Portnoy invites the DT guys to play the 12 step with him

[King Postwhore]

I get you.  It gets blurry at time goes by.  Old fogey problems.  But it still remains all on Mike.

[bosk1]

I get you.  It gets blurry at time goes by.  Old fogey problems.  But it still remains all on Mike.

Well, yes...  But I still feel like that kind of terminology is misleading.  It still kinda "takes sides."  As I've said elsewhere, I don't think there really are "sides" to the story, because it wasn't a "Mike vs. the band" situation--at least, as far as the information presented.  They just had incompatible interests and came to an impasse on how to resolve it.  Mike thought it was in his and the band's best interests to take a break.  The other four felt it was in the band's best interests to keep up the momentum and move forward immediately as had already been planned and scheduled.  Mike presented compromise positions, and perhaps those were fair, but none of them ultimately would have allowed the band to move forward on the schedule they had all previously agreed to and scheduled.  Rather than move forward with the plan, Mike opted to step aside.  And that's fine.  It was his choice.  He made it.  They moved on. 

[Prog Snob]

I get you.  It gets blurry at time goes by.  Old fogey problems.  But it still remains all on Mike.

Well, yes...  But I still feel like that kind of terminology is misleading.  It still kinda "takes sides."  As I've said elsewhere, I don't think there really are "sides" to the story, because it wasn't a "Mike vs. the band" situation--at least, as far as the information presented.  They just had incompatible interests and came to an impasse on how to resolve it.  Mike thought it was in his and the band's best interests to take a break.  The other four felt it was in the band's best interests to keep up the momentum and move forward immediately as had already been planned and scheduled.  Mike presented compromise positions, and perhaps those were fair, but none of them ultimately would have allowed the band to move forward on the schedule they had all previously agreed to and scheduled.  Rather than move forward with the plan, Mike opted to step aside.  And that's fine.  It was his choice.  He made it.  They moved on.

DTF hasn't. 

[King Postwhore]

And I get that but even though I loved him for this, maybe 2 things happened.  He loved playing in side projects.  So 1.  Maybe he was burnt out on DT because he was playing so much or 2.  He found out he was burnt out on their style and loved playing with other players.   While I loved all his side projects, it had to have an affect on his decision to take a break.

[Prog Snob]

And I get that but even though I loved him for this, maybe 2 things happened.  He loved playing in side projects.  So 1.  Maybe he was burnt out on DT because he was playing so much or 2.  He found out he was burnt out on their style and loved playing with other players.   While I loved all his side projects, it had to have an affect on his decision to take a break.

I would think it most certainly had an EFFECT on his decision. He likes to keep busy and try new ventures to experiment and experience the different kinds of music he enjoys.

[cramx3]

Sometimes you don't know how good you got it until it's gone.  I 100% believe that is what he realized.

[mikeyd23]

I would think it most certainly had an EFFECT on his decision. He likes to keep busy and try new ventures to experiment and experience the different kinds of music he enjoys.

Sometimes you don't know how good you got it until it's gone.  I 100% believe that is what he realized.

Agreed on both points.

[King Postwhore]

And I get that but even though I loved him for this, maybe 2 things happened.  He loved playing in side projects.  So 1.  Maybe he was burnt out on DT because he was playing so much or 2.  He found out he was burnt out on their style and loved playing with other players.   While I loved all his side projects, it had to have an affect on his decision to take a break.

I would think it most certainly had an EFFECT on his decision. He likes to keep busy and try new ventures to experiment and experience the different kinds of music he enjoys.

I put affect.  Oops!

[Prog Snob]

[DarkLord_Lalinc]

"Leaving"  while having no other option isn't really quitting.       "Letting someone leave"  while declining to show any type of loyalty to a founding member and long-time friend isn't really "firing"    so maybe it's a little of both.

Wow, no.

[Sir GuitarCozmo]

I was reading through this thread and to all those who say DT and MP will eventually get back together or might get back together then site GnR, Van Halen ect.. as examples. Keep in mind that the majority of the bands oft brought up split when they were in their 30's. DT are all within 49-59. Like it or not they don't have another 30 years in them.

Plus, no offense intended to DT, bands like GnR and Van Halen were about a million times more popular and well known, so the pressure to reunite would be far more expected than if it was DT.

[Darkstarshades]

Go ask your glorious master supreme commander duke count holy shit overlord king of the seven seas master of puppets highlord of masters and patriarchs if your majesty was kicked or quit DT. And the tyrant will tell you he left.

[Bertielee]

"Leaving"  while having no other option isn't really quitting.       "Letting someone leave"  while declining to show any type of loyalty to a founding member and long-time friend isn't really "firing"    so maybe it's a little of both.

Wow, no.

Sorry, Tony, but do you know MP personally? It's an honest question, because you seem to take all this really at heart to the point of rearranging things so that they can suit your point of view.

