DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY

[TheHoveringSojourn808]

Eddie Trunk more like Eddie BUNK

[Trav]

What's funny is that all of Trunk's social media posts are either self promotion or old man griping
"I just saw a Christmas commercial before Halloween. Too early Walmart!" That was an actual tweet. Or an X. Whatever they call it now.

[ReaPsTA]

What's funny is that all of Trunk's social media posts are either self promotion or old man griping
"I just saw a Christmas commercial before Halloween. Too early Walmart!" That was an actual tweet. Or an X. Whatever they call it now.

I hate it too but they do it because people buy.

Whining about it fixes nothing

[Mosh]

Trunk gives a decent interview most of the time, Mangini is probably there to promote his album but there's likely going to be considerable talk about Dream Theater as well which may be interesting. Back in 2010, Portnoy's interview with Trunk filled in a lot of blanks about his split with DT at the time, regardless of personal opinions about Trunk or Portnoy's conduct towards the band at the time. For better or worse, Trunk is probably going to be more interested in the behind-the-scenes of what happened than most other interviewers Mangini is likely to talk to.

All that being said, that podcast that got posted here earlier makes me think that there was some paperwork signed about what Mangini can and can't say re: Dream Theater. He is clearly choosing his words carefully with phrases like "a decision was made" and even the way the interviewer phrased the question is a bit of a tell. She never said anything about Mangini being fired or quitting or even using phrases like "left the band." Just a vague "Mike Portnoy is back in the band that you were in." Trunk will probably be under similar restrictions to what he is able to ask.

It all seems typical to how Petrucci has managed the band's PR over the years. Keep it vague and don't say anything that would cause a controversy with the fans. Plus the split with Portnoy got so ugly that they probably don't want to experience that again, even if Mangini handles everything with more class than Portnoy did they might not want to take the chance. I don't know how the legalities work but I guess there is also a more distant possibility that Mangini's exit package is still being negotiated (supported by the common speculation that this was announced earlier than intended to avoid a leak).

[ariich]

"A decision was made"

Who made the decision?  Yes, it absolutely can be more clear.

It is odd how all of his statements are in the passive voice rather than the active. "A decision was made to" rather than "X decided to". Does he always speak/write like that and I just never noticed or is he just being super vague about this whole situation?

[Madman Shepherd]

He'll ask what his take is on Tommy Thayer and Eric Singer wearing the Kiss makeup.

Ace and Peter are good friends with Eddie. They played at his birthday party. He has another birthday party coming up and it's got a great lineup. Anyway Mike, we've only got 15 seconds left. Tell us about your new solo album.

[TAC]

"A decision was made"

Who made the decision?  Yes, it absolutely can be more clear.

It is odd how all of his statements are in the passive voice rather than the active. "A decision was made to" rather than "X decided to". Does he always speak/write like that and I just never noticed or is he just being super vague about this whole situation?

Honestly, I just think he's being respectful of the band and the process of the band making the change. I think, as he told Mistress Carrie, that he understands what happened.

For better or worse, Trunk is probably going to be more interested in the behind-the-scenes of what happened than most other interviewers Mangini is likely to talk to.

Trunk is quite familiar with all of the parties, so I think Trunk is the perfect guy to do this interview. He usually asks the things that fans want to hear.

All that being said, that podcast that got posted here earlier makes me think that there was some paperwork signed about what Mangini can and can't say re: Dream Theater. He is clearly choosing his words carefully with phrases like "a decision was made" and even the way the interviewer phrased the question is a bit of a tell. She never said anything about Mangini being fired or quitting or even using phrases like "left the band." Just a vague "Mike Portnoy is back in the band that you were in." Trunk will probably be under similar restrictions to what he is able to ask.

I think the only direction given to any interviewer is that Mike will make it clear that he is not there to bad mouth the band, and that he also doesn't want the interviewer to do it either. There's probably details about when the band talked to him, the personal conversations, and some settlement language that will remain confidential, but truly, this has to be the least mysterious band splitting with a member that I can recall.

It all seems typical to how Petrucci has managed the band's PR over the years. Keep it vague and don't say anything that would cause a controversy with the fans. Plus the split with Portnoy got so ugly that they probably don't want to experience that again, even if Mangini handles everything with more class than Portnoy did they might not want to take the chance. I don't know how the legalities work but I guess there is also a more distant possibility that Mangini's exit package is still being negotiated (supported by the common speculation that this was announced earlier than intended to avoid a leak).

