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Dream Theater => Dream Theater => Topic started by: MinistroRaven on April 08, 2024, 06:18:24 AM
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From their Twitter account:
We are excited to announce the Europe leg of our 40th Anniversary Tour 2024-2025. This tour is going to be incredibly special for all of us! More info on dates, venues and how to get tickets at https://dreamtheater.net/tour
(https://i.imgur.com/7i271Kw.png)
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Well, that's certainly news.
Lovely that symbology for albums across the entire era of the band are prominent.
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November 8th in Stockholm..... let's go!
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What has me most excited is the return to the AEW format.
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Very exciting that they're doing the 40th Anniversary tour! I for sure thought there would be one tour before that. An Evening With is always the way to go with DT!!
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Nice!
But what does that mean for the release date of the new album? Will they hold off the release until after this anniversary tour and then do the "proper" new album tour?
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Two things: 1) the O2 in London is massive. That's a Maiden/Metallica venue. DT historically haven't even been to fill Wembley Arena without it being half closed off. The promoter sure is taking a gamble on MP being back and it being a 40th anniversary show, and 2) I hope London will remain MP's first show back because while tickets will be pricey, it'll save me from flying to a more exotic part of the world for his return :biggrin:
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Are any of the tickets on sale yet? I only tried the Stockholm show but nothing is listed.
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https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/dream-theater-album-tour-interview-1234998171/
DT whole band interview. Hadn't seen something like this in a while...
How does the band feel different with Mike back? Has he changed? Have you all changed?
Portnoy: I’ve changed a lot since I left in 2010. Back then, I was a control freak. I was very obsessive and controlling over a lot of elements. But everything I’ve done over the last 13 years outside of Dream Theater taught me how to be more of a team player. I’ve had all these experiences playing with these 87 other bands all these years, and each one of those bands has a different chemistry, different dynamic, different personalities. I think that’s helped me grow as a person. For me, [returning] is almost like a learning process of how to fit in with this new chemistry. It’s like, after 40 years, I’m the new guy.
Petrucci: We definitely had the hard conversation like, “OK, this isn’t the same band you left. Things are run differently.” It took us a few years to regroup and figure things out, and we got to a point where we’re a really well-oiled machine. But Mike has been great. He’s way more chill. [Turns to Portnoy]. You even say some things that are kind of funny, like, “If I’m allowed to do this.” You don’t have to be that careful, but I appreciate it. I feel like it’s very respectful on his part. It’s like a reset.
Myung: There’s a maturity everybody has. It involves having more patience and just being more mellow and appreciating each other and what we bring. We keep talking about the group dynamic, what it takes to have a bunch of guys together and have it really work and move forward. We just feel that those elements are there to make a great album and to enjoy being together, and to enter this next phase with some real grace.
I'm glad that MP isn't a control freak now. Better dynamics.
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Excellent news, I'll be waiting for them in Milan! :hefdaddy
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Budapest looks like a fine option to me. :tup
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Let's hope they'll do this tour like the Octavarium tour, that was also the XX anniversary tour: one song per album (including MM albums), some b-side and a lot of the new album. The Evening With format is always great! BTW they named the tour XXXX because of the cool artwork? But isn't it should be XL?
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Given the average Dream Theater song length, there's no way every album is featured in the set list. :biggrin:
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Cool, time to hope for some good new tunes.
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Really happy to see Evening With make a return. I've always found DT shines in that format.
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Incredible news!! I knew JLB still had it and will be able to CRUSH these long form shows! Be ready to be WOW'd!!!!!
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Given the average Dream Theater song length, there's no way every album is featured in the set list. :biggrin:
;D ;D
Let's see... 15 songs from previous albums = 8 minute average lenght + 40 minutes for the new album. It IS possible! :metal :corn
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Given the average Dream Theater song length, there's no way every album is featured in the set list. :biggrin:
Also, 15 albums is kinda a drag to go through. I mean, I'd still watch it, but back with Octavarium you had 8 albums to go through, now the setlist would feel like a checklist: here's the 9th album.... here's the 10th album.... still five to go.... it kills the surprise of what's coming next, and if you want to hear a certain song and they skip it for that specific album, there, it's gone.
Ready to eat my words but I think these kind of chronological setlists should be done when the albums in a discography are not that many.
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Super stoked about the Europe tour announcement! Thinking of hitting up one of the Scandinavian shows to catch Portnoy in action. Sure, I'm a bit worried about the concert length and James's performance, but hey, that won't stop me from having an awesome time!
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Great news. Wondering if London will be the very 1st reunion show or if they will play any gigs in the US before that. That 1st show-no matter where it is-has to be recorded. It will be something very special.
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Also, 15 albums is kinda a drag to go through. I mean, I'd still watch it, but back with Octavarium you had 8 albums to go through, now the setlist would feel like a checklist: here's the 9th album.... here's the 10th album.... still five to go.... it kills the surprise of what's coming next, and if you want to hear a certain song and they skip it for that specific album, there, it's gone.
Ready to eat my words but I think these kind of chronological setlists should be done when the albums in a discography are not that many.
I think it would work much better without any obligation of chronological order. But I see your point, if some song of a particular album is played, then that album is done in the show.
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Loved this one:
"John Myung: It was a collective moment of certainty.
Petrucci: That sounds like an album title. [All laugh]."
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I can't find anything representing WDaDU, ADTOE, or AVFTTOTW on that poster. Also, what's on the top of the very front X? I can't tell what that is. Helpppp
EDIT: It's the clown!! JLB posted a version on FB that's easier to see.
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Also, 15 albums is kinda a drag to go through. I mean, I'd still watch it, but back with Octavarium you had 8 albums to go through, now the setlist would feel like a checklist: here's the 9th album.... here's the 10th album.... still five to go.... it kills the surprise of what's coming next, and if you want to hear a certain song and they skip it for that specific album, there, it's gone.
Ready to eat my words but I think these kind of chronological setlists should be done when the albums in a discography are not that many.
They might do it like Rush did on the R40 tour - there could be a few albums that get skipped from show to show, depending on how much the setlist rotates from night to night (that RS interview gives the impression there won't be as much rotation as in tours past). I could also see them doing a reverse chronological setlist like Rush did for the R40 just to change it up; after all, the 20th Anniversary tour featured setlists in chronological order as did the brief 30th Anniversary tour they did through Europe in 2015. So to do the same thing again might feel predictable. Or they might just do a typical random assortment setlist as Rush did for the R30 tour. That said, given that it is being branded an anniversary tour and not one merely in support of their new album, I tend to think the setlist will have a chronological element to it.
That all said, I can't foresee them doing the 12SS on this tour, unless it was done in medley form, and since JP's anti-medley schmedley, probably not. Then again, doing the whole thing in medley form would be a great way to perform it in condensed form, banging out 5 albums from their catalog and leaving more room for everything else.
As for if the London show will be the first one, my guess is yes, judging by MP's final comment in that RS interview. Additionally, if they would do warmup shows, I would expect them to be done through Europe in the summer to hit the festivals; so it wouldn't make sense for them to go back to Europe a few months later for the proper tour.
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I'm extremely excited for this, even moreso for the fact that the very first show will be in London. However one thing I did notice is that this is a very gruelling schedule for James. Not only is it an evening with, but they are doing 3 nights in a row twice during the November run. Unless he's worked with an incredible vocal coach that has shown him how to preserve his voice better, those third shows will be hardgoing for both him and the audience.
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I can't find anything representing WDaDU, ADTOE, or AVFTTOTW on that poster. Also, what's on the top of the very front X? I can't tell what that is. Helpppp
That's the ADTOE clown, I can't find anything for WDADU or View either though.
Exciting news, though I'm a little bummed this means there probably won't be any American shows until 2025!
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This is interesting, maybe answering some questions here:
"Mike, are there songs from the Mangini albums they made without you that you’d like to play live?
Petrucci: I don’t think he knows any of them. [All laugh].
Portnoy: One of the things we discussed with me coming back was about set lists for future tours. And John and the guys were open to me taking the reins back [in making them]. But with that came the discussion: what are we going to do with all the stuff from the last 13 years?
Petrucci: Yeah, you need to research.
Portnoy: I need to dive into those albums and do my research and learn these songs in order because obviously everything has to be represented. I am not going to speak for these guys, but I don’t think they want those five albums just erased from the history of the band.
Petrucci: No, absolutely not. Especially not the Grammy Award-winning [“The Alien”]. Did I just say that?
Portnoy: Geez.
LaBrie: The irony in that is I don’t want to play that song."
(Why, James?!)
Good to see MP still thinking as a fan inside the band! :tup
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They keep moving the anniversary earlier and earlier. Score tour was 05-06, not 04-05.
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That's the ADTOE clown, I can't find anything for WDADU or View either though.
Exciting news, though I'm a little bummed this means there probably won't be any American shows until 2025!
I agree, but at the same time I’m glad that they’re taking their time with all of this. They didn’t immediately rush into a tour, they didn’t go throw an album together in a couple of weeks. I think they’re doing it right.
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That's the ADTOE clown, I can't find anything for WDADU or View either though.
Neither can I, however, there's a face in the "Awake clock" that I can't seem to connect to any cover art of theirs, am I missing something or is it a hint of the DT16 artwork? 🤔
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The first show is London and it is a Sunday! I will be there! :metal I wonder where they may be playing at this time. :huh:
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They keep moving the anniversary earlier and earlier. Score tour was 05-06, not 04-05.
It’s a celebration of their upcoming 40th anniversary. :lol
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That all said, I can't foresee them doing the 12SS on this tour, unless it was done in medley form, and since JP's anti-medley schmedley, probably not. Then again, doing the whole thing in medley form would be a great way to perform it in condensed form, banging out 5 albums from their catalog and leaving more room for everything else.
I can't see them knocking out 5 out of the 6 (now 7) albums that this "classic" lineup has on a medley, or even on the whole Suite. My guess is if it ever happens, it won't be on this tour.
I do agree with you that a good way to do this would be to copy Rush's R40 tour. I loved that backwards chronology of the setlist they did, and it will give them a good reason to finally end a show with Only a Matter of Time! (selfish want ;D)
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Can anyone give me a hand understanding what pre-sale is or how it works lol... I put my email address in for the London date and it said something about pre-sale not guaranteeing tickets. Is it a select number of seats go up for pre-sale and beyond that you have to wait until when the main sale goes live?
Beyond stoked for this
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They might do it like Rush did on the R40 tour - there could be a few albums that get skipped from show to show, depending on how much the setlist rotates from night to night (that RS interview gives the impression there won't be as much rotation as in tours past). I could also see them doing a reverse chronological setlist like Rush did for the R40 just to change it up; after all, the 20th Anniversary tour featured setlists in chronological order as did the brief 30th Anniversary tour they did through Europe in 2015. So to do the same thing again might feel predictable. Or they might just do a typical random assortment setlist as Rush did for the R30 tour. That said, given that it is being branded an anniversary tour and not one merely in support of their new album, I tend to think the setlist will have a chronological element to it.
All nice points!
Also, I don't want to be disrespectful to the debut album, but WDADU kinda kills the chronological thing, either in order or backwards. Imagine that Images and Words is their first album - you either start with Metropolis or end with Learning to Live or Pull Me Under. There are great songs on WDADU but starting with Afterlife (like they actually did in 2015) or closing with Only a Matter of Time just isn't that strong, especially with the big shadow of Images and Words looming over it.
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"LaBrie: What’s funny about that is when I saw you guys [John and Mike] in Toronto, I remember thinking, “Fuck, that’s undeniable.” It’s just like the connection was just boom."
Some of you need to read that article. I'm sure there's SOME license with it, and the message/narrative is that "we're a team", but they DIRECTLY answer several of the (nagging) questions that were persistent in the thread we had right after the announcement. It seems they ended up having a number of the conversations that were outstanding at the time of the first announcement.
And not going to lie, as someone the same age and in many ways in the same station of life as them, some of that was emotional (in a good way) to read.
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The first show is London and it is a Sunday! I will be there! :metal I wonder where they may be playing at this time. :huh:
It's at the O2 Arena!
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This RS interview is really excellent!! Indeed I think it adresses a lot of questions we are discussing here.
About the new album, they plan to release it before the tour starts.
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One thing I took from the RS article is it said JP was producing, and NOT JP & MP. I thought that was interesting, though it may have just been pointing out JP's role and not necessarily diminishing MP's.
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https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/dream-theater-album-tour-interview-1234998171/
DT whole band interview. Hadn't seen something like this in a while...
I'm glad that MP isn't a control freak now. Better dynamics.
This interview was a great read, cool bits of info.
James don't want to sing the Alien.
MP open to play the MM material.
The new album will be 60+ minutes long
MP will craft the setlist
They all love being together.
:metal
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I'm counting my €'s. Thinking of going to Cologne, Luxembourg and Holland, all within 3 hours drive. 3 Times DT in 1 month. Really thinking of it ...
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Honestly the idea of an R40-style backwards journey seems pretty cool. That said, after seeing so many videos of James not doing a great job I'm really concerned by them doing Evening With shows unless they do a bunch of instrumentals to let him rest, do excerpts of epics, or downtune and slow down a bunch of songs, eg if you listen to Rush doing "Circumstances" in 07.
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This interview was a great read, cool bits of info.
James don't want to sing the Alien.
MP open to play the MM material.
The new album will be 60+ minutes long
MP will craft the setlist
They all love being together.
:metal
Was this said in this interview? In which part?
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Honestly the idea of an R40-style backwards journey seems pretty cool. That said, after seeing so many videos of James not doing a great job I'm really concerned by them doing Evening With shows unless they do a bunch of instrumentals to let him rest, do excerpts of epics, or downtune and slow down a bunch of songs, eg if you listen to Rush doing "Circumstances" in 07.
I would be VERY surprised if both of the two halves of the show wouldn't have (at least) an instrumental.
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I can't see them knocking out 5 out of the 6 (now 7) albums that this "classic" lineup has on a medley, or even on the whole Suite. My guess is if it ever happens, it won't be on this tour.
Yeah, I tend to agree with you. But I could see the medley being a secondary option, too. Had they separated a proper tour in support of the new album from their 40th anniversary, I'd have expected the 12SS to be featured on the 40th anniversary tour. But because they're combining the two together, it's not a realistic option.
I do agree with you that a good way to do this would be to copy Rush's R40 tour. I loved that backwards chronology of the setlist they did, and it will give them a good reason to finally end a show with Only a Matter of Time! (selfish want ;D)
I thought the same thing. They could even tack the end of March of the Tyrant on to the end of OaMoT as they did in 1993 to include just a taste of the Majesty demo as well! ;)
All nice points!
Thanks! :)
Also, I don't want to be disrespectful to the debut album, but WDADU kinda kills the chronological thing, either in order or backwards. Imagine that Images and Words is their first album - you either start with Metropolis or end with Learning to Live or Pull Me Under. There are great songs on WDADU but starting with Afterlife (like they actually did in 2015) or closing with Only a Matter of Time just isn't that strong, especially with the big shadow of Images and Words looming over it.
I thought about that too. I still maintain that OaMoT could be a good track to end on. But then again, just as they bookended the 20th anniversary shows with tracks from 8v, they could do something similar with the upcoming tour. Something like:
new song
new song
The Alien
d/t track
....
IaW track
WDaDU track
new epic
~~~encore~~~
classic track (Metropolis, PMU, LtL, ToT, ItNoG, 8v, etc.)
One thing I took from the RS article is it said JP was producing, and NOT JP & MP. I thought that was interesting, though it may have just been pointing out JP's role and not necessarily diminishing MP's.
I picked up on that as well. Very interesting if JP is producing without MP. I wonder if that will be the way it is going forward, with MP taking more of a back seat in some areas, or if he'll co-produce future albums again.
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The show in London is going to be insane. I know it's the first show back - but for the energy I anticipate will be there - I really hope they record/release it. It will be an experience for many, I'm sure.
Great interview, really excited to hear the space they're in is so positive. Totally agreed w the part about the chemistry at John's solo shows, watching them together again was special. My hopes for the new record are as high as possible right now.
Edit: lol - Myung: We should sell tissue boxes.
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Was this said in this interview? In which part?
My bad, I think I misread something.
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My bad, I think I misread something.
No problem, we're all too excited with the news to judge! ;D ;)
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It's at the O2 Arena!
Yeah, I just found that out too. That is an awesome place for a concert. There is virtually no bad seats in the arena, even in the upper level. :metal
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Two things: 1) the O2 in London is massive. That's a Maiden/Metallica venue. DT historically haven't even been to fill Wembley Arena without it being half closed off. The promoter sure is taking a gamble on MP being back and it being a 40th anniversary show
Being the only UK show (😢) should help with filling it up a bit I suppose.
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Being the only UK show (😢) should help with filling it up a bit I suppose.
They also mentioned that it being the first show, they expect people to come in from all over the world.
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Cool, time to hope for some good new tunes.
Holy shit, ZGF!
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That's the ADTOE clown, I can't find anything for WDADU or View either though.
Exciting news, though I'm a little bummed this means there probably won't be any American shows until 2025!
I thought the sandcastle looks like the part of mountain from A View From the Top of the World, but that seems a bit stretching.
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This plus bringing Portnoy back represents a great set of business decisions by the band. They're going to make a killing. I hope they come through my area when they do the American leg!
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Great news, but I’m very surprised they didn’t kick it off in NYC. Must have been a reason.
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Great news, but I’m very surprised they didn’t kick it off in NYC. Must have been a reason.
This. I certainly would have been there.
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Great interview! So glad they all agreed to include the non MP albums to be represented. The positive energy seems legit and not manufactured. And yes, being the age I am...and they are, discussions of, "how much time do we have left" hits hard. They ended up back together where they all belong and that's how the DT story will eventually end.
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Great news, but I’m very surprised they didn’t kick it off in NYC. Must have been a reason.
I could be wrong on this, but it seems like they almost always start their tours in Europe and wrap it up in the US at the end.
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I could be wrong on this, but it seems like they almost always start their tours in Europe and wrap it up in the US at the end.
Traditionally, yes, but that hasn't been the case the last few tours.
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Anyone send me the article? It's behind a paywall. I am not paying to access it.
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Anyone send me the article? It's behind a paywall. I am not paying to access it.
The Rolling Stone article? I didn't have to pay to access it.
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Considering its a 40 year anniversary tour celebrating the legacy of the band it would be bizarre to ignore a decade of music with a different drummer which still amounted to 5 studio albums. They're not playing my city unfortunately but I would have gone if they did! Like others have suggested I think it would be cool if they did some rotation from night to night for more song choices.
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Anyone send me the article? It's behind a paywall. I am not paying to access it.
Here's the PDF
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1-5TGTFeGKNNkj9kFS8R7E5Bu6DUnkISg/view?usp=sharing
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Considering its a 40 year anniversary tour celebrating the legacy of the band it would be bizarre to ignore a decade of music with a different drummer which still amounted to 5 studio albums.
They're not going to ignore a decade of music, the interview covers it.
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Loved the Myung humor!
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The interview was not behind a pay wall for me.
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Thanks! I DID have it on a paywall. Not sure why.
p.s. Myung and his DT tissue box! There's a market! KISSTheater lol
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The Rolling Stone article? I didn't have to pay to access it.
Welcome to the Forums!
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I'll me there Nov. 6th in Helsinki! :metal
The venue is a bit questionable though.:justjen Last time DT was in Finland, they played my hometown of Tampere. The venue here is brand new, and the best multi purpose arena in the country. I guess they couldn't book it this time.
Oh well, into the capital I go...
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It just feels so great to here the guys together and doing well. I'm confident the album is going to be great and the tour is going to be a treat for longtime fans and new fans alike. Also, I'm kind of with James if they decide to shelve The Alien. They played it every single show the last two tours.
I'm very excited they are doing an Evening With show and that Portnoy seems like he's going to be doing some mixing of the setlists instead of a static setlist each night, but I do hope they take consideration with James voice and their own pacing. They should probably throw a couple instrumentals in and an acoustic section or something to give everyone a breather. It was very obvious towards the end of the last tour that James was just running out of steam and they were playing too difficult a setlist.
Anyway, I'm excited for DT in a way that I haven't been in a long time. Even though I really loved Distance Over Time and A View from the Top of the World, I think this album and tour have a chance to be something special.
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I feel so bad for MP that he has to sit and listen to The Astonishing. :lol
To this day I have never heard the whole thing.
As cool as it would be to see them live again, I just can't spend the dough not knowing what James will sound like. I will buy the studio albums, as I always do, but I can't see me seeing them live again.
Sorry to be the buzzkill.
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They're not going to ignore a decade of music, the interview covers it.
Exactly. My point was that it would be bizarre to assume they would ignore it to begin with!
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Given that this will be an anniversary tour, and An Evening With, what are the odds that they do one song per album on the tour? Maybe not EVERY night, but perhaps rotate some songs in and out, especially with the MM-era stuff.
I could set the first set covering stuff from the last twenty years, and then the second set from their first twenty years, and then an encore of something especially special.
-Marc.
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Great news, but I’m very surprised they didn’t kick it off in NYC. Must have been a reason.
So that they can have the tour finale in NYC.
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Guess I'll be at the London show.
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While I'm stoked to hear news about DT touring again w MP, I am REALLY BUMMED that they won't be doing a "reunion/escape from studio" summer U.S. Tour! Seems like a gross missed opportunity, not only for income, but mostly for the buzz and set up of anticipation for new album and 40th anniversary tour! "I" would have loved a summer tour, whether it be a 100 minute "dreamsonic" tour with other bands or something similar, just to get out and play the CLASSIC DT / MP material ALONE! Then add new songs and some MM years material on the BIG tour that starts in OCT. I know lots of people on this site are Mangini Era fans that found DT in last 14 years and that's great. I just feel like I want a classics tour before opening up the entire catalogue which is only right. Oh well. :censored
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It will still be MOSTLY classics. It's not like they will do an entire set of Mangini era music.
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So I guess it’ll be mostly radio silence from them over the summer, apart from them revealing the new album details….North American dates probably will be after the new year.
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ticket prices are double what i paid last time. Sorry but i'm not paying 100,- for a DT show...
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So that they can have the tour finale in NYC.
I don't think this is the last Dream Theater tour, but on the 1% chance they pull a Rush and call it quits after 40 years, now I'm really wondering whether I'd go to the finale in NYC...
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ticket prices are double what i paid last time. Sorry but i'm not paying 100,- for a DT show...
Where are you seeing the prices?
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That interview made me so happy to read. I like how Myung suggests they provide tissue boxes for the concerts.
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normal ticket is 85,-E "golden circle" is 115,-E
you can just go to the site of the venue and check prices, ticketsale starts 12th over here
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Wow they're playing the biggest concert (sport) arena in Croatian capital, that's usually only reserved for the biggest names. I highly doubt they'll fill it, maybe they use only half of it. Either way, I'll be there :metal
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A fan on FB complained about London being the only UK date, to which Mike replied:
People from all over the WORLD are gonna be coming to London for the VERY 1ST show!! Surely coming from somewhere within the UK shouldn’t be THAT much of a stretch considering what many others will be doing…
So I guess it's definitive that there won't be any summer dates and that this autumn European tour will mark the FIRST live show of Mike Portnoy with Dream Theater since 2009.
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*Since 2010
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Why why why....not...July-August DT U.S. REUNION tour. New cd out oct.11th. Euro tour oct/Nov '24. US tour starts mid Jan '25. Asia/aus April '25. Euro festival tour summer '25. South America Sept '25. U.S. 2nd leg Nov-Dec '25. Feb '26 start work on DT17! :censored :censored :censored
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A fan on FB complained about London being the only UK date, to which Mike replied:
People from all over the WORLD are gonna be coming to London for the VERY 1ST show!! Surely coming from somewhere within the UK shouldn’t be THAT much of a stretch considering what many others will be doing…
So I guess it's definitive that there won't be any summer dates and that this autumn European tour will mark the FIRST live show of Mike Portnoy with Dream Theater since 2009.
:censored :censored :censored
Sorry Mike. I'm Not flying to London! Been huge fan since '92 but at 64 years of age and financially responsible....this ain't happenin' lol
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:censored :censored :censored
Sorry Mike. I'm Not flying to London! Been huge fan since '92 but at 64 years of age and financially responsible....this ain't happenin' lol
Yeah, I mean, maybe 10 years ago I would have jumped at the opportunity for this one. But being a lot older and having responsibilities... I will swing my hometown show and maaaaaybe a New York/2nd New England show. I'm just sad that I'll probably be off the forums for 6 months trying to not spoil the setlist
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only reason for me to go is when there's proof that JLB is back at where he was around 2003-2004.
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only reason for me to go is when there's proof that JLB is back at where he was around 2003-2004.
The evidence is mounting... See my other thread. We are SO back
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I don't know, I guess DT is really wanting this first show to be a major event, not just another beggining of a tour.
Out of curiosity, is there any place in England more distant from London than a 5 hours car drive or 6 hours by bus?
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Well, even Glasgow to London is seven hours by car.
If the first show had been in NYC, I'd have been there. In fact, I'd have been there virtually anywhere in the world. The fact it's in London, 75 minutes away on a train, is a massive piece of good fortune for me.
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Well, even Glasgow to London is seven hours by car.
If the first show had been in NYC, I'd have been there. In fact, I'd have been there virtually anywhere in the world. The fact it's in London, 75 minutes away on a train, is a massive piece of good fortune for me.
Is there confirmation anywhere that these are going to be the first dates? I was kind of just assuming there was gonna be a late summer/fall tour in the states that just hasn't been announced yet
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ticket prices are double what i paid last time. Sorry but i'm not paying 100,- for a DT show...
Same here. That´s the price I´m paying for a few 2 day festivals this year.
As much as I would love to see them play with MP, I'm not paying this amount of money to see JLB struggle on the last show of the whole tour.
I might takes my chances on the resale market based on the setlist and first performances of the tour.
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I'm just sad that I'll probably be off the forums for 6 months trying to not spoil the setlist
As long as the setlists are rotating, not sure why you'll have to do that. And the indications are there that there will be some variation from show to show.
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Is there confirmation anywhere that these are going to be the first dates? I was kind of just assuming there was gonna be a late summer/fall tour in the states that just hasn't been announced yet
MP seems to have confirmed London will be the first show. They're playing in the UK's largest indoor arena, usually reserved for the likes of Maiden and Metallica. He said they're playing there on the basis that people from all over the world will be in attendance.
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I'm hoping to snag two tickets tomorrow at the Stockholm presale and I thought about going for the London one as well. But without trying to spoil the good news of the tour, for which I am truly excited, I need to hear how the London show went for James before I commit to the Sweden show or give the tickets away.
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MP seems to have confirmed London will be the first show. They're playing in the UK's largest indoor arena, usually reserved for the likes of Maiden and Metallica. He said they're playing there on the basis that people from all over the world will be in attendance.
Dang, what a weird choice. You'd think they'd give some love to the American audiences that gave the band their start 40 years ago. I probably wouldn't be able to make it unless the first show was in Denver (A man can dream), but it definitely feels like a bit of a slap in the face if it's not even IN the country
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I don't take it as a slap in the face. I'm just disappointed we won't see them here until after the New Year.
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Dang, what a weird choice. You'd think they'd give some love to the American audiences that gave the band their start 40 years ago. I probably wouldn't be able to make it unless the first show was in Denver (A man can dream), but it definitely feels like a bit of a slap in the face if it's not even IN the country
I hear you, but remember, the world doesn't revolve around the States. European audiences are known for their enthusiasm, especially for prog bands like these. That's why many DVDs get filmed over there I think. Let's keep the hope alive for a Denver show down the road!
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Dang, what a weird choice. You'd think they'd give some love to the American audiences that gave the band their start 40 years ago. I probably wouldn't be able to make it unless the first show was in Denver (A man can dream), but it definitely feels like a bit of a slap in the face if it's not even IN the country
That's a little ridiculous.
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Although they are an North-American band (proud of it, for sure!) and had to start there, for obvious reasons, I think DT always recognized that Europe was the first place to really embrace the band. There's something about it in the Live at the Marquee liner notes I guess. Maybe it's just about logistics, considering the album release around September/October.
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or Japan for that matter ;-) DT SO ENERGY!!! SO POWAH!!!! :metal
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That's a little ridiculous.
It is. I let my emotion run high. I apologize. I still think they should play America though!
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Although they are an North-American band (proud of it, for sure!) and had to start there, for obvious reasons, I think DT always recognized that Europe was the first place to really embrace the band. There's something about it in the Live at the Marquee liner notes I guess. Maybe it's just about logistics, considering the album release around September/October.
Wasn't that made in Japan? That's not Europe
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Putting together huge tours like this is a lot about logistics and since we are not privy to the inner workings of why exactly this goes before that it's safe to assume it's just what makes the most sense logistically. I think that gets lost a bit in the inevitable discussion of "why not city x" etc you see on social media after an announcement like this. People shouldn't try and read much more into it.
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Wasn't that made in Japan? That's not Europe
Are you suggesting the Marquee is in Japan? It's in London.
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It is. I let my emotion run high. I apologize. I still think they should play America though!
Who said they aren't going to play America?
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For everyone complaining that the US isn't first, you have to remember that they're MUCH more popular in Europe than they are in North America. Perhaps us United States and Canada folks need to step up our game.
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Are you suggesting the Marquee is in Japan? It's in London.
I'm wrong once again. I was thinking of their first live video, which was shot in Japan, but confused it with their first live album, lol. My bad!
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I do find it interesting that the band's first tour with the reunited line up will be in Europe, even though they're an American band. As someone from Eastern Europe, I feel privileged.
It is kind of odd that London is the only date in the entire UK, though. But oh well, that's business for you, you can't play all the cities.
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For everyone complaining that the US isn't first, you have to remember that they're MUCH more popular in Europe than they are in North America. Perhaps us United States and Canada folks need to step up our game.
I agree. I wish everyone would be mandated to go to prog metal concerts in America, similar to certain vaccinations to enter school/travel. We need to educate the masses!
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Based on the attendance at the CT show last tour, the band's management is probably taking a very good look at the US market and where they should play. As pointed out in this thread, concerts are expensive as shit now. My days of seeing a dozen concerts in a summer are long gone. Maybe they've determined that a summer tour in the US would have too much competition, for both venues and wallets. Perhaps the winter months are better for a band like DT as far as the US goes.
I have nothing to back this up. Just spitballing.
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I'm wrong once again. I was thinking of their first live video, which was shot in Japan, but confused it with their first live album, lol. My bad!
Fair enough, I actually forgot the Live in Japan video for a sec :)
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An Evening With format is a bit risky considering James' last performances.
But I think James himself is aware what's the problem and how it can be solved. I think we'll see many altered vocal melodies (like Pull Me Under from Dreamsonic tour) and that has to be done anyway for James' and the band's sake. As long as James sounds great with altered melodies I'm all for it.
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For the first time in my entire life, I’m actually in a good and stable enough financial position that I could *almost* pull off going to the London show….but it would be 4K (2 people for 4-5 days in London) that I really need to put into the house.
Responsibilities will most likely win out.
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The last DT tour was of the US. While I wish they did the US first for selfish reasons, there's likely very strong logistical reasons to tour Europe first.
Also, I'd kind of be shocked if that first UK show sells well. I think there is legit hype for DT right now, but that booking may be a bit too optimistic. I'd love to be wrong.
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An Evening With format is a bit risky considering James' last performances.
But I think James himself is aware what's the problem and how it can be solved. I think we'll see many altered vocal melodies (like Pull Me Under from Dreamsonic tour) and that has to be done anyway for James' and the band's sake. As long as James sounds great with altered melodies I'm all for it.
I don't think there'll be a big hassle with an Evening With. See my other thread for more details
The last DT tour was of the US. While I wish they did the US first for selfish reasons, there's likely very strong logistical reasons to tour Europe first.
Also, I'd kind of be shocked if that first UK show sells well. I think there is legit hype for DT right now, but that booking may be a bit too optimistic. I'd love to be wrong.
This is fair. I just want to see DT with MP so badly, and knowing I may have to wait until 2025 is just too much to bear!!
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Well, even Glasgow to London is seven hours by car.
If the first show had been in NYC, I'd have been there. In fact, I'd have been there virtually anywhere in the world. The fact it's in London, 75 minutes away on a train, is a massive piece of good fortune for me.
Likewise! Thankfully I'll be flying down from Glasgow rather than driving. ;D
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So... my kid is going to school in London until September of 2025... I do need to visit her at some point... I see the planets aligning here.
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So... my kid is going to school in London until September of 2025... I do need to visit her at some point... I see the planets aligning here.
The universe is trying to tell you something.
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So... my kid is going to school in London until September of 2025... I do need to visit her at some point... I see the planets aligning here.
Oh, wow! Hope you can make it work.
And will also be great to see you again, Graham!
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So... my kid is going to school in London until September of 2025... I do need to visit her at some point... I see the planets aligning here.
Be the American Diplomat to the first DT show with MP we all know you were meant to be
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I'm wondering if that interview was recorded so we can hear the riff that JP played.
Also, the answer about the setlist was only that the band were "open" to MP writing it. I wouldn't assume there'll be different setlists every night just based on that, but for a tour like this, it does seem like fitting 16 albums of DT length music into a single set will be difficult without some rotating or truncation/medleys.
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So... my kid is going to school in London until September of 2025... I do need to visit her at some point... I see the planets aligning here.
Similarly, I'm in Italy for a wedding on October 10th. I had planned on traveling some in Europe the week after and then being back in the states by the 17th or 18th, but I might be able to stretch the trip out a few more days.
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I sincerely mean this - thank you for posting the .pdf! I too got the dreaded paywall.
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Omg, first show back for Portnoy in London? I'm there.
Must mean the new album is a few months away too? Wasn't expecting any shows until 2025.
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So... my kid is going to school in London until September of 2025... I do need to visit her at some point... I see the planets aligning here.
DO IT!!!
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Must mean the new album is a few months away too? Wasn't expecting any shows until 2025.
In the interview they addressed it, they basically bit their tongues to not say the date but they guided us through the timeline, "if we want to have the first date here it means that the album has to be out at a certain point which means mastering has to happen at a certain point and so we have to be ready at a certain date"..... I guess it's safe to say that they already know the release date, and that these things are coordinated with the label and the tour manager. I would be very surprised if by now they don't know the roadmap and when the album will be officially finished, when the mastering will begin, and what's the planned release date. At least, that's my guess, I don't have insider industry info on how precise is the planning of the release of an album.
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In the interview they addressed it, they basically bit their tongues to not say the date but they guided us through the timeline, "if we want to have the first date here it means that the album has to be out at a certain point which means mastering has to happen at a certain point and so we have to be ready at a certain date"..... I guess it's safe to say that they already know the release date, and that these things are coordinated with the label and the tour manager. I would be very surprised if by now they don't know the roadmap and when the album will be officially finished, when the mastering will begin, and what's the planned release date. At least, that's my guess, I don't have insider industry info on how precise is the planning of the release of an album.
Unless they do a Pink Floyd and play the whole thing on the road for a year before it's out :lol
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Unless they do a Pink Floyd and play the whole thing on the road for a year before it's out :lol
Well, any chance of them playing a few warmup gigs before the European tour?
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No. They very clearly said London is the first show.
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As far as pricing goes. Going to see DT is right in line with other entertainment.
I have season tickets for the Denver Broncos. Not bad seats, not great. They are 186.50 each for regular season seat.
I go to "Broadway" plays here in Reno, they are 92.00 per seat.
3 hours of DT is way better than any play. And now way better the the Broncos games since they suck so bad. But even if they were good
(someday again, I hope), if I had to choose, I would choose DT.
Nothing is cheap now. And I really don't think the tickets are too high compared to anything else.
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As far as pricing goes. Going to see DT is right in line with other entertainment.
I have season tickets for the Denver Broncos. Not bad seats, not great. They are 186.50 each for regular season seat.
I go to "Broadway" plays here in Reno, they are 92.00 per seat.
3 hours of DT is way better than any play. And now way better the the Broncos games since they suck so bad. But even if they were good
(someday again, I hope), if I had to choose, I would choose DT.
Nothing is cheap now. And I really don't think the tickets are too high compared to anything else.
Have you seen the pricing anywhere?
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A fan on FB complained about London being the only UK date, to which Mike replied:
People from all over the WORLD are gonna be coming to London for the VERY 1ST show!! Surely coming from somewhere within the UK shouldn’t be THAT much of a stretch considering what many others will be doing…
So I guess it's definitive that there won't be any summer dates and that this autumn European tour will mark the FIRST live show of Mike Portnoy with Dream Theater since 2009.
So...according to setlist.fm, the last London show they played was at a venue called Eventim Apollo, and a Google search tells me that venue has a capacity between 3,600-5,300 for concerts. And now they're playing a venue in the same city with 4x the capacity on the premise that they'll pull an additional 15,000 fans from other locations to travel? I don't know.... More power to them if it happens, I guess.
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So...according to setlist.fm, the last London show they played was at a venue called Eventim Apollo, and a Google search tells me that venue has a capacity between 3,600-5,300 for concerts. And now they're playing a venue in the same city with 4x the capacity on the premise that they'll pull an additional 15,000 fans from other locations to travel? I don't know.... More power to them if it happens, I guess.
I’m guessing that promoters are counting on a few factors. It’s the first show with Portnoy, it’s the only show in the U.K. (At least on this leg) and it’s an anniversary show. I’m sure the numbers were better on the I&W and SFAM anniversary shows.
I can’t be there, but I hope they sell the motherfucker out, and it’s the greatest show ever.
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As long as the setlists are rotating, not sure why you'll have to do that. And the indications are there that there will be some variation from show to show.
Nah, I get that. I just like knowing NOTHING. I don't want to know the opener, the closer, the encore, or what is being rotated in and out until after my show. We'll see how it goes. I couldn't wait on the 20th tour and was following that one. There's unfortunately no way of knowing if they're rotating or not without something being spoiled.
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Have you seen the pricing anywhere?
Earlier in the thread someone said 85 and 115 pounds.
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Earlier in the thread someone said 85 and 115 pounds.
I think that was euro (for one of the shows on the continent), not pounds.
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I've barely had time to do more than skim this thread, but the announcement, the article, all of it, it's all such good news. :)
Lovely that symbology for albums across the entire era of the band are prominent.
I love this. My husband and I spent a considerable moment finding all the visual references to the albums. It's all so very exciting. I'm so happy to see references to TA, ADTOE and DoT, but I think I may have strained my eyes searching for anything from AVFTTOTW, only to find nothing. :( Glad to see Octavarium so prominently shown. I think I saw most of the albums with my bucket list songs on them referenced, and already squeeing like the fangirl I am ("A little ant!! Forsaken!!!"), lol. Time will tell :)
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I think that was euro (for one of the shows on the continent), not pounds.
my error. Still the same idea though.
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The evidence is mounting... See my other thread. We are SO back
Wrong. Still greatly anticipating where the shows will be in the Northeast though. Hopefully not in the middle of winter.
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I’m guessing that promoters are counting on a few factors. It’s the first show with Portnoy, it’s the only show in the U.K. (At least on this leg) and it’s an anniversary show. I’m sure the numbers were better on the I&W and SFAM anniversary shows.
I can’t be there, but I hope they sell the motherfucker out, and it’s the greatest show ever.
They 100% were. My venue for the View tour was probably about half empty. The same venue for the Metropolis Part 2 anniversary/Distance Over Time tour was at least about 75% full.
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I'm tempted to go to the London show. Or Switzerland. The wife wants to visit Switzerland at some point in the next few years, if we can get vacation time lined up. But Switzerland in mid-November? Southern Cal may have softened me too much for that.
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I feel so bad for MP that he has to sit and listen to The Astonishing. :lol
To this day I have never heard the whole thing.
Sounds to me like you’re the last person who should have an opinion on it then. lol.
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Extremely exciting news, and as fortune would have it for me, the very first show is in my neck of the woods! It's a no brainer, I have to be there :biggrin:
Despite what was mentioned a couple of pages ago I can't seem to find any information on how much tickets will be, prior to them going on sale... have tried both the gigsandtours website and O2 but no joy.
I toyed with the idea of going for the VIP package, as this is something I have never done despite seeing them more than 10 times. Sadly I don't think my finances will stretch at this moment in the time... again, I'm having to go on a vague assumption that VIP tickets will be upwards of £300+... again, really frustrating that it doesn't seem possible to find out what the pricing plan is before the sale starts as I will be really anxious to book my ticket ASAP.
Is there a suggestion that standing shows will be returning? Someone on an earlier page did mention "golden circle" and there is also a bit on gigsandtours for the London show that says "No under 16s in the Standing areas"... although this may be generic wording.
As much as I personally excited for this show and feel it's guaranteed to be a historic one for the band, I am inclined to agree with the sentiment that booking out the O2 Arena seems a bit of a gamble. I get that this will be the only UK show and there is also an expectation that people will be travelling in from other countries to see the first show, but still... it's massive, far beyond any venue I ever imagined them playing. Fortunately for me it's only an hour or so away but, is it reasonable to expect that a sufficient number of fans are going to come from all corners of the UK and beyond to fill this place up? For the band's sake I really hope this pays off.
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Next October Milan it is.
Meet up?
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If they don't add up Turkey date this time again I'll probably fly over Germany or Switzerland.
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Got row 5 center for the Stockholm show. Going with my dad who's been going with me since 1995. This will feel very special..
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I got ROW N, which is the 14th row, for London. £157.60, O2 presale
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So mobile customers of O2 have had early access? FFS.
