Who else doesn't consider Octavarium a top 20 DT song?

[Slain]

It's a top 1 song.

This. DT hasn't ever executed a flawless idea so flawlessly.

+1

I completely agree. #1 in my book

[Super Dude]

Yeah, but probably at the bottom of those 20.

[m0hawk]

My favourite DT song, just besting The Count. That said, it's not perfect. The vocal melody in the Full Circle verse + chorus is really out of place. Not a fan of that section. Everything else is DT at their absolute best. I do wish that the studio version included JLB's Score screech just before Razor's Edge (you know, the one that gives you the chills EVERY time?). That's the only downside to the studio version.

[HarlequinForest]

It's a top 1 song.

[KevShmev]

  I think the album WDADU is better.

I definitely like WDADU better than Octavarium (the album).  OV is probably the best song from either album, but I like the best four or five songs from WDADU more than the 2nd best song from OV.

Kev, can you help us out by listing the songs you think are better?  That would be cool.

Sure.  Keep in mind that these are songs I like better (listed in chronological order):

Another Day
Take the Time
Surrounded
Metropolis
Learning to Live
Erotomania
Voices
Lifting Shadows Off a Dream
Scarred
Space Dye Vest
A Change of Seasons
Hell's Kitchen
Lines in the Sand
Trial of Tears
Overture 1928/Strange Deja Vu
Fatal Tragedy
Home
The Spirit Carries On
Finally Free
The Glass Prison
Blind Faith
Misunderstood
In the Name of God
This Is the Life
Bridges in the Sky
Breaking All Illusions

That comes out to 26.  Octavarium would be in the next tier along with songs like The Count of Tuscany, 6:00, Light Fuse and Get Away, Outcry, Peruvian Skies, Only a Matter of Time, etc.

[Kotowboy]

#1 for me.  For so many reasons.

[antigoon]

The Wheel of Fortune "Before and After" section drags it down for me.

[Kotowboy]

I can easily listen to all 24 mins of it and not get bored.

[2Timer]

Love it, definitely top 20, and can't wait to hear it on vinyl.

[black_biff_stadler]

It's in the bottom quarter for me.  I really don't care for it.

Same here for me. I was miserably disappointed with all of the album Octavarium when I first listened to it with the exception of slightly liking TRoAE and liking PA pretty well. When I saw that the album ended with a 24-minute song, I thought it had the chance of being the album's saving grace but all it did was reinforce all that I already disliked about the rest of the album. I've listened to it a couple times in the last few months and I don't quite dislike it anymore but I'd still say I lean a little south of neutral towards it.

[Ruba]

I use to like it for only the last ten minutes.

Now I like the whole song. Though the instrumental section between Full Circle and Intervals is overlong.

But it isn't close to the top of my ranking, because DT has made so many better songs.

[Dellers]

Of course it's top 20!

[?]

Octavarium is a top 40 DT song at best for me, maybe even top 50. It's ok but it sounds a bit forced and calculated, I can imagine them saying "this song HAS to be 24 minutes long, no matter what!" A Change of Seasons is much better written IMO (which probably has to do with the fact that ACOS was written in a much longer time). Besides, to my ears James' vocals in Full Circle have an annoying tone and the lyrics don't evoke any emotions in me.

I think the album WDADU is better.

Gotta agree, I'd rather listen to A Fortune in Lies, Afterlife, TOWHTSTS or Only a Matter of Time than 8V.

[snapple]

I don't get how people don't realize that ACOS is a better song in every way. The emotion behind the lyrics (which James PERFECTLY conveys in his masterful delivery), the music itself, the movements, the progression of Mike during the song (as a child growing up and all that shit). ACOS is perfect in every way, as far as a DT epic is concerned. I love every part of the song and could tell you where each part is. 8V? Meh, I've listened to it a lot, but there are many forgettable parts.

Songs I consider better than 8v:

WDADU
I&W
Awake (which isn't even fair to compare them, imo)
ACOS
Lines in the Sand
Trial of Tears
Hell's Kitchen
Overture 1928/SDJV
Beyond this Life
Home
TSCO
The Glass Prison
Misunderstood
Blind Faith
TROAE
These Walls
ITPOE
ANTR (minus DAY AFTER ROROROOROR)
The Count
ADTOE

[BlobVanDam]

I don't get how people don't realize that ACOS is a better song in every way.

Probably because most people are open minded enough to realize that music is subjective and your opinion isn't a matter of fact.
Personally I find that Octavarium is a much more beautiful song, with so many of amazingly crafted progressions and melodies. Lyrically it's not as personal overall, and a bit more cryptic, but musically for me it's not even a contest. I don't even consider ACOS one of their strongest songs of the period.

[snapple]

Well, people not taking my opinion as fact is just flat out absurd

[N4Player]

Top 10 song for me. Has so many of the elements that make Dream Theater special IMO.

[Jaq]

Not in my top 20. In fact, while I appreciate and like the song, I do sort of at arms length. It doesn't feel like it's about anything, it feels more like it's one long running reference to the history of progressive rock. (Here's the Pink Floyd part, here's the Yes part, here's the Genesis part.) It's immaculately constructed, but I can see the structure all too well, if that makes sense. I don't know if it was the band's intent, but listening to it it feels like they sat down and said "okay, this song WILL be a side long epic!"

