DREAM THEATER ANNOUNCE THE RETURN OF DRUMMER MIKE PORTNOY

[Dedalus]

Mangini's statement starts with the sentence "I understand Dream Theater’s decision to get Mike Portnoy back at this time". Does not really sound like how you would open your statement if you were the one who made the decision right? Anything beyond that point is speculating of course but the statement itself is there for everyone to read and it's not very cryptic or anything.

Either way it does seem like a very amicable split so I doubt there will be much drama to come from this. Mike Mangini definitely deserves credit for being a stand up guy, he's been very nice about this. And you can't help but feel a little bit bad for the guy, he did a great job filling in for MP for over a decade, yet the fan reception and hype around MP coming back is unlike any hype during Mangini's time in the band. In less than 24 hours this thread about MP coming back has almost surpassed the Mike Mangini appreciation thread here - started in 2011 when he joined. There's just a certain magic of bringing back the 'classic' lineup that you can't match.

Well, I can't respond to your post with what I think

In any case, yes MM is a tremendous gentleman .... and there was no way he could compete with MP in terms of public success.
He already started losing. C'est la vie.

[nobloodyname]

Honestly, NOT the LEAST bit funny IMO.

Whereas I laughed out loud

[Lax]

A night wasn't enough to think about it.
I really wasn't expecting it, especially since members got bored of interviews asking about MP comeback and were pretty strict in their answers.

For the reasons it happened, IDK if :
-mangini was leaving soon and the guys chose MP over doing a new audition,
-the guys felt an irresistible urge to get MP back and kicked MM out,
-the guys thought it was the only solution for the band to earn more money,
-the guys listened to blink182 new album and called MP immediatly...

For JLB, in the worst case scenario I guess he got "no voice, no physical presence during writing and shit, no opinion"

Now, from a music enjoyer and musician perspective, I have a way harder time to set my opinion :
-I was nearly happy MP left because it felt like the band wasn't as creative as before, I didn't like lazy DT and inspiration corner DT epoch
-I loved MM work on DOT and AVFTTOTW, just out of this planet drumming, a delish. He was the man of the situation.
-Half of the songs of the MM era are modern DT, meaning lots of chug chug and less surprises...In the end it's a little a lazy DT too.

Now, considering songwriting, it's clear that I miss a little crazyness from the past, from concepts to emotions, modern DT is different.
Will bringing modern MP back do the trick ?

Today, my feeling is : On the best case scenario we may experience creativity, groove and less chugchug, on the worst case scenario, we get a cold BC&SL era lazy DT revamp.
I really hope this change is for the best !

[genome]

I've woken up feeling like it was ... 6:00 on a Christmas morning

[wasteland]

I echo the majority's sentiment that once the rift with James had been (ostensibly) mended last year MP joining back was only a matter of time. I guess the guys might have felt similarly, and considering their age and the overall trajectory of the band, elected that the time was now.

I always stood by MM and still do to this day. I find his contribution to the band, both musically and personally, to be top notch. His final album with the band, where incidentally his personal touch shines through the most, stands out in my opinion as one of the band's finest.

That being said, every time the band was jolted, something major happened on the musical side. Images, SFAM, TOT to a degree, ADTOE are examples of this. It would look like we are in for exciting times!

[jimgolf]

Mangini is no longer in the band, and it was the bands decision to rehire Mike Portnoy at this time, and subsequently also follows that Mangini had to go. Regardless of whether this happened with Mangini resigning or them letting him go, is a pure technicality at this point. The decision order was that the band decided to get Portnoy back, and that left Mangini without a job.

I pretty much agree with this. Call it Mangini fired/let go/peacefully sent away/delicately encouraged to retire - the end result is the same. The band wanted Mike Portnoy back and they had to part ways with Mangini. If this was because Mangini wanted to retire, I feel Mangini would've just said in the statement - "Hey, I've had thirteen great years in the band, but touring is hard and I want to go back to teaching and working on other projects so I'm leaving. The guys have mended their relationship with Mike Portnoy and are excited to work with him again, so he will be taking my place as the drummer going forward. Thank you to all the fans for support, love, etc."

Btw, if some casual speculation about this is somehow "over the line," I guess I'm warned too.  Bosk is always even keeled, but I really don't believe there is anything inappropriate in respectfully speculating about what happened.