Edit: ooh, that's really wound me right up. First world problem, Iknow :biggrin:
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I've barely had time to do more than skim this thread, but the announcement, the article, all of it, it's all such good news. :)
I love this. My husband and I spent a considerable moment finding all the visual references to the albums. It's all so very exciting. I'm so happy to see references to TA, ADTOE and DoT, but I think I may have strained my eyes searching for anything from AVFTTOTW, only to find nothing. :( Glad to see Octavarium so prominently shown. I think I saw most of the albums with my bucket list songs on them referenced, and already squeeing like the fangirl I am ("A little ant!! Forsaken!!!"), lol. Time will tell :)
The only thing I can think of is the birds to the far left of the picture. There is a bird/eagle or whatever on the cover of the View album.
What I can't figure out is the figure right underneath the birds. It looks like a man bending over like the man with sheeves on Led Zepplin 4. But that's just me.
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So my mate WhatsApped me last night and told me about this. I'm so excited!
Then I googled details - one UK show at the O2 of all places. I've never experienced such excitement turn to such disappointment so quickly. The O2 is a HORRIBLE venue.
I've seen DT at Wembley Arena on 3 occasions, and they're probably the 3 worst DT shows I've seen. DT just aren't an arena band. They turn up with their theatre-sized venue production, no extra lights, no lasers, no jumbo screens, and they're just lost in that cow-shed venue. Arena bands need big, full sized arena productions, and frankly DT have never stepped up their game. it doesn't help that Wembley is usually half empty when they play there, and on the ADTOE tour, embarrassingly empty.
I've never enjoyed DT in an arena, and so I made the decision not to see them in an arena again. They've spent the last few years playing Hammersmith as their go-to London venue, and that's great. When they played arenas in 2022, including Wembley, I decided not to go, as I knew I wouldn't enjoy it. It was the first tour I missed since Train of Thought (my father died and the gig was the same day as his funeral).
I'm not surprised to see them in an arena, MP rejoining was at least in part an attempt to increase ticket sales. But the O2? I'm still in shock, that's an audacious choice of venue. I hope they come close to filling it.
If I can get decent tickets near the front, even if I have to pay for the VIP package, then I'm up for it (wonder if the VIP includes a good seat or if it's just a meet n' greet upgrade). If not, then no, I'm not going. I'll wait for the 2025 European leg and hope they're back in Hammersmith.
#FirstWorldProblems I know.
EDIT: Oh who am I kidding, of course I'll go. Unless I don't. Arrgh!
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What I can't figure out is the figure right underneath the birds. It looks like a man bending over like the man with sheeves on Led Zepplin 4. But that's just me.
It's the girl headbanging on the 8VM album cover. The birds are the birds on the 8VM cover too
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The only thing I can think of is the birds to the far left of the picture. There is a bird/eagle or whatever on the cover of the View album.
What I can't figure out is the figure right underneath the birds. It looks like a man bending over like the man with sheeves on Led Zepplin 4. But that's just me.
I thought of the birds too but my husband thinks they're the birds on Octavarium. Same for the bent-over person.
We couldn't figure out the mask-like face on the ground (center, under the big X's) nor the lightning. Maybe these are already references to the new album?
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I’m going to (try) to get tickets for the Amsterdam show. I have to be honest, last time in Amsterdam I thought the show wasn’t all that great and I skipped the Tilburg date that came shortly after it. MP returning however does bring out the 15 year old fanboy in me that first saw them live on the Train of Thought tour.
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I thought of the birds too but my husband thinks they're the birds on Octavarium. Same for the bent-over person.
We couldn't figure out the mask-like face on the ground (center, under the big X's) nor the lightning. Maybe these are already references to the new album?
Well they did include the inertia balls for 82V and yes, I couldn't figure that on (face) out either. And for the poster that questioned WDAU, I thought Majesty logo took care of that but who knows.
It's fun though! :)
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So that yellow car (taxi?) is a reference to the Along For The Ride single.
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So that yellow car (taxi?) is a reference to the Along For The Ride single.
Well - that was my interpretation of D12.
But the other thing for me was, why 4 X's instead if 5?
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I thought Majesty logo took care of that but who knows.
It's fun though! :)
We thought the logo also took care of the self-titled.
It is fun! :)
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But the other thing for me was, why 4 X's instead if 5?
4 times 10 is 40
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Well - that was my interpretation of D12.
But the other thing for me was, why 4 X's instead if 5?
The four X's are to represent 40 years in Roman numerals. But it would be XL actually.
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Judging by O2 presale, the very top section of the O2 won't be sold. It's floor and 1st level only
Also, for info:
Cheapest ticket is £55 at back of arena, slightly further along is £88, then £110, and most expensive tickets are £155
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So my mate WhatsApped me last night and told me about this. I'm so excited!
Then I googled details - one UK show at the O2 of all places. I've never experienced such excitement turn to such disappointment so quickly. The O2 is a HORRIBLE venue.
I've seen DT at Wembley Arena on 3 occasions, and they're probably the 3 worst DT shows I've seen. DT just aren't an arena band. They turn up with their theatre-sized venue production, no extra lights, no lasers, no jumbo screens, and they're just lost in that cow-shed venue. Arena bands need big, full sized arena productions, and frankly DT have never stepped up their game. it doesn't help that Wembley is usually half empty when they play there, and on the ADTOE tour, embarrassingly empty.
I've never enjoyed DT in an arena, and so I made the decision not to see them in an arena again. They've spent the last few years playing Hammersmith as their go-to London venue, and that's great. When they played arenas in 2022, including Wembley, I decided not to go, as I knew I wouldn't enjoy it. It was the first tour I missed since Train of Thought (my father died and the gig was the same day as his funeral).
I'm not surprised to see them in an arena, MP rejoining was at least in part an attempt to increase ticket sales. But the O2? I'm still in shock, that's an audacious choice of venue. I hope they come close to filling it.
If I can get decent tickets near the front, even if I have to pay for the VIP package, then I'm up for it (wonder if the VIP includes a good seat or if it's just a meet n' greet upgrade). If not, then no, I'm not going. I'll wait for the 2025 European leg and hope they're back in Hammersmith.
#FirstWorldProblems I know.
EDIT: Oh who am I kidding, of course I'll go. Unless I don't. Arrgh!
If it makes you feel better, I saw Genesis and Queen there in 2022, and the sound was great. Way, way, WAY better than Wembley Arena. I think DT would sound pretty great at the O2.
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Judging by O2 presale, the very top section of the O2 won't be sold. It's floor and 1st level only
Also, for info:
Cheapest ticket is £55 at back of arena, slightly further along is £88, then £110, and most expensive tickets are £155
Thank you for that pricing info. I am not an O2 customer, so I will have to wait til tomorrow the earliest and try my luck.
Yes, the O2 Arena is a great place for concerts.
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Yeah I saw Iron Maiden there last summer and it was fantastic. Helped that I stayed at the hotel next door so I could walk to and from the venue but I had no complaints about the sound or anything.
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4 times 10 is 40
In Roman numerals it should be XL, but I see that it is nicer visually and a less literal message to have X (ten) four times. The letter X may look more like a random object than the letter L.
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In Roman numerals it should be XL, but I see that it is nicer visually and a less literal message to have X (ten) four times. The letter X may look more like a random object than the letter L.
It's actually the XL (extra large) tour, which is why they're playing arenas way too big for them.
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But the other thing for me was, why 4 X's instead if 5?
Why would there be 5?
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Why would there be 5?
5 Xs representing each member.
And as far as me not getting the 40 years - doh! :facepalm:
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So that they can have the tour finale in NYC.
Well that makes a ton of sense. If I know MP he's already planning a DVD of the show. Hopefully the crowd brings the energy. It's been 25 years since the last recorded NY show, right? Live Scenes?
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It's actually the XL (extra large) tour, which is why they're playing arenas way too big for them.
That works.
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So mobile customers of O2 have had early access? FFS.
Edit: ooh, that's really wound me right up. First world problem, Iknow :biggrin:
Goddamit, should have realised this earlier as I am an O2 customer! :-[
Now managed to bag myself a ticket on Row F on the floor, Myung side, so six rows back from the front... looks like these ones are going quickly.
Looks like the shows are remaining fully seated... I'm somewhat surprised, I thought MP might have pushed for standing gigs to make a return.
At present I'll be going on my lonesome as I was too anxious to wait for others to get back to me to confirm whether they would be prepared to join me in the incredibly expensive seats... Might be cool to meet up with anyone else here who will be going though :metal
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Well that makes a ton of sense. If I know MP he's already planning a DVD of the show. Hopefully the crowd brings the energy. It's been 25 years since the last recorded NY show, right? Live Scenes?
Score at RCMH in 2006.
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Well that makes a ton of sense. If I know MP he's already planning a DVD of the show. Hopefully the crowd brings the energy. It's been 25 years since the last recorded NY show, right? Live Scenes?
Score was filmed in Radio City.
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Just bought my ticket for the Helsinki show. Soooo excited!!
I think last time i was this excited to see Dream Theater was on Octacövarium tour in Helsinki. My first gig ever.
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It's actually the XL (extra large) tour, which is why they're playing arenas way too big for them.
:D :D
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So... trying to think about what they would play on this tour...
Definitely think reverse chronological makes sense. Also can see the "A" set and the "B" set where certain songs get rotated. (If I recall they did that with Fall Into the Light and Paralyzed on the D/T tour.)
So: New single
2nd new song from DT16
The Alien (makes sense they would play it despite James' wish)
S2N (never played it)
A New Beginning (fitting, right?)
Behind the Veil/Surrender to Reason - alternating songs per show
This Is the Life/Beneath the Surface - alternating; ballad/give James a break songs
Constant Motion/A Rite of Passage - alternating
Epic from DT16
Intermission
These Walls (never played, I believe)
This Dying Soul, seguing into
The Glass Prison
Home (also a fitting song title)
New Millenium
Space Dye Vest (MP never played it)
Surrounded (how long has it been since they played this? I mean we can get PMU yet again, can we? James can't hit the F# in LtL. UAGM is already on Score...)
Only a Matter of Time (again, fitting song title)
Encore:
Octavarium
Thoughts?
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Well that makes a ton of sense. If I know MP he's already planning a DVD of the show. Hopefully the crowd brings the energy. It's been 25 years since the last recorded NY show, right? Live Scenes?
Who still shoots for DVDs these days? Wouldn't they shoot in 4K or at least Full HD? Lol :lol
-
So... trying to think about what they would play on this tour...
Definitely think reverse chronological makes sense. Also can see the "A" set and the "B" set where certain songs get rotated. (If I recall they did that with Fall Into the Light and Paralyzed on the D/T tour.)
So: New single
2nd new song from DT16
The Alien (makes sense they would play it despite James' wish)
S2N (never played it)
A New Beginning (fitting, right?)
Behind the Veil/Surrender to Reason - alternating songs per show
This Is the Life/Beneath the Surface - alternating; ballad/give James a break songs
Constant Motion/A Rite of Passage - alternating
Epic from DT16
Intermission
These Walls (never played, I believe)
This Dying Soul, seguing into
The Glass Prison
Home (also a fitting song title)
New Millenium
Space Dye Vest (MP never played it)
Surrounded (how long has it been since they played this? I mean we can get PMU yet again, can we? James can't hit the F# in LtL. UAGM is already on Score...)
Only a Matter of Time (again, fitting song title)
Encore:
Octavarium
Thoughts?
As Scotty suggested, maybe the encore will be the big epic of the new album.
Also, it needs to have some instrumentals there. Dystopian Overture could be the perfect compromise: you honor the Astonishing, James take a break, and puny fans who can't stand the album don't have to sit through an actual song.
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I bet there's a very high chance they'll record and release a show from the upcoming tour, and yeah, it'll most likely be something big in NYC. Not happening until next year at the earliest, so it's still a long wait. It's a bummer (the long wait), because I already know there's no way this tour is coming to my country unless the reunion/anniversary prompts a crazy local promoter to try to bring them here, but I highly highly doubt that. Megadeth just played a sold out show here a few days ago, so there's a chance, but they're much more popular than DT anyway.
What I'm interested in is what Portnoy said about the MM era albums and how "everything should be represented". I'm really glad to see that's the approach he's taking and I'm also pretty sure they'll stick with the one song per album anniversary thing again this time. Reverse chronological order sounds about right too: you honor everything in the catalog, and your second set is the high point for most people, since it includes the classics. Not expecting anything from pre-WDADU material to appear, though (unlike Score), there's only so much time in the set. Just waiting for the obligatory "guess the upcoming tour's setlist" thread now :biggrin:
Also, it needs to have some instrumentals there. Dystopian Overture could be the perfect compromise: you honor the Astonishing, James take a break, and puny fans who can't stand the album don't have to sit through an actual song.
That's not a bad idea at all! I guess they'd want to include one of the actual songs to represent the album, but the overture would work perfectly for what you just said.
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Dystopian Overture/The Gift of Music would be a great choice for the upcoming tour IMO.
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The only thing I can think of is the birds to the far left of the picture. There is a bird/eagle or whatever on the cover of the View album.
What I can't figure out is the figure right underneath the birds. It looks like a man bending over like the man with sheeves on Led Zepplin 4. But that's just me.
So...I think...
- WDADU: The only thing I can think of is the Majesty symbol.
- I&W: Little girl in the foreground and sacred heart.
- Awake: The clock face.
- ACOS: Kid building sandcastle
- FII: Two dudes in tall chairs with binoculars.
- SFAM: Face in the sky.
- SDOIT: The happy face on the third X.
- TOT: Eyeball.
- 8VM: Newton's cradle (still with one string too short), birds and leaning guy.
- SC: Ants and sign with Majesty symbol.
- BC&SL: Elephant.
- ADTOE: Guy on unicycle on the second X.
- DT12: The Majesty symbol, and I guess people are saying the car, but I have no idea what that has to do with the album.
- TA: NOMACs.
- DOT: Robot hand and skull
- View: I'm coming up empty. You'd think they'd have the shoes or the viewfinder thing, but...??
These Walls (never played, I believe)
...
Surrounded (how long has it been since they played this?
These Walls was played on the European leg of the 8VM tour (and on a few North American dates). It was also played regularly on the ADTOE tour.
Surrounded is the 6th most played DT song of all time and was most recently played on the I&W&B tour.
Your setlist includes no instrumentals, so I think maybe you're trying to kill James. /s
-
- DT12: The Majesty symbol, and I guess people are saying the car, but I have no idea what that has to do with the album.
It's in the DT12's booklet artwork.
-
Score was filmed in Radio City.
Thank you :facepalm: Don't mind me, everyone move along, nothing to see here :lol
-
2x for London bought.
Gonna be very interesting as the opening night. I'm pleased in a way, as there's no way I'll be tempted to view setlist spoilers :lol
-
These Walls (never played, I believe)
IIRC, they've played the entirety of Octavarium at least once, in Rome, which was recorded and released on DVD for their International Fan Club. Getting that DVD on the secondary market wasn't easy, but it was worth getting! Also, hearing those songs without the orchestra (from Score), and just the band playing it, there's a really different vibe to them.
-Marc.
-
Do we think they may play Octavarium in it's entirety? Like they did for SFAM for its anniversary..
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Do we think they may play Octavarium in it's entirety? Like they did for SFAM for its anniversary..
I would love that but I suspect many would not. :lol
It also just wouldn't make sense for this tour, which judging from the poster is meant to represent a wide variety of eras from the band. Hard to do that when you're playing a full 70+ minute album in there too.
-
Do we think they may play Octavarium in it's entirety? Like they did for SFAM for its anniversary..
The album? I doubt it. (I also hope not, although that's a separate conversation lol)
But the title track? I have high hopes.
-
Well, that's me and my dad booked in for the Budapest show! Just recieved my pre-sale email for the London gig and shall be forcing myself out of bed at 8:45 to impatiently refresh the website in anticipation.
Those of you who already booked tix for London... how, lol?
-
My guess is they'll play a 12SS medley after the intermission.
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IIRC, they've played the entirety of Octavarium at least once, in Rome, which was recorded and released on DVD for their International Fan Club. Getting that DVD on the secondary market wasn't easy, but it was worth getting! Also, hearing those songs without the orchestra (from Score), and just the band playing it, there's a really different vibe to them.
-Marc.
It was played on the ADTOE tour, and was a bonus track on LALP
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I'd really love for the Octavarium title track to return in full
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I'd really love for the Octavarium title track to return in full
100% this. or ACOS. although it certainly hasnt been as long since they played that.
those two are my favourites of the epics, either would be immense to see live.
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The album? I doubt it. (I also hope not, although that's a separate conversation lol)
But the title track? I have high hopes.
I'm almost certain we'll get the title track! :)
It would be nice though to hear the whole album, but I'd be happy with the title track and These Walls. 🙏
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I don't think we can really guess what goes in and what doesn't, but I would think there's a possibility that the thought process is...
... we've got this album, so we're going to play x of that. Of the remaining y minutes, what are the top z songs that we the five of us have been dying to play together on for a while? No slight to Mangini, but I can't imagine there's not ONE SONG in the entire catalogue that one of the other four didn't say "wow, it's good, but I preferred playing this with Portnoy". That's not a dig on Mangini at all; it's all a matter of feel, memory and emotion.
If that's the mindset, that this is about the band and the enjoyment of what they do, I think we'll get most if not all of the new album (assuming it's around an hour or so, plus/minus), we'll get two songs from the Mangini era, and we'll get a full hour or so of just classics that the band wants to revisit, regardless of when it was played last, or whether it was played on the respective tours.
-
These Walls (never played, I believe)
They played These Walls with Mangini on the Dramatic Tour of Events tour. I remember it distinctly.
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They played These Walls with Mangini on the Dramatic Tour of Events tour. I remember it distinctly.
It's also on the Luna Park DVD.
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Also played with MP occasionally on the 8V tour. (It’s on the Romavarium fan club DVD)
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According to setlist.fm These Walls has been played 75 times
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I don't know whether they are going to really try to play something from each and every album or if they are going to just do a good representation of their entire careers without trying to literally capture every album. They know Octavarium is a fan favorite, and it's one that is on at least some of their minds as something they want to play. But if they are taking the former approach on this tour before the album drops, Octavarium might be a long shot just because of its length. That is the same quandary they ran into for the Score show once they decided to play Six Degrees. That decision all by itself had a ripple effect through the entire set that made it a pretty big challenge to vary much from what they actually ended up playing. Granted, that's 43 minutes of music that will not be in the set this time around. But the flip side of that is that they have 7 more albums now. It might be really tough to fit Octavarium in. That said, I really hope they do. And even though it is difficult, just kind of sketching out some rough set lists making sure to hit every album, include things I think are fairly likely, but keeping to mostly shorter(ish) songs, I guess they still have plenty of options. Here's a sample I came up with without noodling too hard on it (I will go with the R40- reverse chron format):
1. The Alien
2. Barstool Warrior (I would love S2N, and it's actually a bit shorter, but I was just "feeling" Barstool as more likely)
3. Our New World (I highly suspect this will be played, although I would prefer Moment of Betrayal)
4. The Enemy Inside
5. Breaking All Illusions (since they seem to love this, for some strange reason; I would go with OTBOA, personally)
6. A Right of Passage (not my fave, but it was a single, it's short, and it hasn't been well represented; I could also see TSF since Portnoy probably wants to play it with the band)
7. Constant Motion
8. Octavarium
--
9. Honor Thy Father (I would rather see ITNOG, and they could easily sub that in instead, but I was initially going for shorter songs. Either would be a great set 2 opener after 8VM closing the first set)
10. Misunderstood
11. Spirit (they'll surely play this, right?)
12. Take Away My Pain (continuing the "soft" song section)
13. Erotomania (surely an instrumental somewhere, right?)
14. To Live Forever (not "truly" an I&W song, but fits the era and could be part of a good Charlie tribute, followed by...)
15. Afterlife (I would rather see OAMOT as the closer, and I really dislike this song, but given Charlie's passing, I think it's likely)
--
16. Pull Me Under (logical encore closer, and it checks the I&W box in a way that TLF only partially does)
With my primary choices, that's only about 2:20 total music. With an intro tape, some short breaks here and there for James banter and JP changing guitars, there's still a good bit of freedom to sub a few of those out for longer songs without going too crazy, without them going over 3 hours total with intermission, which is about what I would expect for an evening with show from them based on past tours. And as far as song selection, I wouldn't mind that set at all. Pretty varied list of things I would expect, things I like, things I'm not crazy about, instrumentals, "ballads," heavy songs, etc. It pretty much has it all.
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From MP:
Already seeing reports of tickets getting scooped up from early 02 pre-sales for the BIG 1ST SHOW!! Opening the tour and playing our very first show back together at the 02 Arena in London is going to be massive and EPIC!! The emotions are gonna be off the charts! Who’s flying in for this one to be part of DT history??? We cannot wait!!!
This pretty much confirms London will be the first show this year. Seems like they won't tour at all during the summer.
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I feel so bad for MP that he has to sit and listen to The Astonishing. :lol
To this day I have never heard the whole thing.
As cool as it would be to see them live again, I just can't spend the dough not knowing what James will sound like. I will buy the studio albums, as I always do, but I can't see me seeing them live again.
Sorry to be the buzzkill.
I imagine he’ll like it a lot more than you do. For one thing he’ll be able to discern the effort JP and JR put into it and all the great melodies. Plus he’ll appreciate how awesome James was on it.
As he goes through the 5 albums and listens to MM’s drum parts, I can picture his eyebrows going up a few times.
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I don't know whether they are going to really try to play something from each and every album or if they are going to just do a good representation of their entire careers without trying to literally capture every album. They know Octavarium is a fan favorite, and it's one that is on at least some of their minds as something they want to play. But if they are taking the former approach on this tour before the album drops, Octavarium might be a long shot just because of its length. That is the same quandary they ran into for the Score show once they decided to play Six Degrees. That decision all by itself had a ripple effect through the entire set that made it a pretty big challenge to vary much from what they actually ended up playing. Granted, that's 43 minutes of music that will not be in the set this time around. But the flip side of that is that they have 7 more albums now. It might be really tough to fit Octavarium in. That said, I really hope they do. And even though it is difficult, just kind of sketching out some rough set lists making sure to hit every album, include things I think are fairly likely, but keeping to mostly shorter(ish) songs, I guess they still have plenty of options. Here's a sample I came up with without noodling too hard on it (I will go with the R40- reverse chron format):
1. The Alien
2. Barstool Warrior (I would love S2N, and it's actually a bit shorter, but I was just "feeling" Barstool as more likely)
3. Our New World (I highly suspect this will be played, although I would prefer Moment of Betrayal)
4. The Enemy Inside
5. Breaking All Illusions (since they seem to love this, for some strange reason; I would go with OTBOA, personally)
6. A Right of Passage (not my fave, but it was a single, it's short, and it hasn't been well represented; I could also see TSF since Portnoy probably wants to play it with the band)
7. Constant Motion
8. Octavarium
--
9. Honor Thy Father (I would rather see ITNOG, and they could easily sub that in instead, but I was initially going for shorter songs. Either would be a great set 2 opener after 8VM closing the first set)
10. Misunderstood
11. Spirit (they'll surely play this, right?)
12. Take Away My Pain (continuing the "soft" song section)
13. Erotomania (surely an instrumental somewhere, right?)
14. To Live Forever (not "truly" an I&W song, but fits the era and could be part of a good Charlie tribute, followed by...)
15. Afterlife (I would rather see OAMOT as the closer, and I really dislike this song, but given Charlie's passing, I think it's likely)
--
16. Pull Me Under (logical encore closer, and it checks the I&W box in a way that TLF only partially does)
With my primary choices, that's only about 2:20 total music. With an intro tape, some short breaks here and there for James banter and JP changing guitars, there's still a good bit of freedom to sub a few of those out for longer songs without going too crazy, without them going over 3 hours total with intermission, which is about what I would expect for an evening with show from them based on past tours. And as far as song selection, I wouldn't mind that set at all. Pretty varied list of things I would expect, things I like, things I'm not crazy about, instrumentals, "ballads," heavy songs, etc. It pretty much has it all.
I like the idea of doing the Rush "travel back in time" setlist. It would also make sense considering the band's mantra - WWRD (What Would Rush Do?). If they go this route, I would expect maybe a few less deep cuts.
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I just find it odd that they'd title a tour promoting their (DT&MP) first album in ages the 40th Anniversary tour.
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I like the idea of doing the Rush "travel back in time" setlist. It would also make sense considering the band's mantra - WWRD (What Would Rush Do?). If they go this route, I would expect maybe a few less deep cuts.
For a band that doesn't really do "singles," I think 8/16 songs being singles is actually pretty good (and that doesn't include Spirit, which is probably in their top 3 most popular songs among the general public). :dunno:
I just find it odd that they'd title a tour promoting their (DT&MP) first album in ages the 40th Anniversary tour.
I find it odd that you would find that odd.
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I just find it odd that they'd title a tour promoting their (DT&MP) first album in ages the 40th Anniversary tour.
I just think it comes down to the fact that they can only really call the tour one thing. It can't be MPs return, 40th anniversary, AND new album tour. It's just too much. I think 40th anniversary type of titling likely sells more tickets than the others, some of which is that we already know it's MP's return being the main selling point for a lot of people so they don't need to really advertise that part as much. Also, the new album hasn't been announced officially so they can't tag the tour as the album because they just don't have the title and whatnot ready yet.
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I just think it comes down to the fact that they can only really call the tour one thing. It can't be MPs return, 40th anniversary, AND new album tour. It's just too much. I think 40th anniversary type of titling likely sells more tickets than the others, some of which is that we already know it's MP's return being the main selling point for a lot of people so they don't need to really advertise that part as much. Also, the new album hasn't been announced officially so they can't tag the tour as the album because they just don't have the title and whatnot ready yet.
Sure, this is all fair.
I find it odd that you would find that odd.
:lol also probably fair.
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If they go the R40 (Rush) route, where would the setlist split at intermission, with regards to the albums? For Rush, their first set ended at their 9th album, and the second set began with their 8th album (Moving Pictures).
I could see them opening the second set with SFAM, which means closing the first set with something from SDOIT. "The Glass Prison" would be neat, especially if they made it a 12SS Medley and closed with the ending part of "The Shattered Fortress", which technically has static at the end of it, which could then segue into the David Bottrill mix of SFAM with its "Opening Scene" where the record plays the SFAM theme.
-Marc.
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I think it just depends on the songs and song lengths. For the one I wrote a few posts back, I was envisioning it splitting after Octavarium, which would be about 80 minutes. But if they chose longer songs on the front side, it would make sense to close the first set just before that and open set 2 with Octavarium. But that was the fulcrum point in my proposed set.
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I think it just depends on the songs and song lengths. For the one I wrote a few posts back, I was envisioning it splitting after Octavarium, which would be about 80 minutes. But if they chose longer songs on the front side, it would make sense to close the first set just before that and open set 2 with Octavarium. But that was the fulcrum point in my proposed set.
I think it also depends on just how many older songs they want to/can do. If they're just looking at one song per their first four or five albums, then the second set would probably start at Octavarium or earlier.
I think they'd also play ACOS as the encore if they wanted to encore with a longer epic, since it's their first big epic and would fit within the reverse-time-frame order since it was written during their first 6-7 years together. I doubt we'd be so lucky as to get BOTH ACOS and 8VM songs in one set, but if it's AWE, they could very well surprise us.
Since it's the line-up that produced SFAM/SDOIT/TOT/SC/BC&SL, I imagine half of the show's runtime will consist of those songs, with a quarter focused on MM-era, and another quarter on their first four albums.
-Marc.
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I'm just wondering how they will fit everything in when they do the 50th anniversary tour.
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If they do play one song per album I'd honestly prefer doing so non linearly, as going through the albums in order (or backwards) makes the set too predictable after a while. Jumbling the order up makes it more of a surprise what they'll play next, and they can move songs to parts of the set that make more sense for them (for example, playing Octavarium at the very end instead of in the middle).
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Do we think they may play Octavarium in it's entirety? Like they did for SFAM for its anniversary..
Song? Yes. Album? No.
So...no one sees anything in that picture representing View?
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So...no one sees anything in that picture representing View?
I'm thinking it's the mountains in the far back.
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So...no one sees anything in that picture representing View?
It's the Taxi Cab.
(https://i.discogs.com/ZIzkbu2eSPNbf3SOsKb8hFOfC15JpMZ-S8TG8kW8DcY/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:510/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTIwNjg0/NTI3LTE2MzY4OTQy/MTktMjAwNS5qcGVn.jpeg)
https://www.discogs.com/release/20684527-Dream-Theater-A-View-From-The-Top-Of-The-World
-Marc.
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So...no one sees anything in that picture representing View?
It’s obvious, isn’t it? The picture IS the view from the top of the world
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It's the Taxi Cab.
(https://i.discogs.com/ZIzkbu2eSPNbf3SOsKb8hFOfC15JpMZ-S8TG8kW8DcY/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:510/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTIwNjg0/NTI3LTE2MzY4OTQy/MTktMjAwNS5qcGVn.jpeg)
https://www.discogs.com/release/20684527-Dream-Theater-A-View-From-The-Top-Of-The-World
So...this was wrong?
- DT12: The Majesty symbol, and I guess people are saying the car, but I have no idea what that has to do with the album.
It's in the DT12's booklet artwork.
And if the car is for View, does that mean that the only thing for WDADU and DT12 is the Majesty Symbol?
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It’s obvious, isn’t it? The picture IS the view from the top of the world
Ah yes, when the world is flat, a top view is taken from the side onto the horizon. Of course!
DT are Flat-Earthers confirmed!
-Marc.
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It's the Taxi Cab.
(https://i.discogs.com/ZIzkbu2eSPNbf3SOsKb8hFOfC15JpMZ-S8TG8kW8DcY/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:510/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTIwNjg0/NTI3LTE2MzY4OTQy/MTktMjAwNS5qcGVn.jpeg)
https://www.discogs.com/release/20684527-Dream-Theater-A-View-From-The-Top-Of-The-World
-Marc.
:tup
I didn't have my booklet with me to check the artwork inside for anything. Thanks so much for posting that picture.
I was also thinking the DT logo is what represents the self-titled, which does make sense image wise. :lol
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:tup
I didn't have my booklet with me to check the artwork inside for anything. Thanks so much for posting that picture.
I was also thinking the DT logo is what represents the self-titled, which does make sense image wise. :lol
I figured I'd check discogs for the booklet images since they usually have scans for nearly every album on their site anyway. I thought that taxi looked more like the one from AVFTTOTW rather than the one in the tray inlay for DT12.
So yeah, I guess the Majesty symbol is pulling double duty for both WDADU and DT12 as far as representing albums. I figured they would've put in the humming bird for DT12, or the Majesty-brand-poker for WDADU, but I guess not.
-Marc.
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They know Octavarium is a fan favorite, and it's one that is on at least some of their minds as something they want to play. But if they are taking the former approach on this tour before the album drops, Octavarium might be a long shot just because of its length.
Great points. I'm sure they'll resurrect the track again, if not on this tour, then the following one. But given that it will be a track that will probably be featured at most if not all shows, I wonder if they'd do it on this tour, since it's a track that already was featured on the 20th Anniversary tour and accompanying live release. I could easily imagine MP deciding to wait with doing it until the next tour.
9. Honor Thy Father (I would rather see ITNOG, and they could easily sub that in instead, but I was initially going for shorter songs. Either would be a great set 2 opener after 8VM closing the first set)
As much as I've grown to love this song (it's now my favorite on ToT), I don't think we'll ever see this song live again given that MP is now on good terms with his step-father. The only way I could see it making it into the setlist may be as part of a medley of some sort, and we know what JP thinks of medley schmedleys!
If they go the R40 (Rush) route, where would the setlist split at intermission, with regards to the albums? For Rush, their first set ended at their 9th album, and the second set began with their 8th album (Moving Pictures).
As Bosk said, it would probably vary depending on what songs are played on a nightly basis. Don't forget that MP will be mindful of selecting certain songs that will serve as proper closing and opening songs in the middle, to end the first set and open the second set. On the 20th Anniversary tour, the first set ended with a SFaM or SDoIT track, and the second set then opened with a track from the following album. I would imagine the same would happen assuming the setlists will be done in a chronological way again (whether forwards or reverse).
I just think it comes down to the fact that they can only really call the tour one thing. It can't be MPs return, 40th anniversary, AND new album tour. It's just too much. I think 40th anniversary type of titling likely sells more tickets than the others, some of which is that we already know it's MP's return being the main selling point for a lot of people so they don't need to really advertise that part as much. Also, the new album hasn't been announced officially so they can't tag the tour as the album because they just don't have the title and whatnot ready yet.
I agree. Let's not forget that aside from the warmup shows in Europe and Gigantour, the tour for Octavarium was known as the 20th Anniversary tour. So it makes sense they'd do the same again now, even though they'll also be supporting a new album as well.
If they do play one song per album I'd honestly prefer doing so non linearly, as going through the albums in order (or backwards) makes the set too predictable after a while. Jumbling the order up makes it more of a surprise what they'll play next, and they can move songs to parts of the set that make more sense for them (for example, playing Octavarium at the very end instead of in the middle).
I know what you're saying, but with songs rotating, you still won't know what's coming up next, even if you know what album it will be from, and even then, there's always a chance that some albums might get skipped from show to show. But even then, with a chronological setlist it will still be less predictable than the static setlists that DT has been doing for the last 10 years. ;)
It's the Taxi Cab.
(https://i.discogs.com/ZIzkbu2eSPNbf3SOsKb8hFOfC15JpMZ-S8TG8kW8DcY/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:510/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTIwNjg0/NTI3LTE2MzY4OTQy/MTktMjAwNS5qcGVn.jpeg)
https://www.discogs.com/release/20684527-Dream-Theater-A-View-From-The-Top-Of-The-World
The taxi cab could rpresent the s/t album or AVFtTotW, or both since it's basically the same in both albums. Hard to say.
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There's something weird with the X's too; they are not the same (there's as far as I can tell, three different kinds) and two of the three (the same two) are not strictly "x's", and the third one (the center one) is a-symetrical along it's x-axis. The top two arms are "doubled".
I don't know how any of those refer to the debut or to DT12, but it's out there for you. :)
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The taxi cab could rpresent the s/t album or AVFtTotW, or both since it's basically the same in both albums. Hard to say.
I thought that too, but then I looked up the taxi from DT12, and well...
(https://i.discogs.com/JW1dE7NxdYPmalu6j7JB3plZgD-yXS8qHHMhIJ1kYoY/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:460/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTQ5Mjgx/NjQtMTY2ODc5NTIy/Ny00NTc3LmpwZWc.jpeg)
They're different pieces of art, and the one on the DT40 Tour artwork is copy-pasted from the View artwork, even facing the same direction.
-Marc.
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I thought the little kid playing in the sand was the reference to the self titled.
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I thought the little kid playing in the sand was the reference to the self titled.
No, that’s A Change of Seasons
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I thought the little kid playing in the sand was the reference to the self titled.
You're talking about this one?
(https://i.discogs.com/dSXFe5HFFPog6rfXSQfgstmSoL4Hxi4qBHzbaEuCWD4/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:295/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTQ5Mjg2/NDEtMTU0NzkyMDYz/NC02NjY5LmpwZWc.jpeg)
Similar idea, but not exactly the same kid. Also not exactly the same kid from the ACOS EP cover.
(https://i.discogs.com/dAAg5MdsiGM8zSyVbGX2GO0Tf4sIsvLu_lqzTalTLK0/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:600/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTM4NzQy/Ny0xNDUwODQ3Njc1/LTkzNTEuanBlZw.jpeg)
Is the kid brand new art or am I forgetting liner-note artwork from something?
-Marc.
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No, that’s A Change of Seasons
The bucket and rose definitely are, but the kid looks different, and the cover of ACOS doesn't even have a sand castle.
-Marc.
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You're talking about this one?
(https://i.discogs.com/dSXFe5HFFPog6rfXSQfgstmSoL4Hxi4qBHzbaEuCWD4/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:295/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTQ5Mjg2/NDEtMTU0NzkyMDYz/NC02NjY5LmpwZWc.jpeg)
Similar idea, but not exactly the same kid. Also not exactly the same kid from the ACOS EP cover.
(https://i.discogs.com/dAAg5MdsiGM8zSyVbGX2GO0Tf4sIsvLu_lqzTalTLK0/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:600/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTM4NzQy/Ny0xNDUwODQ3Njc1/LTkzNTEuanBlZw.jpeg)
Is the kid brand new art or am I forgetting liner-note artwork from something?
Yeah, but the little girl ain't the same one from IaW either, nor the eye from ToT, etc. So it's just a representation of an element from those albums, not the exact one.
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I hope they bring this tour to the US. I remember the 30th anniversary tour was European dates only.
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I hope they bring this tour to the US. I remember the 30th anniversary tour was European dates only.
Oh please don't give me something to worry about. :|
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I hope they bring this tour to the US. I remember the 30th anniversary tour was European dates only.
No way is this not gonna hit North America. I'd be surprised if any of the major territories was overlooked for this one. Maybe even a second leg through some of the territories, too, if the tour is exceptionally successful.
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MP responding a comment in his FB:
To everybody posting / inquiring about shows in North America, South America, Asia, etc etc…this is a WORLD TOUR that will be incredibly busy and thorough throughout all of 2025 once we kick off this first leg in Europe in Oct ‘24…
That being said, there can only ever be ONE “1st Show” and this first night in London is going to be off the charts electric, exciting and surely a very special event in DT history! Hope to share this with as many of you hardcore DT fans as possible! 😎🤘
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That being said, there can only ever be ONE “1st Show” and this first night in London is going to be off the charts electric
Not that I don't think London doesn't 'deserve' the 'first' show back for MP......I just find it weird that his first show back with DT is going to be overseas. I would have bet $1000.00 it'd have been in NYC or Boston....somewhere close to their home or what they consider 'home'
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I'm just waiting for the DREAMSONIC '24 North American dates to drop! Looks like it begins on July 28th in Boston at the Berkley PAC! Here's the info:
DREAMSONIC '24 starring DREAM THEATER with the LONG-AWAITED return of Mike Portnoy!
Special Guests HAKEN with support from NEMIC.
............then I woke up! >:( :censored >:( :censored >:( :censored
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I'm just waiting for the DREAMSONIC '24 North American dates to drop! Looks like it begins on July 28th in Boston at the Berkley PAC! Here's the info:
DREAMSONIC '24 starring DREAM THEATER with the LONG-AWAITED return of Mike Portnoy!
Special Guests HAKEN with support from NEMIC.
............then I woke up! >:( :censored >:( :censored >:( :censored
DreamSonic? Please no. And no Progressive Nation. Just a pure, unadulterated Evening With tour. No opening acts.
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I saw DT at Berklee! :)
And I agree Scotty!
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I'm just waiting for the DREAMSONIC '24 North American dates to drop! Looks like it begins on July 28th in Boston at the Berkley PAC! Here's the info:
DREAMSONIC '24 starring DREAM THEATER with the LONG-AWAITED return of Mike Portnoy!
Special Guests HAKEN with support from NEMIC.
............then I woke up! >:( :censored >:( :censored >:( :censored
You want 2 opening bands for the MP reunion tour / 40th anniversary? Yeah I don’t get it.
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I hope they bring this tour to the US. I remember the 30th anniversary tour was European dates only.
The 30th anniversary one was one of their mini tours that they sometimes do between albums. This one is going to be one of the main album tours, so yes, it will be coming to the US.
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You want 2 opening bands for the MP reunion tour / 40th anniversary? Yeah I don’t get it.
Did you READ IT? Nowhere did it say it was part of the upcoming album tour cycle/40th Anny!!! Jeez! :\ :\ :\ :facepalm:
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DreamSonic? Please no. And no Progressive Nation. Just a pure, unadulterated Evening With tour. No opening acts.
I'm willing to take anything that would've put them out on tour THIS SUMMER prior to the BIG TOUR! It's not to be :loser:
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I decided to sketch up a very, very rough estimate of what the setlist could possibly look like, not factoring in the possibility of rotation. I threw in what I think are likely candidates mixed with songs I saw recommended a lot in this thread. Also, the runtimes you see for new album songs are just guesses, obviously.
Set #1:
1. First single from new album (8:00)
2. The Glass Prison (12:00)
3. S2N (6:22)
4. New album song (6:00)
5. New album song (9:30)
6. Home (12:54)
7. Surrender to Reason (6:35)
8. Surrounded (5:30)
9. In the Name of God (14:15)
--Intermission--
Set #2:
10. The Alien (9:33)
11. Afterlife (5:30)
12. Raise the Knife (12:00)
13. Through My Words/Fatal Tragedy (7:50)
14. Breaking All Illusions (12:30)
15. New album epic (16:00)
Encore:
16. Octavarium (24:00)
2hr, 46m, leaving room for breaks between songs (James banter with the audience and John changes guitars) and intermission, as long as my math isn't painfully wrong.
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Not that I don't think London doesn't 'deserve' the 'first' show back for MP......I just find it weird that his first show back with DT is going to be overseas. I would have bet $1000.00 it'd have been in NYC or Boston....somewhere close to their home or what they consider 'home'
I believe their first overseas show (big distinction from first international shows: the first shows outside the US were in Canada) was in London in the IAW tour, and then they recorded their first live album at the Marquee there within a month (and Distant Memories many years later). Makes sense to me that they see it as a big historical place for them, though I get what you're saying.
Whenever they do play in NYC or Boston, it's going to be really emotional just the same.
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Well, the pre-sale sold out in seconds. And we somehow managed to get A2 row P for the O2 show!!!! 🎉🎉🎉
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Never posted here but I've been lurking recently. Snagged A2 Row V :metal
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Well done - I got A3 Row T - I was there at 9.00 and there were no A2 seats left. By the time I'd checked out the whole pre-sale was sold out.
