Rock In Rio 2022 Stream???

[wolfking]

Funny, just heard PMU in RiR. Everyone's entitled to their opinion and tastes, so I don't want to invalidate other posters' complaints and criticisms, but JLB's performance didn't alarm me. Yes, there are imperfect spots, but I'd say he delivers overall. I'm of the camp that they don't necessarily need to include that song in their setlists because of how high it goes and how much it must strain a singer (I've tried it, and it does), but... isn't it a treat that they played it? I'd be psyched if I was there!

I might be still taken with the whole mojo of "we had no concerts for so long, there was a chance they could've never started happening again, the fact that this is happening is a miracle", so this isn't any objective opinion or anything. Just a sentiment.

Man, I can't comprehend this at all, but I'm glad people are still enjoying his singing in a live setting.

[TheBarstoolWarrior]

Funny, just heard PMU in RiR. Everyone's entitled to their opinion and tastes, so I don't want to invalidate other posters' complaints and criticisms, but JLB's performance didn't alarm me. Yes, there are imperfect spots, but I'd say he delivers overall. I'm of the camp that they don't necessarily need to include that song in their setlists because of how high it goes and how much it must strain a singer (I've tried it, and it does), but... isn't it a treat that they played it? I'd be psyched if I was there!

I might be still taken with the whole mojo of "we had no concerts for so long, there was a chance they could've never started happening again, the fact that this is happening is a miracle", so this isn't any objective opinion or anything. Just a sentiment.

Man, I can't comprehend this at all, but I'm glad people are still enjoying his singing in a live setting.

Agreed. I just watched PMU from RiR again to see if I am being too critical and I am not. I think that people are big fans and willing to overlook, which is great, if you can do that. Ironically the first note of the song he missed...and it did not get any better from there. The pronunciation is also just all over the place. I am not going to bother pointing out every part that is off but I cannot fathom how anyone could objectively believe the goods were 'delivered.'

[wolfking]

Funny, just heard PMU in RiR. Everyone's entitled to their opinion and tastes, so I don't want to invalidate other posters' complaints and criticisms, but JLB's performance didn't alarm me. Yes, there are imperfect spots, but I'd say he delivers overall. I'm of the camp that they don't necessarily need to include that song in their setlists because of how high it goes and how much it must strain a singer (I've tried it, and it does), but... isn't it a treat that they played it? I'd be psyched if I was there!

I might be still taken with the whole mojo of "we had no concerts for so long, there was a chance they could've never started happening again, the fact that this is happening is a miracle", so this isn't any objective opinion or anything. Just a sentiment.

Man, I can't comprehend this at all, but I'm glad people are still enjoying his singing in a live setting.

Agreed. I just watched PMU from RiR again to see if I am being too critical and I am not. I think that people are big fans and willing to overlook, which is great, if you can do that. Ironically the first note of the song he missed...and it did not get any better from there. The pronunciation is also just all over the place. I am not going to bother pointing out every part that is off but I cannot fathom how anyone could objectively believe the goods were 'delivered.'

No offence to anyone and yes, people's dedication to the band is great, but sometimes people need to take their fanboy goggles off and see things for what it is.  I bet if this sort of vocal performance was from another band they didn't care for, the singer would be getting roasted.

[KevShmev]

Funny, just heard PMU in RiR. Everyone's entitled to their opinion and tastes, so I don't want to invalidate other posters' complaints and criticisms, but JLB's performance didn't alarm me. Yes, there are imperfect spots, but I'd say he delivers overall. I'm of the camp that they don't necessarily need to include that song in their setlists because of how high it goes and how much it must strain a singer (I've tried it, and it does), but... isn't it a treat that they played it? I'd be psyched if I was there!

I might be still taken with the whole mojo of "we had no concerts for so long, there was a chance they could've never started happening again, the fact that this is happening is a miracle", so this isn't any objective opinion or anything. Just a sentiment.

Man, I can't comprehend this at all, but I'm glad people are still enjoying his singing in a live setting.

