Ayreon/Arjen Lucassen Thread (Star Three on the way)

[kirksnosehair]

Nice, I love that dude's drumming 

[jingle.boy]

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=187615689870582

Looks like Ed Warby is recording drums for the new Star One!

-Marc.

[The Letter M]

https://www.facebook.com/100001414727158/posts/4165601633496953/

A new video update from Arjen on the next Star One album. He says there will be 15 vocalists and 10 instrumental solo guests as well. The album’s concept will deal with films relating to Time, and he mentions time travel and time loops. I hope there are some Christopher Nolan films in there!

-Marc.

[Adami]

https://www.facebook.com/100001414727158/posts/4165601633496953/

A new video update from Arjen on the next Star One album. He says there will be 15 vocalists and 10 instrumental solo guests as well. The album’s concept will deal with films relating to Time, and he mentions time travel and time loops. I hope there are some Christopher Nolan films in there!

-Marc.

I hope his Tenet song is just Devin Townsend screaming “I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT IS HAPPENING” over and over.

[kirksnosehair]

 

[jingle.boy]

https://www.facebook.com/100001414727158/posts/4165601633496953/

A new video update from Arjen on the next Star One album. He says there will be 15 vocalists and 10 instrumental solo guests as well. The album’s concept will deal with films relating to Time, and he mentions time travel and time loops. I hope there are some Christopher Nolan films in there!

-Marc.

I hope his Tenet song is just Devin Townsend screaming “I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT IS HAPPENING” over and over.

Forwards and backwards simultaneously.   

Is it exclusively movies, or TV shows too (ala Space Metal)?

Predictions:
Songs of the Ocean II (I'm not sure if I'm joking or not).
Something from the Terminator franchise
Back to the Future
Edge of Tomorrow
The Butterfly Effect
A couple of 80s movies that I think would be right up Arjen's alley .... Time Bandits, and Millennium.

[Kwyjibo]

And a classic like The Time Machine

[Big Hath]

possibly Memento?  Definitely not time travel, but the way the storytelling plays with the timeline is cool.
Looper
Interstellar
12 Monkeys

And yeah, Time Bandits would be cool.

[The Letter M]

possibly Memento?  Definitely not time travel, but the way the storytelling plays with the timeline is cool.
Looper
Interstellar
12 Monkeys

And yeah, Time Bandits would be cool.

"Cassandra Complex" already covered 12 Monkeys.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victims_of_the_Modern_Age

-Marc.

[jingle.boy]

I was going to joke and also suggest 12 Monkeys II... as well as Human See Human Do II.   

Oh, there's also Set Your Controls II

[KevShmev]

What is the consensus on the first two Ayreon albums? I had not listened to either from start to finish in probably 15 years until recently.

The Final Experiment is pretty damn good.  Heckuva debut, and songs like Eyes of Time, The Awareness, The Banishment and Sail Away to Avalon are pretty great. Killer stuff.

Actual Fantasy isn't as good.  It's not bad at all, but feels like a let down considering how good the debut it and how great its follow-up was.  Abbey of Synn and Computer Eyes are standouts, but everything else just feels kind of there.  A nice listen, but not much there is what I would consider essential.

[The Letter M]

What is the consensus on the first two Ayreon albums? I had not listened to either from start to finish in probably 15 years until recently.

The Final Experiment is pretty damn good.  Heckuva debut, and songs like Eyes of Time, The Awareness, The Banishment and Sail Away to Avalon are pretty great. Killer stuff.

Actual Fantasy isn't as good.  It's not bad at all, but feels like a let down considering how good the debut it and how great its follow-up was.  Abbey of Synn and Computer Eyes are standouts, but everything else just feels kind of there.  A nice listen, but not much there is what I would consider essential.

I was on an Ayreon binge last fall when Transitus came out, but it's been awhile since then, but I did listen to the first two Ayreon albums  a few times during that period. I've always enjoyed TFE quite a bit, although some of it does feel and sound dated, even at the time it came out, but there are some strong songs on that release. The acoustic versions on the bonus disc are pretty nice as well!

