for giving any of the remaining 3 teams a legitimate chance.
Well, that's a conveniently selective list, leaving out all the offensive blunders and making it seem like the 9ers got Dallas' best game when it was anything but. Take away the 2 turnovers alone (which were not forced errors btw) and the result is mostly like very different. Instead of it being a slaughter, it was more like a narrow escape. One could possibly argue that the 9ers were the lucky ones.
bosk1, your dedication over the years to the "no one has a real chance to beat the 49ers" shtick every time they make the playoffs is impressive.
I see what you did there, but it would be even more impressive if they actually went on to win it all. Hasn't happened so far.
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Honestly, this whole thing sucks. Normally I'd be rooting for anybody against the Eagles. Seriously, fuck Philadelphia. The rampant fanboyism is really turning me off of SF, though. This isn't the 85 Bears or the 93 Cowboys we're talking about here. Bosk would have us believe that they're somehow transcendent. They're a good, well-balanced team. They're not unbeatable, or even exceptional, though.
Agreed. I won't be surprised if any of the four teams left win it, and anyone acting like any team is by far the favorite is just being a homer or taking the piss. The current odds are:
Philadelphia Eagles +240
Kansas City Chiefs +260
Cincinnati Bengals +270
San Francisco 49ers +320
That shows how close these four teams all are.
Pretty sure you know that Vegas odds are not a reflection of a team's actual odds of winning, but are designed to maximize betting revenue. You seem to be confused about that.
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Anyway, if the 49ers team that played yesterday and the Eagles team that played Saturday both show up next week, the 49ers have ZERO chance. The first 10 playoff games have been generally blah, so I'm hoping for a good KC/CIN rematch.
:lol So. Cal. homers are so cute sometimes....
Sigh. I couldn't give a rip about either of the Socal NFL teams. I have no dog in the fight. But we'll see in a week.
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Well, that's a conveniently selective list, leaving out all the offensive blunders and making it seem like the 9ers got Dallas' best game when it was anything but. Take away the 2 turnovers alone (which were not forced errors btw) and the result is mostly like very different. Instead of it being a slaughter, it was more like a narrow escape. One could possibly argue that the 9ers were the lucky ones.
??? It's "convenient" because everything on that list actually happened. And I didn't say they got Dallas' "best game." Everything you said supports what I wrote: a lot of things that in all likelihood shouldn't have gone Dallas' way (based on past performance this season) did go their way. And yet, even with those uncharacteristic breaks, the 49ers played a game that still made Dallas commit errors and play inefficient football. And this is a trend that has been unfolding for this past 12-game winning streak: Good teams are faced with a complete offense, defense, and special teams unit they are unprepared for that makes them look and play a lot worse than they played up to that point. It's amazing how teams that are on a roll or are contenders play the 49ers and suddenly are incapable of turning in their "best game." I don't think it's a coincidence. It's a 12-game trend. And there are logical, analytical reasons for why that trend is occurring that indicate it isn't likely to stop anything soon (watch some serious film studies on what they are doing and how they are doing it). That isn't to say they'll win it all. Stuff happens. And there are 3 other really good teams left. But barring something out of the ordinary happening, I don't see any reason for that trend to magically stop in the next three weeks. There's no logical reason for it to do so.
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bosk1, your dedication over the years to the "no one has a real chance to beat the 49ers" shtick every time they make the playoffs is impressive.
I see what you did there, but it would be even more impressive if they actually went on to win it all. Hasn't happened so far.
Amazing, ain't it? For all of the times the last few years where the 49ers were apparently THE best team, no rings since the 90s. How can this be?????
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Well, first off, I think you're grossly misquoting me, since I don't think I've ever said they were THE best team in prior years. But that not-so-insignificant matter aside, I think anyone who understands sports (or real life) can acknowledge that I team can be objectively "THE best" in a lot of categories, and still lose a game that keeps them from wining a ring. Those two things are not mutually exclusive.
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Well, first off, I think you're grossly misquoting me, since I don't think I've ever said they were THE best team. But that not-so-insignificant matter aside, I think anyone who understands sports (or real life) can acknowledge that I team can be objectively "THE best" in a lot of categories, and still lose a game that keeps them from wining a ring. Those two things are not mutually exclusive.
I think matchups play a significant role in things, especially in the NFL where it’s single-game elimination. The Giants benefited greatly from facing the Vikings instead of the 49ers in the first round. Seeding doesn’t matter if you play a team you don’t match up well against. The 49ers biggest strength this year is how well balanced they are. They do so many things well that there’s no team I can think of that presents a challenge that the 49ers can’t overcome. Even Brock Purdy, someone who wasn’t even supposed to play a snap this season, has proven that the playoffs aren’t too big for him.
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Reading along with the previous posts, and will comment on some later.
Meanwhile, and this could probably go in the 'what p*ssed you off today' thread as it relates to Damar Hamlin and others as to Covid shots (maybe his shot kept him from dying.....hmmmm), but along comes this in the world of 'you can't fix stupid': the Twitter (Dimwitter) verse now has the conspiracy going that his family, the NFL, and others were in cahoots because it was a body double at the stadium Sunday.
:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
Jayzus, I'm just glad these numb nuts didn't have Dimwitter around during the 'Paul Is Dead' bit.
Spoiler alert: he isn't :lol
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I mean, anything is possible in a world where you can just make random bullshit up and have a platform where idiots will actually believe it.
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I TOTALLY agree that Burrow has the makings to be an all-time great, but let's not crown him just yet. He has yet to score more than 27 points in any of the 6 playoff games he's started, he's playing a lot like Brady in those early New England years - trying to be very efficient with a complete team around him. Brady kept getting better so he was throwing for 300+ and 3 TDs in playoff games; we'll see if Burrow takes that next step. He's averaging like 250 yds and 1.5 TDs per playoff game so far. He's been pretty lucky too:
Playoff Records when team scores LESS than 28 points:
Joe Burrow: 5–1 (.833)
Tom Brady: 13-11 (.542)
Big Ben: 8-7 (.533)
Patrick Mahomes: 2-2 (.500)
Joe Montana: 6-7 (.461)
Peyton Manning: 8-12 (.400)
Drew Brees: 4-7 (.363)
Aaron Rodgers: 4-8 (.333
One thing I'm still trying to figure out is why the cockiness and mouthiness appeals to people, Brady was never like that. The only QB I can think of who was like that is Jim McMahon. I think Mahomes or Allen or Herbert would be excoriated if they acted like that. Also Brady didn't start out 0-1 in Super Bowls like Burrow has. What if he makes it and goes 0-2? People still gonna abide the cockiness?
In football, a player playing with an injury is in a no-win situation. You're not allowed to use it as an excuse, but you're severely limited in what you can so. Pat of course handled it the right away, he didn't make a big deal out of it. I have large doubts as to whether the rest of the team can step up around him. Mark Schlereth was a guest on Cowherd's show and he want into some grim detail about high ankle sprains. Yikes.
Oh boy that Eagles-Niners game . . . talk about anticipation.
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bosk1, your dedication over the years to the "no one has a real chance to beat the 49ers" shtick every time they make the playoffs is impressive.
I see what you did there, but it would be even more impressive if they actually went on to win it all. Hasn't happened so far.
Amazing, ain't it? For all of the times the last few years where the 49ers were apparently THE best team, no rings since the 90s. How can this be?????
Yeah, utterly amazing since they got beat by THE best team last year. I guess lessons in humility are short lived if actually learned at all. :lol
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I TOTALLY agree that Burrow has the makings to be an all-time great, but let's not crown him just yet. He has yet to score more than 27 points in any of the 6 playoff games he's started, he's playing a lot like Brady in those early New England years - trying to be very efficient with a complete team around him. Brady kept getting better so he was throwing for 300+ and 3 TDs in playoff games; we'll see if Burrow takes that next step. He's averaging like 250 yds and 1.5 TDs per playoff game so far. He's been pretty lucky too:
Playoff Records when team scores LESS than 28 points:
Joe Burrow: 5–1 (.833)
Tom Brady: 13-11 (.542)
Big Ben: 8-7 (.533)
Patrick Mahomes: 2-2 (.500)
Joe Montana: 6-7 (.461)
Peyton Manning: 8-12 (.400)
Drew Brees: 4-7 (.363)
Aaron Rodgers: 4-8 (.333
One thing I'm still trying to figure out is why the cockiness and mouthiness appeals to people, Brady was never like that. The only QB I can think of who was like that is Jim McMahon. I think Mahomes or Allen or Herbert would be excoriated if they acted like that. Also Brady didn't start out 0-1 in Super Bowls like Burrow has. What if he makes it and goes 0-2? People still gonna abide the cockiness?
In football, a player playing with an injury is in a no-win situation. You're not allowed to use it as an excuse, but you're severely limited in what you can so. Pat of course handled it the right away, he didn't make a big deal out of it. I have large doubts as to whether the rest of the team can step up around him. Mark Schlereth was a guest on Cowherd's show and he want into some grim detail about high ankle sprains. Yikes.
Oh boy that Eagles-Niners game . . . talk about anticipation.
What do you mean "of course"? He made a huge deal out of it. The gestures, the throwing down of the coat... everyone in the stadium knew he was hurt the minute it happened and every minute thereafter. Compare to Ben Roethlisberger, who looked the same whether he was 100% or whether he had a broken foot.
(By the way, for someone that loves the guy so much, you ought to know his name is "Patrick" and he very much does not want to be called "Pat". If memory serves, his mom ripped someone a new asshole for referring to him as "Pat" on social media. Of course, memory serves (https://www.nbcsports.com/washington/ravens/patrick-mahomes-mom-rips-espn-announcers-calling-him-pat). :) )
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After giving it a day to kneejerk about the games this past weekend, my biggest takeaway is the losing QBs can be fixed. Specifically, Dak has regressed since his injury. He looks (at least to me) that he is checking out of certain plays and then making bad decisions as to where to throw the ball. He needs another voice in his ear.
I sense the same with Josh Allen. He had Brian Daboll to help with his bad habits early in his career and once he left Josh had evident problems this year.
Daniel Jones is in good hands.
SF is not necessarily a juggernaut, the defense kept the Cowboys in the game so I think they will have their hands full with Philly and with that high ankle sprain, the sprain usually gets worse before it gets better. Should be fun this week!
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ESPN is reporting that O'Brien is in at NE. Overall this is a good thing. On the one hand I don't think OC was the problem this year. Doesn't matter who's calling the plays if you can't execute, and that was the problem. That said, better playing calling is still a good thing, even if it doesn't solve the problem. What matters is giving McCorkle somebody in his ear he knows and trusts. Towards the end of the season I started thinking that he wasn't making the progress he should be, and perhaps he's not the guy going forward. Verdicts still way out on that one. Having BOB in there will go a long way to addressing that. Most importantly, I'm just tired of hearing about how Patricia was the reason why they suck. Like I said, overall a good thing.
It's also possible they bring back one or two former assistants, and that'll be a big help, too. As I've been saying, brain drain is a problem, but probably not as big as culture drain.
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bosk1, your dedication over the years to the "no one has a real chance to beat the 49ers" shtick every time they make the playoffs is impressive.
I see what you did there, but it would be even more impressive if they actually went on to win it all. Hasn't happened so far.
Amazing, ain't it? For all of the times the last few years where the 49ers were apparently THE best team, no rings since the 90s. How can this be?????
Yeah, utterly amazing since they got beat by THE best team last year. I guess lessons in humility are short lived if actually learned at all. :lol
While, as I said above, bosk's relentless, giddy optimism really takes the edge of my pre game anxiety, I do think this is the best Niner team they've put forward in a long time.
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ESPN is reporting that O'Brien is in at NE. Overall this is a good thing. On the one hand I don't think OC was the problem this year. Doesn't matter who's calling the plays if you can't execute, and that was the problem. That said, better playing calling is still a good thing, even if it doesn't solve the problem. What matters is giving McCorkle somebody in his ear he knows and trusts. Towards the end of the season I started thinking that he wasn't making the progress he should be, and perhaps he's not the guy going forward. Verdicts still way out on that one. Having BOB in there will go a long way to addressing that. Most importantly, I'm just tired of hearing about how Patricia was the reason why they suck. Like I said, overall a good thing.
It's also possible they bring back one or two former assistants, and that'll be a big help, too. As I've been saying, brain drain is a problem, but probably not as big as culture drain.
I was going to post that; I think your post is spot on, top to bottom.
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After giving it a day to kneejerk about the games this past weekend, my biggest takeaway is the losing QBs can be fixed. Specifically, Dak has regressed since his injury. He looks (at least to me) that he is checking out of certain plays and then making bad decisions as to where to throw the ball. He needs another voice in his ear.
I sense the same with Josh Allen. He had Brian Daboll to help with his bad habits early in his career and once he left Josh had evident problems this year.
Daniel Jones is in good hands.
SF is not necessarily a juggernaut, the defense kept the Cowboys in the game so I think they will have their hands full with Philly and with that high ankle sprain, the sprain usually gets worse before it gets better. Should be fun this week!
REALLY disappointed in Josh Allen this year. At the start of the year, I thought it was theirs to lose, and I was high on Josh; I thought this might be his year to be the best QB in the league, all things considered. He didn't show that, except in glimpses and not when it mattered.
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ESPN is reporting that O'Brien is in at NE. Overall this is a good thing. On the one hand I don't think OC was the problem this year. Doesn't matter who's calling the plays if you can't execute, and that was the problem. That said, better playing calling is still a good thing, even if it doesn't solve the problem. What matters is giving McCorkle somebody in his ear he knows and trusts. Towards the end of the season I started thinking that he wasn't making the progress he should be, and perhaps he's not the guy going forward. Verdicts still way out on that one. Having BOB in there will go a long way to addressing that. Most importantly, I'm just tired of hearing about how Patricia was the reason why they suck. Like I said, overall a good thing.
It's also possible they bring back one or two former assistants, and that'll be a big help, too. As I've been saying, brain drain is a problem, but probably not as big as culture drain.
I was going to post that; I think your post is spot on, top to bottom.
The question for me is how long did he commit to. There's no way they sign him if he's going to bail next year to HC somewhere. That was reportedly part of the issue last year. Two years is the minimum, and that may be enough to set Mac straight. Three would be better, but I'm not sure O'Brien holds out that long. Though obviously this depends on how things go with Mac. If he sucks, and I find that unlikely, him leaving to HC probably isn't an issue.
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After giving it a day to kneejerk about the games this past weekend, my biggest takeaway is the losing QBs can be fixed. Specifically, Dak has regressed since his injury. He looks (at least to me) that he is checking out of certain plays and then making bad decisions as to where to throw the ball. He needs another voice in his ear.
I sense the same with Josh Allen. He had Brian Daboll to help with his bad habits early in his career and once he left Josh had evident problems this year.
Daniel Jones is in good hands.
SF is not necessarily a juggernaut, the defense kept the Cowboys in the game so I think they will have their hands full with Philly and with that high ankle sprain, the sprain usually gets worse before it gets better. Should be fun this week!
REALLY disappointed in Josh Allen this year. At the start of the year, I thought it was theirs to lose, and I was high on Josh; I thought this might be his year to be the best QB in the league, all things considered. He didn't show that, except in glimpses and not when it mattered.
Agreed. I had them as the undisputed top of the league. This should have been this year. Dude seems to have regressed.
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I would love to see the Niners beat the Eagles this Saturday.
At a morning staff meeting today, the Eagles fans were already going on a tear. One young lady I work with was talking about how she thinks Burrow is a much better QB than Mahomes, and I replied, "looking forward to seeing how they play against Niners D in the Super Bowl". And, instead of just taking the joke, like someone who has been gloating about her team all morning should, she gave me this awful look like I just said something disgusting and walked away.
Eagles fans need to be knocked down a peg. Nothing worse than Eagles fans who are feelin' themselves. Go Niners.
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The talking heads this week are more entertaining than the actual games. "Dak Prescott is nothing but just another Kirk Cousins with a better brand." :lol :loser:
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The talking heads this week are more entertaining than the actual games. "Dak Prescott is nothing but just another Kirk Cousins with a better brand." :lol :loser:
What's wrong with that statement? :)
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I would love to see the Niners beat the Eagles this Saturday.
At a morning staff meeting today, the Eagles fans were already going on a tear. One young lady I work with was talking about how she thinks Burrow is a much better QB than Mahomes, and I replied, "looking forward to seeing how they play against Niners D in the Super Bowl". And, instead of just taking the joke, like someone who has been gloating about her team all morning should, she gave me this awful look like I just said something disgusting and walked away.
Eagles fans need to be knocked down a peg. Nothing worse than Eagles fans who are feelin' themselves. Go Niners.
As someone who went to college in Pennsylvania during the McNabb years, yes, Eagles fans are the worst. I would love nothing more than to see them lose.
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The talking heads this week are more entertaining than the actual games. "Dak Prescott is nothing but just another Kirk Cousins with a better brand." :lol :loser:
What's wrong with that statement? :)
Did I say there was anything wrong with it? It's absolutely true. Next question...
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Stads, you hear about the Pats signing O'Brien as the OC this morning?
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Stads, you hear about the Pats signing O'Brien as the OC this morning?
Been there. Done that.
ESPN is reporting that O'Brien is in at NE. Overall this is a good thing. On the one hand I don't think OC was the problem this year. Doesn't matter who's calling the plays if you can't execute, and that was the problem. That said, better playing calling is still a good thing, even if it doesn't solve the problem. What matters is giving McCorkle somebody in his ear he knows and trusts. Towards the end of the season I started thinking that he wasn't making the progress he should be, and perhaps he's not the guy going forward. Verdicts still way out on that one. Having BOB in there will go a long way to addressing that. Most importantly, I'm just tired of hearing about how Patricia was the reason why they suck. Like I said, overall a good thing.
It's also possible they bring back one or two former assistants, and that'll be a big help, too. As I've been saying, brain drain is a problem, but probably not as big as culture drain.
I was going to post that; I think your post is spot on, top to bottom.
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Ah, should have clicked the page before.
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bosk1, your dedication over the years to the "no one has a real chance to beat the 49ers" shtick every time they make the playoffs is impressive.
I see what you did there, but it would be even more impressive if they actually went on to win it all. Hasn't happened so far.
Amazing, ain't it? For all of the times the last few years where the 49ers were apparently THE best team, no rings since the 90s. How can this be?????
Yeah, utterly amazing since they got beat by THE best team last year. I guess lessons in humility are short lived if actually learned at all. :lol
Again, it would be cool if you guys stopped misrepresenting me. ::) Feel free to take all the jabs you want and what I actually have said, and I'll take it for the good-natured, sports-related banter that it is. But if you have to set me up as a straw man to knock down, I think that's pretty weak.
I would love to see the Niners beat the Eagles this Saturday.
At a morning staff meeting today, the Eagles fans were already going on a tear. One young lady I work with was talking about how she thinks Burrow is a much better QB than Mahomes, and I replied, "looking forward to seeing how they play against Niners D in the Super Bowl". And, instead of just taking the joke, like someone who has been gloating about her team all morning should, she gave me this awful look like I just said something disgusting and walked away.
Eagles fans need to be knocked down a peg. Nothing worse than Eagles fans who are feelin' themselves. Go Niners.
:lol Well, you can't really blame them though. The Eagles are pretty ferocious. And if they haven't followed the 49ers very closely, I'm sure the only narrative they know is "the 49ers haven't really played any good teams" and "they have a third string rookie at QB." They likely have no idea why the 49ers have now won 12 in a row and pose such a big matchup problem for the Eagles.
Honestly, that goes for the two AFC teams as well. For championship weekend, I think we definitely ended up with four powerhouses that all have strong arguments for why they will win it all. I give KC the worst odds just because of the Mahomes injury. But while I think there is a clear favorite, none of these four teams winning it all should be shocking to anyone.
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I have no issues if the Niners lose to the Eagles on Sunday. Eagles have a great team and there would be no shame in losing to them.
But as a Niners fan deep in Eagles territory, I very VERY much don't want to lose that game come Sunday. I just don't want to deal with Eagles fans in the aftermath.
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I'm watching this discussion with amusement. I'm not as all-in as Bosk, but the criticisms of the Niners are the criticisms I have of the Eagles.
I don't think the Eagles have really been battle-tested this year at all. I don't think Sirianni has the same level of experience as Kyle Shanahan. And I'm not at all on the Jalen Hurts bandwagon; I know the man has won at every level, but so what? This is his first time through, and I don't think he's played anyone that can and will game-plan him like the Niners will.
I love the Giants, but it's a nostalgic love and I don't see how that game is indicative of anything in the bigger picture.
And all of this is to be taken with this spirit: Dream Team likes Tom Brady more than I like the Eagles. :)
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I was pulling for Buffalo, but wow, Cincy is impressive, and Joe Brrr is a super confident big swinging dick right now.
Should be two awesome games this weekend.
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I was pulling for Buffalo, but wow, Cincy is impressive, and Joe Brrr is a super confident big swinging dick right now.
Should be two awesome games this weekend.
I think then, that it's only appropriate the Bengals face off against Big "Chicken" Brock in the Super Bowl.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fmd1w-nXwAAZLKP?format=jpg&name=medium)
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? :| ;D
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Hey - Big Cock Brock!
Why not man????? :mehlin :mehlin
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I think Josh Allen definitely misses Daboll. Just like Holmgren was able to keep Favre mostly in check and limit his turnovers in the 90s, Daboll did the same with Allen. Daboll leaves and Allen, while still a great playmaker, turns into a turnover machine. It doesn't help that the Bills have been unable to build a consistent rushing attack. Their offense is pretty much "Josh, go win it," and if that doesn't work, they are f'd. Their defense getting trucked three playoff games in a row doesn't help. It feels like McDermott and his staff have taken this team as far as they can and that new blood is needed to get them over the top, but I doubt they will make a change at the top right now. Not after McDermott was so good with the team regarding the Damar Hamlin health scare.
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A couple of ongoing hot-button topics.
So Brady has of course decided to appeal the fine (couch cushion change) for his latest dirty chickenshit play:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ItVBhSAE3nQ
His rationale? "Yes I did a cheap dirty illegal thing that could cause injury but since I didn't injure the guy it's OK and the Player's Union is weak". What an ASSHOLE. I feel bad for the kids who are forced to have this guy as a role model. "Daddy why is Tom kicking and tripping players? "It's OK if he does it". "Can Mahomes do it?" "No" "How about Burrow?". "Yes he's another cute little white boy".
Yeah I went there. Please construct for me a rational argument proving racism isn't a factor in why neutral fans are suddenly now loving Burrow so much. What if Pat was the cigar-chomping mouthy cocky punk? Yeah I'm sure that'd go over REAL well in Middle America and the Northeast ::). Oh wait let me guess - he plays the game the right (white) way, from the pocket. Am I right? A black QB will NEVER be nationally embraced, not ever.
The real insanity? The click-bait talking heads and TB12 fans are framing Burrow as Brady in the Burrow vs Mahomes as the new Brady vs Manning debate . . . . even though PAT is the one with the ring!?! (and the MVPS) What kind of crazy reverse logic is that?? Rational thought has truly flown out the window. We've made zero progress in 2 decades.
If you see a headline for a sports commentary show that leads with "Mahomes is 0-3 vs Burrow" or "Brady is 1-5 vs Brees" be warned that if you decide to watch, you're IQ is going to plummet. Quarterbacks DON'T PLAY against other quarterbacks, they play against the other team's defense. The fact that this still has to be explained in 2023 is mind-bogglingly sad. I really wish I didn't care about this stuff :sadpanda:.
Anyway, I'm still going to attempt to enjoy these games. Looking forward to Burrow getting all the credit if the Cinci defense shuts down KC. But either way, if I had to money on it I think the Eagles are winning the Super Bowl this year.
Eagles 24 Niners 21
Bungles 27 Chiefs 17
Eagles 30 Bungles 20
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I'll give you one of the top of my head. Cam Jordan, from the Saints who is African American won an appeal for 50 K when the league fined him for what they said, "Faking an injury." I'll assume there is many more examples.
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A couple of ongoing hot-button topics.
So Brady has of course decided to appeal the fine (couch cushion change) for his latest dirty chickenshit play:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ItVBhSAE3nQ
His rationale? "Yes I did a cheap dirty illegal thing that could cause injury but since I didn't injure the guy it's OK and the Player's Union is weak". What an ASSHOLE. I feel bad for the kids who are forced to have this guy as a role model. "Daddy why is Tom kicking and tripping players? "It's OK if he does it". "Can Mahomes do it?" "No" "How about Burrow?". "Yes he's another cute little white boy".
Yeah I went there. Please construct for me a rational argument proving racism isn't a factor in why neutral fans are suddenly now loving Burrow so much. What if Pat was the cigar-chomping mouthy cocky punk? Yeah I'm sure that'd go over REAL well in Middle America and the Northeast ::). Oh wait let me guess - he plays the game the right (white) way, from the pocket. Am I right? A black QB will NEVER be nationally embraced, not ever.
The real insanity? The click-bait talking heads and TB12 fans are framing Burrow as Brady in the Burrow vs Mahomes as the new Brady vs Manning debate . . . . even though PAT is the one with the ring!?! (and the MVPS) What kind of crazy reverse logic is that?? Rational thought has truly flown out the window. We've made zero progress in 2 decades.
If you see a headline for a sports commentary show that leads with "Mahomes is 0-3 vs Burrow" or "Brady is 1-5 vs Brees" be warned that if you decide to watch, you're IQ is going to plummet. Quarterbacks DON'T PLAY against other quarterbacks, they play against the other team's defense. The fact that this still has to be explained in 2023 is mind-bogglingly sad. I really wish I didn't care about this stuff :sadpanda:.
what
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His rationale? "Yes I did a cheap dirty illegal thing that could cause injury but since I didn't injure the guy it's OK and the Player's Union is weak".
Ummm...that wasn't even close to what he said, and using quotation marks when you're not actually quoting anything and, instead, are simply making things up is highly disingenuous. Did you watch the video? His press conference footage is in there. Here's what he ACTUALLY said:
"I tried to tackle him with my right shoulder and missed him. And I wasn't gonna try to stick my arm out, so I was trying to get him on the ground . . . and I missed him completely. I didn't even hit him. I tried to trip him, but I didn't, so I don't know how you can get fined for something that didn't even happen. . . . It's like targeting and you miss the person you [intended to] hit, and they still call it targeting. So I gotta figure it out and understand why this is the case."
Seems like a perfectly reasonable position to me. If a DB lines up a receiver for a devastating helmet-to-helmet hit and misses, no flag gets thrown. If a DL is homing in on the QB for a helmet to helmet hit and misses, no flag gets thrown. Now...I've only seen one video of the play in question, and it's only 3-seconds long, and it doesn't clearly show whether Brady actually made contact. Needless to say, if he actually made contact, then his argument falls apart. However, if he missed, then he's right, unless there's a rule that makes an ATTEMPTED trip a fineable offense (hence Brady's statement about needing to "figure it out and understand").
And I'm really at a loss to understand why you're trying to turn this into a racial issue. That's just nonsensical on its face.
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Yeah, and who in the hell doesn't like Pat Mahomes, besides Stadler? ;D
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Yeah, and who in the hell doesn't like Pat Mahomes, besides Stadler? ;D
The better question is, who in their right mind does? Can't stand that idiot.
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Yeah, and who in the hell doesn't like Pat Mahomes, besides Stadler? ;D
The better question is, who in their right mind does? Can't stand that idiot.
What's wrong, mahomey?
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Yeah, and who in the hell doesn't like Pat Mahomes, besides Stadler? ;D
The better question is, who in their right mind does? Can't stand that idiot.
He's been classy. His wife and brother? Holy moly!
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Burrow doesn't strike me as cocky, at least not the loud cocky type (relatively speaking, as pretty much all NFL QBs are cocky; you don't get to that level without a LOT of confidence). He seems more like the quiet guy with an arrogant swagger who keeps his head down and just slices up defenses with slick precision. Nothing wrong with that.
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Burrow doesn't strike me as cocky, at least not the loud cocky type (relatively speaking, as pretty much all NFL QBs are cocky; you don't get to that level without a LOT of confidence). He seems more like the quiet guy with an arrogant swagger who keeps his head down and just slices up defenses with slick precision. Nothing wrong with that.
And he's white! ;D
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Yep, white QBs always get fawned over by the media. Just ask Kirk Cousins and Jimmy G. :lol :lol
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Burrow doesn't strike me as cocky, at least not the loud cocky type (relatively speaking, as pretty much all NFL QBs are cocky; you don't get to that level without a LOT of confidence). He seems more like the quiet guy with an arrogant swagger who keeps his head down and just slices up defenses with slick precision. Nothing wrong with that.
Yep. He's stone cold.
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"Cocky" is just one of those things where you like it if it's your guy, and it's offputting if it's "the other guy." Personally, I don't like how Burrow wears it and I find it offputting. But I can see how others might not be bothered by it or might admire his brand of bravado. For me, it just rubs me the wrong way.
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Yep, white QBs always get fawned over by the media. Just ask Kirk Cousins and Jimmy G. :lol :lol
The racism argument is lame and off base. Deshaun Watson should have been crucified a LOT more than he was, and of course both Lamar Jackson and Dak Prescott have been consistently held with kid gloves. The latest is the new golden boy, Jalen Hurts. He hasn't won anything either and he's basically walking on water at this point. Meanwhile, Daniel Jones is a head case and yet another example of the ineptitude of the Giants (at least until this year).
Let's face it: Mahomes is very good, he's just not the second coming of Christ that Dream Team thinks he is. (And I love that Dream Team is trying to argue that "Mahomes has a ring!" as if that matters to him now. Okay, BRADY HAS SEVEN AND COUNTING.)
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"Cocky" is just one of those things where you like it if it's your guy, and it's offputting if it's "the other guy." Personally, I don't like how Burrow wears it and I find it offputting. But I can see how others might not be bothered by it or might admire his brand of bravado. For me, it just rubs me the wrong way.
Did you like Sherman better once he was a Niner? ;D ;)
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"Cocky" is just one of those things where you like it if it's your guy, and it's offputting if it's "the other guy." Personally, I don't like how Burrow wears it and I find it offputting. But I can see how others might not be bothered by it or might admire his brand of bravado. For me, it just rubs me the wrong way.
Did you like Sherman better once he was a Niner? ;D ;)
Absolutely. Good case in point. BUT he's also an interesting case study because I didn't initially like the acquisition and remained set in my ways about him at first. But what happened was, since he was a 49er, there was more local coverage of him, which allowed me to get to "know" him more, which in turn helped me warm up to him. It all kinda worked together in that regard. But you're right to point that out because it's a perfect example of what I described. "Hypocrisy" is probably too strong a word for it, but it's not too dissimilar.
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Ya know...I'm an Eagles fan and I'm not such a bad guy. I get the whole "philly sports fan" stereotype. But it is just that, a stereotype and I know just as many, if not more, polite, passionate philly fans than the drunken a holes that used to populate the 700 level at the Vet. If you don't like the Eagles or Phillies for athletic reasons thats cool but to say I don't deserve a championship as a fan kinda gets under my skin. BTW Both the Phil's and Birds have had pretty good seasons this year, so there is that
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Ya know...I'm an Eagles fan and I'm not such a bad guy. I get the whole "philly sports fan" stereotype. But it is just that, a stereotype and I know just as many, if not more, polite, passionate philly fans than the drunken a holes that used to populate the 700 level at the Vet. If you don't like the Eagles or Phillies for athletic reasons thats cool but to say I don't deserve a championship as a fan kinda gets under my skin. BTW Both the Phil's and Birds have had pretty good seasons this year, so there is that
This is not aimed at you and I tend to understand your post but most Philly fans I have ever met have been out right dickheads. Not saying you're a dickhead or anything but just saying........
And Bosk - hypocrisy is the perfect word. :)
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Yep, white QBs always get fawned over by the media. Just ask Kirk Cousins and Jimmy G. :lol :lol
The racism argument is lame and off base. Deshaun Watson should have been crucified a LOT more than he was, and of course both Lamar Jackson and Dak Prescott have been consistently held with kid gloves. The latest is the new golden boy, Jalen Hurts. He hasn't won anything either and he's basically walking on water at this point. Meanwhile, Daniel Jones is a head case and yet another example of the ineptitude of the Giants (at least until this year).
Let's face it: Mahomes is very good, he's just not the second coming of Christ that Dream Team thinks he is. (And I love that Dream Team is trying to argue that "Mahomes has a ring!" as if that matters to him now. Okay, BRADY HAS SEVEN AND COUNTING.)
Dream Team's slurping aside :P, Mahomes is not very good; he is great, by any measure. I know you like being the one holdout on this ;), but if everyone else sees it, maybe you aren't looking at right. :)
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Ya know...I'm an Eagles fan and I'm not such a bad guy. I get the whole "philly sports fan" stereotype. But it is just that, a stereotype and I know just as many, if not more, polite, passionate philly fans than the drunken a holes that used to populate the 700 level at the Vet. If you don't like the Eagles or Phillies for athletic reasons thats cool but to say I don't deserve a championship as a fan kinda gets under my skin. BTW Both the Phil's and Birds have had pretty good seasons this year, so there is that
You strike me as a pretty good guy. That said, would you suggest to Bosk that he wear his Niners jersey to the game on Sunday? I've told an Eagle's fan (here, in fact) to wear her jersey to a game at Jerry world and she'd have a pretty good time. That go both ways?
Some stereotypes have their origins firmly established in reality.
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Yep, white QBs always get fawned over by the media. Just ask Kirk Cousins and Jimmy G. :lol :lol
The racism argument is lame and off base. Deshaun Watson should have been crucified a LOT more than he was, and of course both Lamar Jackson and Dak Prescott have been consistently held with kid gloves. The latest is the new golden boy, Jalen Hurts. He hasn't won anything either and he's basically walking on water at this point. Meanwhile, Daniel Jones is a head case and yet another example of the ineptitude of the Giants (at least until this year).
I'm on your side here, it's not racism right now, but in fairness Dak is being excoriated. It's approaching brutal. For that matter, Lamar Jackson is catching a tremendous amount of [well deserved] flack right now, too.
The cries of racism will be deafening pretty soon, though, if teams don't want to sign Jackson because he was a little bitch come crunchtime.
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I continue to chuckle at the way the media talks up Jackson. During the Bengals/Ravens playoff game, Tirico actually said it was an uphill battle playing the game without their unanimous MVP QB. :lol :lol Uh, that was 2019, and Jackson hasn't been close to that level on a consistent basis since, but we can't let that get in the way of a good narrative.
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I stumbled on this channel today, didn't know Kurt Warner did this kind of analysis and put it on youtube.
This one is of the Cowboys v 49ers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PozPldpWiOc&t=573s&ab_channel=KurtWarnerxQBConfidential
It's over 50 mins long and detailed and "boring" for most people I imagine, either way it's my kind of video where there's a lot of information and Kurt's own experience shines here. Ronde Barber does something similar for the Bucs channel though those are very short and not as detailed as this.
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Yeah, his analysis is good. But it is long and somewhat tedious. I like Jonnydel's a LOT better (although he focuses on 49ers): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhJN7L7aU_Y
He does the same thing, but does a better job explaining and making it more interesting. And he tells you why he is choosing the plays he is choosing to analyze rather than just having them be random plays.
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I stumbled on this channel today, didn't know Kurt Warner did this kind of analysis and put it on youtube.
This one is of the Cowboys v 49ers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PozPldpWiOc&t=573s&ab_channel=KurtWarnerxQBConfidential
It's over 50 mins long and detailed and "boring" for most people I imagine, either way it's my kind of video where there's a lot of information and Kurt's own experience shines here. Ronde Barber does something similar for the Bucs channel though those are very short and not as detailed as this.
The NFL supplying All 22 video has been a boon for people who want to better understand the nuts and bolts. I really like the added detail you get from them. It's amazing how much pro players have to be able to understand and react instantly.
A few people have been doing these for a while. I really Samuel Gold, myself. Brett Kollmann is very good, too. I wasn't aware of Warner doing one, but it makes sense. There's a big difference, though. Warner's delivery is essentially what a coach would do on Tuesday morning. I'm not making 5 million a year so I'm not required to sit through it. Some of the other guys are putting together nice presentations. Better use of the telestrator (or whatever we're calling it now). Rehearsed, prepared dialogue. Basically the sorts of stuff that make something not quite so tedious.
