Another top 50 thread v. son_ov_hades

[Tom Bombadil]

All three are good, but PMU isn't in the same league as BAI and TOT

[son_ov_hades]

Pull Me Under is a cool song, but there are way too many songs that are better in every way. Putting it above BAI and Trial Of Tears rubs me the wrong way... 

Sorry bro, I'll try to rub you the right way. Actually, you'll probably not like the rest of the list at all. 

All three are good, but PMU isn't in the same league as BAI and TOT

I agree, its better. 

[ThatOneGuy2112]

PMU perhaps too high, though an astounding song. The other two are absolutely fantastic.

[Outcrier]

No problem with PMU placement, just because it's more simpler and straightforward doesn't mean it is least good than BAI or TOT (only if you think that 20 minute songs are automatically better than 4 minute ones) and it is one of their most memorable songs.

[son_ov_hades]

PMU perhaps too high, though an astounding song. The other two are absolutely fantastic.

I like the use of the word astounding. 

No problem with PMU placement, just because it's more simpler and straightforward doesn't mean it is least good than BAI or TOT (only if you think that 20 minute songs are automatically better than 4 minute ones) and it is one of their most memorable songs.

Perfect way to say it.


So I've got the last three songs before the top 10 up now. This late in the list, every song is one of my favorites and a total blast. Dream Theater just has too many incredible songs that they can't all be number 1.

#13  Surrounded





When crafting this list I was reminded again of just how fucking magical Images And Words is. Its varied, dynamic, and every song is iconic. In many ways it is the definitive Dream Theater album and I would recommend it to someone trying to get into the band. That said, Scenes From A Memory beats it for me. Surrounded is one of those songs that just cements my impression of this album, a song that I regarded as a classic the first time I heard it.

Kevin Moore's opening notes are gorgeous, a telling hint at what is to come with this song. James LaBrie sings in a wonderful melodic way that when coupled with the keyboards gives a ballad feel. Petrucci brings the band in with a gentle lead that only slightly increases the momentum, then much more deliberate is the next build up. The song gets rocking and becomes an upbeat, dare I say happy sounding, fun jam. After the line "Walking to the window he throws the shutters all against the wall" an awesome moment with Portnoy playing the offbeat under a standard rhythm serves the make Surrounded's prog leaning just camouflaged enough to let it sneak by with out taking over the song. The guitar solo is short, sweet, and masterfully transitions into an unhinged vocal; classic Labrie on full display. Keys and vocals end the song just as they started it, and this gives the song a true storybook feel. I don't know what these guys were doing in the early 90s, but whatever it was lead to a flawless run of near perfect songs on Images And Words and this is certainly one of them.       



#12  A Fortune in Lies






This is heavy fucking metal! Pure 80s Iron Maiden, Queensryche, Fates Warning, Savatage worship; and better than a lot of what those bands did! When Dream And Day Unite is amazing, GTFO if you disagree. Never since has Dream Theater been so grounded in metal, the nu metal on Train Of Thought doesn't count(if you are false don't entry), which is a shame. The balance on the album is like 75/25 metal and prog rock and I wish they'd do something like this again. In fact When Dream And Day Unite is the third best 80s prog metal album for me, behind only No Exit and Operation: Mindcrime.

Anyway getting to the song at hand, A Fortune In Lies is absolutely brilliant. Right from the big opening chords you know the next 5+ minutes are about to melt your face. Petrucci delivers early with a total Yngwie style run that nearly destroys his guitar(at that's how it sounds). An awesome heavy riff forms the backbone of the song; I dare you not to headbang just a little. Charlie Dominici soars in as if riding an eagle from Lord Of The Rings or something. He gives Geoff Tate and Jon Arch a run for their money, seriously this guy's voice was amazing. Charlie belts out "a hero in frozen water" to bring the song to its apex, the ridiculous heavy rhtyhm with the samples on top. The whole band, every instrument, is locked in to this complicated changing rhythm that keeps hitting you like a jackhammer. God damn that's brutal! Petrucci's solo afterwards is shredding genius; Yngwie, Marty Friedman, and Jason Becker must have been impressed when they heard this. The end is as heavy and pounding as as ever, it doesn't let up until its over. This is the best full on metal song in Dream Theater's career.