As for Actual Fantasy, I'll agree. It's not a particularly strong effort, and I think its lack of success sort of pushed Arjen to make ITEC, which ended up being a huge success for him. It was sort of a Caress Of Steel -> 2112 moment for him. Of course, I've only ever heard the Actual Fantasy Revisited version of the album, which has actual drums by Ed Warby, which definitely helped the sound a bit when it was remixed for the re-release. Over-all, not an AWFUL release, but not one I often reach for if I want an Ayreon fix. It probably sits at the bottom tier of Ayreon albums for me.

Now I'm in the mood to spin some Ayreon!

-Marc.

[KevShmev]

That seems like a fair assessment. 

My friend Matt and I like doing runs through discographies of different bands, which gives us an album to text about daily when running through each one, and provides a nice break in the day during the work week, and we just started Ayreon, so it's gonna be a lot of Ayreon for me the next two weeks. 

[The Letter M]

That seems like a fair assessment. 

My friend Matt and I like doing runs through discographies of different bands, which gives us an album to text about daily when running through each one, and provides a nice break in the day during the work week, and we just started Ayreon, so it's gonna be a lot of Ayreon for me the next two weeks. 

Oh that's pretty cool! I hope you enjoy your journey through the Ayreon Universe. As convoluted and complex as his stories can be, Arjen's universe is one of my favorite fictional universes, with a ton of really cool sci-fi concepts. He's really fleshed it all out over the years, and every time he's released a new album, it's always fun to try and figure out how each song and idea fits in the bigger world of the Ayreon Universe.

Please keep us updated as you venture through your (re)visit of these albums. And if you haven't yet, definitely check out the 3 live albums he's released (The Theater Equation, Ayreon Universe Live, and The Electric Castle Live). They're some of my all-time favorite live videos, and his stage productions are impeccably well made. If COVID hadn't happened, I believe he was definitely thinking of doing another live show. Hopefully that still happens at some point!

-Marc.

[KevShmev]

I have both Ayreon Universe Live and The Electric Castle Live on DVD (or Blu-ray, cannot recall ), and both are stellar, so I am good with those. 

I doubt I will dig too deep into the lyrics through this run as far as how it all connects, as that doesn't interest me as much as it does others.  There are a number of artists for whom the lyrics are always an integral part of my listening experience, but Arjen is not one of them. For me, it's all about the music when it comes to Ayreon.   

[The Letter M]

I don't blame you, sometimes Arjen lays on the cheese very thick, but that's just the nature of his sci-fi influences. For me, the lyrics and vocalists are just as much of an important part of the Ayreon sound as the music is, especially since he gets such a wide range of amazing vocalists on all of his albums, and for the most part, they all play their parts extremely well. I honestly think Arjen directs James LaBrie's voice much better than most of Dream Theater vocal tracks as JLB's two appearances on Ayreon studio albums have been some of my favorite vocal performances of his (especially The Human Equation).

But I do agree, the music is pretty spectacular, especially when he gets some great guest soloists. It still blows my mind that Steve Hackett, Jordan Rudess, Rick Wakeman, and Keith Emerson all feature on The Theory Of Everything, which still stands as one of my favorite Ayreon albums.

-Marc.

[Cool Chris]

I really enjoy the lore that Arjen has built around his Ayreon universe, but it isn't something I think much about when listening to the music. The only album where I am really conscious of the overall story line while listening is 01, and even then it is never at the forefront of my mind.

[kirksnosehair]

I definitely do not listen to Ayreon for the lyrics     In fact, I think the bulk of Arjen's lyrics come across to me like they were written by a 15-year-old kid during study hall.  There have been several times over the years where I've decided he does it intentionally, like the original Batman series was super-campy but it never took itself seriously at all, which made the campiness even cooler.  That's how I think of Arjen's lyrics.  They're campy and pedestrian, but it's almost like he knows it and he lets everyone in on the joke.


