Popular DT songs you don't "get"

[Perpetual Change]

Peruvian Skies. I really strongly dislike that song, even though it often gets grouped in with FII's good stuff. For me, that song is the boring template for future songs like "The Ministry of Lost Souls."

The Best of Times. Portnoy's just kinda ruin the song for me. I know they're important to him, but forcing myself to like them reminds me of the time people would say we should publish material in the campus literary magazine just because it was about a tragic even in someone's life. I'll pass. Musically I guess it's just OK. Petrucci's star-power solo is just enough to keep the band from failing.

Space-Dyed Vest. It tries way to hard to sound sad and depressing.

[Seventh Son]

Peruvian Skies. I really strongly dislike that song, even though it often gets grouped in with FII's good stuff. For me, that song is the boring template for future songs like "The Ministry of Lost Souls."

Space-Dyed Vest. It tries way to hard to sound sad and depressing.

im mad

[orcus116]

Space-Dyed Vest. It tries way to hard to sound sad and depressing.

I'm sorry but you seemed to have gotten Space-Dye Vest confused with Disappear.

[legenden1]

Blind faith - the chorus is just too weak
Stream of conciousness - boring
Ytse jam - maybe not that popular
The count of Tuscany - A big letdown. Not even close to the other epics
In the name of God - The chorus is weak and doesn´t fit the verse

This being said, DT has never made a weak album, have been my favourite band for 18 years and will probably be forever

[Ħ]

Blind faith - the chorus is just too weak
The count of Tuscany - A big letdown. Not even close to the other epics
In the name of God - The chorus is weak and doesn´t fit the verse

[Lowdz]

The solo for Under A Glass Moon is amazing. The song doesn't really get started until like three minutes in though, which kind of hurts it imo

I think what I don't like about it is that it sounds a bit disjointed, as though it's here's the Steve morse bit, here's the SRV bit, here's the Yngwie bit... but I still think it may be just that I don't like the song.

I love Peruvian Skies though.

[John94]

These Walls just does not float my boat. Don't know why, never really grown on me. Whereas I Walk Beside You and The Answer Lies Within (Eventually) grew on me.

[LieLowTheWantedMan]

I'm the opposite of what most people think about UaGM. The solo is overrated, but the rest makes it my favourite I&W song.

[RG93]

These Walls just does not float my boat. Don't know why, never really grown on me. Whereas I Walk Beside You and The Answer Lies Within (Eventually) grew on me.

*high-fives*

[ricky]

8vm. It's a fine song, but I don't understand people who think it's the greatest thing DT has ever done.

+1

[?]

8vm. It's a fine song, but I don't understand people who think it's the greatest thing DT has ever done.

+1

This.

[Perpetual Change]

Space-Dyed Vest. It tries way to hard to sound sad and depressing.

I'm sorry but you seemed to have gotten Space-Dye Vest confused with Disappear.

Dude, every time I mention something I don't like, you mention some other random thing and say "well at least it's better than that!" Lol. Seriously, though, Disappear is great. I don't know why anyone would compare them, though.

[Gorille85]

Space-Dyed Vest. It tries way to hard to sound sad and depressing.

I'm sorry but you seemed to have gotten Space-Dye Vest confused with Disappear.

whaaaaaat? dude! it's my favorite DT song!

[Perpetual Change]

My only problem with SDV is that it realies to heavily on the samples for its power. If you took the samples out, the sound would just seem kinda dumb.

[orcus116]

Space-Dyed Vest. It tries way to hard to sound sad and depressing.

I'm sorry but you seemed to have gotten Space-Dye Vest confused with Disappear.

Dude, every time I mention something I don't like, you mention some other random thing and say "well at least it's better than that!" Lol. Seriously, though, Disappear is great. I don't know why anyone would compare them, though.

