Nightwish...

[The Curious Orange]

That was great, thanks for sharing! Has to be said, that's the first time I've seen footage of them and thought Floor was too good for the band...

[LithoJazzoSphere]

You weren't impressed with the '13 Wacken show?  Her renditions of favorites like "Storytime" and "She Is My Sin" blew me away.  I was already a big fan from her work with Star One, After Forever and such, but to me that's an all-time iconic performance. 

[Architeuthis]

Nightwish set at Pinkpop (Dutch festival), which is broadcast at Dutch television every year:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pF7ukkh9Qhw

This video likely won't last long, most Pinkpop recordings are removed from yt eventually.

And yeah, they sound great 

Dang, that is awesome!  I was only going to watch one song and I ended up watching the whole thing.   

[The Curious Orange]

You weren't impressed with the '13 Wacken show?  Her renditions of favorites like "Storytime" and "She Is My Sin" blew me away.  I was already a big fan from her work with Star One, After Forever and such, but to me that's an all-time iconic performance.

That's not what I'm saying, I'm saying the gulf between the band and the singer seems to have widened. They're not the same band they were, and frankly, these days Floor's too good for them. Tuomas just isn't writing songs to showcase what she can do. I can see her leaving for a solo career after this tour cycle.

[cramx3]

You weren't impressed with the '13 Wacken show?  Her renditions of favorites like "Storytime" and "She Is My Sin" blew me away.  I was already a big fan from her work with Star One, After Forever and such, but to me that's an all-time iconic performance.

That's not what I'm saying, I'm saying the gulf between the band and the singer seems to have widened. They're not the same band they were, and frankly, these days Floor's too good for them. Tuomas just isn't writing songs to showcase what she can do. I can see her leaving for a solo career after this tour cycle.

She stated multiple times recently that she will not be leaving Nightwish and she can handle both her solo and Nightwish.  Nightwish tends to go on long breaks between albums/tours so it makes sense to me that she can do both. 

Also, I don't agree one it that she's too good for them. 

[ErHaO]

Some context to the Pinkpop festival is that it is a non-metal festival with a varied audience. There are always some metal artists, notably also Metallica this year. But Nightwish had a a regular slot of an hour before the headliners, which is a big difference to the usual festivals they play at. At their normal concerts there is a bit more focus at the other members here and there. I will say that I really think Marko brought more balance to the band, by taking the center every now and then. And as fantastic as Floor sounds, in some moments the shift to a piece that was clearly written for a different range doesn't flow as well as having someone else sing it.

As for her solo stuff, you can actually compare because on the same day she had a solo set at Pinkpop: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7bnlzNBQ_A

It is good (though some mistakes here and there and some out of key moments), but I prefer the Nightwish set a great deal. I really disagree Nightwish does not use Floor well enough. A lot of songs fit in her range very well and she has made most of the songs her own. I listen to Nightwish live much more than any of their studio albums part because of it. And song from the latest two albums are a blast live. I saw her solo show two times. The first time was really amazing, the second time was good (which can be found on her channel), but I preferred the songs she picked for her first solo tour. Her solo work obviously has a different focus.

And I sincerely doubt Floor will quit Nightwish any time soon. She seems to have a blast, like the members and Nightwish is a big stadium band in Europe, maybe one of the biggest metal bands that isn't from the 80's.

[LithoJazzoSphere]

You weren't impressed with the '13 Wacken show?  Her renditions of favorites like "Storytime" and "She Is My Sin" blew me away.  I was already a big fan from her work with Star One, After Forever and such, but to me that's an all-time iconic performance.

That's not what I'm saying, I'm saying the gulf between the band and the singer seems to have widened. They're not the same band they were, and frankly, these days Floor's too good for them. Tuomas just isn't writing songs to showcase what she can do. I can see her leaving for a solo career after this tour cycle.

Ok, I can certainly agree on that.  I thought at first you meant that Floor was only finally starting to stand out now.  Yeah, I don't think the albums with her have utilized her talents very well.  Wishmaster was their peak, and they've kind of gradually slide down in quality for me since then, and I just haven't found Tuomas' writing compelling in awhile.  There are numerous lesser known symphonic metal bands I prefer over their newer releases.  Floor sounded much better in After Forever, Revamp, Star One, and Ayreon, though she still brings it live on Nightwish's older material. 

[Grappler]

Who says that Floor would even want to sing in an operatic style anymore?  Just because she can do it, doesn't mean she has to do it just for us....look at her new solo songs, which are much more pop oriented.

She seemed quite happy with the singing on the last two albums, and even adjusted songs like She is My Sin to feature more powerful vocals vs copying Tarja. 