That said, while they seem to know their business, I have no idea who Kollmann and Gold actually are. Warner's a freaking hall of famer. :lol
These are both Patriots related, but they're good examples.
Brett Kollmann (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gu9Jf6V2JwA&t=835s)
Sam Gold (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLmyRYJHt4o)
edit: AKA, what Bosk said.
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Nice thanks for the recs, will check those out. I should've expected there'd be many of these out there.
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Yep, white QBs always get fawned over by the media. Just ask Kirk Cousins and Jimmy G. :lol :lol
The racism argument is lame and off base. Deshaun Watson should have been crucified a LOT more than he was, and of course both Lamar Jackson and Dak Prescott have been consistently held with kid gloves. The latest is the new golden boy, Jalen Hurts. He hasn't won anything either and he's basically walking on water at this point. Meanwhile, Daniel Jones is a head case and yet another example of the ineptitude of the Giants (at least until this year).
Let's face it: Mahomes is very good, he's just not the second coming of Christ that Dream Team thinks he is. (And I love that Dream Team is trying to argue that "Mahomes has a ring!" as if that matters to him now. Okay, BRADY HAS SEVEN AND COUNTING.)
Dream Team's slurping aside :P, Mahomes is not very good; he is great, by any measure. I know you like being the one holdout on this ;), but if everyone else sees it, maybe you aren't looking at right. :)
I don't dislike him as much as some of you think. I won't argue with "great". He is. I'm not dumb, and I watch the games. I do, though, continue to think the slurping is out of hand. He's great, he's not the GREATEST, there's a difference.
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Stat of the day!
4th Q TD drives led over 1st 6 playoff starts (Burrow's current total):
Patrick Mahomes: 10
Josh Allen: 6
Aaron Rodgers: 5
Peyton Manning: 3
Drew Brees: 3
Tom Brady: 3
Joe Burrow: 0
The first 5 for Burrow were all 1-score games in the 4th quarter. It's nice to have a great defense!
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As to Kittle's catch
OK, that may have been one of the greatest catches I’ve ever seen in my life!
I mean, it was nice, quite fortunate (better than I could have done😉 ) but I grew up watching Charlie Sanders making better catches every other week.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CrlO5mMqn7Y (mute the music….)
There’s so many more not shown, when he was in the air and getting drilled by the likes of Butkis or Nitschke or a Purple People Eater throughout the years, and somehow holding onto the ball.
Meanwhile, none of those came close to the one by Justin Jefferson earlier this year
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1S6JtcxFvUM
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Stat of the day!
4th Q TD drives led over 1st 6 playoff starts (Burrow's current total):
Patrick Mahomes: 10
Josh Allen: 6
Aaron Rodgers: 5
Peyton Manning: 3
Drew Brees: 3
Tom Brady: 3
Joe Burrow: 0
The first 5 for Burrow were all 1-score games in the 4th quarter. It's nice to have a great defense!
So let's gear the stat very precisely to favor Mahomes. If you look at just fourth quarter comeback drives in the playoffs (https://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/comebacks_career_playoffs.htm), Mahomes is nowhere to be found (at least in the top 10):
1 Tom Brady 9 2000-2022
2 Joe Montana+ 5 1979-1994
3 Terry Bradshaw+ 4 1970-1983
John Elway+ 4 1983-1998
Eli Manning 4 2004-2019
Russell Wilson 4 2012-2022
7 Ken Stabler+ 3 1970-1984
Ben Roethlisberger 3 2004-2021
Dan Marino+ 3 1983-1999
Dan Fouts+ 3 1973-1987
(Mahomes has 2 and counting; this sort of undermines your point, since that means that at least eight of them weren't to change the lead, but just to pad. That doesn't seem to be a problem of "defense", does it?)
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And, Mahomes just tied Joe Flacco for having won a playoff game five years in a row. ;)
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final catchup post with no mustard...
"Cocky" is just one of those things where you like it if it's your guy, and it's offputting if it's "the other guy." Personally, I don't like how Burrow wears it and I find it offputting. But I can see how others might not be bothered by it or might admire his brand of bravado. For me, it just rubs me the wrong way.
Did you like Sherman better once he was a Niner? ;D ;)
Absolutely. Good case in point. BUT he's also an interesting case study because I didn't initially like the acquisition and remained set in my ways about him at first. But what happened was, since he was a 49er, there was more local coverage of him, which allowed me to get to "know" him more, which in turn helped me warm up to him. It all kinda worked together in that regard. But you're right to point that out because it's a perfect example of what I described. "Hypocrisy" is probably too strong a word for it, but it's not too dissimilar.
Opponents: oh, how Steeler Hines Ward got under the skin of so many Ravens fans. Then ask them a simple question: ‘Would you want him on your team?’ The smart ones would say: ‘In a heartbeat!’
I felt the same as to Brady and Belichick. You know, ‘if you’d beat them a few more times, there wouldn't be so much hate' or ‘wish they were Ravens, and other fans hated US so much because of it’. (that, and the ten thousand needless close ups every game, unlike the TV telecasts from the good old days)
Plus, I still have a soft spot for ol’ #10 helping Michigan defeat Alabama in the Orange Bowl on my last New Year's Day in the Great Lake State.
Bosk….it wasn’t that long ago that the Ravens had a twelve game winning streak as they entered the playoffs. All it took was a couple of injuries, OC Greg Roman calling 71 passing plays, 59 thrown (you remember all those passes he called late in the SB against the Ravens, right?), an opponent playing a near perfect game, and……. >:( :tdwn
I continue to chuckle at the way the media talks up Jackson. During the Bengals/Ravens playoff game, Tirico actually said it was an uphill battle playing the game without their unanimous MVP QB. :lol :lol Uh, that was 2019, and Jackson hasn't been close to that level on a consistent basis since, but we can't let that get in the way of a good narrative.
Pointing out a few things in Lamar’s defense. First, the excitement of 2019 regular season. Like watching Barry Sanders at QB. And then came OC Greg Roman’s game plan play calling debacle against Tennessee. >:( >:( :censored :tdwn
2020: yes, he didn’t finish the playoff game in the 50 MPH gusts of Buffalo, and they only managed three points (hell…Tucker missed TWO FGs that night). He left after retrieving a snap ten feet over his head, simply trying to grab it then throw it OB, before getting his head slammed to the turf. We do still have the memorable MNF 'run to the john, and then throw a 4th down TD' and all that ensued win at Cleveland as one hell of a memory (In Tuck We Trust).
2021: sprained his ankle running OB and landed on the 1st down marker.
2022: injured on a run of the mill QB sack.
All of these came when he was NOT doing a designated running play, with the odds of getting hit increased (he was amazingly good at avoiding direct hits on those plays)
That said….he’s been an immature horse’s axe throughout the year. I can’t swing a dead cat without hearing about his contract or injury every ten minutes on our local sports radio (so I've basically tuned it out). And every night on the local TV sports, or the sports section of The Sun. Not sure what next year brings, but no one could do anything with the WRs or lack of decent passing schemes. Personally, after his juvenile Twitter post a few months ago along with the drama and childish actions, I’m fine with him being someone else’s problem next year.
And then that money can go towards the multiple holes this offense has, and the few new ones the defense will have during the offseason.
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Dream Team's slurping aside :P, Mahomes is not very good; he is great, by any measure. I know you like being the one holdout on this ;), but if everyone else sees it, maybe you aren't looking at right. :)
Yeah, but he's no Scott Rolen. :biggrin:
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Bosk….it wasn’t that long ago that the Ravens had a twelve game winning streak as they entered the playoffs. All it took was a couple of injuries, OC Greg Roman calling 71 passing plays, 59 thrown (you remember all those passes he called late in the SB against the Ravens, right?), an opponent playing a near perfect game, and…….
Oh, sure. I don't disagree with that at all. But those things are equally true of any opponents they might be facing as well. I've never said they couldn't lose or that things couldn't go wrong for them. Just that I have to look at them as the overwhelming favorites based on what they and the other remaining teams of done up to this point and their overall health and performance right now.
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Bosk….it wasn’t that long ago that the Ravens had a twelve game winning streak as they entered the playoffs. All it took was a couple of injuries, OC Greg Roman calling 71 passing plays, 59 thrown (you remember all those passes he called late in the SB against the Ravens, right?), an opponent playing a near perfect game, and…….
Oh, sure. I don't disagree with that at all. But those things are equally true of any opponents they might be facing as well. I've never said they couldn't lose or that things couldn't go wrong for them. Just that I have to look at them as the overwhelming favorites based on what they and the other remaining teams of done up to this point and their overall health and performance right now.
It was the 'twelve game streak' that stood out for me (painfully so :sad: ) that I was responding to.
Other than the aberration of the Chargers losing to the Jags in spite of that 5-0 advantage in turnovers (and how the defenses respond), that will be a key on Sunday (as always).
I learned an interesting fact today (maybe days behind others). The Eagles have two defensive assistants who were on the Iowa State staff while Purdy was there. That is more than fascinating to me. Maybe he has one little 'tick' of body language before a pass or run that they know of, that no one else in the league does. That could be an advantage.
Or the Niners use it to theirs. Hmmmmm.......
Still taking the Eagles 20-16.
AFC: I remember how Mahomes performed with the bad toe in his last SB. It wasn't pretty. I also remember having a high ankle sprain in HS, finished the game, and was on crutches for two weeks afterwards. That ankle will be worse this Sunday than last week. If not, he still won't be able to dart stop on a dime and change direction, and he'll be using more arm than leg to throw from the pocket.
I've also seen 2x a year against the Ravens, that even when they weren't good, the Bengals can play that physical 'globber snot' type of game. And, they're pretty good this year (even with that OL). Cincy 27-17, with Henne perhaps in at the end.
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Ok, prediction time...
Niners over Iggles
Bengals over Chefs
And of course the Niners take down the Bengals for the third time.
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And of course, all these excuses for the QBs that are hurt simply makes my case for me. I certainly do NOT want to see anyone hurt, of course, but that's part of the game. Who knows if Ben or Kenny or Philip or Andrew wouldn't have been the greatest if they played healthy? And for those that were hurt, what about Peyton? He couldn't even lift his arms over his head and could barely float a ball 20 yards downfield, and found a way to win a Super Bowl. If you're REALLY the greatest, there are no excuses, you figure it out. Like Brady did SEVEN TIMES. Like Peyton and Ben did twice.
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RJ,
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2023/01/26/49ers-seeking-their-37th-postseason-win-tying-the-patriots-for-most-in-nfl-history/
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RJ,
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2023/01/26/49ers-seeking-their-37th-postseason-win-tying-the-patriots-for-most-in-nfl-history/
Cool... Shame we don't have the 7 rings to go with it. So close two times though.
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RJ,
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2023/01/26/49ers-seeking-their-37th-postseason-win-tying-the-patriots-for-most-in-nfl-history/
Cool... Shame we don't have the 7 rings to go with it. So close two times though.
Whoever wrote that article miscounted. The Patriots have 36 NFL playoff wins plus 1 AFL playoff win (against 21 NFL playoff losses and 1 AFL playoff loss). The 49ers also have 36 NFL playoff wins plus 1 AAFC playoff win (against 22 NFL playoff losses and 1 AAFC playoff loss), so they're already tied. The Steelers also have 36 NFL playoff wins (against 27 losses).
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Ok, prediction time...
Niners over Iggles
Bengals over Chefs
And of course the Niners take down the Bengals for the third time.
Right there with you.
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RJ,
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2023/01/26/49ers-seeking-their-37th-postseason-win-tying-the-patriots-for-most-in-nfl-history/
Cool... Shame we don't have the 7 rings to go with it. So close two times though.
Whoever wrote that article miscounted. The Patriots have 36 NFL playoff wins plus 1 AFL playoff win (against 21 NFL playoff losses and 1 AFL playoff loss). The 49ers also have 36 NFL playoff wins plus 1 AAFC playoff win (against 22 NFL playoff losses and 1 AAFC playoff loss), so they're already tied. The Steelers also have 36 NFL playoff wins (against 27 losses).
Youare correct but even pro football refrence goes with the AAFC win.
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Ok, prediction time...
Niners over Iggles
Bengals over Chefs
And of course the Niners take down the Bengals for the third time.
Right there with you.
Were coming together like Voltron...
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:zydarscouch:
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If Mahomes is healthy enough to beat the Bengals Sunday, he'll be healthy enough two weeks later to beat the Niners. I'll be rooting for the Niners in that situation, obviously, but if I had money on the game, it would have to go to the Chiefs. And hey, I think a fully charged Chiefs beat the Eagles as well, which would make for a cool storyline via Andy Reid.
So basically I'm going with this:
Chiefs win Sunday, they take the Super Bowl.
Bengals win Sunday, the winner of the NFC Championship game wins the Super Bowl.
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If Mahomes is healthy enough to beat the Bengals Sunday, he'll be healthy enough two weeks later to beat the Niners. I'll be rooting for the Niners in that situation, obviously, but if I had money on the game, it would have to go to the Chiefs. And hey, I think a fully charged Chiefs beat the Eagles as well, which would make for a cool storyline via Andy Reid.
So basically I'm going with this:
Chiefs win Sunday, they take the Super Bowl.
Bengals win Sunday, the winner of the NFC Championship game wins the Super Bowl.
I'm not saying anything for fear of the gooch, but suffice that I disagree with a fair amount of that. :) :) :)
EDIT: WTF is wrong with this world? I googled "gooch" and "goocher" to check spelling, two words I always used growing up to be synonymous with "jinx", and I find now that's it another word for the perineum. Is nothing sacred? FFS.
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If Mahomes is healthy enough to beat the Bengals Sunday, he'll be healthy enough two weeks later to beat the Niners. I'll be rooting for the Niners in that situation, obviously, but if I had money on the game, it would have to go to the Chiefs. And hey, I think a fully charged Chiefs beat the Eagles as well, which would make for a cool storyline via Andy Reid.
So basically I'm going with this:
Chiefs win Sunday, they take the Super Bowl.
Bengals win Sunday, the winner of the NFC Championship game wins the Super Bowl.
I'm not saying anything for fear of the gooch, but suffice that I disagree with a fair amount of that. :) :) :)
EDIT: WTF is wrong with this world? I googled "gooch" and "goocher" to check spelling, two words I always used growing up to be synonymous with "jinx", and I find now that's it another word for the perineum. Is nothing sacred? FFS.
And I had to google ‘perineum’ just now :lol
‘Taint’ was/is our phrase.
Made for a lot of fun with various lyrics.
‘Taint nothin’ butt the real thing, baby, taint nothin’ real at all….’
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If Mahomes is healthy enough to beat the Bengals Sunday, he'll be healthy enough two weeks later to beat the Niners. I'll be rooting for the Niners in that situation, obviously, but if I had money on the game, it would have to go to the Chiefs. And hey, I think a fully charged Chiefs beat the Eagles as well, which would make for a cool storyline via Andy Reid.
So basically I'm going with this:
Chiefs win Sunday, they take the Super Bowl.
Bengals win Sunday, the winner of the NFC Championship game wins the Super Bowl.
I'm not saying anything for fear of the gooch, but suffice that I disagree with a fair amount of that. :) :) :)
EDIT: WTF is wrong with this world? I googled "gooch" and "goocher" to check spelling, two words I always used growing up to be synonymous with "jinx", and I find now that's it another word for the perineum. Is nothing sacred? FFS.
The one and only context I have ever heard "gooch" is from Diff'rent Strokes. There was an unseen character called "The Gooch" who bullied Arnold at school.
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I've never seen gooch used before now.
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I've never seen gooch used before now.
I'm sure it appeared in a post by King...even though he meant something entirely different.
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You mother .......
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:-*
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:biggrin: :biggrin: :lol :lol :rollin :rollin (internets winners of the week!)
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Too many posts today to catch up on them all, but not sure I agree with Nick's sentiment that if KC wins, they win the SB, and if the Bengals win, they lose to whoever comes out of the NFC. The Bengals have been red hot since their rough start and have as good a chance as the other three teams left to win it, but I get it. It's the Bengals, who are historically the Bungles, but if the Blues can win a Stanley Cup, anything is possible now in sports.
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Love you too RJ. LOL
Bengals
San Fran
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I stumbled on this channel today, didn't know Kurt Warner did this kind of analysis and put it on youtube.
This one is of the Cowboys v 49ers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PozPldpWiOc&t=573s&ab_channel=KurtWarnerxQBConfidential
It's over 50 mins long and detailed and "boring" for most people I imagine, either way it's my kind of video where there's a lot of information and Kurt's own experience shines here. Ronde Barber does something similar for the Bucs channel though those are very short and not as detailed as this.
The NFL supplying All 22 video has been a boon for people who want to better understand the nuts and bolts. I really like the added detail you get from them. It's amazing how much pro players have to be able to understand and react instantly.
A few people have been doing these for a while. I really Samuel Gold, myself. Brett Kollmann is very good, too. I wasn't aware of Warner doing one, but it makes sense. There's a big difference, though. Warner's delivery is essentially what a coach would do on Tuesday morning. I'm not making 5 million a year so I'm not required to sit through it. Some of the other guys are putting together nice presentations. Better use of the telestrator (or whatever we're calling it now). Rehearsed, prepared dialogue. Basically the sorts of stuff that make something not quite so tedious.
That said, while they seem to know their business, I have no idea who Kollmann and Gold actually are. Warner's a freaking hall of famer. :lol
These are both Patriots related, but they're good examples.
Brett Kollmann (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gu9Jf6V2JwA&t=835s)
Sam Gold (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLmyRYJHt4o)
edit: AKA, what Bosk said.
Yeah, those are good as well. But I REALLY love Jonnydel's film breakdowns. They are just done in a really interesting, informative, and entertaining way. I would highly recommend the SF/Dallas one I linked above. Just watch it and tell me what you think of his style. (and his opening transitions into his Manscaped sponsorship ads are kinda hilarious)
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Love you too RJ. LOL
Bengals
San Fran
This m'fer spittin'
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Love you too RJ. LOL
Bengals
San Fran
This m'fer spittin'
Spittin' that real deal Mt brutha!
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If Mahomes is healthy enough to beat the Bengals Sunday, he'll be healthy enough two weeks later to beat the Niners. I'll be rooting for the Niners in that situation, obviously, but if I had money on the game, it would have to go to the Chiefs. And hey, I think a fully charged Chiefs beat the Eagles as well, which would make for a cool storyline via Andy Reid.
So basically I'm going with this:
Chiefs win Sunday, they take the Super Bowl.
Bengals win Sunday, the winner of the NFC Championship game wins the Super Bowl.
I'm not saying anything for fear of the gooch, but suffice that I disagree with a fair amount of that. :) :) :)
EDIT: WTF is wrong with this world? I googled "gooch" and "goocher" to check spelling, two words I always used growing up to be synonymous with "jinx", and I find now that's it another word for the perineum. Is nothing sacred? FFS.
And I had to google ‘perineum’ just now :lol
‘Taint’ was/is our phrase.
Made for a lot of fun with various lyrics.
‘Taint nothin’ butt the real thing, baby, taint nothin’ real at all….’
Our word was choad.
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Really good Jonnydel film breakdown for the upcoming NFC championship: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R9YZptrvj5w&list=TLPQMjcwMTIwMjN617rA5nwVZA&index=2
For a relatively short video, it hits on a lot of what both teams like to do on both offense and defense.
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Interesting stat: For QB efficiency, when under pressure, Purdy ranks #3 overall (behind Allen and Mahomes). Hurts ranks #16. When not under pressure, Purdy ranks #1. Hurts ranks #11 (in a cluster near Burrow and Lawrence). Will be interesting to see how much this comes into play on Sunday. Both teams are great at bringing pressure. Given how low the Philly defense ranks against the run, this could really turn into a high scoring game for SF when you pair an incredibly efficient QB and a solid running game against a defense that ranks near the bottom against the run.
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Interesting stat: For QB efficiency, when under pressure, Purdy ranks #3 overall (behind Allen and Mahomes). Hurts ranks #16. When not under pressure, Purdy ranks #1. Hurts ranks #11 (in a cluster near Burrow and Lawrence). Will be interesting to see how much this comes into play on Sunday. Both teams are great at bringing pressure. Given how low the Philly defense ranks against the run, this could really turn into a high scoring game for SF when you pair an incredibly efficient QB and a solid running game against a defense that ranks near the bottom against the run.
Those stats you present are as ambiguous as a warm bowl of jello. Purdy has 7 games under his belt.
It sounds like your trying to will your boy to win.... :hat
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??? How is any of that ambiguous? The numbers are what they are. Seems silly to ignore numbers you don't happen to like.
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??? How is any of that ambiguous? The numbers are what they are. Seems silly to ignore numbers you don't happen to like.
The ambiguity is in the lack of context. For instance, it would be more accurate to rate the QBs that have played the same number of games. Mahomes or Burrow have played 17 games whereas whereas Purdy has played 10 games less. I dunno, I haven't read the entire article like you did but at face value, the numbers look sqewed.
Again, it's not that I don't like the numbers, I just don't how one can make a definitive conclusion based on the numbers you present. No need to get snarky.
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It's a pretty straightforward stat that averages out, so number of reps isn't really too much of a factor. Of course, I'll still grant that when you have a smaller sample size, the numbers still can skew somewhat because it's easy to either perform abnormally well or abnormally bad over a small stretch. But in seven games, Purdy has had quite a few dropbacks, so I think any observable trends can be considered fairly reliable--moreso than, say, if he only played 2, 3, or 4 games.
And sorry if that seemed snarky. But I was responding directly to you calling me out out of nowhere for merely presenting a stat, saying it was interesting, and wondering out loud if/how it will come into play. My post doesn't "make a definitive conclusion" about anything. As I said, it will be interesting to see if/how that comes into play. And if it bears out, as I said, it "could" make for a high scoring game. Not sure how that's somehow controversial. High QB efficiency means the passing game is productive. And since they 49ers also typically have a very productive running game, coupled with Philly being weak on defending the run (if I recall, they are 22nd overall, although if you consider only the games after they acquired Suh and one other guy to bolster the running game, they moved up to 15th during that span), the run game is likely to be productive. That's a decent big-picture explanation for how there is at least a decent likelihood that both phases of the offense could be productive tomorrow, thus producing the likelihood of a high scoring game (and it partially explains why the 49ers are the #1 scoring offense during the span of time after McCaffrey was acquired and began starting).
Again, seems like a pretty straightforward, logical argument to make, so not sure why it got called out so aggressively in the first place.
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Temps below freezing today in KC. Wonder what that will do for Mahomes and that ankle. I have seen the reports and clips all week that show he is moving around fine, but not sure I buy it. I don't care if Collinsworth is right and he is Superman, no one recovers from a high ankle sprain in a matter of days.
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Temps below freezing today in KC. Wonder what that will do for Mahomes and that ankle. I have seen the reports and clips all week that show he is moving around fine, but not sure I buy it. I don't care if Collinsworth is right and he is Superman, no one recovers from a high ankle sprain in a matter of days.
I would think that the cold weather would help but I don't know why. And I agree, that high ankle sprains usually get worse before they get better but I thought PM played on one early in his career.
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Ok folks...it's gameday. LET'S GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!1
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Purdy is out... Fuck.
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This is not going well....
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Nope. Hopefully the D can keep it very low scoring.
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I noticed they are being very stingy with replays already. It's like they don't want people to see just how bad the officiating is and don't want to show anybody anything that New York hasn't seen first.
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I noticed they are being very stingy with replays already. It's like they don't want people to see just how bad the officiating is and don't want to show anybody anything that New York hasn't seen first.
Eh? They've been showing the 4th down "catch" non-stop.
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Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck
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Looks like the Niners offense is imploding without Purdy...
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So....the view from the above the field camera didn't wobble on the punt that hit it? I sure saw the ball go from spiral to wounded duck. :facepalm:
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Ground and pound time.
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That McCaffrey run! :metal
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:metal
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The Niners secondary is killing them with penalties... :censored
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Think we gave them 40 yards and 3 first downs in penalties.
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[division rival fan walks in]
Hey guys! How you enjoying the game so far? ;D
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Damn, I would have bet the Eagles had I known they were gonna get this kind of home cooking with the penalty flags. 49ers are getting called for every ticky tack thing. Meanwhile, the Eagles got a sack on one of Johnson's first plays at QB where the defensive end who sacked him was clearly lined up in the neutral zone. And they got away with a false start on a play from their own 2.
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I think some of the Niners penalties have been pretty blatant. I’m surprised that they are being so sloppy. Especially that hands to the face. That couldn’t have been more obvious if he had been wearing a neon sign.
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:censored
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:censored
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I think some of the Niners penalties have been pretty blatant. I’m surprised that they are being so sloppy. Especially that hands to the face. That couldn’t have been more obvious if he had been wearing a neon sign.
Yeah...these are not ticky tack calls. The Johnson fumble is going to be big. Eagles will get at least a field goal.
And there's another obvious, dumb penalty by the 49ers. :lol
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:censored
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I think some of the Niners penalties have been pretty blatant. I’m surprised that they are being so sloppy. Especially that hands to the face. That couldn’t have been more obvious if he had been wearing a neon sign.
Agreed, but the Eagles have had some blatant penalties not called. That is the difference.
I blame the first TD on Shanahan (you have to throw the flag once you see the WR who made the "catch" signaling for them to get to the line quickly), but the officials not seeing the ball dropped in real time is egregious. Tough to see, I get it, but that's their f'ing job.
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Why would you pull a face mask right in front of the official?
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As far as I’m concerned, the Niners defense gave Philadelphia those last two touchdowns. Not the refs.
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I think that is the ball game. Hard to see the 49ers coming back with Josh Johnson who looked like Cam Newton trying to recover that last fumble. Disappointing championship game. Bring on Bengals/Chiefs.
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:censored
As far as I’m concerned, the Niners defense gave Philadelphia those last two touchdowns. Not the refs.
Absolutely. It's gonna be one quiet locker room for them I'm sure.
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It's going pretty much as I expected.
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No Travis Kelce for the Chefs (possibly)?!
Big time game changer.
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No Travis Kelce for the Chefs (possibly)?!
Big time game changer.
I suspect he will play, but when it comes to the back, that can go on you at any time, so he could easily get some meds and beast like always or see it tighten up in the first quarter and be unable to move the rest of the day.
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Jeez! How do you have so many delay of games!?! :censored
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If Johnson is out, McCaffrey might be an upgrade at QB :lol
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Man, what a shitty game and awful way for a season to end. Even with a Niners loss I was looking forward to a good game.
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Man, what a shitty game and awful way for a season to end. Even with a Niners loss I was looking forward to a good game.
Same. Funny thing is, the D is keeping us relatively in the game, it's just two scores, but there's no way in fucking hell we're scoring unless something drastic happens
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That is the worst roughing the kicker call I've ever seen. I don't care what the broadcasters are saying, that is wrong.
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That is the worst roughing the kicker call I've ever seen. I don't care what the broadcasters are saying, that is wrong.
Yep, it's another example of how every single 50/50 call is going Philly's way.
Take the delay of game penalties on SF. They always tell us that when the clock hits :00, you get a 1-second grace period because the official has to look from the play clock to the ball, but those delay of games on SF are getting whistled immediately. It likely didn't matter as Philly was gonna win this game because of the SF QB situation, but the 49ers are definitely getting shafted on these calls.
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That is the worst roughing the kicker call I've ever seen. I don't care what the broadcasters are saying, that is wrong.
Yep, fucking weak.
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Man, what a shitty game and awful way for a season to end. Even with a Niners loss I was looking forward to a good game.
Agreed.
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Well I'm tapping out, this is just painful to watch. Trying to move the ball against a good D when all you can do is run? Yeah, that just isn't happening.
Good run Niners, and a few great stories, but can't win without a QB.
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Now they’re just giving up. The frustration is just making them stupid.
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Now they’re just giving up. The frustration is just making them stupid.
I already bailed on the game...no need to be a masochist about it.
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Man, what a shitty game and awful way for a season to end. Even with a Niners loss I was looking forward to a good game.
Yeah...I wanted the Eagles to win, but I much rather would have seen something close. The 49ers were outclassed, even before the Purdy injury.
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And now the 49ers are just being a bunch of thug bitches. #71 needs to be suspended for at least a game or two at the start of next season.
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Bench clearing brawl. I can understand that San Francisco is frustrated, but that was just so classless.
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Anyway, if the 49ers team that played yesterday and the Eagles team that played Saturday both show up next week, the 49ers have ZERO chance. The first 10 playoff games have been generally blah, so I'm hoping for a good KC/CIN rematch.
:lol So. Cal. homers are so cute sometimes. Not sure what game you were watching yesterday, but if you are referring to the one where the 49ers held one of the most potent scoring offenses in the NFL to 12 points, I'll take that team showing up any time. It's going to be fun seeing the confusion and "what do we do now??" panic on the Eagles sidelines when their team suddenly can't score.
Yeah...like I said....
Obviously, the injuries played a big part, and the Eagles didn't quite score at will like they did against the Giants, but this was about what I expected.
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And now the 49ers are just being a bunch of thug bitches. #71 needs to be suspended for at least a game or two at the start of next season.
What about the Philly player who had a hold of Deebo's facemask and wouldn't let go for like 20 seconds? Which led to the brawl. Should he be suspended for the Super Bowl?
Man, what a shitty game and awful way for a season to end. Even with a Niners loss I was looking forward to a good game.
Yeah...I wanted the Eagles to win, but I much rather would have seen something close. The 49ers were outclassed, even before the Purdy injury.
That doesn't even make sense.
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Who is that annoying Led Zeppelin wannabe band playing on all the Chevy Silverado commercials that somehow made an entire song out of the first four notes of Out on the Tiles?
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Welp... :dunno:
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Welp... :dunno:
So much for the numbers.
It's to bad about Purdy though. Magical season for him! :tup
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No Travis Kelce for the Chefs (possibly)?!
Big time game changer.
I suspect he will play, but when it comes to the back, that can go on you at any time, so he could easily get some meds and beast like always or see it tighten up in the first quarter and be unable to move the rest of the day.
I.e., Performance enhancing drugs (to continue a theme from the MLB thread that I agree with).
And now the 49ers are just being a bunch of thug bitches. #71 needs to be suspended for at least a game or two at the start of next season.
What about the Philly player who had a hold of Deebo's facemask and wouldn't let go for like 20 seconds? Which led to the brawl. Should he be suspended for the Super Bowl?
Don't know. I know a guy from Philly also got ejected at the same time, but I didn't see what happened, so I can't speak to it.
Who is that annoying Led Zeppelin wannabe band playing on all the Chevy Silverado commercials that somehow made an entire song out of the first four notes of Out on the Tiles?
Rival Sons: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1MaDYbECSg (the song is more than a decade old).
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No Travis Kelce for the Chefs (possibly)?!
Big time game changer.
I suspect he will play, but when it comes to the back, that can go on you at any time, so he could easily get some meds and beast like always or see it tighten up in the first quarter and be unable to move the rest of the day.
I.e., Performance enhancing drugs (to continue a theme from the MLB thread that I agree with).
Yup. Sounds like Dr. Molina's pitching room.
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The use of Cincinnati’s time outs is just driving me nuts. The last two first downs, I would’ve run up and spiked the ball instead of calling a time out. Now they’ve got nothing.
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No one is commenting on this game?
I can’t believe what I’m watching!
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Hey Stadler! This is your opportunity to hear a Mahomes game that isn’t being called by Collinsworth! :rollin :rollin
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Boo! Lol
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Hey Stadler! This is your opportunity to hear a Mahomes game that isn’t being called by Collinsworth! :rollin :rollin
It’s worse, though. Jim Nantz and Tony Romo. They’re co-presidents of the MILF (“Mahomes I’d Love to Fellate”) club. Though I think the refs are trying to start a rival chapter. Nineteen chances for Mahomes to get a first down. Please. ;) ;) ;)
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Ok. That PI call may have been the worst call of either game all day.
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Romo has been brutal.
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No one is commenting on this game?
I can’t believe what I’m watching!
This is game has been fire so far. 2 mins left now. Watching the game on mute because I can't bear to hear anymore of these guys.
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NY: “what the F are you guys doing?!? We need Mahomes!! Throw the grounding flag!!”
Field Refs: “Gotcha boss!!”
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That was grounding though. Didn't make the line of scrimmage and only linemen near it.
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Most boneheaded play by that Bengals DE.
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Two teams I don't want to win, and one will win.
Yuck. :lol
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That was grounding though. Didn't make the line of scrimmage and only linemen near it.
34 was right behind the line. It might not have crossed the line but there WAS a player there.
Tracy(the sideline reporter): “Patrick, you are one of the greatest and you’re not even 100% healthy. Can you tell us how you did it?” (That’s an almost direct quote. Kellen Winslow just cleared his kitchen table off.)
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Yay! We got the most boring outcome of both games! And so we get the most boring Superbowl teams....
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NY: “what the F are you guys doing?!? We need Mahomes!! Throw the grounding flag!!”
Field Refs: “Gotcha boss!!”
Now you know how non-Patriots fans felt for nearly 20 years. :lol :lol
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And I say that as someone who was grossed out by how that ended. The clear block in the back on the Chiefs return to midfield wasn't called, and the obvious hold on Mahomes prior to his run for the 1st down (where the late hit happened) wasn't called. Even my dad and brother (both of whom were here watching the game with me) thought it was blatant how badly the officiating was in KC's favor, and they were both rooting for the Chiefs.
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I’m with king. I thought it was legit grounding.
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I’m with king. I thought it was legit grounding.
It was, but the way the defender landed on Burrow was roughing the passer (based on how that was called for most of this season), yet there was no flag.
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I normally don't let the officiating bother me as they always tend to get some wrong but man some of those calls were just awful. Plus several missed calls.
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Boomer Esiason just called him “the superstar of all superstars”. There was NEVER that ball hugging for Brady, at least not until he had a couple of trophies under his belt.
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Boomer Esiason just called him “the superstar of all superstars”. There was NEVER that ball hugging for Brady, at least not until he had a couple of trophies under his belt.
That's because Brady was a good player winning Super Bowls early in his career, not an All-Pro from the start like Mahomes has been. I think you know this already. :D
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Talk about worst possible option for a SB for me... Zero interest in this game, though I'm thinking Philly by 7 at least. They're pretty fucking airtight.
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Boomer Esiason just called him “the superstar of all superstars”. There was NEVER that ball hugging for Brady, at least not until he had a couple of trophies under his belt.
That's because Brady was a good player winning Super Bowls early in his career, not an All-Pro from the start like Mahomes has been. I think you know this already. :D
That’s because people with eyes could CLEARLY see he wasn’t winning them BY HIMSELF. Didn’t win his first MVP til age 30.
:rollin :lol :lol Eff you Burrow you cocky ahole!!!! Got outplayed despite having the best receiver trio in the league. 2 ints and should have been more. How’s that cigar taste Joe?
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Can finally post some post-game thoughts: Man, Philly was looking SO beatable that game. It's really a shame how the 49ers' season ended. Win or lose, it's a shame Purdy got knocked out right at the getgo and they didn't get to put their best game forward. Really, really unfortunate. But I can't begrudge Philly at all. That was a clean, legal hit, and just had a really unfortunate outcome. And Philly did everything they had to do to take advantage of the situation and get the win. Good for them. And Hurts really is a great story himself. I wish the kid success (I just wish he could have it on a different team :lol).
Anyway, obviously not the way I wanted the season to end. BUT this is the most fun season I've had as a 49ers fan in a long, long time--probably since the SB 16 season, honestly. I wasn't really getting the pundits predicting SF being a contender at the beginning of the season with a QB that had hardly played and was so untested. Then he goes and gets injured when the season is already not looking good, and it seemed like it was inevitable to just being resigned to it being a rebuilding year and probably not even making the playoffs. ...and then Garoppolo starts playing lights out AND they get McCaffrey and the whole season turns around. ...and then he gets injured and we have to start a kid at QB who was picked dead last in the draft against a red hot Miami team that, at the time, was being picked as a legit AFC contender. ...and he somehow wins that game and goes on to light up the entire NFL, and just keeps on winning, and helping make this one of the legit best teams in the league. What a season. Really had a lot of fun and loved rooting these guys on.
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That was grounding though. Didn't make the line of scrimmage and only linemen near it.
34 was right behind the line. It might not have crossed the line but there WAS a player there.
