Is it too early to speculate about DT16?

[Architeuthis]

MP has never done growls in DT (studio, anyway).

He doesn't do them on A Nightmare to Remember?

No, those are just awful vocals.  They aren't technically growls.

Definitely this.  It's also the worst part of what is otherwise a pretty cool song.

I've never had an issue with that part of the song.  I actually like it and there's nothing wrong with DT adding a little bit of humor here and there.  I can't understand why so many people have made such an issue out of it even to this day.   

It's not humor.  It's a shitty vocal.  There's nothing funny about it, it's just a bad choice.

I agree that it's not meant to be humor (what a strange thing to try to say).  But there's nothing "bad" about it at all.  That's an equally bad take.

Why is that strange?  You can't tell me that they didn't have fun in the studio and got a chuckle while recording that part. 

[bosk1]

Well, you're right that I can't tell you.  Because I wasn't there.  But if you asked me to bet on whether or not they had a "chuckle" over it, I highly doubt it, since it's a serious part in a serious song. 

[Dublagent66]

MP has never done growls in DT (studio, anyway).

He doesn't do them on A Nightmare to Remember?

No, those are just awful vocals.  They aren't technically growls.

Definitely this.  It's also the worst part of what is otherwise a pretty cool song.

The worst part of that song is the never ending outro. It would've been a much better 10 minute song.

Yeah, I can see that too Tim.  All that being said, I still like the song.

[Architeuthis]

Well, you're right that I can't tell you.  Because I wasn't there.  But if you asked me to bet on whether or not they had a "chuckle" over it, I highly doubt it, since it's a serious part in a serious song.

You could be right, but I just can't see them taking "RAAAAAWWWWRRRRR" seriously.   I would bet that was supposed to be a bit light hearted.  It's ok to let out a big sigh of relief after surviving an accident..
There's probably not any studio footage of that session like they had for Systematic Chaos.

[EPIC Outro]

Mike's vocals during ANTR are my favorite part of that song, and I never got the hate for them.

I do think MP will appear in their 40th anniversary tour. I could see them doing a normal pair of sets, then a couple of songs with MP (there are some solid contenders they might play with MP that we might be unlikely to hear otherwise). Then they could end it with both drummers on stage for the encore.

It probably wouldn't be feasible for an entire tour, but for the show they record for the Blu-ray? Why not?

[Dublagent66]

I've been wondering, with the good vibes between DT and Mike Portnoy, if the next album will feature both MM and MP on drums on select songs, and both touring. A new record and 40th anniversary tour. Could be huge. If egos are checked, it could result in not only a great record, but the feel good story of 2025.

I never thought about that, but now that you mention it, that would actually be pretty cool if everyone was on board with it.  Not sure how much MM would be open to it, but he seems like the kind of guy that would at least entertain the notion.

No way. Every single moment of Prophets Of War is awesome.

Oh, you mean awesome like Power Windows awesome?   

[wolfking]

I've always been torn on that MP vocal part.  Some days I think it's fine, others not so much.  Hindsight is wonderful.  It would be different in a studio setting with what they hear when creating something as opposed to us hearing something for the first time.  We don't know, maybe the band listen back and still like the part, maybe they don't.  Maybe they listen back now and chuckle themselves, but I doubt it.  If JP was that against it, I'm sure he would have put his foot down with MP on this one.

[Kram]

There's no doubt Mike has worked hard and has improved his vocals tremendously since his time in DT.  He's still not a great singer, but his vocals on both the latest TA and NMB albums are not bad and do compliment the other vocalists nicely.  As for the part in ANTR - that part just sounds stupid to my ears.  If I was the producer I would have had James sing it or went in another creative direction, but that's just me.

[Architeuthis]

Portnoy sings quite well on the NMB albums and especially Iive!  I like his part on ANTR too.

[wolfking]

I've always liked his voice.  Love the interplay in TGP, and really dig his backing vocals on songs like Home.

[Architeuthis]

I've always liked his voice.  Love the interplay in TGP, and really dig his backing vocals on songs like Home.

He was great on "Score" too with his harmonies.

[Dublagent66]

There's no doubt Mike has worked hard and has improved his vocals tremendously since his time in DT.  He's still not a great singer, but his vocals on both the latest TA and NMB albums are not bad and do compliment the other vocalists nicely.  As for the part in ANTR - that part just sounds stupid to my ears.  If I was the producer I would have had James sing it or went in another creative direction, but that's just me.

