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Offline PetFish

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Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe thread v3 (no recent spoilers)
« Reply #1715 on: March 17, 2021, 10:30:25 PM »
We already know Quaritch is coming back. I'm really curious to see how that happens. In A1 he said in his opening monolog that the arrows of the Na'vi were dipped in a neurotoxin that will stop a heart in one minute. Well.. he got shot with two of them in his heart, so I'm pretty sure he's toast. There's a chance that what was shot was a human avatar, but I'm not convinced of that because of the scars on his head.

One thing I'm *REALLY* tired of is characters not staying dead.  There's absolutely no weight to their deaths any more.  Now they're bringing Han back in the next Fast and Furious with some bullshit.  I've been guaranteeing my friends that Gal Gadot will also not be dead somehow.

Your Quaritch theory is interesting, and plausible, since avatars have already been established.



I'm not sure why you assume that their motivations are anything other than what they appear to be.  Frankly, the lack of background/motivation for Quaritch is a legitimate criticism.  And if a critic has issues with the same things that other people do, then there is a reason that everyone has issues with that thing, whatever it is.

The fact that you like, or even love, a film doesn't mean that critics are wrong when they take issue with certain things in the film.  It means that you aren't judging the film by the same standards that they are, or that, for you, the film works, despite the fact that it doesn't for others.  This happens literally ALL THE TIME.  There are critically acclaimed films that I can't watch all the way through, and there are films that I hold close to my heart that were critically reviled.

No problem.  Maybe I just can't articulate my point effectively.  Thanks.

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1716 on: March 18, 2021, 02:16:44 AM »
I love all the action in AVATAR. The way you can actually see exactly what's happening.

Not like a Michael Bay movie where they can't be bothered choreographing a scene so they zoom right in and shake the camera around instead.

Offline bosk1

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1717 on: March 18, 2021, 09:12:57 AM »
^That is a good point.  Also, the immersive nature of the film.  You don't necessarily have to watch it in 3D to get that immersive feeling.  The way it was shot, and the overall cinematography are built around immersing you in this beautiful alien world that Cameron constructed.  And that is all perfectly brilliant. I have to acknowledge that.  I have to give props for it.  And then when you add the 3D layer on top, I have to praise that as well.  As has been pointed out ad nauseum, it was just done so well, and was made part of the experience rather than simply a gimmick to make the audience oooh and ahhh when the random object seemingly hurls out of the screen directly at them.  It didn't rely on 3D as a cheap gimmick the way a lot of 3D films have.  It was used extremely well.  The film deserves its praise for all of that.

But at the end of the day, even giving props for all of that, it still doesn't change my overall feelings for the film.  I'm still left with:  Yeah, I liked it well enough.  It was good, as far as summer action blockbusters go.  Maybe even really good.  But not something that hooks me the same way as a lot of other films or film franchises.  I just can't put it on the same level as, say, Star Wars, or the MCU, or the LOTR films (originals, not The Hobbit trilogy, which was good, but also largely a hot mess).  I guess I'd probably put it up there with the Harry Potter films.  In the same way, I can appreciate those.  And I can watch each of them a few times and enjoy them well enough.  But they are nothing I am interested in watching over and over again, and very little that resonates on a very deep emotional level.
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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1718 on: March 18, 2021, 01:04:27 PM »
Because Jim Cameron waited about 12 years for the tech to catch up to what he wanted instead of using shoddy 3D tech in 1999 when he originally wanted to start Avatar.

Which is why I can't wait for Avatar 2. It's mo cap underwater - which has never been done before. And again - Jim waited for the tech to catch up to his vision

instead of rushing out Avatar 2 and 3 ASAP for the easy $. It confuses the fuck out of me when people say he's just cashing in.

Cashing in ? By waiting 13 years to release Avatar 2 instead of completely half-arsing it in 2 years and basically making the same film again ?

Ok. ???

---

I think Avatar 2 will either be mind blowing and be a 2.5 billion dollar movie - or it will visually stunning as per usual but people won't be as into it and it will make around $1.5bn.

I predict that 2 will do really good numbers and then the rest will make incrementally smaller box office.

I think Chino will refute it - but I think if Avatar 2 and 3 don't perform THAT well - then 4 and 5 might not see a cinema release.

Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1719 on: March 18, 2021, 01:23:27 PM »
I think Chino will refute it - but I think if Avatar 2 and 3 don't perform THAT well - then 4 and 5 might not see a cinema release.

