Important clarifying point: this is NOT the same thing as your favorite DT songs, or the songs you consider their best. I'm talking about songs that you wouldn't change a single note or section. Example: A Change of Seasons is my fave DT song, but there are a couple of minor parts that I don't think are great or are sub-par. Overture 1928 on the other hand, to me is perfect and I wouldn't change a single thing from beginning to end.
DT songs I consider perfect:
Afterlife (Score version)
Surrounded
Metropolis
Under a Glass Moon
Wait for Sleep
Voices
Lifting Shadows off a Dream
Overture 1928
Fatal Tragedy
One Last Time
Blind Faith
so yeah, no "perfect" songs since 6 Degrees
Top 10 DT songs that (to me) aren't quite perfect:
Octavarium (I could do without the "don't forget we're a heavy band" section known as Intervals)
Learning to Live ("No more to give" through first half of 2nd verse "Listening to the city . . . " is the only weak part of the song)
A Change of Seasons (a couple parts in the instrumental sections could be trimmed)
The Count of Tuscany (the "I" part of the chorus, MP vocals)
The Best of Times (Labrie's vocals in the verses don't work for me)
In the Name of God (too many chorusesmake make the song drag a little)
What DT songs (if any) do you consider perfect?
Metropolis (one of the best songs of all time)
Ministry of lost souls
A Change of seasons
Octavarium
Scarred
None, but I doubt perfection is achievable in a song. One can always imagine better if you try.
Quote from: yorost on August 12, 2010, 10:49:16 AM
None, but I doubt perfection is achievable in a song. One can always imagine better if you try.
Pretty much that. Except by the definition of "songs where you wouldn't change a thing", then all of them. The band or artist writes the song, and if I like it great, and if not then oh well. The whole idea of changing something is pretty meaningless really.
I agree with the additions made by ariich.
Agreed with ariich. Those who imagined better became bands like Circus Maximus for example.
Quote from: Ben_Jamin on August 12, 2010, 11:32:11 AM
Agreed with ariich. Those who imagined better became bands like Circus Maximus for example.
I just threw up a little bit in my mouth.
That they imagined better doesn't mean they succeeded.
Quote from: hefdaddy42 on August 12, 2010, 02:14:58 PM
Quote from: Ben_Jamin on August 12, 2010, 11:32:11 AM
Agreed with ariich. Those who imagined better became bands like Circus Maximus for example.
I just threw up a little bit in my mouth.
A vurp? :lol
Quote from: ariich on August 12, 2010, 10:58:02 AM
Quote from: yorost on August 12, 2010, 10:49:16 AM
None, but I doubt perfection is achievable in a song. One can always imagine better if you try.
Pretty much that. Except by the definition of "songs where you wouldn't change a thing", then all of them. The band or artist writes the song, and if I like it great, and if not then oh well. The whole idea of changing something is pretty meaningless really.
Well, that thread was wrapped up quite nicely.
Well done, ariich.
He defined perfect as a song you wouldn't change a note in. I understand that it's the artists' output and and it's what they gave us, but I agree with the OP that there are songs that imo, are just perfect in themselves. Or something.
Anyway:
Metropolis
A Change of Seasons
Hell's Kitchen
The Glass Prison
Endless Sacrifice
Octavarium
The Count of Tuscany
Surrounded
Learning to Live
Scarred
Trial of Tears
A Change of Seasons
Fatal Tragedy
Blind Faith
These Walls
[The Best of Times solo]
The Count of Tuscany
Basically there's at least one on every album except WDADU and SC
EDIT: The Spirit Carries On
*sigh* This is impossible to do off the top of my head. Okay, here goes for all songs that are either perfect, or have a few parts that keep them from being perfect. So...
Pull Me Under - perfect
Take The Time - suffers only because of some lyrics here and there
Metropolis - Part I "The Miracle And The Sleeper" - perfect
Under A Glass Moon - perfect
Wait For Sleep - perfect
Learning To Live - perfect
6:00 - perfect
Erotomania - perfect
Voices - perfect
The Mirror - perfect
Lie - perfect
Lifting Shadows Off A Dream - perfect
Scarred - perfect
A Change of Seasons – near perfect. Sometimes, the instrumental sections seem just a tad overlong, but other times, they feel like they are just right
New Millennium - perfect
Peruvian Skies - perfect
Lines In The Sand - perfect
Just Let Me Breathe - perfect
Anna Lee - perfect
Trial Of Tears - perfect
Regression - perfect
Overture 1928 - perfect
Strange Déjà vu - perfect
Through My Words - perfect
Fatal Tragedy - perfect
Beyond This Life - perfect
Through Her Eyes - perfect
Home – unnecessary porn keeps this from being perfect
The Sprit Carries On - perfect
Finally Free - perfect
The Glass Prison – the repetitive heavy riffing section goes on about 45 seconds too long
Misunderstood – outro is too long
The Great Debate - perfect
Disappear - perfect
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence – Overture is a bit too long, and the first half of Goodnight Kiss feels like too abrupt a shift in energy, too long, and too soft
This Dying Soul – The "Blackened" part suddenly makes a very serious, very dark song sound silly. If not for that part, this would be one of DT's top songs.