I said when it happened that the press release was probably the most honest and least vague communication ever put out in the JP run era.
They may have jumped the announcement up, but I would highly doubt that the ink was not dry.

[jimgolf]

I have a source that is very reliable that claims Mike Portnoy's new kit will have Octobarns.

Should be exciting.

[Trav]

I have a source that is very reliable that claims Mike Portnoy's new kit will have Octobarns.

Should be exciting.

But will it have Octobans?

[Trav]

So, anyone strong enough to sit through the Eddie Trunk show that can let us in on what Mangini says?

[pg1067]

Not sure what "science" you are looking for.  I'm just looking at the plain meanings of the words that were said, and just as before, there is a LOT that is vague and unsaid.  All we know is "a decision was made" and that "he understood it."  Which decision?  Who made it?  When?  We still don't know.  Presumably, from the context, he is talking about the decision to bring Mike Portnoy back into the band.  Because that's what he talks about next.  But was it all part of the same decision?  Were the decisions for Mangini to leave and Portnoy to come in all part of the same decision?  Were they separate decisions?  If so, who were the decision makers?  Again, we still don't know.

Two things here.  First, this reminds me of a time when I was looking for a job and was talking about returning to work for a former employer.  I was told something along the lines of, "well, Paul...it's not just a decision to hire you or not.  It's two decisions; do we want to hire you and do we want to fire someone else to make a place for you?"

Second, I listened to a few minutes of the interview and - this may not resonate with anyone other than Bosk and Stadler (and any other attorneys around here) - but I came to the conclusion that MM would be a TERRIBLE witness in a deposition.  I'd hate to depose him, and I'd REALLY hate to defend him in a deposition.  I feel like he'd be asked the standard, "Mr. Mangini, what do you do for a living," and (if left to his own devices) he'd take about 10 minutes to explain his entire history as a percussionist.   

"A decision was made"

Who made the decision?  Yes, it absolutely can be more clear.

It is odd how all of his statements are in the passive voice rather than the active. "A decision was made to" rather than "X decided to". Does he always speak/write like that and I just never noticed or is he just being super vague about this whole situation?

"So...guys.  Dinner will be made tonight.  Will dinner be eaten by the three of us?"  I follow him on Facebook, and everything he writes seems to be long and meandering.

I have a source that is very reliable that claims Mike Portnoy's new kit will have Octobarns.

Should be exciting.

[bosk1]

Two things here.  First, this reminds me of a time when I was looking for a job and was talking about returning to work for a former employer.  I was told something along the lines of, "well, Paul...it's not just a decision to hire you or not.  It's two decisions; do we want to hire you and do we want to fire someone else to make a place for you?"

Exactly.  Here, there were at least two levels of decisions.  Which one came first and how it influenced the second are important, unanswered questions.

But kind of to TAC's point, there really isn't a great mystery here.  Mangini is no longer in DT and Portnoy is back in, and almost everyone involved seems at least okay if not happy with the latter.  There's only mystery as to the greater details because fans are an intensely curious bunch AND have a propensity to jump to conclusions when it comes to filling in the blanks (or admitting that there even are blanks to begin with).

Second, I listened to a few minutes of the interview and - this may not resonate with anyone other than Bosk and Stadler (and any other attorneys around here) - but I came to the conclusion that MM would be a TERRIBLE witness in a deposition.  I'd hate to depose him, and I'd REALLY hate to defend him in a deposition.  I feel like he'd be asked the standard, "Mr. Mangini, what do you do for a living," and (if left to his own devices) he'd take about 10 minutes to explain his entire history as a percussionist.   

  Absolutely!  And I don't think people who are not in the legal profession (and have done litigation) fully appreciate what you just said.  The only thing I disagree with is the part about "he'd take about 10 minutes to explain his entire history as a percussionist."  And I only disagree because you failed to point out that that would be preceded by 10 minutes on the history of percussionists and then followed by 10 minutes on his philosophy about being a percussionist.

