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Offline In The Wake Of Poseidon

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #525 on: February 11, 2010, 10:33:03 AM »
Fantastic acting ... believable characters ...

lol

It was actually, especially for CGI, the Nav'i princess in particular.

New topic:  CGI winning best actor at Oscars.  I mean for future movies, because one thing Avatar clearly showed was the future of filmmaking. Thoughts?


Jesus Christ I hope not.

Offline Bombardana

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #526 on: February 11, 2010, 10:40:59 AM »
I don't think so. The animators could alter the acting to make it better. Avatar uses CGI on it's actors, but it keeps their performance intact and unenhanced.

Offline soundgarden

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #527 on: February 11, 2010, 10:47:18 AM »
Fantastic acting ... believable characters ...

lol

It was actually, especially for CGI, the Nav'i princess in particular.

New topic:  CGI winning best actor at Oscars.  I mean for future movies, because one thing Avatar clearly showed was the future of filmmaking. Thoughts?


Jesus Christ I hope not.

Why do you "hope" not?  What is the difference between a photo-realistic animated character and a real person?  Same end, different medium.

Offline Genowyn

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #528 on: February 11, 2010, 11:31:10 AM »
It's insanely more expensive and pointless, especially if they're just going to look like people. If that's the "future" of filmmaking then only the really high budget films that can afford to have pointless CG characters will get any recognition.

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Offline reneranucci

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #529 on: February 11, 2010, 11:39:09 AM »

Why do you "hope" not?  What is the difference between a photo-realistic animated character and a real person?  Same end, different medium.
What? Do you really think there is no difference at all?

Hope they remake The Godfather with CGI actors.

Offline In The Wake Of Poseidon

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #530 on: February 11, 2010, 03:41:12 PM »
Fantastic acting ... believable characters ...

lol

It was actually, especially for CGI, the Nav'i princess in particular.

New topic:  CGI winning best actor at Oscars.  I mean for future movies, because one thing Avatar clearly showed was the future of filmmaking. Thoughts?


Jesus Christ I hope not.

Why do you "hope" not?  What is the difference between a photo-realistic animated character and a real person?  Same end, different medium.
I was mainly concerned about the paper thin story and unremarkable action sequences.

Offline soundgarden

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #531 on: February 11, 2010, 04:34:52 PM »

Why do you "hope" not?  What is the difference between a photo-realistic animated character and a real person?  Same end, different medium.
What? Do you really think there is no difference at all?

Hope they remake The Godfather with CGI actors.

No no no, think down the line.  Of course the difference is obvious now.  What about 100 years from now?  What if those animatronix guys affix millions of molecule size sensor balls all over the face of a human to measure the displacement of every single skin cell.  There WILL be a point where an animated character will be completely indistinguishable from that of a real person.   It is NOT sci-fi as Avatar clearly shows that the road is there, we are simply at the start of it.


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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #532 on: February 11, 2010, 04:36:42 PM »
Sure, but what's the point of that? Why spend SO much time and money when you could....just....film them?

Sure, in cases like avatar it makes sense, but in ordinary movies? Nah.
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Offline soundgarden

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #533 on: February 11, 2010, 04:46:20 PM »
Sure, but what's the point of that? Why spend SO much time and money when you could....just....film them?

Because technology allows for greater artistic potential? 

But you guys are not on my first point, this was taken more serious than i intended lol. Forget about costs and time.  The fact of the matter is that the technology WILL be there and we will have animated characters competing with real characters for artistic appreciation.  Figure next century and we have a movie like this where the Nav'i were completely completely indistinguishable from humans.  My point is.... for Best Actor, who is your choice; the Nav'i princess or Daniel Day Lewis in "Nine"  :laugh:





Offline reneranucci

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #534 on: February 11, 2010, 05:10:07 PM »
You would have to program every detail of their performance to match that of a good actor. Which I donīt see happening.

Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #535 on: February 12, 2010, 09:16:07 AM »
Sure, but what's the point of that? Why spend SO much time and money when you could....just....film them?


It cost as much as it did because it was the first time. It's like what drug companies say, "the first pill costs a million dollars, the rest just pennies". In time this new method of film could become the norm, and be no more expensive than regular filming is now.