Enjoying it in the live setting when you are actually there is often different from watching a clip on YT or a concert video.  James has reached the similar point Geddy Lee did for me on the last few Rush tours where I enjoyed the heck out of the shows when I went to them, but when seeing the concert video or a clip, the decline in overall singing quality was hard to overlook.  I never watch the concert DVDs from the last three Rush tours for that reason, and the same applies to recent DT live stuff.  But when you are there, it's easy to get lost in the excitement of the live show to where you just enjoy it and any issues you either don't notice or don't care about in the moment.

[wolfking]

Oh yeah, totally different beast on DVD/Youtube to actually being there.

[cramx3]

It's way too loud at a DT concert to hear the intricacies in JLB's voice.  I think they are overly loud for this reason, because there's really no reason that their concerts are so loud for a theater setting.  I also think they are very negative towards people taking video at their shows for this reason as well.  You don't notice his struggles as much live as you do on video. 

But hey, people love Motley Crue and Guns n Roses too.  I think people can over look his struggles and not be a fan boy.  (I am admittingly a DT fan boy though)

[wolfking]

It's way too loud at a DT concert to hear the intricacies in JLB's voice.  I think they are overly loud for this reason, because there's really no reason that their concerts are so loud for a theater setting.  I also think they are very negative towards people taking video at their shows for this reason as well.  You don't notice his struggles as much live as you do on video. 

But hey, people love Motley Crue and Guns n Roses too.  I think people can over look his struggles and not be a fan boy.  (I am admittingly a DT fan boy though)

Overlooking is one thing, saying it's a great performance or that he delivers the goods is another.

[TAC]

R40 is UNLISTENABLE thanks to Geddy.

[wolfking]

Yeah, the last couple of Rush DVD's were not good.  It's a shame as there's always some gems in the setlist.  Geddy just couldn't quite do them justice at the end. 

[gzarruk]

Funny, just heard PMU in RiR. Everyone's entitled to their opinion and tastes, so I don't want to invalidate other posters' complaints and criticisms, but JLB's performance didn't alarm me. Yes, there are imperfect spots, but I'd say he delivers overall. I'm of the camp that they don't necessarily need to include that song in their setlists because of how high it goes and how much it must strain a singer (I've tried it, and it does), but... isn't it a treat that they played it? I'd be psyched if I was there!

I might be still taken with the whole mojo of "we had no concerts for so long, there was a chance they could've never started happening again, the fact that this is happening is a miracle", so this isn't any objective opinion or anything. Just a sentiment.

Man, I can't comprehend this at all, but I'm glad people are still enjoying his singing in a live setting.

Agreed. I just watched PMU from RiR again to see if I am being too critical and I am not. I think that people are big fans and willing to overlook, which is great, if you can do that. Ironically the first note of the song he missed...and it did not get any better from there. The pronunciation is also just all over the place. I am not going to bother pointing out every part that is off but I cannot fathom how anyone could objectively believe the goods were 'delivered.'

No offence to anyone and yes, people's dedication to the band is great, but sometimes people need to take their fanboy goggles off and see things for what it is.  I bet if this sort of vocal performance was from another band they didn't care for, the singer would be getting roasted.

I consider myself a big DT fanboy, have been for 13-ish+ years, and I still agree with what both of you're saying. He's struggling to sing well live, there's no way around that. And because I love this band so much, I'd honestly prefer to see someone else sing for them than have their performances suffer because of this. Again, no disrespect meant to James at all. I just feel something needs to change to infuse new life to this band (just like the Portnoy/Mangini change did over a decade ago).

[wolfking]

Funny, just heard PMU in RiR. Everyone's entitled to their opinion and tastes, so I don't want to invalidate other posters' complaints and criticisms, but JLB's performance didn't alarm me. Yes, there are imperfect spots, but I'd say he delivers overall. I'm of the camp that they don't necessarily need to include that song in their setlists because of how high it goes and how much it must strain a singer (I've tried it, and it does), but... isn't it a treat that they played it? I'd be psyched if I was there!

I might be still taken with the whole mojo of "we had no concerts for so long, there was a chance they could've never started happening again, the fact that this is happening is a miracle", so this isn't any objective opinion or anything. Just a sentiment.

Man, I can't comprehend this at all, but I'm glad people are still enjoying his singing in a live setting.

