Dream Theater entered the studio in February v. No News is Good News

[SuperTaco]

As I said before, I remain cautiously optimistic.

This has gotta be the most widely use comment with regards to the new album. I've seen a lot of people use it over the last few months xD It's so true, though. Everything feels a bit different this time. We might be in for a huge treat (Or it could be average).

[kaos2900]

Dream Theater has never disappointed me so for me there is no need to be cautiously optimistic. I'm sure I'll like it.

[Voices]

Dream Theater has never disappointed me so for me there is no need to be cautiously optimistic. I'm sure I'll like it.

Same here. I'm trying to think what would be "very different" from what they've ever done...and there's a lot of things DT haven't done yet. For example, a more experimental album, a 'organic' kind of sound (like Heritage), a longer album divided in two different acts (same ideas with two different approaches), etc.

There's a lot of room for changes when it comes to DT13. I'm truly excited, and I won't be disappointed!

[BlackInk]

Like I said before, I've been part of three album releases so far, and two of those have been big disappointments. So they most definetely have the ability to disappoint me, but I do like ADToE, so they seemingly still have it in them to create good things. I'm pretty confindent by now though that they will never "amaze" me again, even though I'm sure they can make music I'll enjoy. So what I'm thinking is "it'll be interesting to see what they'll do", rather than "this is going to be great!".

[ResultsMayVary]

So the double album quote was taken out of context, but it's cool to hear that it'll be something different this time.

Yeah, he said no to the writers' block but not to the double album MUST BE A DOUBLE ALBUM THEN.

Of course, it is entirely possible, so we'll see. I was most interested in his comment accepting that the last couple of albums were safer and that there is some sort of change on the new one that they "needed to do". I've mentioned a bit earlier in this thread that the noises we're getting definitely go quite a lot beyond the usual fluff you get at this stage. It seems like the band genuinely believes they are doing something a bit different this time, more than previously.

This interests me the most. He's goes out of his way (not being led by the interviewer thankfully) to say this was something they needed to do, which implies very strongly that it's something noticeably different. And this excites me.

Octavarium is more like their archetypal album as it contains elements of every style that they do.

I absolutely agree with this. It was the first album I heard, so I may be a bit biased, but I think it's the perfect example of all of DT's elements on one album.

[Kotowboy]

I absolutely agree with this. It was the first album I heard, so I may be a bit biased, but I think it's the perfect example of all of DT's elements on one album.

And what better epic than Octavarium !

[Rodni Demental]

IT?

[BlackInk]

IT?

Eh no, not in a million years.

[Onno]

IT?

Eh no, not in a million years.

[AboutToCrash]

I still highly believe they are doing something in the vein of SDOIT. One disc being regular tracks and the second disc being conceptual but separate tracks as opposed to a 42 minute concept song. The only problem would be that it has kinda been done before. Maybe a heavier record? or even a lighter record? who knows. We'll probably hear something in October/November! Until then let us continue expanding upon the 90+ pages of speculation before anything has even been revealed yet 

[Train of Naught]

IT?

Yes, IT is better than Octavarium. *grabs popcorn* i'm serious about this though.

[Zydar]

IT?

Yes, IT is better than Octavarium. *grabs popcorn* i'm serious about this though.

I'm with you. Share some popcorn.

[BlobVanDam]

Here is Octavarium.


Here is the ballpark.















Here is IT.



Nope, not even close.

[Sycsa]

Yeah, I'll take IT over Octavarium any day. IT has so many good riffs and themes and it's just rockin. James put on his best studio performance since Awake, MM played his ass off. Octavarium, while it might be a better composition overall (plus it has JR's absolutely best solo ever), I really have to be in the mood to enjoy it (but then, I enjoy it immensely). It's a bit soft and slow for my tastes.

The other thing about Octavarium is that it's more '70s prog rock than modern prog metal. You just can't do '70s prog better than Pink Floyd, ELP, Jethro Tull, Yes, Genesis, Gentle Giant & co. used to do in the 70s. In my view, every modern band who try to play '70s prog fall short for this reason (that's why I could never really get into Spock's Beard, The Flower Kings, Transatlantic, Neal Morse...I absolutely love Riverside, though, the way they fused classic prog with metal on ADHD is spectacular).

