If falling into infinity was released like this..

[TheGreatPretender]

And it doesn't make much sense, having ACOS there, seeing how much they wrote for FII, I don't think they would have had an older song on the album assuming they hadn't released it already - kind of like the case of IAW and DLPM/TLF. You could have asked the same thing about having those tracks on the album, or Eve, or something.

I actually kind of wish they had released To Live Forever and Don't Look Past Me on ACOS EP. I would've preferred that over a bunch of live covers.

They didn't play it live for a very long time.  They played it 5 times total before the rework with Sherinian.

That's still significantly different from having an idea or a riff that a band has been sitting on for a couple of years and then deciding to put it on an album. Even if it was reworked, the overall version of it was still close enough to what they did originally. And the band was in a very different place musically during the FII days, I mean, if you compare ACOS to anything on FII, ACOS would stand out like a sore thumb, it has different dynamics, different energy, different mood. It really wouldn't fit in very well, when considering the album as a whole.
Couple of people mentioned this already. There's a difference between a collection of great songs and a great album.

[Samsara]

re: The original post

I think that lineup of songs would strengthen the record a bit. But not sure where that would land for me in terms of rankings.

re: my commentary

I love FII, both as released and the demo version 2 CD set that was released on Ytsejam. I always thought the record got a bad rap that was inflamed further by Portnoy's damning of the record.

I disagree with the use of Desmond Child and with the use of any outside writers for bands in the hard rock/metal/prog metal arena. So that's one strike against it. And I get the argument that the record deviated from what the band (Portnoy?) intended.

But I see FII as an interesting experiment in DT trying to do what QR did with Empire and FW did with Parallels. Maintain musicianship and complexity, but embrace a more structured form to break into the mainstream.

To me, at the time, as a fan, it worked. I know people kill "You Not Me," but frankly, I find it a better standalone song than "You Or Me." It flows better and its more compact. I also agree with changes such as lifting the instrumental section out of "Burning My Soul" and making it a standalone instrumental ("Hell's Kitchen"). To me, those were absolutely right moves.

At the same time, you have songs like Lines in the Sand and Trial of Tears that represented the longer form that DT was known for that are just plain awesome. FII had a chance to completely broaden the audience. The problem was, after the initial label push at radio, the support went south. The record was never really given a chance to flourish.

And if you look at Awake, and the structure for Awake and the variety of song lengths and tempos, FII is a natural continuation of that.

Again, I hate the fact Desmond Child was involved. But as just a plain record, I think it was a bold move that could have been very successful. But waning label support, a change in the mainstream listening preference (nu-metal), etc., really zapped any chance FII had to succeed.

Anyway, don't get me wrong, I think the record would have been pretty damn cool had it been the originally intended 2 CD set. But I also think some of the editing decisions made in the final version of FII were good ones, particularly for what I believe the record and the majority of the band (Portnoy not included) was trying to accomplish with it.

[VioletS16]

It would be a vast improvement but not enough to place it among I&W...

[Octavaripolis]

Remove New Millennium, Anna Lee, and replace them with Raise The Knife.

Then it would be their 3rd best album behind SDOIT and SFAM.

Remove New Millenium and Anna Lee? New Millenium, really? I think that is one of the more experimental DT-tracks. I'd hate to lose it.

[TheGreatPretender]

Remove New Millenium and Anna Lee? New Millenium, really? I think that is one of the more experimental DT-tracks. I'd hate to lose it.

I'd say the experiment turned in underwhelming results.

[7thHanyou]

FII currently ranks as my fourth-favorite Dream Theater album, after I&W, SFaM, and Awake.  I love it as is, and I regularly listen to it, excising only You Not Me.  The proposed version might be a little bit better...but it still drops some of my favorite tracks.  I like ACoS as a stand-alone song, too.

