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Dream Theater => Dream Theater => Topic started by: The Trooper on July 09, 2016, 11:06:58 AM
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https://loudwire.com/mike-portnoy-invites-dream-theater-join-onstage-birthday-bash/
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THEY have made it clear THEY have no intention of reuniting....
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Well he's probably right. He clearly wants to reunite, they clearly don't.
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I'm sure it won't happen but it would be really awesome for them to put aside their differences and support their friend/former friend/ex-bandmate/whatever on this special occasion. It's a pipe dream but would it be so terrible for it to happen just to play that song? Nope.
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If i was in DT and had to put up with everything MP said in the press in the 2 years after he quit i'd be reticent too.
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I've been thinking about this and I'm starting to think that the reason DT isn't doing this isn't so much because of any animosity as much as it is their schedules don't allow it. At least not for all of them to show up. It's not the sort of thing they can do off the cuff, there'd have to be rehearsals and they would need to be able to make the cruise and stay on it for however long it lasts. DT has one of the tightest schedules in the prog/metal world today. It's so tight that even after losing a key member they still managed to get an album out on schedule. Their album/tour cycle has been consistent for so long and when DT isn't active I imagine the last thing they want to do is work on more DT related stuff. They probably want to work on other projects and spend time with their families.
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If i was in DT and had to put up with everything MP said in the press in the 2 years after he quit i'd be reticent too.
I get it, but stranger things have happened. I think out of all of them Jordan would be the most likely to join and James would be the least likely to join.
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“That being said, all four Dream Theater guys have an open invitation to join me on the cruise. I would love nothing more than for them to be there with me.”
Four members?!?!?!?
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Even if they reunited and played all the 12-Step-Suite songs, I don't think it is so special. They have performed the songs live countless times. It may not have been all of them and in order, but it doesn't matter. I understand that it is Portnoy's 50th birthday and that he struggled with substance abuse and that the songs are special for him, but still... there are better songs to play or watch live.
Anyway, it would be nice if they reunited even if only for a concert or a couple of songs.
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“That being said, all four Dream Theater guys have an open invitation to join me on the cruise. I would love nothing more than for them to be there with me.”
Four members?!?!?!?
Honestly, if he didn't invite Mangini as well then I don't think anyone from DT should join. That just doesn't seem right to me. Being that it's unlikely to happen anyway, he should have extended that invite as well.
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Even if they reunited and played all the 12-Step-Suite songs, I don't think it is so special.
To current members of Dream Theater, I agree. It is special to Portnoy for obvious reasons, and it should be, but I doubt it is special to Petrucci, Rudess, LaBrie or Myung, thus I doubt they would look at it as a special can't-miss opportunity.
And that is not even factoring in their schedules, some of them probably having no interest after all of the shots he has taken at them over the years, etc.
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"All four DT guys"
So no drum duel with Mangini then...?
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I think the somewhat non-ceremonious premiere of The Shattered Fortress shows that, for better or worse, the 12 step suite is just "another set of DT songs" for them. Especially for Jordan and Mangini who don't seem to pay much attention to lyrics.
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“That being said, all four Dream Theater guys have an open invitation to join me on the cruise. I would love nothing more than for them to be there with me.”
Four members?!?!?!?
Either a Freudian slip or non acceptance of DT with anyone but MP on the drum stool!
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“That being said, all four Dream Theater guys have an open invitation to join me on the cruise. I would love nothing more than for them to be there with me.”
Four members?!?!?!?
I was so into this happening until I read this line. MP will never change. I hope "all 4 DT guys" never give him what he so desperately wants. He clearly knows he made a terrible mistake in leaving the most important musical project of his life, but he's made his mistake and he's never getting it back.
That sounded a lot more dramatic than I wanted it to be, honest.
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Eh, I don't react to that at all. It makes total sense - the four members that helped created and record the songs are also the four members MP wants to perform them live with. Had it been "DT extends an invitation for MP to perform 12 steps" I would've found it natural that MM also appears in that setting - but here it's MPs concert...
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But he didn't say all four DT guys are invited to play, he said they're invited to join the cruise, in which case I find saying "four" a bit distasteful on his behalf but it doesn't matter cause I don't think they'll do it anyway.
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Eh, as much as I think Portnoy often sticks his foot in his (virtual) mouth, I don't think him inviting just the four DT guys, but not Mangini, is a big deal. The five songs from the suite were recorded with the four, plus he has no musical connection to Mangini. And they are both drummers, so Mangini wouldn't be needed. Sure, it would be a nice gesture to extend the invite to him as well, but I don't think not doing so is a big deal.
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I think that if the current DT reunites with MP, it should be a reunion about DT and not about MP. It's not DT that played with MP; it was MP who played in DT.
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Yeah, I'm pretty sure he's already gotten shit for the "4 members" line, and will be addressing it soon, but as much as I've despised his rhetoric since the split in regards to bashing and passive aggressive behavior, I'm gonna have to side with his eventual "I didn't mean it like that" response. I didn't take it that way, and I'm sure he'd be more than happy to have Mangini on the cruise, but he was referring to the 4 members to which he wrote the songs with. Mangini had no involvement.
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People are going to give him shit for anything he says. I don't think he meant anything personal by it. Like Kev said, it was written by the 5 guys in DT at the time so it's natural that the invitation would be to the four members with whom he recorded the music.
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No guys, he clearly didn't mean anything against MM.
He's obviously leaving JLB out.
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Honestly, you have to be pretty obtuse and deliberately looking for reasons to hate Portnoy to be put off by the "all four Dream Theater guys" comment. There's nothing there to be offended about.
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Honestly, you have to be pretty obtuse and deliberately looking for reasons to hate Portnoy to be put off by the "all four Dream Theater guys" comment. There's nothing there to be offended about.
Personally, I'm more offended by him calling them "guys". Seems a bit presumptuous to impose gender roles on all of them without their consent.
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Honestly, you have to be pretty obtuse and deliberately looking for reasons to hate Portnoy to be put off by the "all four Dream Theater guys" comment. There's nothing there to be offended about.
Personally, I'm more offended by him calling them "guys". Seems a bit presumptuous to impose gender roles on all of them without their consent.
1 week P/R ban! :borlag:
Wait...
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Honestly, you have to be pretty obtuse and deliberately looking for reasons to hate Portnoy to be put off by the "all four Dream Theater guys" comment. There's nothing there to be offended about.
Come on Bosk, you run this site. What else did you expect? :lol
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I think that if the current DT reunites with MP, it should be a reunion about DT and not about MP. It's not DT that played with MP; it was MP who played in DT.
This was my main takeaway from it. "Hey guys, do you want to lock yourselves on a boat in the middle of the ocean with me and play some songs because it would be special for me?"
This seems like a really self-centered request to me, and it shows me that it's still all about MP.
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I don't think the request itself is self-centered - nothing wrong with asking; all they can do is say no - but his reaction to it is. Looking at FB, consider this exchange:
Mark La Vendemmia Cool interview, man...I think everyone would love to see you perform the 12-step with James Labrie, John Petrucci, John Myung and Jordan Rudess just for one night....I really hope that this will happen...you have done so much together...even if your roads are already so far away, as a fan, it would be nice to see that you still love each other...
Mike Portnoy The invite is open to all 4 of them and their families...I'd love nothing more than to perform these songs w THEM and have them with me to celebrate my 50th...they were all such a huge part of my life!
But I wouldn't hold my breath... : (
Thiago Polisel This is not just an invitation issue. There are contractual and legal provisions that you all have to deal with. It is not so simple. We all know they would never refuse.
Mike Portnoy Thiago Polisel - you are 1000% wrong
Our "contractual and legal provisions" were resolved 5 years ago...
There's no reason we can't all be friends at this stage of our lives...
I hold a big place in my heart for all 4 guys as they were an ENORMOUS part of most of my life...
If they choose to not celebrate my 50th birthday with me, that is their choice...no "legal" reasons whatsoever...sad but true!
Life is too waaaay to short to hold onto grudges and resentments..
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The implication there being that the Dream Theater fellas are holding a grudge, while taking the moral high ground. It's just both funny and sad at this point. And just when it appeared as if he was past being a knucklehead about it... :facepalm:
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Honestly, you have to be pretty obtuse and deliberately looking for reasons to hate Portnoy to be put off by the "all four Dream Theater guys" comment. There's nothing there to be offended about.
This is DTF. We know (manufacturing) drama.
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I agree, behind that musician with a huge career behind him, he's still just a human being who happens to miss the DT guys. If I was MM I would go and wouldn't feel bad about this at all, let's face it, I had little to nothing to do with DT during Portnoy's time, aside from one show.
But before you say anything about his reaction, don't forget something very important: You just don't know if he has talked about it with them.
There's photographic evidence that he has spent time with JR, I'm certain that he has brought this up to him, so it has been discussed.
I hope they can just hang around like old pals, as simple people who love music, without these business things involved.
Don't mind me, but DT not caring much about the 12 step suite is senseless. Sure, they proved they could play it without MP, but I fail to see why would they be so cold as to say "meh" to MP's request.
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It's not cold at all, and I cannot fathom how anyone can possibly think it is. It's cold for four of them to not want to just drop what they are doing for close to a week to play homage to their ex-drummer who left the band and then has taken many digs at them since?
Also, them apparently saying no has nothing to do with them proving they could play it without Portnoy.
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LARGE EDIT: So they did say just No? Jeez I tho he was probably just overreacting to silence or idk... Well he is on his right to feel bad. But who knows...
Them not wanting to colaborate anytime soon sounds like an isolated comment made a time ago, and not something fresh.
Btw comments on BM are so funny lol
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Regardless of what anyone thinks, a one off reunion concert would create a huge buzz about a possible full reunion which anybody with a reasonable business sense would want to avoid, unless of course they are actually considering a "reunion" which we know they aren't.
So if Dream Theater was going to put themselves in that position, I'm sure they would rather not do it at a Mike Portnoy tribute concert.
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I'm not sure what the logistics look like with 7 months notice, but I'm turned off by the implication that if DT doesn't show up it validates his position. Disregarding for a moment whether DT has any interest in this, there's a huge difference (financial and logistic) between flying to a venue for a one-off performance and dedicating an entire week on a cruise. While I wouldn't go so far as to say it was intentional on MP's part, I can't help but think that he gave them an offer that he knew they would decline.
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I'm also one of those who basically got what he meant with the "four guys" thing, I just don't see him publicy denying that DT has ever made three albums with another member since he left.
I think he's genuine in his desire to play with them, but puts too much importance on the AA saga... of couse it means a lot to him since he's written it about his personal struggles, but the first comparison that comes into my mind is if Bruce Dickinson when he was out of Iron Maiden invited the rest of the band minus Blaze on a cruise to play along to Revelations, Flash of the Blade, Powerslave and Bring your Daughter to the Slaughter (his songs). Nothing wrong with it but why go all the lenght for it?
Anyway, I wonder if the guys he must have already chosen to play the suite know they have a "firing clause" if one of the original members indeed does show up :biggrin:
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I think that the best move for DT is not to play with Portnoy on this cruise, if only out of respect to Mangini. By avoiding musical contact with Portnoy, they make it clear to the fans and Mangini that he's here to stay.
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Anyway, I wonder if the guys he must have already chosen to play the suite know they have a "firing clause" if one of the original members indeed does show up :biggrin:
That's funny.
I'm very interested in who'll be performing with him. Depending on the vocalist, this could be really cool.
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If MP did in fact ask in the best possible way the other four members who helped create the 5 part suite, and it fell through. He would have been best off not even mentioning that they were invited and declined. They have no obligations to him, so no reason for him to try and shed bad light on them. Even if that wasn't his intention, he should have just not commented on it. But hey, we all know that wouldn't happen.
That said, that's just MP being MP and I like the guy a lot and have no hard feelings either way.
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By avoiding musical contact with Portnoy, they make it clear to the fans and Mangini that he's here to stay.
I thought that was pretty clear already. It has been 6 years and he recorded 3 albums with the band, I don't think anyone still sees Mangini as a substitute drummer. If 6 years isn't enough to be a full, permanent member of the band, then I don't know what is.
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I'm not sure what the logistics look like with 7 months notice, but I'm turned off by the implication that if DT doesn't show up it validates his position. Disregarding for a moment whether DT has any interest in this, there's a huge difference (financial and logistic) between flying to a venue for a one-off performance and dedicating an entire week on a cruise. While I wouldn't go so far as to say it was intentional on MP's part, I can't help but think that he gave them an offer that he knew they would decline.
"Life is too short to hold grudges."
It is a pretty passive aggressive way to imply that if they don't take him up on his offer then they are "holding a grudge."
I think you're right that its kind of setting the band up to validate Mikes way of seeing things
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I'm not sure what the logistics look like with 7 months notice, but I'm turned off by the implication that if DT doesn't show up it validates his position. Disregarding for a moment whether DT has any interest in this, there's a huge difference (financial and logistic) between flying to a venue for a one-off performance and dedicating an entire week on a cruise. While I wouldn't go so far as to say it was intentional on MP's part, I can't help but think that he gave them an offer that he knew they would decline.
Absolutely.
I mean, when it comes to whether to invite them, he's kind of in a bind. He risks negativity from the fanbase and from his former bandmates if he doesn't invite them, but he also kind of sets himself up for the same thing if he does invite them, because it is almost certain they don't come--not necessarily because of any negativity towards him, but mainly because of the logistics of the thing. All in all, I think he probably comes out better by inviting them. The problem is, he loses any potential saving grace and makes himself again look very low-class by making the follow-up comments he made.
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I disagree with your first point. No one would have thought for two seconds he was doing anything wrong, inappropriate, or insulting by not inviting them.
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If I were DT I'd set up at Jordan or MM's home studio live stream a performance of the 12 Step Suite on Youtube or something the the same week of the cruise.
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I'm not sure what the logistics look like with 7 months notice, but I'm turned off by the implication that if DT doesn't show up it validates his position. Disregarding for a moment whether DT has any interest in this, there's a huge difference (financial and logistic) between flying to a venue for a one-off performance and dedicating an entire week on a cruise. While I wouldn't go so far as to say it was intentional on MP's part, I can't help but think that he gave them an offer that he knew they would decline.
Absolutely.
I mean, when it comes to whether to invite them, he's kind of in a bind. He risks negativity from the fanbase and from his former bandmates if he doesn't invite them, but he also kind of sets himself up for the same thing if he does invite them, because it is almost certain they don't come--not necessarily because of any negativity towards him, but mainly because of the logistics of the thing. All in all, I think he probably comes out better by inviting them. The problem is, he loses any potential saving grace and makes himself again look very low-class by making the follow-up comments he made.
I think he could come out of this whole deal very well if he invited them and just didn't comment much about it or chose his words more carefully. I disagree with your earlier comment about looking for reasons to hate Portnoy, he chooses time after time to walk that fine line between taking the high road and putting the blame on them.
He could refer to "Dream Theater" as a band of 5 members that doesn't include him right now, or rather refer to his 4 former bandmates in a clearer way that doesn't sound like he's ignoring the presence of MM in the band ("My 4 bandmates from the band", "The members I'm more familiar with", etc.).
He could not address random comments on Facebook all the time talking implicitly about how he thinks the band is holding a grudge or something, or about what he thinks is the actual reason for them to refuse, or to keep harping on how much he's hurt from their refusal.
He could not retweet, like and share various comments throughout the years about how so and so album of DT recorded without him is terrible, sounds too much like Images and Words, how they're not what they used to be without him, and many many more of these.
He could stop bringing up the term "reuniting at any point" as if we're still talking about an end goal that may and will eventually happen, but rather talk about it like it is: A likely permanent separation. There can be collaborations, there can be reunion *shows*, but he chooses to say it as if he's expecting them to actually reunite with him in the long term.
MP is a big boy and he's making it very hard to relate to him in this whole ordeal. He's absolutely responsible for the negative image he has publicly among some DT fans and I don't think you can blame it on them. He's always choosing to tread along this line of bitterness and passive aggressive comments about the band when the "breakup" was supposedly smooth and mutually agreed on, he's always putting out the dirty laundry, he's always encouraging campy behavior in the fanbase. He chose to have a solo career and that's fine, but this band really doesn't need periodic tackles and drama with ex-bandmates in my opinion, this is not Guns n' Roses or Queensryche; but he keeps steering the wheel in that direction IMO.
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My favourite thing is whenever MP says anything about DT and is all like " *I* wanted to do this *FOR THE FANS* but *THEY* and *THEIR* lawyers thought differently..."
As if MP is this angel who wants to make everyone happy when really he wants to make himself happy and Dream Theater are the evil band who shoot down anything he wants to do
*for the fans* ( i.e. Mike Portnoy )
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And if this does happen, we have an issue with how the band should be credited. It certainly shouldn't be credited as "Dream Theater", because DT without Mangini now isn't DT. For the same reason, it shouldn't be "MP feat. DT". And "MP feat. JLB, JP, JMX and JR" is a mouthful.
This has just put everyone into an awkward situation. MP should have just kept his mouth shut.
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It's almost as if he was suffering a terminal disease (hopefully not).
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By avoiding musical contact with Portnoy, they make it clear to the fans and Mangini that he's here to stay.
I thought that was pretty clear already. It has been 6 years and he recorded 3 albums with the band, I don't think anyone still sees Mangini as a substitute drummer. If 6 years isn't enough to be a full, permanent member of the band, then I don't know what is.
In my mind, it's just one of those things that's better avoided. Now, if Portnoy wants to come play one song with the guys during a DT show that Mangini's at, that's a different story. But the guys basically leaving Mangini behind while they go party with the dude he replaced seems a little... I dunno, uncool. Maybe I'm overthinking it, but it doesn't seem like a good idea to me.
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By avoiding musical contact with Portnoy, they make it clear to the fans and Mangini that he's here to stay.
I thought that was pretty clear already. It has been 6 years and he recorded 3 albums with the band, I don't think anyone still sees Mangini as a substitute drummer. If 6 years isn't enough to be a full, permanent member of the band, then I don't know what is.
In my mind, it's just one of those things that's better avoided. Now, if Portnoy wants to come play one song with the guys during a DT show that Mangini's at, that's a different story. But the guys basically leaving Mangini behind while they go party with the dude he replaced seems a little... I dunno, uncool. Maybe I'm overthinking it, but it doesn't seem like a good idea to me.
The entire theme of this thread is overthinking it.
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The guys are Dream Theater are being clever about not even addressing this whole thing. They know it would create an even bigger controversy. And it would be even more chaotic if it happens, which isn't something they would want to invite into their career.
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Jordan will not be going, we talked a few days ago, you can read the whole interview here
https://noisefull.com/interviews/jordan-rudess (https://noisefull.com/interviews/jordan-rudess)
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We don't know how that invitation was made. Was it a facebook post like "hey guys, come over and play with me", or was there a serious attempt to reach out personally and discuss the matter. And then we don't know if and why they refused. This could be anything from a grudge to conflicting schedules to one of them being seasick on boats. So there's a lot of room for speculation and a lot of room for putting the blame on one party or the other. And the truth is probably something completely different.
It would have been better not to mention anything of it, but now that the damage is done, we can at least analyse and theorize and discuss the whole matter ad nauseam. After all we're DTF and we at least are a little bit less one sided than the Portnoy forum.
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Jordan will not be going, we talked a few days ago, you can read the whole interview here
https://noisefull.com/interviews/jordan-rudess (https://noisefull.com/interviews/jordan-rudess)
Nice interview, thanks for posting! I guess that clears up any question about JR's involvement.
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I'm not sure what the logistics look like with 7 months notice, but I'm turned off by the implication that if DT doesn't show up it validates his position. Disregarding for a moment whether DT has any interest in this, there's a huge difference (financial and logistic) between flying to a venue for a one-off performance and dedicating an entire week on a cruise. While I wouldn't go so far as to say it was intentional on MP's part, I can't help but think that he gave them an offer that he knew they would decline.
Absolutely.
I mean, when it comes to whether to invite them, he's kind of in a bind. He risks negativity from the fanbase and from his former bandmates if he doesn't invite them, but he also kind of sets himself up for the same thing if he does invite them, because it is almost certain they don't come--not necessarily because of any negativity towards him, but mainly because of the logistics of the thing. All in all, I think he probably comes out better by inviting them. The problem is, he loses any potential saving grace and makes himself again look very low-class by making the follow-up comments he made.
I think he could come out of this whole deal very well if he invited them and just didn't comment much about it or chose his words more carefully. I disagree with your earlier comment about looking for reasons to hate Portnoy, he chooses time after time to walk that fine line between taking the high road and putting the blame on them.
He could refer to "Dream Theater" as a band of 5 members that doesn't include him right now, or rather refer to his 4 former bandmates in a clearer way that doesn't sound like he's ignoring the presence of MM in the band ("My 4 bandmates from the band", "The members I'm more familiar with", etc.).
He could not address random comments on Facebook all the time talking implicitly about how he thinks the band is holding a grudge or something, or about what he thinks is the actual reason for them to refuse, or to keep harping on how much he's hurt from their refusal.
He could not retweet, like and share various comments throughout the years about how so and so album of DT recorded without him is terrible, sounds too much like Images and Words, how they're not what they used to be without him, and many many more of these.
He could stop bringing up the term "reuniting at any point" as if we're still talking about an end goal that may and will eventually happen, but rather talk about it like it is: A likely permanent separation. There can be collaborations, there can be reunion *shows*, but he chooses to say it as if he's expecting them to actually reunite with him in the long term.
MP is a big boy and he's making it very hard to relate to him in this whole ordeal. He's absolutely responsible for the negative image he has publicly among some DT fans and I don't think you can blame it on them. He's always choosing to tread along this line of bitterness and passive aggressive comments about the band when the "breakup" was supposedly smooth and mutually agreed on, he's always putting out the dirty laundry, he's always encouraging campy behavior in the fanbase. He chose to have a solo career and that's fine, but this band really doesn't need periodic tackles and drama with ex-bandmates in my opinion, this is not Guns n' Roses or Queensryche; but he keeps steering the wheel in that direction IMO.
I agree with all of that except the "He could refer to "Dream Theater" as a band of 5 members that doesn't include him right now, or rather refer to his 4 former bandmates in a clearer way that doesn't sound like he's ignoring the presence of MM in the band ("My 4 bandmates from the band", "The members I'm more familiar with", etc.)" part. He deserves whatever he gets for all that other stuff because it is completely his fault for stirring up drama and saying things that are in poor taste. He obviously can't stop acting childish or take the high road no matter how much time passes, and that's sad. But the "4 members" comment is a big nothing. It isn't even remotely a slight at Mangini, and you really have to be reaching for something that isn't there to see one.
