- " The Astonishing " - One Year -- er, EIGHT YEARS On.

[KevShmev]

I love Roll the Bones.  Part of it is that it came out right when I was getting into Rush, but it's just a fun record. Even the 2-3 average tunes sound fine when listening to the album from start to finish.  I wouldn't have wanted every Rush record to sound like that, but they did an excellent job with it at the time.

[Dublagent66]

I liked RTB's too.  Solid album. 

[ytserush]

Well, as a Rush fan, I can say that Roll the bones was a bad album and I think that some Dream Theater's fan can say the same about TA.  That does not mean we don't like them anymore.  And that does not mean that there are not any good songs in TA.  I doubt very much they ever do again that kind of project.

I wouldn't say Roll The Bones as a whole was bad at all, maybe a few songs. I love just about any song from that album that was played live, except for maybe Ghost of a Chance.

Roll the bones is their softest album ever.  Even today, I think is more like a pop rock album.  And what happened?  Their next effort, Counterparts, came with a totally different approach.  Much more heavy, bass and guitars sounds way different.  Kind of what DT did with their new album.  If Rush would have kept going with a sound and style like Roll The Bones, I would have stepped out for some time.

Might be "soft" as you say, but I don't think it makes it bad.

But even so Rush never made the same album twice.

[gzarruk]

Before saying anything else, I have to say I know JP hates medleys (or so I've heard) and that they were pretty much a Portnoy thing to do, so I know this probably won't happen, ever. Even I'm not a big fan of medleys to begin with, just play the whole song and not small fragmets of many songs.

Having said that, what if, for fun, we imagine the scenario where DT are no longer celebrating the SFAM anniversary on tour and decided to include a TA medley on their set: what would it include? I imagine a 20+ minute thing would suffice. I'd like to give it a try, but I certainly don't have the audio editing skills to pull that off.

[bosk1]

Before saying anything else, I have to say I know JP hates medleys (or so I've heard) and that they were pretty much a Portnoy thing to do, so I know this probably won't happen, ever. Even I'm not a big fan of medleys to begin with, just play the whole song and not small fragmets of many songs.

Having said that, what if, for fun, we imagine the scenario where DT are no longer celebrating the SFAM anniversary on tour and decided to include a TA medley on their set: what would it include? I imagine a 20+ minute thing would suffice. I'd like to give it a try, but I certainly don't have the audio editing skills to pull that off.

He does "hate" them.  But that said, that doesn't mean DT will never do one.  He has changed his mind about a lot of things over time.  If he felt like it was a good idea to do one for whatever reason, I'm sure he would, even though he generally doesn't like them.

[gzarruk]

Before saying anything else, I have to say I know JP hates medleys (or so I've heard) and that they were pretty much a Portnoy thing to do, so I know this probably won't happen, ever. Even I'm not a big fan of medleys to begin with, just play the whole song and not small fragmets of many songs.

Having said that, what if, for fun, we imagine the scenario where DT are no longer celebrating the SFAM anniversary on tour and decided to include a TA medley on their set: what would it include? I imagine a 20+ minute thing would suffice. I'd like to give it a try, but I certainly don't have the audio editing skills to pull that off.

He does "hate" them.  But that said, that doesn't mean DT will never do one.  He has changed his mind about a lot of things over time.  If he felt like it was a good idea to do one for whatever reason, I'm sure he would, even though he generally doesn't like them.

I definitely get where that comes from. I can only imagine how uncomfortable it was for him every time Portnoy went to them like "Hey, guys, I have an idea for another medley of songs! And guess what? I'm going to do this crazy scream on the Octavarium Razor's Edge part, you're all gonna love it!"

[cramx3]

Before saying anything else, I have to say I know JP hates medleys (or so I've heard) and that they were pretty much a Portnoy thing to do, so I know this probably won't happen, ever. Even I'm not a big fan of medleys to begin with, just play the whole song and not small fragmets of many songs.

Having said that, what if, for fun, we imagine the scenario where DT are no longer celebrating the SFAM anniversary on tour and decided to include a TA medley on their set: what would it include? I imagine a 20+ minute thing would suffice. I'd like to give it a try, but I certainly don't have the audio editing skills to pull that off.

