Mike Mangini on DT12

[detemete]

So, the inevitable question

How do you think Mike Mangini fares on DT12? Regarding JP's "Mangini unleashed" comments, I want to see what everyone thinks of his performance on the new album, since it's the first one where he has complete creative control of his drumming.

[chrisbDTM]

i think the he had complete control over his drumming on the last album. people overblow 'JP wrote the drums' WAY too much. he probably gave MM super rough versions with drums just indicating overall feels like double time, fast, etc. I saw stuff online last album cycle where people think JP wrote all the fills too 


anyway MM is awesome as usual on the new album. Really gotta listen closely to understand how difficult some of the parts were, whereas MP was in your face but the drumming wasn't all that technical. alot of SSBBTTBBTT fills

[rumborak]

I'm kinda middle of the road on it. To some degree I'm disappointed because it doesn't really stand out as much as you'd think it should with a guy so technically strong as MM.

[FourthHorseman]

Only on my 5th listen, so I haven't fully digested it yet, but what Mike is doing is really impressive. 

Excited for the album to drop next week so we have better audio quality.

[Sycsa]

As a drummer, I'm absolutely blown away by his performance and creativity. I probably listened to his Enigma Machine solo a few dozen times already. Another highlight is what he does accompanying Jordan's piano fugue in IT. The drumming is interesting and engaging all the way through and I really love the huge, fat, thick sound as well.

[LTE3]

I feel MM's drum sound is not up to par with past DT records, have to wait for the cd to make final determination but so far I am disappointed. They almost sound electronic to me, and the cymbal hits are almost inaudible. Need more time to digest the whole album but another thing I notice I get the sense that MP may have a better natural groove nature or better feel to his drumming. Yes, MM can fit more hits in during his fills and in between measures but does that make it pleasing to the ear? For me not so much. I keep coming back to the snare sound also, just sounds like another tom most of the time, and hi-hat is not very distinctive, again will reserve final judgment after listening to cd on nice system.

[wolven74]

I feel MM's drum sound is not up to par with past DT records, have to wait for the cd to make final determination but so far I am disappointed. They almost sound electronic to me, and the cymbal hits are almost inaudible. Need more time to digest the whole album but another thing I notice I get the sense that MP may have a better natural groove nature or better feel to his drumming. Yes, MM can fit more hits in during his fills and in between measures but does that make it pleasing to the ear? For me not so much. I keep coming back to the snare sound also, just sounds like another tom most of the time, and hi-hat is not very distinctive, again will reserve final judgment after listening to cd on nice system.

I'm sorry, I have to disagree with you. I'm not discounting your opinion, I can understand that completely.

I think the new music calls for a fatter drum sound, and I think MM has pulled that off perfectly. I think MMs playing has just as much groove as MP did. The difference to my ear is that MM plays with the band. He listens to what others are doing and picks a beat that will fit the groove the others are playing. MP was a leader. I got the feeling the band was following him. MM blends in and his playing compliments what the band is doing, not the other way around. The only thing I hear that I'm not too sure of on the new record is his deeper octoban sound. But again, it fit the music.

[ResultsMayVary]

Mangini has been unleashed. His playing is so god damn precise, some people has mistaken that for triggering. And some of the shit he plays is just not human. He does hang back for the majority of the songs (not to be too upfront) except for Enigma Machine, which is just insanity on every instrument. And even though he hangs back on some songs, they are still some crazy parts and other parts with subtle things going on behind the guitar or bass.

[LTE3]

I feel MM's drum sound is not up to par with past DT records, have to wait for the cd to make final determination but so far I am disappointed. They almost sound electronic to me, and the cymbal hits are almost inaudible. Need more time to digest the whole album but another thing I notice I get the sense that MP may have a better natural groove nature or better feel to his drumming. Yes, MM can fit more hits in during his fills and in between measures but does that make it pleasing to the ear? For me not so much. I keep coming back to the snare sound also, just sounds like another tom most of the time, and hi-hat is not very distinctive, again will reserve final judgment after listening to cd on nice system.

I'm sorry, I have to disagree with you. I'm not discounting your opinion, I can understand that completely.

I think the new music calls for a fatter drum sound, and I think MM has pulled that off perfectly. I think MMs playing has just as much groove as MP did. The difference to my ear is that MM plays with the band. He listens to what others are doing and picks a beat that will fit the groove the others are playing. MP was a leader. I got the feeling the band was following him. MM blends in and his playing compliments what the band is doing, not the other way around. The only thing I hear that I'm not too sure of on the new record is his deeper octoban sound. But again, it fit the music.

I hear you as well. For me I wish MM was playing on MP's kit and that it was mastered like his drum sound on ToT then I think I might be more blown away. I will make adjustments to my system like I did for ADTofE to get the best drum sound I can and see what I hear.

[hefdaddy42]

I think he's fantastic.

