Kamelot

[Grappler]

https://www.kamelotgermany.de/site/interviewty-2020/

Interesting interview with Thomas, about the bands plans for 2020.  A few items to note:

The new DVD was delayed due to legal issues with previous songwriters.  I haven't looked at writing credits. But I'd guess that's Khan.  At least they got it worked out and it should come out this summer.  They are so overdue for a new live release. 

They signed a book deal, which I'm actually very interested in reading, whenever it is eventually written and released. 

[Adami]

I just hope the dvd is good and has a good Setlist. Haven’t really dug their last few albums, but they each have a good song or two.

[MirrorMask]

I just hope the dvd is good and has a good Setlist. Haven’t really dug their last few albums, but they each have a good song or two.

Well, don't click if you don't want to know, but they recorded it at this show, so....

https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/kamelot/2018/poppodium-013-tilburg-netherlands-6be99a6e.html

Best case scenario, you get exactly the entire setlist, otherwise a song or two will be cut for whatever reason.

[Adami]

I’m good with that Setlist.


Wish the band wasn’t trying to act like Fourth Legacy didn’t exist. But whatever. I’d be happy with that dvd.

[MirrorMask]

Wish the band wasn’t trying to act like Fourth Legacy didn’t exist. But whatever. I’d be happy with that dvd.

Would it be up to me, at least two songs between The Fourth Legacy, Nights of Arabia and The Shadow of Uther would be present in every setlist.

[cramx3]

I’m good with that Setlist.


Wish the band wasn’t trying to act like Fourth Legacy didn’t exist. But whatever. I’d be happy with that dvd.

At this point, they act like nothing from Khan exists anymore besides the same songs.  It's been a long time since they played an older less played song. I'd love to see some songs from that album as well as Karma (besides Karma and Forever). 

The blu-ray looks like it should be sweet.

[wolfking]

I just hope the dvd is good and has a good Setlist. Haven’t really dug their last few albums, but they each have a good song or two.

Well, don't click if you don't want to know, but they recorded it at this show, so....

https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/kamelot/2018/poppodium-013-tilburg-netherlands-6be99a6e.html

Best case scenario, you get exactly the entire setlist, otherwise a song or two will be cut for whatever reason.

Jeez, they are trying to erase the Khan stuff from existence.

[Evermind]

I’m good with that Setlist.


Wish the band wasn’t trying to act like Fourth Legacy didn’t exist. But whatever. I’d be happy with that dvd.

At this point, they act like nothing from Khan exists anymore besides the same songs.  It's been a long time since they played an older less played song. I'd love to see some songs from that album as well as Karma (besides Karma and Forever). 

This is why I'll probably never go see them live again unless they change it up or release some serious masterpiece.

[The Walrus]

I don't like the Tommy-era Kamelot albums much at all unfortunately. I think Haven has the strongest selection of songs but still pales compared to the Khan era. Just feels like the band has a template and a formula they've fallen into rehashing time and time again, and the live sets are super disappointing these days. They have so many great classic songs they're just ignoring for all the new stuff. That's a dilemma a lot of bands in their position face but it's still sad to see so much of the new stuff that I personally dislike being favored over songs like Nights of Arabia which imo should always be a Kamelot encore...

[cramx3]

I love how they play new songs, I just wish they'd diversify the old stuff.

Rule the World
The Great Pandemonium
Center of the Universe
Forever
March of Mephisto
When The Lights Are Down

... all awesome songs and all played to death.  I've seen Kamelot so many times now, these songs need to be rotated out with others IMO

Elizabeth
The Fourth Legacy
Nights of Arabia
Farewell
The Haunting
The Black Halo
EdenEcho

... all awesome songs they've played before and what happened to them? I've never seen any of those live

[MirrorMask]

I don't even consider Pandemonium and especially Rule the World an awesome song. Very lackluster song that feels it doesn't even have a chorus, just a bridge. I admit it has a certain punch and groove when played live, but why the title track has not become the live staple from Ghost Opera is beyond me.

Forever, Center of the Universe and Mephisto can stay.

[cramx3]

I think they did do a poll before last tour about what song they should drop.  I think it was Center of the Universe that lost and wasn't played as much last tour.  Forever could be replaced with a couple songs based on how they extend it with the whoas.  That's really gotten old with me though.  I'd rather Center of the Universe or March than Forever at this point.  Plus those songs make use of whoever the female touring with them is. 

