Dream Theater entered the studio in February v. No News is Good News

[The Presence of Frenemies]

There are definitely times when it makes sense for it to be James (Imagine BMUBMD with John singing those backing screams). But I miss the multiple voice approach as well. It usually added to the songs even though Mike and especially John are quite limited in terms of emotive capacity (and John has very little range). I think the biggest thing is how that translates to the live performances, where post-MP, we've seen some very awkward turns from John (with the whole lipsyncing debate) up there.

[ReaPsTA]

A lot of times, it's really obvious that the music was written before the vocals.  Something like About to Crash has so much stuff going on under the vocals.  It feels like they recorded the music and were like "oh yeah, singing has to happen here.  We have to fit it somehow."  The music under the vocals is just so melodically and rhythmically dense.  It feels like a disservice to JLB a bit.

Well, i really liked that, and i think it's something that feels boring these days. JP usually plays some powerchords during the choruses, while on older albums he kept things interesting.

It doesn't have to be all one way or another.  During the second verse of Live, Die, Kill in IT, there's a lot of cool instrumental stuff going on.  But it's all either pure rhythm from the drums/bass/guitar or the keyboards directly complimenting the vocals by almost doubling the line or playing counterpoint to it.  The vocals are very clearly the focus.  Is that not interesting?

[OsMosis2259]

Mike Mangini
The stoppage of scheduled plans and work from forces out of one's control could really be a terrible thing. Snow happens. Well, record snow is rare. Anyway, I'm healing my muscle pulls, getting dental work, cut the hair, changed the diet, learning more ultra-prog AND opposite feeling electronic drumming than I'd ever take time to soak up, viewing online courses to catch up on things I should know about composing and studio gear I really didn't understand, spending more time with my family, compiling some non-drum riff seeds and taking a break from "science project" drum pattern building and killing myself and my need for hours for that in trying to get more coordinated and faster by brute force. I am posting an iPhone video of my 19&17 pattern on my YouTube Channel today (if it loads correctly.) Y'll know the cliche phrase ..."go with the flow ...." I hope anybody side tracked this this is also making lemonade out of lemons. I don't post a lot and get involved too much on the internet as you know, but I hope all this work produces things you can hear and hopefully enjoy and that all who have their course changed by outside forces, to see opportunity in it. This all looks overwhelming in print, but cleaning house really will be a big time saver in the end.

[SystematicThought]

I wish he would mention the studio 

[Edergilmour]

I'm starting to hope they are making all this mystery on purpose. (Cause they have something big and they want to keep it a secret) haha

[Prog Snob]

I'm sure they are writing away.

[rumborak]

3 weeks later he is still stuck at home because of snow?

o_O

[erwinrafael]

He says this is not meant to be musical but I hope that some of the things he showed here gets in the record, specially the 17 and 19 combo with the 32nd notes on the bass.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BJ37nonagho&feature=youtu.be

[Madman Shepherd]

There are definitely times when it makes sense for it to be James (Imagine BMUBMD with John singing those backing screams). But I miss the multiple voice approach as well. It usually added to the songs even though Mike and especially John are quite limited in terms of emotive capacity (and John has very little range). I think the biggest thing is how that translates to the live performances, where post-MP, we've seen some very awkward turns from John (with the whole lipsyncing debate) up there.

I sometimes miss the members backing on vocals too.  It got too much towards the end of Portnoy's tenure but when it is balanced it is pretty cool. 

I hate to bring up a previous intense debate but I definitely DO NOT mind the backing tracks for vocals.  So much better than some of the attempts by other members to replicate James's voice. 

[Prog Snob]

He says this is not meant to be musical but I hope that some of the things he showed here gets in the record, specially the 17 and 19 combo with the 32nd notes on the bass.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BJ37nonagho&feature=youtu.be

That was really cool! 

[Kotowboy]

He says it's not musical but that was probably the most musical "exercise' i've heard him play.

[?]

I hate to bring up a previous intense debate but I definitely DO NOT mind the backing tracks for vocals.  So much better than some of the attempts by other members to replicate James's voice.

Totally agreed; I've been listening to older DT live albums like LSFNY on Spotify recently and was struck by how cringeworthy the backing vocals were on some songs.

