What are the chorus in these DT songs?

[TheGreatPretender]

All right. Well, it always came off to me as a pre-chorus anyway. Or at least what is normally classified as a pre-chorus, although now I'm thinking if it doesn't always preceed a chorus, it is a bit of a misnomer.

[a8ac]

I dont know what youre talking about, The chorus in Metropolis has always been for me the: "As a child..." part.  Its one of the most powerful moments in the song and one of the most memorable chord proggresions in the song, they repeat them at the ending of the song, and even throughout the SFAM album, you can almost say that the chords in Home's chorus are the same as in the chorus in Metropolis just with some minor changes.... But even if thats not the chorus, I love that part

[TheGreatPretender]

I dont know what youre talking about, The chorus in Metropolis has always been for me the: "As a child..." part.  Its one of the most powerful moments in the song and one of the most memorable chord proggresions in the song, they repeat them at the ending of the song, and even throughout the SFAM album, you can almost say that the chords in Home's chorus are the same as in the chorus in Metropolis just with some minor changes.... But even if thats not the chorus, I love that part

Yes, it's an awesome part. 
No, it's not a chrous. 

[sylvinception]

Don't care enough about OAMOT or SDV to check.

Ok, NOW I understand why you're not an Awake fan 

[ToT-147]

Well, I'M an Awake fan, but don't like SDV (don't care about it either).. With this last tour, the song has grown a little on me, but not enough to get to like it..

Anyway, the point is: you can be a "fan" of something (album, band), not exactly liking everything on it (a song, an album).. IMO, at least..

[TheGreatPretender]

Well, I'M an Awake fan, but don't like SDV (don't care about it either).. With this last tour, the song has grown a little on me, but not enough to get to like it..

Anyway, the point is: you can be a "fan" of something (album, band), not exactly liking everything on it (a song, an album).. IMO, at least..

I like it a lot better now that I remixed it without those awful samples. 

[In The Name Of Rudess]

You know you're on a DT forum when there's a thread about determining what exactly constitutes a song's chorus

[TheGreatPretender]

Couple of other unusual cases that came to mind.

ITPOE1, I'd say the "Do you still wait for your God," all the way through, "Promise you will be the chosen one," is the chorus of the song. Even though the second time around, the lyrics are vastly altered. The melodic pattern and the way it works within the song's context, I'd say it counts as a chorus. "Do you still wait for your God and the symbol of your faith," brief as it is, might even be considered a pre-chorus.


Another one is Learning To Live, where I'd say "The way the heart sounds" part is the chorus. It only repeats in the song twice, and even the melodic pattern of it changes, but the fact that it does repeat, and that it states the song's title, I think it counts.

[ToT-147]

Learning To Live, where I'd say "The way the heart sounds" part is the chorus. It only repeats in the song twice, and even the melodic pattern of it changes, but the fact that it does repeat, and that it states the song's title, I think it counts.

But those two features are in several other DT choruses.. Like Under a Glass Moon (only the second feature), Lost Not Forgotten (these two have exactly the same structure ), Peruvian Skies (the second feature), Beyond this Life (both), The Spirit Carries On (the second one), Misunderstood (the second), The Answer Lies Within (second), Outcry (first), The Enemy Inside (second)..

And also in these songs with parts: This Dying Soul (first feature), The Root of all Evil (first), Repentance (first) and Illumination Theory (both features)..

ITPOE1, I'd say the "Do you still wait for your God," all the way through, "Promise you will be the chosen one," is the chorus of the song. Even though the second time around, the lyrics are vastly altered. The melodic pattern and the way it works within the song's context, I'd say it counts as a chorus. "Do you still wait for your God and the symbol of your faith," brief as it is, might even be considered a pre-chorus.

Yeah, I agree with this.. It's very ambiguos and undetermined.. In fact, that kind of chorus is the same that in The Glass Prison.. "Help Me - Save Me - Heal Me".. I always like the way it seems to end, but continues..
About ItPoE pt 1, one more thing.. I also consider this: "Servants of the fallen..." to "...Standing in their way" as the main chorus of the whole two songs (or tracks ).. Anyway, if it is, then it'd be a weird chorus, I know.. There's something strange on it, very peculiar.. I completely love it.. Specially the "through a veil of madness" part in The Slaughter of the Damned...

You also said that:

the fact that it does repeat, and that it states the song's title, I think it counts.

Here you have two songs with, I think, unquestionable choruses, but with only one appearance on them: One Last Time (maybe that's why they've called it that way ) and About to Crash (Reprise), which we know it's not a song, but also that is a special case, along with the rest of the movements within SDoIT.. However, while by themselves it's clear they have their choruses appearing only one time throughout the song, those choruses are repeated in some other place, earlier or later in the album they are.. One Last Time's chorus is on Finally Free and About to Crash (Reprise)'s chorus is on About to Crash, two times in this case..

[TheGreatPretender]

But those two features are in several other DT choruses.. Like Under a Glass Moon (only the second feature), Lost Not Forgotten (these two have exactly the same structure ), Peruvian Skies (the second feature), Beyond this Life (both), The Spirit Carries On (the second one), Misunderstood (the second), The Answer Lies Within (second), Outcry (first), The Enemy Inside (second)..

Right... So those are all their choruses. Hence why I consider the one in LTL the chorus as well. The only thing that really sets it apart is that the first one just goes, "spread before me is my soul, I'm learning to live, I won't give up til I've no more to give, no more to give," and the second time, it goes, "spread before you is your soul, so forever hold the dreams within our hearts, with nature's inflexible grace I'm learning to live". So there, even the structure is different. But I'd still count it.

