Do you think it was disrespectful of DT to play A Change of Seasons last tour?

[Rammstein]

I searched if this topic was discussed before, but couldn't find anything. sorry if I just missed it.

As we all know, DT played ASOS at the Images & Word and beyond tour. A song, that fit in perfectly, because it was intended to include it in I&W. And of course, because it is fan favorite and considered to be a top 3 track for a lot of fans. It is a classic. But it is also a very personal song for MP (lyrics about his mother dying in a plane crash). The interview he did during his Shattered Fortress tour made it clear, how beaten he was that they played it.

Do you think DT should have known that and should have not included ASOS in the setlist (and played Octavarium instead for example)

[bosk1]

No, there is absolutely nothing inappropriate about them playing it.  It is a Dream Theater song, a fan favorite, and one that is extremely relevant to the era they were celebrating.  It is part of the Images and Words session and should have been played.  There isn't a good argument to the contrary.

[Samsara]

Last I checked, "A Change of Seasons" is a Dream Theater song, released by them. Not sure why its disrespectful. It's their song. Portnoy wrote the lyrics to it, and they are personal to him. So what?

Personally, I think MP made an error just not playing it with his Shattered Fortress project. Who cares if DT did it.

But disrespectful on DT's part by playing their own song? No.

Damn it bosk1. LOL

[Dedalus]

No, there is absolutely nothing inappropriate about them playing it.  It is a Dream Theater song, a fan favorite, and one that is extremely relevant to the era they were celebrating.  It is part of the Images and Words session and should have been played.  There isn't a good argument to the contrary.

This.

Last I checked, "A Change of Seasons" is a Dream Theater song, released by them. Not sure why its disrespectful. It's their song. Portnoy wrote the lyrics to it, and they are personal to him. So what?

Personally, I think MP made an error just not playing it with his Shattered Fortress project. Who cares if DT did it.

But disrespectful on DT's part by playing their own song? No.

Damn it bosk1. LOL

This, part II.

[Rammstein]

I agree with this. But I still was interested in the common opinion.

[Madman Shepherd]

Not in the slightest. Mike did such a good job writing the lyrics that even though it is based on his own personal tragedy, the song is about tragedy in general and seizing the day. Universal themes that appeal to wide swaths of people.

[Lethean]

Agreed with all of the above.

[pg1067]

The interview he did during his Shattered Fortress tour made it clear, how beaten he was that they played it.

Do you think DT should have known that and should have not included ASOS in the setlist (and played Octavarium instead for example)

Just for the sake of clarity, here's what MP said:  "I'm not going to be able to play 'A Change of Seasons,' which I had intended on making the encore. That was the first song I ever wrote the lyrics to in Dream Theater; and, as I mentioned earlier, it was written about my mom dying in a plane crash. It's an incredibly, incredibly personal song to me and it breaks my heart that Dream Theater are playing it on their current tour without me. Once I heard that they were performing it, that pretty much scratched it off my set list because I don't want to be doing it now because they are. I had to choose some other songs instead."  http://spotlightreport.net/music/interview-mike-portnoy-announces-shattered-fortress-australian-tour

I was unaware that he had said this until reading your post and googling to find this interview, and I find it odd that you're raising this issue nearly two years after the interview and over 14 months after the I&W&B tour concluded.

As for MP's comments, the statements that he was "not going to be able to play" ACOS and that he "had to choose some other songs instead" were false.  He most certainly was able to play ACOS and did not have to choose other songs.  It was a choice that he made.  "I don't want to play it because they're playing it" is rather juvenile.

He claimed to have been heartbroken that DT did the song without him.  However, during that 14+ month period at least two documented gatherings between MP and JP and at least one between MP and JR occurred.  By all accounts, those gatherings were beyond cordial.  Since it is (I think) reasonable to assume that JP is (and since MP left has been) the primary set list creator for DT, it seems that any problem MP had with this is now forgotten.

Getting back to your two questions:

1. Should DT have known that it was going to bother MP if they played ACOS?  I haven't the slightest idea.  Would it surprise me if, during the various dealings that occurred between JP/JM/JLB/JR and MP and their lawyers after MP left the band, MP expressed a desire that DT not play certain songs?  No, but again, I have no way of knowing if DT "should have known" that MP would be bothered.

