Over two years after Black Clouds & Silver Linings released and I have to say..

[MegaDTSX]

...that the first ~3 minutes and the last ~3 minutes of the song are some of the best song writing this band has put out in its history.  Hate on that if you will, just know that I'm a big fan and love many songs from each album.  

**WAY LATE EDIT**



I was talking about The Count of Tuscany.

[darkshade]

Yes, Black Clouds & Silver Linings is a great song

[DarkEternalNight]

My track ends suddenly. Anyone have this problem?

[Implode]

Actually, after the 6 minutes of seagulls at the end of TCOT is the real ending to PMU.

[Vajra]

The Count of Tuscany, I assume...

I'd say the first 10 minutes of the song are some of the best they've ever done. The heavy verse is amazing. The last 3 minutes is also epic.

[WDADU]

Black Clouds And Silver Linings is actually one of my favourite records from them, to be honest. I can understand where some people may shy away from the heavy material, but I thought that it was their best album since Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence and is probablt placed an number four for my favourite Dream Theater record. The Count Of Tuscany is easily, in my opinion, the best song that they have written in a long time and is probably in my top three (at least top five) favourite songs of theirs.

I can't speak for anybody, but I think with Black Clouds And Silver Linings, they really knocked it out of the park--which is something that I most definitely cannot say about Systematic Chaos.

[darkshot]

Yeah ANTR is an amazing opening song especially live, just rocks the adrenaline.  And TCOT is a fantastic ending song to the album and to a show.  Everything in between those 2 songs on the album are hit and miss for me, but still good.

I can see why people hate TCOT's lyrics because they are kinda cheesy, but personally I enjoy them, it is fun to listen to and proves DT doesn't need to write serious songs every time.  Musically however it is a masterpiece in my book.

[TheGreatPretender]

There is no such thing as a bad Dream Theater album. There are just awesome ones, and slightly less awesome ones, hahah.

[FlyingBIZKIT]

There is no such thing as a bad Dream Theater album. There are just awesome ones, and slightly less awesome ones, hahah.

This. I love every album. I love my least favorite, WDADU, and I love the rest as well.

[TheGreatPretender]

The thing is, regardless of how "uninspired" people claim Silver Linings may be, it's still better than most of the stuff that comes out these days.

[darkshot]

The thing is, regardless of how "uninspired" people claim Silver Linings may be, it's still better than most of the stuff that comes out these days.

Yeah I've seen a lot of people get a little carried a way when they talk about how they HATE certain DT albums.  Maybe a few of them legitimately hate them, and that's fine, but I think a lot people need to take a step back and remember what you are comparing it to.

If you took all the best bands in the world and compared them to each other, there would be a best and "worst" band.  But the worst is still the worst of the best.  When you compare the worst of the best to the rest of the world, its still pretty damn good.

[TheGreatPretender]

Yeah I've seen a lot of people get a little carried a way when they talk about how they HATE certain DT albums.  Maybe a few of them legitimately hate them, and that's fine, but I think a lot people need to take a step back and remember what you are comparing it to.

If you took all the best bands in the world and compared them to each other, there would be a best and "worst" band.  But the worst is still the worst of the best.  When you compare the worst of the best to the rest of the world, its still pretty damn good.

And even then, "Best" is a matter of opinion. The Beatles sold over, what? 600,000,000 records? I still wouldn't say there's anything too spectacular about their music. And that's just my opinion. So it's really impossible to say who's "The Best".

[darkshade]

I think ANTR, TSF, TBOT, and TCOT are some of DT's most memorable material. Wither is an ok song, I enjoy it when it's on. SC was heavy and in your face, but a lot of it loses its charm a little too easily; with some exceptions...

I still listen to BC&SL with the same excitement I did when it was the new album. Can't say that about SC, or even 8V (though I love 8V)

[SystematicThought]

There is no such thing as a bad Dream Theater album. There are just awesome ones, and slightly less awesome ones, hahah.

This. I love every album. I love my least favorite, WDADU, and I love the rest as well.

You two have obviously never listened to Systematic Chaos 

[FlyingBIZKIT]

Systematic Chaos is right above WDADU.

[TheGreatPretender]

You two have obviously never listened to Systematic Chaos 

Har, har. My third favorite, and by far the most underrated DT album. So tharr.

[SystematicThought]

Most underrated is Falling Into Infinity and Train of Thought in my opinion. The production of SC is just horrible and the album has wasted opportunities. I'm glad you two like it though.

[FlyingBIZKIT]

Most underrated is Falling Into Infinity and Train of Thought in my opinion. The production of SC is just horrible and the album has wasted opportunities. I'm glad you two like it though.

Yeah, I love FII. Systematic Chaos was good, but only had a few of my favorites. Repentance and ITPOE

[manticore999]

Absolutely horrible album IMO. Not one song worth listening to. Better to just forget it ever existed!

[TheGreatPretender]

Absolutely horrible album IMO. Not one song worth listening to. Better to just forget it ever existed!

Most underrated is Falling Into Infinity and Train of Thought in my opinion. The production of SC is just horrible and the album has wasted opportunities. I'm glad you two like it though.

Yeah, I love FII. Systematic Chaos was good, but only had a few of my favorites. Repentance and ITPOE

Yeah, but FII still gets its due praise around here. Whereas Systematic Chaos gets stiff like that . ^

[pmahoney1337]

Never thought about that... I agree with you for the most part. I assume you mean the first and last 3 minutes of each song, not of the album.

