Guns: Yay or nay?

[Chino]

I didn't get a chance for the up close practice. I'll save that for the indoor facility I go to. It has retractable target lines, so it's easy to constantly readjust your distance, and they let you shoot as close as 5 yards. At the outdoor range, you can only move your targets once every 30 minutes when they do a cease fire. You also can't move them any closer to the firing line than that set of targets all the way to the right.

You've made me realize that I've never fired anything left handed. That'd be an absolute shit show. I can't even piss left handed 

[gmillerdrake]

You've made me realize that I've never fired anything left handed. That'd be an absolute shit show. I can't even piss left handed 

I think you'll be surprised at how well you do when you finally do it. It's hard to explain, but....for me there's less thought put into it and not all the 'noise' from the different techniques/grips/sight windows etc etc that you read and try through the years with your dominant hand.....and you just shoot because you aren't really trying for the lack of a better term. I've found it to be completely reflexive and more organic and have had pretty good success (10yds or less) at getting nice groupings and staying on the paper.

[Phoenix87x]

I practice with the left hand because I just know that the one time in my life I have to defend myself the guy will probably have my right hand pinned down 

Murphy's law madness

[bosk1]

I remember a guy I served with in the military once saying, "I like using my left hand because it feels like it's someone else."  But I don't think he was talking about shooting. 

[hefdaddy42]

I remember a guy I served with in the military once saying, "I like using my left hand because it feels like it's someone else."  But I don't think he was talking about shooting.

[Stadler]

I remember a guy I served with in the military once saying, "I like using my left hand because it feels like it's someone else."  But I don't think he was talking about shooting.

I've tried that; and it did feel like it's someone else... someone who didn't know what the hell they were doing! 

[hefdaddy42]

I remember a guy I served with in the military once saying, "I like using my left hand because it feels like it's someone else."  But I don't think he was talking about shooting.

I've tried that; and it did feel like it's someone else... someone who didn't know what the hell they were doing! 

[Architeuthis]

I don't own any guns.  If I have enough money to buy a gun,  I'm gonna buy a guitar instead. At least something music gear related.

[Chino]

I added a 22lr wheel gun to the collection this morning. I wanted another 22lr because the indoor range I like the most for winter shooting is 22 only, and this will be a good alternative to the semiauto Buck Mark I have.

It's a Charter Arms Target Pathfinder. Not my first choice. Ideally I wanted a S&W 617, but haven't found one. I couldn't find a Taurus 942 either (the 22lr version of the 856 snub pictured below). With the Black Friday sale, and being one of the 20 first in line and getting a $25 gift card, I got this and 1000 rounds of ammo for $420. Not a bad morning!

[Phoenix87x]

That's quite the collection 

[Chino]

Froze my balls off, but went to the range for a few hours this morning on my day off. Have to do something while the golf courses are shut down!

I don't think I'm loving that Charter Arms I recently purchased. I'm having a really hard time zeroing the sight in. I can't adjust the vertical axis any further, and it's still shooting really high. In the image below, I was aiming at center (unlike the Buck Mark where I was picking dots). I struggle terribly with it in double action. Far more so than with either of my other two revolvers. I'm on the fence on whether or not I want to trade it in. Part of me wants to keep it for no reason other than it's made in Shelton CT, which is like 30 minutes from me.

That snub nose did a number on me today too. It really rattles my wrist. I can still feel it 6 hours later. I was hitting the paper pretty good though for being 10 yards out.

[gmillerdrake]

Good groupings though Brian. I'd personally ditch anything you don't like firing or have confidence firing. With ammo costs and getting to the range varying in frequency.....no need to waste time with a firearm you don't like to shoot. Too many good ones out there to choose from.

[El Barto]

Froze my balls off, but went to the range for a few hours this morning on my day off. Have to do something while the golf courses are shut down!

I don't think I'm loving that Charter Arms I recently purchased. I'm having a really hard time zeroing the sight in. I can't adjust the vertical axis any further, and it's still shooting really high. In the image below, I was aiming at center (unlike the Buck Mark where I was picking dots). I struggle terribly with it in double action. Far more so than with either of my other two revolvers. I'm on the fence on whether or not I want to trade it in. Part of me wants to keep it for no reason other than it's made in Shelton CT, which is like 30 minutes from me.

