Petrucci's Posting

[Adami]

I wonder what he thinks of my avatar

Probably the same thing that anyone thinks of your avatar. That it's amazing. And sexy.

[Elsydeon]

I want to see JP suit up.  bear suit up?   Where's that picture of him in a suit that popped up a year or two ago?

[j]

How does that fool stay so humble when everyone worships him?

How does that make him a fool?

I meant it in a sort of brotherly jest.  Maybe even flirtatiously, depending on what he's interested in.  You know, like "silly".

-J

[LieLowTheWantedMan]

How does that fool stay so humble when everyone worships him?  The man has no critics.

No critics? You should snoop around progarchives sometimes. That site is filled with DT haters, and A LOT of people that complain JP has no feel whatsoever in any of his playing. Those people have not heard aCoS, Goodnight Kiss, Solitary Shell, The Spirit Carries On, Hollow Years L@B, Through Her Eyes, Octavarium, About to Crash, Overture 1928, The Count Of Tuscany, Another Day, and other songs with great, non excessive wanking solos.

[darkshade]

How does that fool stay so humble when everyone worships him?  The man has no critics.

No critics? You should snoop around progarchives sometimes. That site is filled with DT haters, and A LOT of people that complain JP has no feel whatsoever in any of his playing. Those people have not heard aCoS, Goodnight Kiss, Solitary Shell, The Spirit Carries On, Hollow Years L@B, Through Her Eyes, Octavarium, About to Crash, Overture 1928, The Count Of Tuscany, Another Day, and other songs with great, non excessive wanking solos.

as a member of that site, i do know that many of the DT haters over at PA have heard those songs mentioned, and still argue JP has no feel (though some will admit to liking at least Octavarium (song), and MAYBE something off I&W or Scenes), they just dont really like Dream Theater

of course many of them do not enjoy metal at all, so it's hard to enjoy DT if you cringe at just the thought of metal. many members must be at least 50 or so, since many of them grew up listening to prog rock back in the 70s. but there's younger members like that too.

bit arguments sprout up from time to time over there and go on for 30 pages since there are as many DT-haters as there are DT-lovers

DT are probably the most hated and loved band over there, at times there's threads about the band in all different sub-forums (and many in one sub-forum)

dont worry, JP, and the rest of the band, have their nay-sayers  

[j]

How does that fool stay so humble when everyone worships him?  The man has no critics.

No critics? You should snoop around progarchives sometimes. That site is filled with DT haters, and A LOT of people that complain JP has no feel whatsoever in any of his playing.

Actually, I've heard some around here mock people who supposedly claim that Petrucci's playing "has no feeling", but I never knew where it came from, and I've never seen/heard it first hand.  Of course it would be dumb to assume that he literally has NO critics: you can name any topic or person and there will be someone who will bitch about it on the internet.

-J

[Perpetual Change]

It's not a video game song. It wasn't part of the game, and the only connection is that it was supposed to be 'inspired' by the game and its setting.

Not sure the guys actually knew that. Not really sure the guys knew WHAT they were doing, since I'm not even sure they ever stopped saying it was on the soundtrack or stopped calling it "Gods of War."

[KevShmev]

How does that fool stay so humble when everyone worships him?  The man has no critics.

No critics? You should snoop around progarchives sometimes. That site is filled with DT haters, and A LOT of people that complain JP has no feel whatsoever in any of his playing. Those people have not heard aCoS, Goodnight Kiss, Solitary Shell, The Spirit Carries On, Hollow Years L@B, Through Her Eyes, Octavarium, About to Crash, Overture 1928, The Count Of Tuscany, Another Day, and other songs with great, non excessive wanking solos.

as a member of that site, i do know that many of the DT haters over at PA have heard those songs mentioned, and still argue JP has no feel (though some will admit to liking at least Octavarium (song), and MAYBE something off I&W or Scenes), they just dont really like Dream Theater

Then those people are idiots.  Not liking a band is one thing, but to say someone like JP has no feeling in his playing, even after hearing him play, is just idiotic.  If someone had heard just the last two minutes of "This Dying Soul' and said that, that would be one thing , but if you have heard even a small fraction of the rest of his playing, you really have to be an idiot to think that.