As much as I am excited to see the return of Mike Portnoy, I'm really gonna miss Mangini - I really grew to love him. At first I wanted them to pick Marco Minneman or Peter Wildoer and subsequently I wasn't a huge fan of his drumming on ADTOE - but seeing him live and hearing the self-titled album really sold me on the fact that he was the guy for DT. Since then, his drumming found its groove with the band and his performances on Distance Over Time and A View From the Top of the World were just incredible. Things like The Alien,Pale Blue Dot,The Enemy Inside, and Barstool Warrior have become classics from the Mangini era in big part because of his drumming. He came through for the band in a time where they really needed him. I've been a fan of the band since around 2005, so Mangini has been the drummer of the band for most of my time listening to them. I've seen Portnoy a couple times with the band before he left, but I've seen the band with Mangini 10 times(which is kind of crazy to think about).

I really hope he knows how much the fans love and appreciate his time in the band. I got a chance to meet him at a Meet&Greet and he was nothing but gracious, kind, and an all around happy dude. Maybe we'll get to see him again on a James Labrie solo record like he did with Elements of Persuasion or at a reunion show with the band. I wish him nothing but the best.

As for the return of Mike Portnoy, I cannot overstate how giddy I was this morning when I found out. I had a friend text me and I thought for sure it was some kind of hoax. Mangini has been a great part of this band, but Portnoy is one of my all time favorite drummers. He helped the band develop their best/classic albums and he's an absolute blast to see live. The thought of them making a new record and me being able to see the classic lineup together again on stage is so awesome. Plus, I hope to see some of Portnoy's social media interaction with the fans about the music/recording/tour. That was one of my favorite parts of the band back in the day - Portnoy's online presence and funny documentation of all sorts of random crap.

[Infinite Cactus]

You know I didn't even consider the part where Portnoy would likely be interacting with the fans again. Hell yeah! Here's to hoping.

[TAC]

It's quite simple.  Saying as fact that MM was "fired" is just flat out wrong, as nothing of the kind has been said by ANY official source.  And those saying they "agree" with that can consider themselves warned as well.  Again, NOBODY from any camp involved in any of this has said anything of the sort.  This forum will not be used as a tool to spread wild rumors like that.

Ok, well, "Fired" is certainly not the desired connotation as it paints Mangini negatively, but in the statement Mike confirms that the band wanted to get back with MP, and in the MP social media post, MP even compliments Mangini of being classy with "the change".

I can understand you not wanting people posting on this board that he was fired, but he was .... how can I eloquently say this...replaced.

I don't know how any of that is rumor. Nothing in life is cut and dry I get, but there doesn't seem to be a lot of nuance happening here. No one is painting the band in a bad light for it.



EDIT:
Sorry, but I'm not trying to kick up dust.  My understanding is that this was not mutual, nor did Mike quit. When I say not mutual, that's not to say that he didn't accept "the decision" (Mike's words) with grace.

[wolfking]

It's quite simple.  Saying as fact that MM was "fired" is just flat out wrong, as nothing of the kind has been said by ANY official source.  And those saying they "agree" with that can consider themselves warned as well.  Again, NOBODY from any camp involved in any of this has said anything of the sort.  This forum will not be used as a tool to spread wild rumors like that.

Ok, well, "Fired" is certainly not the desired connotation as it paints Mangini negatively, but in the statement Mike confirms that the band wanted to get back with MP, and in the MP social media post, MP even compliments Mangini of being classy with "the change".

I can understand you not wanting people posting on this board that he was fired, but he was .... how can I eloquently say this...replaced.

I don't know how any of that is rumor. Nothing in life is cut and dry I get, but there doesn't seem to be a lot of nuance happening here. No one is painting the band in a bad light for it.

The thing is, it's always going to be a talking point no matter which way it went down.  But outside this thread, is anyone really going to care about the technicalities behind it?

Edit:  I am in no way making excuses to discuss the topic or downplaying bosks request.

[Pebsie]

Octavarium was re-added to Apple Music in the UK after being off the platform for about 2 years. Seems awfully relevant timing. I wonder…

[Skeever]

When I think "fired", I think of someone being forced to leave  for their own wrongdoing. Like a guy gets "fired" for showing up smelling like booze everyday.

Then there's people who are let go for other reasons that don't connotate any wrongdoing, like people who are let go during reductions, or because the company decide to outsource.

Then you have people who just wind up being let go or leave because it doesn't work out for whatever reason. Said person wants x, the organization are only willing to give z, they can't meet in the middle and that person walks.