Agreed. I just watched PMU from RiR again to see if I am being too critical and I am not. I think that people are big fans and willing to overlook, which is great, if you can do that. Ironically the first note of the song he missed...and it did not get any better from there. The pronunciation is also just all over the place. I am not going to bother pointing out every part that is off but I cannot fathom how anyone could objectively believe the goods were 'delivered.'

No offence to anyone and yes, people's dedication to the band is great, but sometimes people need to take their fanboy goggles off and see things for what it is.  I bet if this sort of vocal performance was from another band they didn't care for, the singer would be getting roasted.

I consider myself a big DT fanboy, have been for 13-ish+ years, and I still agree with what both of you're saying. He's struggling to sing well live, there's no way around that. And because I love this band so much, I'd honestly prefer to see someone else sing for them than have their performances suffer because of this. Again, no disrespect meant to James at all. I just feel something needs to change to infuse new life to this band (just like the Portnoy/Mangini change did over a decade ago).

As critical as I am, I'm not sure I'd prefer that personally. I'd really rather them pigeon hole their sets, cuts the old classics and detune some more. 

However, I do think a different singer nailing some of the classics would breathe new like into the band also but I can't see JP booting him.

[TheBarstoolWarrior]

The issue has affected the new songs too, though.

[wolfking]

The issue has affected the new songs too, though.

This is true.  Even Invisible Monster you could see him really trying hard just to get the notes in that song.

[Kram]

It's way too loud at a DT concert to hear the intricacies in JLB's voice.  I think they are overly loud for this reason, because there's really no reason that their concerts are so loud for a theater setting.  I also think they are very negative towards people taking video at their shows for this reason as well.  You don't notice his struggles as much live as you do on video. 

But hey, people love Motley Crue and Guns n Roses too.  I think people can over look his struggles and not be a fan boy.  (I am admittingly a DT fan boy though)

Overlooking is one thing, saying it's a great performance or that he delivers the goods is another.

This is how I feel.

[Kram]

R40 is UNLISTENABLE thanks to Geddy.

This is sadly true as well.  And it was such a great setlist!

[Kram]

Funny, just heard PMU in RiR. Everyone's entitled to their opinion and tastes, so I don't want to invalidate other posters' complaints and criticisms, but JLB's performance didn't alarm me. Yes, there are imperfect spots, but I'd say he delivers overall. I'm of the camp that they don't necessarily need to include that song in their setlists because of how high it goes and how much it must strain a singer (I've tried it, and it does), but... isn't it a treat that they played it? I'd be psyched if I was there!

I might be still taken with the whole mojo of "we had no concerts for so long, there was a chance they could've never started happening again, the fact that this is happening is a miracle", so this isn't any objective opinion or anything. Just a sentiment.

Man, I can't comprehend this at all, but I'm glad people are still enjoying his singing in a live setting.

Agreed. I just watched PMU from RiR again to see if I am being too critical and I am not. I think that people are big fans and willing to overlook, which is great, if you can do that. Ironically the first note of the song he missed...and it did not get any better from there. The pronunciation is also just all over the place. I am not going to bother pointing out every part that is off but I cannot fathom how anyone could objectively believe the goods were 'delivered.'

No offence to anyone and yes, people's dedication to the band is great, but sometimes people need to take their fanboy goggles off and see things for what it is.  I bet if this sort of vocal performance was from another band they didn't care for, the singer would be getting roasted.

I consider myself a big DT fanboy, have been for 13-ish+ years, and I still agree with what both of you're saying. He's struggling to sing well live, there's no way around that. And because I love this band so much, I'd honestly prefer to see someone else sing for them than have their performances suffer because of this. Again, no disrespect meant to James at all. I just feel something needs to change to infuse new life to this band (just like the Portnoy/Mangini change did over a decade ago).

As critical as I am, I'm not sure I'd prefer that personally. I'd really rather them pigeon hole their sets, cuts the old classics and detune some more. 

However, I do think a different singer nailing some of the classics would breathe new like into the band also but I can't see JP booting him.

I'm with you here as well.  James is our guy, and I'll take him with his current capabilities over a new singer.  Let's just stop pretending his current capabilities are something they're not, that's all.