Offline reneranucci

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #536 on: February 12, 2010, 10:52:59 AM »
Overall I enjoyed the movie, but I have to say something: I donīt like Pandora, and I donīt know why people say is "much more beautiful than our crapy planet". I prefer our cute puppies, elegant eagles and sad pandas to the animals depicted in the movie. We have magnificent plants, too. And the Navi were just ugly, much more than humans, with their cat faces and tails. And if you like virgin regions with waterfalls and amazing sunsets, there are plenty of them in our world.

Does anybody agree?

Offline Dark Master Of Sin

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #537 on: February 12, 2010, 10:53:39 AM »
Nope. Pandora was amazing.
gone

Offline Volk9

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #538 on: February 12, 2010, 10:55:35 AM »
DOWNLOAD MY FREE NEW ALBUM!

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Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #539 on: February 12, 2010, 10:57:20 AM »
Day time Pandora = Day time Earth
Night time Pandora > Night time Earth

Online Adami

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #540 on: February 12, 2010, 11:24:09 AM »
Sure, but what's the point of that? Why spend SO much time and money when you could....just....film them?


It cost as much as it did because it was the first time. It's like what drug companies say, "the first pill costs a million dollars, the rest just pennies". In time this new method of film could become the norm, and be no more expensive than regular filming is now.

Baseless. How can you say that doing a lot more work would cost the same as not doing a lot more work?

Like I said, in cases like Avatar, this technology makes a lot of sense. But what about normal movies? Is there even a point in making a movie like Goodfellas all CG? No, filming them is fine. Just because the technology exists doesn't mean it needs to be used constantly, I think George Lucas proved that.
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Offline bosk1

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #541 on: February 15, 2010, 04:09:33 PM »
Definitely late to the party, as I just saw this last night.  I went into it with relatively low expectations and was pretty happy with it.  I agree with Reap's assessment.  Very good movie.  Not great, but thoroughly enjoyable despite its flaws.  CGI was at times brilliant; at times not.  3D was used really well, IMO.  For the most part, Cameron stayed away from the cheap 3D gimmicks one would expect, such as hurling things at you or making stuff jump out at you to get a reaction.  It was used more to draw you into the world you were seeting.  I liked that.  Really not much more to add, since I really don't have the time to get into a therapy session for Chino.
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Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #542 on: February 15, 2010, 04:29:17 PM »
Am I officially DTF's Avatard?

Offline Bombardana

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #543 on: February 15, 2010, 04:37:10 PM »
The number of times you've seen it... you're an honorary Na'vi

Offline emindead

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #544 on: February 15, 2010, 04:39:40 PM »

Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #545 on: February 15, 2010, 04:39:57 PM »
The number of times you've seen it... you're an honorary Na'vi

I think I hold the world record.

8 times in theaters (5 of them imax)
7 at my house

Offline Bombardana

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #546 on: February 15, 2010, 04:41:12 PM »
Have you seen it in 2d?

Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #547 on: February 15, 2010, 04:43:26 PM »
Have you seen it in 2d?

only at my house

Offline bosk1

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #548 on: February 15, 2010, 04:56:19 PM »
Am I officially DTF's Avatard?

Oh, I dunno.  I wouldn't say that.

:chino:
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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #549 on: February 15, 2010, 04:57:11 PM »
Quote
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Offline ReaPsTA

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #550 on: February 15, 2010, 05:01:54 PM »
I read my initial take and somewhat agree.

The biggest thing is that I've kinda soured on the story. It's well done. I felt invested in the Na'vi winning. I buy that Jake and Neytiri fall in love. The pace and the ebb and flow are all good. Etc. etc.

But it's the same story as Dances with Wolves and Pocahontas. I don't even mean it's a rip off. The "outsider falls in with natives" superstructure is bigger than any single movie. But look at it this way. (SPOILERS:)



 - White fairy thing lands on Neytiri. I immediately know it's a supernatural sign she shouldn't shoot him.

 - White fairy things land on Jake. I immediately know it's a supernatural harbinger of Jake being the chosen one.

 - Jake's whole training with the Na'vi just flows very... lacksidaisically. Although in fairness, that's kinda the point. This long stretch of the movie is important because you need to invest in their culture, and it's perhaps smart on Cameron's part to present as few obstacles to that as possible.

 - But more importantly, I'm painfully aware of the upcoming scene where Jake's gonna have to reveal he was sent to the Na'vi to kick them out of their tree. In an interesting omission, he never tells them that he provided the human military with the necessary tactical information to bring it down.

 - The one dickhead Na'vi is just so over-the-top. Does he have any dimension as a character beyond "tell Jake how much he sucks"? Although, to Cameron's credit, there's the super-satisfying moment where Jake kicks his ass. The man knows how to play to an audience.

