Parasomnia Timeline Thread

[crystalstars17]

MP will bring the fun back.

That depends on what you define as "fun".

[Stadler]

I agree with what you have said here. The driving forces here are JP and to a lesser extent JR, given the prominent role the guitar has in this band. I will not comment on MP's supposed arrangement skills as it is not something I have ever followed, although on a more general level I take your tongue-in-cheek point about his deified status when it comes to certain things. More recently he is also apparently the deity of groove/feel (since he has a tendency to speed up), though I have never heard his name mentioned once in drum circles in the context of deep pocket, groove, or 'feel' drummers, who tend to be represented by totally separate genres of music.

On the View thread someone recently posted that adding MP to the mix would have 'spiced things up' and could have made it great, so apparently just adding Mike Portnoy to a whole variety of things just makes whatever the thing is better. 

All will be answered in due course but I think that right now there is a bit of nostalgia creeping into peoples' forward looking sentiments about the band's output.

Look, if you don't agree, you don't agree, that's fine, but you seem to have a not-so-veiled mocking tone in there that I'm not sure is warranted.  I DO think he spices things up, for real.  I DO think he brings a lot to the table that is intangible beyond 74/17 time signatures and 8,461 beats per minute (see, snark goes both ways).   

There is ABSOLUTELY nostalgia creeping in; so?  I've long written that Dream Theater up to 2010 was an elite band for me; I got into them in '92 with Images and Words, and though I moved around/traveled a lot for work and so didn't get to experience the seminal live shows of the era, I bought every single, every album etc, etc, and checked every show for the setlist, blah blah blah.  And after? They were great, don't get me wrong, but they were one among several.  I've seen a lot of there things that made DT special during the Portnoy years bubble up in the projects he did outside - Transatlantic, Flying Colors, Neal Morse - and I'm hoping they return or are at least more emphasized on his return.

I believe a lot in chemistry and the "locker room".  I believe in group/band dynamics.   Yes is great, but Yes isn't the same with Wakeman as with Kaye.  Yes isn't the same with Howe as with Rabin.  Marillion is still great with Hogarth, but it's a different dynamic with H than with Fish.  Portnoy is a charismatic, powerful figure and I don't think we should mock his inputs and presence in the work he does.  We don't have to appreciate it, I get that, but understand that others might.     

[Awaken]

Definitely. It's also taking over as a general sentiment that overshadows a good deal of posts  which is why I've been away more often than not.

And it seems that now this is all we're gonna get?? MP taking over setlists, MP taking over social media, etc.

Adding more of a particular "spice" to a recipe doesn't always make it better, in fact it can destroy the flavor entirely. And even if it's a "spice" you can tolerate in small doses but are not particularly a fan of to begin with, too much of it can make the whole thing intolerable and put you off from something you once loved.

And reading this sounds even more like nostalgia is the recipe they're serving. Whatever happened to the promise of honoring the last thirteen years?

I hope I am wrong and that things balance out in the future, or it may unfortunately be time to say "No, thank you".

If I am "nostalgic" for anything now it's last summer, before this all happened. 😭

Totally understand your sentiment.  I felt very similar when MP left and they had to find a replacement to move on.  I think the return of MP will mean good things for the band all around, and I think the one who will benefit most is JLB. 