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Tried to get A2 but couldn't get it for 2 tickets (Me and Dad). Got A3 though which is the next best thing I guess! Row M. Can't fucking wait.
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A3 Row N for me. Beyond stoked. Bring on October!
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I had similar feelings of excitement about this show that I did for Michael Jackson in 2009. That was a big comeback, this is a big reunion, both at the O2. Please don't let any of them kick the bucket before this one :-[ :-[
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Booked tickets to see Dream Theater at the O2...never thought I'd be writing those words.
The last Dream Theater tour I went to was Octavarium, and Octavarium was also the most recently released DT album that I have actually listened to. I kind of thought I was done with the band, but the MP reunion has reawakened my interest. And once I saw that the very first concert would be in London, it was impossible to pass up.
I guess I need to listen to some of the post-2005 albums now...
EDIT: Apparently I have posted 121 times under this login! No idea when exactly, but I used to be an active user of the DT board back in the early 2000s. It's cool to see that quite a few of the posters from that era are still around!
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Booked tickets to see Dream Theater at the O2...never thought I'd be writing those words.
I just booked mine in Section 111 row U. They are not exactly good seats, but I am not complaining, especially perhaps they are the few LAST remaining top-tier tickets. I checked again 5 minutes later and nothing was left.
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Not that I don't think London doesn't 'deserve' the 'first' show back for MP......I just find it weird that his first show back with DT is going to be overseas. I would have bet $1000.00 it'd have been in NYC or Boston....somewhere close to their home or what they consider 'home'
Bruce and Adrian's first show back in Maiden was in the US, I think. Is what it is.
Anyway, got tickets this morning for the show. B3 but what can you do? Looks like you others had a little more luck although I was there dead on nine. Still, I'm going, that's the main thing.
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I just booked mine in Section 111 row U. They are not exactly good seats, but I am not complaining, especially perhaps they are the few LAST remaining top-tier tickets. I checked again 5 minutes later and nothing was left.
I got Section 103 row H. I've only been to the O2 once before for a gig and we were way up in the rafters so this is going to feel much closer to the action. When I first signed on there were some floor seats available, but my wife is short and would probably struggle to see without the banking. I think 103 will be okay.
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I got Section 103 row H. I've only been to the O2 once before for a gig and we were way up in the rafters so this is going to feel much closer to the action. When I first signed on there were some floor seats available, but my wife is short and would probably struggle to see without the banking. I think 103 will be okay.
I am looking at the seating chart as I am typing this. You sir are sitting right across from my section, and one section farther from the stage, not too bad at all. Yeah, I was going to buy the floor seats initially, but the guy I am going to is quite short and he was worrying about the same thing too. Plus, no more good floor seats were left when I logged in. It just wasn't worth the high price. Let's enjoy the show and have a great time in 6 months! Lol! :metal
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Bruce and Adrian's first show back in Maiden was in the US, I think. Is what it is.
Canada, but yea they toured NA first. In fact their first UK stop was unceremoniously in the middle of the next tour and they didn’t even properly tour there until 2004. But their first tour was more of a low key warmup tour anyway where their equivalent of this first DT tour happened the following year. Seems like DT really wants to go big for the first show/tour and I wonder if they just got better offers in Europe. Also makes sense since fhey we’re just in the USA.
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Well, the pre-sale sold out in seconds. And we somehow managed to get A2 row P for the O2 show!!!! 🎉🎉🎉
Damn! Glad I snagged yesterday.
Section 111 Row W x2. I’m taking my Dad to his first DT show!
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Damn! Glad I snagged yesterday.
Section 111 Row W x2. I’m taking my Dad to his first DT show!
Interesting... I got mine only this morning yet I am 2 rows in front of you in row U. ???
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Interesting... I got mine only this morning yet I am 2 rows in front of you in row U. ???
Still "presale" I guess! What side of the block are you? I'm left side, so closer to the stage. The seats look decent according to here (https://aviewfrommyseat.co.uk/photo/258463/the+o2%2C+london/section-111/row-v/seat-337/), Petrucci side too which I what I was after.
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Decided I'm going for the Golden Circle ticket. I got GC tickets for Metallica a few years ago and I really enjoyed that experience. Nice view and usually less crowded.
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First there was the O2 pre-sale, and now it's the general pre-sale, and presumably at some point there will just be the "normal" sale. This is confusing. What's the difference between a general pre-sale and just "being on sale"?
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On another note: Scotty, did you make the pieces of art accompanying the tour announcement? I love them.
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First there was the O2 pre-sale, and now it's the general pre-sale, and presumably at some point there will just be the "normal" sale. This is confusing. What's the difference between a general pre-sale and just "being on sale"?
I gather pre-sale is generally something you have to sign up for. In the O2 case, it would be those who are members of the O2 priority club (I believe) with general pre-sale just requiring you to put in your email address.
Then general sale is just where you can go on the website, click buy tickets and away you go.
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It still doesn't look like they are selling the top section of the O2 so depending on demand, I imagine they might open that up in general sale
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Still "presale" I guess! What side of the block are you? I'm left side, so closer to the stage. The seats look decent according to here (https://aviewfrommyseat.co.uk/photo/258463/the+o2%2C+london/section-111/row-v/seat-337/), Petrucci side too which I what I was after.
The same side as yours in Section 111 in row U. Yeah, I checked out the virtual seating and it is not a bad place to be in. :metal
First there was the O2 pre-sale, and now it's the general pre-sale, and presumably at some point there will just be the "normal" sale. This is confusing. What's the difference between a general pre-sale and just "being on sale"?
If you are an O2/Virgin Media customer, you get their pre-sale on Monday (I think). Otherwise, you needed to sign up for a pre-sale list and get a special link for that pre-sale this morning. Or else try your luck with the general sale on Friday,
I gather pre-sale is generally something you have to sign up for. In the O2 case, it would be those who are members of the O2 priority club (I believe) with general pre-sale just requiring you to put in your email address.
Then general sale is just where you can go on the website, click buy tickets and away you go.
That. :hat
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I am once again expressing my dismay that the ticket cost £75, but I was then subject to a "booking fee" and "transaction fee" and then a "faciliation fee" whatever that is.
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I am once again expressing my dismay that the ticket cost £75, but I was then subject to a "booking fee" and "transaction fee" and then a "faciliation fee" whatever that is.
I hear you. I too hate those charges. Speaking of which, I was charged so much to begin with and I went pay an extra £5 and got the "refund protection" just in case.
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I hear you. I too hate those charges. Speaking of which, I was charged so much to begin with and I went pay an extra £5 and got the "refund protection" just in case.
Yeah, I did the same. With two children the risk that one of them gets too ill for us to leave them with grandparents is quite high...Fingers crossed we will be okay.
Tried to go and see Devin Townsend at the Royal Albert Hall in 2022 but had to pull out at short notice for childcare reasons. My younger son was much smaller then though, so I really hope we can actually get to the concert this time.
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Hello guys , I would like to visit London O2 Arena . I am going to travel from Greece . I found the official website for the tickets but the tickets will be available on 12/4 at 9:00 . Can you tell me (if you know it of course) , the main arena will be full of seats (and the tickets will be in combine with a seat number) ? Or it will be 1 ticket for standing spectators in the arena ?
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Hello guys , I would like to visit London O2 Arena . I am going to travel from Greece . I found the official website for the tickets but the tickets will be available on 12/4 at 9:00 . Can you tell me (if you know it of course) , the main arena will be full of seats (and the tickets will be in combine with a seat number) ? Or it will be 1 ticket for standing spectators in the arena ?
It’s all seated in London.
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On another note: Scotty, did you make the pieces of art accompanying the tour announcement? I love them.
Yeah, it's cool, but no - I'm guessing it was Hugh that did that image.
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I'm just waiting for the DREAMSONIC '24 North American dates to drop! Looks like it begins on July 28th in Boston at the Berkley PAC! Here's the info:
DREAMSONIC '24 starring DREAM THEATER with the LONG-AWAITED return of Mike Portnoy!
Special Guests HAKEN with support from NEMIC.
............then I woke up! >:( :censored >:( :censored >:( :censored
I feel this post deep in my soul (BURNIN' MAH SOUL)
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I’m behind, but I wanted to comment on the whole “first show is in the U.K. not the U.S.” thing. Dream Theater is very much an international band in terms of status and influence. From what I could tell they have always been more embraced by Europe and Asia and made a bigger mark in those parts of the world before making a mark in the United States. If it’s a national pride thing, then I can’t really relate to that. I’m American and I’m not really a “salute the flag” type. If it was more logistically viable to start in London, and they have a massive show, I think it’s awesome.
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I’m behind, but I wanted to comment on the whole “first show is in the U.K. not the U.S.” thing. Dream Theater is very much an international band in terms of status and influence. From what I could tell they have always been more embraced by Europe and Asia and made a bigger mark in those parts of the world before making a mark in the United States. If it’s a national pride thing, then I can’t really relate to that. I’m American and I’m not really a “salute the flag” type. If it was more logistically viable to start in London, and they have a massive show, I think it’s awesome.
Yeah, there was some shock on my end when Londong was announced as the first show, but after taking a few days to think about it, I totally agree with this. Whatever they can do to make their first show back as big and huge as possible, I'm all for. Happy that they get to play a huge venue like O2 for the first show back, even if there is no way I could be there
(https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/qENFapcEHndBaE4P8U6sR7.jpg)
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DreamSonic? Please no. And no Progressive Nation. Just a pure, unadulterated Evening With tour. No opening acts.
That's kind of where I'm at. It doesn't help that I'm not huge into the rest of the genre (I really enjoyed Devin when I saw him, and I'd probably go to Haken just out of curiosity, but generally, the proposed openers for DT do nothing for me.). I'd rather get 2 1/2 or 3 hours of DT and have a break in the middle.
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I'd rather get 2 1/2 or 3 hours of DT and have a break in the middle.
Yep, any day. No openers, no package tours, unless ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY for some reason.
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The O2 gig is exciting enough, what with it being MP's first show back, but it being the first show of the tour and the setlist therefore being unspoiled just adds another level of excitement for me. Well, unless they decide to go and spoil at least some of it in advance again.
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The O2 gig is exciting enough, what with it being MP's first show back, but it being the first show of the tour and the setlist therefore being unspoiled just adds another level of excitement for me. Well, unless they decide to go and spoil at least some of it in advance again.
Yes this excited me about going to the very first show as well, I always have the intention of not spoiling the setlist for myself, but then can't help having a peak once the tour starts. Now I'll have no way of spoiling it for myself!
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I got tix for the Oslo show, row 5 in section 003 (closest to stage on JP's side), but I'm so over it being a seated show. Like 5% of me is thinking of going both here and taking a plane to whichever city that's going to have a normal show on a Saturday, but sadly I'm not a rich person :lol Last time around in the same venue I got to see a standing show in the golden circle and the vibes were on point :'(
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12. Raise the Knife (12:00)
There's no way this one gets played, with MP's lyrics and everything that happened since 2010 :lol
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I got tix for the Oslo show, row 5 in section 003 (closest to stage on JP's side), but I'm so over it being a seated show. Like 5% of me is thinking of going both here and taking a plane to whichever city that's going to have a normal show on a Saturday, but sadly I'm not a rich person :lol Last time around in the same venue I got to see a standing show in the golden circle and the vibes were on point :'(
Budapest is on a Saturday and has standing. :lol
I'm surprised there are some standing and others all seated. It seems an odd choice to do a random mix of all seated and part seated/part standing. I wonder if it's venue requirements or something?
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I live at a comparable distance from Oslo, Stockholm and Copenhagen. Decided to buy tickets for Copenhagen mainly because it was the only standing show!
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I wonder if it's venue requirements or something?
I have no idea. On the View tour the venue wasn't sold out but the attendance was pretty good. Trying to pack seats into it will probably result in less people getting tickets that would really like to.
This was also my first time experiencing the "presale available through one link only, type in code that's only been figured out online, and still find the first four rows are completely packed anyway with maniacs who did this even earlier than you" ticket scramble that you guys always do on the other side of the pond. If this is the future of ticket sales in Europe too, I'm going to start listening to more obscure bands :lol
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I got tix for the Oslo show, row 5 in section 003 (closest to stage on JP's side), but I'm so over it being a seated show. Like 5% of me is thinking of going both here and taking a plane to whichever city that's going to have a normal show on a Saturday, but sadly I'm not a rich person :lol Last time around in the same venue I got to see a standing show in the golden circle and the vibes were on point :'(
Why are seated shows a thing at Dream Theater gigs now? I last saw them on the 8V tour and it was not seated. The idea of sitting down at what is (in theory) a metal gig is really weird to me.
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Why are seated shows a thing at Dream Theater gigs now? I last saw them on the 8V tour and it was not seated. The idea of sitting down at what is (in theory) a metal gig is really weird to me.
We weren't seated at the Dreamsonic show I saw, but all the previous shows at the Oakdale in Wallingford - back through The Astonishing - were seated.
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Why are seated shows a thing at Dream Theater gigs now? I last saw them on the 8V tour and it was not seated. The idea of sitting down at what is (in theory) a metal gig is really weird to me.
Not everyone likes to stand for 3 hours. Myself included.
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Not everyone likes to stand for 3 hours. Myself included.
Thank you! Same here, but it is not by choice. I have a chronic lower back injury, and I can't stand for too long before feeling pain.
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I can almost guarantee that as soon as the band comes out at the O2 and Portnoy appears with them, everyone is going to stand up.
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We weren't seated at the Dreamsonic show I saw, but all the previous shows at the Oakdale in Wallingford - back through The Astonishing - were seated.
OT but I think we've been at many of the same shows!
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This tour will surely be recorded at some point? A truly historic show in the career of Dream Theater.
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This tour will surely be recorded at some point? A truly historic show in the career of Dream Theater.
I'd be shocked if there's no concert film of this tour.
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Not everyone likes to stand for 3 hours. Myself included.
Which is why there should be a big section for people who want to sit and a big section for people who want to stand. Even if the best case scenario happens and we all stand up, I'm stuck behind whoever bought the ticket to the seat in front of me, while with standing tickets you can actually move around.
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Most venues support seating in the balcony / stands/ bleachers and can take the seats out in the stalls to accommodate standing downstairs. I agree that not everyone can stand for 3 hours, but the all-seated vibe kills the atmosphere for those of us that would rather stand downstairs. And if I'm honest, standing gigs create a better atmosphere for those sitting down upstairs too. I just hate being sat next to inconsiderate a-holes, standing gigs give be an opportunity to move away from them.
It is a metal show, not Barry F*cking Manilow.
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I think an unintended consequence of all-seated shows is that it divides the crowd in the sense that some will want to stand at their seat, and others prefer to sit.
I feel like without fail, every show I've been to that is all-seated has the inevitable group that will stand, and the people behind them yelling at them to sit down. For me, I like to be close to the front in shows and if it is all seated, I stay seated unless the people behind me are standing, but I also feel that being seated reduces the excitement a little. I'm a bit tall, so have to be conscious about blocking people who are there to see the band, not the back of my head :)
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I am once again expressing my dismay that the ticket cost £75, but I was then subject to a "booking fee" and "transaction fee" and then a "faciliation fee" whatever that is.
I mean, even in 2014 DT tickets cost £60. For the AVFTTOTW tour we paid £120 per seat for each show. It's ridiculously expensive but that's what they can charge I guess.
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I think an unintended consequence of all-seated shows is that it divides the crowd in the sense that some will want to stand at their seat, and others prefer to sit.
I feel like without fail, every show I've been to that is all-seated has the inevitable group that will stand, and the people behind them yelling at them to sit down. For me, I like to be close to the front in shows and if it is all seated, I stay seated unless the people behind me are standing, but I also feel that being seated reduces the excitement a little. I'm a bit tall, so have to be conscious about blocking people who are there to see the band, not the back of my head :)
Other than the "tall" part - haha - that's how I feel.
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Other than the "tall" part - haha - that's how I feel.
Haha, not tall at all, 5'2" here (and my husband is also not tall) so I don't want to be looking at the backs of heads either! It's nice to be able to find a little niche, anywhere, where we can see the band and not heads/backs.
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Haha, not tall at all, 5'2" here (and my husband is also not tall)
Finally we get the real reason you prefer Mangini to Portnoy! ;D
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Finally we get the real reason you prefer Mangini to Portnoy! ;D
:rollin
Oh this place is giving me my laughs today! :lol
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I totally get why people want to stand. And I'd be happy if it was guaranteed I could see. But at 5'7, virtually everyone is taller than me which means I usually can't see shit. And that ain't fair. As for just having seating at the sides, why should you get to be closer to the band than me just because you're tall?
I'm okay with the O2 being seated.
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The way I've always seen it is that if if you get floor-level tickets, you stand and if you want to sit, get a balcony seat. Always made perfect sense to me. I suppose the perfect balance would be a place with seated balconies and non-seated floor area, but not sure if such a place exists.
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Haha, not tall at all, 5'2" here
Finally we get the real reason you prefer Mangini to Portnoy! ;D
Well, actually, Portnoy is actually pretty short too. I'm not sure exactly how tall, but I would estimate maybe about 5'4" or so judging from a pic I have standing next to him back in 2010.
The way I've always seen it is that if if you get floor-level tickets, you stand and if you want to sit, get a balcony seat. Always made perfect sense to me. I suppose the perfect balance would be a place with seated balconies and non-seated floor area, but not sure if such a place exists.
Yeah, exactly.
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Other than the "tall" part - haha - that's how I feel.
Who's the tallest member of Dream Theater anyway?
That's right, looks like it's my guy, James LaBrie
(https://dreamtheater.net/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/48378205_10155716752697181_7965675337637953536_o.jpg)
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Who's the tallest member of Dream Theater anyway?
That's right, looks like it's my guy, James LaBrie
(https://dreamtheater.net/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/48378205_10155716752697181_7965675337637953536_o.jpg)
OUR guy, hehe! 🤭🤗✨
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The way I've always seen it is that if if you get floor-level tickets, you stand and if you want to sit, get a balcony seat. Always made perfect sense to me. I suppose the perfect balance would be a place with seated balconies and non-seated floor area, but not sure if such a place exists.
Plenty of venues like that here in NYC. Their 2014 show was in a venue like that, but they prefer Beacon Theater for NYC (I think they do, heard it somewhere) which is all seated.
(https://maps.ticketmaster.com/maps/geometry/3/event/0000605DD8A27121/staticImage?type=png&systemId=HOST)
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@THS: Hard to tell without them standing the same way all next to each other, but it's either James or JP. I don't know exactly how tall any of them are, and I don't recall ever comparing. But for reference, I'm 6'1", and while JP is slightly shorter than me, he has hugged me and I don't recall having to slouch at all, so he's not much shorter than that. And I think he and James are close.
And, yes, I survived the bear hug. :lol
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@THS: Hard to tell without them standing the same way all next to each other, but it's either James or JP. I don't know exactly how tall any of them are, and I don't recall ever comparing. But for reference, I'm 6'1", and while JP is slightly shorter than me, he has hugged me and I don't recall having to slouch at all, so he's not much shorter than that. And I think he and James are close.
And, yes, I survived the bear hug. :lol
I'm 6'5" but i've only met the shortest members of the band (JR and MP) lol. But yes it could be JP but due to the way they're standing in that shot it might be a bit off
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I'm 6'5" but i've only met the shortest members of the band (JR and MP) lol. But yes it could be JP but due to the way they're standing in that shot it might be a bit off
How tall is JR? I thought he was one of the taller ones (but when I met them they were all sitting down so I may be wrong!).
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JP is max 5'9. Mike's about 5'7/5'8.
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I am right at 5'-6" tall. Here's a pic of me and my boys when we stalked their tour bus in Nashville back in early 2019.
(https://i.imgur.com/2qWcmhE.jpg)
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JP is max 5'9. Mike's about 5'7/5'8.
I'm 5' 7.5" and MP's a bit taller than me. I'd imagine he's closer to 5' 9" and JP is 5' 10" or even 5' 11". MM is definitely the shortest - I'm thinking 5' 5" or 5' 6". IIRC, Jordan's about 5' 10" and JL is about the same as JP. And I think JM is about 5' 9" as well.
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I'm 5' 7.5" and MP's a bit taller than me. I'd imagine he's closer to 5' 9" and JP is 5' 10" or even 5' 11". MM is definitely the shortest - I'm thinking 5' 5" or 5' 6". IIRC, Jordan's about 5' 10" and JL is about the same as JP. And I think JM is about 5' 9" as well.
Oh, really? I'm surprised. Looking at that pic I snapped with him after the TA show in Downey (I think you were actually behind the camera for that, or just out of frame--can't remember), he looks shorter than that, and I am a bit hunched over. But I'm sure you are right. You've spent a lot more time around him than I have.
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I don't know whether they are going to really try to play something from each and every album or if they are going to just do a good representation of their entire careers without trying to literally capture every album. They know Octavarium is a fan favorite, and it's one that is on at least some of their minds as something they want to play. But if they are taking the former approach on this tour before the album drops, Octavarium might be a long shot just because of its length. That is the same quandary they ran into for the Score show once they decided to play Six Degrees. That decision all by itself had a ripple effect through the entire set that made it a pretty big challenge to vary much from what they actually ended up playing. Granted, that's 43 minutes of music that will not be in the set this time around. But the flip side of that is that they have 7 more albums now. It might be really tough to fit Octavarium in. That said, I really hope they do. And even though it is difficult, just kind of sketching out some rough set lists making sure to hit every album, include things I think are fairly likely, but keeping to mostly shorter(ish) songs, I guess they still have plenty of options. Here's a sample I came up with without noodling too hard on it (I will go with the R40- reverse chron format):
1. The Alien
2. Barstool Warrior (I would love S2N, and it's actually a bit shorter, but I was just "feeling" Barstool as more likely)
3. Our New World (I highly suspect this will be played, although I would prefer Moment of Betrayal)
4. The Enemy Inside
5. Breaking All Illusions (since they seem to love this, for some strange reason; I would go with OTBOA, personally)
6. A Right of Passage (not my fave, but it was a single, it's short, and it hasn't been well represented; I could also see TSF since Portnoy probably wants to play it with the band)
7. Constant Motion
8. Octavarium
--
9. Honor Thy Father (I would rather see ITNOG, and they could easily sub that in instead, but I was initially going for shorter songs. Either would be a great set 2 opener after 8VM closing the first set)
10. Misunderstood
11. Spirit (they'll surely play this, right?)
12. Take Away My Pain (continuing the "soft" song section)
13. Erotomania (surely an instrumental somewhere, right?)
14. To Live Forever (not "truly" an I&W song, but fits the era and could be part of a good Charlie tribute, followed by...)
15. Afterlife (I would rather see OAMOT as the closer, and I really dislike this song, but given Charlie's passing, I think it's likely)
--
16. Pull Me Under (logical encore closer, and it checks the I&W box in a way that TLF only partially does)
With my primary choices, that's only about 2:20 total music. With an intro tape, some short breaks here and there for James banter and JP changing guitars, there's still a good bit of freedom to sub a few of those out for longer songs without going too crazy, without them going over 3 hours total with intermission, which is about what I would expect for an evening with show from them based on past tours. And as far as song selection, I wouldn't mind that set at all. Pretty varied list of things I would expect, things I like, things I'm not crazy about, instrumentals, "ballads," heavy songs, etc. It pretty much has it all.
Also a great set list...
Except you kind of forgot about DT16!
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No, I didn't forget it. I think they are going to be touring before it comes out, so I was assuming this anniversary tour will be only songs that exist right now. But I could be wrong.
And once the new album drops, I don't see any way they can include songs from every album. They would essentially be forced to play only the shortest songs from each album and to play only a small sampling from the new album, and neither of those parameters fit their general approach to live shows.
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I'm just wondering how they will fit everything in when they do the 50th anniversary tour.
A day with Dream Theater? ;D
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Just curious what people's thoughts are.... If Octavarium was on the chopping block because of its length, would you be alright with them ditching the continuum intro and just getting to the song if it freed up another 5+ minutes for another song?
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Just curious what people's thoughts are.... If Octavarium was on the chopping block because of its length, would you be alright with them ditching the continuum intro and just getting to the song if it freed up another 5+ minutes for another song?
Yep. It's a cool section and I 'get' why it's there....but....it's also one of my youngest sons favorite songs and anytime he puts it on in my car he does that exact thing. Skips it to get to the 'start' of the song.
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No, I didn't forget it. I think they are going to be touring before it comes out, so I was assuming this anniversary tour will be only songs that exist right now. But I could be wrong.
And once the new album drops, I don't see any way they can include songs from every album. They would essentially be forced to play only the shortest songs from each album and to play only a small sampling from the new album, and neither of those parameters fit their general approach to live shows.
In the latest interview Mike talked about them making sure the album is ready to be released before the tour. I think they're going to release it a few weeks before the first show.
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Just curious what people's thoughts are.... If Octavarium was on the chopping block because of its length, would you be alright with them ditching the continuum intro and just getting to the song if it freed up another 5+ minutes for another song?
NooOOOoooOo!!!!*!* 😭😭😭😭😭
That intro is literally what made me a fan... ✨💙
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I decided to sketch up a very, very rough estimate of what the setlist could possibly look like, not factoring in the possibility of rotation. I threw in what I think are likely candidates mixed with songs I saw recommended a lot in this thread. Also, the runtimes you see for new album songs are just guesses, obviously.
Set #1:
1. First single from new album (8:00)
2. The Glass Prison (12:00)
3. S2N (6:22)
4. New album song (6:00)
5. New album song (9:30)
6. Home (12:54)
7. Surrender to Reason (6:35)
8. Surrounded (5:30)
9. In the Name of God (14:15)
--Intermission--
Set #2:
10. The Alien (9:33)
11. Afterlife (5:30)
12. Raise the Knife (12:00)
13. Through My Words/Fatal Tragedy (7:50)
14. Breaking All Illusions (12:30)
15. New album epic (16:00)
Encore:
16. Octavarium (24:00)
2hr, 46m, leaving room for breaks between songs (James banter with the audience and John changes guitars) and intermission, as long as my math isn't painfully wrong.
This would be a cool show as well.
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And, yes, I survived the bear hug. :lol
"Both modes are Bear Mode."
Are we now going to have three pages debating how tall they are?
Just curious what people's thoughts are.... If Octavarium was on the chopping block because of its length, would you be alright with them ditching the continuum intro and just getting to the song if it freed up another 5+ minutes for another song?
Absolutely, without question. It's boring as sin. I'd also be ok with them ditching the steel guitar part of the intro (it wouldn't save much time dumping only the Continuum part of the intro).
In fact, it'll be interesting to see whether the Continuum and steel guitar are on stage to start the show (although, if 8VM is the encore, then could wait until then to put those instruments on stage to preserve the surprise).
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"Both modes are Bear Mode."
:rollin
In fact, it'll be interesting to see whether the Continuum and steel guitar are on stage to start the show (although, if 8VM is the encore, then could wait until then to put those instruments on stage to preserve the surprise).
Interesting question. I doubt a lot of people would notice them being there (but I could be wrong). But the other thing that I think warrants mentioning is that at the time that song was composed, Jordan hadn't really developed and wasn't using the iPad apps he has now. IMO, the Continuum is basically obsolete now, as he can use his apps to do pretty much the same things he used to do on the Continuum. And I would venture to say that he can probably replicate a steel guitar well enough that he might dispense with an actual steel guitar as well.
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A day with Dream Theater? ;D
:lol
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Just curious what people's thoughts are.... If Octavarium was on the chopping block because of its length, would you be alright with them ditching the continuum intro and just getting to the song if it freed up another 5+ minutes for another song?
When the album first came out, I regularly used to do exactly that. Not that I didn’t appreciate the intro, I just wanted to get straight to the “song” parts. Because ultimately, Someone Like Him and Medicate for me are right up there with the strongest melodic and lyrical passages they have created, and that they flow right into one another makes it all the more special.
So yeah, in answer to your suggestion, I wouldn’t mind at all for the sake of getting more songs in. But is it likely to happen if JP has anything to say about it, which he will :lol
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But the other thing that I think warrants mentioning is that at the time that song was composed, Jordan hadn't really developed and wasn't using the iPad apps he has now. IMO, the Continuum is basically obsolete now, as he can use his apps to do pretty much the same things he used to do on the Continuum. And I would venture to say that he can probably replicate a steel guitar well enough that he might dispense with an actual steel guitar as well.
I both agree and disagree here, respectfully. He could indeed make all the same sounds with the apps, but it would be missing something.
He is also known for using vintage instruments alongside the newest gadgets to create the sounds he wants to. I was just watching the View documentary where he did just that. And that is recent. So I doubt he would not use the Continuum.
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If they do, indeed, play Octavarium on the tour (I still maintain that I'm almost certain they will), I think they gotta bring out the Continuum. It just makes sense...
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So I accidentally ended up with four tickets for London O2 instead of two...
I was on an overnight flight from Dallas back to Ireland and I knew the presale would start while I was still in the air. Bought a WiFi package from the airline and was able to get 2 tickets in the presale, happy days! Then I landed and my father rings me and says he got 2 tickets for the London show. His seats are better! :-[
Anyone interested in the 2 spare tickets? Has to be re-sold through Twickets (never used them before myself) but I can't list them for sale there until the general sale start time on Friday morning. I'm happy to write off the booking fee and even a little extra, so will be selling for £115 each (bought for £153 including £18 booking fee) so you're getting a 38 discount on each. Must be sold as a pair.
Seats are in section B3, Row B, seats 44 & 45.
(Moderators - If I'm posting this in the wrong place, please point me to the correct one and I'll repost there instead)
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It's the Taxi Cab.
(https://i.discogs.com/ZIzkbu2eSPNbf3SOsKb8hFOfC15JpMZ-S8TG8kW8DcY/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:510/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTIwNjg0/NTI3LTE2MzY4OTQy/MTktMjAwNS5qcGVn.jpeg)
https://www.discogs.com/release/20684527-Dream-Theater-A-View-From-The-Top-Of-The-World
-Marc.
Good catch. I though the taxi cab was from the self-titled album. So that being the case, I don't see When Dream And Day Unite, Metropolis Pt.2, and the self-titled album represented on the poster.
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Good catch. I though the taxi cab was from the self-titled album. So that being the case, I don't see When Dream And Day Unite, Metropolis Pt.2, and the self-titled album represented on the poster.
SFAM has the album cover right in the middle
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SFAM has the album cover right in the middle
Bro stared at the sun during the eclipse.
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Bro stared at the sun during the eclipse.
To be fair, the picture without the dates does not have SFAM
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So...I think...
- WDADU: The only thing I can think of is the Majesty symbol.
- I&W: Little girl in the foreground and sacred heart.
- Awake: The clock face.
- ACOS: Kid building sandcastle
- FII: Two dudes in tall chairs with binoculars.
- SFAM: Face in the sky.
- SDOIT: The happy face on the third X.
- TOT: Eyeball.
- 8VM: Newton's cradle (still with one string too short), birds and leaning guy.
- SC: Ants and sign with Majesty symbol.
- BC&SL: Elephant.
- ADTOE: Guy on unicycle on the second X.
- DT12: The Majesty symbol, and I guess people are saying the car, but I have no idea what that has to do with the album.
- TA: NOMACs.
- DOT: Robot hand and skull
- View: I'm coming up empty. You'd think they'd have the shoes or the viewfinder thing, but...??/s
Where is the face in the sky?
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Where is the face in the sky?
(https://i.imgur.com/7i271Kw.png)
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To be fair, the picture without the dates does not have SFAM
I was looking at the picture without the dates. I still don't see anything tied to the debut or self-titled albums.
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WDADU doesn’t seem to have anything, but I think it’s fair to say the Majesty symbol represents the self-titled album.
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(https://i.imgur.com/7i271Kw.png)
Thanks I was looking at the poster without the dates.
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WDADU doesn’t seem to have anything, but I think it’s fair to say the Majesty symbol represents the self-titled album.
I could represent that album, but it's also on all of the other albums.
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WDADU doesn’t seem to have anything, but I think it’s fair to say the Majesty symbol represents the self-titled album.
The yellow car represents the self-titled. It's from the Along for the Ride video, I think.
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(https://i.imgur.com/7i271Kw.png)
Do you think there will be posters?? I don't usually look for posters at the concerts and haven't noticed them at DT shows. With some concerts or bands, they are a big deal, so it's obvious. (Metallica)
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Do you think there will be posters?? I don't usually look for posters at the concerts and haven't noticed them at DT shows. With some concerts or bands, they are a big deal, so it's obvious. (Metallica)
They seem to have them fairly sporadically. I got them from the pre-ADTOE tour, and for the View tour. My gut says, it's a big event and people might want to have something to display from it, so, yes...
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The yellow car represents the self-titled. It's from the Along for the Ride video, I think.
As I mentioned earlier in the thread, the taxi is exactly the same from the AVFTTOTW liner notes booklet, and looks different from the one in the DT12 artwork/music video. That one has luggage on the top and has a different window shape on the side.
As others have said, I think we can just say the Majesty symbol is pulling double duty to represent their debut album and their self-titled album.
-Marc.
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UPDATED:
- WDADU: The only thing I can think of is the Majesty symbol.
- I&W: Little girl in the foreground and sacred heart.
- Awake: The clock face.
- ACOS: Kid building sandcastle
- FII: Two dudes in tall chairs with binoculars.
- SFAM: Face in the sky.
- SDOIT: The happy face on the third X.
- TOT: Eyeball.
- 8VM: Newton's cradle (still with one string too short), birds and leaning guy.
- SC: Ants and sign with Majesty symbol.
- BC&SL: Elephant.
- ADTOE: Guy on unicycle on the second X.
- DT12: The Majesty symbol, and I guess people are saying the car, but I have no idea what that has to do with the album.
- TA: NOMACs.
- DOT: Robot hand and skull
- View: The car/taxi (which appears in the liner notes). I'm coming up empty. You'd think they'd have the shoes or the viewfinder thing, but...??
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Thanks I was looking at the poster without the dates.
use this one
(https://i.imgur.com/thd7a9G.png)
Open in new tab it has a nice resolution, however the SFAM face is not visible
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As I mentioned earlier in the thread, the taxi is exactly the same from the AVFTTOTW liner notes booklet, and looks different from the one in the DT12 artwork/music video. That one has luggage on the top and has a different window shape on the side.
As others have said, I think we can just say the Majesty symbol is pulling double duty to represent their debut album and their self-titled album.
-Marc.
Didn't know that since I don't own the CD yet. Suppose that makes sense.
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I've mentioned before that searching for "sfam" on Wikipedia will redirect to the SFAM page (also works for "wdadu," "sdoit," "bc&sl," and "adtoe"). However, if you google "sfam," you get a bunch of completely unrelated results, including the Society for Applied Microbiology. :biggrin:
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use this one
(https://i.imgur.com/thd7a9G.png)
Open in new tab it has a nice resolution, however the SFAM face is not visible
That *is* the poster without the dates, which seems to cut off the top half of the image where the SFAM face collage appears in the poster WITH the dates.
...or am I missing something here?
-Marc.
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So why XXXX instead of XL?
I’m thinking they might be featuring songs from each decade with maybe a video in between each rather than playing 1 song from each album. The new album will be released in 2024 but I don’t see another album until 2026 IDK, just a thought.
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Well, at least us North American people can start putting money aside now lol. I’m expecting more dates to be released in the next month or 2. I’ll actually try to get good seats this time lol. My wife even agreed to come, because even tho I dragged her to see DT many times she never saw this line up live lol.
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So why XXXX instead of XL?
It's better than Call Of Duty using IIII instead of IV. :lol
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It's better than Call Of Duty using IIII instead of IV. :lol
Oh my god. That always made me rage.
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WDADU doesn’t seem to have anything, but I think it’s fair to say the Majesty symbol represents the self-titled album.
The word "Dream" seems to be uniting with the daylight in the poster - that's a stretch but good enough for me :lol
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So why XXXX instead of XL?
I’m thinking they might be featuring songs from each decade with maybe a video in between each rather than playing 1 song from each album. The new album will be released in 2024 but I don’t see another album until 2026 IDK, just a thought.
Could be, but I think XXXX has a cooler visual than XL. Besides, XL often means "extra large" which could cause lots of confusion, not the least being the apparently oversized venues they're booked in for this tour! :lol
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use this one
(https://i.imgur.com/thd7a9G.png)
Open in new tab it has a nice resolution, however the SFAM face is not visible
https://scontent.fbfh2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/435502782_973754077452597_3681605962199605525_n.jpg?_nc_cat=104&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=5f2048&_nc_ohc=sN9No8Bh0y4Ab6eOEsL&_nc_ht=scontent.fbfh2-1.fna&oh=00_AfAvuHJ9qm4D86nxBwhpQJp6JUIQRh9fMOKn0f9f2rsUHw&oe=661CDB06
This one is nice too. Portnoy just posted on Facebook.
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The X’s (particularly the front one) looks AI generated. There’s even a weird partial 5th X behind it. Lol
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The X’s (particularly the front one) looks AI generated. There’s even a weird partial 5th X behind it. Lol
I noticed the additional 5th X and figured it was an editing oversight.
Regardless
https://scontent.fbfh2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/435502782_973754077452597_3681605962199605525_n.jpg?_nc_cat=104&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=5f2048&_nc_ohc=sN9No8Bh0y4Ab6eOEsL&_nc_ht=scontent.fbfh2-1.fna&oh=00_AfAvuHJ9qm4D86nxBwhpQJp6JUIQRh9fMOKn0f9f2rsUHw&oe=661CDB06
I would love to have this as a jigsaw puzzle.
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https://scontent.fbfh2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/435502782_973754077452597_3681605962199605525_n.jpg?_nc_cat=104&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=5f2048&_nc_ohc=sN9No8Bh0y4Ab6eOEsL&_nc_ht=scontent.fbfh2-1.fna&oh=00_AfAvuHJ9qm4D86nxBwhpQJp6JUIQRh9fMOKn0f9f2rsUHw&oe=661CDB06
This one is nice too. Portnoy just posted on Facebook.
Ahh that's much better. Happy to see a complete version with the SFAM face in landscape orientation.
The X’s (particularly the front one) looks AI generated. There’s even a weird partial 5th X behind it. Lol
It's not even a full X as it doesn't go up to cover the front of the third X (with the SDOIT smiley on it). But yeah, now that you point that out, it looks REALLY weird to me and I cannot unsee it. Thanks.
-Marc.
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Doesn't really look AI generated to me. Just looks like typical Hugh Syme artwor- nevermind.
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Thing with the front X is that is wider at the top (2 blocks), while the bottom half is only 1 block wide.
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Tickets, flights and hotel booked for London!
I had a link to the pre-sale, but got caught up with work this morning and missed the 9:00 AM opening, so prob missed out on a better seat. Grr.
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Thing with the front X is that is wider at the top (2 blocks), while the bottom half is only 1 block wide.
The longer I look at it, the more I realize that the X's aren't lined up at all, especially the third one from the left, where you can easily tell that the top right part of the X doesn't line-up with the bottom left. :rollin
-Marc.
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Doesn’t it seem odd for them to put this out now? Shouldn’t they have waited to include the artwork from the new album as well?
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Could be, but I think XXXX has a cooler visual than XL. Besides, XL often means "extra large" which could cause lots of confusion, not the least being the apparently oversized venues they're booked in for this tour! :lol
Another way to rationalize it: they're not trying to write a number in roman letters. Each X just represents a decade.
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I feel like I'm forgetting something really obvious or an album cover is entirely going over my head, but what's the Elephant? Isn't that the Elephant from Flower Kings - Waiting For Miracles?
Also it kind of looks like the I&W girl is playing with a Nintendo Switch, maybe it's a nod to the Astonishing Steam game?
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Doesn’t it seem odd for them to put this out now? Shouldn’t they have waited to include the artwork from the new album as well?
I think this is indicative that the tour will be happening before the album is out. My guess is the album drops for the US leg which will happen in Winter 2025 or something
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I noticed the additional 5th X and figured it was an editing oversight.
I think if you zoom in, it actually is the mountains in the background, not a 5th X.
Doesn’t it seem odd for them to put this out now? Shouldn’t they have waited to include the artwork from the new album as well?
Well they want to have *something* to use to promote the tour and hype it up right away, so what better way than this? Given that the lyrics aren't written for the new songs yet (at least I assume so), they probably haven't started to tackle the artwork for the album. But who's to say that the artwork won't be adjusted and elements of the new album won't be included when the album cover is revealed?
Another way to rationalize it: they're not trying to write a number in roman letters. Each X just represents a decade.
Could be.
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I think this is indicative that the tour will be happening before the album is out. My guess is the album drops for the US leg which will happen in Winter 2025 or something
I wouldn't think so.MP said something to the effect about setting the tour, and then counting backwards for all of the album components.
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Indeed, here's the quote from the interview:
Even though we have a very loose schedule, and we have control over that, we do have a tour in October. So you look at that and backtrack: If we’re starting the tour on October 20th, we need to be in rehearsals by the last week of September, which means that the album needs to be mixed and mastered, and delivered by X date. We need to have it tracked before we can mix it, so that kind of dictates it. Luckily, we’re not at the mercy of a studio that’s kicking us out or of a label that’s pulling the plug on the project. But scheduling a tour is something you need to be conscious of.
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Indeed, here's the quote from the interview:
Even though we have a very loose schedule, and we have control over that, we do have a tour in October. So you look at that and backtrack: If we’re starting the tour on October 20th, we need to be in rehearsals by the last week of September, which means that the album needs to be mixed and mastered, and delivered by X date. We need to have it tracked before we can mix it, so that kind of dictates it. Luckily, we’re not at the mercy of a studio that’s kicking us out or of a label that’s pulling the plug on the project. But scheduling a tour is something you need to be conscious of.