[bosk1]

No offence to anyone and yes, people's dedication to the band is great, but sometimes people need to take their fanboy goggles off and see things for what it is.  I bet if this sort of vocal performance was from another band they didn't care for, the singer would be getting roasted.

Well, I think it is offensive to accuse anyone who doesn't agree with you as simply having "fanboy goggles."  Pretty sure Cram, for example, doesn't lap up everything the band does, but still really enjoyed this performance. 

Let's just stop pretending his current capabilities are something they're not, that's all.

I haven't seen anyone in this thread doing that.

[wolfking]

No offence to anyone and yes, people's dedication to the band is great, but sometimes people need to take their fanboy goggles off and see things for what it is.  I bet if this sort of vocal performance was from another band they didn't care for, the singer would be getting roasted.

Well, I think it is offensive to accuse anyone who doesn't agree with you as simply having "fanboy goggles."  Pretty sure Cram, for example, doesn't lap up everything the band does, but still really enjoyed this performance. 

Let's just stop pretending his current capabilities are something they're not, that's all.

I haven't seen anyone in this thread doing that.

Boss, I apologise to you as yes, you are clearly getting offended by everything I say, but as mentioned before by others, both sides of the coin should be discussed, not just positive.  I'm certainly not going out of my way to be a dickhead to stir shit up on purpose, I go to work for that, and I love the band as much as anyone else.   I still said also, I'd take James warts and all over another singer, couldn't imagine the band without him, so I too have had my fanboy moments.  Although if DT started covering El Dorado live...........then we'd have to talk. 

[Ben_Jamin]

Funny, just heard PMU in RiR. Everyone's entitled to their opinion and tastes, so I don't want to invalidate other posters' complaints and criticisms, but JLB's performance didn't alarm me. Yes, there are imperfect spots, but I'd say he delivers overall. I'm of the camp that they don't necessarily need to include that song in their setlists because of how high it goes and how much it must strain a singer (I've tried it, and it does), but... isn't it a treat that they played it? I'd be psyched if I was there!

I might be still taken with the whole mojo of "we had no concerts for so long, there was a chance they could've never started happening again, the fact that this is happening is a miracle", so this isn't any objective opinion or anything. Just a sentiment.

Man, I can't comprehend this at all, but I'm glad people are still enjoying his singing in a live setting.

Agreed. I just watched PMU from RiR again to see if I am being too critical and I am not. I think that people are big fans and willing to overlook, which is great, if you can do that. Ironically the first note of the song he missed...and it did not get any better from there. The pronunciation is also just all over the place. I am not going to bother pointing out every part that is off but I cannot fathom how anyone could objectively believe the goods were 'delivered.'

No offence to anyone and yes, people's dedication to the band is great, but sometimes people need to take their fanboy goggles off and see things for what it is.  I bet if this sort of vocal performance was from another band they didn't care for, the singer would be getting roasted.

I have met and talked to people who do like Dream Theater and say things like..."Dream Theater does not need a vocalist" and also, "I would listen to Dream Theater if they had a different singer."

JLB has been getting flak from casual listeners since day one. My friends mom can't stand JLB at all, she doesn't like how his tone sounds, which she says is too nasally and whiny sounding. Also, the same friend likes Dream Theater as well, and he also told me, "JLB is not a very good singer."

I agree, but I do enjoy his tone, especially his softer, warmer tone. JLB has always struggled live, and he is not consistent at all with his performances. Yet, I still enjoy hearing him sing his live vocals, and is one reason for me being more upset about him not singing the end of TCOT.

I will also say that the food poisoning incident really affected his voice, it got so bad it effected his entire vocal range. He also had to make his "Path of Division" at this time. To either halt DT from any shows until he healed, or sacrifice his vocals. And we know what he decided and that I feel is why he continues to struggle with singing those early songs, and with having such inconsistent live performances, where it's a gamble which nights he will be amazing, good, or just plain bad.

I will always continue to try and see Dream Theater, and can only hope JLB has a good night. Of the times I have seen him, he has been amazing on vocals. I've heard many bands that have had bad live vocals, yet people didn't care, people were rocking out regardless of whether the vocals were note for note like the studio album or not. One band that is in a similar situation is Avenged Sevenfold, I enjoy seeing them live regardless if M. Shadows vocals sound like snot.