Tracy(the sideline reporter): “Patrick, you are one of the greatest and you’re not even 100% healthy. Can you tell us how you did it?” (That’s an almost direct quote. Kellen Winslow just cleared his kitchen table off.)
34 wasn't. He was in a route 7 yards from the line. I wanted the Bengals to win but that was grounding.
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Boomer Esiason just called him “the superstar of all superstars”. There was NEVER that ball hugging for Brady, at least not until he had a couple of trophies under his belt.
That's because Brady was a good player winning Super Bowls early in his career, not an All-Pro from the start like Mahomes has been. I think you know this already. :D
That’s because people with eyes could CLEARLY see he wasn’t winning them BY HIMSELF. Didn’t win his first MVP til age 30.
:rollin :lol :lol Eff you Burrow you cocky ahole!!!! Got outplayed despite having the best receiver trio in the league. 2 ints and should have been more. How’s that cigar taste Joe?
Even by your hit and run posting standards, this is a terrible take. Burrow got outplayed? On what planet? Are we ignoring that the Chiefs o-line gave Mahomes time to throw for much of the day (and got to hold on the game's deciding play), while ignoring that the Bengals o-line was atrocious? These things matter, and I am guessing you know this, but your man crush on Mahomes has apparently made you blind.
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Too bad about Purdy. I would have much preferred seeing a full-strength SF vs. full-strength Philly.
But, we wound up with both top seeds going to the Super Bowl. Should be an interesting game.
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I think it's pretty fair to say Burrow got "outplayed". Mahomes at 80% (or less) still has more aspects to his game than Burrow at 100%. We'll see how he holds up against that Philly D-line.
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Going to be interesting to see Suh face Mahomes in the superbowl again, last time Mahomes was injured and constantly kept getting pressured and was running for his life most of the time. He had something like 500 scrambling yds of running after the snap and BEFORE throwing the ball. If I remember correctly he played pretty good even though the stats didn't show it as he made some crazy throws but his WRs kept dropping them.
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Boomer Esiason just called him “the superstar of all superstars”. There was NEVER that ball hugging for Brady, at least not until he had a couple of trophies under his belt.
That's because Brady was a good player winning Super Bowls early in his career, not an All-Pro from the start like Mahomes has been. I think you know this already. :D
How does a blown PI or a blown block in the back make him "the superstar of all superstars?" I get he's an All-Pro, but C'mon. That's now what the hype is saying. The hype is saying he's Tom Brady and Robert Redford and Bruce Springsteen and Martin Luther King all rolled up into one, just better. He didn't even win the SUPER BOWL yet; that was just the AFC CHAMPIONSHIP game. Guess what: 65 other guys have done that. Some were hurt at the time. Some drove their team to a field goal to win the game. Look, it was great play. IT WAS NOT "SUPERSTAR OF ALL SUPERSTARS". It just wasn't.
And if you're going to say it was, then you need to stop with the Brady, because what I saw last night was certainly AS BAD as the Ford call in that ONE game that took Brady to ONE (of his NINE) Super Bowls that keeps getting thrown up in his face.
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Boomer Esiason just called him “the superstar of all superstars”. There was NEVER that ball hugging for Brady, at least not until he had a couple of trophies under his belt.
That's because Brady was a good player winning Super Bowls early in his career, not an All-Pro from the start like Mahomes has been. I think you know this already. :D
That’s because people with eyes could CLEARLY see he wasn’t winning them BY HIMSELF. Didn’t win his first MVP til age 30.
:rollin :lol :lol Eff you Burrow you cocky ahole!!!! Got outplayed despite having the best receiver trio in the league. 2 ints and should have been more. How’s that cigar taste Joe?
And neither has Mahomes. Duh. It's not like Kelce sucks, or anything. There were easily 18 Chiefs on the field for those last five minutes. Which is fine; that's how the game goes, you take the good with the bad. It all evens out in the end. But the standard ought to at least be similar, if not the same.
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Can finally post some post-game thoughts: Man, Philly was looking SO beatable that game. It's really a shame how the 49ers' season ended. Win or lose, it's a shame Purdy got knocked out right at the getgo and they didn't get to put their best game forward. Really, really unfortunate. But I can't begrudge Philly at all. That was a clean, legal hit, and just had a really unfortunate outcome. And Philly did everything they had to do to take advantage of the situation and get the win. Good for them. And Hurts really is a great story himself. I wish the kid success (I just wish he could have it on a different team :lol).
FWIW - I totally 100% agree with you. It was a shame about Purdy and after he and the 4th stringer went down, Philly was stacking 9 in the box when Purdy came back in and that was church for the Niners. Bummer.....
I tell ya, Shanahan's coaching scheme's should steer the Niner's to multiple Super Bowls.
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Patrick Mahomes is a better Quarterback than Tom Brady ever was and those who can't accept it simply have trouble discerning between "ability" and "accomplishment".
Sorry Brady-lovers, but it's over. While Peyton Manning was playing, everyone liked him better than Brady anyway, now we'll gladly move on to the next guy because 1.) he's better and 2.) no one likes that Tom Brady anyway. He'll be hated as a commentator too, and booed like Goodell any time he's got to make a public appearance in neutral territory.
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Man, what a shitty game and awful way for a season to end. Even with a Niners loss I was looking forward to a good game.
Yeah...I wanted the Eagles to win, but I much rather would have seen something close. The 49ers were outclassed, even before the Purdy injury.
Agreed. I also would've preferred a much more competitive game but it would be a lie if I said I didn't enjoy the result. :tup
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Patrick Mahomes is a better Quarterback than Tom Brady ever was and those who can't accept it simply have trouble discerning between "ability" and "accomplishment".
Sorry Brady-lovers, but it's over. While Peyton Manning was playing, everyone liked him better than Brady anyway, now we'll gladly move on to the next guy because 1.) he's better and 2.) no one likes that Tom Brady anyway. He'll be hated as a commentator too, and booed like Goodell any time he's got to make a public appearance in neutral territory.
Lot of hate there, but that's the beauty of sports. We all get to give our two cents on the matter and no one is right or wrong. I for one have engaged in this debate for a lot longer than Patrick Mahomes has even been playing. It's not about Patrick Mahomes. FOR ME, winning matters. Not solely, but certainly it's a part of the equation. Dan Marino is not an elite quarterback because he didn't do what every team intends to do before the season starts: win the Super Bowl. He had the players, he had the coach, but he couldn't do it. He was a very good, maybe great QB in terms of physical ability (except for his knees) but he's not even top ten in my book of greatest QBs of all time. Mahomes is on the cusp. He wins a couple more and he's there, no question. He's got the tools, but he still has boxes to check. Win the big one the second time around. Win with a second generation of players around him. All those things that the truly great - the Brady's, the Montana's, the Staubach's, the Unitas's, the Manning's, the Roethlisberger's - have done before him.
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Again, I am talking about "ability", and you are talking about "accomplishment".
Anyway, Mahomes is already the MVP and first team All-Pro now on his "2nd time around".
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Again, I am talking about "ability", and you are talking about "accomplishment".
Anyway, Mahomes is already the MVP and first team All-Pro now on his "2nd time around".
Well, both really. Is throwing side arm the only "ability" that matters? There's not a quarterback that played the game that has the technique that Brady has developed over the years. Is scrambling the only "ability" that matters? Fran Tarkenton was doing that for the Giants and the Vikings back when I was still in elementary school. Again, not that Mahomes sucks, but let's not overstate things here.
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There were easily 18 Chiefs on the field for those last five minutes
Does this number include the Officials as well??
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There were easily 18 Chiefs on the field for those last five minutes
Does this number include the Officials as well??
It includes all of them. 11 Chiefs in full uniform and seven more acting as deputies in the black and white.
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Again, I am talking about "ability", and you are talking about "accomplishment".
Anyway, Mahomes is already the MVP and first team All-Pro now on his "2nd time around".
Well, both really. Is throwing side arm the only "ability" that matters? There's not a quarterback that played the game that has the technique that Brady has developed over the years. Is scrambling the only "ability" that matters? Fran Tarkenton was doing that for the Giants and the Vikings back when I was still in elementary school. Again, not that Mahomes sucks, but let's not overstate things here.
Having never thrown a football beyond the midget level or with any awareness of "technique", I feel fairly confident that Mahome's physical game is above Brady's, and pretty much has been for every year Patrick Mahomes has started under center. It's the mental game that Brady had going, especially as his physical abilities have started wane, and unironically this is both the year where I've seen Mahomes take a huge leap forward in that department while Brady continues to lose it.
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Boomer Esiason just called him “the superstar of all superstars”. There was NEVER that ball hugging for Brady, at least not until he had a couple of trophies under his belt.
That's because Brady was a good player winning Super Bowls early in his career, not an All-Pro from the start like Mahomes has been. I think you know this already. :D
How does a blown PI or a blown block in the back make him "the superstar of all superstars?" I get he's an All-Pro, but C'mon. That's now what the hype is saying. The hype is saying he's Tom Brady and Robert Redford and Bruce Springsteen and Martin Luther King all rolled up into one, just better. He didn't even win the SUPER BOWL yet; that was just the AFC CHAMPIONSHIP game. Guess what: 65 other guys have done that. Some were hurt at the time. Some drove their team to a field goal to win the game. Look, it was great play. IT WAS NOT "SUPERSTAR OF ALL SUPERSTARS". It just wasn't.
And if you're going to say it was, then you need to stop with the Brady, because what I saw last night was certainly AS BAD as the Ford call in that ONE game that took Brady to ONE (of his NINE) Super Bowls that keeps getting thrown up in his face.
I didn't say it did, counselor, so I cannot answer that question. :)
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I blame the first TD on Shanahan (you have to throw the flag once you see the WR who made the "catch" signaling for them to get to the line quickly), but the officials not seeing the ball dropped in real time is egregious. Tough to see, I get it, but that's their f'ing job.
Seriously, dude? The fucking networks with their 27 cameras didn't even get us a decent angle until after the commercial break. And a referee's job is to monitor a dozen things on every single play. When the NFL R&D department provides all of their refs with X-Ray specs then maybe I'll agree with you, but at this point the harping on referees is just getting silly.
Turns out that one of the electives in the DISD curriculum is "group sports officiating." That's a marvelous idea. Given the percentage of people who grow up up to be sports fans I'm starting to wonder if it shouldn't be a required course. Aside from the valuable life lessons of fairness, deescalation, multitasking, and countless others, it'd be good for people to get an idea of how tough it must be. :lol
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Again, I am talking about "ability", and you are talking about "accomplishment".
Anyway, Mahomes is already the MVP and first team All-Pro now on his "2nd time around".
Well, both really. Is throwing side arm the only "ability" that matters? There's not a quarterback that played the game that has the technique that Brady has developed over the years. Is scrambling the only "ability" that matters? Fran Tarkenton was doing that for the Giants and the Vikings back when I was still in elementary school. Again, not that Mahomes sucks, but let's not overstate things here.
Having never thrown a football beyond the midget level or with any awareness of "technique", I feel fairly confident that Mahome's physical game is above Brady's, and pretty much has been for every year Patrick Mahomes has started under center. It's the mental game that Brady had going, especially as his physical abilities have started wane, and unironically this is both the year where I've seen Mahomes take a huge leap forward in that department while Brady continues to lose it.
And the funny thing is that if that Jaguars receiver doesn't conveniently fumble the football inside the 10 yard line as they're about to score.....they're beat a week ago.
I have no qualms with folks praising Mahommes....dude can play football. BUT....when you're team habitually gets the call or DOESN'T get called...it' "easy" to do the things they've done. And, like every other really good team in the past, he has a cast of characters that make him that good. So...whatever...I personally have no skin in the game but the over the top praise for the dude is utterly annoying.
On top of the fact that everyone and their sister knows the NFL is a well choreographed show with predetermined winners.
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If Johnson is out, McCaffrey might be an upgrade at QB :lol
As soon as Purdy demonstrated that he couldn't grip a ball, much less throw one, McCaffrey was an easy call that they whiffed on. Just having Purdy out there to hand off every single play made them completely predictable. While nobody wants to have to do it, at least having a RB as your starting QB provides some unpredictability. There's at least the possiblity that he tries to throw the ball downfield, and he can probably complete 10 yard passes. Purdy with no hand strength was never going to.
That said, they clearly wanted their two best offensive weapons remaining at their positions. That's very understandable. That's also a failure of planning. It wouldn't have occurred to me before, but you shouldn't have one of your weapons as your E-QB. Live and learn.
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Bench clearing brawl. I can understand that San Francisco is frustrated, but that was just so classless.
Reminded me of the Seahawks after Malcolm Butler's interception. Seriously, I considered Pete Carroll's inability to control his team a more egregious blunder than the quick slant. That's what locked the game. :lol
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Patrick Mahomes is a better Quarterback than Tom Brady ever was and those who can't accept it simply have trouble discerning between "ability" and "accomplishment".
Mahomes is certainly more athletic, and it's easy for athleticism to make QB play look all the better. I have no reason right now to assume that Mahomes can actually do what Brady was doing for most of his career, which is adjusting every single play on the fly, from blocking assignments to route trees based on what he's seeing out there. It's also what made Manning great. What made Brady so fearsome in the 4th quarter was that he'd seen what you were up to for the first three, and he's learned how to exploit what you'd done. It's certainly possible that PM reaches a level where he can do that, but it's just as, if not more likely that his ability to morph plays stops at turning every play into a rollout and off-balance left handed miracle.
This isn't a knock on Mahomes, BTW. He's very definitely got playmaking ability beyond anything TB ever had, but in the long run I think TB's skillset was better and more productive.
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If Johnson is out, McCaffrey might be an upgrade at QB :lol
As soon as Purdy demonstrated that he couldn't grip a ball, much less throw one, McCaffrey was an easy call that they whiffed on. Just having Purdy out there to hand off every single play made them completely predictable. While nobody wants to have to do it, at least having a RB as your starting QB provides some unpredictability. There's at least the possiblity that he tries to throw the ball downfield, and he can probably complete 10 yard passes. Purdy with no hand strength was never going to.
That said, they clearly wanted their two best offensive weapons remaining at their positions. That's very understandable. That's also a failure of planning. It wouldn't have occurred to me before, but you shouldn't have one of your weapons as your E-QB. Live and learn.
I think they should have done this just to have an extra blocker on the field. Purdy wasn't going to throw or do anything but hand the ball off. They should have just gone with CMC as the wildcat if they were going to run the whole time, as the Eagles had stacked the box anyway. Yeah, he could've thrown some too, what do you have to lose. I don't think they were coming back anyway.
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If Johnson is out, McCaffrey might be an upgrade at QB :lol
As soon as Purdy demonstrated that he couldn't grip a ball, much less throw one, McCaffrey was an easy call that they whiffed on. Just having Purdy out there to hand off every single play made them completely predictable. While nobody wants to have to do it, at least having a RB as your starting QB provides some unpredictability. There's at least the possiblity that he tries to throw the ball downfield, and he can probably complete 10 yard passes. Purdy with no hand strength was never going to.
That said, they clearly wanted their two best offensive weapons remaining at their positions. That's very understandable. That's also a failure of planning. It wouldn't have occurred to me before, but you shouldn't have one of your weapons as your E-QB. Live and learn.
I think they should have done this just to have an extra blocker on the field. Purdy wasn't going to throw or do anything but hand the ball off. They should have just gone with CMC as the wildcat if they were going to run the whole time, as the Eagles had stacked the box anyway. Yeah, he could've thrown some too, what do you have to lose. I don't think they were coming back anyway.
Good point about the extra blocker. I think there was a failure to recognize when it was time for desperation, and therefore a move into the wildly unconventional. I'm not suggesting that they could have won that way, but Phili really wasn't playing all that well, and they may have been able to move the ball a little bit. They were completely inept with number 4 in there, and it only got worse when he was replaced by Mr. Handoff. They needed to try something different.
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Yeah, that was disappointing. There was really no contingency for, "what if Purdy goes down?"
Even the Jets, who were on QB2 or 3 depending on how you looked at it, had that in the wretched TNF game against the Jags. The came out in the 4th Quarter with the Streveler package. It didn't work, but it did provide some kind of spark. The Niners just seemed like they'd been defeated mentally long before Johnson even went out.
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I get what you both are saying, but the thing is, there just weren't really a lot of other options. Most teams just don't have more than 3 QBs on roster. SF was down to #3 with Purdy and had to made a late season acquisition to pick up Johnson. The fact that it was Johnson should indicate that the available options weren't great.
As far as whether to put CMC in as a QB, I can't really knock the decision they made. Yeah, he's the emergency QB. But taking a guy who isn't used to taking plays at the QB position and putting him there against a ferocious Philly D that has already knocked out two QBs in that game could have put CMC in an unnecessary position of vulnerability to a long-term injury. I get pulling out all the stops to try to get the championship game win. But with the deck stacked against them that badly, choosing to not put a longterm superstar at risk for almost no possibility of a good outcome isn't really wise.
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I've always despised the Eagles as a division rival for years. However, Jalen Hurts is the epitome of leadership, class and humility. He doesn't even need to put up monster stats for his team to dominate. They sure have rallied around this kid and it shows.
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Just watched the "bench clearing brawl" (I had tuned out by that point, so didn't see it live). Can't agree at all with the "classless thug" comments. Not even a little. There were a few things going on that led up to that. First was Aiuk getting slammed to the ground after the whistle by Johnson (which wasn't called), and then Johnson dives on top of him as well (also wasn't called). Then Juszczyk and Samuel come over to separate the two, and then Wallace comes flying in, grabs Samuel's facemask, and starts swinging him around. Like it or not, a lineman in those situations is coming to step and in try to defend his guys. That's clearly what Williams was doing. Yeah, he eventually crosses the line when he slams Wallace, and while that's wrong, it wasn't unprovoked or done in a vaccuum at all. And he didn't slam him head first, dive on him, or do anything to indicate he was looking to injure or to prolong the confrontation after tossing Wallace off of his guy. I don't disagree with Williams' ejection, but I don't lose even a little bit of respect for Williams in that situation. That was not a "thug move" by any stretch.
I've always despised the Eagles as a division rival for years. However, Jalen Hurts is the epitome of leadership, class and humility. He doesn't even need to put up monster stats for his team to dominate. They sure have rallied around this kid and it shows.
Agreed. (well, mostly--I wouldn't necessarily agree that he is the epitome of humility, but I'm right with you on the rest of it)
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A guy who has on several occasions quoted John 13:7 in reference to himself is definitely not the picture of "humility" that comes to my mind.
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I get what you both are saying, but the thing is, there just weren't really a lot of other options. Most teams just don't have more than 3 QBs on roster. SF was down to #3 with Purdy and had to made a late season acquisition to pick up Johnson. The fact that it was Johnson should indicate that the available options weren't great.
As far as whether to put CMC in as a QB, I can't really knock the decision they made. Yeah, he's the emergency QB. But taking a guy who isn't used to taking plays at the QB position and putting him there against a ferocious Philly D that has already knocked out two QBs in that game could have put CMC in an unnecessary position of vulnerability to a long-term injury. I get pulling out all the stops to try to get the championship game win. But with the deck stacked against them that badly, choosing to not put a longterm superstar at risk for almost no possibility of a good outcome isn't really wise.
The lack of foresight I referred to was not having a viable option as your emergency quarterback if you're not willing to play McCafferty.
And I don't buy the risk thing. Was having him run into an 8 man box every single play good for his health? Assuming you don't have Tom Tupa as your punter you can still look for better options. Or, they could have just taken a knee every down and bowed out gracefully with no risk to anybody.
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I get what you both are saying, but the thing is, there just weren't really a lot of other options. Most teams just don't have more than 3 QBs on roster. SF was down to #3 with Purdy and had to made a late season acquisition to pick up Johnson. The fact that it was Johnson should indicate that the available options weren't great.
As far as whether to put CMC in as a QB, I can't really knock the decision they made. Yeah, he's the emergency QB. But taking a guy who isn't used to taking plays at the QB position and putting him there against a ferocious Philly D that has already knocked out two QBs in that game could have put CMC in an unnecessary position of vulnerability to a long-term injury. I get pulling out all the stops to try to get the championship game win. But with the deck stacked against them that badly, choosing to not put a longterm superstar at risk for almost no possibility of a good outcome isn't really wise.
The lack of foresight I referred to was not having a viable option as your emergency quarterback if you're not willing to play McCafferty.
And I don't buy the risk thing. Was having him run into an 8 man box every single play good for his health? Assuming you don't have Tom Tupa as your punter you can still look for better options. Or, they could have just taken a knee every down and bowed out gracefully with no risk to anybody.
You could have gone with Danny White as well. :lol
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A guy who has on several occasions quoted John 13:7 in reference to himself is definitely not the picture of "humility" that comes to my mind.
I'm not really interested in people's religious beliefs. Personally, I'd rather players not mention the bible or God at all. I'm talking about his demeanor in press conferences and interviews related to sportsmanship and the relationship he has with the team. Humility in this context means he doesn't feel the need to boast about how good his team is.
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I get what you both are saying, but the thing is, there just weren't really a lot of other options. Most teams just don't have more than 3 QBs on roster. SF was down to #3 with Purdy and had to made a late season acquisition to pick up Johnson. The fact that it was Johnson should indicate that the available options weren't great.
As far as whether to put CMC in as a QB, I can't really knock the decision they made. Yeah, he's the emergency QB. But taking a guy who isn't used to taking plays at the QB position and putting him there against a ferocious Philly D that has already knocked out two QBs in that game could have put CMC in an unnecessary position of vulnerability to a long-term injury. I get pulling out all the stops to try to get the championship game win. But with the deck stacked against them that badly, choosing to not put a longterm superstar at risk for almost no possibility of a good outcome isn't really wise.
The lack of foresight I referred to was not having a viable option as your emergency quarterback if you're not willing to play McCafferty.
And I don't buy the risk thing. Was having him run into an 8 man box every single play good for his health? Assuming you don't have Tom Tupa as your punter you can still look for better options. Or, they could have just taken a knee every down and bowed out gracefully with no risk to anybody.
You could have gone with Danny White as well. :lol
Danny was a good quarterback who happened to also be a pretty good punter. He was always the backup QB, and started for eight seasons when Roger retired. Tupa was a punter who played QB in college. Danny is oft overlooked, which is a real shame. He was injury prone, but when he started he fared pretty well. He went 62-30, had 4 10+ win seasons, a trip to the pro bowl, and only had one losing season--his final, after the wheels had completely fallen off. He's known for the novelty aspect, which overshadows his career as a QB.
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The lack of foresight I referred to was not having a viable option as your emergency quarterback if you're not willing to play McCafferty.
OK, but "having a viable option" from where? As I mentioned, I don't think there was a viable option from outside the organization. And freeing up a roster spot to have picked up another backup QB in addition to Johnson wasn't really feasible because they had limited options for being able to designate players to IR to free up a roster spot, etc., due to earlier season injuries and moves they had to make earlier on, which used up a lot of those spots.
And if you mean having someone else from within the organization being ready, that's also problematic for a number of reasons. QB isn't just a "plug-and-play" position in today's NFL, obviously. Players already devote an enormous amount of time to maximizing their abilities at their own positions (and for a select few, maybe some closely-related positions as well). Learning to play QB competently is beyond the reach of most players who don't play that position regularly. Yeah, maybe you get a back or a receiver that can come in and run a small handful of trick plays they have run in practice. But running an offense for an entire game and all that entails? I just don't think it's realistic to expect that and prepare for that contingency.
In retrospect, it's easy to say that Kyle gambled and lost. But CMC was their fifth QB on the season. Having to choose to rely on him for a whole game in the QB role in the NFC championship and beyond is such a longshot, and if there are stats on such things, I would guess is pretty near unprecedented. I can't call that a "lack of foresight."
And I don't buy the risk thing. Was having him run into an 8 man box every single play good for his health? Assuming you don't have Tom Tupa as your punter you can still look for better options. Or, they could have just taken a knee every down and bowed out gracefully with no risk to anybody.
Not trying to persuade you, but just to explain why I think that way: I think having someone who isn't used to playing QB is much worse than having him run into an 8 man box every play. When you've played a given position all your life and instinctively know what the hits feel like, where they are coming from, etc., you know instinctively how to protect yourself as best you can. That goes out the window when you are suddenly thrust into a completely different position and now have those defensive lineman coming at you from different angles, coming from your blind side, coming at you when you are standing in the pocket as opposed to running at them full speed and delivering a hit yourself, and any number of other issues. So, yeah, I think he is "safer" running the ball than being the play caller, if given the option. And that's the thing--they had the option. The calculus is different if, say, Purdy gets taken out on a stretcher and they don't actually have a play caller. Who knows? Maybe Kyle gets asked that very same question and says, "Nah, the risk factor wasn't really an issue--I just thought this gave us a better chance than the other way around." That's fine. I'm just throwing it out there that, to me, that seems like it would be a valid consideration.
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El Barto. Oh I remember. I'd say 77 was my NFL awakening at 9 years old. Dallas vs. Denver. Staubach vs. Morton.
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The lack of foresight I referred to was not having a viable option as your emergency quarterback if you're not willing to play McCafferty.
OK, but "having a viable option" from where? As I mentioned, I don't think there was a viable option from outside the organization. And freeing up a roster spot to have picked up another backup QB in addition to Johnson wasn't really feasible because they had limited options for being able to designate players to IR to free up a roster spot, etc., due to earlier season injuries and moves they had to make earlier on, which used up a lot of those spots.
And if you mean having someone else from within the organization being ready, that's also problematic for a number of reasons. QB isn't just a "plug-and-play" position in today's NFL, obviously. Players already devote an enormous amount of time to maximizing their abilities at their own positions (and for a select few, maybe some closely-related positions as well). Learning to play QB competently is beyond the reach of most players who don't play that position regularly. Yeah, maybe you get a back or a receiver that can come in and run a small handful of trick plays they have run in practice. But running an offense for an entire game and all that entails? I just don't think it's realistic to expect that and prepare for that contingency.
In retrospect, it's easy to say that Kyle gambled and lost. But CMC was their fifth QB on the season. Having to choose to rely on him for a whole game in the QB role in the NFC championship and beyond is such a longshot, and if there are stats on such things, I would guess is pretty near unprecedented. I can't call that a "lack of foresight."
And I don't buy the risk thing. Was having him run into an 8 man box every single play good for his health? Assuming you don't have Tom Tupa as your punter you can still look for better options. Or, they could have just taken a knee every down and bowed out gracefully with no risk to anybody.
Not trying to persuade you, but just to explain why I think that way: I think having someone who isn't used to playing QB is much worse than having him run into an 8 man box every play. When you've played a given position all your life and instinctively know what the hits feel like, where they are coming from, etc., you know instinctively how to protect yourself as best you can. That goes out the window when you are suddenly thrust into a completely different position and now have those defensive lineman coming at you from different angles, coming from your blind side, coming at you when you are standing in the pocket as opposed to running at them full speed and delivering a hit yourself, and any number of other issues. So, yeah, I think he is "safer" running the ball than being the play caller, if given the option. And that's the thing--they had the option. The calculus is different if, say, Purdy gets taken out on a stretcher and they don't actually have a play caller. Who knows? Maybe Kyle gets asked that very same question and says, "Nah, the risk factor wasn't really an issue--I just thought this gave us a better chance than the other way around." That's fine. I'm just throwing it out there that, to me, that seems like it would be a valid consideration.
It's certainly an interesting thing to speculate. And to be fair, I'm not saying they would have won. You never really know, though. I didn't really think the Eagles D played all that well, save for the play that knocked Purdy out. What I do think is that at some point you have to plan for the what-ifs, and one of those is that you might need to plug in your emergency quarterback some day.* Obviously that's where you dumb things down a lot, but you still have some plays and some schemes you can run. Plays and schemes, mind you, that the D will also be completely unfamiliar with. Of course their number 5 receiver isn't going to be able to run the whole playbook. They should have made sure that he could run some plays, though. Hell, go nuts and run the wishbone. Make their D play against something they haven't seen since Pop Warner. You at least open the door for freak occurrences that up until then had only gone Phili's way. And at that point they really didn't have anything at all to lose.
*One of my favourite YT channels is a gun guy. In a video about shooting under stressful situations he made the point that you cannot train for every single scenario; there are simply too many of them. Repeatedly training to cross draw and chamber a round with your non-dominant hand isn't really feasible. You at least learn how to do it, though, even if you're far from proficient. If somebody shoots your right hand off, knowing what to do next and sucking at it is far better than not having a clue what to do next. It just seemed like dumping the playbook to accommodate an emergency QB is something they'd never even considered before.
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Been feeling since yesterday I got so excited for an NFC Championship game and it never happened. Got a quarter of football and then just had to watch a slow moving inevitable trainwreck that ended with the Eagles in the Super Bowl. Even if the Niners lost, I was hoping for a good game between two great teams. Instead, two injuries later it was just over.
Eagles are in a pretty interesting situation. They haven't in my mind played a real game since Jan. 1. After that we had...
Final game of the regular season where Giants played as few starters as possible.
Bye week
First game of the playoffs where the Giants played their starters but were still awful by comparison and the game was a blowout.
NFC Championship quarter where they could sit back after the QB injuries.
And then another week off.
On one hand, they might be a bit rusty, on the other it should be one of the overall healthiest and well rested squads to ever see a Super Bowl.
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El Barto. Oh I remember. I'd say 77 was my NFL awakening at 9 years old. Dallas vs. Denver. Staubach vs. Morton.
Norris Weese FTW! That game was a depressing ending to the first season I followed football (around the same age).
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Been feeling since yesterday I got so excited for an NFC Championship game and it never happened. Got a quarter of football and then just had to watch a slow moving inevitable trainwreck that ended with the Eagles in the Super Bowl. Even if the Niners lost, I was hoping for a good game between two great teams. Instead, two injuries later it was just over.
Eagles are in a pretty interesting situation. They haven't in my mind played a real game since Jan. 1. After that we had...
Final game of the regular season where Giants played as few starters as possible.
Bye week
First game of the playoffs where the Giants played their starters but were still awful by comparison and the game was a blowout.
NFC Championship quarter where they could sit back after the QB injuries.
And then another week off.
On one hand, they might be a bit rusty, on the other it should be one of the overall healthiest and well rested squads to ever see a Super Bowl.
Either way, it isn't a Super Bowl I am interested in watching. Just bought my ticket to Cancun.
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Such a shame about Purdy. I think the kid is going to be the Niners' starting QB for a long time. If he gets surgery in the next couple of weeks, he should be back up to full strength by the end of training camp. Trey Lance has an opportunity to step back in and reclaim the job. Niners fans are no doubt feeling down about what happened, but the future is bright.
As for me, I'm treading the QB talk. I hate everyone mentioned not named Lamar Jackson, Mike White, or Gardner Minshew.
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I blame the first TD on Shanahan (you have to throw the flag once you see the WR who made the "catch" signaling for them to get to the line quickly), but the officials not seeing the ball dropped in real time is egregious. Tough to see, I get it, but that's their f'ing job.
Seriously, dude? The fucking networks with their 27 cameras didn't even get us a decent angle until after the commercial break. And a referee's job is to monitor a dozen things on every single play. When the NFL R&D department provides all of their refs with X-Ray specs then maybe I'll agree with you, but at this point the harping on referees is just getting silly.
Turns out that one of the electives in the DISD curriculum is "group sports officiating." That's a marvelous idea. Given the percentage of people who grow up up to be sports fans I'm starting to wonder if it shouldn't be a required course. Aside from the valuable life lessons of fairness, deescalation, multitasking, and countless others, it'd be good for people to get an idea of how tough it must be. :lol
Is it possible that I am so jaded by awful officiating overall that I do not feel like giving them the benefit of the doubt when they miss a big call? Of course. That said, yes, they have a dozen things to monitor every play, but I would think one of them close to the play is watching the ball when the receiver is attempting a catch it and going to the ground. Consider this: the official who called a catch must have seen it as a catch, right? You can't call it a catch if you think he caught it; you need to be sure. And if he got a good enough look, that means he totally missed it coming loose and hitting the ground and moving before Smith regained control of it.
Now, I will repeat that I think Shanahan has to wear the clown hat on that one, though. You have to throw a challenge flag there. The fact that the Eagles were hurrying to the line to get a play off just screamed, "We are not sure if our guy caught the ball," so Shanahan doing nothing meant his team went down 7-0 shortly thereafter instead of getting a big stop and getting the ball around midfield early in the game following a big 4th down stop. It was the first half, when timeouts are less valuable, so you have to throw the challenge flag there.
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Is it possible that I am so jaded by awful officiating overall that I do not feel like giving them the benefit of the doubt when they miss a big call? Of course. That said, yes, they have a dozen things to monitor every play, but I would think one of them close to the play is watching the ball when the receiver is attempting a catch it and going to the ground. Consider this: the official who called a catch must have seen it as a catch, right? You can't call it a catch if you think he caught it; you need to be sure. And if he got a good enough look, that means he totally missed it coming loose and hitting the ground and moving before Smith regained control of it.
Now, I will repeat that I think Shanahan has to wear the clown hat on that one, though. You have to throw a challenge flag there. The fact that the Eagles were hurrying to the line to get a play off just screamed, "We are not sure if our guy caught the ball," so Shanahan doing nothing meant his team went down 7-0 shortly thereafter instead of getting a big stop and getting the ball around midfield early in the game following a big 4th down stop. It was the first half, when timeouts are less valuable, so you have to throw the challenge flag there.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=igf91J_jy48
The catch took place on the left sideline. The closest official was the field judge, who was positioned out of bounds. He was the guy who initially made the call because, from his viewpoint, it appeared to be a catch. The camera that showed the ball hitting the ground was on the opposite side of the field - i.e., a completely different point of view. The initial replays, which showed what the field judge saw, showed nothing that would indicate it wasn't a catch because that point of view was screened by the receiver's body (and the fact that the bobble happened in real time and the FJ had no ability to slow-mo the play). Even the endzone camera replay (shown around the 50-second mark of the video) didn't show any issue. It took a minute and a half to find the replay that showed the ball hitting the ground.
The only official who had a chance of seeing the ball touching the ground was the back judge. The back judge is positioned in the middle of the field about 30 yards downfield.
In this case, the back judge would have been right around the 5-yard line at the start of the play. In this case, Smith first got his hand on the ball around the 10-yard line. If you pause the video around the 5-second mark, you'll see that the field judge is in perfect position, and he's the only official in the picture. You can see all the way to the hashmarks, which are about 25 yards from the sideline, and the back judge is not in the picture. Where is he? His job, once he reads that it's a pass play is to go to the #2 or #3 receiver,* which, in this case, was not Smith. Once the ball is in the air, the back judge runs toward where the pass is thrown. In this case, he obviously was not close enough to see the ball hit the ground (coupled with the fact that he was probably running at the time of the catch).
Bottom line is that the officials did exactly what they're supposed to do, and there are just some plays that are going to squeeze through the cracks. Maybe put a second back judge on the field?
As far as Shanahan, I guess you could throw the challenge flag, but are you really going to do that based on a receiver doing something that Shanahan didn't necessarily know the meaning of? Rushing to the line to hurry up could mean any number of things. Shanahan was WAY too far away to have seen the ball hit the ground, and no one in his ear was telling him it wasn't a good catch. The safety (#29) signaled no catch and pointed to the ground, but he was hardly emphatic. Defensive backs do that sort of thing on virtually every play. Obviously, in hindsight, he should have done it, but potentially burning one of his two challenges on what, at the time, seemed like a non-controversial catch, five minutes into a scoreless game doesn't make a ton of sense to me.
* - https://operations.nfl.com/officiating/the-officials/officials-responsibilities-positions/
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So the refs are ass-clowns because they missed something 10' away when they had a band angle, and Shanahan is an ass-clown because he didn't challenge something that happened 30 yards away, from the same bad angle?
Also, now that you mentioned it, if I'm some clever bastard head coach always looking for ways to gain an advantage, I'm training my players to only haul ass to get the play off if they're certain it's a catch. I'm looking to make some lesser coach burn a challenge/timeout for no damn reason so I can laugh at him from the other side of the field. :lol
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Exactly. :lol :lol
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So the refs are ass-clowns because they missed something 10' away when they had a band angle, and Shanahan is an ass-clown because he didn't challenge something that happened 30 yards away, from the same bad angle?