FII could get a boost simply by removing You Not Me, Burning My Soul, and Take Away My Pain.  You Not Me is just bad (and I don't think You Or Me was that much better), and the other two, while okay, don't add much.  Lots of people hate on Just Let Me Breathe, but that's an energetic, good track, and I'd keep it.

Throwing in Raise the Knife and Speak to Me would possibly make the album outrank Awake for me.  Cover My Eyes wouldn't hurt.  I also like the demo version of Hollow Years, but the original works too.

I actually made a playlist that incorporated some demo tracks, and I enjoy listening to it a bit more than the original:

New Millennium
Just Let Me Breathe
Hell's Kitchen
Lines in the Sand
Hollow Years (Demo)
Peruvian Skies
Cover My Eyes (Demo)
Raise the Knife (Demo)
Speak to Me (Demo)
Anna Lee
Trial of Tears

Unfortunately, this runs 1:23:39.  This can be fixed by removing Cover My Eyes and replacing the Hollow Years Demo.  I've also toyed with removing New Millennium and replacing it with Raise the Knife, but frankly, I'd rather sacrifice Cover My Eyes, as much as I like it.

In any case, this could possibly boost it above SFaM.  Not I&W level, but close.  I really do love FII's high points that much.

[Laich21DT]

Where's New Millennium? AKA one of DT's top 5 underrated songs.

That's how I feel, at least. Never understood all of the hate for it. I recall James saying in an interview that he felt the song wasn't received well live. In my case, they performed it at my first DT show (also first ever concert) back in '03, and seeing Myung up there with the chapman stick is very vivid memory.

[Polis]

Where's New Millennium? AKA one of DT's top 5 underrated songs.

That's how I feel, at least. Never understood all of the hate for it. I recall James saying in an interview that he felt the song wasn't received well live. In my case, they performed it at my first DT show (also first ever concert) back in '03, and seeing Myung up there with the chapman stick is very vivid memory.

Yeah,  I like new millennium too. don't understand how people can hate ot.

[erasiel]

I actually made a playlist that incorporated some demo tracks, and I enjoy listening to it a bit more than the original:

New Millennium
Just Let Me Breathe
Hell's Kitchen
Lines in the Sand
Hollow Years (Demo)
Peruvian Skies
Cover My Eyes (Demo)
Raise the Knife (Demo)
Speak to Me (Demo)
Anna Lee
Trial of Tears

Rather than using the demo versions of Cover My Eyes, Raise the Knife and Speak to Me, suggest you try try it with the versions from the Cleaning out the Closet fan club CD instead. These are the same recordings, but they were mastered much more professionally on COTC and so they'll fit much more seamlessly into the album. Not sure what to do about the Hollow Years demo though.

[jammindude]

My version of FII:

New Millenium 
You OR Me
Peruvian Skies
Hollow Years
Burning My Soul (original version that includes Hell's Kitchen)
Raise the Knife
The Way It Used to Be
Cover My Eyes
Take Away My Pain (original version)
Trail of Tears

Is there enough room for that?   I don't really have it....this is just my pipe dream version. 

[Laich21DT]

Falling Into Infinity > Systematic Chaos.

Absolutely.

And while I don't think New Millennium is a top 5 DT song, I certainly think that it's underrated.

[LBC.]

1. Lines in the Sand.
2. New Millenium.
3. Raise the Knife.
4. Eve.
5. Hollow Years (Budokan long version style -specially the guitar solo-).
6. Speak to Me.
7. Burning My Soul.
8. Just Let Me Breathe.
9. Peruvian Skies.
10. Anna Lee.
11. Hells Kitchen.
12. Trial of Tears.
13. A Change of Seasons.