[BlobVanDam]

There are definitely times when it makes sense for it to be James (Imagine BMUBMD with John singing those backing screams). But I miss the multiple voice approach as well. It usually added to the songs even though Mike and especially John are quite limited in terms of emotive capacity (and John has very little range). I think the biggest thing is how that translates to the live performances, where post-MP, we've seen some very awkward turns from John (with the whole lipsyncing debate) up there.

Agreed. The simpler singing voices work well for backups in the studio imo. I felt that vocal element was missing on ADTOE (I still wanted to hear prominent backups from JP), and live the backing tracks look silly.
I think they should take an all or nothing approach. Have the backup vocals entirely live, or entirely use backing tracks without anyone standing at a mic.

[TL]

3 weeks later he is still stuck at home because of snow?

o_O

The north-east has gotten an insane amount of snow over the past few weeks, and in such a way that there's also a ridiculous amount of solid ice everywhere. Like, to an extent where those of us in the north-east think it's a lot of snow. I know that here in Halifax, every time some progress is made in clearing it, more rolls in. Boston has been one of the hardest hit areas too. I could see it being less than easy to get from Boston to New York at the moment.

[rumborak]

You may not be aware of that fact, but I live in Boston. There is no part of Massachusetts where for the last two weeks a person could not just have gotten into a car and driven/flown to New York.
I'm not suggesting anything, but snow is not the reason MM is not in the studio.

[Stadler]

Not defending Mike (I have no idea and won't even hazard a guess as to why he is where he is), but I know for me, I put off some non-essential work travel because I didn't want to leave my house unattended.  If you get an ice dam, you can get some pretty significant damage in a very short amount of time.  Granted, you can also get people to take care of that sort of thing, but still.

[Prog Snob]

You may not be aware of that fact, but I live in Boston. There is no part of Massachusetts where for the last two weeks a person could not just have gotten into a car and driven/flown to New York.
I'm not suggesting anything, but snow is not the reason MM is not in the studio.

yeah, it's not as if people are trapped in their homes. Something else is the reason.

[King Postwhore]

You may not be aware of that fact, but I live in Boston. There is no part of Massachusetts where for the last two weeks a person could not just have gotten into a car and driven/flown to New York.
I'm not suggesting anything, but snow is not the reason MM is not in the studio.

But the T rumbo, the T!!

[rumborak]

Not defending Mike (I have no idea and won't even hazard a guess as to why he is where he is), but I know for me, I put off some non-essential work travel because I didn't want to leave my house unattended.  If you get an ice dam, you can get some pretty significant damage in a very short amount of time.  Granted, you can also get people to take care of that sort of thing, but still.

That was maybe a good reason three weeks ago. Boston has actually gotten only smatterings of snow in the last three weeks. And we're not talking flying to another country. He could be back in Boston within an hour if a new snow storm was predicted.
I think the reason is really that JP and JR *write* the songs, and there's little point in having MM sit around.

[SuperTaco]

I think the reason is really that JP and JR *write* the songs, and there's little point in having MM sit around.

An unfortunate truth, If it is true. As good as those two are at writing songs, I think some significant input from JM and MM would do the end result good. They're the rhythm section, and they're both in the top echelon of their chosen craft (Especially MM).

[Sycsa]

They're the rhythm section, and they're both in the top echelon of their chosen craft (Especially MM).

I always felt like JM could be right up there as well, but he just doesn't want to go the extra mile in getting more exposure and making a bigger name out of himself. Although I did hear it once that he has some fundamental flaws in his technique, but I didn't buy it.

[Dream Team]

Speaking of JM, it would be nice if EVERY song had an interesting bass line instead of just doubling the guitar. DT12 was a step in the right direction.

Now onto my real reason for posting - production quality. I just listened to some 70s and 80s metal albums with awesome, crystal-clear production where every instrument has space. Stuff like Metal Heart from Accept, and a couple of Priest's older albums. What are the chances that the new DT and Metallica albums will have quality production like that? Less than zero?

[ReaPsTA]

I think the reason is really that JP and JR *write* the songs, and there's little point in having MM sit around.

JM and JLB are there too I assume.

The real issue I think is they liked the environment of the ADTOE sessions a lot.  You can't have that with a drum kit in the room.