[KevShmev]

Eh, the "I would listen to Dream Theater if they had a different singer" crowd means nothing.  That is their problem, not the band's.  We could easily argue that many fans might not be fans if JLB wasn't the singer (it is unlikely that their style would have drawn me in back in 1993 with a different singer).

Regardless of JLB's live struggles, in the past or currently, he is one of the great rock singers, and vital to their success.  He made those vocal melodies soar on I&W and Scenes, their two most iconic records. 

So yeah, the anti-JLB crowd can kiss my ass.

[Ben_Jamin]

Regardless of JLB's live struggles, in the past or currently, he is one of the great rock singers, and vital to their success.  He made those vocal melodies soar on I&W and Scenes, their two most iconic records. 

I agree. And his vocals are amazing on The Human Equation and his solo albums. I actually bought the Roswlell Six - Terra Incognita albums he was a guest on specifically for his vocal contributions. I was really bummed when he cancelled his ProgPower appearance as I really wanted to hear the Static Impulse and Impermanent Resonance songs live.

[wolfking]

Funny, just heard PMU in RiR. Everyone's entitled to their opinion and tastes, so I don't want to invalidate other posters' complaints and criticisms, but JLB's performance didn't alarm me. Yes, there are imperfect spots, but I'd say he delivers overall. I'm of the camp that they don't necessarily need to include that song in their setlists because of how high it goes and how much it must strain a singer (I've tried it, and it does), but... isn't it a treat that they played it? I'd be psyched if I was there!

I might be still taken with the whole mojo of "we had no concerts for so long, there was a chance they could've never started happening again, the fact that this is happening is a miracle", so this isn't any objective opinion or anything. Just a sentiment.

Man, I can't comprehend this at all, but I'm glad people are still enjoying his singing in a live setting.

Agreed. I just watched PMU from RiR again to see if I am being too critical and I am not. I think that people are big fans and willing to overlook, which is great, if you can do that. Ironically the first note of the song he missed...and it did not get any better from there. The pronunciation is also just all over the place. I am not going to bother pointing out every part that is off but I cannot fathom how anyone could objectively believe the goods were 'delivered.'

No offence to anyone and yes, people's dedication to the band is great, but sometimes people need to take their fanboy goggles off and see things for what it is.  I bet if this sort of vocal performance was from another band they didn't care for, the singer would be getting roasted.

I have met and talked to people who do like Dream Theater and say things like..."Dream Theater does not need a vocalist" and also, "I would listen to Dream Theater if they had a different singer."

JLB has been getting flak from casual listeners since day one. My friends mom can't stand JLB at all, she doesn't like how his tone sounds, which she says is too nasally and whiny sounding. Also, the same friend likes Dream Theater as well, and he also told me, "JLB is not a very good singer."

I agree, but I do enjoy his tone, especially his softer, warmer tone. JLB has always struggled live, and he is not consistent at all with his performances. Yet, I still enjoy hearing him sing his live vocals, and is one reason for me being more upset about him not singing the end of TCOT.

I will also say that the food poisoning incident really affected his voice, it got so bad it effected his entire vocal range. He also had to make his "Path of Division" at this time. To either halt DT from any shows until he healed, or sacrifice his vocals. And we know what he decided and that I feel is why he continues to struggle with singing those early songs, and with having such inconsistent live performances, where it's a gamble which nights he will be amazing, good, or just plain bad.

I will always continue to try and see Dream Theater, and can only hope JLB has a good night. Of the times I have seen him, he has been amazing on vocals. I've heard many bands that have had bad live vocals, yet people didn't care, people were rocking out regardless of whether the vocals were note for note like the studio album or not. One band that is in a similar situation is Avenged Sevenfold, I enjoy seeing them live regardless if M. Shadows vocals sound like snot.

Oh, he doesn't sing the ending of TCOT?  Not sure that's been mentioned. 

Seriously though, I get all that.  I know the history behind his voice, I know he has always been a sticking point for some people, but as Kev says, that's their problem.  Obviously the only one that had issues with it was MP and look how that turned out.  I'm mainly just talking about his vocals NOW, that's it.  But on the other side, the five people here mentioning it mean nothing if the band are happy.  That's who really matters at this point of their career.  Only the other 4 guys on the stage have the possible impact if they had issues.  If all 4 of them are happy with his live vocals currently, then play on, who the fuck am I?

