Dream Theater Finishes Smoking Barbecue!! - Album in Food Warmer!

[TAC]

And I am glad they chose to utilize James to the fullest and not turn it in to a multi-vocalist album.

Amen, brother!

[Ninjabait]

I love JLB's performance on tA (seriously one of the best vocal performances on any album period), but I definitely wouldn't mind seeing it presented like a musical with different people singing the different roles too ngl. Not replacing his performance, but as a separate thing.

[TAC]

If they wanted to do some type of one off, then fine.

[Lethean]

Taking Lethean's side here. First off, who cares what it's called if the music is good. If it wasn't considered a "DT album" that would just mean we haven't had a proper DT album since 2013. And I am glad they chose to utilize James to the fullest and not turn it in to a multi-vocalist album.

Couldn't agree more.   

[Mosh]

The promotion for DT12 was perfect IMO. How we got semi-weekly behind the scenes videos leading up to the announcement that started vague and slowly became more revealing with little bits of music dropped in here and there.

[Herrick]

Don't forget Theresa on SFAM. That was a very cool guest appearance.

You don't need a prog dude as the guest star. Bring in someone totally different to add a new dimension to a song.

I always fast forward through that part of Through Her Eyes. Don't mind it so much on the other song.

[Madman Shepherd]

Taking Lethean's side here. First off, who cares what it's called if the music is good.

Well, I didn't think (most of) the music was good    This was just my personal opinion and in the end it doesn't matter much.  Astonishing was just really hard to swallow.  Others loved it which is great.  If everybody hated it then it would have been a waste so even though opinions appear to be relatively evenly divided, I'm sincerely happy people like it.  Selfishly, I would have loved for it to be called a little side project rather than this sort of weird album that in my opinion doesn't fit in with the rest of their catalog.  I also don't think DT should bow to the whim of one random dude or even dozens, hundreds, or thousands so as long as the next album kicks ass, I'm fine.

If it wasn't considered a "DT album" that would just mean we haven't had a proper DT album since 2013.

What's wrong with a 5 year break?









Too soon?

[Cool Chris]

Selfishly, I would have loved for it to be called a little side project rather than this sort of weird album that in my opinion doesn't fit in with the rest of their catalog.

Fair enough, but by "little side project" do you mean no tour? Just an album release? Because it would either have to be an album with no tour, which probably wouldn't have been financially feasible, of what we ended up with, which would have meant no "actual" DT activity for several years.

And it is never too soon for comments like that.

[PetFish]

No no no no no no no no.

The Astonishing is perhaps my favorite vocal performance ever and it wouldn't be nearly as good as it is with either of those two.  Both great singers, but no thanks.  If I wanted something like that, I bet I could find it on an Ayreon disc or two...

But they went through the effort to make a rock opera, right?  Two acts with an intermission.  Overtures for each act.  Many different characters with names and back stories and specific lyrics (dialog).  I really think they should have had different vocalists do the different parts, at the very least on the album itself, if it's too expensive to do it live every day then no big deal, then if they were going to film it have the individual characters for that show.

Why run the marathon and then bug-out near the end by *not* having different players voice each character?

Take a look at these multi-vocalist versions of:

Our New World:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eUh2DPe8CaM
A New Beginning:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FtpJfCKPlZs

Imagine how awesome The Astonishing would sound if they went with different vocalists.  These covers are amazing.

And let's not forget, but they did do a *real* version of Our New World with Lzzy Hale:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_m-NngPzJA which was probably a test to see how it would be received to see if they'd take it any further.

[TAC]

No no no no no no no no.

The Astonishing is perhaps my favorite vocal performance ever and it wouldn't be nearly as good as it is with either of those two.  Both great singers, but no thanks.  If I wanted something like that, I bet I could find it on an Ayreon disc or two...

