*Official* A View from the Top of the World discussion thread

[Elite]

Sleeping Giant is probably my favourite track on the new album

[DT89]

For all my fellow guitar players, I transcribed the whole album and put synchronized tab videos on my youtube channel:

The Alien Guitar Tab
Answering the Call Guitar Tab
Invisible Monster Guitar Tab
Sleeping Giant Guitar Tab
Transcending Time Guitar Tab
Awaken the Master Guitar Tab
A View From the Top of the World Guitar Tab

[Architeuthis]

Wow,  you're on it!   
It seems accurate too. I've learned the first section of IM previously and your tab is spot on. I learned from watching JP break down and explain the chord progressions.  Thanks for posting!

[dparrott]

*snip* wrong thread

[Trav86]

I know a guy that does play a little bit of guitar now and then.  His name is John Petrucci.  And he doesn't consider TOT to be a "magnum opus."  Go figure.

What is the context of this? Has he said “TOT is meh”. Or like “TOT is great, but not nearly our best work”.

[Kotowboy]

Remember when Petrucci said DT12 was supposed to be their definitive album ?

Now it barely gets mentioned by fans.

[Trav86]

Remember when Petrucci said DT12 was supposed to be their definitive album ?

Now it barely gets mentioned by fans.

What Petrucci thinks and what fans think isn’t the same thing.

[Kotowboy]

I just wish DT12 had a tighter snare sound. It ruins a lot of songs.

Along For The Ride might have been a good song but its bogged down by DOOF DOOF DOOF

[Kotowboy]

Now that they have DTHQ - I imagine Jimmy T will be their de facto in house engineer and hopefully all their albums going forward will sound this good.

[jammindude]

I’ve now had three listens to the new album, and something occurred to me today that quite honestly blew my mind.

For as chaotic and non-linear BTBAM tends to be, I actually have more “ear worms” that immediately stuck in my head from Colors II than I do from 3 listens of AVFTTOTW.

If the album is as dense as it seems to be, it might grow on me and I might find it to be more engrossing than it currently is. I’m just a little surprised. DT usually delivers up something that “lingers” long after you heard it.

After watching a portion of the documentary from the Blu-ray disc, it seems that they are writing with ProTools. I understand this is really common nowadays, but one of the downfalls of writing this way is that you’re patch working things together and seeing if it fits to your ears without actually playing it out and seeing if it all fits together as a play-thru piece.

But now I’m just thinking out loud. Maybe if I watched the entire documentary I would find out they did play it all the way through to find out if it worked for them. But a lot of it sounds like they pieced together a lot of really cool parts and didn’t stop to think about whether or not they had a cohesive melody that could stick with you.

But three or four more spins may reveal more layers that make me change my mind completely. We are still in the embryonic phase.

[lovethedrake]

I’ve now had three listens to the new album, and something occurred to me today that quite honestly blew my mind.

For as chaotic and non-linear BTBAM tends to be, I actually have more “ear worms” that immediately stuck in my head from Colors II than I do from 3 listens of AVFTTOTW.

If the album is as dense as it seems to be, it might grow on me and I might find it to be more engrossing than it currently is. I’m just a little surprised. DT usually delivers up something that “lingers” long after you heard it.

After watching a portion of the documentary from the Blu-ray disc, it seems that they are writing with ProTools. I understand this is really common nowadays, but one of the downfalls of writing this way is that you’re patch working things together and seeing if it fits to your ears without actually playing it out and seeing if it all fits together as a play-thru piece.

But now I’m just thinking out loud. Maybe if I watched the entire documentary I would find out they did play it all the way through to find out if it worked for them. But a lot of it sounds like they pieced together a lot of really cool parts and didn’t stop to think about whether or not they had a cohesive melody that could stick with you.

But three or four more spins may reveal more layers that make me change my mind completely. We are still in the embryonic phase.

Just did another spin of most of the album and I think I figured out my biggest issues  with it.

First of all, it was a successful spin, I enjoyed it, especially Sleeping Giant.  Here what’s holding it back.