[hefdaddy42]

 

[Progmetty]

It occured to me today that I would be giddy as fuck if the new DT album is entitled "A Return to Normal Events".

[MirrorMask]

It occured to me today that I would be giddy as fuck if the new DT album is entitled "A Return to Normal Events".

Or maybe Bridges in the Sky.

"No guys you had the right title at the beginning, why did you change it?"

[Dedalus]

The astonishing return to normal events.

[OptionalPlayer]

Metropolis Pt. 3: A Dramatic Return of Events

[Weymolith]

It occured to me today that I would be giddy as fuck if the new DT album is entitled "A Return to Normal Events".

Elephants Maintain Artistry And Balance

[Jamesman42]

It will be interesting to see if DREAM THEATER can top its magnum opusA Dramatic Turn of Events.

[porcacultor]

It occured to me today that I would be giddy as fuck if the new DT album is entitled "A Return to Normal Events".

Or maybe Bridges in the Sky.

"No guys you had the right title at the beginning, why did you change it?"

Or perhaps The Shaman's Trance 

[HOF]

I have a source that is very reliable that claims Mike Portnoy's new kit will have Octobarns.

Should be exciting.

Can has play blast beats though?

[gzarruk]

So, anyone strong enough to sit through the Eddie Trunk show that can let us in on what Mangini says?

Anyone?

[The Letter M]

I have a source that is very reliable that claims Mike Portnoy's new kit will have Octobarns.

Should be exciting.

Can has play blast beats though?

If it's with Octobarns, maybe he'll play Blast Bleats with some sheep.

-Marc.

[nobloodyname]

Second, I listened to a few minutes of the interview and - this may not resonate with anyone other than Bosk and Stadler (and any other attorneys around here) - but I came to the conclusion that MM would be a TERRIBLE witness in a deposition.  I'd hate to depose him, and I'd REALLY hate to defend him in a deposition.  I feel like he'd be asked the standard, "Mr. Mangini, what do you do for a living," and (if left to his own devices) he'd take about 10 minutes to explain his entire history as a percussionist.   

"So...guys.  Dinner will be made tonight.  Will dinner be eaten by the three of us?"  I follow him on Facebook, and everything he writes seems to be long and meandering.

I gave up watching interviews with him very early on his DT days because as affable as he seemed, and as much as I'm a fan of verbosity myself, I couldn't bear listening to his meandering ruminations. Get to the fucking point, man

[nobloodyname]

I have a source that is very reliable that claims Mike Portnoy's new kit will have Octobarns.

Should be exciting.

What a great callback

Related, I used to look forward to PROGnostications each week.

[Lax]

So, are they waiting for the portnoy announcement to calm down before saying James left the band ?
I didn't expect him to come back without this condition lol.

I heard fear factory's original singer is available 

[Ben_Jamin]

Second, I listened to a few minutes of the interview and - this may not resonate with anyone other than Bosk and Stadler (and any other attorneys around here) - but I came to the conclusion that MM would be a TERRIBLE witness in a deposition.  I'd hate to depose him, and I'd REALLY hate to defend him in a deposition.  I feel like he'd be asked the standard, "Mr. Mangini, what do you do for a living," and (if left to his own devices) he'd take about 10 minutes to explain his entire history as a percussionist.   

"So...guys.  Dinner will be made tonight.  Will dinner be eaten by the three of us?"  I follow him on Facebook, and everything he writes seems to be long and meandering.

I gave up watching interviews with him very early on his DT days because as affable as he seemed, and as much as I'm a fan of verbosity myself, I couldn't bear listening to his meandering ruminations. Get to the fucking point, man

I quite enjoyed the part in that podcast where he mentions his siblings saying, maybe he fell on his head. 

[Stadler]

I'm a firm believer right now that he was "let go" though. And I believe he agreed to the terms of being let go via a non disclosure agreement that likely included a payment towards MM to not bad mouth the band.  I don't think that means something bad happened. Possible, but I think that's unlikely.  More like, the band just wants to keep their agreements confidential, which is completely fine and normal. MM clearly knows MP's importance to the band.  I don't know who started the discussion and it is likely more like Stadler's point, it probably happened over time.  Maybe since that moment JP made a clear statement about MM being in the band. Who knows. There's no reason to think there's bad blood here though based on everything shared publicly. 