[detemete]

I, for one, think that part of the problem with his drum sound is caused by the bad (read: awfully loud) mastering of the album. It sounds kinda flat and lifeless. And you miss some of the details for sure.

Other than that, I'd think that his playing is definitely more technical and has a more "schooled" feeling to it, compared to MP. And I'm not saying this as a compliment or an insult. MP is obviously a music school graduate too but MM is definitely more rooted in that side of the drumming world, which is expected after spending that much time as an instructor in Berklee. I think it boils down to personal preference among the 2 styles, but I think JP overall was doing MM a disservice by saying things like "Mangini unleashed" and hyping his drumming up more than he should.

[ResultsMayVary]

I thought MP dropped out of Berklee? It should be music school dropout. Not to insult, but to be factually correct.

Also maybe JP thought that was the best way to describe MM's playing on the album. I sure as hell agree with him on that description.

[MrBoom_shack-a-lack]

I think he did a solid work behind the drums. There's alot of cool things going on.

[DarkLord_Lalinc]

I thought MP dropped out of Berklee? It should be music school dropout.

He is, just like John Petrucci and John Myung.

[ariich]

His performance on this album is one of the best I've ever heard. He does so much great stuff, but he really knows when to go crazy and when to stay simple. And his playing is very musical - he really locks in to what other instruments are doing.

[Tom Bombadil]

MM's performance didn't blow me away, but it's very solid drumming throughout. No complaints.

[blackspot]

I think he's fantastic.

+1

[sunseeker]

I never thought I'd say this but I miss Portnoy. MM is amazing, but now I realized that I liked MP's flashy, in-your-face style (minding the overuse of fills). I recently picked up The Whirlwind and found MP's playing very enjoyable.

Maybe I cannot appreciate or cannot hear all the hidden gems in Manginis playing. With DT12 i was hoping for moments like the polyrythm section in the beggining of OTBOA 

[DarkLord_Lalinc]

One of the reasons this album probably feels so fresh to me is that for the first time in years I'm hearing some new fills and rhythms in DT land. I mean, ADTOE was pretty safe musically and drumming-wise, but this is one whole new territory.

[ResultsMayVary]

I thought MP dropped out of Berklee? It should be music school dropout.

He is, just like John Petrucci and John Myung.

And look where they are now. A piece of useless information to bring up the Berklee thing, imho.

[nikatapi]

Great playing, some really cool cymbal stuff that goes on both the left and right side of the sound (hihats and stuff).
Too bad i don't like the sound. I don't know if it's a production thing or a matter of the drum-cymbal brand, it just sounds a bit lifeless and artificial.

He is doing an incredible job anyway, some amazing fills and grooves. I expected some more polyrhythmic stuff that would throw me off, but great job overall.

[moof]

Not as catchy as Portnoy but I don't really mind that. He's an absolute beast, live the drumming on this album.

[7StringedBeast]

I think Mangini puts every beat where it is supposed to be, but nothing really surprises me.  Portnoy I feel like surprised me more (or he used to). 

That being said, Mangini is on a whole other level of drumming.  The dude is so talented it's insane.  It's too early for me to tell how much I like the drumming on     this album, so far like I said it just sounds like every drum is in the right place but nothing surprising or standing out.  He let's the grooves happen though.

I think the more I listen to it the more I can pick things out.  It's still early to be analyzing just the drums.

[Tis BOOLsheet]

I never thought I'd say this but I miss Portnoy. MM is amazing, but now I realized that I liked MP's flashy, in-your-face style (minding the overuse of fills). I recently picked up The Whirlwind and found MP's playing very enjoyable.

Maybe I cannot appreciate or cannot hear all the hidden gems in Manginis playing. With DT12 i was hoping for moments like the polyrythm section in the beggining of OTBOA 

Could you please elaborate on this? I keep hearing about MP's "in your face" playing, but I do not understand what this exactly means relative to MM's playing. I don't find MM to be any less "flashy" (if you want to use that term) or intense. In fact, I find it quite the OPPOSITE.

I'm getting the impression people are just using "in-your-face playing" as a generic term meant to be understood as an overall appreciation for MP's individual sound as a musician. I can totally appreciate that, if that is in fact what you meant.

On a totally separate note.... lol @ the guy in the other thread who still thinks MM is 'holding back' in his playing.

[Daso]

I heard the album twice and I'm absolutely in love with Mike's playing. He has a superhuman musical comprehension, he sounds adequate everywhere, and it is very clear whenever he intends to shine through and does so in a very educated way, as in saying he's not playing complex for the sake of it. There were parts where one could say he could've shown off much more, and indeed he had the ability to do so, but it wouldn't fit fully the context of those parts, and it could be noticed that he knew.  He's the perfect fit, I'm sure of it now.

[GandL]

In some places, the sound is right, but most of it, it is too flat, but I put it on the production, ... One thing that I've noticed is that he almost never perform twice the same thing, there is always someting different in the next measure.