Yeah, I agree with this.. It's very ambiguos and undetermined.. In fact, that kind of chorus is the same that in The Glass Prison.. "Help Me - Save Me - Heal Me".. I always like the way it seems to end, but continues..
About ItPoE pt 1, one more thing.. I also consider this: "Servants of the fallen..." to "...Standing in their way" as the main chorus of the whole two songs (or tracks ).. Anyway, if it is, then it'd be a weird chorus, I know.. There's something strange on it, very peculiar.. I completely love it.. Specially the "through a veil of madness" part in The Slaughter of the Damned...

I'd say Servants of the fallen to be more of a bridge... But it depends on whether you consider ITPOE 1 and 2 to be separate songs or the same one, because it does reoccur in part 2, so it can definitely be counted as a chorus in that context. But if you look at ITPOE1 just by itself, it definitely doesn't act like a chorus in that context.

Here you have two songs with, I think, unquestionable choruses, but with only one appearance on them: One Last Time (maybe that's why they've called it that way ) and About to Crash (Reprise), which we know it's not a song, but also that is a special case, along with the rest of the movements within SDoIT.. However, while by themselves it's clear they have their choruses appearing only one time throughout the song, those choruses are repeated in some other place, earlier or later in the album they are.. One Last Time's chorus is on Finally Free and About to Crash (Reprise)'s chorus is on About to Crash, two times in this case..

Well, it depends on how you look at it, because if as most people, you consider SDOIT to be one song, then About to Crash and About to Crash reprise are both a part of one single song, in which case, it would techincally count as two appearances. And in fact, when I listened to About to Crash for the first time, I didn't consider that part a chorus (we are talking about "still it hurts to just get by" part, right?), because after it, we move on to War inside my Head, so it really gives About to Crash the appearance of not having a chorus at all, until 10+ minutes later when you hear the reprise and that part comes up again, and then it suddenly clicks.
But structurally, it doesn't act like a chorus.

There is another weird case, in The Glass Prison actually. Aside from the one you mentioned, it can be argued that the first chorus in it could be a non-recurring one, which goes, "Crawling to my glass prison, a place where no one knows." Although it doesn't appear in the song again, the structure of it repeats twice:

Crawling to my glass prison
A place where no one knows
My secret lonely world begins

So much safer here
A place where I can go
To forget about my daily sins

Life here in my glass prison
A place I once called home
Fall in nocturnal bliss again

Chasing a long lost friend
I no longer can control
Just waiting for this hopelessness to end

The fact that the Glass Prison words repeat twice, and always at the same part of the melodic structure, really makes it seem like a chorus that repeats but with slightly different lyrics.

[ToT-147]

I agree with all of that.. Except this:

when I listened to About to Crash for the first time, I didn't consider that part a chorus (we are talking about "still it hurts to just get by" part, right?), because after it, we move on to War inside my Head, so it really gives About to Crash the appearance of not having a chorus at all, until 10+ minutes later when you hear the reprise and that part comes up again, and then it suddenly clicks.
But structurally, it doesn't act like a chorus.

I mean, if you don't think, considering SDoIT as one song, in that part ("Still it hurts to just get by...") as a chorus, you can't consider SDoIT to have any chorus at all.. What about the choruses on War Inside My Head, Goodnight Kiss, Solitary Shell and Losing Time (in which the chorus appears one time, I forgot to mention it before)?.. Because all this are part of the same song too.. I've always hear it as a chorus on itself.. Like in the case of Full Circle (one chorus), or Heretic (two choruses), having their own choruses even being part of a greater track...

And about TGP, yeah, I guess that's also a chorus (chorus A, being the other chorus B)..
Like I said here:

Songs without a specific chorus, or with too many:

-The Killing Hand (there's not one I can notice)
-The Glass Prison ("Crawling to my glass prison..." / "Help Me - Save Me - Heal Me")
-Octavarium (Medicate Me's / Full Circles')
-The Best of Times ("I'll always remember..." / "These were the best of times...")
-In the Presence of Enemies - pt 3-6 ("Angels fall - Dark Master" / "I judge as my eyes see...")

[TheGreatPretender]

I agree with all of that.. Except this:
I mean, if you don't think, considering SDoIT as one song, in that part ("Still it hurts to just get by...") as a chorus, you can't consider SDoIT to have any chorus at all.. What about the choruses on War Inside My Head, Goodnight Kiss, Solitary Shell and Losing Time (in which the chorus appears one time, I forgot to mention it before)?.. Because all this are part of the same song too.. I've always hear it as a chorus on itself.. Like in the case of Full Circle (one chorus), or Heretic (two choruses), having their own choruses even being part of a greater track...

No, I mean, I didn't consider About To Crash as having any choruses at all, until I heard it in the reprise. Sorry, I didn't clarify.

Songs without a specific chorus, or with too many:

-The Killing Hand (there's not one I can notice)
-The Glass Prison ("Crawling to my glass prison..." / "Help Me - Save Me - Heal Me")
-Octavarium (Medicate Me's / Full Circles')
-The Best of Times ("I'll always remember..." / "These were the best of times...")
-In the Presence of Enemies - pt 3-6 ("Angels fall - Dark Master" / "I judge as my eyes see...")

Ah yes. So it seems like we covered that. Very good, then.