Update on the supposed legal issues regarding the DT/Portnoy split

[zxlkho]

Classy move Mike.


Also inb4 the lock.

[orcus116]

I looked up the Rogers/Floyd feud.  The parallels are creepy.

And hasn't MP always said that he philosophically sided with Waters?

Well their personalities are quite similar.

[Madman Shepherd]

Can't Roadrunner do something? Don't they technically own Dream Theater right now?

You would think so. They're probably the second biggest name on that label after Slipknot now. A change of name would be disastrous for both band and label.

However, Portnoy left out of his own volition. Surely that means he knowingly loses out on any rights he had on the name, as he is not in the band anymore. Much like when someone leaves a company and forfeits their stake of bonus money or so on and so forth. MP is maybe due royalties from the back catalogue but the name is the band. Much like when DS/KM left, they got a lump sum in place of royalties. If it's done by founder members, surely JM and/or JP could buy him out with some assistance from the label?

When Rod Evans and Nick Simper were kicked out of Deep Purple, they still got a profit from the sales of future albums (until Rod Evans screwed it up by forming a bogus Deep Purple).  Of course, they got kicked out...they didn't leave voluntarily.  

So it isn't unprecedented for a former member to be entitled to shares of the profit but I'm not positive about the circumstances.  I doubt Derek Sherinian or Kevin Moore got any future profits though....

In fact, in Lifting Shadows DT said they were afraid DS was going to sue but it never happened and they remained friends.  

[Aniland]

I need to get Lifting Shadows.

[ReaPsTA]

I looked up the Rogers/Floyd feud.  The parallels are creepy.

And hasn't MP always said that he philosophically sided with Waters?

I feel like this might have happened but I don't remember.  Wouldn't be surprised.

Also, why don't KM and DS make royalties from the material they wrote?  This makes zero sense to me.

[Aniland]

I thought DS didn't write anything?

[Jarlaxle]

I haven't brushed myself on all the rules of the forum in awhile, but why would this thread be locked?

[Aniland]

Discussion is generally forbidden if I understand correctly.

[robwebster]

Right - I'm not going to get embroiled in this discussion, because frankly we're discussing a poor translation of a translated article, so we've got two layers of stained glass between us and any truth, and that's before any of us applied our own conjecture...

With regards to rights, though, you may need to register, but this website might shed a little light onto proceedings:

https://www.warnerchappell.com/smartsearchresult.jsp?searchText=dream%20theater&SearchType=all&country=US#

Click "Dream Theater" under artist and you get a list of all the songs, and - I think - the licence holders. 6:00, for instance, lists WB MUSIC CORP as owning a 100 (per cent, presumably) share.

Click "IMAGE AND LIKENESS OF DREAM THEATER" and you get a very ambiguous page which looks like it's classified.

[orcus116]

I haven't brushed myself on all the rules of the forum in awhile, but why would this thread be locked?

Because the word "slander" on this forum has a thousand different definitions.

[Aniland]

Whoa @ the WB thing.

[zxlkho]

I haven't brushed myself on all the rules of the forum in awhile, but why would this thread be locked?

Because the word "slander" on this forum has a thousand different definitions.

Yeah, this.

[Adami]

I thought DS didn't write anything?

He wrote a good amount of music on FII. In fact I'm pretty sure musically, Anna Lee was all him.

[Mladen]

I looked up the Rogers/Floyd feud.  The parallels are creepy.

And hasn't MP always said that he philosophically sided with Waters?

That's different, because Pink Floyd without Waters kinda sucked. DT without Portnoy will be either just as good or better.

[Aniland]

Seriously? I thought that was JLB, which is why it's nearly the same melody as "Medicate Me?"

HAPPY 1300

[Adami]

Seriously? I thought that was JLB, which is why it's nearly the same melody as "Medicate Me?"

HAPPY 1300

JLB wrote the vocals.

[Aniland]

I thought the whole thing was his... the vocals or the lyrics?

[Madman Shepherd]

I looked up the Rogers/Floyd feud.  The parallels are creepy.

And hasn't MP always said that he philosophically sided with Waters?

I feel like this might have happened but I don't remember.  Wouldn't be surprised.

Also, why don't KM and DS make royalties from the material they wrote?  This makes zero sense to me.

Let me clarify:

I'm sure they do get royalties from the material they were on and the things they contributed.  

