DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY

[Dedalus]

Well, I only thought the last two were terrible. But as long as Mike is jazzed to be back in the band, I think it should make the next album really exciting.

Well, Octavarium isn't really horrible, as the title track is spectacular.

But the other three are really terrible.

[jammindude]

Well, I only thought the last two were terrible. But as long as Mike is jazzed to be back in the band, I think it should make the next album really exciting.

Well, Octavarium isn't really horrible, as the title track is spectacular.

But the other three are really terrible.

I've been a fan boy since October 1992 and I can easily say that Octavarium is my number one favorite complete album by the band. All killer no filler.

And Train of Thought is exactly what it is supposed to be. It's just a nonstop metal classic. When I'm in the mood for that, I love it.

[KevShmev]

Eh, I don't think DT has ever made a terrible album.  Some are obviously better than the others, but the ones I could consider the least best (SC, BC&SL, DT12) are still good records with plenty to like.

[MrMike]

The more I think about JLB's declaration of this being the final DT lineup, it makes me think they've either set the definite end point for the band (hopefully several years away) OR they made a pact that if ANY member leaves and the other 4 carry on, it won't be called Dream Theater (I could see MP especially pushing for this).

[jammindude]

The more I think about JLB's declaration of this being the final DT lineup, it makes me think they've either set the definite end point for the band (hopefully several years away) OR they made a pact that if ANY member leaves and the other 4 carry on, it won't be called Dream Theater (I could see MP especially pushing for this).

If it weren't a statement that had already been repeated, I would agree with you.

[Dedalus]

First I would argue that four of those albums are definitely not "terrible". Secondly, I don't think we should assume anything about where they will go musically.  There's been a 13 year gap. These people
Have changed and evolved for 13 years.

Fair point.

[BlobVanDam]

I never in my life thought I'd see the day, and thought this was a joke when I first saw it posted somewhere. Very pleasantly surprised though! I knew that things had improved a little bit between MP and the rest of the band, but I didn't know this was even a possibility. Doesn't even feel like that long ago we were shocked by MP's departure.

I didn't listen to the last album beyond the singles, and the one before that I listened to once, so this definitely renews my interest in the band. While there's plenty I enjoy from the MM era, there's just something about that dynamic with MP that I've missed in recent times.

[King Postwhore]

Blob!!!!  Miss you bro!  Great to see you!

[jammindude]

BLOB!!!!

[TheHoveringSojourn808]

WHO ARE YOU!!!!

but also hi

[porcacultor]

I don't think I've seen anyone bring this up, so...

I wonder if we'll get some medleys in the setlist again...

[kiwiclapton]

Welcome back Mike .
Thanks for the Winery Dogs material you did too !

[The Letter M]

I don't think I've seen anyone bring this up, so...

I wonder if we'll get some medleys in the setlist again...

John - Mike, come back to DT.
Portnoy - Only if we can do medleys again...
John - ...
Mike - I'll buy your beard oil.
John - Deal.

-Marc.

[LCArenas]

My concern is that the JLB/JM/JP/JR/MP line-up recorded six albums, the first two excellent and the last four terrible.
It doesn't seem like an exciting line-up to me.

But it may be different now.

First I would argue that four of those albums are definitely not “terrible”. Secondly, I don’t think we should assume anything about where they will go musically.  There’s been a 13 year gap. These people have changed and evolved for 13 years.

I agree. I feel Portnoy is a guy who shifts his inspiration to write new music from time to time. I feel that back in 2007-11 he was really influenced by Heavy Metal (Gigantour, Adrenaline Mob, A7X) and it showed in Systematic Chaos and BC&SL. It's different now that he's Released stuff with the Neal Morse Band more recently. I'm quite excited to see what he brings to the band in terms of sound and song composition after 13 years.

I just realized as well that I know next to nothing about MP's projects as of right now apart from DT, LTE and the Neal Morse Band.

[Zook]

Holy shit, Blob is back. All these familiar faces coming back to DTF because of Portnoy's return. Next thing we know DTF and 5/8 will merge back into DT.net!

[Grizz]

I love moments like this, when something spurs old heads reunite on a forum
For a moment, the internet is fun again

[Weymolith]

Holy shit, Blob is back. All these familiar faces coming back to DTF because of Portnoy's return. Next thing we know DTF and 5/8 will merge back into DT.net!

[hefdaddy42]

I never in my life thought I'd see the day, and thought this was a joke when I first saw it posted somewhere. Very pleasantly surprised though! I knew that things had improved a little bit between MP and the rest of the band, but I didn't know this was even a possibility. Doesn't even feel like that long ago we were shocked by MP's departure.