But they went through the effort to make a rock opera, right?  Two acts with an intermission.  Overtures for each act.  Many different characters with names and back stories and specific lyrics (dialog).  I really think they should have had different vocalists do the different parts, at the very least on the album itself, if it's too expensive to do it live every day then no big deal, then if they were going to film it have the individual characters for that show.

Why run the marathon and then bug-out near the end by *not* having different players voice each character?

Take a look at these multi-vocalist versions of:

Our New World:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eUh2DPe8CaM
A New Beginning:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FtpJfCKPlZs

Imagine how awesome The Astonishing would sound if they went with different vocalists.  These covers are amazing.

And let's not forget, but they did do a *real* version of Our New World with Lzzy Hale:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_m-NngPzJA which was probably a test to see how it would be received to see if they'd take it any further.

Yes, Chego's videos are all kinds of awesome, but I'll take James singing Our New World any day of the week. The album proper should be James and James only. If they ever want to expand the production for a one off, or some sort of Vegas residency thing, then fine, have multiple vocalist. But this is a Dream Theater album.

[Adami]

I'd prefer multiple vocalists, personally. I know DT fans tend to be purists, but this seems like a good chance to try very new things, but sadly they greatly limited where they were willing to go.

Maybe if it had been a John Petrucci and Jordan Ruddess presents...kind of thing, the purist fans wouldn't be so angry at multiple vocalists.

Also the idea that because Ayreon does multiple vocalists, therefore Dream Theater isn't allowed to is just odd. It's like saying Dream Theater shouldn't write riffs that sound a bit like Metallica or Rush because those bands do that already.

[The Walrus]

I'd prefer multiple vocalists, personally. I know DT fans tend to be purists, but this seems like a good chance to try very new things, but sadly they greatly limited where they were willing to go.

Maybe if it had been a John Petrucci and Jordan Ruddess presents...kind of thing, the purist fans wouldn't be so angry at multiple vocalists.

Also the idea that because Ayreon does multiple vocalists, therefore Dream Theater isn't allowed to is just odd. It's like saying Dream Theater shouldn't write riffs that sound a bit like Metallica or Rush because those bands do that already.

Exactly! Ayreon better not make another album, 'cause Avantasia's already putting out a new one next year. 

[Lethean]

I'm not at all saying that Dream Theater isn't "allowed" to have multiple vocalists because Ayreon does.  What I am saying is that the album - in my opinion of course - would not be as good as it is had they done so.  I don't think that by not having multiple singers that they didn't go "all the way." They certainly did, and more singers aren't required to make the concept complete.

The Ayreon comment - had they used those particular vocalists, well, they'd still be "allowed" to do it, but it would certainly be reminiscent of Ayreon, especially with Anneke. I've seen her live, and I appreciate what she does, but James nailed that performance (studio and live), and it's better with him doing it.  I've also seen Devin, and I like him a lot, but again - same thing.  I'll take James as Lord Nafaryus any day.

If this makes me a Dream Theater purist, so be it.  I think it just makes me a fan of what James LaBrie did on that album.  In my opinion, he put everything into it and turned in the performance of a lifetime.  It's my favorite vocal performance period, and I wouldn't trade a second of it to have anyone else on that album - not even other favorite singers of mine, certainly not Anneke using too much vibrato while singing A Life Left Behind. 

If I ever for a second doubted the above feelings, any doubt was erased when they released that version with Lzzy Hale.  Don't mind them doing it as it's not on the album, but I wasn't a fan of her voice on it at all.

[Adami]

[The Walrus]

 

Hey, I agree. James did awesome. But if I had a choice between hearing James sing Faythe's parts and any female singer instead, I'm going with the female singer.  And if the late Chris Lee was still around, I'd TOTALLY want him doing Nafaryus's parts, now that I think about it.  #rhapsody

[Adami]

I will agree that I wouldn't want Anneke or Devin on the album, though I love them both.