 - The moment they introduce the idea of the guy being a legend because he rides the big bird, I IMMEDIATELY know Jake's gonna do it, and that's gonna be his big step to legendary status.

 - When the corporate head decides he just wants to burn Na'vi stuff down and make money, okay, I get it, some people are that bad, but we never see the layer of him that explains that level of dehumanization. In Aliens, we understand the corporate guy is that personally greedy and interested in glory. In Avatar, he's just a businessman who's really evil. Please.

 - The chief dying when the tree comes down just felt too simple and easy. Neytiri hates him after his big revelation (cliche, but it's hard to do it any other way). None of this is bad, just meh and unsurprising.

 - Jake gets on the big bird after escaping. And this is maybe the lamest part of the movie. Jake's idea of approaching the big bird from above is actually pretty awesome. But this calls into question why he was the first one to think of it. Are we as the audience supposed to buy that? And then, when he lands on the big bird, EVERYONE INSTANTLY WELCOMES HIM BACK INCLUDING DOUCHE'VI. I get the idea of respect. I get the idea of different cultures. I understand that trying to ride the big bird shows real commitment on Jake's part to being welcomed back. But this is just preposterous. Having a skill does not necessarily equate with personal fortitude.

 - The whole time after thing I'm thinking "Please don't let the Na'vi lose so Pandora can then rally its animals to save itself."

Yeah.

Again, I get it. A big part of the point of the movie is that this planet is one big interconnected network that functions as a brain. But come on.

 - From there, I dunno. Michelle Rodriguez dies for no reason. Norm lives for no reason.* Neytiri gets trapped under the big animal. (Which was an overly on the nose moment that maybe didn't need to be there. The animal that tried to eat Jake earlier now wants to help save the planet with Neytiri. I mean... Eh?) So she can't help Jake while he battles the Colonel, and then she saves Jake when he's about to get killed by the Colonel, which is kind of a bummer because I wanted to see Jake win that fight on his own.

It sounds kind of silly, but being able to use movie-tropes in an expected yet riveting way is the key to great film making. The more original you try to be, the harder it is for your audience to relate to the film. What's the one part of Avatar everyone loves? The military hardware. And it's really not that out there. Walkers, Space Marines, and Helicopter gunships. Cameron's able to make them just different enough to be interesting without trying from those very base audience expectations.

But from a plot standpoint, Avatar's just too on the nose for me. If you look at Star Wars, the plot isn't really that out there, but it gets to the expected points in interesting ways. Avatar does have some great moments, but in far too many cases it just delivers on the expected trope without an extra layer to make it fun.

*Wouldn't it have been a more interesting character arc if Norm died for the Na'vi cause, thus transforming from a pretentious science nerd to someone who really cares about the subjects he's helping? Then, you could have a smaller arc where the Indian(?) doctor had to go from a low-level assistant to the main characters to the leader of the remaining human encampment.
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Offline bosk1

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #551 on: February 15, 2010, 05:10:36 PM »
I hear you Reap, and I don't disagree much.  But it was fun, and I'm just kinda like, "yeah, okay, that's that."  I don't particularly care how much it cost.  I'm not really inclined to invest myself in it anymore than I otherwise would just because it cost so much to make, or just because it was so long in the making.  It was a fun movie that was executed well enough to hold my interest for the full 161 minutes.  I'll probably see it one more time just because it was fun enough and there is certainly enough eye candy that I missed the first time through.  I probably will NOT see it more than that (save if it is on TV, or friends have it on when I'm over, or something like that).  But that's okay.  Once was satisfying enough.  Other than from a moviemaking tech standpoint, it's not an "important" movie in any real sense, so I'm not inclined to pretend that it somehow is.  It is what it is, and that's good enough for me.
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Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #552 on: February 15, 2010, 06:08:15 PM »
Am I officially DTF's Avatard?

Oh, I dunno.  I wouldn't say that.

:chino:

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Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #553 on: February 15, 2010, 06:49:44 PM »



 
Quote
- Jake's whole training with the Na'vi just flows very... lacksidaisically. Although in fairness, that's kinda the point. This long stretch of the movie is important because you need to invest in their culture, and it's perhaps smart on Cameron's part to present as few obstacles to that as possible.

I think keeping it simple was a good move. It allowed you to feel as though you knew the Na'vi well.

