The Shattered Fortress discussion thread

[Mr. Mackwo]

I thoroughly enjoyed this song from start to finish.  Reprising the themes from the previous songs seamlessly into the next.  I liked the vocal changes to the riffs we are so most familiar with. As stated above, i very much enjoyed the solos by JR and JP, although JR's is my favorite.  I got chills when they reprise the "Glass Prison" theme. I don't think this song is the best on the album, but it's a solid rocking tune that i think fans will enjoy hearing live.

-Mackwo

[Jamariquay]

At shows this tour when the band doesn't play the entire suite, it would make an awesome mini-suite if they played TGP with a little transition into TSF.  I would love to see something like that.

Perhaps even the other way round.. then the glass prison reprise can be the start of the glass prison (awsome transition!).. but i guess thats like saying "12 steps don't work".

Why not both? The entire show can consist of TGP and TSF looping endlessly, with a transitional piece that shall be known as "Relapse". We moooove in circlesssssss

I'm going to make this.



RIGHT NOW.

[tri.ad]

I think the "Now that you can see all you have done" section is absolutely beautiful. Such a great lyrical reprise to a kind of different musical "environment".

[antigoon]

I think the "Now that you can see all you have done" section is absolutely beautiful. Such a great lyrical reprise to a kind of different musical "environment".

Me too. I really like the "deep voice" as well and I think it's one of the more emotional moments on the album.

[Metropolis Pt. II]

Initially, I was disappointed that TSF wasn't a song with completely new ideas and riffs. It was more of an overture than a stand-alone song.
But then, while showing my younger brother TSF, I suddenly gained appreciation for it somehow. I'm not sure why, but it just clicked with me. Now I absolutely love it! 

[DeanTheater]

Initially, I was disappointed that TSF wasn't a song with completely new ideas and riffs. It was more of an overture than a stand-alone song.
But then, while showing my younger brother TSF, I suddenly gained appreciation for it somehow. I'm not sure why, but it just clicked with me. Now I absolutely love it! 

The use of familiar Riffs but with a more plodding Metal edge.  I love this song, it is diefferent but nostalgic as well. JP's sound is so crisp.

[Dream Team]

I think the "Now that you can see all you have done" section is absolutely beautiful. Such a great lyrical reprise to a kind of different musical "environment".

Me too. I really like the "deep voice" as well and I think it's one of the more emotional moments on the album.

I like that section, but actually feel like MP's normal voice would have been even better, and conveyed the necessary emotion better.

And I wish MP would get it that: JLB singing softly = automatic win . . . . JLB singing gruffly: hit-and-miss

[Jamesman42]

At shows this tour when the band doesn't play the entire suite, it would make an awesome mini-suite if they played TGP with a little transition into TSF.  I would love to see something like that.

Perhaps even the other way round.. then the glass prison reprise can be the start of the glass prison (awsome transition!).. but i guess thats like saying "12 steps don't work".

Why not both? The entire show can consist of TGP and TSF looping endlessly, with a transitional piece that shall be known as "Relapse". We moooove in circlesssssss

I'm going to make this.



RIGHT NOW.

[John]

Man it's going to be a real mindfuck for them trying to play this song when parts so similar enough to other songs they played so much

The Responsible part is so cool! holy shit. There's one horrible transition and one mediocre transition but the others are pretty natural and the individual parts are all great. This series, if they can actually pull it off, will be impossibly awesome live

[SnakeEyes]

I tried to give this song a chance.  I really did.  But, I personally think it's awful.  The song has absolutely no emotional impact on me whatsoever.  It's kind of just like.... "blah I know that song.... blah.... oh yeah, I know that song, too....blah..... yup, that's the other one I know, blah rinse, repeat for 12 minutes"

[CrimsonSunrise]

I've givien it a week to grow on me....but..... I dunno.  The only part I really like is the last part.. "I am Responsible"  everything else to me is decent re-hash.

[ZachyDou]

not really original
but a satisfying song anyways

[Zeltar]

You know, when I heard the part where James sings "Serenity now" the first thing I thought was "insanity later...".

Oh and I absolutely LOVE the last verse. And the way they closed it out, with the TGP intro reprise and the static. I can't think of a better way to end the 12 step suite.