1.  can anyone argue that DT's social media presence was anything but ads for endorsed products since MP left?  Having him 'take back the reigns' will only lead to more fan interaction, which I have really missed.  Don't get me wrong, I appreciated what the members did while MM was in the band - but it's very obvious that it's not their preference and that's ok.  It wouldn't be mine, either.
2.  regarding the 'nostalgia' - yes, I'm definitely guilty of this and I know others are too.  While I have LOVED most everything the band released w MM, it definitely did feel like *something* was missing.  I'm not in the room while they write, I see what most people here see regarding those interactions.  But I do get the sense that MP is not afraid to challenge the direction and want to try something else.  Sleeping Giant is a perfect example of a song I personally feel would have benefitted from someone pushing back and saying 'hey, this verse kinda sounds samey to a few other songs we've done lately, maybe we try something like this instead'.  That's what I think is missing most since he left.  They don't work w outside producers, I think the return of MP will be as close to that as we'll see for this band.  I have loved what he and JP have come up with in everything they've done - they have a writing chemistry that I miss in DT.
3. To my point re: JLB above.  No secret the bad blood between MP and JLB in the past.  However, when he came back, it was made very clear to him (read rolling stone article) that this isn't the same band he left.  Coming back means - play nice w everyone, accept a different role, but don't forget - MP help found this band, and I believe him coming back to it will bring a new found 'let's make this the best we possibly can' and that means helping w vocal melodies that JLB can handle not only in the studio, but live.  I honestly believe he could be helpful in tweaking older songs to better fit JLB's current range. 

I really hope you stick around - you're obviously very passionate about the MM era of the band and I can only guess you've grown to appreciate the older MP-era material too.   I may be nostalgic, and the next album may fall short of expectations, but I think we're all in for a treat when we finally hear it.

[SeRoX]

Offical DT instagram page says KEYBORDS are fully done.

[Zydar]

"The keyboard wizardry is complete! All tracks for the new album are officially wrapped up!"

[nobloodyname]

Yeah, great.

Can we get back to arguing about DT being weakened by MP's return, please?

[emtee]

So just vocals/lyrics now, right?

[Mosh]

Man, MP's no comment on Metropolis 3 feels pretty suspicious. I feel like if they weren't doing it he would just say so. Seems weird to be ambiguous if that's not exactly what they're doing.

[WilliamMunny]

Man, MP's no comment on Metropolis 3 feels pretty suspicious. I feel like if they weren't doing it he would just say so. Seems weird to be ambiguous if that's not exactly what they're doing.

I have no basis for this other than my own gut, but I'd be shocked if the band didn't announce Metropolis Pt. 3.

[Mladen]

The comments along the lines of "we're currently not discussing Metropolis part 3" are particularly cryptic. Are they not discussing it with each other or with us? 

[Adami]

I feel like at this point DT should release a bonus song called Metropolis Pt. 3 where they just play as fast as they can for 20 seconds while everyone yells "ARE YOU HAPPY NOW?!?!?"

[The Letter M]

Watch "Metropolis Part 3" be a 4-minute ballad with just piano, acoustic guitar and vocals.

-Marc

[fadetoblackdude7]

Man, Jordan works fast!

[crystalstars17]

The comments along the lines of "we're currently not discussing Metropolis part 3" are particularly cryptic. Are they not discussing it with each other or with us? 

I hope it means that it never crossed their minds.

[Mosh]

I actually could see them doing a part 3 in form of a single epic song. There are different ways it could manifest. The novelization of Scenes seems oddly timed as well.

[MirrorMask]

The comments along the lines of "we're currently not discussing Metropolis part 3" are particularly cryptic. Are they not discussing it with each other or with us? 

I hope it means that it never crossed their minds.

Me too.

And I still want them to do a Metropolis part 3 which is many minutes of the static noise like the end of SFAM with the disc finally skipping or someone turning it down upon discovering Nick's body 

[Pettor]

I am not ashamed at all for getting hyped with having MP back. Sure it's nostalgia or whatever, but being hyped for something is fun and I am a big fan of MP. For me this is exciting fun times for my favorite band. Haven't looked forward to a tour this much with DT in years and by the ticket sale it seems many are. Maybe the tour and album comes and the whole thing wears of in just one album but for now I am enjoying the ride. Being excited for an album and not know exactly what it will be is pretty great tbh.

I guess I am not sure where or what MP would have spiced up (made things less dull)? Is it a drum thing or just an arrangement of the songs thing? I would think that if it is a drum thing, you got one of the most spiced up records you're ever going to get from the band on the last album.