2. Do I think that DT "should have not included ASOS [sic] in the setlist" or that it was somehow "disrespectful" for them to have done that?  Absolutely not.  ACOS is a Dream Theater song, not a Mike Portnoy song, and the fact that he wrote the lyrics about a personal experience doesn't change that.  Should DT stop playing all songs for which MP wrote lyrics?  How about songs for which Kevin Moore and Charlie Dominici wrote lyrics?  I don't see anyone complaining that it was somehow "disrespectful" to KM for DT to play "Space Dye Vest" a few years ago.  Of course, I also don't see KM and CD whining about how their hearts were broken that their former band played one of its own songs.  If you're a member of a band and write lyrics for the band's songs, you can't reasonably expect the band not to play any of those songs after you leave the band.

By the way, the song is only partly about MP's mother and her plane crash.  According to MP, "it's about the cycle of life."  http://www.mikeportnoy.com/aboutmike/faq/answers/30.aspx#304

[MirrorMask]

No, there is absolutely nothing inappropriate about them playing it.  It is a Dream Theater song, a fan favorite, and one that is extremely relevant to the era they were celebrating.  It is part of the Images and Words session and should have been played.  There isn't a good argument to the contrary.

It's kinda a discussion stopper when the first reply is already the correct one.

[RoeDent]

I legit thought this was some WildRanger clickbait when I saw the thread title.

[Rammstein]

On the other hand most people would agree, that the Best of times should not be played, because it is about the passing of MPs Dad

[Mladen]

This actually might be interesting to debate. I have a feeling the guys in Dream Theater wouldn't really consider playing The Best of times since it's too personal for Mike, but removing ACOS from the set list for the same reasons is out of question. I wonder why that is. Maybe it has something to do with the fact that ACOS has a slightly broader meaning lyrically. It's also a bigger fan favorite than TBOT.

[EPIC Outro]

They did nothing wrong by playing ACOS.

And furthermore, I also believe they will definitely play The Best of Times live some day. I hope Portnoy will join them on stage for it, but either way, I hope it will happen.

[bosk1]

No, there is absolutely nothing inappropriate about them playing it.  It is a Dream Theater song, a fan favorite, and one that is extremely relevant to the era they were celebrating.  It is part of the Images and Words session and should have been played.  There isn't a good argument to the contrary.

It's kinda a discussion stopper when the first reply is already the correct one.

Sorry.  I'll try not to be so on-point next time. 

On the other hand most people would agree, that the Best of times should not be played, because it is about the passing of MPs Dad

Yeah, that's an interesting wrinkle to bring up.  And you rightly bring up the big similarity.  But here is where the similarity ends, both in terms of the song itself and its place in a live set:
-Although both are about the passing of Mike's loved ones, ACOS is much more indirect and has much more universal messaging in the lyrics.  TBOT is very literal and specific.
-ACOS was a big part of the history that was being celebrated on this last tour.  TBOT does not have that distinction.
-ACOS is an established time-tested fan favorite.  There are not many people clamoring to hear TBOT live.

[Squa7ch2112]

Mike has been playing DT and LTE songs on his tours, so why can't DT play their own songs while on tour?

[bill1971]

I don't think so since it was a band written song. If if was a quiet acoustic piece written and sung by him then I would agree with him. I think he should have played it with The Shattered Fortress.

[MirrorMask]

No, there is absolutely nothing inappropriate about them playing it.  It is a Dream Theater song, a fan favorite, and one that is extremely relevant to the era they were celebrating.  It is part of the Images and Words session and should have been played.  There isn't a good argument to the contrary.

It's kinda a discussion stopper when the first reply is already the correct one.

Sorry.  I'll try not to be so on-point next time. 

It was ironic, and also a compliment 

[As I Am]

Absolutely NOT.

[rab7]

There are not many people clamoring to hear TBOT live.

I would, however, love to hear that ending solo live

[cramx3]

Not disrespectful in any way.  The fans wanted it and the tour was the perfect time to bring it back.  It's really just a timing thing for MP because he wanted to do it in the same timeframe.  He shouldn't of changed his mind because of what DT were doing, but he did and that's fine too.

[pg1067]

On the other hand most people would agree, that the Best of times should not be played, because it is about the passing of MPs Dad

Not having communicated with "most people," I can't speak intelligently about what "most people" think about this subject.  Have you communicated with "most people" such that you know their opinions about this?  If not, what is your basis for making this claim?

