Dream Theater: The Astonishing (now with moment of betrayal!)

[Aythesryche]

What if this is the cover art for the new album, just without the "live"? I doubt it but could be...

Yeah I've pondered that too.

I don't think it will be. I'm just going by how creative this artist is that's working on all this new material for DT. Something tells me he's not lazy like Syme at all, and he probably presented DT with a handful of grand options to choose from for the cover.

[Setlist Scotty]

also a double album of middling music is way worse than a single disc of middling music

Not sure I agree with that. Whenever a favorite album or song thread comes up, it's amazing to see how many people express polar opposites about so many different albums/songs. So while some songs may be considered drivel by one part of the fanbase, another part may love it. Having more material to enjoy increases the amount of chance that something is going to click and be enjoyable to each person. Sure, it also means that there's more of a chance for someone to hate more songs, but I'd rather have more material to pick from than less. There's always the skip button if I don't like something.

[SuperTaco]

What if this is the cover art for the new album, just without the "live"? I doubt it but could be...

*snip*

That would be a pretty good album cover, but considering that this project seems to be bigger and more complex than most DT albums, I'd wager that the real cover will be something more intricate and detailed than a NOMAC in front of clouds.

(It would be a shame to waste the amazing talents of that artist too)

Also, it can't just be a coincidence that the NOMAC eyes on the Astonishing page are still "clickable". I think they'll lead to something eventually.

[hadi-persian]

when astonishing and ocatavrium unite! but using from uper gain 4 playing riffs. the should be useing from another drop:C/F/Bb/ and not use from standard tuning.but we have some good E tuning in dt songs. 1.octavarium.2.the count of tuscany.3.in the precense of enemise.4.the best of times.(but other tuning in 7 string guitar can give to us heavy-progress rythm for starting new year.) but in ur new year in iran our calendar is persian. we are in 1394.and u r in 2015. iranian analyse the calendar from rounding the earth around the sun. hey guys happy new year before release the 2016.i said to you.good luck

[Kotowboy]

belly dance !

[TAC]

also a double album of middling music is way worse than a single disc of middling music

Not sure I agree with that. Whenever a favorite album or song thread comes up, it's amazing to see how many people express polar opposites about so many different albums/songs. So while some songs may be considered drivel by one part of the fanbase, another part may love it. Having more material to enjoy increases the amount of chance that something is going to click and be enjoyable to each person. Sure, it also means that there's more of a chance for someone to hate more songs, but I'd rather have more material to pick from than less. There's always the skip button if I don't like something.

Amen, brother.

As with The Book Of Souls, I'm thinking if they cut song X and Song Y, they could've made a single CD, but of course that is always met with "No way bro, Song X and Song Y are awesome!" 

[Kotowboy]

And with smartphones etc - we can just compile a playlist of our faves.

[hadi-persian]

hey fans.i have never seen the live.because i live in ian.i see dt only in DVD/youtube. one of my great expections is seeing dt near the stage.i must travel to istanbul or other cities that dt come to these cities. but u can go out from ur home and going to shop .buying ticket.then no need to car . u can run for enjoying from the dt concert.but i must working very hard for traveling to istanbul.need to money and another fuck'in thing. u have best choise in u.k. u.s.a and other countries. hey guys do u remember jamshid sharifi in Score 2006? he lead the orchestral for playing SDOIT/Octavarium. do u remember him?

[Kotowboy]

You live in Ian ? Does Ian get a say in this ? 

[Kotowboy]

I remember Score yes. I could never remember the name of the conductor.

Shukran !


No, i cannot speak persian

[hadi-persian]

i must edit it.IRAN. shukran dose not the persian word.it is the arabic word. u must say :mamnoon. that's mean is thank you. 

[Kotowboy]

Mamnoon ! 

[hadi-persian]

kotowboy.whats the time in ur country now? the time here is 2:42 AM

[Kotowboy]

That cannot be. Here it is exactly 23:21



Your clock is 21 minutes fast like Dr. Emmett Brown.

[Nihil-Morari]

That cannot be. Here it is exactly 23:21



Your clock is 21 minutes fast like Dr. Emmett Brown.

It's actually 30, cause he lives in a half-time zone. Thanks NM for the facts!

Anyway, still looking forward to this album. And I too like a double cd more if it's cut in 2 by concept, or if it's just too much for one disc. Not 2 full albums of music. I mean, The Flower Kings have made a couple of 130-140 minute double albums, but their music is more up and down in nature than DT's, and even more based on improvisation, so that gives the listener more time to process the longer songs.

