Songs for Next Tour / What Can James Sing?

[Indiscipline]

For those interested in vocalists with veritable James' game, check out Michele Luppi.

[Herrick]

I don't want to put words in Rob24's mouth, but I think he was poking fun at crystalstars17 there a little.

I've seen similar things come out of her mouth (fingers?) when she was facing opposing opinions on topics she was passionately arguing.

I'm not familiar with his posting history but that comment seemed too over to the top to be serious.

[Adami]

I don't want to put words in Rob24's mouth, but I think he was poking fun at crystalstars17 there a little.

I've seen similar things come out of her mouth (fingers?) when she was facing opposing opinions on topics she was passionately arguing.

I'm not familiar with his posting history but that comment seemed too over to the top to be serious.

Indeed. Nor is it the first time he has said similarly rude things to her.



Also I did not love that singer. Sounded like he had some digital help being on key, plus I am just always a bit taken out of it hearing DT sung by someone with a very very noticeable accent.

[Herrick]

I don't want to put words in Rob24's mouth, but I think he was poking fun at crystalstars17 there a little.

I've seen similar things come out of her mouth (fingers?) when she was facing opposing opinions on topics she was passionately arguing.

I'm not familiar with his posting history but that comment seemed too over to the top to be serious.

Indeed. Nor is it the first time he has said similarly rude things to her.



Also I did not love that singer. Sounded like he had some digital help being on key, plus I am just always a bit taken out of it hearing DT sung by someone with a very very noticeable accent.

You mean the singer in the video Crystal posted? I thought he sounded good but I don't think he sounds very similar to LaBrie.

[Adami]

Yes. Sorry. The one she posted.

Again it’s like just a me thing, but hearing people with very heavy accents sing songs that are sung originally with a North American neutral accent is a bit jarring for me. Almost all of the DT collab covers have that issue for me. But it’s likely just me and I’m glad it doesn’t bother anyone else.

[MirrorMask]

For those interested in vocalists with veritable James' game, check out Michele Luppi.

Saw him live with Secret Sphere!

[crystalstars17]

Yes. Sorry. The one she posted.

Again it’s like just a me thing, but hearing people with very heavy accents sing songs that are sung originally with a North American neutral accent is a bit jarring for me. Almost all of the DT collab covers have that issue for me. But it’s likely just me and I’m glad it doesn’t bother anyone else.

I believe he is based in the Northwest US. I'm in the Northeast US and I don't notice the accent. Maybe we're just used to James's Canadian vowels in the song?

I do know that he is trained by the same teacher who worked with Geoff Tate and Ann Wilson. Of course that doesn't mean anything, except that he is trained by a known entity.

ETA, Have you listened to him speak? His speech sounds absolutely Midwestern! So I do not hear anything that different from his actual speech here. It's not as if we're hearing a perfect American accent from someone whose native accent is strongly European or Asian, for example, which would be jarring and sound a bit artificial.

[hefdaddy42]

I don't want to put words in Rob24's mouth, but I think he was poking fun at crystalstars17 there a little.

I've seen similar things come out of her mouth (fingers?) when she was facing opposing opinions on topics she was passionately arguing.

I'm not familiar with his posting history but that comment seemed too over to the top to be serious.

Indeed. Nor is it the first time he has said similarly rude things to her.

Well, I certainly have no problem admitting I was wrong, if that's the case.

[crystalstars17]

I don't want to put words in Rob24's mouth, but I think he was poking fun at crystalstars17 there a little.

I've seen similar things come out of her mouth (fingers?) when she was facing opposing opinions on topics she was passionately arguing.

I'm not familiar with his posting history but that comment seemed too over to the top to be serious.

Indeed. Nor is it the first time he has said similarly rude things to her.

Well, I certainly have no problem admitting I was wrong, if that's the case.

I know I tend to get feisty when defending James! My apologies, and also for calling Rob24 a troll. Maybe I just don't get his particular style of humor.❔

At any rate, thank you, Herrick and Adami.

[Herrick]

Yes. Sorry. The one she posted.

