DREAM THEATER - Europe leg of the 40th Anniversary Tour 2024-2025

[cramx3]

While I'm not a fan of Terminal 5, I wouldn't mind if they play there.

Last time I saw DT at a general admission show was in 2014 at the Hammerstein Ballroom on 34th.

DT played Terminal 5 back to back nights for my 2nd and 3rd time seeing them in 2008.  I was also at that Hammerstein Ballroom show.

I quite enjoyed those three, and if I recall, I think those three were the only times I saw DT with general admission.

[Stadler]

I would guess they'd play the Oakdale again in Wallingford; can't beat that place, even if it is a seated theater.   I'd rather go there than the Meadows amphitheater (even if it is half the distance for me).

[Schurftkut]

In Holland you mean? Considering your name I'm thinking you're Dutch. But that's probably not the case. Or you will be seeing these shows outside of The Netherlands. In Holland DT plays at AFAS Live. Symphony X plays a few weeks earlier at smaller venues: Boerderij in Zoetermeer and Next Stage of the 013 in Tilburg (700 maximum capacity). So I'm a bit confused.

i didn't notice it was in a smaller room than normal in 013. I saw DT there plenty times for 45,- though, point still stands, same with AFAS.

[The Paddies]

i didn't notice it was in a smaller room than normal in 013. I saw DT there plenty times for 45,- though, point still stands, same with AFAS.

I can understand your point. Prices have been going up for quite a few years now. Not only with DT, tickets in general and everything actually. I guess SymX is still affordable as it's more niche than DT. No news on a new album right? Those guys should really up their communication/marketing. And they should pay respect to more songs in their catalog. It's always the same setlist over again with just a few tweaks here and there. That's what keeps me from going to their show this time. Might change if there's a great new album coming.

[cramx3]

i didn't notice it was in a smaller room than normal in 013. I saw DT there plenty times for 45,- though, point still stands, same with AFAS.

Actually saw Gwar in that smaller hall at 013.  I didn't realize the show was in the smaller hall until getting there.

[Schurftkut]

sounds even more interesting to go see actually. Boerderij is also cozy, but with a horrible trainconnection..

[pg1067]

The clip played:

The Root of All Evil
The Spirit Carries On
Take the Time
Rite of Passage

I hope they play them all except A Rite of Passage, that's not worthy being in such a special set for me 

Root would be cool, but I don't need/want any of the others.

TSCO has been done to death and isn't all that great outside of the album context.  TTT would have to be heavily edited vocally.  AROP...bleh.  If they're going to do something from BC&SL, Wither is the best choice (IMO, of course).

[Ayeegit]

With the exception of the last tour with DTB, DT usually play an all-seated venue in Colorado (The Paramount in Denver). Have seen them there three times now, I think

I've seen most of their Denver shows over the last ~25 years, and the only time I remember folks sitting in the Paramount was for The Astonishing...

[cramx3]

The clip played:

The Root of All Evil
The Spirit Carries On
Take the Time
Rite of Passage

I hope they play them all except A Rite of Passage, that's not worthy being in such a special set for me 

I'd say that ARoP would be the song I'd want to see the most out of that list, even if I rate it my least favorite, just because it hasn't gotten the live play like the rest. 

Also, seeing TTT makes me wonder about JLB.  Those I&W songs are going to be tough and kind of would figure they wouldn't hit that album too hard.

Granted, not sure those songs being in the ad means anything at all.  I'm not taking it more than a discussion point.

[crystalstars17]

Also, seeing TTT makes me wonder about JLB.  Those I&W songs are going to be tough and kind of would figure they wouldn't hit that album too hard.

Granted, not sure those songs being in the ad means anything at all.  I'm not taking it more than a discussion point.

I'll say 🙄 I thought the same hearing TTT, and seeing ancient footage of a Score-era James singing these songs. What are they thinking?! Hopefully they learned the first time they made him sing those (I&W) songs and won't just go the nostalgia route now.

[TheHoveringSojourn808]

I've seen most of their Denver shows over the last ~25 years, and the only time I remember folks sitting in the Paramount was for The Astonishing...

Sure, people stand. But the question was around "all seated venues", which the Paramount is one lol

[Mrpmrprpmrp]

I’m pretty sure they will tune down for a lot of that stuff so Labrie has an easier time. So many bands do this for the same reason. I remember when they played change of seasons with Mangini it was tuned down quite a bit still sounded great.