[chaossystem]

I'm surprised that there has been little or no speculation about what the live presentation of this story is going to be.

I'm hoping that each of the two discs will be no more than about an hour long, so the live show will have room for about 30-40 minutes of music from some of their other albums as well.

What I would like to see them do is use a large projection screen to tell the story, along with one or two smaller screens that would mostly show the band as they are performing for people in the "cheap seats."

Also it wouldn't bother me if they open with two or three older songs before going into the story. Then they could play disc one, have an intermission, play disc two for the second set, and another 15 or 20 minutes of older songs for the encore.

[Madman Shepherd]

I'm surprised that there has been little or no speculation about what the live presentation of this story is going to be.

I'm hoping that each of the two discs will be no more than about an hour long, so the live show will have room for about 30-40 minutes of music from some of their other albums as well.

What I would like to see them do is use a large projection screen to tell the story, along with one or two smaller screens that would mostly show the band as they are performing for people in the "cheap seats."

Also it wouldn't bother me if they open with two or three older songs before going into the story. Then they could play disc one, have an intermission, play disc two for the second set, and another 15 or 20 minutes of older songs for the encore.

I agree 100%

[TAC]

Also it wouldn't bother me if they open with two or three older songs before going into the story. 

There is absolutely no way this happens.

[Rodni Demental]

Although - some times an album can fail on all counts and still be somewhat enjoyable.

St. Anger has terrible songs, production and lyrics but I still enjoy it somewhat

Not sure if serious, but I would agree anyway. St. Anger is just terrible in every way at face value, but then there's something "fun" about it and it grows on you. Got some cool riffs in C tuning. It has nice groove, or something, I think, maybe that's it. 

also a double album of middling music is way worse than a single disc of middling music

Not sure I agree with that. Whenever a favorite album or song thread comes up, it's amazing to see how many people express polar opposites about so many different albums/songs. So while some songs may be considered drivel by one part of the fanbase, another part may love it. Having more material to enjoy increases the amount of chance that something is going to click and be enjoyable to each person. Sure, it also means that there's more of a chance for someone to hate more songs, but I'd rather have more material to pick from than less. There's always the skip button if I don't like something.

Yeah absolutely, I know sometimes less can be more, but most of the time... It inherently isn't. Having more to choose from is mostly always better I would imagine.

[Calvin6s]

Just wish whoever did the clever satire to the middle section of BoRhap would repost it.  Sadly, I saved the link to show the wife (which, obviously, no longer works) instead of copying it.

Thanks in advance.

[the wife works fine]

I'm assuming you are talking about my off the cuff post.  Didn't write it down anywhere, so I'll do my best to recreate.

Mangini's contribution to DT's upcoming rock opera:

Thunderbolt and lightning very very frightening me
Double Kick Drum, Double Kick Drum,
Double Kick Drum, Double Kick Drum,
Double Kick Drum, Rototom - magnifico

But I'm just a poor snare and nobody loves me
It's just a poor mix from a poor recording
Spare us this snare from this monstrosity
Easy come easy go will you let me go
Mike Portnoy! No we will not let you go - let him go
Mike Portnoy! We will not let you go - let him go
Mike Portnoy! We will not let you go let me go
Will not let you go let me go (never)
Never let you go let me go
Never let me go ooo
No, no, no, no, no, no, no
Oh Dominici, Dominici, Dominici let me go
Sherinian has a devil put aside for Moore
For Moore
For Moore

[Setlist Scotty]

also a double album of middling music is way worse than a single disc of middling music

Not sure I agree with that. Whenever a favorite album or song thread comes up, it's amazing to see how many people express polar opposites about so many different albums/songs. So while some songs may be considered drivel by one part of the fanbase, another part may love it. Having more material to enjoy increases the amount of chance that something is going to click and be enjoyable to each person. Sure, it also means that there's more of a chance for someone to hate more songs, but I'd rather have more material to pick from than less. There's always the skip button if I don't like something.

Amen, brother.

As with The Book Of Souls, I'm thinking if they cut song X and Song Y, they could've made a single CD, but of course that is always met with "No way bro, Song X and Song Y are awesome!" 

Exactly. I mean, taking it a step even further, why not just say "I don't want DT to put out any more music for fear that it's gonna suck"? I mean that's just silly, and stating "I don't want a double album just because some of the material will probably suck" is essentially the same thing.