Also, now that you mentioned it, if I'm some clever bastard head coach always looking for ways to gain an advantage, I'm training my players to only haul ass to get the play off if they're certain it's a catch. I'm looking to make some lesser coach burn a challenge/timeout for no damn reason so I can laugh at him from the other side of the field. :lol
Something they talk about on Around the NFL seems to be resonating.
Guys up in the booth are watching the broadcast, and on more than a few occasions, it seems like they coach has gone with whatever the commentator says. In this case, Greg Olsen said it was a "great catch". You gotta wonder if, instead he says, "I don't know about that one", Harbaugh decides to throw the red flag.
Anyway, not enough props to Philly for how damn quick they got that next play off. That was skill. I've seen teams with way more to lose hussle way less.
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I think that's silly. The only reason they can't fully review is time constraints which leads to my point, replay is useless. HD TV has made fans insane.
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I think that's silly. The only reason they can't fully review is time constraints which leads to my point, replay is useless. HD TV has made fans insane.
A sizable portion of the fanbase has always been insane.
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I think that's silly. The only reason they can't fully review is time constraints which leads to my point, replay is useless. HD TV has made fans insane.
A sizable portion of the fanbase has always been insane.
It's like throwing a match on gasoline.
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I think that's silly. The only reason they can't fully review is time constraints which leads to my point, replay is useless. HD TV has made fans insane.
What's silly about it?
Coach is on the field. Coordinators are up in the box, with the game on TV. Coach doesn't get a good look at the play. Coach asks the coordinators up in the box, "what are you seeing on TV?" The right angle - or statement - on TV could easily make the difference in the decision on whether the coach throws that flag or not.
It's very similar to those jumbotron replays.
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I was not clear enough. An announcer says its a great catch so it influences the coaching staff in the box? No coach would be influenced by the announcers. The just didn't have the time to see different angles. You're not silly, the talking heads saying that are.
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Non-controversial commentary!
I really do feel bad for the Niners players and their fans. Such a great, complete team but constantly snakebit by QB injuries. But Kyle Shanahan can get bent; may he be forever cursed to get close but never get a ring as penance for the 28-3 debacle.
The Chiefs were driving with about 2:30 left in the 4th quarter when they got called for Offensive Holding. That should have cost them the game right there. There's NO WAY the refs call that if there is some kind of fix in for KC. Come on. Fortunately Burrow sucked again when he got the ball back and then the Bengals bungled as they tend to.
Here's a weird trend that I'm sure Burrow will break at some point, but going back to the 1994 season no QB who lost his first Super Bowl ever got back. Burrow I think will break that curse, he's just too good. But of course, he's gonna get paid soon and so that means the team will have to make decisions with their roster.
Cowherd with the best, honest take as usual on Pat's game. He referred quite a bit (along with Sean Payton) to Pat's intelligence but of course as a black quarterback he'll never be given credit for that. But talent, resilience, leadership, he's got it all. No run game. Three of his receivers knocked out. Kelce limited with back spasms. Going against a better D on a gimpy leg. Not bad.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55YniVJ_654
As he points out again so people understand the difference, greatest talent doesn't mean he'll have the greatest career. Brady's had the greatest career and that will unlikely ever be challenged. But come one, 5 years as a starter, 5 years at home in the Championship Game with 3 wins, 2 MVPs, always dragging average or below average Ds. The kid deserves a little credit for that.
In checking the various fan boards, I notice that NE fans are way over the top to a sociopathic level over Hitler Mahomes getting the W - WAY more vitriolic than the Bengals boards. Wrap your head around that. 90% or Cinci fans are like "yup we got beat, but we'll be back".
Burrow had been 3-0 "against" Mahomes. He owns him! Oh but wait Burrow is 1-4 "against" Mayfield/Brissett of the Browns. Pay no attention to that, it doesn't mean anything! So silly but the fact that that kind of "analysis" has legs tells you that the average NFL fan has no interest in deep thinking unfortunately.
Now of course as a reward Pat gets the Number 1 pass defense in the league with the 2nd most sacks in history and the best O-Line in the game. KC has the edge at QB and TE but is completely outgunned in all other facets of the game - so I expect that the Mahomes detractors are going to have a field day before it's over :lol.
Enjoy the game guys, you're all cool :tup.
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I was not clear enough. An announcer says its a great catch so it influences the coaching staff in the box? No coach would be influenced by the announcers. The just didn't have the time to see different angles. You're not silly, the talking heads saying that are.
I think you're missing the chain of communication. It's the coach, listening to the coordinator in the box, who is watching the broadcast (among other things). There are many examples of where the broadcast team have a clearer picture (and, perhaps, theoretically, more objective perspective) than the coach on the sidelines. I don't think the coach makes that decision 100% based on the broadcast booth, obviously, but if the coach can and does get that information from the box over air while watching the game, he'd be foolish not to consider it.
In this case, though, again I think you have to give credit to Philly for getting a play off so fast. Suppose the broadcast DID show the other angle, right away? Had they shown the other angle before Philly got their play off, guarantee you see that red flag hit the turf.
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I was not clear enough. An announcer says its a great catch so it influences the coaching staff in the box? No coach would be influenced by the announcers. The just didn't have the time to see different angles. You're not silly, the talking heads saying that are.
I think you're missing the chain of communication. It's the coach, listening to the coordinator in the box, who is watching the broadcast (among other things). There are many examples of where the broadcast team have a clearer picture (and, perhaps, theoretically, more objective perspective) than the coach on the sidelines. I don't think the coach makes that decision 100% based on the broadcast booth, obviously, but if the coach can and does get that information from the box over air while watching the game, he'd be foolish not to consider it.
In this case, though, again I think you have to give credit to Philly for getting a play off so fast. Suppose the broadcast DID show the other angle, right away? Had they shown the other angle before Philly got their play off, guarantee you see that red flag hit the turf.
Coaches do not have enough time to see the correct replay to tell the head coach to throw the red flag. This is what exactly happened on that call.
What should happen is the booth should stop paly, look at it and the booth makes the call. That won't happen and in all honesty, the game was a lot better just going with the call on the field.
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The receiver of that (so-called) catch gave his team a signal that it may have been incomplete. That's why they were in hurry up and it worked. But yeah, had the coach seen that particular angle, he would've challenged it for sure. It certainly is a game of inches and seconds.
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A guy who has on several occasions quoted John 13:7 in reference to himself is definitely not the picture of "humility" that comes to my mind.
I'm not really interested in people's religious beliefs. Personally, I'd rather players not mention the bible or God at all. I'm talking about his demeanor in press conferences and interviews related to sportsmanship and the relationship he has with the team. Humility in this context means he doesn't feel the need to boast about how good his team is.
Well, don't look at the religiosity of it; the statement in "John 13:7" implies that the speaker is doing something otherworldly and beyond the comprehension of mere mortals. He's throwing a fucking football. Running it. Jalen Hurts is very good, but he's not transformative. He wins, I'll give him that, but this is really his first full time through. He's got a solid defense, and good skill position players. Yet again, let's let him earn his accolades.
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Yeah, that's it.
But hey, on one hand, you have Jalen Hurts saying that John 13:7 could maybe be a reference to him if looked at in the right light. On the other hand, you've got Patrick Mahomes crediting God for "healing him" in time for the AFC Championship game. Gonna be a great one, figuring out which NFL QB the Abrahamic God REALLY supports on Super Bowl Sunday.
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Yeah, that's it.
But hey, on one hand, you have Jalen Hurts saying that John 13:7 could maybe be a reference to him if looked at in the right light. On the other hand, you've got Patrick Mahomes crediting God for "healing him" in time for the AFC Championship game. Gonna be a great one, figuring out which NFL QB the Abrahamic God REALLY supports on Super Bowl Sunday.
He sure as fuck isn't a Niner fan :rollin
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A guy who has on several occasions quoted John 13:7 in reference to himself is definitely not the picture of "humility" that comes to my mind.
I'm not really interested in people's religious beliefs. Personally, I'd rather players not mention the bible or God at all. I'm talking about his demeanor in press conferences and interviews related to sportsmanship and the relationship he has with the team. Humility in this context means he doesn't feel the need to boast about how good his team is.
Well, don't look at the religiosity of it; the statement in "John 13:7" implies that the speaker is doing something otherworldly and beyond the comprehension of mere mortals. He's throwing a fucking football. Running it. Jalen Hurts is very good, but he's not transformative. He wins, I'll give him that, but this is really his first full time through. He's got a solid defense, and good skill position players. Yet again, let's let him earn his accolades.
That has absolutely nothing to do with what I'm talking about. Do me a favor will ya? Next time you feel the urge to quote me, don't.
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:corn
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Tyler Huntley makes the Pro Bowl when Allen backed out. Tyler threw 2 TD's all year. :facepalm:
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Tyler Huntley makes the Pro Bowl when Allen backed out. Tyler threw 2 TD's all year. :facepalm:
With a defense that ended up 3rd in fewest points allowed, and a Pro Bowl QB, my Ravens should have gone further in the playoffs. :lol
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:lol
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So the refs are ass-clowns because they missed something 10' away when they had a band angle, and Shanahan is an ass-clown because he didn't challenge something that happened 30 yards away, from the same bad angle?
Also, now that you mentioned it, if I'm some clever bastard head coach always looking for ways to gain an advantage, I'm training my players to only haul ass to get the play off if they're certain it's a catch. I'm looking to make some lesser coach burn a challenge/timeout for no damn reason so I can laugh at him from the other side of the field. :lol
Hey Bill! Good to have you here! :) :) :)
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A guy who has on several occasions quoted John 13:7 in reference to himself is definitely not the picture of "humility" that comes to my mind.
I'm not really interested in people's religious beliefs. Personally, I'd rather players not mention the bible or God at all. I'm talking about his demeanor in press conferences and interviews related to sportsmanship and the relationship he has with the team. Humility in this context means he doesn't feel the need to boast about how good his team is.
Well, don't look at the religiosity of it; the statement in "John 13:7" implies that the speaker is doing something otherworldly and beyond the comprehension of mere mortals. He's throwing a fucking football. Running it. Jalen Hurts is very good, but he's not transformative. He wins, I'll give him that, but this is really his first full time through. He's got a solid defense, and good skill position players. Yet again, let's let him earn his accolades.
That has absolutely nothing to do with what I'm talking about. Do me a favor will ya? Next time you feel the urge to quote me, don't.
It has everything to do with what we're talking about. Whether it was a religious reference or not is immaterial; he - Hurts - said it. It was anything but humble.
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I'm the one who brought it up. What I originally said had nothing to do with religion. It was taken out of context and I clarified. Then you took it out of context again. Stop twisting my words around to fit your own fucking narrative.
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I'm the one who brought it up. What I originally said had nothing to do with religion. It was taken out of context and I clarified. Then you took it out of context again. Stop twisting my words around to fit your own fucking narrative.
You don't hang around P&R much, do you? :lol
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I'm the one who brought it up. What I originally said had nothing to do with religion. It was taken out of context and I clarified. Then you took it out of context again. Stop twisting my words around to fit your own fucking narrative.
You don't hang around P&R much, do you? :lol
Wow. Really? It was a fair comment to what was a pretty chill conversation. I don't feel like I have anything to apologize for. I certainly wasn't pushing any "narrative", fucking or otherwise.
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I was not clear enough. An announcer says its a great catch so it influences the coaching staff in the box? No coach would be influenced by the announcers. The just didn't have the time to see different angles. You're not silly, the talking heads saying that are.
I think you're missing the chain of communication. It's the coach, listening to the coordinator in the box, who is watching the broadcast (among other things). There are many examples of where the broadcast team have a clearer picture (and, perhaps, theoretically, more objective perspective) than the coach on the sidelines. I don't think the coach makes that decision 100% based on the broadcast booth, obviously, but if the coach can and does get that information from the box over air while watching the game, he'd be foolish not to consider it.
In this case, though, again I think you have to give credit to Philly for getting a play off so fast. Suppose the broadcast DID show the other angle, right away? Had they shown the other angle before Philly got their play off, guarantee you see that red flag hit the turf.
From the account we have of what happened, Kyle was looking at the review on the jumbotron, and that angle didn't show anything. He was about to throw the flag just in case, and the coordinator in the booth said they couldn't see anything showing it wasn't a catch, so he didn't throw it. Philly quickly got the play off, and THEN they found the other view that showed it not being a catch. It all happened very quickly in real time.
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Non-controversial commentary!
I really do feel bad for the Niners players and their fans. Such a great, complete team but constantly snakebit by QB injuries. But Kyle Shanahan can get bent; may he be forever cursed to get close but never get a ring as penance for the 28-3 debacle.
To touch on this, when you think about it, I don't think the 49ers were snakebit by the injuries Sunday. It is easy to say, "It's a different game if Purdy, or even Johnson, doesn't get hurt," but it's not like those guys tripped over their own feet and got hurt; the Eagles defense knocked both quarterbacks out of the game.
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I was not clear enough. An announcer says its a great catch so it influences the coaching staff in the box? No coach would be influenced by the announcers. The just didn't have the time to see different angles. You're not silly, the talking heads saying that are.
I think you're missing the chain of communication. It's the coach, listening to the coordinator in the box, who is watching the broadcast (among other things). There are many examples of where the broadcast team have a clearer picture (and, perhaps, theoretically, more objective perspective) than the coach on the sidelines. I don't think the coach makes that decision 100% based on the broadcast booth, obviously, but if the coach can and does get that information from the box over air while watching the game, he'd be foolish not to consider it.
In this case, though, again I think you have to give credit to Philly for getting a play off so fast. Suppose the broadcast DID show the other angle, right away? Had they shown the other angle before Philly got their play off, guarantee you see that red flag hit the turf.
From the account we have of what happened, Kyle was looking at the review on the jumbotron, and that angle didn't show anything. He was about to throw the flag just in case, and the coordinator in the booth said they couldn't see anything showing it wasn't a catch, so he didn't throw it. Philly quickly got the play off, and THEN they found the other view that showed it not being a catch. It all happened very quickly in real time.
Might have been a situation to burn a timeout?
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Sean Payton to the Broncos is a done deal.
I have never hidden that I think he is overrated, but he is still a massive upgrade over the idiot they had this past season. They had to make this move, as they are tied to Russell Wilson for years, so might as well bring in a proven QB guru to get the most of their QB.
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Brady retires…..again.
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Brady retires…..again.
Hopefully that squashes the TB to the Niners chat that's taken over the local talk radio
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In that video he looked like he's done for good.
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Now we can enjoy the real GOAT (Mahomes) without the fake GOAT (Brady) clinging to football life. ;)
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Guess he just wanted out of his marriage.
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Guess he just wanted out of his marriage.
:lol
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That's hella fucked up :rollin
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Guess he just wanted out of his marriage.
Clearly
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Congrats to Tom for a one-of-a-kind AMAZING career!! Hope he does a good job in the booth, he should be able to provide great analysis.
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Sean Payton to the Broncos is a done deal.
I have never hidden that I think he is overrated, but he is still a massive upgrade over the idiot they had this past season. They had to make this move, as they are tied to Russell Wilson for years, so might as well bring in a proven QB guru to get the most of their QB.
I can be excited again...until about week 4 or 5.....
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Guess he just wanted out of his marriage.
Clearly
Or she did. It could certainly go either way. I'd love to be a fly on the wall of that. Maybe it's me, but short of something really extraordinary (meaning, NOT something that either party has done for the last 13 years) I can't imagine there's ANYTHING that someone can't swallow for eight months.
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Sean Payton to the Broncos is a done deal.
I have never hidden that I think he is overrated, but he is still a massive upgrade over the idiot they had this past season. They had to make this move, as they are tied to Russell Wilson for years, so might as well bring in a proven QB guru to get the most of their QB.
I have mixed feelings, but the guy had a .631 winning percentage, finished first in the division in 9 of 15 seasons, and only had 4 losing seasons. Obviously, it's hard to know how much was him and how much was Drew Brees, but it's a pretty clear upgrade from what the Broncos have had lately.
The one thing I really don't like is giving up ANOTHER first round draft pick to get him.
Now we can enjoy the real GOAT (Mahomes) without the fake GOAT (Brady) clinging to football life. ;)
And, in a couple weeks, both of them will have Super Bowl losses to the Eagles on their resumes! :laugh:
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The worst part of TB's second retirement is that we have to go through yet another tribute where everything on every sports channel is how great he was. Didn't we do this last year about this time? :tdwn
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Can't believe I have to root one way or the other for an Eagles association (Reid or the actual team). What's this world coming to?
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As a diehard fan of Michigan football, I watched Brady before the rest of the world. I would never have predicted he would rise to such heights. He seemed slow and average in every in every aspect. I wish him well.
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Did he sign one of those one-day contracts with the Pats? Do they still do that sort of thing anymore?
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Did he sign one of those one-day contracts with the Pats? Do they still do that sort of thing anymore?
Not yet....but you know it's coming. But for him....it'll probably have to be a 'one more play' contract where he gets to take an in game snap.....the NFL gets involved and it's scripted to where it's a TD pass to win the game or something like that.
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Sean Payton to the Broncos is a done deal.
I have never hidden that I think he is overrated, but he is still a massive upgrade over the idiot they had this past season. They had to make this move, as they are tied to Russell Wilson for years, so might as well bring in a proven QB guru to get the most of their QB.
I have mixed feelings, but the guy had a .631 winning percentage, finished first in the division in 9 of 15 seasons, and only had 4 losing seasons. Obviously, it's hard to know how much was him and how much was Drew Brees, but it's a pretty clear upgrade from what the Broncos have had lately.
The one thing I really don't like is giving up ANOTHER first round draft pick to get him.
It's not an early 1st rounder, though, so I am good with it. The Broncos needed a proven commodity to come in and fix Wilson, and Payton was the best possible option.
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Did he sign one of those one-day contracts with the Pats? Do they still do that sort of thing anymore?
Not yet....but you know it's coming. But for him....it'll probably have to be a 'one more play' contract where he gets to take an in game snap.....the NFL gets involved and it's scripted to where it's a TD pass to win the game or something like that.
Maybe 2 plays. An opposing player gives him a handshake, gets an unnecessary roughness penalty and then the TD.
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Did he sign one of those one-day contracts with the Pats? Do they still do that sort of thing anymore?
Not yet....but you know it's coming. But for him....it'll probably have to be a 'one more play' contract where he gets to take an in game snap.....the NFL gets involved and it's scripted to where it's a TD pass to win the game or something like that.
Maybe 2 plays. An opposing player gives him a handshake, gets an unnecessary roughness penalty and then the TD.
When does he do that "slide kick" thing that he picked up in Tampa? :)
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Sean Payton to the Broncos is a done deal.
I have never hidden that I think he is overrated, but he is still a massive upgrade over the idiot they had this past season. They had to make this move, as they are tied to Russell Wilson for years, so might as well bring in a proven QB guru to get the most of their QB.
I have mixed feelings, but the guy had a .631 winning percentage, finished first in the division in 9 of 15 seasons, and only had 4 losing seasons. Obviously, it's hard to know how much was him and how much was Drew Brees, but it's a pretty clear upgrade from what the Broncos have had lately.
The one thing I really don't like is giving up ANOTHER first round draft pick to get him.
It's not an early 1st rounder, though, so I am good with it. The Broncos needed a proven commodity to come in and fix Wilson, and Payton was the best possible option.
I just saw that it's the 49ers pick. I suppose, although I'm not sure Wilson's fixable - especially behind the Broncos offensive line.
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He's "fixable" by removing him from the NFL permanently.
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The Nick Caley thing is interesting to me. Everybody had him pegged for an OC gig somewhere, not sure why, and he winds up moving to LA to be their TE coach. A strangely lateral move. For one thing, he must have really wanted out of NE, or NE really wanted him gone. Also, considering that the Patriots TEs have been pretty much afterthoughts for the last few years makes me wonder why he's thought so highly of.
In any case, the Patriots coaching turnover is now 100% since 2019.
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The Nick Caley thing is interesting to me. Everybody had him pegged for an OC gig somewhere, not sure why, and he winds up moving to LA to be their TE coach. A strangely lateral move. For one thing, he must have really wanted out of NE, or NE really wanted him gone. Also, considering that the Patriots TEs have been pretty much afterthoughts for the last few years makes me wonder why he's thought so highly of.
In any case, the Patriots coaching turnover is now 100% since 2019.
I always thought you couldn't move laterally. Seems he wanted to get away from Bill where there was no opportunity to move up as a coach.
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I'm not sure that's a surprising move, though. McKay was not a given to come back this year, so I think Caley is joining a young staff, and a staff that is almost certain to change over the next couple years. I would grab that spot in a heartbeat if I was in Caley's position (CERTAINLY over the Jets or Texans OC job).
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The Nick Caley thing is interesting to me. Everybody had him pegged for an OC gig somewhere, not sure why, and he winds up moving to LA to be their TE coach. A strangely lateral move. For one thing, he must have really wanted out of NE, or NE really wanted him gone. Also, considering that the Patriots TEs have been pretty much afterthoughts for the last few years makes me wonder why he's thought so highly of.
In any case, the Patriots coaching turnover is now 100% since 2019.
I always thought you couldn't move laterally. Seems he wanted to get away from Bill where there was no opportunity to move up as a coach.
His contact expired. He could go anywhere.
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The Nick Caley thing is interesting to me. Everybody had him pegged for an OC gig somewhere, not sure why, and he winds up moving to LA to be their TE coach. A strangely lateral move. For one thing, he must have really wanted out of NE, or NE really wanted him gone. Also, considering that the Patriots TEs have been pretty much afterthoughts for the last few years makes me wonder why he's thought so highly of.
In any case, the Patriots coaching turnover is now 100% since 2019.
I always thought you couldn't move laterally. Seems he wanted to get away from Bill where there was no opportunity to move up as a coach.
That was my take, but I think it speaks to being a mutual thing. If there was no opportunity for him to move up, and I don't know if that's the case or not, maybe that's on Caley. Since the other Belichiks are on the defensive side of the ball you don't get to chalk that up as nepotism.
I'm not sure that's a surprising move, though. McKay was not a given to come back this year, so I think Caley is joining a young staff, and a staff that is almost certain to change over the next couple years. I would grab that spot in a heartbeat if I was in Caley's position (CERTAINLY over the Jets or Texans OC job).
Good take. I can certainly see that calculus working for him. :tup
My concern on that end would be that McVey was the brains of the organization, and without him the Rams are likely just another mediocre team. If he goes there's no guarantee that Caley still has a place there. Perhaps there's an assurance that there will be one, but in that scenario maybe he wouldn't want it. What happens if they hire a known loser of a coach? Even if he gets bumped up to the OC gig, if they suck it's going to fall back on him. He might have signed on to be the new whipping boy for Matt Patricia. :lol
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The Nick Caley thing is interesting to me. Everybody had him pegged for an OC gig somewhere, not sure why, and he winds up moving to LA to be their TE coach. A strangely lateral move. For one thing, he must have really wanted out of NE, or NE really wanted him gone. Also, considering that the Patriots TEs have been pretty much afterthoughts for the last few years makes me wonder why he's thought so highly of.
In any case, the Patriots coaching turnover is now 100% since 2019.
I always thought you couldn't move laterally. Seems he wanted to get away from Bill where there was no opportunity to move up as a coach.
That was my take, but I think it speaks to being a mutual thing. If there was no opportunity for him to move up, and I don't know if that's the case or not, maybe that's on Caley. Since the other Belichiks are on the defensive side of the ball you don't get to chalk that up as nepotism.
I'm not sure that's a surprising move, though. McKay was not a given to come back this year, so I think Caley is joining a young staff, and a staff that is almost certain to change over the next couple years. I would grab that spot in a heartbeat if I was in Caley's position (CERTAINLY over the Jets or Texans OC job).
Good take. I can certainly see that calculus working for him. :tup
My concern on that end would be that McVey was the brains of the organization, and without him the Rams are likely just another mediocre team. If he goes there's no guarantee that Caley still has a place there. Perhaps there's an assurance that there will be one, but in that scenario maybe he wouldn't want it. What happens if they hire a known loser of a coach? Even if he gets bumped up to the OC gig, if they suck it's going to fall back on him. He might have signed on to be the new whipping boy for Matt Patricia. :lol
I totally agree with that last part. I think McVey is a special coach in that way (read anything that Aaron Donald has said about his last couple years on the Rams and that part is clear) and it WON'T be the same without him. But that hasn't held anyone back in the past has it? :) :) :) Who knows, maybe he thinks he's the next (whose that nerd coaching the 'fins?)
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The Nick Caley thing is interesting to me. Everybody had him pegged for an OC gig somewhere, not sure why, and he winds up moving to LA to be their TE coach. A strangely lateral move. For one thing, he must have really wanted out of NE, or NE really wanted him gone. Also, considering that the Patriots TEs have been pretty much afterthoughts for the last few years makes me wonder why he's thought so highly of.
In any case, the Patriots coaching turnover is now 100% since 2019.
I always thought you couldn't move laterally. Seems he wanted to get away from Bill where there was no opportunity to move up as a coach.
That was my take, but I think it speaks to being a mutual thing. If there was no opportunity for him to move up, and I don't know if that's the case or not, maybe that's on Caley. Since the other Belichiks are on the defensive side of the ball you don't get to chalk that up as nepotism.
I'm not sure that's a surprising move, though. McKay was not a given to come back this year, so I think Caley is joining a young staff, and a staff that is almost certain to change over the next couple years. I would grab that spot in a heartbeat if I was in Caley's position (CERTAINLY over the Jets or Texans OC job).
Good take. I can certainly see that calculus working for him. :tup
My concern on that end would be that McVey was the brains of the organization, and without him the Rams are likely just another mediocre team. If he goes there's no guarantee that Caley still has a place there. Perhaps there's an assurance that there will be one, but in that scenario maybe he wouldn't want it. What happens if they hire a known loser of a coach? Even if he gets bumped up to the OC gig, if they suck it's going to fall back on him. He might have signed on to be the new whipping boy for Matt Patricia. :lol
Not in this case. He wants to be a GM and Bill was forced by Kraft to bring in a vet to run the offense so Nick was stalled there in his side of the ball. I can see why he left.
Edit, I'm responding to El Barto on the Nepotism remark. Caley was just stuck going nowhere is because of the circumstances.
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One of the things I enjoy about the week before the Super Bowl is that the NFL Network airs the NFL Films highlight packages for all of the previous Super Bowls. The first however many of them are narrated by John Facenda. They're really great and evoke memories of my childhood when, on Saturdays, I'd watch highlights of the prior week's games. The first 11 games are particularly enjoyable to watch since I didn't see them live.
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I enjoy those too, and also revisit old SBs around this time.
However, I will say that what little interest I had going in to this game is waning fast. Minority opinion here, ( I think?) but this 2-week interval can be a real drag.
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I enjoy those too, and also revisit old SBs around this time.
However, I will say that what little interest I had going in to this game is waning fast. Minority opinion here, ( I think?) but this 2-week interval can be a real drag.
Two Things:
1) I love revisiting those old SBs too but I love the old NFL Films with the music (I think they used music from the old Westerns).
2) I have come to appreciate the 2 week interval because it gives me time to breath and the players time to heal. I remember when they went to 1 week and I came to dislike it.
What I don't like is the 17 week schedule and a soon to be 18 weeks. This is taking a toll on the players. A 16 week schedule is the sweet spot.
BTW - can we start the season on Labor Day?
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Oh boy just found out Carl Cheffers is the ref for this game. The guy is a notorious Chiefs hater. Seriously, look up his sordid history on KC games he's reffed. This gives the Eagles another edge they didn't need with that stacked roster.
Just curious, are there any math majors in this thread? The reason I ask is because of something I keep seeing brought up: PM has started 13 playoff games, and is #1 all time in passer rating, TDs per game, TD-INT ratio, etc but the most vocal critics want to take a subset of 2 games (one of which he actually won with a great 4th quarter comeback) so actually a subset of 7 quarters where his numbers aren't as good as the rest and try to say that is statistically significant. It isn't. It's an absolutely meaningless sample size. Math majors would recognize this. It's random distribution, like AL MVP Aaron Judge going 0-8 in the first 2 games of the Championship Series. It doesn't mean anything. Never mind that those 7 quarters were against some of the toughest defenses in recent memory.
Randomness occurs a lot in all sports. If a QB is in the playoffs every year, some years he'll have his best games in the Division Round, some in the Championship Game, some in the Super Bowl. You can't pre-plan when your best games will be. In 2007 and 2011 Brady happened to have his best games in earlier rounds. A lot of it is matchups too.
So . . . how again did we get to spot in sports where "ringz" are the only things that matter to the exclusion of literally everything else? Bill Russell got 11 rings, Jordan didn't even have his 6th yet before he was being called the goat, and this in a sport where a guy controls the outcome even more than a QB. MAKE IT MAKE SENSE.
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Minority opinion here, ( I think?) but this 2-week interval can be a real drag.
Minority? I don't think anyone who isn't directly making money from the Super Bowl agrees. And of course, it doesn't help having two teams no one wants to see win anyway. My interest in the game could not be any lower. It'll be interesting to see how much interest there is down in Mexico this weekend.
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Oh boy just found out Carl Cheffers is the ref for this game. The guy is a notorious Chiefs hater. Seriously, look up his sordid history on KC games he's reffed. This gives the Eagles another edge they didn't need with that stacked roster.
Just curious, are there any math majors in this thread? The reason I ask is because of something I keep seeing brought up: PM has started 13 playoff games, and is #1 all time in passer rating, TDs per game, TD-INT ratio, etc but the most vocal critics want to take a subset of 2 games (one of which he actually won with a great 4th quarter comeback) so actually a subset of 7 quarters where his numbers aren't as good as the rest and try to say that is statistically significant. It isn't. It's an absolutely meaningless sample size. Math majors would recognize this. It's random distribution, like AL MVP Aaron Judge going 0-8 in the first 2 games of the Championship Series. It doesn't mean anything. Never mind that those 7 quarters were against some of the toughest defenses in recent memory.
Randomness occurs a lot in all sports. If a QB is in the playoffs every year, some years he'll have his best games in the Division Round, some in the Championship Game, some in the Super Bowl. You can't pre-plan when your best games will be. In 2007 and 2011 Brady happened to have his best games in earlier rounds. A lot of it is matchups too.
So . . . how again did we get to spot in sports where "ringz" are the only things that matter to the exclusion of literally everything else? Bill Russell got 11 rings, Jordan didn't even have his 6th yet before he was being called the goat, and this in a sport where a guy controls the outcome even more than a QB. MAKE IT MAKE SENSE.
Of course rings don't matter... when you don't have any. Someone else help me, but that post almost - ALMOST - reads like an excuse or an disclaimer for Mahomes not winning the ring this year, even before the game happens! If he's so fucking good, if he's the GOAT, HE NEEDS NO EXCUSES. Just shut up and do it, or not. He's either greatest, or he's not. IF the Eagles and Hurts beat him, well, guess what, he wasn't.
Name me a team in the NFL that starts the season thinking "fuck the playoffs, fuck the Super Bowl, we're going to make our mission statement to have the most Passing TDs over 10 yards this year. We do that, and we'll consider it a win!" Or, "Hey, men, our only objective this year is to make sure our QB has the highest QB rating in history. I don't give a rat's ass HOW many games we win, we're going to make sure that rating is just as high as it can be! On three!" Maybe the Jets. I don't know. Certainly none of the teams that are IN the playoffs.
(And not for nothing, but the only "stat" that I could reproduce on my own was playoff QB rating, where Mahomes is first. Everything else, I've got other people ranked higher. But whatever. You do you.)
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Two Things:
1) I love revisiting those old SBs too but I love the old NFL Films with the music (I think they used music from the old Westerns).
2) I have come to appreciate the 2 week interval because it gives me time to breath and the players time to heal. I remember when they went to 1 week and I came to dislike it.
What I don't like is the 17 week schedule and a t'ssoon to be 18 weeks. This is taking a toll on the players. A 16 week schedule is the sweet spot.
BTW - can we start the season on Labor Day?
AFAIK, most of the music used by NFL Films was original (e.g., The Autumn Wind) and most definitely not from westerns (e.g., Sailor's Odyssey). I've had a CD of NFL Films in my Amazon wish list for years. One of these days, I may pull the trigger. It's all good stuff.
Couldn't agree more about the rest of what you wrote. 17 games is silly, and I think we'll find pretty quickly that 18 is too many. And Labor Day weekend would be a perfect way to start the season.
As for the two weeks, I also agree, but I see the value in giving the competing teams time for injuries to heal. The problem with it is that, when the season starts late and is longer, we're extending too long into the new year.
And of course, it doesn't help having two teams no one wants to see win anyway.
Not bitter at all, are you? This is a marquee matchup whether you're interested or not.
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And of course, it doesn't help having two teams no one wants to see win anyway.
Not bitter at all, are you? This is a marquee matchup whether you're interested or not.
Why, yes. Yes I am. But that's beside the point. I wouldn't have wanted this matchup regardless of anything that happened in recent weeks. Two teams that I would never root for under any circumstances, so I have no interest. As long as Andy Reid, Patrick Mahomes, and current ownership are in place in KC, I will root for them to lose every single game they play and will hold out hope that the NFL will simply revoke their franchise. And Philly is...eh. The only thing they have going for them is that I kinda admire Hurts. And the fact that they aren't the Chiefs.
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This is a marquee matchup whether you're interested or not.
Both the top seeds, both won 14 games. Agreed, it's a top match up.
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Top seeds facing each other in the big game is not a rare occurrence, so that fact isn't really compelling to me. And even if it were less common, if the top seeds are both completely unlikeable, I don't see how it can be considered a marquee matchup.
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Top seeds facing each other in the big game is not a rare occurrence, so that fact isn't really compelling to me. And even if it were less common, if the top seeds are both completely unlikeable, I don't see how it can be considered a marquee matchup.
I was going in a different direction; the Chiefs are one of the better teams, generally, in the AFC, but the Eagles are not exactly perennial contenders, and this is both Siriani's and Hurts' first run at the ring. I can think of probably five matchups (at least) that better qualify as "marquee matchups".
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Top seeds facing each other in the big game is not a rare occurrence, so that fact isn't really compelling to me. And even if it were less common, if the top seeds are both completely unlikeable, I don't see how it can be considered a marquee matchup.
I was going in a different direction; the Chiefs are one of the better teams, generally, in the AFC, but the Eagles are not exactly perennial contenders, and this is both Siriani's and Hurts' first run at the ring. I can think of probably five matchups (at least) that better qualify as "marquee matchups".
Like who?
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I can definitely offer matchups I would rather have seen, but it's hard to argue with # 1 vs. # 1.
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Top seeds facing each other in the big game is not a rare occurrence, so that fact isn't really compelling to me. And even if it were less common, if the top seeds are both completely unlikeable, I don't see how it can be considered a marquee matchup.
I was going in a different direction; the Chiefs are one of the better teams, generally, in the AFC, but the Eagles are not exactly perennial contenders, and this is both Siriani's and Hurts' first run at the ring. I can think of probably five matchups (at least) that better qualify as "marquee matchups".
Like who?
I'd much rather see any of these:
Chiefs v 49ers
Chiefs v Dallas
Bills v 49ers
Bills v Dallas
Cin v 49ers
Cin v Dallas
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Not sure how many listen to his podcast, Jim Gray on Sirius XM with Tom Brady and Larry Fitz has been a thing for a while and yesterday's episode had Tom Brady with Bill Belichick and Peyton Manning who were great listens. Had a lot to say and overall a fun listen, more admiration than animosity, some interesting tidbits from Peyton and Bill throughout. Plus some flybys from Gronk and Patrick Mahomes though I think it was more of a recorded message by Patrick.
Link (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/tom-brady-with-bill-belichick-peyton-manning-rob/id1584409759?i=1000598372745)for anyone interested
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Just because one person would, subjectively, prefer a different matchup doesn't make the actual matchup not a "marquee matchup."
Two #1 seeds, one of whom has played in 5 consecutive conference championship games and 3 of the last 5 Super Bowls and is led by a QB widely regarded as the best in the league, and the other who won a Super Bowl only 5 years ago, is a marquee matchup, regardless of any one person's personal interest.
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I don't know that I would define "marquee matchup" that way.
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Top seeds facing each other in the big game is not a rare occurrence, so that fact isn't really compelling to me. And even if it were less common, if the top seeds are both completely unlikeable, I don't see how it can be considered a marquee matchup.