Because I don't believe there is bad blood, I also believe MM will be playing with DT again at some point, maybe a special anniversary show or the next time DT plays in Boston for a song. 

I also still feel bad for him, I think he wanted to continue being in DT but basically "took one for the team".  All my opinions and thoughts here.

"I understand Dream Theater's decision to get Mike Portnoy back at this time" I don't know in what universe you say that if it was your decision to leave.

But as you and a few people have said or suggested, you either say yes and are probably given generous terms to leave or you say no and then what?

Not to argue with you but we've given examples of how that works.   A decision was made for my wife and I to divorce.   Did one of us just go to the other and say "I'm DONE! You're OUT!"   No.  That never happened.   It was, if nothing else, an act of attrition. The magic at the end wasn't the same as the magic at the start.  She wanted to do other things outside the marriage, I wanted to do do other things outside the marriage and a decision was made to divorce.  Now, I don't think the timing here supports a LONG buildup, but I can ABSOLUTELY see a meeting of the five of them where Mike M. asked to have dispense to tour his solo album, or something along the lines of something that differed from the rest of the band (or some members) and the rest of the band (or some members) saying "IF you do that, that's fine, but then I think we the rest of us should do this", and at some point the "this" was bringing Mike P. back.   And Mike M. saying "Wow, I understand that."   

I don't know; I feel like this isn't that complicated; I can't speak for anyone else  but my life just doesn't work in discrete blocks of action like that.  Everything is a continuum.  And sometimes a continuum is not easy to put into words.   

[TheHoveringSojourn808]

I'm a firm believer right now that he was "let go" though. And I believe he agreed to the terms of being let go via a non disclosure agreement that likely included a payment towards MM to not bad mouth the band.  I don't think that means something bad happened. Possible, but I think that's unlikely.  More like, the band just wants to keep their agreements confidential, which is completely fine and normal. MM clearly knows MP's importance to the band.  I don't know who started the discussion and it is likely more like Stadler's point, it probably happened over time.  Maybe since that moment JP made a clear statement about MM being in the band. Who knows. There's no reason to think there's bad blood here though based on everything shared publicly. 

Because I don't believe there is bad blood, I also believe MM will be playing with DT again at some point, maybe a special anniversary show or the next time DT plays in Boston for a song. 

I also still feel bad for him, I think he wanted to continue being in DT but basically "took one for the team".  All my opinions and thoughts here.

"I understand Dream Theater's decision to get Mike Portnoy back at this time" I don't know in what universe you say that if it was your decision to leave.

But as you and a few people have said or suggested, you either say yes and are probably given generous terms to leave or you say no and then what?

Not to argue with you but we've given examples of how that works.   A decision was made for my wife and I to divorce.   Did one of us just go to the other and say "I'm DONE! You're OUT!"   No.  That never happened.   It was, if nothing else, an act of attrition. The magic at the end wasn't the same as the magic at the start.  She wanted to do other things outside the marriage, I wanted to do do other things outside the marriage and a decision was made to divorce.  Now, I don't think the timing here supports a LONG buildup, but I can ABSOLUTELY see a meeting of the five of them where Mike M. asked to have dispense to tour his solo album, or something along the lines of something that differed from the rest of the band (or some members) and the rest of the band (or some members) saying "IF you do that, that's fine, but then I think we the rest of us should do this", and at some point the "this" was bringing Mike P. back.   And Mike M. saying "Wow, I understand that."   

I don't know; I feel like this isn't that complicated; I can't speak for anyone else  but my life just doesn't work in discrete blocks of action like that.  Everything is a continuum.  And sometimes a continuum is not easy to put into words.   

Sorry to hear you're getting divorced, that sounds stressful.

[Stadler]

I'm a firm believer right now that he was "let go" though. And I believe he agreed to the terms of being let go via a non disclosure agreement that likely included a payment towards MM to not bad mouth the band.  I don't think that means something bad happened. Possible, but I think that's unlikely.  More like, the band just wants to keep their agreements confidential, which is completely fine and normal. MM clearly knows MP's importance to the band.  I don't know who started the discussion and it is likely more like Stadler's point, it probably happened over time.  Maybe since that moment JP made a clear statement about MM being in the band. Who knows. There's no reason to think there's bad blood here though based on everything shared publicly. 