I don't personally see where he says it will be released by then. "Delivered" usually means "to the record company" at which point they control the rest of the process, including the release. I took that quote to mean more about pacing out the schedule of writing/finishing the album and then touring, not necessarily including the album's release
EDIT: FWIW, I'd love to be wrong, I want to hear it as much as anyone. I just don't want to build up an expectation that it's coming this year for myself.
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So why XXXX instead of XL?
My guess: because "XL" looks like a clothing size and is less cool looking than "XXXX".
The X’s (particularly the front one) looks AI generated. There’s even a weird partial 5th X behind it. Lol
I don't see a 5th X, but isn't the whole thing computer generated? Why would AI-generated look different than artist-generated on a computer?
Also, I don't think there was any intent for the X's to be symmetrical or identical.
Doesn’t it seem odd for them to put this out now? Shouldn’t they have waited to include the artwork from the new album as well?
They're announcing a tour. Seems perfectly reasonable to include artwork. And maybe there's a reference in here to the new album that will become evident once we see the new album. Just guessing.
I feel like I'm forgetting something really obvious or an album cover is entirely going over my head, but what's the Elephant? Isn't that the Elephant from Flower Kings - Waiting For Miracles?
(https://dreamtheater.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/blackclouds.jpg)
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I don't personally see where he says it will be released by then. "Delivered" usually means "to the record company" at which point they control the rest of the process, including the release. I took that quote to mean more about pacing out the schedule of writing/finishing the album and then touring, not necessarily including the album's release
Well it doesn't say the words "The album WILL BE released before the tour starts in October", so technically, you might are right, but I think the process that MP describes points to the album being out.
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My guess: because "XL" looks like a clothing size and is less cool looking than "XXXX".
I don't see a 5th X, but isn't the whole thing computer generated? Why would AI-generated look different than artist-generated on a computer?
Also, I don't think there was any intent for the X's to be symmetrical or identical.
They're announcing a tour. Seems perfectly reasonable to include artwork. And maybe there's a reference in here to the new album that will become evident once we see the new album. Just guessing.
(https://dreamtheater.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/blackclouds.jpg)
:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
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I feel like I'm forgetting something really obvious or an album cover is entirely going over my head, but what's the Elephant? Isn't that the Elephant from Flower Kings - Waiting For Miracles?
It definitely is if Hugh Syme did that album too.
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Well it doesn't say the words "The album WILL BE released before the tour starts in October", so technically, you might are right, but I think the process that MP describes points to the album being out.
Yeah, I guess we'll see. Given that they only finished the drums and it's already April, I don't see the album coming before the holiday season, let alone October. But also, I would love to be wrong :lol
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My guess: because "XL" looks like a clothing size and is less cool looking than "XXXX".
Anthrax just used it for their 40th..
(https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/91kWo2PpbtL._UF1000,1000_QL80_.jpg)
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Yeah, I guess we'll see. Given that they only finished the drums and it's already April, I don't see the album coming before the holiday season, let alone October. But also, I would love to be wrong :lol
Recording will only take a few weeks, month tops. Mixing and mastering only take a few months. It will almost certainly be ready by September.
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But also, I would love to be wrong :lol
Apparently. ;D
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Recording will only take a few weeks, month tops. Mixing and mastering only take a few months. It will almost certainly be ready by September.
You forget that James Hetfield and Taylor Swift personally own all the vinyl pressing plants on this planet, so DT might be last in line for physical pressings, which can (and very often does) delay things :lol
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You forget that James Hetfield and Taylor Swift personally own all the vinyl pressing plants on this planet, so DT might be last in line for physical pressings, which can (and very often does) delay things :lol
I'm starting to wish the vinyl resurgence never happened.
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I think there will be a single out by the tour, and it'll be part of the setlist.
Then the album will be released by the Holidays, the US tour after that, and they will add more new album songs to
the setlist. At which point people will lose their minds, because (and even though there could be some rotating)
some songs will have to go....(Should this be in green?? ???)
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Tickets, flights and hotel booked for London!
I had a link to the pre-sale, but got caught up with work this morning and missed the 9:00 AM opening, so prob missed out on a better seat. Grr.
You will be surprised that they seem to sell from the top row down toward the front. Those O2/Virgin Media customers seemed to get all the last few rows on Monday, and I got a few rows in front of them when I bought mine today. And then when I went to check the pre-sale page again later in the afternoon, not only those top-tier tickets were available again; they were all located several rows in front of mine! So you may have better seats than mine if you got yours in the late morning or early afternoon today.
By the way, which hotel are you staying at and how much do they charge? I live just an hour away from London and I always find hotel prices there are ripoffs. :lol
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Maybe those Xs are actually going to be part of their next studio album's cover art.
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I still want to know what the lightning is from..
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I still want to know what the lightning is from..
Maybe that's the new album callout...
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Maybe that's the new album callout...
I thought of the same thing.. 🌩️
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Wonder if they'll bring back the Psycho intro
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Folks, the AVFTTOTW reference is RIGHT in front of us!
It's the Invisible Monster.
(I'll show myself out.)
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Wonder if they'll bring back the Psycho intro
The Psycho intro tape followed by them coming in with the 2001 Theme was so epic.
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Folks, the AVFTTOTW reference is RIGHT in front of us!
It's the Invisible Monster.
(I'll show myself out.)
:evilmonkey:
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Also, since DOT is already represented by the skull, maybe the robot hand is actually...
The Killing Hand
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Tickets, flights and hotel booked for London!
I had a link to the pre-sale, but got caught up with work this morning and missed the 9:00 AM opening, so prob missed out on a better seat. Grr.
Even still, its a boss move to travel for this show. Where are you coming from?
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How realistic is this scenario?
The single is released a week or two before the tour starts and is thus the only piece of new material played on the 40A tour. The band gets back and has a month to rest. The album drops at the end of the year and the tour begins early January.
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Albums like these usually don't drop towards the end of the year (December or a little earlier). Either they save it until early 2025 (I doubt it), or release it around September/October.
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Do you think the 40A will be a mix of DT16 and old?
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Maybe that's the new album callout...
Maybe, but as I said before, it's likely the lyrics haven't been written for the new songs yet, so they probably haven't started to tackle the artwork for the album.
How realistic is this scenario?
The single is released a week or two before the tour starts and is thus the only piece of new material played on the 40A tour. The band gets back and has a month to rest. The album drops at the end of the year and the tour begins early January.
I don't see that happening, although it's always a possibility. Based on what MP said in that RS interview, they want to start off the tour in a major way, which suggests that there wouldn't be a warmup leg, and that is in essence what you're suggesting. Given the time frame for which they started work on the new one (which pretty much parallels when they started work on ADToE), my guess is that it will be released some time in September, giving the public roughly a month to get familiar with it before they start the tour.
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Do you think the 40A will be a mix of DT16 and old?
Well, that depends if they release the album for the start of the tour or not. Portnoy's comment makes me thing the plan is to have it out just for the tour, so I think they'll try to cover stuff from all their catalog. Would love to see them incorporate all 16 albums, but that depends on whether they want to focus more on the 40th anniversary vs DT16 and also how are the new song lengths. I guess everything's possible, but whatever they do, some people will love, others will be indiferent, and others will dislike :lol
I think Mike P has a very good sense for crafting setlists and his hits are more than his misses with that, so I'm confident it'll work out well enough in the end.
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I noticed the additional 5th X and figured it was an editing oversight.
I think if you zoom in, it actually is the mountains in the background, not a 5th X.
Scratch that. I see what you're talking about now Lonk. The "fifth" X appears next to the lower right leg of the most prominent X (the one with the Majesty symbol) as another leg running parallel to the prominent one.
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I think if you zoom in, it actually is the mountains in the background, not a 5th X.
Scratch that. I see what you're talking about now Lonk. The "fifth" X appears next to the lower right leg of the most prominent X (the one with the Majesty symbol) as another leg running parallel to the prominent one.
Yep, and it doesn't even have the top parts of the X, so it's more like /\ than a full X.
-Marc.
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Golden circle in Amsterdam :metal
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I listened to Octavarium (the song) on the second half of my ride this morning. I was lucky enough to be there for the recording of Score, and this morning, combined with thinking about MP appearing on stage with the band again at The O2 in October, I had proper goosebumps. It's going to be an utterly magical moment, that appearance on stage, that first song. I'm already having tingles of excitement over it. I'm going to be beside myself on the evening, as excited as I was in the audience at Radio City Music Hall 18 years ago.
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I listened to Octavarium (the song) on the second half of my ride this morning. I was lucky enough to be there for the recording of Score, and this morning, combined with thinking about MP appearing on stage with the band again at The O2 in October, I had proper goosebumps. It's going to be an utterly magical moment, that appearance on stage, that first song. I'm already having tingles of excitement over it. I'm going to be beside myself on the evening, as excited as I was in the audience at Radio City Music Hall 18 years ago.
I listened to it as well as I was washing the dishes last night. I've never had such a good time scrubbing a greasy pot. ;D
Goosebumps indeed.
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I listened to it as well as I was washing the dishes last night. I've never had such a good time scrubbing a greasy pot. ;D
Goosebumps indeed.
When you were done, did you ask yourself "could this be everything?"?
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Scratch that. I see what you're talking about now Lonk. The "fifth" X appears next to the lower right leg of the most prominent X (the one with the Majesty symbol) as another leg running parallel to the prominent one.
Yeah, I was just going to post this:
(https://i.imgur.com/cu5OSIO.jpeg)
It's not a big deal (to me), but it is really noticeable.
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I just love we're pouring over artwork again, digging out nuggets. There's NO WAY all that is an accident. NO WAY.
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Bought a ticket with my best friend (who brought me into Dream Theater) for the Köln, Germany gig in october. It's a couple of hours driving but this got to be the very most emotional tour-eve I'll ever experience. And there is a huge possibility I'll be there in Amsterdam as well...
That fifth X, it's got to be the decade to come, throwing all these wonderful albums at our doorsteps.
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Yeah, I was just going to post this:
(https://i.imgur.com/cu5OSIO.jpeg)
It's not a big deal (to me), but it is really noticeable.
I'll bite, what's the significance of the fifth X?
Also, can somebody please point me to the Awake reference?
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I'll bite, what's the significance of the fifth X?
Also, can somebody please point me to the Awake reference?
I mentioned earlier that I don't think it means anything, I think it was just an editing oversight.
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I just love we're pouring over artwork again, digging out nuggets. There's NO WAY all that is an accident. NO WAY.
Well, if Hugh Syme is involved, then there is definitely ONE WAY for there to be an accident or several.
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Well, if Hugh Syme is involved, then there is definitely ONE WAY for there to be an accident or several.
It's the Syme effect :lol
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I still want to know what the lightning is from..
I think it was a reference for the Black Clouds and Silver Lining album, the last one before MP's departure.
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I'll bite, what's the significance of the fifth X?
Also, can somebody please point me to the Awake reference?
The clock face (PG posted a synopsis of each album's reference on Page 10 of this thread. Post #324 if memory serves.)
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Yeah, I was just going to post this:
(https://i.imgur.com/cu5OSIO.jpeg)
It's not a big deal (to me), but it is really noticeable.
I can't see the image you posted.
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I don't see a 5th X, but isn't the whole thing computer generated? Why would AI-generated look different than artist-generated on a computer?
Are you unfamiliar with AI generated art? AI is notorious for stuff like giving people the wrong number of fingers on their hands and weird stuff like that. Created on a computer and created by a computer are different things, with different potential pitfalls.
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Yeah, I was just going to post this:
(https://i.imgur.com/cu5OSIO.jpeg)
It's not a big deal (to me), but it is really noticeable.
Now that I'm looking closely, it's not just 5 X's, theres even more with the smaller edges only being seen in the background under the DT logo in the center. It actually looks terrible now that I notice. Because even the ends of the X's don't line up size wise. It kind of makes no sense at all.
Are you unfamiliar with AI generated art? AI is notorious for stuff like giving people the wrong number of fingers on their hands and weird stuff like that. Created on a computer and created by a computer are different things, with different potential pitfalls.
Do we know if this was actually AI made? I know what you are saying and I can see that now, just wondering if the band stated where the art came from.
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I’m definitely starting to wonder if there’s AI involved. Which is a new low for Syme’s art if it’s true. Heavy emphasis on if. All the little bits of past artwork are certainly original, but that extra leg and what looks like more X’s in the background make me think he used an image generator just for the X’s.
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I think it was a reference for the Black Clouds and Silver Lining album, the last one before MP's departure.
This was my first thought too, but there's no lighting on that one? :huh:
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Would AI really be any worse than the crap Syme was producing before?
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Given Jordan's propensity for promoting AI software, I wouldn't be surprised if they were OK with Syme (or anyone) using it to make their artwork.
-Marc.
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Personally, I don't see anything wrong with him using AI to jazz up his designs. I mean, if it helps him elevate his artwork (especially considering the quality of his own artwork in recent years)? But here's the thing, if he's gonna go that route, he really should make sure to tidy up the picture. Those X's in the poster, they start to look worse the more you stare at them. I'm not expert on AI but I can't imagine a human making those weird mistakes.
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Given Jordan's propensity for promoting AI software, I wouldn't be surprised if they were OK with Syme (or anyone) using it to make their artwork.
-Marc.
Maybe, but I doubt they have any idea or really care HOW he produces his art.
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Would AI really be any worse than the crap Syme was producing before?
Hugh Syme's recent artwork pretty much is AI :rollin
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The clock face (PG posted a synopsis of each album's reference on Page 10 of this thread. Post #324 if memory serves.)
Thanks, that was helpful!
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I assume the poster wasn't made by Hugh Syme - he's never done tour posters for them before, has he?
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I think the tour poster was made by AI and the prompt was "Please make a Hugh Syme Dream Theater tour poster, thank you"
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Hugh Syme's recent artwork pretty much is AI :rollin
It's pretty much Colorforms.
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Given Jordan's propensity for promoting AI software, I wouldn't be surprised if they were OK with Syme (or anyone) using it to make their artwork.
-Marc.
I'm not sure I like it though. Art is supposed to be original, but AI uses existing art to create images so they don't come out very original to me. Also, they seem to come out quite poor for weird things.
I actually used copilot (microsoft AI) to make my new logo. I think it came out fine, but if you were to look really close, you'd see things that don't make any sense and clearly shows it was AI made and not human made. It was also a struggle to get it to spell "cramx3" correctly somehow :lol
I think for a band that is established and has to means to create original art, they should not use AI art. But I think, generally, as long as it's not in the music, it's probably fine at the end of the day and more of a preference.
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I could see it being made with the help of AI, but also we go over this every time there's a new piece that uses Hugh Syme's work, so I would just assume status quo here.
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MP's reply to somebody on Facebook last night moaning that XXXX "is not how you write 40 in Latin" 😆:
First of all, these are “Roman” numerals…but secondly, I’m/We’re well aware…but XXXX is waaaay cooler than XL (which 90% of the people would interpret as “Extra Large” rather than Roman numerals…) Just go with it! 😉😝😎
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Tickets for Amsterdam secured, can’t wait :metal
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One ticket for the Finnish date on Nov 6th is the bag and thankfully it's for the GA portion of the arena (judging by my one experience on the Octavarium tour, sitting down at a DT gig is not my thing)! I'm looking forward to it and have my fingers crossed that James can deliver. Not that his performance has ever tanked a show as far as I'm concerned, but you know, it'd sure be nice...
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MP's reply to somebody on Facebook last night moaning that XXXX "is not how you write 40 in Latin":
never enough sequel lyrics for new album confirmed
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Got tickets for Stockholm at row 2
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Only 1 UK show ? London - how predictable !
......and at those prices - not a chance
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**Rant Alert**
This is why I hate presale. So I couldn't find anything closer to the stage than Section B2's back on Wednesday, during the O2 show presale period. I ended up getting a pair of tickets in Section 111. They are not great seats but not too bad either. I knew I shouldn't have but I still went check out the general sale site at 10:30 this morning, or a full 30 minutes after general sale got started. Holy hell! I could still find GREAT seats in Section As. Actually, there were a pair of tickets located in Section A2 or directly in front of the stage dead center! WTF? >:(
**Rant Over**
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Yup. It's bad enough O2 customers got a presale. And then this shit gets layered in on top.
I had a look myself this morning and could have had two tickets in A1 but decided to keep my B3 tickets because we're second row in that block and if everyone stands up, it's only one row of tall people in front of me. Plus I don't have the issue of trying to resell horribly overpriced tickets.
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This is why I hate presale.
Not planning to go to any European shows, and I'm not sure it'll be done the same way in the US, but what does one even need to do in order to get presale? I saw this and thought "we'll have to manage this somehow when it's our turn" but IIRC they've never done this before.
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Yeah, presales are common. There were two presales for the O2 show. 1) People who are customers of O2 (a mobile phone service provider, think Verizon) get presales to all events held at the O2 arena (it's sponsored by them, as you'll have cunningly spotted!). That presale was on Tuesday. 2) A presale for anyone who clicked on the presale link on DT's own website. In exchange for your email address, they sent a link on Tuesday evening for use on Wednesday. This second presale was available, I think, for every date on the tour so far. I'd be surprised if it's not replicated in the US. Tickets are on sale to the general public today.
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never enough sequel lyrics for new album confirmed
Kicked my self out of the band,
Mended things with the guys,
Especially with James,
Waited to come back
And then you complain
How I spelled the anniversary number on the poster tour wrong
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**Rant Alert**
This is why I hate presale. So I couldn't find anything closer to the stage than Section B2's back on Wednesday, during the O2 show presale period. I ended up getting a pair of tickets in Section 111. They are not great seats but not too bad either. I knew I shouldn't have but I still went check out the general sale site at 10:30 this morning, or a full 30 minutes after general sale got started. Holy hell! I could still find GREAT seats in Section As. Actually, there were a pair of tickets located in Section A2 or directly in front of the stage dead center! WTF? >:(
**Rant Over**
I noticed this too. I am fine with the seats I have, but what is the point of presale unless it gives you priority access to the best seats? I don't understand the logic of it at all. What am I missing?
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I noticed this too. I am fine with the seats I have, but what is the point of presale unless it gives you priority access to the best seats? I don't understand the logic of it at all. What am I missing?
I do with presale tickets would list the seats that are available and those that are not. For the Stockholm show it was a bit of guesswork.
The reasoning behind it not being all the tickets is to keep it a bit more fair. For my show as a Mastercard holder I got a presale but not everyone has that. What it got me was the convenience of still getting a great pair of seats without having to worry about absolutely everyone else wanting to get tickets at the same time.
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I noticed this too. I am fine with the seats I have, but what is the point of presale unless it gives you priority access to the best seats? I don't understand the logic of it at all. What am I missing?
Yeah, I feel like 15 years ago, pre-sale meant priority over better seats. Nowadays it's more of a "Buy from this group of tickets available early". Not all seats are released for pre-sale. Heck, sometimes not even for the general sale (certain seats might be reserved and only released closer to the date of the show). But it is feeling increasingly less of a priority to buy pre-sale. Do we even know how venues determine which seats will be available for pre-sale?
The one advantage to pre-sale is that the day it starts, there is less "competition" for seats than the day of general sales (I even hate to call it a competition, but that's how it feels at times).
EDIT: just saw DT posted on their youtube channel a short with MP and JM :metal
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/bTKrC0A8y5g
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Yeah, presales are common. There were two presales for the O2 show. 1) People who are customers of O2 (a mobile phone service provider, think Verizon) get presales to all events held at the O2 arena (it's sponsored by them, as you'll have cunningly spotted!). That presale was on Tuesday. 2) A presale for anyone who clicked on the presale link on DT's own website. In exchange for your email address, they sent a link on Tuesday evening for use on Wednesday. This second presale was available, I think, for every date on the tour so far. I'd be surprised if it's not replicated in the US. Tickets are on sale to the general public today.
Thanks, yeah I'm pretty sure we've gotten a presale once (for another band) just by having a Ticketmaster account. I was just curious as to whether there'd be different hoops to jump through this time (ie. a fanclub membership or similar) because the tickets for this tour would be so coveted.
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**Rant Alert**
This is why I hate presale. So I couldn't find anything closer to the stage than Section B2's back on Wednesday, during the O2 show presale period. I ended up getting a pair of tickets in Section 111. They are not great seats but not too bad either. I knew I shouldn't have but I still went check out the general sale site at 10:30 this morning, or a full 30 minutes after general sale got started. Holy hell! I could still find GREAT seats in Section As. Actually, there were a pair of tickets located in Section A2 or directly in front of the stage dead center! WTF? >:(
**Rant Over**
I have the exact same frustrations, I’m not complaining to much as I got A3 Row M in the presale but I was under the impression that I’d been really lucky. However this morning I just had a look out of curiosity at the general sale and there still available were seats in A2 row fucking A! I had them in my basket and was debating checking out but decided not to as I didn’t know what the resale process would be like for my original tix as I’m not a very experienced ticket purchaser.
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Unfortunately I'm just not going to be able to justify the travel for this show but I went looking for tickets this morning anyway. Looks like this has sold really well, stoked for the band!
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Kicked my self out of the band,
Mended things with the guys,
Especially with James,
Waited to come back
And then you complain
How I spelled the anniversary number on the poster tour wrong
Spot on.
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Kicked my self out of the band,
Mended things with the guys,
Especially with James,
Waited to come back
And then you complain
How I spelled the anniversary number on the poster tour wrong
Well, I could type 40 or I could reference 10+10+10+10 and it would still equal 40 so it's still technically correct and let's face it, XL would be boring in my mind.
Also, they could name the tour R40 with the R standing for Reunion. Maybe?
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Not planning to go to any European shows, and I'm not sure it'll be done the same way in the US, but what does one even need to do in order to get presale? I saw this and thought "we'll have to manage this somehow when it's our turn" but IIRC they've never done this before.
Yeah, presales are common. There were two presales for the O2 show. 1) People who are customers of O2 (a mobile phone service provider, think Verizon) get presales to all events held at the O2 arena (it's sponsored by them, as you'll have cunningly spotted!). That presale was on Tuesday. 2) A presale for anyone who clicked on the presale link on DT's own website. In exchange for your email address, they sent a link on Tuesday evening for use on Wednesday. This second presale was available, I think, for every date on the tour so far. I'd be surprised if it's not replicated in the US. Tickets are on sale to the general public today.
Beyond that, I've seen shows in the U.S. with 3 or 4 different presales. Depending on the venue, you can have the band's fan club presale, the LiveNation presale, the MasterCard or American Express presale, etc. AFAIK, there's no official U.S. DT fan Club, but they may do the above for the U.S. dates as well. If you go to dreamtheater.net, you can sign up for the mailing list (just scroll down on the home page). Then you'll be notified about stuff. Credit card presales usually require you to enter the first six digits of your card to unlock the presale. LiveNation also has a mailing list you can sign up for.
EDIT: just saw DT posted on their youtube channel a short with MP and JM :metal
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/bTKrC0A8y5g
I think it must have been a condition of Mike returning that JM actually talk on stuff. Between the RS interview and this, that must be more than JM said during the entire MM era! :lol
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Got a ticket for London.
Went to an NBA EU game back in 2017, i should be in the same area of the venue.
I could barely see a thing back then, but who cares, it’s a reunited DT @ the O2 Arena!!!
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I've reached a point of zen where I'm fine with everything I complained about :) they could have very well started with the NA tour first and I could have waited until 2025 to see them. Sucks I don't get to stand and move around but what can you do!
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Got a ticket for London.
Went to an NBA EU game back in 2017, i should be in the same area of the venue.
I could barely see a thing back then, but who cares, it’s a reunited DT @ the O2 Arena!!!
Loving this! :biggrin:
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Beyond that, I've seen shows in the U.S. with 3 or 4 different presales. Depending on the venue, you can have the band's fan club presale, the LiveNation presale, the MasterCard or American Express presale, etc. AFAIK, there's no official U.S. DT fan Club, but they may do the above for the U.S. dates as well. If you go to dreamtheater.net, you can sign up for the mailing list (just scroll down on the home page). Then you'll be notified about stuff. Credit card presales usually require you to enter the first six digits of your card to unlock the presale. LiveNation also has a mailing list you can sign up for.
I think it must have been a condition of Mike returning that JM actually talk on stuff. Between the RS interview and this, that must be more than JM said during the entire MM era! :lol
DT USA is the official US fan club. They run official preshow parties, and work with the label and usually get some stuff from them for trivia contests run at the preshows.
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Well, I could type 40 or I could reference 10+10+10+10 and it would still equal 40 so it's still technically correct and let's face it, XL would be boring in my mind.
The should have done forty Roman numeral I’s Lol
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Beyond that, I've seen shows in the U.S. with 3 or 4 different presales. Depending on the venue, you can have the band's fan club presale, the LiveNation presale, the MasterCard or American Express presale, etc. AFAIK, there's no official U.S. DT fan Club, but they may do the above for the U.S. dates as well. If you go to dreamtheater.net, you can sign up for the mailing list (just scroll down on the home page). Then you'll be notified about stuff. Credit card presales usually require you to enter the first six digits of your card to unlock the presale. LiveNation also has a mailing list you can sign up for.
Nice, thank you!
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Tickets for Amsterdam secured, can’t wait
Congratz friend.
I've seen them five times but this year - with Portnoy being back - is brilliant. I've got tickets for the show in Köln, Germany... and also, tickets for Afas Amsterdam, the golden circle. But it's getting even better, I've got also a platinum ticket for a meet & greet. Cost me a bone from my body, but I cannot believe I'll finally be able to shake hands with the band who I've became to love so much.
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DT USA is the official US fan club. They run official preshow parties, and work with the label and usually get some stuff from them for trivia contests run at the preshows.
Are you talking about this: https://www.facebook.com/dreamtheaterusa/
Looks more like just a Facebook group than a fan club (and doesn't really appear to be "official").
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Are you talking about this: https://www.facebook.com/dreamtheaterusa/
Looks more like just a Facebook group than a fan club (and doesn't really appear to be "official").
On their page here is what is says under Intro.
USA chapter of Dream Theater World, Official Fan Club. Bringing DT fans together across the US.
I've hosted some pre-shows. They are official.
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Tickets for Amsterdam secured, can’t wait :metal
See you there :metal
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MP's reply to somebody on Facebook last night moaning that XXXX "is not how you write 40 in Latin" 😆:
Lol I'm with Mike on this though
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Could be worse- they could've been the band Asia and name an album XXX (released on their 30th anniversary). Try imagining having to Google "Asia XXX"...
-Marc.
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Could be worse- they could've been the band Asia and name an album XXX (released on their 30th anniversary). Try imagining having to Google "Asia XXX"...
-Marc.
No shortage of search results there :lol
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Congratz friend.
I've seen them five times but this year - with Portnoy being back - is brilliant. I've got tickets for the show in Köln, Germany... and also, tickets for Afas Amsterdam, the golden circle. But it's getting even better, I've got also a platinum ticket for a meet & greet. Cost me a bone from my body, but I cannot believe I'll finally be able to shake hands with the band who I've became to love so much.
Wow, that's awesome! Meeting the band you love after seeing them live so many times must be a dream come true. Enjoy every second of it!
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So…who else is feeling the central positioning of the SFAM face could be a hint that the new album is indeed Metropolis Pt. III?
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So…who else is feeling the central positioning of the SFAM face could be a hint that the new album is indeed Metropolis Pt. III?
I got the same impression and discussed it with a couple of friends. And more because it's the only reference that's fading, like something is coming from the clouds and shadows, haha
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So…who else is feeling the central positioning of the SFAM face could be a hint that the new album is indeed Metropolis Pt. III?
That might be a really bad idea.
A self standing concept album.... sure
But a follow up to Metropolis pt 2. One of their most beloved albums of all time. If the follow up does not live up to peoples unrealistcally high expectations they could face a lot of backlash.
But who knows.... DT if any could possibly pull it of
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I had previously said on the thread about DT16 that the band wants something really special now that MP is back.
Portnoy himself said they purposefully don't reveal anything regarding the album.
(Do you remember which other album was covered in secretiveness and ambiguity? When a new member was added to the band? That's right..)
And JP, when they uploaded the video about the end of the writing, said 'You have no clue'.
And also, Mike made it sound like they will work on the lyrics from now on, as if the lyrics will complete what they are creating.
So based on all of the above, I'd bet my money on a concept album first of all, with it being Metropolis pt3 as my second guess.
When i wrote that this is most of DT's fans wet dream, there were a lot of you that you clearly didn't like the idea.
And even though i don't have the slightest idea on how a new Metropolis album can evolve and unfold lyrically from where it was left, i also know that the guys want to give us something monumental at this point.
And also with their 40th anniversary tour coming up next fall.
I would even go as far as to say that what they are creating right now is their most ambitious album to date, even more than SFaM and The Astonishing.
These are all pure guesses on my side, but the fact is that DT really want to blow us away, in their own words.
We are waiting guys, we are waiting..
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I am against the idea of Metropolis Pt. 3. Leave it alone and move on.
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On their page here is what is says under Intro.
USA chapter of Dream Theater World, Official Fan Club. Bringing DT fans together across the US.
I've hosted some pre-shows. They are official.
Is there a way to join this that ISN'T Facebook?
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I am against the idea of Metropolis Pt. 3. Leave it alone and move on.
The biggest reason I'm also against it is because you know it'd just be filled with callbacks to Metropolis Part 2... which already has lots of callbacks to Metropolis Part 1... it'd just feel super forced at this point.
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I really hope we don't get Metropolis pt. 3.
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Is there a way to join this that ISN'T Facebook?
Instagram. Dream Theater USA
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I really hope we don't get Metropolis pt. 3.
Agreed. Thematically, everything in Metropolis is binary, thus its a story of twins, told in two acts over the course of two songs. Part 3 would go against the underpinning binary theme.
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Count me in the camp of Metropolis pt 3 being the worst derivative idea they could have. It would be even more unnecessary than The Unforgiven III.
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Could be worse- they could've been the band Asia and name an album XXX (released on their 30th anniversary). Try imagining having to Google "Asia XXX"...
-Marc.
I've had to spam the closing of a couple of browser windows as a result.
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Around the time of ADTOE, I remember watching a Q&A with Jordan where he was asked about making Met. 3 and he basically said they wouldn't do that, as that would be like a bad movie franchise that never properly ends. Hopefully they didn't change their mind about that.
I'd gladly welcome another concept album though :metal
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Ticket for Budapest secured. :metal
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Scenes, Metropolis….
Those are just words.
As long as it rocks, they can call and present it whatever they want.
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If they went the Metropolis 3 route I would go into it open minded. It seems like an odd choice, but then again Scenes From a Memory itself was pretty arbitrary in the sense that the lyrics to Metropolis are abstract and there wasn’t anything besides the song title that suggested a sequel would make sense. The bigger challenge this time around would be the temptation to make a narrative sequel to Scenes when a musical continuation with an entirely different lyrical concept would make more sense.
All that being said, I highly doubt that’s what they’re doing. All of the arguments saying they’re hinting toward Metropolis 3 can imo be boiled down to the band just being really excited to be back together making a new album.
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Is there a way to join this that ISN'T Facebook?
Instagram. Dream Theater USA
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Scenes, Metropolis….
Those are just words.
As long as it rocks, they can call and present it whatever they want.
Basically. If it were good, people who hate the idea now would be on board. I always love a good sequel and it always kind of bothered me - even though I understand it from a narrative perspective - that evil prevailed over good twice in Met pt.2 and two innocent people died. It's a bit too nihilistic for Dream Theater, and what's the point of the spirit carrying on if it's going to be reborn into a life where it gets senselessly murdered :lol So even in the most derivative scenario which everyone else fears where they write a lyrical continuation of the story and fill it with musical references, it would be an introduction of something new if the Victoria/Nicholas character cheated death this time and triumphed over their would-be murderer in some way.
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Instagram. Dream Theater USA
but instagram IS facebook...
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but instagram IS facebook...
META-opolis Part 3: When Facebook & Instagram Unite
-Marc.
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Nice! :lol
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Basically. If it were good, people who hate the idea now would be on board. I always love a good sequel and it always kind of bothered me - even though I understand it from a narrative perspective - that evil prevailed over good twice in Met pt.2 and two innocent people died. It's a bit too nihilistic for Dream Theater, and what's the point of the spirit carrying on if it's going to be reborn into a life where it gets senselessly murdered :lol So even in the most derivative scenario which everyone else fears where they write a lyrical continuation of the story and fill it with musical references, it would be an introduction of something new if the Victoria/Nicholas character cheated death this time and triumphed over their would-be murderer in some way.
Very insightful comments. But I view both parts through a binary lens, like a yin and yang pairing. Metropolis 1 is uplifting (with the dances of Death, Deceit, Love in that order), with Part 2 being the opposite (a tragedy) with the dances being the inverse: love, deceit and death. So while Scenes is nihilistic, it is also the counter-balance of the love discovered in Part 1. But when taken together, they represent a larger whole balanced by opposing polarities.
I guess what I'm saying is that Metropolis Part 3 would be a hot mess of a bad idea.
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I mean absolutely no disrespect to anyone by saying this, but to say Metropolis Pt 3 would be a bad idea is just silly. What if it's good? Like, you don't want it even if it turns out to be the greatest album ever written?? It's just silly to say something like that because you have absolutely no clue what it would actually be.
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Loved this one:
"John Myung: It was a collective moment of certainty.
Petrucci: That sounds like an album title. [All laugh]."
Myung bringing the humor. That's a great sign right there.
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I agree, but at the same time I’m glad that they’re taking their time with all of this. They didn’t immediately rush into a tour, they didn’t go throw an album together in a couple of weeks. I think they’re doing it right.
Europe is where their bread is buttered. They do well there and US promoters have to take notice. Definitely the right move.
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Some of you need to read that article. I'm sure there's SOME license with it, and the message/narrative is that "we're a team", but they DIRECTLY answer several of the (nagging) questions that were persistent in the thread we had right after the announcement. It seems they ended up having a number of the conversations that were outstanding at the time of the first announcement.
There was no indication that these conversations actually happened until now. I'm pleased the essentials got hammered out.
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I feel so bad for MP that he has to sit and listen to The Astonishing. :lol
To this day I have never heard the whole thing.
As cool as it would be to see them live again, I just can't spend the dough not knowing what James will sound like. I will buy the studio albums, as I always do, but I can't see me seeing them live again.
Sorry to be the buzzkill.
Depends on the ticketmaster ransom and if there's a way to beat the legalized scalping. Need a shower just thinking about it.
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I don't think we can really guess what goes in and what doesn't, but I would think there's a possibility that the thought process is...
... we've got this album, so we're going to play x of that. Of the remaining y minutes, what are the top z songs that we the five of us have been dying to play together on for a while? No slight to Mangini, but I can't imagine there's not ONE SONG in the entire catalogue that one of the other four didn't say "wow, it's good, but I preferred playing this with Portnoy". That's not a dig on Mangini at all; it's all a matter of feel, memory and emotion.
If that's the mindset, that this is about the band and the enjoyment of what they do, I think we'll get most if not all of the new album (assuming it's around an hour or so, plus/minus), we'll get two songs from the Mangini era, and we'll get a full hour or so of just classics that the band wants to revisit, regardless of when it was played last, or whether it was played on the respective tours.
Over/Under of Mangini era is 5 and I'm going under 5 for the entire tour.
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I just find it odd that they'd title a tour promoting their (DT&MP) first album in ages the 40th Anniversary tour.
Sounds like a business decision. I just hope the play most of the new album live.
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I just think it comes down to the fact that they can only really call the tour one thing. It can't be MPs return, 40th anniversary, AND new album tour. It's just too much. I think 40th anniversary type of titling likely sells more tickets than the others, some of which is that we already know it's MP's return being the main selling point for a lot of people so they don't need to really advertise that part as much. Also, the new album hasn't been announced officially so they can't tag the tour as the album because they just don't have the title and whatnot ready yet.
The Portnoy Returns Tour is a good a name as any since this is where most of the buzz is coming from.
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Would AI really be any worse than the crap Syme was producing before?
YES!
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META-opolis Part 3: When Facebook & Instagram Unite
-Marc.
Metropolis Part IIII -Gangster of Beards Trilogy
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Very insightful comments. But I view both parts through a binary lens, like a yin and yang pairing. Metropolis 1 is uplifting (with the dances of Death, Deceit, Love in that order), with Part 2 being the opposite (a tragedy) with the dances being the inverse: love, deceit and death. So while Scenes is nihilistic, it is also the counter-balance of the love discovered in Part 1. But when taken together, they represent a larger whole balanced by opposing polarities.
I guess what I'm saying is that Metropolis Part 3 would be a hot mess of a bad idea.
I get you, but it's also true that Met pt.1 is a jumble of lyrics without any distinct characters we relate to and follow and it bugs me that that gets to be the light part of the pairing but the concept album with characters and plot gets to be a tragedy :lol I don't know, it's a bit un-Dream-Theater-like to end on a low note! So from that standpoint I'd like Met pt.3, as long as it's good.
I also thought in the past that making Met pt.3 would be kind of a cheap-ish move to bring hype, but since they're already bringing hype by bringing MP back into the fold, they can do whatever they like. I don't know if that even makes sense but it's how I feel!
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Wow, that's awesome! Meeting the band you love after seeing them live so many times must be a dream come true. Enjoy every second of it!
Thanks mate! I will... and I'm telling it basicly every person I come across, and they all give me that "dude, grow up"-look. Which I would normally total understand, but since it's Dream Theater, there isn't such a thing, as normal.
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Thanks mate! I will... and I'm telling it basicly every person I come across, and they all give me that "dude, grow up"-look. Which I would normally total understand, but since it's Dream Theater, there isn't such a thing, as normal.
I know how it is... in my case, the person who said that was my BOSS when I asked him to leave the work early for the DT's Meet and Greet on the 2014 tour! ;D (he said it with good humor, he was a really nice guy). From the bottom of my heart, I hope this little joy helps you, Wim, through these difficult times as you mourn your mother. :heart
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thank you so much devieira, it really does. My mother gave me the Octavarium vinyl, when she find out Dream Theater was all the music I cared for.
So if they choose to play Octavarium as an encore, that would make the circle round... and this 40-year old child cry like a kid, I pressume.
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Are you talking about this: https://www.facebook.com/dreamtheaterusa/
Looks more like just a Facebook group than a fan club (and doesn't really appear to be "official").
They are official enough to be bequeathed with backstage passes to give out as prizes at meetups before DT concerts.
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I’ve been thinking about what songs they might want to play for this first tour with Portnoy/their “40th anniversary “ tour.
I don’t think them calling it their 40th anniversary tour means it’s a guarantee that they’ll play a song from every album, but I’d say its a strong possibility, and I think it’d be a fun way to start off this next chapter of the band while highlighting all of their eras thus far. If they went the route of a song from every album + 4-5 from DT16, that would obviously put some limitations on the longer songs.
I have to imagine MP would like to do the full 12 Step Suite with the band. It’s not a guarantee, but I’ll be a bit surprised if they never do it. They don’t need that to be the spotlight on this first go around, and I think a great concept for a future tour would be to do the 12SS as a second set of an Evening With show, and then finally play Octavarium as the encore. So with that wishful thinking on my part, I’ve avoided adding any of those 6 songs to a potential set.
I also ignored doing a chronological set. It’s expected, and it can limit what songs you can pick from certain albums for the sake of the flow of the show. With all of that in mind, I came up with the following:
ACT I
1. DT16 Song
2. DT16 Song
3. 6:00 (I know they just played this but I wouldn’t be surprised if MP wants to play one of his most famous intros. If not this song then I’d forsee The Mirror being picked)
4. Blind Faith (I would’ve picked TGP if not this)
5. Sleeping Giant (can be swapped for The Alien)
6. DT16 Song (depending on how long the new songs are. If this didn’t fit, this would be cut)
7. The Gift of Music (I can see Our New World being chosen instead, but this was the lead single and I like it much more than ONW)
8. Constant Motion (another legendary MP drum part during JP’s solo and hasn’t been played worldwide in 14 years)
9. A Rite of Passage (both of the shorter BC&SL songs are some of DT’s weakest. This is the lesser of 2 evils, so to speak)
10. Outcry (Hasn’t been played since the ADToE tour cycle, and would be a fun Mangini era surprise. If not, BAI or OtBoA seem likely)
————————————————————
ACT II
11. As I Am (They seem to like playing this one, and it’s always fun, even if it’s been played a ton. I would prefer Honor Thy Father, but I feel like I remember MP saying something that made it sound like he wouldn’t want to play it anymore based off the subject of the song? If that’s incorrect, then I would choose it over AIA)
12. Panic Attack (Like CM, a great concert song that was only played a handful of times with Mangini during the 2015 festival run. Otherwise it hasn’t been played since
MP left, and that’s a shame.)
13. DT16 Song
14. Peruvian Skies (Been over a decade since it was played for a full tour)
15. The Dance of Eternity (TSCO seems like the obvious choice so I would love a surprise here. I’d imagine there’d be at least one instrumental in the set, and this one would be great to see with MP again)
16. Behind the Veil (Same concept as Panic Attack and CM, except they’ve played this one even less. They could hit the last three notes in TDoE and slide right into the full band intro to this. I’d also welcome the premiere of Surrender to Reason here)
17. S2N (Hoping this debuts soon. If not, I’d expect Barstool Warrior)
18. Only A Matter of Time (My favorite off WDaDU, and I know JP has expressed interest in playing it)
19. DT16 closing track
——————————————————
20. Metropolis (I would prefer this over PMU, but it could go either way. But one of them will absolutely be played)
That clocks in at 115 min before DT16 songs, which I think leaves about 40 min for the new album. Depending on how long the songs are, I would predict 4-5 of them will be played on this tour, with hopefully the others played on the proceeding run. Tried to do an even blend of songs I want to see and songs I actually presume will happen, but doing a highlight of all 16 albums is certainly doable, even with their massive catalog.