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Jordan will not be going, we talked a few days ago, you can read the whole interview here
https://noisefull.com/interviews/jordan-rudess (https://noisefull.com/interviews/jordan-rudess)
Hey, congratulations on your interview! Just finished reading it.
Too bad they haven't been to Greece lately. I got to know Athens (and one other island) in January 2014. My grandma was born there, so I was really keen. Such a nice place - and weather! (it was Winter, but we wore t-shirts most of the time). I love the food - I would visit again just for a little more soublakia and salads :)
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I think it's definitely smart by DT to ignore this whole thing. The ambers have finally settled down from outright burning to a tiny amount of smoke, no need to throw a liter of gasoline onto it.
I somehow also can totally see them not being super-excited about playing the 12-step suite in its entirety. Even among fans it's a mixed bag.
And honestly, I think MP playing this in a completely different rendition is way more interesting than DT playing it.
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I think MP playing this in a completely different rendition is way more interesting than DT playing it.
I can't see how anyone but JP and JR play TGP correctly and make it sound good. The other songs in the suite can be covered to the point of a passing grade....but I personally am dying to see whoever butcher TGP.
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And honestly, I think MP playing this in a completely different rendition is way more interesting than DT playing it.
Yes. I really look forward to seeing how it is rearranged to be played as a single unit. There are lots of things (especially in the later songs) that work really well in context of the song/album but would make the whole thing seem disjointed when played as a suite. MP is a smart arranger and probably recognizes this and will adjust accordingly. I imagine DT in their current form would rather just replicate the albums.
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I think MP playing this in a completely different rendition is way more interesting than DT playing it.
I can't see how anyone but JP and JR play TGP correctly and make it sound good. The other songs in the suite can be covered to the point of a passing grade....but I personally am dying to see whoever butcher TGP.
Unless they slow down the tempo.
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I think MP playing this in a completely different rendition is way more interesting than DT playing it.
I can't see how anyone but JP and JR play TGP correctly and make it sound good. The other songs in the suite can be covered to the point of a passing grade....but I personally am dying to see whoever butcher TGP.
His other one-off bands have often had Paul Gilbert on guitar. I think he could handle it.
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I think MP playing this in a completely different rendition is way more interesting than DT playing it.
I can't see how anyone but JP and JR play TGP correctly and make it sound good. The other songs in the suite can be covered to the point of a passing grade....but I personally am dying to see whoever butcher TGP.
His other one-off bands have often had Paul Gilbert on guitar. I think he could handle it.
true. He is capable....but I have a hard time believing he'd play it note for note, plus he and the keyboardist would need to be spot on as well. I'm sure it'd sound good though....I just think it's a song that's so intricate it'd be tough to cover.
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I think MP playing this in a completely different rendition is way more interesting than DT playing it.
I can't see how anyone but JP and JR play TGP correctly and make it sound good. The other songs in the suite can be covered to the point of a passing grade....but I personally am dying to see whoever butcher TGP.
His other one-off bands have often had Paul Gilbert on guitar. I think he could handle it.
true. He is capable....but I have a hard time believing he'd play it note for note, plus he and the keyboardist would need to be spot on as well. I'm sure it'd sound good though....I just think it's a song that's so intricate it'd be tough to cover.
I've always thought Marco Sfogli should team up with MP for different projects. He can absolutely handle anything thrown at him and completely own it, plus there's a ton of Petrucci in his playing :metal I don't imagine Marco would want to do something like this though, so it's just a dream ;D You wouldn't be able to find a better guitarist to cover Dream Theater.
At any rate, I do really hope that Portnoy's performance of the 12 step suite ends up sounding great and gives him a lot of satisfaction :tup
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I think MP playing this in a completely different rendition is way more interesting than DT playing it.
I can't see how anyone but JP and JR play TGP correctly and make it sound good. The other songs in the suite can be covered to the point of a passing grade....but I personally am dying to see whoever butcher TGP.
His other one-off bands have often had Paul Gilbert on guitar. I think he could handle it.
true. He is capable....but I have a hard time believing he'd play it note for note, plus he and the keyboardist would need to be spot on as well. I'm sure it'd sound good though....I just think it's a song that's so intricate it'd be tough to cover.
I think you're grossly overestimating how impossible DT parts are. Sure, they are very difficult for most musicians, but it's mostly the fact that DT was creative enough to write parts that are both complex and musical at the same time. There's plenty of bands/musicians who play things the guys in DT probably couldn't, but they're boring as all hell to listen to. However, those musicians could probably replicate DT parts without an issue.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSJ8Kfddadc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3XVvUoayiX0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuNh6Yz9PXo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s6f28NpPjPE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vnf2usvBUQo
That's just The Glass Prison opening stuff (although I think 2 are the full song) after a very quick youtube search.
Portnoy can easily find people to do this.
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Jordan will not be going, we talked a few days ago, you can read the whole interview here
https://noisefull.com/interviews/jordan-rudess (https://noisefull.com/interviews/jordan-rudess)
Props to JR for taking the high road. Gave a simple answer, short and sweet, and said nothing else. That's the way to do it. :tup :tup
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Jordan will not be going, we talked a few days ago, you can read the whole interview here
https://noisefull.com/interviews/jordan-rudess (https://noisefull.com/interviews/jordan-rudess)
Props to JR for taking the high road. Gave a simple answer, short and sweet, and said nothing else. That's the way to do it. :tup :tup
Yup. No need for ME and THEM and THEY.
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Jordan will not be going, we talked a few days ago, you can read the whole interview here
https://noisefull.com/interviews/jordan-rudess (https://noisefull.com/interviews/jordan-rudess)
Props to JR for taking the high road. Gave a simple answer, short and sweet, and said nothing else. That's the way to do it. :tup :tup
Yup. No need for ME and THEM and THEY.
How dare comments refer to people! The nerve. Capitalizing words doesn't make them a thing.
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Jordan will not be going, we talked a few days ago, you can read the whole interview here
https://noisefull.com/interviews/jordan-rudess (https://noisefull.com/interviews/jordan-rudess)
Props to JR for taking the high road. Gave a simple answer, short and sweet, and said nothing else. That's the way to do it. :tup :tup
Idk, that ellipsis at the end had me triggered.
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Idk, that ellipsis at the end had me triggered.
Yeah, what did he really mean when he wrote dot dot dot
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Perhaps he was dictating it.
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Here is a quote from the MP forum:
"Mike can be the nicest dude on earth, but even that guy gets tired of always being the nice one reaching out only to be rebuffed."
:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
I can't believe how blind some people can be. I know that if I had a best friend who keeps taking shots at me after we "amicably" seperate I wouldn't want anything to do with them.
The DT guys have been nothing but classy this entire time, barely saying a negative word (if any) about MP or the situation, and the hardcore MP fans seem to think that MP can do nothing wrong and has done nothing wrong and make him out to be some sort of victim here.
Most of us here know the history of the split and that MP kept fanning the flames with actions and words and then people like the one I quoted seem to think MP is so nice and DT are so not nice. It's really mind-boggling.
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MP is still MP... I like what he does with Winery Dogs, PSMS and others.
But I wish he could keep his mouth shut.
"Shoulda, coulda, woulda, shut up
I wished I kept my mouth shut 'Cause I can't change anything I did..."
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Here are some more quotes from the Mike Portnoy forum (from user DT2003)
Exactly! Just because the band has made it clear they have no intentions of playing with Mike doesn't mean they are holding a grudge. The band has moved on and there is nothing wrong with that.
Now if MP were to reach out to the guys to just say hi and see how they are doing and the guys wanted no part in it, than that would be wrong, but I doubt that has happened.
Mike's response
Uh, don't be so sure….
(at least with a few members…)
I've tried my best…pretty sad…but life goes on...
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I......MY......
100% those members are Myung and LaBrie...
This reminds me of " I tried to rejoin the band for the fans ( after they'd gone through all the legal shit with getting Mangini in and filmed the documentary )..But they made it clear the
door was closed...."
He always has to be the victim.
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Now if MP were to reach out to the guys to just say hi and see how they are doing and the guys wanted no part in it, than that would be wrong, but I doubt that has happened. [/i]
Well, but still, what's wrong in saying no?
"Hey, 'sup dude, care to join me on a cruise and play the suite?"
"Well, thanks Mike, but in that time we're busy, I don't like cruises, the wife can't take off that time from work... I really wouldn't mind but sorry, I can't just spend a week next April on a cruise"
Is this so horrible? of course if some bandmember would reply "Not in a chance in hell, I hope the boat sinks, screw you" that's different, but I don't see why they should want at all costs to go on a cruise just because it was offered.
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I've tried my best…pretty sad…but life goes on...
::) Sure you keep telling yourself that Mike. Keep telling everyone you're over DT.
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Dear God, you're bitter.
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I'm sure he has major regret still over having left the band, and my theory is that the many deaths by music legends in the last year has only punctuated that regret for him, since it's like a reminder that life is short, anyone could go at any time, and he might never get to play with his bandmates of 20+ years again. I remember the chatter about his tweet about crying after Bowie's death when listening to Lady Stardust from the Ziggy Stardust album, where the chorus is:
And he was alright, the band was altogether
Yes he was alright, the song went on forever
Yes he was awful nice
Really quite out of sight
And he sang all night long
The band was altogether...I can definitely see the line be emotional for any musician who misses a band he used to be in, especially when a legend like Bowie just passed. It doesn't excuse his passive-aggressive public comments, that he cannot seem to let go of, but I can sort of understand why he feels the way he does. He would just be better off keeping such comments to himself, but I think he likes keeping his hardcore fans squarely on his side, and comments like some of the ones posted are like throwing red meat to them and always do a good job of making them dig their heels in more to defend him and view DT as the "bad guys," so to speak. Meanwhile, DT continues to take the high road by saying nothing inflammatory whatsoever. :tup :tup
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...and view DT as the "bad guys," so to speak. Meanwhile, DT continues to take the high road by saying nothing inflammatory whatsoever. :tup :tup
Would you allow that maybe DT are the "bad guys", and maybe that "high road" really isn't that high?
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No, because I have literally seen nothing that would indicate otherwise. They have handled everything about this in the best manner possible for nearly six years now.
But hey, if you've got something, I am always willing to listen.
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I don't, but I truly believe that appearances here aren't all that they seem. I think some of MP's comments are fueled by his frustration about their "corporate silence", almost trying to cryptically say that they are not angels in all of this.
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Well, that's his problem, not theirs. And honestly, their "corporate silence" is the best way to go. By giving him nothing, they keep themselves out of drama or any possible headlines. I am sure both DT and their legal team know that Portnoy loves to run his mouth, so if any of them would hang out with him and say anything about Dream Theater, suddenly Portnoy would be posting on Twitter about hanging about with an old friend with the quote "You never know what the future might look like..." And then all of a sudden Blabbermouth is running a story wondering if DT is going to bring Portnoy back, DT starts getting asked about it, and drama is everywhere. Their silence is THE best way to go, for the band and for their sanity.
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Well, that's his problem, not theirs. And honestly, their "corporate silence" is the best way to go. By giving him nothing, they keep themselves out of drama or any possible headlines. I am sure both DT and their legal team know that Portnoy loves to run his mouth, so if any of them would hang out with him and say anything about Dream Theater, suddenly Portnoy would be posting on Twitter about hanging about with an old friend with the quote "You never know what the future might look like..." And then all of a sudden Blabbermouth is running a story wondering if DT is going to bring Portnoy back, DT starts getting asked about it, and drama is everywhere. Their silence is THE best way to go, for the band and for their sanity.
It's like Noel Gallagher saying in every single interview that he's never getting oasis back together ( at least not with him in it ).. Every single interview. He literally cannot say "no" enough times.
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Well, that's his problem, not theirs. And honestly, their "corporate silence" is the best way to go. By giving him nothing, they keep themselves out of drama or any possible headlines. I am sure both DT and their legal team know that Portnoy loves to run his mouth, so if any of them would hang out with him and say anything about Dream Theater, suddenly Portnoy would be posting on Twitter about hanging about with an old friend with the quote "You never know what the future might look like..." And then all of a sudden Blabbermouth is running a story wondering if DT is going to bring Portnoy back, DT starts getting asked about it, and drama is everywhere. Their silence is THE best way to go, for the band and for their sanity.
Oh, I completely agree with all of that.
I think my only point is that I wouldn't make any behind the scenes assumptions based on how MP does or how DT doesn't handle it publicly.
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Sometimes I get the feeling that MP is still thinking that the split was more of a temporary hiatus on his side and that the reunion (and kicking out of MM) is inevitable and he's frustrated that it hasn't happened yet. While DT clearly see their future without him and have acted accordingly by not answering or commenting his tweets and postings and statements.
And even after an amicable split the band can decide that they don't want to do anything with MP, maybe not even have contact, and you can't really blame them because it was MP's decision to leave and their decision to carry on. They aren't obliged to anything outside of what was fixed by the lawyers. One may find this sad, one may hope that this changes, one may hope for a reunion or other projects or whatever, but clearly no one is obliged to do anything and crying on the internet is not going to change it. And the longer it takes MP to realize this, the lesser the chances are that anything happens at all.
I really hope MP pulls of a good performance of the 12 step suite and I really hope he gets some good musicians. He should change it up a bit to suit the performers and make it interesting. And I really hope he doesn't make a long birthday speech about DT and what could/should/would have been.
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Well, that's his problem, not theirs. And honestly, their "corporate silence" is the best way to go. By giving him nothing, they keep themselves out of drama or any possible headlines. I am sure both DT and their legal team know that Portnoy loves to run his mouth, so if any of them would hang out with him and say anything about Dream Theater, suddenly Portnoy would be posting on Twitter about hanging about with an old friend with the quote "You never know what the future might look like..." And then all of a sudden Blabbermouth is running a story wondering if DT is going to bring Portnoy back, DT starts getting asked about it, and drama is everywhere. Their silence is THE best way to go, for the band and for their sanity.
This sums up the whole issue perfectly.
This MP/DT reunion case has been closed a long time ago, and Portnoy should have better things to do than open this up again..
Portnoy should focus he's energy into finding a lineup, that is able to perform the suite. I would like to see Sherinian, McAlpine, Sheehan and a great singer perform this with him.
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As cool as I thought the 12SS performance was when first announced, Mike's continued antics are really souring me on any desire to hear it, honestly. Yeah, the music will be cool, and it's nice that it is something that has been so long in the making. But he cannot seem to restrain himself from publicly attaching negativity to it all at every opportunity. There comes a point, as with Tate, Axl, etc. that I get to, "Eh, just not interested." I am rapidly approaching that point. As others have said, his best course of action would have been to not say ANYTHING about the DT guys. And if asked directly, he could have just said something like, "It would be really cool to perform it with them, but it's not in the cards right now," and leave it at that. It's just a shame that he is becoming so offputting to me that I am losing interest in ANYTHING he is associated with.
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I just wish that if he got the DT guys to agree, then post publicly, but if not, just don't say a word about it.
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As cool as I thought the 12SS performance was when first announced, Mike's continued antics are really souring me on any desire to hear it, honestly. Yeah, the music will be cool, and it's nice that it is something that has been so long in the making. But he cannot seem to restrain himself from publicly attaching negativity to it all at every opportunity. There comes a point, as with Tate, Axl, etc. that I get to, "Eh, just not interested." I am rapidly approaching that point. As others have said, his best course of action would have been to not say ANYTHING about the DT guys. And if asked directly, he could have just said something like, "It would be really cool to perform it with them, but it's not in the cards right now," and leave it at that. It's just a shame that he is becoming so offputting to me that I am losing interest in ANYTHING he is associated with.
Bosk, I totally agree.
And it blows because I have not been remotely interested in anything he has done since leaving DT. Nothing. The closest thing is him filling in for Twisted Sister!!! How sad is that?
And I KNEW that was going to happen as soon as he left. It's the main reason why I was so bummed when he left.
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I think you're grossly overestimating how impossible DT parts are. Sure, they are very difficult for most musicians, but it's mostly the fact that DT was creative enough to write parts that are both complex and musical at the same time.
And just to be tooting my own horn here, here's me playing Glass Prison:
https://youtu.be/0VMrMe8BkGQ?t=85
(conveniently skipping my fuckup at the beginning :biggrin: )
Mind you, by no means perfect, but we were all normal-working folks, and if we can play this, then some Berklee kid can definitely do a flawless job at it.
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I don't think playing the material on its own is the same as playing it with the band. For example, I am sure Portnoy can find three guys who can play the end of This Dying Soul with him, but getting the timing down, especially for three guys who have probably zero history of playing it, will be the tricky part. And if just one of them is off at all in that section, it'll be a train wreck.
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I honestly think finding people to practice and play with him is the least of the problems here. He knows a lot of people in the business, I'd imagine he could put together a nice cast of musicians and they will be fine playing the material.
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I honestly think finding people to practice and play with him is the least of the problems here. He knows a lot of people in the business, I'd imagine he could put together a nice cast of musicians and they will be fine playing the material.
Right.
They are professional musicians. Youtube is filled with Joe Blows playing DT.
Joe Blow =/= Rumbo! ;D
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I understand it's MP's event and it's his party.
But simply looking at it from JLB, JP, JR and JMX's point of views.....they've accepted MM as their new family member and therefore probably wouldn't do ANYTHING DT-related without him.
Sorry if someone said that already, didn't have the time to read every comment lol
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Would you allow that maybe DT are the "bad guys", and maybe that "high road" really isn't that high?
Suppose the guys really don't like MP as a person anymore and don't want anything to do with him. That doesn't make them bad people. No one owes anyone their undying friendship. Friends come and go throughout the course of all our lives.
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Would you allow that maybe DT are the "bad guys", and maybe that "high road" really isn't that high?
Suppose the guys really don't like MP as a person anymore and don't want anything to do with him. That doesn't make them bad people. No one owes anyone their undying friendship. Friends come and go throughout the course of all our lives.
I think my only point is that I wouldn't make any behind the scenes assumptions based on how MP does or how DT doesn't handle it publicly.
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I think the opposite. DT finally had enough of MP. Sometimes you live a guy like a brother but you can't take the drama anymore
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Get your ass back on the General Discussion side!
(I don't disagree)
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Yes Dad. Lol.
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I understand it's MP's event and it's his party.
But simply looking at it from JLB, JP, JR and JMX's point of views.....they've accepted MM as their new family member and therefore probably wouldn't do ANYTHING DT-related without him.
Sorry if someone said that already, didn't have the time to read every comment lol
I think that's pretty much it. It's not so much that there are any grudges or they hate MP or whatever, at the end of the day they just don't want to entertain the idea of MP coming back or give ammo to the "DT was better with Portnoy" crowd. It's the same reason the original Kiss didn't perform together at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame a couple years ago. As soon as DT performs with MP, people are going to constantly ask when MP is rejoining the band and there's going to be even more of a "DT without MP isn't DT" sentiment than there already is. They've put a ton of work into validating this current lineup as the definitive version of the band, they aren't going to jeopardize that with a one off performance that, frankly, is going to be all about MP with DT as glorified backing musicians.
Which is unfortunate. If this could be a one off fun performance without any of that baggage, I'm sure they'd all be there.
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...and view DT as the "bad guys," so to speak. Meanwhile, DT continues to take the high road by saying nothing inflammatory whatsoever. :tup :tup
Would you allow that maybe DT are the "bad guys", and maybe that "high road" really isn't that high?
I know *I* wouldn't allow if we are judging purely on what we, the public, know about the situation.
Are we into their personal lives and all that? Of course we aren't. So all we have to go on is what's been going on out here in the land of the Internetz and the bitter-mometer is 99% pointing at MP for the way he's acted since the split. We've barely heard a peep from the DT camp but plenty from MP.
If MP truly wanted things to be better he wouldn't be representing himself the way he has and the whole "well, that's just MP being MP" thing doesn't excuse the behaviour at all.
I *really* thought this would be the best and possibly only way we'd ever get to hear the 12SS by the original members and I'm bummed that it didn't work out but I'm also OK with the reasons for it not happening.
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Portnoy put DT in a complicated place with his 'harmless' invitation (in my humble opinion), and here's why:
If LaBrie, Myung, Petrucci and Rudess agreed and went to that cruise, the original line-up would be reunited; sparking that eternal flame within MP hardcore fans that reject Mangini in any way possible. 'THIS IS THE TRUE DT! PLS COME BACK!', I can already read comments like those if that were to happen. That would really put MM in a complicated situation.
Mike Portnoy is a clever man, and his wording of situations is a clear example of that. In this matter, as in most matters DT-related in the past few years, his tone has been the following:
I have done everything in my book to be cool with the guys and have a nice reunion, but it's not up to me anymore...the ball is in their court now...not mine...it's them, not me.
That seems sincere (and probably is) of his part, but that's not the whole part of the story. Why make his invitation to DT public? What purpose does it have? To show the fans that he's the one that's cool and that LaBrie and Myung are bitter old men who hate him? I know JR and JP love him dearly (and probably JLB and JM do as well), but they have all the right in the world to be pissed at him for all the MP drama that has lingered in their backs for the past 6 years.
And now back to my original point, now that DT has (somewhat) rejected his invitation, MP stays as the good guy; the one that wanted one little harmless performance of his 12 Suite with his original bandmates, while the other guys look bad to the eyes of the fanatics. That's why I think MP put the band in a complicated position. I love Mike Portnoy and everything he's done in progressive rock, but this feels pretty lame to me. I really think he should have someone overseeing his social media posting, because at this point I think his constant 'sincere' wording is doing him more harm than good.
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Kind of unrelated, but why do some people assume that JM hates Portnoy now? Did I miss something? I keep seeing him brought up along with JLB as the ones on bad terms with MP. JLB is understandable, but haVe JM and Portnoy even mentioned each other since?
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Kind of unrelated, but why do some people assume that JM hates Portnoy now? Did I miss something? I keep seeing him brought up along with JLB as the ones on bad terms with MP. JLB is understandable, but haVe JM and Portnoy even mentioned each other since?
Just look at any picture of Myung after the split, you can see the hate and rage and fury in his eyes.
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The canadian SINGER and the korean BASSIST have proven to ME that THEY don't want this reunion possible. I wanted NOTHING but playing FOR THE FANS. And because I am such a good guy I WILL perform THE ASTONISHING completely through LIVESTREAM and make it clear that I am more than JUST a Drummer.
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And now back to my original point, now that DT has (somewhat) rejected his invitation, MP stays as the good guy; the one that wanted one little harmless performance of his 12 Suite with his original bandmates, while the other guys look bad to the eyes of the fanatics.