Not really random since the two seem to be the ones compared to each other. SDV is the Moore era piano ballad and Disappear is the Rudess era piano ballad. There's even been heavy debate in the past, er, "Blob era" with very split camps. I do like both songs, honestly, it's just that I feel that SDV shows more genuine emotion and sadness created out of its atmosphere and composition than Disappear does. I guess I've got kind of a touchy defense mechanism on that song in particular because Blob would keep harping on how stupid of a song it was because "lol it's a guy crying over a girl in a magazine". I'd still say that, artistically speaking, it's probably the most serious and authentic song released under the Dream Theater name.

My only problem with SDV is that it realies to heavily on the samples for its power. If you took the samples out, the sound would just seem kinda dumb.

That's such a dumb thing to say. Take any track or part out of a song and it'll most likely suffer.

[Perpetual Change]

I'll admit I used to listen to the samples in SDV because I wanted to figure out what they were, and see how they related to the song's meaning. But I don't like them, and I'm just pointing out that the song would sound naked without them. Now I just see SDV as like a horrible, downtrodden ending to what is otherwise DT's best album.

I don't know why that's dumb. Would you agree more if I had made a statement like "My problem with The Dark Eternal Night is Portnoy's vocals. The song would sound a lot better without them."

[orcus116]

The Dark Eternal Night would sound a lot better without The Dark Eternal Night 

I can agree the reasoning behind the samples is a little offputting for some. I really like it in context with the song (flipping channels out of sheer boredom) because it adds a whole new artistic dynamic that hasn't been seen much in any Dream Theater songs.

[IdoSC]

There are 4 DT songs I don't get, popular or not. TDEN, Repentance, You Not Me (You or Me) and A Rite of Passage.
TDEN is a decent song but I really can't feel connected.

Repentance, again, is nice, but I'd have loved it if it was shortened to like 5 minutes (verse, chorus etc+solo, without all the quotes). I just don't like that whole part...and even then, it's not anything unique in terms of DT songs.

You or Me is definitely better in the demo version, but yet, nothing special.

And finally, A Rite of Passage, that both lacks (in my opinion, once again, in terms of DT songs) originality, and in this case I don't like the lyrics or the solo either. The solo is nice for headbanging if you're in an actual show, but other than that...can't relate to it much.

Oh and also, I don't have anything against SDV but I do find it overrated sometimes...personally Disappear is probably my favorite ballad, while SDV is somewhere in the middle.

[Tick]

I'm such a die hard fan I hate to criticize songs but one song that was meant to be an epic but comes off as cheesy for me is The Great Debate.

[m0hawk]

A Change of Seasons.

Seriously, what the hell? There are some really cool moments in the song, and individually, I think they would have been good songs, but as a whole, it just.....doesn't....flow that well. Don't get me wrong, I do like some parts of the song, but the instrumental section(s) are quite weak, really. To me, it's a good first attempt at an epic. NOTHING MORE. For people to say it is better than Octavarium, Six Degrees or The Count of Tuscany is quite strange. It's like they haven't even heard the other epics 

That said, I have only heard the studio version. Apparently the live version craps all over the studio version. Do you think this will sway me to orgasm over the song as much as you guys?

[?]

A Change of Seasons.

Seriously, what the hell? There are some really cool moments in the song, and individually, I think they would have been good songs, but as a whole, it just.....doesn't....flow that well. Don't get me wrong, I do like some parts of the song, but the instrumental section(s) are quite weak, really. To me, it's a good first attempt at an epic. NOTHING MORE. For people to say it is better than Octavarium, Six Degrees or The Count of Tuscany is quite strange. It's like they haven't even heard the other epics  

IMO Octavarium intro drags on, ACOS doesn't have that problem at any part. You said ACOS doesn't flow well. IMO it flows much better than 6DOIT. The Count of Tuscany... I don't think I need to say anything about that.

[LieLowTheWantedMan]

I'm such a die hard fan I hate to criticize songs but one song that was meant to be an epic but comes off as cheesy for me is The Great Debate.

Long song =/= epic

And I'm confused about the above comment. Are you saying The Count Of Tuscany does not flow well? I think it has a brilliant flow to it.

