Dream Theater's Jordan Rudess Sits in with Dropping The Needle

[Weymolith]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkgZz3nUz1Y

[cyberdrummer]

Just watched this, it's a really interesting interview. A lot about his musical youth etc. Frustratingly he brushed over the issue of the dvd! He also mentioned that DT might consider using an outside producer in the future.

[robwebster]

53 minutes! Bring it on.

...Is he being interviewed by his own stunt doubles?

[goo-goo]

Nice

JR Steinway Piano future release

[Prog Snob]

Downloading it right now... I'll check it out later on.

[KevShmev]

Interesting interview, and Rudess was super cool as always, but one thing kind of bothered me, and that was the comment about the group dynamic and how the talk several years ago was about how they can't stray too far out of their "stylistic window."  It reminded me again of the comment years ago about the LTE song Liquid Dreams and how one of them remarked that they could never do a song like in DT, which I found just crazy.  A band that is truly progressive should have no boundaries.

[Prog Snob]

Interesting interview, and Rudess was super cool as always, but one thing kind of bothered me, and that was the comment about the group dynamic and how the talk several years ago was about how they can't stray too far out of their "stylistic window."  It reminded me again of the comment years ago about the LTE song Liquid Dreams and how one of them remarked that they could never do a song like in DT, which I found just crazy.  A band that is truly progressive should have no boundaries.

Interesting point Kev. I wasn't aware they kept any boundaries really.  If you listen to the various styles they have incorporated into their sound since even Jordan joined, I'd say they have covered most of the gamut of music.  From pop to metal to classical to jazz to prog to infinity and beyond, they really do expound upon their proficiency in so many ways. 

[KevShmev]

I can't agree with that.

What pop songs has Dream Theater written?  And FYI, having a song with a catchy chorus, ala I Walk Beside You, is not automatically pop.

What jazz song has Dream Theater written? 

Throwing 5-second blurbs of certain genres in songs that are mainly prog metal doesn't really count as covering them.

[Cedar redaC]

Solitary Shell is pretty Jazzy, especially during that latinish bit during the second half.

[Prog Snob]

I can't agree with that.

What pop songs has Dream Theater written?  And FYI, having a song with a catchy chorus, ala I Walk Beside You, is not automatically pop.

What jazz song has Dream Theater written? 

Throwing 5-second blurbs of certain genres in songs that are mainly prog metal doesn't really count as covering them.

Poppy songs? I would definitely say I Walk Beside You or Beneath The Surface or The Answer Lies Within played by an already mainstream band would be pop hits as compared to songs like Metropolis, Breaking All Illusions and A Change of Seasons. When I say pop, I am not necessarily referring to just artists like Taylor Swift or Katy Perry. I am speaking in regards to the pop rock sub-genre as a whole.

As to your last comment, I think that is a matter of opinion.  Personally, I do think showing their influences in random ways counts as covering them whether they are "5-second blurbs" or three minute instrumental interludes or entire songs. Most bands don't stray from their usual writing styles regardless of influence, but Dream Theater has constantly displayed their influences in the music they write. I think it is a bit arbitrary to dismiss the jazz influence in a certain part of a song because they never wrote a "jazz song."

[Plasmastrike]

Wow, what an amazing interview. Such enjoyable responses from JR! Lots of openness and honesty.

EDIT: Beautiful improvisation

[wasteland]

This shall be the first thing I'll check out whe I get home this evening! I wish he provided any valuable infos concerning the DVD...

[nikatapi]

Nice interview covering a lot of topics, i liked that Jordan mentioned they might decide to get an external producer on the next albums, and i also liked that he mentioned Steven Wilson as someone he would like to have producing a future album. Maybe we could get a good sounding DT album after a long time if this happened.

As KevShmev said, and i've seen this said in past interviews as well, they seem to have a very precise idea of what is able to fit into "DT" style. This might be good from a business standpoint, but it might hurt the "proginess" if you will, although at this point and given that they chose MM as a drummer, it seemed pretty obvious that they are comfortable playing a certain style of music and not experimenting so much.

[Perpetual Change]

A few comments:

1. Did anyone catch how JR said he'd "keep people guessing" about which was his "day" job between DT and designing music apps? I know it was an off-handed, joking comment, but I still thought it was interesting. I wonder how Jordan sees himself at this juncture in life? Either way, it's definitely good to know that someone so rooted in classical training has so much to do with designing the digital wave of musical instruments.

2. Thought it was weird how Jordan said the thing about DT being limited musically. I've never felt of the band as being that way, but I guess they are. Still, I wish the band would give us more credit then that. I'd love to see DT really take it off the rails occasionally, and the optimist in me thinks fans would go crazy over it. But there's the other part of me that knows it'd probably divide fans, as the metal side of DT fandom probably wouldn't be down. On the flipside, it's nice that DT still do put out quality progressive metal, when all the other good progressive metal bands have taken the plunge into full-on prog.