My two biggest gripes about the album:

1. Rudess is way too low in the mix and the guitars are way too high.   Rudess is doing so much stuff in the background that gets drowned out which is a real shame because it causes the album to have a “sameness” vibe that brings it down a peg.  The moments where you can properly hear Rudess really brighten the album up.  I also think it actually hurts some of the JP solos as they almost sound disconnected with the band. 

2. The choruses are sooooo generic… sleeping giant, answering the call, awaken the master, transcending time, have these choruses that seem like they’re patched into the song and are just insanely boring and generic.  They are melodic but they add nothing to the song.  Another shame because those are all great tracks… none of them even needed proper choruses.   

Dream theater has had some great choruses in the past but never before have they seemed so insanely forced.   Would rather them have no choruses at all.  Especially Sleeping Giant.

This album is so close to being awesome but those really hold it back and keep it in the middle of the pack for me. 

[Trav86]

I just wish DT12 had a tighter snare sound. It ruins a lot of songs.

Along For The Ride might have been a good song but its bogged down by DOOF DOOF DOOF

Not to derail this thread too much but, I never had as much of a problem with DT12’s production as everyone else. I never noticed, including the snare sound. However…those songs seemed to really come alive when played live. I’m sure that is a sign of negative impacts the production had on those songs.

[TheBarstoolWarrior]

the choruses are all generic? They don't even sound similar to one another.....

[lovethedrake]

the choruses are all generic? They don't even sound similar to one another.....

Wow do I disagree with that statement.  I literally can’t even tell them apart.   They all sound exactly the same to me and none of them add anything to the song.

The Alien and the title track have worthwhile choruses but even on the title track it feels forced.  The Alien leads nicely into the chorus and stands out imo.

[TheBarstoolWarrior]

the choruses are all generic? They don't even sound similar to one another.....

Wow do I disagree with that statement.  I literally can’t even tell them apart.   They all sound exactly the same to me and none of them add anything to the song.

The Alien and the title track have worthwhile choruses but even on the title track it feels forced.  The Alien leads nicely into the chorus and stands out imo.

If you really cannot tell ATC chorus or TT from Sleeping Giant, I am not sure what to say...except that I am unsure how you are defining generic (maybe you just mean you don't particularly like them?) and would be curious to know what DT choruses don't qualify as generic.

[erwinrafael]

Sing the chorus of Answering The Call, Sleeping Giant  and A Vjee back to back to back then tell us if they sound the same.

[TheBarstoolWarrior]

I don't think TT chorus is even hitting the same intervals in the scale as ATC for example...

[lovethedrake]

the choruses are all generic? They don't even sound similar to one another.....

Wow do I disagree with that statement.  I literally can’t even tell them apart.   They all sound exactly the same to me and none of them add anything to the song.

The Alien and the title track have worthwhile choruses but even on the title track it feels forced.  The Alien leads nicely into the chorus and stands out imo.

If you really cannot tell ATC chorus or TT from Sleeping Giant, I am not sure what to say...except that I am unsure how you are defining generic (maybe you just mean you don't particularly like them?) and would be curious to know what DT choruses don't qualify as generic.

I don’t like when the band suddenly bursts into a mid tempo chorus with Labrie overdubbing himself several times.  It comes off as generic to me.  Not distinguishable from the rest.  I do think TT is a little different.

I’ll tell you choruses I like:

Choruses I love:

 take the time
A matter of time
Voices
Glass prison
Solitary shell
One last time

[bosk1]

Just did another spin of most of the album and I think I figured out my biggest issues  with it.

Same here.  I think I can sum up everything wrong with this album in one word:  nothing. 

[Glasser]

I love the chorus in TT!!! It has the same impact as Surrender To Reason which I absolutely love.

***Hot take: I think this is Dream Theaters best work EVER! 7 songs that keep me engaged from start to finish. I think it encapsulates everything DT is about. It’s like Images and Words comes full circle. If this album is their swan song it would make perfect sense. Obviously I hope they continue but hypothetically if it was it would be a strong finish.

[jammindude]

Just did another spin of most of the album and I think I figured out my biggest issues  with it.

Same here.  I think I can sum up everything wrong with this album in one word:  nothing.

