Rotating set lists (updated spoilers)

[ResultsMayVary]

Wow, I hadn't realized the next leg of the tour had started. That is one kickass setlist. A Fortune in Lies is a real surprise. I'm really happy Surrounded is back in, and The Root of All Evil is an interesting add too (as well as a really ballsy way to swiftly end the rumors that DT won't be playing material with lyrics by MP).

The Dark Eternal Night gets a spot right after Surrounded in the B setlist, which is the same place it was in for the Rosemont show on the Chaos in Motion tour. It's just interesting to me that they're sticking with such a funny transition. And The Spirit Carries on gets the pre-Breaking All Illusions spot it always deserved, so that's good.

Overall, DT has got some really awesome sets here, and I'm bummed I won't be witnessing them.

Don't forget The Root of All Evil's new and EPIC ending. Holy shit, it's awesome.

[theseoafs]

Wow, I hadn't realized the next leg of the tour had started. That is one kickass setlist. A Fortune in Lies is a real surprise. I'm really happy Surrounded is back in, and The Root of All Evil is an interesting add too (as well as a really ballsy way to swiftly end the rumors that DT won't be playing material with lyrics by MP).

The Dark Eternal Night gets a spot right after Surrounded in the B setlist, which is the same place it was in for the Rosemont show on the Chaos in Motion tour. It's just interesting to me that they're sticking with such a funny transition. And The Spirit Carries on gets the pre-Breaking All Illusions spot it always deserved, so that's good.

Overall, DT has got some really awesome sets here, and I'm bummed I won't be witnessing them.

Don't forget The Root of All Evil's new and EPIC ending. Holy shit, it's awesome.

WHAT? I must go listen.

[ResultsMayVary]

Wow, I hadn't realized the next leg of the tour had started. That is one kickass setlist. A Fortune in Lies is a real surprise. I'm really happy Surrounded is back in, and The Root of All Evil is an interesting add too (as well as a really ballsy way to swiftly end the rumors that DT won't be playing material with lyrics by MP).

The Dark Eternal Night gets a spot right after Surrounded in the B setlist, which is the same place it was in for the Rosemont show on the Chaos in Motion tour. It's just interesting to me that they're sticking with such a funny transition. And The Spirit Carries on gets the pre-Breaking All Illusions spot it always deserved, so that's good.

Overall, DT has got some really awesome sets here, and I'm bummed I won't be witnessing them.

Don't forget The Root of All Evil's new and EPIC ending. Holy shit, it's awesome.

WHAT? I must go listen.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nAw7ZyVigiQ

^Ask and you shall receive

[BlobVanDam]

Don't forget The Root of All Evil's new and EPIC ending. Holy shit, it's awesome.

For real real? What is it?

[ResultsMayVary]

Don't forget The Root of All Evil's new and EPIC ending. Holy shit, it's awesome.

For real real? What is it?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nAw7ZyVigiQ

Bam.

[theseoafs]

That ending is RIDICULOUS, man. More or less what I was expecting but it's very powerful. It also feels good to have that song end with some resolution; the ending on the submediant is just a bummer when played live.

[ResultsMayVary]

That ending is RIDICULOUS, man. More or less what I was expecting but it's very powerful. It also feels good to have that song end with some resolution; the ending on the submediant is just a bummer when played live.

Yea, it's great. Makes me want them to play Octavarium RIGHT after it.

[The Letter M]

That ending is RIDICULOUS, man. More or less what I was expecting but it's very powerful. It also feels good to have that song end with some resolution; the ending on the submediant is just a bummer when played live.

Yea, it's great. Makes me want them to play Octavarium RIGHT after it.

Or BEFORE it...still waiting for them to play TROAE after 8VM (or at very least, "Razor's Edge").

-Marc.

[theseoafs]

That ending is RIDICULOUS, man. More or less what I was expecting but it's very powerful. It also feels good to have that song end with some resolution; the ending on the submediant is just a bummer when played live.

Yea, it's great. Makes me want them to play Octavarium RIGHT after it.

Or BEFORE it...still waiting for them to play TROAE after 8VM (or at very least, "Razor's Edge").

-Marc.