[Lethean]

Hey, I agree. James did awesome. But if I had a choice between hearing James sing Faythe's parts and any female singer instead, I'm going with the female singer.  And if the late Chris Lee was still around, I'd TOTALLY want him doing Nafaryus's parts, now that I think about it.  #rhapsody

Should they have brought in a female singer for Goodnight Kiss too?









<no>

[The Walrus]

I dunno, I was 11 so I didn't know any good female singers at that age

[gzarruk]

I completely love TA the way it is, and it's James' vocal masterpiece indeed. However, it would've been really cool to have only one female singer doing all the female character parts, with James singing all the male character parts (which is most of the album, anyway). They could've chosen (pun intended) a very good female singer for the album and brought her with them on the tour, and it wouldn't have been like taking a whole cast or anything like that.

Back to the guest appearances thing on DT albums, I think it's a great idea if done right. The LITS thing with Dug Pinnick didn't work that well, but if we look at the others like Theresa Thomason on SFAM or Eugene Friesen playing cello on Vacant, they can help make the album better. Now, with DT14, I think they could add a couple extra elements like a female singer doing a duet with James on a song or bring in a couple instrumentalists that play different things and add new flavors to a song. Didn't the Dregs violinist play on TBOT? That's what I'm talking about.

[Ben_Jamin]

Theresa would've been perfect i think for Faythe.

But it was just a thought I had.

I fucking love the album immensely. Love James' vocals and his different styles for each character. Wish we got more Arabelle dialogue though, he used his nice warm somber style for her. And I find the buildup to "My Music Player" beautiful with JPs run. I dont have any problem with that lyric. I mean how else you gonna represent Faythes greatest gift of all.

[Lethean]

Theresa would've been perfect i think for Faythe.

But it was just a thought I had.

I fucking love the album immensely. Love James' vocals and his different styles for each character. Wish we got more Arabelle dialogue though, he used his nice warm somber style for her. And I find the buildup to "My Music Player" beautiful with JPs run. I dont have any problem with that lyric. I mean how else you gonna represent Faythes greatest gift of all.

I like the Arabelle voice too.    And I agree with you about the music player.  I thought it was kinda cheesy the first time I listened to it, and I get why people don't like it, but it does make sense.

[Cool Chris]

Also the idea that because Ayreon does multiple vocalists, therefore Dream Theater isn't allowed to is just odd.

Dream Theater is a band made up of 5 guys who have specific roles within the group, and have ever since their inception, allowing for the few changes made over the years. Ayreon is a musical project conceived and written by one individual, specifically designed to feature different musicians and vocalists.

[Adami]

Also the idea that because Ayreon does multiple vocalists, therefore Dream Theater isn't allowed to is just odd.

Dream Theater is a band made up of 5 guys who have specific roles within the group, and have ever since their inception, allowing for the few changes made over the years. Ayreon is a musical project conceived and written by one individual, specifically designed to feature different musicians and vocalists.

Indeed. So?

[Cool Chris]

Maybe I missed a post, but I wasn't aware anyone was making the argument you were arguing against. So I found your post a bit of a non-sequitur. Otherwise I agree with your statement. 

[Adami]

Maybe I missed a post, but I wasn't aware anyone was making the argument you were arguing against. So I found your post a bit of a non-sequitur. Otherwise I agree with your statement.

It was in response to the idea that DT shouldn't use multiple vocalists, and that if you want to hear an album with multiple vocalists, you should listen to Aryeon.

[Madman Shepherd]

Selfishly, I would have loved for it to be called a little side project rather than this sort of weird album that in my opinion doesn't fit in with the rest of their catalog.

Fair enough, but by "little side project" do you mean no tour? Just an album release? Because it would either have to be an album with no tour, which probably wouldn't have been financially feasible, of what we ended up with, which would have meant no "actual" DT activity for several years.

Well, I would have been ok with it being a "big side project" with a tour and all.  I'm well aware that the DT name made it much more financially feasible to pull something like that off but in my own perfect world it could have had the DT name in some fashion but since I see it more as "DTish," either way I wouldn't be *happy* with the break from what I consider normal DT records but I would have been more ok with it. 