Both teams won 14 games, I know that's a product of the extra game, but still, it has to mean something that we are seeing the two best teams play. (I read this has never happened before, but can't find the qoute and too lazy to look it up myself)
There's brothers going against each other.
Both head coaches have ties to the opponent.
They didn't play each other this year
Point spread is small
First time two black QBs are starting
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Top seeds facing each other in the big game is not a rare occurrence, so that fact isn't really compelling to me. And even if it were less common, if the top seeds are both completely unlikeable, I don't see how it can be considered a marquee matchup.
I was going in a different direction; the Chiefs are one of the better teams, generally, in the AFC, but the Eagles are not exactly perennial contenders, and this is both Siriani's and Hurts' first run at the ring. I can think of probably five matchups (at least) that better qualify as "marquee matchups".
Like who?
I'd much rather see any of these:
Chiefs v 49ers
Chiefs v Dallas
Bills v 49ers
Bills v Dallas
Cin v 49ers
Cin v Dallas
Wanting Niners or Cincy is understandable since both teams got shafted by officiating in some significant ways.
But, Bills did it to themselves, and Dallas I just can't understand.
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Bills v 49ers
That's the matchup I was hoping for the most, at the start of the playoffs.
BTW, Steve Wilks, former Panthers defensive coordinator, interim head coach, and jilted head coach candidate, to the 49ers as defensive coordinator.
The Panthers continue to give gifts to the 49ers. Treat him well, San Fran, he's a good one.
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Well, I thought my list was pretty profound. Cincinnati and SF was a rematch of TWO previous Super Bowls; would Joe Burrow over come those two previous losses? The Chiefs never actually played Dallas in the SB, but they were two of the four or five powerhouse teams of the late '60s, early '70s and it's only a quirk that Hank Stram didn't coach against Tom Landry in the big game. Dallas beat Buffalo twice in a row back during the Bill's oh-fer-four run (the third and fourth losses). THOSE are marquee games.
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Well, I thought my list was pretty profound. Cincinnati and SF was a rematch of TWO previous Super Bowls; would Joe Burrow over come those two previous losses? The Chiefs never actually played Dallas in the SB, but they were two of the four or five powerhouse teams of the late '60s, early '70s and it's only a quirk that Hank Stram didn't coach against Tom Landry in the big game. Dallas beat Buffalo twice in a row back during the Bill's oh-fer-four run (the third and fourth losses). THOSE are marquee games.
The Chiefs started out in Dallas as the Texans, and then moved to KC and became the Chiefs, so that would be sort of cool. This year's Superb Owl could've been WAY worse, though, it could've been a Giants-Ravens rematch!
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I think the league is mostly star-driven enough now to where players are the marquee, not teams.
Imagine if the Super Bowl this year had been Bucs/Bengals. While TB vs Cincy is not a classic marquee matchup by any stretch of the imagination, TB12 the Goat vs the young stud Burrow most certainly would have been.
I think there are still a few brands that can make just about any game a marquee one - Dallas, Pitt, GB - but, by and large, it is the players, and the QBs in most cases, who are the draw.
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Imagine if the Super Bowl this year had been Bucs/Bengals.
I'd watch that. :tup
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https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/aaron-rodgers-says-retirement-decision-will-come-after-four-day-darkness-retreat-qb-makes-super-bowl-pick/
Thanks Aaron, for letting us know when you will let us know.
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I did chuckle when Rodgers busted out the Ted Lasso line, "Be curious, not judgmental."
I think we, including myself sometimes, would all do well to abide by that. :hat :hat
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Well, I thought my list was pretty profound. Cincinnati and SF was a rematch of TWO previous Super Bowls; would Joe Burrow over come those two previous losses? The Chiefs never actually played Dallas in the SB, but they were two of the four or five powerhouse teams of the late '60s, early '70s and it's only a quirk that Hank Stram didn't coach against Tom Landry in the big game. Dallas beat Buffalo twice in a row back during the Bill's oh-fer-four run (the third and fourth losses). THOSE are marquee games.
Most of that means nothing to me. I didn't start watching the NFL until the Cowboys were done with their SBs, hence the confusion why anyone would want to see more of THIS particular Cowboys team.
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HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA (https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/aaron-rodgers-says-retirement-decision-will-come-after-four-day-darkness-retreat-qb-makes-super-bowl-pick/)
Scroll down to almost the end, and watch the video snippet of the wrestling match. PERFECT!!!
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I did chuckle when Rodgers busted out the Ted Lasso line, "Be curious, not judgmental."
I think we, including myself sometimes, would all do well to abide by that. :hat :hat
I'm curious why he doesn't just do DMT like normal people. That said, if he really does do 4 days of total darkness I'm impressed.
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My (corporate) attorney and friend works on the 31st floor of a building in Philly not far from Ben Franklin Parkway. He said the celebrations are already starting. There is a real, palpable level of confidence in that city that both impresses and scares the hell out of me (I'm not a "count your chickens" kind of guy).
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https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/aaron-rodgers-says-retirement-decision-will-come-after-four-day-darkness-retreat-qb-makes-super-bowl-pick/
Thanks Aaron, for letting us know when you will let us know.
Darkness retreat? My eyes are in full roll mode.
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(https://i.imgur.com/JrSMDGu.jpg)
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:rollin :rollin :rollin
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Brilliant, except for the damn @tag right in the freaking middle of the last picture.
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Knew they should have shot down that spy balloon :lol :lol
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31-28 Philly
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TB12 is officially retired, dont think he'll pull a Favre and unretire.
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https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/aaron-rodgers-says-retirement-decision-will-come-after-four-day-darkness-retreat-qb-makes-super-bowl-pick/
Thanks Aaron, for letting us know when you will let us know.
Please trade this nut job out of Green Bay.
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^
I thought Groundhog's Day was two weeks ago....
Just curious as to what the over/under as to the amount of times the word 'ankle' is said by the broadcasters? btw...Chiefs RB Clyde Edwards-Helaire returns for the first time since late November after suffering a high ankle sprain. You just know they'll work in a common reference to their QB.
Make it your 'drink' word of the late afternoon/evening, and you'll be lucky to make it to halftime.
Taking the Eagles because of their OL and defensive front seven. 27-19 maybe
My 55th Superb Owl viewing (add on the first two AFL-NFL World Championship games, and I'll have seen them all.....)
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Ok...gonna go with the Iggles on this one.
Score...
Philly- 34
Chefs- 22
or...
Philly- 25
Chefs- 21
Honestly, any score that ends up Philly 4, Chefs 2 or Philly 5, Chefs 1, no matter who wins, is what I'm rooting for.
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Honestly, any score that ends up Philly 4, Chefs 2 or Philly 5, Chefs 1, no matter who wins, is what I'm rooting for.
Great Googly Moogly, this isn't the CFL :D
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Honestly, any score that ends up Philly 4, Chefs 2 or Philly 5, Chefs 1, no matter who wins, is what I'm rooting for.
Great Googly Moogly, this isn't the CFL :D
Eagles with 5 field goals and Chiefs with a touchdown, an extra point and 2 safeties. You never know!
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Honestly, any score that ends up Philly 4, Chefs 2 or Philly 5, Chefs 1, no matter who wins, is what I'm rooting for.
Great Googly Moogly, this isn't the CFL :D
Eagles with 5 field goals and Chiefs with a touchdown, an extra point and 2 safeties. You never know!
Or 35-21, 5 td's vs 3 td's....they're not bad numbers...the only tough one of the lot is the 2. My brother on the other hand got 7-7, the asshole.
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I predict a Super Bowl Scorigami of Eagles 25-Chiefs 18.
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Impressive first drive from Philly.
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I tend to not get too caught up in who is broadcasting a game, and I can't comment on how objectively their analysis is, but I like this team of Burkhardt and Olson.
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Olson is pretty good.
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I like Olson too. Philly will close it out if Mahomes is limping the whole 2nd half.
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Philly will close it out if Mahomes is limping the whole 2nd half.
I was thinking the same thing
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Honestly, any score that ends up Philly 4, Chefs 2 or Philly 5, Chefs 1, no matter who wins, is what I'm rooting for.
Great Googly Moogly, this isn't the CFL :D
Eagles with 5 field goals and Chiefs with a touchdown, an extra point and 2 safeties. You never know!
Or 35-21, 5 td's vs 3 td's....they're not bad numbers...the only tough one of the lot is the 2. My brother on the other hand got 7-7, the asshole.
I read the line as 'ends up 4-2 or 5-1' :facepalm: :lol
Often during the Ravens games, we'll pause the broadcast, and start watching about twenty minutes in, so that we can FF through the commercials and booth reviews. The wife insists on watching the SB commercials, which really suxx. :sad:
The lead FOX team is OK, but they remind me of all those 3rd tier groups who do all the 3rd rate games.
Is halftime over yet? zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
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Yeah, the halftime show is not being seen favorably by my majority metalhead social media community :lol
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Yeah, the halftime show is not being seen favorably by my majority metalhead social media community :lol
So I wasn't listening..I'm doing writeups for my roulette, but the production of the halftime show was incredible.
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Half time show was great, stage setup was fantastic.
Mahomes ankle has some miracle spray on it.
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Wow, that was one hell of a momentum swing.
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The receivers on the last two KC TDs have been wide open.
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We’ve got ourselves a ball game!!!!
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Horse shit call. NFL is a joke.
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Yea that was a total bs call
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I was shocked by that penalty as well. I can’t believe that one of the few penalties of the entire game was such a ticky tack thing and ended up altering the entire ending of the game.
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Awful end to this game.
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I was shocked by that penalty as well. I can’t believe that one of the few penalties of the entire game was such a ticky tack thing and ended up altering the entire ending of the game.
It’s easy to believe. The darling team was in dire need of some help.
What. A. Joke.
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That's certainly not the way to prove the NFL isn't scripted. What a ticky tacky call. I mean, technically it was probably a penalty with the little grab of the jersey. But that's not the place for that call.
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That's certainly not the way to prove the NFL isn't scripted. What a ticky tacky call. I mean, technically it was probably a penalty with the little grab of the jersey. But that's not the place for that call.
So they should just not call an obvious penalty because “it’s not the right time”? How about don’t commit a penalty in a crucial moment of the game? The Eagles were up by two scores and took their foot off the gas and blew it. Let’s not blame the refs for the Eagles failure.
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A little bit of a ticky tacky call to seal the deal, but overall a hell of a game.
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That's certainly not the way to prove the NFL isn't scripted. What a ticky tacky call. I mean, technically it was probably a penalty with the little grab of the jersey. But that's not the place for that call.
So they should just not call an obvious penalty because “it’s not the right time”? How about don’t commit a penalty in a crucial moment of the game? The Eagles were up by two scores and took their foot off the gas and blew it. Let’s not blame the refs for the Eagles failure.
Then call it all game. They weren’t. They were letting them play real football most of the game but when the league darlings were in danger of possibly shitting the bed there was a convenient call made.
They don’t even try to hide it any more. It was a shit call, period.
A little bit of a ticky tacky call to seal the deal, but overall a hell of a game.
A hell of a game that was stole from allowing thr players to determine the winner. Just gift wrapped for the darlings
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That's certainly not the way to prove the NFL isn't scripted. What a ticky tacky call. I mean, technically it was probably a penalty with the little grab of the jersey. But that's not the place for that call.
So they should just not call an obvious penalty because “it’s not the right time”? How about don’t commit a penalty in a crucial moment of the game? The Eagles were up by two scores and took their foot off the gas and blew it. Let’s not blame the refs for the Eagles failure.
Nothing the defender did altered the offensive players route. Guarantee worse things happened during the game that went uncalled.
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Who told Kelce that KC wasn't a contender for the sb :lol?
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A little bit of a ticky tacky call to seal the deal, but overall a hell of a game.
A hell of a game that was stole from allowing thr players to determine the winner. Just gift wrapped for the darlings
If the refs wanted to make an impact for KC they had much better opportunities (Goedert's big 3rd down catch, the second defensive TD that got overturned). It was a bad call, but KC were already in very good shape when they made it so I don't buy into the idea that the refs had an agenda at all.
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Ticky-tack call, yes, but I have seen teams with other star QBs get crap calls to help them win over the years as well (no names! :lol), so this is par for the course. And the Eagles got a little lucky with that Goedert "catch" in the 3rd that helped them get points, so neither team benefited all game by bad calls.
The bottom line is the Eagles couldn't stop the Chiefs offense in the second half.
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Also, Mahomes breaks the long streak of regular seasons MVPs losing in the Super Bowl. Kurt Warner in 1999 was the last QB to win the regular season MVP and then win the Super Bowl in the same season. I think it was 9 MVPs since actually made it to the Super Bowl and lost.
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Just the NFL continuing a twenty+ year tradition of incredibly offensive ineptness by referees! :tdwn :tdwn :tdwn :tdwn :tdwn
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A little bit of a ticky tacky call to seal the deal, but overall a hell of a game.
A hell of a game that was stole from allowing thr players to determine the winner. Just gift wrapped for the darlings
If the refs wanted to make an impact for KC they had much better opportunities (Goedert's big 3rd down catch, the second defensive TD that got overturned). It was a bad call, but KC were already in very good shape when they made it so I don't buy into the idea that the refs had an agenda at all.
KC kicks a field goal there no matter what, yes. But Philly would have had (what) like 1:40 or so with a timeout? They got that literally stolen from them.
I’m not a massive NFL fan and this is why. It’s not a real game……its entertainment that is way to easily manipulated. I’m not conspiratorial scripted games guy…..but it’s very simple to guide these games in any direction by crafted officiating.
That was a horrible call that didn’t allow the game to be settled in a competitive manner.
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The holding call was egregious, but the non-call on the Helmet-hit earlier in the drive was also baffling, even if it didn't ultimately impact the drive.
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I agree that the Chiefs were on their way to take the lead, just would have been a nice showdown allowing Philly to answer.
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Meanwhile every citizen in Philly is just hoping it’s not their house or business that burns to the ground tonight. That was happening win or lose.
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I agree that the Chiefs were on their way to take the lead, just would have been a nice showdown allowing Philly to answer.
The defender shouldn't have held the WR, then. I agree it was a ticky tack call, one that could be made 40 times a game, but he did hold him. Both teams had 50/50 calls go against them in this game.
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I’m not convinced. I saw the replay several times, and as was stated earlier, he did not impede the receivers route. And that is usually the standard by which this is called or not.
There’s and old saying in the NFL. “There’s ‘holding’ on EVERY play.” If the refs literally called every holding every time, the game would be 5 hours long and decided completely by penalties. So in the real world, it is usually only called if it is either incredibly blatant, or it actually had an obvious impact on the play (like if someone were actually impeded from running their route).
This was neither.
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I stopped watching Football in part because the ticky tack calls were too much. I see my reasoning was correct.
Embarrassing to call a penalty that stupid in such a huge moment.
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Eh, I see holding calls on the defense all the time that had nothing to do with the play. And trust me, I get frustrated with how so many rules make it impossible for defenses to do anything sometimes, and I am not one to defend NFL officiating most of the time, but I guess I was so jaded by the sequence in the 3rd quarter that saw a KC TD get taken off the board and then Philly get a drive extended (where they got 3) on a catch where it appeared the receiver did not get control with both feet down in bounds that I was in "KC was due to have an iffy call go their way" mode. And I am not a fan of the "just let them play at the end of the game" mentality. If it's a penalty with 8 minutes left in the 2nd quarter, it's a penalty with 2 minutes left in the game.
Also, KC went 3 and out on their 2nd drive of the game when Juju was held and turned on 3rd down and there was no call. That was a terrible non-call, so getting outraged about the call at the end and not recognizing that Philly was the beneficiary of some bad calls/non calls earlier in the game seems a bit...inconsistent. :D
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You could look at the overall reffing in the game a bunch of ways I'm sure. I thought it was basically fair.
Unlike you though, unless you tackle a receiver running his route, I don't think pass interference should ever be called at the end of the game. And even then the refs should at least think about it.
Even worse is that this is the first defensive holding they apparently called all game. What timing!
The refs let a lot of pro Philly calls go so you hate to call it rigged. But man.... feels scripted
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I think that's the issue most have, if you're not calling that same hold the rest of the game, defense doesn't expect to get it called at the end too. Either way it ruined what was setting up to be a fun end.
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Meanwhile every citizen in Philly is just hoping it’s not their house or business that burns to the ground tonight. That was happening win or lose.
(https://i.imgur.com/FXd5xJI.jpg)
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I think that's the issue most have, if you're not calling that same hold the rest of the game, defense doesn't expect to get it called at the end too. Either way it ruined what was setting up to be a fun end.
Thank god America didn't get to see a Jalen Hurts two minute drill the refs had to make sure to keep the game under control.
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The DB has come out and said “I held him. I was hoping the refs missed it.”
The Chiefs scored on every possession of the 2nd half. That’s why they won.
Kudos to Kev as usual for having the correct take (and he’s a fan of a Chiefs rival at that).
Jalen Hurts is awesome.
The 2 O-Lines lived up to their reputation.
Great game.
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Scripted would be not calling a penalty because it'd fuck up the drama going on at the end of the game. Seriously, "that was not the time to call a penalty" is a ridiculous thing to say.
Mahomes ankle has some miracle spray on it.
Or he was overplaying it at the end of the half.
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I never said “that was not the time to call a penalty”. I am however, insinuating that it was an odd time to throw the flag on what was…to me…a phantom foul, and I have given my precise reasons why I think so.
For the record, I was also rooting for a Chiefs win, and I even goaded a friend of mine who was an Eagles fan today. I walked up to him right after Bible meeting and said, “KC by 3”.
I almost feel bad for being that spot on. :lol
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Mahomes ankle has some miracle spray on it.
Or he was overplaying it at the end of the half.
Yup, I'd bet his doctors are going to say something along the lines of "glad you won, but man you fucked this thing up good"... Wonder how much further damage he did to it.
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You could look at the overall reffing in the game a bunch of ways I'm sure. I thought it was basically fair.
Unlike you though, unless you tackle a receiver running his route, I don't think pass interference should ever be called at the end of the game. And even then the refs should at least think about it.
Even worse is that this is the first defensive holding they apparently called all game. What timing!
The refs let a lot of pro Philly calls go so you hate to call it rigged. But man.... feels scripted
I believe a tin foil hat is being prepared for you as we speak.
Scripted would be not calling a penalty because it'd fuck up the drama going on at the end of the game. Seriously, "that was not the time to call a penalty" is a ridiculous thing to say.
Thank you! :tup :tup
I never said “that was not the time to call a penalty”. I am however, insinuating that it was an odd time to throw the flag on what was…to me…a phantom foul, and I have given my precise reasons why I think so.
But it wasn't a phantom foul. As Dream Team noted above, the DB admitted that he held and said he had hoped the officials wouldn't call it. Ticky tack? Yes? Still a hold? Yes.
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I’m not a massive NFL fan and this is why. It’s not a real game……its entertainment that is way to easily manipulated.
I'm with ya. I bailed on the NFL years ago when the definition of a catch became a moving target. It's kinda like a 'kicking motion' in the NHL these days.
I’m not conspiratorial scripted games guy…..
:spitcoffee: Good one :tup :tup Thanks for the early morning laugh
:biggrin: Luv ya dude.
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That's certainly not the way to prove the NFL isn't scripted. What a ticky tacky call. I mean, technically it was probably a penalty with the little grab of the jersey. But that's not the place for that call.
So they should just not call an obvious penalty because “it’s not the right time”? How about don’t commit a penalty in a crucial moment of the game? The Eagles were up by two scores and took their foot off the gas and blew it. Let’s not blame the refs for the Eagles failure.
I wouldn't call that an obvious penalty. I'd call it a play that was technically a penalty, but generally wouldn't get called. There are dozens of those types of non-calls every game. We would all be pulling our hair out if the refs called everything that was technically a penalty. I personally wasn't too upset about the call because I really didn't give a crap who won, but thought it was a little weak. I do agree with your general sentiment that the Eagles blew it and I think they almost certainly would have lost anyway without that penalty. If I were the Eagles or an Eagles fan, I would not be blaming my team's loss on a single mediocre call.
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Who told Kelce that KC wasn't a contender for the sb :lol?
Was that bullshit or what? That's when I turned it off. You can't have the "GOAT" and "underdog" narrative at the same time. I get the emotion of the moment and all (especially given that there's a real chance this is the last go-round of this iteration of the Chiefs) but while I sort of like Kelce (I'm a much bigger fan of his brother) I thought that was ThugLifeTM more than anything else.
Overall, that was a pretty decent WWF match. ;) :) ;) :). I kid; I think it was an inconsistent call, but it was the right call nonetheless. That wasn't what lost the game for the Eagles, though it did seal the deal. The Eagles defense didn't step up to the degree that the Chiefs defense did, and that was that in a nutshell. That game could well have been 28-7 at the half, not 24-14, and that was the difference right there. If Patrick Mahomes was half the man his lovers apologists supporters say he is, he would give that MVP trophy to Nick Bolton, who played out of his ass for 60 minutes. Mahomes played very well for that game (he's a great actor as well; ;)) but he wasn't even the best QB on the field that game, let alone "the GOAT").
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The holding penalty was crap. Yes, there was a small tug. It didn't look like anything egregious or outside of contact that happens on virtually every play. It even looked like it was inside 5 yards. The ball sailed way over the receivers head and it had no impact on the play.
It would be one thing if the Refs were calling this sort of thing all game-- would ruin any game but I digress. A small tug will happen every snap. They let them play the entire game and then all of a sudden gave KC a fresh set of downs at the end of the play on something that looked like routine contact and didn't throw the route or timing off. I think people are upset about the lack of consistency in the calls.
Now, this is the 2nd high stakes game in a row in which the Chiefs got suspect calls (particularly their offense) that gave them a reset on downs or a new play. It DOES feel scripted -- the script for the next 10 years being 'Mahomes chases Brady' -- given the last 2 games but I know it's likely not. Lack of consistency aside, the real issue causing these sorts of horrible calls imo is the trend over the last decade of shaping the rules to benefit the offense in order to drive up scoring and allegedly protect players.
It was a great game up until the crap holding call. Ultimately, the Eagles lost not because of that call but because their defense was poor in the 2H. I don't even care for either team but felt bad for Bradberry. He played a great game and has to live with that lousy call forever now.
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The defender held the guy got called for it, and admitted to it. Some of you are coming off as a little full of shit.
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The defender held the guy got called for it, and admitted to it. Some of you are coming off as a little full of shit.
Well, like I said, it was the right call, it was just inconsistent, and it wasn't what blew the game for the Eagles.
I think was bugs me more and more about these big games is the forced narratives that seem to surround all these games now. It's no longer 11-on-11 (or 22-on-22, or 55-on-55, however you want to count it). I tried to watch the pregame and got disgusted; went to play Skyrim until 6:30, then was going to play Skyrim at the half, but my wife wanted to watch Rihanna (who was AWESOME; I thought that was excellent, and kudos for a 34-year-old pregnant woman doing what I couldn't have done at any point in my life (I'm scared of heights)). I tried to watch the post-game and was disgusted, and DID go back to Skyrim. Why can't it just be football? Why does EVERYTHING have to be a social statement and a message?
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Ticky-tack call, yes, but I have seen teams with other star QBs get crap calls to help them win over the years as well (no names! :lol), so this is par for the course. And the Eagles got a little lucky with that Goedert "catch" in the 3rd that helped them get points, so neither team benefited all game by bad calls.
The bottom line is the Eagles couldn't stop the Chiefs offense in the second half.
This is the correct take. It's amazing how people complain. Especially rooting for a team that had so many "breaks" throughout the year walking in to Sunday.
I honestly think some people need to find a new hobby, or something. NFL is never "perfect". There are lots of factors - the field, the weather, the officiating, the health of players on both sides... If you're gonna accept the good, you have to also accept the bad. In this case, the teams were about equally matched, and the experience of the Chiefs players and staff allowed them to persevere and win the day.
I will give you all one thing, though. The whole "sore winners" trend needs to stop. Travis Kelce might be the most annoying man in sports. "No one believed we could do it?" Come on. Being a 1.5 point underdog does not give mean you should feel persecuted.
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To the people who say - "It was a penalty, so it should have been called" - If you consistently call those kinds of penalties, there would be a penalty on every play. The refs already have to make judgement calls on when to call and not call penalties. If we accept that the refs are doing that, then why is that particular place in the game the right time to call the penalty?
I will give you all one thing, though. The whole "sore winners" trend needs to stop. Travis Kelce might be the most annoying man in sports. "No one believed we could do it?" Come on. Being a 1.5 point underdog does not give mean you should feel persecuted.
Because this is how the players motivate themselves to want to win. Michael Jordan was notorious for constantly creating stories in his head about how he was disrespected, even though you won't find an athlete, even in his day, more universally acclaimed.
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To the people who say - "It was a penalty, so it should have been called" - If you consistently call those kinds of penalties, there would be a penalty on every play. The refs already have to make judgement calls on when to call and not call penalties. If we accept that the refs are doing that, then why is that particular place in the game the right time to call the penalty?
I will give you all one thing, though. The whole "sore winners" trend needs to stop. Travis Kelce might be the most annoying man in sports. "No one believed we could do it?" Come on. Being a 1.5 point underdog does not give mean you should feel persecuted.
Because this is how the players motivate themselves to want to win. Michael Jordan was notorious for constantly creating stories in his head about how he was disrespected, even though you won't find an athlete, even in his day, more universally acclaimed.
Correct. There are some things that happen on *almost* every play. Offensive holding is another example. Offensive pass interference is another thing that often happens but is rarely called. It's about egregiousness and consistency. The refs establish a baseline this and it was just a headscratcher last night and totally off in the AFC game.
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I'm just pissed KC didn't go for 6,that would've been 400 for me.
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I think it's bullshit to say "this happened every single play". Do we know that? Lots of people spent the night reviewing the full 22, it seems. Also, I'm failing to buy the idea that the refs shafted Philly. Just because we don't understand the full thought that went in to throwing a flag on an actual penalty there, doesn't mean that there was something nefarious behind it.
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But see how clever the NFL is!
The talk today should be about how awful the field was (how does a city have that much time to prepare for the Super Bowl and then end up with a field that bad??), but because of the penalty at the end of the game, no one is talking about. Genius. /tin foil hat
:P :P
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I think it's bullshit to say "this happened every single play". Do we know that? Lots of people spent the night reviewing the full 22, it seems. Also, I'm failing to buy the idea that the refs shafted Philly. Just because we don't understand the full thought that went in to throwing a flag on an actual penalty there, doesn't mean that there was something nefarious behind it.
I think it's one or both of the following:
- Refs have historically called superstars leniently for a number of reasons. Mahomes complained for a penalty and a late flag was thrown. Doesn't require there to be nefarious intent
- Stupidity. Refs train themselves to call games soft because the league wants scoring. A circuit fired at the wrong time to throw a first half flag in a fourth quarter situation
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But see how clever the NFL is!
The talk today should be about how awful the field was (how does a city have that much time to prepare for the Super Bowl and then end up with a field that bad??), but because of the penalty at the end of the game, no one is talking about. Genius. /tin foil hat
:P :P
This was going to be part of my write up :tup
Scott Van Pelt mentioned last night that the same problems existed years ago there for the NCAA title game between Auburn-Oregon (I didn't watch, so I can't confirm). I mean, they only had five weeks to prep it correctly.....
And then let whatever halftime show takes place make things worse
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I think it's bullshit to say "this happened every single play". Do we know that? Lots of people spent the night reviewing the full 22, it seems. Also, I'm failing to buy the idea that the refs shafted Philly. Just because we don't understand the full thought that went in to throwing a flag on an actual penalty there, doesn't mean that there was something nefarious behind it.
I mean, yes. If you watch football regularly you will see that there is holding (defensive and offensive) all the time. The offensive holdings are even more frequent and on virtually every play.
Again, it's a matter of egregiousness. There was one play last night in which the ball was thrown in the endzone and coverage was very tight. Might have been Bradberry in coverage again. There was contact so I guess technically one could have thrown a defensive PI flag. However, because the defender got his head around and was looking for the ball and the contact was deemed not material, there was no penalty. It's a matter of judgement because at a certain point, if you're going to be able to have an actual game, you cannot throw a penalty flag every time there is contact.
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I think it's bullshit to say "this happened every single play". Do we know that? Lots of people spent the night reviewing the full 22, it seems. Also, I'm failing to buy the idea that the refs shafted Philly. Just because we don't understand the full thought that went in to throwing a flag on an actual penalty there, doesn't mean that there was something nefarious behind it.
I mean, yes. If you watch football regularly you will see that there is holding (defensive and offensive) all the time. The offensive holdings are even more frequent and on virtually every play.
I watched 3-4 games per week, almost always, during the NFL season. And I have no idea what you are talking about. Also, what you are saying may be true about offensive holding, but that is not the same thing as defensive holding, especially in the redzone at a critical time.
What if the refs DON'T call that, Philly scores, and eventually then game goes the other way? Unlikely, given the Chiefs were strongly outplaying them by that time, but wow we're all watching reals about the blown missed call of flagrant defensive holding in the Red Zone on a critical play.
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Correct. There are some things that happen on *almost* every play. Offensive holding is another example. Offensive pass interference is another thing that often happens but is rarely called. It's about egregiousness and consistency. The refs establish a baseline this and it was just a headscratcher last night and totally off in the AFC game.
Mahommes little 25 yard run certainly had one or two of his O Line that with a firm grip on some jerseys that were most likely way more egregious than that love tap that was called on the Eagles. So the D Back admitted to a tug.....that happens on every play by every defender at the line and could be called on every play.
Folks like me aren't arguing that it wasn't a penalty.....the argument is up until that point the refs had largely let both teams play and what do you know.....it was a great game. But it was ruined by that call and just added to the fuel that feeds what a joke the NFL is.
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I think it's bullshit to say "this happened every single play". Do we know that? Lots of people spent the night reviewing the full 22, it seems. Also, I'm failing to buy the idea that the refs shafted Philly. Just because we don't understand the full thought that went in to throwing a flag on an actual penalty there, doesn't mean that there was something nefarious behind it.
I mean, yes. If you watch football regularly you will see that there is holding (defensive and offensive) all the time. The offensive holdings are even more frequent and on virtually every play.
I watched 3-4 games per week, almost always, during the NFL season. And I have no idea what you are talking about. Also, what you are saying may be true about offensive holding, but that is not the same thing as defensive holding, especially in the redzone at a critical time.
What if the refs DON'T call that, Philly scores, and eventually then game goes the other way? Unlikely, given the Chiefs were strongly outplaying them by that time, but wow we're all watching reals about the blown missed call of flagrant defensive holding in the Red Zone on a critical play.
A non-call was the correct one. It had no impact on the play and the ball went far enough ahead of him that a small tug didn't impair his ability to make a catch. It wasn't a "flagrant" holding. It was normal game contact. You even have some WRs coming out and saying it's not DH.
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I was hoping the Eagles would win - TJ Edwards grew up on my street and went to my kids' school. So it was fun to root for a local kid, and he had a great tackle on Mahomes (re-aggrivating the ankle in the process) and a lot of open-field tackles last night. He played great, but they just couldn't get it done.
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REap quite correctly says that the holding was a judgment call. These calls happen all the damn time. Yet the assumption is that when a judgment call goes a different way than what we approve of it's not an error in judgment but the NFL rigging the game. The problem with conspiracies is that people always tend to jump towards the feelgood answer rather than the most likely one. In this case the ref who was 10' away thought it was a legitimate holding penalty and threw the flag. It's really quite simple.
And for fuck's sake, if you really think that Roger Goodell is actually Vince McMahon pulling the strings and writing scripts for each season, QUIT WATCHING THE DAMN GAME! It's not for you.
Mahomes ankle has some miracle spray on it.
Or he was overplaying it at the end of the half.
Yup, I'd bet his doctors are going to say something along the lines of "glad you won, but man you fucked this thing up good"... Wonder how much further damage he did to it.
I was actually suggesting that maybe he wasn't hurt as badly as he made it out to be at the end of the half. There's no question that Phili played a different game in the second half than they did in the first.
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I guess we'll see what happens with Terry Bradshaw after he basically called Andy Reid fat on live TV after the game. I think Bradshaw is the NFL's version of Charles Barkley in that everyone knows he says offensive stuff and it is accepted because it is part of his brand, but that one might have been over the line, even for him. Plus, Bradshaw, in his old age, isn't as charismatic as Sir Charles, so he likely doesn't have as much rope as Barkley does.
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It sucks the game, which was a good game overall, ends with a penalty, but while a ticky tacky penalty it was, it was still a penalty.
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There's no question that Phili played a different game in the second half than they did in the first.
The KC coaching staff prepped/adjusted better. You could see it most obviously in that motion play the Chiefs ran where they ran the guy toward the line and had him cut back at the snap. They figured out the zone coverage the Eagles were running and found every hole possible.
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Yep, Andy Reid took the Eagles coaching staff to school in that second half. Look at KC's last two touchdowns. Both were inside the 10 and both went to receivers who were wide open in space to where they could have dropped to the ground and crawled into the end zone untouched. Great play design by Reid in both cases.
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Travis Kelce has said in previous interviews when everyone keeps asking him how he gets so open all the time, "It's all Andy Reid's doing"
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I guess we'll see what happens with Terry Bradshaw after he basically called Andy Reid fat on live TV after the game. I think Bradshaw is the NFL's version of Charles Barkley in that everyone knows he says offensive stuff and it is accepted because it is part of his brand, but that one might have been over the line, even for him. Plus, Bradshaw, in his old age, isn't as charismatic as Sir Charles, so he likely doesn't have as much rope as Barkley does.
I don't think Andy Reid was really bothered by it. They seemed to be having a good time. These are old ballplayers and coaches talking to each other. Also, Andy Reid doesn't drink, and has been open about his love of cheeseburgers.
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Let's ignore for the moment the tick-tackiness of that holding call. Here's my bigger beef:
Why does defensive holding result in an automatic first down which offensive holding is a 10 yard penalty? They should both just be a 10 yard penalty. Yes, I know in this particular situation it would have given the Chiefs a first down anyway since it was 3rd and 8, but that has always bugged me.
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I always felt these things happen with a higher frequency at the end of big games because the refs are more hyper-focused to make sure they get it right. In the middle of the season, in a blowout game, that hold would probably slide, but at the biggest moment the refs are on top of every detail.
Just speculating
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Let's ignore for the moment the tick-tackiness of that holding call. Here's my bigger beef:
Why does defensive holding result in an automatic first down which offensive holding is a 10 yard penalty? They should both just be a 10 yard penalty. Yes, I know in this particular situation it would have given the Chiefs a first down anyway since it was 3rd and 8, but that has always bugged me.
It used to be a 15 yard penalty from the spot of the foul for offensive holding. As was intentional grounding, plus loss of play. Talk about brutal!
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Let's ignore for the moment the tick-tackiness of that holding call. Here's my bigger beef:
Why does defensive holding result in an automatic first down which offensive holding is a 10 yard penalty? They should both just be a 10 yard penalty. Yes, I know in this particular situation it would have given the Chiefs a first down anyway since it was 3rd and 8, but that has always bugged me.
To increase the scoring because that is what drives views, ratings, and subsequent revenue (i.e., gambling).
You could end up with a situation in which the offense is 4th and 15, let's say. The defender has no incentive not to hold if he isn't in danger of giving up a fresh set of downs for the penalty. I could see wanting to avoid this. At the end of the day, it is a trade off as to which side of the ball you're going to give the edge to.
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Let's ignore for the moment the tick-tackiness of that holding call. Here's my bigger beef:
Why does defensive holding result in an automatic first down which offensive holding is a 10 yard penalty? They should both just be a 10 yard penalty. Yes, I know in this particular situation it would have given the Chiefs a first down anyway since it was 3rd and 8, but that has always bugged me.
To increase the scoring because that is what drives views, ratings, and subsequent revenue (i.e., gambling).
You could end up with a situation in which the offense is 4th and 15, let's say. The defender has no incentive not to hold if he isn't in danger of giving up a fresh set of downs for the penalty. I could see wanting to avoid this. At the end of the day, it is a trade off as to which side of the ball you're going to give the edge to.
I would not attribute this to juicing the score.
Because of YAC, a pass interference can change the drive and thus the game. Actual pass interference has to be punished harshly or, as you said, there would be no incentive not to do it.