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I still think they will play either Afterlife or Only A Matter of Time to pay tribute to Charlie.
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Saw it on socials and think it's a good idea:
Playing the whole 12SS will involve all the albums from 6 Degrees into Black Clouds. Especially if they are doing a song from each/most albums (my guess is a MMera medley)
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I would be mega pissed off if they played the 12SS. It's like the same riff repeated over and over again for
six five songs. There's no way they're going to devote half of their reunion show to one fricking riff.
(I had to look up how many songs there actually are in the 12SS. To me it's just one long boring mess.)
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It went a bit overboard I guess.
Imagine if A Mind Beside Itself was spread over three albums - Erotomania in one, Voices in the next, and The Silent Man in the third. Then when played together they would flow in a cohesive way for 20 minutes.
That would be doable, but 55 minutes of almost always heavy and fast music is waaaay overkill. I respect Mike's committment to it, the fact that 12 steps could not be rushed and the fun in trying to fool around with sound editing tools to create a single "song", but it came out such a gargantuan piece that became a very divisive thing among the fanbase.
Also, Mike got to play the whole thing live so he probably won't suggest it for DT.
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Imagine if A Mind Beside Itself was spread over three albums - Erotomania in one, Voices in the next, and The Silent Man in the third. Then when played together they would flow in a cohesive way for 20 minutes.
But... they don't even flow in a cohesive way the way they were released on Awake. :P
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+
Also, Mike got to play the whole thing live so he probably won't suggest it for DT.
Yes. I think he kind of managed to close that chapter by himself and is ready to move on to something else.
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But... they don't even flow in a cohesive way the way they were released on Awake. :P
Why not? Erotomania flows directly into Voices, it's a very coherent segue. The Silent Man is more abrupt but it kinda fits with the last notes of Voices.
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I think they'll play Breaking All Illusions. I can see Portnoy liking that one.
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Playing the whole 12SS will involve all the albums from 6 Degrees into Black Clouds. Especially if they are doing a song from each/most albums (my guess is a MMera medley)
You're not wrong, but it would also involve ignoring the best music from most of those albums. Therefore, personally not a fan.
If they do it, I will watch and enjoy it, but there is definitely material on those albums I would prefer to see to the 12SS stuff. Also, that's just a lot to take in.
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Also not sure if Portnoy will do it as he did it with Shattered Fortress. I think there's other ground he will want to cover
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I would be mega pissed off if they played the 12SS.
I would be over the moon surely, it's one of the most unique pieces they ever made. Musical perfection.
(I had to look up how many songs there actually are in the 12SS. To me it's just one long boring mess.)
That's not only hard, that's basicly cruel.
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I wouldn't think they would dedicate all that time to just the 12SS. Maybe they'll arrange a small medley of it though, that seems more realistic.
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I wouldn't think they would dedicate all that time to just the 12SS. Maybe they'll arrange a small medley of it though, that seems more realistic.
I don't like meddleys at all, BUT this one seems like an excellent idea! Around 20 minutes, maybe?
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I don't like meddleys at all, BUT this one seems like an excellent idea! Around 20 minutes, maybe?
I'd be good with 8-12 minutes, but I'm not the biggest fan of the Suite, personally.
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Wouldn't an 8-12 minute medley of the 12SS just be The Shattered Fortress? :neverusethis:
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Wouldn't an 8-12 minute medley of the 12SS just be The Shattered Fortress? :neverusethis:
(https://media.tenor.com/LUu3RUNjIwkAAAAM/black-kid-hand-frowb-scratches-head.gif)
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I can see them playing one or two of these, but hopefully not the whole thing. It made sense to play it in 2009/10 when they had just finished it, but now? It'd be a waste of set time to do it in full. I don't think Portnoy'd want to do it anyway, since he already played it for a whole tour with his own (cover) band.
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I'd vote no to the 12SS, I'd also vote no to any of the songs being played except for TGP. TGP is probably my #1 or maybe #2 (8VM) songs that I most want to see from DT and it not being played in such a long time means it should be due. I do understand JP has stated a reason he doesn't want to play it, but that still remains my want if anything from the 12SS.
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Given that they are celebrating their entire career, I sort of hope Mike Mangoni joins them for any Blu-ray they might film on this tour. At least for a single song.
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Given that they are celebrating their entire career, I sort of hope Mike Mangoni joins them for any Blu-ray they might film on this tour. At least for a single song.
No shot.
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Another 40th anniversary idea:
1. In the Presence of Enemies
2. Illumination Theory
3. Octavarium
-----------------------------
4. The Count of Tuscany
5. A View From the Top of the World
6. New Epic
-----------------------------
7. A Change of Seasons
I'd be satisfied! :hat
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Another 40th anniversary idea:
1. In the Presence of Enemies
2. Illumination Theory
3. Octavarium
-----------------------------
4. The Count of Tuscany
5. A View From the Top of the World
6. New Epic
-----------------------------
7. A Change of Seasons
I'd be satisfied! :hat
Interesting idea, and I don't hate it... just not sure if I want to hear AVFtTotW again so soon. How about replacing it with Stream of Consciousness?
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Another 40th anniversary idea:
1. In the Presence of Enemies
2. Illumination Theory
3. Octavarium
-----------------------------
4. The Count of Tuscany
5. A View From the Top of the World
6. New Epic
-----------------------------
7. A Change of Seasons
I'd be satisfied! :hat
I can see the MP Instagram post praising a successful "epic" night.
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Why not? Erotomania flows directly into Voices, it's a very coherent segue. The Silent Man is more abrupt but it kinda fits with the last notes of Voices.
One song ends, the key changes and another song with no connection to the preceding one starts. That's not really very cohesive in my book.
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Instagram. Dream Theater USA
Thank you!
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Thank you!
You're welcome. :) You should try to attend a preshow if they have one where you see DT. It adds to the excitement of the day.
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Given that they are celebrating their entire career, I sort of hope Mike Mangoni joins them for any Blu-ray they might film on this tour. At least for a single song.
What are you talking about?
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What are you talking about?
It's happened with every other ex-band member other than Kevin Moore (IIRC). Though in this case it probably won't happen because it's literally the first tour after the switch back, lol.
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It's happened with every other ex-band member other than Kevin Moore (IIRC). Though in this case it probably won't happen because it's literally the first tour after the switch back, lol.
It happened once and not for a band anniversary tour, but for a specific album anniversary show.
Derek and Charlie didn't join them for their 20th anniversary tour.
It also never happened with MP before he rejoined.
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I want them to reunite with Chris Collins for the 40th anniversary recording.
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It happened once and not for a band anniversary tour, but for a specific album anniversary show.
Derek and Charlie didn't join them for their 20th anniversary tour.
It also never happened with MP before he rejoined.
Right, I just meant a live performance with an ex-member. It wouldn't surprise me if they played with MM again, but it would surprise me if it happened this tour.
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Right, I just meant a live performance with an ex-member. It wouldn't surprise me if they played with MM again, but it would surprise me if it happened this tour.
TBH, I can't see why MM would want to do this given the circumstances.
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TBH, I can't see why MM would want to do this given the circumstances.
Me either. At least, at this point.
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Right, years down the road, I would never say never, but it sure as hell ain't happening this tour.
Although, I wouldn't be surprised if he attended the show in Boston to say hi.
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No shot.
Agreed, but even if it was, I don't think I want that distraction anyway. Too soon.
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Yeah, this tour doesn't feel right to have MM be apart of it. I get it's a 40th anniversary tour and so in theory, respecting the former band members may seem fitting, but it's just not good timing with MP first tour back. Having said that, if they do film a show at say the end of the tour, and MM was willing to be apart of it, I think that would be cool. But it would have to just be a one off thing, not a tour thing. MM has always come off as a positive guy, I can see him saying yes to that even if maybe he thinks it may be too soon too.
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Another 40th anniversary idea:
1. In the Presence of Enemies
2. Illumination Theory
3. Octavarium
-----------------------------
4. The Count of Tuscany
5. A View From the Top of the World
6. New Epic
-----------------------------
7. A Change of Seasons
I'd be satisfied! :hat
:lol I was actually thinking of this as well. Didn't check to see if it would work. But great to know it would. I would love that set.
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Another 40th anniversary idea:
1. In the Presence of Enemies
2. Illumination Theory
3. Octavarium
-----------------------------
4. The Count of Tuscany
5. A View From the Top of the World
6. New Epic
-----------------------------
7. A Change of Seasons
I'd be satisfied! :hat
:lol I was actually thinking of this as well. Didn't check to see if it would work. But great to know it would. I would love that set.
I am all in on this one!
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Imo they won’t reunite with Mangini for the same reason they never brought Portnoy back prior to a full reunion. They spent a lot of the Mangini era pumping it up as the band’s best lineup and the one that they would retire with. Now they are doing the same thing with Portnoy. I feel like bringing back the former drummer just invites comparisons and diverts focus from the core lineup which is what the band (especially under JP’s leadership) wants to avoid. DS and CD coming back was different because the band was still in its formative stages when they were dismissed and they (mostly MP) had been really candid that it wasn’t the right fit for DT. There just isn’t room for comparing DS to Rudess or CD to JLB. Mangini and Portnoy is a different situation and one I don’t think the band will ever broach.
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I can see them inviting him at some point (if they ever get into the RNRHOF or a farewell tour show, for example), but definitely not anytime soon. Also, we shouldn't assume Mike M would do it anyway. They just sent him home because he wasn't needed anymore, I don't think he's just sitting there waiting for them to invite him to guest at a show; even if they're all on "good terms". I wouldn't do it if I were him, honestly.
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We’ve obviously ran out of things to talk about.
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I can see them inviting him at some point (if they ever get into the RNRHOF or a farewell tour show, for example), but definitely not anytime soon. Also, we shouldn't assume Mike M would do it anyway. They just sent him home because he wasn't needed anymore, I don't think he's just sitting there waiting for them to invite him to guest at a show; even if they're all on "good terms". I wouldn't do it if I were him, honestly.
It's a cryin' shame that DT hasn't been inducted yet. An absolute tragedy
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We’ve obviously ran out of things to talk about.
:lol
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I can see them inviting him at some point (if they ever get into the RNRHOF or a farewell tour show, for example), but definitely not anytime soon. Also, we shouldn't assume Mike M would do it anyway. They just sent him home because he wasn't needed anymore, I don't think he's just sitting there waiting for them to invite him to guest at a show; even if they're all on "good terms". I wouldn't do it if I were him, honestly.
But - and I say this with the utmost respect - you're not him. If I was asked, I'd do it in a heartbeat. It's not about me; I never would have taken the gig without understanding that taking the spot of a founding member of a band like Dream Theater was at best ever going to be a foundation made on sand. Mangini is not a dumb guy and has spent his life in the music industry; he's friends with guys like Vai, et al., who have veritable revolving doors for bands. If he didn't know this was a possibility, then maybe he's not as sharp as I give him credit for.
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It's a cryin' shame that DT hasn't been inducted yet. An absolute tragedy
No it isn't.
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I'm not one of those people who decry the importance of winning a grammy but the RRHoF seems like an absolute joke by most people nowadays. There are simply too many bands that should be there by now that DT's exclusion is hardly worth raising an eyebrow for.
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I'm not one of those people who decry the importance of winning a grammy but the RRHoF seems like an absolute joke by most people nowadays. There are simply too many bands that should be there by now that DT's exclusion is hardly worth raising an eyebrow for.
Yeah; I love DT, but Phil Collins, Iron Maiden and Ronnie Dio are all like "hold my beer."
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I'm not one of those people who decry the importance of winning a grammy but the RRHoF seems like an absolute joke by most people nowadays. There are simply too many bands that should be there by now that DT's exclusion is hardly worth raising an eyebrow for.
The injustices should be corrected for all bands that have been excluded, including Yes, Phish, Beardfish, and Pain of Salvation
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Beardfish and PoS?
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Beardfish and PoS?
Yeah. If I was President of the Rolling Stone, I would add more prog bands, even the ones I don't like, but do respect, like Pain of Salvation.
Beardfish is just criminally underrated.
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We’ve obviously ran out of things to talk about.
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The injustices should be corrected for all bands that have been excluded, including Yes, Phish, Beardfish, and Pain of Salvation
Yes is in, and those other two bands aren't even in the conversation and shouldn't be, IMO.
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We’ve obviously ran out of things to talk about.
Not really. I wonder how many bass drums will be featured in MP's kit. :lol
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The injustices should be corrected for all bands that have been excluded, including Yes, Phish, Beardfish, and Pain of Salvation
Hard to take you seriously, when you champion for two bands that most HOF voters have never heard of, and one band that is already in.
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Yes was inducted? I missed that haha
What about Rush, Genesis, ELP, King Crimson? If any of those are missing feel free to append them to my point, which I find valid.
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The injustices should be corrected for all bands that have been excluded, including Yes, Phish, Beardfish, and Pain of Salvation
Bands have to be famous to get in the hall of fame. (The clue is in the name.)
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Yes was inducted? I missed that haha
What about Rush, Genesis, ELP, King Crimson? If any of those are missing feel free to append them to my point, which I find valid.
Rush and Genesis are in, ELP and King Crimson are not (and fair is fair, I'll give you props for that; Fripp essentially invented progressive rock and ought to be there and is nowhere to be found.)
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Bands have to be famous to get in the hall of fame. (The clue is in the name.)
:rollin
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Rush and Genesis are in, ELP and King Crimson are not (and fair is fair, I'll give you props for that; Fripp essentially invented progressive rock and ought to be there and is nowhere to be found.)
Fripp also contributed to other music as well. He played with Peter Gabriel and David Bowie. Guy should have his own wing in the hall
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Fripp also contributed to other music as well. He played with Peter Gabriel and David Bowie. Guy should have his own wing in the hall
Daryl Hall; you need to check that out (it's called Sacred Songs, and was intended to be the third of a trilogy with Fripp's Exposure and Gabriel's.... I think it was Melt).
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Fripp also contributed to other music as well. He played with Peter Gabriel and David Bowie. Guy should have his own wing in the hall
Not sure you understand how halls of fame work.
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Not sure you understand how halls of fame work.
I mean, they're all totally arbitrary based on the rules of each individual hall. If I was the big man in charge of the Rolling Stone magazine that owns the Hall there'd be some big changes coming from me. I'd prog that bitch up
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Rolling Stone doesn’t even own the Hall of Fame
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wasn't it founded by Jann Wenner?
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wasn't it founded by Jann Wenner?
No, by Ahmed Ertegun. Jann was on the board but the magazine is/was not involved.
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A HoF that just catered to the whims of one individual without actually considering things like "popularity" and "fame" wouldn't be a HoF at all. It would just be one person's obscure vanity project.
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A HoF that just catered to the whims of one individual without actually considering things like "popularity" and "fame" wouldn't be a HoF at all. It would just be one person's obscure vanity project.
That's why we need to save the hall for prog
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That's why we need to save the hall for prog
Eh?
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The hall, as it stands presently, is catering to the whims of one individual (Jann Wenner, famously hates prog)
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But at least it's bands people have heard of, which is kinda the point
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You guys ever heard of Dream Theater?
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You guys ever heard of Dream Theater?
Who?
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You guys ever heard of Dream Theater?
I know of a Dream Theatre.....
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You guys ever heard of Dream Theater?
How many people do you meet in your daily life that have even heard of Dream Theater?
Apart from people I have met because of music it's very few and far between.
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Funny you asked. I got cut off on the interstate the other day by a black pickup truck with a Majesty logo in the back window. :lol
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How many people do you meet in your daily life that have even heard of Dream Theater?
Apart from people I have met because of music it's very few and far between.
Actually, I’ve changed my job a couple of months ago and most people here around my age (37) know them. I was really surprised.
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How many people do you meet in your daily life that have even heard of Dream Theater?
Almost never. And those who claim to know Dream Theater, I often pressume they're lying.
Maybe, in those rare casus, I should throw a quick quiz at their window.
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Yes was inducted? I missed that haha
What about Rush, Genesis, ELP, King Crimson? If any of those are missing feel free to append them to my point, which I find valid.
This latest exchange illustrates again why it's almost impossible to take your seriously. One can never tell if you're just clowning as usual or legit ignorant about what you're discussing. Don't forget the green font is available to you if you'd like others to be able to play along :tup.
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Rolling Stone doesn’t even own the Hall of Fame
Maybe not, but it's an insular group of people. Dave Marsh, who was on the induction committee for the longest time (maybe still is) famously said "Kiss will get in over my dead body". WTF is that? You don't have to like it, but you DO have to be objective enough to understand if others like it. Seymour Stein was another one; he would famously lobby for the acts on his record label (Sire Records); not a surprise that acts like The Pretenders are in and other, IMO more worthy acts, are not.
I have also been very vocal about the politics of the Hall. I firmly believe that it plays a part, since Jann Wenner has been very vocal in pushing the idea of "political activism" as a "character trait".
I despise Jann Wenner and his arrogance and self-importance. That man wouldn't know "humility" if it was giving him a purple nurple.
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The hall, as it stands presently, is catering to the whims of one individual (Jann Wenner, famously hates prog)
This is not true.
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Maybe not, but it's an insular group of people. Dave Marsh, who was on the induction committee for the longest time (maybe still is) famously said "Kiss will get in over my dead body". WTF is that? You don't have to like it, but you DO have to be objective enough to understand if others like it. Seymour Stein was another one; he would famously lobby for the acts on his record label (Sire Records); not a surprise that acts like The Pretenders are in and other, IMO more worthy acts, are not.
I have also been very vocal about the politics of the Hall. I firmly believe that it plays a part, since Jann Wenner has been very vocal in pushing the idea of "political activism" as a "character trait".
I despise Jann Wenner and his arrogance and self-importance. That man wouldn't know "humility" if it was giving him a purple nurple.
Agree with all of this :tup
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This is not true.
Agreed, it's not true. But it is a limited group of elitist insiders that are high on themselves.
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Elitist insiders who hate prog and Kiss
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I’m just happy Rush made it in before Neil passed. I wish the same could be said about Deep Purple and Jon Lord.
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Elitist insiders who hate prog and Kiss
To be fair, no one except prog fans and KISS fans like prog or KISS. So I'm not sure what you think can realistically happen here.
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To be fair, no one except prog fans and KISS fans like prog or KISS. So I'm not sure what you think can realistically happen here.
Yeah!... wait, wut?!? ;D ;D ;D
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I’m just happy Rush made it in before Neil passed. I wish the same could be said about Deep Purple and Jon Lord.
That ship has sailed for so many people... Ben Orr, Chris Squire, Jon Lord, Ronnie Dio...
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To be fair, no one except prog fans and KISS fans like prog or KISS. So I'm not sure what you think can realistically happen here.
:lol very fair point. I guess the same is true of the few jambands I'd argue are worthy of the hall.
Funny enough, that jam band Phish isn't inducted (though they probably deserve it by now based on how they nearly single-handedly reinvented the concept of Festivals that later became things like bonarroo in the early 90s) though their Flying Hot Dog prop from their New Years Eve 1999 show is hanging in the Hall's main entrance (and has been for quite a while)
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IMO, Phish does belong. But I don't get a vote.
But Beardfish? No way.
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I don't think they've even had 20 years since their first album anyway, that suggestion was more of a joke, lol
(though, they do rule)
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So, my plan to make it to London for the first show has officially been halted, really bummed to be missing this one.
Anyone here think there *could* be a decent turnout for a livestream/ppv of the first show back? I'm already in for whatever it costs - I have to believe they're going to be shooting it (maybe not professionally) anyway . . . . hey, one can hope
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How many people do you meet in your daily life that have even heard of Dream Theater?
Apart from people I have met because of music it's very few and far between.
Only two! :omg: And not directly. One was like "my brother is a huge fan" and for the other, it was his best friend. But I never met these ppl. So it's literally just me and my husband, whom I credit with my exposure to this stellar band and eternally thank for randomly popping in that Score dvd one day eight years ago. And he heard about them about eight years before that from his guitar teacher.
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Had a dream last night about the O2 show. They came out and played the entirety of ADTOE plus Octavarium as the set 1 closer. As the lights dimmed Portnoy ran out to the front of the stage and announced "OUR NEXT ALBUM WILL BE A DRAMATIC TURN OF EVENTS 2: YET MORE DRAMA". Then he came and hung out with me and my brother because my bro met Bill Hubauer on a cruise ship once. So, uh, let's wait and see if I'm a prophet or what...
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:lol
Reminds me of a dream I had where they played a local multi-storey car park :metal
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Had a dream last night about the O2 show. They came out and played the entirety of ADTOE plus Octavarium as the set 1 closer. As the lights dimmed Portnoy ran out to the front of the stage and announced "OUR NEXT ALBUM WILL BE A DRAMATIC TURN OF EVENTS 2: YET MORE DRAMA". Then he came and hung out with me and my brother because my bro met Bill Hubauer on a cruise ship once. So, uh, let's wait and see if I'm a prophet or what...
I love the logic of dreams!!! (I'm being serious, not making fun of you.)
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Who is Bill Hubauer?
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Who is Bill Hubauer?
Keyboardist in The Neal Morse Band.
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Keyboardist in The Neal Morse Band.
Thank you!
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I was listening to Scenes From A Memory today while I was swimming, and man, I wish they would include the sampled portions of the record in live performances. The samples really improve some parts of the album, but especially Home. I know some people find the moaning weird, but it is there for a reason (narrative) and it would be cool if they played Home on the upcoming tour since that always felt like a great song that showcased MP well.
Also, if the sample can't be patched through or JR doesn't want to map it to his keyboard, they could have James do the moaning part. I think it would be cool to see him get more "immersive" with his performances.
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I was listening to Scenes From A Memory today while I was swimming, and man, I wish they would include the sampled portions of the record in live performances.
They do.
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I was listening to Scenes From A Memory today while I was swimming, and man, I wish they would include the sampled portions of the record in live performances. The samples really improve some parts of the album, but especially Home. I know some people find the moaning weird, but it is there for a reason (narrative) and it would be cool if they played Home on the upcoming tour since that always felt like a great song that showcased MP well.
Also, if the sample can't be patched through or JR doesn't want to map it to his keyboard, they could have James do the moaning part. I think it would be cool to see him get more "immersive" with his performances.
:lol
I'm taking you haven't heard or seen LSFNY or Distant Memories.
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Also, if the sample can't be patched through or JR doesn't want to map it to his keyboard, they could have James do the moaning part. I think it would be cool to see him get more "immersive" with his performances.
This is the worst yet of your bad ideas.
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yet.. :natalieportman:
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This is the worst yet of your bad ideas.
Just wait a few minutes. And he forgot the green font again.
On a different note, listening to Light Fuse and Get Away this morning, that has got some really killer riffing and I love the arrangement from the When Dream and Day Re-Unite performance. If they could take that 2nd set of verses and play them in half-time so James could breathe, I wouldn't mind seeing that one brought back. The song has grown on me over the years although it's still not a favorite from that album.
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I was listening to Scenes From A Memory today while I was swimming
Now that's an interesting environment to listen to music.
they could have James do the moaning part.
It must be the chlorine... got to be.
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JP should do it :zydar:
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This is the worst yet of your bad ideas.
yet.. :natalieportman:
Please don't challenge him :lol
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JP should do it :zydar:
I'd be down, but he has to do it in as low a voice as he can.
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Please don't challenge him :lol
It'll happen eventually lol
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It'll happen eventually lol
lol
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You guys ever heard of Dream Theater?
Welcome to the forum!
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Looks like most of the European dates are selling very well, hopefully this translates to more offers for the US leg(s)
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They still haven't opened the upper tier for the London show. There are a handful of tickets remaining for the lower tiers.
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They still haven't opened the upper tier for the London show. There are a handful of tickets remaining for the lower tiers.
I'd guess it would be a massive win for them to open the upper tier of a 20k capacity arena for DT
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I'd guess it would be a massive win for them to open the upper tier of a 20k capacity arena for DT
It's ridiculous that they've gone from struggling to sell out a 3.5k seater venue in London to there being scarce tickets available for a 10k seater venue -- especially when the good tickets are £30 more expensive than they were 2 years ago. Expand it for sure. Would be incredible to see how well they can sell this show. Shows the buzz behind the band.
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I was listening to Scenes From A Memory today while I was swimming, and man, I wish they would include the sampled portions of the record in live performances. The samples really improve some parts of the album, but especially Home. I know some people find the moaning weird, but it is there for a reason (narrative) and it would be cool if they played Home on the upcoming tour since that always felt like a great song that showcased MP well.
Also, if the sample can't be patched through or JR doesn't want to map it to his keyboard, they could have James do the moaning part. I think it would be cool to see him get more "immersive" with his performances.
This is the worst yet of your bad ideas.
I hate the moaning section in Home on the record and live, as great as Met Pt. 2 is that sample and the video effects on Met 2000 dvd are horrendous.
Now JLB moaning into the mic, that I want to see :lol
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I will never defend the DVD effects on that disc lmao
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It's ridiculous that they've gone from struggling to sell out a 3.5k seater venue in London to there being scarce tickets available for a 10k seater venue -- especially when the good tickets are £30 more expensive than they were 2 years ago. Expand it for sure. Would be incredible to see how well they can sell this show. Shows the buzz behind the band.
The power of nostalgia :hat
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They still haven't opened the upper tier for the London show. There are a handful of tickets remaining for the lower tiers.
I checked this out, OOC, and even with the upper bowl not being sold, that's looking like a great turn out for them. It looks like that set up is similar to what Judas Priest and Avenged Sevenfold did at my local arena recently (didn't sell the top bowl, although they opened up some sections for both shows when the date got closer because the lower seats mostly sold out. I feel like even without that top bowl open, that could be one of the best DT headline turn outs in awhile.
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The power of nostalgia :hat
Yep. And I recall during the Dreamsonic tour, talking about low attendance, and people suggesting MP coming back. A few naysayers thought it wouldn’t make a difference. Now we know that isn’t true!
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I've been given so much more in life
I've got a son, I've got a wife
(https://render.fineartamerica.com/images/rendered/default/t-shirt/35/5/images/artworkimages/medium/1/james-labrie-melanie-d-transparent.png)
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:lol
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first sold out show for the new tour is a fact!
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I like how the math for this tour works out, 8 albums and a 20th anniversary tour and then 8 more albums before the 40th anniversary. Fitting.
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I like how the math for this tour works out, 8 albums and a 20th anniversary tour and then 8 more albums before the 40th anniversary. Fitting.
Trapped inside this Octavarium...
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It's ridiculous that they've gone from struggling to sell out a 3.5k seater venue in London to there being scarce tickets available for a 10k seater venue -- especially when the good tickets are £30 more expensive than they were 2 years ago. Expand it for sure. Would be incredible to see how well they can sell this show. Shows the buzz behind the band.
Well, given how much they’ve squized for consecutive years and multiple times their stronger makerts (and UK has been always tricky for them anyway) it was remarkable they were still able to sell the amount of tickets they did.
On the other hand, putting out an initial limited number of tickets + shouting LOW TICKETS ALERT is a good old ticketing technique. I’m not saying these show are not selling well, i’m sure they are and eventually the O2 will be a memorable evening for the band and the fans, i just think that with DT we weren’t anymore used to see any promotion/marketing activity (which so far consists in….MP social media :P )
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The upper part of The O2 hasn't been opened yet. DT are several thousand away from filling the place, despite the recent claims about it being almost sold out.
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Lol hyperbole at its best!
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The upper part of The O2 hasn't been opened yet. DT are several thousand away from filling the place, despite the recent claims about it being almost sold out.
Yeah, I don't personally like this sort of advertising. It's far from being a true sell out. I noticed Kamelot did this for the show coming up this week locally. The venue held back almost all the tickets for the balcony and the bands been advertising it as almost sold out. We all know, if the tickets available sell, they will open up more. So it's false advertising to me. I do understand the point of not selling all the tickets though, just don't tell me it's low tickets when we all know that's far from the truth.
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I agree with most of the points made but I am not sure this is anything the band or the band's management has much control over? Maybe their ticketing liaison?
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They're not necessarily going to open the balcony. Yes, most places will but they have to do it in a calculated manner in order to ensure there is adequate staff. I've been to shows where they oddly open up one section but the whole other part is curtained off. They may just open up the first 3 rows of the balcony and put the curtain behind those. If they only "sold out" a few days before the show they would probably just leave it. This far out, I'm sure they'll offer more seats.
So they are close to the point where no more tickets are available but handfuls will still probably pop up depending on demand.
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They're not necessarily going to open the balcony. Yes, most places will but they have to do it in a calculated manner in order to ensure there is adequate staff. I've been to shows where they oddly open up one section but the whole other part is curtained off. They may just open up the first 3 rows of the balcony and put the curtain behind those. If they only "sold out" a few days before the show they would probably just leave it. This far out, I'm sure they'll offer more seats.
So they are close to the point where no more tickets are available but handfuls will still probably pop up depending on demand.
This is literally what happened at my local Judas Priest concert a week or so ago. They only sold the lower bowl but it basically sold out a week before the show and they opened up the sections in the top bowl, but only a few of them. I'd imagine if those all somehow sold (they did not) they'd open more.
I agree with most of the points made but I am not sure this is anything the band or the band's management has much control over? Maybe their ticketing liaison?
The band has control over the social media advertising it as low tickets. Not sure how much the band has control of opening those tickets up, it's likely part of their agreement that was in place to book the show. I'd imagine it's possible they aren't away of the upper bowl being blocked off and they only see a % of the sold vs. currently available.... but I feel like MP actually knows these things. If he weren't in the band right now, I'd give them a bit more slack because historically, their team seems to not be fully aware of details like that.
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It's not like that just with Mike back they're suddenly going to sell 15k tickets! Yes, it will be a bigger attendance than without MP but I would still expect no more than 6-8 thousand at best.
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It's not like that just with Mike back they're suddenly going to sell 15k tickets! Yes, it will be a bigger attendance than without MP but I would still expect no more than 6-8 thousand at best.
Yeah, that's why I still think it's actually a good turn out even if they never open up the top bowl.
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Exactly.
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It's not like that just with Mike back they're suddenly going to sell 15k tickets! Yes, it will be a bigger attendance than without MP but I would still expect no more than 6-8 thousand at best.
Correct, in the grand scheme of the music world, MP isn't even a blip on the radar.
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I think this is also part of the "new car smell syndrome". This is the reunion/40th anniversary tour, so obviously the hype is high; but how will the shows do moving forward will depend on a few different things like the setlists, vocals, etc.
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I think this is also part of the "new car smell syndrome". This is the reunion/40th anniversary tour, so obviously the hype is high; but how will the shows do moving forward will depend on a few different things like the setlists, vocals, etc.
Yeah for sure. I fully expect the hype to die back down once the album is out and touring has been happening. Hopefully I'm wrong and the new album brings in new fans and truly a new era for the band.
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"new car smell syndrome"
Is that like when MP said "Smell my beard"? :lol
EDIT: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODM9vvvXWD8
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Is that like when MP said "Smell my beard"? :lol
EDIT: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODM9vvvXWD8
Yeah, exactly when MP said that.
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LMAO wow, talk about a brain fart. I even shared the video that clearly has JP in it :lol
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Hand drawing from a fan:
(https://i.imgur.com/bWuye3N.jpeg)
Much better than what Huge did, IMO
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Agreed, thats incredible
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+1, I think I get every reference... except the stick figure drawing taped onto the left side?
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I'm thinking that may be a Six Degrees reference.
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Wow! The detail, the accent and everything. I love it.
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That is VERY well done for what it is intending to be. Much better than the Syme one.
That said, maybe it's cause of the MCU and modern movie posters, but I just am a bit over the collage "let's put everything we possibly can" on a poster mentality, though I get for an anniversary deal, it has its logic. Just not for me.
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I'm thinking that may be a Six Degrees reference.
Yeah, that image is somewhere in the album art (maybe the back cover?) of SDOIT.
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Yup, much better. DT might be better off just letting fans create their artwork.
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Yup, much better. DT might be better off just letting fans create their artwork.
Wouldn't it also be cheaper? I can't imagine an upcoming young talented artist asking more than Hugh Syme.
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Wouldn't it also be cheaper? I can't imagine an upcoming young talented artist asking more than Hugh Syme.
Probably can find people to do it for free since fans already do stuff like this. I think the only issue might be having the art link more directly to the music, in the case of like an album cover. I'd imagine Hugh gets to listen to the music and hear from the band directly to get inspiration for the art which wouldn't really be possible if they had an open art contest for example. I feel like Haken did something like this recently with the Nightingale single.
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Well, they could have an unrelated contest before and once they got their guy, they can clue him/her in on the details.
Also, they could just give directions without providing information about the actual music. What piece of music was essential for Syme to create the cover art for View? the lyrics of the title track and a general suggestion of what they wanted on the cover are already enough IMO.
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Well, they could have an unrelated contest before and once they got their guy, they can clue him/her in on the details.
Also, they could just give directions without providing information about the actual music. What piece of music was essential for Syme to create the cover art for View? the lyrics of the title track and a general suggestion of what they wanted on the cover are already enough IMO.
Yeah, there's probably ways it can happen if they wanted to go that route, but I doubt we ever see them do.
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Syme is the unofficial 6th DT member at this point, I don't think they'll ever try working with someone else (would love to be wrong on this one).
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Probably can find people to do it for free since fans already do stuff like this. I think the only issue might be having the art link more directly to the music, in the case of like an album cover. I'd imagine Hugh gets to listen to the music and hear from the band directly to get inspiration for the art which wouldn't really be possible if they had an open art contest for example. I feel like Haken did something like this recently with the Nightingale single.
No offense to Huge Sign (that's my new name for him, lol), but I would have never known this in a million years. His artwork never seems like he personally heard the music and created something from that
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Maybe Hugh Syme has like a rewards program or something. Buy 3 album artworks get one free.
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Syme is the unofficial 6th DT member at this point, I don't think they'll ever try working with someone else (would love to be wrong on this one).
They did for The Astonishing, but that was only because what JP had in mind was something Hugh wasn't proficient at, so he passed on doing the artwork for that album.
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No offense to Huge Sign (that's my new name for him, lol), but I would have never known this in a million years. His artwork never seems like he personally heard the music and created something from that
I have no idea if that's the case, but that would be my thought process on making artwork for music.
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Maybe Hugh Syme has like a rewards program or something. Buy 3 album artworks get one free.
:lol
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I have no idea if that's the case, but that would be my thought process on making artwork for music.
I agree with you that it makes sense, I just don't hear/see anything implying they give 'ol Huge a sneak peak, simply based on the existing artwork. Any of those "amalgamation" images of song themes or nouns can just simply be told to him.
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Maybe Hugh Syme has like a rewards program or something. Buy 3 album artworks get one free.
The key is he has an even better punch card at the stock photos store, that's how he makes his money.
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Mark Wilkinson?
He did the last Judas Priest, he did Senjutsu, and while I think he's doing the Fish deluxe sets for Vigil and Internal, he's losing Fish as a client, so...
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I think he has been the artist for every Judas Priest album since Painkiller. Big fan of his work.
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Mark Wilkinson?
He did the last Judas Priest, he did Senjutsu, and while I think he's doing the Fish deluxe sets for Vigil and Internal, he's losing Fish as a client, so...
He did every Fish album (barring Songs From The Mirror) as well as the first four Marillion albums as well. I personally like Hugh's work (yes really). I wouldn't mind Mark doing the cover art for DT (since I also entirely love his work), but (as with Rush), since Hugh has such a long association with DT, I welcome Hugh doing it again.
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He did every Fish album (barring Songs From The Mirror) as well as the first four Marillion albums as well. I personally like Hugh's work (yes really). I wouldn't mind Mark doing the cover art for DT (since I also entirely love his work), but (as with Rush), since Hugh has such a long association with DT, I welcome Hugh doing it again.
I'm actually with you. I understand some of the criticisms - the reused unicyle, the line on the self-titled - but I actually like his style, and I'm generally a fan.
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I'm actually with you. I understand some of the criticisms - the reused unicyle, the line on the self-titled - but I actually like his style, and I'm generally a fan.
There's no real art to it though. It's just colorforms.
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I don't remember the I&W girl looking so pissed.
They did for The Astonishing, but that was only because what JP had in mind was something Hugh wasn't proficient at...
Creating something unique from scratch?
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Exactly.
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Jokes aside, every artist is entitled to have their comfort zones and knowing what their abilities are; heck, even Brian May didn't want to play the flamenco solo in Innuendo and they got Steve Howe from Yes to do it.
Having said that, what kind of reply from a professional artist is "it's not the thing I usually do?"... imagine John Petrucci being asked to be a guest on an album and saying "nah, I'm more comfortable doing prog metal, I don't want to play a rock song".
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There's no real art to it though. It's just colorforms.
So? Unless you're Roger Dean or the aforementioned Mark Wilinson, there's no real art to ANY album, is there?
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So, The Prog Report are about to premiere a video on YT where they talk about their setlist predictions for the upcoming tour. MP commented on the Facebook post with:
This will be interesting! Curious how much of it you get right (as I’ve already written it 😉) Will watch tonite!
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So, The Prog Report are about to premiere a video on YT where they talk about their setlist predictions for the upcoming tour.
Nice! I had a chat with Kyle Fagala, one of the guys who participated, just hours before they filmed their discussion, so I'm also looking forward to it. One thing he did say is that they came to the conclusion that the new DT album wouldn't be out until after the first leg of the tour, which affected what they ultimately came up with. But the following day, we were chatting (which is when he told me that) and I pointed out that considering the time frames for ADToE (started on January 3, released September 12) and SFaM (started February 8, released on October 26), I expect the new one to be out by the end of September or beginning of October since they started work on it February 7.
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So HoSo's real name is Kyle?
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So HoSo's real name is Kyle?
No no no. Not understanding how you could've come up with that bizarre connection. :huh:
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Well, they're both operating on the notion that the album will not be out before the tour.
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I am also of the idea that they'll try to release it before the tour. Hopefully that happens.
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they kinda confirmed it will be out before the tour, when answering questions about schedule etc.
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Well, they're both operating on the notion that the album will not be out before the tour.
WITH THE ADDENDUM THAT I HOPE I AM WRONG!! lolll :lol
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Nice! I had a chat with Kyle Fagala, one of the guys who participated, just hours before they filmed their discussion, so I'm also looking forward to it. One thing he did say is that they came to the conclusion that the new DT album wouldn't be out until after the first leg of the tour, which affected what they ultimately came up with. But the following day, we were chatting (which is when he told me that) and I pointed out that considering the time frames for ADToE (started on January 3, released September 12) and SFaM (started February 8, released on October 26), I expect the new one to be out by the end of September or beginning of October since they started work on it February 7.
I feel like the more important dates are from when the album is finished to when it's released. It's May and as far as I understand, the album is not finished. Also, I'm not following, but if there's production delays that could impact release dates.
Personally, I kind of feel like this is not going to be out before the tour, but it still seems possible. But I've got to think the new single will be out by then and performed on the tour.
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But what if they hadn't, sincerely and consciously, decided yet? Obviously, it's just a hypothesis, but they might be seeing if MP's return and the fact that it's the 40th-anniversary tour are enough to sell enough tickets.
If that were the case, then the card "new music to promote" could be played to further extend the tour once the anniversary thing has done its job.
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If they didn't plan on having the album out by then, why only start the tour in October? Why not start it earlier?
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If they didn't plan on having the album out by then, why only start the tour in October? Why not start it earlier?
One possibility might be that Summer tours were already all booked up. I've had tickets for some shows this summer that I bought the ticket for long before DT-MP reunion was ever announced.
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If they didn't plan on having the album out by then, why only start the tour in October? Why not start it earlier?
I believe they assumed that first and foremost they would have, in any case, written music together. Therefore, advancing the tour would have still meant aiming for the summer. And in the summer, you have two options: festivals or solo tours. And it's evident that the more lucrative option, leveraging Portnoy's return, is a solo tour. That's why I believe they chose to start in October and not earlier in any case.
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And in the summer, you have two options: festivals or solo tours. And it's evident that the more lucrative option, leveraging Portnoy's return, is a solo tour. That's why I believe they chose to start in October and not earlier in any case.
This makes sense.
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O2 Arena availability looking pretty low now
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Jokes aside, every artist is entitled to have their comfort zones and knowing what their abilities are; heck, even Brian May didn't want to play the flamenco solo in Innuendo and they got Steve Howe from Yes to do it.
Actually, that came about simply to a chance meeting of mutual friends
https://brianmay.com/queen-news/queen-features/2022/06/on-the-spot-steve-howe/
and
https://www.loudersound.com/features/queen-innuendo-single-steve-howe-interview
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I believe they assumed that first and foremost they would have, in any case, written music together. Therefore, advancing the tour would have still meant aiming for the summer. And in the summer, you have two options: festivals or solo tours. And it's evident that the more lucrative option, leveraging Portnoy's return, is a solo tour. That's why I believe they chose to start in October and not earlier in any case.
Right, but you're missing the point. My argument is that they would have the album released before the tour starts. Had they wanted to do a warm up tour beforehand, then they would have been better off doing what they did in 2005, 2007, 2009 and 2011 before starting each tour properly: do a mix of festivals and headlining gigs in B-markets throughout Europe during the summer, which is a great way to get the band name out into the public eye - especially to those who weren't fans yet. That in turn would help them have turnouts much better than otherwise when they started the proper support tour for the new album. But they're not doing that this time. So besides the similar time periods to SFaM and ADToE, the beginning of the tour in October to me is clear evidence that the album will be out by then. Plus MP's final comment in that recent Rolling Stone interview that the full band did was
It’s scary because, under normal circumstances, it takes a bunch of shows to get your sea legs back. But in this case, we need to hit the ground running. That first show is going to be dissected with a magnifying glass in the age of YouTube. We can’t suck. The pressure’s on.