3. As I've said before, I'm not sure how Steven Wilson could help DT. Steven Wilson is primarily a style-specialist who definitely leaves his stylistic fingerprints on everything he does. Most of the productions of his I've listened to are very minimalist, atmospheric, and restrained. It'd be cool to hear DT try that again, but honestly, most DT songs that have gone for that (let's say "conservative") vibe have been pretty forgettable, while the songs DT have put it all on the line have been great. I'd rather have a guy like Rick Rubin come in and encourage DT to be DT, rather than Steven Wilson come in and help DT write their "Damnation" or "We're Here Because We're Here".

[MoraWintersoul]

The comment about the limited style is the last thing I want to hear from any of them. If they have music inside them, that music is Dream Theater music, because they are Dream Theater. They have fans who would follow them wherever they went stylistically, and more variety is always a good thing. If they can write good in whatever style they choose, I couldn't care less which style it is. Really, I know everyone says that but I mean it.

I won't worry because, obviously, if they write an album in the established style and it's good, I'll like it just as much. But it would be cool if my favorite prog band could step up and be progressive in the real sense of the word as well. I'm not asking them to revolutionize music, but just not throw good stuff away because it doesn't 100% fit with Dream Theater. A love for oddball music is what brought us - and them! - here.

[?]

*snip*

Just what I think! They shouldn't feel they have any boundaries - the main thing is that each guy in the band can stand behind each song they make, no matter what the style is. If they feel like making, say, a reggae song, then they should do it. I'm not a fan of the said style of music, but they can do whatever they want.

[robwebster]

I do think limitations hone creativity every bit as much as they stifle it. If the band have an identity, and they feel they've got a lot of things they want to say which that style lends itself to, then absolutely - revel in that identity. And as identities go, it's already a very broad one. Cover My Eyes and This Dying Soul were both written by the same band - most bands wouldn't touch that. And a good, interesting, distinctive identity that people connect to is something a lot of artists could only wish for. They're very talented and a little bit lucky to have created it in the first place. Absolutely, keep that alive.

That said, it'd be a shame if they were holding back because they thought their fans wouldn't accept it. Kev suggested that a song like Liquid Dreams was outside of their remit. Not taking that at face value (though I don't doubt your testimony) - but has anyone ever met a Dream Theater fan who thinks Liquid Tension Experiment's a bit edgy? If that's where the limit is, the window could absolutely be made a bit broader. I'd love to hear them write a song a bit like Osmosis.

But I think, as artists, resolving to keep their feet on the ground is possibly a sensible decision. It's like the difference between Porcupine Tree and Steven Wilson's solo project. Porcupine Tree's hardly dull, or stifled, or unable to evolve - but I wouldn't want to hear any of that Remainder the Black Dog stuff on the next PT album. Experimentation is a good thing, but experimentation at the cost of your identity isn't always. And it's a good identity. It's a genre they all but invented! So in that sense, I totally stand behind the decision to monitor what's Dream Theater and what's not, but as MoraWintersoul says, a love for oddball music is what brought us here. I like to be surprised with each album. I'd hate for the band to become predictable, or dull, or safe. Each of (or at least two of) their last three albums has done interesting things with the band's sound, but Systematic Chaos with its swords-and-sorcery, power metal, fantasy vibe was the only one to outright surprise me. ADToE sounded like the old sound refreshed, and BCSL sounded like a summary of everything they'd done that decade.

"This fits our identity and is something we want to say," is a good approach. "This sounds like the rest of the stuff we've written, which is how we can tell it's Dream Theater," is probably not entirely healthy. They're clever people, and this is what they've chosen to do with their lives - I'd say when an idea's dismissed, it's more likely to be related to the former than the latter. If there is a little bit of the latter in it, though, then I think we'd not only be happy to open the window a bit, we'd be thrilled to. I've always said, ever since it was released, Dream Theater need a Supermassive Black Hole - something completely baffling, I love that feel of wrestling with a song. Reacting with revulsion, at first, and then finding little things to like, one by one. Muse are very good at that. Constantly looking for their next direction. Writing songs that are divisive at first, but in the fullness of time, you won't be able to believe it didn't sound like classic Muse, straight out of the starting blocks.

As long as they keep writing interesting albums, the system clearly works! Until they get boring, it's probably a little premature to complain. But yes, it's an interesting tidbit.

[emtee]

^Great post.