I mean, it could have been done kind of like Metallica and Lou Reed's Lulu.  Not technically a Metallica album but still sort of a Metallica album.  Like that...except the Astonishing is better than Lulu.  See, even I don't hate TA *that* much to say it is on par or worse than Lulu. 

[Cool Chris]

Maybe I missed a post, but I wasn't aware anyone was making the argument you were arguing against. So I found your post a bit of a non-sequitur. Otherwise I agree with your statement.

It was in response to the idea that DT shouldn't use multiple vocalists, and that if you want to hear an album with multiple vocalists, you should listen to Aryeon.

Well yeah, that is not a good argument. What one band does shouldn't dictate what another band does. Nor should it dictate what a listener chooses to listen to.

[MirrorMask]

I think it all comes down to personal taste. Those who like The Astonishing are perfectly happy with it the way it is, and those who don't wish it to be more detached from DT's name, and so being so different to the point that becomes a "JP and JR presents" kind of thing and less of a "DT album" thing.

And The Astonishing is more in line with DT's previous output than Lulu is with Metallica's output. Imagine if "An evening with JP and JR" would have had vocal lines for James to sing, now THAT would have truly been a WTF (albeit beautiful) DT album if, released as such. The Astonishing is still Dream Theater, it's not that if it wasn't for James singing you could never ever tell it's JP and JR who wrote it.

[Fritzinger]

I think it all comes down to personal taste. Those who like The Astonishing are perfectly happy with it the way it is, and those who don't wish it to be more detached from DT's name, and so being so different to the point that becomes a "JP and JR presents" kind of thing and less of a "DT album" thing.

And The Astonishing is more in line with DT's previous output than Lulu is with Metallica's output. Imagine if "An evening with JP and JR" would have had vocal lines for James to sing, now THAT would have truly been a WTF (albeit beautiful) DT album if, released as such. The Astonishing is still Dream Theater, it's not that if it wasn't for James singing you could never ever tell it's JP and JR who wrote it.

And MP would have completely lost it 

[MirrorMask]

Hey, maybe that could have been the solution to the 2010 split. "ok, tell you what Mike, you stay in the band, but you simply don't do anything because we're gonna do a guitar / piano album" 

[mikeyd23]

Guys, guys, guys... No need to debate this, clearly the band should have released two versions of TA. The first being the version we all know with James singing all the parts. The second being a version with vocalists for each character. It would make like almost 5 hours of DT music. Win win.

[MirrorMask]

Guys, guys, guys... No need to debate this, clearly the band should have released two versions of TA. The first being the version we all know with James singing all the parts. The second being a version with vocalists for each character. It would make like almost 5 hours of DT music. Win win.

Additional bonus disc on the super deluxe edition: a disc of covers of what was on Faythe's music player 

[AngelBack]

Guys, guys, guys... No need to debate this, clearly the band should have released two versions of TA. The first being the version we all know with James singing all the parts. The second being a version with vocalists for each character. It would make like almost 5 hours of DT music. Win win.

Additional bonus disc on the super deluxe edition: a disc of covers of what was on Faythe's music player 

Sons of Sons of Sons of Sons of Apollo ?

[Zydar]

JM does a capella renditions of the NOMAC tracks.

[bosk1]

I like James doing all the vocal parts, and I feel like he knocked it out of the park.  I think there are some practical difficulties that present themselves if DT would have used guests.  If they used guests for only SOME of the characters, and had James play multiple ones, I think it would feel kind of strange.  And if they used guest vocalists and didn't have them on the tour, then THAT would have felt strange.  All in all, I really like the way they did it.  James' performance was fantastic. 

That said, if they had chosen to have different vocalists, I'm sure I would have enjoyed that too.  It sounds really cool on, say, Avantasia's stuff.  I'm sure DT would have made it sound amazing with multiple vocalists had they chosen to go that direction.