Because I don't believe there is bad blood, I also believe MM will be playing with DT again at some point, maybe a special anniversary show or the next time DT plays in Boston for a song. 

I also still feel bad for him, I think he wanted to continue being in DT but basically "took one for the team".  All my opinions and thoughts here.

"I understand Dream Theater's decision to get Mike Portnoy back at this time" I don't know in what universe you say that if it was your decision to leave.

But as you and a few people have said or suggested, you either say yes and are probably given generous terms to leave or you say no and then what?

This exactly. I think there are two things happening here.

  1. Bosk doesn't want everyone going around here saying that MM got "fired" because that gives a bad connotation, and that's fine. I don't think anyone here feels that the band sacked MM because of...fill in the blank...any negative reason. But we can't just keep arguing that it's a big mystery.  For probably multiple reasons, that really aren't anything to do with MM, they decided to bring Portnoy back. Therefore MM had to go. It's obvious, and just common sense. And it's pretty much told to us in the press release. I understand wanting to be respectful to MM and the rest of the band, but I don't see the point of dancing around this. Especially when a lot of it just seems to be semantics.

2. The other thing that I think makes this more mysterious is that we rarely see a band where the members transition so peacefully and with such mutual respect. It makes people question the obvious because it's been such a love fest between the Mike's on social media, which unfortunately is rare in instances like this.

Common sense is neither common, nor sense.

You may not even realize it but you're making these little, subtle assumption leaps in there that I think several of us have pointed out aren't necessarily accurate, and aren't really supported by the statements being made.  I've been fired, and I can tell you when you live it, it's not semantics.

And for the record, I didn't say this in my opinion, but if it turns out that Mike M. WAS fired, then so be it. I'm not saying it didn't happen, I'm saying you can't say for sure it DID happen, and "common sense" doesn't get you there.

[Stadler]

I'm a firm believer right now that he was "let go" though. And I believe he agreed to the terms of being let go via a non disclosure agreement that likely included a payment towards MM to not bad mouth the band.  I don't think that means something bad happened. Possible, but I think that's unlikely.  More like, the band just wants to keep their agreements confidential, which is completely fine and normal. MM clearly knows MP's importance to the band.  I don't know who started the discussion and it is likely more like Stadler's point, it probably happened over time.  Maybe since that moment JP made a clear statement about MM being in the band. Who knows. There's no reason to think there's bad blood here though based on everything shared publicly. 

Because I don't believe there is bad blood, I also believe MM will be playing with DT again at some point, maybe a special anniversary show or the next time DT plays in Boston for a song. 

I also still feel bad for him, I think he wanted to continue being in DT but basically "took one for the team".  All my opinions and thoughts here.

"I understand Dream Theater's decision to get Mike Portnoy back at this time" I don't know in what universe you say that if it was your decision to leave.

But as you and a few people have said or suggested, you either say yes and are probably given generous terms to leave or you say no and then what?

Not to argue with you but we've given examples of how that works.   A decision was made for my wife and I to divorce.   Did one of us just go to the other and say "I'm DONE! You're OUT!"   No.  That never happened.   It was, if nothing else, an act of attrition. The magic at the end wasn't the same as the magic at the start.  She wanted to do other things outside the marriage, I wanted to do do other things outside the marriage and a decision was made to divorce.  Now, I don't think the timing here supports a LONG buildup, but I can ABSOLUTELY see a meeting of the five of them where Mike M. asked to have dispense to tour his solo album, or something along the lines of something that differed from the rest of the band (or some members) and the rest of the band (or some members) saying "IF you do that, that's fine, but then I think we the rest of us should do this", and at some point the "this" was bringing Mike P. back.   And Mike M. saying "Wow, I understand that."   

I don't know; I feel like this isn't that complicated; I can't speak for anyone else  but my life just doesn't work in discrete blocks of action like that.  Everything is a continuum.  And sometimes a continuum is not easy to put into words.   

Sorry to hear you're getting divorced, that sounds stressful.

Well, thank you, but for clarity, it happened ten years time ago.   I've thankfully bounced back, but it certainly was a monumental time in my life and even looking back over those ten years, it's hard to put things in discrete little boxes of responsibility.   

