Dream Theater: The Astonishing (now with moment of betrayal!)

[Kotowboy]

The album is all about the career of DT and the album will move between the different eras of the band.

[millahh]

My one observation is that, impressionistic as the geography is, Glen Cove is made a very prominent feature on the Endless Island.

[RoeDent]

Considering that JP revealed Faythe and Arabelle in the Rolling Stone interview, that's 6 characters we now know about. Nice to be able to locate Ravenskill now though. Although I always pictured it being in the bottom-right corner of the map.

[thosava]

I'm just a little worried about the religious elements of the album. I hope religion takes a smaller role in the lyrics, than on the previous album. With (the angel) Gabriel, and Evangeline holding a cross  makes me a bit worried. Religious analogies are not a problem, but some of the lyrics on DT12 were a bit on the preachy side.

[bosk1]

...but some of the lyrics on DT12 were a bit on the preachy side.

  Um...no. 

[thosava]

  Um...no.

I'm talking about the lyrics on The Bigger Picture, Surrender to Reason and some parts in Illumination Theory. Maybe preachy is a strong word, but the spirituality of some of those lyrics just doesn't speak to me at all.

[Bertielee]

...but some of the lyrics on DT12 were a bit on the preachy side.

  Um...no.

[BlackInk]

...but some of the lyrics on DT12 were a bit on the preachy side.

  Um...no.

They're incredibly preachy, but not in a religious way.

[bosk1]

There has been in increase in chatter being detected by both factions.  I would expect the Emperor and the Commander to speak to us soon.

[r3d86]

There has been in increase in chatter being detected by both factions.  I would expect the Emperor and the Commander to speak to us soon.

How so?

[CDrice]

There has been in increase in chatter being detected by both factions.  I would expect the Emperor and the Commander to speak to us soon.

So I guess we'll either receive a new email from them or they'll post something on Twitter... or maybe it'll be something more astonishing!

[r3d86]

There has been in increase in chatter being detected by both factions.  I would expect the Emperor and the Commander to speak to us soon.

Maybe they would speak on the videos 

[Frankgate]

other stuff but videos
I need a video, whatever it might be.

[r3d86]

We want to see the clock guy!

[CDrice]

We want to see the clock guy!

Just a few posts and the guy is already a legend. 

At this point I think he should be awarded the title of the most influential DTF member of 2015.

[r3d86]

We want to see the clock guy!

Just a few posts and the guy is already a legend. 

At this point I think he should be awarded the title of the most influential DTF member of 2015.

I think that we all hope that he has sung parts on the album, because if he is the only character that don't sing, it's gonna be hard to bear

[bosk1]

...but some of the lyrics on DT12 were a bit on the preachy side.

  Um...no.

They're incredibly preachy, but not in a religious way.

There certainly is nothing religious about any of them, but I don't get "preachy" in ANY way, shape, or form either.

[thosava]

...but some of the lyrics on DT12 were a bit on the preachy side.

  Um...no.

They're incredibly preachy, but not in a religious way.

There certainly is nothing religious about any of them, but I don't get "preachy" in ANY way, shape, or form either.

Obviously people interpret lyrics differently. That said, i'm (in my own personal opinion) unable to interpret lyrics such as "Shine your light on me", and "Restless angels, help me find my way" in any way other than a religious.

[V_R11]

Anyone else think that Evangeline seems kind of an odd character to be in a rebel militia? 

[pcs90]

I'm just a little worried about the religious elements of the album. I hope religion takes a smaller role in the lyrics, than on the previous album. With (the angel) Gabriel, and Evangeline holding a cross  makes me a bit worried. Religious analogies are not a problem, but some of the lyrics on DT12 were a bit on the preachy side.

I'm not entirely sure what's so bad about that. It's not like the lyrics have to be interpreted as religious. I tend to think of them that way because they connect with me better, but it's not like they're forcing a particular religion or set of beliefs on you, and in fact when JP says what a song like this is about it has nothing to do with religion (take TBP for example). In my opinion DT does a very good job at lyrics like this, because they're vague enough not to be shoved down the throats of people who don't like the concept but clear enough to be interpreted as religious for those who like that idea.

[BlackInk]

Obviously people interpret lyrics differently. That said, i'm (in my own personal opinion) unable to interpret lyrics such as "Shine your light on me", and "Restless angels, help me find my way" in any way other than a religious.

Yeah I never saw those as religious. Just stuff people say in lyrics because it sounds poetic.

"Let love show the way
Let grace be the way
Surrender to reason"

"To really feel the joy in life
You must suffer through the pain
When you surrender to the light
You can face the darkest days
If you open up your eyes
And you put your trust in love
On those cold and endless nights
You will never be alone"

Those are two examples of passages I'd define as pretty preachy.

