Author Topic: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY  (Read 124831 times)

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Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2941 on: January 23, 2024, 01:10:41 PM »
Hmmm
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.


Offline Kocak

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2943 on: January 23, 2024, 01:18:26 PM »
I'm still of the opinion that his departure was handled poorly by the band.

"So the fish comes up out of the water, it's immediate. But the fish was swimming for a while. Where was the fish? Whatever."

Is he hinting at this as well?

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Offline nobloodyname

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2945 on: January 23, 2024, 01:23:49 PM »
Oh gawd. This is gonna send at least three people into meltdown here.
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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2946 on: January 23, 2024, 01:24:39 PM »
I'm still of the opinion that his departure was handled poorly by the band.

"So the fish comes up out of the water, it's immediate. But the fish was swimming for a while. Where was the fish? Whatever."

Is he hinting at this as well?

Love him, I do, but the man talks in circles sometimes.  :) :) :) :) :)

Offline nobloodyname

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2947 on: January 23, 2024, 01:26:42 PM »
That's why I gave up listening to him speak and reading his interviews. I find it insufferable. Nice chap, mind.

Just say what you mean, man. For goodness' sake.
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Offline wolfking

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2948 on: January 23, 2024, 01:27:55 PM »
How much 'notice' did people expect him to be given.  I don't see why this is such a surprise.
Everyone else, except Wolfking is wrong.

Offline Samsara

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2949 on: January 23, 2024, 01:28:00 PM »
I was waiting for someone to post it. LOL.

For once, I wish Mangini would speak normally.

It'll be what it is, with the decision. Sounds like MM was surprised, but like a pro, just pivoted and moved on. Honestly, no one is going to blame DT for wanting to reunite with MP. Why wouldn't they? The current lineup with him is the one most people consider the "classic" lineup. Makes only sense to ride out with one of the principal guys that got them there.

Mangini is a class act. MP handled the media well too.

Hopefully MM is fulfilled. Hopefully MP is happy. And hopefully DT has another few records in them and they power down and out in a classy way.
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Offline devieira73

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2950 on: January 23, 2024, 01:31:13 PM »
Well, I guess the fish was at JP solo album, in LTE3, in DT backstage... ;D sometimes I think Mangini is a bit confusing, but this time he was clear like... water?
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Offline nobloodyname

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2951 on: January 23, 2024, 01:31:15 PM »
How much 'notice' did people expect him to be given.  I don't see why this is such a surprise.

Probably 'cos it would have implied a nice, cuddly, warm and fluffy exit.
Paul
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Offline nobloodyname

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2952 on: January 23, 2024, 01:32:24 PM »
Honestly, no one is going to blame DT for wanting to reunite with MP. Why wouldn't they?

Welcome to the forum!
Paul
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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2953 on: January 23, 2024, 01:32:56 PM »
Honestly, no one is going to blame DT for wanting to reunite with MP. Why wouldn't they?

Welcome to the forum!

 :tup

Offline cramx3

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2954 on: January 23, 2024, 01:33:11 PM »
This is non news.

It's VERY normal not to know you are about to get laid off. If your employer told you so before hand, that would be really awkward. And lets be real, MM was an employee in the band.

The bigger question is how long did the band have this decision made before letting MM know.  That's where the speculation is IMO and would be some interesting insight if DT made this info public, which I don't expect (at least not in the near future).

Offline TAC

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would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline TAC

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2956 on: January 23, 2024, 02:01:02 PM »

For once, I wish Mangini would speak normally.

I mean, I thought he did. Did you not like the fish analogy?
That's how he sees it. I'm a bit surprised he answered this as honestly as he did.




This is non news.

It's VERY normal not to know you are about to get laid off.

Well it's news because despite the evidence, some people didn't believe he was simply let go.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline Jamesman42

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2957 on: January 23, 2024, 02:01:44 PM »
DREAM THEATER announce their new single, "FISH OUT OF WATER".

Offline nobloodyname

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2958 on: January 23, 2024, 02:05:55 PM »
To be fair, the way Mangini says the fish thing in that video, it makes far more sense than when simply written down.
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Offline TAC

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2959 on: January 23, 2024, 02:07:12 PM »
DREAM THEATER announce their new single, "FISH OUT OF WATER".

 :rollin :rollin


To be fair, the way Mangini says the fish thing in that video, it makes far more sense than when simply written down.