[Madman Shepherd]

Regarding the "love fest" between the two Mikes. I've seen what MM has said about MP but can somebody fill me in about what MP has said about MM.

[MoraWintersoul]

Not to argue with you but we've given examples of how that works.   A decision was made for my wife and I to divorce.   Did one of us just go to the other and say "I'm DONE! You're OUT!"   No.  That never happened.   It was, if nothing else, an act of attrition. The magic at the end wasn't the same as the magic at the start.  She wanted to do other things outside the marriage, I wanted to do do other things outside the marriage and a decision was made to divorce.

(so glad this still works)

Okay Stads, but if your ex wife put out a Facebook status saying "I understand Stads' decision to go back to his ex-girlfriend at this time", that would in fact not be saying it was an act of attrition too complicated to put into words, and any nosy second cousin snooping on her Facebook could have the right to assume the decision to divorce was yours. Whatever happened in the run up to your decision to reunite with your ex girlfriend could be complicated and difficult to put into a little box of responsibility, but the decision itself to divorce and the direct reason for it is publicly assigned to you by your ex wife.

Now I assume your ex-wife would not additionally comment on your ex-girlfriend's Facebook status saying she "kept that seat warm and in good condition" so I can't continue with the marriage analogy but stranger things have happened

[TheHoveringSojourn808]

I'm a firm believer right now that he was "let go" though. And I believe he agreed to the terms of being let go via a non disclosure agreement that likely included a payment towards MM to not bad mouth the band.  I don't think that means something bad happened. Possible, but I think that's unlikely.  More like, the band just wants to keep their agreements confidential, which is completely fine and normal. MM clearly knows MP's importance to the band.  I don't know who started the discussion and it is likely more like Stadler's point, it probably happened over time.  Maybe since that moment JP made a clear statement about MM being in the band. Who knows. There's no reason to think there's bad blood here though based on everything shared publicly. 

Because I don't believe there is bad blood, I also believe MM will be playing with DT again at some point, maybe a special anniversary show or the next time DT plays in Boston for a song. 

I also still feel bad for him, I think he wanted to continue being in DT but basically "took one for the team".  All my opinions and thoughts here.

"I understand Dream Theater's decision to get Mike Portnoy back at this time" I don't know in what universe you say that if it was your decision to leave.

But as you and a few people have said or suggested, you either say yes and are probably given generous terms to leave or you say no and then what?

Not to argue with you but we've given examples of how that works.   A decision was made for my wife and I to divorce.   Did one of us just go to the other and say "I'm DONE! You're OUT!"   No.  That never happened.   It was, if nothing else, an act of attrition. The magic at the end wasn't the same as the magic at the start.  She wanted to do other things outside the marriage, I wanted to do do other things outside the marriage and a decision was made to divorce.  Now, I don't think the timing here supports a LONG buildup, but I can ABSOLUTELY see a meeting of the five of them where Mike M. asked to have dispense to tour his solo album, or something along the lines of something that differed from the rest of the band (or some members) and the rest of the band (or some members) saying "IF you do that, that's fine, but then I think we the rest of us should do this", and at some point the "this" was bringing Mike P. back.   And Mike M. saying "Wow, I understand that."   

I don't know; I feel like this isn't that complicated; I can't speak for anyone else  but my life just doesn't work in discrete blocks of action like that.  Everything is a continuum.  And sometimes a continuum is not easy to put into words.   

Sorry to hear you're getting divorced, that sounds stressful.

Well, thank you, but for clarity, it happened ten years time ago.   I've thankfully bounced back, but it certainly was a monumental time in my life and even looking back over those ten years, it's hard to put things in discrete little boxes of responsibility.   

ahh, gotcha. well i'm glad you're doing better now!

[skydivingninja]

No one says "I understand the decision" instead of "we made a decision" if something was done mutually. If MM and DT wanted to mutually part they would have said so.

I haven't been super hot on Mangini era DT outside of the excellent Distance Over Time, but comparing my favorite Mangini tracks to even mid Portnoy tracks, the difference in creativity and enjoyment I get from listening to the drums is very clear. Glad to hear he'll be back and I'm curious to see if DT get a bit more adventurous with their sound rather than the refinement of the standard DT sound they've been working on the past 15 years (excepting The Astonishing).