That snub nose did a number on me today too. It really rattles my wrist. I can still feel it 6 hours later. I was hitting the paper pretty good though for being 10 yards out.

First off, at 30' you're shooting quite well. Nothing to be concerned about there (and far, far better than I can shoot).

As for the shooting high part, 22lr is cheap. Buy 3 small boxes of different ammo and don't be surprised is one of them is bang on. Hell, don't be surprised if one of them is hitting low at that range.

If that doesn't resolve the issue take it to the manufacturer and tell it shoots for shit and see what they do about it. I'd be fascinated to hear the story.

[Chino]

Thanks dudes. The advice is appreciated.   

Taurus just announced an updated version of the 856 I have. It'll come optic ready now.

 

I was hunting for the 22lr version (the 942) of that for the better part of 9 months or so, and they are nowhere to be found. I'm hoping they'll be announcing a new version of that one as well. If they do, I'm trading in that Charter Arms without hesitation and getting one of them.

[gmillerdrake]

Optics on a revolver looks 'strange' to me. Good luck finding the .22 model

[Chino]

I think the universe was trying to send me a sign for Valentine's Day yesterday. After searching for over a year for a S&W 617 6", I got alerts from three websites last night that they were now in stock. S&W must have finally gotten a  fresh batch into the wild. I don't know how, but one appeared in my cart. In a panic, I accidentally entered all of my CC and FFL information before clicking the "confirm order" button 



This is my first time purchasing a firearm on the internet. Finger crossed it all goes smoothly.

I'm debating what to do with that Charter Arms I got. It pails in comparison to this new one in every category besides weight. I don't know whether or not I should trade/sell it to my LGS or just keep it as a "guest gun" for other people on range days.

[gmillerdrake]

Nice!   

[Chino]

Grabbed my new 617 this morning. This thing is beefy! I can't wait to try it out next weekend.

[Dave_Manchester]

From the off let me say that I know less than zero about guns and how they're handled. My exposure to both has been via movies. That's why I was struck by the bodycam footage of the Tennessee shooter being taken down. I've time-stamped the section I'm talking about and my question is: why is the officer holding his weapon at what seems to be a 45-degree angle and away from his body? I've never seen that before. In Hollywood films (I know, I know) cops who go searching for someone in a house always have their weapon tucked tight against their shoulder and pointed arrow-straight. Is this (the 45-degree thing) just that one officer's preference or is that in fact how it's meant to be done? 

https://youtu.be/x97jfBwvT2E?t=191

(note/warning: the clip is not graphic but is very intense)

[Phoenix87x]

I could be wrong, but it just looked like the officer was clearing a corner. Meaning that by peaking a weapon out slanted exposes less of your person.

As for actually firing, I've always been taught to keep it level. But there's also the chaos of the situation as well, so who knows.

But good question/observation though

[El Barto]

From the off let me say that I know less than zero about guns and how they're handled. My exposure to both has been via movies. That's why I was struck by the bodycam footage of the Tennessee shooter being taken down. I've time-stamped the section I'm talking about and my question is: why is the officer holding his weapon at what seems to be a 45-degree angle and away from his body? I've never seen that before. In Hollywood films (I know, I know) cops who go searching for someone in a house always have their weapon tucked tight against their shoulder and pointed arrow-straight. Is this (the 45-degree thing) just that one officer's preference or is that in fact how it's meant to be done? 

https://youtu.be/x97jfBwvT2E?t=191

(note/warning: the clip is not graphic but is very intense)

You mount the scope directly on top for when you need distance aiming, and then a red-dot sight offset 45° that you can use in situations like this. Carrying it at that angle allows him to use the red dot. Looks like this.

[Chino]

Got to spend some time at the indoor range over the weekend and got to test out my new speed loader. That was hands down the best investment I've made since getting into shooting!

[hefdaddy42]

Nice!