Musically I think Ayreon can be somewhat hit/miss.  Most of the albums are at least good.  A few of them are even great.  I don't listen to the first two very much at all.  When I need an Ayreon fix it's almost always going to be something from The Universal Migrator forward.  In my mind Into The Electric Castle is still the most consistently good album start to finish but there are others that are pretty close.  I put Transitus in the same category as the first two albums.  It's OK, but nothing special.  The spoken dialog ruins it for me. I hope he keeps that shit to a minimum on the next album.

[jingle.boy]

  I put Transitus in the same category as the first two albums.  It's OK, but nothing special.  The spoken dialog ruins it for me. I hope he keeps that shit to a minimum on the next album.

Ditto.  TFE > AF = Transitus.  The latter two are definitely my least favorite Arjen albums. 

TFE is a very enjoyable listen for sure, but not something I often reach for when I feel I want an Ayreon fix.

[KevShmev]

I don't blame you, sometimes Arjen lays on the cheese very thick, but that's just the nature of his sci-fi influences. For me, the lyrics and vocalists are just as much of an important part of the Ayreon sound as the music is, especially since he gets such a wide range of amazing vocalists on all of his albums, and for the most part, they all play their parts extremely well. I honestly think Arjen directs James LaBrie's voice much better than most of Dream Theater vocal tracks as JLB's two appearances on Ayreon studio albums have been some of my favorite vocal performances of his (especially The Human Equation).

But I do agree, the music is pretty spectacular, especially when he gets some great guest soloists. It still blows my mind that Steve Hackett, Jordan Rudess, Rick Wakeman, and Keith Emerson all feature on The Theory Of Everything, which still stands as one of my favorite Ayreon albums.

-Marc.

The Theory of Everything has always been nothing but a blur to me, so maybe a fresh listen will reveal more.  Time will tell...

Agreed about JLB.  It feels like DT sometimes just writes melodies with no regard as to if they fit JLB's voice or not, while it seems like all of his Ayreon parts were perfectly suited for him. Of course, that is easier to do when he is playing just one character and is just one of a dozen singers on the album.

[MrBoom_shack-a-lack]

I don't blame you, sometimes Arjen lays on the cheese very thick, but that's just the nature of his sci-fi influences. For me, the lyrics and vocalists are just as much of an important part of the Ayreon sound as the music is, especially since he gets such a wide range of amazing vocalists on all of his albums, and for the most part, they all play their parts extremely well. I honestly think Arjen directs James LaBrie's voice much better than most of Dream Theater vocal tracks as JLB's two appearances on Ayreon studio albums have been some of my favorite vocal performances of his (especially The Human Equation).

But I do agree, the music is pretty spectacular, especially when he gets some great guest soloists. It still blows my mind that Steve Hackett, Jordan Rudess, Rick Wakeman, and Keith Emerson all feature on The Theory Of Everything, which still stands as one of my favorite Ayreon albums.

-Marc.

The Theory of Everything has always been nothing but a blur to me, so maybe a fresh listen will reveal more.  Time will tell...

Agreed about JLB.  It feels like DT sometimes just writes melodies with no regard as to if they fit JLB's voice or not, while it seems like all of his Ayreon parts were perfectly suited for him. Of course, that is easier to do when he is playing just one character and is just one of a dozen singers on the album.

Yea I agree about JLB 100%, Arjen has a gift of pushing every artist and their voice and range in the right direction. The same can be said about Bruce Dickinson.

[The Letter M]

I don't blame you, sometimes Arjen lays on the cheese very thick, but that's just the nature of his sci-fi influences. For me, the lyrics and vocalists are just as much of an important part of the Ayreon sound as the music is, especially since he gets such a wide range of amazing vocalists on all of his albums, and for the most part, they all play their parts extremely well. I honestly think Arjen directs James LaBrie's voice much better than most of Dream Theater vocal tracks as JLB's two appearances on Ayreon studio albums have been some of my favorite vocal performances of his (especially The Human Equation).

But I do agree, the music is pretty spectacular, especially when he gets some great guest soloists. It still blows my mind that Steve Hackett, Jordan Rudess, Rick Wakeman, and Keith Emerson all feature on The Theory Of Everything, which still stands as one of my favorite Ayreon albums.