[Tom Bombadil]

I would be remiss if I didn't mention the 12:55 mark in IT. That is some of the most ridiculous drumming ever.

[BlobVanDam]

Technically I think he's great, and definitely better than on ADTOE, but overall I agree with rumby. There are some very cool fills, but it's not as "unleashed" as I was expecting, in terms of crazy polyrhythms or pure awe etc. There are even spots where I hear familiar MP parts.
I want drums that make me want to air drum and fail!

I do have a question though. From about 1:07 - 1:21 of FAS, it sounds like MM is playing the marching snare, but also throwing in toms. Is he doing the snare one handed there? Because I know he can do crazy shit like that, and it wouldn't surprise me.

[ResultsMayVary]

I bet he is doing it one-handed. It's definitely within his ability.

[BlobVanDam]

I bet he is doing it one-handed. It's definitely within his ability.

Oh for sure, I mostly just wasn't sure if I was mistaken about there being toms there. It kind of blends in with the bass drum a bit, and I know he wouldn't overdub it.

[theseoafs]

I'm very impressed with MM's performance on the album.  JP and JR have been heaping praise onto the man, and I think it's well-deserved.  Technically speaking, the most impressive stuff is in the fills that litter every track, many of which have rhythmic subdivisions I can't even begin to fathom.  For the most part, though, he's happy to live in the pocket and play a supporting role, which is entirely appropriate.  Having said that, a lot of his grooves are deceptively simple, and a lot of them complement the song so well that you don't even notice how technically impressive they are until you focus directly on them.

[gmillerdrake]

I feel MM's drum sound is not up to par with past DT records, have to wait for the cd to make final determination but so far I am disappointed. They almost sound electronic to me, and the cymbal hits are almost inaudible. Need more time to digest the whole album but another thing I notice I get the sense that MP may have a better natural groove nature or better feel to his drumming. Yes, MM can fit more hits in during his fills and in between measures but does that make it pleasing to the ear? For me not so much. I keep coming back to the snare sound also, just sounds like another tom most of the time, and hi-hat is not very distinctive, again will reserve final judgment after listening to cd on nice system.

I'm sorry, I have to disagree with you. I'm not discounting your opinion, I can understand that completely.

I think the new music calls for a fatter drum sound, and I think MM has pulled that off perfectly. I think MMs playing has just as much groove as MP did. The difference to my ear is that MM plays with the band. He listens to what others are doing and picks a beat that will fit the groove the others are playing. MP was a leader. I got the feeling the band was following him. MM blends in and his playing compliments what the band is doing, not the other way around. The only thing I hear that I'm not too sure of on the new record is his deeper octoban sound. But again, it fit the music.

This. MP needed/wanted/ had to be heard.....he was a showman and did all he could to make sure he stood out in DT from his drums being mixed 'loud' to onstage antics. MM is a true team player.....that just happens to be incredible. His style may not be as flashy but it's as evidenced by this album in particular he 's forgotten more about musical composition than most of us could ever learn.

I heard the album twice and I'm absolutely in love with Mike's playing. He has a superhuman musical comprehension, he sounds adequate everywhere, and it is very clear whenever he intends to shine through and does so in a very educated way, as in saying he's not playing complex for the sake of it. There were parts where one could say he could've shown off much more, and indeed he had the ability to do so, but it wouldn't fit fully the context of those parts, and it could be noticed that he knew.  He's the perfect fit, I'm sure of it now.

This.

His performance on this album is one of the best I've ever heard. He does so much great stuff, but he really knows when to go crazy and when to stay simple. And his playing is very musical - he really locks in to what other instruments are doing.

That....with a couple +1's thrown in there....

I think he's fantastic.

And that, just to sum it up.

[adastra]

I think he sounds like a drum machine.  I'm not a drummer but correct me if I'm wrong; I think his playing isn't as versatile as Portnoy's

[farizfariz]

I think he sounds like a drum machine.  I'm not a drummer but correct me if I'm wrong; I think his playing isn't as versatile as Portnoy's

He sounds like a drum machine because he's a damn precise drummer
And about versatility, maybe because he didn't throwing too much fill ? IMO

[metropofreak]

I think he's done an incredible job. Basically, this:

His performance on this album is one of the best I've ever heard. He does so much great stuff, but he really knows when to go crazy and when to stay simple. And his playing is very musical - he really locks in to what other instruments are doing.

There are quite a few polyrhythmic moments, but most are really subtle. He does a lot of stuff between his two ride cymbals that's hard to pick out. Personally, I love the beat at the start of IT - not really sure exactly what he's doing there but its awesome! Also, during the insane vocal moment on IT starting at 11:11 he adds in crotchet (quarter) notes on the hi-hat which makes the other rhythm he is playing in unison with JM and JP ten times more awesome.