My personal opinion is that DT shouldn't play TBOT because it's not very good.

[Lonk]

Was it disrespectful for Portnoy to Play "Regression" during the Shattered Fortress show? Song was written by Petrucci 

I loved that they played ACOS, and I think Labrie did an awesome job with it.

[gmillerdrake]

No, there is absolutely nothing inappropriate about them playing it.  It is a Dream Theater song, a fan favorite, and one that is extremely relevant to the era they were celebrating.  It is part of the Images and Words session and should have been played.  There isn't a good argument to the contrary.

doesn't need to go any further than that statement.

[Dedalus]

On the other hand most people would agree, that the Best of times should not be played, because it is about the passing of MPs Dad

Not having communicated with "most people," I can't speak intelligently about what "most people" think about this subject.  Have you communicated with "most people" such that you know their opinions about this?  If not, what is your basis for making this claim?

My personal opinion is that DT shouldn't play TBOT because it's not very good.

It would be disrespectful to the audience. 

[Herrick]

I don't think it was disrespectful for them to play the song. I'm not even sure Portnoy thought it was disrespectful.

[PetFish]

No.

On the other hand most people would agree, that the Best of times should not be played, because it is about the passing of MPs Dad

So what?  A song isn't just vocals/lyrics, it's the entire composition.  Would it matter if the circumstance were different?  Let's say that instead of leaving DT that MP had actually died, would this song (or anything else he wrote lyrics for) be off limits then?

I personally don't think they will play TBoT unless MP is with them but even if they did that would be fine.

[The Curious Orange]

Hey, most of us thought they'd never play Space Dye Vest without KevMo...

[KevShmev]

Hey, most of us thought they'd never play Space Dye Vest without KevMo...

Apples and bowling balls.

[Samsara]

My personal opinion is that DT shouldn't play TBOT because it's not very good.

Agreed. Very personal to Mike, which I respect. He needed to get it out, and I very much appreciate that. But it's not a great song IMO.

[DarkLord_Lalinc]

There's always been some turmoil with the "written by" phrase that is usually on a grey area. True, MP penned this classic and talked about a deeply personal subject matter (and it was done wonderfully, IMO) but the song was written by the band as a whole. Maybe it's more personal for MP, but that doesn't make the song *his*. It's kinda funny that it's MP, the one that usually says "I wrote ACOS", along with a post that sparkled some drama on why he wouldn't play it in his Shattered Fortress shows. That, as expected, drives fans nuts and kinda adds to the "MP wrote the song, proof he was everything in DT" extravaganza. Oh, well.

Answering the question: no. DT has been as respectful and classy about MP as they can possibly be. Cannot say the same of MP.

[Cool Chris]

There's always been some turmoil with the "written by" phrase that is usually on a grey area. True, MP penned this classic and talked about a deeply personal subject matter (and it was done wonderfully, IMO) but the song was written by the band as a whole. Maybe it's more personal for MP, but that doesn't make the song *his*.

That is how I have always felt, just articulated better.

[rumborak]

I think everybody will agree that there is a huge difference in "personal-ness" between ACOS (which is written in pretty vague terms) and The Best of Times (which specifically calls out MP's relationship with his dad).

[bosk1]

I think everybody will agree that there is a huge difference in "personal-ness" between ACOS (which is written in pretty vague terms) and The Best of Times (which specifically calls out MP's relationship with his dad).

Exactly.  That is pretty much what I said above.  And as I have posted before, it is also a hindrance in my enjoyment of TBOT.  I respect the song.  But it is SO specific and set out in such literal terms that it is hard for me to find an emotional connection to the lyrics, despite the fact that they are very emotional.

[rumborak]

I always liked TAMP for its directness. My issue with TBOT is that I think the lyrics are just plain bad That "and thank you ... FOR MY LIFE!" induces an actual trepidation in me before it comes.

[CodyWanKenobi]

Portnoy should have just played it with TSF. Who cares if DT was playing it during their tour? I'm not sure why he cares about stupid shit like that as much as he does. He also got in a fight with Neal Morse during the writing of The Similitude of a Dream - MP didn't want it to be a double concept album because DT had just done one with TA. It's like dude, get over it and live your life.