I didn't listen to the last album beyond the singles, and the one before that I listened to once, so this definitely renews my interest in the band. While there's plenty I enjoy from the MM era, there's just something about that dynamic with MP that I've missed in recent times.

Great to see you, old friend!

[BlobVanDam]

Aw you guys 

Reaper forced me here

[Dream Team]

Blob AND Indiscipline. Wow does MP have clout.

[Jamesman42]

Aw you guys 

Reaper forced me here

GET THE MUDCAKES OUT

[Weymolith]

This is total class right here. On MP's post about rejoining DT.

[King Postwhore]

Aw you guys 

Reaper forced me here

Forced what?  Lol. Tee hee.

[hefdaddy42]

This is total class right here. On MP's post about rejoining DT.

[LCArenas]

This is total class right here. On MP's post about rejoining DT.

What a good sport MM is. And what a beast of a drummer, too. Wish him the best in all his future projects.

[TheBarstoolWarrior]

As one of Mangini's more ardent supporters, obviously I am extremely disappointed by the decision. I've said a few times I think the MM era produced some of the best DT music and reinvigorated my interest in the band. I am going into DT16 with an open mind and I feel like it'll be a great album because the band may feel like there is something to prove now, but I cannot escape my deeply felt preference for MM's more technical and sophisticated style of drumming and orchestration.

A few random thoughts and opinions on the issue:

1. Mangini got let go. We don't need to go through a grammatical analysis of what he released but it is extremely clear that it was a decision made for him. I understand there is more to uncover, but unless something comes out that contradict's 'DT's decision to get MP back at this time' or his reminder to everyone that from day one he was never going to be what MP was to the band, the most straight forward reading of his statement is 'I got fired.' He got let go in the absence of any contradictory information from the horses' mouths.

2. It was a business decision. From day 1 on this board fans were noticing that the DreamSonic attendance and enthusiasm was dismal. Initially I was reluctant to accept the tour was poorly attended until it was complete but it became obvious from eye witness testimony that as the concert went on, people were not happy or willing to put their money down. I was personally happy about my experience but I can't deny that so many outspoken fans did not like the setlist, the performance of some members, or the alleged predictability of the DT shows as of late.

I saw a very cynical post on another outlet that said this was a 'desperate attempt at a money grab' and while I do NOT agree with the tone of that, I do suspect this was meant to be a shot of adrenaline into an act that is declining in popularity as of late. Obviously I do not have the sales numbers, but the reality is that in business you don't make changes to your personnel when everything is going great. You make changes when things are not going well. Hence, if there was no personal conflict there is literally no reason to rock the boat unless you think it needs to be. After over a decade and 5 albums it wasn't a 'fit' or work ethic issue. But the grumblings were getting louder. As you can see on social media outlets, the overwhelming response to this is one of nostalgic bliss. This announcement created a ton of positive buzz around DT and the next album and tour are going to be hyped.

In my opinion, to the extent that fans were unhappy and unmotivated by the setlist, poor vocal performances, lack of fan engagement, or even the songwriting (all things that were brought up on this forum), that is John Petrucci's responsibility. He was the one who spearheaded the setlist; he is the one who refuses to do anything about the vocal performances; he is the one who as the leader of the band cannot fill MP's shoes on fan engagement. He did not hire MM to do any of those jobs, as was made clear from day one. Am I saying he is throwing MM under the bus? No. But I do think the growing feeling was that something was missing, it was showing up in the sales numbers, and he needed to do something to energize the fans.

3. MP in DT in 2023 will not be the same as MP in DT in 2009. I don't think MP is going to come in and pick up where he left off. I don't expect to hear any vocal backing tracks stepping all over JLB or any public criticisms regardless of how bad things get. What I expect to hear is his straight-forward rock drumming style with his signature fills and patterns. Just my opinion, but the drums will be less interesting now. Also they're still going to play MM-era songs, including their one and only grammy win, but things just won't be the same. MP cannot physically execute a faithful rendition of MM-era songs like the Alien, and he would be the first to tell you that.

5. DT is not done any time soon. I don't think this means there has been some discussion about the end. I think the guys love what they do and this was only meant to address the business side of things and try to set things on a better path for the long haul.

6. This change does not necessarily fix the issues people were complaining about in the last couple years. It probably fixes the fan engagement aspect of things because MP is so involved with the fans, but it does nothing to address the volatile vocal performances that were so widely criticized here. I don't think the band has committed to rotating setlists (something JP was free to continue in MP's absence if he wanted) so that part remains to be seen. If the song writing was bothering people, that is mainly JP and JR so unless those two are going to start changing their approach, I doubt we'll hear anything substantially different on DT16.

