Marvel Studios' Thor: Love And Thunder, OUT NOW! SPOILERS now inside!

[jingle.boy]

 

It’s really amazing to see people leave the theatre before the credits are over these days (at an MCU film)

[lonestar]

Well that was a fucking blast...

[Adami]

It’s really amazing to see people leave the theatre before the credits are over these days (at an MCU film)

I just assume it’s their second or later time seeing it.

[jingle.boy]

It’s really amazing to see people leave the theatre before the credits are over these days (at an MCU film)

I just assume it’s their second or later time seeing it.

Perhaps some, but I've seen more than a few stay for the mid credits, but leave before the post-credits.

[ErHaO]

I enjoyed the film. Some really great moments. But I did feel a little disappointed, I feel like the film really could have used a bit more time to expand certain characters. And to have a bit more spacing between the drama and comedy, which sometimes delt a bit odd here. Bale is such a great villain, but he has way too little screentime. Still, great cast, solid plotline, many funny moments and beautiful visuals. Solid MCU entry, one of the better phase 4 films.



Vague SPOILERS:

I disliked the post credit scenes, especially the second one. For the love of god just let MCU characters die off if they die. I know "nobody really dies" is a thing in comics, but to me that is very detrimental to the storylines.

[Adami]

Fun movie. Like a piece of pretty good cake. Light, fluffy, sugary, and sweet. But not really filling or necessary.

More to say when we can do spoilers.

[Lonk]

Fun movie. Like a piece of pretty good cake. Light, fluffy, sugary, and sweet. But not really filling or necessary.

That's a great way of putting

[King Postwhore]

Better than the 1st two Thor movies. A smidge less than Ragnarok.   Fun movie with heart.

[soupytwist]

Fun movie. Like a piece of pretty good cake. Light, fluffy, sugary, and sweet. But not really filling or necessary.

Yeah that about sums it up.  Phase 4 is lacking direction at the minute, so a lot of the films/shows at minute feel a bit like this.

[King Postwhore]

Fun movie. Like a piece of pretty good cake. Light, fluffy, sugary, and sweet. But not really filling or necessary.

Yeah that about sums it up.  Phase 4 is lacking direction at the minute, so a lot of the films/shows at minute feel a bit like this.

I think you just have knowledge from the other phases.  In Phase 1 did you think they had direction?  I think this has been all mapped out and wait until phase 6.

[Adami]

Fun movie. Like a piece of pretty good cake. Light, fluffy, sugary, and sweet. But not really filling or necessary.

Yeah that about sums it up.  Phase 4 is lacking direction at the minute, so a lot of the films/shows at minute feel a bit like this.

I think you just have knowledge from the other phases.  In Phase 1 did you think they had direction?  I think this has been all mapped out and wait until phase 6.

Yes and no. Obviously during phase 1 we didn't know it would lead to the infinity gauntlet and what not. But end of Iron Man teases Avengers. End of Hulk teases Avengers. End of Iron Man II teases Avengers. End of Thor teases Avengers. End of cap is literally a trailer for Avengers. So we knew THAT part was coming. End of Avengers teased Thanos. If anything, Phase II was less directional.

But maybe looking back, we'll see how all the pieces fit together, but right now, I have no clue where they're going after 5 movies I think? Not counting Black Widow. They could be going a ton of directions. Thunderbolts, Aliens, Secret Wars, Gods, etc. I just have no idea.

[MinistroRaven]

Fun movie. Like a piece of pretty good cake. Light, fluffy, sugary, and sweet. But not really filling or necessary.

Yeah that about sums it up.  Phase 4 is lacking direction at the minute, so a lot of the films/shows at minute feel a bit like this.

I think you just have knowledge from the other phases.  In Phase 1 did you think they had direction?  I think this has been all mapped out and wait until phase 6.