I agree with those who are trying to respect a bit of nuance here. We can understand at least some of the reasons why MP is rejoining, because he is in original founding member who the fans still love. But as far as Mangini goes, I don't think it's fair to speculate on the exact circumstances of the situation. Everybody knows that he was doing his job, and holding things down. The band let him say it in the Press release. I am not going to speculate on all the personal and professional factors that might have made now the opportune time to bring MP back but "fired people" usually don't get to put out a press release.

[Zydar]

Octavarium was re-added to Apple Music in the UK after being off the platform for about 2 years. Seems awfully relevant timing. I wonder…

Oh, we're getting Octavarium Pt 2: Sacrificed Sons Of Apollo

[lucky7]

Wow I am in shock. The email from the Dream Theater website went to my spam folder, (it has been a long term before any news releases from the website)
I have spent the last few hours reading posts on this page.
It seems crazy to think MP left in 2010, I found out on my first trip to America way back then.
Like so many we watched those drummer auditions and I was so happy with MM joining the band, (I had followed him from when he toured and recorded with Steve Vai) even though it was still a shock MP leaving, it became the norm.
He is such a nice guy at meet and greets and in interviews, not to mention an insanely talented musician
I enjoyed some albums more than others during his tenure, but was so happy to see JP accept the Grammy on behalf if the band for The Alien.
I was lucky enough to see JP tour his solo album Terminal Velocity, alongside MP on drums, in Los Angeles and Chicago, supported by Meanstreak.
I never would have guessed that road may lead MP back to DT.
But now it has happened, I am sad first and foremost for MM, but watching that recent interview on YouTube he will not lack for work, and I am quietly excited to see what the next chapter holds for Dream Theater. 
If I am totally honest, first and foremost I am a guitar fan and I just think JP just keeps getting better and better. So if this reunion inspires him even more I cannot wait! 
I read many pages back on this thread that someone hoped Rich Wilson may do another update at some point in the future, I would love that too!

[Trav86]

Octavarium was re-added to Apple Music in the UK after being off the platform for about 2 years. Seems awfully relevant timing. I wonder…

Oh, we're getting Octavarium Pt 2: Sacrificed Sons Of Apollo

Oh hell yeah!

[WilliamMunny]

Lot's of interesting takes to read since I last checked in yesterday.

Obviously, the fanbase (myself included) is, by and large, stoked. The sheer volume of responses here and elsewhere are a clear indicator of that.

I did, however, want to offer a small piece of perspective regarding some of the brouhaha that's developed over these last couple of pages...

Without going into the specifics, here's my take on 'us' voicing our thoughts 'here': this is an internet forum, not a bar (or insert public place here). As such, I've always viewed my participation here as though I were a guest in someone else's home.

When I'm at my friend's house, and we're shooting the breeze, if he throws down a 'hey, don't talk about that,' regardless of whether or not I feel his reaction is warranted, I'm going to respect his wishes, because I am in his house.

I dig lurking and posting here, and have for many, many years–the mods/site owners have been so kind as to post a list of rules by which I happily abide. We are all here by choice, and I suppose each of us has the right and ability to simply close the tab if we feel strongly that there's something we dislike about the way the forum works.

[Herrick]

A night of little sleep, lots of reading and contemplation has given me a perspective. There is a big void between the two outer ends of the spectrum, 'Mangini who quit at his own request' and 'Mangini was fired'. And while I want to be careful in word choices, I believe the most likely scenario lies somewhere in the middle.

Mangini is an artist who had a much bigger life than 'just' Dream Theater. For the other band members, the band consumes a much larger part of life. Dream Theater is much bigger for them than for Mangini. And when rumors came that Portnoy wanted to return, I wouldn't be surprised if Mangini voluntarily left the drum seat vacant. Out of respect for Dream Theater... and in the knowledge that he will remain happy in many other fields. I hope they reveal the transition later on, someday.

But most of all, although I am thrilled to see Portnoy return, I have the most respect of Mangini and adore all the work he've done. Mangini is not only gifted on drums, but also as a character. So much joy and life-energy, he really will be missed.

What rumors?

Lot's of interesting takes to read since I last checked in yesterday.

Obviously, the fanbase (myself included) is, by and large, stoked. The sheer volume of responses here and elsewhere are a clear indicator of that.

I did, however, want to offer a small piece of perspective regarding some of the brouhaha that's developed over these last couple of pages...

Without going into the specifics, here's my take on 'us' voicing our thoughts 'here': this is an internet forum, not a bar (or insert public place here). As such, I've always viewed my participation here as though I were a guest in someone else's home.