[Rodni Demental]

Don't get me wrong I think Octavarium is great (even though it actually took a while to grow at first) but... Illumination Theory just seems more interesting at this point. Maybe because the former I've listened to hundreds of times and the latter probably less than 50. lol

[ReaperKK]

Interesting indeed. I'm hoping the extra studio time has gone into crafting one disc of something especially special, and not just creating a longer album of the same (although that wouldn't be anything different that they haven't done before).
I'm hoping the mention of a double album was just the equivalent of clickbait.

I really hope you're right.

[MirzekDT]

Yeah, I'll take IT over Octavarium any day. IT has so many good riffs and themes and it's just rockin. James put on his best studio performance since Awake, MM played his ass off. Octavarium, while it might be a better composition overall (plus it has JR's absolutely best solo ever), I really have to be in the mood to enjoy it (but then, I enjoy it immensely). It's a bit soft and slow for my tastes.

This. Every second of IT is pure bliss for my ears and I can listen to it any day. Especially the live version. Octavarium while very very good I have to be in mood for it and even then IT is still clearly better for me.

[BlackInk]

1) The production - The guitars on IT sound really weird and muffled, one of JP's worst guitar sounds on a DT album so far. The drums are just awfully produced. This lessens the listening experience of IT considerably for me. Octavarium sounds fine in every aspect of production.

2) Vocals - There are some truly cringe-worthy vocal lines by JLB on IT. Notes he just can not pull off. There are no such moments on Octavarium. The vocal melodies in IT are also just very "tame", or "nice". Most tracks on DT12 have that problem.

3) Lyrics - The lyrics on IT is just are okay at best, and horrible at worst. Cliche, preachy, silly, and seems as if just thrown together in an afternoon, with very little thought put into it. Octavarium's lyrics are amazing at best, and completely fine at worst. This is also a problem this track shares with most other tracks on DT12.

4) Flow - Octavarium has a very clear and defined flow throughout its entire length. The opening minutes might drag on repeated listens, but it's at least in the beginning, and doesn't disrupt any flow. On IT though, the extended bit is in the middle, and not only repeats that structure that they only just recently used in TCoT, but brings the track to a jarring halt halfway through. The other shifts between sections in IT are also much more awkward than in Octavarium, where they feel very natural.

5) The orchestra bit - The melodies are nice, but an orchestra with only strings sounds pretty hollow.

Musically, IT contains a quite a few cool ideas, I'll admit that much, but it has sooo many issues that just completely overshadows the good stuff.

[puppyonacid]

but an orchestra with only strings sounds pretty hollow.

.....unless it's supposed to be a string orchestra

[IDontNotDoThings]

but an orchestra with only strings sounds pretty hollow.

.....unless it's supposed to be a string orchestra

Should it really matter what it's "supposed to be". It's the end result that matters, isn't it?

[Kotowboy]

Here is Octavarium.


Here is the ballpark.















Here is IT.



Nope, not even close.

This.

Illumination Theory doesn't stay on one idea long enough for it to grab you. There's that bit near the beginning where it changes riff and feel every few bars and you're just getting into the groove and

then it changes. Plus THOSE DRUMS.

[hefdaddy42]

If I had to choose, I do prefer 8VM to IT.  But not by much.  Both are fantastic songs, and very compelling examples of progressive rock/metal songwriting (albeit for different reasons).

[emtee]

3 disc concept album with multiple songs where an orchestra is used. Liner booklet that has written story with artwork galore.


Or not 

[Lucien]

I like both songs. Octavarium is special to me because it was the first DT song I listened to, and it blew my mind at the time. Illumination Theory was a song I was hyped for (mostly because of the name ) releasing, and it delivered massively.

I like a whole lot of music more than either of those, though. I rarely listen to DT epics/songs anymore. Obviously, that will change once DT13 comes out, but until then, Scheherazade, The Rite of Spring, Sky Blue (the other DT), and To Pimp a Butterfly are my jam right now

[TheCountOfNYC]

Illumination Theory is an amazing song but Octavarium is simply on another plane of existence. I love all of their epics but ItPoE, IT, SDoIT, ACoS, and TCoT simply can't compete with the greatness of 8VM. IMO, it's the greatest song ever written.