Yes and no. Obviously during phase 1 we didn't know it would lead to the infinity gauntlet and what not. But end of Iron Man teases Avengers. End of Hulk teases Avengers. End of Iron Man II teases Avengers. End of Thor teases Avengers. End of cap is literally a trailer for Avengers. So we knew THAT part was coming. End of Avengers teased Thanos. If anything, Phase II was less directional.

But maybe looking back, we'll see how all the pieces fit together, but right now, I have no clue where they're going after 5 movies I think? Not counting Black Widow. They could be going a ton of directions. Thunderbolts, Aliens, Secret Wars, Gods, etc. I just have no idea.

That's what I like the most about phase 4, WE DON'T KNOW WHERE WE ARE HEADING! 

[Adami]

While I can't say I LIKE that aspect of it, it doesn't really bother me. It'd be cool, but it's not a huge deal.

I just wish the writing was better.

[lonestar]

I think what I'm most curious about is what gets announced in two weeks at SDCC. That'll probably give us more direction than anything else.

[Adami]

I think what I'm most curious about is what gets announced in two weeks at SDCC. That'll probably give us more direction than anything else.

True. I think Kevin said he will be a bit more direct with the future plans. If nothing else, I'm hoping we get some concrete updates on some of their more vague announcements. Like Blade or FF.

[soupytwist]

Given how long some of the Marvel films have been recently (and generally the longer ones tend to do better) anyone else feel like the editing felt absolutely brutal - to the point where it felt like I was watching an abridged verison of a much longer film. 

[King Postwhore]

Fun movie. Like a piece of pretty good cake. Light, fluffy, sugary, and sweet. But not really filling or necessary.

Yeah that about sums it up.  Phase 4 is lacking direction at the minute, so a lot of the films/shows at minute feel a bit like this.

A

I think you just have knowledge from the other phases.  In Phase 1 did you think they had direction?  I think this has been all mapped out and wait until phase 6.

Yes and no. Obviously during phase 1 we didn't know it would lead to the infinity gauntlet and what not. But end of Iron Man teases Avengers. End of Hulk teases Avengers. End of Iron Man II teases Avengers. End of Thor teases Avengers. End of cap is literally a trailer for Avengers. So we knew THAT part was coming. End of Avengers teased Thanos. If anything, Phase II was less directional.

But maybe looking back, we'll see how all the pieces fit together, but right now, I have no clue where they're going after 5 movies I think? Not counting Black Widow. They could be going a ton of directions. Thunderbolts, Aliens, Secret Wars, Gods, etc. I just have no idea.

Hindsight.   BTW, Blade is coming.  You saw the X Men and Fantastic 4, Adam Warlock.  I think we all know what is coming.

[lonestar]

I think what I'm most curious about is what gets announced in two weeks at SDCC. That'll probably give us more direction than anything else.

True. I think Kevin said he will be a bit more direct with the future plans. If nothing else, I'm hoping we get some concrete updates on some of their more vague announcements. Like Blade or FF.

My predictions...we'll get FF casting, and we'll finally get some hint of mutants being properly introduced, be it a movie or whatnot.

[ErHaO]

I assume all the timey wimey multirealitydimension stuff will give them an opportunity to introduce mutants as an existing force? I hope so, selling me on the X-men always being there in the MCU would be tough.

[ZirconBlue]

Given how long some of the Marvel films have been recently (and generally the longer ones tend to do better) anyone else feel like the editing felt absolutely brutal - to the point where it felt like I was watching an abridged verison of a much longer film.

I haven't seen the movie yet, but allegedly, Waititi's initial cut was ~4 hours long.  And Lena Headey was in it.

[The Letter M]

Given how long some of the Marvel films have been recently (and generally the longer ones tend to do better) anyone else feel like the editing felt absolutely brutal - to the point where it felt like I was watching an abridged verison of a much longer film.

I haven't seen the movie yet, but allegedly, Waititi's initial cut was ~4 hours long.  And Lena Headey was in it.