[gmillerdrake]

Had a fun shoot this past Saturday. Once a year those of us who are approved to CCW at our church as a part of the Safety Team have to Qualify. So, went out Saturday morning to take part in the qualification. I asked the guy who runs our team and does the training to send me the criteria list so I could share....here it is:


Training Drills

3 Yards
10 Round Evaluation (1 Mag of 10 Rounds or 2 Mags of 5 ea.) (10 Rds)
Draw from holster
Fire 5 rounds making the tightest group
Holster
Evaluate your group
Repeat 1x


3 Yards
Touch your Buddies Hole (2 Mags of 10 Rounds) (20 Rds)
-   First person fires a shot on target. Next person's shot has to hit that 'hole'. Then, that person puts a shot on target, partner has to hit that hole....and so on.

I won my group. I still had 12 rounds left and my opponent emptied his 20. This is a fun one from 3 yards out because it makes you aim small/miss small


3 Yards
Speed Drill (2 Magazines of 10 Rounds) (20 Rds)
One shooter at a time, timed individually to see who can get the best time.
From High Compressed Ready fire 10 rounds as fast as possible
Holster
Repeat 1x and see if times improve


This one is set up to get you to get as many rounds on target as fast as possible. My final time I got 10 rounds on target in just under 5 seconds, that's from holster


5 Yards
One Handed - Strong Hand (1 Magazines of 10 Rounds) (10 Rds)
Draw one handed (strong hand) fire 5 rounds one handed in 8 seconds (Reload)
Holster
Repeat 1x with Weak Hand


7 Yards
Holster Drill-Timed (1 Magazine of 10 Rounds) (10 Rds.)
Draw from Holster fire 2 rounds into center mass of target (Repeat 5x)
Holster after every 2 rounds

So I ended up getting my time down to getting out of the holster and first round on target in 1.3 seconds....second round at 1.6. That was from fully concealed and waiting for a random whistle. Instructor did it in 1.1/1.3 so I was pretty happy with my result there.


7 Yards
1 Reload 1 (1R1) Drill (1 Magazine of 10 Rounds and 1 Empty Magazine) (10 Rds.)
Drill Set-Up - 1 Round in Chamber and Empty Mag in Gun
Draw from Holster fire 1 round, speed reload and fire 1 more round
Recover empty mag and set-up again (1 in chamber, empty mag in gun)
Holster
Repeat 5x


7 Yards
Chair / Mozambique Drill (1 Magazine of 3 rounds) (6 Rds)
Shooter starts seated in Chair at 10 Yards, facing away from target. On buzzer stand, move to shooting position (7 yards)
Draw from holster 2 rounds to body, 1 to head - All in 8 Seconds
Holster
Repeat 1x


10 Yards
Headshot Drill (1 Magazine of 5 rounds) (5 Rds)
Draw shoot one round into head box in 5 seconds
Holster
Repeat 5x


10 Yards
Push / Pull Drill (1 Full Magazine) - 1 Shooter at a Time
Partner Up - Non shooting partner will move shooter around by belt / belt loop Shooter will take one shot on steel target on each whistle End drill when mag is empty

This one was fun and weird at the same time. This guy that was moving/tugging me around was a lot bigger than me so he was just jostling me around. You're sitting there getting on target and waiting for the random whistle and you have a second to fire after that. My magazine was a 12 round capacity and I had one chambered so....I went 6/13 on this. It was REALLY hard but fun.

15 Yards
Moving while Shooting (2 Magazines of 10 rounds) (20 Rds)
Start facing away from target. On threat command turn and face target, Draw and walk toward target
Fire 10 rounds at target before reaching 5 yard line
Holster
Repeat 1x


25 Yards
Distance Shooting (1 Magazine of 10 rounds) (10 rds)
From standing position draw and fire 10 rounds
Holster


Qualification – All From Holster – Standard Qualification Target 23"x35"

3 Yards (under 4 seconds)
-   (3) rounds Strong Hand (one Handed) Holster
-   (3) Rounds Weak Hand (one Handed) Holster

All shooting from this point out can be two-hand braced

5 Yards (under 4 seconds)
-   (4) rounds

7 Yards (under 16 seconds)
-   (6) rounds mag change (6) rounds

15 Yards (under 8 Seconds) – Sitting backwards away from target(s), instructor marks random target to shoot at. On whistle stand and turn around, ID target and fire (6) rounds on marked target

15 Yards walking to 7 Yards (under 10 seconds)
-   From sitting position, on whistle, stand and walk towards target and fire (6) rounds before reaching the 7 Yard marker



Starting at 25 Yards - Must be completed in under 40 Seconds

-   prior to firing, participant must start jumping jacks, running in place etc etc to raise heart rate. Instructor lets this go for 45-60 seconds then on random whistle participant begins
-   Turn and fire (2) Rounds
-   Move quickly to 15 Yards – (2) rounds
-   While moving to 10 yard marker reload, from 10 to 7 yard marker, fire (4) rounds while walking towards target
-   From 7 Yards – Fire (2) rounds on paper target (2) on steel target set 8-10  yards off to the side of main target
-   Move to 5 Yard maker, (4) rounds into head shot area

To Qualify must have minimum 40/50 rounds hit target area.