As a long time fan, since PMU was played for the first time, I've been along for the ride. It's been a long ride for sure and
I'm 100% ready for boundries to be shattered...EVEN if it means I don't connect with it. I&W was so different sounding to
me at the time of it's release. It broke new ground and took me to a new place musically. DT were the standard bearers
of a new genre of music. I would love for them to think in those terms. Lead me to a new place. Challenge me. Create
something that takes me 20 listens to begin to unravel it.

[MoraWintersoul]

Ultimately we all fucking love Dream Theater and will follow them into battle.

[Zydar]

Ultimately we all fucking love Dream Theater and will follow them into battle.

[nikatapi]

3. As I've said before, I'm not sure how Steven Wilson could help DT. Steven Wilson is primarily a style-specialist who definitely leaves his stylistic fingerprints on everything he does. Most of the productions of his I've listened to are very minimalist, atmospheric, and restrained. It'd be cool to hear DT try that again, but honestly, most DT songs that have gone for that (let's say "conservative") vibe have been pretty forgettable, while the songs DT have put it all on the line have been great. I'd rather have a guy like Rick Rubin come in and encourage DT to be DT, rather than Steven Wilson come in and help DT write their "Damnation" or "We're Here Because We're Here".

Have you listened to the last Steven Wilson album "the raven that refused to sing" ? I had the same doubts with you given that most of the music Steven had been involved with was a bit restrained, but this last album really changed my mind. It is so proggy, with lots of solos and high level of musicianship, and a very good sounding result.

In terms of sound production, i've been wanting to hear DT in a more dynamic production and not the compressed-metal type of sound they've had since TOT. And Steven is the only person in the prog-metal world that really pushes for good sound and better dynamic range.

So even the thought of him producing-mixing a DT album is very promising to me, since it could be the first time we get a great sounding, balanced between the instruments album. I think many of the contributions from each member get lost in the mix every time, whether it is a cool bass lick, or some cymbal work or an atmospheric part from the wizard. Having a sonic space for every member seems like a great prospect for the band, and i wish we see it in the future. ADTOE was a little disappointing production-wise, but probably an improvement over Black Clouds, though there is much more space for improvement.

[gm5k]

"There's no way in hell that John Petrucci's gonna do something that sucks.  It just doesn't happen."    Awesome quote.  (was in regards to respecting John's opinions as a producer for the band)

Really great interview 

Wow, that improv at the end 

[Perpetual Change]

Have you listened to the last Steven Wilson album "the raven that refused to sing" ?

I have preordered it, but I haven't listened to the leak, no.

[?]

3. As I’ve said before, I’m not sure how Steven Wilson could help DT. Steven Wilson is primarily a style-specialist who definitely leaves his stylistic fingerprints on everything he does. Most of the productions of his I’ve listened to are very minimalist, atmospheric, and restrained. It’d be cool to hear DT try that again, but honestly, most DT songs that have gone for that (let’s say “conservative”) vibe have been pretty forgettable, while the songs DT have put it all on the line have been great. I’d rather have a guy like Rick Rubin come in and encourage DT to be DT, rather than Steven Wilson come in and help DT write their “Damnation” or “We’re Here Because We’re Here”.

Steven didn't produce WHBWH, he only mixed it.

It'd be interesting to hear a DT album produced by SW, but it will never happen, because he doesn't like their music, is pretty busy anyway and concentrates on mixing other artists' albums instead of being a producer.

I'm not an audiophile, but I do get annoyed when records are mastered overloudly and there's a crapload of compression. I wish more metal albums had the dynamic range of Fear of a Blank Planet or The Incident...

[Perpetual Change]

Yeah, but that's the point. Steven Wilson doesn't like progressive metal, so why would you want him to produce DT? Steven Wilson already produces a bunch of bands who he has do music he likes. What would be so great about DT becoming another band like that?

Which is why I think someone like Rick Rubin would ultimately be better. A guy like Rubin would come in and kinda unhinge DT, without bringing in any attitude about their specific style, except that they should do the best album in their style that they can.

[robwebster]

I wish more metal albums had the dynamic range of Fear of a Blank Planet or The Incident...

Ah! Here, I disagree entirely. Fear of a Blank Planet is a bloody chore to listen to in a quiet house. All that constant volume-twiddling - it's pleasant, but completely impractical. The reason dynamic range gets limited, and it's a very good reason, is because most of the time, when you're listening to music, you're not listening to it in an ideal environment. It might be a noisy house, or you might have someone trying to sleep next door, or you might be driving a car... so many things, you need a consistent volume.