As were Peter Dinklage and Jeff Goldblum, but their scenes were cut. There's quite a bit of stuff in trailers I don't recall seeing in the film either.

I think Taika has said that he filmed the movie with the intention of keeping everything and then figuring out the film in the edit, which seems kind of reckless but VERY Taika. So if it feels like we're missing stuff, it's probably because we are.

One big thing I remember from set leaks was Jane hovering above the shards of Mjolnir at New Asgard but that's nowhere in the film. And recently I saw an ad today that showed Thor and Korg hi-fiving and saying "YES!" but I don't recall that being in the film either. Here's hoping we get these scenes on the BD release in a few months.

-Marc.

[bosk1]

Just got back.  Overall, enjoyed it.  Not as good as most of the pre-phase 4, but a nice bit of frivolous fun and adventure.

I just wish the writing was better.

Same.  But this is definitely one of the better phase 4 films, IMO.  Yeah, it got silly and over the top more than a few times, but I didn't mind that. 

Gor was a pretty good villain, and I kinda wish we got more of him.  Well written, and Bale performed him well.  Just seemed a bit underdeveloped for how much could have been done with him.

A subtle bit of humor I enjoyed at the end was people's names appearing in the font of various '80s metal bands.

[jingle.boy]

Bale was great as Gorr.  They rushed his intro/back-story, and while accurate, I just didn't get the same kind of understanding of they depth of his motivation from the intro of the movie as I did in the comics.  No big deal, just that another 3-4 minutes on his backstory would've helped.

The humour.  Each piece/line in-and-of-itself was fine, but they were trying too hard at times.  The whole sentient aspect of Stormbreaker was silly, despite being a metaphor to Jane's/Thor's relationship.  I get that Mjolnir has some level of sentience (as it does in the comics), but I wasn't buying it for Stormbreaker.

Omnipotent City - ugh.  That was bad.  Total divergent from the comics, and a bit ridiculous and campy.  Also, why was it 'ok' and celebrated that Thor "killed" Zeus?  Anyone realize that (until it was revealed that Zeus wasn't dead), Thor killed more Gods on screen than Gorr did?

Too often Thor was made out to be a bumbling idiot - more like a Court Jester than the King of Asgard.  That part I didn't like.

I think it was a pretty weak effort to introduce Eternity that way.

Enjoyable?  Barely.  Slightly better than Thor 2.

Introducing Hercules I guess is a setup as the next antagonist for Thor?  I liked the Valhalla scene.  That was a nice nod.  Too bad they couldn't have had Rene/Frigga there too.  That would've been fitting since she died for Jane.

Overall, 6.5/10.  I guess it was a slice of mildly fresh carrot cake.

[lonestar]

If you have mildly fresh carrot cake at 6.5/10, then you need to seek out better carrot cake.



Fuck, now I'm hella craving carrot cake.

I totally agree with the forced humor criticism, especially in the first half of the movie. Lots of cringe for such a short amount of time. Thor was already a bumbler, they set that in Ragnorok and it worked, so I'm guessing they added a few shots of Party Thor to see if they could expand on it. Kind of fell short for me. I'd personally love to see a darker Thor movie instead of what we've seen in the last two.

[Lonk]

Oh we are ready to discuss? Here are some thoughts I had :

1) The F***ing goats: while funny for 10 seconds, it got annoying real quick.
2) The plot of the movie called for a much darker tone. I don't mind some one liners here and there if the story calls for it, but this was not the movie for that.
3) The comedy itself was not good, really forced at times. After all Thor went through in the last 3 movies he was in, I really wished his character was a bit less of an idiot.
4) Zeus? what was that about?
5) So much talk about Zeus' lighting bolt/weapon, and how "thunder is just the sound of lighting", and all that went nowhere. I thought we would see a powered up Thor with Zeus' weapon, yet...
6) Since when can Thor grant the power of Thor to others?
7) Yeah the whole Stormbreaker sentient thing was silly.
8) Korg fake death was also silly.
9) When Thor was headed toward the final battle without Storbreaker, why didn't he just take Mjolnir? He agreed that Jane was not going to use it, so why not just take?
10) Really wish we would have seen a bit more of Gorr, specially how he killed some of the other Gods. I think that would have elevated the stakes a bit more.