[cramx3]

I mean, if you watched a live version of Shoemaker, I think you'd see her talents on full display.  I bet the reality is neither her nor the band want to go full on opera style like the past.  They migrated away from that style while Tarja was still in the band.

[425]

Yeah, I was going to say, there are passages on the latest album that definitely make full use of her voice, and Shoemaker was exactly what I had in mind. I sometimes wonder if people's expectations are a little bit off when thinking about immensely talented singers like Floor. I don't think it's realistic to expect any songwriter to craft material specifically designed for her to be doing vocal acrobatics all the time. That's making the song serve the singer instead of having the singer serve the song, which I think is the right approach (and is the approach taken by people who pride themselves as songwriters).

To be clear, I think I fall victim to skewed expectations of talented singers myself, but usually I'm able to adjust by asking myself what is reasonable to expect and whether the singer is doing a good job on the songs as they are written.

[gazinwales]

You weren't impressed with the '13 Wacken show?  Her renditions of favorites like "Storytime" and "She Is My Sin" blew me away.  I was already a big fan from her work with Star One, After Forever and such, but to me that's an all-time iconic performance.

That's not what I'm saying, I'm saying the gulf between the band and the singer seems to have widened. They're not the same band they were, and frankly, these days Floor's too good for them. Tuomas just isn't writing songs to showcase what she can do. I can see her leaving for a solo career after this tour cycle.

Ok, I can certainly agree on that.  I thought at first you meant that Floor was only finally starting to stand out now.  Yeah, I don't think the albums with her have utilized her talents very well.  Wishmaster was their peak, and they've kind of gradually slide down in quality for me since then, and I just haven't found Tuomas' writing compelling in awhile. There are numerous lesser known symphonic metal bands I prefer over their newer releases.  Floor sounded much better in After Forever, Revamp, Star One, and Ayreon, though she still brings it live on Nightwish's older material.

I think they peaked at Once, and almost got back with the two albums with Anette, which I play and enjoy far more than the two releases with Floor.
I'd love to know these lesser bands, do elaborate.

[425]

I think their peak era was Century Child through Imaginaerum. Those are my two favorite albums, and then the two in between are my 5th and 3rd favorites, with Oceanborn coming in at #4.

Wishmaster is actually, in my opinion, a lull in the quality of songwriting between two much stronger albums.

[LithoJazzoSphere]

I'd love to know these lesser bands, do elaborate.

Ad Infinitum, Blackbriar, The Dark Element, Dark Horse White Horse, Edenbridge, Eleine, The Gentle Storm, Imperia, Magnus Karlsson's Heart Healer, Kingfisher Sky, Kowai, Krypteria, Mortal Love, Nemesea, Anette Olzon, Ostura, Phantom Elite, Scardust, Stream of Passion, Unlucky Morpheus, and Visions of Atlantis are the first that come to mind. 

Wishmaster is actually, in my opinion, a lull in the quality of songwriting between two much stronger albums.

Man, even if "Crownless", "She Is My Sin", "Wishmaster", and "Wanderlust" were the only good songs on it it'd be hard to call it a lull for me. 

[425]

Crownless and Wanderlust are actually two of the songs that I don't much care for.

[ariich]

I'm going to offer a dissenting opinion and say that their two albums with Floor have been my favourites of the lot. For my tastes and interests, the band has (broadly speaking) got better and better.

[Architeuthis]

I'm going to offer a dissenting opinion and say that their two albums with Floor have been my favourites of the lot. For my tastes and interests, the band has (broadly speaking) got better and better.

Agreed!  I also love all the live releases with Floor singing the older songs. She's exactly what this band has been waiting for.. 

[MirrorMask]

I'd call Wishmaster the peak of the early era, full of youthful exuberance and enthusiasm. The debut was, well, a debut, Oceanborn I recognize it's good  but I personally like way more Wishmaster, the band was having a lot of fun there, they were young and hungry.

Then they went in pairs I  guess, adopting a style, or a singer, and perfectioning it. Bless the Child was a switch to a more melanchonic atmosphere, and then came the better Once. Then came Annette, with Dark Passion Play a stepping stone for Imaginaerum which is still my favorite Nightwish album. Then came Floor, and again I feel that EFMB was the "safe album with the new singer" and Human || Nature was them getting to know better the singer and going wild with it.

[cramx3]

I'm going to offer a dissenting opinion and say that their two albums with Floor have been my favourites of the lot. For my tastes and interests, the band has (broadly speaking) got better and better.

Agreed!  I also love all the live releases with Floor singing the older songs. She's exactly what this band has been waiting for.. 

I rate EFMB as my favorite NW album.  H2N is pretty good, but did not come to the level of EFMB to me. 

But if we are going to talk about NW's peak, it's probably right now considering thier popularity.