[Metro]

Yeah but tuning down didn't help him with a song like Take the Time.
I think he could manage it in a lower key, but he’d still have to rewrite the vocal melodies as well. Something that needs to be worked out well before the tour starts rather then in the midst of the tour like he did with Pull Me Under last year.

[TheCountOfNYC]

I’m pretty sure they will tune down for a lot of that stuff so Labrie has an easier time. So many bands do this for the same reason. I remember when they played change of seasons with Mangini it was tuned down quite a bit still sounded great.

They only tuned ACoS and the entire IaW album (except for WFS which they kept in its original key) down a half step, from E to Eb.

[Mrpmrprpmrp]

They only tuned ACoS and the entire IaW album (except for WFS which they kept in its original key) down a half step, from E to Eb.

It’s funny I never noticed or don’t remember them changing the key for Images and Words but I definitely remember how much lower changes of season sounded in my mind. Either way goes to show I just remember it was a great show so tune down away lol.

[TheHoveringSojourn808]

Down-tuning is something I always immediately notice. I remember all the down-tuned songs on the Rush tour I saw (I think it was the Moving Pictures Time Machine tour). It doesn't ruin it for me but it is instantly obvious why they're doing it.

[DreamerTV]

It’s funny I never noticed or don’t remember them changing the key for Images and Words but I definitely remember how much lower changes of season sounded in my mind. Either way goes to show I just remember it was a great show so tune down away lol.

Probably because ACOS is played with a 7 strings guitar, which already has a lower string than the 6

[MirrorMask]

I was with a musician at the I&W concert and he immediately noticed the downtuning, but for me it was just the same, A Change of Seasons included.

However, one thing I did notice for the first time, was the click track. Innocence, when it kicked in after the intro, felt so SLOW. Years and years of Mike Portnoy giving all his energy into pumping up the actual beginning of the song ingrained in me a tempo much faster than the studio track, and I definitively noticed it. It felt like it was dragging.

[TheCountOfNYC]

Funny story about the downtuning. I knew they were tuning down after hearing fan recordings of the first show. I was going to the Asbury Park show with my drummer. I told him that they were tuning down and he said “oh I don’t notice things like that, I don’t know enough about music to notice that”. Two notes into Pull Me Under, he turns to me and says “…I notice it”.

[Schurftkut]

yeah just like some songs sounding too fast with MP or too slow with MM, some of the songs really sounded weird with the downtuning

[TAC]

yeah just like some songs sounding too fast with MP or too slow with MM, some of the songs really sounded weird with the downtuning

The “slowness” of the songs didn’t have anything to do with Mangini though. He had nothing to do with those decisions.

[Schurftkut]

i'm not saying that, just referring to the different eras

[TAC]

i'm not saying that, just referring to the different eras

Gotcha

[TheHoveringSojourn808]

The “slowness” of the songs didn’t have anything to do with Mangini though. He had nothing to do with those decisions.

You never know; do you remember the show Time Warp? It was a Discovery Channel show or something that used high speed cameras to film things and then go into the science behind what was happening. They had Mike Mangini on for one episode once (this was before he was ever in Dream Theater) and they were filming his drumming and explaining how high performance drummers use physics to get the sounds they want, etc. etc. etc.

Anyway, what if Mike Mangini, when being recorded with the high-speed cameras, actually got "stuck" in time. Maybe "trapped" is a better word. Where he can only move as fast as you see in the high-speed camera slowdowns. If that happened to him when he was younger, maybe Dream Theater would be understanding and play slowed down for him. Or maybe I'm reading too many Philip K Dick novels.

By the way, here is the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-xxpkxRRYs

[Dream Team]

If Mangini could travel through time, he would have decided to play as sloppy as hell in DT so he wouldn't be accused of being robotic . . .

[Stadler]

If Mangini could travel through time, he would have decided to play as sloppy as hell in DT so he wouldn't be accused of being robotic . . .

That misses the point; it's not about "sloppy" even a little bit (at least for me).  Let's not distort the narrative here to where Mike Portnoy is like Lars Ulrich or something.   And it's not just one interpretation of "robotic".  For me, someone that didn't like his work with DT as much as I do Portnoy's, it was about something more intangible.   Granted, I'm not a drummer, but I still can't tap out the intro to "Bird On A Wire" (Neal Morse Band) but that is just PERFECT for that song and it's one of my NMB favorites.   There are plenty of Portnoy parts in DT that are structured, measured, not sloppy... and perfect for the song.  I can count too many times where I'm listening to DT and think "why are those 87 drum hits there?!?"