Despite all that, I enjoyed the film (more so the second half than the first), but it lands really far down on MCU ranking. The Chemistry between Portman and Hemsworth wasn't really there.

[lonestar]

Really curious to see what was left on the editing room floor of the initial 4 hours of run time.

[bosk1]

If you have mildly fresh carrot cake at 6.5/10, then you need to seek out better carrot cake.

+1

now I'm hella craving carrot cake.

+1

Really curious to see what was left on the editing room floor of the initial 4 hours of run time.

+1

1) The F***ing goats: while funny for 10 seconds, it got annoying real quick.

I simultaneously agree with you AND love the goats.

2) The plot of the movie called for a much darker tone. I don't mind some one liners here and there if the story calls for it, but this was not the movie for that.

Eh, maybe.  Ragnarok called for a dark tone as well, but most agree that what we got actually worked really well. 

3) The comedy itself was not good, really forced at times. After all Thor went through in the last 3 movies he was in, I really wished his character was a bit less of an idiot.

Mixed bag for me.  Quite often, it landed.  Quite often, it did not.

4) Zeus? what was that about?

I hated pretty much everything about it, with the possible exception of Bao Supreme.

5) So much talk about Zeus' lighting bolt/weapon, and how "thunder is just the sound of lighting", and all that went nowhere. I thought we would see a powered up Thor with Zeus' weapon, yet...

Well, Thor was the only one who went toe-to-toe with Gorr and not die, so there's that. 

6) Since when can Thor grant the power of Thor to others?

2 things:  (1)  He didn't.  He gave the power of the lightning bolt to others.  That's why it was gold, not blue/white.  (2)  Even if he did, what's wrong with that?  In previous movies, we saw him learn how to do other things for the first time as well.

7) Yeah the whole Stormbreaker sentient thing was silly.

I loved that, actually.  It was a metaphor and mirror for his own feelings, which I thought was actually a neat device (as well as being at the heart of some of the humor that did land).

8) Korg fake death was also silly.

Yes. 

9) When Thor was headed toward the final battle without Storbreaker, why didn't he just take Mjolnir? He agreed that Jane was not going to use it, so why not just take?

Because (1) Stormbreaker would have been mad, and (2) he didn't think he needed it since he had the lightning.  I don't really have an issue with this.

10) Really wish we would have seen a bit more of Gorr, specially how he killed some of the other Gods. I think that would have elevated the stakes a bit more.

For sure.  This is one of my bigger (not biggest, but up there) complaints.

Despite all that, I enjoyed the film (more so the second half than the first), but it lands really far down on MCU ranking.

I enjoyed it as well.  As far as ranking, I just kind of lump all of phase 4 together as "that mess that followed three brilliant phases."  I think Marvel is just trying to make DC not feel too bad about themselves for putting out absolute crap that had the potential to be so much better, so they are like "Hey, we've been untouchable for so long, but we can put out crap as well.  Just don't focus too much on the fact that our box office numbers still destroy yours.  Nothing to see here..."  Honestly, I think they've just gotten too big for their own good and can't get out of their own way now.

The Chemistry between Portman and Hemsworth wasn't really there.

Wow, really?  That was one thing that I thought absolutely worked.

[jingle.boy]

I may be jaded a bit by the 'bumbling Thor' part, as I've read about 25 Thor comics in the last two weeks, and NONE of that side of his character was there.  Even after losing his worthiness and ability to lift Mjolnir, he was still a mighty and ferocious warrior.

[Lonk]

6) Since when can Thor grant the power of Thor to others?