Also, love the last 3 live releases with Floor and Decades is incredible.

[gazinwales]

Marco Hietala has resurfaced with the Northern Kings, playing a festival gig in Finland.

[CrimsonSunrise]

I'm going to offer a dissenting opinion and say that their two albums with Floor have been my favourites of the lot. For my tastes and interests, the band has (broadly speaking) got better and better.

For the most part I agree.  I like the 2 Floor albums very much.  I also love Imaginerium and DPP.  What I rarely listen too is the early stuff which is not really my cup of tea.

[ErHaO]

Hellfest livestream starting right now: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYIX1Jyb64E

[MirrorMask]

Thanks for the tip!

[MirrorMask]

Damn, Floor is one of the best vocalists in metal right now.

Not women vocalists, just singers period. Top of the top of the class 

[ErHaO]

Damn, Floor is one of the best vocalists in metal right now.

Not women vocalists, just singers period. Top of the top of the class 

Agreed! She is in top form.

And Hellfest streams have been great. Watching it on my tv with stereo set and the production is great. Going to watch Epica after this (already aired) and the Blind Guardian stream will start later tonight 

[cramx3]

Damn, Floor is one of the best vocalists in metal right now.

Not women vocalists, just singers period. Top of the top of the class 

Agreed! She is in top form.

And Hellfest streams have been great. Watching it on my tv with stereo set and the production is great. Going to watch Epica after this (already aired) and the Blind Guardian stream will start later tonight 

Yeah, this festival has been epic for all of us who can't be there.  Ill check out more of the sets tomorrow

[MirrorMask]

Love Floor's contagious enthusiasm during I Want My Tears Back!!! that goes beyond her frontwoman duties, I'm 100% sure she's having legit super fun with that song.

[cramx3]

Love Floor's contagious enthusiasm during I Want My Tears Back!!! that goes beyond her frontwoman duties, I'm 100% sure she's having legit super fun with that song.

How can you not?  Song is just pure fun.

[MoraWintersoul]

Marco Hietala has resurfaced with the Northern Kings, playing a festival gig in Finland.

He's played shows with Raskasta Joulua too last year, performed a few songs at the closing of a legendary rock bar in Kuopio just a few months after he left Nightwish, and according to some collaborators' stories on Instagram last year, the second solo album is well under way. Think it's safe to say he only wanted to quit Nightwish in the end

Loved the Northern Kings videos though, everyone sounds so good. Take the gray hair and some wrinkles away and it's like no time has passed for them at all!

[MirrorMask]

Pity for Marco, Floor obviously carries the show but his absence is evident.

The new bassist looks like a session musician, which he basically is. I understand it would be weird if he'd run around like Steve Harris nor I expect him to, he's probably just happy to have gotten such a big gig and he just wants to do his job without coming across as arrogant or in need of attention, but during the live stream I remembered he was even there only when Floor was walking next to him.

[MrBoom_shack-a-lack]

It's always fun seeing Emppu next to Floor.

[MirrorMask]

It's always fun seeing Emppu next to Floor.

I have a photo from one of my shows when she almost kneels next to him, and she's still a bit taller 

[MrBoom_shack-a-lack]

It's always fun seeing Emppu next to Floor.

I have a photo from one of my shows when she almost kneels next to him, and she's still a bit taller 

Yea she really lives up to being a godess.

[LithoJazzoSphere]

Tall women in giant heels is always amusing.  Tuomas is 6'2 and Marco 6'3, but in some promo photos 6'0 Floor is towering over them due to them.  I have a cousin who is at least 5'11 and it's such a weird feeling to see her wearing them in person.  I wonder if they factor the potential for endless back issues later in their lives though. 

[ErHaO]

Tall women in giant heels is always amusing.  Tuomas is 6'2 and Marco 6'3, but in some promo photos 6'0 Floor is towering over them due to them.  I have a cousin who is at least 5'11 and it's such a weird feeling to see her wearing them in person.  I wonder if they factor the potential for endless back issues later in their lives though.

I think most women don't wear them enough for it to become a posture problem. But maybe it is different in other countries. And Floor
doesn't seem to use actual high heels when performing (boots with heels, but high heels are in a different ballpark).

Edit: looked up some performance pics and she does use high heels sometimes it seems. Can't imagine that feels good running on stage but what do I know

[Adami]

Tall women in giant heels is always amusing.  Tuomas is 6'2 and Marco 6'3, but in some promo photos 6'0 Floor is towering over them due to them.  I have a cousin who is at least 5'11 and it's such a weird feeling to see her wearing them in person.  I wonder if they factor the potential for endless back issues later in their lives though.

I’m quite confident neither of those men are that height. Having met them both.