[Seventh Son]

How does that fool stay so humble when everyone worships him?  The man has no critics.

No critics? You should snoop around progarchives sometimes. That site is filled with DT haters, and A LOT of people that complain JP has no feel whatsoever in any of his playing. Those people have not heard aCoS, Goodnight Kiss, Solitary Shell, The Spirit Carries On, Hollow Years L@B, Through Her Eyes, Octavarium, About to Crash, Overture 1928, The Count Of Tuscany, Another Day, and other songs with great, non excessive wanking solos.

as a member of that site, i do know that many of the DT haters over at PA have heard those songs mentioned, and still argue JP has no feel (though some will admit to liking at least Octavarium (song), and MAYBE something off I&W or Scenes), they just dont really like Dream Theater

Then those people are idiots.  Not liking a band is one thing, but to say someone like JP has no feeling in his playing, even after hearing him play, is just idiotic.  If someone had heard just the last two minutes of "This Dying Soul' and said that, that would be one thing , but if you have heard even a small fraction of the rest of his playing, you really have to be an idiot to think that.

I think its more a case of hype backlash, more than anything else. Like, take someone who doesn't care for JP style of guitar playing and surround him with tons of people that worship it 24/7. Nothing wrong with worshiping it, JP is quite the guitarist after all, even though if I were being honest he isn't even close to my favorite (That's nothing against him, there are just others I like so much more ). I don't agree with that kind of backlash, but eh, its inevitable and I'd be lying if I said I've been 100% immune to hype backlash in the past as well.

[TAC]

JP has recently surpassed my two faves..Gary Moore and Michael Schenker. I made that declaration this summer.

[Global Laziness]

Nice to see Petrucci being so open so quickly. I hope this continues past the fallout.

[Kotowboy]

IMO , saying Petrucci has no feel is like saying Myung only ever plays root notes.

[SnakeEyes]

I think what people are saying is that Petrucci lost his feel.  For example, listen to the solo on Live in Tokyo (the one that's at the end of To live Forever) .... or, even watch the solos on his instructional DVD, "Rock Discipline," then compare those performances to the solo he does during, "Hollow Years" on the Budokan DVD.  He really sounds like a completely different player, but not for the better. 

I TRULY mean no disrespect when I say that.  But, unfortunately, it's the truth.  JP used to be so melodic and unique.... he really did have his own voice until.... probably the early 2000's.  Then, something happened.  I don't know if it was playing with Jordan, Portnoy pushing for heavier music within DT, maybe a combination..... it doesn't really matter.  What matter is that it's evident - at least to me and many other fans.

So, yeah, there's some truth to the, "no feeling" comment that people make - except it's not that he doesn't "have" feel, it's just that he doesn't USE the feel he used to so amazingly have. 

[TL]

There are plenty of recent examples, both studio and live, that show that he can still play with a ton of feeling.

[orcus116]

It all sounds forced though. I can't really explain it but a lot of the examples I expect people to whip out (end of Octavarium, end of TMOLS, The Best of Times solo) sound artificial. There's quite a difference between making your guitar sound like its crying and making your guitar cry.

[j]

Yeah trying to explain why something does or doesn't have "feeling" is pretty futile, I think.

However, now that orcus mentions it, while those are all very good solos that are often cited as people's favorites, I definitely consider them several notches below my "all-time great" Petrucci solos (LiTS, Scarred, ACoS, UaGM, etc etc), and I can't explain why.

-J

[TL]

Obviously, it's impossible to quantify emotion in a song. For example, I've always felt that the solo at the end of Octavarium is absolutely packed with emotion. It will vary from person to person though.

[SnakeEyes]

It all sounds forced though. I can't really explain it but a lot of the examples I expect people to whip out (end of Octavarium, end of TMOLS, The Best of Times solo) sound artificial. There's quite a difference between making your guitar sound like its crying and making your guitar cry.