I went 47/50. I was perfect until the final timed 16 rounds. I know I missed the second shot I took on the steel plate which I was pissed about because it's a pretty easy shot....I'm guessing the other two came during the two from 25 yards or the four rounds while walking towards the target.

[bosk1]

I think those are some great drills for CCW, as they really get you thinking about things that will occur with you as a shooter in a real-time scenario if you ever had to draw your weapon.  It's about a lot more than just calmly standing at the firing line grouping your shots.  I would hope that it not only tests one's skills, but also gets people to reflect on scenarios to avoid.  For instance, I suspect that if I were to do that one-handed drill, I would quickly come to the conclusion that if I were ever forced to draw on someone in a crowded environment (or any environment where a miss could likely be disastrous and hit someone else), I would want to avoid trying to fire one-handed at all costs, especially with my weak hand, and especially at any distance that was not extremely close.

[Stadler]

Some of those seem really hard! 

You have to rename that second drill, though. Stat. 

[gmillerdrake]

I think those are some great drills for CCW, as they really get you thinking about things that will occur with you as a shooter in a real-time scenario if you ever had to draw your weapon.  It's about a lot more than just calmly standing at the firing line grouping your shots.  I would hope that it not only tests one's skills, but also gets people to reflect on scenarios to avoid.  For instance, I suspect that if I were to do that one-handed drill, I would quickly come to the conclusion that if I were ever forced to draw on someone in a crowded environment (or any environment where a miss could likely be disastrous and hit someone else), I would want to avoid trying to fire one-handed at all costs, especially with my weak hand, and especially at any distance that was not extremely close.

The instructor was saying that nearly 40% of shootings from people with their CCW turn out to be using just one hand/arm....due to a variety of reasons. Be it shielding loved ones, bracing yourself, struggling with the intruder or person who is attacking you....so, they like you to practice one handed AND off handed. Oddly enough, anytime I've fired/practiced 'off handed' I have a great grouping....I don't know why? I'm guessing it's less thinking and just a point and shoot scenario.

You have to rename that second drill, though. Stat. 

   No kidding. He said this was a tongue and cheek name from his Navy days where he learned the drill. I just left it at that 

[Chino]

I had to drop my Buck Mark off at the smith the other day, and while I was wandering around, I talked myself into this .22:

 

I've always wanted a 1911, and I had 15% off to the store. So I did five minutes of comment reading on Reddit and decided to roll the dice. I ended up getting it for a hair under $275 after tax. It was hard to say no. It's made by GSG, but they're slapping the Mauser name on them at the moment. They did the same for Colt some time ago. It's a full-sized 1911 with the same weight as the original. It's a hoot to shoot.

I always liked the look of dark 1911s with white/pearl grips. I've got some "granite" filament in my workshop and have been messing around with this idea:



I've printed with the granite before, and it ends up looking really good. I'm curious to see how it comes out on the set of grips. The tolerances are going to be wicked tight, so I'm not sure if those inlays are going to fit (even if the math says it does). I've got a draft of left grip printing right now. We'll see.   

[gmillerdrake]

Very Nice     I used a Kimber sub compact 1911 as my carry gun for the first few years I carried but found that it was just too bulky....even in the sub compact model. Went with a single stack after that and it's just more comfortable but I don't think I've found a smoother shooting gun than what that1911 was....and it was a .45 in a compact frame.

I'm curious to see how those grips turn out....of course I dig the design.

[Chino]

 I'm digging them so far. I think they'll look good with the Black inlay.

[gmillerdrake]

Oh heck yeah. That's gonna look sweet.

[Zantera]

Maybe you can bring it to a show and have the guys sign it