But, royalties work in several ways.  You can get writing royalties, performance royalties, and I'm no legal expert but you can also get royalties simply stemming from your participation in the entity of the band such as Rod Evans and Nick Simper meaning, you built it and if you are fired, rather than having a long drawn out process which would hypothetically lead the court to decide you are owed X amount of money, they can simply pay you off and give you a small percentage of future profits so you know you can rely on a yearly check to come in and help off set expenses.  

Lifting Shadows did not go into much detail but I'm assuming DS and KM do get royalties for what they contributed (writing and probably performance royalties) but that's it and there were never any lawsuits to decide on additions percentages that the band and management didn't offer up in the first place.  

[Ħ]

I haven't brushed myself on all the rules of the forum in awhile, but why would this thread be locked?

From what I know, nothing is inherently wrong with the thread topic or OP, but usually when things get out of hand (like lots of people bashing MP), and 20 people are in the ban-zone, then the thread gets locked.

[Aniland]

It's criticism of his actions in most people's cases. 

[robwebster]

Right - I'm not going to get embroiled in this discussion, because frankly we're discussing a poor translation of a translated article, so we've got two layers of stained glass between us and any truth, and that's before any of us applied our own conjecture...

With regards to rights, though, you may need to register, but this website might shed a little light onto proceedings:

https://www.warnerchappell.com/smartsearchresult.jsp?searchText=dream%20theater&SearchType=all&country=US#

Click "Dream Theater" under artist and you get a list of all the songs, and - I think - the licence holders. 6:00, for instance, lists WB MUSIC CORP as owning a 100 (per cent, presumably) share.

Click "IMAGE AND LIKENESS OF DREAM THEATER" and you get a very ambiguous page which looks like it's classified.

Incidentally, if anyone can't get in yet, the pages look a bit like this...



I presume they'll have the same setup across the board. Keeping an eye out for any differences.

[Aniland]

Kevin Moore? Super outdated.

Also, Myung's middle name is Ro?

[Jarlaxle]

Kevin Moore? Super outdated.

Also, Myung's middle name is Ro?

It's for 6:00

Super up-to-date

[Aniland]

Just noticed the little blue 6:00 in the corner.

[Gadough]

Kevin Moore? Super outdated.

Also, Myung's middle name is Ro?

Maybe now we can start calling him JRM instead of JMX...because JMX makes no damn sense.

[Madman Shepherd]

James's last name is Brie?

[Ħ]

hef's here.  everybody hide

[hefdaddy42]

It's criticism of his actions in most people's cases. 

It isn't criticism of actions, it is outright bashing or otherwise acting like a dick.

I haven't seen anything ban-worthy or lock-worthy yet.

And WTF H

[millahh]

The band name was also spelled "dream theatre"...

[robwebster]

Interestingly (or not!), A Nightmare to Remember, for instance, is divided thusly:

WB MUSIC CORP.   70
WARNER-TAMERLANE PUBLISHING CORP.   30

And the publishers are...

NAME   / SOCIETY / CONTROL
Ytse Jams, Inc. / ASCAP / Y
Wb Music Corp. / ASCAP / Y
Key Wiz Music / BMI / Y
Warner-Tamerlane Publishing Corp. / BMI / Y

So it's a little more complex, as late.

[Aniland]

He's been here.

[wasteland]

God, Brie, Kevin James La is the best thing I've seen today.

and what the hell does "collectively Pka Dream Theatre" mean? This page is weird to say the least.

[JayOctavarium]

Interestingly (or not!), A Nightmare to Remember, for instance, is divided thusly:

WB MUSIC CORP.   70
WARNER-TAMERLANE PUBLISHING CORP.   30

And the publishers are...

NAME   / SOCIETY / CONTROL
Ytse Jams, Inc. / ASCAP / Y
Wb Music Corp. / ASCAP / Y
Key Wiz Music / BMI / Y
Warner-Tamerlane Publishing Corp. / BMI / Y

So it's a little more complex, as late.

Key Wiz? is that like jordan or something?

[ZeppelinDT]

Man... the degree of pure speculation being treated as absolute fact here is insane.  I'm guessing that their lawyers probably told them to not give any details of the lawsuit(s) and to just to respond that way whenever the issue came up.  If an interviewer says "So I hear Portnoy is suing you for X, Y and Z", and instead of denying it they respond by saying "There are legal issues, but we can't talk about them", that doesn't necessary mean X, Y and Z are correct just because they weren't denied.  It's possible that it just means they can't talk about it.

[ZeppelinDT]

God, Brie, Kevin James La is the best thing I've seen today.

and what the hell does "collectively Pka Dream Theatre" mean? This page is weird to say the least.

I'm assuming "pka" stands for "performing known as"