ACOS is a much better epic IMO.

[KevShmev]

I agree that ACOS vs. OV is not close.  The highs in A Change of Seasons are higher, the lyrics are better (easily the best Portnoy have ever written), it sounds far more original and unique (I agree that they definitely went overboard with the references/borrowing in OV), and it is simply a much better song, IMO.  A Change of Seasons grabs you from the get-go and is interesting as hell for the entire 23 plus minutes.  I cannot say that about Octavarium. 

[manticore999]

Down towards the bottom of the list for me.  Hard not to fall asleep waiting for something to happen. I guess it's ok once it gets going, but it's nothing special.  It would be slightly above TCOT and ACOS, so I guess third from the bottom.

[Jaffa]

It would be slightly above TCOT and ACOS, so I guess third from the bottom.

Just so I'm clear, are you talking about the bottom of your top 20 list, or the bottom of all their songs?

[manticore999]

It would be slightly above TCOT and ACOS, so I guess third from the bottom.

Just so I'm clear, are you talking about the bottom of your top 20 list, or the bottom of all their songs?

Bottom of the list of all their songs.  Although, this doesn't take into consideration WDADU, as I don't think of DT beginning until after that one. Never got the fascination with ACOS.  Lyrically, I guess it's ok, but the singing is so god-awful that I just can't listen to it.  It kind of rambles on and on too.  Just not a good song to me. 

[Dublagent66]

I don't get how people don't realize that ACOS is a better song in every way.

Probably because most people are open minded enough to realize that music is subjective and your opinion isn't a matter of fact.

I've learned a lot about this concept in the past 4 1/2 years.  It's almost like people's different tastes in food.  Although, there is some comfort in knowing that a lot of people have similar tastes and sharing those similarities makes it all worth while.   

[theseoafs]

It would be slightly above TCOT and ACOS, so I guess third from the bottom.

Just so I'm clear, are you talking about the bottom of your top 20 list, or the bottom of all their songs?

Bottom of the list of all their songs.  Although, this doesn't take into consideration WDADU, as I don't think of DT beginning until after that one. Never got the fascination with ACOS.  Lyrically, I guess it's ok, but the singing is so god-awful that I just can't listen to it.  It kind of rambles on and on too.  Just not a good song to me.

[Syzzle]

It would be slightly above TCOT and ACOS, so I guess third from the bottom.

Just so I'm clear, are you talking about the bottom of your top 20 list, or the bottom of all their songs?

Bottom of the list of all their songs.  Although, this doesn't take into consideration WDADU, as I don't think of DT beginning until after that one. Never got the fascination with ACOS.  Lyrically, I guess it's ok, but the singing is so god-awful that I just can't listen to it.  It kind of rambles on and on too.  Just not a good song to me.

If Another World is awful singing then I'm curious what good singing is.

[orcus116]

I agree that ACOS vs. OV is not close.  The highs in A Change of Seasons are higher, the lyrics are better (easily the best Portnoy have ever written), it sounds far more original and unique (I agree that they definitely went overboard with the references/borrowing in OV), and it is simply a much better song, IMO.  A Change of Seasons grabs you from the get-go and is interesting as hell for the entire 23 plus minutes.  I cannot say that about Octavarium.

It also doesn't suffer from the "build-an-epic" songwriting, a huge plus.

[SeRoX]

beginning until after that one. Never got the fascination with ACOS.  Lyrically, I guess it's ok, but the singing is so god-awful that I just can't listen to it.  It kind of rambles on and on too.  Just not a good song to me.

[sfam2112]

I like it ok. Didn't really click at all until Score. It's far from my Top 20.

[Jaffa]

Never got the fascination with ACOS.  Lyrically, I guess it's ok, but the singing is so god-awful that I just can't listen to it.

...

Well.  Can't say I've heard that one before.

[Omega]

Octavarium not being in the top 20, let alone the top 10?


Blasphemy!

[snapple]

A Change of Seasons is one of Dream Theater's most emotionally moving songs they have ever created. I'm very thankful Mike was able to lend lyrics about his life to this song, and that James had the tact to sing it correctly. To think that James didn't absolutely slay this song is asinine. He's absolutely wonderful in it.

[King Postwhore]

A Change of Seasons is one of Dream Theater's most emotionally moving songs they have ever created. I'm very thankful Mike was able to lend lyrics about his life to this song, and that James had the tact to sing it correctly. To think that James didn't absolutely slay this song is asinine. He's absolutely wonderful in it.

I love the tune but I wouldn't say it's the most emotionally moving songs they have ever created.

[7StringedBeast]

Top song from them.  In fact, it still holds up the spot for what I think to be the best written song ever written.  Seriously, I think its just a perfectly awesome song.

[hefdaddy42]

Never got the fascination with ACOS.  Lyrically, I guess it's ok, but the singing is so god-awful that I just can't listen to it.  It kind of rambles on and on too.  Just not a good song to me.

I've heard of people not caring for the song, but I've never heard that given as a reason why.

[ZBomber]

One of my favorite DT songs and one of the few I still really enjoy when I listen to it.