#11  Ytse Jam





The guys in this band are big fans of Rush, if that's news to you then you need to listen more carefully. One of the biggest, most obvious homages to the best band to ever come from the great white north is without a doubt Ytse Jam. What we have here is a bunch of kids who grew up on Rush trying to write their own YYZ years later. The first instrumental is not the best, but its damn close. Each band member gets a solo, well except for Dominici , and they make the best use of them. Sure there is a great deal of showing off, but that's what you want from a prog instrumental. While the solo sections are extreme, the song really is at its best when each member is playing together and working off each other. The main riff is a perfect example of this. An expertly performed song and a simple pleasure to listen to.

[jakepriest]

Three 50-70 rank songs. Surrounded used to be my favourite off I&W but I don't enjoy it as much today compared to other songs. Ytse Jam and AFiL are the two best songs off WDADU but still not good enough to be this high.

[Laughingplace56]

Three 50-70 rank songs. Surrounded used to be my favourite off I&W but I don't enjoy it as much today compared to other songs. Ytse Jam and AFiL are the two best songs off WDADU but still not good enough to be this high.

Surrounded was never my favorite off I&W but it's a top 50 song for me. The other two are great, but not my favorite off the album. They're top 50 material, but they weren't on my list.

[son_ov_hades]

Three 50-70 rank songs.

You crazy man

[ThatOneGuy2112]

Surrounded is probably my least favorite from I&W, and I can't honestly say any song form WDADU would make my top 20. They're great songs, but I feel that DT just has so much greater.

[Tom Bombadil]

Surrounded is perfectly placed, just an amazing song all around. The other two would still be in my top 50 but no so high.

[Sacul]

Surrounded is perfectly placed, just an amazing song all around. The other two would still be in my top 50 but no so high.

This, but a bit more exaggerated.

[erwinrafael]

Coming out of the frantic ending of The Glass Prison to the emotive atmospherics of the intro to Blind Faith was such a great decision in sequencing. There is so much space in this song's introduction, nothing crazy happens but there is a huge amount of experimentation and creativity. The ambient sounds Rudess uses, the simple highlighted bass riff, the tamped down guitar, and most of all LaBrie's extremely clean and calm voice makes for one of the best intros in the band's career. I don't really think they've done anything like this since, shame. Then holy shit they stomp on the gas for the chorus which it just completely awesome, "Blind faith we have in yoooooou! Invisible!". The riff after the second chorus at the line "and still life pushes on" is just spectacular, and very unexpected. The song gets really heavy and Petrucci whips out one of his "excuse me while I destroy this guitar" solos, only to then throw us for a loop with a wonderful piano break and jump right back in. Rudess' Hammond Organ style solo is my favorite part by far, and very reminiscent of Keith Emerson and Richard Wright. One minor complaint is the ending, I love how it reprises the intro bass/piano riffs but then Rudess gives us a real wtf moment with what sounds like a humpback whale mating call to finish the song off. 
[/center]

I have this in my Top 20, and the reason why it did not go higher is because of MP. I love MP's work in a lot of other DT songs, but here, he overplayed. This song is JR's DT moment, but MP competed with JR after the piano solo. He did not complement it. He competed., specially in the Hammond Organ style solo It's a shame because MP did very good work in the other songs in the SDOIT album.

[jakepriest]

I have this in my Top 20, and the reason why it did not go higher is because of MP. I love MP's work in a lot of other DT songs, but here, he overplayed. This song is JR's DT moment, but MP competed with JR after the piano solo. He did not complement it. He competed., specially in the Hammond Organ style solo It's a shame because MP did very good work in the other songs in the SDOIT album.

I've never heard anyone mention this and don't feel this way myself. If anything MP is trying to follow JP's riff throughout the entire instrumental section.

[erwinrafael]

MP followed JP's riff and was putting in his own fills, but in the process, he was drowning out and was quite unmindful of what JR was doing in the Hammond organ. Specially between 7:00 - 7:25 of the song, they only synced in the transition starting 7:26 going to the keyboard solo.

[son_ov_hades]

I have this in my Top 20, and the reason why it did not go higher is because of MP. I love MP's work in a lot of other DT songs, but here, he overplayed. This song is JR's DT moment, but MP competed with JR after the piano solo. He did not complement it. He competed., specially in the Hammond Organ style solo It's a shame because MP did very good work in the other songs in the SDOIT album.

I've never heard anyone mention this and don't feel this way myself. If anything MP is trying to follow JP's riff throughout the entire instrumental section.

Yeah I just don't hear any overplaying at all 

[erwinrafael]

I have this in my Top 20, and the reason why it did not go higher is because of MP. I love MP's work in a lot of other DT songs, but here, he overplayed. This song is JR's DT moment, but MP competed with JR after the piano solo. He did not complement it. He competed., specially in the Hammond Organ style solo It's a shame because MP did very good work in the other songs in the SDOIT album.