[rumborak]

What's peculiar I find is also, given how he sits at home and practicing rhythms and concepts "that might become useful", it sounds to me he isn't even privy to the progress made in the studio. Like, if they sent him rough cuts here and there, I'm pretty sure he would work on those, not on making his legs stronger or 17+19 patterns.

[Calvin6s]

Speaking of JM, it would be nice if EVERY song had an interesting bass line instead of just doubling the guitar. DT12 was a step in the right direction.

Yeah.  JP shouldn't double JM's bassline.

[Calvin6s]

I just wish Mangini would be there during the writing process.  If he doesn't feel like he is the songwriting type, a simple "I like that guys" can be almost effective during the songwriting process.

[hefdaddy42]

Speaking of JM, it would be nice if EVERY song had an interesting bass line instead of just doubling the guitar. DT12 was a step in the right direction.

Yeah.  JP shouldn't double JM's bassline.

Yeah, no kidding.

[Madman Shepherd]

Not defending Mike (I have no idea and won't even hazard a guess as to why he is where he is), but I know for me, I put off some non-essential work travel because I didn't want to leave my house unattended.  If you get an ice dam, you can get some pretty significant damage in a very short amount of time.  Granted, you can also get people to take care of that sort of thing, but still.

Exactly.  Not only that but when you have a wife and two young kids, it really sucks to leave them and run the risk of not being able to get back and leaving her stuck with all of the problems at the house.  Maybe it was a mutual decision of the band to say, "Hey, if you dont really need me right now i'd rather stay home with the family just in case" even if he technically could make it there with minimal problems. 

One of the times I met MM I specifically asked him if he would be writing with DT for what turned out to be DT12 and he gave a very diplomatic answer but seemed excited to write with them.  Likewise, he seemed excited about not being forced to write with them for ADTOE (since he had a lot of odds and ends to wrap up).  He is just an excitable guy.   

[Kotowboy]

I just wish Mangini would be there during the writing process.  If he doesn't feel like he is the songwriting type, a simple "I like that guys" can be almost effective during the songwriting process.

He was.

For DT12.

[Calvin6s]

I just wish Mangini would be there during the writing process.  If he doesn't feel like he is the songwriting type, a simple "I like that guys" can be almost effective during the songwriting process.

He was.

For DT12.

And his drumming was better incorporated.  Don't know how much he got in the mix of songwriting non-drum parts as opposed to sitting on the bench waiting to record his parts.

Does Mangini have any songs out there that he was a main (at least co-equal) songwriter?  I honestly don't even know what his songwriting style is.

[Grizz]

I think the reason is really that JP and JR *write* the songs, and there's little point in having MM sit around.

JM and JLB are there too I assume.

The real issue I think is they liked the environment of the ADTOE sessions a lot.  You can't have that with a drum kit in the room.

James isn't there, according to his FB.

[The Presence of Frenemies]

So either DT is in the middle of their most scattered and disorganized writing/recording in years (if not ever), or there's some sort of giant misdirect/something they're not telling us.

[erwinrafael]

From JLB: Hey Everyone,
 Hope all is great at your end. Can't wait to get in the studio with my Bruthas and create the next album. Raaaawwwwk.

----

Also, sensing too much judgment on MM in this thread for staying home with the family during a record snowfall. MM took down his lengthy post about what he's doing at home and replaced it with a generic short update. I hope it's not him getting annoyed at people questioning his decision as if music is more important than family, as if he's not committed enough for these vocal fans.

[The Presence of Frenemies]

Not questioning MM--I just wish we'd get some sort of idea from the people who actually are at the studio. You know, just a "Hey, writing on DT13 is moving forward! Mike got held up in Boston but he's still going to be contributing, and we're excited to get James down soon as well!" The fact that we keep getting these posts about stuff going on that isn't the album is the odd part. Maybe this is just being spoiled by MP for all the years--the idea that they'd be in the studio for a month in that era and say nothing is unfathomable. At least it's not the Symphony X situation, where one band member's going "Hey, I did my tracks, no idea what else is going on." Which maybe underscores that DT is hardly the only band that has these periods of non-updates during studio time, but it's still frustrating because of the minimal effort required to put the fan's minds at ease.

[Calvin6s]

Talking about the band in terms of musical contribution seems far more appropriate than discussing their weight issues, hairline, clothing and even family.