Again it’s like just a me thing, but hearing people with very heavy accents sing songs that are sung originally with a North American neutral accent is a bit jarring for me. Almost all of the DT collab covers have that issue for me. But it’s likely just me and I’m glad it doesn’t bother anyone else.

I believe he is based in the Northwest US. I'm in the Northeast US and I don't notice the accent. Maybe we're just used to James's Canadian vowels in the song?

I do know that he is trained by the same teacher who worked with Geoff Tate and Ann Wilson. Of course that doesn't mean anything, except that he is trained by a known entity.

ETA, Have you listened to him speak? His speech sounds absolutely Midwestern! So I do not hear anything that different from his actual speech here. It's not as if we're hearing a perfect American accent from someone whose native accent is strongly European or Asian, for example, which would be jarring and sound a bit artificial.

Ha! You're right. I also thought he had an accent when he sang. I assumed he was from Brazil or something. That's weird. I'll have to check out his other singing videos.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jenDsn9lFyo

[crystalstars17]

I think his voice is gorgeous! Not as much so nor in actually the same ways as James (who despite loving many other great singers he will always be my OG favorite singer!), but in a way that he has a powerful and capable tenor voice and the emotional intelligence as a singer to give this music what it deserves (and incidentally he is also the author of The Astonishing novel, so he really gets it). Are we looking at Gabriel v2.0? 😁

[Dream Team]

I don't want to put words in Rob24's mouth, but I think he was poking fun at crystalstars17 there a little.

I've seen similar things come out of her mouth (fingers?) when she was facing opposing opinions on topics she was passionately arguing.

You are correct. A lot of people miss humor that is really dry though.

[geeeemo]

I think his voice is gorgeous! Not as much so nor in actually the same ways as James (who despite loving many other great singers he will always be my OG favorite singer!), but in a way that he has a powerful and capable tenor voice and the emotional intelligence as a singer to give this music what it deserves (and incidentally he is also the author of The Astonishing novel, so he really gets it). Are we looking at Gabriel v2.0? 😁

I didn't listen, but
Oh! Peter Orullian! He does sound great. I love his DT covers, and he is super friendly on social media. I couldn't get into him for being a replacement for James though. However, he even kind of looks like James in a way.

[crystalstars17]

I think his voice is gorgeous! Not as much so nor in actually the same ways as James (who despite loving many other great singers he will always be my OG favorite singer!), but in a way that he has a powerful and capable tenor voice and the emotional intelligence as a singer to give this music what it deserves (and incidentally he is also the author of The Astonishing novel, so he really gets it). Are we looking at Gabriel v2.0? 😁

I didn't listen, but
Oh! Peter Orullian! He does sound great. I love his DT covers, and he is super friendly on social media. I couldn't get into him for being a replacement for James though. However, he even kind of looks like James in a way.

That Wither cover literally moved me to tears.

I don't think he should replace James, but if James decided for himself that he was ready for retirement, I couldn't see anyone else even remotely as a possibility.

I would rather however see them share the stage like Kiske/Deris as I said earlier! 😁

[Adami]

Listening to it again (the Wither cover).


Yea, dude has either some kind of non-American accent or is pronouncing many vowels VERY strangely.


But also just not a fan. It didn't hurt to listen to or anything, and I've heard WAY worse, but he just didn't have much personality for me. Also it definitely sounded pretty helped, pitch wise.

But to each their own!

[Skeever]

I'll take "doesn't hurt to listen to or anything", I think.

[crystalstars17]

Also it definitely sounded pretty helped, pitch wise.

Not to start an argument (I promise!), but while I can detect technique issues with a natural voice, I do not know how to tell if a voice has been "helped". Can anyone educate me as to what to listen for to detect this? What are the telltale signs? Can you provide a timestamp in the video that can illustrate it? Thanks in advance as this comes up a lot here and I would really like to learn.

[Schurftkut]

oooh it's all over the vocals. no need for timestamps really. it's a robot-y sound to his voice especially noticable when he changes pitch or sustains notes.

[Adami]

No problem!