He does "hate" them.  But that said, that doesn't mean DT will never do one.  He has changed his mind about a lot of things over time.  If he felt like it was a good idea to do one for whatever reason, I'm sure he would, even though he generally doesn't like them.

I definitely get where that comes from. I can only imagine how uncomfortable it was for him every time Portnoy went to them like "Hey, guys, I have an idea for another medley of songs! And guess what? I'm going to do this crazy scream on the Octavarium Razor's Edge part, you're all gonna love it!"

I know I loved it 

I'd like to see a TA medley, but it's just not happening. 

[KevShmev]

No need to do a medley, just play 3-4 songs in a row from it (that does not make it a medley).  I'll be surprised if it ever happens, though.

[TAC]

I wouldn't be surprised.

They are officially known as The Anniversary Band, aren't they? At some point TA will cycle 10 years.

[CodyWanKenobi]

I'm generally not a fan of medleys, but when I saw Haken (sorry bosk) on their 10th anniversary tour, they did a medley of the songs from their first album which was fantastic. I think the main reason it worked so well is because Aquarius is a concept album so it was basically a "long story short" version of that story. I think if DT ever did a medley of TA or maybe SFAM (way down the line obviously) it could be really cool. Once again, I wouldn't be saying this if I hadn't seen how well Haken was able to do it.

[gzarruk]

I'm generally not a fan of medleys, but when I saw Haken (sorry bosk) on their 10th anniversary tour, they did a medley of the songs from their first album which was fantastic. I think the main reason it worked so well is because Aquarius is a concept album so it was basically a "long story short" version of that story. I think if DT ever did a medley of TA or maybe SFAM (way down the line obviously) it could be really cool. Once again, I wouldn't be saying this if I hadn't seen how well Haken was able to do it.

I think a TA medley would work very well, specially considering one of the main complaints people have about it is that it's too long. It most likely will never happen, though, as we know JP dislikes them (and I do too, when they're just a bunch of random songs connected in a weird way). Concept album medleys are different because the songs usually share many themes and melodies, so it's easier to connect the songs and the transitions are smoother, but I still think Petrucci has no intentions on doing that.

[Max Kuehnau]

One thing I've always asked myself about the album (and I still do now actually) is: Given that this one took them the longest to record (9 months give or take), why is the music so comparatively simple and non-technical (exceptions apply and yes I know it's a musical and all that and it does what musicals are supposed to do to people)? ADTOE and DT12 took them 5 months to write and record and they both have a lot more parts that are rather difficult to play. 

[IDontNotDoThings]

One thing I've always asked myself about the album (and I still do now actually) is: Given that this one took them the longest to record (9 months give or take), why is the music so comparatively simple and non-technical (exceptions apply and yes I know it's a musical and all that and it does what musicals are supposed to do to people)? ADTOE and DT12 took them 5 months to write and record and they both have a lot more parts that are rather difficult to play.

I think the simple answer is its length. Even if it's more simple music, 2 hours is a lot - especially when a lot of it is venturing outside DT's comfort zone.

Besides that, the music was written by only JP & JR, so they may have spent some amount of time communicating their ideas to the other members - especially with James, as I'd imagine the characters would require a fair bit of voice direction.

[TAC]

One thing I've always asked myself about the album (and I still do now actually) is: Given that this one took them the longest to record (9 months give or take), why is the music so comparatively simple and non-technical (exceptions apply and yes I know it's a musical and all that and it does what musicals are supposed to do to people)? ADTOE and DT12 took them 5 months to write and record and they both have a lot more parts that are rather difficult to play.

I think it's scope and length are so much bigger, especially with all of the extras.

I didn't realize there was a correlation between technical playing and recording time.

[gzarruk]

It's much more than just which albums are more technically challenging than others to perform. TA is the biggest thing they've ever done. There's layers upon layers of instruments, effects, etc. They had to record an orchestra and a choir, to the point that they said some songs had more than 100 tracks to mix. The writing also took longer because they were creating the music simultaneously with and for the story, and it takes a lot of time to write something as complex as that. And they're Dream Theater, it's probably much easier for them to make a super technical wank fest with a chorus and call it a song, but rather they focused on songwriting and storytelling. That's the beauty of TA.