Endless Sacrifice – the instrumental section just kills an otherwise very good song.
Vacant - perfect
Stream Of Consciousness - perfect
In The Name Of God - perfect
The Root Of All Evil - perfect
These Walls - perfect
I Walk Beside You - perfect
Panic Attack - perfect
Never Enough - perfect
Sacrificed Sons - perfect
Octavarium - perfect
In The Presence of Enemies – instrumental section is too long and too all over the place
Forsaken - perfect
Constant Motion - perfect
The Dark Eternal Night - perfect
Repentance – a great idea, but given how one-dimensional the song is, it is just too long and repetitive
The Ministry of Lost Souls – the instrumental section sounds completely out of place
A Nightmare To Remember – the "roar" at the end of Mike's vocal sectionkills the killer mood he had just set, and the instrumental portion that follows feels unnecessary and overdone. Otherwise, the song would be perfect.
A Rite of Passage – perfect
Wither – perfect
The Shattered Fortress – the Repentence reprise is too long and is unnecessary. The "take all of me" TROAE reprise simultaneously feels epic and forced. The song would be top notch if these two parts didn't cross the line into reprise hell.
The Count of Tuscany – the volume swell part is just too long to be smack dab in the middle of the song. Otherwise, flawless.
Surrounded
The Silent Man
6:00
Voices
Blind Faith
Constant Motion
Vacant
Metropolis
Erotomania
Trial of Tears (probably gonna be disagreed with here)
Fatal Tragedy
Overture 1928
The Dance of Eternity
Thats pretty much it for me, Octavarium is close but the Full Circle section I could do without
Quote from: Ben_Jamin on August 12, 2010, 11:32:11 AM
Agreed with ariich. Those who imagined better became bands like Circus Maximus for example.
LOL
Anyway, I'm just going to make this easy and say "most of Images and Words + Awake".
A Change of Season = First section repeats the riff too much
Glass Prison = Instrumental should have ended around 12:00 or so, too many repeats
Six Degrees = Overture should have ended at 6:00, Test Stumped instrumental is too long and boring, Goodnight Kiss first half is too soft, Losing Time and Grand Finale are too slow
Finally Free = I don't like that all the song's original melodies or riffs are never referenced earlier in the album
Only a Matter of Time = the intro cymbals sound awful
Stream of Consciousness = Middle slow section is boring
Octavarium = First section is who cares
Count of Tuscany = Heavy section is cheesy
Perfect songs would be Surrounded and Metropolis.
More complaints from wasp2020:
Trial of Tears - It should have been called "It's Raining"
Scarred - LaBrie should have held the note at the end of: "IT CALMS TO ME TO KNOW THAT I WOOOOON'T" for 0.3 seconds longer
New Millennium - This was released before the year 2000.
One Last Time - This should have been the closing track on SFAM because it has "Last" in the title
Misunderstood - The title makes it sound like a Pink song
Metropolis is the only perfect song in DT's catalog, reasonable instrumental wanking ratio, great arrangement and structure, awesome music and the song doesn't overstay it's welcome by a second, there's nothing else by DT I can describe as so.
I might add a few notes to PMU... :neverusethis:
I don't get it.
Sarcasm
all of I&W and Awake
A Change of Seasons
Peruvian Skies
Most of SFAM
Blind Faith
Disappear
Vacant
In the Name of God
I Walk Beside You
Wither
Quote from: ? on August 13, 2010, 04:55:58 AM
all of I&W and Awake
A Change of Seasons
Peruvian Skies
Most of SFAM
Blind Faith
Disappear
Vacant
In the Name of God
I Walk Beside You
Wither
Really?
Quote from: zxlkho on August 13, 2010, 05:02:19 AM
Quote from: ? on August 13, 2010, 04:55:58 AM
all of I&W and Awake
A Change of Seasons
Peruvian Skies
Most of SFAM
Blind Faith
Disappear
Vacant
In the Name of God
I Walk Beside You
Wither
Really?
I wouldn't change anything about those songs, so yes. They are perfect as they are.
By any definition, Wither is one of DT's strongest contenders for a perfect song.
I would agree if it weren't for the cheesy lyrics.
I completely disagree with "I Walk Beside You" though.
Take the Time is as perfect as a song can get. Just perfect.
Learning To Live is as perfect as it gets.
I really don't think I could call any of their songs perfect. Basically every song in general has parts that I like more than other parts, therefore they wouldn't be perfect. I can't think of a DT song where I like all parts absolutely equal. I always say things like "They should repeat that part," or "That part should be shorter/longer." etc.
Seeing some of you posting I Walk Beside You, I would definitely agree with you if it weren't for the part in the chorus we're he sings "I walk beside you" and ends the "you" with a cracked voice. Other than that, perfect song.
I Walk Beside You is a great song, I don't get all the hate. Well, actually, I DO get the hate... but it's undeserved.