In a controlled environment - a soundproof room with no responsibilities - yes, the dynamic range is more pleasant, and when an album gives you the option of dynamic range that's a very good thing. But Fear of a Blank Planet, for instance, just doesn't work at low volumes. The amount of twiddling! I can't leave it on and let myself drift to sleep - as soon as I get the quiet bits loud enough to be audible, the loud bits will be loud enough to piss me off. Nightmare.

[KevShmev]

I can't agree with that.

What pop songs has Dream Theater written?  And FYI, having a song with a catchy chorus, ala I Walk Beside You, is not automatically pop.

What jazz song has Dream Theater written? 

Throwing 5-second blurbs of certain genres in songs that are mainly prog metal doesn't really count as covering them.

Poppy songs? I would definitely say I Walk Beside You or Beneath The Surface or The Answer Lies Within played by an already mainstream band would be pop hits as compared to songs like Metropolis, Breaking All Illusions and A Change of Seasons. When I say pop, I am not necessarily referring to just artists like Taylor Swift or Katy Perry. I am speaking in regards to the pop rock sub-genre as a whole.

As to your last comment, I think that is a matter of opinion.  Personally, I do think showing their influences in random ways counts as covering them whether they are "5-second blurbs" or three minute instrumental interludes or entire songs. Most bands don't stray from their usual writing styles regardless of influence, but Dream Theater has constantly displayed their influences in the music they write. I think it is a bit arbitrary to dismiss the jazz influence in a certain part of a song because they never wrote a "jazz song."

I mostly disagree, but it's all good.

Which is why I think someone like Rick Rubin would ultimately be better. A guy like Rubin would come in and kinda unhinge DT, without bringing in any attitude about their specific style, except that they should do the best album in their style that they can.

Okay, but isn't Rubin guilty of being one of the worst offenders nowadays when it comes to music he produces sounding squashed/clipped to the max?  With music as "busy" as Dream Theater's, I can only imagine how compressed the final product would be.

[?]

I wish more metal albums had the dynamic range of Fear of a Blank Planet or The Incident...

Ah! Here, I disagree entirely. Fear of a Blank Planet is a bloody chore to listen to in a quiet house. All that constant volume-twiddling - it's pleasant, but completely impractical. The reason dynamic range gets limited, and it's a very good reason, is because most of the time, when you're listening to music, you're not listening to it in an ideal environment. It might be a noisy house, or you might have someone trying to sleep next door, or you might be driving a car... so many things, you need a consistent volume.

In a controlled environment - a soundproof room with no responsibilities - yes, the dynamic range is more pleasant, and when an album gives you the option of dynamic range that's a very good thing. But Fear of a Blank Planet, for instance, just doesn't work at low volumes. The amount of twiddling! I can't leave it on and let myself drift to sleep - as soon as I get the quiet bits loud enough to be audible, the loud bits will be loud enough to piss me off. Nightmare.

I admit that it can be annoying when you listen to it in the car or train on your mp3 player and you have to turn the volume up and down, but hey - that's what the volume button is made for! And when you listen to it at home with no distractions, it sounds simply perfect. But obviously that kind of dynamic range wouldn't work for every band: it would be weird if some basic death/thrash metal albums didn't sound loud all the time.

[lithium112]

Steven Wilson doesn't like progressive metal

Wut. He's certainly said that he doesn't like DT's music in the past but I don't think you can say that he doesn't like progressive metal in general since he produced Blackwater Park and has some prog metal elements in his own music. The way he approaches music is just very different from the way DT does, so I agree that he would not be a good produce choice, no matter how much I like his work.

[me7]

Which is why I think someone like Rick Rubin would ultimately be better. A guy like Rubin would come in and kinda unhinge DT, without bringing in any attitude about their specific style, except that they should do the best album in their style that they can.

Okay, but isn't Rubin guilty of being one of the worst offenders nowadays when it comes to music he produces sounding squashed/clipped to the max?  With music as "busy" as Dream Theater's, I can only imagine how compressed the final product would be.

Absolutely, just listen to Metallica's Death Magnetic.
I'm convinced that Rubin is suffering from hearing loss and produces compressed music that sounds good to his ears, but bad to anyone else.

[DarkLord_Lalinc]

I was incredibly excited for the Andy Wallace mixing thing with ADTOE (The man's mixed some amazing stuff), but it was kind of a letdown. I mean, it sounds nice and everything, but it just doesn't make me wanna kick butt.

[goo-goo]

Would love for Andy Sneap to take a shot at mixing the latest DT. Loved his mix on Tool's Lateralus

[MoraWintersoul]

How about them letting us recruit their producers?

[philmcson]

How about them letting us recruit their producers?

I agree!  Kevin Shirley!!!

[Kotowboy]

I think Rubin should be an ideas guy but shouldn't have any say on the audio.

He seems to get good results from bands material wise but the albums always sound awful.