I've never heard anyone mention this and don't feel this way myself. If anything MP is trying to follow JP's riff throughout the entire instrumental section.

Yeah I just don't hear any overplaying at all 

MP did follow JP's riff throughout the instrumental. I am not arguing that. I am referring instead to how he did the complicated fills in the hi hat, cymbals and the toms while Rudess is doing his Hammond organ style solo (not the fast keyboard solo). His fills fit JP's riff, but it did not complement JR's solo at all. The highlighted hits did not sync with the downbeats of JR's solo, but it did not do counterpoints also. I actually wondered if they recorded the pieces separately because what JR and MP were doing in that section were clashing.

[Crow]

So his bits under the Constant Motion guitar solo are overplaying, too? I honestly don't understand the problem, I mean it's a DT instrumental what do you think they're going to do, show restraint? 

[jakepriest]

I don't remember MP ever really trying to synchronize what he's doing with the other band members THAT much. You're thinking Mangini

[erwinrafael]

I don't remember MP ever really trying to synchronize what he's doing with the other band members THAT much. You're thinking Mangini

I am actually not thinking of him syncing ala Mangini. More of along the lines of what he did in similar sections in Hell's Kitchen, Trial Tears or the solo section in Solitary Shell.

Mind you, I actually like the song. It's in my Top 20 list (number 13, just behind Trial of Tears). The Hammond Organ solo section in the song just did not work as well for me as it could have. I do not mind MP's complicated fills when the other instruments are doing mainly riffing, unisons, or slow solos with long drawn-out notes. But when the solos are elaborate (like the organ solo in this case), I think it's better if he pulled back a little so that the JR's solo would get notices more.

[jakepriest]

I don't remember MP ever really trying to synchronize what he's doing with the other band members THAT much. You're thinking Mangini

I am actually not thinking of him syncing ala Mangini. More of along the lines of what he did in similar sections in Hell's Kitchen, Trial Tears or the solo section in Solitary Shell.

Mind you, I actually like the song. It's in my Top 20 list (number 13, just behind Trial of Tears). The Hammond Organ solo section in the song just did not work as well for me as it could have. I do not mind MP's complicated fills when the other instruments are doing mainly riffing, unisons, or slow solos with long drawn-out notes. But when the solos are elaborate (like the organ solo in this case), I think it's better if he pulled back a little so that the JR's solo would get notices more.

I get your point, but I just don't see it that way. The way MP plays during that section makes it that much better in my opinion.

[son_ov_hades]

Alright time to break into the top 10. I think that one of these songs will come as a surprise, but the other should be expected. That is if you all have figured out my taste by now. I think I still have at least one more shocker left though.

#10  The Silent Man





Perhaps the simplest and most straight forward song of Dream Theater's career, The Silent Man is fairly uncharacteristic. There is little in the way of drums or keys, no electric guitar, and most importantly no metal or prog rock to be found. A straight forward verse-chorus-verse structure and a short run time cement the the fact that this really is a just a pop song. A lot of the great prog bands have done pop song better than any pop artist; Genesis did Follow You Follow Me, Yes did Owner Of A Lonely Heart, and Styx did Babe. This is Dream Theater's best attempt at writing pop, and it is one of their best songs. John Petrucci's simple chords on acoustic are so beautiful and give so much space in the song. James LaBrie rules the song with his emotional approach. The backing vocals are absolutely perfect and complement LaBrie in every way. The Silent Man has what I believe is the shortest guitar solo, but its great for what it is. I can't really say much more about this song, its beauty is in its simplicity.




#9  Lines in the Sand





Derek Sherinian. God damn man! The synth intro to this song is the single best keyboard moment in Dream Theater history. Yes you read that right. The whole beginning section is just amazing, everything flows perfectly and each instrument fits so well with the others. It sounds less like a written composition and more like an improvised jam of musicians that know each other better than themselves. The verses are so melodic and laid back, thanks the lack of guitar and the focus on John Myung, while the chorus is full of energy and power. Doug Pinnick's backing vocals are wonderful, he adds a gospel church feel to a song that already has a strong spiritual vibe. That unison Sherinian and Petrucci do before the guitar solo gets me so amped every time. Speaking of the solo, it is one of Petrucci's best understated emotional efforts. LaBrie is great on Lines In The Sand too, my favorite part being the slowed down belting after the guitar solo. "Living comes much easier once we admit we're dying" shows how great LaBrie really is on this song. Sherinian's piano solo evokes more emotion in me than most of what Rudess or Moore have done. It is a real shame they don't play this song much, but maybe its better as Rudess would likely butcher it

[jakepriest]

Again two 60-70 rank songs. You have done well to go against my taste with your top 20 so far.
Honestly Derek's keyboard sounds are nothing but annoying to me.