-Marc.

The Theory of Everything has always been nothing but a blur to me, so maybe a fresh listen will reveal more.  Time will tell...

Agreed about JLB.  It feels like DT sometimes just writes melodies with no regard as to if they fit JLB's voice or not, while it seems like all of his Ayreon parts were perfectly suited for him. Of course, that is easier to do when he is playing just one character and is just one of a dozen singers on the album.

I just gave TTOE a fresh spin last night and this morning, and it definitely holds up for me eight years later. I think even after the five-year wait after 01 and all the hype that came with it, it definitely lived up to my expectations. It's different enough from the other Ayreon albums but still carries that signature feel that Arjen is known for. Also, it features John Wetton, and although his part isn't incredibly big, he kills it on all of his vocal lines. I also just really like Tommy Karevik and Mike Mills here as well, and I'm glad Arjen has utilized them many times since then.

I also gave Transitus a spin last night as well, and I still enjoy it. I can see why some folks might not like it, especially compared to Arjen's other (better) works, but I like the operatic feel of it, especially considering it was originally a film idea. Tom Baker is a great choice for the narrator and he adds a flavor to the album that isn't really found on other Ayreon albums.

Back to my earlier point of Arjen wanting to do another live show of a full album performance, I really do think The Theory Of Everything could be great, given how small the cast is (only 7 characters) and how the stage set could be laid out fairly easily with the Blackboard in the center of the stage, a light house in the top center. I think it would just translate well to the stage, though a replacement would be needed for Wetton. The next obvious choice would be Transitus, but given the mixed reception to the album, I don't think many fans would be clamoring for tickets to a Transitus show.

Pulling off live productions of 01 or The Source would be very difficult considering how large those casts are, but definitely not impossible, though it would probably takes YEARS to plan because I'm sure many of those musicians would be aching to tour with their regular bands first once restrictions are lifted and touring becomes a possibility again.

-Marc.

[Kwyjibo]

In fact, I think the bulk of Arjen's lyrics come across to me like they were written by a 15-year-old kid during study hall. 

That could be said about 90% of rock and metal lyrics, so Arjen fits right in. 

Not trying to defend him, but keep in mind, that english is not his native tongue. And as someone who isn't a native speaker also, I don't find his lyrics as bad as most of you here.

[KevShmev]

I don't find the lyrics totally hokey per se (although some are), so much as that I find the stories to be hilariously hokey, sometimes in a good way, sometimes not.  But hey, it's his shtick and he jumps in with both feet, so I give him mad props.   

[TAC]

I'm going to listen to one Arjen/Ayreon album later this week. You guys have until Tuesday afternoon to decide which one it'll be.

EDIT: Forgot to mention I have never heard a single song by him/them..

[KevShmev]

Well, considering you like your music to rock, I won't recommend The Dream Sequencer which is easily their best single album.

I'd go with either Into the Electric Castle or The Human Equation, both of which are doubles.  I find Into the Electric Castle to be much better, but a lot of fans do not agree with me, and The Human Equation does have James LaBrie on it as the main character, so that might be more of a grabber for you right away.

[Ben_Jamin]

I'd say go for The Source or 01. Those are good introductions to Ayreons sound and gives a good insight into the overall arching story as well...

[SwedishGoose]

My vote is for The Human Equation...
LaBrie kills it as the main character and the rest of the cast is amazing  too.
Musically great and storywise to ne at lest the strongest story  of them all.

Actually I would suggest watching The Theater Equation as it's such a great and unique concert with a striking scenen and a great way to see the story.

[The Letter M]

I'll also double down on going with The Human Equation as your first foray into Ayreon, but Into The Electric Castle is his breakout album, so that's not a bad place to start.

The Source is pretty good, too. I've seen a lot of music react channels react to "The Day That World Breaks Down", which really captures the Ayreon sound in a single 12 minute song, which also features the album's entire STELLAR cast is one song.

But do know going in that, no matter which album you pick, there's a rock opera sort of style that Arjen goes for, casting his characters with various vocalists on each album. Some vocalists he's employed several times, so if vocal performances and performers are a big thing for you, definitely do some research into the album you want to listen to beforehand.