Also, the band wouldn't be as popular as they are if JLB wasn't the singer IMO, that's how much I think of him, but whatever.

[Lethean]

Eh, the "I would listen to Dream Theater if they had a different singer" crowd means nothing.  That is their problem, not the band's.  We could easily argue that many fans might not be fans if JLB wasn't the singer (it is unlikely that their style would have drawn me in back in 1993 with a different singer).

Regardless of JLB's live struggles, in the past or currently, he is one of the great rock singers, and vital to their success.  He made those vocal melodies soar on I&W and Scenes, their two most iconic records. 

So yeah, the anti-JLB crowd can kiss my ass.

I agree with this post.  And for me.... youtube videos just aren't something I'd ever want to be the cause of a singer leaving a band.  Aside from James, there's Geddy Lee, who sounded pretty good live and in person but on youtube, maybe not so much.  But I've seen bad youtube videos of pretty much all of my favorite bands, and some are a lot younger than those two.  The albums will be there forever, so if they sound good on the albums, and if I enjoy the shows I'm actually at in person, that's good enough for me.  I had no issues with James on the Astonishing or Scenes anniversary tours - yeah, some notes weren't perfect, but over the course of a whole show, I thought he sounded great.  I&W was a little more difficult, but I still saw multiple shows and like them all.  James should stay until the band is ready to call it quits and I hope he does.

[The Realm]

I love Dream Theater and James vocals on the classic albums as much as anyone but I am fully in the camp that his live vocals are currently very poor and have been for a while. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion of course but I am really not sure how anyone could think his Rock in Rio performance was great. I do not for one minute want James replaced but just imagine if he was sick for that gig and was replaced by someone else who sounded exactly as James himself sounded for that performance. That person would be flamed to hell.

The only thing that is really saving James at the moment is the fact that he is James and even though his vocals are poor, it is still him and some of his distinctive tone/style still comes through in his performance.

[bosk1]

No offence to anyone and yes, people's dedication to the band is great, but sometimes people need to take their fanboy goggles off and see things for what it is.  I bet if this sort of vocal performance was from another band they didn't care for, the singer would be getting roasted.

Well, I think it is offensive to accuse anyone who doesn't agree with you as simply having "fanboy goggles."  Pretty sure Cram, for example, doesn't lap up everything the band does, but still really enjoyed this performance. 

Let's just stop pretending his current capabilities are something they're not, that's all.

I haven't seen anyone in this thread doing that.

Boss, I apologise to you as yes, you are clearly getting offended by everything I say, but as mentioned before by others, both sides of the coin should be discussed, not just positive.  I'm certainly not going out of my way to be a dickhead to stir shit up on purpose, I go to work for that, and I love the band as much as anyone else.   I still said also, I'd take James warts and all over another singer, couldn't imagine the band without him, so I too have had my fanboy moments.  Although if DT started covering El Dorado live...........then we'd have to talk. 

Well, no, I'm not getting offended by everything you say.  You're a good dude that I've had a long history of positive interaction with, and I hope and expect that to continue.  I just don't get the repeated insistence that James's performance must be bad when the majority of people posting here have heard it and think otherwise, and then accusing anyone who disagrees with just having on their fanboy goggles.  That's unfair.  I mean, by and large, I don't really mind being labeled a fanboy.  And, by and large, I do tend to default love everything they put out.  But to insinuate that that means I just turn of my mind and lap it up because the DT logo is associated with it, and that others do the same...I dunno.  That's just going too far to me.  And it isn't really accurate.  James's singing aside, to give an example:  James is my favorite lyricist in the band.  To me, lyrically, he was far and away the lyrical MVP of Distance Over Time.  However, some of his lyrics are duds for me.  And one song that he wrote lyrics for I outright can't stand (lyrically, anyway; which bums me out, because it is some of the best music they have written).  I don't shut off my mind and say they are great lyrics when I find them to be poor.  But by the same token, I have said my piece and don't put down others who like them.  I just don't find that approach to be productive.