The one area that I can think of that got a *tiny* bit mundane was the guitar riffage and I am not seeing any scenario where MP has meaningful say in that. There is a view that DT just isn't innovating anymore and everything is getting boring. I get that sentiment but not understanding what exactly MP is going to do to make their output more flavorful/spicy/caliente.

Well it has been a bit more boring recently to be honest. I love the guys but MP is an energetic charismatic figure. He is inspired by music from all around the spectrum and I believe his creative juice is partly influenced by that. He also influence the band quite a lot, more than I believe MM did.

But let's start with the drumming. I do think the last two records had a great sound for MM that the first three didn't, but I guess the Finally Free ending solo is a good indication of something I feel overall. MP drumming is just so much more interesting and fun to me. I honestly think MP is great at enhancing a song and adding that needed playfulness to the band. In The Name of God is another good example. The crazy note section with JR and JP could just be notes by number but I believe what MP does there makes the whole section more groovy and enjoyable.

(Link) https://www.youtube.com/shorts/EeF5O-rPPfI


Let's rank according to this:

Playful [---------------------] Technical

I understand there's tons of dimension to playing music and this is a simplification. I think MM is far right on that bar. JR and JP is quite far as well but not as much as MM. MP is a bit more to the left compared to the others, I believe.

When you say the last album was "one of the most spiced up records" I weirdly can't agree. It's technical and correct in a way. Some moments are ofc great and the title track maybe brings most of the excitement. D/T was more in my taste I guess. ADTOE had moments where I def missed MP a lot.

[gborland]

That depends on what you define as "fun".

Do you like Viper King? No judgment; I'm genuinely curious to know what you think of it, as I know many others hate it.

[crystalstars17]

Do you like Viper King? No judgment; I'm genuinely curious to know what you think of it, as I know many others hate it.

I am firmly in the "hate it" camp 😅 And that's one of my favorite albums, too. When I listen to DoT I just act like it doesn't exist. In my world, Pale Blue Dot is the very last song. 🤣

No judgement here either though! There's something for everyone.

[Jamesman42]

Do you like Viper King? No judgment; I'm genuinely curious to know what you think of it, as I know many others hate it.

I just heard this song for the first time yesterday. It's pretty cool and definitely more fun than a lot of the later MM era.

[BlackInk]

I don't like Viper King as a song that much either, but there's definetely a fun vibe to it that I appreciate.

I will not comment on MP's supposed arrangement skills as it is not something I have ever followed, although on a more general level I take your tongue-in-cheek point about his deified status when it comes to certain things. More recently he is also apparently the deity of groove/feel (since he has a tendency to speed up), though I have never heard his name mentioned once in drum circles in the context of deep pocket, groove, or 'feel' drummers, who tend to be represented by totally separate genres of music.

For me personally, emphasizing MP's groove was always specifically in comparison to MM, which is an outlier in lack of groove (at least in DT), rather than MP being an outlier in having it.

Man, MP's no comment on Metropolis 3 feels pretty suspicious. I feel like if they weren't doing it he would just say so. Seems weird to be ambiguous if that's not exactly what they're doing.

Maybe, but trying to put myself in the situation of MP being asked a random question in an interview, it could just be that he means that it's not something they've talked about, but that they've never said explicitly that they won't so there's no reason to 100% rule it out.

I'm also in the camp that wish they don't do Metropolis part 3, there's no need for that and can pretty much only fail.

[crystalstars17]

I'm also in the camp that wish they don't do Metropolis part 3, there's no need for that and can pretty much only fail.

The ONLY reason they would do it is fan service/nostalgia, which would make it pretty tacky.

[The Letter M]

Look who's been resurrected! Yes, Jose has been here at the studio and has reassembled my Black & Silver Monster for the first time since my last show w DT (Aug 8th 2010 in Tokyo)
🎼 "So glad to see you my friend...it's been a while..." 🎶

https://www.facebook.com/share/epRV9rwxJhzjLGmL/?mibextid=oFDknk

-Marc.

[Mosh]

Going back to that MP interview, I feel like there was actually quite a bit of juicy nuggets in there, but a lot of it is tea leaf reading.