Yup, perfect response.  It seems like Petrucci has two types of solo modes now:  "SHRED AS FAST AS HE CAN" and, "play a bunch of long notes with a ton of distortion and delay in a really dramatic melody at the end of a twenty minute epic."  Of course, most of the time, it's still awesome.... I mean.... it's PETRUCCI.  But, the problem is that, in my opinion, he has become predictable.  I don't feel like he's trying to come up with something that says something new or different.... it has kind of been the same old thing every album....

In my opinion, the last great, amazing solo he did was for The Great Debate.... it seems like he spent some time really thinking about melodic ideas.... or, maybe they just came to him easily for that one.  Either way, I want him to do more of that. 

[emindead]

I think what people are saying is that Petrucci lost his feel.  For example, listen to the solo on Live in Tokyo (the one that's at the end of To live Forever) .... or, even watch the solos on his instructional DVD, "Rock Discipline," then compare those performances to the solo he does during, "Hollow Years" on the Budokan DVD.  He really sounds like a completely different player, but not for the better.

I think you chose a bad example "Hollow Years" is one of his greatest live solos, if not the best. His solos in "Rock Discipline" are as boring as you can get, I don't know why you bring those up. You may have a good poll between the one you mention in Tokyo and the Budokan one.

[hefdaddy42]

I don't know, I've never bought the hype for that Hollow Years solo. 

[SnakeEyes]

I think you chose a bad example "Hollow Years" is one of his greatest live solos, if not the best. His solos in "Rock Discipline" are as boring as you can get, I don't know why you bring those up. You may have a good poll between the one you mention in Tokyo and the Budokan one.

lol...

Hey, it's all subjective.  I don't care for the Hollow Years solo on Budokan at all.  It just seems like there's not a lot of phrasing.  It's a lot of really cool, REALLY FAST, licks that are kind of strung together.  I think his phrasing, his melodic ideas, even his technique is better on the Rock Discipline solos.  Hell, I think those solos are better than what he has been doing on the albums in the past few years!   

[Zorander]

humm.. maybe, just maybe, the feeling that he plays with less, or more forced, feeling, is that he is SO clean and use such clean leads, that it takes away some of the "natural" emotion or something. Ie. in my opinion, there's just something about the more "gritty" fender sound or even the old ibanez leads he used to have. I loved how his ibanez sounded, and sometimes I just think his sound now is too processed, or too clean.. I don't know. It's hard to express in english, I lack the vocabulary

edit: To me though, I don't think there's any question about him being able to channel emotion and feel in his music.. but it's all subjective as  you say 

[tri.ad]

I don't know, I've never bought the hype for that Hollow Years solo. 

Me neither. Sure, it's good, but it could have been way better.

[Lowdz]

It all sounds forced though. I can't really explain it but a lot of the examples I expect people to whip out (end of Octavarium, end of TMOLS, The Best of Times solo) sound artificial. There's quite a difference between making your guitar sound like its crying and making your guitar cry.

It could be that it's your interpretation of what he is doing that has changed over the years. You may just be hearing the new stuff differently, for any number of reasons.

[MajorMatt]

I want to see JP suit up.  bear suit up?   Where's that picture of him in a suit that popped up a year or two ago?

This one?....



Looks like a Mafia Don imo 

Matt

[darkshade]

How does that fool stay so humble when everyone worships him?  The man has no critics.