[JRuivo]

This album is a bit of an oddity to my taste; it's got so much of what I call DT filler but all the other songs belong to my top10 or 15. While it's not perfect from beggining to end, there's something about the sound, the atmosphere, their image at the time and the album cover that locked me into this band forever... I rank it, without a doubt, above I&W. It's interesting that I found this thread, let's give it a shot:

1. New Millenium
2. Raise the Knife
3. Hollow Years
4. Burning My Soul
5. Peruvian Skies
6. Hell's Kitchen
7. Lines in the Sand
8. Take Away My Pain
9. Cover My Eyes
10. Anna Lee
11. Trial of Tears
12. A Change of Seasons

[GasparXR]

My ideal version of the album isn't TOO different from FII as it is:

New Millennium
Cover My Eyes
Peruvian Skies
Hollow Years '96
Just Let Me Breathe
Hell's Kitchen
Lines in the Sand
Take Away My Pain
Speak to Me
Anna Lee
Trial of Tears

[Mosh]

I like FII quite well as is, but there are 3 songs I can't stand. You Not Me, Just Let Me Breathe, and Burning My Soul. Replace those with Cover My Eyes, Raise The Knife, and Speak To me and we're good to go. 

[Sketchy]

I like FII a lot as it is, but I would prefer You Or Me, the original version of Take Away My Pain (because that organ is feels central), and would not object to Speak To Me, Cover My Eyes or Where Are You Now? because that song has some great melodies and a bitching guitar solo at the end.

Raise The Knife is a song that I like, but to me it's really non-essential.

Are there any songs I'd specifically remove from FII? No, I don't think so. For me, that album has some of DT's best songwriting, and I adore Anna Lee. It's really beautiful.

[adastra]

I wouldn't change a thing on FII.  Perfect album!

[puppyonacid]

1. New Millennium
2. Peruvian Skies
3. Hollow Years
4. Hell's Kitchen
5. Lines in the Sand
6. Anna Lee
7. Trial of Tears
8. A Change of Seasons

would it be among Images and Words and Awake and Scenes from a Memory as godly albums?

Nope.

Had it been released like this:

1. Raise the knife
2. Cover my eyes
3. Peruvian skies
4. Hollow years
5. Burning my soul
6. Where are you now
7. The Way it used to be
8. Trial of tears

...it would be up there. Or at least very close.

I'm really sorry to single this out and I don't mean to come across as a bully but man..........the would be the WORST DT album in ever!

I mean actually think about the reaction that tracklist would have elicited from fans after Awake and ACOS. That would have killed the band right then and there. If it didn't it would have been purely on the strength of the first and last tracks. It's not that the rest are bad songs, but they are songs that don't really define that DT sound. I don't think they could have carried an album on their own.

Rant over.

[?]

My FII tracklist would look like this:

The Way It Used to Be
Burning My Soul
Hell's Kitchen
Lines in the Sand
Hollow Years
Peruvian Skies
Speak to Me
Trial of Tears

I know it's "just" an hour long, but I thought 8 songs would be enough.

[Nefarius]

I really don't get all the hate for You Not Me. Yes, it's short and not exactly an overly complicated song. But it has a lot of punch and energy, an overdriven bass riff shaping the verse, a very catchy singalong chorus, tasty drumming details in between, great sounding production. In contrast to a lot of other songs it's very concise which isn't by definition a bad thing either, not even for prog. I would say it's entry level DT material for people that would feel put off getting introduced to DT listening to something like Octavarium. And I think it's great that there's DT stuff you can add to non-prog playlists that doesn't break a flow of structurally simpler songs and stand out as an oddball. I like the song and I don't think I'm the only one.

Greetings...
Nef

[puppyonacid]

I don't wholly disagree. I do like the dark riff between the chorus and versus.

But I still think it'd not a shining moment for DT; but then again they have lots of songs that I would describe as sub par.

What I love about debates like this are those WTF moments when someone just can't stand a song you love - I think Hell's Kitchen and New Millenium are brilliant!

or vice versa - I can't stand Hollow Years, Another Day, the Answer Lies Within, A Rite of Passage.

So really I guess one thing I do admire is that DT don't mind giving it a go. I love their big proggy epics but they will give a nice pop ditty a go, or a balls to the wall rocker. They do seem to like to mix it up.