1: I took the "picking up where we left off" comment less as the album is a direct successor to BCSL and more that it's in the style of that 1999-2009 lineup, which definitely had a signature sound compared to other eras of DT (they were still figuring out their style before JR joined imo). On the other hand, highlighting the Train of Thought album and A Nightmare To Remember in that interview gives a bit of a vibe that they are leaning in a heavier direction, at least more so than the last album which wasn't very heavy. Anyway, it's not like they deviated that much from their core style when Mangini joined, but I take MP's comments to not mean much more than "it sounds like the classic lineup of DT."

2: Honestly, MP is very intentional with what he says in interviews, and all of them are really. He knows that by answering the Metropolis 3 question the way he did it would trigger a ton of specuation among fans. Whether he's doing that to misdirect the fans in order to preserve the surprise of the new album or something else isn't clear, but I am increasingly starting to feel like Metropolis 3 is going to be a thing. It could even be limited to a single song, which actually would be an appropriate way to round out the trilogy. I don't think it's that weird or bad of a decision when you think about it. 

The thing with Metropolis imo is that it's such a loose concept to begin with. Part 1 was put there as a joke and between the original song and SFAM, the lyrics really have no tangible connection to each other. Home is the only attempt at actually tying the songs together and even then it's just callbacks to phrases from the original. If anything, there was more room for a sequel at the end of Part 2. If they're working with an author to flesh out SFAM for a novelization, I can easily see that leading them to figure out what a sequel would look like.

3: No setlist hints, but I'm hoping his love for Train of Thought brings him to include some more material in the setlist. I think since Mangini joined they only played 2 songs? I would love to see any of the others make a comeback, especially Stream of Consciousness and In the Name of God. SoC in particular seems like such a no brainer for a 3 hour set as it gives James an additional significant break. Calling out ANTR as a signature DT song also makes me think there's a good chance it makes an appearance. Also would not be surprised if The Best of Times makes it on.

Once again, for all the arguments about who the better drummer is or whether or not they are jumping the shark by making Metropolis 3, and as someone who enjoyed most of the Mangini era, I am really excited about what the band has cooking and I don't see any reason to go into this with optimism.

[emtee]

What an awesome looking kit.

His parts are done so I assume that will be for rehearsals and maybe last minute punch-in tweaks.

[HOF]

Going back to that MP interview, I feel like there was actually quite a bit of juicy nuggets in there, but a lot of it is tea leaf reading.

1: I took the "picking up where we left off" comment less as the album is a direct successor to BCSL and more that it's in the style of that 1999-2009 lineup, which definitely had a signature sound compared to other eras of DT (they were still figuring out their style before JR joined imo). On the other hand, highlighting the Train of Thought album and A Nightmare To Remember in that interview gives a bit of a vibe that they are leaning in a heavier direction, at least more so than the last album which wasn't very heavy. Anyway, it's not like they deviated that much from their core style when Mangini joined, but I take MP's comments to not mean much more than "it sounds like the classic lineup of DT."

2: Honestly, MP is very intentional with what he says in interviews, and all of them are really. He knows that by answering the Metropolis 3 question the way he did it would trigger a ton of specuation among fans. Whether he's doing that to misdirect the fans in order to preserve the surprise of the new album or something else isn't clear, but I am increasingly starting to feel like Metropolis 3 is going to be a thing. It could even be limited to a single song, which actually would be an appropriate way to round out the trilogy. I don't think it's that weird or bad of a decision when you think about it. 

The thing with Metropolis imo is that it's such a loose concept to begin with. Part 1 was put there as a joke and between the original song and SFAM, the lyrics really have no tangible connection to each other. Home is the only attempt at actually tying the songs together and even then it's just callbacks to phrases from the original. If anything, there was more room for a sequel at the end of Part 2. If they're working with an author to flesh out SFAM for a novelization, I can easily see that leading them to figure out what a sequel would look like.