2 things:  (1)  He didn't.  He gave the power of the lightning bolt to others.  That's why it was gold, not blue/white.  (2)  Even if he did, what's wrong with that?  In previous movies, we saw him learn how to do other things for the first time as well.

The Chemistry between Portman and Hemsworth wasn't really there.

Wow, really?  That was one thing that I thought absolutely worked.

To the first, that fair. I don't have a problem with abilities being shown on screen without any indication of how they got it, but this was in particular just felt odd and random.

The second, I dont know, maybe i was looking into it too much, but it was apparent specially when they were on Omnipotent city. And then again when they were on their way to Gorr the first time (the scene when they were both on the ship's deck).

I'll watch it again as soon as it hits Disney+, maybe my opinion will change just like it has for other MCU movies

[lonestar]

I may be jaded a bit by the 'bumbling Thor' part, as I've read about 25 Thor comics in the last two weeks, and NONE of that side of his character was there.  Even after losing his worthiness and ability to lift Mjolnir, he was still a mighty and ferocious warrior.

Yeah, that whole aspect to his character is definitely unique to the MCU.

[MinistroRaven]

Here's the deleted/leaked scene of Jane becoming mighty Thor:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FjlzhVGb_zY

I hope it's OK to post this.

[jingle.boy]

I remember those leaks a long ways back.

[Zantera]

This fell in the 'enjoyable for the moment but no desire to watch again' category which is mid to bottom tier Marvel for me. Gorr had potential to be one of the great villains of the MCU and Bale does a good job when he is present, but they really did him a disservice by not showing more of him killing different gods and establishing his growth in power (as well as how dangerous he was) and also by the end I felt that his 'turn' kinda came out of nowhere. They didn't give me enough to believe that he would make that choice which might be due to the studio mandate that the movie had to be under 2 hours so they just trimmed things.

Thor has been great as a more humorous character in Infinity War and Ragnarok (I wasn't a big fan of Fat Thor personally) but in Love and Thunder it almost feels like Flanderization and the season 20 version of a character who now has their 'traits' taken to extreme levels and that's all they are. I like Natalie Portman but her getting her powers was also handled quite poorly in my opinion and it felt like their idea for this movie was "Hey let's bring Jane back and make her Thor like in the comics" and everyone went "Yeah let's do that" without a single person asking "Why? And how do we craft a great story around it?".

Overall I did have an enjoyable time while in the cinema though so I didn't find it to be awful or anything but so far Phase 4 feels pretty aimless and lackluster. Aside from maybe No Way Home the rest has been 'fine' at best and 'bottom Marvel' at worst.

[bosk1]

This fell in the 'enjoyable for the moment but no desire to watch again' category which is mid to bottom tier Marvel for me.

For me, it's more:  Watch it once in theaters; watch it a second time later to let it soak in and to pick up the details I might have missed.  And maybe down the road if the kids want to watch it just killing time.  But as with the rest of phase 4 thus far, it doesn't really have much replay value after that second viewing and is MUCH more shallow and hollow than just about anything in the first 3 phases.

To put what I have been saying another way, I guess MCU films just don't feel "special" anymore.  They're a fun pastime, but just feel more like "typical summer blockbuster" type movies, albeit with a larger connected narrative.  They used to be so much more.  They were an "event."  They were special.  They made you feel something.  And they made most fans truly enjoy the present of the MCU and truly anticipate what was coming next.  Even the weakest entries did that, to an extent.  Phase 4 isn't doing that.  And I don't think it has as much to do with the quantity of MCU material as it does with the quality.   

As to your specific points, I wholeheartedly agree with all of them except the point about Jane.  Personally, I think that was handled just fine, and I feel like it actually gave a lot of meat to the story and some closure and growth for Thor and all of our earthbound characters from the first two films. 

[Lonk]

Bosk, you bring up a good point about what phase 4 is missing (for me). For me, Phase 1-3 made you believe what the character was going through. There was great character writing, but I don't think we have gotten that in Phase 4.