Because of this thread, I've been on an Ayreon kick today and spun The Human Equation earlier today, and just recently finished through Arjen's Lost In The New Real, the Ayreon Universe adjacent solo concept album, which I hadn't listened to in awhile, but it's still pretty good to my ears.

-Marc.

[Cool Chris]

I wouldn't suggest to anyone they start their Ayreon journey with The Human Equation or Into the Electric Castle, but that might be based on my personal feelings about those albums. 01 is my favorite, but that might be too much Ayreon for someone to make as their first experience, despite it being fairly representative of what Ayreon is all about.

[The Letter M]

I wouldn't suggest to anyone they start their Ayreon journey with The Human Equation or Into the Electric Castle, but that might be based on my personal feelings about those albums. 01 is my favorite, but that might be too much Ayreon for someone to make as their first experience, despite it being fairly representative of what Ayreon is all about.

I would agree with this. Even after 13 years, I still haven't super warmed up to 01011001, mostly because of it's large cast of 17 vocalists, but I do recognize that many fans do enjoy the album.

If length is an issue for a first-time listener, perhaps going into Into The Electric Castle, The Human Equation, or 01011001 might not be the BEST idea as each album is over 100 minutes long. The Theory Of Everything and The Source are both under 90 minutes long, and Transitus is just over 80, but I wouldn't suggest Transitus to a first-time listener, but The Source might be a good spot.

When I first discovered Ayreon, I started with ITEC and THE, mostly because THE was their latest album at the time, but I also dove into some of Arjen's other projects as well, like Star One, so there were a fair amount of albums under his belt, even by 2005.

Of course, you could also just go at it chronologically and start at the beginning with The Final Experiment, however, as discussed earlier, it's not one of his best albums, and I think it can sound a little dated, but it definitely shows where Arjen's idea for the project began, and it really only got better from there after the first two albums.

I think I'll give 01 a spin as I head to be tonight to see if I find it better this time around than I remember it, though I feel like I say that everytime I'm in the Ayreon mood and listen to that album. 

-Marc.

[Bentower]

I'll reach for a wild card and suggest The Universal Migrator.

I know TAC likes his metal and that's an album of Arjen going whole-hog into spacey prog metal territory. Some killer songs and guest performances from musicians I bet he's already a fan of.
It was my introduction to Ayreon and it did the trick for me. I think it's also more immediate and engaging than those sprawling double albums.

[jingle.boy]

I'll reach for a wild card and suggest The Universal Migrator.

I know TAC likes his metal and that's an album of Arjen going whole-hog into spacey prog metal territory. Some killer songs and guest performances from musicians I bet he's already a fan of.
It was my introduction to Ayreon and it did the trick for me. I think it's also more immediate and engaging than those sprawling double albums.

I could have sworn I'd recommended TAC some music from The Universal Migrator.  As much as I think THE is not a bad place to start, I'll have to second this nomination (Dawn of a Million Souls was my first intro to Arjen - and Russell Allen for that matter!).  THE is a lot to digest, and (imo) the story and uniqueness and diversity of the characters is what truly makes it.  TUM on the other hand, is a collection of great individual tracks.  I'm sure he'll love the Bruce Dickinson track, and hate the Ralf Scheepers one. 

I just think he'd get overwhelmed with any of the double discs.  Start with TUM, and if he doesn't like that, then I don't suspect any of the double-albums would be to his liking.

[v_clortho]

Go with The Source. You'll know after the first song if Ayreon is for you.

[ErHaO]

For me, prior to enjoying/knowing progmetal, 01 is actually one of the albums that got me into it. That and watching the Star One live dvd after hearing that album. (I listened to 01 because I just became a Blind Guardian fan and I saw Hansi was on it, River of Time was the first Ayreon song I heard). I did not really like THE on my first listen, that came much later (and ended up as my fave).

Still, I think The Source is the best point of entry these days. Just look at all those internet reactions to The Day That The World Breaks Down.

So yeah, my vote goes to The Source.