I may be reading into it, but that to me says they're not doing any warm up legs this time around, but that the proper tour starts in October 2024, complete with the new album.
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O2 Arena availability looking pretty low now
The upper tier still isn't on sale, is it?
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Plus MP's final comment in that recent Rolling Stone interview that the full band did was I may be reading into it, but that to me says they're not doing any warm up legs this time around, but that the proper tour starts in October 2024, complete with the new album.
Given the way they're promoting that show and trying to get people from all around the world to attend, I don't think there's any way they could get away with doing a warm up show, never mind a warm up leg.
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Actually, that came about simply to a chance meeting of mutual friends
https://brianmay.com/queen-news/queen-features/2022/06/on-the-spot-steve-howe/
and
https://www.loudersound.com/features/queen-innuendo-single-steve-howe-interview
Thanks! I stand corrected then, I always knew the story as Brian not being sure he could do it.
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^
I'd heard Brian's ever so humble (more forgetful? ;)) version years before, so that's no surprise.
Anyhoo, thought the Queen and Yes fans here would enjoy that great story. DT fans as well...
On to the matter at hand: hoping for at least a couple of releases from the new album before the tour. And hope that MP hits mostly home runs with the set list.
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The upper tier still isn't on sale, is it?
No, but I think they will start to open it soon, the lower tiers and floor looks nearly gone
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If they didn't plan on having the album out by then, why only start the tour in October? Why not start it earlier?
This. They announced the reunion back in October, DT has been inactive since the last Dreamsonic show in the summer and MP just had a few live commitments sprinkled in since then. Imo they had plenty of opportunities to book a summer tour immediately and clearly decided not to for the sole reason of ensuring the album is done before the tour. Otherwise they would be seriously crunched for time as the first show would probably be happening within weeks. I see no other reason to wait until October to start playing shows again.
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MP on FB said that the setlist is basically done.
Not surprised, he had the Score setlist locked since many months before the show.
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My prediction is that the setlist will have The Majesty or Another One from Majesty demos. I think Mike Portnoy won't miss the opportunity to play a 40 years-old song to mark the anniversary.
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This. They announced the reunion back in October, DT has been inactive since the last Dreamsonic show in the summer and MP just had a few live commitments sprinkled in since then. Imo they had plenty of opportunities to book a summer tour immediately and clearly decided not to for the sole reason of ensuring the album is done before the tour. Otherwise they would be seriously crunched for time as the first show would probably be happening within weeks. I see no other reason to wait until October to start playing shows again.
It's very possible they couldn't get onto a summer tour, these things are booked so far in advance. They likely needed that in motion before MP rejoined.
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My prediction is that the setlist will have The Majesty or Another One from Majesty demos. I think Mike Portnoy won't miss the opportunity to play a 40 years-old song to mark the anniversary.
As neat as it would be to see them play "Your Majesty" or "Another Won", that's probably not going to happen. At least, not as full songs, but it'd be neat if they did an instrumental medley of various Majesty songs lumped together. Cuz we all know JP *loves* medleys. :lol
-Marc.
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As neat as it would be to see them play "Your Majesty" or "Another Won", that's probably not going to happen. At least, not as full songs, but it'd be neat if they did an instrumental medley of various Majesty songs lumped together. Cuz we all know JP *loves* medleys. :lol
-Marc.
Well, I think the main problem is James' ability to sing any of these songs. But maybe an instrumental medley is the solution to that! More or less what Rush did on the R30 tour, opening those shows. We all know JP hates medleys, but in this specific situation and considering they're not songs from the "official" albums, I can see him being okay with it. Anyway I can't imagine MP ignoring the Majesty era on this tour.
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I mean, acknowledging properly the Majesty era, not throwing only 5 seconds at end of the last song of the show.
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The Majesty and Another One :facepalm: :D
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Anyway I can't imagine MP ignoring the Majesty era on this tour.
I don't think I can either. It would be a nice surprise.
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Bring back "Only A Matter of Time" with the "March of The Tyrant" outro. 😁😛
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Bring back "Only A Matter of Time" with the "March of The Tyrant" outro. 😁😛
That's what gets my vote!
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I’m betting he won’t be able to hold back the tears once they kick into that first song in London. Will be cool for everyone there to witness such an emotional moment.
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Wasn't my first bet, but I think now more than ever MP is going for a song from each album, but not in chronological order. Kinda to honor the band's history as a whole. Maybe fit into a few special ones like Majesty Demos or others.
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Majesty songs during the 20th were cool, but back then they only had 8 albums. I would rather them tack a bit from a Majesty song onto the end of something else than give a whole song slot to a Majesty track when that space could go to anything else.
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Wasn't my first bet, but I think now more than ever MP is going for a song from each album, but not in chronological order. Kinda to honor the band's history as a whole. Maybe fit into a few special ones like Majesty Demos or others.
Man, that's going to be one looooong concert........
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I wouldn't be surprised if there is a rotating spot for a 'rare' track on this tour, like a Majesty tune or a B-Side. I still really hope they play 'A Vision' one day!
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Majesty songs during the 20th were cool, but back then they only had 8 albums. I would rather them tack a bit from a Majesty song onto the end of something else than give a whole song slot to a Majesty track when that space could go to anything else.
I guess it depends what swap out is. I’d take Another Won over any number of tunes.
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I'd love to hear a Majesty tune, but a minimum, they gotta play a song off WDADU in honor of Charlie!
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I may be channeling my inner TAC here, but am I the only one that doesn't need to hear anything from the Majesty years, or from WDADU?
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I may be channeling my inner TAC here, but am I the only one that doesn't need to hear anything from the Majesty years, or from WDADU?
Just Killing Hand, but only if James can sing the high A flat.
Otherwise, no, not interested.
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Since they're celebrating the 40th anniversary of the band it would be weird if they just skipped the Majesty/WDADU years.
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I may be channeling my inner TAC here, but am I the only one that doesn't need to hear anything from the Majesty years, or from WDADU?
Yes.
Since they're celebrating the 40th anniversary of the band it would be weird if they just skipped the Majesty/WDADU years.
My thoughts exactly.
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Okay. I mean, I'm not going to leave the arena if they do, or anything.
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Okay. I mean, I'm not going to leave the arena if they do, or anything.
Do you think DT will be playing arenas on the NA tour? That'd be a huge step up for them, no?
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I don't know if anyone said it, but now that I'm thinking about it and based on Mike wanting to give us something very special, I'd vote for Eve. I guess many newer fans haven't heard this, but for us the older ones, that's a hell of a song.
One of their most emotional ever, so melodic and beautiful.
It would be a great surprise for the fans!
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Do you think DT will be playing arenas on the NA tour? That'd be a huge step up for them, no?
No, larger theaters. I meant "arena" in the broadest sense of the word.
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I don't know if anyone said it, but now that I'm thinking about it and based on Mike wanting to give us something very special, I'd vote for Eve. I guess many newer fans haven't heard this, but for us the older ones, that's a hell of a song.
One of their most emotional ever, so melodic and beautiful.
It would be a great surprise for the fans!
I would love this. That song is special to me. Back in 95 my dad interviewed JP for radio here in Sweden and I was in the room awestruck to be sitting next to my favorite guitarist. He gave me the Silent Man single which had Eve on it. It's a great song and as someone who would love to see more of the instrumental stuff done live I think it would be a treat. It's my favorite instrumental effort by them.
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I have a feeling people are really getting their hopes up regarding the set list. They will perform a show that's only three hours long including the intermission, which might seem like a long concert, but we're talking about a band whose average song length is nine minutes. I'm having a hard time imagining a concert that contains more than fifteen tracks, so I would immediately eliminate two scenarios:
- getting a song from each album
- getting some serious deep cuts
If this is indeed being marketed as a 40th anniversary tour, it would be strange for them not to include anything from the first album or the early demos. However, we can expect one song, two at best, most likely shorter ones. Only a matter of time and Another won are the safest bets. Then again, Status seeker and Afterlife are songs that Charlie actually wrote lyrics for, so that's also a possibility.
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I may be channeling my inner TAC here, but am I the only one that doesn't need to hear anything from the Majesty years, or from WDADU?
Outer TAC would definitely want to hear that. ;D
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I may be channeling my inner TAC here, but am I the only one that doesn't need to hear anything from the Majesty years, or from WDADU?
No, I'm with you, Stads. I certainly am in no hurry to hear Majesty or WDADU material.
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No, larger theaters. I meant "arena" in the broadest sense of the word.
Gotcha :lol
I was like "uhh, I doubt they're going to book hockey arenas.."
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I may be channeling my inner TAC here, but am I the only one that doesn't need to hear anything from the Majesty years, or from WDADU?
Need is a strong word. I'm not really excited about most of those songs being played, but there's some that I'd like to see.
Since they're celebrating the 40th anniversary of the band it would be weird if they just skipped the Majesty/WDADU years.
Yeah, for this reason, I kind of expect a song to be played.
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Ten thousand fans from all over the world are not converging on London on 20 October to hear a Majesty demo.
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I may be channeling my inner TAC here, but am I the only one that doesn't need to hear anything from the Majesty years, or from WDADU?
I have zero interest in any Majesty era material, but I think they should do something from WDADU (other than YJ) in tribute to Charlie.
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I have zero interest in any Majesty era material, but I think they should do something from WDADU (other than YJ) in tribute to Charlie.
My thoughts exactly
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I have zero interest in any Majesty era material, but I think they should do something from WDADU (other than YJ) in tribute to Charlie.
Exactly this.
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I have zero interest in any Majesty era material, but I think they should do something from WDADU (other than YJ) in tribute to Charlie.
Agreed. I'm sure they'll be some sort of tribute to Charlie.
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How about right before the second set, a short video montage with some audio, then James comes on and says "Hey, we've been lucky enough to rekindle our relationship with the Mighty Mike Portnoy, and it's a blessing. We're not so lucky in that we can't do that with someone who was at ground zero of this forty year anniversary. Can you please acknowledge, as we acknowledge in our hearts, the late, great Charlie Dominici. This next one is a song about loss, and it is "The Best Of Times"."
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I have a feeling people are really getting their hopes up regarding the set list. They will perform a show that's only three hours long including the intermission, which might seem like a long concert, but we're talking about a band whose average song length is nine minutes. I'm having a hard time imagining a concert that contains more than fifteen tracks, so I would immediately eliminate two scenarios:
- getting a song from each album
- getting some serious deep cuts
If this is indeed being marketed as a 40th anniversary tour, it would be strange for them not to include anything from the first album or the early demos. However, we can expect one song, two at best, most likely shorter ones. Only a matter of time and Another won are the safest bets. Then again, Status seeker and Afterlife are songs that Charlie actually wrote lyrics for, so that's also a possibility.
Time for some medleys!
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Without bringing this debate back, what kind of songs they can play without killing James? Some of the early stuff is really high pitched and his recent track record (the last couple years) hasn't been too flattering vocally, to put it nicely.
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They’ll have to rewrite the vocal melodies and/or tune the songs down. There’s just no other option at this point.
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Without bringing this debate back, what kind of songs they can play without killing James? Some of the early stuff is really high pitched and his recent track record (the last couple years) hasn't been too flattering vocally, to put it nicely.
Well, not to change my tune here, but if they WERE to do a Charlie tune, that would be the ultimate chance to drop things down an octave, no?
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I have zero interest in any Majesty era material, but I think they should do something from WDADU (other than YJ) in tribute to Charlie.
Well, I don't know any of the Majesty stuff, but if they reworked something to the quality that they did Another Won, I'd be all for that anytime.
I love the WDADU tracks, so I'd definitely take one of those.
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They’ll have to rewrite the vocal melodies and/or tune the songs down. There’s just no other option at this point.
If MP already has the set list ready and the shows aren't for another 5 months, sounds like they have 5 months to adjust the songs to make them work for JLB. I just wonder if they'll actually do that. I also haven't heard anything if JLB took any action the last year to help his vocals. I do worry the whole reunion thing doesn't work out because JLB can't perform. I feel like the hype might die down quickly if the first show is a disaster from the vocals and it comes off like nothing has changed from Dreamsonic.
Ten thousand fans from all over the world are not converging on London on 20 October to hear a Majesty demo.
Not specifically, but they are going to see DT celebrate 40 years so the crowd should go in understanding it's possible.
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Ten thousand fans from all over the world are not converging on London on 20 October to hear a Majesty demo.
Did Another Won sound like a demo when you listened to Score? No way!
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How about right before the second set, a short video montage with some audio, then James comes on and says "Hey, we've been lucky enough to rekindle our relationship with the Mighty Mike Portnoy, and it's a blessing. We're not so lucky in that we can't do that with someone who was at ground zero of this forty year anniversary. Can you please acknowledge, as we acknowledge in our hearts, the late, great Charlie Dominici. This next one is a song about loss, and it is "The Best Of Times"."
This is not bad, except for the part about playing The Best of Times.
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This is not bad, except for the part about playing The Best of Times.
Yeah, save that for the encore. Good idea Hef!
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Ten thousand fans from all over the world are not converging on London on 20 October to hear a Majesty demo.
I don't know, but I think this material is exactly for that kind of fan! :metal
And nowadays the Majesty demos are on Spotify, they aren't something obscure anymore.
OK, I also get that a lot of hardcore fans like us don't like it, so it's not a good sign. But DT did it on Score, isn't it?
Well, maybe I'm totally wrong on it, but it's still my bet for this tour: we'll listen to more than a few seconds from the Majesty demos in instrumental form. And to play it as an instrumental also would be a nice nod for DT beginnings.
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This is not bad, except for the part about playing The Best of Times.
Yes, that song is about Mike's dad, and may be too personal to MP for that. But I agree with the sentiment, some sort of tribute to Charlie.
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How about right before the second set, a short video montage with some audio, then James comes on and says "Hey, we've been lucky enough to rekindle our relationship with the Mighty Mike Portnoy, and it's a blessing. We're not so lucky in that we can't do that with someone who was at ground zero of this forty year anniversary. Can you please acknowledge, as we acknowledge in our hearts, the late, great Charlie Dominici. This next one is a song about loss, and it is "The Best Of Times"."
Aside from the fact that TBOT is a bottom 10 DT song for me, it would seem odd to play that song, which is expressly about MP's father, in connection with mentioning Charlie's death.
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Aside from the fact that TBOT is a bottom 10 DT song for me, it would seem odd to play that song, which is expressly about MP's father, in connection with mentioning Charlie's death.
Well, for all of us that relate to it, we're not Mike's dad's son, so for us it's more generally about loss and how it impacts our lives. If there's a better DT song about the loss of someone dear, they can play that instead. It was a general point, not a specific request for that song.
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Yeah, save that for the encore. Good idea Hef!
Not at all what I meant.
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Well, for all of us that relate to it, we're not Mike's dad's son, so for us it's more generally about loss and how it impacts our lives. If there's a better DT song about the loss of someone dear, they can play that instead. It was a general point, not a specific request for that song.
I still think it would be odd, but I get your point. For my money, and regardless of whether they play TBOT, Afterlife would be the most appropriate song.
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Well, for all of us that relate to it, we're not Mike's dad's son, so for us it's more generally about loss and how it impacts our lives. If there's a better DT song about the loss of someone dear, they can play that instead. It was a general point, not a specific request for that song.
Agree. Not a son of Portnoy's dad, but of my own mother who passed away recently and I think it fits perfectly.
I still think it would be odd, but I get your point. For my money, and regardless of whether they play TBOT, Afterlife would be the most appropriate song.
LaBrie would have a hard time with Afterlife, I guess...
edit; well, this LaBrie-part of me might be bullshit, on a second thought.
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Agree. Not a son of Portnoy's dad, but of my own mother who passed away recently and I think it fits perfectly.
same for me
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This is not bad, except for the part about playing The Best of Times.
Agreed.... TBOT is way down on my list of DT songs.
Change it to A Change of Seasons instead and I'm in.
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They could also do Take Away My Pain, which is probably easier for James vocally anyway (and a better song that TBOT).
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They could also do Take Away My Pain, which is probably easier for James vocally anyway (and a better song that TBOT).
Agreed with all of this.
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I definitely want them to play The Best of Times, and it’s not because I love the song, but because, IMO, TBoT has the greatest guitar solo ever written and I want to see John play it in person.
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I definitely want them to play The Best of Times, and it’s not because I love the song, but because, IMO, TBoT has the greatest guitar solo ever written and I want to see John play it in person.
Yes.
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I definitely want them to play The Best of Times, and it’s not because I love the song, but because, IMO, TBoT has the greatest guitar solo ever written and I want to see John play it in person.
I get why people don't like the song (though I'm not in that camp), but never hearing that solo live would really suck. I'm hoping it makes the setlist this time around. And if it doesn't, I hope it appears at some point when MP feels he can present it live every night.
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I don't know, that solo didn't do a lot for me when I heard it. I think it's more that musical section overall seems a bit too over the top.
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It's a good solo, no doubt.
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I don't know, that solo didn't do a lot for me when I heard it. I think it's more that musical section overall seems a bit too over the top.
In all fairness, it’s really not in your lane. But yeah one of his best solos ever.
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Haven't listened to that song in so long to remember the solo. I don't hate the song though, I'd welcome it due to it not being played.
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it's a good solo
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It's a fine solo, just don't know that it is an especially interesting or memorable solo.
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It's indeed a beautiful solo, with nice melodical playing but also great shredding. I'm not a big fan of the song overall though, but my bet is that they are playing it because Portnoy is finally back to the band, so they can't miss the chance of doing it AND because of the solo. Kinda like a too long of a song for such an important set this will be, but I think it's happening!
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Agreed.... TBOT is way down on my list of DT songs.
Change it to A Change of Seasons instead and I'm in.
All of this.
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I must be one of the few who actually loves TBOT.
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I love The Best of times, but come on, there's no way Mike is putting himself through the torture of having to play such an emotional song every night. He can barely listen to it.
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I must be one of the few who actually loves TBOT.
Same here. Top 15 DT song.
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I must be one of the few who actually loves TBOT.
There are probably a lot of DT fans who like or love the song.
However, I am not included in that group.
Which is fine, because I'm sure I like songs that lots of other people don't care for.
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It's indeed a beautiful solo, with nice melodical playing but also great shredding. I'm not a big fan of the song overall though, but my bet is that they are playing it because Portnoy is finally back to the band, so they can't miss the chance of doing it AND because of the solo. Kinda like a too long of a song for such an important set this will be, but I think it's happening!
I love The Best of times, but come on, there's no way Mike is putting himself through the torture of having to play such an emotional song every night. He can barely listen to it.
Because of this (the bolded), the best idea is to just segue form another song into the solo section of TBOT (the best part of the song) and problem solved! :tup
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I love The Best of times, but come on, there's no way Mike is putting himself through the torture of having to play such an emotional song every night. He can barely listen to it.
Really no reason to play it every night. Do it once for a special occasion, maybe for a DVD filming so everyone can experience it.
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It's a fine solo, just don't know that it is an especially interesting or memorable solo.
Every time I mention how meh that song is, someone responds with, "but the solo!!!!!" So I go and re-listen to the song, and...it's just a solo. Nothing at all special.
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You still have to endure 10 minutes of tedium before you get to the solo.
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You still have to endure 10 minutes of tedium before you get to the solo.
Yup...I feel the same way about guitar solos as I do about lyrics: great lyrics or a great guitar solo can't turn an otherwise crappy song into a great song. The corollary only really works with lyrics: crappy lyrics can ruin an otherwise great song.
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I would like to see TBOT live someday. It's a song that goes on a structural journey. It's a song I can put on, close my eyes, and imagine an accompanying scenario.
In the intro, I see a person sitting down at home reminiscing on childhood memories. It's in a sort of slow motion, black and white style. This person knows that their loved one's time is short. When the full band comes in, all those happy memories rush into their memory, which is represented by the uplifting music. I enjoy that MP made this personal by including the happy memories he had with his father. The mood shifts when the call comes, the call that the person has passed on. The music then sets that background for the emotional final moments with the loved one. This is where MP says his heartfelt thanks to his father. Even though I think he overuses the word 'day' in the lyrics here, I feel the mourning in the way JLB delivers those lines and the accompanying music behind it.
The way the songs on BC&SL take you on a journey through their structure is a reason why I like the album, and that title is really fitting for the structures of the songs going from a moment of something dark to a moment of brightness and clarity.
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Yup...I feel the same way about guitar solos as I do about lyrics: great lyrics or a great guitar solo can't turn an otherwise crappy song into a great song. The corollary only really works with lyrics: crappy lyrics can ruin an otherwise great song.
This.
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crappy lyrics can ruin an otherwise great song.
Allow me to present... The Count Of Tuscany!
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I think The Best of Times is a really unique song in the catalog actually and surprised it doesn't get more praise. The Rush worship isn't unusual for DT but what IS unusual is how lyrically driven it is. There aren't any big instrumental sections breaking up the song (think Sacrificed Sons, Endless Sacrifice, The Ministry of Lost Souls) or anything where JLB isn't driving the song until the huge guitar solo at the end (which is one of JP's best). It's such an earned and epic moment and I wish DT would make more songs like that.
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Pretty sure Mike has always spoken of TBOT as "when" he plays it live not "if" so for the people suggesting it would be too emotional for Mike to play it, yeah it will be emotional, but not to the point it will never be played.
Also it would be incredibly awkward to dedicate that to anybody other than Mike's dad, especially considering it's so specific.
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I’m sure they’ll play it live eventually before the band calls it a day, but probably just for a one-off performance.
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They can always alter the lyrics and play it on a farewell tour
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Another possibility: maybe there’s a song on the new album specifically written for/dedicated to Charlie.
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Really no reason to play it every night. Do it once for a special occasion, maybe for a DVD filming so everyone can experience it.
Yes, this. Not only will they play it for a special occasion, like a DVD filming - but Mike will sing it (like he did in the demo version he played for his dad before he passed).
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Pretty sure Mike has always spoken of TBOT as "when" he plays it live not "if" so for the people suggesting it would be too emotional for Mike to play it, yeah it will be emotional, but not to the point it will never be played.
Also it would be incredibly awkward to dedicate that to anybody other than Mike's dad, especially considering it's so specific.
Will it be too emotional? Don't you think enough time has passed?
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Will it be too emotional? Don't you think enough time has passed?
That's pretty subjective but considering he sang that to his dad on his death bed, I don't think time will change how emotional it is. Mike's an emotional dude.
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Wasn’t there a video from not that long ago of someone asking Mike about The Best of Times? Maybe it was on Cruise to the Edge. Anyway, he made it seem like it was too difficult emotionally to perform it live.
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That's pretty subjective but considering he sang that to his dad on his death bed, I don't think time will change how emotional it is. Mike's an emotional dude.
Yeah, I was very very close to my dad, and I lost him in June of 2022, and honestly, you'd THINK it gets better... now, he has over a decade but still, we each grieve in our own way, and we carry our memories in our own way.
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I think The Best of Times is a really unique song in the catalog actually and surprised it doesn't get more praise. The Rush worship isn't unusual for DT but what IS unusual is how lyrically driven it is. There aren't any big instrumental sections breaking up the song (think Sacrificed Sons, Endless Sacrifice, The Ministry of Lost Souls) or anything where JLB isn't driving the song until the huge guitar solo at the end (which is one of JP's best). It's such an earned and epic moment and I wish DT would make more songs like that.
Amen, brother, and I find the intro extremely touching and as good as the outro solo.
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The Best of Times is a really good track with one of JP’s finest guitar solos. Last week I gave it another spin and the song’s meaning and touching lyrics are just really strong. The various parts where the music seems to mimic a certain band (Rush, The Beatles) are very deliberate and well done. Underrated track for sure.
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Wasn’t there a video from not that long ago of someone asking Mike about The Best of Times? Maybe it was on Cruise to the Edge. Anyway, he made it seem like it was too difficult emotionally to perform it live.
I'm not sure about that interview but he had said things like that in the past. Normally he says something along the lines of, "I don't know how I'll get through it when it comes time to play it."
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Theyjust dropped a new Europe tour ad on social featuring different songs they have played live… Are these hints of what they’re gonna play?
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The clip played:
The Root of All Evil
The Spirit Carries On
Take the Time
Rite of Passage
I hope they play them all except A Rite of Passage, that's not worthy being in such a special set for me :P
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What if they just compiled some footage they had from the three most recent tours they did with MP?
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The clip played:
The Root of All Evil
The Spirit Carries On
Take the Time
Rite of Passage
I hope they play them all except A Rite of Passage, that's not worthy being in such a special set for me :P
Well, if they are going to represent BC&SL, that would be the song to play.
ANTR & Count have been played in recent tours. TBOT, while possible, probably will not be played on this tour. TSF is possible, but I feel that if they are going to play this, they might as well do a 12SS medley. That leaves Wither or AROP. I'll take whatever they played, but if they are going to represent this album (Which is pretty much guaranteed, given it was the last one with MP), then AROP is probably the song most likely to make the setlist.
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I noticed that they seem to be promoting a lot of "nearly sold out" tickets for weeks now, so I decided to take a look. Seems like there are a LOT of seats left in the O2. They've nearly sold-out the floor, but the first level ring still has a lot of availability, and the upper ring has not even been opened. Out of curiosity, I checked a few other venues, and found mostly the same issue - floors are gone, upper decks are closed or 50%ish (from a limited spot check).
Makes me wonder... maybe MP back isn't enough to have people running out to see the band a third year in a row. For me, I'm sure I'll go, but also I kinda just can't help but think... "how about some music, fellas?" I feel I am really lacking that to take my excitement to the next level.
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Dream Theater NEVER WAS and NEVER WILL BE an ARENA band! I have had management issues with the band since the 90's so THIS^ is NOT surprising!
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I noticed that they seem to be promoting a lot of "nearly sold out" tickets for weeks now, so I decided to take a look. Seems like there are a LOT of seats left in the O2. They've nearly sold-out the floor, but the first level ring still has a lot of availability, and the upper ring has not even been opened. Out of curiosity, I checked a few other venues, and found mostly the same issue - floors are gone, upper decks are closed or 50%ish (from a limited spot check).
Makes me wonder... maybe MP back isn't enough to have people running out to see the band a third year in a row. For me, I'm sure I'll go, but also I kinda just can't help but think... "how about some music, fellas?" I feel I am really lacking that to take my excitement to the next level.
We're 5 months ahead of the tour, and people are still saving for summer. Despite that, the pace at which tickets are selling — I'm a bit of a nerd in this regard as well — is faster than usual - not crazily faster, but still. Not even the SC tour, which I think was their peak here in Europe in terms of attendance, sold out this early.
The O2 is a huge gamble, no doubt, but I'm pretty sure the tour will sell well in the end.
Dream Theater NEVER WAS and NEVER WILL BE an ARENA band! I have had management issues with the band since the 90's so THIS^ is NOT surprising!
In some markets, they have been for years now.
We're talking about 8/10 k arenas, not 15k, sure, but what's the point?
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Theyjust dropped a new Europe tour ad on social featuring different songs they have played live… Are these hints of what they’re gonna play?
No, they are just snippets designed to make a lot of fans ask "Are these hints of what they’re gonna play?" on the internet.
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Dream Theater NEVER WAS and NEVER WILL BE an ARENA band! I have had management issues with the band since the 90's so THIS^ is NOT surprising!
I agree. The only thing worse than seeing them in an arena is seeing them in an all-seated arena. I guess maybe US fans are more used to this, but over here in Europe it's the best way to suck all the atmosphere out of the place.
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The only thing worse than seeing them in an arena is seeing them in an all-seated arena.
The only thing worse than seeing them in an arena is seeing them in a half-empty all-seated arena.
I guess maybe US fans are more used to this, but over here in Europe it's the best way to suck all the atmosphere out of the place.
Totally.
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Arena or not, it's going to be an epic fucking moment :metal
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTRPqgnpe2TJZV6lyPy5jqJLb76TvhSq4I-c14u1EEzCg&s)
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yeah i'm going to see Symphony X play the same venue DT is playing a few months later for 36,-. No way i'm paying 90,- to hear JLB struggle.
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The only thing worse than seeing them in an arena is seeing them in a half-empty all-seated arena.
Totally.
Agree.
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I have no doubt it will sell well, but jesus do I hate the all-seated thing. It will be particularly jarring because it's the same arena and I saw them in the spring of '22 in the golden circle part of the standing section and I remember the feeling of the night quite well still. I probably won't be sitting much farther back here than I was back then but it will probably feel much less exciting. Still, Americans on the server will see them quite a bit later so it could have been worse, and I have a feeling they'll pull out all the stops for the setlist.
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I've seen Dream Theater eight times and it was never an all-seated venue. That must be a strange experience.
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With the exception of the last tour with DTB, DT usually play an all-seated venue in Colorado (The Paramount in Denver). Have seen them there three times now, I think
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For me the best venues for them is a large music club. Acoustics usually support a huge low end which lend itself extremely well to their sound and it makes them look larger than life. Terminal 5 in nyc is a great example.
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yeah i'm going to see Symphony X play the same venue DT is playing a few months later for 36,-. No way i'm paying 90,- to hear JLB struggle.
In Holland you mean? Considering your name I'm thinking you're Dutch. But that's probably not the case. Or you will be seeing these shows outside of The Netherlands. In Holland DT plays at AFAS Live. Symphony X plays a few weeks earlier at smaller venues: Boerderij in Zoetermeer and Next Stage of the 013 in Tilburg (700 maximum capacity). So I'm a bit confused.
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For me the best venues for them is a large music club. Acoustics usually support a huge low end which lend itself extremely well to their sound and it makes them look larger than life. Terminal 5 in nyc is a great example.
While I'm not a fan of Terminal 5, I wouldn't mind if they play there.
Last time I saw DT at a general admission show was in 2014 at the Hammerstein Ballroom on 34th.
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While I'm not a fan of Terminal 5, I wouldn't mind if they play there.
Last time I saw DT at a general admission show was in 2014 at the Hammerstein Ballroom on 34th.
I was at that show! Was amazing. Something about them being elevated works well. Back half of Awake was like a bucket list moment.
Saw both Radio City shows as well. The sound was not great. Rc and the beacon do not allow for low end so it really thins out their sound. Selling out RC at this point is just kind of an ego thing. Hopefully they wont go that direction. Hopefully they’ll scout out the best venues for sound and technical compatibility. Brooklyn steel would be amazing.
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While I'm not a fan of Terminal 5, I wouldn't mind if they play there.
Last time I saw DT at a general admission show was in 2014 at the Hammerstein Ballroom on 34th.
DT played Terminal 5 back to back nights for my 2nd and 3rd time seeing them in 2008. I was also at that Hammerstein Ballroom show.
I quite enjoyed those three, and if I recall, I think those three were the only times I saw DT with general admission.
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I would guess they'd play the Oakdale again in Wallingford; can't beat that place, even if it is a seated theater. I'd rather go there than the Meadows amphitheater (even if it is half the distance for me).
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In Holland you mean? Considering your name I'm thinking you're Dutch. But that's probably not the case. Or you will be seeing these shows outside of The Netherlands. In Holland DT plays at AFAS Live. Symphony X plays a few weeks earlier at smaller venues: Boerderij in Zoetermeer and Next Stage of the 013 in Tilburg (700 maximum capacity). So I'm a bit confused.
i didn't notice it was in a smaller room than normal in 013. I saw DT there plenty times for 45,- though, point still stands, same with AFAS.
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i didn't notice it was in a smaller room than normal in 013. I saw DT there plenty times for 45,- though, point still stands, same with AFAS.
I can understand your point. Prices have been going up for quite a few years now. Not only with DT, tickets in general and everything actually. I guess SymX is still affordable as it's more niche than DT. No news on a new album right? Those guys should really up their communication/marketing. And they should pay respect to more songs in their catalog. It's always the same setlist over again with just a few tweaks here and there. That's what keeps me from going to their show this time. Might change if there's a great new album coming.
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i didn't notice it was in a smaller room than normal in 013. I saw DT there plenty times for 45,- though, point still stands, same with AFAS.
Actually saw Gwar in that smaller hall at 013. I didn't realize the show was in the smaller hall until getting there.
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sounds even more interesting to go see actually. Boerderij is also cozy, but with a horrible trainconnection..
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The clip played:
The Root of All Evil
The Spirit Carries On
Take the Time
Rite of Passage
I hope they play them all except A Rite of Passage, that's not worthy being in such a special set for me :P
Root would be cool, but I don't need/want any of the others.
TSCO has been done to death and isn't all that great outside of the album context. TTT would have to be heavily edited vocally. AROP...bleh. If they're going to do something from BC&SL, Wither is the best choice (IMO, of course).
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With the exception of the last tour with DTB, DT usually play an all-seated venue in Colorado (The Paramount in Denver). Have seen them there three times now, I think
I've seen most of their Denver shows over the last ~25 years, and the only time I remember folks sitting in the Paramount was for The Astonishing...
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The clip played:
The Root of All Evil
The Spirit Carries On
Take the Time
Rite of Passage
I hope they play them all except A Rite of Passage, that's not worthy being in such a special set for me :P
I'd say that ARoP would be the song I'd want to see the most out of that list, even if I rate it my least favorite, just because it hasn't gotten the live play like the rest.
Also, seeing TTT makes me wonder about JLB. Those I&W songs are going to be tough and kind of would figure they wouldn't hit that album too hard.
Granted, not sure those songs being in the ad means anything at all. I'm not taking it more than a discussion point.
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Also, seeing TTT makes me wonder about JLB. Those I&W songs are going to be tough and kind of would figure they wouldn't hit that album too hard.
Granted, not sure those songs being in the ad means anything at all. I'm not taking it more than a discussion point.
I'll say 🙄 I thought the same hearing TTT, and seeing ancient footage of a Score-era James singing these songs. What are they thinking?! Hopefully they learned the first time they made him sing those (I&W) songs and won't just go the nostalgia route now.
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I've seen most of their Denver shows over the last ~25 years, and the only time I remember folks sitting in the Paramount was for The Astonishing...
Sure, people stand. But the question was around "all seated venues", which the Paramount is one lol
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I’m pretty sure they will tune down for a lot of that stuff so Labrie has an easier time. So many bands do this for the same reason. I remember when they played change of seasons with Mangini it was tuned down quite a bit still sounded great.
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Yeah but tuning down didn't help him with a song like Take the Time.
I think he could manage it in a lower key, but he’d still have to rewrite the vocal melodies as well. Something that needs to be worked out well before the tour starts rather then in the midst of the tour like he did with Pull Me Under last year.
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I’m pretty sure they will tune down for a lot of that stuff so Labrie has an easier time. So many bands do this for the same reason. I remember when they played change of seasons with Mangini it was tuned down quite a bit still sounded great.
They only tuned ACoS and the entire IaW album (except for WFS which they kept in its original key) down a half step, from E to Eb.
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They only tuned ACoS and the entire IaW album (except for WFS which they kept in its original key) down a half step, from E to Eb.
It’s funny I never noticed or don’t remember them changing the key for Images and Words but I definitely remember how much lower changes of season sounded in my mind. Either way goes to show I just remember it was a great show so tune down away lol.
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Down-tuning is something I always immediately notice. I remember all the down-tuned songs on the Rush tour I saw (I think it was the Moving Pictures Time Machine tour). It doesn't ruin it for me but it is instantly obvious why they're doing it.
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It’s funny I never noticed or don’t remember them changing the key for Images and Words but I definitely remember how much lower changes of season sounded in my mind. Either way goes to show I just remember it was a great show so tune down away lol.
Probably because ACOS is played with a 7 strings guitar, which already has a lower string than the 6
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I was with a musician at the I&W concert and he immediately noticed the downtuning, but for me it was just the same, A Change of Seasons included.
However, one thing I did notice for the first time, was the click track. Innocence, when it kicked in after the intro, felt so SLOW. Years and years of Mike Portnoy giving all his energy into pumping up the actual beginning of the song ingrained in me a tempo much faster than the studio track, and I definitively noticed it. It felt like it was dragging.
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Funny story about the downtuning. I knew they were tuning down after hearing fan recordings of the first show. I was going to the Asbury Park show with my drummer. I told him that they were tuning down and he said “oh I don’t notice things like that, I don’t know enough about music to notice that”. Two notes into Pull Me Under, he turns to me and says “…I notice it”.
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yeah just like some songs sounding too fast with MP or too slow with MM, some of the songs really sounded weird with the downtuning
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yeah just like some songs sounding too fast with MP or too slow with MM, some of the songs really sounded weird with the downtuning
The “slowness” of the songs didn’t have anything to do with Mangini though. He had nothing to do with those decisions.
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i'm not saying that, just referring to the different eras
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i'm not saying that, just referring to the different eras
Gotcha
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The “slowness” of the songs didn’t have anything to do with Mangini though. He had nothing to do with those decisions.
You never know; do you remember the show Time Warp? It was a Discovery Channel show or something that used high speed cameras to film things and then go into the science behind what was happening. They had Mike Mangini on for one episode once (this was before he was ever in Dream Theater) and they were filming his drumming and explaining how high performance drummers use physics to get the sounds they want, etc. etc. etc.
Anyway, what if Mike Mangini, when being recorded with the high-speed cameras, actually got "stuck" in time. Maybe "trapped" is a better word. Where he can only move as fast as you see in the high-speed camera slowdowns. If that happened to him when he was younger, maybe Dream Theater would be understanding and play slowed down for him. Or maybe I'm reading too many Philip K Dick novels.
By the way, here is the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-xxpkxRRYs
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If Mangini could travel through time, he would have decided to play as sloppy as hell in DT so he wouldn't be accused of being robotic . . .
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If Mangini could travel through time, he would have decided to play as sloppy as hell in DT so he wouldn't be accused of being robotic . . .
That misses the point; it's not about "sloppy" even a little bit (at least for me). Let's not distort the narrative here to where Mike Portnoy is like Lars Ulrich or something. And it's not just one interpretation of "robotic". For me, someone that didn't like his work with DT as much as I do Portnoy's, it was about something more intangible. Granted, I'm not a drummer, but I still can't tap out the intro to "Bird On A Wire" (Neal Morse Band) but that is just PERFECT for that song and it's one of my NMB favorites. There are plenty of Portnoy parts in DT that are structured, measured, not sloppy... and perfect for the song. I can count too many times where I'm listening to DT and think "why are those 87 drum hits there?!?"
I've said this before and I"ll say it again, Portnoy has a knack for playing in 47/13 time and making it sound like 4/4, and Mangini has a knack for playing in 4/4 and making it sound like 47/13. It's all a matter of taste, for sure, but I prefer the former.
None of this is to say that Mangini sucks, or Portnoy is the "better" drummer, or takes anything away from Mangini as a man or a band mate. From everything I've ever heard, he's an amazing guy. You can be all those things and still not be right for the situation you're in. I'm an amazing guy, too, but I'm not a good fit for Primus in any capacity.
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That misses the point; it's not about "sloppy" even a little bit (at least for me). Let's not distort the narrative here to where Mike Portnoy is like Lars Ulrich or something. And it's not just one interpretation of "robotic". For me, someone that didn't like his work with DT as much as I do Portnoy's, it was about something more intangible. Granted, I'm not a drummer, but I still can't tap out the intro to "Bird On A Wire" (Neal Morse Band) but that is just PERFECT for that song and it's one of my NMB favorites. There are plenty of Portnoy parts in DT that are structured, measured, not sloppy... and perfect for the song. I can count too many times where I'm listening to DT and think "why are those 87 drum hits there?!?"
I've said this before and I"ll say it again, Portnoy has a knack for playing in 47/13 time and making it sound like 4/4, and Mangini has a knack for playing in 4/4 and making it sound like 47/13. It's all a matter of taste, for sure, but I prefer the former.
None of this is to say that Mangini sucks, or Portnoy is the "better" drummer, or takes anything away from Mangini as a man or a band mate. From everything I've ever heard, he's an amazing guy. You can be all those things and still not be right for the situation you're in. I'm an amazing guy, too, but I'm not a good fit for Primus in any capacity.
While I agree w your point, I *think* he was joking. I can never tell with THS808, though
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I've said this before and I"ll say it again, Portnoy has a knack for playing in 47/13 time and making it sound like 4/4, and Mangini has a knack for playing in 4/4 and making it sound like 47/13. It's all a matter of taste, for sure, but I prefer the former.
I think this really minimizes what both drummers are capable of doing.
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I think this really minimizes what both drummers are capable of doing.
Shouldn't; I'm certainly not minimizing their talents. I think both are extremely talented drummers at the top of their game. They're just different games.
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I’m sure lots of you have used ChatGPT to try to make a setlist. I was playing with it and here’s one it came up with…
Make one using their most popular songs with a total run time of 2.5 hours
Sure! Here's a setlist featuring Dream Theater's most popular songs, tailored to fit within a 2.5-hour timeframe:
**Set 1:**
1. Pull Me Under
2. Metropolis Pt. 1: The Miracle and the Sleeper
3. The Spirit Carries On
4. As I Am
5. Forsaken
6. Panic Attack
7. On the Backs of Angels
**Intermission**
**Set 2:**
1. The Enemy Inside
2. Through Her Eyes
3. In the Presence of Enemies Pt. 1: Prelude / Pt. 2: Resurrection
4. The Dance of Eternity
5. Octavarium
**Encore:**
1. Home
2. The Count of Tuscany
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Other than Octavarium, that setlist is not very interesting to me. Home and The Enemy Inside would be my next most interested songs, the rest... I don't know, I know they are the popular ones, but they've also been the ones played live the most. I certainly expect a lot of those songs to be played, but a set almost exclusively of the most popular songs is not really fun for me.