Also it wouldn't bother me if they open with two or three older songs before going into the story. 

There is absolutely no way this happens.

Me and Timmy agree once again. Guarantee that this won't happen. If it were to have ever happened, then it would've made much more sense for DT to open up their shows with Metropolis part I before performing all of SFaM, and yet even that didn't happen. Makes no sense that they'd perform a few older songs before doing the whole new album, especially if it's a double album.

I'm surprised that there has been little or no speculation about what the live presentation of this story is going to be.

There's been a little talk about it, but mostly just the length - whether the whole story will be the first set or both sets. I'm of the feeling that it'll be a double album (as in 2 CDs) so set 1 will be the first CD and set 2 will be the second CD, with an encore of one or a few older tracks.

Hard to say what the actual presentation will be like without having anything to go by. I can imagine that there will be various video clips that will help explain the story and that the stage will be more unique with more props. Maybe there'll be some actors as well. But whatever the case, I hope they don't end up doing something as cheesy/silly/ridiculous as Styx did for the tour supporting Kilroy Was Here or what QR did when they performed both Operation: Mindcrime albums in 2006.

[The Letter M]

Since it seems we are getting a double album, I'm guessing the odds are pretty high that we'll be getting at least one side-length epic song (that is, in the 18-25 minute range). I'm also going to guess that the album will likely be a triple vinyl, so each disc will probably be about 60 minutes long, or three side of vinyl, so a 2CD would equal about a 3LP.

I wonder what the odds are of having TWO side-length epics? I mean, they've never done that before, and there's usually only ONE piece of music that is that length per album (and no, I'm not going to count both halves of SDOIT, that's just silly). I mean, let's see two separate songs that are in that 18-25 minute range, one on each disc! I doubt it, but it'd be cool to see.

I also hope, as far as song lengths go, that we get a few in that 12-15 minute range that only a few DT songs land in, something more along the lengths of ITNOG and TMOLS, or perhaps even longer than that. There's really nothing that DT has done that lands in the 17-18 minute range, but that's just being nit-picky, but we did get ANTR and TCOT, and they're around that space.

Either way, I'd like to see a lot of variety in terms of song length on this album. Throw in some short interludes or short acoustic pieces, then those mid-ranged 7-8 minute heavy prog-metal pieces, a couple of 10-12 minute epics, and at least one side-length epic in the 18-25 minute range!

-Marc.

[DragonAttack]

Just thanking Calvin6s for reposting the BoRhap Mangini contribution (now copied and pasted for safe keeping)

[mikemangioy]

I'm so hyped. This is the second album that comes out since I became a fan and if this thing lives up to the tremendous expectations, I'll be extremely satisfied.

[BlackInk]

Many people here seem to not find lyrics important at all, even to the point of "not even listening to them, so it doesn't even matter". I'm the opposite, I find lyrics to be super important. Which is one big reason I didn't like DT12 and BC&SL. Bad lyrics in music is like bad sound in a movie or video, no matter how good the rest is, it'll give me an overwhelming sense of amateurism.

If lyrics are super important to you, why are you a fan of DT? That hasn't been their strong suit since Kevin Moore left. The last two albums aren't any worse than their previous efforts, IMO.

You don't have to hate something just because you don't love it. Some of the lyrics as of late have not been super awesome, but most of it is still passable enough for me to enjoy, just not as much as other better bands out there.

[MirrorMask]

Hard to say what the actual presentation will be like without having anything to go by. I can imagine that there will be various video clips that will help explain the story and that the stage will be more unique with more props. Maybe there'll be some actors as well. But whatever the case, I hope they don't end up doing something as cheesy/silly/ridiculous as Styx did for the tour supporting Kilroy Was Here or what QR did when they performed both Operation: Mindcrime albums in 2006.

I saw Queensryche doing the Mindcrime albums back to back, I didn't mind the very theatrical presentation, but I don't see James walking around the stage with a to-the-mouth mic (how are called those?)... I think that a presentation like Scenes from a Memory with added production value (namely, an actor who remembers his spoken parts and how slow / fast he has to go  ) will be more than enough, the focus will still be the band but there will be some visual threats (they surely will expand on the background animations of the last tour).

I also hope, as far as song lengths go, that we get a few in that 12-15 minute range that only a few DT songs land in, something more along the lengths of ITNOG and TMOLS, or perhaps even longer than that. There's really nothing that DT has done that lands in the 17-18 minute range, but that's just being nit-picky, but we did get ANTR and TCOT, and they're around that space.