I've never really minded MP's backup vocals when he's singing a harmony with James and/or JP.  I think he's pretty good at providing that kind of accompaniment in moderation.  But sometimes he takes it a little too far, like that time he went nuts in the 8VM portion of Schmedley Wilcox.  That was cringeworthy for sure.  The ANTR section is not really bad and maybe not cringeworthy, but the harsh vocals (not really growls) just don't seem to fit the lyrical passage.  Especially at the end, "By the grace of God above, everyone survived RAAAWWWWRRRR!"  Doesn't quite seem to work.

[geeeemo]

There's no doubt Mike has worked hard and has improved his vocals tremendously since his time in DT.  He's still not a great singer, but his vocals on both the latest TA and NMB albums are not bad and do compliment the other vocalists nicely.  As for the part in ANTR - that part just sounds stupid to my ears.  If I was the producer I would have had James sing it or went in another creative direction, but that's just me.

I've never really minded MP's backup vocals when he's singing a harmony with James and/or JP.  I think he's pretty good at providing that kind of accompaniment in moderation.  But sometimes he takes it a little too far, like that time he went nuts in the 8VM portion of Schmedley Wilcox.  That was cringeworthy for sure.  The ANTR section is not really bad and maybe not cringeworthy, but the harsh vocals (not really growls) just don't seem to fit the lyrical passage.  Especially at the end, "By the grace of God above, everyone survived RAAAWWWWRRRR!"  Doesn't quite seem to work.

I can see why people would say this.  I was just listening to the album today. (gotta get through all 15 here soon!), and I loved it! I think I enjoyed it more today than I have in a long time. What I like about DT, is it can have the unexpected. It's fun.

[KevShmev]

A thread to speculate about the next album, and it has somehow turned into a "let's talk about an ex-member" thread. 

[wolfking]

To be fair, how often does a thread really stay on topic? 

[KevShmev]

To be fair, how often does a thread really stay on topic? 

That sounds like code for "let's talk about the greatness of Promised Land some more." 

[Max Kuehnau]

As I said, I will be making another thread with the album timeline (as I have done for A View) once we know anything related to DT16. What we know as of now though is that John will be on his solo tour soon and that will end in November of this year (as of now). My guess is that the DT16 sessions might not start until January of 2023 or thereabouts (or even later).

[wolfking]

To be fair, how often does a thread really stay on topic? 

That sounds like code for "let's talk about the greatness of Promised Land some more." 

I'm sorry I don't have time, I'm already late for work......

[TAC]

To be fair, how often does a thread really stay on topic? 

That sounds like code for "let's talk about the greatness of Promised Land some more." 

More like code for how great the Maiden albums were with Blaze.

[Dream Team]

The RAAWWRRR is lol-worthy and always has been. When that album came out metal forums everywhere blew up with memes rightly ridiculing that choice.

[wolfking]

To be fair, how often does a thread really stay on topic? 

That sounds like code for "let's talk about the greatness of Promised Land some more." 

More like code for how great the Maiden albums were with Blaze.

Tim stepping in to help a brother out.

[TAC]

To be fair, how often does a thread really stay on topic? 

That sounds like code for "let's talk about the greatness of Promised Land some more." 

More like code for how great the Maiden albums were with Blaze.

Tim stepping in to help a brother out.

[Architeuthis]

If I remember right, DT will be doing another leg of the View tour in 2023. Perhaps with a different setlist?  So DT 16 probably won't happen until sometime in 2024.  I guess we'll see. 

[Lonk]

Well, you're right that I can't tell you.  Because I wasn't there.  But if you asked me to bet on whether or not they had a "chuckle" over it, I highly doubt it, since it's a serious part in a serious song.

You could be right, but I just can't see them taking "RAAAAAWWWWRRRRR" seriously.   I would bet that was supposed to be a bit light hearted.  It's ok to let out a big sigh of relief after surviving an accident..
There's probably not any studio footage of that session like they had for Systematic Chaos.

Sorry to go back to this, but I never thought of it as humor/light hearted fun but I can see that. Wouldn't be the first time they add a "funny" part to a serious song (S2N? ITNOG?)