That would just... be gross. Octavarium's job is to close the set. I feel like that's what it's engineered to do.

[BlobVanDam]

Don't forget The Root of All Evil's new and EPIC ending. Holy shit, it's awesome.

For real real? What is it?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nAw7ZyVigiQ

Bam.

Thanks. Nice I didn't have to skip through anything!
I actually prefer the original ending tbh. I like the full band participation, but the way the chord progression is looped makes it sound less interesting (they should have stuck with the full melody loop like in Octavarium rather than this more repetitive loop that is an awkward mismatch of the major and minor key bars), and now it sounds a bit too similar to some of their other "epic" endings.
I don't hate it, but I do think the original ending works better overall.

[ResultsMayVary]

That ending is RIDICULOUS, man. More or less what I was expecting but it's very powerful. It also feels good to have that song end with some resolution; the ending on the submediant is just a bummer when played live.

Yea, it's great. Makes me want them to play Octavarium RIGHT after it.

Or BEFORE it...still waiting for them to play TROAE after 8VM (or at very least, "Razor's Edge").

-Marc.

That works, too. But will they honestly ever play Octavarium, but not as the encore? It seems like that hope would be a lost cause, imho.

[theseoafs]

Thanks. Nice I didn't have to skip through anything!
I actually prefer the original ending tbh. I like the full band participation, but the way the chord progression is looped makes it sound less interesting (they should have stuck with the full melody loop like in Octavarium rather than this more repetitive loop that is an awkward mismatch of the major and minor key bars), and now it sounds a bit too similar to some of their other "epic" endings.
I don't hate it, but I do think the original ending works better overall.

The chords here are exactly the same as 8V's, if my ears are correct. There shouldn't be a mismatch because TROAE and 8V are in the same key, and the actual chords sort of straddle the line between major and minor anyway.

[BlobVanDam]

Thanks. Nice I didn't have to skip through anything!
I actually prefer the original ending tbh. I like the full band participation, but the way the chord progression is looped makes it sound less interesting (they should have stuck with the full melody loop like in Octavarium rather than this more repetitive loop that is an awkward mismatch of the major and minor key bars), and now it sounds a bit too similar to some of their other "epic" endings.
I don't hate it, but I do think the original ending works better overall.

The chords here are exactly the same as 8V's, if my ears are correct. There shouldn't be a mismatch because TROAE and 8V are in the same key, and the actual chords sort of straddle the line between major and minor anyway.

Oops, you're right. I was thinking it was doing M,m,M,M instead of the usual M,m,M,m, but it still is. It just puts me off hearing the exact same 2 bar loop instead of the whole 4 bar phrase. It's the added repetitiveness of the melody that makes this ending weaker imo. Had they went with the same 4th bar as the Octavarium melody to keep the original 4 bar phrase, then this ending could be possibly better than the original piano only outro, but as it is, I prefer the original.

[antigoon]

I really love the original outro; I think it's masterful. This is pretty cool, too.

[nobloodyname]

I don't hate it, but I do think the original ending works better overall.

Absolutely. Although I suppose I would say that, since I was lucky enough to see the song played five times in support of Octavarium, culminating with the incredibly goosebumpy moment of it being played at Radio City. Remember the way the crowd errupted to this day as the song finished.

Anyway, for me, it simply didn't need extending.

[ZirconBlue]

1 and B?

I usually use A and 2, but thought I'd switch it up a little.

[Ben_Jamin]

I don't hate it, but I do think the original ending works better overall.

Absolutely. Although I suppose I would say that, since I was lucky enough to see the song played five times in support of Octavarium, culminating with the incredibly goosebumpy moment of it being played at Radio City. Remember the way the crowd errupted to this day as the song finished.

Anyway, for me, it simply didn't need extending.

You do know Mangini, was the one who made it epic, with his great fills.

[KevShmev]

I think that new ending to Root.. is great, and a definite upgrade over the original ending, which always sounds unfinished because of the way the piano stops in the middle of the progression.  I get why they did that, but when listening to the song on its own, it is a very unsatisfying ending.

[Implode]

And TROAE ends on the note that's the tonal center of Repentance.

[The Letter M]

And TROAE ends on the note that's the tonal center of Repentance.