Learning To Live really is a strong contender for a perfect song.
Also, To Live Forever.
Pull Me Under a Glass Prison Moon
Quote from: zxlkho on August 13, 2010, 05:35:22 AM
I would agree if it weren't for the cheesy lyrics.
Wtf, the lyrics are one of the songs greatest assets. Very heartfelt and honest.
I was there the first time ariich ever listened to the song, and I remember the very moment it was over, he picked up the lyrics sheet, pointed at it, and said "I'm sexin' you later."
Learning To Live is probably the only song of theirs I'd consider perfect.
Quote from: ariich on August 13, 2010, 10:24:31 AM
Quote from: zxlkho on August 13, 2010, 05:35:22 AM
I would agree if it weren't for the cheesy lyrics.
Wtf, the lyrics are one of the songs greatest assets. Very heartfelt and honest.
I dunno I can't help but think of "bland" when describing Wither, especially the lyrics. True they're heartfelt but Petrucci picked the most obvious words and I don't think they do the song any favors after one or two listens.
Yep. Exactly what orcus116 said.
Quote from: bösk1 on August 13, 2010, 10:59:43 AM
I was there the first time ariich ever listened to the song, and I remember the very moment it was over, he picked up the lyrics sheet, pointed at it, and said "I'm sexin' you later."
That's when this was taken:
(https://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r243/ariich/me/sexinyoulater.jpg)
I just read through the thread now so I'm sorry I'm just commenting on the OP now, but:
Quote from: Dream Team on August 12, 2010, 10:37:54 AM
Top 10 DT songs that (to me) aren't quite perfect:
Octavarium (I could do without the "don't forget we're a heavy band" section known as Intervals)
The song is supposed to be a crescendo. What the hell is the point if the song doesn't, you know, get bigger as it goes? That's what a crescendo is! Octivarium wouldn't be anywhere near as good if it didn't build up to that moment.
All of IaW is perfect for me, at least compositionally (damned drum tracks), but I have to make a shout-out to LtL and Metropolis. Two of my favourite songs of all time, the latter being no1 without question. On Awake there aren't any, on FII there's ToT, on SFAM there's Finally Free, on SDOIT there aren't any, on ToT there's ITNOG, on 8V there's the title track, on SC there aren't any, and on BCSL there aren't any.
And ACoS.
To Me:
Images and Words
Scenes From a Memory
Octavarium (the song)
Wither
Honor Thy Father
Six Degrees of the Inner Turbulence (the song)
That's it. The rest has parts that I either find boring, don't like, can't stand, need a beer to get through, or etc.
Metropolis
Take The Time
Learning To Live
Overture 1928/Strange Deja Vu
Misunderstood
Octavarium
Quote from: tri.ad on August 13, 2010, 07:15:46 AM
Learning To Live really is a strong contender for a perfect song.
Also, To Live Forever.
Exactly this.
Innocence Faded
Erotomania
Lines In The Sand
Trial of Tears
The Dance Of Eternity
The Spirit Carries On
Finally Free
The Glass Prison
The Great Debate
Disappear
About To Crash
About To Crash (Reprise)
Endless Sacrifice
The Root Of All Evil
The Shattered Fortress
6:00
Wither
The Best Of Times
A Change Of Seasons
Lines In The Sand
Metropolis
The Glass Prison
Blind Faith
Home
Fatal Tragedy
The Spirit Carries On
Enemies Part 1
As I Am
In The Name Of God
I'm gonna get flammed, but I don't care.
The Ministry of Lost Souls
I agree with you! That song is perfection!
All of I&W
To Live Forever
6:00
SDV
Innocence Faded
LSOAD
Eve
AcoS
Hell's kitchen
LITS
TOT
SFAM
Blind Faith
Solitary Shell Instrumental section
Nothing since has been perfect, but TBOT comes close.
By my vague intuition:
Surrounded
Metropolis Pt.1
Voices
Hell's Kitchen
Overture 1928
Disappear
So nothing after 6DoIT, although I like those albums a lot.
I Forgot about Surrounded. Makes it sad that their best lyrics writer left.
Surrounded.
All their epics are perfect IMO
Quote from: ? on August 13, 2010, 04:55:58 AM
all of I&W and Awake
A Change of Seasons
Peruvian Skies
Most of SFAM
Blind Faith
Disappear
Vacant
In the Name of God
I Walk Beside You
Wither
Damn, I forgot To Live Forever ('94)! The Root of All Evil is excellent too.
Surrounded is the only perfect DT song, IMO.
Some others come close, but none as complete as Surrounded.
I'd even go as far to say it's DT's best song.
Quote from: InTheNameOfGod on August 20, 2010, 05:41:21 AM
Surrounded is the only perfect DT song, IMO.
Some others come close, but none as complete as Surrounded.
I'd even go as far to say it's DT's best song.
Using the purest definition of the word "song", you could be right.
The Great Debate -
Every section is solid on its own, and matches perfectly with the lyrics' theme.