Well, but in the end it's not "one little harmless performance". Jordan or JP being in town when MP is playing and them showing up to play Pull Me Under is a little harmless performance; playing the entire suite needs basically a mini-reunion of rehearsals, and it should take place on a cruise also.
I remember an interview with Petrucci saying something like "Fans always ask these forgotten songs for the setlists, they want Octavarium but I don't play it since years, I'd have to re-learn it by now"... well, isn't The Glass Prison missing from the setlist since years? Petrucci, and maybe not only him, would have to re-learn it along as the other songs as well.
Wether MP is realizing this or not, he's not asking the band to join a party, he's actually asking them to reunite with him, even for a week. And due respect to him since it's his party, but if at all, it should be him to re-join for a one-off performance DT, not the other way around. The only other example that comes into my mind is when Ozzy asked Black Sabbath to play with him when he was, ehm, "retiring" in 1992 - and again, all due respect, Ozzy vs Black Sabbath is a completely different monster than MP vs DT.
Furthermore Ronnie James Dio was in Black Sabbath at the time and he got pissed off and didn't want to do the show (Black Sabbath should have opened for Ozzy) 'cause he knew it would have led to a reunion, and he was actually right. The reunion fell through, but there were talks about it. DT just don't want or need to give Mangini unnecessary bad thoughts.
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The canadian SINGER and the korean BASSIST have proven to ME that THEY don't want this reunion possible. I wanted NOTHING but playing FOR THE FANS. And because I am such a good guy I WILL perform THE ASTONISHING completely through LIVESTREAM and make it clear that I am more than JUST a Drummer.
:rollin
Love how he chucks in that it's for the fans when in reality he just wants to play in Dream Theater again.
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The canadian SINGER and the korean BASSIST have proven to ME that THEY don't want this reunion possible. I wanted NOTHING but playing FOR THE FANS. And because I am such a good guy I WILL perform THE ASTONISHING completely through LIVESTREAM and make it clear that I am more than JUST a Drummer.
MP is chaossystem :omg:
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I still think MP leaving DT was the best thing that happened to both parties. It's just too bad that only one side has truly chosen to move on.
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I still think MP's OCD is the only thing that kept him in DT the last few years he was there......I think he only stuck it out to complete the 12 Step Suite. BC&SL completed the 12 Step Suite and he was gone soon after that.
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And now back to my original point, now that DT has (somewhat) rejected his invitation, MP stays as the good guy; the one that wanted one little harmless performance of his 12 Suite with his original bandmates, while the other guys look bad to the eyes of the fanatics.
Well, but in the end it's not "one little harmless performance". Jordan or JP being in town when MP is playing and them showing up to play Pull Me Under is a little harmless performance; playing the entire suite needs basically a mini-reunion of rehearsals, and it should take place on a cruise also.
The one harmless performance thing was sacrasm. Missed my green in there. :lol
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Metallica and Mustaine were able to bury the hatchet and play together. Even Danzig, Jerry, and Doyle are reuniting for shows as the Original Misfits with all the animosity and legal issues they've had over the years. It would be nice to see the same happen with MP and the DT guys.
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i'm just FASCINATED how MP seems to think things will ever get better with the guys in DT when he continues to post HIS side of the story at THEIR expense. he takes issue with THEIR resentment, but he seems to not realize he's probably keeping that resentment alive and well.
with all of the "press statements" he puts out, why not a sincere apology if he's legit over it all? why not show up at a DT show and be supportive of their moving on?
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The canadian SINGER and the korean BASSIST have proven to ME that THEY don't want this reunion possible. I wanted NOTHING but playing FOR THE FANS. And because I am such a good guy I WILL perform THE ASTONISHING completely through LIVESTREAM and make it clear that I am more than JUST a Drummer.
MP is chaossystem :omg:
You beat me to it. :lol
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Metallica and Mustaine were able to bury the hatchet and play together.
In 30 years, we'll see haha.
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The canadian SINGER and the korean BASSIST have proven to ME that THEY don't want this reunion possible. I wanted NOTHING but playing FOR THE FANS. And because I am such a good guy I WILL perform THE ASTONISHING completely through LIVESTREAM and make it clear that I am more than JUST a Drummer.
MP is chaossystem :omg:
You beat me to it. :lol
:rollin
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Metallica and Mustaine were able to bury the hatchet and play together.
In 30 years, we'll see haha.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but Mustaine played with the whole of Metallica, meaning his replacement, Kirk Hammett, was also on the stage.
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Metallica and Mustaine were able to bury the hatchet and play together.
In 30 years, we'll see haha.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but Mustaine played with the whole of Metallica, meaning his replacement, Kirk Hammett, was also on the stage.
Indeed, I was actually a little let down how it was all handled. (Slightly unrelated rant, sorry..but....keep note DT?)
1. There shouldn't have been such redundancy. When Dave or Ron played, Kirk should have gone off stage. When Jason was there, Rob should have gone off stage. If they wanted a big everyone jam at the end, cool, but it would have been really special to JUST see certain lineups.
2. THEY DIDN'T EVEN FILM IT FOR A DVD!
/rant
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I saw myself Mustaine playing with Metallica, he joined them (and he was not alone, it was the Big Four festival) for Die Die My Darling :hat
And now back to my original point, now that DT has (somewhat) rejected his invitation, MP stays as the good guy; the one that wanted one little harmless performance of his 12 Suite with his original bandmates, while the other guys look bad to the eyes of the fanatics.
Well, but in the end it's not "one little harmless performance". Jordan or JP being in town when MP is playing and them showing up to play Pull Me Under is a little harmless performance; playing the entire suite needs basically a mini-reunion of rehearsals, and it should take place on a cruise also.
The one harmless performance thing was sacrasm. Missed my green in there. :lol
[/quote]
I figured, I just took the occasion to make my point, maybe Mike himself doesn't realize how actually a huge deal is to play the entire suite to just shrug off a declined invitation as "holding a grudge".
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When band members leave on amicable terms and refrain from making passive-aggressive remarks or otherwise nasty insinuations about their old band or bandmates, the door often remains open for one-off reunion songs or shows, or even reunion tours. The new (permanent) members often step aside so they're not sharing the stage like in the absurd "big four" Metallica + Mustaine jams which I don't think anyone actually enjoyed (least of all Dave who looked miserable). You know, "for the fans".
Mike Portnoy, being a friend of several past and present members of Fates Warning, a band which handles these sort of reunions like pros, knows this better than anyone--and he knows not even a DT led by Jim Matheos would suffer his presence after all he's said in the press the last several years.
This is what happens... This is what happens... when you're totally uncool after a break-up.
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I'm missing your point.
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i'm just FASCINATED how MP seems to think things will ever get better with the guys in DT when he continues to post HIS side of the story at THEIR expense. he takes issue with THEIR resentment, but he seems to not realize he's probably keeping that resentment alive and well.
with all of the "press statements" he puts out, why not a sincere apology if he's legit over it all? why not show up at a DT show and be supportive of their moving on?
Totally all of this but especially the highlighted. If he were truly humble about this and is at a place where he's 'all good'....then why won't he just admit, just privately to the guys that he F'd up....got caught up in the hype of Avenged Seven Fold....and tried to have his cake and eat it too? When that's clearly what happened. He never in a million years thought they'd go on without him....the guy who puts all the time in on set lists and does all the fan stuff and yadda yadda yadda. He thought they'd bow to his decision and remain hostages to his will.
When they said don't let the door hit your a$$ on the way out he did all he could to try and blame them....then when reality set in on him and the honeymoon was over and Avenged dismissed him he tried to worm his way back in.
I commend Jordan for having spent time with him here and there since then but don't blame the rest of them one bit for not wanting to have anything to do with him....until at least he'd man up and admit this entire thing was all the fault of his ego.
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I'm missing your point.
Really? I'm sorry.
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I'm missing your point.
Really? I'm sorry.
:lol
I was ribbing you for the long about way of saying Portnoy is the his own worst enemy. Funny thing though, it's over 5 years and he still puts his foot in his mouth through the media. He can never do things privately.
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I'm missing your point.
Really? I'm sorry.
:lol
I was ribbing you for the long about way of saying Portnoy is the his own worst enemy. Funny thing though, it's over 5 years and he still puts his foot in his mouth through the media. He can never do things privately.
Yeah, but I was also trying to suggest disingenuousness on his part. I don't think Mike just doesn't get it... I think he knows, looking back, that he went about things in the wrong way immediately following his departure when emotions were charged. Having had time to cool down and occupy himself with other projects, he hasn't really changed his approach since then. He has plenty of sycophants who will continue to see him as the good guy as he continues his, err, very public approach to "reconciliation". But the only way he can get friendly with DT again and come back for a song or show or two every once in a while is to go totally silent on these matters for many years, then privately reach out to members, particularly JM and JLB. At his age, he should start with the radio silence if he ever wants that to be possible, and again, I think he knows that on some level.
Did he actually think DT -1 playing songs that aren't even especially significant to them on a booze cruise with him was possible when he went to the media with it? I seriously doubt it. Some will still read it as friendly "Mike Portnoy just can't break through DT's corporate ice," and it seems like that short-term gratification is enough for him at this stage.
(This wasn't that long, was it?)
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Way too long. :lol. I kid!
I think Mike can't stop himself. It's just his personality. Instead of privately contacting the guys he blurts it out in an interview. That automatically put them on their heals and we knew the answer would be no.
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Hate how he tries to make the band look like the bad guys by offering something that he makes out is best for everyone and the precious fans...
...But in reality it's something he knows they have no obligation or even the time to accept.
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While it would be cool to see them re-unite for a one-off show (or a LTE show for that matter), I can see why they'd be hesitant when MP says things on twitter like:
Sadly some people aren't as sentimental and forgiving as I am... 😞 Life's waaaaay too short for resentments...
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Way too long. :lol. I kid!
I think Mike can't stop himself. It's just his personality. Instead of privately contacting the guys he blurts it out in an interview. That automatically put them on their heals and we knew the answer would be no.
He's just an exceedingly extroverted person. That's never going to change. That chip in our brains that tell us to think first - his is based on Windows ME.
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Way too long. :lol. I kid!
I think Mike can't stop himself. It's just his personality. Instead of privately contacting the guys he blurts it out in an interview. That automatically put them on their heals and we knew the answer would be no.
He's just an exceedingly extroverted person. That's never going to change. That chip in our brains that tell us to think first - his is based on Windows ME.
That really changes my perspective on him... Who else could function half as normally as Mike while experiencing constant BSODs?
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Way too long. :lol. I kid!
I think Mike can't stop himself. It's just his personality. Instead of privately contacting the guys he blurts it out in an interview. That automatically put them on their heals and we knew the answer would be no.
He's just an exceedingly extroverted person. That's never going to change. That chip in our brains that tell us to think first - his is based on Windows ME.
I love Mike. I will always follow him. Also, thankfully I never owned ME.
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Way too long. :lol. I kid!
I think Mike can't stop himself. It's just his personality. Instead of privately contacting the guys he blurts it out in an interview. That automatically put them on their heals and we knew the answer would be no.
He's just an exceedingly extroverted person. That's never going to change. That chip in our brains that tell us to think first - his is based on Windows ME.
I love Mike. I will always follow him. Also, thankfully I never owned ME.
I will always be a fan of his, too. I still read his blog on the MP forums to see what he's up to, but what I said about him is true, for better or worse.
Way too long. :lol. I kid!
I think Mike can't stop himself. It's just his personality. Instead of privately contacting the guys he blurts it out in an interview. That automatically put them on their heals and we knew the answer would be no.
He's just an exceedingly extroverted person. That's never going to change. That chip in our brains that tell us to think first - his is based on Windows ME.
That really changes my perspective on him... Who else could function half as normally as Mike while experiencing constant BSODs?
That's when he sleeps.
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why the stab at being sentimental? does HE see DT as a nostalgia act or something? THEY want to move forward. i'm sure THEY all have fond memories, but that doesn't mean a reunion is best for THEM.
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I so want this to happen for purely selfish reasons. I'm not into this newest album or the show I went to for it. So this is something different and would be great to see those songs together
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Yeah, but I was also trying to suggest disingenuousness on his part. I don't think Mike just doesn't get it... I think he knows, looking back, that he went about things in the wrong way immediately following his departure when emotions were charged. Having had time to cool down and occupy himself with other projects, he hasn't really changed his approach since then. He has plenty of sycophants who will continue to see him as the good guy as he continues his, err, very public approach to "reconciliation". But the only way he can get friendly with DT again and come back for a song or show or two every once in a while is to go totally silent on these matters for many years, then privately reach out to members, particularly JM and JLB. At his age, he should start with the radio silence if he ever wants that to be possible, and again, I think he knows that on some level.
He had been silent about them for a while until this recently, and I agree that deep down he probably does regret his decision back in September 2010, but on the flip side, my guess is he probably thought, "They want to prove they can do it without me, and once they get it out of their system, they'll want me back." But it's been nearly six years and they are currently touring on their 3rd album without him, and the realization that "they really might not let me come back ever" is setting in, which probably stings, and given his mouth, verbally or when typing on social media, it can't help but come out in his words, even when he does try to choose them carefully. Again, he's still the most in the wrong by far (which I think nearly everyone would agree with, except his hardcore fans, who come off as quite delusional when talking about the split), but his frustration, with the band (which is misplaced) and quite frankly himself (which isn't), isn't that difficult to understand.
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My god, we got one huge novel about MP here.
Seriously, he's the Miley Cyrus/Justin Bieber/Bush of rock, I don't think there has ever been someone featuring so constantly at blabbermouth and having so much to say about him. He can't open his mouth without sparking worldwide controversies and tons of hours of chats about him, lol.
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I think Dave Mustaine has him well and truly covered at Blabbermouth :lol
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My god, we got one huge novel about MP here.
Seriously, he's the Miley Cyrus/Justin Bieber/Bush of rock, I don't think there has ever been someone featuring so constantly at blabbermouth and having so much to say about him. He can't open his mouth without sparking worldwide controversies and tons of hours of chats about him, lol.
Outside of this form, I rarely hear about him. I check Blabbermouth daily, and he's there............rarely. More so than some artists for sure, but way way way less than a ton others. Honestly, outside of MP and DT fan sites, they aren't talked about much, including MP.
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True, yes I did exaggerate, but the only time he's not there, is when he doesn't say anything with DT on it.
Or even without it, I recall him being there for a hospital rant. (Or not?)
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True, yes I did exaggerate, but the only time he's not there, is when he doesn't say anything with DT on it.
Or even without it, I recall him being there for a hospital rant. (Or not?)
Yea, I remember the weird hospital rant from some years ago, can't remember if I read about it here or there though.
And yea, most of his BM appearances are DT related, but I've seen him listed for things related to Flying Colors, Winery Dogs etc. We just generally ignore the non-inflammatory stuff and pay attention to when he puts his foot in his mouth, but honestly it's not as common as we are saying it is.
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My god, we got one huge novel about MP here.
Seriously, he's the Miley Cyrus/Justin Bieber/Bush of rock, I don't think there has ever been someone featuring so constantly at blabbermouth and having so much to say about him. He can't open his mouth without sparking worldwide controversies and tons of hours of chats about him, lol.
Outside of this form, I rarely hear about him. I check Blabbermouth daily, and he's there............rarely. More so than some artists for sure, but way way way less than a ton others. Honestly, outside of MP and DT fan sites, they aren't talked about much, including MP.
Pretty much. To everyone else, it's a total non event, as it should be. To Blabbermouth, it's a non event spun into click bait that most people still consider a non event.
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My god, we got one huge novel about MP here.
Seriously, he's the Miley Cyrus/Justin Bieber/Bush of rock, I don't think there has ever been someone featuring so constantly at blabbermouth and having so much to say about him. He can't open his mouth without sparking worldwide controversies and tons of hours of chats about him, lol.
Outside of this form, I rarely hear about him. I check Blabbermouth daily, and he's there............rarely. More so than some artists for sure, but way way way less than a ton others. Honestly, outside of MP and DT fan sites, they aren't talked about much, including MP.
Pretty much. To everyone else, it's a total non event, as it should be. To Blabbermouth, it's a non event spun into click bait that most people still consider a non event.
The worst thing he did was when he had that blow up about not getting special treatment at an emergency room and I think that drama died in like two days. If that was a bigger star, like someone like Kanye West, they'd still be making memes about it. So yeah. MP doesn't really get that much attention except for the things he should be getting attention for, like making music and whatnot. His other antics barely resonate throughout the ether.
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The worst thing he did was when he had that blow up about not getting special treatment at an emergency room and I think that drama died in like two days. If that was a bigger star, like someone like Kanye West, they'd still be making memes about it. So yeah. MP doesn't really get that much attention except for the things he should be getting attention for, like making music and whatnot. His other antics barely resonate throughout the ether.
Yeah, that one was inexcusable, but generally my response to these things is whatever. :dunno:
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Oh gosh, I remember that emergency room thing, that was rough. :facepalm:
He had been silent about them for a while until this recently, and I agree that deep down he probably does regret his decision back in September 2010, but on the flip side, my guess is he probably thought, "They want to prove they can do it without me, and once they get it out of their system, they'll want me back." But it's been nearly six years and they are currently touring on their 3rd album without him, and the realization that "they really might not let me come back ever" is setting in, which probably stings, and given his mouth, verbally or when typing on social media, it can't help but come out in his words, even when he does try to choose them carefully. Again, he's still the most in the wrong by far (which I think nearly everyone would agree with, except his hardcore fans, who come off as quite delusional when talking about the split), but his frustration, with the band (which is misplaced) and quite frankly himself (which isn't), isn't that difficult to understand.
Good freaking post Kev, this pretty much is exactly how I feel.
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I feel like MP should have tried to put together another LTE before trying to do anything with DT as a whole. It's completely disrespectful to MM if you ask me.
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While it would be cool to see them re-unite for a one-off show (or a LTE show for that matter), I can see why they'd be hesitant when MP says things on twitter like:
Sadly some people aren't as sentimental and forgiving as I am... 😞 Life's waaaaay too short for resentments...
Holy crap. I hope this is his last DT-related post in a long time, for his own sake.
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that or his "you can't handle the truth" meme in response to someone respecting his decision not to speak about the current DT...
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While it would be cool to see them re-unite for a one-off show (or a LTE show for that matter), I can see why they'd be hesitant when MP says things on twitter like:
Sadly some people aren't as sentimental and forgiving as I am... 😞 Life's waaaaay too short for resentments...
Holy crap. I hope this is his last DT-related post in a long time, for his own sake.
Yikes, yeah man. Saying nothing at all would probably be a wiser choice.
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DT has nothing to gain and everything to lose. Conversely, Mike has everything to gain and nothing to lose. While I empathize with Mike for wanting this to happen, this should probably have been handled in private as now no one is the winner.
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DT has nothing to gain and everything to lose. Conversely, Mike has everything to gain and nothing to lose. While I empathize with Mike for wanting this to happen, this should probably have been handled in private as now no one is the winner.
If he also really wanted to play with the DT guys again, he shouldn't have scheduled a cruise. If playing with those guys is so important, he should have thought about them when making the plans. Say do a show in NYC where some of the guys are from and easy to get to for the rest. A week out in the ocean? That makes for a logistical nightmare for a band who wasn't planning on doing this on their own.
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Oh gosh, I remember that emergency room thing, that was rough. :facepalm:
"still not feeling much better today, but the show must go on! And to the rest of you, I don't have time to hate people who hate me because I'm too busy loving people who love me."
::) That sounds like it came out of the mouth of an uptight college girl who says things like "If you can't handle me at my worst, you don't deserve me at my best"
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::) That sounds like it came out of the mouth of an uptight college girl who says things like "If you can't handle me at my worst, you don't deserve me at my best"
:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
I hate those cliche sayings so much
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"still not feeling much better today, but the show must go on! And to the rest of you, I don't have time to hate people who hate me because I'm too busy loving people who love me."
::) That sounds like it came out of the mouth of an uptight college girl who says things like "If you can't handle me at my worst, you don't deserve me at my best"
:lol Yup that pretty much sums it up.
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maybe the invite was extended to the FOUR members so he could "trap" them on the boat and try to convince them how much a permanent reunion is best for everyone (see: THE FANS)...?
it honestly would've been better had he invited ALL of DT to perform shows of their own on the cruise. 12 step would've just been a bonus, not a requirement for them.
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MP is a drama queen.
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I still think MP's OCD is the only thing that kept him in DT the last few years he was there......I think he only stuck it out to complete the 12 Step Suite. BC&SL completed the 12 Step Suite and he was gone soon after that.
I completely agree with that. I have written that years ago, here, and everybody said I was crazy. But I really believe in that. MP thinks only in himself. An egotistical, disturbed man.
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I still think MP's OCD is the only thing that kept him in DT the last few years he was there......I think he only stuck it out to complete the 12 Step Suite. BC&SL completed the 12 Step Suite and he was gone soon after that.
I completely agree with that. I have written that years ago, here, and everybody said I was crazy. But I really believe in that. MP thinks only in himself. An egotistical, disturbed man.
I disagree. I think that Portnoy really believed that the band was going to be willing to take that multiple year break that he wanted. And after he quit the band, I think that he really believed that the band would take him back and was genuinely shocked when the band took measures to move on without him.
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I don't think he was tired of the band after Six Degrees and then he was like "Mh, guess I'll have to stick around for four more albums to complete the saga". When he left I remember he said having pondered about it for a year and I don't see no reason to not believe him on that particular detail... at worst, if he was tired after Systematic Chaos, completing the saga may have kept him around for Black Clouds, but no way he was making several albums to get to the end of the saga.
Furthermore, he would have never considered firing James after Six Degrees, since he started to sing on the saga and then another singer would have to complete it.
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::) That sounds like it came out of the mouth of an uptight college girl who says things like "If you can't handle me at my worst, you don't deserve me at my best"
:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
I hate those cliche sayings so much
His daughter probably said it.
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And the uptight college girl who says that is one of the single most obnoxious and self-absorbed drama queens you will ever encounter on Facebook.
I know a few people like this. :lol
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With those "look at me" updates like
" Actually thought it would be different..."
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There's only one boat where this was going to happen!
(https://1019thewave.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/fantasy-island.jpg)
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With those "look at me" updates like
" Actually thought it would be different..."
God, that shit makes me irritable. Either tell everybody WTF your problem is or STFU. Not this fishing around to try to encourage people to ask you what's wrong, then say "oh, I can talk about it on here, I sent you a PM".
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Stuff like this is off limits:
MP is a drama queen.
An egotistical, disturbed man.
Regardless of whether there might be any truth to any of that, namecalling is in poor taste and against forum rules. Discuss his conduct and what you don't like about it, but namecalling is out of bounds.