Quote
- The one dickhead Na'vi is just so over-the-top. Does he have any dimension as a character beyond "tell Jake how much he sucks"? Although, to Cameron's credit, there's the super-satisfying moment where Jake kicks his ass. The man knows how to play to an audience.

Remember when Grace was explaining him to Jake early on. She said that he and Neytiri were to become a mated pair. He saw Jake as a threat and was jealous of him. Thats my guess at least.




Quote
- The chief dying when the tree comes down just felt too simple and easy. Neytiri hates him after his big revelation (cliche, but it's hard to do it any other way). None of this is bad, just meh and unsurprising.

It was expected, and he had to die at some point. Him getting killed by any weapon would have been cliche.

Quote
- Jake gets on the big bird after escaping. And this is maybe the lamest part of the movie. Jake's idea of approaching the big bird from above is actually pretty awesome. But this calls into question why he was the first one to think of it. Are we as the audience supposed to buy that?

Keep in mind, even though the Na'vi are intelligent, they are no where near as intelligent as a human. They may not have thought of it. Neytiri did say that it had happened 5 times before, maybe its just too difficult. Also, remember Neytiri said that the ikran must also choose its rider... perhaps Turok could have refused past riders, even if they managed to attack it in a manner Jake did.

Quote
- The whole time after thing I'm thinking "Please don't let the Na'vi lose so Pandora can then rally its animals to save itself."

Yeah.

That was to show us all that Ewa was infact real. I think that Grace was wrong in the whole planet acting like a human brain. I think the connection between everything in nature was actually Ewa. Science lead Grace to believe it worked like a brain, but she was being blinded by the science. Much like religious debates on Earth.


Quote
- From there, I dunno. Michelle Rodriguez dies for no reason. Norm lives for no reason.

She was on the side of the Na'vi. She tried trying to help them. She knew going in that she was going to die. Remember she mentioned the martydom plan.

Quote
*Wouldn't it have been a more interesting character arc if Norm died for the Na'vi cause, thus transforming from a pretentious science nerd to someone who really cares about the subjects he's helping?


Norm's Avatar got killed, yet he still went out unprotected with nothing more than a gun once back in human form. That to me was pretty cool and showed he cared for the Na'vi.
« Last Edit: February 15, 2010, 08:21:51 PM by Chino »

Offline ReaPsTA

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #554 on: February 16, 2010, 02:07:07 PM »
Quote
- Jake's whole training with the Na'vi just flows very... lacksidaisically. Although in fairness, that's kinda the point. This long stretch of the movie is important because you need to invest in their culture, and it's perhaps smart on Cameron's part to present as few obstacles to that as possible.

I think keeping it simple was a good move. It allowed you to feel as though you knew the Na'vi well.

I do agree with you here. This part of the movie obviously achieved its intended audience response.

Quote
Quote
- The one dickhead Na'vi is just so over-the-top. Does he have any dimension as a character beyond "tell Jake how much he sucks"? Although, to Cameron's credit, there's the super-satisfying moment where Jake kicks his ass. The man knows how to play to an audience.

Remember when Grace was explaining him to Jake early on. She said that he and Neytiri were to become a mated pair. He saw Jake as a threat and was jealous of him. Thats my guess at least.

That aspect of the character dynamic is explained once in a line of dialog that I didn't even catch the first time I saw the movie. And when we find out Jake mated with her, it's not really explicitly mentioned that Tsu'tey's woman was taken from him. If you're gonna do that, well, okay. It's cliche and silly but I can roll with it. But commit to your character arcs.

Quote
Quote
- The chief dying when the tree comes down just felt too simple and easy. Neytiri hates him after his big revelation (cliche, but it's hard to do it any other way). None of this is bad, just meh and unsurprising.

It was expected, and he had to die at some point. Him getting killed by any weapon would have been cliche.

Why did he have to die? If he lives, you get two interesting scenes:

 - When Jake rides in on the big bird, because he's an elder, he can provide more perspective on why it matters.

 - He could directly pass the torch of leadership over to Jake after the final battle.

If he must die though, I'd almost rather it be to a weapon. I can't pinpoint why, but his whole death scene just bummed me out.

Quote
Quote
- Jake gets on the big bird after escaping. And this is maybe the lamest part of the movie. Jake's idea of approaching the big bird from above is actually pretty awesome. But this calls into question why he was the first one to think of it. Are we as the audience supposed to buy that?