[wolfking]

I don't like the Tommy-era Kamelot albums much at all unfortunately. I think Haven has the strongest selection of songs but still pales compared to the Khan era. Just feels like the band has a template and a formula they've fallen into rehashing time and time again, and the live sets are super disappointing these days. They have so many great classic songs they're just ignoring for all the new stuff. That's a dilemma a lot of bands in their position face but it's still sad to see so much of the new stuff that I personally dislike being favored over songs like Nights of Arabia which imo should always be a Kamelot encore...

Yeah, I don't like what Tommy has done with the band either.  SHadow Theory is probably my fav our of the three.  That had a few decent songs.  The other two I just can't stand to be honest.

NIghts of Arabia
Expedition
Until Kingdom Comes
Fourth Legacy
Lunar Sanctum
Millennium
Across the Highlands
Edge of Paradise
Farewell
Shadow of Uther

So many good songs just completely forgotten about.

[MoraWintersoul]

I understand why they would want to focus on the newer stuff at this point; The Fourth Legacy, as much as I love it, is 20 years away. I agree with you guys that I can't believe they wouldn't want to diversify their set a little bit. There's lots of great and forgotten-by-them-but-not-by-us material on the few Khan albums they still revisit. I talked a little bit about how some bands seem to think they have to take their Spotify top 10, add new songs from the album they're promoting and get a setlist for every tour, and Kamelot is literally the worst offender. If you "invest" in a song that gets marginally weaker feedback from the audience, it can become one of your staples in a tour or two. People aren't dumb. People will see you're playing something unfamiliar to them and play it on Youtube to check it out. And you don't need to play every song for the lowest common denominator who put your Spotify top 10 on shuffle anyway. Play some songs for the rest of us.

What bothers me in their studio work is that Thomas seems to think they've hit on a new modern groove and that they're so ahead of the curve right now. But this "new" grimdark style they've been doing has been a thing for more than ten years now. Time for something fresh. Silverthorn was a great transition imo, it had something old, something new, a whimsical concept that took us a little closer to older Kamelot, and it was very well executed lyrically and vocally by Tommy. On Haven, it's like they came up with the stage costumes first and the music later, and TST is an extension of that.

[The Walrus]

Not only that but their 'lead single' formula is irritating as hell. They've basically re-released Sacrimony twice now, once for Haven and once for Shadow Theory. The waltz-time anthem with a big string patch is their gimmick now.

[MoraWintersoul]

Yup. It's like..... fine........ I get it..... this is truly as overdone as the power metal you think is overdone, my good dudes.

I can't knock them for playing the game successfully, even in the past there were signs of all of this. You know, tactical cross-promotion and featuring new hot talent every release (starting with Simone and Shagrath), CGI videos, outside songwriting partners, a certain amount of trend-chasing. But the heart was always there, and the music was just so damn good. Most people blame it on the absence of Khan and his creative vision, but honestly, Tommy is just as charismatic (or getting up there, anyway), smart, dedicated to the craft of singing and writing lyrics, he's been at this for a real long time and he has his flair, it's just slightly different, but it's there. He could really carry the band like Khan did. I guess the real G in this band is Sascha Paeth and I am getting bored of him 

[The Walrus]

I really think the neverending 'write, record, tour tour tour, write record tour tour tour' cycle has taken its toll on the band. Not in their performance, because every show they do is fun, but with regards to the setlists and apparently their own songwriting stagnating. Of course I think Poetry is their best album so what do I know? Even though they still put out records with a few songs I love on each one, overall the quality is far from what they used to be imo. I don't attribute it to Tommy, just the wear and tear of a band who won't take a well deserved creative break for just a short while like Nightwish.

[cramx3]

That's not a bad observation, they definitely just seem to be in autopilot. 

[Evermind]

I don't have a problem with Tommy too. Silverthorn was great in my opinion and then the songwriting quality just continued to decline after that.

However given how successful they are right now, I don't see them changing their approach in the near future. Can't wait for the next album featuring songs called ShadowDark, HeartStop Ointment and of course the lead single, Fallen Ghost (Gothic Ascendancy).

[MirrorMask]

I really think the neverending 'write, record, tour tour tour, write record tour tour tour' cycle has taken its toll on the band.