[Max Kuehnau]

One thing I've always asked myself about the album (and I still do now actually) is: Given that this one took them the longest to record (9 months give or take), why is the music so comparatively simple and non-technical (exceptions apply and yes I know it's a musical and all that and it does what musicals are supposed to do to people)? ADTOE and DT12 took them 5 months to write and record and they both have a lot more parts that are rather difficult to play.

I think it's scope and length are so much bigger, especially with all of the extras.
I didn't realize there was a correlation between technical playing and recording time.

There may actually not be. My post simply was describing what I observed. The length aspect makes sense though. (Gabriel's observation about the mixing time as well, I simply forgot about that aspect.) And please keep in mind that this is not a slight on the album in any way. They achieved what they wanted to achieve and with flying colours. (pun not intended)

[bosk1]

I'm generally not a fan of medleys, but when I saw Haken (sorry bosk) on their 10th anniversary tour, they did a medley of the songs from their first album which was fantastic. I think the main reason it worked so well is because Aquarius is a concept album so it was basically a "long story short" version of that story. I think if DT ever did a medley of TA or maybe SFAM (way down the line obviously) it could be really cool. Once again, I wouldn't be saying this if I hadn't seen how well Haken was able to do it.

I think a TA medley would work very well, specially considering one of the main complaints people have about it is that it's too long. It most likely will never happen, though, as we know JP dislikes them (and I do too, when they're just a bunch of random songs connected in a weird way). Concept album medleys are different because the songs usually share many themes and melodies, so it's easier to connect the songs and the transitions are smoother, but I still think Petrucci has no intentions on doing that.

I wouldn't assume it will never happen.  Yeah, he doesn't like medleys.  But in my opinion, you are right about it making sense to mash up some of these smaller songs into an "Astonishing suite" or something like that.  If JP and the band feel like it makes sense at some point, I wouldn't assume that JP's dislike of medleys would hold them back from doing it.

[gzarruk]

I'm generally not a fan of medleys, but when I saw Haken (sorry bosk) on their 10th anniversary tour, they did a medley of the songs from their first album which was fantastic. I think the main reason it worked so well is because Aquarius is a concept album so it was basically a "long story short" version of that story. I think if DT ever did a medley of TA or maybe SFAM (way down the line obviously) it could be really cool. Once again, I wouldn't be saying this if I hadn't seen how well Haken was able to do it.

I think a TA medley would work very well, specially considering one of the main complaints people have about it is that it's too long. It most likely will never happen, though, as we know JP dislikes them (and I do too, when they're just a bunch of random songs connected in a weird way). Concept album medleys are different because the songs usually share many themes and melodies, so it's easier to connect the songs and the transitions are smoother, but I still think Petrucci has no intentions on doing that.

I wouldn't assume it will never happen.  Yeah, he doesn't like medleys.  But in my opinion, you are right about it making sense to mash up some of these smaller songs into an "Astonishing suite" or something like that.  If JP and the band feel like it makes sense at some point, I wouldn't assume that JP's dislike of medleys would hold them back from doing it.

Maybe they need someone from here to suggest that to them?

[IDontNotDoThings]

They could just play Dystopian Overture if they wanted to cover a lot of TA's themes in one song.

[KevShmev]

I think it worth noting as well that if they did decide to do 3-5 TA songs in a row at shows, that doesn't make it a medley, at least in the sense of the kind JP dislikes.  I think of a medley as a bunch of songs played together in abridged form, and Rush doing that occasionally back in the day is what made Petrucci dislike medleys. If they played 3-5 songs in a row in full from TA, it is a not a medley, it would just be them playing 3-5 songs in a row from the same album, like they did on the Along for the Ride tour when they played 5 songs in a row from Awake and then 4 in a row from Scenes.

[Mladen]

I would love it if they did that, but I'm having a hard time figuring out which streak of songs would work well without making you crave for more. Maybe The X aspect, A New beginning and The Road to revolution.