When I'm at my friend's house, and we're shooting the breeze, if he throws down a 'hey, don't talk about that,' regardless of whether or not I feel his reaction is warranted, I'm going to respect his wishes, because I am in his house.

I dig lurking and posting here, and have for many, many years–the mods/site owners have been so kind as to post a list of rules by which I happily abide. We are all here by choice, and I suppose each of us has the right and ability to simply close the tab if we feel strongly that there's something we dislike about the way the forum works.

This is true. His forum, his rules. If I'm going to get warned/banned for agreeing with Barstool's opinion (which I do agree with) or any other...illegal opinions in the future then no hard feelings *shrugs*

[Wim Kruithof]

What rumors?

'Rumors' was the most-close translation of my Dutch in English, where I meant to say, 'when became clear Portnoy actually was willing to return home'.

[Madman Shepherd]

Wow, what an absolute lovely post from MM under MP's post. He could have just said nothing, but he congratulated him. He's basically the reason why I'm not 100% happy with the reunion - the fact that such a gentleman and a world class drummer had to go!

About James' comments about "this is the final line-up", yesterday at home I didn't double check, but I'm damn sure that in the Mullmuzzler booklet (his first album of 1999) he welcomed Jordan in the band calling it "hopefully the last member change ever" 

Yep, you're right! He sure likes to insist each lineup change is the last! 

[Podaar]

Well...that's too bad. Darnit!

[Herrick]

What rumors?

'Rumors' was the most-close translation of my Dutch in English, where I meant to say, 'when became clear Portnoy actually was willing to return home'.

I see.

[Podaar]

Octavarium was re-added to Apple Music in the UK after being off the platform for about 2 years. Seems awfully relevant timing. I wonder…

Oh, we're getting Octavarium Pt 2: Sacrificed Sons Of Apollo

I know you're kidding, Zydar (you witty hunk), but this is what I fear we'll actually be getting.

[Stadler]

Mangini's statement starts with the sentence "I understand Dream Theater’s decision to get Mike Portnoy back at this time". Does not really sound like how you would open your statement if you were the one who made the decision right? Anything beyond that point is speculating of course but the statement itself is there for everyone to read and it's not very cryptic or anything.

Either way it does seem like a very amicable split so I doubt there will be much drama to come from this. Mike Mangini definitely deserves credit for being a stand up guy, he's been very nice about this. And you can't help but feel a little bit bad for the guy, he did a great job filling in for MP for over a decade, yet the fan reception and hype around MP coming back is unlike any hype during Mangini's time in the band. In less than 24 hours this thread about MP coming back has almost surpassed the Mike Mangini appreciation thread here - started in 2011 when he joined. There's just a certain magic of bringing back the 'classic' lineup that you can't match.

But that's the point.   It does SOUND LIKE, if you're inclined in that direction, but it isn't NECESSARILY.   "When I expressed interested in taking time off (see what I did there?) to do my solo thing, I understand Dream Theater’s decision to get Mike Portnoy back at this time,” states Mike Mangini.  "I fought them motherf--------s as hard as I could, but at the end of the day, I understand Dream Theater’s decision to get Mike Portnoy back at this time,” states Mike Mangini.   The point being, there's as much unsaid there as said, and it could be a number of other scenarios. 

These things are generally worded VERY carefully, by lawyers or press people.  Sometimes there IS hidden info in there, and sometimes there is not.  It' is, in my not inconsiderable experience in these matters, dangerous to start inferring things that fit your narrative.  If you are Team Mangini and feel that this couldn't' have happened without his firing, so be it, I can't tell you what to think.  But I can tell you you can't make the inferences that some are making.  It may actually come out that it's true; he was fired. I don't know that.  But if it does come out, anyone saying "I knew it! I told you! it was clear in the statements!" is billshotting you. It was not clear in the statements.

[Wim Kruithof]

Off, but... suddenly I was thinking, 'where's Kotowboy' since al those Portnoy-fans are back in here, but I remember I haven't red Kotowboy in a while. Can be he's still active in threads I do not participate, as well though.

[WilliamMunny]

Off, but... suddenly I was thinking, 'where's Kotowboy' since al those Portnoy-fans are back in here, but I remember I haven't red Kotowboy in a while. Can be he's still active in threads I do not participate, as well though.

Banned, I believe.

[Wim Kruithof]

Banned, I believe.