It’s not something I can quantify scientifically. It’s just experience. I’ve recorded a good amount of vocals when I owned a studio and I record a lot of demo vocals on my own. And I’ve used and still use a lot of Melodyne. Mostly because I’m a crap singer and when I demo my own voice, I need to fix almost all of my notes haha. So I’ve just become very used to what it sounds like when a voice is artificially changed note wise. Not always. It can easily be done in a much more subtle way that I likely wouldn’t ever notice. But this felt like they just locked a good amount of notes at close to 100% match with the desired note. It just has a quality I’ve heard a million times while doing it. Might be wrong. That’s just what I’m hearing.  Not a big deal though. As I’ve said before, most professional recordings use it these days.

Edit: as the dude above me pointed out, no need to time stamp since it’s all over the song. Mostly the more pushed or belty notes. At least it’s easier to hear on those.

[nobloodyname]

But also just not a fan. It didn't hurt to listen to or anything, and I've heard WAY worse, but he just didn't have much personality for me. Also it definitely sounded pretty helped, pitch wise.

Agree with everything you said but especially the part in bold. The vocals seem super processed, almost to the point of making the singer sound like he's singing with a lisp. (Which he could well be doing, I only know him as the author of the novelisation of The Astonishing. Which I ought to sell, really, 'cos I highly doubt I'll ever read it.)

Crystal, on the subject of pitch correction in recordings (and autotune live), this YouTube channel has some really good videos: https://www.youtube.com/@wingsofpegasus. You can clearly hear and see how pitch correction has been applied in a lot of his videos on the subject.

[crystalstars17]

Interesting, and thank you all, but it still seems a little vague. So it's basically the vocal equivalent of the uncanny valley, almost like looking at AI art (and tbf, I can't even tolerate hearing AI voices!)? And, so it seems, you need to be a sound engineer of at least the amateur level to be able to detect it (because, like the banker who has spent enough time with real money and can easily detect counterfeit, I've spent enough time with real voices and still can't hear this)? And while this is usually leveraged against a singer, almost tantamount to calling them a fraud (they did what!?!?! ), it is somehow also widely tolerated within popular (as in all non-classical) recordings as a necessary evil?

I'll take a look at that link in the hopes of understanding better.

[Adami]

Interesting, and thank you all, but it still seems a little vague. So it's basically the vocal equivalent of the uncanny valley, almost like looking at AI art (and tbf, I can't even tolerate hearing AI voices!)? And, so it seems, you need to be a sound engineer of at least the amateur level to be able to detect it (because, like the banker who has spent enough time with real money and can easily detect counterfeit, I've spent enough time with real voices and still can't hear this)? And while this is usually leveraged against a singer, almost tantamount to calling them a fraud (they did what!?!?! ), it is somehow also widely tolerated within popular (as in all non-classical) recordings as a necessary evil?

I'll take a look at that link in the hopes of understanding better.

Kind of haha. It is used a lot, sometimes to a large degree, but mostly just here and there. It's often just easier and more cost effective to change a few notes than to have the singer redo a great delivery. Also modern music DOES have that perfect vocals feel, so vocals are almost always perfectly pitched in most mainstream bands, just to compete in the modern world.

But it's not just vocals. Drums are often quantized. Guitars can be cleaned up a lot. Editing can make any musician sound like they can do something they otherwise could never pull off. This is just modern digital music. I just happen to notice the melodyne influence.

[crystalstars17]

This explains a lot, thanks!

[nobloodyname]

Virtually everyone sings any given note a little sharp or a little flat. Pitch correction, in its simplest form, will raise or lower the sung note to match the intended (tuned) note. The sung note is basically snapped to the exact note it was intended to be.

[gborland]

Of all the many many DT cover videos I've seen over the years, that was definitely one of the mediocre-est. He does sing with a weird accent. Not terrible, but nothing to distinguish it from a hundred other mediocre cover versions.

(I think I read two or three paragraphs of his Astonishing book. I decided not to continue.)

[Skeever]

Peter Orullian has a typical American accent. I'm not sure why his vowels are off in that video, but it's very apparently to me. Maybe he's been instructed, or thinks it's better, to sing this way?