I don't know what you actually meant with writing "tour tour tour", but if it's the same thing I intend, I noticed too that mid-sized bands (big but not as big as the titans of the genre) spend a lot of time on the road, going over the same places more than once.

The reason is obvious - touring is where money is, and the more they tour, the more they earn. But it's hard to follow these tours, there's an european one, then an american one, then another american one maybe with a package, then another european tour part II with the same setlist... it's tour tour tour until "Well, I guess we've stretched this as far as we could, we should do a new album".

I also don't begrudge them too much for sticking with Tommy's songs - with all the lineup changes, the number of people who didn't play on the Khan album is increasing, I bet they want to play their own songs, it's not a situation like Maiden where Blaze kinda had to play those Bruce classics, the new songs - at least the new classic - are strong enough to warrant a place in the set. And Tommy is fantastic (and from what you can tell a very nice and positive person), so he was a blessing for the band, but yeah, the autopilot feel is strong with the latest album. I absolutely ADORED Haven, I think it's a fantastic album, but The Shadow Theory feels like one of those "two-three cool songs and the rest is forgettable" albums, which I never thought would fit a description for a Kamelot record.

[ariich]

I don't like the Tommy-era Kamelot albums much at all unfortunately. I think Haven has the strongest selection of songs but still pales compared to the Khan era. Just feels like the band has a template and a formula they've fallen into rehashing time and time again, and the live sets are super disappointing these days. They have so many great classic songs they're just ignoring for all the new stuff. That's a dilemma a lot of bands in their position face but it's still sad to see so much of the new stuff that I personally dislike being favored over songs like Nights of Arabia which imo should always be a Kamelot encore...

Haven is one of my favourites, but yeah for me the others don't match up to the best Khan era albums.

[cramx3]

If you combined the best of Haven and The Shadow Theory you'd have a fantastic album.  Both have their good songs, their clunkers, and some that sound exactly the same.  But there's enough good stuff in both to keep me entertained.  I'm not sure they have it in them to make another masterpiece album like The Black Halo, but they are definitely doing well enough to keep me going to their shows.  Plus Tommy is still my favorite vocalist.  They are a fun live band, and having different female vocalists almost means the tour cycles will offer something different even if they are playing mostly the same set.  I'm just bummed I missed them when Simone Simons used to be the female vocalist.  I've gotten to see them with (either as the touring vocalist or guest from an opening band) Elize Ryd, Alissa White-Gluz, Kobra Paige, Lauren Hart, Charlotte Wessels, and Clementine Delauney. 

[MoraWintersoul]

Can't wait for the next album featuring songs called ShadowDark, HeartStop Ointment and of course the lead single, Fallen Ghost (Gothic Ascendancy).

I'm not a big fan of the revolving door of female vocalists. It used to be pretty simple: they would wanna feature a vocalist on a song, someone close to them would fill up the spot, it would work out that this person could join them on tour for a while, and things would be peachy. Now there's almost an expectation that they have to do that, so they have to pick someone who isn't so busy, and, well, Lauren Hart isn't all that busy because her main band is crap and she isn't amazing either  Alyssa is immensely talented but I don't like seeing talented assholes succeed. Elize and Charlotte are on the other end of the spectrum: they are successful because they are very nice people and willing to work very hard, but I don't see extraordinary talent there  but even if I liked them, they can't take any one of those three anymore because they are too busy, so we will get diminishing talent every time. Maybe Kobra's band folds because she's not getting it to where she wanted (read a recent interview where she hinted at the possibility), so she is able to join full time, that would save them from having to perform career-building services for middle-of-the-road vocalists.

[ariich]

Maybe Kobra's band folds because she's not getting it to where she wanted (read a recent interview where she hinted at the possibility)

That would be a shame as I thought their latest album was a blast.