I see, he hasn't been online since january I found out, so he's basicly gone. A shame...

[Anxiety35]

After almost 24 hours to soak it all in, here are my thoughts:

Portnoy returning gives DT a shot in the arm. Fans seem excited. The band seems excited. Shoot, I'm excited!

Mangini's comments aren't run-of-the-mill stuff. He's showing grace and class, which we all know is part of his character. I'll miss him in DT as I thought he did an excellent job.

As to how all of this came about, I'm guessing it didn't happen quickly. MP's Instagram story had his daughter's post saying her dad's return to DT was the hardest secret she's ever had to keep. So, they've all known for some time. How it all came about will be interesting to learn.

I'm looking forward to interviews and more comments from the band, as well as from Mangini.

[nobloodyname]

Off, but... suddenly I was thinking, 'where's Kotowboy' since al those Portnoy-fans are back in here, but I remember I haven't red Kotowboy in a while. Can be he's still active in threads I do not participate, as well though.

He's off being angry about it on Twitter. (He really is.)

[King Postwhore]

Banned, I believe.

I see, he hasn't been online since january I found out, so he's basicly gone. A shame...

He shot his way out of town. 

[Zydar]

Off, but... suddenly I was thinking, 'where's Kotowboy' since al those Portnoy-fans are back in here, but I remember I haven't red Kotowboy in a while. Can be he's still active in threads I do not participate, as well though.

He's off being angry about it on Twitter. (He really is.)

He's angry about MP returning or just angry in general?

[WilliamMunny]

After almost 24 hours to soak it all in, here are my thoughts:

Portnoy returning gives DT a shot in the arm. Fans seem excited. The band seems excited. Shoot, I'm excited!

Mangini's comments aren't run-of-the-mill stuff. He's showing grace and class, which we all know is part of his character. I'll miss him in DT as I thought he did an excellent job.

As to how all of this came about, I'm guessing it didn't happen quickly. MP's Instagram story had his daughter's post saying her dad's return to DT was the hardest secret she's ever had to keep. So, they've all known for some time. How it all came about will be interesting to learn.

I'm looking forward to interviews and more comments from the band, as well as from Mangini.

This is such a good point!

That 'grace' you speak of (which MP is displaying as well) has made this whole thing feel that much better to me.

[King Postwhore]

Off, but... suddenly I was thinking, 'where's Kotowboy' since al those Portnoy-fans are back in here, but I remember I haven't red Kotowboy in a while. Can be he's still active in threads I do not participate, as well though.

He's off being angry about it on Twitter. (He really is.)

He's angry about MP returning or just angry in general?

Yup.  No believing it's true because it wasn't posted on other social media right away.  LOL

[Stadler]

Off, but... suddenly I was thinking, 'where's Kotowboy' since al those Portnoy-fans are back in here, but I remember I haven't red Kotowboy in a while. Can be he's still active in threads I do not participate, as well though.

He's off being angry about it on Twitter. (He really is.)

Did we expect anything else?   

[Azyiu]

Pretty much everything I have on my mind has been said, so I will keep it simple and say this. I am happy to see MP back, but I have mixed feeling about MM's departure. All the best MM.

[axeman90210]

One thing I was thinking about last night. The news breaks yesterday and by and large there is joy in the fanbase (not absolutely everyone, and largely not without due respect for Mr. Mangini). The band has received a shot in the arm in terms of attention/enthusiasm, and they're going to capitalize on that by... eventually releasing new music and going on tour? MP is on tour with the Winery Dogs through Thanksgiving week. He gets home from Japan and they'd maybe have a couple weeks to get together and write before the holidays. Best case scenario is maybe there's a new album written and recorded by sometime in February? Then wait for it to get mixed and mastered and into the elongated album release cycle waiting for vinyl pressing and whatnot. If they wait to tour behind the new album then there might not be anything tangible in terms of new music or shows with Portnoy back in the drummer's stool before August or September of 2024, almost a year from the announcement. Just seems like a waste in some ways. If it were me I would have had as part of yesterday's announcement something to the effect of "We're obviously excited to get into the studio and record new music together, but we don't want to wait that long to play music together in front of all of you" and drop some tour dates for the first half of 2024. You don't need new music to sell the first tour with Portnoy back in the band.

[ReaperKK]

I was talking about that last night. I feel like with as much attention this is getting maybe they should do a quick tour first? I don't know but it seems like it's going to be a while before new music comes out and there is a tour to support it.