[changing_seasons]

So I'm just surfing/doing random stuff while listening to BC&SL, and I'm currently at The Shattered Fortress. As I got to 10:29, the second part of the guitar solo, where the riff that's under the I am responsible part was introduced, it snapped me out of my relaxed state of mind and had me focus entirely on the music. It was amazing, and I don't think any song has made me react like that before. I'm starting to really love this song, and this whole album is moving closer to my number one spot with each listen. Incredible.

[DannyVaz]

I think the "Now that you can see all you have done" section is absolutely beautiful. Such a great lyrical reprise to a kind of different musical "environment".

Me too. I really like the "deep voice" as well and I think it's one of the more emotional moments on the album.

You didn't know that DT resurrected Barry White to do that part?

[RobertD]

Probably the weakest song on the album.  It seems kind of disjointed, and it doesn't flow as well as the other songs on the album.  I like the reuse of the lyrical melodies with different lyrics, but I was disappointed with the lack of NEW music.  Not a bad song, but it's definitely not as strong as the rest of the songs on the album in my opinion.

My thoughts excatly.

[Dream Team]

Anyone else think that the "whoas" are a lame way to end the saga? Wouldn't another intense scream of "Fly now be free" or something like that be more appropriate? After all, The Count of Tuscany also ends with "whoas" but they are much better.

[hefdaddy42]

Anyone else think that the "whoas" are a lame way to end the saga? Wouldn't another intense scream of "Fly now be free" or something like that be more appropriate? After all, The Count of Tuscany also ends with "whoas" but they are much better.

No, I like the "whoas".

[tri.ad]

I think the "whoas" end up a little anticlimactic. The build-up is nice, but it leaves behind some expectations. They still work very well.

[Mebert78]

So, I was listening to this song last night and I realized that the song ends with the sounds of of static from the record player that can be heard at the end of Scenes From a Memory and the start of "The Glass Prison."  I thought that was interesting.  Not sure if it had ever been pointed out before.  For the same sound to appear at the beginning of "The Glass Prison" (the suite's first song) and the ending of "The Shattered Fortress" (the suite's final song) is symbolic if you as me.  It's like saying that a person's battle with alcoholism is a neverending cycle and the steps must constantly be repeated over and over again.  It's not a one-time fix.  It's a neverending process.  Just a little detail that I thought was cool.

[Samsara]

So, I was listening to this song last night and I realized that the song ends with the sounds of of static from the record player that can be heard at the end of Scenes From a Memory and the start of "The Glass Prison."  I thought that was interesting.  Not sure if it had ever been pointed out before.  For the same sound to appear at the beginning of "The Glass Prison" (the suite's first song) and the ending of "The Shattered Fortress" (the suite's final song) is symbolic if you as me.  It's like saying that a person's battle with alcoholism is a neverending cycle and the steps must constantly be repeated over and over again.  It's not a one-time fix.  It's a neverending process.  Just a little detail that I thought was cool.

I'm shocked you never noticed that before. I heard it upon first listen and I also agree with your sentiment behind its meaning.

[Mebert78]

So, I was listening to this song last night and I realized that the song ends with the sounds of of static from the record player that can be heard at the end of Scenes From a Memory and the start of "The Glass Prison."  I thought that was interesting.  Not sure if it had ever been pointed out before.  For the same sound to appear at the beginning of "The Glass Prison" (the suite's first song) and the ending of "The Shattered Fortress" (the suite's final song) is symbolic if you as me.  It's like saying that a person's battle with alcoholism is a neverending cycle and the steps must constantly be repeated over and over again.  It's not a one-time fix.  It's a neverending process.  Just a little detail that I thought was cool.

I'm shocked you never noticed that before. I heard it upon first listen and I also agree with your sentiment behind its meaning.

Yea, never noticed it lol.  It took me a long time to warm up to the song.  It originally sounded too pieced together and medley-like to me.  But now I enjoy it a lot more and have been noticing it's subtleties.

[Samsara]

I actually agree with your initial take on the song...still. I think MP ran out of inspiration. Not a fan of this particular tune.