[orcus116]

Maybe he was referring to "The Count Of Tuscany" being a better epic than "A Change Of Seasons"? His response didn't flow as well as m0hawks. I mean it was a good first attempt at a response though.

[Perpetual Change]

I've always thought that A Change of Seasons, though great, is a little disjointed. The production isn't very good and the instrumental sections also kinda suffer from "Yar guys! I'm using a 7 string!" *Chugga chugga chugga* Though I like the LSFNY version MUCH better than the studio one on the EP.

Octavarium, on the other hand, flows very well. The only part which really ever catches me off guard is the 2nd chorus of Medicate, where John hits the distortion pedal. I always think that 2nd chorus sounds a little strange.

As for Tuscany, nothing really throws me off about the flow, the I guess the first verse kinda seems odd after the intromental. I've said it a couple times, and I'll say it again: Tuscany is Dream Theater's "Gates of Delirium." It's not as good as some of their other epics, but it's still pretty damn satisfying. I'd probably rank ACOS of seasons a bit higher than it on most days.

[orcus116]

I've never thought of "A Change of Seasons" as disjointed but then again I don't think of "Scarred" as disjointed either so my auditory perception is on some bizarre frequency. It's pretty seemless for the most part aside from the two transitions into the heavy parts but those don't really bother me. Could have something to do with my getting used to it having never heard any prog before Dream Theater so I just guessed it was the norm. On the other hand I can clearly hear the transitions into sections of "Octavarium" which has always bugged me. It'd be dumb to call it disjointed but it seems so rigidly segmented that there's no real gap in between. Minor things, though.

[Seventh Son]

A Change of Seasons.

Seriously, what the hell? There are some really cool moments in the song, and individually, I think they would have been good songs, but as a whole, it just.....doesn't....flow that well. Don't get me wrong, I do like some parts of the song, but the instrumental section(s) are quite weak, really. To me, it's a good first attempt at an epic. NOTHING MORE. For people to say it is better than Octavarium, Six Degrees or The Count of Tuscany is quite strange. It's like they haven't even heard the other epics 

That said, I have only heard the studio version. Apparently the live version craps all over the studio version. Do you think this will sway me to orgasm over the song as much as you guys?

I don't think ACOS is the #1 DT song like a lot of people seem to, but its definitely top 20 material for me. It flows a lot better than say The Count of Tuscany or Six Degrees does (Count starts off great, but the middle part is kind of meh until it gets to the synth section which is really badass and ends great; while Six Degrees starts off great until about The Test That Stumped Them All where its a bit meh after that. Goodnight Kiss solo is still great though! But the ending to Six Degrees leaves a lot to be desired). I really love Octavarium and I feel it flows perfectly but I can see why people wouldn't like it as much as the other mega-epics. I've said it before, but as a whole epic, In The Presence of Enemies is extremely disappointing. Part 1 is  great but Part 2 drags on for far too long (Take out Reckoning alone and I'd like it a lot more). ITPOE wouldn't even make my top 50.

Maybe he was referring to "The Count Of Tuscany" being a better epic than "A Change Of Seasons"? His response didn't flow as well as m0hawks. I mean it was a good first attempt at a response though.

I've never thought of "A Change of Seasons" as disjointed but then again I don't think of "Scarred" as disjointed either so my auditory perception is on some bizarre frequency. It's pretty seemless for the most part aside from the two transitions into the heavy parts but those don't really bother me. Could have something to do with my getting used to it having never heard any prog before Dream Theater so I just guessed it was the norm. On the other hand I can clearly hear the transitions into sections of "Octavarium" which has always bugged me. It'd be dumb to call it disjointed but it seems so rigidly segmented that there's no real gap in between. Minor things, though.

I think Scarred has amazing flow, a lot better than some recent DT songs do. I'd love it if Scarred were longer, actually. One of my favorite 10+ minute songs by them. Scarred just might be borderline top 10 for me.

[j]

A Change of Seasons.

Seriously, what the hell? There are some really cool moments in the song, and individually, I think they would have been good songs, but as a whole, it just.....doesn't....flow that well. Don't get me wrong, I do like some parts of the song, but the instrumental section(s) are quite weak, really. To me, it's a good first attempt at an epic. NOTHING MORE. For people to say it is better than Octavarium, Six Degrees or The Count of Tuscany is quite strange. It's like they haven't even heard the other epics 

That said, I have only heard the studio version. Apparently the live version craps all over the studio version. Do you think this will sway me to orgasm over the song as much as you guys?

Whoa.  Well, lyrically, it's simply no contest, but I assume that's not what you were referring to.  But I think ACoS has mostly brilliant instrumental passages as well, and is better musically overall.  I can see your point about the flow--it does seem a bit disjointed at times--but with those other songs you mentioned each having glaring flaws, ACoS still easily comes out on top.

I don't think ACOS is the #1 DT song like a lot of people seem to, but its definitely top 20 material for me. It flows a lot better than say The Count of Tuscany or Six Degrees does (Count starts off great, but the middle part is kind of meh until it gets to the synth section which is really badass and ends great; while Six Degrees starts off great until about The Test That Stumped Them All where its a bit meh after that. Goodnight Kiss solo is still great though! But the ending to Six Degrees leaves a lot to be desired). I really love Octavarium and I feel it flows perfectly but I can see why people wouldn't like it as much as the other mega-epics. I've said it before, but as a whole epic, In The Presence of Enemies is extremely disappointing. Part 1 is  great but Part 2 drags on for far too long (Take out Reckoning alone and I'd like it a lot more). ITPOE wouldn't even make my top 50.

Totally agree about TCoT.  I think 6DOIT is pretty up-and-down, with the lowest points being War Inside My Head and The Test That Stumped Them All.  It has a pretty good ending, IMO.  I do like Octavarium a lot, but it's just not as "gripping" as DT's really great stuff and it has a couple of weaker sections.  I'd probably rank it around #10 or so.  I also agree about ITPOE, although it might make my top 50.

I've never thought of "A Change of Seasons" as disjointed but then again I don't think of "Scarred" as disjointed either so my auditory perception is on some bizarre frequency. It's pretty seemless for the most part aside from the two transitions into the heavy parts but those don't really bother me. Could have something to do with my getting used to it having never heard any prog before Dream Theater so I just guessed it was the norm. On the other hand I can clearly hear the transitions into sections of "Octavarium" which has always bugged me. It'd be dumb to call it disjointed but it seems so rigidly segmented that there's no real gap in between. Minor things, though.

I think Scarred has amazing flow, a lot better than some recent DT songs do. I'd love it if Scarred were longer, actually. One of my favorite 10+ minute songs by them. Scarred just might be borderline top 10 for me.

I definitely understand the opinion that Scarred (and ACoS to an extent) are "disjointed".  In the case of Scarred, that actually adds to the song for me, given the subject matter.  Scarred is definitely in my top 5 DT songs, despite it taking months and months to finally grow on me.  It contains some of DT's very best and most unorthodox musical ideas.

-J

[Tick]

I'm such a die hard fan I hate to criticize songs but one song that was meant to be an epic but comes off as cheesy for me is The Great Debate.

Long song =/= epic

I kind of feel when a song is that long, that's what its going for? Anyway, call it an epic, or just a regular song, whatever. Either way, I think it misses the mark. I find all the soundbites in the beginning a bit cheesy. Also, Labrie singing "LIFE TO SAVE LIFE! LIFE TO SAVE LIFE!" is a bit like nails on a blackboard. Its one of the very few DT songs I can skip on an album. That being said, I still don't completely hate the song.

[jcmistat]

Scenes From a Memory - Used to think it was the best DT album but its lost its touch. I can't listen to these songs individually anymore they don't hold up. The whole "concept" thing was cool but it got boring. Six Degrees is my favorite album and song and I like the mini concept way better telling multiple stories related to one topic.

Falling Into Infinity - I would consider this album underrated because I think the general consensus is dislike more than like. But I don't get why people like this album. The sound quality is really good especially Myung's bass but none of the songs aside a few make me think of DT. I only listen to Hollow Years (Budokan) the studio version doesn't come close. He'lls Kitchen is the only studio track I listen to regulary now. Lines in the Sand lost it for me but the solo still never fails.

Lifting Shadows off a Dream - I'll have to give this song a listen again but I've never enjoyed it

Space Dye Vest - I'll never understand the why anyone likes this song Vacant is way better anyways and transitions into a beast of a song.

Octavarium - the tribute part is still iffy, funny because I never really noticed it until I read up on the lyrics now I can't unhear them. Touted as one of their best songs, hell no I don't think it makes top 30 maybe 40 on my list.

[Tick]

Scenes From a Memory - Used to think it was the best DT album but its lost its touch. I can't listen to these songs individually anymore they don't hold up. The whole "concept" thing was cool but it got boring. Six Degrees is my favorite album and song and I like the mini concept way better telling multiple stories related to one topic.

Falling Into Infinity - I would consider this album underrated because I think the general consensus is dislike more than like. But I don't get why people like this album. The sound quality is really good especially Myung's bass but none of the songs aside a few make me think of DT. I only listen to Hollow Years (Budokan) the studio version doesn't come close. He'lls Kitchen is the only studio track I listen to regulary now. Lines in the Sand lost it for me but the solo still never fails.

Lifting Shadows off a Dream - I'll have to give this song a listen again but I've never enjoyed it

Space Dye Vest - I'll never understand the why anyone likes this song Vacant is way better anyways and transitions into a beast of a song.

Octavarium - the tribute part is still iffy, funny because I never really noticed it until I read up on the lyrics now I can't unhear them. Touted as one of their best songs, hell no I don't think it makes top 30 maybe 40 on my list.

Wow, I don't agree with any paragraph. That's ok, we all like what we like.

[lord-ruler]

6:00 is so bad that there are some Depeche mode songs that rank higher than it. I don't hate "these walls" but I dont see what is so special about it either.  "Backwards Song" is just pointless.  I hope DT has gotten all their growling vocal songs out of their system.  James Labrie was meant to sing. I will also add that the Lyrics cause "Octavarium" fall several spots down my best D.T song list.  I really do not like the part when they start naming old songs like Lucy in the sky with Diamonds and any Pink floyd reference instantly makes a song lose points in my book.  The lyrics to "the count of Tuscany" on the other hand are perfect.   A top 5 D.T song.

[Ħ]

6:00 is so bad that there are some Depeche mode songs that rank higher than it. I don't hate "these walls" but I dont see what is so special about it either.  "Backwards Song" is just pointless.  I hope DT has gotten all their growling vocal songs out of their system.  James Labrie was meant to sing.

WTF to the first.  WTF to the second.  WTF to the third (Gnos Sdrawkcab?).  FTW to the fourth and fifth.

[Seventh Son]

Space Dye Vest - I'll never understand the why anyone likes this song Vacant is way better anyways and transitions into a beast of a song.

Because its one of the darkest, saddest, and most depressing things they've done and it doesn't really sound like anything else they've done? (Which isn't a bad thing either).

[guysullavin]

A Change of Seasons.

To me, it's a good first attempt at an epic. NOTHING MORE.

Dream Theater had 2 Epics before ACOS came around, The Killing Hand and Metropolis P1.

[kingsXrocks]

the count of tuscany.. yes it has its moments but it really doesn't hold a candle to octavarium or a change of seasons...it's just goofy IMO..


their last 2 albums have had this goofy vibe.. like trying to be more metal than they really are. get back to six degrees or scenes from a memory.. last time they were relevant was octavarium.. just sayin y'all...