3: No setlist hints, but I'm hoping his love for Train of Thought brings him to include some more material in the setlist. I think since Mangini joined they only played 2 songs? I would love to see any of the others make a comeback, especially Stream of Consciousness and In the Name of God. SoC in particular seems like such a no brainer for a 3 hour set as it gives James an additional significant break. Calling out ANTR as a signature DT song also makes me think there's a good chance it makes an appearance. Also would not be surprised if The Best of Times makes it on.

Once again, for all the arguments about who the better drummer is or whether or not they are jumping the shark by making Metropolis 3, and as someone who enjoyed most of the Mangini era, I am really excited about what the band has cooking and I don't see any reason to go into this with optimism.

All of this sounds pretty discouraging for me in terms of hoping the new DT will be of interest to me.

[brakkum]

2.  regarding the 'nostalgia' - yes, I'm definitely guilty of this and I know others are too.  While I have LOVED most everything the band released w MM, it definitely did feel like *something* was missing.  I'm not in the room while they write, I see what most people here see regarding those interactions.  But I do get the sense that MP is not afraid to challenge the direction and want to try something else.  Sleeping Giant is a perfect example of a song I personally feel would have benefitted from someone pushing back and saying 'hey, this verse kinda sounds samey to a few other songs we've done lately, maybe we try something like this instead'.  That's what I think is missing most since he left.  They don't work w outside producers, I think the return of MP will be as close to that as we'll see for this band.  I have loved what he and JP have come up with in everything they've done - they have a writing chemistry that I miss in DT.

This is my exact feeling too about "The MP Debate"™️. I think he helps reign in JP especially and provides a much need pull to JP's push.

[hunnus2000]

I am not bashing JLB, but at this stage of his career, can he pull off ITNOG in the higher register?

[gzarruk]

"The keyboard wizardry is complete! All tracks for the new album are officially wrapped up!"

The bolded section reads to me like they finished recording the whole album, but James still hasn't recorded anything yet, has he? I guess they finally made an all instrumental record with James on the tambourine.

As for Met. 3, I'm in the camp who thinks it's the worst idea they could ever try. It'd just feel like a huge nostalgia and easy cash grab move on their part, as those anniversary tours for IAW and SFAM feel in retrospective. Of course, there's the chance they felt genuinely inspired by the story and organically wanted to expand it more, but I'm VERY skeptical on that. (not that my opinion matters too much to the band anyway )

[Ben_Jamin]

I am really hoping for Stream of Consciousness to be in the set.

[hefdaddy42]

None of this stuff from MP really means anything.

[TheHoveringSojourn808]

He's got the hornets buzzin' though!!!

[MirrorMask]

The thing with Metropolis imo is that it's such a loose concept to begin with. Part 1 was put there as a joke and between the original song and SFAM, the lyrics really have no tangible connection to each other. Home is the only attempt at actually tying the songs together and even then it's just callbacks to phrases from the original. If anything, there was more room for a sequel at the end of Part 2.

How so? all the characters in both timelines (past and present) died, and the only one who survived is the villain.

[devieira73]

About Met.3, maybe the writing of Met.2's novel sparked any really interesting idea? I'm skeptical about that, but I never imagined they could write a great Toy Story 4 and they did!
But if it happens, I would prefer DT doing it in a just one song than an entire album, since I would prefer a new album with fresh musical ideas than with a lot of recurring themes from another album.

Maybe a double album, with the second disc being Met.3 as a 40 minute epic?

[Mosh]

How so? all the characters in both timelines (past and present) died, and the only one who survived is the villain.

Since they brought in the concepts of cycles and reincarnation they could easily just reincarnate Victoria/Nicholas and give that character a new mystery to solve. Anything that they flesh out in the novel could also be used as foreshadowing for a sequel (which is why I think the novel could easily be a way for them to justify continuing the story). The new reincarnation could try to kill the villain as revenge plot. Idk, there are different ways to do it.

I am not saying it's a great story idea.  But it is more to work with than the original song lyrics which were pretty abstract and didn't really contain any discernible characters or themes.