Author Topic: The bass drum doubling guitars & bass; what do you think of this trend in DT? (Read 4077 times)

rumborak · « **on:** June 30, 2011, 08:16:21 AM »

I've been noticing this more and more in DT songs, that the bass drums is almost solely used for either fast double-bass, or accentuating palm-muted guitars and bass lines. Listen to OTBOA and compare the bass drums with JM's playing, there's only a few times where it differs.

rumborak

hefdaddy42 · « **Reply #1 on:** June 30, 2011, 09:48:00 AM »

I didn't notice, I was paying more attention to MM's cymbal and tom work. I will check it out when I can.

Ryzee · « **Reply #2 on:** June 30, 2011, 09:54:42 AM »

I think that's something that's been a part of metal music for awhile now, going as far back as the verse riff in "Domination" by Pantera or even the classic riff in the second half of "One" by Metallica. I enjoy it, syncopation like that in metal always ups the

factor for me.

darkshade · « **Reply #3 on:** June 30, 2011, 10:05:29 AM »

This has been going on since I&W (maybe WDADU), so I dont think it's a trend.

The trend of the bass always doubling the guitar had only gotten to be the norm since around the ToT era, which is (apparently) a thing of the past now, with OTBOA

perfectchaos180 · « **Reply #4 on:** June 30, 2011, 10:05:50 AM »

Agree with this topic soooooooo much, its unfortunate

ibadminssaywearewrongandtheyarerightanddtneverdoesanythingwrong

ronrule · « **Reply #5 on:** June 30, 2011, 10:10:52 AM »

Yeah, I think this is pretty normal. Being a King's X fan, I've noticed almost all their drumming (well the earlier albums) has the kick following the riff, not matter what rock drumming conventions would be expected for the song. Check out the verses on Talk To You!

ReaPsTA · « **Reply #6 on:** June 30, 2011, 10:17:28 AM »

Quote from: rumborak on June 30, 2011, 08:16:21 AM

I've been noticing this more and more in DT songs, that the bass drums is almost solely used for either fast double-bass, or accentuating palm-muted guitars and bass lines. Listen to OTBOA and compare the bass drums with JM's playing, there's only a few times where it differs.

rumborak

I actually don't mind that use of the drum. It makes the riffs, especially the djenty stuff, more powerful. I generally prefer a more unified rhythm pulse in the song, so when everything's locked in together it tends to work for me.

MetropolisxPt1 · « **Reply #7 on:** June 30, 2011, 10:21:40 AM »

Quote from: Ryzee on June 30, 2011, 09:54:42 AM

I think that's something that's been a part of metal music for awhile now, going as far back as the verse riff in "Domination" by Pantera or even the classic riff in the second half of "One" by Metallica. I enjoy it, syncopation like that in metal always ups the factor for me.

This, Its probably an effort to not change the sound of DT's drums too drastically at the same time.

bss4life15 · « **Reply #8 on:** June 30, 2011, 10:23:29 AM »

I always love having the syncopation of the bass drums and guitars in songs.

TheGreatPretender · « **Reply #9 on:** June 30, 2011, 11:23:08 AM »

Well, I'm a fan of Fear Factory, and yeah, they made it pretty much their trademark back in the early 90's. Of course, that's Extreme Metal, so there you can hear it very, very clearly.
But the point is, I think it makes the drums and the guitar (or bass) sound like one instrument, which is really cool, so instead of hearing the hit of the drum and the note of the guitar, it just sounds like a really punched note. I'm not saying they should do it on EVERY song, certainly not in ballads, but I do think it adds to how powerful a song feels.

rumborak · « **Reply #10 on:** June 30, 2011, 11:44:16 AM »

I think that's more my point really. I can totally see the value in it because it gives a great oomph to whatever the riff is. But, all in good measure, and lately I've had the impression that DT does almost nothing but play the bass drum in lockstep with guitar and bass.

rumborak

TheGreatPretender · « **Reply #11 on:** June 30, 2011, 11:46:55 AM »

Well, that's not so much on the drums as it is on the Bass I think. I love JM, but where are those crazy bass grooves and solos that he had in songs like Metropolis or Octavarium?

atalkingfish · « **Reply #12 on:** June 30, 2011, 02:48:26 PM »

Quote from: Ryzee on June 30, 2011, 09:54:42 AM

I think that's something that's been a part of metal music for awhile now, going as far back as the verse riff in "Domination" by Pantera or even the classic riff in the second half of "One" by Metallica. I enjoy it, syncopation like that in metal always ups the factor for me.