B.Lee

[CodyWanKenobi]

He thought relationships were strained in DT. ***

Wanted a break to go off touring with AX7

DT didn't want a break so he left to join AX7

AX7 said that was never on the cards

MP tried to get back in DT but they'd already hired Mangini and gone through all the legal stuff to do that.

This is all from the mouths of DT & AX7. Of course what MP said happened is probably different...




*** Funnily enough - everyone gets on great now.....

Honestly guys, this.

[Kotowboy]

I just groan when I see that MP will " obviously " rejoin DT like it's 100% a done deal.

Nobody knows what will happen tomorrow of course but to be that certain....

[Darkstarshades]

I just groan when I see that MP will " obviously " rejoin DT like it's 100% a done deal.

Nobody knows what will happen tomorrow of course but to be that certain....

Mike Portnoy will obviously return DT

DT just lost the manliness that used to make them DT.

[King Postwhore]

 

[KevShmev]

I get you.  It gets blurry at time goes by.  Old fogey problems.  But it still remains all on Mike.

Well, yes...  But I still feel like that kind of terminology is misleading.  It still kinda "takes sides."  As I've said elsewhere, I don't think there really are "sides" to the story, because it wasn't a "Mike vs. the band" situation--at least, as far as the information presented.  They just had incompatible interests and came to an impasse on how to resolve it.  Mike thought it was in his and the band's best interests to take a break.  The other four felt it was in the band's best interests to keep up the momentum and move forward immediately as had already been planned and scheduled.  Mike presented compromise positions, and perhaps those were fair, but none of them ultimately would have allowed the band to move forward on the schedule they had all previously agreed to and scheduled.  Rather than move forward with the plan, Mike opted to step aside.  And that's fine.  It was his choice.  He made it.  They moved on.

DTF hasn't. 

Actually, DTF has, when you consider that most of the posters here have accepted Mangini as the new drummer.  That is moving on.

The Portnoy fans who still long for the old days, insist that he was the heart and soul of the band, and keep insisting that he will be back one day, are the ones who can't get over it.

[Bertielee]

I get you.  It gets blurry at time goes by.  Old fogey problems.  But it still remains all on Mike.

Well, yes...  But I still feel like that kind of terminology is misleading.  It still kinda "takes sides."  As I've said elsewhere, I don't think there really are "sides" to the story, because it wasn't a "Mike vs. the band" situation--at least, as far as the information presented.  They just had incompatible interests and came to an impasse on how to resolve it.  Mike thought it was in his and the band's best interests to take a break.  The other four felt it was in the band's best interests to keep up the momentum and move forward immediately as had already been planned and scheduled.  Mike presented compromise positions, and perhaps those were fair, but none of them ultimately would have allowed the band to move forward on the schedule they had all previously agreed to and scheduled.  Rather than move forward with the plan, Mike opted to step aside.  And that's fine.  It was his choice.  He made it.  They moved on.

DTF hasn't. 

Actually, DTF has, when you consider that most of the posters here have accepted Mangini as the new drummer.  That is moving on.

The Portnoy fans who still long for the old days, insist that he was the heart and soul of the band, and keep insisting that he will be back one day, are the ones who can't get over it.

Exactly this.

[Kotowboy]

The Portnoy fans who still long for the old days, insist that he was the heart and soul of the band, and keep insisting that he will be back one day, are the ones who can't get over it.

Exactly this.

[Prog Snob]

I get you.  It gets blurry at time goes by.  Old fogey problems.  But it still remains all on Mike.

Well, yes...  But I still feel like that kind of terminology is misleading.  It still kinda "takes sides."  As I've said elsewhere, I don't think there really are "sides" to the story, because it wasn't a "Mike vs. the band" situation--at least, as far as the information presented.  They just had incompatible interests and came to an impasse on how to resolve it.  Mike thought it was in his and the band's best interests to take a break.  The other four felt it was in the band's best interests to keep up the momentum and move forward immediately as had already been planned and scheduled.  Mike presented compromise positions, and perhaps those were fair, but none of them ultimately would have allowed the band to move forward on the schedule they had all previously agreed to and scheduled.  Rather than move forward with the plan, Mike opted to step aside.  And that's fine.  It was his choice.  He made it.  They moved on.

DTF hasn't. 

Actually, DTF has, when you consider that most of the posters here have accepted Mangini as the new drummer.  That is moving on.

The Portnoy fans who still long for the old days, insist that he was the heart and soul of the band, and keep insisting that he will be back one day, are the ones who can't get over it.

I'm not saying that people haven't moved on. I'm saying it, in jest, that we still have this lengthy discussions about the whole damn thing, still arguing about the specifics. So, in part, it still can't be totally let go.

[King Postwhore]

It's never been the same since KM left.

[Darkstarshades]

It's never been the same since KM left.

Life on stage left with Steve Stone, guy knew how to turn on the audience.

[King Postwhore]

 

What's not controversial is bands with longevity never satisfy it's full fan base.   Band get influenced by the times.  Some fans are stuck in certain eras.  It's just life.