[Tom Bombadil]

Both songs are great. No problem seeing them this high.

[GentlemanofDread]

Lines in the Sand is perfectly placed, Silent Man bit high for my tastes.

[ThatOneGuy2112]

LITS is definitely a top 20 song at the very least, and I see no problem with it this high. TSM is probably too high for me though, though great.

[son_ov_hades]

You have done well to go against my taste with your top 20 so far.

More like my top 50 

Both songs are great. No problem seeing them this high.

I see more and more that we have similar tastes.

Lines in the Sand is perfectly placed, Silent Man bit high for my tastes.

LITS is definitely a top 20 song at the very least, and I see no problem with it this high. TSM is probably too high for me though, though great.

Great to see love for Lines In The Sand, which I feel is under appreciated. I figured most people would think The Silent Man is too high, but its one of the songs that I keep coming back to the most.

[Sacul]

Th Silent Man is a bit high IMO, but it's a perfect ballad, so no complaints. But LITS... man, I don't know what everybody sees to that song. The solo is pretty lame; the chorus is cool, yeah; but that's all I can see.

[Laughingplace56]

Th Silent Man is a bit high IMO, but it's a perfect ballad, so no complaints. But LITS... man, I don't know what everybody sees to that song. The solo is pretty lame; the chorus is cool, yeah; but that's all I can see.

Agreed. The intro is pretty cool and there's some nice musicianship, but I'm not a fan of the song as a whole. I hate the chorus. I don't like it at all.

[erwinrafael]

Lines in the Sand is your number 9. It is my number 8. Close enough.  What a great song.

I also like The Silent Man, but it did not enter my Top 20 because it did not give me a full DT experience.

[son_ov_hades]

#8  The Dance Of Eternity





The instrumental to end all instrumentals, The Dance Of Eternity is a ridiculously complex monster of rhythms, time signatures, and riffs. If Ytse Jam was Dream Theater trying to do YYZ, this is them trying to best Rush's best instrumental La Villa Strangiato. You know what, they fucking did it! In many ways this song is the product of egoism and lack of restraint, and I understand why some wouldn't like that. For me though, the complete freedom that each musician is given makes for an absolutely stellar performance from each of them.

The Dance Of Eternity begins with several musical nods to Metropolis Pt. 1, most notably the intro riff that both songs share. Before long it comes into its own, but this is the first of many references to the precursor song. I love how Dream Theater does this, acknowledging their past and using it to create in the present. Once the song gets going on that one riff is gets good. The whole band is just firing on all cylinders here and blazing! Rudess' piano solo breaks the mood for a short time in such a perfect way. That makes way for the second best unison the band has done, its like Rudess and Petrucci are one linked by an endless thread impossible to break Then comes the rare John Myung bass solo, how the hell does he play that fast?! The song becomes full blown chaos and finally builds into an outrageous climax which is the best part of the song for sure. The rest is more calm, though not by that much, and serves as the lead into One Last Time elegantly. The Dance Of Eternity Is Not Just Dream Theater's best instrumental, it is the best instrumental by anyone ever.   



#7  Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence





The crazy epic song, yes it is one song, that runs longer and has more movements than most albums. My write up is epic too, sorry. The highlight of both the album that bears its name and the Score live album. The most ambitious and over the top song that Dream Theater has ever done. Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence is a truly magnificent accomplishment. The studio version is amazing, but for this list I've chosen the transcendent performance of it from Score.

Overture is a brilliant composition through and through. This is a classical or theatrical level work that serves as a fitting intro to the epic song. Each theme of the song's different movement is represented here in a beautiful, cohesive manner. Score is the definitive version of this song largely because of the orchestra, and having a real full orchestra play this entire overture is awesome. The whole piece reminds me of the music you hear in The Legend Of Zelda games, which is obviously a good thing. Having close to ten minutes of a Dream Theater song with no actual members of the band on the stage is a bold move and it works so damn well.

About To Crash leads the song away from Overture with a gorgeous piano melody that shows the genius of Jordan Rudess. When the spotlight shines on him as he leads the rest of the band into the song the atmosphere is amazing. It gets rocking when LaBrie comes in, "She can't stop pacing" is one of my favorite vocal entrances. The section breaks down and then gets heavy, LaBrie gives us a hell of a note "she enjoyed the RACE!" god damn that's awesome. The orchestral backing in the section really adds a nice touch and makes it feel much bigger in scale.