What would be productive is if they would play an entire 3-hour set of covering El Dorado on repeat.  But I know that's a pipe dream that has a slim chance of coming to fruition, so I'll just have to revisit the Maiden Top 50 thread every so often instead...

[wolfking]

No offence to anyone and yes, people's dedication to the band is great, but sometimes people need to take their fanboy goggles off and see things for what it is.  I bet if this sort of vocal performance was from another band they didn't care for, the singer would be getting roasted.

Well, I think it is offensive to accuse anyone who doesn't agree with you as simply having "fanboy goggles."  Pretty sure Cram, for example, doesn't lap up everything the band does, but still really enjoyed this performance. 

Let's just stop pretending his current capabilities are something they're not, that's all.

I haven't seen anyone in this thread doing that.

Boss, I apologise to you as yes, you are clearly getting offended by everything I say, but as mentioned before by others, both sides of the coin should be discussed, not just positive.  I'm certainly not going out of my way to be a dickhead to stir shit up on purpose, I go to work for that, and I love the band as much as anyone else.   I still said also, I'd take James warts and all over another singer, couldn't imagine the band without him, so I too have had my fanboy moments.  Although if DT started covering El Dorado live...........then we'd have to talk. 

Well, no, I'm not getting offended by everything you say.  You're a good dude that I've had a long history of positive interaction with, and I hope and expect that to continue.  I just don't get the repeated insistence that James's performance must be bad when the majority of people posting here have heard it and think otherwise, and then accusing anyone who disagrees with just having on their fanboy goggles.  That's unfair.  I mean, by and large, I don't really mind being labeled a fanboy.  And, by and large, I do tend to default love everything they put out.  But to insinuate that that means I just turn of my mind and lap it up because the DT logo is associated with it, and that others do the same...I dunno.  That's just going too far to me.  And it isn't really accurate.  James's singing aside, to give an example:  James is my favorite lyricist in the band.  To me, lyrically, he was far and away the lyrical MVP of Distance Over Time.  However, some of his lyrics are duds for me.  And one song that he wrote lyrics for I outright can't stand (lyrically, anyway; which bums me out, because it is some of the best music they have written).  I don't shut off my mind and say they are great lyrics when I find them to be poor.  But by the same token, I have said my piece and don't put down others who like them.  I just don't find that approach to be productive.

What would be productive is if they would play an entire 3-hour set of covering El Dorado on repeat.  But I know that's a pipe dream that has a slim chance of coming to fruition, so I'll just have to revisit the Maiden Top 50 thread every so often instead...

I appreciate this response boss.  I'm not sure over the last couple of pages there has been more positive views on his vocals than negative, but I'm certainly not trying to rally anyone into thinking what I do, and that's not what I'm about, but, I'm not the only one saying it.  I've mentioned my love for the man also too.    The shoe could be put on the other foot though really.  I could say, I don't understand the continual insistence from you that his performance must be great when a few think otherwise, but I think we need to move on from that.  I take full responsibility for the discussion getting to this point though, don't get me wrong.  I'm happy you have no issue with the performance also, I wish I thought the same.  I will admit a few agreeing with me did give me a little validation, only because I thought I seriously was being too harsh on him (which is still possible) or I'm completely missing something, or I'm just growing out of his vocal style.

Agree with the lyrics, he's written some of the best by far, but others you wonder if it's come from the same dude.

I mean, by and large, I don't really mind being labeled a fanboy.  And, by and large, I do tend to default love everything they put out.  But to insinuate that that means I just turn of my mind and lap it up because the DT logo is associated with it, and that others do the same...I dunno.  That's just going too far to me.  And it isn't really accurate. 

Appreciate this also.  I'll quit the fanboy talk now, thank you for addressing that.  I actually wish I was still like that with DT like I am with bands like Maiden (except El Dorado of course), which leads me to this......

What would be productive is if they would play an entire 3-hour set of covering El Dorado on repeat.

Now that is something I find very highly offensive myself and is going WAY to far.  I shudder just thinking of this.

[crystalstars17]

the anti-JLB crowd can kiss my ass.

🎉 Woohoo!!

How nice it is to wake up to see that I'm not the only one defending him.

[MarceloMalulo]

I got through the RiR stream without really worrying about James. Sounded ok to me.