I'd say there's a near zero probability of that happening. For one, they'll already be done by the time A3 wraps up it's theatrical run. Disney has already staggered their Christmas releases for the next decade to alternate between Avatar and Star Wars. I doubt they're going to deviate from that schedule. Remember, Disney just sunk like $3B into building amusement parks for both of those franchises. They need to keep supporting those for a time.   

Also, it's important to note, Disney will still make money of A4 and A5 even if they "flop". I imagine each of those movies would still make $300M-$400M a piece in a worst case scenario, which would still be profitable for Disney.

Offline PetFish

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1720 on: March 18, 2021, 11:22:16 PM »
I love all the action in AVATAR. The way you can actually see exactly what's happening.

Not like a Michael Bay movie where they can't be bothered choreographing a scene so they zoom right in and shake the camera around instead.

Exactly.  Why waste all that time and effort to make nice choreography if you're so zoomed-in all the time to the point where I can barely tell who's punching whom?

I love Michael Bay (shaddap) movies for a lot of reasons but hate them for this exact reason.  I've watched the final fight in Revenge of the Fallen a million times and I'm still trying to figure out what's actually happening.  Move the camera back and let us breathe and take-in the big picture of the fight once in a while.

Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1721 on: June 08, 2021, 10:50:09 AM »
I guess it's World's Oceans Day, and in celebration Jon Landau shared this piece of concept art from the sequels.


Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1722 on: June 09, 2021, 07:01:00 AM »
I'll probably watch these films if they ever come out. Loved the first one. Love James Cameron. But i'm not counting the days.



But you just know Avatar haters will rush to their computers to call Avatar 2 a MASSIVE FLOP LOL if it makes less than $3bn

Offline soupytwist

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1723 on: June 09, 2021, 07:26:23 AM »
First one was a great cinema experience, but a pretty average film when I tried to rewatched at home.  The constant narration is a strange choice too.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2021, 07:39:58 AM by soupytwist »

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1724 on: June 09, 2021, 09:35:00 AM »
I'll be the first to admit that I don't understand the love some people have for it, but I could also say the same for other films, and I'm sure that other people could say the same about films that I love.

Cameron is really swinging for the fences here, so even if it's just out of respect for the audacity, I wish him success.
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Offline bosk1

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1725 on: June 09, 2021, 09:48:10 AM »
But you just know Avatar haters will rush to their computers to call Avatar 2 a MASSIVE FLOP LOL if it makes less than $3bn

Yeah.  They might.  So what?  Is there any reason you seem to feel such a compelling need to point this out every time you post in this thread?
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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1726 on: June 09, 2021, 03:57:27 PM »
The same reason absolutely everyone disagrees with me every time I post anything I guess.

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1727 on: November 09, 2021, 07:13:13 AM »
" John Oliver takes aim at ‘Avatar’ sequels: “No one gives a shit” take as long as you want.."

Well clearly YOU do... :lolpalm:

Why else would you completely randomly say that?? :p  If we were inundated with Avatar sequels every year and Avatar news and updates every other day MAYBE i'd agree with you..

But it's been TWELVE years. Why would anyone still HATE Avatar this much after 12 years when there's been zero sequels so far and barely any news ?

What a strange thing to suddenly come out with.

Offline soupytwist

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1728 on: November 09, 2021, 07:33:23 AM »
Probably apathy is a better word too associate with Avatar?  To me it's one of those films that came, was huge (maybe because of the experience, rather than the story) then quickly fell out of public conscious.  From a personal experience, I enjoyed it at the cinema, but when I went to re watch it a couple of years later I don't think I even finished it.
I did very much enjoy the ride at Disney though, that was awesome - but didn't want to make me watch the film again though!
 

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1729 on: November 09, 2021, 07:37:34 AM »
If I don’t like a film - I accept it and move on  :justjen

Now I hope that Avatar 1-5 occupy all top 5 movies of all time.

Just to really annoy the people who bang on and on about how much they

hated that one film from 2009.

Offline soupytwist

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1730 on: November 09, 2021, 07:45:49 AM »
If I don’t like a film - I accept it and move on  :justjen

Now I hope that Avatar 1-5 occupy all top 5 movies of all time.

Just to really annoy the people who bang on and on about how much they

hated that one film from 2009.

Trying to fathom why things are so popular, yet seems so crap to us can be annoying - case in point (and this you'll agree with me) Ed Sheeran  ;D

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1731 on: November 09, 2021, 09:03:20 AM »
In that case - I can admit if I like a pop song - I have a massive Spotify playlist for all the POP songs I really like.