I've said this before and I"ll say it again, Portnoy has a knack for playing in 47/13 time and making it sound like 4/4, and Mangini has a knack for playing in 4/4 and making it sound like 47/13.   It's all a matter of taste, for sure, but I prefer the former.

None of this is to say that Mangini sucks, or Portnoy is the "better" drummer, or takes anything away from Mangini as a man or a band mate.  From everything I've ever heard, he's an amazing guy.   You can be all those things and still not be right for the situation you're in.  I'm an amazing guy, too, but I'm not a good fit for Primus in any capacity.

[Awaken]

That misses the point; it's not about "sloppy" even a little bit (at least for me).  Let's not distort the narrative here to where Mike Portnoy is like Lars Ulrich or something.   And it's not just one interpretation of "robotic".  For me, someone that didn't like his work with DT as much as I do Portnoy's, it was about something more intangible.   Granted, I'm not a drummer, but I still can't tap out the intro to "Bird On A Wire" (Neal Morse Band) but that is just PERFECT for that song and it's one of my NMB favorites.   There are plenty of Portnoy parts in DT that are structured, measured, not sloppy... and perfect for the song.  I can count too many times where I'm listening to DT and think "why are those 87 drum hits there?!?"

I've said this before and I"ll say it again, Portnoy has a knack for playing in 47/13 time and making it sound like 4/4, and Mangini has a knack for playing in 4/4 and making it sound like 47/13.   It's all a matter of taste, for sure, but I prefer the former.

None of this is to say that Mangini sucks, or Portnoy is the "better" drummer, or takes anything away from Mangini as a man or a band mate.  From everything I've ever heard, he's an amazing guy.   You can be all those things and still not be right for the situation you're in.  I'm an amazing guy, too, but I'm not a good fit for Primus in any capacity.

While I agree w your point, I *think* he was joking.  I can never tell with THS808, though

[Mosh]

I've said this before and I"ll say it again, Portnoy has a knack for playing in 47/13 time and making it sound like 4/4, and Mangini has a knack for playing in 4/4 and making it sound like 47/13.   It's all a matter of taste, for sure, but I prefer the former.

I think this really minimizes what both drummers are capable of doing.

[Stadler]

I think this really minimizes what both drummers are capable of doing.

Shouldn't; I'm certainly not minimizing their talents. I think both are extremely talented drummers at the top of their game. They're just different games.

[Trav86]

I’m sure lots of you have used ChatGPT to try to make a setlist. I was playing with it and here’s one it came up with…

Make one using their most popular songs with a total run time of 2.5 hours

Sure! Here's a setlist featuring Dream Theater's most popular songs, tailored to fit within a 2.5-hour timeframe:

**Set 1:**

1. Pull Me Under
2. Metropolis Pt. 1: The Miracle and the Sleeper
3. The Spirit Carries On
4. As I Am
5. Forsaken
6. Panic Attack
7. On the Backs of Angels

**Intermission**

**Set 2:**

1. The Enemy Inside
2. Through Her Eyes
3. In the Presence of Enemies Pt. 1: Prelude / Pt. 2: Resurrection
4. The Dance of Eternity
5. Octavarium

**Encore:**

1. Home
2. The Count of Tuscany

[cramx3]

Other than Octavarium, that setlist is not very interesting to me. Home and The Enemy Inside would be my next most interested songs, the rest... I don't know, I know they are the popular ones, but they've also been the ones played live the most.  I certainly expect a lot of those songs to be played, but a set almost exclusively of the most popular songs is not really fun for me.

[Trav86]

Yeah, I asked most popular mostly out of curiosity of what it would do. But also, given that it’s an Anniversary (and a sort of reunion, which is how they’re promoting it) tour that seemed like a reasonable basis.

[Schurftkut]

i only just noticed there's almost no rest for JLB on the upcoming tour...

[RaiseTheKnife]

Other than Octavarium, that setlist is not very interesting to me. Home and The Enemy Inside would be my next most interested songs, the rest... I don't know, I know they are the popular ones, but they've also been the ones played live the most.  I certainly expect a lot of those songs to be played, but a set almost exclusively of the most popular songs is not really fun for me.

Agreed.  While its a very balanced setlist, absolutely no fireworks or spark to make it especially special.

[The Paddies]

i only just noticed there's almost no rest for JLB on the upcoming tour...

I'm no expert on this, but EU has 24 shows with 12 days of rest in total in between. That's quite a lot of days off I'd say.
Sure, sometimes three shows in a row (quite intense), but also sometimes two days of rest in between shows. I think they deliberately give James a bit of a break with this schedule.