[The Stray Seed]

I'm actually really glad they didn't put ACOS in FII. The first has a very dark vibe to me, while FII is quite... the opposite! Don't get me wrong, I really like FII - it's one of my favorite albums - and of course I love ACOS, but they simply can't get along well together xD

[Elite]

1. New Millennium
2. Peruvian Skies
3. Hollow Years
4. Hell's Kitchen
5. Lines in the Sand
6. Anna Lee
7. Trial of Tears
8. A Change of Seasons

would it be among Images and Words and Awake and Scenes from a Memory as godly albums?

Although everybody knows FII is already a top 5 DT album, if you do it like this, it would be even better:

1. Raise the Knife
2. Cover My Eyes
3. Peruvian Skies
4. Speak to Me
5. Hell's Kitchen
6. Lines in the Sand
7. Hollow Years
8. Trial of Tears
9. A Change of Seasons

I don't even know if that would fit, actually. If it doesn't, remove Speak to Me.

[matte.braso]

interesting topic! FII could have been potentially one their very best for me with this tracklist. I emphasized on the proggy songs in the album except for You not me 'cause I think it's pretty good in its simplicity (same for Take away my pain).
 
1. New Millennium 
2. You not me
3. Raise The Knife (I definitely LOVE this song, it's in my top 10 for sure)
4. Take Away my pain (I like both versions, the album one has a better structure, the original more energy)   
5. Hell's Kitchen               
6. Lines in the Sand
7. Anna Lee 
8. Trial of Tears                 

[aprilethereal]

Remove NM, YNM and JLMB and add Raise The Knife and it's a fantastic album.

[Kotowboy]

No. I hate A Change Of Seasons. I listened to it again a  few days ago and it just sounds like rejected sections from older songs that all got a home in

this one B-side.  It doesn't flow very well and just seems thrown together to make a long song. Derek's solo is good but that's about it.

[Sketchy]

Ah, crap, I'm always getting The Way It Used To Be and Where Are You Now? confused.

[?]

Ah, crap, I'm always getting The Way It Used To Be and Where Are You Now? confused.

I never get those two mixed up, because I only like the former

[Sketchy]

Lol, the latter is ok by my book, but the former really kicks balls with that guitar solo (that is the one which ends with the epic guitar solo, isn't it?).

[Hanz Gruber]

1. New Millennium
2. Peruvian Skies
3. Hollow Years
4. Hell's Kitchen
5. Lines in the Sand
6. Anna Lee
7. Trial of Tears
8. A Change of Seasons
would it be among Images and Words and Awake and Scenes from a Memory as godly albums?

I would adjust the order slightly so that epic songs are split up.  (Trial of Tears, Lines in the Sand, and Change of Seasons.)
Other than that looks killer

1. New Millennium
2. Peruvian Skies
3. Trial of Tears
4. Hollow Years
5. Hell's Kitchen
6. Lines in the Sand
7. Anna Lee
8. A Change of Seasons

[ddtonfire]

Too many slow songs.

[aprilethereal]

Raise Da Knife has to be in there somewhere.

[RoeDent]

ACOS would be out of place, as it was originally planned to be on Images & Words.

But kudos for including Anna Lee, one of the most beautiful DT songs ever written. Doesn't get anywhere near enough appreciation round here.

[hefdaddy42]

Yeah, I'm not sure where all the stuff about ACOS is coming from.  AFAIK, it was never on the table for it to be released on FII. 

[LCArenas]

Probably yes but I'll switch New Millennium with Raise the Knife. Aaaaaaaaand what both RoeDent and Blob said.

How 'bout this?
1. Raise the Knife
2. Speak to Me
3. Peruvian Skies
4. Hollow Years
5. Cover My Eyes
6. Hell's Kitchen
7. Lines in the Sand
8. Take Away My Pain (Demo Version)
9. Anna Lee
10. Trial of Tears