But _his_ pop songs are just so utterly generic. If they were great pop songs too ok fine. But they're really like bottom of the barrel least amount of effort "that will do."  :sadpanda:

Anyway - compared to Avatar - which took like 3 years of the top people in the industry working at the top of their game.

James Cameron spent like a YEAR in the motion capture space picking the shots for all the CG footage.

And as I said before - it's been TWELVE YEARS. If Jim Cameron was some greedy cash grabber - he could have EASILY crapped out two sequels by now for an easy payday.

Imagine it :

2012 : Avatar II : The Rise of Quaritch

2015 : Avatar III : The Battle for Eywa

:puke:

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1732 on: November 10, 2021, 09:41:24 AM »
" John Oliver takes aim at ‘Avatar’ sequels: “No one gives a shit” take as long as you want.."

Well clearly YOU do... :lolpalm:

Why else would you completely randomly say that?? :p 
Because we've been hearing about these sequels seemingly since the first film came out.

Announcement, linger, delay, linger, delay, delay, etc.

Just a useful piece of pop culture "We're still waiting" trivia to pluck from.  He could just as easily have referenced The Winds of Winter from George R. R. Martin. 
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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1733 on: November 10, 2021, 10:59:16 AM »
So in that case he DOES care and is...*checks notes* tired of waiting ?

Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1734 on: November 10, 2021, 11:16:05 AM »
" John Oliver takes aim at ‘Avatar’ sequels: “No one gives a shit” take as long as you want.."

Well clearly YOU do... :lolpalm:

Why else would you completely randomly say that?? :p 
Because we've been hearing about these sequels seemingly since the first film came out.

Announcement, linger, delay, linger, delay, delay, etc.

Just a useful piece of pop culture "We're still waiting" trivia to pluck from.  He could just as easily have referenced The Winds of Winter from George R. R. Martin.

It went more like:
1) Announcement there'd be two more movies
2) Linger
3) Delay
4) Announcement there'd be three more movies
5) Linger
6) Announcement there'd be four new movies 
7) Linger
8) Covid delayed production for 4 months
8.5) Cameron announces quite a while ago that 2 and 3 are done done.
9) Covid forced Disney to delay further because of their alternating Avatar/Star Wars holiday schedule for the next 8 years. They couldn't have both franchises release in the same December.

Not saying you are, but a lot of people give James shit for this project taking 12 years to come to fruition. They've done a terrible job at keeping the public up to date on what's to come (or maybe the public doesn't care). But I've conversed with many people that say something to the tune of "When's the sequel finally coming out?" and then they're shocked to hear there are actually four more films on the way.

I really hope the wait is worth it. I think writing and filming the rest of the franchise together is really going to make for a very polished end product. The CEO of AMC said he got a sneak peak at the second film last week and called it "mind blowing". I mean, I highly doubt the CEO of a theater chain is going to say anything that might sway someone to not see it in a theater, but still.

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1735 on: November 10, 2021, 11:35:51 AM »
So in that case he DOES care and is...*checks notes* tired of waiting ?
I doubt he cares very much at all.

I doubt very many people do, actually.  I think Cameron is going to have to re-stoke the fires that the original started.  It's been too damn long.  It was huge, for sure, but it was only one film.  It's not Star Wars, it's not the Avengers.

I mean, I'm not one of those longtime fans.  I am speaking as a mildly interested outsider.  I wish him well, and I hope the sequels turn out well.
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Offline jammindude

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1736 on: November 11, 2021, 05:40:28 AM »
It’s the Chinese Democracy of film at this point.
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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1737 on: November 11, 2021, 06:05:44 AM »
I'd agree if it was ONE film - but he's doing FOUR films. And they take THREE years each.

Of course i'd prefer it was JUST AVATAR 2 and 3. I'd be fine with two more.

Apparently if nobody really responds to 2 and 3 - he's gonna cancel 4 and 5.

I'd rather wait twelve years and be absolutely blown away than wait 2 years and get the exact same film again.

He's not Michael Bay. He originally wanted to make Avatar in like 1999 but the tech wasn't good enough for how realistic he wanted.

It wasn't until he saw Gollum in PJ's Lord Of The Rings that he knew the tech was good enough.

Plus Avatar 2 is reportedly the first movie EVER to use *underwater* motion capture. I'm very interested in how it's gonna look.

I'm not mad keen on the idea of 60 FPS because i thought The Hobbit looked like a TV show and that was 48 FPS.

Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1738 on: November 11, 2021, 06:16:14 AM »
I'd agree if it was ONE film - but he's doing FOUR films. And they take THREE years each.