Keep in mind, even though the Na'vi are intelligent, they are no where near as intelligent as a human. They may not have thought of it. Neytiri did say that it had happened 5 times before, maybe its just too difficult. Also, remember Neytiri said that the ikran must also choose its rider... perhaps Turok could have refused past riders, even if they managed to attack it in a manner Jake did.

What's it supposed to be though? Are the Na'vi these amazingly intelligent creatures we should idealize, or are they inferior versions of humans? Is it the Forrest Gump thing where they're not as smart but then somehow more in tune with what makes life worth living?

Then again, the Na'vi have really poor battle tactics*, so maybe it's not completely illogical.

But even so, I can't agree with you on this. Coming at the Toruk from above is a good idea, but one that a civilization thousands of years old could have figured out and been able to execute more regularly by the time of the movie. And the thing about Toruk choosing its rider doesn't fly. It's not in the movie at all from what I understand.

And I still want to know why the Na'vi immediately accept him back into their tribe. I think you can get away with this if you give the Na'vi actual flaws throughout the movie and let this be a big moment where we're forced to see that this is what their value system is, for better or for worse. But since we're supposed to think they're an idealistic species, then tell me what's idealistic about them accepting Jake because he rode a big bird.

Quote
Quote
- The whole time after thing I'm thinking "Please don't let the Na'vi lose so Pandora can then rally its animals to save itself."

Yeah.

That was to show us all that Ewa was infact real. I think that Grace was wrong in the whole planet acting like a human brain. I think the connection between everything in nature was actually Ewa. Science lead Grace to believe it worked like a brain, but she was being blinded by the science. Much like religious debates on Earth.

I don't think Ewa is real, and it's tough to believe that knowing (a) Cameron doesn't believe in any kind of deity and (b) if I understand correctly, Cameron's definition of religious fulfillment is based on being able to through your own actions and connection to life satisfy the religious urges in you. Based on that, it would seem Cameron tried to create a planet where the intelligent life (Na'vi) are able to satisfy that religious need by literally connecting to each other electronically. Cameron himself is most likely going to favor science over religion in any debate.

But putting all that aside. As a plot point in a movie, it was a cliche I knew was coming that wasn't done with any interesting layers added onto it.

Quote
Quote
- From there, I dunno. Michelle Rodriguez dies for no reason. Norm lives for no reason.

She was on the side of the Na'vi. She tried trying to help them. She knew going in that she was going to die. Remember she mentioned the martydom plan.

Why does she die except to die? I read an early draft of the script where she dies because she actually has to. In the final movie, she just does.

Quote
Quote
*Wouldn't it have been a more interesting character arc if Norm died for the Na'vi cause, thus transforming from a pretentious science nerd to someone who really cares about the subjects he's helping?


Norm's Avatar got killed, yet he still went out unprotected with nothing more than a gun once back in human form. That to me was pretty cool and showed he cared for the Na'vi.

It's certainly not bad. I just think it could be better.

*Perhaps ironically, this is in contrast to the American Indians, who knew how to disperse and hide in trees and fight guerrilla style against superior armies.
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Online orcus116

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #555 on: February 16, 2010, 03:40:07 PM »
Quote
- The chief dying when the tree comes down just felt too simple and easy. Neytiri hates him after his big revelation (cliche, but it's hard to do it any other way). None of this is bad, just meh and unsurprising.

It was expected, and he had to die at some point. Him getting killed by any weapon would have been cliche.

Uh the whole tree falling on him is incredibly cliche. If he had gotten killed by random weapon it would've been way less expected, more interesting and a bit more realistic. Or he could've not died at all for the reasons Reap stated. The other part that really bugged me about that scene is when he hands the bow to what's her face it's painfully obvious that she's going to use that to kill the General even though it wasn't going to come for another hour or so. That whole retribution thing is so stupid, lame and predictable.

Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #556 on: February 16, 2010, 06:35:47 PM »
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That aspect of the character dynamic is explained once in a line of dialog that I didn't even catch the first time I saw the movie. And when we find out Jake mated with her, it's not really explicitly mentioned that Tsu'tey's woman was taken from him. If you're gonna do that, well, okay. It's cliche and silly but I can roll with it. But commit to your character arcs.

I think it was kept on the down low on purpose. I wasn't meant to stand out. I think it will play more into the drama in the sequel.


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Why did he have to die? If he lives, you get two interesting scenes:

 - When Jake rides in on the big bird, because he's an elder, he can provide more perspective on why it matters.