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https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.espn.com%2Fnfl%2Fstory%2F_%2Fid%2F35649198%2Fhow-patrick-mahomes-chiefs-played-perfect-second-half-super-bowl-2023-nfl-win-jalen-hurts-eagles&data=05%7C01%7C%7C7d26a992e72d45edd74f08db0de6f46f%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638119057813277162%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=fHDzOksyn%2BKc3KhfkcXW0SITbKiPAFV%2FqZPrXiieCoQ%3D&reserved=0
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But see how clever the NFL is!
The talk today should be about how awful the field was (how does a city have that much time to prepare for the Super Bowl and then end up with a field that bad??), but because of the penalty at the end of the game, no one is talking about. Genius. /tin foil hat
:P :P
This was going to be part of my write up :tup
Scott Van Pelt mentioned last night that the same problems existed years ago there for the NCAA title game between Auburn-Oregon (I didn't watch, so I can't confirm). I mean, they only had five weeks to prep it correctly.....
And then let whatever halftime show takes place make things worse
Didn't Butker or someone actually get hurt early this season on that field? I know the Chiefs logged a complaint after their early season game there.
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Any favorite commercials?
I liked the Rock Star one ("Hi, my name is Ozwald.") and the Amazon dog crate one (that one hit close to home for me and my family). I thought the CaddyShack ones were lame-o.
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I thought "Premature Electrification" was hilarious. Kinda awful (go buy our gas guzzling pickup to own the libs and prove you're a man who can keep it up!), but gotta give them props. It was smart, and funny.
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This whole thing makes me think about the missed call a week or two ago where LeBron was clearly hit on the shooting arm by Tatum, but there was no call. In that case, it seemed like the refs had decided to simply not call a foul on the last play no matter what happened. People were super pissed that call was missed.
In last night's case, the ref made a call that wasn't quite as clear but it wasn't like an egregiously blown call (I think it was correct based on the rule book? Someone correct me if I'm wrong...) but people were pissed because they didn't want the refs deciding the game.
I'm not here to defend bad referring (because there's a lot of it) but it does seem like an incredibly difficult balance to strike between "make sure to call the super obvious penalties but don't call non-obvious penalties even if they are technically penalties". Perhaps adding more replay would help but that only slows down the game and people don't even agree with the replay decisions half the time. :lol
I thought "Premature Electrification" was hilarious. Kinda awful (go buy our gas guzzling pickup to own the libs and prove you're a man who can keep it up!), but gotta give them props. It was smart, and funny.
That commercial was just amazing. And that's coming from someone who is pretty liberal. I just about died laughing. :rollin
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Any favorite commercials?
I liked the Rock Star one ("Hi, my name is Ozwald.") and the Amazon dog crate one (that one hit close to home for me and my family). I thought the CaddyShack ones were lame-o.
Paul Stanley being in the Rock Star one didn't sway your choice in any way, did it? ;) :lol Yeah, that was good. :tup
Alicia Silverstone's 'Clueless' recreation for Rakuten (whatever that is) was well done.
The 'Farmer's Dog' commercial: Iames did one similarly well done and tear jerking years ago with a little girl and puppy, the girl ages to a college student with long hair, and the Golden Retriever semi struggles up steps and has noticeably turned gray in the face. Our eight year old cocker is showing those same signs :'(
Pop Corners: bring back Bryan Cranston and Aaron Paul for a 'Breaking Bad' reunion, add Tuco to the mix, and .... nothing else came close. :tup
I thought "Premature Electrification" was hilarious. Kinda awful (go buy our gas guzzling pickup to own the libs and prove you're a man who can keep it up!), but gotta give them props. It was smart, and funny.
Oh, yeah, that was clever as all hell. (we miss Jason Jones and his 'Daily Show' segments). But...it was about their future electric truck, and how it will be so much better than what is currently available.
The 'Scrubs' pair (who we love) with Travolta for T-Mobile was cringe worthy. Man, he needs to grow back his hair and get rid of the beard. :tdwn
The rest....I would leave the room and fix food, take out the trash, or read segments of a great book by Lonn Friend called 'Life On The Planet Rock'
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I must say, another year where I am unimpressed with the commercials. It's become way too much of having the most celebrities and not enough creativity. I don't think a single commercial made me laugh. Some were, of course, better than others. I actually somehow didn't see the rock star commercial so maybe that would have interested me. The Ben Affleck working the drive through was probably my favorite.
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I don't like Kiss and I loved the rockstar commercial. I've thought the same thing myself hearing it thrown around at work, so they totally read my mind and stole my idea.
Also, I liked seeing The Undertaker for 5 seconds (draft kings commercial).
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I thought the Pepsi ads with Steve Martin and Ben Stiller were great.
The Breaking Bad one was probably my favorite.
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I thought "Premature Electrification" was hilarious. Kinda awful (go buy our gas guzzling pickup to own the libs and prove you're a man who can keep it up!), but gotta give them props. It was smart, and funny.
I forgot that one; you're right. The cute girl at the end: "Start and stop. Start and stop. Start. Stop." was priceless.
For the record, I didn't take even one IOTA of "libs/politics" from that commercial. Maybe a LITTLE bit of the wussy Prius perception of electric cars. To me, it was more of a dig at the perception of the majority of Americans that it's untested, incomplete technology.
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Paul Stanley being in the Rock Star one didn't sway your choice in any way, did it? ;) :lol Yeah, that was good. :tup
Of course it did; but it was really Ozzy that kicked it over the top (big fan of Joan Jett and Gary Clark, Jr., too).
Pop Corners: bring back Bryan Cranston and Aaron Paul for a 'Breaking Bad' reunion, add Tuco to the mix, and .... nothing else came close. :tup
Another good one I forgot. "Six flavors!" "MAKE SEVEN!"
The 'Scrubs' pair (who we love) with Travolta for T-Mobile was cringe worthy. Man, he needs to grow back his hair and get rid of the beard. :tdwn
I'm the opposite; I love Travolta, and like his look (he can't hit the high notes, though) but I think Zack Braff is ANNOYING AF and I'm not a fan of the bromance with Donald Faison. I like Donald, but Braff is so annoying he makes both annoying.
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The Sarah McLachlan one for Busch Light when the dude tells her to be quiet and says 'that's a Wolf' was pretty good.
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Just a couple quick points about this game before too many false narratives run wild. First of all, Pat was almost perfect in this game - a QBR of 96.4 which may or may not be the highest in Super Bowl history. He had virtually no negative plays, no sacks or interceptions, and the only thing that kept the Chiefs from scoring 50 is that he never had the ball in the first half. They declined a TD at the end of the game and missed an easy FG, so that's another 7 points for 45 total against the #1 Defense.
Secondly, I'm begging Patriot and Brady fans to stop pissing and moaning about the defensive holding - it's the EXACT SAME call that gave Brady and the Bucs the NFC Championship 2 years ago. Remember? Against the Packers, calling nothing all game and then calling Kevin King for the hold that iced the game.
For this post-season during which he played a grand total of 1 healthy quarter, Pat completed 72% with 7 TDs and 0 picks.
It may sound crazy, but if you look at advanced stats the Chiefs significantly outplayed the Eagles. Hurts had way more negative plays counting fumbles and sacks and was way worse than Pat in the red zone, and their run game had way more negative plays:
https://www.footballoutsiders.com/quick-reads/2023/super-bowl-lvii-dvoaquick-reads
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I guess we'll see what happens with Terry Bradshaw after he basically called Andy Reid fat on live TV after the game. I think Bradshaw is the NFL's version of Charles Barkley in that everyone knows he says offensive stuff and it is accepted because it is part of his brand, but that one might have been over the line, even for him. Plus, Bradshaw, in his old age, isn't as charismatic as Sir Charles, so he likely doesn't have as much rope as Barkley does.
I don't think Andy Reid was really bothered by it. They seemed to be having a good time. These are old ballplayers and coaches talking to each other. Also, Andy Reid doesn't drink, and has been open about his love of cheeseburgers.
Agreed.
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Mahomes played very well for that game (he's a great actor as well; ;)) but he wasn't even the best QB on the field that game, let alone "the GOAT").
I missed this earlier, but you disappoint me, sir. Even after a game like that, you're still basically doing the "yeah but" with Mahomes? :facepalm: :facepalm:
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Mahomes was most definitely the best QB on the field.
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Half time show was great, stage setup was fantastic.
Missed this when you first posted it.....man.....I disagree wholeheartedly. Extremely boring.....zero choreography unless you consider mildly jumping up and down and shaking each leg back and forth for 20 minutes choreographed? No delineation between when a song ended and new one started.....just one long....boring ride. No guest performers.....no twists or turns....just droning boringness.
The stages were cool but the performers had nothing to do but stand there. Neat idea but bad execution.
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Half time show was great, stage setup was fantastic.
Missed this when you first posted it.....man.....I disagree wholeheartedly. Extremely boring.....zero choreography unless you consider mildly jumping up and down and shaking each leg back and forth for 20 minutes choreographed? No delineation between when a song ended and new one started.....just one long....boring ride. No guest performers.....no twists or turns....just droning boringness.
The stages were cool but the performers had nothing to do but stand there. Neat idea but bad execution.
Zero choreography??WUT?
My biggest issue with it was that it went on forever.
I also didn't listen to the music.
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Half time show was great, stage setup was fantastic.
Missed this when you first posted it.....man.....I disagree wholeheartedly. Extremely boring.....zero choreography unless you consider mildly jumping up and down and shaking each leg back and forth for 20 minutes choreographed? No delineation between when a song ended and new one started.....just one long....boring ride. No guest performers.....no twists or turns....just droning boringness.
The stages were cool but the performers had nothing to do but stand there. Neat idea but bad execution.
Zero choreography??WUT?
My biggest issue with it was that it went on forever.
I also didn't listen to the music.
I found it a little creepy, to be honest. Maybe it was because I had it muted, but it seemed more than a little dystopian to me.
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Half time show was great, stage setup was fantastic.
Missed this when you first posted it.....man.....I disagree wholeheartedly. Extremely boring.....zero choreography unless you consider mildly jumping up and down and shaking each leg back and forth for 20 minutes choreographed? No delineation between when a song ended and new one started.....just one long....boring ride. No guest performers.....no twists or turns....just droning boringness.
The stages were cool but the performers had nothing to do but stand there. Neat idea but bad execution.
Zero choreography??WUT?
My biggest issue with it was that it went on forever.
I also didn't listen to the music.
As far as actually dancing yeah.....all that happened was some swaying and continual jumping and some leg shimmy's. Wasn't a whole lot going on there at all.
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That music in the halftime show is generally not my thing, so I thought it was pretty meh, but my 17-year old nephew, whom I watched the game with along with my dad and older brother, thought it wasn't that good either, and he thinks Rihanna is hot and likes some of her songs, so take that for what it is worth.
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I was just amazed at the energy and the synching of the dancers.
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I actually got around to watching a bit of the halftime show late last night, and it was the overproduced pop extravaganza I had expected, nothing about it surprised nor entertained me, with the exception of the moving stages which were very cool.
Mind you, this is a personal taste thing, she's basically the biggest artist in the world, so I'm sure I'm in the minority on this one. (not here, but in general)_
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I actually got around to watching a bit of the halftime show late last night, and it was the overproduced pop extravaganza I had expected, nothing about it surprised nor entertained me, with the exception of the moving stages which were very cool.
Mind you, this is a personal taste thing, she's basically the biggest artist in the world, so I'm sure I'm in the minority on this one. (not here, but in general)_
I am pretty sure that is Lizzo.
(this is a joke, so no one freak out)
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I didn't care much for the halftime show myself. I understand, musically, it's not aimed for someone like myself so I get that. I just felt like there was nothing unique about that show to draw me in. I thought some of the camera angles and lighting made for some cool shots including of the dancers, but that's really about the presentation of the show, not the show itself that I found enjoyable. Also, I believe she was lip synced, but still, she didn't even sound great. The people I watched with (my gf's family) weren't totally impressed either. But then I go on twitter and everyone's saying it was great. I don't know, I feel like last year was significantly better.
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Mahomes played very well for that game (he's a great actor as well; ;)) but he wasn't even the best QB on the field that game, let alone "the GOAT").
I missed this earlier, but you disappoint me, sir. Even after a game like that, you're still basically doing the "yeah but" with Mahomes? :facepalm: :facepalm:
This. At this point I don’t know what Mahomes has to do for Stads to accept his greatness.
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Keep winning rings throughout a 20+ year career?
I won't speak for Stadler, and I don't know as we're even on the same side of this. For my part I do think he's great, and I think he's one of the greats. I just don't think he's quite earned the standing he's got right now. I'm not ready to put him on the Rushmore yet, even if he may well get there someday. If he is the legend that people make him out to be he'll get there eventually anyway.
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Mahomes played very well for that game (he's a great actor as well; ;)) but he wasn't even the best QB on the field that game, let alone "the GOAT").
I'm curious how you justify this. Number of completions: Hurts (27-21). Completion percentage: Mahomes (77.78% - 71.05%. Yards: Hurts (304-182). Touchdown passes: Mahomes (3-1). Completely unforced fumbles that resulted in the Eagles having a 10-point halftime lead when it should have been 20-24 points: Hurts (1-0).
Any talk of "GOAT" is even sillier than the folks who still think Montana is the "GOAT" solely because he was undefeated in Super Bowls. The most valuable players yesterday were the Chiefs' offensive and defensive lineman. Mahomes didn't play well, but with no standout individual performance, the winning team's QB wins by default (see, e.g., Manning, Eli).
The Sarah McLachlan one for Busch Light when the dude tells her to be quiet and says 'that's a Wolf' was pretty good.
I wasn't paying attention to that one when it aired and just now watched it. That's friggin' hilarious. "Wrong shelter, Sarah. . . . Also, that's a wolf." :lol
I'm begging Patriot and Brady fans to stop pissing and moaning about the defensive holding
Well...good thing I'm a Broncos fan. That was a fucking awful call. The game was well-officiated to that point, and for whichever official dropped the flag to take it upon himself to end the game for something so ticky tacky was utterly unacceptable.
it's the EXACT SAME call that gave Brady and the Bucs the NFC Championship 2 years ago. Remember?
Nope. Don't remember at all. Nor do I give the tiniest little fuck. Why do people continue to insist that, just because something worse or the same happened in the past, it's ok now?
It may sound crazy....
The reality is that the Eagles outplayed the Chiefs in the first half. But for Hurts's fumble, the halftime lead probably would have been more than 20. However, the Chiefs figured it out big time and more than outplayed the Eagles in the second half. In particular, the Chiefs offensive line had its way with the Eagles pass rush - and Hassan Reddick in particular was a total non-factor.
Half time show was great, stage setup was fantastic.
Missed this when you first posted it.....man.....I disagree wholeheartedly. Extremely boring.
I put the TV on mute when halftime started, and my son and I went into the kitchen to finish up the ribeyes we had bought. I sat down right as they were kicking off the ball for the third quarter. Perfect timing. Last time I saw ANY portion of a halftime show was Katy Perry and her sharks for Owl #49.
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I put something else on during the halftime performance. I don't usually enjoy them so I thought I'd not give myself something to complain about.
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Mahomes is the future. He's the best QB of his era and might beat Brady's record someday. If he can stay healthy.
I wonder if he runs less because he can be injured with tackling. If not, he's on his way.
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And KC is coming back down to earth, BTW.
Worst take ever. :lol
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And KC is coming back down to earth, BTW.
Worst take ever. :lol
For that day. :lol
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:lol
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To be fair, I think most thought the Chiefs would pull back to the pack. They had lost Tyreek Hill and had turned over a lot of their roster, but a lot of the rookies played well and Mahomes proved that he can kick ass no matter who his RBs and WRs are. It's notable that not a single RB or WR who played for the Chiefs last night played in the Super Bowl against the 49ers three years ago. This just adds to the legend of Mahomes. He lost his All-Pro future Hall of Fame WR and still went on to win the regular season MVP and win the Super Bowl. It's scary how good he is.
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That was a fucking awful call. The game was well-officiated to that point, and for whichever official dropped the flag to take it upon himself to end the game for something so ticky tacky was utterly unacceptable.
To be fair, the game was well-PLAYED to that point. There weren't a ton of penalties, dumb or otherwise, committed in this game, which is one reason the game was so good.
But THAT guy committed a penalty, and got called for it.
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Mahomes played very well for that game (he's a great actor as well; ;)) but he wasn't even the best QB on the field that game, let alone "the GOAT").
I missed this earlier, but you disappoint me, sir. Even after a game like that, you're still basically doing the "yeah but" with Mahomes? :facepalm: :facepalm:
There are enough people fawning over St. Patrick, he doesn't need me. He played a solid, MVP-worthy game (see what PG said). I don't have to participate in the bone-numbing hyperbole to give him his props. It takes nothing away from Mahomes to say what I did. Hurts was a bigger part of his offense than Mahomes was of his, which is why I said what I said (and am not backing off it). PG conveniently left off the three rushing TDs (most for a QB in a Superbowl, tied for most for a player), as well as the 4th down conversions.
I'm at a complete loss. I can't for the LIFE of me understand why simply saying he's a great player isn't enough.
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Keep winning rings throughout a 20+ year career?
I won't speak for Stadler, and I don't know as we're even on the same side of this. For my part I do think he's great, and I think he's one of the greats. I just don't think he's quite earned the standing he's got right now. I'm not ready to put him on the Rushmore yet, even if he may well get there someday. If he is the legend that people make him out to be he'll get there eventually anyway.
This is exactly my position. He IS great. For some people, though, that's just not enough, and I'm not playing that hyperbole game.
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It seems clear to me that he's the best player right now, and his accomplishments to this point rank him AMONG the best starts to a career of all time. If his trajectory continues this way, he will wind up in the discussion for GOAT, which is basically just a matter of opinion anyway.
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It seems clear to me that he's the best player right now, and his accomplishments to this point rank him AMONG the best starts to a career of all time. If his trajectory continues this way, he will wind up in the discussion for GOAT, which is basically just a matter of opinion anyway.
Perfect. Tell that to Dream Team, who's already measured out and bought the yellow coat.
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It seems clear to me that he's the best player right now, and his accomplishments to this point rank him AMONG the best starts to a career of all time. If his trajectory continues this way, he will wind up in the discussion for GOAT, which is basically just a matter of opinion anyway.
Perfect. Tell that to Dream Team, who's already measured out and bought the yellow coat.
I have.
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Speaking of yellow coats, it was cool seeing the reactions of HOF inductees getting informed they made it by current HOF members.
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Mahomes played very well for that game (he's a great actor as well; ;)) but he wasn't even the best QB on the field that game, let alone "the GOAT").
I missed this earlier, but you disappoint me, sir. Even after a game like that, you're still basically doing the "yeah but" with Mahomes? :facepalm: :facepalm:
There are enough people fawning over St. Patrick, he doesn't need me. He played a solid, MVP-worthy game (see what PG said). I don't have to participate in the bone-numbing hyperbole to give him his props. It takes nothing away from Mahomes to say what I did. Hurts was a bigger part of his offense than Mahomes was of his, which is why I said what I said (and am not backing off it). PG conveniently left off the three rushing TDs (most for a QB in a Superbowl, tied for most for a player), as well as the 4th down conversions.
I'm at a complete loss. I can't for the LIFE of me understand why simply saying he's a great player isn't enough.
The thing is this: Mahomes was perfect. Hurts was far from it. Hurts had a catastrophic fumble that was scooped up for a touchdown. He also threw several balls that could have easily been picked. Switch which team the QBs are on, and you have the Eagles winning by double digits.
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It seems clear to me that he's the best player right now, and his accomplishments to this point rank him AMONG the best starts to a career of all time. If his trajectory continues this way, he will wind up in the discussion for GOAT, which is basically just a matter of opinion anyway.
This. Incredible player BUT the longevity has to be there and the 'eye test' says it will but you have to just wait and see. That is/was my beef with folks throwing around all the praise and accolades to MLB players like Machado, Tatis Jr, Soto......sure, they've had a good couple seasons here and there but that's it. IF they're around in a decade and have stayed consistent in producing in that manner THEN they'd be worthy of the incessant amount of praise they receive.
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On Mahomes, I think a players needs 10+ years in the league before you can start measuring him against the all-time greats. He is on a trajectory to be amongst the top 5 QBS of all time, but it's too soon to crown him since he's only been in the league, for what, 5 years? Even if he falls back to earth and puts up only average numbers for the next 7-10 years before retiring, just winning 2 Super Bowls puts him in a rare group of top QBs
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It seems clear to me that he's the best player right now, and his accomplishments to this point rank him AMONG the best starts to a career of all time. If his trajectory continues this way, he will wind up in the discussion for GOAT, which is basically just a matter of opinion anyway.
This. Incredible player BUT the longevity has to be there and the 'eye test' says it will but you have to just wait and see. That is/was my beef with folks throwing around all the praise and accolades to MLB players like Machado, Tatis Jr, Soto......sure, they've had a good couple seasons here and there but that's it. IF they're around in a decade and have stayed consistent in producing in that manner THEN they'd be worthy of the incessant amount of praise they receive.
I'm calling it. Skeever at the Dream Theater forum says Mahomes is a top 10 QB of all time. Right now. No "if" or "when" involved.
QBs who are definitely ahead of him:
-Peyton Manning
-Aaron Rodgers
-Tom Brady
-Drew Brees
-Joe Montana
Everyone else - and I don't care if they've got double the passing yards or 20 years in the league - is highly, highly debatable.
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It seems clear to me that he's the best player right now, and his accomplishments to this point rank him AMONG the best starts to a career of all time. If his trajectory continues this way, he will wind up in the discussion for GOAT, which is basically just a matter of opinion anyway.
This. Incredible player BUT the longevity has to be there and the 'eye test' says it will but you have to just wait and see. That is/was my beef with folks throwing around all the praise and accolades to MLB players like Machado, Tatis Jr, Soto......sure, they've had a good couple seasons here and there but that's it. IF they're around in a decade and have stayed consistent in producing in that manner THEN they'd be worthy of the incessant amount of praise they receive.
I'm calling it. Skeever at the Dream Theater forum says Mahomes is a top 10 QB of all time. Right now. No "if" or "when" involved.
QBs who are definitely ahead of him:
-Peyton Manning
-Aaron Rodgers
-Tom Brady
-Drew Brees
-Joe Montana
Everyone else - and I don't care if they've got double the passing yards or 20 years in the league - is highly, highly debatable.
Johnny Unitas and John Elway should be in that list as well. Possibly Dan Marino and Brett Favre, too.
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Mahomes played very well for that game (he's a great actor as well; ;)) but he wasn't even the best QB on the field that game, let alone "the GOAT").
I missed this earlier, but you disappoint me, sir. Even after a game like that, you're still basically doing the "yeah but" with Mahomes? :facepalm: :facepalm:
There are enough people fawning over St. Patrick, he doesn't need me. He played a solid, MVP-worthy game (see what PG said). I don't have to participate in the bone-numbing hyperbole to give him his props. It takes nothing away from Mahomes to say what I did. Hurts was a bigger part of his offense than Mahomes was of his, which is why I said what I said (and am not backing off it). PG conveniently left off the three rushing TDs (most for a QB in a Superbowl, tied for most for a player), as well as the 4th down conversions.
I'm at a complete loss. I can't for the LIFE of me understand why simply saying he's a great player isn't enough.
The thing is this: Mahomes was perfect. Hurts was far from it. Hurts had a catastrophic fumble that was scooped up for a touchdown. He also threw several balls that could have easily been picked. Switch which team the QBs are on, and you have the Eagles winning by double digits.
I absolutely do not agree with that. Kelce being wide open by five yards does not make Mahomes the greatest of all time. Kadarious Toney and Skye Moore not being within 20 yards of ANY defender, let alone one covering them specifically, doesn't make Mahomes the greatest of all time.
None of that is to take anything away from Mahomes; he's great. He's not the GREATEST, nor was he "perfect".
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It seems clear to me that he's the best player right now, and his accomplishments to this point rank him AMONG the best starts to a career of all time. If his trajectory continues this way, he will wind up in the discussion for GOAT, which is basically just a matter of opinion anyway.
This. Incredible player BUT the longevity has to be there and the 'eye test' says it will but you have to just wait and see. That is/was my beef with folks throwing around all the praise and accolades to MLB players like Machado, Tatis Jr, Soto......sure, they've had a good couple seasons here and there but that's it. IF they're around in a decade and have stayed consistent in producing in that manner THEN they'd be worthy of the incessant amount of praise they receive.
I'm calling it. Skeever at the Dream Theater forum says Mahomes is a top 10 QB of all time. Right now. No "if" or "when" involved.
QBs who are definitely ahead of him:
-Peyton Manning
-Aaron Rodgers
-Tom Brady
-Drew Brees
-Joe Montana
Everyone else - and I don't care if they've got double the passing yards or 20 years in the league - is highly, highly debatable.
Johnny Unitas and John Elway should be in that list as well. Possibly Dan Marino and Brett Favre, too.
Mahomes is not above Johnny Golden Arm yet. I think he's on par with Elway. He's better than both Marino and Favre, at least with the stats that are on the table right now.
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Otto Graham won 5 titles in his first 5 years. Just throwing that out there.
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The talk of Mahomes as a GOAT already is just part of the typical hype that drives sports every year. No doubt he is the face of the new generation of QBs and he is off to an unprecedented start in his career when you pair his numbers with the SB wins. I personally don't believe SB wins is the best measure of individual performance but I am obviously way outnumbered.
However, by any measure, right now he isn't the GOAT or amongst the GOATs because he just hasn't played long enough to rack up the numbers to fairly decide the question. Time will tell but there is just so much hype to drive narrative in sports. It's just not sexy or tantalizing to say 'let's wait and see'. Now we are talking about Mahomes chasing Brady despite the fact that Brady played for decades, has more MVPs nearly all the big all-time stats and 6 rings. Will it surprise me if Mahomes has 6 SB rings when it's all said and done? No, because this is an amazing trajectory he appears to be on. But will it surprise me if he starts suffering injuries that impact his performance, or if at some point as he ages he can no longer scramble like he once did and doesn't do as well as a mostly pocket passer? No. We have seen that story time and time again (though, we've only seen the 6 ring story once). Football can be an unpredictable sport but sooner or later, almost everyone gets hurt.
I think his pairing with Andy Reid is special and it *could* one day look like Brady + Belicheck. We'll see in 10 years.
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Otto Graham won 5 titles in his first 5 years. Just throwing that out there.
Also this.
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And out of nowhere everybody suddenly agrees with Stadler re Mahomes. :lol
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Mahomes has a solid start towards being in the GOAT conversation, but he needs some time behind him to be seriously considered. If he has a career ending injury in the pre-season, we'll only talk of his potential career that went away.
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The talk of Mahomes as a GOAT already is just part of the typical hype that drives sports every year. No doubt he is the face of the new generation of QBs and he is off to an unprecedented start in his career when you pair his numbers with the SB wins. I personally don't believe SB wins is the best measure of individual performance but I am obviously way outnumbered.
However, by any measure, right now he isn't the GOAT or amongst the GOATs because he just hasn't played long enough to rack up the numbers to fairly decide the question. Time will tell but there is just so much hype to drive narrative in sports. It's just not sexy or tantalizing to say 'let's wait and see'. Now we are talking about Mahomes chasing Brady despite the fact that Brady played for decades, has more MVPs nearly all the big all-time stats and 6 rings. Will it surprise me if Mahomes has 6 SB rings when it's all said and done? No, because this is an amazing trajectory he appears to be on. But will it surprise me if he starts suffering injuries that impact his performance, or if at some point as he ages he can no longer scramble like he once did and doesn't do as well as a mostly pocket passer? No. We have seen that story time and time again (though, we've only seen the 6 ring story once). Football can be an unpredictable sport but sooner or later, almost everyone gets hurt.
I think his pairing with Andy Reid is special and it *could* one day look like Brady + Belicheck. We'll see in 10 years.
Forget Mahomes for a second; Andy Reid doesn't coach for ten more years, IMO. He's already hinted at "making a decision" this off-season.
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It seems clear to me that he's the best player right now, and his accomplishments to this point rank him AMONG the best starts to a career of all time. If his trajectory continues this way, he will wind up in the discussion for GOAT, which is basically just a matter of opinion anyway.
Perfect. Tell that to Dream Team, who's already measured out and bought the yellow coat.
I have.
Yep. If Mahomes retired today, he'd already be a Hall of Famer (and justifiably so). Longevity is not always needed when you are this good in a shorter window. Kurt Warner made the Hall and he was really only very good/great for 4-5 years.
I absolutely do not agree with that. Kelce being wide open by five yards does not make Mahomes the greatest of all time. Kadarious Toney and Skye Moore not being within 20 yards of ANY defender, let alone one covering them specifically, doesn't make Mahomes the greatest of all time.
None of that is to take anything away from Mahomes; he's great. He's not the GREATEST, nor was he "perfect".
Now, wait a minute. How often have we (the general "we" :lol) given Brady love over the years for finding the open guy who catches a 2-yard pass and takes it 30 yards? But when Mahomes does it, it is suddenly an issue?
Mahomes has a solid start towards being in the GOAT conversation, but he needs some time behind him to be seriously considered. If he has a career ending injury in the pre-season, we'll only talk of his potential career that went away.
I disagree. It is worth repeating: he is now one of only three QBs to EVER win two regular season MVP awards AND two Super Bowl MVP awards. The other two are Tom Brady and Joe Montana. He is a legend already, regardless of how his next 10-15 years play out.
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It seems clear to me that he's the best player right now, and his accomplishments to this point rank him AMONG the best starts to a career of all time. If his trajectory continues this way, he will wind up in the discussion for GOAT, which is basically just a matter of opinion anyway.
Perfect. Tell that to Dream Team, who's already measured out and bought the yellow coat.
I have.
Yep. If Mahomes retired today, he'd already be a Hall of Famer (and justifiably so). Longevity is not always needed when you are this good in a shorter window. Kurt Warner made the Hall and he was really only very good/great for 4-5 years.
I absolutely do not agree with that. Kelce being wide open by five yards does not make Mahomes the greatest of all time. Kadarious Toney and Skye Moore not being within 20 yards of ANY defender, let alone one covering them specifically, doesn't make Mahomes the greatest of all time.
None of that is to take anything away from Mahomes; he's great. He's not the GREATEST, nor was he "perfect".
Now, wait a minute. How often have we (the general "we" :lol) given Brady love over the years for finding the open guy who catches a 2-yard pass and takes it 30 yards? But when Mahomes does it, it is suddenly an issue?
Mahomes has a solid start towards being in the GOAT conversation, but he needs some time behind him to be seriously considered. If he has a career ending injury in the pre-season, we'll only talk of his potential career that went away.
I disagree. It is worth repeating: he is now one of only three QBs to EVER win two regular season MVP awards AND two Super Bowl MVP awards. The other two are Tom Brady and Joe Montana. He is a legend already, regardless of how his next 10-15 years play out.
He’s also the first player to win both league MVP and Super Bowl MVP in the same season since Kurt Warner in 1999.
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The talk of Mahomes as a GOAT already is just part of the typical hype that drives sports every year. No doubt he is the face of the new generation of QBs and he is off to an unprecedented start in his career when you pair his numbers with the SB wins. I personally don't believe SB wins is the best measure of individual performance but I am obviously way outnumbered.
However, by any measure, right now he isn't the GOAT or amongst the GOATs because he just hasn't played long enough to rack up the numbers to fairly decide the question. Time will tell but there is just so much hype to drive narrative in sports. It's just not sexy or tantalizing to say 'let's wait and see'. Now we are talking about Mahomes chasing Brady despite the fact that Brady played for decades, has more MVPs nearly all the big all-time stats and 6 rings. Will it surprise me if Mahomes has 6 SB rings when it's all said and done? No, because this is an amazing trajectory he appears to be on. But will it surprise me if he starts suffering injuries that impact his performance, or if at some point as he ages he can no longer scramble like he once did and doesn't do as well as a mostly pocket passer? No. We have seen that story time and time again (though, we've only seen the 6 ring story once). Football can be an unpredictable sport but sooner or later, almost everyone gets hurt.
I think his pairing with Andy Reid is special and it *could* one day look like Brady + Belicheck. We'll see in 10 years.
Forget Mahomes for a second; Andy Reid doesn't coach for ten more years, IMO. He's already hinted at "making a decision" this off-season.
I didn't know that but if Reid goes away that could seriously affect Mahomes' trajectory. Reid is considered by many an offensive genius. Many years he made the playoffs with mediocre quarterbacks (also made a SB) but never got over the finish line. Now he has a good QB and he is winning superbowls. It's another big part of the GOAT equation we'll just need to see and wait on.
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It seems clear to me that he's the best player right now, and his accomplishments to this point rank him AMONG the best starts to a career of all time. If his trajectory continues this way, he will wind up in the discussion for GOAT, which is basically just a matter of opinion anyway.
Perfect. Tell that to Dream Team, who's already measured out and bought the yellow coat.
I have.
Yep. If Mahomes retired today, he'd already be a Hall of Famer (and justifiably so). Longevity is not always needed when you are this good in a shorter window. Kurt Warner made the Hall and he was really only very good/great for 4-5 years.
Kurt Warner might be in my top three of favorite players of all time (I just think he's quality guy, a class act) but he's not the greatest quarterback to ever play the game. And when he went into the Hall, the knock was, he didn't do it long enough or in enough iterations. I won't dispute Mahomes gets into the Hall right now. But it's the same debate as Warner (re: longevity).
Now, wait a minute. How often have we (the general "we" :lol) given Brady love over the years for finding the open guy who catches a 2-yard pass and takes it 30 yards? But when Mahomes does it, it is suddenly an issue?
Nope, not from me. That's not what made Brady great, or the greatest. We're talking a very specific criteria here.
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The talk of Mahomes as a GOAT already is just part of the typical hype that drives sports every year. No doubt he is the face of the new generation of QBs and he is off to an unprecedented start in his career when you pair his numbers with the SB wins. I personally don't believe SB wins is the best measure of individual performance but I am obviously way outnumbered.
However, by any measure, right now he isn't the GOAT or amongst the GOATs because he just hasn't played long enough to rack up the numbers to fairly decide the question. Time will tell but there is just so much hype to drive narrative in sports. It's just not sexy or tantalizing to say 'let's wait and see'. Now we are talking about Mahomes chasing Brady despite the fact that Brady played for decades, has more MVPs nearly all the big all-time stats and 6 rings. Will it surprise me if Mahomes has 6 SB rings when it's all said and done? No, because this is an amazing trajectory he appears to be on. But will it surprise me if he starts suffering injuries that impact his performance, or if at some point as he ages he can no longer scramble like he once did and doesn't do as well as a mostly pocket passer? No. We have seen that story time and time again (though, we've only seen the 6 ring story once). Football can be an unpredictable sport but sooner or later, almost everyone gets hurt.
I think his pairing with Andy Reid is special and it *could* one day look like Brady + Belicheck. We'll see in 10 years.
Forget Mahomes for a second; Andy Reid doesn't coach for ten more years, IMO. He's already hinted at "making a decision" this off-season.
I didn't know that but if Reid goes away that could seriously affect Mahomes' trajectory. Reid is considered by many an offensive genius. Many years he made the playoffs with mediocre quarterbacks (also made a SB) but never got over the finish line. Now he has a good QB and he is winning superbowls. It's another big part of the GOAT equation we'll just need to see and wait on.
Including the Super Bowl three of the last four years. ;)
I'M KIDDING, FFS. Lighten up, all you Francis's.
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Kurt Warner might be in my top three of favorite players of all time (I just think he's quality guy, a class act) but he's not the greatest quarterback to ever play the game. And when he went into the Hall, the knock was, he didn't do it long enough or in enough iterations. I won't dispute Mahomes gets into the Hall right now. But it's the same debate as Warner (re: longevity).
I own two NFL jerseys. One is a Broncos Terrell Davis jersey (late 90s uni). The other is a Rams Kurt Warner jersey from the GSOT years. :tup :tup
(how I never bought an Elway jersey or a Peyton one once he became a Bronco is a total mystery)
Now, wait a minute. How often have we (the general "we" :lol) given Brady love over the years for finding the open guy who catches a 2-yard pass and takes it 30 yards? But when Mahomes does it, it is suddenly an issue?
Nope, not from me. That's not what made Brady great, or the greatest. We're talking a very specific criteria here.