Someone recently mentioned a Buenos Aires show from around the same time, and a link was posted but now I can't find it. It's supposed to be an even better performance. I found only one recent YouTube and it was unwatchable (weird commercials...kinda creepy). Does anyone have a better link? I'd love to see it. Thanks in advance.

I send a mail to that guy asking him for the recording without commercials. He said:
- No. It is only for trade. If you filmed a band, we see.
I told him I don't record shows, but I passed him my trading list and he said all of my shows were on DIME haha (impossible, because some of them are made by me as recopilations and only are traded on the DT Hub). Later, he said:
- Do you record Mr Bungle or Judas Priest?
I don't have anything of those bands. If anyone can help me with the trade, I promise I will share the full argentina recording with you, as well as I did with Rio.

[gzarruk]

I love Dream Theater and James vocals on the classic albums as much as anyone but I am fully in the camp that his live vocals are currently very poor and have been for a while. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion of course but I am really not sure how anyone could think his Rock in Rio performance was great. I do not for one minute want James replaced but just imagine if he was sick for that gig and was replaced by someone else who sounded exactly as James himself sounded for that performance. That person would be flamed to hell.

The only thing that is really saving James at the moment is the fact that he is James and even though his vocals are poor, it is still him and some of his distinctive tone/style still comes through in his performance.

Basically, nostalgia

As critical as I am, I'm not sure I'd prefer that personally. I'd really rather them pigeon hole their sets, cuts the old classics and detune some more. 

However, I do think a different singer nailing some of the classics would breathe new like into the band also but I can't see JP booting him.

I agree, I don't think there's any chance of that happening, and I't not like I want it to happen, it's just that some shake up in the vocal department could, as I said, infuse this band with new life for at least another decade or more.

Also, Derek got the boot for a lot less

[Architeuthis]

Ha, I wouldn't be surprised if Derek got the boot because he couldn't keep his ego in check.  Also Jordan being a superior musician and a nicer guy might have had an impact too. 

[cramx3]

Jordan was also the guy they always wanted

it's just that some shake up in the vocal department could, as I said, infuse this band with new life for at least another decade or more.

Not sure I agree with this.  The guys are old.  Some younger lad isn't going to change the ways of these older dudes. 

And honestly, the band is nearing their end. Any shake up at this point could more likely mean the end of the band.

[Architeuthis]

Jordan was also the guy they always wanted

it's just that some shake up in the vocal department could, as I said, infuse this band with new life for at least another decade or more.

Not sure I agree with this.  The guys are old.  Some younger lad isn't going to change the ways of these older dudes. 

And honestly, the band is nearing their end. Any shake up at this point could more likely mean the end of the band.

Mid
They're not that old, mid fifties is middle-aged.  James is in his late fifties and Jordan in his sixties. Bands like Yes, The Roliing Stones, and even Sammy Hagar are still going at it in their seventies.
I would bet DT lasts at least another decade and we get three or four more albums out of them.

[crystalstars17]

Jordan was also the guy they always wanted

it's just that some shake up in the vocal department could, as I said, infuse this band with new life for at least another decade or more.

Not sure I agree with this.  The guys are old.  Some younger lad isn't going to change the ways of these older dudes. 

And honestly, the band is nearing their end. Any shake up at this point could more likely mean the end of the band.

Mid
They're not that old, mid fifties is middle-aged.  James is in his late fifties and Jordan in his sixties. Bands like Yes, The Roliing Stones, and even Sammy Hagar are still going at it in their seventies.
I would bet DT lasts at least another decade and we get three or four more albums out of them.

And don't forget legendary prog forerfathers the Moody Blues, who toured well past their 50th anniversary!!!

[Stadler]

If I'm not mistaken, Roger Waters is 79 and Sir Paul is 80.  FUCKING 80.

Dream Theater - who are more or less my age, by the way - are pups in comparison.

[crystalstars17]

If I'm not mistaken, Roger Waters is 79 and Sir Paul is 80.  FUCKING 80.

Dream Theater - who are more or less my age, by the way - are pups in comparison.

Yes! And I seem to recall an interview with JR where he said they love making music and aren't gonna stop? (I would find a link but I'm at work, help me out pls?).