[setrataeso]

And even then, "Best" is a matter of opinion. The Beatles sold over, what? 600,000,000 records? I still wouldn't say there's anything too spectacular about their music.

I was on your side until you mentioned this. Failure.

BC&SL has not aged well for me. I really don't find myself loving it as much as other DT releases. They were clearly trying too hard to make the album they thought the fans wanted, and I really don't think it turned out to be the golden disc we were all hoping for.
It was pretty much the starting point for my diminishing interest in DT. I don't have very high expectations for ADTOE, so I'm hoping to be surprised.

[legenden1]

It´s a good album but it´s probably on the lower half in the discography. I never could get into TCOT, before hearing it I was expecting a true epic but to me it failed terribly. It hasnt got anything of the golden formula that made the other epics incredible.

[toro]

It´s a good album but it´s probably on the lower half in the discography. I never could get into TCOT, before hearing it I was expecting a true epic but to me it failed terribly. It hasnt got anything of the golden formula that made the other epics incredible.

What formula?

[Aniland]

Yes, Black Clouds & Silver Linings is a great song

I appreciate your post.

[MegaDTSX]

Sorry for the mass confusion guys. I meant the first and last 3 minutes of The Count of Tuscany. I also love ANTR and TSF a lot on Black Clouds,
But roughly the first and last 3 minutes of The Count of Tuscany are some of their best writing IMO.



I was kinda drunk earlier and thought I'd typed it out better lol.

[?]

BC&SL was my first DT album! At first it was 5th in my ranking but it has dropped down to the 8th position. Listening now, I have to complain about the boring bass parts (fortunately Myung seems much more inspired now) and the fact that they kinda "played it safe" on this album; if you listen to the whole DT discography in chronological order, you won't find many surprises on BC&SL, maybe apart from the blastbeats in ANTR and the Bebot solo in AROP. It's still MUCH better than SC, though.

[MegaDTSX]

BTW I think their best overall epic song is A Change of Seasons by far, but again I was talking more about the opening and closing of TCoT.

[ariich]

Black Clouds And Silver Linings is actually one of my favourite records from them, to be honest. I can understand where some people may shy away from the heavy material, but I thought that it was their best album since Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence and is probablt placed an number four for my favourite Dream Theater record. The Count Of Tuscany is easily, in my opinion, the best song that they have written in a long time and is probably in my top three (at least top five) favourite songs of theirs.

I can't speak for anybody, but I think with Black Clouds And Silver Linings, they really knocked it out of the park--which is something that I most definitely cannot say about Systematic Chaos.

All of this, except it's number 3 for me. Well said!

[stryker]

BC&SL has not aged well for me. I really don't find myself loving it as much as other DT releases. They were clearly trying too hard to make the album they thought the fans wanted, and I really don't think it turned out to be the golden disc we were all hoping for.
It was pretty much the starting point for my diminishing interest in DT.

Pretty much this!  I saw someone earlier say Whither is just "ok" compared to the other songs on the album.  To me it's the best song on this record.

[Dream Team]

It´s a good album but it´s probably on the lower half in the discography. I never could get into TCOT, before hearing it I was expecting a true epic but to me it failed terribly. It hasnt got anything of the golden formula that made the other epics incredible.

What formula?

This. Their epics are incredible because they are so different, there is no formula.

[Addy]

TCOT is a great and epic song, but the lyrics ruin it... I mean, the story IMO is ridiculously bad (seems like JP really had a writers block ). Well, actually most of BC&SL is ruined by lyrics and Portnoy's I-wanna-be-a-lead-singer-and-growler kind of attitude. Songs like TCOT, ANTR, TBOT would be on my top 15-20 list if they had good lyrics. The only song I like from start to finish is Wither.

[Guitalguy]

BCSL is one of my favorite albums, in fact. And TCOT is one of my favorite songs by DT. I think the whole song is amazing, maybe not the instrumental sections before the verses, but still very good. Have been trying to learn some of it on guitar, and that's some difficult sh*t.

I think that's some of the beauty with DT, that there's almost no albums that everyone agrees is their best, or worst. Everyone obviously likes different albums.

Regarding the SC-discussion, I don't think it's their best, but I really like both ITPOE-parts, TDEN, and, believe it or not, The ministry of lost souls.

But well, I love every DT-album.

[Guitalguy]

Pretty much this!  I saw someone earlier say Whither is just "ok" compared to the other songs on the album.  To me it's the best song on this record.

I can't really compare Wither to the rest of the songs, I mean, it's a really great song, and I really like it. But it's just a standard 4-chord, and that can't really overcome the epics lik TCOT or ANTR. Besides AROP all the songs are long and progressive, and Wither, imo, is just a little too simple compared to the other songs.

With that being said, i really like the song, and I think it's great that DT has a little bit of both, and just not only long, progressive epics.

[Lumiukko]

TCoT got it's place in my personal Top 10 DT songs. Yes, lyrics are kind of dull, but the musical content over compensates that.
About SC, I have been trying to enjoy some of those songs since I heard for the first time, but I couldn't. TMoLS, TDEN, PoW seems to be the most close that they have gotten from being considered uninspired. Although I like ITPoE a lot. That "servants of the falling..." part is very great.
BC&SL seems to go that same direction but the were a lot more inspired.