Right, but throwing to wide open receivers is not what makes Mahomes great either. Kelce is obviously one of the top 3 receiving TEs ever (along with Gonzo and Gronk; no need to split hairs putting them in order), but look at his WRs this past season. Pretty bleak crew overall, on par with the misfits Brady was throwing to in NE before Moss came to town.
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The talk of Mahomes as a GOAT already is just part of the typical hype that drives sports every year. No doubt he is the face of the new generation of QBs and he is off to an unprecedented start in his career when you pair his numbers with the SB wins. I personally don't believe SB wins is the best measure of individual performance but I am obviously way outnumbered.
However, by any measure, right now he isn't the GOAT or amongst the GOATs because he just hasn't played long enough to rack up the numbers to fairly decide the question. Time will tell but there is just so much hype to drive narrative in sports. It's just not sexy or tantalizing to say 'let's wait and see'. Now we are talking about Mahomes chasing Brady despite the fact that Brady played for decades, has more MVPs nearly all the big all-time stats and 6 rings. Will it surprise me if Mahomes has 6 SB rings when it's all said and done? No, because this is an amazing trajectory he appears to be on. But will it surprise me if he starts suffering injuries that impact his performance, or if at some point as he ages he can no longer scramble like he once did and doesn't do as well as a mostly pocket passer? No. We have seen that story time and time again (though, we've only seen the 6 ring story once). Football can be an unpredictable sport but sooner or later, almost everyone gets hurt.
I think his pairing with Andy Reid is special and it *could* one day look like Brady + Belicheck. We'll see in 10 years.
Forget Mahomes for a second; Andy Reid doesn't coach for ten more years, IMO. He's already hinted at "making a decision" this off-season.
I didn't know that but if Reid goes away that could seriously affect Mahomes' trajectory. Reid is considered by many an offensive genius. Many years he made the playoffs with mediocre quarterbacks (also made a SB) but never got over the finish line. Now he has a good QB and he is winning superbowls. It's another big part of the GOAT equation we'll just need to see and wait on.
Including the Super Bowl three of the last four years. ;)
I'M KIDDING, FFS. Lighten up, all you Francis's.
lol. I am not AS skeptical on Mahomes' greatness but I do think the hype around him is a little bit much at present. He is an amazing athlete but in terms of pure QB play, I don't see him as in the top 3. Part of that is maybe the position has changed so much in the last decade, but it is hard for me to ignore that every time I see him complete a pass, he either makes some crazy athletic play OR his receivers are wide open.
The numbers are really impressive but it's impossible to compare apples-to-apples to the prior generation when the game was indisputably played much differently. We'll all have clearer perspective in a few years time.
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Top 3 all time? Top 3 of this generation?
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Now, wait a minute. How often have we (the general "we" :lol) given Brady love over the years for finding the open guy who catches a 2-yard pass and takes it 30 yards? But when Mahomes does it, it is suddenly an issue?
Nope, not from me. That's not what made Brady great, or the greatest. We're talking a very specific criteria here.
Right, but throwing to wide open receivers is not what makes Mahomes great either. Kelce is obviously one of the top 3 receiving TEs ever (along with Gonzo and Gronk; no need to split hairs putting them in order), but look at his WRs this past season. Pretty bleak crew overall, on par with the misfits Brady was throwing to in NE before Moss came to town.
No, it's not. And that's my point. Several of the things that made Brady (and Manning, for that matter, since I think Manning is historically ranked higher than Mahomes) the greatest Mahomes hasn't encountered or shown yet.
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Top 3 all time? Top 3 of this generation?
Sorry, I meant I do not see him as top 3 all time yet. He is easily the best QB of his generation (a young generation, granted) right now.
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Top 3 all time? Top 3 of this generation?
All time, no, not yet. It all depends on how it plays out from here, but I think he is comfortably in the top 10 already. If he drops off a bit like Favre did after Holmgren left GB, he likely finishes in that 6-10 range where Favre is, but if he can keep this up, the sky is the limit.
Now, wait a minute. How often have we (the general "we" :lol) given Brady love over the years for finding the open guy who catches a 2-yard pass and takes it 30 yards? But when Mahomes does it, it is suddenly an issue?
Nope, not from me. That's not what made Brady great, or the greatest. We're talking a very specific criteria here.
Right, but throwing to wide open receivers is not what makes Mahomes great either. Kelce is obviously one of the top 3 receiving TEs ever (along with Gonzo and Gronk; no need to split hairs putting them in order), but look at his WRs this past season. Pretty bleak crew overall, on par with the misfits Brady was throwing to in NE before Moss came to town.
No, it's not. And that's my point. Several of the things that made Brady (and Manning, for that matter, since I think Manning is historically ranked higher than Mahomes) the greatest Mahomes hasn't encountered or shown yet.
Agreed on Manning. For me, Brady, Manning and Montana are a firm top 3 right now, and it will take a lot for someone to penetrate that barrier and knock one of them down to 4th.
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I should add that it's extremely hard to compare apples-to-apples QBs playing right now to those who played 20, 30, 40 years ago. The rules have changed so much to benefit the offense that we are just in a different era of football-- one in which the first generation includes Mahomes.
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Top 3 all time? Top 3 of this generation?
Sorry, I meant I do not see him as top 3 all time yet. He is easily the best QB of his generation (a young generation, granted) right now.
Agreed. He's on a hell of a pace though. He just needs longevity now.
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Top 3 all time? Top 3 of this generation?
Sorry, I meant I do not see him as top 3 all time yet. He is easily the best QB of his generation (a young generation, granted) right now.
Agreed. He's on a hell of a pace though. He just needs longevity now.
Le this.
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Just saw an article that said Donna Kelce brought her two sons Tupperware containers of home baked cookies before the game :laugh:
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Just saw an article that said Donna Kelce brought her two sons Tupperware containers of home baked cookies before the game :laugh:
Wasn't there a shot of Jason Kelce eating something like a cookie or bar on the sideline during the first half?
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Just saw an article that said Donna Kelce brought her two sons Tupperware containers of home baked cookies before the game :laugh:
That's the most wholesome thing I've read all week. :)
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Just saw an article that said Donna Kelce brought her two sons Tupperware containers of home baked cookies before the game :laugh:
Wasn't there a shot of Jason Kelce eating something like a cookie or bar on the sideline during the first half?
No clue.. Didn't watch the game live.
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Even if I was totally non-partisan, I think it's factually hard to argue with what some of the talking heads are pointing out.
Patrick Mahomes just completed the greatest season by a QB in the NFL ever:
Led the league in passing yards
Led the league in TD passes
Led the league in QBR and all advanced stats
Set an NFL record for total yards from scrimmage
Won the regular season MVP
Helmed the #1 offense in the NFL
Led his team to the #1 seed
Was great in the playoffs despite 1 fully healthy quarter
Posted a 96.4 QBR in the Super Bowl against the #1 defense
Won the Super Bowl
Won the Super Bowl MVP
Had a 4th quarter lead in all 20 games he played
Did this in a "rebuild/retool" year after losing his #1 all-pro receiver, with 3 new receivers and a ton of rookies on defense
All-time greats like Brady and Peyton also accomplished all of the above of course, just not in the same season.
He has yet to hit his prime. I think the Chiefs will be better next year with all these rookies having a full season under their belt. I rooted for Big Ben for 17 years despite his flaws but now I get to root for a guy with no character issues and who's a better leader and teammate. I'll ride with him no matter what.
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Even if I was totally non-partisan, I think it's factually hard to argue with what some of the talking heads are pointing out.
Patrick Mahomes just completed the greatest season by a QB in the NFL ever:
Led the league in passing yards
Led the league in TD passes
Led the league in QBR and all advanced stats
Set an NFL record for total yards from scrimmage
Won the regular season MVP
Helmed the #1 offense in the NFL
Led his team to the #1 seed
Was great in the playoffs despite 1 fully healthy quarter
Posted a 96.4 QBR in the Super Bowl against the #1 defense
Won the Super Bowl
Won the Super Bowl MVP
Had a 4th quarter lead in all 20 games he played
Did this in a "rebuild/retool" year after losing his #1 all-pro receiver, with 3 new receivers and a ton of rookies on defense
All-time greats like Brady and Peyton also accomplished all of the above of course, just not in the same season.
He has yet to hit his prime. I think the Chiefs will be better next year with all these rookies having a full season under their belt. I rooted for Big Ben for 17 years despite his flaws but now I get to root for a guy with no character issues and who's a better leader and teammate. I'll ride with him no matter what.
Except, many of those are not "facts", nor are they "objective". Was he really "great"? Is that a stat? How many do I need to have before I'm great? ;)
This list (https://athlonsports.com/nfl/10-greatest-quarterback-seasons-nfl-history), which contemplates his current season, doesn't put that one on the list (but does put 2018 in, at number six, behind at least Brady and Manning (as well as Young, Marino and Montana). Good thing you're not totally non-partisan! :) :) :)
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I thought about Marino in my list, but ultimately he was too caught up in his own statline to have the kind of year/game that Mahomes had on Sunday. And I easily take Mahomes of Favre.
As far as Unitas goes, hell if I know.
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Marino probably wouldn't make my Top 10 list.
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Just saw an article that said Donna Kelce brought her two sons Tupperware containers of home baked cookies before the game :laugh:
This was a few days before the game, there's video too ;)
https://youtu.be/ZPqc-aOGWCo?t=68 (https://youtu.be/ZPqc-aOGWCo?t=68)
(https://media-cldnry.s-nbcnews.com/image/upload/t_social_share_1200x630_center,f_auto,q_auto:best/rockcms/2023-02/donna-kelce-homemade-cookies-super-bowl-zz-230207-03f477.jpg)
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Marino probably wouldn't make my Top 10 list.
Honestly, Marino doesn't make any of my lists (I'm not a fan), either, but I'm trying to be as flexible as I can for different QBs in different scenarios.
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Marino probably wouldn't make my Top 10 list.
Honestly, Marino doesn't make any of my lists (I'm not a fan), either, but I'm trying to be as flexible as I can for different QBs in different scenarios.
Yeah. When he retired, he held a lot of career records, mostly as a result of just playing forever. If not for that and that one season where he hit 5,000 yards and 48 TDs, I'm not sure he would be talked about hardly at all.
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Yep, jewelry is definitely a pre-requisite for being in the discussion
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Marino probably wouldn't make my Top 10 list.
Honestly, Marino doesn't make any of my lists (I'm not a fan), either, but I'm trying to be as flexible as I can for different QBs in different scenarios.
Yeah. When he retired, he held a lot of career records, mostly as a result of just playing forever. If not for that and that one season where he hit 5,000 yards and 48 TDs, I'm not sure he would be talked about hardly at all.
This was a huge milestone in 1984, unlike today. And he has a number of extremely impressive accolades and stats to back up his legacy as in the top 10. I think even if he never threw for 5K yards, we would very much talk about him. He is one of the best quarterbacks ever. When you put his stats into the time period during which he played, they're exceptional. It wasn't just that he stuck around forever.
Obviously no ring hurts the legacy. I view that as somewhat unfair because winning Super Bowls is such a complex puzzle with dozens of pieces/factors -- not just one, even though everyone is obsessed by quarterbacks -- but alas it is what it is. There are many great individual players who are GOATs but never were on a SB winning team. He is one of them.
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I mean, I guess. I was watching football when he was playing. He was, almost every season, one of the guys who was considered upper tier, but he was rarely considered "the best in the game".
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I mean, I guess. I was watching football when he was playing. He was, almost every season, one of the guys who was considered upper tier, but he was rarely considered "the best in the game".
Who were considered top 3 at the time?
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I mean, I guess. I was watching football when he was playing. He was, almost every season, one of the guys who was considered upper tier, but he was rarely considered "the best in the game".
Who were considered top 3 at the time?
I'm having trouble remembering who even played at the time. :lol
I mean he played for so damn long, you'd have to go by decades.
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I mean, I guess. I was watching football when he was playing. He was, almost every season, one of the guys who was considered upper tier, but he was rarely considered "the best in the game".
Who were considered top 3 at the time?
I'm having trouble remembering who even played at the time. :lol
I mean he played for so damn long, you'd have to go by decades.
Elway, Montana. Those are the first two off the top of my head. Pretty sure Marino was considered one of the best while he was playing.
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I mean, I guess. I was watching football when he was playing. He was, almost every season, one of the guys who was considered upper tier, but he was rarely considered "the best in the game".
Who were considered top 3 at the time?
I'm having trouble remembering who even played at the time. :lol
I mean he played for so damn long, you'd have to go by decades.
There was significant overlap with Montana, who some players still consider the GOAT. When you compare the two, Marino's numbers dwarf Montana's or even Young's, who has more overlap. He did not play much longer than those two and they all played in the same era.
Had he played better and won just one more game in his super bowl year, we would be talking about a top 3-5 QB.
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I mean, I guess. I was watching football when he was playing. He was, almost every season, one of the guys who was considered upper tier, but he was rarely considered "the best in the game".
Who were considered top 3 at the time?
Which year?
He led the league in passing several years early in his career, but only won MVP once. He played at roughly the same time as players like John Elway, Joe Montana, Steve Young, Brett Favre, Dan Fouts, Warren Moon, Jim Kelly, Boomer Esiason, Warren Moon, Randall Cunningham, Troy Aikman, and even Peyton Manning (at the end of his career). He was definitely well respected, but I don't remember very many single seasons where he was thought of as one of the 2 or 3 very best in the game for that season. I mean, it happened occasionally, especially early in his career, but not for most of it.
To my memory, at least.
There was significant overlap with Montana, who some players still consider the GOAT. When you compare the two, Marino's numbers dwarf Montana's or even Young's, who has more overlap. He did not play much longer than those two and they all played in the same era.
Numbers aren't everything. He threw it all the damned time. The 49ers offense was much more balanced. Neither Montana nor Young threw as often as Marino.
Had he played better and won just one more game in his super bowl year, we would be talking about a top 3-5 QB.
Maybe. It would have helped also if he had ever sniffed getting to the Super Bowl again.
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If my research is correct..
Marino
1983 (rookie season)..2nd team all pro (Theisman #1)
1984..1st team all pro
1985...1st team all pro
1986...1st team all pro
1987...Montana/Kosar/Lomax
1988...3rd Team all pro (Boomer/Everett)
1989...Montana/Boomer/Everett
1990...Cunningham/Montana/Kelly
1991...Kelly/Rypien
1992...2nd team all pro (Young)
1993...Young/Elway/Aikman
1994...2nd team all pro (Young)
1995...3rd team all pro (Young/Harbaugh)
1996...Farve/Bledsoe/Young
Dan Marino was easily one of the best of his era.
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Marino is tough, because he put up crazy passing numbers for his era, but I don't give him the "he could have won a Super Bowl if he had had a running game" excuse because he didn't want one! He wanted to throw, throw, throw, and even in his last few years, he still resisted, which is why he butted heads with Jimmy Johnson, who knew they needed to run it more. Contrast that to Elway, who had no issue in throwing less once Terrell Davis emerged and ran it down the throat of everyone.
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Marino is tough, because he put up crazy passing numbers for his era, but I don't give him the "he could have won a Super Bowl if he had had a running game" excuse because he didn't want one! He wanted to throw, throw, throw, and even in his last few years, he still resisted, which is why he butted heads with Jimmy Johnson, who knew they needed to run it more. Contrast that to Elway, who had no issue in throwing less once Terrell Davis emerged and ran it down the throat of everyone.
Seems Elway is the golden boy and Marino is the villian.
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I mean, I guess. I was watching football when he was playing. He was, almost every season, one of the guys who was considered upper tier, but he was rarely considered "the best in the game".
Who were considered top 3 at the time?
At the height of Marino's career (i.e., mid- to late '80s and a bit into the '90s), Montana, Elway and Marino.
Keep in mind that Marino's career lasted from 1983-99, which is only one year longer than Elway's, so Elway is probably the best comparison for a whole career (especially since, like the Dolphins, the Broncos didn't have much of a running game for most of Elway's career). Elway didn't have the raw numbers, but he was considered more clutch. He led the Broncos to 5 Super Bowls, the first three of which the Broncos lost, and the last two of which (in his last two seasons) they won (and he was named MVP of SB33, which was his last game ever). By contrast, Marino led the Dolphins to one SB, in his second season, which they lost. The Dolphins were in the playoffs most of Marino's seasons, but they never returned to the Super Bowl and only played in one more AFCCG.
Here's one list of best QBs of the '80s ( https://sportsnaut.com/ranking-the-best-nfl-quarterbacks-of-the-1980s/ ). Once you get past Montana, Marino and Elway, it's a bunch of guys who were solid (e.g., Dave Krieg and Randall Cunningham) and guys whose best years were in the '70s or '90s but also played in '80s (e.g., Dan Fouts and Warren Moon). I'm pretty sure if you look up a bunch of similar lists, Montana will be almost universally the #1 guy, Elway will be top 3, and Marino will be no worse than top 5.
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Marino is tough, because he put up crazy passing numbers for his era, but I don't give him the "he could have won a Super Bowl if he had had a running game" excuse because he didn't want one! He wanted to throw, throw, throw, and even in his last few years, he still resisted, which is why he butted heads with Jimmy Johnson, who knew they needed to run it more. Contrast that to Elway, who had no issue in throwing less once Terrell Davis emerged and ran it down the throat of everyone.
Seems Elway is the golden boy and Marino is the villian.
It felt like as the 90s moved along that Marino was generally considered better than Elway, until Elway won those two rings at the end of his career, and then seemingly everyone changed their mind. Marino's constant quick playoff exits did not help his cause, that's for sure, and like pg1067 said, while he had to wear the "he had gotten blown out in three Super Bowls" badge, Elway still had more of the clutch label due to his many deep playoff runs.
Back then, however, not every great QB won a Super Bowl. When Marino retired, he was one of a few from his era that didn't get one (Fouts, Moon, Kelly). Nowadays, thanks to the change in rules that have made the QB even more important than he was before, pretty much every great QB wins one at some point or another. Think of every great QB from the last 20 years, ones were consistently great, not ones who had one great season (like Ryan or Cam). Pretty much all of them won at least one ring, except for Rivers, and even many wouldn't give Rivers the "great" tag. Hey, Bill! :biggrin: :biggrin:
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I'm not here to tell anyone that Marino was better than Elway, but I will say that Marino gets dismissed a tad too easily, that's all. He was one of the top QBs of his era, rings or no rings.
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I'm not here to tell anyone that Marino was better than Elway, but I will say that Marino gets dismissed a tad too easily, that's all. He was one of the top QBs of his era, rings or no rings.
I agree, but it just shows how obsessed everyone is now with rings. Marino never got one, so he gets dismissed. But no one can tell me with a straight face that Marino was better than Bradshaw, Aikman or Eli. Sorry, but no.
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Marino is tough, because he put up crazy passing numbers for his era, but I don't give him the "he could have won a Super Bowl if he had had a running game" excuse because he didn't want one! He wanted to throw, throw, throw, and even in his last few years, he still resisted, which is why he butted heads with Jimmy Johnson, who knew they needed to run it more. Contrast that to Elway, who had no issue in throwing less once Terrell Davis emerged and ran it down the throat of everyone.
Seems Elway is the golden boy and Marino is the villian.
It felt like as the 90s moved along that Marino was generally considered better than Elway,
I don't remember it being that way - then again, I was a massive fanboy for Denver and Elway, and didn't care much for Marino/Dolphins. I seem to recall that Elway held the record (at one point - I'm sure someone/Brady has broken it by now) for the most 4th quarter comebacks? I seem to recall that Denver was almost always a contender from the late-80s to late-90s, and don't remember Miami that way - likely due to the dominance of the Bills during most of the 90s.
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They have an almost identical regular season record.
Marino 147-93
Elway 148-82-1
Playoffs were a different story.
Marino 8-10
Elway 14-7
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I mean, I guess. I was watching football when he was playing. He was, almost every season, one of the guys who was considered upper tier, but he was rarely considered "the best in the game".
Who were considered top 3 at the time?
I'm having trouble remembering who even played at the time. :lol
I mean he played for so damn long, you'd have to go by decades.
Elway, Montana. Those are the first two off the top of my head. Pretty sure Marino was considered one of the best while he was playing.
So.... I was a senior in high school in 1984, and I was ABSOLUTELY watching football at that time. Remember, the question was Who were considered top three AT THE TIME. This makes my Mahomes point almost perfectly:
Montana
McMahon
And one of:
Marino
Theismann
Moon
Esiason was there, but a rookie; what was he going to do? Simms and Elway, IMO, were guys with talent who won games, but their place in the cosmos was yet to be determined. They were the sort of guys that again, had promise but it hadn't really paid off. Not Josh Allen's necessarily, but maybe Derek Carr? Russell Wilson now? I don't know.
Until Theismann got hurt, he was a sort of Brady/Brees guy in the sense that he didn't do any one thing spectacularly, but he found ways to beat you consistently. Moon was the guy that had these insane numbers... in the CFL. Could he translate? At that point, to quote St. Elmo's Fire, "we don't know".
Fouts and Danny White were on the downside of the mountain in terms of their careers and weren't any longer a being judged by their "promise" but by their production, which was very very good, but not elite.
At that point, before he started to really get hurt, and before he got out of the cuckoon that was the Bears, Jim McMahon was a ROCK STAR. He was the guy. Everyone thought this guy was going to be the format for QBs moving forward. Young, tough, aggressive, multi-tooled... and then his body fell apart spectacularly. He won two SBs (one with Chicago and one with Green Bay as a backup) but he was a shooting star.
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Marino is tough, because he put up crazy passing numbers for his era, but I don't give him the "he could have won a Super Bowl if he had had a running game" excuse because he didn't want one! He wanted to throw, throw, throw, and even in his last few years, he still resisted, which is why he butted heads with Jimmy Johnson, who knew they needed to run it more. Contrast that to Elway, who had no issue in throwing less once Terrell Davis emerged and ran it down the throat of everyone.
Seems Elway is the golden boy and Marino is the villian.
That's the narrative now, but AT THE TIME, Elway hadn't fully established his bona fides. Elway was Jim Kelly/Fran Tarkenton then (I meant that in terms of stature, but he was actually a lot like Tarkenton in style and performance too). Neither of those two guys come up in ANY of these conversations these days, because they never could close the deal on the big game and that was the knock on Elway. Even "The Drive!" was sort of with a silent asterisk as it was against the Browns, and it was "Byner's Fumble" that many remember. Wha, wha.
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Seems Elway is the golden boy and Marino is the villian.
That's the narrative now,
Yes, that's what I was saying.
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I'm not here to tell anyone that Marino was better than Elway, but I will say that Marino gets dismissed a tad too easily, that's all. He was one of the top QBs of his era, rings or no rings.
I agree, but it just shows how obsessed everyone is now with rings. Marino never got one, so he gets dismissed. But no one can tell me with a straight face that Marino was better than Bradshaw, Aikman or Eli. Sorry, but no.
"Was" or "wasn't"? I think Bradshaw was a better QB than Marino, at least in terms of who I would want under center on my team. I might even take Aikman, as well.
My lasting impressions of Marino are the same as Rivers: late in the game, down by three with three minutes left in a 38-35 game, and Marino/Rivers red in the face yelling at his receivers or backs for not doing whatever, and the effort falling flat. Controversial statement that I'm going to get flack for, but some players know how to win and some don't. Some of those have talent, and some don't. Marino had talent up the wazoo, but didn't know how to win. He couldn't put himself to the side to do what it took to get there. He only knew what he knew, and that wasn't the secret sauce at that time (or ever, really). Yeah, it might take a complicated set of variables to win the SB, but one of those IS the QB.
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I'm not here to tell anyone that Marino was better than Elway, but I will say that Marino gets dismissed a tad too easily, that's all. He was one of the top QBs of his era, rings or no rings.
I agree, but it just shows how obsessed everyone is now with rings. Marino never got one, so he gets dismissed. But no one can tell me with a straight face that Marino was better than Bradshaw, Aikman or Eli. Sorry, but no.
"Was" or "wasn't"? I think Bradshaw was a better QB than Marino, at least in terms of who I would want under center on my team. I might even take Aikman, as well.
My lasting impressions of Marino are the same as Rivers: late in the game, down by three with three minutes left in a 38-35 game, and Marino/Rivers red in the face yelling at his receivers or backs for not doing whatever, and the effort falling flat. Controversial statement that I'm going to get flack for, but some players know how to win and some don't. Some of those have talent, and some don't. Marino had talent up the wazoo, but didn't know how to win. He couldn't put himself to the side to do what it took to get there. He only knew what he knew, and that wasn't the secret sauce at that time (or ever, really). Yeah, it might take a complicated set of variables to win the SB, but one of those IS the QB.
That's all totally fair Stads.
Oh, and I'm a big Aikman fan.
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Oh, and Stads, your morning coffee needs to produce an instrumental, and not just football talk. ;D
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Marino is tough, because he put up crazy passing numbers for his era, but I don't give him the "he could have won a Super Bowl if he had had a running game" excuse because he didn't want one! He wanted to throw, throw, throw, and even in his last few years, he still resisted, which is why he butted heads with Jimmy Johnson, who knew they needed to run it more. Contrast that to Elway, who had no issue in throwing less once Terrell Davis emerged and ran it down the throat of everyone.
Seems Elway is the golden boy and Marino is the villian.
It felt like as the 90s moved along that Marino was generally considered better than Elway,
I don't remember it being that way - then again, I was a massive fanboy for Denver and Elway, and didn't care much for Marino/Dolphins. I seem to recall that Elway held the record (at one point - I'm sure someone/Brady has broken it by now) for the most 4th quarter comebacks? I seem to recall that Denver was almost always a contender from the late-80s to late-90s, and don't remember Miami that way - likely due to the dominance of the Bills during most of the 90s.
Depends who you ask (https://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/comebacks_career.htm); Dream Team will tell you it's Patrick Mahomes, because of some complicated percentage-based analysis gamed to shoe-horn him into history before the games are played*. It is, in fact, Brady, with 46. Elway is ninth, with 31. Marino is eighth with 33.
The top three:
Brady: 46
Manning: 43
Roethlisberger: 41
*. Mahomes is actually way down at number 90 on the list (yes, 90), with 13.
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Oh, and Stads, your morning coffee needs to produce an instrumental, and not just football talk. ;D
And a scene for that other thread too. My god, the demands on my time.
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I wonder what Mahomes vs Brady first half stats look like. Perhaps Mahomes comes out ready to play and Brady doesn't?
I feel like Mahomes has brought the Chiefs from behind more than 13 times, but maybe it's a 3rd quarter comeback.
I think there are things like key drives and all that, but 4th quarter comebacks is a stat that doesn't mean much to me.
Oh, and Stads, your morning coffee needs to produce an instrumental, and not just football talk. ;D
And a scene for that other thread too. My god, the demands on my time.
Me first me first. I'm leaving for the hospital in two hours.
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My lasting impressions of Marino are the same as Rivers:
I think that's a good comparison.
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My lasting impressions of Marino are the same as Rivers:
I think that's a good comparison.
Except Marino was better, but I understand the point.
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My lasting impressions of Marino are the same as Rivers:
I think that's a good comparison.
Except Marino was better, but I understand the point.
I don't know that he was better.
They were both the best of the non-champions of their era. They are pretty equivalent to me. Does Marino making the SB once and losing make him better than Rivers, who never made it at all? I don't know. I don't think so.
But this is the kind of thing that is ruled by opinions.
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I'm not here to tell anyone that Marino was better than Elway, but I will say that Marino gets dismissed a tad too easily, that's all. He was one of the top QBs of his era, rings or no rings.
I agree, but it just shows how obsessed everyone is now with rings. Marino never got one, so he gets dismissed. But no one can tell me with a straight face that Marino was better than Bradshaw, Aikman or Eli. Sorry, but no.
"Was" or "wasn't"? I think Bradshaw was a better QB than Marino, at least in terms of who I would want under center on my team. I might even take Aikman, as well.
My lasting impressions of Marino are the same as Rivers: late in the game, down by three with three minutes left in a 38-35 game, and Marino/Rivers red in the face yelling at his receivers or backs for not doing whatever, and the effort falling flat. Controversial statement that I'm going to get flack for, but some players know how to win and some don't. Some of those have talent, and some don't. Marino had talent up the wazoo, but didn't know how to win. He couldn't put himself to the side to do what it took to get there. He only knew what he knew, and that wasn't the secret sauce at that time (or ever, really). Yeah, it might take a complicated set of variables to win the SB, but one of those IS the QB.
Wasn't. I was still half asleep when I typed that (and actually had it right the first time and then changed it in my haze :lol).
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So I can see purely looking at rings as being a narrow stat. I don't agree, but I see it. But as you move down from that pinnacle, it gets harder and harder to see. At SOME LEVEL what you do has to translate into wins, otherwise why are you doing it? Can a QB who throws for 5,000 yards and 50 TD but goes 4-12 (or however many games there are these days) be considered "great"? Aren't we just trading one arbitrary metric for another at that point? Yeah, Marino did get there one year, but he had arguably the second greatest coach of all time, and two Hall of Fame receivers; we can't put all the blame on the defense here. Same with Rivers, who I think only reached ONE championship game if memory serves.
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So I can see purely looking at rings as being a narrow stat. I don't agree, but I see it. But as you move down from that pinnacle, it gets harder and harder to see. At SOME LEVEL what you do has to translate into wins, otherwise why are you doing it? Can a QB who throws for 5,000 yards and 50 TD but goes 4-12 (or however many games there are these days) be considered "great"? Aren't we just trading one arbitrary metric for another at that point? Yeah, Marino did get there one year, but he had arguably the second greatest coach of all time, and two Hall of Fame receivers; we can't put all the blame on the defense here. Same with Rivers, who I think only reached ONE championship game if memory serves.
It's a tough thing to judge, no doubt about it.
I was incredulous at this time last year when some in the media if Stafford, having just won the Super Bowl, was now a Hall of Famer. :eek :eek One ring now makes you a Hall of Famer? Putting up empty calories on a mostly bad Lions team for a decade (not his fault, but that is what it was) means a lot all of a sudden?
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I think the obvious question here is which would you rather have on your team, Marino or Elway? Kind of seems like Elway by a mile to me. Marino might put up slightly higher numbers, but you know you can count on Elway to gut one out at the end. Somebody mentioned "clutch" and I think that pretty much sums up the difference.
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Same with Rivers, who I think only reached ONE championship game if memory serves.
With Philip Rivers, I actually think he deserves to be cut some slack for his playoff shortcomings. In the 2009 season, the Chargers lost to the Jets in the Divisional Round 17-14. In that game, kicker Nate Kaeding missed three field goals. That’s nine points the special teams missed out on in a game decided by three points. That set the tone for the next season, as in 2010 the Chargers became the first team to have the top ranked offense AND defense and still miss the playoffs, mostly due to a league worst special teams unit that cost the Chargers a lot of close games. Rivers often carried poorly built Chargers rosters and bad coaches further than they had any business going. Do I consider him an all-time great? No, but I also don’t think Eli Manning is either despite his two Super Bowl rings, and ironically enough had the two quarterbacks not swapped teams in the 2004 Draft, I think Philip Rivers gets a Lombardi.
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I agree with you about Eli, for sure.
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The hyperfocus on rings to determine the best or the GOAT is a bit puzzling. I get that this is the reason people play the game but football isn't a boxing match-- there are two dozen other starters who have a huge amount of say over who wins a game. Half the time a particular quarterback may not even be on the field and it's then a defensive game for that team.
The saying used to be 'defense wins championships' and while that appears to be less and less the case as the rules bend towards offensive play, that is still a compelling point in most of NFL history. So if it were the case that defense wins championships, I don't see how the QB can a) take the vast majority of credit for a superbowl winning season and b) how it can be so critical to determining the GOAT(s). Yet all anyone want to talk is which quarterback allegedly 'won' the game as though no one else had a decisive impact. If Tom Brady had a top 5-10 defense every superbowl winning year except for one, then why shouldn't I factor that into his resume when I compare him to Peyton Manning, who never had close to the same help except for his 2015 season? That sounds like a perfectly legitimate reason for why one guy has more rings than another though I am not discounting other reasons but if one QB plays a lousy defense and his team wins, but the other QB plays a top 5 defense with an elite pass-rusher and his team loses in the playoffs, I don't think we can just say QB 1 is better. There are a lot of other examples in history of non-GOAT Qbs winning the ring because of defense, from the 2002 Bucs, to the Ravens, Bears etc. I just think everyone puts too much emphasis on super bowl wins to determine individual greatness of ONE position. A football game is never about one person even though more and more these days it is about scoring lots of points.
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The hyperfocus on rings to determine the best or the GOAT is a bit puzzling. I get that this is the reason people play the game but football isn't a boxing match-- there are two dozen other starters who have a huge amount of say over who wins a game. Half the time a particular quarterback may not even be on the field and it's then a defensive game for that team.
The saying used to be 'defense wins championships' and while that appears to be less and less the case as the rules bend towards offensive play, that is still a compelling point in most of NFL history. So if it were the case that defense wins championships, I don't see how the QB can a) take the vast majority of credit for a superbowl winning season and b) how it can be so critical to determining the GOAT(s). Yet all anyone want to talk is which quarterback allegedly 'won' the game as though no one else had a decisive impact. If Tom Brady had a top 5-10 defense every superbowl winning year except for one, then why shouldn't I factor that into his resume when I compare him to Peyton Manning, who never had close to the same help except for his 2015 season? That sounds like a perfectly legitimate reason for why one guy has more rings than another though I am not discounting other reasons but if one QB plays a lousy defense and his team wins, but the other QB plays a top 5 defense with an elite pass-rusher and his team loses in the playoffs, I don't think we can just say QB 1 is better. There are a lot of other examples in history of non-GOAT Qbs winning the ring because of defense, from the 2002 Bucs, to the Ravens, Bears etc. I just think everyone puts too much emphasis on super bowl wins to determine individual greatness of ONE position. A football game is never about one person even though more and more these days it is about scoring lots of points.
Since I'm one of those that thinks that rings DO matter, I'll answer. One, there's a reason that the phrase "quarterback" has entered the non-football vernacular. The best of the best quarterbacks inspire all 35 players (11 offense, 11 defense, and 13 special teams if you count kickers, punters and holders) to play well, not just his other 10 offensive players. Two, if both defenses play PERFECTLY, the game ends in a 0-0 tie. No one wins. Yes, "defense wins championships", but the QB - specifically - is the guy that can most often and most "easily" (in quotes because its not easy) change the tone or tenor of the game from "0-0 tie" to "win". Not always - Lawrence Taylor would like a word with me - but most often. Three, you can scheme an offense for the lack of a QB in the short term; look at when Brady served his suspension. It's almost impossible to scheme for the long term, because too much of what the QB does is in the moment. You can scheme a defense for longer, IMO.
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What a great look.
https://twitter.com/BrittanyLynne/status/1625548254841651203?s=20
Again, if you really ARE the GOAT, and not just a great player with a lot of hype, why are we worried about this?
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What a great look.
https://twitter.com/BrittanyLynne/status/1625548254841651203?s=20
Again, if you really ARE the GOAT, and not just a great player with a lot of hype, why are we worried about this?
About what?
And that's from his wife, not him. Irrelevant.
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And we know she's bat shit crazy.
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And we know she's bat shit crazy.
Indeed
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What a great look.
https://twitter.com/BrittanyLynne/status/1625548254841651203?s=20
Again, if you really ARE the GOAT, and not just a great player with a lot of hype, why are we worried about this?
She's not "the GOAT." Nor is she a goat. Nor is she a member or employee of the Chiefs or any other NFL team. Not that a player's wife's public comments mean anything, but I seem to recall another quarterback's wife making some dumb public statements after a Super Bowl loss....
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Not for nothing, I wanted Gisele to STFU too.
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The trend is clear with "some" TB12 fans. They will find a way to demean any QB who might possibly threaten TB12's goat-ness. They did it with Peyton for years, then they moved on to Rodgers, and now Mahomes is the target. I read a blurb the other day that the most outspoken doubters of Mahomes in the sports media all just happen to be HUGE fans of Brady. That is no coincidence. The same thing happens with Michael Jordan fans, who have made a sport out of trashing any and every basketball player since (mainly LeBron James) whom they deem an eventual threat to his goat-ness.
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Frankly, I see no use for trying to identify any GOAT. I'm just enjoying the games.
