DT to play the whole I&W in full next year!

[bosk1]

TITL also talks about "cast[ing] off the monsters inside."

Don't see how that relates to Epica, either, but I thought I'd just throw that out there.

The opening song doesn't relate to Epica.  But the fact that I was listening to Epica when I was is a clue.

Just one question though: why not Scarred, Finally Free or The Great Debate?.. The three of them match the description too..

Interesting.

[Tony From Long Island]

I Am The Killing HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAND!

I think I can say with almost 100% certainty that they won't open with The Killing Hand   :-)



"For those who understand . . . I extend my hand . . . . to the doubtful I demand . . . take me as I am . .  ."     I'd love that as an opener

[jsbru]

Just one question though: why not Scarred, Finally Free or The Great Debate?.. The three of them match the description too..

If these three are "interesting," the only one that strikes me as unusual as an opener is Finally Free.  I'd say that is a fan favorite.  It's lyrics talk about Friday afternoon, though, and bosk was listening to it on a Thursday afternoon (although if he works at a defense firm, I'm sure Thursday, Friday, Saturday all might seem like the same day to him  )..

I don't know of TGD as a crowd pleaser or something that strikes me as odd to open with.

I love Scarred, but I don't that it's a fan favorite generally.

I guess Bosk is in Pacific time, so his posts were at 2:58 and 3:23 on a Thursday afternoon--the first listening to the mystery track, and the second listening to Epica.

That's a 25 minute gap, and the song is less than 25 minutes.  But we don't know for sure that his second post is when he started listening to Epica.

Nothing I can think of relates to "Thursday" in a DT song, so it might have something to do with the time.

Where is clocks guy when you need him... 

[jsbru]

.

oops

[bosk1]

Try to remember to PM me the day before the first show, and I will connect the dots for you and tell you exactly where you have been right and where you have been off in your analysis. 

[Tony From Long Island]

" . . . . . I love Scarred, but I don't that it's a fan favorite generally. . . . . . "


Interesting you should say that.   A former band I was in  played Scarred . . . along with Glass Moon, Pull Me Unda, and bits from Change of Seasons . . .      Of course I had been booted by that point because I am not nearly competent enough of a guitarist to play DT!

Scarred was one of our favorite DT songs.

[jsbru]

" . . . . . I love Scarred, but I don't that it's a fan favorite generally. . . . . . "


Interesting you should say that.   A former band I was in  played Scarred . . . along with Glass Moon, Pull Me Unda, and bits from Change of Seasons . . .      Of course I had been booted by that point because I am not nearly competent enough of a guitarist to play DT!

Scarred was one of our favorite DT songs.

It's in my Top 4.  BAI, TTT, Scarred, and ToT.

They're all kind of similar in style and length.  Could be described as mini-epics.  It's hard for me to decide between those four which is my all-time favorite, as each of them probably have been at some point.  I think currently it's ToT by a hair, although I am learning BAI on guitar right now.

Three of those four were played on the BTFW DVD, so that was a treat.  And TTT will definitely be on this upcoming tour.

With that said, I always thought these were more popular with a select group of hardcore fans than with the general fan base.  But other than that, they all fit within the criteria listed.

I don't know how the timing of bosks posts implicate any one of them, either.

[bosk1]

I am listening to Epica again right now.  But not for any reason that relates to DT.  I just wanted to listen to them.  So I just thought I would share that here so people would speculate as to whether it might mean something.  It doesn't. 

[jsbru]

I'll be listening to them in a minute, too, because I'll be heading Home.  Plaintiffs attorneys don't work Friday afternoons.

[bosk1]

  I know.  Or after 4:00 p.m.  That's why I eventually took a government job.  I liked plaintiffs' attorneys' hours, but placed a bit more value on my immortal soul than to be one.

EDIT:  By the way, if I understood some of your earlier posts correctly, you were not previously familiar with Epica.  For the vast majority of bands, I would probably not recommend a live release as an introduction.  But Epica is the exception.  I recommend checking out Retrospect.  It is an excellent introduction to a huge chunk of their discography, and it was a great live performance.  The video is cool as well, but the lighting at that show was odd and was not conducive to being captured on a live video release and can be distracting.  If you watch it, you will see what I mean.  But outstanding release.

[Samsara]

They should open with Vacant...just to piss everyone off. 

[jsbru]

Whoops...Wednesday afternoon.

Can't see how that's significant quite yet.

[thosava]

He was listening to the song in the afternoon. Probably while watching a crimson sunset, in the chill of November the 30th.

[bosk1]

I'll always remember...

[TheAtliator]

Just one question though: why not Scarred, Finally Free or The Great Debate?.. The three of them match the description too..

Interesting.

I was thinking of keeping those included, but I just don't see how they could open with FF, and the other two are only my favorites, probably not crowd pleasers.


The 25-minute difference between listening to the song and listening to Epica could mean that the song is almost 25 minutes long, but there could have also just been a gap between songs. It could also mean Illumination Theory if Epica comes after Dream Theater alphabetically in Bosk's iTunes you don't have the Astonishing in your library so IT is the last DT song 

[TheAtliator]

I don't see how "Innocence" is a "monster" song, and they have already opened with the Crimson Sunrise...

[bosk1]

I am listening to The Astonishing right now.  I use Windows Media Player. 

[RaiseTheKnife]

Shattered Fortress is another candidate which I have not seen bandied around much here yet, though Illumination Theory seems more likely in my opinion.

[TheAtliator]

Well you considered ToTs "question" and there were 20 minutes between posts so it's Illumination Theory

[ToT-147]

Just one question though: why not Scarred, Finally Free or The Great Debate?.. The three of them match the description too..