 

[KevShmev]

Sing the chorus of Answering The Call, Sleeping Giant  and A Vjee back to back to back then tell us if they sound the same.

I am sitting here and honestly cannot remember the chorus to any of those songs.  That is how unmemorable all of them are to me so far.  They are not bad, they are just kinda there.

For me so far, Transcending Time and Awaken the Master are the only songs that are really sticking (mostly) from start to finish, and even those are songs I would merely call good.  I don't hear anything here that I can imagine some day thinking, "this is one of their best songs ever," and nearly every DT album usually has at least a few of those to me (even DT12 did at first, even if none of them are ones I would now think as one of their best).   

The bigger problem is that the album is less than a week old and I am already listening to a bunch of other stuff already. I have already moved on from this new album to other stuff.  A new DT album usually dominates my listening time for weeks (or months) after its release. 

I am glad some of you are enjoying this a lot, though. 

[TheBarstoolWarrior]

I really like the ATC chorus. The rest of them are fine. But yeah, very few compelling hooks to me either.

[metropofreak]

Has anyone bought the HDtracks version of the album? I'm curious if the dynamic range is better than the CD version.

[The Letter M]

Has anyone bought the HDtracks version of the album? I'm curious if the dynamic range is better than the CD version.

The album isn't even up on the Loudness War site yet, but I check occasionally to see if it updates so I know whether or not to get the HD Tracks version.

https://dr.loudness-war.info/album/list/year/desc?artist=Dream+Theater

-Marc.

[Dedalus]

I am sitting here and honestly cannot remember the chorus to any of those songs.  That is how unmemorable all of them are to me so far.  They are not bad, they are just kinda there.

For me so far, Transcending Time and Awaken the Master are the only songs that are really sticking (mostly) from start to finish, and even those are songs I would merely call good.  I don't hear anything here that I can imagine some day thinking, "this is one of their best songs ever," and nearly every DT album usually has at least a few of those to me (even DT12 did at first, even if none of them are ones I would now think as one of their best).   

The bigger problem is that the album is less than a week old and I am already listening to a bunch of other stuff already. I have already moved on from this new album to other stuff.  A new DT album usually dominates my listening time for weeks (or months) after its release. 

I am glad some of you are enjoying this a lot, though. 

That point of being memorable can be a criterion. But ....

I listened to the latest NMB album and thought it was a good record. Today, some time after listening for the last time, I can't remember anything. I tried humming some melody from the album and nothing. Zero. So I could tell I was wrong and it's not a good record like I thought it was.

At the same time, I can hum different parts of Senjutsu, which I heard before the NMB album.

It's a criterion... but I don't honestly know to what extent I would adopt it for my final word on records.

[lovethedrake]

I love the chorus in TT!!! It has the same impact as Surrender To Reason which I absolutely love.

***Hot take: I think this is Dream Theaters best work EVER! 7 songs that keep me engaged from start to finish. I think it encapsulates everything DT is about. It’s like Images and Words comes full circle. If this album is their swan song it would make perfect sense. Obviously I hope they continue but hypothetically if it was it would be a strong finish.

Haha funny because I don’t like the choruses on the self titled, including surrender to reason, and honestly that was the first album when I felt like “generic” and DT could be used in the same sentence.

[lovethedrake]

Sing the chorus of Answering The Call, Sleeping Giant  and A Vjee back to back to back then tell us if they sound the same.

I am sitting here and honestly cannot remember the chorus to any of those songs.  That is how unmemorable all of them are to me so far.  They are not bad, they are just kinda there.

For me so far, Transcending Time and Awaken the Master are the only songs that are really sticking (mostly) from start to finish, and even those are songs I would merely call good.  I don't hear anything here that I can imagine some day thinking, "this is one of their best songs ever," and nearly every DT album usually has at least a few of those to me (even DT12 did at first, even if none of them are ones I would now think as one of their best).   

The bigger problem is that the album is less than a week old and I am already listening to a bunch of other stuff already. I have already moved on from this new album to other stuff.  A new DT album usually dominates my listening time for weeks (or months) after its release. 

I am glad some of you are enjoying this a lot, though. 