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I still think MP's OCD is the only thing that kept him in DT the last few years he was there......I think he only stuck it out to complete the 12 Step Suite. BC&SL completed the 12 Step Suite and he was gone soon after that.
I completely agree with that. I have written that years ago, here, and everybody said I was crazy. But I really believe in that. MP thinks only in himself. An egotistical, disturbed man.
Disagree. His problem is that he wears his heart on his sleeve. People who are like that will sometimes to behave in curious ways without even realizing it. He's just an extroverted person who sometimes crosses the line.
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namecalling is out of bounds
Is that so, Mr. Poopypants?
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If he really wants to have the four DT guys and he's not too picky, he could always contact Chris, Charlie, Derek and Kevin. They're not ''the'' four DT guys, but they're still four DT guys
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Poor Steve
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Steve?
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(https://i.imgur.com/StiyYrM.png)
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(https://static6.bornrichimages.com/cdn2/500/500/91/c/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/Steve-Harris-Tour-2013_thumb.jpg)
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If I can put up my psych major hat for a second here...
I honestly don't think Portnoy is egotistical; I think he is a very insecure person. His actions, the way he talks, the way he acts, just screams of insecurity. It's why he does so many little things for the various bands he's in, always looking for a way to please others so they like him. Same with wanting the credit for doing such things. By getting credit, he gets props and makes people like and appreciate him. Or the fact that both his FB page and the home page of his website are draped in drum magazines where he was on the cover; he's not doing it so much to brag, but to remind everyone, "See, I am good." He needs that constant validation, which is why he loves his hardcore fans so much, because they constantly validate him. Meanwhile, an insecure person doesn't take criticism well, even when presented in a constructive way. A secure person simply doesn't react so negatively to criticism the way he has over the years; a secure person can blow it off and move on since they know that not everyone is going to love them and/or everything they do.
Now, I do think he had gotten a little too big for his britches in the late 00s with Dream Theater, thinking he ran the show and they could never go on without him, hence him leaving the band and publicly saying so almost immediately, when most people would have waited for the smoke to clear before telling the public. I am guessing he figured his value at that point was so high that public pressure and everything would persuade the band either that he was right in needing a break or that they could not go on without him. Plus, he thought he was a good bet to keep the drumming gig in A7X full-time and long term, so he was covered either way. Or so he thought. Turns out, DT said, "See ya, we're moving on," and A7X said, "Thanks for the tour, adios." And he was left with neither. That would make most people a little bitter and resentful, especially an insecure person who frequently needs validation.
As one last point, I have said for years that he is almost a different person when he is around Neal Morse, and that is easy to figure out why. Neal is probably his closest friend and biggest musical soulmate, one who accepts him no matter what, so he is comfortable, relaxed and laid back around Neal, because he always has his best friend right there with him. Really, it's no wonder he does so many projects with him. It's more than just the music aspect of it, which is strong already.
I am sure this breakdown will go over the heads of some... :lol :lol
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Here here Kev.
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I think that that analysis is pretty spot-on. I would add one thing.
Turns out, DT said, "See ya, we're moving on," and A7X said, "Thanks for the tour, adios." And he was left with neither. That would make most people a little bitter and resentful, especially an insecure person who frequently needs validation.
This didn't just make him bitter and/or resentful. It crushed him. To be that insecure, to think that things were really going great, and then to be "rejected" by both bands really must have been horrible. It's easy to say that he didn't handle it well; it's much more difficult to say why. To most people, it was "His ego just couldn't handle it" and while that's true, it's more complicated than that.
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Here here Kev.
where?
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I've never seen these many MP haters in one forum :chill
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I've never seen these many MP haters in one forum :chill
You have a strange definition of "hater."
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/Hate Mike Portnoy
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Turns out, DT said, "See ya, we're moving on," and A7X said, "Thanks for the tour, adios." And he was left with neither. That would make most people a little bitter and resentful, especially an insecure person who frequently needs validation.
This didn't just make him bitter and/or resentful. It crushed him. To be that insecure, to think that things were really going great, and then to be "rejected" by both bands really must have been horrible. It's easy to say that he didn't handle it well; it's much more difficult to say why. To most people, it was "His ego just couldn't handle it" and while that's true, it's more complicated than that.
Yep, and to make matters worse, the first "new" band he had after leaving DT, Adrenaline Mob, was an abject failure on just about every level imaginable.
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Here here Kev.
where?
Ha! ;D
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In response to a previous post, I don't think he got tired of DT after 6DOIT, I think it was after Score.
If you notice, he had a master plan for everything and things dealing with patterns and keys and nuggets. Once they finished 8V with the whole reoccurring theme deal going on, and they performed with an orchestra, and then when asked what the gimmick the followup would have (which ended up being SC) Mike kinda threw his hands in the air. The only thing that was consistent was that he did his 12 Step Suite. By the time BC&SL rolled around, the only things on his bucket list were touring with a huge band and performing at Madison Square Garden. He said touring with Metallica, Rush, or Maiden would be a dream. Maiden was the only feasible one and that happened...in MSG.
A7X offering to have him tour was the perfect excuse to bail but like most people agree, he probably thought he would be asked on full time.
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If you notice, he had a master plan for everything and things dealing with patterns and keys and nuggets. Once they finished 8V with the whole reoccurring theme deal going on, and they performed with an orchestra, and then when asked what the gimmick the followup would have (which ended up being SC) Mike kinda threw his hands in the air. The only thing that was consistent was that he did his 12 Step Suite. By the time BC&SL rolled around, the only things on his bucket list were touring with a huge band and performing at Madison Square Garden. He said touring with Metallica, Rush, or Maiden would be a dream. Maiden was the only feasible one and that happened...in MSG.
That's interesting.
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He should have gone Luca Turilli and founded "Mike Portnoy's Dream Theater"
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He should have gone Luca Turilli and founded "Mike Portnoy's Dream Theater"
Dream Theater of Fire!
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Honestly, you have to be pretty obtuse and deliberately looking for reasons to hate Portnoy to be put off by the "all four Dream Theater guys" comment. There's nothing there to be offended about.
I've never seen these many MP haters in one forum :chill
You have a strange definition of "hater."
After all the comments that have ensued, I think it can be said that a lot of people don't really like MP. I suppose 'hate' is an extreme word for it; even my Dad has told me numerous times that I throw that word around too often. But really, I think everyone is just making a meal out of this.
(https://iv1.lisimg.com/image/4003570/500full-dream-theater.jpg)
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I don't think that discussing Mike's personality, including his very real issues with control and seeming lack of throttle between his brain and his mouth, and the consequences of them, makes us haters. I still very much admire the guy as a musician and respect what he's done and continues to do as an artist, but I also think the guy has some problems which you'd have to be blind, deaf, and dumb not to acknowledge. Nobody here is saying "He's such an asshole!" That would imply that he enjoys causing chaos and harm, which clearly isn't the case. I would even characterize the current discussion as leaning toward the apologist side. He's not hurtful toward others out of malice, and he's not harmful to himself on purpose, either. He's an impulsive guy who makes bad decisions sometimes, as do we all. The difference is that he does his very publicly, and loudly. Acknowledging that and discussing it doesn't make you a hater.
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I've never seen these many MP haters in one forum :chill
You have a strange definition of "hater."
I don't think the people of this forum really hate or despise Portnoy. I do think the forum are really really deep in terms of analyzing him and his quirks and flaws, in addition to his positive qualities.
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In response to a previous post, I don't think he got tired of DT after 6DOIT, I think it was after Score.
If you notice, he had a master plan for everything and things dealing with patterns and keys and nuggets. Once they finished 8V with the whole reoccurring theme deal going on, and they performed with an orchestra, and then when asked what the gimmick the followup would have (which ended up being SC) Mike kinda threw his hands in the air. The only thing that was consistent was that he did his 12 Step Suite. By the time BC&SL rolled around, the only things on his bucket list were touring with a huge band and performing at Madison Square Garden. He said touring with Metallica, Rush, or Maiden would be a dream. Maiden was the only feasible one and that happened...in MSG.
A7X offering to have him tour was the perfect excuse to bail but like most people agree, he probably thought he would be asked on full time.
I also agree with this, but that's life basically, it can happen to anyone that one day you wake up and you realize you're not enjoying what you're doing anymore, be it your work, your band or the relationship with your wife.
If at all, kudos to him for having such a fire going on for so many albums, there's only so much you can do before you run out of even the widest of imaginations, which he surely had when it comes to the extra stuff.
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Here here Kev.
where?
Hear hear John. You feel better bro? :biggrin:
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I don't think that discussing Mike's personality, including his very real issues with control and seeming lack of throttle between his brain and his mouth, and the consequences of them, makes us haters. I still very much admire the guy as a musician and respect what he's done and continues to do as an artist, but I also think the guy has some problems which you'd have to be blind, deaf, and dumb not to acknowledge. Nobody here is saying "He's such an asshole!" That would imply that he enjoys causing chaos and harm, which clearly isn't the case. I would even characterize the current discussion as leaning toward the apologist side. He's not hurtful toward others out of malice, and he's not harmful to himself on purpose, either. He's an impulsive guy who makes bad decisions sometimes, as do we all. The difference is that he does his very publicly, and loudly. Acknowledging that and discussing it doesn't make you a hater.
Hear, hear!!
:lol
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:lol
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I've never seen these many MP haters in one forum :chill
You have a strange definition of "hater."
I don't think the people of this forum really hate or despise Portnoy. I do think the forum are really really deep in terms of analyzing him and his quirks and flaws, in addition to his positive qualities.
There are definitely some people on here who seem heavily biased against him and pick apart everything he says right down to the pronoun usage. That said, it's a minority and there are just as many who defend him blindly. This forum as a whole seems to be pretty objective on him for the most part, if a little over analytical. :lol But I get it.
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I've never seen these many MP haters in one forum :chill
Nobody hates him. In fact, I think that what makes this conversation somewhat interesting is that even those (me included) who have been critical of him love the man's work to some extent. He was a huge musical influence on me some years ago, and I'll always cherish that; but that doesn't mean I can't be critical of him when he speaks. He has seen some criticism in this forum because, according to some of our opinions, he has deserved it lol.
If you want a place where you want to talk mostly wonders about him and have lots of people to agree with you, you can always join MP.com. :D
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I definitely am a fan of Portnoy. I wish i could meet him someday.
The poster that said Adrenaline Mob was a failure on every level is wrong. 'Omerta' was a great album.
I think this whole thing is just the first step to him getting back in the band. We know it's going to happen. Maybe later than we think, but think.....even Dokken is getting back together for some Japan shows. Who thought that would ever happen? Someday Geoff Tate will be back in Queensryche. The only one that i don't see happening, as VH is my fave band is Mike Anthony getting back in, unless Sammy returns....
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Adrenaline Mob was like a midlife crisis.
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I definitely am a fan of Portnoy. I wish i could meet him someday.
The poster that said Adrenaline Mob was a failure on every level is wrong. 'Omerta' was a great album.
I think this whole thing is just the first step to him getting back in the band. We know it's going to happen. Maybe later than we think, but think.....even Dokken is getting back together for some Japan shows. Who thought that would ever happen? Someday Geoff Tate will be back in Queensryche. The only one that i don't see happening, as VH is my fave band is Mike Anthony getting back in, unless Sammy returns....
That's pretty much how I see it. DT had a relatively clean breakup compared to bands like GNR or Van Halen. I don't think a DT reunion is that far out of the realms of possibility, I just think MP is asking for it too early. Give it time and maybe it'll happen.
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I think this whole thing is just the first step to him getting back in the band. We know it's going to happen.
I hate this kind of blinkered fanboi opinion.
Portnoy will NEVER be a full time member of Dream Theater ever again.
NEVER.
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Here here Kev.
where?
Hear hear John. You feel better bro? :biggrin:
:lol
Oh, I didn't say that because you spelled it wrong. I was just being a ball-buster.
I've never seen these many MP haters in one forum :chill
You haven't seen hate until you've seen my reaction to the person who gets in the way of my meal times.
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That's pretty much how I see it. DT had a relatively clean breakup compared to bands like GNR or Van Halen. I don't think a DT reunion is that far out of the realms of possibility, I just think MP is asking for it too early. Give it time and maybe it'll happen.
[/quote]
Yup, the breakup was relatively clean. All Mike wanted to do was take a break. I don't blame him, because DT weren't making completely great albums. Maybe 3-4 great songs, some true clunker songs, and some that needed serious editing. There was the burnout issue.
My only problem is what to do with MM. You can't just kick him to the curb as he has been a more than capable replacement. I appreciate him a lot. Has the personality of a head of lettuce, but not everyone can't be colorful, lol.
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I think this whole thing is just the first step to him getting back in the band. We know it's going to happen.
I hate this kind of blinkered fanboi opinion.
Portnoy will NEVER be a full time member of Dream Theater ever again.
NEVER.
Ha ha ha. Maybe you can pick some lottery numbers for me, since you know the future.
And of course i'm a fan.....
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I think this whole thing is just the first step to him getting back in the band. We know it's going to happen.
I hate this kind of blinkered fanboi opinion.
Portnoy will NEVER be a full time member of Dream Theater ever again.
NEVER.
This is just as arrogant as people who say it's guaranteed for Portnoy to come back.
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It's just when people say Portnoy will OBVIOUSLY return to Dream Theater full time...
When everyone in the band has repeatedly said that will not happen.
I see it happening for a one off show but not re-joining full time - even if mangini retires.
...
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They should fire Mangini and get Lars. Better than both Migueles
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It's just when people say Portnoy will OBVIOUSLY return to Dream Theater full time...
When everyone in the band has repeatedly said that will not happen.
I see it happening for a one off show but not re-joining full time - even if mangini retires.
...
I can see Myung's face when he gets the news that everyone else is ready for Mike to finally return to the band full-time...
It looks the same as it always does.
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(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-FgJ9TF0YzP4/AAAAAAAAAAI/AAAAAAAAABc/CLyK0qsEVro/photo.jpg)
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Oh God, his eyes are so open.
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I've never seen these many MP haters in one forum :chill
Nobody hates him. In fact, I think that what makes this conversation somewhat interesting is that even those (me included) who have been critical of him love the man's work to some extent. He was a huge musical influence on me some years ago, and I'll always cherish that; but that doesn't mean I can't be critical of him when he speaks. He has seen some criticism in this forum because, according to some of our opinions, he has deserved it lol.
If you want a place where you want to talk mostly wonders about him and have lots of people to agree with you, you can always join MP.com. :D
Thanks for the advice.
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I've never seen these many MP haters in one forum :chill
Nobody hates him. In fact, I think that what makes this conversation somewhat interesting is that even those (me included) who have been critical of him love the man's work to some extent. He was a huge musical influence on me some years ago, and I'll always cherish that; but that doesn't mean I can't be critical of him when he speaks. He has seen some criticism in this forum because, according to some of our opinions, he has deserved it lol.
If you want a place where you want to talk mostly wonders about him and have lots of people to agree with you, you can always join MP.com. :D
Thanks for the advice.
It's good advice. If you're such a fan of the man that you can't handle reading a little constructive criticism, his site, where such talk is frowned upon, could be the perfect fit for you. We're just trying to help.
The poster that said Adrenaline Mob was a failure on every level is wrong. 'Omerta' was a great album.
Come on now. :lol
I think this whole thing is just the first step to him getting back in the band. We know it's going to happen.
We do?
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I've never seen these many MP haters in one forum :chill
Nobody hates him. In fact, I think that what makes this conversation somewhat interesting is that even those (me included) who have been critical of him love the man's work to some extent. He was a huge musical influence on me some years ago, and I'll always cherish that; but that doesn't mean I can't be critical of him when he speaks. He has seen some criticism in this forum because, according to some of our opinions, he has deserved it lol.
If you want a place where you want to talk mostly wonders about him and have lots of people to agree with you, you can always join MP.com. :D
Thanks for the advice.
It's good advice. If you're such a fan of the man that you can't handle reading a little constructive criticism, his site, where such talk is frowned upon, could be the perfect fit for you. We're just trying to help.
I never said it was bad advice. I AM a fan of the man, and I'm also a fan of Dream Theater. My comments have in now way suggested that I 'can't handle reading a little constructive criticism'.
However, if the discussion here is geared towards purely criticizing MP's actions and comments; then it's not much of a discussion, is it? Just because I'm defending what he (MP) says, y'all seem to be pushing me towards MP's forum. If you're referring to my infamous 'hater' comment, I followed up by saying that it might have been too strong a word.
MP is a drama queen.
An egotistical, disturbed man.
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/23/f9/7f/23f97f61ac76c3bf65618cd50e13b1f0.jpg)
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I definitely am a fan of Portnoy. I wish i could meet him someday.
The poster that said Adrenaline Mob was a failure on every level is wrong. 'Omerta' was a great album.
I think this whole thing is just the first step to him getting back in the band. We know it's going to happen. Maybe later than we think, but think.....even Dokken is getting back together for some Japan shows. Who thought that would ever happen? Someday Geoff Tate will be back in Queensryche. The only one that i don't see happening, as VH is my fave band is Mike Anthony getting back in, unless Sammy returns....
That's pretty much how I see it. DT had a relatively clean breakup compared to bands like GNR or Van Halen. I don't think a DT reunion is that far out of the realms of possibility, I just think MP is asking for it too early. Give it time and maybe it'll happen.
Breakup? Reunion?
The band never split! They just replaced the drummer, after all. And didn't even take too long to come back with a new album. In the golden years, Yes changed drummer pretty frequently and no one ever talked about "Yes breakup". Ok Portnoy was a founder member, the one who gave the name to the band (his beloved father's advice), has been there for decades, but that doesn't qualify for "breakup".
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Imagine you part ways with a friend, and that friend goes away to do his stuff, various differences between you two and maybe he moves to another city altogether.
And after that, you meet a new friend, and you start to trust each other. 5 years is damn enough time to put large amounts of your trust and friendship on someone, would you tell that new friend to go fuck himself just because your old friend decides to come back?
They basically share many things during the months a tour lasts, and the writing and the recording, so stop treating it as if it was merely a business relationship, which is not.
They clearly get along, and Portnoy, while still relevant and they possibly still care very much about him, is just not anymore in their daily lives, which MM is.
I'm pretty sure MP wants the Kevin Moore treatment, where the band repeatedly invites him to come back to remember old DT days, and remember, between KM leaving the band and the Roseland show (in which, as far as I know KM was invited to perform SDV) there are 5 years, which is around the time MP has out of the band.
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It's hard to defend MP when he continues to do the wrong thing with DT. He airs everything publicly.
That will never stop me from following him and most of his projects.
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I definitely am a fan of Portnoy. I wish i could meet him someday.
The poster that said Adrenaline Mob was a failure on every level is wrong. 'Omerta' was a great album.
I think this whole thing is just the first step to him getting back in the band. We know it's going to happen. Maybe later than we think, but think.....even Dokken is getting back together for some Japan shows. Who thought that would ever happen? Someday Geoff Tate will be back in Queensryche. The only one that i don't see happening, as VH is my fave band is Mike Anthony getting back in, unless Sammy returns....
That's pretty much how I see it. DT had a relatively clean breakup compared to bands like GNR or Van Halen. I don't think a DT reunion is that far out of the realms of possibility, I just think MP is asking for it too early. Give it time and maybe it'll happen.
Breakup? Reunion?
The band never split! They just replaced the drummer, after all. And didn't even take too long to come back with a new album. In the golden years, Yes changed drummer pretty frequently and no one ever talked about "Yes breakup". Ok Portnoy was a founder member, the one who gave the name to the band (his beloved father's advice), has been there for decades, but that doesn't qualify for "breakup".
Splitting hairs.
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I never said it was bad advice. I AM a fan of the man, and I'm also a fan of Dream Theater. My comments have in now way suggested that I 'can't handle reading a little constructive criticism'.
However, if the discussion here is geared towards purely criticizing MP's actions and comments; then it's not much of a discussion, is it? Just because I'm defending what he (MP) says, y'all seem to be pushing me towards MP's forum. If you're referring to my infamous 'hater' comment, I followed up by saying that it might have been too strong a word.
This thread is about the invitation MP did to the other guys to join him on the boat to play the suite; and lots of us agree that the way he has addressed the situation (and rejection of the invitation) hasn't been the best; but that doesn't make the conversation non-constructive. bosk1 has already warned the bashing folks because they do not contribute anything valuable to this thread, so there's that. The rest of us are just expressing our emotions and, in my case, disappointment regarding MP's passive-aggressive stance with the DT guys in this particular situation. When a 'post your favorite things about MP!' thread comes around, I'm sure you'll see a lot of positive vibes in which, I reckon, you'll feel more comfortable with.
Also, if by 'y'all' you mean Kev and me, we're not pushing you away lol. It's just that your posting history and overall content of your posts revolves around how much you love MP and how, apparently, you can't handle the man being criticised like what's happening in this thread; so you might actually feel more at home in MP.com in these subject matters. It's not a better or a worse place, it's just different in the way the 95% of the MP-related posts over there are people agreeing with MP with everything he does/says.
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Studies have shown that being an addict stunts your emotional growth and maturity. I know 40-yr-old recovered druggies that have the persona of a 13 year old. Probably one other contributing factor to the way he handles things.
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It's hard to defend MP when he continues to do the wrong thing with DT. He airs everything publicly.
Sorry dude, but the memo already went out.
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:lol
Yet Rumbo, we still see people come on and defend his actions.
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:emo: b...b....but i already put out my PRESS RELEASE.
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Sorry dude, but the memo already went out.
I still love that A7X interview.
"Mike came to us and said, I quit Dream Theater, now I can be with you guys full time."
"Mike, I think you should reconsider"
"But I already put out my press release."
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For those who haven't read that interview: https://loudwire.com/zacky-vengeance-avenged-sevenfold-speaks-mike-portnoy-dream-theater-drama/
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Now I finally understand the James LaBrie shovel meme. It's because DT fans love constantly digging up old shit. :neverusethis:
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Now I finally understand the James LaBrie shovel meme. It's because DT fans love constantly digging up old shit. :neverusethis:
Everything you say here is always awesome and true. :hefdaddy
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Now I finally understand the James LaBrie shovel meme. It's because DT "fans" love constantly digging up old shit. :neverusethis:
FTFY
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Awwww maannnnnn.... :facepalm:
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What happened to Chaossystem?
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What happened to Chaossystem?
bosky popped a CAP lock in his ASS :)
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What happened to Chaossystem?
He's hanging out On the Back of Angela.
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What happened to Chaossystem?
He's hanging out On the Back of Angela.
All praise ASacrificedSon.
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Now I finally understand the James LaBrie shovel meme. It's because DT fans love constantly digging up old shit. :neverusethis:
If this were Facebook, I would like this. Then I'd unlike it. So that I could like it again.