BTW - the call the referee made was the right call. I hate that the game ended that way because now, we have to talk about. But give Mahomes credit for recognizing the tug and throwing the ball in that direction AND politicking for the penalty. Pretty head's up play if you ask me.
KC was just the better team from o-line to d-line.
And yes, defense still wins championships! :hat
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The trend is clear with "some" TB12 fans. They will find a way to demean any QB who might possibly threaten TB12's goat-ness. They did it with Peyton for years, then they moved on to Rodgers, and now Mahomes is the target. I read a blurb the other day that the most outspoken doubters of Mahomes in the sports media all just happen to be HUGE fans of Brady. That is no coincidence. The same thing happens with Michael Jordan fans, who have made a sport out of trashing any and every basketball player since (mainly LeBron James) whom they deem an eventual threat to his goat-ness.
Oh stop. I've been clear this has nothing to do with Brady. If anything it has everything to do with me being old, if you want truth, and being disgusted with the hype-machine that is all of media (social and otherwise) these days.
Honestly, I thought it was funny (remember Ms. Gillette?) so I posted it. Though I do stand by the nonsense about the Chiefs claiming to be victimized underdogs with no respect. See: Kelce's post-game interview. GTFO, that's ridiculous.
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The trend is clear with "some" TB12 fans. They will find a way to demean any QB who might possibly threaten TB12's goat-ness. They did it with Peyton for years, then they moved on to Rodgers, and now Mahomes is the target. I read a blurb the other day that the most outspoken doubters of Mahomes in the sports media all just happen to be HUGE fans of Brady. That is no coincidence. The same thing happens with Michael Jordan fans, who have made a sport out of trashing any and every basketball player since (mainly LeBron James) whom they deem an eventual threat to his goat-ness.
Oh stop. I've been clear this has nothing to do with Brady. If anything it has everything to do with me being old, if you want truth, and being disgusted with the hype-machine that is all of media (social and otherwise) these days.
Honestly, I thought it was funny (remember Ms. Gillette?) so I posted it. Though I do stand by the nonsense about the Chiefs claiming to be victimized underdogs with no respect. See: Kelce's post-game interview. GTFO, that's ridiculous.
Well, Kelce is a blowhard and a monster douche; that has been obvious, to me anyway, since very early in his career. I tune him out whenever he speaks.
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I must not be the typical Brady lover then. ;)
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Some KC players have indeed played a strange underdog card. If they have the GOAT at QB at apparently at TE, then how are were they underdogs? Makes no sense to me.
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Some KC players have indeed played a strange underdog card. If they have the GOAT at QB at apparently at TE, then how are were they underdogs? Makes no sense to me.
Same way the Patriots for years played it.
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Exactly Tim. The Pats always looked for a chip to rally around and its no difference. Us silly fans buy into it as well.
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Some KC players have indeed played a strange underdog card. If they have the GOAT at QB at apparently at TE, then how are were they underdogs? Makes no sense to me.
Players do whatever they can to get motivation, and to unpack the Chiefs thing a bit, Mahomes injury affected the last two games and how they were viewed and predicted. Because of the Mahomes high ankle sprain, they were underdogs at home for much of the week leading up to the Bengals game, and they were dogs the whole time vs the Eagles. And I think they viewed that as "hey, we are usually big favorites, and now we are the underdog."
I must not be the typical Brady lover then. ;)
That's why I said "some" and put it in quotes. :biggrin: :biggrin:
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I do think, (and I'm definitely involved here) why the Pats fans are so defensive is the attacks over the years. When the bs of deflategate comes up and takes over 2 weeks before the SB, you feel cheated. I think these attacks stemmed from other jealous owners who hated the Pats success. They acted like spoiled brats always fucking each other when they can. Only time they get together is when their combined money is on the line.
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Some KC players have indeed played a strange underdog card. If they have the GOAT at QB at apparently at TE, then how are were they underdogs? Makes no sense to me.
Same way the Patriots for years played it.
Is that true though? Maybe in the first couple years, and at that time it was legit. Seventh Rounder and a bunch of guys named Lennon, McCartney, Simmons and Stanley at the skill positions. I don't recall anything like that at the point where the "D" word started getting tossed around like Tootsie Rolls at a May Day parade.
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Brady made a career out of it.
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Some KC players have indeed played a strange underdog card. If they have the GOAT at QB at apparently at TE, then how are were they underdogs? Makes no sense to me.
Same way the Patriots for years played it.
Is that true though?
Yes.
Again, it's a common tool for self-motivation. Say it enough times in private, and you believe it, and then it comes out in public. The Patriots weren't the first to do it, and the Chiefs won't be the last.
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Some KC players have indeed played a strange underdog card. If they have the GOAT at QB at apparently at TE, then how are were they underdogs? Makes no sense to me.
Same way the Patriots for years played it.
Is that true though?
Yes.
Again, it's a common tool for self-motivation. Say it enough times in private, and you believe it, and then it comes out in public. The Patriots weren't the first to do it, and the Chiefs won't be the last.
Sure, internally; I'm talking more the "ThugLifeTM" style chip on the shoulder that Kelce showed in the final interview. I saw that segment with him and Erin Andrews and Patrick Mahomes and I was like, "comin' in hot, are we?" and turned the station. It's one thing to self-motivate, I get that, but it's entirely another to be bitter about it and actually hold OTHERS accountable for it.
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Speaking of Kelce...I often wonder how the outside looked at Gronk. He's generally considered around here as a loveable buffoon. I always thought his schtick was annoying and I can't imagine people on the outside not thinking he was a douche.
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Some KC players have indeed played a strange underdog card. If they have the GOAT at QB at apparently at TE, then how are were they underdogs? Makes no sense to me.
Same way the Patriots for years played it.
Is that true though?
Yes.
Again, it's a common tool for self-motivation. Say it enough times in private, and you believe it, and then it comes out in public. The Patriots weren't the first to do it, and the Chiefs won't be the last.
Sure, internally; I'm talking more the "ThugLifeTM" style chip on the shoulder that Kelce showed in the final interview. I saw that segment with him and Erin Andrews and Patrick Mahomes and I was like, "comin' in hot, are we?" and turned the station. It's one thing to self-motivate, I get that, but it's entirely another to be bitter about it and actually hold OTHERS accountable for it.
No. You're separating two things that are only ONE thing.
Ever hear literally ANYTHING about Michael Jordan? He held opponents personally responsible for shit that he made up in his head as a motivational exercise. The chip on the shoulder is the motivation. It's only one thing.
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Some KC players have indeed played a strange underdog card. If they have the GOAT at QB at apparently at TE, then how are were they underdogs? Makes no sense to me.
Same way the Patriots for years played it.
Is that true though?
Yes.
Again, it's a common tool for self-motivation. Say it enough times in private, and you believe it, and then it comes out in public. The Patriots weren't the first to do it, and the Chiefs won't be the last.
Sure, internally; I'm talking more the "ThugLifeTM" style chip on the shoulder that Kelce showed in the final interview. I saw that segment with him and Erin Andrews and Patrick Mahomes and I was like, "comin' in hot, are we?" and turned the station. It's one thing to self-motivate, I get that, but it's entirely another to be bitter about it and actually hold OTHERS accountable for it.
No. You're separating two things that are only ONE thing.
Ever hear literally ANYTHING about Michael Jordan? He held opponents personally responsible for shit that he made up in his head as a motivational exercise. The chip on the shoulder is the motivation. It's only one thing.
I don't follow basketball, so while I know about the motivational thing (Kobe, too; you don't get to that level thinking you're great and can coast on your laurels) I don't recall Jordan's public persona being a bitter old man whining about the lack of respect he is or is not getting. I could be wrong about that, but I recall Jordan always being moderately graceful in his outward presentations.
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Speaking of Kelce...I often wonder how the outside looked at Gronk. He's generally considered around here as a loveable buffoon. I always thought his schtick was annoying and I can't imagine people on the outside not thinking he was a douche.
Lovable buffoon is about right, and I was fine with him in small doses. It's once he started showing up in commercials everywhere that I grew to despise him.
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Some KC players have indeed played a strange underdog card. If they have the GOAT at QB at apparently at TE, then how are were they underdogs? Makes no sense to me.
Same way the Patriots for years played it.
Is that true though?
Yes.
Again, it's a common tool for self-motivation. Say it enough times in private, and you believe it, and then it comes out in public. The Patriots weren't the first to do it, and the Chiefs won't be the last.
Sure, internally; I'm talking more the "ThugLifeTM" style chip on the shoulder that Kelce showed in the final interview. I saw that segment with him and Erin Andrews and Patrick Mahomes and I was like, "comin' in hot, are we?" and turned the station. It's one thing to self-motivate, I get that, but it's entirely another to be bitter about it and actually hold OTHERS accountable for it.
No. You're separating two things that are only ONE thing.
Ever hear literally ANYTHING about Michael Jordan? He held opponents personally responsible for shit that he made up in his head as a motivational exercise. The chip on the shoulder is the motivation. It's only one thing.
I don't follow basketball, so while I know about the motivational thing (Kobe, too; you don't get to that level thinking you're great and can coast on your laurels) I don't recall Jordan's public persona being a bitter old man whining about the lack of respect he is or is not getting. I could be wrong about that, but I recall Jordan always being moderately graceful in his outward presentations.
Kelce also isn't being a bitter old man.
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Speaking of Kelce...I often wonder how the outside looked at Gronk. He's generally considered around here as a loveable buffoon. I always thought his schtick was annoying and I can't imagine people on the outside not thinking he was a douche.
Lovable buffoon is about right, and I was fine with him in small doses. It's once he started showing up in commercials everywhere that I grew to despise him.
Yeah, his schtick wears thin really quickly. I'm watching him now on Fox struggle to be a credible analyst - he IS smarter than he lets on, especially about football - as a result of everyone sort of defaulting into "Gronk-mode".
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Some KC players have indeed played a strange underdog card. If they have the GOAT at QB at apparently at TE, then how are were they underdogs? Makes no sense to me.
Same way the Patriots for years played it.
Is that true though?
Yes.
Again, it's a common tool for self-motivation. Say it enough times in private, and you believe it, and then it comes out in public. The Patriots weren't the first to do it, and the Chiefs won't be the last.
Sure, internally; I'm talking more the "ThugLifeTM" style chip on the shoulder that Kelce showed in the final interview. I saw that segment with him and Erin Andrews and Patrick Mahomes and I was like, "comin' in hot, are we?" and turned the station. It's one thing to self-motivate, I get that, but it's entirely another to be bitter about it and actually hold OTHERS accountable for it.
No. You're separating two things that are only ONE thing.
Ever hear literally ANYTHING about Michael Jordan? He held opponents personally responsible for shit that he made up in his head as a motivational exercise. The chip on the shoulder is the motivation. It's only one thing.
I don't follow basketball, so while I know about the motivational thing (Kobe, too; you don't get to that level thinking you're great and can coast on your laurels) I don't recall Jordan's public persona being a bitter old man whining about the lack of respect he is or is not getting. I could be wrong about that, but I recall Jordan always being moderately graceful in his outward presentations.
Kelce also isn't being a bitter old man.
I was giving him the benefit of the doubt; the only adjective that doesn't fit is "old" and IMO it's worse to be a bitter YOUNG man. :) :) :) :)
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If you haven't seen it, I recommend watching the Michael Jordan documentary The Last Dance. It's fascinating.
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Do you guys consider the Chiefs a dynasty yet?
5 straight appearances in the AFC championship. 3 super bowl appearances in the last 4 years. 2 super bowl wins.
Can we crown them a dynasty, or is a dynasty something you crown more after the fact?
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Do you guys consider the Chiefs a dynasty yet?
5 straight appearances in the AFC championship. 3 super bowl appearances in the last 4 years. 2 super bowl wins.
Can we crown them a dynasty, or is a dynasty something you crown more after the fact?
Yes, but more so with Two more years of this kind of dominance.
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Do you guys consider the Chiefs a dynasty yet?
5 straight appearances in the AFC championship. 3 super bowl appearances in the last 4 years. 2 super bowl wins.
Can we crown them a dynasty, or is a dynasty something you crown more after the fact?
Sure.
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Someone asked Mahomes that question and he said no. They got more work to do. Agreed.
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If he didn't say "No" he would be an asshole.
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Do you guys consider the Chiefs a dynasty yet?
5 straight appearances in the AFC championship. 3 super bowl appearances in the last 4 years. 2 super bowl wins.
Can we crown them a dynasty, or is a dynasty something you crown more after the fact?
Terry Bradshaw asked Mahomes that after he was done telling "Big Guy" Andy to waddle over to him.
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On Gronk, I have always loved him and I am an unabashed hater of all things Belihoodie and mostly Brady. I loved that Gronk seemed to do whatever he could to go against the stuffy, no fun persona that the Pats very rightly have. He was an outlier there and I have never had an issue with him.
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There are certainly other dynasties with that level of accomplishment. I wouldn't argue that.
(https://i.imgur.com/ukW0tBn.jpg)
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Do you guys consider the Chiefs a dynasty yet?
5 straight appearances in the AFC championship. 3 super bowl appearances in the last 4 years. 2 super bowl wins.
Can we crown them a dynasty, or is a dynasty something you crown more after the fact?
Sure.
I'd say yes. Starting with Andy Reid they are 117-45 over 10 seasons, with 8 playoff appearances, 7 division titles, 2 SBs. Ain't that about as good as it gets? I know it's not AS GOOD as it has gotten from some others, but it's right up there with most of what we'd call a Dynasty, no?
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Do you guys consider the Chiefs a dynasty yet?
5 straight appearances in the AFC championship. 3 super bowl appearances in the last 4 years. 2 super bowl wins.
Can we crown them a dynasty, or is a dynasty something you crown more after the fact?
Sure.
I'd say yes. Starting with Andy Reid they are 117-45 over 10 seasons, with 8 playoff appearances, 7 division titles, 2 SBs. Ain't that about as good as it gets? I know it's not AS GOOD as it has gotten from some others, but it's right up there with most of what we'd call a Dynasty, no?
That raises the question of when the dynasty started? With Reid or with Mahomes?
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If this is the discussion, I would say with Mahomes. 5 years as starting QB, 5 AFC title game appearances, 3 SB appearances, 2 SB wins.
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Speaking of Kelce...I often wonder how the outside looked at Gronk. He's generally considered around here as a loveable buffoon. I always thought his schtick was annoying and I can't imagine people on the outside not thinking he was a douche.
From where I sit, he existed on a spectrum with "lovable buffoon" on one end and colossal (albeit harmless) douche on the other. Currently, he's very much on the "lovable buffoon" end of things.
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If this is the discussion, I would say with Mahomes. 5 years as starting QB, 5 AFC title game appearances, 3 SB appearances, 2 SB wins.
Interesting consideration. The Chiefs were always a very good team under Reid. They only had one season under 11-5, and never had a losing season. At the same time, I think "dynasty" has to involve titles. We don't call the early 90's Bills a dynasty despite being a great team for many years. KC didn't become a championship team until Mahomes, so I think the dynasty tag has to based on him.
That having been said, KC is kind of on the border regarding dynasty status, IMO. Dynasties are based on lineage. You have to be successful long enough to experience a lot of churn. We're talking about replacing most of your roster and still winning titles. I don't know as there's a set time frame, and I don't know if KC is there yet or not. I'd say they're certainly on the verge of dynastic and the next year or two will settle it.
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If this is the discussion, I would say with Mahomes. 5 years as starting QB, 5 AFC title game appearances, 3 SB appearances, 2 SB wins.
Interesting consideration. The Chiefs were always a very good team under Reid. They only had one season under 11-5, and never had a losing season. At the same time, I think "dynasty" has to involve titles. We don't call the early 90's Bills a dynasty despite being a great team for many years. KC didn't become a championship team until Mahomes, so I think the dynasty tag has to based on him.
That having been said, KC is kind of on the border regarding dynasty status, IMO. Dynasties are based on lineage. You have to be successful long enough to experience a lot of churn. We're talking about replacing most of your roster and still winning titles. I don't know as there's a set time frame, and I don't know if KC is there yet or not. I'd say they're certainly on the verge of dynastic and the next year or two will settle it.
I tend to agree. If KC were to fall apart next year and just be a borderline playoff team for the next 5 years, would we still call 2017-2023 KC a dynasty? I'm not sure. I think one more title in the next few seasons would seal it for sure. Even a couple more AFC championships.
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If this is the discussion, I would say with Mahomes. 5 years as starting QB, 5 AFC title game appearances, 3 SB appearances, 2 SB wins.
Interesting consideration. The Chiefs were always a very good team under Reid. They only had one season under 11-5, and never had a losing season. At the same time, I think "dynasty" has to involve titles. We don't call the early 90's Bills a dynasty despite being a great team for many years. KC didn't become a championship team until Mahomes, so I think the dynasty tag has to based on him.
That having been said, KC is kind of on the border regarding dynasty status, IMO. Dynasties are based on lineage. You have to be successful long enough to experience a lot of churn. We're talking about replacing most of your roster and still winning titles. I don't know as there's a set time frame, and I don't know if KC is there yet or not. I'd say they're certainly on the verge of dynastic and the next year or two will settle it.
If you look at the entirety of the Reid era (10 seasons from 2013-22), which also happens to be the Kelce era since Reid's first season was also Kelce's rookie year (although Kelce only played one snap because of injury), it's pretty damn impressive:
- 117-45 record (this is 6 games better than the Patriots over the same span)
- 8 seasons with 11 or more wins (9-7 in 2014 and 10-6 in 2017)
- 7 division titles (two in the pre-Mahomes years)
- 9 playoff appearances
- 12-7 playoff record
It was a team on the precipice, and the addition of Mahomes kinda put them over the edge. I can't say that I remember that far back, but my guess is that, when the Patriots won 3 Owls in 4 years, the term dynasty was bandied about pretty frequently (even though it took 10 years and 2 years of getting Elied before they won another one).
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By the way, at the other end of the spectrum, the 5 worst teams over the last 20 seasons:
- Browns.........................106-216
- Raiders.........................116-206 (Commitment to Excrement!)
- Jaguars.........................121-201
- Lions............................127-195
- Redskins/Commanders....131-191
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Dallas was the first to win 3 SB's in 4 years and were called a dynasty. NE was the 2nd and only other team to do that and were also called a dynasty. If KC goes to the SB next year and repeats, I'd say they're in the dynasty club.
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I know they have three other close calls in the last half decade, but only two championships does not a dynasty make. If they get to three in the next season or two, we can talk, but until then, no way.
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I know they have three other close calls in the last half decade, but only two championships does not a dynasty make. If they get to three in the next season or two, we can talk, but until then, no way.
I was thinking similar, I'd want to see a third Super Bowl win before considering anyone a dynasty.
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Wow, surprising how many pages this thread has spawned. Not even going to try catching up.
Despite not being interested in the game, I did catch a bit of it. Saw a bit of early second quarter, I think it was, in Spanish before dinner (it's kinda fun watching a major sporting event in a different country, even if not interested in the game itself). Afterward, came back and saw a good portion of the 4th until the end of the game. Didn't really care who won. Was just hoping to catch Mahomes suffer a career-ending injury, but alas, it didn't happen. Did see "the penalty." On one hand, it was a "good call." They DB clearly committed a penalty, and the ref was in a position where it was obvious. On the other, it was a "bad call" because it was really minor, and that type of contact is more often not called. But I'm a bit surprised over the outrage. It was the "correct" call, and one that is called quite frequently. Yeah, there's a lot to wanting to see a particular game called consistently, and if the refs aren't calling it early in the game, it can feel unfair for it to be called late in the game at a critical moment. But, again, that happens all the time. And it was the correct call, and it did happen in full view of a ref. Not really a major issue.
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I know they have three other close calls in the last half decade, but only two championships does not a dynasty make. If they get to three in the next season or two, we can talk, but until then, no way.
I was thinking similar, I'd want to see a third Super Bowl win before considering anyone a dynasty.
I tend to agree. But then again, making it 3 out of 4 times, and being in serious contention for making it 4/4 is pretty impressive too, so I'm not sure I'd split hairs with anyone arguing for "dynasty" status if they are close again a couple more times over the next few years, even if they don't win another one.
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Kev had briefly changed the thread title (tongue firmly in cheek) to Mahomes goat stuff. Nowhere near of course, but the comparison is interesting.
Looking at the playoff TD-INT, it's clear Pat was given the keys to the kingdom from the get-go and the team rides or dies with him. Brady came into a situation of defense and running game and "just don't screw it up". No comparison of difficulty level of those first 5 years, but Tom kept getting better and better and had that basically unstoppable peak as a passer from 2007-2012 beginning at age 30. But no rings during that peak; it's the ultimate team game.
Part has a chance to be well ahead of Tom by age 36 - but the reason Tom cemented GOAT status is what he did AFTER age 36. That's where it's a tremendous challenge. I have little doubt Pat will be ahead of Tom by age 36, but after that a LOT of things have to go right . . . . . Tom's legacy is secure anyway.
Tom age 27, 5 seasons as starter Pat age 27, 5 seasons as starter
Total W/L 68 - 21 (.764) 75 - 19 (.798)
Pass YDs 18,035 24,241
Pass TDs 123 192
MVPs 0 2
Championship Games 3 5
Super Bowls 3 - 0 2 - 1
Playoff W/L 10 - 1 11 - 3
Playoff TD/INT 11 - 3 35 - 7
Ages 28-36 0 Super Bowls, 9-8 playoff record, 2 MVPs ??
Ages 37-45 4 Super Bowls, 17-5 playoff record 1 MVP ??
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I kind of like the idea of separating the generations, because there will always be bias towards who was the top guy when you were most into the game. Up until Brady won his seventh ring, there were still people who considered Montana the GOAT. I’m sure if we talk to some of our much older football fans, they’ll swear by Johnny Unitas. If we look at the game and how it evolved, obviously it’s unfair to compare the QB’s of the 70’s and 80’s to the QB’s of today, because back then defenses could essentially murder the entire offense without a flag and running backs were the kings of their offenses. This isn’t to discredit the accomplishments of modern players, as I consider Tom Brady the GOAT and think skill wise Peyton Manning is the best QB to ever do it, but it’s impossible to compare players from different eras because we have no idea how they would do if they played in an earlier or later generation. This is what will happen with guys like Mahomes, Allen, and Burrow, where they’ll need to not just surpass Brady and Manning but completely blow them out of the water for the fans who grew up watching in the 00’s and 10’s to concede that their heroes (or in my case villains) have been surpassed.
EDIT: To prove my point, right after I initially posted this comment, I went on Twitter and a photo came up comparing Mahomes and Brady at age 27 (so what Dream posted before me) and the first comment I saw under the picture was “How is that comparable? Different eras with different rules. Brady led the league in TDs in his first season as a passer, and it was with 28. That’s how much the NFL changes from 2002 to 2022”.
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I had season tickets for the Pats in the 2002 season. I saw what you said Count on Brady leading the league in TD's. I was like, "No way!"
Yup. He did. That's crazy.
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Daniel Jones wants 45 million?! Good luck and see ya! Well, I guess that means he'll more likely get franchised, but given how Daboll helped Allen and now Jones, I think the Giants could draft another QB to develop and may not see the biggest drop off. Jones had a great playoff game against Minnesota, but that does not mean he is worth anything more then 30-35 IMO. Jones is not the person to break the salary cap over.
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Daniel Jones wants 45 million?! Good luck and see ya! Well, I guess that means he'll more likely get franchised, but given how Daboll helped Allen and now Jones, I think the Giants could draft another QB to develop and may not see the biggest drop off. Jones had a great playoff game against Minnesota, but that does not mean he is worth anything more then 30-35 IMO. Jones is not the person to break the salary cap over.
Presumably he's aiming high to settle for less. I don't see him getting more than Cousins money. His problem is that he waited to long to not suck. NYG could have extended his contract last year, but there was no inclination that he'd stop sucking. Now they're suddenly scrambling to create cap room for a giant contract they didn't see coming. NY's problem is that it's entirely possible that he's the real deal. I remember when he was drafted there was an outside chance that NE would pick him up, as he was regarded as a real darkhorse, high-potential developmental prospect. I was disappointed that he didn't fall to NE. People laughed at the Giants for drafting him when they did (and I think they might have traded up to snag him), but they recognized the potential. He was just late to show it off. Now he's created a situation where people have to gamble big on him based on one good year.
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Tampa has staked out a big, giant home in cap hell. They're into BBB for $35m, and they're currently $55m over the cap. Hard not to have seen this coming, and they're first of several teams that'll wind up there. They helped create the idea of mortgaging years of your future to win now. It worked year one, obviously, but failed thereafter. Probably looking at a fire-sale to unload some contracts and stock up on some draft picks for the inevitable rebuild. In the meantime they've got no QB, a shaky coach, and no money.
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Daniel Jones wants 45 million?! Good luck and see ya! Well, I guess that means he'll more likely get franchised, but given how Daboll helped Allen and now Jones, I think the Giants could draft another QB to develop and may not see the biggest drop off. Jones had a great playoff game against Minnesota, but that does not mean he is worth anything more then 30-35 IMO. Jones is not the person to break the salary cap over.
Presumably he's aiming high to settle for less. I don't see him getting more than Cousins money. His problem is that he waited to long to not suck. NYG could have extended his contract last year, but there was no inclination that he'd stop sucking. Now they're suddenly scrambling to create cap room for a giant contract they didn't see coming. NY's problem is that it's entirely possible that he's the real deal. I remember when he was drafted there was an outside chance that NE would pick him up, as he was regarded as a real darkhorse, high-potential developmental prospect. I was disappointed that he didn't fall to NE. People laughed at the Giants for drafting him when they did (and I think they might have traded up to snag him), but they recognized the potential. He was just late to show it off. Now he's created a situation where people have to gamble big on him based on one good year.
Yeah, I agree with what you are saying. As much as he improved last year, who knows how much of that is sustainable for him and also, it's not like he had some good season. Other than his rushing, he's a below average passer. I understand some of that is the Giants having no WRs and a poor OL, but still, if he's going to suck up cap space, then they aren't going to be able to help him with surrounding talent. I'm OK letting him leave or franchising him (assuming he won't sign for something much less than 45M)
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Kev had briefly changed the thread title (tongue firmly in cheek) to Mahomes goat stuff. Nowhere near of course, but the comparison is interesting.
Looking at the playoff TD-INT, it's clear Pat was given the keys to the kingdom from the get-go and the team rides or dies with him. Brady came into a situation of defense and running game and "just don't screw it up". No comparison of difficulty level of those first 5 years, but Tom kept getting better and better and had that basically unstoppable peak as a passer from 2007-2012 beginning at age 30. But no rings during that peak; it's the ultimate team game.
Part has a chance to be well ahead of Tom by age 36 - but the reason Tom cemented GOAT status is what he did AFTER age 36. That's where it's a tremendous challenge. I have little doubt Pat will be ahead of Tom by age 36, but after that a LOT of things have to go right . . . . . Tom's legacy is secure anyway.
Tom age 27, 5 seasons as starter Pat age 27, 5 seasons as starter
Total W/L 68 - 21 (.764) 75 - 19 (.798)
Pass YDs 18,035 24,241
Pass TDs 123 192
MVPs 0 2
Championship Games 3 5
Super Bowls 3 - 0 2 - 1
Playoff W/L 10 - 1 11 - 3
Playoff TD/INT 11 - 3 35 - 7
Ages 28-36 0 Super Bowls, 9-8 playoff record, 2 MVPs ??
Ages 37-45 4 Super Bowls, 17-5 playoff record 1 MVP ??
You know he HATES being called "Pat", right? Not kidding, either; he, his wife and his mom have all referenced that at various times and with varying degrees of briskness.
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It's amazing how full of shit the media is. It apparently it is a travesty that Eric Bieniemy has never gotten the opportunity to be the head coach on an NFL team, and the question was often, "tell me why?" Well, LeSean McCoy*, a former player who was coached by Bieniemy, came out the other day on live today and gave reasons why, and instead of listening and entertaining that maybe what he was saying had some truth in it, he is getting attacked from every direction by the sports media. Typical. Not to turn this political, but it reminds me of when Democrats trash Republicans for not being diverse enough, and then when person of color speaks out as a Republican, they are called a traitor or, worse, an Uncle Tom. There is simply no way to win with these people who want to scream that everything is about race.
And to reiterate so there is no confusion about my position, yes, there are still some race issues in this country, but the media always makes it 10 times worse than it really is, often by stirring the pot with crap like this, and the sports media is just as bad with it now as the news media.
*As for McCoy, I think he is a jerk and a bully, and I stopped watching Speak (the FS1 show that I used to DVR and watch some clips of every night) because of him, as he is a bully, the others on the show are seemingly afraid to disagree with him too strongly (likely because they know how condescending he gets when you do not agree with him), and Acho constant fellating of him was too much to take (do we need to be told every segment when it is McCoy's turn to speak that he is the Eagles all-time rushing champ and a 2-time Super Bowl champ, the last distinction he got by being a backup who barely touched the ball on two teams that won it all lol). But, as a former player who played under Bieniemy, maybe there is something to what he is saying, no?
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It's amazing how full of shit the media is. It apparently it is a travesty that Eric Bieniemy has never gotten the opportunity to be the head coach on an NFL team, and the question was often, "tell me why?" Well, LeSean McCoy*, a former player who was coached by Bieniemy, came out the other day on live today and gave reasons why, and instead of listening and entertaining that maybe what he was saying had some truth in it, he is getting attacked from every direction by the sports media. Typical. Not to turn this political, but it reminds me of when Democrats trash Republicans for not being diverse enough, and then when person of color speaks out as a Republican, they are called a traitor or, worse, an Uncle Tom. There is simply no way to win with these people who want to scream that everything is about race.
And to reiterate so there is no confusion about my position, yes, there are still some race issues in this country, but the media always makes it 10 times worse than it really is, often by stirring the pot with crap like this, and the sports media is just as bad with it now as the news media.
*As for McCoy, I think he is a jerk and a bully, and I stopped watching Speak (the FS1 show that I used to DVR and watch some clips of every night) because of him, as he is a bully, the others on the show are seemingly afraid to disagree with him too strongly (likely because they know how condescending he gets when you do not agree with him), and Acho constant fellating of him was too much to take (do we need to be told every segment when it is McCoy's turn to speak that he is the Eagles all-time rushing champ and a 2-time Super Bowl champ, the last distinction he got by being a backup who barely touched the ball on two teams that won it all lol). But, as a former player who played under Bieniemy, maybe there is something to what he is saying, no?
I'm with you 100%. The fact is, if an owner thought he would win as HC, he would be hired, full stop. Granted, I can accept that there might - MIGHT - be reasons that an owner might not think that that aren't valid, but as long as Lovie Smith and Brian Flores and Todd Bowles continue to get jobs, this idea that the primary factor against Eric Bieniemy is "race" is just unsubstantiated propaganda.
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It's amazing how full of shit the media is. It apparently it is a travesty that Eric Bieniemy has never gotten the opportunity to be the head coach on an NFL team, and the question was often, "tell me why?" Well, LeSean McCoy*, a former player who was coached by Bieniemy, came out the other day on live today and gave reasons why, and instead of listening and entertaining that maybe what he was saying had some truth in it, he is getting attacked from every direction by the sports media. Typical. Not to turn this political, but it reminds me of when Democrats trash Republicans for not being diverse enough, and then when person of color speaks out as a Republican, they are called a traitor or, worse, an Uncle Tom. There is simply no way to win with these people who want to scream that everything is about race.
And to reiterate so there is no confusion about my position, yes, there are still some race issues in this country, but the media always makes it 10 times worse than it really is, often by stirring the pot with crap like this, and the sports media is just as bad with it now as the news media.
*As for McCoy, I think he is a jerk and a bully, and I stopped watching Speak (the FS1 show that I used to DVR and watch some clips of every night) because of him, as he is a bully, the others on the show are seemingly afraid to disagree with him too strongly (likely because they know how condescending he gets when you do not agree with him), and Acho constant fellating of him was too much to take (do we need to be told every segment when it is McCoy's turn to speak that he is the Eagles all-time rushing champ and a 2-time Super Bowl champ, the last distinction he got by being a backup who barely touched the ball on two teams that won it all lol). But, as a former player who played under Bieniemy, maybe there is something to what he is saying, no?
I'm with you 100%. The fact is, if an owner thought he would win as HC, he would be hired, full stop. Granted, I can accept that there might - MIGHT - be reasons that an owner might not think that that aren't valid, but as long as Lovie Smith and Brian Flores and Todd Bowles continue to get jobs, this idea that the primary factor against Eric Bieniemy is "race" is just unsubstantiated propaganda.
I read something about this a few days ago, and they said the consensus is that Bieniemy "doesn't interview well". Maybe... just maybe that's why he hasn't gotten a head coaching job.
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It's amazing how full of shit the media is. It apparently it is a travesty that Eric Bieniemy has never gotten the opportunity to be the head coach on an NFL team, and the question was often, "tell me why?" Well, LeSean McCoy*, a former player who was coached by Bieniemy, came out the other day on live today and gave reasons why, and instead of listening and entertaining that maybe what he was saying had some truth in it, he is getting attacked from every direction by the sports media. Typical. Not to turn this political, but it reminds me of when Democrats trash Republicans for not being diverse enough, and then when person of color speaks out as a Republican, they are called a traitor or, worse, an Uncle Tom. There is simply no way to win with these people who want to scream that everything is about race.
And to reiterate so there is no confusion about my position, yes, there are still some race issues in this country, but the media always makes it 10 times worse than it really is, often by stirring the pot with crap like this, and the sports media is just as bad with it now as the news media.
*As for McCoy, I think he is a jerk and a bully, and I stopped watching Speak (the FS1 show that I used to DVR and watch some clips of every night) because of him, as he is a bully, the others on the show are seemingly afraid to disagree with him too strongly (likely because they know how condescending he gets when you do not agree with him), and Acho constant fellating of him was too much to take (do we need to be told every segment when it is McCoy's turn to speak that he is the Eagles all-time rushing champ and a 2-time Super Bowl champ, the last distinction he got by being a backup who barely touched the ball on two teams that won it all lol). But, as a former player who played under Bieniemy, maybe there is something to what he is saying, no?
I'm with you 100%. The fact is, if an owner thought he would win as HC, he would be hired, full stop. Granted, I can accept that there might - MIGHT - be reasons that an owner might not think that that aren't valid, but as long as Lovie Smith and Brian Flores and Todd Bowles continue to get jobs, this idea that the primary factor against Eric Bieniemy is "race" is just unsubstantiated propaganda.
I read something about this a few days ago, and they said the consensus is that Bieniemy "doesn't interview well". Maybe... just maybe that's why he hasn't gotten a head coaching job.
it's not bullshit. I've had that criticism leveled against me in my early career. I can think of three different occasions where I was recommended for a job, did the interview and the feedback came back that there was "no energy, no enthusiasm". I (think I) worked through it, but nonetheless, that's your showcase. If you can't rise to that pressured, stressful occasion, then I can't blame an owner for not giving you the keys to what might be a $2 BILLION dollar ship.
From working at GE, I learned first hand that there is sometimes a HUGE difference in being No. 1 and No. 2. How many times have we said "the buck stops with the Head Coach". We just had this conversation ad nauseam with Belichick re: Patricia.
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Yep, like Silvio one said on The Sopranos, "some guys are better at being numbers 2s than number 1s." Of course, with coaching especially, it is impossible to know beforehand which number 2 (or 3 or 4) will be a good number 1, which is why halfwits like Nathaniel Hackett get shots at being a head coach. I have no doubt that plenty of rich white owners don't really want a black guy to be their head coach (see: Jerry Jones), but not sure what the answer here is. Plenty of black coaches ARE given the opportunity to be a head coach, so not sure what makes Eric Bieniemy so special to where him not being given a chance is the crime of the century.
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Not too different from the Kaepernick situation in many respects.
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Saw a pretty crazy fact posted yesterday on twitter, of the 57 teams to win the Super Bowl, 54 of them had at least one game in their playoff run where the defense held the opposition to under 20 points. The exceptions?
1981 Niners
2019 Chiefs
2022 Chiefs
It’s safe to say no QB in history leans less on his defense than #15.
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I would say we now live in the offensive era where the calls favor the offensive. So it might not be a surprise that a team might be lead to win SB'S by offenses.
We'll never see an 85 Bears or 00 Ravens again.