[lithium112]

I actually agree with your initial take on the song...still. I think MP ran out of inspiration. Not a fan of this particular tune.

I definitely got the same feeling on the first few listens of the song. However, I think it works very well in the context of the whole suite. My impression is that the song was written to have maximum effect when the suite was played in its entirety. When you hear all 5 parts back-to-back, TSF is like the final grand chorus, where they repeat all the motifs and themes of the piece.

Of course at this point it's questionable whether we'll get to experience that in a live setting or not, but... we can always hope.

[Samsara]

That's actually a damn good point. I'm probably the only DT fan on here that has NOT listened to the whole suite in order, as intended. I might have to try that and see if it changes my opinion. I just wasn't that much of a fan of the past few DT releases, and I think that probably just resulted in me not even bothering to listen to the suite as one whole piece.

I'll try it.

[Mebert78]

Somebody posted it on YouTube in its entirety.  It's 56 minutes.  Here's the link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhck33eDlcY

[Metropolis Pt. II]

Here's what REALLY bothers me about the song: "Fateful ascent through darkest fires. I've found the path to take me higher."
That lyric should not have a descending melody, but it does. It's talking about ascending and going higher, for crap's sake. Make the melody reflect the lyrics, damnit.

[SystematicThought]

Somebody posted it on YouTube in its entirety.  It's 56 minutes.  Here's the link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhck33eDlcY

Listening to the end of each song really makes me wish that they made them to transition into each other..(They flow together pretty smoothly, but not perfectly) but I know that would have been difficult to do. It's also interesting to hear how DT changed sonically over the decade and how they progressed with their music

[Jamesman42]

Anyone else think that the "whoas" are a lame way to end the saga? Wouldn't another intense scream of "Fly now be free" or something like that be more appropriate? After all, The Count of Tuscany also ends with "whoas" but they are much better.

No, I like the "whoas".

Me too, they're good, but:

I think the "whoas" end up a little anticlimactic. The build-up is nice, but it leaves behind some expectations. They still work very well.

This. It's awkward with the last "whoa." I don't know how they could have changed it, but at the same time, it almost leaves you hanging.

Maybe that's the point.

[Metropolis Pt. II]

Somebody posted it on YouTube in its entirety.  It's 56 minutes.  Here's the link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhck33eDlcY

Listening to the end of each song really makes me wish that they made them to transition into each other..(They flow together pretty smoothly, but not perfectly) but I know that would have been difficult to do. It's also interesting to hear how DT changed sonically over the decade and how they progressed with their music

My version of the 12-Step Suite flows perfectly together. DT definitely made each song able to transition into the next.

[Ħ]

I think this song is unjustifiably bashed.  This would make my top 30.  Only one slot below TGP.

[Scard]

Somebody posted it on YouTube in its entirety.  It's 56 minutes.  Here's the link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhck33eDlcY

Listening to the end of each song really makes me wish that they made them to transition into each other..(They flow together pretty smoothly, but not perfectly) but I know that would have been difficult to do. It's also interesting to hear how DT changed sonically over the decade and how they progressed with their music

I edited them all together and it worked perfectly; this guy is doin it wrong.

[Metropolis Pt. II]

Somebody posted it on YouTube in its entirety.  It's 56 minutes.  Here's the link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhck33eDlcY

Listening to the end of each song really makes me wish that they made them to transition into each other..(They flow together pretty smoothly, but not perfectly) but I know that would have been difficult to do. It's also interesting to hear how DT changed sonically over the decade and how they progressed with their music

I edited them all together and it worked perfectly; this guy is doin it wrong.

Exactly.

[IdoSC]

Talking about the "whoas", when I listened to the song for the first time, I was in the middle of it and I thought "damn, I bet a climactic Learning-to-Live-like finale will come in this song". In the end there were those "whoas"...that's nice, not too climactic though.

[Moonchild]

The strangest thing about the 12 step suite for me.. is how anticlimactic it is. I can't understand how could something that is good (being able to cope and pass your addictions) have such a heavy sound on the background. Repentance is the only "light" song of the suite and is depressing as hell.

I like making edit versions on audacity and I've just made a short version of the glass prison and the shattered fortress. after i'm done with those I'm gluing the suite.