[Madman Shepherd]

It's never been the same since KM left.

Life on stage left with Steve Stone, guy knew how to turn on the audience.

Long Beach screamed for him

[TAC]

I get you.  It gets blurry at time goes by.  Old fogey problems. But it still remains all on Mike.

Well, yes...  But I still feel like that kind of terminology is misleading.  It still kinda "takes sides."  As I've said elsewhere, I don't think there really are "sides" to the story, because it wasn't a "Mike vs. the band" situation--at least, as far as the information presented.  They just had incompatible interests and came to an impasse on how to resolve it. Mike thought it was in his and the band's best interests to take a break.  The other four felt it was in the band's best interests to keep up the momentum and move forward immediately as had already been planned and scheduled.  Mike presented compromise positions, and perhaps those were fair, but none of them ultimately would have allowed the band to move forward on the schedule they had all previously agreed to and scheduled.  Rather than move forward with the plan, Mike opted to step aside.  And that's fine.  It was his choice.  He made it.  They moved on.

Check the boded.
Well, that's awful lawyerly, there, Bosky!

King says "It's on Mike".
Bosk says "It was his choice"
How is that any different?

[bosk1]

I get you.  It gets blurry at time goes by.  Old fogey problems. But it still remains all on Mike.

Well, yes...  But I still feel like that kind of terminology is misleading.  It still kinda "takes sides."  As I've said elsewhere, I don't think there really are "sides" to the story, because it wasn't a "Mike vs. the band" situation--at least, as far as the information presented.  They just had incompatible interests and came to an impasse on how to resolve it. Mike thought it was in his and the band's best interests to take a break.  The other four felt it was in the band's best interests to keep up the momentum and move forward immediately as had already been planned and scheduled.  Mike presented compromise positions, and perhaps those were fair, but none of them ultimately would have allowed the band to move forward on the schedule they had all previously agreed to and scheduled.  Rather than move forward with the plan, Mike opted to step aside.  And that's fine.  It was his choice.  He made it.  They moved on.

Check the boded.
Well, that's awful lawyerly, there, Bosky!

King says "It's on Mike".
Bosk says "It was his choice"
How is that any different?

As I have said, the only "difference" is in the tone.  I agree with the basic facts and the basic conclusion.  It's just that King's way of putting it makes it seem like it was "Mike Portnoy vs. DT" and that it was very contentious.  I have never really had the sense that it was.  Yes, it became that way after the fact, in large part I think because Of Portnoy's failure to handle the situation maturely.  But at the time, even though it truly was ultimately Mike's decision, you could almost say that it was mutual because they simply had incompatible goals.  That's all I'm saying.  Ultimately, we are saying nearly the same thing.  It's just the "MP vs. DT" tone that I object to. 

[WheyWaffles]

I know what we can all agree on:

Adrenaline Mob

Let's come together in camaraderie in our unspoken but likely unanimous feelings about Adrenaline Mob.

[bosk1]

No.  Let us not.

[King Postwhore]

It wasn't meant that way sir but I think we all can say Mike was burnt for many reasons on DT and him flirting with other bands didn't help.  Like you said, the other band members didn't feel the same and in the end Mike made the decision.

And this is from a guy that followed all the side projects and I loved that about him.

[WheyWaffles]

No.  Let us not.

There's young(er) Christopher Lee throwing a broadsword into my unifying Adrenaline Mob hate-in...

[Prog Snob]

No.  Let us not.

There's young(er) Christopher Lee throwing a broadsword into my unifying Adrenaline Mob hate-in...

I can share in your detestation of them. I've tried numerous times to listen to them but it just doesn't work for me.

[Sir GuitarCozmo]

I still chuckle about the episode of That Metal Show where Billy Sheehan was the guest musician and every time they'd cut to him to talk, they'd finish up and be like "And in that time, Mike Portnoy just joined three more bands", etc. 

[Tony From Long Island]

Plus, no offense intended to DT, bands like GnR and Van Halen were about a million times more popular and well known, so the pressure to reunite would be far more expected than if it was DT.

I'm not sure I agree.  It's true that those bands were far more well known and "popular,"   but DT has a much more hard-core and loyal fan base.

I actually felt TERRIBLE that I hate The Astonishing.   It mattered to me.  It bothered me that I hated it.

On the other hand, I actually kinda liked Van Halen III  :-)

[Prog Snob]

Plus, no offense intended to DT, bands like GnR and Van Halen were about a million times more popular and well known, so the pressure to reunite would be far more expected than if it was DT.

I'm not sure I agree.  It's true that those bands were far more well known and "popular,"   but DT has a much more hard-core and loyal fan base.

I actually felt TERRIBLE that I hate The Astonishing.   It mattered to me.  It bothered me that I hated it.

On the other hand, I actually kinda liked Van Halen III  :-)

I agree. DT have a cult following that would jump on board for a reunion no matter what. I don't think popularity has anything to do with it. That's sort of like saying that unless a band is exceedingly popular, why bother at all?