[erwinrafael]

As one of the resident IT lovers here, I just have to say that if the snare sound is enough for you to not appreciate the single best drumming composition in a DT song, I would say that you really are just predisposed not to like it from the start.

In terms of structure, they are just apples and oranges. IT has a narrative. Octavarium is thematic. I think it's much easier to appreciate the IT structure if you appreciate the story it is telling, as the transitions and changes in mood contribute to the narrative.

[goo-goo]

Not a fan of Octavarium at all (although I do like it more in a live setting). But in my opinion, IT is leaps ahead than 8V. For me 8V is my least favorite DT epic...by a lot. I just find it "glued together". The section where songs and bands are names, I just cringe at it. Sounds very forced, especially lyrically. Musically, the intro is very long but I do like the Medicate Me and the Someone Like Him and Razor's Edge, which seem to have the same feel and flow as About To Crash and Losing Time. I love it when DT goes into this mode (Losing TIme, About To Crash, Trial of Tears, etc...).

[BlobVanDam]

Don't get me wrong I think Octavarium is great (even though it actually took a while to grow at first) but... Illumination Theory just seems more interesting at this point. Maybe because the former I've listened to hundreds of times and the latter probably less than 50. lol

I was worn out on IT well before 50 listens, probably at about 10-20, and it was as much of a slog to hear live as ITPOE, which is about where I rank it with. No idea how many countless times I've heard Octavarium, but it still sounds as fresh and beautiful as ever.

[Kotowboy]

Don't get me wrong I think Octavarium is great (even though it actually took a while to grow at first) but... Illumination Theory just seems more interesting at this point. Maybe because the former I've listened to hundreds of times and the latter probably less than 50. lol

I was worn out on IT well before 50 listens, probably at about 10-20, and it was as much of a slog to hear live as ITPOE, which is about where I rank it with. No idea how many countless times I've heard Octavarium, but it still sounds as fresh and beautiful as ever.

Yep. Octavarium never gets old ( song or album ) but I was bored of DT12 and IT after about 10 listens.

[Kotowboy]

Illumination Theory is an amazing song but Octavarium is simply on another plane of existence. I love all of their epics but ItPoE, IT, SDoIT, ACoS, and TCoT simply can't compete with the greatness of 8VM. IMO, it's the greatest song ever written.

I wouldn't go that far but I definitely think it's the best Dream Theater song - with Lines In The Sand a close second.

[ZKX-2099]

Illumination Theory is an amazing song but Octavarium is simply on another plane of existence. I love all of their epics but ItPoE, IT, SDoIT, ACoS, and TCoT simply can't compete with the greatness of 8VM. IMO, it's the greatest song ever written.

I wouldn't go that far but I definitely think it's the best Dream Theater song - with Lines In The Sand a close second.

Stop reading my diary.

[MarkFitDT]

Don't get me wrong I think Octavarium is great (even though it actually took a while to grow at first) but... Illumination Theory just seems more interesting at this point. Maybe because the former I've listened to hundreds of times and the latter probably less than 50. lol

I was worn out on IT well before 50 listens, probably at about 10-20, and it was as much of a slog to hear live as ITPOE, which is about where I rank it with. No idea how many countless times I've heard Octavarium, but it still sounds as fresh and beautiful as ever.

I cant remember the last time that I listened to Octavarium....I listen to IT nearly every day.

[425]

As one of the resident IT lovers here, I just have to say that if the snare sound is enough for you to not appreciate the single best drumming composition in a DT song, I would say that you really are just predisposed not to like it from the start.

**puts stick in cage**

Metropolis, Pt. 1 has the single best drumming composition in a DT song.

[Kotowboy]

Illumination Theory is an amazing song but Octavarium is simply on another plane of existence. I love all of their epics but ItPoE, IT, SDoIT, ACoS, and TCoT simply can't compete with the greatness of 8VM. IMO, it's the greatest song ever written.

I wouldn't go that far but I definitely think it's the best Dream Theater song - with Lines In The Sand a close second.

Stop reading my diary.

Your secret is safe with me. I won't tell anyone you have a massive crush on Hef.

[ZKX-2099]

Passionate love hardly qualifies as a crush.