Nostalgia is a powerful thing but my personal opinion is that we traded a hell of a lot of technical prowess and sophistication in the drum department for a lot of feel-good vibes. I've heard what MP has to say on drums and I love the side projects that he did. But for DT, I think we've returned to a much smaller world of rhythmic possibilities at a time when we could use more.

[wolfking]

This is total class right here. On MP's post about rejoining DT.

What a good sport MM is. And what a beast of a drummer, too. Wish him the best in all his future projects.

I mean, what other options does he have?  Say nothing I guess but even if he's salty AF, putting something like this out there regardless of what he thinks simply does him no harm.  He still needs to progress his career and this is a move that can only help.

[TAC]

Love your post BS!

... we traded a hell of a lot of technical prowess and sophistication in the drum department for a lot of feel-good vibes.

I think this was always the crux of the MP/MM comparisons to begin with. I don't think you meant drumming wise, but still..


I pretty much agree though with all you posted.

[KevShmev]

I agree with much of his post as well, but I don't care about having maximum technical prowess.  Portnoy will be just fine, and he will be able to play any Mangini songs just fine (one doesn't have to play someone else's parts at the same technical level for it to be good), so I am not worried at all about the band's playing.  Good songs and melodies are always more important, even with Dream Theater, so as long as they keep writing good songs with good melodies, their playing will be just fine and more than good enough.

[Zook]

Even though he already did it with other musicians, I hope we get the 12 Step suite live with DT proper.

[kaos2900]

Well, this shocked me just as it did everyone else. I've been in training all day but my buddy texted me the news and I immediately had to run to the bathroom to read a little more. Reminds me a lot of when Bruce & Adrian came back to Iron Maiden. Great for the band and the fans.

After processing this for most of the afternoon I'm still excited and happy to (hopefully) get to see MP in DT again. I'm excited that the best version of the band will close out their career. I'm excited to see MP play some of the MM songs. I'm excited for MP to inject some new energy into the DT writing machine. I really enjoyed D/T and it's probably my favorite of the MM albums but AVFTOW was a pretty big meh for me. It didn't connect with me all and I still have a hard time remembering any of the songs.

That all being said, this is going to be different from the glory days. It's hard to explain to people who weren't there just how freaking awesome it was to be a fan of DT specifically due to the fan service that MP. I have NO expectations that DT is going to become MP's baby again. There are a lot of things that we'll have to wait and see how the chips fall, but I don't think it will go back to the way it used to be.

I also want to echo what other's have said about being sad/disappointed/etc. I feel like that too and for me it's around thinking "what could have been" over the last 14 years. I get they needed a break and it was all needed, but the DT that I was a 100% fan boy of died the day MP left. It's great that he's back, but again it's still not the same for me. Also, 14 years is a LONG time. I remember the day MP quit vividly because of how much it impacted me. 14 years ago I wasn't married, didn't have kids, was at the start of my career, and countless other life experiences that have changed me. Hell I'm almost 40 now. Hard to say if I'd still be as passionate about the band if MP never left due to changing life priorities but I like to think I would.

This is still going to be great for the band financially and for the fans to close out their career. Even if we get only one more album and an album/farewell tour cycle I'd be happy with that. I don't see getting more than a couple of albums but who knows. My biggest wish would be a final amazing 4k concert recording with commentary!

Welcome back MP and Thank you MM!

[Bluefish]

Interesting note by JLB saying this is the "final incarnation of DT " I know they are getting up there in age, so maybe this is going to be the last few rounds for them or recording and touring. 

Also wondering what happened to MM.  From the vague wording, it almost sounds to me like they asked him if he wanted out for MP to rejoin.  I'm clearly guessing here.  Hoping it's a positive ending because MM didn't deserve to be forced out.

James also once said that he thought Mike Mangini would be in the band until they were done.  My guess is that they'll keep going as long as they able to and are enjoying it.

I also didn't see this coming.  I wonder if and when the story will come out

[TAC]

I wonder if and when the story will come out

I mean, the story is pretty obvious, no?

[JustJen]

Aw you guys 

Reaper forced me here

Well I'll be dammed. BlobVanDammed.

[TheBarstoolWarrior]

We are not likely to get any further information unless MM decides to say how the call went. The band is going to be asked about this and I would expect that in typical JP form, he will be very cordial and guarded with his response. He isn't going to say the View and DreamSonic sales were weak or that MP is going to get people excited again when they were getting bored. He is going to say something like 'we are childhood friends and we just felt like the time was right to get back together.'