[thosava]

Yeah i agree. Of course religious imagery is mostly used because they sound poetic. And i realize i'm in a minority seeing the world through pretty strongly atheistic (and non-spritual) eyes. But the lyrics in the ending of Surrender to Reason has always sadly made me appreciate such a great song a little less.

[Gpals71]

Meet Evangeline. Flyt.it/TheAstonishing

[Prog Snob]

bowchicka bow wow

[RoeDent]

No matter how close I put my eyes to my monitor, I can hardly read most of the place names on the map. Hopefully when it's complete we'll be able to zoom in and get a bigger picture (no pun intended).

[TheLordOfTheStrings]

eh, never mind

[millahh]

Yeah i agree. Of course religious imagery is mostly used because they sound poetic. And i realize i'm in a minority seeing the world through pretty strongly atheistic (and non-spritual) eyes. But the lyrics in the ending of Surrender to Reason has always sadly made me appreciate such a great song a little less.

Dude...I'm seriously athiest (and have some significant problems w/ organized religion), but I can appreciate the architecture of cathedrals and the beauty in early music...

[Frank]

Yeah i agree. Of course religious imagery is mostly used because they sound poetic. And i realize i'm in a minority seeing the world through pretty strongly atheistic (and non-spritual) eyes. But the lyrics in the ending of Surrender to Reason has always sadly made me appreciate such a great song a little less.

I can understand this. As an atheist myself (who studies the intersection of religion, philosophy, and society) the more overtly "spiritual" lyrics do create a disconnect between me and the songwriter. Messages about the strength and power of faith - belief in empirically unverifiable realities - certainly don't resonate with me. However, as others have pointed out, it seems that DT consciously tries to avoid overt religious imagery in their lyrics so as to not alienate listeners while still writing music and lyrics that are meaningful to them. I can appreciate and respect that.

The disconnect I feel doesn't really matter for a variety of reasons - 1) the songwriter said what mattered to them, and I can relate with the strong emotions people feel in life anyway, 2) I feel like my enjoyment of a song shouldn't be contingent on whether I agree with the cosmology it's founded upon, especially because at the end of the day I prioritize music over lyrics, 3) the lyrics' internal structure reveal patterns, poetry, and other constructed delights I can enjoy, 4) I can use the song the study the influences religious and spiritual belief systems have upon art, etc.

All that being said, I can't deny it's nice when I listen to things which I can viscerally relate to.

[thosava]

Yeah i agree. Of course religious imagery is mostly used because they sound poetic. And i realize i'm in a minority seeing the world through pretty strongly atheistic (and non-spritual) eyes. But the lyrics in the ending of Surrender to Reason has always sadly made me appreciate such a great song a little less.

Dude...I'm seriously athiest (and have some significant problems w/ organized religion), but I can appreciate the architecture of cathedrals and the beauty in early music...

Yeah, i have the same position as you. I love visiting old norwegian stave churches for example (and other religious houses such as mosques). But for me there is a difference between appreachiating that kind of architecture and art, and religious lyrics. The difference is that the architecture has beauty outside of being religious symbols. Religious lyrics doesn't really mean anything outside of the context of that particular religion.

I know i may sound negative, or argumentative, but that's not how i'm trying to come across. The only thing i'm trying to say is that i for example don't like the ending section in Surrender to reason because of the lyrics (or should i say, it doesn't resonate with me personally). And that is only my own fault. I'm really excited about the Sci-fi and fantasy elements of The Astonishing, i just hope that religious imagery isn't too prominent.

[r3d86]

How we end talking about religious? This is The Astonishing post, so we should talk about it.

I like a lot Evangeline:



Do you think that the rest of the characters that we haven't seen are from the GNEA?

[thosava]

Well i ended up talking about religion because of that particular picture 

[Nomaniac]

Don't let religious references ruin songs for you guys . . . it's all in poetic purpose plus lyrics are meant for you to interpret the way you want and relate it to your own life. I understand how it would make it less relatable though, don't get me wrong, just don't let it ruin a song for you

[r3d86]

It's a great picture! Faythe and Arabelle will be from Ravenskill or from GNEA?

[Nomaniac]

It's a great picture! Faythe and Arabelle will be from Ravenskill or from GNEA?

Have no idea . . . maybe there will be a third group we don't know about yet?

[r3d86]

It's a great picture! Faythe and Arabelle will be from Ravenskill or from GNEA?

Have no idea . . . maybe there will be a third group we don't know about yet?

The NOMACs? The ex members perhaps?