I'd do that probably 100 more times.
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What happened to Chaossystem?
He's hanging out On the Back of Angela.
All praise ASacrificedSon.
I hadn't noticed they had also stopped posting, why? Lol
Anywho, I feel like I miss Chaossystem, he was part of this forum's folklore
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Was he the dude that was completely obsessed with making fantasy Dream Theater setlists?
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And randomly CAPITALIZING words THAT didn't seem TO have ANY SORT of rhyme OR reason to THEM.
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And randomly CAPITALIZING words THAT didn't seem TO have ANY SORT of rhyme OR reason to THEM.
I read him like it was William Shatner.
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And randomly CAPITALIZING words THAT didn't seem TO have ANY SORT of rhyme OR reason to THEM.
I read him like it was William Shatner.
:lol Ditto
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And randomly CAPITALIZING words THAT didn't seem TO have ANY SORT of rhyme OR reason to THEM.
I read him like it was William Shatner.
:lol Ditto
That was my favorite part. :lol :lol
When someone gets banned, does their profile get deleted? I tried to go back and look at old post but couldn't find his username.
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And randomly CAPITALIZING words THAT didn't seem TO have ANY SORT of rhyme OR reason to THEM.
I read him like it was William Shatner.
:rollin
I don't really have anything constructive to add; Kev said it best a few pages ago I think.
The post a few pages back that said that MM has the personality of a head of lettuce reminded me of the "Salad Boy" challenge from Impractical Jokers... MM's the one with the pickle arms right? (BTW, the two times I've met MM he was a joy to be around and very engaging)
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And randomly CAPITALIZING words THAT didn't seem TO have ANY SORT of rhyme OR reason to THEM.
I HAVE no IDEA to what YOU are referring.
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Now I finally understand the James LaBrie shovel meme. It's because DT "fans" love constantly digging up old shit. :neverusethis:
FTFY
Yup, because "real" fans know that you can't provide a source to the relevant post so people know that it was an actual quote and not more so-called MP bashing. ::)
Besides, it's not like there's anything more to discuss here as evidenced by the last page, so why not lock it and move on?
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What happened to Chaossystem?
He's hanging out On the Back of Angela.
All praise ASacrificedSon.
I hadn't noticed they had also stopped posting, why? Lol
They were the same person with two accounts or something...
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Yes. Apparently she felt like she would get more respect if she posted as a male.
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Yes. Apparently she felt like she would get more respect if she posted as a male.
understandable, after all the people calling her stories bullshit, that was a sad situation.
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Yes. Apparently she felt like she would get more respect if she posted as a male.
understandable, after all the people calling her stories bullshit, that was a sad situation.
I don't think that had anything to do with gender...
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Yes. Apparently she felt like she would get more respect if she posted as a male.
understandable, after all the people calling her stories bullshit, that was a sad situation.
Well, they probably were bullshit.
Yes. Apparently she felt like she would get more respect if she posted as a male.
understandable, after all the people calling her stories bullshit, that was a sad situation.
I don't think that had anything to do with gender...
Well, her apology included that detail. The fact that she was a little girl looking for attention, it's totally plausible.
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For those who haven't read that interview: https://loudwire.com/zacky-vengeance-avenged-sevenfold-speaks-mike-portnoy-dream-theater-drama/
I do say, that's some fine old shit you've dug up there. All these years later, it goes down even more roflsome than before. *tips hat*
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Anywho, I feel like I miss Chaossystem, he was part of this forum's folklore
WUT??
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Offtopic, I know, but I don't miss chaossystem at all, he was one of the only two people I've added to ignore list here.
I'm not revealing who's the other one. :biggrin:
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Offtopic, I know, but I don't miss chaossystem at all, he was one of the only two people I've added to ignore list here.
I'm not revealing who's the other one. :biggrin:
Well it's not me. :) :hug: :-*
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Definitely not. :tup
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It's hadi-persian
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Chris Pierman is god
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Wasn't really expecting that reaction to talking about that interview :lol
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Now I finally understand the James LaBrie shovel meme. It's because DT "fans" love constantly digging up old shit. :neverusethis:
FTFY
Yup, because "real" fans know that you can't provide a source to the relevant post so people know that it was an actual quote and not more so-called MP bashing. ::)
Besides, it's not like there's anything more to discuss here as evidenced by the last page, so why not lock it and move on?
BTW, those large bolded quotes were my attempt at sarcasm. I got kind of sick of certain musicians putting quotes around the word fans when discussing someone that isn't cool with his behavior. The thousands of dollars I have spent on CDs, concerts, hotels, gas, etc. (even drumming DVDs...and I'm not a drummer) just doesn't matter.
I think linking the interview was very relevant and appreciated by those who might not of seen it while when it first came out.
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I was happy that I wasn't the only one that remembered that interview. I could never find it, so I was happy to watch it again and chuckle and feel bad for MP and A7X.
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I wonder how did MP react when being told ‘Dude, that’s not how we do business. You should have talked to us before.’
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I'm just surprised that such a big decision was made without talking to the band or their respective managers. I have to imagine that MP had his own manager during that time, or he just went along with the band and their management. I'm just surprised that not more people were involved in his conversations or decisions.
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This thread is funny (:
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Wow you guys are looking wayyyyyyy to much into it.
He just wants to reunite for a gig. And they don't want. That's it.
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Well Portnoy himself is not helping with this being blown out of proportion.
This is coming from someone who thinks the criticism he gets is pretty over exaggerated on here.
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People assume too much. They talk as if they knew intimately what goes on between Portnoy and DT, as if they are inside their heads and can see their thoughts. Like a guy said above, it was just an invitation and DT refused, that's it. But people love some controversy, no wonder the topic is 8 pages now.
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Wow you guys are looking wayyyyyyy to much into it.
He just wants to reunite for a gig. And they don't want. That's it.
Agreed. But Mosh 100% hit the nail on the head with this, which is what has stirred up probably at least half of the conversation:Well Portnoy himself is not helping with this being blown out of proportion.
And this is coming from someone else who thinks the criticism he gets is pretty over exaggerated on here.
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People assume too much. They talk as if they knew intimately what goes on between Portnoy and DT, as if they are inside their heads and can see their thoughts. Like a guy said above, it was just an invitation and DT refused, that's it. But people love some controversy, no wonder the topic is 8 pages now.
But, of course, this thread wouldn't even exist if not for some guy who has a love of controversy.
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Since MP is so open, we know it all. Poster, please.
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Miguel will probably end up playing with Teodorico as keyboardist
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The way that I see it is this - MP obviously knows that anything he says publicly regarding DT is going to be manipulated to make him look like the bad guy, mainly because when this all started he was being very childish and was making their "break up" very VERY public. At this point, he really should know better than to send out a PUBLIC invitation to the guys about anything, ESPECIALLY when it's an invitation to get on stage and play with him again. It seems to me, that he's doing it knowing they're more than likely going to say no, because he deliberately wants the fans to think they're holding some grudge against him. If he really wanted them to just play with him, he should just send them an email or a text or whatever. Why must he make these things public when there is so much uncertainty to what their response is going to be? Now all the fans know he extended an invitation to them, and when they decline, now it's "stupid old DT's fault that they couldn't just let it go and play the songs with MP for his birthday". It just doesn't seem genuine. If it was me, and I really missed my friends deep down in my heart, I would make it a little more personal, and NOT make it some public Facebook post. I just don't get it.
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The way that I see it is this - MP obviously knows that anything he says publicly regarding DT is going to be manipulated to make him look like the bad guy, mainly because when this all started he was being very childish and was making their "break up" very VERY public. At this point, he really should know better than to send out a PUBLIC invitation to the guys about anything, ESPECIALLY when it's an invitation to get on stage and play with him again. It seems to me, that he's doing it knowing they're more than likely going to say no, because he deliberately wants the fans to think they're holding some grudge against him. If he really wanted them to just play with him, he should just send them an email or a text or whatever. Why must he make these things public when there is so much uncertainty to what their response is going to be? Now all the fans know he extended an invitation to them, and when they decline, now it's "stupid old DT's fault that they couldn't just let it go and play the songs with MP for his birthday". It just doesn't seem genuine. If it was me, and I really missed my friends deep down in my heart, I would make it a little more personal, and NOT make it some public Facebook post. I just don't get it.
Completely agree on everything you said.
B.Lee
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I disagree, I think MP just wanted to make it a fun thing. Being that he recorded all those songs with DT, He wanted to give them a heads up and felt it would be appropriate to keep them first in mind for the invite. I don't see any harm in that at all and I wouldn't second guess his character. He's done alot of really good things in music and has good intentions.
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I totally agree that he shouldn't have made it a public invitation.
He should have asked the guys discreetly .
Whether it's always intentional or not - he has a habit of trying to make himself look good in the public eye and it horribly backfiring.
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If it was me, and I really missed my friends deep down in my heart, I would make it a little more personal, and NOT make it some public Facebook post. I just don't get it.
That's because you are not a celebrity. That seems like how they communicate everything: On TwittFaceGram, for all the world to see.
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@MikePortnoy
" Yo @MrsPortnoy
Sorry I got drunk and threw up in your lap at your sisters wedding. Asking for forgiveness FOR MY FANS. "
@MrsPortnoy
" @MikePortnoy MIKE I CANNOT BELIE VE YOU TWEETED THIS. YOU ARE IN SO MUCH SHIT. "
@MikePortnoy
" @MrsPortnoy Seems you can't rely on anyone. Well. I Tried. FOR THE FANS "
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MP just posted in response to a fan's request to pick his brain about songwriting:
"For those DT fans with short term memories and have "forgotten" that I was one of the key writers in DT: https://youtu.be/_ovdzUj8h6o"
Coooooome onnnnnnnn.....
Anyway, I don't think this was addressed to me because I am a "fan" but I'm not sure if I have forgotten or "forgotten" or just always correctly "assessed" his "place" in the band"."
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That's what passes us long time fans off. Shut your mouth Mike and give the guy an answer without being bitter.
It's your damn fault that you have to deal with your bitterness
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That's what passes us long time fans off. Shut your mouth Mike and give the guy an answer without being bitter.
It's your damn fault that you have to deal with your bitterness
Sounds like you're pretty passed off yourself.
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:biggrin: :biggrin:
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That's what passes us long time fans off. Shut your mouth Mike and give the guy an answer without being bitter.
It's your damn fault that you have to deal with your bitterness
Sounds like you're pretty passed off yourself.
You feel better now that you pointed that out? Good for you.
The point stands. I love his music and will always follow him but damn that's the stuff that rubs me the wrong way.
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That's what passes us long time fans off. Shut your mouth Mike and give the guy an answer without being bitter.
It's your damn fault that you have to deal with your bitterness
Sounds like you're pretty passed off yourself.
You feel better now that you pointed that out?
No. :'(
I agree with your overall point though. Dude has no one to blame but himself.
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That's what passes us long time fans off. Shut your mouth Mike and give the guy an answer without being bitter.
It's your damn fault that you have to deal with your bitterness
Sounds like you're pretty passed off yourself.
You feel better now that you pointed that out?
No. :'(
I do. :corn :corn :corn
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Alright hugs and kisses. :-*
Kotowboy I fart in your general direction.
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Alright hugs and kisses. :-*
Kotowboy I fart in your general direction.
:angry: NOW GO AWAY OR I WILL TAUNT YOU A SECOND TIME
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:lol
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I totally agree that he shouldn't have made it a public invitation.
He should have asked the guys discreetly .
I think he did ask them discreetly; he just made the invitation public once it became clear that none of them were coming.
MP just posted in response to a fan's request to pick his brain about songwriting:
"For those DT fans with short term memories and have "forgotten" that I was one of the key writers in DT: https://youtu.be/_ovdzUj8h6o"
Coooooome onnnnnnnn.....
Anyway, I don't think this was addressed to me because I am a "fan" but I'm not sure if I have forgotten or "forgotten" or just always correctly "assessed" his "place" in the band"."
Right, a video directed by Portnoy himself, where he can show himself a lot, is definitely going to tell the real tale as to the songwriting hierarchy in the band. :lol :lol
Watching that, you'd think Portnoy was far more important to the writing process than Rudess, and I think most of us know that that wasn't the case.
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MP just posted in response to a fan's request to pick his brain about songwriting:
"For those DT fans with short term memories and have "forgotten" that I was one of the key writers in DT: https://youtu.be/_ovdzUj8h6o"
Coooooome onnnnnnnn.....
Anyway, I don't think this was addressed to me because I am a "fan" but I'm not sure if I have forgotten or "forgotten" or just always correctly "assessed" his "place" in the band"."
(https://cdn.meme.am/instances/500x/58821573.jpg)
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If it was me, and I really missed my friends deep down in my heart, I would make it a little more personal, and NOT make it some public Facebook post. I just don't get it.
That's because you are not a celebrity.
I might be... you don't know my life...
;)
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I totally agree that he shouldn't have made it a public invitation.
He should have asked the guys discreetly .
I think he did ask them discreetly; he just made the invitation public once it became clear that none of them were coming.
Maybe he thought they would succumb to pressure from the fans. Idk, it's baseless speculation at that point.
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It's been awfully quiet around MP lately (at least from my perception). Maybe he just wanted to stoke the fire a bit. It *is* the only news item that reliably gets him on Blabbermouth headlines.
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But MP hates Blabbermouth. He can't stand it when they cover him and build controversy, especially when it's about DT remarks.
Really.
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After reading the recent interview with JLB, it's clear they want to tour until at least March. Which makes it impossible for them to make the cruise.
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Yup, further supports my theory that the reason they aren't showing up is mainly because of scheduling conflicts. MP has always been big on juggling several projects at once, to him making this cruise while also touring with DT would probably be no big deal. The other DT guys aren't like that from what I've gathered.
I also think it would've been better received if the invitation wasn't on MP's terms. Why not collaborate with them on a date/venue that would work for everyone? Not saying that would automatically make DT agree to it, but there'd certainly be a better chance of it than MP just throwing a date at them (on a cruise no less) and expecting them to drop everything for it.
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So HE can say that HE tried for THE FANS but THEY refused.
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I am absolutely amazed (but also completely unsurprised) that DTF has managed to stretch a relative non-story out across nine pages ;D
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It's DTF's version of the 13th step.
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But MP hates Blabbermouth. He can't stand it when they cover him and build controversy, especially when it's about DT remarks.
Really.
Yeah, but I think MP likes exposure more than he hates that site. Instead of ignoring the deceiving headlines and articles from Blabbermouth (like the rest of the band has done since 2010), he always chooses to acknowledge them and, it the process, make them extremely known among the fanbase.
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It's DTF's version of the 13th step.
NUGGETZ
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:splodetard:
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It's DTF's version of the 13th step.
Is that the crooked one?
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It's DTF's version of the 13th step.
Is that the crooked one?
Yes. It's the one that always makes noise.........
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It's DTF's version of the 13th step.
Is that the crooked one?
Yes. It's the one that always makes noise.........
The one that alerts the occupants to the burglar.
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But MP hates Blabbermouth. He can't stand it when they cover him and build controversy, especially when it's about DT remarks.
Really.
Yeah, but I think MP likes exposure more than he hates that site. Instead of ignoring the deceiving headlines and articles from Blabbermouth (like the rest of the band has done since 2010), he always chooses to acknowledge them and, it the process, make them extremely known among the fanbase.
I absolutely agree. I was being sarcastic. I think he craves this shit, even if he's not always cognizant of it.
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Why not collaborate with them on a date/venue that would work for everyone?
Because the other guys don't want to collaborate. Don't overthink it.
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Exactly. It's obvious.
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Why not collaborate with them on a date/venue that would work for everyone?
Because the other guys don't want to collaborate. Don't overthink it.
Not my point. If they were to reunite, it would have to be on everybody's terms, not just Portnoy's.
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I chucked at this yesterday. On a Rush fan FB page, they had this link:
https://web.musicaficionado.com/main.html#!/collection/Mike_Portnoy_Picks_His_Top_10_Prog_Albums_Of_All_Time
From the Spock's Beard The Light write-up, he said:
This record set the template for what Spock's Beard was all about: a classic retro prog sound, using Hammond organs and Mellotrons and guitars going through Leslies. It had all those classic sounds, which to me was so refreshing, because around 1995 all I was hearing were Dream Theater wannabes. Even though that was my band, and it was the monster I created, the sound-alikes didn't interest me as a listener.
"The monster I created."
I.
Yep, you created it all yourself, didn't ya? It's no wonder Dream Theater wants no part of him anymore.
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I chucked at this yesterday. On a Rush fan FB page, they had this link:
https://web.musicaficionado.com/main.html#!/collection/Mike_Portnoy_Picks_His_Top_10_Prog_Albums_Of_All_Time (https://web.musicaficionado.com/main.html#!/collection/Mike_Portnoy_Picks_His_Top_10_Prog_Albums_Of_All_Time)
From the Spock's Beard The Light write-up, he said:
This record set the template for what Spock's Beard was all about: a classic retro prog sound, using Hammond organs and Mellotrons and guitars going through Leslies. It had all those classic sounds, which to me was so refreshing, because around 1995 all I was hearing were Dream Theater wannabes. Even though that was my band, and it was the monster I created, the sound-alikes didn't interest me as a listener.
"The monster I created."
I.
Yep, you created it all yourself, didn't ya? It's no wonder Dream Theater wants no part of him anymore.
Blabbermouth, much? Quit twisting his words around by quoting them verbatim!
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In providing the full context of Mike's remarks, KevShmev is obviously quoting his words out of context.
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In providing the full context of Mike's remarks, KevShmev is obviously quoting his words out of context.
Quoting out or context or not, MP really needs to think twice before writing anything on the internet lol.
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In what context is I not...I?
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In what context is I not...I?
Yes, I was wondering as well.
B.Lee
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Gheez, why wouldn't he just say..."the band that I was in..." "the monster I helped create..." or something like that. Maybe in his head the way he said it sounded fine but it comes across bad.
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In what context is I not...I?
In a world where philosophy and identity crisis unite.
And also when it's roman number 1...
Does this mean he considers himself the Number 1 in DT? Omg Mike, how can you go that far...
"The Monster I created" I, not II, not III, I.
I is him, II is JP and III is JM.
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I is him, II is JP and III is JM.
Actually...
(https://img.discogs.com/b_UswRBR5TpR1XNKhR0D_D4LfGg=/fit-in/300x300/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(40)/discogs-images/R-2519936-1395747293-5938.jpeg.jpg)
:P
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I noticed the very same thing in that The Light write-up but wasn't bothered by it too much. It also came to me that he could have said "the monster we created" or "the monster I helped create", but MP obviously can't bother being diplomatic and correct every time he says something related to Dream Theater. I also don't think he meant this as a passive-aggressive dig this time around.
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I got what he meant, but, as usual, he didn't say it the best way possible.
But he's right about all the DT imposters from that period.
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And to this day. Progressive metal has only recently started to become innovative again.
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I is him, II is JP and III is JM.
Actually...
(https://img.discogs.com/b_UswRBR5TpR1XNKhR0D_D4LfGg=/fit-in/300x300/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(40)/discogs-images/R-2519936-1395747293-5938.jpeg.jpg)
:P
But then who's 6?
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Nightmare Cinema of course.
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But then who's 6?
The fans. The fans are the turbulence.
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But then who's 6?
The fans. The fans are the turbulence.
I do have a lot of gas built up.
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But then who's 6?
THE FANS. THE FANS are the turbulence.
FIFY
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But then who's 6?
THE "FANS". THE "FANS" are the turbulence.
FIFY
No, I FIFY
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:facepalm:
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I was reading through this thread and to all those who say DT and MP will eventually get back together or might get back together then site GnR, Van Halen ect.. as examples. Keep in mind that the majority of the bands oft brought up split when they were in their 30's. DT are all within 49-59. Like it or not they don't have another 30 years in them.
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Yet, he doesn't seem to remember JM and JP discovered him at Berkley, which means Those two are the main core of the band.
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I haven't posted in a few months on here, so I hope I'm not opening a can of worms, but this thread caught my eye right away.
MP was and is the "soul" of DT. I like Mike Mangini. He's good drummer and a good guy. I even saw him during his brief stint in Extreme at a dump called THE ROXY on Long Island (run by the same dude who ran SUNDANCE)
However, in my opinion, DT has been "sterile" since MP was canned. In my opinion, THE ASTONISHING either would not have been made or would sound a lot different if MP were in the band to counter JP's ideas (yes, the fact that I don't like THE ASTONISHING probably influenced that opinion).
I won't even mention my feelings that THE LOOKING GLASS lyrics that you all shot at me for :-)
I still remain optimistic that a reunion will happen. But I also think the Islanders are coming back to Long Island, so what do I know??!??
However, if by some miracle, DT takes him up on his offer to play on the cruise (which they certainly will not) Mike Mangini should obviously play also
- TC
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I think a lot of us feel that way but are realistic about how the break up happened and how Mike has handled himself after the break up. I just don't see it happening any time soon.
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However, in my opinion, DT has been "sterile" since MP was canned. In my opinion, THE ASTONISHING either would not have been made or would sound a lot different if MP were in the band to counter JP's ideas (yes, the fact that I don't like THE ASTONISHING probably influenced that opinion).
They were thinking about another concept album for some time already, I remember reading somewhere there was even the idea for the follow up to Black Clouds to be a concept, with the tour being half the concept and half the 12 steps suite. They would have done a concept in an album or two anyway, and of course with MP's input it would have been different.
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While your opinion in respected, you also named some obvious things.
Obviously his opinion would have countered JP's, like EVERYONE ELSE's opinion in the band.
Never have we been told that JP and JR wrote 100% the album, and told MM exactly where and when to hit.
And JLB obviously contributed to the developement of the album.
And from what I see, you associated TLG lyrics to MP, which is total nonsense.
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I haven't posted in a few months on here, so I hope I'm not opening a can of worms, but this thread caught my eye right away.
MP was and is the "soul" of DT. I like Mike Mangini. He's good drummer and a good guy. I even saw him during his brief stint in Extreme at a dump called THE ROXY on Long Island (run by the same dude who ran SUNDANCE)
However, in my opinion, DT has been "sterile" since MP was canned. In my opinion, THE ASTONISHING either would not have been made or would sound a lot different if MP were in the band to counter JP's ideas (yes, the fact that I don't like THE ASTONISHING probably influenced that opinion).
I won't even mention my feelings that THE LOOKING GLASS lyrics that you all shot at me for :-)
I still remain optimistic that a reunion will happen. But I also think the Islanders are coming back to Long Island, so what do I know??!??