[hefdaddy42]

Well, you're right that I can't tell you.  Because I wasn't there.  But if you asked me to bet on whether or not they had a "chuckle" over it, I highly doubt it, since it's a serious part in a serious song.

You could be right, but I just can't see them taking "RAAAAAWWWWRRRRR" seriously.   I would bet that was supposed to be a bit light hearted.  It's ok to let out a big sigh of relief after surviving an accident..

That is a really weird take.  There is nothing light-hearted anywhere in that song.  That is a harsh vocal over really aggressive music, and there is nothing tongue-in-cheek about it.  I have no idea why you would think it was supposed to be light-hearted.

I mean, believe what you want, but there is nothing there to warrant it.

[Adami]

I've been in lots of bands and written and recorded a lot of songs with a lot of singers. Almost all of the songs have been quite serious, and in the studio there's always lots of light fun moments where they do something vocally and we all have a laugh.


But we never keep it.

[pg1067]

Interesting that seemingly all of the discussion in an "early speculat[ion] about DT16" thread is about the growly section in ANTR and a long-gone former member's vocal abiliities.

[WilliamMunny]

Interesting that seemingly all of the discussion in an "early speculat[ion] about DT16" thread is about the growly section in ANTR and a long-gone former member's vocal abiliities.

Sounds like an average day at the DT Forums

[Kwyjibo]

Interesting that seemingly all of the discussion in an "early speculat[ion] about DT16" thread is about the growly section in ANTR and a long-gone former member's vocal abiliities.

DT 16: Remembering the Nightmare featuring Mike Portnoy on harsh vocals 

[Architeuthis]

Well, you're right that I can't tell you.  Because I wasn't there.  But if you asked me to bet on whether or not they had a "chuckle" over it, I highly doubt it, since it's a serious part in a serious song.

You could be right, but I just can't see them taking "RAAAAAWWWWRRRRR" seriously.   I would bet that was supposed to be a bit light hearted.  It's ok to let out a big sigh of relief after surviving an accident..

That is a really weird take.  There is nothing light-hearted anywhere in that song.  That is a harsh vocal over really aggressive music, and there is nothing tongue-in-cheek about it.  I have no idea why you would think it was supposed to be light-hearted.

I mean, believe what you want, but there is nothing there to warrant it.

The reason I got that take is when I first got the album and took it with me to band practice. It was a long drive and  I stopped and picked up our singer/bass player along the way. I then said, hey let's listen to the new DT album.  I cranked the cd loud in the car and when we got to the RAAAWWWRRR  section,  he immediately started laughing out loud.   He thought it was funny because it came right after " by the grace of God everyone survived.  He was a avid DT fan like me at the time, and he wasn't making fun of it but he saw the humor in that part. So now I can't unsee it, lol. Anyway, back to DT16... continue..

[Deadeye21]

If I remember right, DT will be doing another leg of the View tour in 2023. Perhaps with a different setlist?  So DT 16 probably won't happen until sometime in 2024.  I guess we'll see.

Jordan did mention something about studio time around the holiday of 22/23. However, I am certainly hoping for another leg of View in 23 that allows for a proper Australasian leg like they would normally do.

[Mladen]

Where's noxon when you need him? He might have some insight. 

[wolfking]

Interesting that seemingly all of the discussion in an "early speculat[ion] about DT16" thread is about the growly section in ANTR and a long-gone former member's vocal abiliities.

You new around here?

[geeeemo]

 

[nikatapi]

It's never early to speculate on DTF, we've been doing it for years. This is actually one of the most chill periods i recall.

Now onto the album, i can safely say that AVFTTOTW is one of their best of the latter years.
I hope they get back to writing with the same energy. I'm hopeful that they will collaborate with Andy Sneap on the mixing front, since this is one of their best sounding records in a very long time. (I can still hope for Kevin Shirley, but don't think it's possible).

Seems to me that Mike had lots of input on this album (Alien seems 100% Mike from a rhythmical perspective), and i think the success of the album and the song will give him even more room for contribution on the next one.

I'd like the band to take some risks though, and not play it safe.

Whatever they do, i'm pretty sure i'll like it either way. Each DT album is a milestone in my life, and is connected with specific memories, and the next one again will be something special. We're lucky that the band is still productive and want to write new music, so anything is welcome.