[Phoenix87x]

Did The Astonishing hurt them as a brand at all? or slow some of their momentum?

I don't have any significant issues with the TA, but I know I didn't buy it day one and I definitely didn't go see that tour, but despite that I did buy D/T on day one and went to go see this tour. 

[the_silent_man]

Given the general reaction to this album (which is much more negative than this forum implies), I can't see more than one or two songs popping up in each setlist over the years. I don't mind the album (its ok but deeply flawed), but I can't imagine it would go down particularly well if they played 4-5 songs in a row...

[bosk1]

Did The Astonishing hurt them as a brand at all? or slow some of their momentum?

I doubt it.  Not significantly, anyway.  I think, if anything  connected to TA, the way the second leg of the tour was booked slowed their momentum.  But when you look at them doing the I&W tour right after, and now this album, I don't think it really had much of any long-term effect.  And when established bands have a one-album "tangent" where they do something uber creative that differs from the norm, but then go back to the status quo that the fans love, you don't generally see any real falloff in terms of popularity. 

[cramx3]

Did The Astonishing hurt them as a brand at all? or slow some of their momentum?

I doubt it.  Not significantly, anyway.  I think, if anything  connected to TA, the way the second leg of the tour was booked slowed their momentum.  But when you look at them doing the I&W tour right after, and now this album, I don't think it really had much of any long-term effect.  And when established bands have a one-album "tangent" where they do something uber creative that differs from the norm, but then go back to the status quo that the fans love, you don't generally see any real falloff in terms of popularity.

Yea, seems like whatever slow or hurt they might have had has recovered with D/T and tour.  It seems like D/T tour has been the most successful since I've been a fan.  At least from my perspective.

[Samsara]

Focus on Metal -- www.focusonmetal.net, one of my favorite podcasts, interviewed Jordan earlier in the year, and posted the interview a few weeks back. In it, Jordan was asked what album does he think is the most underappreciated, and he was pretty straightforward that it was The Astonishing. He understood why, and that they basically set themselves up for that, but thinks in time it'll be better appreciated. I think that was the gist of it (I listened to the podcast this morning).

[KevShmev]

I wish he were right, but I doubt he will be.  The Astonishing is so long that I doubt the people who really do not like it will decide years later to give a 2-hour album they didn't like in the first place any kind of attention. 

[Chino]

I wish he were right, but I doubt he will be.  The Astonishing is so long that I doubt the people who really do not like it will decide years later to give a 2-hour album they didn't like in the first place any kind of attention.

There's actually a lot of music I really disliked back in the day that I came around on. I used to hate more Beetles songs than I liked, now it's the complete opposite.

[jammindude]

I can think of several albums that I *hated* when I first listened to them, but then they later became some of my favorite albums of all time.   Ride the Lightning leaps immediately to mind.   But there are others. 

But I also get that the length of the album does get in the way.   

[Dublagent66]

I didn't like SDOIT at first and it became my favorite.  TA is a far cry from SDOIT, but I have learned to appreciate quite a few tracks on TA even though I still don't like it much overall.

BTW, isn't TA more than 3 years on now?  Oh yeah, Kotowboy isn't here anymore to change the thread title. 

[54_diplomats]

Damn it's really been 3 years since this album was released? It's still my least favorite DT album but I do enjoy listening to some of it from time to time.

[gzarruk]

More than 3 years later and I still love it. Wish I could listen to it more often, though, it's a bit too long to just sit and listen to the whole thing from start to finish.

[dparrott]

I wouldn't be surprised.

They are officially known as The Anniversary Band, aren't they? At some point TA will cycle 10 years.

The 10th anniversary Nursing Home tour! 

[TheOutlawXanadu]

For the first time in about a year - maybe more - I listened to The Astonishing. Honestly, I was kind of blown away. Some of the music on that record is pretty amazing. I am really bummed that they didn't film a live show. What a memento that would have been!

[ytserush]

For the first time in about a year - maybe more - I listened to The Astonishing. Honestly, I was kind of blown away. Some of the music on that record is pretty amazing. I am really bummed that they didn't film a live show. What a memento that would have been!

You're not the only one who is bummed.....