However, if by some miracle, DT takes him up on his offer to play on the cruise (which they certainly will not) Mike Mangini should obviously play also
- TC
MP? That you?
-
I haven't posted in a few months on here, so I hope I'm not opening a can of worms, but this thread caught my eye right away.
MP was and is the "soul" of DT. I like Mike Mangini. He's good drummer and a good guy. I even saw him during his brief stint in Extreme at a dump called THE ROXY on Long Island (run by the same dude who ran SUNDANCE)
However, in my opinion, DT has been "sterile" since MP was canned. In my opinion, THE ASTONISHING either would not have been made or would sound a lot different if MP were in the band to counter JP's ideas (yes, the fact that I don't like THE ASTONISHING probably influenced that opinion).
I won't even mention my feelings that THE LOOKING GLASS lyrics that you all shot at me for :-)
I still remain optimistic that a reunion will happen. But I also think the Islanders are coming back to Long Island, so what do I know??!??
However, if by some miracle, DT takes him up on his offer to play on the cruise (which they certainly will not) Mike Mangini should obviously play also
- TC
MP? That you?
Cant be since Tony said MM should have been invited and MP did not invite him :lol
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Mike Por - Tony.
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@Tony from Long Island
I feel that DT became stale *before MP left. While Systematic and Black Clouds have some good songs, both of these releases feel "formulaic". ADTOE had a very fresh sound. I don't think the band would have written something like ADTOE with MP still behind the kit.
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since MP was canned.
ummm....let's not re-write history here. MP quit. He wasn't canned. He tried a long con on the other members so he could have his cake and eat it to and they called his bluff and he quit. He wasn't canned....he quit. Not canned. Quit.
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Cant be since Tony said MM should have been invited and MP did not invite him :lol
:lol
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Wow! Am I MP? :-) I wish . . .
go back and read my opinions on the Looking Glass Lyrics. . . . that was fun . . . .
for that guy who said he quit . . . I disagree..
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On yeah . . . for Gmiller guy . . yes, I agree that they were a bit STALE before MP left. . . but that's not the same as being "sterile" since then.
I did very much like the 2013 DT album. However, I haven't been able to listen to THE ASTONISHING through one time. It's the first DT album I truly disdain. It's pretentious, and the story is rehashed from a million other "concept" albums. The concept in general is laughable . . . but anyway . . .not what this thread is about . . .
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for that guy who said he quit . . . I disagree..
Disagree all you want.
He quit.
He wasn't fired.
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for that guy who said he quit . . . I disagree..
Disagree all you want.
He quit.
He wasn't fired.
Yeah. I don't see what there is to 'disagree' with. He left the band. They didn't fire him. They said they were't taking any breaks...at all....he said fine then, I'll leave...where I contend he was fully expecting them to beg him to stay whereas they just let him leave. It has worked out for the best for both.
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Of course.
He even tried to worm his way back in AFTER they'd filmed the Drummer Doc AND gone through all the legal paperwork etc with getting Mangini in
" FOR THE FANS "
Oh Please.
-
This video is more relevant than I thought it would be:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kj_8E3FOU4s
It's pretentious,
::)
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for that guy who said he quit . . . I disagree..
Disagree all you want.
He quit.
He wasn't fired.
Yeah, there isn't really anything to debate. Even MP said that he left. None of the five guys involved disagrees with that.
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"Leaving" while having no other option isn't really quitting. "Letting someone leave" while declining to show any type of loyalty to a founding member and long-time friend isn't really "firing" so maybe it's a little of both.
For the guy who said it worked out well for both . . . really???? The Astonishing???? Yuck!
Yes, I like Winery Dogs. But DT members had been pursuing "outside projects" for years, so Winery Dogs could still have existed while MP was in DT.
I do admit that I like the 2013 DT album . . . a lot . . . but to say it worked out well for both? It worked out for Mike Mangini, who is a good guy and an excellent drummer.
I don't see how frayed long-time friendships can be seen as a net positive, whether it's in a band or in life.
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"Leaving" while having no other option isn't really quitting.
The option was there, find in himself the will to carry on. "Ok, guys, I know I asked for a break, but seeing as you all four want to continue and the only solution would be leaving, I'd rather accept the situation and commit myself to this, 'cause I don't want to lose Dream Theater".
He left. End of the story.
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The no other option part was on him. It was all or nothing. 5 year break or else. He could have asked for 2 years but in the end he decided he couldn't do it anymore. So he did leave.
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The no other option part was on him. It was all or nothing. 5 year break or else. He could have asked for 2 years but in the end he decided he couldn't do it anymore. So he did leave.
It was not "5 year break or else". He said he asked for less, even half a year iirc, but the band wanted to continue, so he decided to leave.
Nothing at all wrong with the band wanting to continue and keep their momentum, especially as this is their main job, I just see some people have gotten hazy on the details over the past 6 years. :P
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He talked about a 5 year break. I never read anything about less time after that. Lets not cloudy this. MP lost his priorities by playing in so many other bands. Was burnt out on DT, wanted them to take a break. He backed himself in that corner. This isn't on the 4 other guys and never will be.
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He talked about a 5 year break. I never read anything about less time after that. Lets not cloudy this. MP lost his priorities by playing in so many other bands. Was burnt out on DT, wanted them to take a break. He backed himself in that corner. This isn't on the 4 other guys and never will be.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLRo9RT539k
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He talked about a 5 year break. I never read anything about less time after that. Lets not cloudy this. MP lost his priorities by playing in so many other bands. Was burnt out on DT, wanted them to take a break. He backed himself in that corner. This isn't on the 4 other guys and never will be.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLRo9RT539k
Come on. He wanted a break from DT. It's still on him 1 year or 5 year it doesn't matter. He still left the band because he put himself in that position.
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The no other option part was on him. It was all or nothing. 5 year break or else. He could have asked for 2 years but in the end he decided he couldn't do it anymore. So he did leave.
It was not "5 year break or else". He said he asked for less, even half a year iirc, but the band wanted to continue, so he decided to leave.
Nothing at all wrong with the band wanting to continue and keep their momentum, especially as this is their main job, I just see some people have gotten hazy on the details over the past 6 years. :P
All true. (except that I don't remember it being shortened to quite half a year--I think it was more like a year or two, but I could be misremembering) But people have been saying it was "5 years or else" from the beginning, even though I think it was relatively clear that that was only Mike's initial proposal and he then offered some sort of middle ground. Not that that ultimately changes things at the end of the day, but I agree that what actually happened should be presented fairly instead of just a partial (and biased) picture.
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He talked about a 5 year break. I never read anything about less time after that. Lets not cloudy this. MP lost his priorities by playing in so many other bands. Was burnt out on DT, wanted them to take a break. He backed himself in that corner. This isn't on the 4 other guys and never will be.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLRo9RT539k
Come on. He wanted a break from DT. It's still on him 1 year or 5 year it doesn't matter. He still left the band because he put himself in that position.
I'm not denying that.
He says there that he didn't say specifically 5 years.
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He thought relationships were strained in DT. ***
Wanted a break to go off touring with AX7
DT didn't want a break so he left to join AX7
AX7 said that was never on the cards
MP tried to get back in DT but they'd already hired Mangini and gone through all the legal stuff to do that.
This is all from the mouths of DT & AX7. Of course what MP said happened is probably different...
*** Funnily enough - everyone gets on great now.....
-
Again, I could care less if it was one, two or five years. What matters is Mike put himself in that position and forced himself out of the band. Now I love the guy and follow most of his musical endeavors but it's still on him that he is no longer in DT.
-
He thought relationships were strained in DT. ***
Wanted a break to go off touring with AX7
DT didn't want a break so he left to join AX7
AX7 said that was never on the cards
MP tried to get back in DT but they'd already hired Mangini and gone through all the legal stuff to do that.
This is all from the mouths of DT & AX7. Of course what MP said happened is probably different...
*** Funnily enough - everyone gets on great now.....
Put the press release...
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The no other option part was on him. It was all or nothing. 5 year break or else. He could have asked for 2 years but in the end he decided he couldn't do it anymore. So he did leave.
It was not "5 year break or else". He said he asked for less, even half a year iirc, but the band wanted to continue, so he decided to leave.
Nothing at all wrong with the band wanting to continue and keep their momentum, especially as this is their main job, I just see some people have gotten hazy on the details over the past 6 years. :P
All true. (except that I don't remember it being shortened to quite half a year--I think it was more like a year or two, but I could be misremembering) But people have been saying it was "5 years or else" from the beginning, even though I think it was relatively clear that that was only Mike's initial proposal and he then offered some sort of middle ground. Not that that ultimately changes things at the end of the day, but I agree that what actually happened should be presented fairly instead of just a partial (and biased) picture.
I'm remembering down to either a year or half a year (I recall it was half a year, but I can't find the original source for his clarification now), but yeah, my only point was clearing up the misconception that it was 5 years or nothing, which is definitely false. People can have whatever opinion they want on the split, just at least have all of the relevant information. I wasn't arguing one side over another at all.
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I get you. It gets blurry at time goes by. Old fogey problems. But it still remains all on Mike.
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I get you. It gets blurry at time goes by. Old fogey problems. But it still remains all on Mike.
Well, yes... But I still feel like that kind of terminology is misleading. It still kinda "takes sides." As I've said elsewhere, I don't think there really are "sides" to the story, because it wasn't a "Mike vs. the band" situation--at least, as far as the information presented. They just had incompatible interests and came to an impasse on how to resolve it. Mike thought it was in his and the band's best interests to take a break. The other four felt it was in the band's best interests to keep up the momentum and move forward immediately as had already been planned and scheduled. Mike presented compromise positions, and perhaps those were fair, but none of them ultimately would have allowed the band to move forward on the schedule they had all previously agreed to and scheduled. Rather than move forward with the plan, Mike opted to step aside. And that's fine. It was his choice. He made it. They moved on.
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I get you. It gets blurry at time goes by. Old fogey problems. But it still remains all on Mike.
Well, yes... But I still feel like that kind of terminology is misleading. It still kinda "takes sides." As I've said elsewhere, I don't think there really are "sides" to the story, because it wasn't a "Mike vs. the band" situation--at least, as far as the information presented. They just had incompatible interests and came to an impasse on how to resolve it. Mike thought it was in his and the band's best interests to take a break. The other four felt it was in the band's best interests to keep up the momentum and move forward immediately as had already been planned and scheduled. Mike presented compromise positions, and perhaps those were fair, but none of them ultimately would have allowed the band to move forward on the schedule they had all previously agreed to and scheduled. Rather than move forward with the plan, Mike opted to step aside. And that's fine. It was his choice. He made it. They moved on.
DTF hasn't. :lol
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And I get that but even though I loved him for this, maybe 2 things happened. He loved playing in side projects. So 1. Maybe he was burnt out on DT because he was playing so much or 2. He found out he was burnt out on their style and loved playing with other players. While I loved all his side projects, it had to have an affect on his decision to take a break.
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And I get that but even though I loved him for this, maybe 2 things happened. He loved playing in side projects. So 1. Maybe he was burnt out on DT because he was playing so much or 2. He found out he was burnt out on their style and loved playing with other players. While I loved all his side projects, it had to have an affect on his decision to take a break.
I would think it most certainly had an EFFECT on his decision. He likes to keep busy and try new ventures to experiment and experience the different kinds of music he enjoys.
-
Sometimes you don't know how good you got it until it's gone. I 100% believe that is what he realized.
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I would think it most certainly had an EFFECT on his decision. He likes to keep busy and try new ventures to experiment and experience the different kinds of music he enjoys.
Sometimes you don't know how good you got it until it's gone. I 100% believe that is what he realized.
Agreed on both points.
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And I get that but even though I loved him for this, maybe 2 things happened. He loved playing in side projects. So 1. Maybe he was burnt out on DT because he was playing so much or 2. He found out he was burnt out on their style and loved playing with other players. While I loved all his side projects, it had to have an affect on his decision to take a break.
I would think it most certainly had an EFFECT on his decision. He likes to keep busy and try new ventures to experiment and experience the different kinds of music he enjoys.
I put affect. Oops! :lol
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(https://www.ocm.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/040416-rumplefakeshock-OCM.gif)
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"Leaving" while having no other option isn't really quitting. "Letting someone leave" while declining to show any type of loyalty to a founding member and long-time friend isn't really "firing" so maybe it's a little of both.
Wow, no.
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I was reading through this thread and to all those who say DT and MP will eventually get back together or might get back together then site GnR, Van Halen ect.. as examples. Keep in mind that the majority of the bands oft brought up split when they were in their 30's. DT are all within 49-59. Like it or not they don't have another 30 years in them.
Plus, no offense intended to DT, bands like GnR and Van Halen were about a million times more popular and well known, so the pressure to reunite would be far more expected than if it was DT.
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Go ask your glorious master supreme commander duke count holy shit overlord king of the seven seas master of puppets highlord of masters and patriarchs if your majesty was kicked or quit DT. And the tyrant will tell you he left.
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"Leaving" while having no other option isn't really quitting. "Letting someone leave" while declining to show any type of loyalty to a founding member and long-time friend isn't really "firing" so maybe it's a little of both.
Wow, no.
Sorry, Tony, but do you know MP personally? It's an honest question, because you seem to take all this really at heart to the point of rearranging things so that they can suit your point of view.
B.Lee
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He thought relationships were strained in DT. ***
Wanted a break to go off touring with AX7
DT didn't want a break so he left to join AX7
AX7 said that was never on the cards
MP tried to get back in DT but they'd already hired Mangini and gone through all the legal stuff to do that.
This is all from the mouths of DT & AX7. Of course what MP said happened is probably different...
*** Funnily enough - everyone gets on great now.....
Honestly guys, this.
-
I just groan when I see that MP will " obviously " rejoin DT like it's 100% a done deal.
Nobody knows what will happen tomorrow of course but to be that certain....
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I just groan when I see that MP will " obviously " rejoin DT like it's 100% a done deal.
Nobody knows what will happen tomorrow of course but to be that certain....
Mike Portnoy will obviously return DT
DT just lost the manliness that used to make them DT.
-
:lol
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I get you. It gets blurry at time goes by. Old fogey problems. But it still remains all on Mike.
Well, yes... But I still feel like that kind of terminology is misleading. It still kinda "takes sides." As I've said elsewhere, I don't think there really are "sides" to the story, because it wasn't a "Mike vs. the band" situation--at least, as far as the information presented. They just had incompatible interests and came to an impasse on how to resolve it. Mike thought it was in his and the band's best interests to take a break. The other four felt it was in the band's best interests to keep up the momentum and move forward immediately as had already been planned and scheduled. Mike presented compromise positions, and perhaps those were fair, but none of them ultimately would have allowed the band to move forward on the schedule they had all previously agreed to and scheduled. Rather than move forward with the plan, Mike opted to step aside. And that's fine. It was his choice. He made it. They moved on.
DTF hasn't. :lol
Actually, DTF has, when you consider that most of the posters here have accepted Mangini as the new drummer. That is moving on.
The Portnoy fans who still long for the old days, insist that he was the heart and soul of the band, and keep insisting that he will be back one day, are the ones who can't get over it.
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I get you. It gets blurry at time goes by. Old fogey problems. But it still remains all on Mike.
Well, yes... But I still feel like that kind of terminology is misleading. It still kinda "takes sides." As I've said elsewhere, I don't think there really are "sides" to the story, because it wasn't a "Mike vs. the band" situation--at least, as far as the information presented. They just had incompatible interests and came to an impasse on how to resolve it. Mike thought it was in his and the band's best interests to take a break. The other four felt it was in the band's best interests to keep up the momentum and move forward immediately as had already been planned and scheduled. Mike presented compromise positions, and perhaps those were fair, but none of them ultimately would have allowed the band to move forward on the schedule they had all previously agreed to and scheduled. Rather than move forward with the plan, Mike opted to step aside. And that's fine. It was his choice. He made it. They moved on.
DTF hasn't. :lol
Actually, DTF has, when you consider that most of the posters here have accepted Mangini as the new drummer. That is moving on.
The Portnoy fans who still long for the old days, insist that he was the heart and soul of the band, and keep insisting that he will be back one day, are the ones who can't get over it.
Exactly this.
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The Portnoy fans who still long for the old days, insist that he was the heart and soul of the band, and keep insisting that he will be back one day, are the ones who can't get over it.
Exactly this.
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I get you. It gets blurry at time goes by. Old fogey problems. But it still remains all on Mike.
Well, yes... But I still feel like that kind of terminology is misleading. It still kinda "takes sides." As I've said elsewhere, I don't think there really are "sides" to the story, because it wasn't a "Mike vs. the band" situation--at least, as far as the information presented. They just had incompatible interests and came to an impasse on how to resolve it. Mike thought it was in his and the band's best interests to take a break. The other four felt it was in the band's best interests to keep up the momentum and move forward immediately as had already been planned and scheduled. Mike presented compromise positions, and perhaps those were fair, but none of them ultimately would have allowed the band to move forward on the schedule they had all previously agreed to and scheduled. Rather than move forward with the plan, Mike opted to step aside. And that's fine. It was his choice. He made it. They moved on.
DTF hasn't. :lol
Actually, DTF has, when you consider that most of the posters here have accepted Mangini as the new drummer. That is moving on.
The Portnoy fans who still long for the old days, insist that he was the heart and soul of the band, and keep insisting that he will be back one day, are the ones who can't get over it.
I'm not saying that people haven't moved on. I'm saying it, in jest, that we still have this lengthy discussions about the whole damn thing, still arguing about the specifics. So, in part, it still can't be totally let go.
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It's never been the same since KM left.
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It's never been the same since KM left.
Life on stage left with Steve Stone, guy knew how to turn on the audience.
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:lol
What's not controversial is bands with longevity never satisfy it's full fan base. Band get influenced by the times. Some fans are stuck in certain eras. It's just life.
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It's never been the same since KM left.
Life on stage left with Steve Stone, guy knew how to turn on the audience.
Long Beach screamed for him
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I get you. It gets blurry at time goes by. Old fogey problems. But it still remains all on Mike.
Well, yes... But I still feel like that kind of terminology is misleading. It still kinda "takes sides." As I've said elsewhere, I don't think there really are "sides" to the story, because it wasn't a "Mike vs. the band" situation--at least, as far as the information presented. They just had incompatible interests and came to an impasse on how to resolve it. Mike thought it was in his and the band's best interests to take a break. The other four felt it was in the band's best interests to keep up the momentum and move forward immediately as had already been planned and scheduled. Mike presented compromise positions, and perhaps those were fair, but none of them ultimately would have allowed the band to move forward on the schedule they had all previously agreed to and scheduled. Rather than move forward with the plan, Mike opted to step aside. And that's fine. It was his choice. He made it. They moved on.
Check the boded.
Well, that's awful lawyerly, there, Bosky!
King says "It's on Mike".
Bosk says "It was his choice"
How is that any different? ;D
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I get you. It gets blurry at time goes by. Old fogey problems. But it still remains all on Mike.
Well, yes... But I still feel like that kind of terminology is misleading. It still kinda "takes sides." As I've said elsewhere, I don't think there really are "sides" to the story, because it wasn't a "Mike vs. the band" situation--at least, as far as the information presented. They just had incompatible interests and came to an impasse on how to resolve it. Mike thought it was in his and the band's best interests to take a break. The other four felt it was in the band's best interests to keep up the momentum and move forward immediately as had already been planned and scheduled. Mike presented compromise positions, and perhaps those were fair, but none of them ultimately would have allowed the band to move forward on the schedule they had all previously agreed to and scheduled. Rather than move forward with the plan, Mike opted to step aside. And that's fine. It was his choice. He made it. They moved on.
Check the boded.
Well, that's awful lawyerly, there, Bosky!
King says "It's on Mike".
Bosk says "It was his choice"
How is that any different? ;D
As I have said, the only "difference" is in the tone. I agree with the basic facts and the basic conclusion. It's just that King's way of putting it makes it seem like it was "Mike Portnoy vs. DT" and that it was very contentious. I have never really had the sense that it was. Yes, it became that way after the fact, in large part I think because Of Portnoy's failure to handle the situation maturely. But at the time, even though it truly was ultimately Mike's decision, you could almost say that it was mutual because they simply had incompatible goals. That's all I'm saying. Ultimately, we are saying nearly the same thing. It's just the "MP vs. DT" tone that I object to.
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I know what we can all agree on:
Adrenaline Mob
Let's come together in camaraderie in our unspoken but likely unanimous feelings about Adrenaline Mob.
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No. Let us not.
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It wasn't meant that way sir but I think we all can say Mike was burnt for many reasons on DT and him flirting with other bands didn't help. Like you said, the other band members didn't feel the same and in the end Mike made the decision.
And this is from a guy that followed all the side projects and I loved that about him.
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No. Let us not.
There's young(er) Christopher Lee throwing a broadsword into my unifying Adrenaline Mob hate-in...
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No. Let us not.
There's young(er) Christopher Lee throwing a broadsword into my unifying Adrenaline Mob hate-in...
I can share in your detestation of them. I've tried numerous times to listen to them but it just doesn't work for me.
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I still chuckle about the episode of That Metal Show where Billy Sheehan was the guest musician and every time they'd cut to him to talk, they'd finish up and be like "And in that time, Mike Portnoy just joined three more bands", etc. :lol
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Plus, no offense intended to DT, bands like GnR and Van Halen were about a million times more popular and well known, so the pressure to reunite would be far more expected than if it was DT.
I'm not sure I agree. It's true that those bands were far more well known and "popular," but DT has a much more hard-core and loyal fan base.
I actually felt TERRIBLE that I hate The Astonishing. It mattered to me. It bothered me that I hated it.
On the other hand, I actually kinda liked Van Halen III :-)
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Plus, no offense intended to DT, bands like GnR and Van Halen were about a million times more popular and well known, so the pressure to reunite would be far more expected than if it was DT.
I'm not sure I agree. It's true that those bands were far more well known and "popular," but DT has a much more hard-core and loyal fan base.
I actually felt TERRIBLE that I hate The Astonishing. It mattered to me. It bothered me that I hated it.
On the other hand, I actually kinda liked Van Halen III :-)
I agree. DT have a cult following that would jump on board for a reunion no matter what. I don't think popularity has anything to do with it. That's sort of like saying that unless a band is exceedingly popular, why bother at all?
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No. Let us not.
There's young(er) Christopher Lee throwing a broadsword into my unifying Adrenaline Mob hate-in...
I can share in your detestation of them. I've tried numerous times to listen to them but it just doesn't work for me.
I share it as well. I just don't want this thread to get bogged down in that.
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Plus, neither the GnR or Van Halen reunions are "real"
No Izzy? No Matt Sorum? (Steve Adler just can't hack it..) But especially IZZY. He was the best songwriter in GnR.