[MoraWintersoul]

Loads of people like them, but apparently the band isn't super financially sustainable

[Max Kuehnau]

Loads of people like them, but apparently the band isn't super financially sustainable

when I first looked at that photo, I thought that was Alyssa White-Gluz' sister (who borrowed her hair dye)

[Evermind]

I'm not a big fan of the revolving door of female vocalists. It used to be pretty simple: they would wanna feature a vocalist on a song, someone close to them would fill up the spot, it would work out that this person could join them on tour for a while, and things would be peachy. Now there's almost an expectation that they have to do that, so they have to pick someone who isn't so busy, and, well, Lauren Hart isn't all that busy because her main band is crap and she isn't amazing either  Alyssa is immensely talented but I don't like seeing talented assholes succeed. Elize and Charlotte are on the other end of the spectrum: they are successful because they are very nice people and willing to work very hard, but I don't see extraordinary talent there  but even if I liked them, they can't take any one of those three anymore because they are too busy, so we will get diminishing talent every time. Maybe Kobra's band folds because she's not getting it to where she wanted (read a recent interview where she hinted at the possibility), so she is able to join full time, that would save them from having to perform career-building services for middle-of-the-road vocalists.

I would disagree on Charlotte, I think is plenty of talent there; agreed on everyone else though.

I wish they wrote an album without guest female singers just for the novelty of it. They could drop all the guest-spot songs from their setlist then for the tour and bust out some rare stuff, too.

[MirrorMask]

I might have my metal gossip mixed up but didn't Tommy and the Kobra singer actually get married, or at the very least they're engaged? if they're a couple they'd be more willing to align their schedules.

Even Khan, after all, brought along her wife on tour to sing.

[Evermind]

I might have my metal gossip mixed up but didn't Tommy and the Kobra singer actually get married, or at the very least they're engaged? if they're a couple they'd be more willing to align their schedules.

Engaged at least for sure, I remember Tommy posting it on Facebook. I know I was very baffled by this as I thought his wife sang on Tiara and did the voice-over on Mercy Falls turns out that was his sister and I mixed him up with Tom Englund whose wife sang on piano version of Hymns for the Broken.

[MoraWintersoul]

Yeah, you are correct, Tommy and Kobra are married and he moved to the US. So it would be a nice gig for them personally, and would be a good fit musically as well. As for Khan's wife, maybe you mean Thomas Youngblood's wife?

I wish they wrote an album without guest female singers just for the novelty of it. They could drop all the guest-spot songs from their setlist then for the tour and bust out some rare stuff, too.

Man, same. I wish they would contain guest spots to interesting tracks they aren't too likely to play live, like the bonus track "Grace" with Apollo of Firewind and "The Zodiac" with Jon Oliva. But I have a feel they're going to keep doing it, because it worked out so great for them with Simone and Amanda Sommerville, and they really hit the jackpot in terms of fan crossover with Elize and Alyssa as well. It's probably super fun for them to just not have the same people on tour all the time and make these connections.

[MirrorMask]

Yeah, you are correct, Tommy and Kobra are married and he moved to the US. So it would be a nice gig for them personally, and would be a good fit musically as well. As for Khan's wife, maybe you mean Thomas Youngblood's wife?

No, I mean Elisabeth Kjaernes, I saw her live and she's on the On the Coldest Winter Night DVD (see March of Mephisto for example, or Center of the Universe). She's Khan's wife.

Youngblood's wife was on the DVD as well, but off the top of my head I can't remember when.

[cramx3]

I congratulated Tommy personally on his proposal back in September 

Hey, you guys are free to have those opinions on not liking the revolving door of females, but it adds a level of excitement for me.  I forgot to add Noora Louhimo to the list  but if they dropped that in favor of busting out older rarer tunes, I'd be down for that.

I do hope Kobra doesn't join Kamelot though, she may have been my least favorite of the bunch from a vocals perspective although she was super nice after the NJ show so I've got nothing against her as a person.  I'll agree about not really being a fan of Alissa but her vocals are solid and she's a good performer.  I stopped following her on social media a couple years ago when I felt like I just didn't really like her.

Either way, if they aren't going to change the setlists much, at least changing the singers gives some variety.

[MoraWintersoul]

No, I mean Elisabeth Kjaernes, I saw her live and she's on the On the Coldest Winter Night DVD (see March of Mephisto for example, or Center of the Universe). She's Khan's wife.

Wow I completely blanked out on them being married. Fun times.

[cramx3]

Finally we get the first video from their new concert dvd/cd/blu-ray:

KAMELOT ft. Alissa White-Gluz and Elize Ryd - Sacrimony (Official Live Video)

  definitely plan on getting this on blu-ray

[The Walrus]

Wow. About time they put out another concert DVD. Awesome. That is a cringe title, but boy it looks good.