No critics? You should snoop around progarchives sometimes. That site is filled with DT haters, and A LOT of people that complain JP has no feel whatsoever in any of his playing. Those people have not heard aCoS, Goodnight Kiss, Solitary Shell, The Spirit Carries On, Hollow Years L@B, Through Her Eyes, Octavarium, About to Crash, Overture 1928, The Count Of Tuscany, Another Day, and other songs with great, non excessive wanking solos.

as a member of that site, i do know that many of the DT haters over at PA have heard those songs mentioned, and still argue JP has no feel (though some will admit to liking at least Octavarium (song), and MAYBE something off I&W or Scenes), they just dont really like Dream Theater

Then those people are idiots.  Not liking a band is one thing, but to say someone like JP has no feeling in his playing, even after hearing him play, is just idiotic.  If someone had heard just the last two minutes of "This Dying Soul' and said that, that would be one thing , but if you have heard even a small fraction of the rest of his playing, you really have to be an idiot to think that.

im not going to defend those members but they might think he's overrated, especially compared to other guitarists. or they just dont like his style, who knows... like i said, a lot of them grew up in the 70s so the prog rock guitarists back then were more blues, jazz, and classical based. Obviously so is JP, but his playing also is metal-inspired/shred-inspired (something that basically didnt exist in the 70s)

it's funny, because i remember a poll over there and it was "who is the better guitarist - John Petrucci or Dave Gilmour?" and man, was that the biggest debate ive seen on PA forums...

[j]

humm.. maybe, just maybe, the feeling that he plays with less, or more forced, feeling, is that he is SO clean and use such clean leads, that it takes away some of the "natural" emotion or something. Ie. in my opinion, there's just something about the more "gritty" fender sound or even the old ibanez leads he used to have. I loved how his ibanez sounded, and sometimes I just think his sound now is too processed, or too clean.. I don't know. It's hard to express in english, I lack the vocabulary

edit: To me though, I don't think there's any question about him being able to channel emotion and feel in his music.. but it's all subjective as  you say 

I agree, I've considered this before.  And you got your point across better than I would have, and I ONLY speak English.

It could be that it's your interpretation of what he is doing that has changed over the years. You may just be hearing the new stuff differently, for any number of reasons.

This is probably a factor in my case, although I certainly don't hold the opinion that Petrucci suddenly lost the ability to convey emotion through his playing or whatever.

Welcome, by the way.

it's funny, because i remember a poll over there and it was "who is the better guitarist - John Petrucci or Dave Gilmour?" and man, was that the biggest debate ive seen on PA forums...

Haha, I can see that being one hell of a "discussion".

-J

[darkshade]

oh it was 

the hump that broke the camel's back was someone said something like "Dave Gilmour can pack more emotion into one note-bend that lasts 45 seconds than Petrucci can with 482647329147 notes in 45 seconds"

[7StringedBeast]

oh it was 

the hump that broke the camel's back was someone said something like "Dave Gilmour can pack more emotion into one note-bend that lasts 45 seconds than Petrucci can with 482647329147 notes in 45 seconds"

that's kind of ridiculous.  No real argument as the emotion in some of petrucci's solos are outrageous.  Spirit carries on?  LITS?  UAGM?  Or when he's just improvising over something soft such as the introduction to a spirit carries on live.  And when I saw them play Octavarium at Sore live, when he held that last note of the razor's edge solo, it was the most emotional note I have ever heard in my life.  It was just beyond emotional.

[AwakeFromOctavarium]

How can you measure one's emotion anyway? Well there's clearly a difference between Kirk Hemmet and Eric Clapton, but I don't understand how you can possibly say Gilmour puts more emotion than Petrucci in any way. Just because he makes a better orgasm face? Because he takes years to pick another note? Some people are just less expressive. (Forgive my exaggeration, PF fans)

[orcus116]

You can just tell in the playing. This isn't a cop out or anything I just have no other way of explaining it.

[EPICVIEW]

JP has recently surpassed my two faves..Gary Moore and Michael Schenker. I made that declaration this summer.

wow.. all three are my favs...great taste you have my friend.

Gary is soooo bluesy tho, its hard to compare him to JP

[LieLowTheWantedMan]

I don't know, I've never bought the hype for that Hollow Years solo. 

Personally, I find the intro solo to be better than the middle one. I think it's an amazing mood setter.

[DarkLord_Lalinc]

And that middle Budokan guitar solo is your classic shredding climax, to end the ballad with a more powerful note and bring the song to its highest point.

[orcus116]

When I hear Hollow Years solo I only think of the intro one.