 - He could directly pass the torch of leadership over to Jake after the final battle.


Atukan knew that Jake still wasn't 100% a Na'vi, even though he was one of the people. Tsu'tey is the new chief. That was the plan from the beginning, again going back to what Grace said early on. I think Jake will finally become the chief in the sequel. I didn't expect Atukan to die so early in the film. I thought for sure it was going to be in the final battle.



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And the thing about Toruk choosing its rider doesn't fly. It's not in the movie at all from what I understand.

Neytiri said a hunter must choose his ikran, and the ikran must also choose him. This was right before Jake selected his ikran. Trust me on this one.

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And I still want to know why the Na'vi immediately accept him back into their tribe. But since we're supposed to think they're an idealistic species, then tell me what's idealistic about them accepting Jake because he rode a big bird.

Because the last time it was done, Neytiri's grandfather's grandfather rode Turok and brought the clans together in a time of great sorrow. She said that all Na'vi know this story. When seeing Jake on Turok, I believe all the Na'vi saw it as a sign from Ewa, and immediately knew what it meant. They also didn't except him back right away. Most of them seemed dumbfounded and didn't know what to make of it. It wasn't until after he made his speech that he was truly back on their side.

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I don't think Ewa is real, and it's tough to believe that knowing (a) Cameron doesn't believe in any kind of deity and (b) if I understand correctly, Cameron's definition of religious fulfillment is based on being able to through your own actions and connection to life satisfy the religious urges in you. Based on that, it would seem Cameron tried to create a planet where the intelligent life (Na'vi) are able to satisfy that religious need by literally connecting to each other electronically. Cameron himself is most likely going to favor science over religion in any debate.

Cameron in life might be in favor of science on all occasions, except when it comes to making a movie that grosses two billion dollars. However, you could be right on this.  


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Why does she die except to die? I read an early draft of the script where she dies because she actually has to. In the final movie, she just does.

She doesn't just die. She tried taking out the main ship by shooting the hell out of the cockpit. I know it is a stretch, but it was never confirmed she died. She could have ejected or something right before the explosion and we may see a flashback to that in the sequel.

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*Wouldn't it have been a more interesting character arc if Norm died for the Na'vi cause, thus transforming from a pretentious science nerd to someone who really cares about the subjects he's helping?



You also have to remember that at the end of the film when they chose to only keep a select few humans, there were several Avatars standing there holding guns. That means that the labs must still be in use and Norm and that black guy (don't know his name) are there to operate them. Again, I think this will play a big part into the sequel.


Offline Scurvy!Dreams

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #557 on: February 16, 2010, 07:34:56 PM »
Avatar wasn't written with a sequel in mind, and even if it was, shit has to make sense in the context of the first movie. Bad fan-wanking.

Online orcus116

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #558 on: February 16, 2010, 07:45:56 PM »
Plus that would make one boring ass sequel. I don't really get why people are eluding to movie sequels for movies that are obviously standalone. Take District 9 for instance. The guy said "I'll see you in 3 years" at the end, big fucking deal. Suddenly everyone is pointing to that as the evidence of a sequel next to the side note that everyone was moved to District 10. What possibly could happen in a potential sequel that is interesting enough to have taken part during that time period? The main characters story is over which pretty much mean the movies story is over. I feel like moviegoers are getting exponentially more retarded.

(sorry for the little sidetrack but it was appropriate in context with Scurvy's point)

Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar (Spoilers likely)
« Reply #559 on: February 16, 2010, 07:54:21 PM »
Avatar wasn't written with a sequel in mind, and even if it was, shit has to make sense in the context of the first movie. Bad fan-wanking.

Avatar was definitely written with a sequel in mind. Cameron himself said that there are scenes in the movie that are in there for the sole purpose of the sequel. He said Pandora took too much time and money to be used only once.
Plus that would make one boring ass sequel. I don't really get why people are eluding to movie sequels for movies that are obviously standalone. Take District 9 for instance. The guy said "I'll see you in 3 years" at the end, big fucking deal. Suddenly everyone is pointing to that as the evidence of a sequel next to the side note that everyone was moved to District 10. What possibly could happen in a potential sequel that is interesting enough to have taken part during that time period? The main characters story is over which pretty much mean the movies story is over. I feel like moviegoers are getting exponentially more retarded.

(sorry for the little sidetrack but it was appropriate in context with Scurvy's point)

I don't have a scanner, but I will try and get a decent pic of the article tomorrow.