Outcry Instrumental Section - Why is it so Musically Advanced?

[johncal]

Unless it's copying Mangini,  then its very difficult. 

[Öxölklöfför]

The section starting at 5:17. It has some irregularities in it that makes it really cool, and I can't say that anything similar is to find in TDOE.

[bosk1]

It is definitely right up there with TDOE in terms of complexity.  Who really cares which one is "more complex?"  How would you even measure that anyway?  But one of the things that blows me away with the instrumental section of Outcry is that it is up there with the most complex passages DT has ever done, and yet it never feels like you have meandered very far enough from the main themes of the song.  All the way through, that instrumental feels like it belongs there. 

[reneranucci]

It is definitely right up there with TDOE in terms of complexity.  Who really cares which one is "more complex?"  How would you even measure that anyway?  But one of the things that blows me away with the instrumental section of Outcry is that it is up there with the most complex passages DT has ever done, and yet it never feels like you have meandered very far enough from the main themes of the song.  All the way through, that instrumental feels like it belongs there.

Disagree. To me, it is one of the most out of place instrumental sections DT has ever created.

[johncal]

It is definitely right up there with TDOE in terms of complexity.  Who really cares which one is "more complex?"  How would you even measure that anyway?  But one of the things that blows me away with the instrumental section of Outcry is that it is up there with the most complex passages DT has ever done, and yet it never feels like you have meandered very far enough from the main themes of the song.  All the way through, that instrumental feels like it belongs there.

I agree 100%. The song is crafted in the classical tradition and meant to tell a story. The whole instrumental section is a story of war and conflict and can really be felt throughout. Factually, guys like Stravinsky wrote the first "progressive" music almost 100 years ago. I grew up listening to classical so I really have an appreciation for that type of structure. The contrasts in the sounds and themes are intentional and well done. I think the great composers of the last century would be wowed by these guys and would probably pen the same kinds of things if they had modern intrumentation.

[bosk1]

It is definitely right up there with TDOE in terms of complexity.  Who really cares which one is "more complex?"  How would you even measure that anyway?  But one of the things that blows me away with the instrumental section of Outcry is that it is up there with the most complex passages DT has ever done, and yet it never feels like you have meandered very far enough from the main themes of the song.  All the way through, that instrumental feels like it belongs there.

Disagree. To me, it is one of the most out of place instrumental sections DT has ever created.

Yes, but thatjust further proves that drugs are bad for you.

[FlyingBIZKIT]

 

[hefdaddy42]

It is definitely right up there with TDOE in terms of complexity.  Who really cares which one is "more complex?"  How would you even measure that anyway?  But one of the things that blows me away with the instrumental section of Outcry is that it is up there with the most complex passages DT has ever done, and yet it never feels like you have meandered very far enough from the main themes of the song.  All the way through, that instrumental feels like it belongs there.

Disagree. To me, it is one of the most out of place instrumental sections DT has ever created.

[Bertielee]

It is definitely right up there with TDOE in terms of complexity.  Who really cares which one is "more complex?"  How would you even measure that anyway?  But one of the things that blows me away with the instrumental section of Outcry is that it is up there with the most complex passages DT has ever done, and yet it never feels like you have meandered very far enough from the main themes of the song.  All the way through, that instrumental feels like it belongs there.

Disagree. To me, it is one of the most out of place instrumental sections DT has ever created.

Yeah but look who said that : Reneranucci! Is it surprising?

B.Lee

[Nihil-Morari]

Well, the only problem that I have with it, is that they need a breakdown to bring a next verse in. And a long breakdown as well, as if they already thought of the applause time they'd need when playing this song live. That takes the pace out of the song like crazy, and even makes the instrumental bit feel like it's going nowhere.
But imo it's not the instrumental bit, it's the cut afterwards before the song kicks in again.

[Sixtease]

Wait, wouldn't the "Tickle Section" (as JP and JR call it) in "Lost Not forgotten" be the most technically insane instrumental moment on the entire album? I'm pretty sure that JP and JR admitted that it gave them the hardest time to get right. This also leads me to believe that this section's technicality is what is preventing DT from performing it live.

Please, where did JP and JR talk about it? And where in the song is the tickle section? I'm burning with curiosity.

[Elite]

The tickle section is the weird part in the beginning, from the heart I'd say starting around 1:50.
As to where they said it, I don't know.

[Sixtease]

Oh right, I should have figured. That was the part when my GF fled the room, tearing her hair off when I first listened to the album. :-) Romantic memories.

[The Silent Cody]

I join in to the conversation IMO the most brutal hard technical parts from ADTOE are in Lost In Forgotten ("The tickle section") and instrumental part of Outcry. Outcry instrumental part is longer, although tickle section consists of two parts which are practicaly the same. It's very very hard to play, but there's a pattern there, in Outcry we have changes, changes and changes, even to many changes for me That's why people seeing connections with TDOE, it's in constant motion....

[KevShmev]

It is definitely right up there with TDOE in terms of complexity.  Who really cares which one is "more complex?"  How would you even measure that anyway?  But one of the things that blows me away with the instrumental section of Outcry is that it is up there with the most complex passages DT has ever done, and yet it never feels like you have meandered very far enough from the main themes of the song.  All the way through, that instrumental feels like it belongs there.

Totally agree.  It fits the rest of the song perfectly.

And the piano part Rudess plays from 6:25 to 6:30 is one of the best things he has ever done with the band.  The way that piano part expands, it's like seeing a flower open up.  That might sound corny, but that is the best way I can describe it off the top of my head.  And that piano part actually goes on for another 10 seconds or so, but those first five seconds are aural bliss. 

[bosk1]

That flower image is a perfect description of that part. 

[hefdaddy42]

That flower image is a perfect description of that part. 

[KevShmev]