War Inside My Head is short and to the point, yet my favorite section of the whole song. This is so heavy, so dark, so hateful, and raw. War Inside My Head is the heaviest the band ever got while still being good(again fuck Train Of Thought). I love how the orchestra continues the melody which leaves Petrucci, Myung, and Portnoy to provide the huge heavy bottom end riff. James even manages to sound gritty and raw without getting into self parody, and Mike's vocals actually add something great(note this is how you do this type of thing, not A Nightmare To Remember).

The Test That Stumped Them All is a balls out metal movement that forgoes the orchestra entirely. The main riff is total Metallica worship, and awesome. So many great moments in this section, but my favorite is "SAVE HIM FROM HIMSELF!". The only part of the entire Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence performance that is better in the studio is right here. Mike Portnoy's falsetto vocals are kind of weak, but that's minor. I love the keyboard solo here and Petrucci proves himself over and over with those riffs.

Goodnight Kiss brings the orchestra back and significantly alters the mood of the song. This signals a major thematic shift from confusion, anger, and hate in the early parts of the song to loss, depression, and pity. LaBrie sings with only the orchestra accompanying him, which differs drastically from the studio version. This is a change for the best, because when the band comes in it has more more meaning. This section is quite haunting, there is a beauty to it but a serious dark atmosphere hangs overhead. The extended guitar solo is nice, but Petrucci has done these better both before and after. Overall this is the weakest section of the song.

Solitary Shell is very 70s prog rock, never a bad thing. Petrucci's 12 string playing sounds just wonderful, and when coupled with Rudess' analog style snyth part it works so damn well. The obvious nod to Yes' "And You And I" is nothing less than a fantastic tribute. While the lyrical theme is certainly pity and confusion, the music creates such a feel good moment. Maybe this is a contradiction, but it doesn't bother me at all.

About To Crash (Reprise) picks up where the About To Crash left off. It contains epic, lush solos from both Petrucci and Rudess. This section gets the song rocking again, and signals the sort of full circle Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence takes to the end. I love the part when Portnoy plays a rhythm on his snare and both Myung and Petrucci follow him while Rudess plays a short melody lead. These little details are part of what makes this epic so song great.

Losing Time/Grand Finale as the title suggests brings the epic to a close. There isn't much particularly noteworthy about Losing Time, other than it has a very dramatic/cinematic feel. The section serves as a proper ending, slowing down to a big closing. This gives the audience plenty of space to being cheer and clapping without overpowering anything. It works well, a fitting end to an absolutely wild ride.       

[Tom Bombadil]

Ah unfortunately I don't like either of these,  so I guess our tatstes aren't that similar.

[jakepriest]

TDOE is a great instrumental, but unlike SoC I don't think it's top 20-worthy.

I've been liking SDOIT more than ever lately.
If I had to rank the movements, it would go like this:

Losing Time/Grand Finale > About to Crash > About to Crash (Reprise) > Goodnight Kiss > Overture > TTTSTA > WIMH > Sollitary Shell

[son_ov_hades]

Ah unfortunately I don't like either of these,  so I guess our tatstes aren't that similar.

How can you not like these songs? You mean you don't like them at all?! I'll never understand that.

TDOE is a great instrumental, but unlike SoC I don't think it's top 20-worthy.

I've been liking SDOIT more than ever lately.
If I had to rank the movements, it would go like this:

Losing Time/Grand Finale > About to Crash > About to Crash (Reprise) > Goodnight Kiss > Overture > TTTSTA > WIMH > Sollitary Shell

For me its War Inside My Head>Solitary Shell>About To Crash>About To Crash (Reprise)>Overture>The Test That Stumped Them All>Goodnight Kiss> Losing Time/Grand Finale

We don't agree on anything 

[Tom Bombadil]

Ah unfortunately I don't like either of these,  so I guess our tatstes aren't that similar.

How can you not like these songs? You mean you don't like them at all?! I'll never understand that.

I only like TDOE because it's fun to drum. As an actual song it just sounds like "how many time signature changes can we put in one song?".
And SDOIT is one of my least favorite DT songs. If I were to break it up I don't think even one movement would make it to my top 50. Just personal preference.

But, hey, the rest of your list has been great.

[Sacul]

The first half of TDOE is awesome, but the rest is damn awful and boring - not top-70-worthy. But 6DOIT is like 6 spots lower than it should be