Yup. It makes a ton of sense and is really the perfect metaphor for what happened.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline Samsara

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2960 on: January 23, 2024, 02:07:19 PM »
Hugh Syme already using "fish out of water" in combing the internet for images to manipulate for the next DT cover idea...
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Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2961 on: January 23, 2024, 02:07:45 PM »
Hugh Syme already using "fish out of water" in combing the internet for images to manipulate for the next DT cover idea...
:lol
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2962 on: January 23, 2024, 02:26:36 PM »
I think the translation is that he was like a fish on a line for a little while ("the fish was swimming for a while") before they told him outright he was being replaced by MP ("the fish comes out of the water, it's immediate" i.e. the fish being reeled in). So there was maybe some period where he wasn't sure what the plan was going forward, and then they told him MP was coming back right before the announcement was made (and it sounds like he wanted to make the announcement right away).

Offline Samsara

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2963 on: January 23, 2024, 02:38:41 PM »
I think the translation is that he was like a fish on a line for a little while ("the fish was swimming for a while") before they told him outright he was being replaced by MP ("the fish comes out of the water, it's immediate" i.e. the fish being reeled in). So there was maybe some period where he wasn't sure what the plan was going forward, and then they told him MP was coming back right before the announcement was made (and it sounds like he wanted to make the announcement right away).

That's how I interpreted it as well.
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Offline TAC

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2964 on: January 23, 2024, 03:06:54 PM »
The translation isn't that Mangini was like a fish on the line. What he's saying is that MP was hovering around the band for a period of time, like a fish or a shark circling.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2965 on: January 23, 2024, 03:10:40 PM »
Of course there couldn't have been an advance notice. Derek didn't get an advance notice when he played those late '98 acoustic shows when the band already decided to go with Jordan. But Mangini's metaphor is clear, he wonders, like all of us, how long the reunion plans were going on.

I'm sure it all gets lost in translation when you read the written words, but as gracious and lovely he has been about it, perhaps he's been.... "too much" gracious? of course he's very careful with words, but a little bit of melancholy, of sadness.... nothing? he really was like "oh, so they got the original guy back, K, guess I'm gonna do my own stuff"? I mean, that's a great attitude to have, to not be negative or harbor resentment, but 13 years of your carrer are gone and you're just "Ok, I get it, time to move on?" - again, it's cool to have such a positive attitude, but he comes across as "fine, whatever" about it.
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Offline TAC

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2966 on: January 23, 2024, 03:17:12 PM »
Of course there couldn't have been an advance notice. Derek didn't get an advance notice when he played those late '98 acoustic shows when the band already decided to go with Jordan. But Mangini's metaphor is clear, he wonders, like all of us, how long the reunion plans were going on.


Reunion plans by the band...I don't think he knows, but MP's intentions seemed to be clear to him.



I'm sure it all gets lost in translation when you read the written words, but as gracious and lovely he has been about it, perhaps he's been.... "too much" gracious? of course he's very careful with words, but a little bit of melancholy, of sadness.... nothing? he really was like "oh, so they got the original guy back, K, guess I'm gonna do my own stuff"? I mean, that's a great attitude to have, to not be negative or harbor resentment, but 13 years of your carrer are gone and you're just "Ok, I get it, time to move on?" - again, it's cool to have such a positive attitude, but he comes across as "fine, whatever" about it.

I found his fish metaphor remarkably honest. I don't think he has a choice other than to be professional, but IMO, if you got Mangini some truth serum, he'd still be upset (saddened) by it. I think bitter is too strong of a word, but he's only human to feel that way.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2967 on: January 23, 2024, 03:27:20 PM »


Mike Mangini: "Almost 2024, I am gonna get ready for the new album recording with DT"
.
.
.
3 minutes later...



DT: "Mike, the fist is out of the water"



NOTE: NOT FACT JUST FUN

Offline Indiscipline

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2968 on: January 23, 2024, 03:27:57 PM »
We have heard a bit from both the Mikes, but honestly at this point whom I'm mostly interested in hearing regarding the whole thing is Johnny P.

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2969 on: January 23, 2024, 03:31:16 PM »
We have heard a bit from both the Mikes, but honestly at this point whom I'm mostly interested in hearing regarding the whole thing is Johnny P.

Yup, but you've heard from the two guys that will at least be straight with you.

Maybe JP will as well.





What interests me is "the call". Who made it?
Was it JP?
Was it a full band call?
Was it Frank Soloman?
All of the above?
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2970 on: January 23, 2024, 03:40:30 PM »
We have heard a bit from both the Mikes, but honestly at this point whom I'm mostly interested in hearing regarding the whole thing is Johnny P.

Yup, but you've heard from the two guys that will at least be straight with you.

Maybe JP will as well.