I am more OK with Van Halen because the bass player is actually named VAN HALEN....but couldn't he have played Rhythm guitar?
I'm kinda torn about reuinions. Imagine DT broke up for 10 years. A true reunion would HAVE to include JP, MP, JM, JL and either of the keyboard players. Just as a true GnR reunion would HAVE to include Axl, Slash, Duff and Izzy. Anything less (without extenuating circumstances) isn't truly a reunion.
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No. Let us not.
There's young(er) Christopher Lee throwing a broadsword into my unifying Adrenaline Mob hate-in...
I can share in your detestation of them. I've tried numerous times to listen to them but it just doesn't work for me.
I share it as well. I just don't want this thread to get bogged down in that.
Indeed.
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Plus, neither the GnR or Van Halen reunions are "real"
No Izzy? No Matt Sorum? (Steve Adler just can't hack it..) But especially IZZY. He was the best songwriter in GnR.
I am more OK with Van Halen because the bass player is actually named VAN HALEN....but couldn't he have played Rhythm guitar?
I'm kinda torn about reuinions. Imagine DT broke up for 10 years. A true reunion would HAVE to include JP, MP, JM, JL and either of the keyboard players. Just as a true GnR reunion would HAVE to include Axl, Slash, Duff and Izzy. Anything less (without extenuating circumstances) isn't truly a reunion.
As far as a true reunion, I suppose it would have to be either JR or KM on keys. They make the most sense.
And yes, I'm intentionally ignoring discussing GNR and VH because they're nothing to me.
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As far as a true reunion, I suppose it would have to be either JR or KM on keys. They make the most sense.
And yes, I'm intentionally ignoring discussing GNR and VH because they're nothing to me.
That's because you are a PROG SNOB! :-) To paraphrase Dee Snider (who also means nothing to you I'm sure) "If it ain't PROG, It's CRAP!!"
P.S. please take notice of the sarcasm
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As far as a true reunion, I suppose it would have to be either JR or KM on keys. They make the most sense.
And yes, I'm intentionally ignoring discussing GNR and VH because they're nothing to me.
That's because you are a PROG SNOB! :-) To paraphrase Dee Snider (who also means nothing to you I'm sure) "If it ain't PROG, It's CRAP!!"
P.S. please take notice of the sarcasm
Not a total prog snob. ;) I just despise Axl and think VH is overrated. Sarcasm is noted, though.
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I just can't see how is GnR even in this topic.
Axl only did ONE album on his own, DT has done 3 without MP and 10 without KM.
There really wasn't any GnR after the famous lineup quit, as much as I like Chinese Democracy, other than hugging from their past fame and past record sales.
However, DT hasn't slowed down one bit since MP left, and if any, they're more productive.
So I don't see this MP coming back happening simply because he isn't needed for any reason.
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No. Let us not.
There's young(er) Christopher Lee throwing a broadsword into my unifying Adrenaline Mob hate-in...
I can share in your detestation of them. I've tried numerous times to listen to them but it just doesn't work for me.
I share it as well. I just don't want this thread to get bogged down in that.
I did say unspoken. Our hate-in was to be through the ether.
In fact, it's going on right now and you're in attendance. I feel the harmony already.
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No. Let us not.
There's young(er) Christopher Lee throwing a broadsword into my unifying Adrenaline Mob hate-in...
I can share in your detestation of them. I've tried numerous times to listen to them but it just doesn't work for me.
I share it as well. I just don't want this thread to get bogged down in that.
I did say unspoken. Our hate-in was to be through the ether.
In fact, it's going on right now and you're in attendance. I feel the harmony already.
There's a lot of words going back and forth for something meant to be unspoken. ;)
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I just can't see how is GnR even in this topic.
Ummm because this thread is about a (highly improbable) DT reunion and GnR is in the midst of a sort of "reunion" tour. You see no relevance?
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I just can't see how is GnR even in this topic.
Ummm because this thread is about a (highly improbable) DT reunion and GnR is in the midst of a sort of "reunion" tour. You see no relevance?
I explained why inmediately after that.
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As far as a true reunion, I suppose it would have to be either JR or KM on keys. They make the most sense.
And yes, I'm intentionally ignoring discussing GNR and VH because they're nothing to me.
That's because you are a PROG SNOB! :-) To paraphrase Dee Snider (who also means nothing to you I'm sure) "If it ain't PROG, It's CRAP!!"
P.S. please take notice of the sarcasm
Not a total prog snob. ;) I just despise Axl and think VH is overrated. Sarcasm is noted, though.
Eddie may be an asshole, but VH rock :metal :metal :metal
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As far as a true reunion, I suppose it would have to be either JR or KM on keys. They make the most sense.
And yes, I'm intentionally ignoring discussing GNR and VH because they're nothing to me.
That's because you are a PROG SNOB! :-) To paraphrase Dee Snider (who also means nothing to you I'm sure) "If it ain't PROG, It's CRAP!!"
P.S. please take notice of the sarcasm
Not a total prog snob. ;) I just despise Axl and think VH is overrated. Sarcasm is noted, though.
Eddie may be an asshole, but VH rock :metal :metal :metal
These guys rock harder than VH. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dP9Wp6QVbsk
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Plus, no offense intended to DT, bands like GnR and Van Halen were about a million times more popular and well known, so the pressure to reunite would be far more expected than if it was DT.
I'm not sure I agree. It's true that those bands were far more well known and "popular," but DT has a much more hard-core and loyal fan base.
I actually felt TERRIBLE that I hate The Astonishing. It mattered to me. It bothered me that I hated it.
On the other hand, I actually kinda liked Van Halen III :-)
You hate an album you haven't listened to? ::)
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Saying VH is overrated just doesn't even make any fucking sense. Even from someone who calls themself "snob". :lol
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Saying VH is overrated just doesn't even make any fucking sense.
How?
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Saying VH is overrated just doesn't even make any fucking sense. Even from someone who calls themself "snob". :lol
Disregarding the tiresome snob reference...
Popularity aside, and that should never be a measurement of how great a band is, and I'll gladly provide popular music artists who defy that as any rational argument, why doesn't it make any fucking sense? Sure, they had some great songs, but I don't think they deserve all of the accolades they get. Most popular bands don't. A lot of VH's albums are filler, especially the DLR era albums. This is the same general public that gave us Trump and Hillary. Something tells me that people will only look as far as what's in front of their face, ignoring any peripheral observations. It's like people who fawn over Led Zeppelin as the greatest rock band ever, meanwhile most live performances I've heard from them are not the caliber of the "greatest rock band", not even in the Top 10. I'll take Floyd, The Beatles, The Who, and The Doors any day over LZ, VH, or GNR.
So how can I make sense out of my comment? Easily. By listening to bands that are dreadfully underrated and not caring how many albums they sell. When you don't have to appease the general public, it opens up the possibilities to be a musician, not an entertainer. That reference directly from Gene Simmons who personally labeled bands like Kiss as entertainers, not musicians. It's a perfectly coherent train of thought.
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The 1st 4 albums changed a genre and we're fresh, new any very influential.
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I don't even like VH that much and even I admit that the debut album is one of the greatest rock records ever recorded.
EVH changed the way every kid in America learned to play guitar, and DLR (while being admittedly tiresome to some people) *INVENTED* the new era of front man as a "ring leader" and "MC of events" instead of just being the guy who sung the songs.
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So many rock guitarists owe their existence to Eddie, Petrucci included. He would probably be the first to admit that.
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Yep, Van Halen came with a new sound and guitar players started to play like Eddie. I saw VH twice, in 81 and 84. I think they came with a solid first album, a great one in fact. Live, they were partying totally. Certainly not being as pro and serious about their performance. Cannot be 100% when under some sort of medecine. But they were delivering their stuff not as bad than any other bands who were using a lot ot med (the Who, I love them so much but they were really flying, the Doors, Morison drunk most of the time). I found Roth way too much of a poser since he was constantly chatting between songs but it was part of the whole VH package. Didn't like them that much after DLR departure.
So to me, VH changed the music and Eddy is a master, some Bethoven of the rock music.
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[OFF-TOPIC]
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[OFF-TOPIC]
That might be for the best at this point.
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[OFF-TOPIC]
It is but people were going that way
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I hate to interrupt this Van Halen thread with Mike Portnoy info but this was an interesting comment he made on his facebook page
Some fan commented: "Mike, please come back with Dream Theater, without you is no longer the same band!"
Mike responded: "So tell that to THEM!"
:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
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I hate to interrupt this Van Halen thread with Mike Portnoy info but this was an interesting comment he made on his facebook page
Some fan commented: "Mike, please come back with Dream Theater, without you is no longer the same band!"
Mike responded: "So tell that to THEM!"
:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
:lol
Or, he could go back in time and tell himself not to be so capricious.
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Jesus Fucking Christ.
To Quote Lars Ulrich : HE FUCKING LEFT THE BAND. :facepalm:
Oh My God.
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I hate to interrupt this Van Halen thread with Mike Portnoy info but this was an interesting comment he made on his facebook page
Some fan commented: "Mike, please come back with Dream Theater, without you is no longer the same band!"
Mike responded: "So tell that to THEM!"
:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
I have to ask if that's real. We've had a ton of fake joke ones in this thread. That one just seems way too over the top.
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Someone check his official Facebook.
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I hate to interrupt this Van Halen thread with Mike Portnoy info but this was an interesting comment he made on his facebook page
Some fan commented: "Mike, please come back with Dream Theater, without you is no longer the same band!"
Mike responded: "So tell that to THEM!"
:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
I have to ask if that's real. We've had a ton of fake joke ones in this thread. That one just seems way too over the top.
Completely real.
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1300245863326386&substory_index=0&id=116713035013014
Mike gives this kind of responses very very often.
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He should've just left it at "Thank you, I appreciate that."
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He should've just left it at "Thank you, I appreciate that."
He can't. Six years later and he still can't.
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I hate to interrupt this Van Halen thread with Mike Portnoy info but this was an interesting comment he made on his facebook page
Some fan commented: "Mike, please come back with Dream Theater, without you is no longer the same band!"
Mike responded: "So tell that to THEM!"
:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
I have to ask if that's real. We've had a ton of fake joke ones in this thread. That one just seems way too over the top.
Completely real.
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1300245863326386&substory_index=0&id=116713035013014
Mike gives this kind of responses very very often.
I'm too lazy to find the Picard face palm meme, but that's my response. Oh mike....
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• Drummer tries to have his cake & eat it
• Drummer quits band
• Band hires new drummer
• Old Drummer tries to get back in band once new drummer has joined
• Old drummer slags off the band for not letting him back in after he quit and they hired a new drummer.
• Old Drummer continues to act like the victim when the band have done nothing wrong in the slightest.
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He should've just left it at "Thank you, I appreciate that."
If he had, it wouldn't have been a big deal, but in those cases it's best just to not respond. If this was in person, sure, he would have to respond with something. But this is facebook, and he doesn't respond to a lot of his comments, so why choose that one?
It's funny. About 2014 I think the general consensus was that Mike finally moved on. He had somewhat classy responses to the old tired "You should reunite with Dream Theater" comments. I believe several times he said, "It would be nice someday but I'm happy where I'm at and they're happy where they're at."
Hey, can't snipe at him for that. It was pretty tactful.
Now he is back to 2011 territory and its pretty insufferable.
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If MP makes a sound in the forest and nobody is around to hear it, does DTF still get all triggered?
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If MP makes a sound in the forest and nobody is around to hear it, does DTF still get all triggered?
Bad faith, Blob, sorry. Facebook is a social media, it's not a "sound in the forest". He perfectly knows what kind of reaction such comment will trigger, even from his fanboys (not hinting you're one).
B.Lee
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If MP makes a sound in the forest and nobody is around to hear it, does DTF still get all triggered?
He won't be able to make a sound in the forest by himself, he needs the support and understanding of his loyal fans. He'll post a video on Facebook :biggrin:
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" I just made a sound in a forest and THEY weren't here to hear it.
You can't trust anyone these days : ) "
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This topic turned into "Search and Destroy: The Life Crimes of Mike Portnoy".
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If MP makes a sound in the forest and nobody is around to hear it, does DTF still get all triggered?
Bad faith, Blob, sorry. Facebook is a social media, it's not a "sound in the forest". He perfectly knows what kind of reaction such comment will trigger, even from his fanboys (not hinting you're one).
Yep. I think it was said that this whole thing shouldn't be an "us vs them" situation, but Portnoy has turned it into one. I think he wants his hardcore fans to turn against DT as punishment for not letting him back in the band.
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If MP makes a sound in the forest and nobody is around to hear it, does DTF still get all triggered?
Judging from the responses to this post, yes, clearly they do.
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If MP makes a sound in the forest and nobody is around to hear it, does DTF still get all triggered?
If MP burns down a forest and everyone is around to see it because he publicized it on Facebook, will his defenders claim "it was just a couple of trees"?
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If MP makes a sound in the forest and nobody is around to hear it, does DTF still get all triggered?
If MP burns down a forest and everyone is around to see it because he publicized it on Facebook, will his defenders claim "it was just a couple of trees"?
Wow, talk about blowing it out of proportion. :lol
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If MP makes a sound in the forest and nobody is around to hear it, does DTF still get all triggered?
careful with these micro-aggressions blob
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If Portnoy's post DT output is anything to go by - he's made A LOT of sounds that nobody will hear.
:neverusethis:
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I think people who're downplaying MP's attitude are as silly as the people blowing it out of proportion. My take is that MP doesn't matter within the context of DT anymore and discussing his post-DT statements or actions in the DT section of the forums has no purpose but creating drama.
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Completely real.
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1300245863326386&substory_index=0&id=116713035013014
Mike gives this kind of responses very very often.
For anyone who chose not to read this link, the next comment went like this:
Commenter: Dream Theatre may have been his baby and ya gotta respect the talent but Winery Dogs, Transatlantic, hell, even his drumming on Big Elf was, I dunno... more fun? You can hear the fun in his playing the last few years. Totally more into his post-DT.
Mike Portnoy: Shouldn't playing music and being in a band be FUN?? Yes, indeed I am very HAPPY with everything I am doing now...
THAT ASSHOLE!! WHO THE HELL DOES HE THINK HE IS BEING HAPPY WITH EVERYTHING HE'S DOING NOW!! I'M OUTRAGED!!
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Mike Portnoy...Chaossystem? :omg:
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Completely real.
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1300245863326386&substory_index=0&id=116713035013014
Mike gives this kind of responses very very often.
For anyone who chose not to read this link, the next comment went like this:
Commenter: Dream Theatre may have been his baby and ya gotta respect the talent but Winery Dogs, Transatlantic, hell, even his drumming on Big Elf was, I dunno... more fun? You can hear the fun in his playing the last few years. Totally more into his post-DT.
Mike Portnoy: Shouldn't playing music and being in a band be FUN?? Yes, indeed I am very HAPPY with everything I am doing now...
THAT ASSHOLE!! WHO THE HELL DOES HE THINK HE IS BEING HAPPY WITH EVERYTHING HE'S DOING NOW!! I'M OUTRAGED!!
So tell that to THEM!
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Mike Portnoy...Chaossystem? :omg:
Suddenly, everything makes sense.
So tell that to THEM!
:lol
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Pretty close, but not quite. Chaossystem would be more like: "So TELL that TO them" and "Shouldn't PLAYING music and being in a BAND be fun?"
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Out of joke, if you scroll around his posts searching for people telling him to go back to DT, he usually answers with something like this...
"Ugh... STOP! THEY are the ones..."
or
"I tried but they wouldn't...
Whathever.
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I tried :rollin...
Hey guys i'm quitting...
Ok ! We'll get a new drummer and film a new drummer documentary and go through all the legal shit we have to go through to get Mangini in the band etc etc etc.....
Hey guys can I come back ?
After all that ? Fuck no....
OMFG GUYSSSSSI TRIIIIEEDDDDDDDDDDDDD af :( :( :(
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"Ugh... STOP! THEY are the ones..."
If he says this then I feel for him, being bombarded by these fans constantly asking for you to return to the band They(the fans) liked you in, must be exhausting.
I can understand what he means by THEY. But it's just the way he worded it makes it sound negative.
I'm not defending Mike and his actions, just stating that I'd be upset and frustrated if fans kept asking. Yes I wish he'd stop with his resentment but he is feeling deep regret with his decision and props to him for keeping on.
Also, I'm more interested in hearing how the 12 step suite in full would sound with whomever he chooses to play it with, than a DT reunion one-off.
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If MP makes a sound in the forest and nobody is around to hear it, does DTF still get all triggered?
If MP burns down a forest and everyone is around to see it because he publicized it on Facebook, will his defenders claim "it was just a couple of trees"?
Wow, talk about blowing it out of proportion. :lol
I have a RIGHT to post my opinion about "forests!"
But seriously, maybe I did blow it out of proportion. Instead of burning forests I should have said burning bridges.
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If MP makes a sound in the forest and nobody is around to hear it, does DTF still get all triggered?
If MP burns down a forest and everyone is around to see it because he publicized it on Facebook, will his defenders claim "it was just a couple of trees"?
Wow, talk about blowing it out of proportion. :lol
I have a RIGHT to post my opinion about "forests!"
But seriously, maybe I did blow it out of proportion. Instead of burning forests I should have said burning bridges.
Bridges would be acceptable. :biggrin:
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Here's a question.
Suppose Mangini quit after The Astonishing tour and Portnoy got the position back ?
Do you think he'd go right back to super controlling "my baby" Mike Portnoy or would he be content with just being the drummer in DT again ?
I don't think it would happen immediately but maybe after a year or two.
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At this point, I think they would get a different drummer rather than Portnoy. If they did actually get Portnoy back, I think there would be a lot of conditions on his participation.
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Yes. In reality if Mangini left I think DT would be done.
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Yes. In reality if Mangini left I think DT would be done.
I don't think so, personally. If anything I think it's only certain that DT would disband if Petrucci stepped down - although obviously LaBrie or Rudess leaving would be huge.
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If MM left right now, I think they'd keep going for sure.
But I don't see the point of any of this hypothetical scenario discussion.
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If MM left right now, I think they'd keep going for sure.
But I don't see the point of any of this hypothetical scenario discussion.
News flash, Blob. This is a message board. 95% of what we talk about here is pointless.
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If MM left right now, I think they'd keep going for sure.
But I don't see the point of any of this hypothetical scenario discussion.
There's not much else to discuss between albums.
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If MM left right now, I think they'd keep going for sure.
But I don't see the point of any of this hypothetical scenario discussion.
News flash, Blob. This is a message board. 95% of what we talk about here is pointless.
Also this.
I mean just look at me - i'm 95% pointless !!
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If MM left right now, I think they'd keep going for sure.
But I don't see the point of any of this hypothetical scenario discussion.
News flash, Blob. This is a message board. 95% of what we talk about here is pointless.
Well this comes as news to me.
I always figured it was more like 99%. :neverusethis:
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If MM left right now, I think they'd keep going for sure.
But I don't see the point of any of this hypothetical scenario discussion.
News flash, Blob. This is a message board. 95% of what we talk about here is pointless.
Well this comes as news to me.
I always figured it was more like 99%. :neverusethis:
Ha. Well the very important Van Halen discussion in this very thread proves that number is just too high!
BTW, I think Gary Cherone would make a great replacement for Mangini if he ever leaves.
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Yes. In reality if Mangini left I think DT would be done.
I don't think so, personally. If anything I think it's only certain that DT would disband if Petrucci stepped down - although obviously LaBrie or Rudess leaving would be huge.
They didn't quit when Portnoy left, why should they quit once the drummer for three albums would leave?
I can only imagine what would be Portnoy's reaction if Mangini would step down of his own free will and the band would pick another drummer rather than welcoming him back.
Also - do you think the members who were reportedly more happy about his departure would welcome him back? or would they put their foot down?
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If MM were ever to leave the band, I wouldn't come near this place for a minimum of 7 years.
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It will only be safe again after the statute of limitations has expired.
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Here's a question.
Suppose Mangini quit after The Astonishing tour and Portnoy got the position back ?
Do you think he'd go right back to super controlling "my baby" Mike Portnoy or would he be content with just being the drummer in DT again ?
I don't think it would happen immediately but maybe after a year or two.
If that happened, I don't think they'd let him go back to being the leader and controlling everything; he'd have to adapt to the way things are done now, plain and simple.
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Yes. In reality if Mangini left I think DT would be done.
I don't think so, personally. If anything I think it's only certain that DT would disband if Petrucci stepped down - although obviously LaBrie or Rudess leaving would be huge.
They didn't quit when Portnoy left, why should they quit once the drummer for three albums would leave?
I can only imagine what would be Portnoy's reaction if Mangini would step down of his own free will and the band would pick another drummer rather than welcoming him back.
Also - do you think the members who were reportedly more happy about his departure would welcome him back? or would they put their foot down?
I think them quitting is a realistic prospect. I remember JLB saying in an interview something along the lines of, "I think we have two or three more albums in us." I remember thinking it was very odd for him to say that as if the band had talked about retirement. I think this was around the time of DT12 so if that was legit, they would do at least two more albums meaning that *maybe* they would think about retiring in about 2021-22.
Of course, this is their income and if the crowds are still coming and they can still perform I would imagine they would keep going. I could see them scaling back though.
...and yes, I do think some members would put their foot down and IF MP ever did come back, it would be under several conditions.
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Here's a question.
Suppose Mangini quit after The Astonishing tour and Portnoy got the position back ?
Do you think he'd go right back to super controlling "my baby" Mike Portnoy or would he be content with just being the drummer in DT again ?
I don't think it would happen immediately but maybe after a year or two.
Like a week tops. People don't change. Once you are 40, your spots are indelible and you are who you are. Plus, going back to the invite, I find the whole thing utterly narcissistic. Throw a huge birthday bash for yourself on a cruise ship, invite people back who you rejected, and play music about being a drunk. What am I missing, why would any of this appeal to DT? It wouldn't, I'm not missing anything. And also, attending such a charade would be an act of disloyalty and cruelty to the current drummer in the band. The whole thing is a self-centered self-aggrandizing joke and literally screams out "nothing has changed, or ever will". I find the whole thing to be distasteful, to be kind.
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MP will divide DT like Helmut Zemo in MCU Civil War.
Idk, I'm team JR.
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I can't believe all the contentious posting about things other people have said in this thread, but THIS
I actually kinda liked Van Halen III :-)
gets ignored.
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What's Van Halen III?
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What's Van Halen III?
The bullshitest of bullshits.
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What's so bad about it ? Did they go full 80s and abandon guitars for synths ?