I like it more than you so far but there are just way too many songs that have parts where I say “ok let’s move on and get to the good stuff”.   Many of these parts are the choruses and I think sleeping giant is a great example,  love the whole song outside of the chorus.

Honestly the only song I don’t feel that way about is The Alien.  That is strong from start to finish and builds to something great.

I love a lot of the title track but there are several moments where I’m just waiting for the next part.

[AVFTTOTW]

First two words of "Answering The Call"

*BTBAM moment 

[Glasser]

I love the chorus in TT!!! It has the same impact as Surrender To Reason which I absolutely love.

***Hot take: I think this is Dream Theaters best work EVER! 7 songs that keep me engaged from start to finish. I think it encapsulates everything DT is about. It’s like Images and Words comes full circle. If this album is their swan song it would make perfect sense. Obviously I hope they continue but hypothetically if it was it would be a strong finish.

Haha funny because I don’t like the choruses on the self titled, including surrender to reason, and honestly that was the first album when I felt like “generic” and DT could be used in the same sentence.

Tastes are personal. What are your favorite DT albums and songs?

[lovethedrake]

My favorite songs are below and my album ranking is below that not counting View.

Favorite songs in no order would be:

Learning to live
A change of seasons
Fatal Tragedy
Overture 1928
Six Degrees
Take the Time
Metropolis
Trial of Tears

Album ranking:

Scenes
Images
Six degrees

Awake



Distance over Time
Falling into Infinity
Train of Thought
The Astonishing

Black Clouds
When dream and day unite
Self titled


Octavarium





Systematic Chaos
A dramatic Turn of events

[erwinrafael]

The chorus of A View gives me the same vibe as Take The Time. It actually feels like music for a sports channel.  The chorus of Sleeping Giant is memorable to me in the same way as Bridges in the Sky, not just because of the 6/8 beat but because of the vocal harmonies. The verse of Awaken The Master reminds me of Lost Not Forgotten because of how MM played LNF live.

Answering the Call I associate with Fates Warning.  The vocal hook for me in this song is not the chorus but the pre-chorus.

To lovethedrake: I see that we really have different tastes because ACOS and Learning to Live are bottom songs in my DT list. 

[Vandalism]

the choruses are all generic? They don't even sound similar to one another.....

Wow do I disagree with that statement.  I literally can’t even tell them apart.   They all sound exactly the same to me and none of them add anything to the song.

The Alien and the title track have worthwhile choruses but even on the title track it feels forced.  The Alien leads nicely into the chorus and stands out imo.

If you really cannot tell ATC chorus or TT from Sleeping Giant, I am not sure what to say...except that I am unsure how you are defining generic (maybe you just mean you don't particularly like them?) and would be curious to know what DT choruses don't qualify as generic.

I think the criticisms that the choruses or verse riffs or instrumentals are all very samey in an album are quite understandable given that it has only been out for a few days and we are all still internalizing it.

I remember when ADTOE first came out I couldn't tell BiTS/LNF/Outcry apart for months, especially the instrumental sections.

[lovethedrake]

The chorus of A View gives me the same vibe as Take The Time. It actually feels like music for a sports channel.  The chorus of Sleeping Giant is memorable to me in the same way as Bridges in the Sky, not just because of the 6/8 beat but because of the vocal harmonies. The verse of Awaken The Master reminds me of Lost Not Forgotten because of how MM played LNF live.

Answering the Call I associate with Fates Warning.  The vocal hook for me in this song is not the chorus but the pre-chorus.

To lovethedrake: I see that we really have different tastes because ACOS and Learning to Live are bottom songs in my DT list. 

I think most people in the fanbase would consider those two of their major classics.   I’m definitely someone who became a fan because of their 90’s output and I stick around because of how incredible that era was.  I like everything they do but nothing since six degrees outside of maybe “at wits end” has come even close to any of the songs I mentioned above.  Of course just my opinion.

[The Realm]

To lovethedrake: I see that we really have different tastes because ACOS and Learning to Live are bottom songs in my DT list. 

Wow! Of all the diverse opinions in this thread, this is surely the most crazy one I have read!