Of course i'd prefer it was JUST AVATAR 2 and 3. I'd be fine with two more.

Apparently if nobody really responds to 2 and 3 - he's gonna cancel 4 and 5.

I'd rather wait twelve years and be absolutely blown away than wait 2 years and get the exact same film again.

Where does this idea come from? I've seen many people repeat this line, and I don't get why. 2 and 3 are already done, and 4 and 5 are well into development and will most likely be long done filming by the time the third film comes out. Disney sunk a stupid amount of money into a theme park around the franchise. They're not going to pull the plug and not release 4 and 5, especially if they're already near completion or done.

Quote
He's not Michael Bay. He originally wanted to make Avatar in like 1999 but the tech wasn't good enough for how realistic he wanted.

I think he actually wanted to make it prior to Titanic. I thought he had the script done in 1996 or so. Don't quote me on that though.

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1739 on: November 11, 2021, 07:00:49 AM »
I dunno i've seen it around a lot...

But i'd much rather he did 2 and 3 AND THEN wait to see if people want more.

Offline bosk1

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1740 on: November 12, 2021, 08:36:55 AM »
I'd rather wait twelve years and be absolutely blown away than wait 2 years and get the exact same film again.

That's all well and good, but I suspect that the end result will be something along the lines of:  We will have waited 12+ years, and while not getting the exact same film again, will have something far less than mind-blowing.  But beyond that, who can say?  It won't be for quite some time until we know whether Avatar will go down as a legendary franchise, a so-so franchise with some groundbreaking tech and effects, or something else. 
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Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1741 on: December 08, 2021, 05:54:05 AM »
Looks like the info train is starting to leave the station!   :corn I don't know if I want to take a peak or not when these issues drop.



Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1742 on: April 26, 2022, 12:59:30 PM »
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/avatar-2-cinemacon-james-cameron-1235131009/

Quote
While Disney is keeping tight-lipped, CinemaCon attendees are expected to get a first glimpse at James Cameron’s wildly anticipated Avatar sequels — the first of which is scheduled to open Dec. 16 — during its slate presentation Wednesday at the theater owners confab.


Offline MrBoom_shack-a-lack

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1743 on: April 26, 2022, 02:02:34 PM »
Are they pushing this for 3D or is that a thing of the past? I haven't followed this for a while.
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Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1744 on: April 26, 2022, 02:05:22 PM »
Are they pushing this for 3D or is that a thing of the past? I haven't followed this for a while.

Yes, with higher definition and quicker framerates as well.

Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1745 on: April 27, 2022, 11:13:34 AM »
I'd consider this as good as confirmation. I'm am so sour and jealous of these people right now! It's finally happening. After 13 freaking years, the sequel's footage is finally here :chino:


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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1746 on: April 27, 2022, 11:24:09 AM »
The first Avatar was probably Cameron's worst movie and the script/story/acting was super generic but I'll still probably watch the second one for the 'spectacle' alone. Besides Cameron has kinda earned my money after his strong 80s/90s run.

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1747 on: April 27, 2022, 11:55:17 AM »
Are they pushing this for 3D or is that a thing of the past? I haven't followed this for a while.

Yes, with higher definition and quicker framerates as well.
Ok, nice. Stupid question but will regular theaters play with that higher framerate or are we talking new gear for cinemas so to speak?
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Offline Chino

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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1748 on: April 27, 2022, 12:04:10 PM »
Are they pushing this for 3D or is that a thing of the past? I haven't followed this for a while.

Yes, with higher definition and quicker framerates as well.
Ok, nice. Stupid question but will regular theaters play with that higher framerate or are we talking new gear for cinemas so to speak?

They'll play whatever version they're able to play. If they have the projectors that play the high frame versions, that's what they'll go with. In 2009, basically every theater upgraded to the new 3D projectors specifically for Avatar.


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Re: Avatar
« Reply #1749 on: April 27, 2022, 12:06:03 PM »
My understanding is that the sequel is being made available in several formats, 3D, high framerate, various IMAX formats, etc..

This is the tweet I found regarding the release
Quote
Breaking AVATAR 2 news: NATO chief John Fithian in press session with #CinemaCon media just said that James Cameron's sequel  "will have more versions" than any movie in history: IMAX, 3D, PLF, high-res, high frames-per-second rate, variable sound systems, in 160 languages, etc.




It just means your theater will play whatever version is available to them.




EDIT: OH snap, not faster than Chino, and we referenced the same source!
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