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Yeah, I asked most popular mostly out of curiosity of what it would do. But also, given that it’s an Anniversary (and a sort of reunion, which is how they’re promoting it) tour that seemed like a reasonable basis.
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i only just noticed there's almost no rest for JLB on the upcoming tour...
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Other than Octavarium, that setlist is not very interesting to me. Home and The Enemy Inside would be my next most interested songs, the rest... I don't know, I know they are the popular ones, but they've also been the ones played live the most. I certainly expect a lot of those songs to be played, but a set almost exclusively of the most popular songs is not really fun for me.
Agreed. While its a very balanced setlist, absolutely no fireworks or spark to make it especially special.
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i only just noticed there's almost no rest for JLB on the upcoming tour...
I'm no expert on this, but EU has 24 shows with 12 days of rest in total in between. That's quite a lot of days off I'd say.
Sure, sometimes three shows in a row (quite intense), but also sometimes two days of rest in between shows. I think they deliberately give James a bit of a break with this schedule.
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I'm no expert on this, but EU has 24 shows with 12 days of rest in total in between. That's quite a lot of days off I'd say.
Sure, sometimes three shows in a row (quite intense), but also sometimes two days of rest in between shows. I think they deliberately give James a bit of a break with this schedule.
In the past, they would do about 24 shows in 30 days (5-6/week). So they are definitely trying to space shows with more vocal rest in mind. I am not sure it will do the trick though - it is still a too busy schedule for high-level singing). It seems they can't (or don't want to) adopt a more relaxed schedule (like some bigger bands do, say, Iron Maiden, with a day off between any two shows).
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In the past, they would do about 24 shows in 30 days (5-6/week). So they are definitely trying to space shows with more vocal rest in mind. I am not sure it will do the trick though - it is still a too busy schedule for high-level singing). It seems they can't (or don't want to) adopt a more relaxed schedule (like some bigger bands do, say, Iron Maiden, with a day off between any two shows).
There are so many influences on a performance, especially for a vocalist. We'll just have to wait and experience it. Night to night will be different I guess. I hope James saves some energy for the last show, in Amsterdam. Can go two ways. A last show can mean he will give a little bit extra because there's much rest ahead. He could also be worn out by the travelling and singing. The setlist(s) will also play a big part in this. Let's see what they'll bring. I'm excited.
And I probably won't be sitting out on tours from now on, because if we are lucky there's only a handful of tours we can witness. They can't perform forever, certainly not this type of music. I want to celebrate what they have done and what's still left in the can.
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In the past, they would do about 24 shows in 30 days (5-6/week). So they are definitely trying to space shows with more vocal rest in mind. I am not sure it will do the trick though - it is still a too busy schedule for high-level singing). It seems they can't (or don't want to) adopt a more relaxed schedule (like some bigger bands do, say, Iron Maiden, with a day off between any two shows).
A day off on tour costs a lot of money. IM can take the cut I assume, maybe DT can't. More rest does seem ideal for JLB, but the touring finances may say otherwise sadly.
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Which costs? off the top of my head I can guess hotels, renting of the tour bus and depending on the contracts, what happens to a crew member in a day they don't work, but shouldn't all these things be somehow accounted? I mean, no band is gonna play 25 shows in 25 days, there have to be some days off, especially when two cities are too distant and you wouldn't be there in time considering how late concerts end, and how relatively early you have to show up to set up your gear.
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Which costs? off the top of my head I can guess hotels, renting of the tour bus and depending on the contracts, what happens to a crew member in a day they don't work, but shouldn't all these things be somehow accounted? I mean, no band is gonna play 25 shows in 25 days, there have to be some days off, especially when two cities are too distant and you wouldn't be there in time considering how late concerts end, and how relatively early you have to show up to set up your gear.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5M_SqJfvfRY (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5M_SqJfvfRY)
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That was both interesting and depressing. How do smaller bands can even tour nowadays?
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That was both interesting and depressing. How do smaller bands can even tour nowadays?
Spend less money on touring. Small bands sometimes dont even use tour busses, just vans and do it themselves basically. I honestly don't really know, I feel like most small bands sacrifice a lot to go on tour. Live in the back seat of a van with little food and dirty clothes. Although I read from Alestorm's reddit (where the band members are active) that they said if you can tour for 500 people a night, you're good. So it makes me think the bands touring less than that are likely struggling to make those tours work.
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I don’t remember who it was, but I remember a smaller band was manning their own merchandise booth, and one of them made the comment that they had worked all their life to be a musician and it turned out they were just traveling T-shirt salesman.
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Musicians should have taken a collective stand decades ago to prevent this scenario, but it’s far too late now.
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What "stand" should they have taken?
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5M_SqJfvfRY (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5M_SqJfvfRY)
Tank The Tech!
Yeah, he has some great info on his channel.
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What "stand" should they have taken?
Back in the beginning of the file-sharing era, CDs cost a lot, a full downloadable album came a bit later and didn't cost much less and there was basically no legal way to meaningfully sample music you'd be buying, so people started torrenting and stopped buying CDs. People are completely fine paying 11 dollars a month today for legally streaming, including people who used to pirate, and somewhere in the early 00's that willingness should have been funneled into downloadable albums that cost a couple of dollars and a way to sample an entire album before buying - say, you have the right to listen to it once, then you have to download if you want to listen to it again. Yes, there's people who put those 11 dollars to use to listen to way, way more than 5-10 new albums per month, but those people are rare, mostly congregate on music forums, and buy 30-40 dollar vinyl to supplement their collection anyway :lol
A band like Dream Theater has almost 1.5 mil monthly listeners, and I doubt they receive more money from Spotify now than they would receive if somewhere along the line the value of the mp3 hasn't been reduced to zero by labels and executives who did nothing while the internet was becoming a global marketplace of mp3s. Then Spotify came along and legalized this marketplace and the industry went along because at least they'd get some cents out of these files without value, when they should have stepped in a long time ago to prevent them from losing value in the first place.
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Uh, what? We were talking about the economics of days off on tour, not torrents and pirates?
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The reason why they have to squeeze maximum money out of the tour is because that's the only time a musician can actually make money. Bands used to go on tours to advertise their music, now they make new music because that's new material to tour.
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I’m sure lots of you have used ChatGPT to try to make a setlist. I was playing with it and here’s one it came up with…
Make one using their most popular songs with a total run time of 2.5 hours
Sure! Here's a setlist featuring Dream Theater's most popular songs, tailored to fit within a 2.5-hour timeframe:
**Set 1:**
1. Pull Me Under
2. Metropolis Pt. 1: The Miracle and the Sleeper
3. The Spirit Carries On
4. As I Am
5. Forsaken
6. Panic Attack
7. On the Backs of Angels
**Intermission**
**Set 2:**
1. The Enemy Inside
2. Through Her Eyes
3. In the Presence of Enemies Pt. 1: Prelude / Pt. 2: Resurrection
4. The Dance of Eternity
5. Octavarium
**Encore:**
1. Home
2. The Count of Tuscany
I tried it and got this:
Dream Theater 40th Anniversary Tour Setlist
Set 1:
The Glass Prison (13:52)
Panic Attack (7:16)
Pull Me Under (8:11)
Forsaken (5:36)
The Dance of Eternity (6:13)
Another Day (4:23)
Lost Not Forgotten (8:10)
Set 2:
Metropolis Pt. 1: The Miracle and the Sleeper (9:32)
Bridges in the Sky (11:01)
The Spirit Carries On (6:39)
A Change of Seasons: I The Crimson Sunrise (3:56)
A Change of Seasons: II Innocence (3:05)
A Change of Seasons: III Carpe Diem (3:14)
A Change of Seasons: IV The Darkest of Winters (2:11)
A Change of Seasons: V Another World (1:32)
A Change of Seasons: VI The Inevitable Summer (3:51)
A Change of Seasons: VII The Crimson Sunset (3:51)
On the Backs of Angels (8:42)
Encore:
As I Am (7:47)
The Count of Tuscany (19:16)
Final Encore:
Octavarium (24:00)
Not a bad set! But I would swap out Pull Me Under, Another Day and As I Am, and add in Hell's Kitchen/Lines In The Sand somewhere.
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The average age of a forumer here must be younger than I thought. I have NO idea what “ChatGPT” means.
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The average age of a forumer here must be younger than I thought. I have NO idea what “ChatGPT” means.
I'm pretty much the same age as you and I know what it is. With all the AI talk, it's hard *not* to know what ChatGPT is given that it's what has really kicked off all the AI talk of the last year or so, even though there have been various forms of AI long before it. I first learned about it about 18 months ago when a friend of mine experimented with it by posting the results of it writing the 5 minute talk he had been assigned to give. ;)
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The average age of a forumer here must be younger than I thought. I have NO idea what “ChatGPT” means.
It probably is, but still, I have no idea how you don't know what ChatGPT is.
Even if this were the only site you visited on the internet, because it has certainly been discussed here some.
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The average age of a forumer here must be younger than I thought. I have NO idea what “ChatGPT” means.
(https://i.imgur.com/OzLomoI.png)
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(https://i.ibb.co/MS2dB4v/Screenshot-2024-05-17-172219.png) (https://ibb.co/sRm7WGf)
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but does TAC know what ChatGPT is??
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I did consider asking ChatGPT whether TAC would fail automatically on point two!
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but does TAC know what ChatGPT is??
Doubtful
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The average age of a forumer here must be younger than I thought. I have NO idea what “ChatGPT” means.
I don't know what it MEANS either.
But I know what it is.
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I've heard of it for sure. It's an AI thing, but I don't know what it means, how to access it, or how to use it.
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I've heard of it for sure. It's an AI thing, but I don't know what it means, how to access it, or how to use it.
https://chatgpt.com/
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:tdwn :tdwn :tdwn
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Back in the beginning of the file-sharing era, CDs cost a lot, a full downloadable album came a bit later and didn't cost much less and there was basically no legal way to meaningfully sample music you'd be buying, so people started torrenting and stopped buying CDs. People are completely fine paying 11 dollars a month today for legally streaming, including people who used to pirate, and somewhere in the early 00's that willingness should have been funneled into downloadable albums that cost a couple of dollars and a way to sample an entire album before buying - say, you have the right to listen to it once, then you have to download if you want to listen to it again. Yes, there's people who put those 11 dollars to use to listen to way, way more than 5-10 new albums per month, but those people are rare, mostly congregate on music forums, and buy 30-40 dollar vinyl to supplement their collection anyway :lol
A band like Dream Theater has almost 1.5 mil monthly listeners, and I doubt they receive more money from Spotify now than they would receive if somewhere along the line the value of the mp3 hasn't been reduced to zero by labels and executives who did nothing while the internet was becoming a global marketplace of mp3s. Then Spotify came along and legalized this marketplace and the industry went along because at least they'd get some cents out of these files without value, when they should have stepped in a long time ago to prevent them from losing value in the first place.
I'm going to gently push back here. Not on you, but on the idea itself; I think this "blaming streaming" is a cop out. I know it's popular for artists to point to that, but I think that sort of divests culpability from them.
One, radio. I used to make entire tapes from songs just off the radio. Cost me the price of a tape and the radio; didn't pay a dime for the songs. The WRITERS get paid royalties for radio play, but performers generally do not (those are called "performance royalties").
Two, the artists themselves. I maintain that file sharing was as much the market correcting itself as anything else. CDs and LPs started to get ridiculous. $18.99 for a CD that cost a buck and a half to produce. Pigs get fat, hogs get slaughtered. There are some records I have that I have bought five or six different versions in different formats over the years (some more). I grew up making cassettes from my LPs, in order to take my music to the car. We were advised repeatedly that this was "okay" since it was fair use of the license I bought with the LP.
I don't know; I'm sure it's had SOME effect, but and there will always be assholes that abuse the systems in place, but those assholes were there to begin with. I think we're overestimating those that don't pay as having paid in the past; I don't believe that to be the case.
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I like that musicians have to work harder to make a living. They can't just sit back and watch the recording royalties flood in; they have to get off their asses and perform to people.
This is the way it was for hundreds of years, and this is the way it should be. The 20th century was an abberation.
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CDs and LPs started to get ridiculous. $18.99 for a CD that cost a buck and a half to produce. Pigs get fat, hogs get slaughtered..
Well yeah, which is why they had to step in and make digital albums that cost less or their own fairer model of streaming before absolutely everyone got on the "mp3s are to be downloaded off the internet for free" train. These by and large are the same people who now pay the 11 dollars a month to Spotify, so clearly there's still money to be made in digital distribution of music and those mp3s weren't valueless after all. But they wanted to hang on to the 18 dollar CD and thought they'd get the people back into 18 dollar CDs by lawsuits and wagging fingers. Now we have travelling T-shirt salesmen and you can't really get a tour with decent breaks included even if you're a 60-year-old vocalist who's done this for 30 years in a rock band.
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There's something in my head, and I am not sure how to articulate it, on the nature of people being able to "make a living" doing... anything. "Should" the band in jammindude's example necessarily be able to make a living making music? If they cannot, do we need to assign blame somewhere?
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Well yeah, which is why they had to step in and make digital albums that cost less or their own fairer model of streaming before absolutely everyone got on the "mp3s are to be downloaded off the internet for free" train. These by and large are the same people who now pay the 11 dollars a month to Spotify, so clearly there's still money to be made in digital distribution of music and those mp3s weren't valueless after all. But they wanted to hang on to the 18 dollar CD and thought they'd get the people back into 18 dollar CDs by lawsuits and wagging fingers. Now we have travelling T-shirt salesmen and you can't really get a tour with decent breaks included even if you're a 60-year-old vocalist who's done this for 30 years in a rock band.
I don’t think those people are paying for Spotify now. They just use the free subscription probably, which is why Spotify itself is not profitable.
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I don’t think those people are paying for Spotify now. They just use the free subscription probably, which is why Spotify itself is not profitable.
Out of more than 600millions monthly users, 230millions are Premiums.
Spotify makes 13.2 billions out of the 28 of the global music sales.
It's not profitable because record companies are still those who make the most out of all of this.
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A day off on tour costs a lot of money. IM can take the cut I assume, maybe DT can't. More rest does seem ideal for JLB, but the touring finances may say otherwise sadly.
This is something we will hardly ever know, but I'd be really curious to know. Would a less rigid schedule with a better performing James (and, as a result, higher attendance, but this is a big maybe) result in less profit, would it be comparable, or worse? There are too many unknowns, I guess, even for the people making these decision.
On a related note, in all those discussions about how different singers preserving or losing their voices, it would be really informative to compare their touring schedules. From my perspective, based on my - admittedly very limited - personal experience, full gas singing 5-6 days a week is just too much, something you can partially recover from when younger, but not really when age hits you. IMO, spacing of the shows is an elephant in the room as it is rarely brought up when talking about singers' performance decline, but I suspect it is one of the major factors. But more data would be needed to confirm (or refute) this claim.
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This is something we will hardly ever know, but I'd be really curious to know. Would a less rigid schedule with a better performing James (and, as a result, higher attendance, but this is a big maybe) result in less profit, would it be comparable, or worse? There are too many unknowns, I guess, even for the people making these decision.
On a related note, in all those discussions about how different singers preserving or losing their voices, it would be really informative to compare their touring schedules. From my perspective, based on my - admittedly very limited - personal experience, full gas singing 5-6 days a week is just too much, something you can partially recover from when younger, but not really when age hits you. IMO, spacing of the shows is an elephant in the room as it is rarely brought up when talking about singers' performance decline, but I suspect it is one of the major factors. But more data would be needed to confirm (or refute) this claim.
Honest question, what part don't you know? I think the only part we can't really know for sure is how the extra days impact James, and that's only because it's specific to him. How the extra days impact profitability is just simple math. If you've read any of the liner notes from the Fish remasters from a couple years ago, he goes into great detail on how cancelled shows (for various reasons) impact the profitability of a tour. Add to that the location of the shows - can't just tack on a show in Munich to that tour of England and hope the profit doesn't change - and the logistics there, and you have material impacts. All calculable.
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Out of more than 600millions monthly users, 230millions are Premiums.
Spotify makes 13.2 billions out of the 28 of the global music sales.
It's not profitable because record companies are still those who make the most out of all of this.
Good point. I remember a little while back Snoop Dogg was talking about how much he got for 1 billion streams of a song, it was some crazy low amount. What he failed to disclose is that the song had 18 different writers and sample credits and that the gross amount the song made was much higher.
I'm not defending Spotify at all but whether it's a record deal or streaming there are many avenues taken to grab more pieces of the artist pie, and of course some is to blame on the artists signing a bad deal.
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On a related note, in all those discussions about how different singers preserving or losing their voices, it would be really informative to compare their touring schedules. From my perspective, based on my - admittedly very limited - personal experience, full gas singing 5-6 days a week is just too much, something you can partially recover from when younger, but not really when age hits you. IMO, spacing of the shows is an elephant in the room as it is rarely brought up when talking about singers' performance decline, but I suspect it is one of the major factors. But more data would be needed to confirm (or refute) this claim.
You can certainly look at Rush as a reference. I don't remember exactly what tour it was, but there was a point where they stopped doing shows on consecutive days just to make sure Geddy had time to rest his voice. And even then, while on tour, I recall him saying that at least on show days he kept his speaking to a bare minimum, once again to preserve his voice. Now obviously DT doesn't have the draw that Rush does - at least in North America - so that's a factor, as is the increase in expenses post-pandemic, which Rush never had to deal with. So I'm sure that if it were up to them, they'd space the shows out more for James' sake, but it's quite possible that's just not financially feasible.
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I spun D/T and ADToE this weekend, paying really close attention to the drums. It's going to be interesting to hear MP's rendition of some of these songs. Gotta believe The Alien will be in the setlist. This is a tough song to play. MP will certainly handle it just fine but it may have his spin on it in some places.
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I spun D/T and ADToE this weekend, paying really close attention to the drums. It's going to be interesting to hear MP's rendition of some of these songs. Gotta believe The Alien will be in the setlist. This is a tough song to play. MP will certainly handle it just fine but it may have his spin on it in some places.
Oddly, I think MP (playing MM songs, specifically) will have the benefits/issues as LaBrie live. In the moment, at the concert, 95% of the people won't notice any differences as long as the parts are mostly similar, but when people see either a DVD or live videos, they will notice the differences a lot more and those that demand identical performances will not be thrilled.
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Oddly, I think MP (playing MM songs, specifically) will have the benefits/issues as LaBrie live. In the moment, at the concert, 95% of the people won't notice any differences as long as the parts are mostly similar, but when people see either a DVD or live videos, they will notice the differences a lot more and those that demand identical performances will not be thrilled.
You're probably right on all accounts. The one thing to keep in mind (especially for those critical of MP not playing MM's parts exactly) is that MP never played his own parts exactly either. Neil Peart he is not. So to expect him to do so now is ridiculous. Just look at how he handled Donati's parts in Apocalypse 1470 B.C. for the PSMS shows to get an idea of how he'll likely handle MM's parts.
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You're probably right on all accounts. The one thing to keep in mind (especially for those critical of MP not playing MM's parts exactly) is that MP never played his own parts exactly either. Neil Peart he is not. So to expect him to do so now is ridiculous. Just look at how he handled Donati's parts in Apocalypse 1470 B.C. for the PSMS shows to get an idea of how he'll likely handle MM's parts.
You're exactly right on every point.
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It'll be interesting to see how that plays out among the fans, and I would guess that MP is thinking about it when preparing the setlist. It's weird to think about, but I guess MP's time in Dream Theater predates the amount of stuff that gets posted and widely shared on social media/youtube/etc. There's going to be a level of scrutiny that wasn't as prominent 14 years ago.
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It'll be interesting to see how that plays out among the fans, and I would guess that MP is thinking about it when preparing the setlist. It's weird to think about, but I guess MP's time in Dream Theater predates the amount of stuff that gets posted and widely shared on social media/youtube/etc. There's going to be a level of scrutiny that wasn't as prominent 14 years ago.
This is a really interesting though.
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Out of more than 600millions monthly users, 230millions are Premiums.
Spotify makes 13.2 billions out of the 28 of the global music sales.
It's not profitable because record companies are still those who make the most out of all of this.
Still, that's almost a 2:1 ratio of non-payers to payers (though I guess there is ad revenue too). Just saying, I don't think people who were download only and didn't pay for music before the onset of streaming suddenly started paying for Spotify. And I don't know how you get people to pay for music when it is so easily accessible for free.
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I'd be interested in the usage or number of streams between the payers and the non payers.
Are there stats for that?
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I still can’t imagine MP playing MM songs. And then also with as much enthusiasm as he plays his own. I’m also quite curious to know which MM era tracks he likes and dislikes. I can’t imagine MP digging The Astonishing all that much, lol.
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I have no doubt that MP will be quite convincing in performing the Mangini Era material.
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Still, that's almost a 2:1 ratio of non-payers to payers (though I guess there is ad revenue too). Just saying, I don't think people who were download only and didn't pay for music before the onset of streaming suddenly started paying for Spotify. And I don't know how you get people to pay for music when it is so easily accessible for free.
1. People are lazy - i'm one of them
2. Spotify is insanely conveniant
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Did anyone receive their Platinum VIP tickets already?
I bought them for the Amsterdam show but am not sure if it worked.
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I still can’t imagine MP playing MM songs. And then also with as much enthusiasm as he plays his own. I’m also quite curious to know which MM era tracks he likes and dislikes. I can’t imagine MP digging The Astonishing all that much, lol.
That thought was posted in another thread, and I'll answer it the same way here: MP would appreciate many aspects of The Astonishing.
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That thought was posted in another thread, and I'll answer it the same way here: MP would appreciate many aspects of The Astonishing.
The fact that you don't like The Astonishing does not equate to MP disliking it as well.
Just like the fact that I adore it and hold it as their greatest acievement does not equate to MP adoring it too.
He can hate it, love it or be totally neitral to it and unless he says what he thinks we will never know.
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IIRC, during the time Mike was putting together what became TSF band and tour somebody asked him on Facebook comments if Derek was going to join him for that (since they were already working together for SOA), and he replied something like "Derek is as interested in playing anything from the Jordan era DT as I am in playing anything from The Astonishing :)".
Sure, those were different (bitter) times for him and now he's back in the band, but I don't think he enjoyed it too much back then at least.
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I think he was being mean to The Astonishing out of bitterness related to DT. He also got weird when Neal Morse wanted to do a double concept album shortly after The Astonishing. It’s a different ball game now that Portnoy is in the band and he is undoubtedly going to be more open minded to those albums than he was before.
With that being said, given how contentious the album was and how a lot of the songs don’t really work out of context, I also don’t think it would be that surprising if they never play Astonishing material again. But that would’ve been true even with MM still in the band. They have a big discography now and not everything is going to make it in.
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But that would’ve been true even with MM still in the band.
That's probably true.
And if they're just playing the hokey Our New World...nah, just leave it out.
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Yea, I imagine it would be limited to the singles primarily. Our New World, The Gift Of Music, Moment of Betrayal, maybe they would go for something like A New Beginning. I didn't mind The Astonishing and enjoyed the tour enough, but I'm not going to be sad if they never play anything off it again.
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Yea, I imagine it would be limited to the singles primarily. Our New World, The Gift Of Music, Moment of Betrayal, maybe they would go for something like A New Beginning. I didn't mind The Astonishing and enjoyed the tour enough, but I'm not going to be sad if they never play anything off it again.
The bolded are three songs I like!
I honestly don't care what albums they hit or not. I do know that I don't want the Mangini Era marginalized though. There was a ton of great music released within.
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They will probably use my namesake for PA music, maybe while they walk out?
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They will probably use my namesake for PA music, maybe while they walk out?
Why would they do that
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The bolded are three songs I like!
Yeah, I'd love to see those three songs. I'd really love them to do like a 3 song part of the album, but I understand that's a me thing. It seems the fans, in general, and the band have no desire to play those songs. Sucks for someone like myself who did enjoy the album and thinks some of those songs are very much worthy of being in the live rotation.
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Why would they do that
Because I want them to really bad.
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Because I want them to really bad.
Well, that is a fact about you, but it is not a reason why they would do that.
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Well, that is a fact about you, but it is not a reason why they would do that.
Mike Portnoy is a NOMAC and has infiltrated the band :) so it only makes sense for my namesake to become his walk-out music
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They will probably use my namesake for PA music, maybe while they walk out?
What loses out of everyone's criticisms is how JR was the one making those tracks. And they are some good "noise" tracks.
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They may or may not break out any The Astonishing songs at their 40th anniversary tour, but I have no doubt it will pop up in future set lists. I would love to get a shortened Astonishing Suite one day in a live set.
Less likely, but I would really love to see them re-do a different version of the album one day with more of a metal edge.
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They may or may not break out any The Astonishing songs at their 40th anniversary tour, but I have no doubt it will pop up in future set lists. I would love to get a shortened Astonishing Suite one day in a live set.
Less likely, but I would really love to see them re-do a different version of the album one day with more of a metal edge.
I could see them doing A Gift of Music, A Moment of Betrayal, and A Life Left Behind.
If you do a "reversion" of the album. That would mean an entirely different story to consider.
Since I love The Astonishing, do the fans even grasp the concept, what it's about?
For me, it's a Love story of music. And that is presented with the characters of Faythe and Gabriel. The disassociation of that music is presented by Nefaryus and the NOMACS.
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I think he was being mean to The Astonishing out of bitterness related to DT. He also got weird when Neal Morse wanted to do a double concept album shortly after The Astonishing. It’s a different ball game now that Portnoy is in the band and he is undoubtedly going to be more open minded to those albums than he was before.
With that being said, given how contentious the album was and how a lot of the songs don’t really work out of context, I also don’t think it would be that surprising if they never play Astonishing material again. But that would’ve been true even with MM still in the band. They have a big discography now and not everything is going to make it in.
I hope some of them make it to the setlists at some point, but it seems like most of that stuff won't ever get played again. Just give me a good LNFA live version of it and I'll be happy.
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I hope some of them make it to the setlists at some point, but it seems like most of that stuff won't ever get played again. Just give me a good LNFA live version of it and I'll be happy.
That's like saying it's a stain their career
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I think he was being mean to The Astonishing out of bitterness related to DT. He also got weird when Neal Morse wanted to do a double concept album shortly after The Astonishing. It’s a different ball game now that Portnoy is in the band and he is undoubtedly going to be more open minded to those albums than he was before.
With that being said, given how contentious the album was and how a lot of the songs don’t really work out of context, I also don’t think it would be that surprising if they never play Astonishing material again. But that would’ve been true even with MM still in the band. They have a big discography now and not everything is going to make it in.
It doesn't have to be bitterness. SF was a tour to celebrate music HE wrote and played on. For Derek to be part of that, Derek would be playing on songs that were released on the second, third, fourth, fifth and sixth record AFTER he left. The Astonishing was at that time, the most recent record from Dream Theater, and was the fourth since Mike left.
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That's like saying it's a stain their career
Not for me! I love that album (though it's a little bit too long and the lyrics too cheesy at times). I just don't think that, realistically, most of those songs are ever going to be played again. Even still with MM in the band they didn't play anything from it since 2017.
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I also love The Astonishing as it is, but I do think the music leaned a little too much in one direction and neglected the proginess and metal that has always been a huge part of their sound.
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Did anyone receive their Platinum VIP tickets already?
I bought them for the Amsterdam show but am not sure if it worked.
Bought them for Amsterdam as well and recieved a mail which said more information will come in time. Looks like we're gonna meet each other.
As for touring and resting LaBries voice... there's another way to limit the pressure on his vocals - next to do less touring - and that's to use setlists that does require less on his high's. Stay more in the vocal range he's comfortable with. I really hope they'll build evenings that do not have those Once In a LIVEtime-moments where you'll get unconfortable with, hearing LaBrie's struggle.
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Bought them for Amsterdam as well and recieved a mail which said more information will come in time. Looks like we're gonna meet each other.
As for touring and resting LaBries voice... there's another way to limit the pressure on his vocals - next to do less touring - and that's to use setlists that does require less on his high's. Stay more in the vocal range he's comfortable with. I really hope they'll build evenings that do not have those Once In a LIVEtime-moments where you'll get unconfortable with, hearing LaBrie's struggle.
Maybe he's been asked this and I missed it, but someone who interviews MP should bring it up. Since he's making the setlist, is he taking into account JLB's capabilities each night? Will the setlist reflect his abilities? Because I think it should if he's going to struggle. They really don't need to play the hardest songs for him to sing, but I fear MP might want to play those songs the most now that he's back in the band.
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Maybe he's been asked this and I missed it, but someone who interviews MP should bring it up. Since he's making the setlist, is he taking into account JLB's capabilities each night? Will the setlist reflect his abilities? Because I think it should if he's going to struggle. They really don't need to play the hardest songs for him to sing, but I fear MP might want to play those songs the most now that he's back in the band.
He has in the past. That's why they performed abridged versions of Voices and TtT, skipping over the brutal verses that JL struggled with 15-20 years ago. I'm sure MP will do the same now, and in fact even more so given that they're older and JL's abilities are more limited. Plus there will probably be some songs that they'll downtune, change the vocal melodies and/or change in other ways to make it easier on him, too.
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He has in the past. That's why they performed abridged versions of Voices and TtT, skipping over the brutal verses that JL struggled with 15-20 years ago. I'm sure MP will do the same now, and in fact even more so given that they're older and JL's abilities are more limited. Plus there will probably be some songs that they'll downtune, change the vocal melodies and/or change in other ways to make it easier on him, too.
Exactly. And even more, Portnoy strives and longs for perfection. So if 'taking care of his friend LaBrie' isn't enough to keep the setlist vocal-comfortable, then the desire of building a wonderful live experience, surely would do.
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Portnoy strives and longs for perfection.
I wouldn't say this is accurate. He wants to create a unique live experience for sure, but I don't think perfection is the word for it. He doesn't even learn his own drum parts to perfection and is much more of a "spur of the moment" kind guy. Not a dig at him at all, it's just not how I would describe him in that context.
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I wouldn't say this is accurate. He wants to create a unique live experience for sure, but I don't think perfection is the word for it. He doesn't even learn his own drum parts to perfection and is much more of a "spur of the moment" kind guy. Not a dig at him at all, it's just not how I would describe him in that context.
I like that thought... gonna digest it.
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He has in the past. That's why they performed abridged versions of Voices and TtT, skipping over the brutal verses that JL struggled with 15-20 years ago. I'm sure MP will do the same now, and in fact even more so given that they're older and JL's abilities are more limited. Plus there will probably be some songs that they'll downtune, change the vocal melodies and/or change in other ways to make it easier on him, too.
Well, this sounds hopeful and it's along the lines of what I hope we see.
My nightmare is that, with MP back and in control of the setlists, that James's current ability level won't be good enough for him to capture the nostalgia (or whatever his vision is), which will ruin their new "friendship", and lead to James being fired.
But I think you may have just debunked that fear.
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Honest question, what part don't you know? I think the only part we can't really know for sure is how the extra days impact James, and that's only because it's specific to him. How the extra days impact profitability is just simple math. If you've read any of the liner notes from the Fish remasters from a couple years ago, he goes into great detail on how cancelled shows (for various reasons) impact the profitability of a tour. Add to that the location of the shows - can't just tack on a show in Munich to that tour of England and hope the profit doesn't change - and the logistics there, and you have material impacts. All calculable.
Sure, Stadler, you are right, most of it is calculable. What I meant was that you or I can't make the calculations as the band is not likely to share the necessary data with us. But the band management certainly can calculate these. Except, as you correctly pointed, the impact the extra rest days would have on James. Plus, no one, including the band, can really know how much would James firing on all cylinders (or just on more cylinders than he did the last time) would impact the attendance. I know there are some fans who cite the displeasure with James performance as the reason for not attending shows, but what percentage of potential attendance they are? Is it 10%? 30 %? Or more like 1 %? I have no idea.
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Sure, Stadler, you are right, most of it is calculable. What I meant was that you or I can't make the calculations as the band is not likely to share the necessary data with us. But the band management certainly can calculate these. Except, as you correctly pointed, the impact the extra rest days would have on James. Plus, no one, including the band, can really know how much would James firing on all cylinders (or just on more cylinders than he did the last time) would impact the attendance. I know there are some fans who cite the displeasure with James performance as the reason for not attending shows, but what percentage of potential attendance they are? Is it 10%? 30 %? Or more like 1 %? I have no idea.
All fair points. I understand your point better now.
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Sure, Stadler, you are right, most of it is calculable. What I meant was that you or I can't make the calculations as the band is not likely to share the necessary data with us. But the band management certainly can calculate these. Except, as you correctly pointed, the impact the extra rest days would have on James. Plus, no one, including the band, can really know how much would James firing on all cylinders (or just on more cylinders than he did the last time) would impact the attendance. I know there are some fans who cite the displeasure with James performance as the reason for not attending shows, but what percentage of potential attendance they are? Is it 10%? 30 %? Or more like 1 %? I have no idea.
I can only speak for myself, but I feel a severe lack of excitement for this upcoming tour, and the uncertainty of how James will sound is pretty much the main reason. Considering how he sounded on the last tour, I have serious doubts that he can do that much of a 180 so quickly (the human voice is fragile after all), but I am definitely rooting for him. If word gets out after a few shows that James is sounding very good again, I will be as happy as anybody.
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My nightmare is that, with MP back and in control of the setlists, that James's current ability level won't be good enough for him to capture the nostalgia (or whatever his vision is), which will ruin their new "friendship", and lead to James being fired.
I mean, it is a possibility, even if there's a very small chance of that happening. I don't think the positions of power in the band are the same now as they were 20 years ago, and it's worth noting that, as far as we know, James didn't come close to actually being fired even with band co-leader Mike pushing for some sort of reckoning in that direction back then. But I'm curious to see how their relationship will be five - or even three - years into this, when the reunion glow fades and it's the daily in and out of Mike and James dealing with each other's quirks and preferences.
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Unpopular opinion.
I think this is the last tour with James. In honor of their 40th anniversary and the reunion with MP they will tour with this line-up for the last time. Then I think DT will carry on with another singer and maybe make instrumental songs. It's because James' voice is done for a live setting. Altering vocal melodies, instrumental break or downtuning can't make a big difference from this point. This senario for me is a nightmare. I love James, he is my fav. singer, musician. And please James. PROVE ME WRONG!
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I don't see that happening. Other than James leaving under his own accord I don't think they will kick him out no matter how bad he sounds. Tons of other bands have singers whose voices have aged terribly but they're still there. Not to mention I don't think they would gain any sort of boost in popularity unless they bring in a huge name and even that that boost would be brief at best.
My nightmare is that, with MP back and in control of the setlists, that James's current ability level won't be good enough for him to capture the nostalgia (or whatever his vision is), which will ruin their new "friendship", and lead to James being fired.
I mean, it is a possibility, even if there's a very small chance of that happening. I don't think the
positions of power in the band are the same now as they were 20 years ago, and it's worth noting that, as far as we know, James didn't come close to actually being fired even with band co-leader Mike pushing for some sort of reckoning in that direction back then. But I'm curious to see how their relationship will be five - or even three - years into this, when the reunion glow fades and it's the daily in and out of Mike and James dealing with each other's quirks and preferences.
I don't think this is going to happen either. MP maybe back in the band and he might be doing setlists again but the power dynamic seems to have shifted. This is JP's band now and I feel like he has the final say. Will MP and James get on each other's nerves? Maybe, possibly, but that could happen with anyone you're spending that amount of time with. Additionally MP personality has seemed to have gotten softer of the years.
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I can think of musicians who were let go from bands because they were no longer doing the job well (the bass players from Bon Jovi and Tom Petty & The Heartbreakers are the first two that come to mind), but I cannot think of any longtime singers who were let go from bands for the sole reason of, they couldn't sing well anymore.
I can't imagine the band brought back Portnoy to do one last final tour and then call it a day, and his return should ensure that this first tour with the band back together will do well, but it's hard to imagine multiple tours going forward without James' vocals rebounding in a big way.
I will reiterate as well that I am rooting for James to get it back, but time will tell.
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yeah they MUST figure out new vocalmelodies and where to downtune before going on tour. I was really surprised they didn't before the last tour.
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I don't get the sentiment that there's any possibility of JLB leaving/being replaced after this tour. It would be such a major lineup shift for a band that probably is nearing its twilight years. I've interpreted MP's return as at least partially with the intention of making sure the band retires with the "classic" lineup in tact. Taking JLB out of the band after a tour seems to defeat the purpose to me. I think it's more likely that they'll just call it a day if/when JLB's voice gives out. JLB aside, I also am not really expecting this to turn into an Iron Maiden situation where the lineup continues for another 20+ years. I'm getting more of a "ride into the sunset" kinda vibe from this.
I do agree that this is going to be seen as a make or break moment for JLB, with all the extra scrutiny on the shows and the controversies around his singing over the last few years. But it's important to keep some things in mind IMO:
1: JLB is getting over a year off from live shows. He can use that time to work with a coach, get any medical attention that he might need, or whatever else he needs to do to get in better shape than he was in 2023.
2: JLB has turned things around in the past, often when under pressure. I remember feeling like he was putting more effort in when Mangini came in compared to the previous few tours (between 2007 - 2010). Obviously making major changes is harder as you get older, but I'm not going to bet against him here. He knows as well as anyone else that he needs to deliver on this tour.
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I agree, there's absolutely zero universe where the band replaces JLB before it stops functioning (as in making music and touring regularly). This is the final lineup, folks. Let's hope we get as many albums and tours of good stuff as possible.
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Doctor Strange says 1 in 14 million of the possible timelines this happens.
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I agree, there's absolutely zero universe where the band replaces JLB before it stops functioning (as in making music and touring regularly). This is the final lineup, folks. Let's hope we get as many albums and tours of good stuff as possible.
🙏💕
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I agree, there's absolutely zero universe where the band replaces JLB before it stops functioning (as in making music and touring regularly). This is the final lineup, folks. Let's hope we get as many albums and tours of good stuff as possible.
Not saying it would happen but if he was replaced I'm pretty sure they are not losing a single fan.
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1: JLB is getting over a year off from live shows. He can use that time to work with a coach, get any medical attention that he might need, or whatever else he needs to do to get in better shape than he was in 2023.
I hear you, but boy did we say the same thing during the lockdowns in 2020-2021. They basically didn't tour for about a year and a half but instead of getting James in great shape we got what we saw live in 2022-2023.
Not trying to be pessimistic or rain in anyone's parade, but I think we shouldn't approach this with false high expectations for the vocal department.
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I can think of musicians who were let go from bands because they were no longer doing the job well (the bass players from Bon Jovi
It's not exactly hard to play bass for Bon Jovi. How bad was he?
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Not saying it would happen but if he was replaced I'm pretty sure they are not losing a single fan.
Think again!
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I hear you, but boy did we say the same thing during the lockdowns in 2020-2021. They basically didn't tour for about a year and a half but instead of getting James in great shape we got what we saw live in 2022-2023.
Not trying to be pessimistic or rain in anyone's parade, but I think we shouldn't approach this with false high expectations for the vocal department.
Maybe. I wasn’t paying as much attention to DT specifically at that point admittedly, but for in general I was pretty skeptical and expected a lot of musicians to come out of lockdown pretty out of shape.
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Not saying it would happen but if he was replaced I'm pretty sure they are not losing a single fan.
One right here.
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Two here. If James goes, I go. It would take a monumentally masterpiece of an album to keep me interested.
And to be brutally honest, while I still love the band and I don't have a single regret about seeing them on the last tour, and I was more than willing to go again even if Portnoy hadn't returned, the last two albums were the ones that had least staying power for me. They came and went and while I don't dislike them, I hardly ever returned to them, and even when they were new the times I played those album were dramatically inferior to the playing time the previous albums got.
So if in this equation, where I still like the band but the albums already don't have any lasting effect on me, you take away the defining voice of DT.... that's where I jump ship, unless they come up with the perfect replacement and a literal masterpiece. No, a quite good album with another singer isn't enough, it has to be a masterpiece to keep me interested.
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Two here. If James goes, I go.
Three! That would be absolutely the last straw.
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Not saying it would happen but if he was replaced I'm pretty sure they are not losing a single fan.
Then it seems you don't know well DT fanbase. Pretty amount of fans listen DT and being a fan because of James in the first place. I, for one, quit listening if James leaves.
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I will continue to be a supportive fan regardless of who comes or goes and for whatever reason they do so.
I said in another thread that there is a possibility that any of them may have said they only have 1 more album and tour left in them. Only time will tell.
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I will continue to be a supportive fan regardless of who comes or goes and for whatever they do so.
Same here. Not even with the departure of MP in 2010 did I stop listening to them. No member in the band is that sacred or untouchable to me.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sJXxTlKi0z4
:metal
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sJXxTlKi0z4
:metal
The last James' frame and Jordan's facial expression. :lol :lol
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I will continue to be a supportive fan regardless of who comes or goes and for whatever reason they do so.
No member in the band is that sacred or untouchable to me.
That's me as well :tup
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If any member decides to leave on their own accord I’ll continue to support the band, but if the band decided to kick James out, that’s when I walk, but I really don’t think that’s gonna happen.
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Not saying I want him to leave, but if James left of his own accord and was able to pick his replacement, I would at least give them a chance
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Then it seems you don't know well DT fanbase. Pretty amount of fans listen DT and being a fan because of James in the first place. I, for one, quit listening if James leaves.