Actually, I doubt they did that in foresight considering the music for the latter was written two years after the former. They just wrote "Repentance" to 'connect' to the end of "The Root Of All Evil", and the intro may be the tonal center of the last note of TROAE, but it then drops to B (to be in the same key, I believe, as "This Dying Soul", where that riff comes from).

As for the "new ending", it's nice that they took the rather obvious "Octavarium"-ish ending and tacked it to the end of TROAE, it gives it a better "EPIC ENDING OMG ROXXOR" feeling, and I like the cool fills by MM. Good stuff, DT!

I'm glad they're not afraid to mess with the songs, and I'm glad they're fiddling with endings, like the "new" ending to "Learning To Live" they did last year.

-Marc.

[Ħ]

The studio version works well in the context of the album.  The live version works well in the context of a live performance.  Well done, DT.

[snapple]

dat endingggg

[JayOctavarium]

Oh my God!

[Jaq]

Holy shit, epic ending is epic. Nice fills by MM there!

[hefdaddy42]

Had they went with the same 4th bar as the Octavarium melody to keep the original 4 bar phrase, then this ending could be possibly better than the original piano only outro, but as it is, I prefer the original.

If they did that, it would BE the Octavarium melody.

[BlobVanDam]

Had they went with the same 4th bar as the Octavarium melody to keep the original 4 bar phrase, then this ending could be possibly better than the original piano only outro, but as it is, I prefer the original.

If they did that, it would BE the Octavarium melody.

It IS the Octavarium melody already. That's the entire point of the section. All they're doing here is truncating it to looping the first 2 bars instead of the whole 4 bar pattern.

[hefdaddy42]

*shrugs*

To me, the way they've done it ALLUDES to Octavarium, but isn't EXACTLY Octavarium.  It's cool.  Of course it would have worked that way, too.

It's fine.

[BlobVanDam]

It was the exact same melody as the very end of Octavarium anyway. The only difference is that TROAE doesn't resolve back to the root note (so just the one note added to the end). And this new ending still plays that exact melody on the last bars anyway. It just loops it shorter beforehand.
I just don't see why they shortened it to a less interesting and more monotonous loop. It's not bad, but I don't see how it's better than the original version at all.

[Mladen]

The Dark Eternal Night gets a spot right after Surrounded in the B setlist, which is the same place it was in for the Rosemont show on the Chaos in Motion tour. It's just interesting to me that they're sticking with such a funny transition.

I just watched a youtube video with both Surrounded and TDEN, and I realized how awesome that transition is. You've got that beautiful James & Jordan moment, and then BANG, a heavy riff. 

[Implode]

Had they went with the same 4th bar as the Octavarium melody to keep the original 4 bar phrase, then this ending could be possibly better than the original piano only outro, but as it is, I prefer the original.

If they did that, it would BE the Octavarium melody.

It IS the Octavarium melody already. That's the entire point of the section. All they're doing here is truncating it to looping the first 2 bars instead of the whole 4 bar pattern.

Well it's not exactly the Octavarium melody. Octavarium goes (in scale degrees) 5 3 2 1   5 b3 2 1, and TROAE goes 5 4 3 1   5 4 b3 1.

[BlobVanDam]

Well it's not exactly the Octavarium melody. Octavarium goes (in scale degrees) 5 3 2 1   5 b3 2 1, and TROAE goes 5 4 3 1   5 4 b3 1.

Oh yeah, you're right. Completely forgot that! Nice catch. I was only thinking of the phrasing of the 4 bar pattern with the 4th bar doing the 1 2 3b 4 5 (6) run, which is the bit I wish they'd kept in the repeating loop.

[axeman90210]

Like the new ending, and this thread reminded me that I hadn't checked out any of the new setlists. Seeing 6:00 on there means I'll definitely be at at least one show for the next US leg.

[KevShmev]

Okay, so now that the set list for this summer appears to be mostly static thus far, I thought it was good time to bump this thread.

[Implode]

I know the members have said in the past that they like the static set lists a bit more because it lets them be much more confident in performances.

At the same time, I wonder if they ever get tired playing the same songs every night.

[bosk1]

Hmm...