JP is wonderful at public speaking and never says a word out of line, he's a consumate professional about it. I don't doubt his honesty when he says things but he would be able to be more diplomatic about it, while Portnoy in the Drumeo vid just told it in a simpler and more factual way.




What interests me is "the call". Who made it?
Was it JP?
Was it a full band call?
Was it Frank Soloman?
All of the above?

I like to think that all band members told him. Maybe along with the manager who whould pose as the "HR" of the situation, with the guys telling him on a personal level, and the manager addressing whatever business angle there is to address about his "severance".
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Offline devieira73

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2971 on: January 23, 2024, 04:02:53 PM »
The translation isn't that Mangini was like a fish on the line. What he's saying is that MP was hovering around the band for a period of time, like a fish or a shark circling.
Sure!! I guess people are so used to Mangini saying things in a very cryptic way, that can't believe when he makes a simple analogy. :D
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Offline wolfking

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2972 on: January 23, 2024, 04:35:54 PM »
The translation isn't that Mangini was like a fish on the line. What he's saying is that MP was hovering around the band for a period of time, like a fish or a shark circling.

Yeah, that's exactly how I read it also.
Everyone else, except Wolfking is wrong.

Offline wolfking

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2973 on: January 23, 2024, 04:37:08 PM »
What interests me is "the call". Who made it?
Was it JP?
Was it a full band call?
Was it Frank Soloman?
All of the above?

I've wondered this from the start too.  I'd say full band plus manager.  Maybe even just JP and the manager.

"Hey Mike, about that thing we said about welcome to the family and all.........'
Everyone else, except Wolfking is wrong.

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Re: DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY
« Reply #2974 on: January 23, 2024, 04:47:06 PM »
I guess what bothers me the most about this is that it shatters my (admittedly naive) concept of what a band is and how it operates.  I've played in bands all my life, obviously not on nearly the level of Dream Theater, but they were bands.  A bunch of us who knew each other got together and played music.  We went through various permutations throughout junior high and high school.  But "band" decisions always involved all members of the band, and were actual discussions.  Decisions were made as a group regarding what songs we would play.

Post-college (the first time), I joined a band being put together by a guy, and while it was "his" band, many of the decisions were made as a committee.  There were a few more important decisions that he had to make an executive decision regarding, and it actually made sense that he do that.  Sometimes one guy has to make the call, especially if the band cannot reach a consensus.

Back in the 2010's, I was in a band that actually lasted several years and went through various permutations, and while all decisions were originally made by committee, after a while we'd replaced the lead guitarist a few times and went through various lead singers.  It was a seven-piece band, but four of us had been consistent for a couple of years and were the "core" of the band.  "Band" decisions were made by the four of us.  Guitarists and singers were auditioned, hired, and fired, on decisions made by the four of us.  I never really liked that, even if I did see how it was the most practical solution.  This was a band with a clear leader, but he at least had the grace to get input from the three of us who'd been in the band since the beginning.

So Dream Theater is a band, but it is not a band of five guys with equal say.  MP spoke more than once about replacing JLB as a singer.  WTF?  JLB is a member of the band.  How can one other member decide to oust another?  Simple: JLB was not the original singer.  He always had and will always have "junior" status in MP's eyes because of that.  It apparently didn't matter that he was with them 20+ years.  If "the band" wanted to get a different singer, JLB would have been out.

Mike Mangini was the drummer for 13 years and change.  Five albums.  There's no asterisk next to his name in the band credits, no "special thanks" or anything to indicate that he was anything but a full member of the band.  Yet "the band" decided to fire him and get MP back.  In that context, MM was not part of the band.  He was a member of Dream Theater, until John Petrucci decided he wasn't anymore.  One guy did in fact oust another guy from the band.

As they said many times in The Godfather, it's only business; it's not personal.  But that sucks.  Making music with other people is as personal as it gets.  It's a bond.  Dream Theater themselves used to speak of it being like a kind of marriage with five people all trying to compromise and cooperate.  But Derek Sherinian was not the original keyboard player, therefore the others could decide to can him and get someone else.  JLB was not the original singer, therefore he would've been gone if MP had convinced JP to pull the trigger.  And now MM is out because JP wanted MP back.

I'm not sure why it bothers me so much.  Most people are thrilled that MP is back.  MM has no choice but to be gracious about it publicly, and that certainly has helped reduce any potential backlash.  But I can't help feeling like MM got screwed, just as DS got screwed, and JLB almost got screwed.  Michael Corleone was right: It's all personal.  Killing someone isn't personal?  Bullshit.  Killing someone is as personal as it gets.  Saying it's only business is just an excuse to not feel bad about screwing someone over.