Yeah... I don't think you know what syncopation means

rumborak · « **Reply #13 on:** June 30, 2011, 02:59:24 PM »

I was gonna make that comment too

rumborak

MetropolisxPt1 · « **Reply #14 on:** June 30, 2011, 04:20:01 PM »

Quote from: rumborak on June 30, 2011, 11:44:16 AM

I think that's more my point really. I can totally see the value in it because it gives a great oomph to whatever the riff is. But, all in good measure, and lately I've had the impression that DT does almost nothing but play the bass drum in lockstep with guitar and bass.

rumborak

Agreed but they have been doing that since FII but then again the bass and drums are in sync in a lot of music. It would be nice to see some accentuation of some off beats

MetropolisxPt1 · « **Reply #15 on:** June 30, 2011, 04:20:54 PM »

double post refresh fail

Ryzee · « **Reply #16 on:** June 30, 2011, 05:46:32 PM »

Quote from: atalkingfish on June 30, 2011, 02:48:26 PM

Quote from: Ryzee on June 30, 2011, 09:54:42 AM
I think that's something that's been a part of metal music for awhile now, going as far back as the verse riff in "Domination" by Pantera or even the classic riff in the second half of "One" by Metallica. I enjoy it, syncopation like that in metal always ups the factor for me.

Yeah... I don't think you know what syncopation means

Yeah you're right, that's not the right term. Sorryaboutit. What am I thinking of?

Metabog · « **Reply #17 on:** June 30, 2011, 06:03:56 PM »

That's a metal staple. And it sounds awesome.

rmp0012002 · « **Reply #18 on:** June 30, 2011, 08:02:02 PM »

I first remember a drummer doubling the bass and guitar with Scott Travis in RacerX, good example is Scarified. I have always thought MP always tried to mix it up but maybe it's lack of ideas or just easier to lock in with the groove of the guitar and bass.

gabeh1018 · « **Reply #19 on:** June 30, 2011, 09:15:46 PM »

i personally love when the 3 instruments lock up as well! so powerful , so energy!! It's great when bands like Sevendust do this as well

TheGreatPretender · « **Reply #20 on:** June 30, 2011, 09:21:38 PM »

Like I said, I like it, I just hope to hear at least a couple of Bass solos. The fact that DT is a breakdown type of band, and they're solo heavy, makes the drum and guitar sync okay for the riff parts.

I barely even noticed, to be honest. After Fear Factory, the way DT does it is nothing. It certainly doesn't seem to HINDER the songs. So I'm not gonna complain.

The Silent Cody · « **Reply #21 on:** June 30, 2011, 10:14:57 PM »

Like you said, Fear Factory is a typical example of bass drum doubling guitars, you could even tell that this is their style. DT also have it, but in more wise and clever way - not all the time

And I love it, I always liked rhytmic and groovy songs.

ddtonfire · « **Reply #22 on:** June 30, 2011, 11:23:42 PM »

When I write/record music, my bass drum is usually synchronized with the bass, and oftentimes the guitar as well, so I see no issue with it. It seems to provide a lot more power/oomph to the song.

TheGreatPretender · « **Reply #23 on:** July 01, 2011, 12:08:53 AM »

Quote from: ddtonfire on June 30, 2011, 11:23:42 PM

When I write/record music, my bass drum is usually synchronized with the bass, and oftentimes the guitar as well, so I see no issue with it. It seems to provide a lot more power/oomph to the song.

Well, I do think in some cases, it's better to sacrifice that oomph for some colors. You know, some 'jazziness' I guess you can call it. Look at Learning to Live or Metropolis. That's what I mean.

But like I said, I like the sync, I'm just being a devil's advocate. Or... Well, since we're talking about metal... Advocate of the Beast?

WildeSilas · « **Reply #24 on:** July 01, 2011, 10:14:13 AM »

Not sure how much stock anyone here puts in the Kings X influence, but they did influence ALOT of bands to adopt this nearly robotic bass/bass drum coupling in the early 90s. They themselves borrowed it from Zep to some degeree, but everyone from Alice in Chains to Foo Fighters to Alter Bridge has adopted a similar approach based on their admiration for KX. I know DT has had their albums in studio before, and JM plays in Jelly Jam with Ty Tabor. I wouldn't be surprised if the KX factor was at least a part of that shift since SDOIT.

lordxizor · « **Reply #25 on:** July 01, 2011, 10:31:08 AM »

I think using the bass drum in this fashion can really accentuate some good riffs, but I feel like it's used too much. Funny this topic was started today because I was just thinking about this yesterday.

MetropolisxPt1 · « **Reply #26 on:** July 01, 2011, 12:49:38 PM »

Quote from: WildeSilas on July 01, 2011, 10:14:13 AM

Not sure how much stock anyone here puts in the Kings X influence, but they did influence ALOT of bands to adopt this nearly robotic bass/bass drum coupling in the early 90s. They themselves borrowed it from Zep to some degeree, but everyone from Alice in Chains to Foo Fighters to Alter Bridge has adopted a similar approach based on their admiration for KX. I know DT has had their albums in studio before, and JM plays in Jelly Jam with Ty Tabor. I wouldn't be surprised if the KX factor was at least a part of that shift since SDOIT.

its the ringo influence.

olliemedsy · « **Reply #27 on:** July 03, 2011, 12:26:45 PM »

Meshuggah anyone?

LieLowTheWantedMan · « **Reply #28 on:** July 03, 2011, 12:27:35 PM »

I like it.

The Silent Cody · « **Reply #29 on:** July 03, 2011, 12:27:55 PM »

Meshuggah

News: Fall Into the Light, official video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFxH4kky6z4

Author Topic: The bass drum doubling guitars & bass; what do you think of this trend in DT? (Read 4077 times)