What I'm most longing for is song in that range, another song like Finally Free, 12 minutes where the song structures serve the lyrics and not the other way around... a song with an unusual structure that is made up around the portion of the story they have to tell. Something like High Water Mark, for those of you who follow Iced Earth and know their Gettysburg trilogy.

[sfam2112]

but I don't see James walking around the stage with a to-the-mouth mic (how are called those?)

Headset mic.  While he didn't walk around with one, he did use one during Regression on LSFNY, if I remember right.

[MirrorMask]

Yeah, indeed, but it was just for the therapist scene and he was laying down, he didn't use it for the whole show... I don't picture him pretending to kneel down at Victoria's grave or something 

[TAC]

Hard to say what the actual presentation will be like without having anything to go by. I can imagine that there will be various video clips that will help explain the story and that the stage will be more unique with more props. Maybe there'll be some actors as well. But whatever the case, I hope they don't end up doing something as cheesy/silly/ridiculous as Styx did for the tour supporting Kilroy Was Here or what QR did when they performed both Operation: Mindcrime albums in 2006.

Not sure what QR did there, but I loved their Promised Land tour. That was a great performance. Really brought those songs to life.
Something the album did not do.

[The Paddies]

but I don't see James walking around the stage with a to-the-mouth mic (how are called those?)

Headset mic.  While he didn't walk around with one, he did use one during Regression on LSFNY, if I remember right.

James used a headset mic for the entire Ayreon - The Theater Equation show and he did a great job with that. He was a good performer as well, he really seemed to be into it. I've seen twenty Dream Theater shows and also attended the James LaBrie soloband in Holland. And The Theater Equation definitely belongs to one of his best performances I've seen live so far. That - I believe - is partly due to the fact he uses a lot more of his softer tone on The Human Equation/The Theater Equation, he doesn't/didn't have to sing two hours straight and he doesn't/didn't have to sing on top of his lungs all that time. I hope the boys in Dream Theater keep those things in mind while writing new material as well - and I do believe they do (maybe Build Me Up, Break Me Down aside).

[Evermind]

Well, everyone from the main cast used headset mic there - the amount of acting pretty much required that (and yeah, JLB did great with the acting, though I wouldn't say he was amazing in singing department.) Anyway, I just can't see it happening with DT show, the full-blown set with headset mic.

I'm ready for the band to prove me wrong though.

[Mike PornToy]

Act I : 60 minutes or more ?

1. Descent of the NOMACS
2. Dystopian Overture
3. The Gift of Music
4. The Answer
5. A Better Life

[wolven74]

I realize this is going on a limb a bit here...

Since I haven't seen emails and such, I've been worried that this double "concept" album is something along the lines of 6DOIT. Not to say that 6DOIT is a bad album, but essentially it's a double album with a single disc being the concept and a single disc of non concept songs. I'm hoping one of you can confirm that this is indeed a double disc of concept material. Ya know, two discs, one story? From all I've read on here so far, that is the case, but can you link me to where that's confirmed?

[Nihil-Morari]

I realize this is going on a limb a bit here...

Since I haven't seen emails and such, I've been worried that this double "concept" album is something along the lines of 6DOIT. Not to say that 6DOIT is a bad album, but essentially it's a double album with a single disc being the concept and a single disc of non concept songs. I'm hoping one of you can confirm that this is indeed a double disc of concept material. Ya know, two discs, one story? From all I've read on here so far, that is the case, but can you link me to where that's confirmed?

Well since there's actually 'places' a map and main characters, it has to be much more of a concept than Six Degrees. Apart form that, this one is really promoted as being a concept album. So it would be very strange if only one of the two discs would be a concept disc.

[BlobVanDam]

I realize this is going on a limb a bit here...

Since I haven't seen emails and such, I've been worried that this double "concept" album is something along the lines of 6DOIT. Not to say that 6DOIT is a bad album, but essentially it's a double album with a single disc being the concept and a single disc of non concept songs. I'm hoping one of you can confirm that this is indeed a double disc of concept material. Ya know, two discs, one story? From all I've read on here so far, that is the case, but can you link me to where that's confirmed?

How can a song be a concept?
As far as we know, it's a double concept album, all related to the same story. Given that they're going to play the album in full at their shows, I'd say that's a very safe assumption until proven otherwise.