Been a fan before James was there. I love his voice but if he couldn't do it anymore and they decide to replace him I am sure they would do it right. I don't see them continuing as DT if that happened but I wouldn't bail on them if they did.
*** When I first heard WDaDU I listened non stop and that was DT for me. When James joined it was new and had to get used to it.
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Been a fan before James was there. I love his voice but if he couldn't do it anymore and they decide to replace him I am sure they would do it right. I don't see them continuing as DT if that happened but I wouldn't bail on them if they did.
It's not that I would bail on them, but it would matter who they bring in. I bailed on Redemption because I cannot stand Tom Englund, so the choice indeed matters.
I have way more history with DT obviously, but picking the wrong singer would definitely affect how I view things going forward.
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It's not that I would bail on them, but it would matter who they bring in. I bailed on Redemption because I cannot stand Tom Englund, so the choice indeed matters.
I have way more history with DT obviously, but picking the wrong singer would definitely affect how I view things going forward.
As you know I have the same long history with DT, and at one point it was personal. DT was Charlie for me until James joined. I love Tom's voice but not for DT.
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I hear you, but boy did we say the same thing during the lockdowns in 2020-2021. They basically didn't tour for about a year and a half but instead of getting James in great shape we got what we saw live in 2022-2023.
Not trying to be pessimistic or rain in anyone's parade, but I think we shouldn't approach this with false high expectations for the vocal department.
That, and I wouldn't make any predictions about "they won't continue if...".
I know "speculate" is what we do, and that's fun; hell, I'm part of it too. But the reality is, there are NO irreplaceable members in ANY band. Go look at the Rush thread. It's not "Bonham" that is keeping Zeppelin from being a touring unit. I've only ever seen Pink Floyd WITHOUT Roger Waters. I can go on. If James did one more tour and said "my family calls, I'm done", there's not one person here - well, there may be ONE, or two - that can say with any certainty whether DT is over as a touring/recording unit. We're going to be facing this at some point with Jordan.
Whether anyone actually stays on as a fan, is a very different story. It didn't happen as badly with DT, but I definitely will bail on a band if I don't like a member, and "singers" are a different breed for that, for sure. To this day, I've never purchased and do not listen to the Priest without Halford. Although I've warmed to him after seeing him live with the SchenkerFest tour, I bailed on Michael Schenker when he got rid of Gary Barden.
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Whether anyone actually stays on as a fan, is a very different story. It didn't happen as badly with DT, but I definitely will bail on a band if I don't like a member, and "singers" are a different breed for that, for sure. To this day, I've never purchased and do not listen to the Priest without Halford. Although I've warmed to him after seeing him live with the SchenkerFest tour, I bailed on Michael Schenker when he got rid of Gary Barden.
This, 💯 . I will never, ever, ever see Queensryche without Geoff Tate, not even if I was given the tickets for free (and anyone who knows me would know better than to offer them to me anyway). There is a different kind of loyalty to a singer and their place in a band you love. I don't think we can strive to define it, either, it just is.
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I have a feeling that when the next man wants to retire, Dream Theater is done, and another project pops up centered around JP and MP. JMX would be in it too if he's not the next man to quit and if he's eager to continue after DT (but out of all of them, he's been the closest to being a DT-only guy, so maybe he would hang it up with the band). If we're going by conventional wisdom of age and how long they've worked in music professionally, JR and JLB are most likely to retire first, but I can see the one that didn't retire carrying on in this new project as well. I see JP and MP as least likely to quit because they only seem to be amping up their activities in the music business with no plans of stopping. JR seems to be in a similar mindset and as sharp as ever, but the oldest still working rockstars now are all past 75ish and slowly reducing their activities, and JR is close to that ceiling of age at 67.
They've played with a number of singers and instrumentalists they liked, so that lineup is likely to fill up fast and be 60-80% DT, so it will be as if they just replaced the member(s), but they will be able to say they retired DT with the original lineup.
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Not saying it would happen but if he was replaced I'm pretty sure they are not losing a single fan.
James was, and still is, the main draw for me to DT. As others have said, if he leaves of his own accord, I'll give his successor a chance. But if he gets kicked out, I will be done with DT.
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James was, and still is, the main draw for me to DT. As others have said, if he leaves of his own accord, I'll give his successor a chance. But if he gets kicked out, I will be done with DT.
I think this is where I'm at too....
Without JLB it will not feel like DT.
Anyone else could theoretically be replaced and it could still feel like DT.
But replacing the voice is like replacing the guitarplayer with a fluteplayer.
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There's bands with dramatic vocalist changes I can think of.
Kamelot
Queensryche
Redemption
Journey
Then there are bands who's vocalist was so integral they had to change name brands
Queen
Sublime
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James was, and still is, the main draw for me to DT. As others have said, if he leaves of his own accord, I'll give his successor a chance. But if he gets kicked out, I will be done with DT.
JLB "the MAIN draw"? I honestly don't think that that statement makes ANY LOGICAL SENSE! :facepalm:
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I don't think blind loyalty to anyone in a band is a good thing (for the most part). IMO quality should always come before nostalgia. Sure, anyone is free to like/dislike a band based on who's on the roster, but wishing for DT (or any band) to be done only because x member leaves or gets replaced is just a very selfish, short-sighted mindset. "I don't like it, therefore they're done. This is not X band anymore". That's the same reason why we say a lot of people saying DT was no longer DT because MP wasn't in the band for over a decade. Really? :facepalm:
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I don't think blind loyalty to anyone in a band is a good thing (for the most part). IMO quality should always come before nostalgia. Sure, anyone is free to like/dislike a band based on who's on the roster, but wishing for DT (or any band) to be done only because x member leaves or gets replaced is just a very selfish, short-sighted mindset. "I don't like it, therefore they're done. This is not X band anymore". That's the same reason why we say a lot of people saying DT was no longer DT because MP wasn't in the band for over a decade. Really? :facepalm:
I'm coming from a different angle here, about 99% of us would find it really difficult to imagine DT without JP, and in the very unlikely event that he left and the others had a burning desire to continue under the name DT, we would all get to say that. There's a smaller percentage of the fanbase that puts James in that #1 spot instead and that's completely valid, because it's just a matter of taste. The people who said it about MP and kept to their word didn't really harsh my mellow either - they made a number of internet spaces really annoying to be in as a DT fan, but we have DTF to be free of all of that!
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There's bands with dramatic vocalist changes I can think of.
Kamelot
Queensryche
Redemption
Journey
Then there are bands who's vocalist was so integral they had to change name brands
Queen
Sublime
AC/DC
Van Halen
Marillion
If you could ever name a band that had a brand associated with their lead singer it's Van Halen and Diamond David Lee Roth, and yet they were as successful - arguably more successful under certain metrics - than with Roth.
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I don't think blind loyalty to anyone in a band is a good thing (for the most part). IMO quality should always come before nostalgia. Sure, anyone is free to like/dislike a band based on who's on the roster, but wishing for DT (or any band) to be done only because x member leaves or gets replaced is just a very selfish, short-sighted mindset. "I don't like it, therefore they're done. This is not X band anymore". That's the same reason why we say a lot of people saying DT was no longer DT because MP wasn't in the band for over a decade. Really? :facepalm:
But it's a matter of taste, and there's no way of knowing - at least for me - until after the damage is done. I just need to hear the material. It's as simple as that.
For every band I've stuck with through singer thick and singer thin - Deep Purple, Rainbow, Marillion, Yes - there have been bands I've bailed on for the same reasons - Priest, Michael Schenker, Bad Company, Genesis...
I think for me, the point is, NO RULES. There just aren't any rules for this sort of thing. I'll know it when I hear it.
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I'm coming from a different angle here, about 99% of us would find it really difficult to imagine DT without JP, and in the very unlikely event that he left and the others had a burning desire to continue under the name DT, we would all get to say that. There's a smaller percentage of the fanbase that puts James in that #1 spot instead and that's completely valid, because it's just a matter of taste. The people who said it about MP and kept to their word didn't really harsh my mellow either - they made a number of internet spaces really annoying to be in as a DT fan, but we have DTF to be free of all of that!
Oh, I agree with you, specially the bolded. In that particular case, though, it's the main driving force behind the band that's being replaced, not a "regular" member. No one expects Megadeth to continue without Mustaine or Opeth without Akerfeldt because those guys are the main writers and pretty much everything else for their respective bands, and there's plenty other examples to cite like Nightwish, Angra, Big Big Train, you name it. Spock's Beard even broke that rule and continued without Neal, who was the main guy for about everything up until that point.
I agree that it's all subjective and we're free to like or dislike whatever we want. There's bands that I've stopped following because I didn't like lineup changes of and thats totally fine, but that doesn't mean the band should stop existing just because my favorite member of the band isn't there anymore.
But it's a matter of taste, and there's no way of knowing - at least for me - until after the damage is done. I just need to hear the material. It's as simple as that.
And I also agree here, the music and live shows should speak for themselves, but that's the beauty of it all, different tastes. Some changes work and some don't, but we as fans aren't and shouldn't be the measuring rod that dictates whether or not a band has the right to continue without x member. (Whether they stay in business is another story).
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JLB "the MAIN draw"? I honestly don't think that that statement makes ANY LOGICAL SENSE! :facepalm:
I'm coming from a different angle here, about 99% of us would find it really difficult to imagine DT without JP, and in the very unlikely event that he left and the others had a burning desire to continue under the name DT, we would all get to say that. There's a smaller percentage of the fanbase that puts James in that #1 spot instead and that's completely valid, because it's just a matter of taste.
Yup, I agree with Mora. James is my main draw to the band. I don't consider him to be the most important member of the band, that's Petrucci for me, and to piggyback off Mora's example, a Dream Theater without Petrucci would be to me a band without its most important core carrying on off the strenght of the name and the brand. However I am not a musician, and while I do appreciate the musicianship of the guys, I listen to Dream Theater to have the technical prowess in service of the music and the melody. I don't care to hear a 5 minutes long guitar solo, I care to hear what the songwriters' ability in the band conjured up to allow James to sing a beautiful melody that touches me. And while I said that I'm not a musician, if I would have been one, I would have been a singer. I actually took singing lessons for some year. Vocals will always be my main draw in the band and it's the reason why I don't like black metal or the more extreme forms of music. I can't connect with the growling vocals, I enjoy them here and there in specific occasions but a kind of music that I would normally like sang with harsh vocals would be a turn off for me. In basically every band I love, the vocals have to attract me. And I'm along the DT ride for the vocals. James going would be a terrible and unfixable damage to my connection with DT's music.
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JLB "the MAIN draw"? I honestly don't think that that statement makes ANY LOGICAL SENSE! :facepalm:
Because these things are, by nature, not logical - they are entirely subjective!
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I'm coming from a different angle here, about 99% of us would find it really difficult to imagine DT without JP, and in the very unlikely event that he left and the others had a burning desire to continue under the name DT, we would all get to say that. There's a smaller percentage of the fanbase that puts James in that #1 spot instead and that's completely valid, because it's just a matter of taste. The people who said it about MP and kept to their word didn't really harsh my mellow either - they made a number of internet spaces really annoying to be in as a DT fan, but we have DTF to be free of all of that!
All of this!
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I agree with all saying it isn't DT without JLB as much as JP.
IF Jlb can't tour anymore, it should be something like Dream Theater presents: Dino Jelusick (or whatever great singer is around for that part of the world)
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AC/DC
Van Halen
Marillion
If you could ever name a band that had a brand associated with their lead singer it's Van Halen and Diamond David Lee Roth, and yet they were as successful - arguably more successful under certain metrics - than with Roth.
So then why is JLB leaving DT one where the band will be done?
I have said before. IF JLB gets replaced, Mike Mills will be an excellent replacement.
Although, if John Myung leaves. I would consider that the end of the band.
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So then why is JLB leaving DT one where the band will be done?
Although, if John Myung leaves. I would consider that the end of the band.
Well, some people think the same as you, but put JLB in the spot of JM.
I'm kind of in that position where I love JLB, I'd have a hard time swallowing that change and really don't want him to be the first to leave, but I also don't want to sit through two or three tours where he sounds like he did on the View/Dreamsonic run. If at some point we have to go through scenario A to avoid going through scenario B, then who am I to say no to that.
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James was, and still is, the main draw for me to DT. As others have said, if he leaves of his own accord, I'll give his successor a chance. But if he gets kicked out, I will be done with DT.
Not that this is even close to the voice of DT but its OK Mangini lost his job? I know MP is the first but what did Mangini do wrong? :corn
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Yup, I agree with Mora. James is my main draw to the band. I don't consider him to be the most important member of the band, that's Petrucci for me, and to piggyback off Mora's example, a Dream Theater without Petrucci would be to me a band without its most important core carrying on off the strenght of the name and the brand. However I am not a musician, and while I do appreciate the musicianship of the guys, I listen to Dream Theater to have the technical prowess in service of the music and the melody. I don't care to hear a 5 minutes long guitar solo, I care to hear what the songwriters' ability in the band conjured up to allow James to sing a beautiful melody that touches me. And while I said that I'm not a musician, if I would have been one, I would have been a singer. I actually took singing lessons for some year. Vocals will always be my main draw in the band and it's the reason why I don't like black metal or the more extreme forms of music. I can't connect with the growling vocals, I enjoy them here and there in specific occasions but a kind of music that I would normally like sang with harsh vocals would be a turn off for me. In basically every band I love, the vocals have to attract me. And I'm along the DT ride for the vocals. James going would be a terrible and unfixable damage to my connection with DT's music.
I agree with pretty much all of this (although I am a musician -- I play tuba).
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Not that this is even close to the voice of DT but its OK Mangini lost his job? I know MP is the first but what did Mangini do wrong? :corn
In the case of MM (and DS, for that matter) it seems to be a matter of chemistry within the band. MM didn't do anything wrong, I gather they just wanted to work with MP again.
Anyone replacing JLB would have a very hard time filling his shoes. For all the talk about his problems live, I think he still sounds great in the studio. And his voice is unique. I've heard other people who sound like Geoff Tate. I've never heard anyone that sounds like JLB. I would not be optimistic in them finding someone who would suit my preferences. Adding negative baggage to that calculus by kicking JLB to the curb would make it very difficult for me to get past.
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Anyone replacing JLB would have a very hard time filling his shoes.
Maybe, but all I have to think about is watching Devin Townsend sing The Spirit Carries on last year and well, I think there's a lot of room for a better front man today. Having said that, it's not something I want to see and I'll go along with Zircon said. If JLB is fired, I won't be happy and could potentially be so turned off that I won't want to follow DT anymore. If he leaves on his own and the band continues, I also won't be happy, but I would continue to support the band and check out the new singer with open ears.
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In the case of MM (and DS, for that matter) it seems to be a matter of chemistry within the band. MM didn't do anything wrong, I gather they just wanted to work with MP again.
Anyone replacing JLB would have a very hard time filling his shoes. For all the talk about his problems live, I think he still sounds great in the studio. And his voice is unique. I've heard other people who sound like Geoff Tate. I've never heard anyone that sounds like JLB. I would not be optimistic in them finding someone who would suit my preferences. Adding negative baggage to that calculus by kicking JLB to the curb would make it very difficult for me to get past.
I agree that JLB sounds great in the studio and is unique. I love his voice. I remember when they asked James to join MP telling me he sounded like a metal version of Dennis Deyoung of Styx. I remember Mike giving me the 3 song ATCO demo and at that time he and JP truly valued my opinion, which was very cool being in the DT circle back then. MP was awesome back then, total goofball and just fun to be around. Even after introducing DT to Bill Rogers to be the vocalist that they were very excited about at that time, then the nightmare gig I was at when they introduced Steven Stone, James was a slam dunk perfect fit. I got so used to the demo versions of Take The Time and Metropolis that the album versions were a slight adjustment, nothing big. But yeah, I'm rooting for James to kick ass on the album and hopefully the same on tour man!
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JLB "the MAIN draw"? I honestly don't think that that statement makes ANY LOGICAL SENSE! :facepalm:
DT without JLB would become, in my mind and ears, your archetypical progressive metal band. JLB is one of the most important parts of the DT formula, in spite of his flaws as a live performer nowadays, and the band knows this (so much that they haven't parted ways with him, even in his darkest and lowest of days as a singer). The people that know what's best for Dream Theater are Dream Theater, so if JLB is still in the band it's because people, far more important and knowledgable in the subject than you and I, consider it so. That should be enough for us, fans.
I do appreciate most of the discussions held on this subject matter in this thread. I think that lots of us feel kinda the same: we don't want to see JLB go, but we really wish and need to see him up his game in the last few tours that they still have together as a band (I'm not worried at all of studio releases, he's going to kick ass as always in those).
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What do you guys think would there be a "backup" singer, like what Mr. Big is doing with Eric on the stage to "help him out with those tougher to reach" notes?
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Most prog metal bands have bad singers ("it's so bland it hurts!"). The only two which don't are DT and Symphony X.
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Most prog metal bands have bad singers ("it's so bland it hurts!"). The only two which don't are DT and Symphony X.
Plus QR in Tate's prime.
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Plus QR in Tate's prime.
Yes.
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I am just waiting to see if a "prophecy" given by a certain guy comes to be true, I am waiting for this album/tour cycle to end and see if he had it right.
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I am just waiting to see if a "prophecy" given by a certain guy comes to be true, I am waiting for this album/tour cycle to end and see if he had it right.
Care to share the prophecy with us?
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Most prog metal bands have bad singers ("it's so bland it hurts!"). The only two which don't are DT and Symphony X.
And of course, by "DT and Symphony X", you mean "DT". (I think Russell Allen is wildly overrated by the people here on this board; I just do not get it.)
:) :) :) :) :) :) :)
(For the record, and of course, depending on how you define "prog metal", I actually don't particularly care for "prog metal" beyond early Queensryche and DT; and the problem is almost always the singer. James is very much the exception to the rule as far as I'm concerned, and is BY FAR my favorite in the genre.)
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Ray Alder would be in my top tier list as well.
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Ray Alder would be in my top tier list as well.
I've never gotten into Fates Warning, and mostly it's because of his voice. It just doesn't grab me at all.
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Care to share the prophecy with us?
Sure, here it is (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwmB_bIJUHw).
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Sure, here it is (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwmB_bIJUHw).
Brilliant.
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I've never gotten into Fates Warning, and mostly it's because of his voice. It just doesn't grab me at all.
I think Ray's voice is great, but the vocal melodies I've heard from FW left me wanting. Tooooo. Maaaaaanyyyyy. Loooooong. Noooooootes. Iiiiiin. Eeeeeeeevery. Liiiiiiiiine.
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I think Ray's voice is great, but the vocal melodies I've heard from FW left me wanting. Tooooo. Maaaaaanyyyyy. Loooooong. Noooooootes. Iiiiiin. Eeeeeeeevery. Liiiiiiiiine.
Yes, that's it! You nailed it.
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Yes, that's it! You nailed it.
On paper, FW is a band I should really like. It took me a long time to figure out what exactly it was that was keeping me from getting into them. It finally clicked when I was looking at the lyrics in the APSoG booklet and noticed how few words there actually were.
I did hear an Arch-era FW song on the radio once that I liked, so I've been meaning to check out their older stuff, but haven't gotten around to it yet.
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Care to share the prophecy with us?
Someone said that after this album/tour cycle ends, MP will start convincing JP to bring in a new singer.
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Someone said that after this album/tour cycle ends, MP will start convincing JP to bring in a new singer.
it has also been stated that MP moved to Seattle :hat
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it has also been stated that MP moved to Seattle :hat
haha, that too!
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What do you guys think would there be a "backup" singer, like what Mr. Big is doing with Eric on the stage to "help him out with those tougher to reach" notes?
There will be, it's Mike Portnoy and John Petrucci :angel:
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This, 💯 . I will never, ever, ever see Queensryche without Geoff Tate, not even if I was given the tickets for free (and anyone who knows me would know better than to offer them to me anyway). There is a different kind of loyalty to a singer and their place in a band you love. I don't think we can strive to define it, either, it just is.
Crystal, not to get off topic, but I have to ask: considering the crap show that Tate was responsible for, and the underhanded business dealings he was trying to pull on the band, how can you give him a free pass and never give the band who, IMO, was completely justified in kicking him to the curb? Of course JL is not that kind of person thankfully, so that would not be an issue with DT.
With regards to the comments that JL is a key ingredient to DT's sound, I completely agree, but it is not *the* key ingredient. That is JP, along with JR and now MP again. I say that because, while I enjoyed JL's 2 Mullmuzzler albums and Elements of Persuasion, the other 2 with Matt Guillory seemed more average-Joe prog to me. So that points to the way the music is written, more than the vocals. Let's not forget that while JL does contribute vocal melodies (which are important in their own right), he does not really contribute to the songwriting at all, so he doesn't play a key factor in what draws at least me to the band. Like Glasser, I got into DT with WDaDU, so for me Charlie was the voice of DT, and it took some time for me to get used to their "new" sound when IaW first came out. And I still love WDaDU and rank it higher in their catalog than probably most DT fans, but it's because of the music, not the vocals. All that said, while I want to see JL succeed not only in the studio (which is a given) but in the live environment, if he and the band parted ways (whether initiated by him or not), I will still continue following the band so long as the music continues to speak to me, which I'd wager it will, as long as it doesn't consist of a lot of cookie monster vocals like JL's last 2 Guillory solo albums did.
I don't think blind loyalty to anyone in a band is a good thing (for the most part). IMO quality should always come before nostalgia. Sure, anyone is free to like/dislike a band based on who's on the roster, but wishing for DT (or any band) to be done only because x member leaves or gets replaced is just a very selfish, short-sighted mindset. "I don't like it, therefore they're done. This is not X band anymore". That's the same reason why we say a lot of people saying DT was no longer DT because MP wasn't in the band for over a decade. Really? :facepalm:
Great point Gabriel!
But it's a matter of taste, and there's no way of knowing - at least for me - until after the damage is done. I just need to hear the material. It's as simple as that.
For every band I've stuck with through singer thick and singer thin - Deep Purple, Rainbow, Marillion, Yes - there have been bands I've bailed on for the same reasons - Priest, Michael Schenker, Bad Company, Genesis...
I think for me, the point is, NO RULES. There just aren't any rules for this sort of thing. I'll know it when I hear it.
I agree. But I think that *if* it would come down to this for DT, they would be very cautious about the route they would end up going in. With MP being musical social butterfly that he is, I'm sure he knows of many different vocalists that could be considered if that bridge needed to be crossed. With DT being a well-known entity now - unlike in 1990-91 - it will be far easier for DT to find someone who they can be confident in. There will never be another Steve Stone fiasco - you can bank on that!
IF Jlb can't tour anymore, it should be something like Dream Theater presents: Dino Jelusick (or whatever great singer is around for that part of the world)
Honestly, no. DT is not Queen who had only been the same 4 members on all their albums.
I've never gotten into Fates Warning, and mostly it's because of his voice. It just doesn't grab me at all.
If I may, I suggest you at least give the songs selected as the top 10 FW songs in a thread that pg1067 (IIRC) did. I was just listening to The Light and Shade of Things (from their Theories of Flight album) and that song just blows me away, and I find it hard to imagine that most prog fans wouldn't enjoy it.
There will be, it's Mike Portnoy and John Petrucci :angel:
Exactly! :tup
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100% across the board, Scotty!
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Crystal, not to get off topic, but I have to ask: considering the crap show that Tate was responsible for, and the underhanded business dealings he was trying to pull on the band, how can you give him a free pass and never give the band who, IMO, was completely justified in kicking him to the curb? Of course JL is not that kind of person thankfully, so that would not be an issue with DT.
Well, I'm afraid I don't have a good answer for you except that, vocally speaking (saying nothing of his personality/actions which I'm not condoning), he is one of the all time greats. I don't want to hear Iron Maiden without Bruce for similar reasons. It's just not the same.
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The thing is, as least with Queensryche, is that the band is NOT Queensryche. It's almost a completely different entity altogether. So it's not like it's Degarmo, Wilton, Jackson, Rockenfield, and....Todd LaTorre.
That'd be like Iron Maiden having Harris, Murray, a different drummer, a different guitarist, and a different singer.
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Well, I'm afraid I don't have a good answer for you except that, vocally speaking (saying nothing of his personality/actions which I'm not condoning), he is one of the all time greats. I don't want to hear Iron Maiden without Bruce for similar reasons. It's just not the same.
Well you can do whatever you want, and sure, vocally it might not be exactly the same, but considering everything that went on that led to Tate being kicked out of the band, wouldn't it be reasonable to give the current band a fair shake before dismissing them just because the original vocalist (who lost a lot of his abilities in his final years with the band and was a schmuck to boot) is no longer with them?
The thing is, as least with Queensryche, is that the band is NOT Queensryche. It's almost a completely different entity altogether. So it's not like it's Degarmo, Wilton, Jackson, Rockenfield, and....Todd LaTorre.
That'd be like Iron Maiden having Harris, Murray, a different drummer, a different guitarist, and a different singer.
Funny that you say that. Only Harris and Murray are the same compared to the first album. And during the MM years, only JP and JM were left from the first album's lineup. ;)
Let's not forget that in QR's situation, it wasn't even remotely like Angra, where more than half the band jumped ship all at once. Like Maiden, the lineup changes with QR were incremental. Yeah, DeGarmo and Tate were the primary songwriters, but that was most evident on the last 2 albums with DeGarmo (which, IIRC, you don't like anyway). With Empire and the previous albums, Wilton had much more input in the songwriting. And once DeGarmo left and Tate started taking control - especially with OMII - then you had almost none of the songwriting being done by anyone other than Tate and whoever he chose to work with; the rest of the band was cut out of the creative process. So while only 2 of the original members are still in QR at the present time, I'd say the last 4 albums they've done with TLT are much more QR than at least the last 3 that Tate directed, if not everything after DeGarmo split.
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Tate was guilty of several disgusting acts towards his bandmates, people many describe as brothers. While I can't say he's an awful human being (I lack data) as opposed to being guilty of awful behaviour, it does mean I have no interest in listening to him. Funny how it goes.
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Well you can do whatever you want, and sure, vocally it might not be exactly the same, but considering everything that went on that led to Tate being kicked out of the band, wouldn't it be reasonable to give the current band a fair shake before dismissing them just because the original vocalist (who lost a lot of his abilities in his final years with the band and was a schmuck to boot) is no longer with them?
Because it's not about that. I'm frankly just not interested.
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I find it kinda funny that Tate is touring tiny little clubs these days. Like, literally smaller than my living room. He plays near me quite regularly, and I will never go. I love(d) his voice but I loathe the man and I will not give him a single penny.
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To get back on-topic, i sure hope that James and the band are aware of the (valid) criticism against James' recent live performances, and try to mitigate his shortcomings in many ways (songwriting choices, setlists, downtuning).
I personally love James' voice, and even though even on the albums after TA i think he's changed (for the worse), i wouldn't never want to see the band without him.
Maybe some vocal coaching could help alleviate some of the issues, and we have to be realistic with the guy, he's aging, it's normal that he won't be the same as he was 30 years ago.
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I think it's highly unlikely that the band is going to get rid of James. I mean, if they were inclined to ditch him, they'd have done so years ago. If James does leave, for whatever reason, I'd give the new guy (or girl - in a world where Lzzy Hale can be the new singer with Skid Row, anything's possible) a chance. If the music's there, I'm still a fan.
I still liked Motley Crue with John Corabi, I still liked Anthrax with John Bush, I still liked Maiden with Blaze. Hell, I even liked Van Halen with Gary Cherone. Of course the singer is important, but they're not the only component.
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in a world where Lzzy Hale can be the new singer with Skid RowDream Theater
FTFY. This is my dream scenario. ;D
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Honestly, a female singer with DT would work fine.
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Eddie Van Halen always talked about having Patty Smythe be the singer for Van Halen and I would KILL to have heard that. Female is fine for me; I just don't want the same retreads (Russell Allen is often mooted to be the new singer and that's a complete non-starter for me. That would, dare I say, be mutherfuckin' psychosane).
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FTFY. This is my dream scenario. ;D
No way. Her appearing on the redo of ONW was a complete non-starter for me. Pass.
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Eddie Van Halen always talked about having Patty Smythe be the singer for Van Halen and I would KILL to have heard that. Female is fine for me; I just don't want the same retreads (Russell Allen is often mooted to be the new singer and that's a complete non-starter for me. That would, dare I say, be mutherfuckin' psychosane).
There's been some rumors about Linkin Park coming back with a female singer taking Chester's place. One thing that was stated when reading some of these rumors was that a female singer would be less likely to be compared to Chester than a male. That may or may not be true in reality, but I can kind of see why someone might think that.
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In a strange turn of events, I am considering going to the Berlin, Milan or Rome show. Or possibly the one in Koln. Anyone have any experience of the venues in question, please?
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Eddie Van Halen always talked about having Patty Smythe be the singer for Van Halen and I would KILL to have heard that. Female is fine for me; I just don't want the same retreads (Russell Allen is often mooted to be the new singer and that's a complete non-starter for me. That would, dare I say, be mutherfuckin' psychosane).
I’ve seen this punchline before, but I’ll address whoever’s reading this thread that isn’t familiar with Russell and ask them to listen to Symphony X songs like Awakenings, The Odyssey, Lady of the Snow or A Winter’s Dream and tell me that voice wouldn’t go with DT’s music perfectly. He would bring to DT an unprecedented level of power, soulfulness, and very importantly PITCH accuracy when singing live.
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While Russel is a talented singer the timbre of his voice is a huge miss for me personally. Who knows, it might work against the backdrop of DT compared to Symphony X whose tracks are forgettable at best.
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I’ve seen this punchline before, but I’ll address whoever’s reading this thread that isn’t familiar with Russell and ask them to listen to Symphony X songs like Awakenings, The Odyssey, Lady of the Snow or A Winter’s Dream and tell me that voice wouldn’t go with DT’s music perfectly. He would bring to DT an unprecedented level of power, soulfulness, and very importantly PITCH accuracy when singing live.
IMO, his voice wouldn't go with DT's music perfectly. What do you want me to tell you? I'm not so stupid that I passed judgment on a guy without having ever heard his work. Please. I'm not knocking his technical ability, I just don't like how he sings. And our intrepid friends here have made sure I'm aware of his work from roulettes. I think it took about four or five submissions before people realized that he wasn't going to get the scores they anticipated.
The one exception: Jingle, I believe, sent a song from Star One where Russell sang, and it was quite good.
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Maybe a weird opinion, but I thought Russell was GREAT in Adrenaline Mob. His voice suits that style of music pretty perfectly. On the flip side, I have never enjoyed anything I've heard from Symphony X. Granted I haven't tried all that hard, but to me it always sounded like a band trying to sound like Dream Theater and coming up short instrumentally and VERY short vocally.
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On the flip side, I have never enjoyed anything I've heard from Symphony X. Granted I haven't tried all that hard, but to me it always sounded like a band trying to sound like Dream Theater and coming up short instrumentally and VERY short vocally.
This.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KuJuqycLWLs
this video is what first made me a fan of Russel, then came symphony x, which for me has real beautiful gems and a lot of filler-y type songs.
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I like Symphony X. Russell is great. But their songs get same-y very quickly. Russell's voice isn't for DT, even though it is well preserved.
... and no female vocalist for DT for me.
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Maybe a weird opinion, but I thought Russell was GREAT in Adrenaline Mob. His voice suits that style of music pretty perfectly. On the flip side, I have never enjoyed anything I've heard from Symphony X. Granted I haven't tried all that hard, but to me it always sounded like a band trying to sound like Dream Theater and coming up short instrumentally and VERY short vocally.
That's mutherfuckin' psychosane. ;)
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While Russel is a talented singer the timbre of his voice is a huge miss for me personally. Who knows, it might work against the backdrop of DT compared to Symphony X whose tracks are forgettable at best.
(https://c.tenor.com/pqmidHvSelgAAAAC/no.gif)
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That's mutherfuckin' psychosane. ;)
Yeah it is! :lol
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My DT fandom isn't what it used to be anyway (call it age, as my tastes have changed and mellowed out a bit), but I am pretty sure it would come to a screaming halt if Russell Allen ever became their singer. That would be a hard pass for me.
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I think Ray's voice is great, but the vocal melodies I've heard from FW left me wanting. Tooooo. Maaaaaanyyyyy. Loooooong. Noooooootes. Iiiiiin. Eeeeeeeevery. Liiiiiiiiine.
Yeah, this seemed like more of a problem from about A Pleasant Shape of Gray onward.
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Not knocking on your strong opinions on Russell Allen, but I can't imagine who would have to sing in Dream Theater for my fandom to come for a screaming halt. If it were someone I vaguely dislike but who is a technically sound singer and can actually cover the range of Dream Theater songs, I'd still give them a shot. When I was asked by the universe if my fandom is brought to a screaming halt by James singing the way he does lately, I said "no" and bought tickets for shows in 2022 and 2024 knowing fully how he was going to sound, so :lol
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Ronnie Romero? :) :) :) :) :)
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Russell Allen in DT is an awful, awful idea. No thank you.
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Russell Allen in DT is an awful, awful idea. No thank you.
Indeed, and I love Russell.
You know what would be cool? A tribute to DT album with a bunch of the top people in the genre. That way we can hear what people like RA and so forth would sound like on a DT song without worrying about JLB being replaced.
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We all know Devin Townsend has the goods to do the job (I don't think he would want it though)
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He wouldn't want it, and I wouldn't want him to.
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He wouldn't want it, and I wouldn't want him to.
Me neither, and I generally would think, most of the known singers probably wouldn't even want the job. It's a demanding singing spot. I'd guess they'd more likely find an unknown or lesser known person who would be willing to do the DT grind for personal exposure than someone already established.
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Ronnie Romero? :) :) :) :) :)
That would be Tim's choice for sure! Maybe Kade's too :lol
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FUCK THAT!! :lol
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Not knocking on your strong opinions on Russell Allen, but I can't imagine who would have to sing in Dream Theater for my fandom to come for a screaming halt. If it were someone I vaguely dislike but who is a technically sound singer and can actually cover the range of Dream Theater songs, I'd still give them a shot. When I was asked by the universe if my fandom is brought to a screaming halt by James singing the way he does lately, I said "no" and bought tickets for shows in 2022 and 2024 knowing fully how he was going to sound, so :lol
I went to DreamSonic not because of DT, but because that was a great lineup.
Getting to hear Devin sing TSCO was an epic moment, as well as Tosin playing along as well.
Regardless of JLBs vocals I still had a great time. I jammed out and sang along. It was more than just seeing my favorite bands, it was the experience of the show, and Dream Theater shows are about the songs for me, which I don't care if JLB sounded bad, I love the songs enough to sing along to them.
I even did the same when I saw them opening for Maiden. Although the set was like a singles set, I still had a blast.
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Indeed, and I love Russell.
You know what would be cool? A tribute to DT album with a bunch of the top people in the genre. That way we can hear what people like RA and so forth would sound like on a DT song without worrying about JLB being replaced.
That is an amazing idea. Honestly, if DT are the pioneers of Progressive Metal, why hasn't this been done.
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Me neither, and I generally would think, most of the known singers probably wouldn't even want the job. It's a demanding singing spot. I'd guess they'd more likely find an unknown or lesser known person who would be willing to do the DT grind for personal exposure than someone already established.
Imagine Mike Mills doing Learning to Live.
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That is an amazing idea. Honestly, if DT are the pioneers of Progressive Metal, why hasn't this been done.
It has a long time ago:
https://www.discogs.com/release/4135279-Various-Voices-A-Tribute-To-Dream-Theater
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It has a long time ago:
https://www.discogs.com/release/4135279-Various-Voices-A-Tribute-To-Dream-Theater
Wow, that's quite a lineup. :lol
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Wow, that's quite a lineup. :lol
Yea……guess I was thinking less bands, specifically obscure bands, doing covers but groups of less obscure prog people getting together.
Like Burning my Soup with Tony McAlpine, Billy Sheehan, whomever on drums and keys and Devin on vox. Etc.
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Like Burning my Soup with Tony McAlpine, Billy Sheehan, whomever on drums and keys and Devin on vox. Etc.
don't burn the soup
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don't burn the soup
I’d imagine Dev might change it to soup.
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It has a long time ago:
https://www.discogs.com/release/4135279-Various-Voices-A-Tribute-To-Dream-Theater
:lol
That's too obscure.
More like those more known bands that some consider DT clones. Like Circus Maximus. :lol
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:lol
That's too obscure.
More like those more known bands that some consider DT clones. Like Circus Maximus. :lol
Back around that time Empty Tremor was a fairly known band on the Ytsejam mailing list. Can't speak for the others. But you never specified that they had to be better known! :biggrin:
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Back around that time Empty Tremor was a fairly known band on the Ytsejam mailing list. Can't speak for the others. But you never specified that they had to be better known! :biggrin:
Yeah, should've specified more known bands besides these obscure bands that only Ytsejam mailing list members know of.... :lol
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I don't even know why this conversation (about replacement singers) is even still going on.
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I don't even know why this conversation (about replacement singers) is even still going on.
To be fair, I think now we’re talking about a DT tribute album. Not replacements. I think that would be cool, however unlikely.
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Back around that time Empty Tremor was a fairly known band on the Ytsejam mailing list. Can't speak for the others. But you never specified that they had to be better known! :biggrin:
Empty Tremor and Arkhe were great DT worship bands. A lot of bands from Italy came out known as the Italian Dreamers.
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It has a long time ago:
https://www.discogs.com/release/4135279-Various-Voices-A-Tribute-To-Dream-Theater
:lol are you actually familiar with this release?
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It'd be interesting to see what Ozzy Osbourne could muster in DT but I think JLB is the only singer for me when it comes to the band
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That is an amazing idea. Honestly, if DT are the pioneers of Progressive Metal, why hasn't this been done.
Just started thinking about this. Maybe because DT are so technical that bands don't want to touch it? Like I'm sure there's plenty of bands that can play the music, but would they be able to do it justice? Would they be able to put their own spin on it? Also, who would be interested in such a thing beyond some of us DT nerds? Are there DT cover songs already out there from established bands?
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:lol are you actually familiar with this release?
I never grabbed it. Didn't interest me. But I remember when it came out and the discussions about it. ;)
Just started thinking about this. Maybe because DT are so technical that bands don't want to touch it? Like I'm sure there's plenty of bands that can play the music, but would they be able to do it justice? Would they be able to put their own spin on it? Also, who would be interested in such a thing beyond some of us DT nerds? Are there DT cover songs already out there from established bands?
Part of it is probably because the tribute thing had been done to death. Magna Crapa did a lot of them, and there were plenty of others done in the late 90s and early 00s, so it was probably just a matter of over saturating the market and/or it became a trend that just faded away.
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In a strange turn of events, I am considering going to the Berlin, Milan or Rome show. Or possibly the one in Koln. Anyone have any experience of the venues in question, please?
Anyone? :biggrin:
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Anyone? :biggrin:
Milan is a nice enough venue, it's a place Iron Maiden sell out in a day and a half when they play there. Big sporting arena, basketball teams play there. Sound decent enough. It's the terminal of the subway so you're guaranteed a ride back with the subway to whatever part of Milan you'll chose to stay.
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Thank you, really appreciated.
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Milan is a nice enough venue, it's a place Iron Maiden sell out in a day and a half when they play there. Big sporting arena, basketball teams play there. Sound decent enough. It's the terminal of the subway so you're guaranteed a ride back with the subway to whatever part of Milan you'll chose to stay.
They actually opened part of the second tier for the DT concert a couple of days ago.
I think it's going to sold out for them as well - not as fast as for Maiden though :P
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I'm just catching up with this thread, as I'm seriously considering getting tickets for London. They are a bit pricey but I found, what looks like, decent seats for £88. I've never actually seen DT live, and what with this being the 40th Anniversary Tour and Portnoy being back in the band, there's never going to be an opportunity like this.
So, DTF, who from the UK is going to be there and are we doing a DTF meet up before the show?
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I'm just catching up with this thread, as I'm seriously considering getting tickets for London. They are a bit pricey but I found, what looks like, decent seats for £88. I've never actually seen DT live, and what with this being the 40th Anniversary Tour and Portnoy being back in the band, there's never going to be an opportunity like this.
So, DTF, who from the UK is going to be there and are we doing a DTF meet up before the show?
So... would you welcome a Yank at the meet up?
Let me rephrase that; would the invite be open to an American abroad? I'm about 60-40 that I'm going, though I haven't lifted a finger yet to make it happen...
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So... would you welcome a Yank at the meet up?
Let me rephrase that; would the invite be open to an American abroad? I'm about 60-40 that I'm going, though I haven't lifted a finger yet to make it happen...
Fuck yea dude, literally anyone and everyone from DTF is welcome! I didn't really think people would be travelling in, but hell yea :metal
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So... would you welcome a Yank at the meet up?
Let me rephrase that; would the invite be open to an American abroad? I'm about 60-40 that I'm going, though I haven't lifted a finger yet to make it happen...
Nice, that would be awesome! And a UK DT meet up sounds really fun.
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Nice, that would be awesome! And a UK DT meet up sounds really fun.
Oh sweet, are you flying in too dude?
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I will be at the London show with a friend. Keep me posted if there is anything fun going on.
No, I am not flying in. I live just an hour south of London :lol
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Oh sweet, are you flying in too dude?
Nah, just in theory, it would be fun lol I'd really love to go, never been to London, but it's not in the cards this year as my vacations are already booked for Denver soon (2 red rocks concerts) and Atlanta for Progpower in September.
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I'll be flying in for the show from the US, I decided I couldn't not help welcome back MP :metal
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Love that! I'd have done the same if it'd been in the US (or pretty much anywhere else!) :biggrin:
I'd be up for saying hello if there's a pub meet or something somewhere.