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What's Van Halen III?
The Gary Cherone album.
The un-VH-ish of all VH albums.
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What's Van Halen III?
The Gary Cherone album.
The un-VH-ish of all VH albums.
Hef, I know what VHIII is..
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I never heard it. It might actually be good. ;)
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I vaguely remember Gary Cherone being the lead singer for Van Halen for a while in the 90's, and thought it could be okay because I like him as a singer, but I've never heard the album, and I didn't realize that they actually named it Van Halen III. Kinda bizarre, since it's obviously not their third album and both the eponymous self-titled album and Van Halen II exist. So it actually means "the third version of Van Halen"? Lame.
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I have actually never heard a single note of VHIII.
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I have actually never heard a single note of VHIII.
It's not the single notes; it's the way they're arranged that's usually questionable.
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I have actually never heard a single note of VHIII.
It's not the single notes; it's the way they're arranged that's usually questionable.
It's not the single words in your post, it's the way they're arranged that's usually questionable. :P
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I have actually never heard a single note of VHIII.
It's not the single notes; it's the way they're arranged that's usually questionable.
It's not the single words in your post, it's the way they're arranged that's usually questionable. :P
(https://s2.quickmeme.com/img/fa/fa7009ae51733959d7d889b6b5af4b6d7b4ddb123dc366574aee43e482da5b42.jpg)
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I have actually never heard a single note of VHIII.
It's not the single notes; it's the way they're arranged that's usually questionable.
It's not the single words in your post, it's the way they're arranged that's usually questionable. :P
(https://s2.quickmeme.com/img/fa/fa7009ae51733959d7d889b6b5af4b6d7b4ddb123dc366574aee43e482da5b42.jpg)
W-what?
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Van Halen III is not as bad as most think. It's a solid record with a few really good songs.
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Balance is worse than VH3* and also pretty un-VH sounding. 3 has some good moments and I'm a huge fan of Extreme so I'm on board with Cherone. I think it's just a bit too long really, some songs should've been shorter and some should've not been on the album at all. It's an exhausting album to listen to.
The whole album is weird and was also the first without Michael Anthony so the signature background vocals are completely gone.
*Slightly related to Orbert's point, it's actually Van Halen 3, not Van Halen III. So it's also inconsistent with Van Halen II.
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Balance is pretty good.
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I think it would be nice if DT joined the cruise for a few shows and then joined Mike for the 12 step song. That way, Mangini would not be left out. I know there is a lot of animosity within the band about Mike, but it times to bury the hatchet and not into each other's backs anymore. If that actually materialized, I hope that it wouldn't be the Florida run and DT would still do shows here in Miami, Tampa, etc. It stinks that there are so many killer prog bands that play the cruises but not Florida itself. I'd like to see Transatlantic here in Florida. I would drive to Orlando or Tampa for that.
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Balance is pretty good.
It's a mixed bag. There are songs that are among the best they've ever done, but a lot of it is among their worst.
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Balance is pretty good.
It's a mixed bag. There are songs that are among the best they've ever done, but a lot of it is among their worst.
You described FII.
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Nah, FII is way better than Balance. I can skip the three songs on FII that I dislike and still have an hour of solid to awesome music. Balance is pretty much the opposite: I listen to the first four songs then skip to the instrumental (and sometimes Aftershock if I feel like it) and then I'm done.
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I think it would be nice if DT joined the cruise for a few shows and then joined Mike for the 12 step song. That way, Mangini would not be left out. I know there is a lot of animosity within the band about Mike, but it times to bury the hatchet and not into each other's backs anymore. If that actually materialized, I hope that it wouldn't be the Florida run and DT would still do shows here in Miami, Tampa, etc. It stinks that there are so many killer prog bands that play the cruises but not Florida itself. I'd like to see Transatlantic here in Florida. I would drive to Orlando or Tampa for that.
??? There is no hatchet on the side of the band; they have moved on and are looking ahead instead of behind. Their ex-drummer is the one who can't get over it.
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I think it would be nice if DT joined the cruise for a few shows and then joined Mike for the 12 step song. That way, Mangini would not be left out. I know there is a lot of animosity within the band about Mike, but it times to bury the hatchet and not into each other's backs anymore. If that actually materialized, I hope that it wouldn't be the Florida run and DT would still do shows here in Miami, Tampa, etc. It stinks that there are so many killer prog bands that play the cruises but not Florida itself. I'd like to see Transatlantic here in Florida. I would drive to Orlando or Tampa for that.
??? There is no hatchet on the side of the band; they have moved on and are looking ahead instead of behind. Their ex-drummer is the one who can't get over it.
It's just a turn of phrase...I'm late to this whole discussion and I just read Jordan's interview, so it isn't going to happen. It's a shame really, but it is what it is. Sometimes family takes liberties with each other that shouldn't be taken. This was the case with Mike P. As far as Mike Mangini, he's a great drummer, but after seeing them in 2011, I couldn't help but feel there is a glaring hole center rear of the stage that he simply can't fill. I miss MP's energy and stage presence. He was the one that got the crowd on it's feet. He was the one that made even the most dour person smile. As I said, it's a shame about all that went down, but it's been six years now and as you said, Dream Theater has moved on.
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Balance is worse than VH3* and also pretty un-VH sounding. 3 has some good moments and I'm a huge fan of Extreme so I'm on board with Cherone. I think it's just a bit too long really, some songs should've been shorter and some should've not been on the album at all. It's an exhausting album to listen to.
The whole album is weird and was also the first without Michael Anthony so the signature background vocals are completely gone.
*Slightly related to Orbert's point, it's actually Van Halen 3, not Van Halen III. So it's also inconsistent with Van Halen II.
Actually, I looked it up prior to posting. I can't find much about Van Halen 3, but plenty about Van Halen III, including the cover art.
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51gLKMDsOWL.jpg)
Everyone from Amazon to AMG to Wikipedia refer to it as Van Halen III.
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:facepalm: You are right. I forgot it was that way on the front cover, but take a look at the rest of the packaging:
(https://nickbattista.com/movies/VAN%20HALEN%20-%20DISCOGRAPHY/ORIGINAL/1998%20-%20Van%20Halen%20III%20(Warner%20Bros.%209%2046662-2)/covers/Van%20Halen%20-%20Van%20Halen%20III%20(USA)%20-%20Back.jpg)
(https://eil.com/images/main/Van+Halen+Van+Halen+III+541769.jpg)
(https://fanart.tv/detailpreview/fanart/music/b665b768-0d83-4363-950c-31ed39317c15/cdart/van-halen-iii-4efbecebd09b8.png)
(https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-0suljOCZbms/T1WyuqUfAOI/AAAAAAAAAq0/RJaQBBufC-8/s1600/vh3.jpg)
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That's just odd. It's like they either intentionally wanted to make it go either way, or they didn't give a shit.
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That's just odd. It's like they either intentionally wanted to make it go either way, or they didn't give a shit.
Much like the fans, I doubt they gave a shit.
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Man, this thread really got off the rail with the Van Halen III discussion. As a modern music fan, I decided to take a listen of it out of curio thinking that it wouldn't be that bad. Now while it is not a disaster like I was thinking (I was thinking Metallica/Lou Reed's Lulu disaster), after 15 minutes of it, I just got bored of it and went on doing other stuff.
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There are few things that are Lulu levels of disaster.
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Man, this thread really got off the rail with the Van Halen III discussion. As a modern music fan, I decided to take a listen of it out of curio thinking that it wouldn't be that bad. Now while it is not a disaster like I was thinking (I was thinking Metallica/Lou Reed's Lulu disaster), after 15 minutes of it, I just got bored of it and went on doing other stuff.
I also decided to give it a fair shot last night, but turned it off after the third song. Poor Gary Cherone.
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I didn't realize that Michael Anthony wasn't on it, either. Now that I think about it, it makes sense, as I do remember that he left when Sammy left.
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I didn't realize that Michael Anthony wasn't on it, either.
Oh really, neither did I? Who played bass?
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Wikipedia says Anthony played on 3 tracks, and Eddie played the rest.
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I didn't know MP was to play for VH. Oh, the VH discussion is off? :biggrin:
B.Lee
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When an esteemed Mod like Hef partakes in the Van Halen posts, it's safe to say that it's not crucial to stay on topic for a thread of this importance.
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I didn't realize that Michael Anthony wasn't on it, either. Now that I think about it, it makes sense, as I do remember that he left when Sammy left.
I think it was a situation where he was still in the band but just didn't play on the album because of band drama or whatever. He's in the videos and afaik played on the tour.
He did leave for good after the train wreck of a reunion tour with Sammy though.
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I saw VH on the VHIII tour. I was used to the standard "wall of Marshalls".
There were three speaker cabinets on the stage.
Three.
WTF?
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When an esteemed Mod like Hef partakes in the Van Halen posts, it's safe to say that it's not crucial to stay on topic for a thread of this importance.
:lol
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"thread of this importance" implies that there is importance to the thread. There isn't really. It's the usual suspects carrying on the same "MP sucks" bitchfest. This thread has long outlived its usefulness, IMO, which is why we're discussing Van Halen.
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I saw VH on the VHIII tour. I was used to the standard "wall of Marshalls".
There were three speaker cabinets on the stage.
Three.
WTF?
Yeah, but in fairness, the proverbial "wall of Marshalls" that some '80s bands used was fakery in most if not all cases. Meniketti has some stories about that. He saw it from some of the bigger bands they opened for early on, such as AC/DC. When Y&T got big enough to headline, they did the same thing. Except instead of buying empty cabinets, Dave made them himself in his garage. So, yeah, a LOT of bands had the huge walls of speakers back then, but most were empty cabinets that were just there for looks.
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Even Dream Theater used fake amps. I think JP had 3-4 cabinets and I think only one was real.
Sorry for being off topic and bringing up Dream Theater in a Van Halen thread
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Even Dream Theater used fake amps. I think JP had 3-4 cabinets and I think only one was real.
Sorry for being off topic and bringing up Dream Theater in a Van Halen thread
Yeah, for the last couple DT tours, the only cabinets that have actually been plugged in and used sit off-stage, mic'ed up under a blanket, not visible to the audience. The cabinets on stage are there for looks (and probably Boogie promo purposes) only.
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Yeah, but in fairness, the proverbial "wall of Marshalls" that some '80s bands used was fakery in most if not all cases. Meniketti has some stories about that. He saw it from some of the bigger bands they opened for early on, such as AC/DC. When Y&T got big enough to headline, they did the same thing. Except instead of buying empty cabinets, Dave made them himself in his garage. So, yeah, a LOT of bands had the huge walls of speakers back then, but most were empty cabinets that were just there for looks.
Oh, I know the cabinets are all fakes and not actually pushing any sound, but as noted, it IS for looks. It's a total rock and roll move. Showmanship. It's one of the things I love about a good rock band. But even knowing they're empty cabs, coming in to see the almighty Van Halen and finding 3 cabinets on stage was a little underwhelming.
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Well, JR is making music out of a NOMAC, so I don't see why JP can't make sounds out of an empty carcass.
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Empty carcass = the MP dead horse DTF continues to beat?
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Empty carcass = the MP dead llama DTF continues to beat?
The NOMAC is real... right?
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(https://s2.quickmeme.com/img/17/17fc8de2b65a62c26fd3e6ec7d3742b82275db6d2f07ab41c6995b2c5cda85b4.jpg)
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Well, JR is making music out of a NOMAC, so I don't see why JP can't make sounds out of an empty carcass.
But can he call life from a cold metal frame?
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Have you seen his new keyboard stand?
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Sadly, I have not.
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I don't know if he has one, but it seemed like the most useful interpretation of "cold metal frame", with regards to JR. :lol
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When an esteemed Mod like Hef partakes in the Van Halen posts, it's safe to say that it's not crucial to stay on topic for a thread of this importance.
The album's official title is Van Halen III, not Van Halen 3. The band showed remarkably consistent inconsistency in using "3" on the spine and on the disc.
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Have you seen his new keyboard stand?
Who? Mike Portnoy or Van Halen?
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Have you seen his new keyboard stand?
Who? Mike Portnoy or Van Halen?
Mic Michaeli, from Europe. Please try to keep up.
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The album's official title is Van Halen III, not Van Halen 3. The band showed remarkably consistent inconsistency in using "3" on the spine and on the disc.
Usually it's not the band, though. The marketing suits decide what goes on the spine, and the artwork on the disc itself could be reasoned away as "just the artwork".
My CD of Chicago's second album (official title: Chicago) says "Chicago II" on the spine. My CD of their fifth album (Chicago V) says "Chicago" on the spine. And the best one is the first album (The Chicago Transit Authority) which says "Chicago Transit Authority I" on the spine, both dropping "The" and adding "I".
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Speaking of Van Halen -
- you know who's a massive douchebag ?
Mike Portnoy.
:biggrin:
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Have you seen his new keyboard stand?
Who? Mike Portnoy or Van Halen?
Mic Michaeli, from Europe. Please try to keep up.
(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Wu9D9y8xxic/U-0CZgfVhFI/AAAAAAAADgQ/Cuk4r8OgZi4/s1600/bad-pun-puma-meme.jpg)
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Wait...Americans pronounce it Poomah ?
We Brits pronounce it like Pew Mah. . . ???
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Yeah but you guys say a lot of things wrong, so...
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Didn't JP scale back to just the one working amp on this tour? I always liked the wall he had with the album artwork on it or something from the booklet.
Eddie on the last few tours went back to the wall, even the disastrous 2004 tour. Was the III concert good, Coz?
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Didn't JP scale back to just the one working amp on this tour? I always liked the wall he had with the album artwork on it or something from the booklet.
He still had two dummie Boogie 4x12 cabinets on stage with two of his new signature heads on top. I believe the heads were plugged in as backups, but the actual heads he was using were mounted in his rack.
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Yeah but you guys say a lot of things wrong, so...
If you really want to make Kotow cry, just start dumping tea bags in front of him.
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Didn't JP scale back to just the one working amp on this tour? I always liked the wall he had with the album artwork on it or something from the booklet.
He still had two dummie Boogie 4x12 cabinets on stage with two of his new signature heads on top. I believe the heads were plugged in as backups, but the actual heads he was using were mounted in his rack.
JP uses Dimmu Borgir's cabinets?
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JP uses Dimmu Borgir's cabinets?
Let's see if I can do this right....
(https://s2.quickmeme.com/img/17/17fc8de2b65a62c26fd3e6ec7d3742b82275db6d2f07ab41c6995b2c5cda85b4.jpg)
Yup
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Eddie on the last few tours went back to the wall, even the disastrous 2004 tour. Was the III concert good, Coz?
Best I recall, it was. 5/7/98. Gund Arena in Cleveland, OH. Also:
Speaking of Van Halen -
- you know who's a massive douchebag ?
Mike Portnoy.
:biggrin:
Is this really necessary? We ALL get it. You don't like Mike Portnoy.
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This thread needs one of these:
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRRxvbgZp_-qdRDWYhBlBpyX1LPVTcEeE1P0zu6hNKVZ4AZxDU21w&reload=on)
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^^ Yeah, unless DT changes their mind on it, or MP makes a significant (note the word, significant, not a facebook post responding to the fans) comment regarding them not attending, I don't see how much more we can discuss in this thread.
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Eddie on the last few tours went back to the wall, even the disastrous 2004 tour. Was the III concert good, Coz?
Best I recall, it was. 5/7/98. Gund Arena in Cleveland, OH. Also:
Speaking of Van Halen -
- you know who's a massive douchebag ?
Mike Portnoy.
:biggrin:
Is this really necessary? We ALL get it. You don't like Mike Portnoy.
Just trying to get the thread back on track :neverusethis:
-
:lol
-
Eddie on the last few tours went back to the wall, even the disastrous 2004 tour. Was the III concert good, Coz?
Best I recall, it was. 5/7/98. Gund Arena in Cleveland, OH. Also:
Speaking of Van Halen -
- you know who's a massive douchebag ?
Mike Portnoy.
:biggrin:
Is this really necessary? We ALL get it. You don't like Mike Portnoy.
Just trying to get the thread back on track :neverusethis:
Dude, come on, wtf. If you can't post about MP without occasionally bashing him for no reason, then maybe it's better to avoid posting about him at all.
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Back on topic: I'm not grasping the debate about whether the Van Halen album in question is titled "III" or "3." What is the significance of one over the other? What am I missing? I truly don't get what the issue is.
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Just caught up on the VH discussion :lol Never noticed the 3 vs III thing, but maybe that's because it's the only VH album I don't own. I recall a few good songs, but the rest to be unforgettable from my listens some years ago.
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Back on topic: I'm not grasping the debate about whether the Van Halen album in question is titled "III" or "3." What is the significance of one over the other? What am I missing? I truly don't get what the issue is.
Well, see, if you add 3 and III, you get 6 (VI). Now consider that Van Halen 1 (I) was their best album, subtract that from 6 (VI) and you get 5 (V), aka Diver Down. Loaded with filler, not a great album. So what do you get when you add 3 (III) and 5 (V)? 8 (Octavarium). Also loaded with filler and not a great album. So nuggetz or something.
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I always liked the song Without You off of III. We just won't talk about How Many Say I where Eddie sings lead vocals....
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Back on topic: I'm not grasping the debate about whether the Van Halen album in question is titled "III" or "3." What is the significance of one over the other? What am I missing? I truly don't get what the issue is.
Well, see, if you add 3 and III, you get 6 (VI). Now consider that Van Halen 1 (I) was their best album, subtract that from 6 (VI) and you get 5 (V), aka Diver Down. Loaded with filler, not a great album. So what do you get when you add 3 (III) and 5 (V)? 8 (Octavarium). Also loaded with filler and not a great album. So nuggetz or something.
Octavarium is the best Dream Theater album.
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Best I recall, it was. 5/7/98. Gund Arena in Cleveland, OH. Also:
Speaking of Van Halen -
- you know who's a massive douchebag ?
Mike Portnoy.
:biggrin:
Is this really necessary? We ALL get it. You don't like Mike Portnoy.
Both statements are correct.
-
Back on topic: I'm not grasping the debate about whether the Van Halen album in question is titled "III" or "3." What is the significance of one over the other? What am I missing? I truly don't get what the issue is.
Well, see, if you add 3 and III, you get 6 (VI). Now consider that Van Halen 1 (I) was their best album, subtract that from 6 (VI) and you get 5 (V), aka Diver Down. Loaded with filler, not a great album. So what do you get when you add 3 (III) and 5 (V)? 8 (Octavarium). Also loaded with filler and not a great album. So nuggetz or something.
(https://s2.quickmeme.com/img/24/247b2cf2617fbe5a8b2e1fc0670dbcb01ccab9276b474b5ad6105d51817598bc.jpg)
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Back on topic: I'm not grasping the debate about whether the Van Halen album in question is titled "III" or "3." What is the significance of one over the other? What am I missing? I truly don't get what the issue is.
Well, see, if you add 3 and III, you get 6 (VI). Now consider that Van Halen 1 (I) was their best album, subtract that from 6 (VI) and you get 5 (V), aka Diver Down. Loaded with filler, not a great album. So what do you get when you add 3 (III) and 5 (V)? 8 (Octavarium). Also loaded with filler and not a great album. So nuggetz or something.
Okay, but seriously, what is it that people are fixating on here? I am not getting why it matters that one or the other is the "correct" album name. The only significance I have ever attached to it is that, to me, "3" or "III" was incredibly insulting to their past and (then) present singers in that it basically says, "this band is really only Eddie and Alex, and whoever is singing is just a number." I don't think that is what they were trying to convey, but there was little doubt in my mind that it did in fact convey how they actually felt about the band.
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Octavarium is the best Dream Theater album.
:huh: No, Images and Words is.
(https://s2.quickmeme.com/img/24/247b2cf2617fbe5a8b2e1fc0670dbcb01ccab9276b474b5ad6105d51817598bc.jpg)
:tup
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:huh: No, Images and Words is.
Surrounded rules that out.
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Octavarium is the best VH album.
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Octavarium is the best VH album.
V = 5
H = 8th letter of the alphabet
:omg: NUGGETZ
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*head asplode*
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Back on topic: I'm not grasping the debate about whether the Van Halen album in question is titled "III" or "3." What is the significance of one over the other? What am I missing? I truly don't get what the issue is.
Well, see, if you add 3 and III, you get 6 (VI). Now consider that Van Halen 1 (I) was their best album, subtract that from 6 (VI) and you get 5 (V), aka Diver Down. Loaded with filler, not a great album. So what do you get when you add 3 (III) and 5 (V)? 8 (Octavarium). Also loaded with filler and not a great album. So nuggetz or something.
Okay, but seriously, what is it that people are fixating on here? I am not getting why it matters that one or the other is the "correct" album name. The only significance I have ever attached to it is that, to me, "3" or "III" was incredibly insulting to their past and (then) present singers in that it basically says, "this band is really only Eddie and Alex, and whoever is singing is just a number." I don't think that is what they were trying to convey, but there was little doubt in my mind that it did in fact convey how they actually felt about the band.
There is no significance.
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If you're going to discuss an album, it helps to know its name. And if that discussion is in writing (as on, for example, discussion forums), then I would say that it's better to spell things correctly. Many folks disagree. But to me, this is merely an application of the rule "If you're going to do something, do it right."
Someone mentioned the Van Halen album with Gary Cherone on vocals, the one known as Van Halen III. Someone said it's not "III" but actually "3". At this point, it's a matter of honor, life or death, Ginger vs Mary Ann, you get the idea. It's important. If you're gonna write the album name, you should write it correctly.
But you can't do that until the correct name has been established, thus the discussion. This is far more important than whether or not Mike plays the 12-step suite with DT or some other guys, and nearly as important as how many empty Marshall cabinets Eddie Van Halen has on stage behind him.
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the fuck is this thread
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the fuck is this thread
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Ginger vs Mary Ann
Jeez, man, I don't know. They both have their appeal.
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I know, right?
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I guess you'd get married to Mary Ann, and Ginger could be your side piece.
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Someone mentioned the Van Halen album with Gary Cherone on vocals, the one known as Van Halen III. Someone said it's not "III" but actually "3". At this point, it's a matter of honor, life or death, Ginger vs Mary Ann, you get the idea. It's important. If you're gonna write the album name, you should write it correctly.
What about DLR vs. SH?
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the fuck is this thread
I say we take off and nuke the site from orbit.
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It's the only way to be sure.
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Game Over, Man.
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the fuck is this thread
I say we take off and nuke the site from orbit.
Let's move to the MP forum. :neverusethis:
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Alien
Aliens
Prometheus
Alien 3
Alien V Predator
Alien Resurrection
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Lock
Locked
Locke
:lokked: