Author Topic: Marillion  (Read 158129 times)

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Offline romdrums

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Re: Marillion
« Reply #1750 on: September 19, 2022, 11:47:54 AM »
On all things HiE related:

I think the electronic drums were only used on the singles, as I've noticed a difference between the three singles (Cover My Eyes, No One Can, Dry Land) and the rest of the album in terms of the drum sound.  Everything else was Ian's acoustic kit.

Speaking of the desire for hit singles, I know H likes to play it off like it's not a big deal, but I really do think he wanted a greater degree of fame than he got. Maybe it's me, but I've always sensed a hint of envy in songs like Deserve, 3-Minute Boy, etc, or even in interviews where he mentions people like Sting.  He tries to play it off, but there's always a little bit of jealousy in his musings on fame.

I was so used to the American track listing that hearing the remaster with the original order threw me off for a long time.  I ended up making a playlist from the late 90's remaster series that had the US running order.  I like the flow with Cover My Eyes and No One Can kicking off the album and then the drastic feel change with Splintering Heart.  Feels kinda similar to the feel change from Jigsaw into Emerald Lies on Fugazi.

Stads mentioned Tony Banks, and I think Steve Rothery is very much the Tony Banks of Marillion, as in, the band doesn't do what Steve doesn't want to do. 

As far as Mark being the main prog guy in the band, I think that was most evident in the live versions of the This Town trilogy.  They usually stretched out The Rakes Progress live (they did when I saw them on the TourFund tour), and that's when Mark got to get in some of the more "widdly bits" as he calls them.  Otherwise, he's pretty low key on HiE. Hogarth, I think he's into the proggy, experimental stuff as well, but I think he comes from a different approach than Mark.  I think that's why he and Richard Barbieri work well together outside of the band. 

Beyond that, I love the parallels between the 4 Fish albums and the first 4 Hogarth albums.

Script and Seasons: First album for each singer.  Lots of material written prior to member(s) joining.  A few 8 minute epics.
Fugazi and Holidays: Difficult second album, kinda short on material for both, pressure to live up to the prior album.
Misplaced and Brave: Concept albums with children as part of the theme.  Band is unified in terms of the direction. 
Clutching and AOS: Thematically linked albums concerned mainly with the darker side of fame.  Big changes lurking around the corner for the band.   

Though we live in trying times, we're the ones who have to try. -Neil Peart, 1952-2020.

There is a fundamental difference between filtered facts and firehosed opinions. -Stadler.

Online HOF

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Re: Marillion
« Reply #1751 on: September 19, 2022, 12:25:27 PM »
I definitely think H wanted to be a rock star/pop star, and that you can hear that play out in his music. He talks about it somewhat frequently on his podcast. At this stage in life, I think he appreciates that not becoming big and famous actually contributed to his and the bandís longevity, and their ability to make music on their own terms without having to consider popular appeal and record company demands, etc. But there is still a hint of Uncle Rico when he talks about it. I think generally Afraid of Sunlight was sort of his coping mechanism, and you still hear him talk about avoiding the perils of fame today. Itís an ďI may not be famous, but Iím not in jail, playing in a sandbox, or dead!Ē sort of thing. I also think he got a lot of personal satisfaction out of the band playing the Royal Albert Hall, which might have been the closest thing to ďarrivingĒ in his career.

Offline romdrums

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Re: Marillion
« Reply #1752 on: September 19, 2022, 01:22:37 PM »
@HOF.  Great observations!  Also, because of that longevity, one could argue that their current profile is as high as it's been since the Fish years.  Seeing a band like them still producing valid work is its own selling point.  Regardless of what I think of their last few albums, I also feel the fact that they haven't succumbed to being a nostalgia act is one of the driving forces behind their higher profile now.
Though we live in trying times, we're the ones who have to try. -Neil Peart, 1952-2020.

There is a fundamental difference between filtered facts and firehosed opinions. -Stadler.

Offline Stadler

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Re: Marillion
« Reply #1753 on: September 19, 2022, 01:43:40 PM »
Speaking of the desire for hit singles, I know H likes to play it off like it's not a big deal, but I really do think he wanted a greater degree of fame than he got. Maybe it's me, but I've always sensed a hint of envy in songs like Deserve, 3-Minute Boy, etc, or even in interviews where he mentions people like Sting.  He tries to play it off, but there's always a little bit of jealousy in his musings on fame.

I TOTALLY agree with this.   

Quote
Script and Seasons: First album for each singer.  Lots of material written prior to member(s) joining.  A few 8 minute epics.
Fugazi and Holidays: Difficult second album, kinda short on material for both, pressure to live up to the prior album.
Misplaced and Brave: Concept albums with children as part of the theme.  Band is unified in terms of the direction. 
Clutching and AOS: Thematically linked albums concerned mainly with the darker side of fame.  Big changes lurking around the corner for the band.

And this too!!

Offline romdrums

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Re: Marillion
« Reply #1754 on: September 25, 2022, 05:47:51 PM »
Got the HiE package this weekend, and I watched the documentary this morning, and then played the album and the live set this afternoon. The documentary was pretty cool.  Nothing too surprising, but it was cool to hear that Ian had the most sympathy for H during the early writing stages because he had worked in a similar fashion prior to joining Marillion during the Fugazi sessions.  It was also interesting to hear Rotheryís comments on things, as it seems heís not really happy with how the album turned out aside from his solos.  The remix of the album is refreshing though, as I feel it adds the edge to the material developed in a live setting, as well as some added punch in the drums.  And the live set included is really solid as well.  My only complaint being that Hís voice and style doesnít really play well with the melodies Fish sang on Blind Curve and Lords of the Backstage.  Otherwise, itís great to hear H in his prime vocally.  He was my favorite singer for so many years, and is still, in my opinion, one of the greatest frontmen of all time.
Though we live in trying times, we're the ones who have to try. -Neil Peart, 1952-2020.

There is a fundamental difference between filtered facts and firehosed opinions. -Stadler.

Offline ytserush

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Re: Marillion
« Reply #1755 on: October 01, 2022, 08:37:38 PM »
Ghosts of Pripyat is pretty good. Not sure itís anything that would blow you away but it has a certain moodiness and atmosphere to it. I personally like the two The Wishing Tree albums a lot, but your interest level would probably depend on what you think about Hannah Stobartís voice.

Mark Kellyís Marathon was interesting to me, but I canít say itís my favorite thing ever. There is one really good track (Puppets) that features some nice Steve Rothery solos though, which is pretty much worth the price of admission

I like Ghost of Pripyat (and less so the Wishing Tree albums)but I really love Rothery's Live releases from that album....Live in Rome and Live in London. Also love the Edison's Children releases and Postmankind. I can't wait for the next one and would really love his band to play some gigs in the US.

Offline ytserush

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Re: Marillion
« Reply #1756 on: October 01, 2022, 08:48:41 PM »
On all things HiE related:


Speaking of the desire for hit singles, I know H likes to play it off like it's not a big deal, but I really do think he wanted a greater degree of fame than he got. Maybe it's me, but I've always sensed a hint of envy in songs like Deserve, 3-Minute Boy, etc, or even in interviews where he mentions people like Sting.  He tries to play it off, but there's always a little bit of jealousy in his musings on fame.



That was the one thing that never sat well with me with Hogarth live, at least the early years live. He didn't seem to me to be on the same wavelength as the rest of the band. As time went on I think he seemed to make peace with it.

Offline ytserush

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Re: Marillion
« Reply #1757 on: October 01, 2022, 08:58:38 PM »
As far as the reissue itself goes, I changed things up a bit with this one. Instead of diving straight into the live material like I usually do I listened to the remix a bunch of times first and I while there's a few things that we changed that I didn't like, I think the remix is mostly and improvement of the original. It sounds less dated and more organic. The doc was OK but I kind of get annoyed that they take a lot of the liner notes straight from the doc which to me comes off as a bit lazy. it's going to be great to dig into the live material which I know is going to be great.

Offline ytserush

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Re: Marillion
« Reply #1758 on: October 01, 2022, 09:07:56 PM »
For someone that grew up in the Fish era - I bought Misplaced Childhood upon release, more or less - and was thrilled with both Season's End and Vigil In A Wilderness Of Mirrors, I can't tell you how disappointing the one-two punch of Internal Exile and Holidays In Eden were.  What happened to my heroes, that so effortlessly put out powerful, deep material like Slainte Mhath, and King Of Sunset Town and View From The Hill?   Internal Exile showed just how badly Fish needed the "base" of Marillion, and Holidays showed just how badly Marillion wanted to have hit singles (maybe, just maybe, Fish was right in that whole blowup that led to his leaving!)

I experienced this exact same thing, but for me it happened an album later with Brave and Songs From The Mirror. Those albums are what stopped me from being the collector I had been. The subsequent albums (Afraid Of Sunlight and Suits) were marginal improvements Fortunately both Fish and the band seemed to get back on the rails with Sunsets On Empire and This Strange Engine which I think are both top albums.

Offline XeRocks81

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Re: Marillion
« Reply #1759 on: October 19, 2022, 02:27:47 PM »
just got the Deluxe Holidays in Eden in the mail today. Canít wait to dig into it later. The live
stuff has been my favourite bits of these reissues as well. 

Offline ytserush

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Re: Marillion
« Reply #1760 on: November 12, 2022, 05:15:50 PM »
just got the Deluxe Holidays in Eden in the mail today. Canít wait to dig into it later. The live
stuff has been my favourite bits of these reissues as well.

The live material is great. Steven W. Taylor did a great job with the studio album too. In most cases, I didn't like much of the remixes, but in this case I do.