If these three are "interesting," the only one that strikes me as unusual as an opener is Finally Free.  I'd say that is a fan favorite.  It's lyrics talk about Friday afternoon, though, and bosk was listening to it on a Thursday afternoon (although if he works at a defense firm, I'm sure Thursday, Friday, Saturday all might seem like the same day to him  )..

I don't know of TGD as a crowd pleaser or something that strikes me as odd to open with.

I love Scarred, but I don't that it's a fan favorite generally.

Instead, I think the most unusual of the three is TGD.. Regarding Scarred, I do think is a fan favorite; at least judging by the polls I've seen here (including the DT league, in which IIRC has always ranked ninth) and in other places about the best songs..

Having said that, I agree with FF being the more plausible option of these three.. But I guess we'll see...

[thosava]

Yeah i'm starting to believe it might be Illumination Theory too. I have already seen it live, so was hoping for another mega-epic on this tour, but Illumination Theory is a great song too!

[ToT-147]

Yeah.. Me too..

EDIT:

I'd say it's between Trial of Tears, TDEN, BAI, IT... or Finally Free..

[jsbru]

Finally Free does sort of follow from the end of The Astonishing...

[Octavarious]

Since MP would be touring with the 12 step suite, I don't expect that any of these songs would be featured in a show which would tour about the same time. Am I right?

[V_R11]

Wouldn't IT require them touring with an orchestra?

[MirrorMask]

Wouldn't IT require them touring with an orchestra?

It was never required during the whole DT12 tour so I wouldn't see why it would need one now.

[ToT-147]

Since MP would be touring with the 12 step suite, I don't expect that any of these songs would be featured in a show which would tour about the same time. Am I right?

Good point..

Wouldn't IT require them touring with an orchestra?

It was never required during the whole DT12 tour so I wouldn't see why it would need one now.

Hmmm.. I don't know.. Now that I'm thinking in that section, it'd be a bit strange if they don't skip it or something like that.. What would they do while the orchestral section is played on the background?.. Show the same visual the AFTR tour had?... a different one?.. Mmmm...

[TheAtliator]

They should do something clever with that part to actually play it live between JP and JR, not necessarily to sound exactly like the original, but to play the melody. It would be nice to hear acoustic guitar and piano or something.

[KevShmev]

Since MP would be touring with the 12 step suite, I don't expect that any of these songs would be featured in a show which would tour about the same time. Am I right?

Nah.  If they end up not playing any of those songs, that won't be the reason why, nor should it be.

[thosava]

They should do something clever with that part to actually play it live between JP and JR, not necessarily to sound exactly like the original, but to play the melody. It would be nice to hear acoustic guitar and piano or something.

That's a great idea! It's always cool with alternate live versions of songs.

[gzarruk]

I just watched the live version of Outcry from LALP and...wow, what a song! Hope they play it again on the next tour. One of the best from the MM era.

[YtseJamittaja]

OMG OMG OMG I just bought a meet&greet ticket for Helsinki show!!!

[jsbru]

Maybe it is Octavarium.  It was played during the tour where they recorded "Score."  They haven't played it with MM (as far as I know, but I'm not an expert on what they've played on every leg of every tour), but that could qualify as "recent."  Razor's Edge was also part of Schmedly Wilcox a few years later.  It's 24 minutes, which meets bosk's critera, and would fit in between his listening to it and his listening to Epica.  This would fit in with MM having to translate it as well.

ACOS would sort of fit as well, being 23 minutes, but they've already opened with Crimson Sunrise, and really haven't played that whole song recently.  But it does have "chill of November" in it, and bosk was listening to it on the last day of November.  And they have played parts of this song as recently as last year.

[julien_fr]

TITL also talks about "cast[ing] off the monsters inside."

Don't see how that relates to Epica, either, but I thought I'd just throw that out there.

The opening song doesn't relate to Epica.  But the fact that I was listening to Epica when I was is a clue.

Just one question though: why not Scarred, Finally Free or The Great Debate?.. The three of them match the description too..

Interesting.

It's Finally Free IMHO.

bosk1 finds interesting that the song is being suspected as the opener. I agree with jsbru, that reduces the hypothesis to those 3 songs Scarred, Finally Free or The Great Debate.
Opening the show with Scarred or TGD would be an unexpected choice because it has never been done, but still a good thing to hear them as openers.
But Finally Free? That is really unexpected! (especially if they play the tape "You are once again surrounded by a brillant white light...")

First, it's a fan favorite.

He emphasized the fact that they did not open with that song.

Bosk, have they EVER opened with this song before?

Opened?  No.  And I think the reason it didn't register is that it has been played in recent years, and I knew it is a crowd pleaser.  So despite it being in the #1 slot, I just skimmed right past it without thinking.

So I though they may have closed with it in the recent years.
It appears that, during the 2014 tour, they played songs from SFAM for it's birthday (saw them twice in Paris that year).
And they closed with Finally Free.

bosk1 is an Epica listener, maybe he just fees good when he listen to them ?
He was listening to them friday December 2nd, so he was "feeling good this that friday afternoon"... ?
That Epica part relly needs improvement.

Finally, It's a monster song because...
well first Portnoy
second it's 12 minutes long (and bosk1 seem to have a different idea of what an epic song is ; you may think an epic is 20-minutes long, but to him, it may be 10-minutes ?)
and then during the last 4 minutes, the drums seems to be really difficult (to me as a non-drummer).
Mangini would not want to improvise that part, but play it the way it has been written by Portnoy, hence the fact he wants to transcribe it...

What do you think ?

[Fritzinger]

But Finally Free has already been played by Mangini. BTW, I didn't like what he did at the end of the song.. Portnoy completely killed it at the end, it was HIS big moment of the Live Scenes album imho. Mangini just played some rhythmical variations and easy polyrhythms. Cmon MM you're better than that.