Author Topic: Official top 50 Van Halen songs thread!! (Countdown has begun!!)  (Read 26669 times)

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Offline hefdaddy42

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5150 is not only my favorite VH album, but it's one of my favorite albums period.
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Offline Stadler

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Oh, and I have generally regarded OU812 as my favorite Van Hagar album. I just feel that it has a looseness to it. I know Carnal Knowledge is great as well, but I guess I've always found it hard to rate, but I finally figured out why..

The other day at work, I ran through the Sammy albums. I believe Carnal Knowledge is musically the best Sammey album, but those lyrics...Holy Shit...I know the DLR Era gets some grief, but there are no more cringey lyrics in their catalog than Carnal Knowledge. I think that's what has always held me back. But musically, it's one of their strongest albums in their entire catalog.

I've written about this before; it's obviously dependent on your point of view, but I always saw a cleverness, a tongue-in-cheekness with the Roth lyrics.  Some ARE dumb, but some are incredibly clever in their own way and even when they go a little dark, it's with a sense of humor, a circus/ringmaster attitude.   As much as I love Sam (Standing Hampton is not a good record, it's a GREAT record) he doesn't have that same breeziness, that same wink wink nod nod.  There's a crass-ness, a heavy-handedness to some of Sammy's lyrics that may have fit the time - the late '80's - but sort of aren't timeless in that same way.  When it's dark, it's dark.   I know I don't identify with them nearly as much.   

Martha Quinn was right, and Sammy didn't have that.  Don't misunderstand; Dave was never considered a "clown" back in the day - he was the real deal, and I know many women that thought he was stone-cold hot. But he was the guy who hit on your girlfriend and you still wanted to have beers with. Sam hit on your girlfriend and you were scrapping in the driveway.

I still love this lyric: "Mousewife to momshell in the time it took to get that new tattoo"  I think that perfectly captures the explosion (and acceptance) of tattoos in the late 2000's, early 2010's.   To me, that slays a line like "Honey, I ain't through with you...The harder the better (let's do it 'til) we're black and blue."   


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Sammy wrote some good stuff, you just have to keep him away from the party/sex stuff where he really was awful. Roth probably did do those topics better, but not sure he ever did much besides those topics.

Offline Stadler

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Even though Van Halen would win the war, I always gave the first battle to DLR.

This is so true; I saw DLR (with Cinderella opening, who KILLED it) and it was everything you would hope for from a Van Halen show.  So good. I didn't see the 5150 show, but I was sort of not really impressed with that record.  "Summer Nights" is the only song that REALLY screamed "VAN HALEN!" to me.

Offline Stadler

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I hear you guys about VH bringing you back to younger days.  I can't listen to Van Hagar without thinking of outdoor summer concerts, as we went to so many of those in the 90s, and all three times I saw VH was in the 90s, outside, in the summer.  Great stuff.

But I also agree that there is a bit of "you had to be there" with them.  It seems like for as much as younger people are getting into artistsloved by their parents, like Queen or Nirvana or Prince or Pink Floyd, you rarely hear about VH making new fans.  Wasn't it Billie Eilish a few years back who asked, "who?", when asked about VH on a late night talk show?  Sure, she is just one person, but I think it's indicative that Van Halen is just not an older band that is grabbing a lot of new fans here in 2022. 


Kev, I saw VH in the summer of '93 outdoors on a fucking HOT July night. It was literally one of the best shows I've ever seen. I even took my shirt off. :lol


Oh, and I have generally regarded OU812 as my favorite Van Hagar album. I just feel that it has a looseness to it. I know Carnal Knowledge is great as well, but I guess I've always found it hard to rate, but I finally figured out why..

The other day at work, I ran through the Sammy albums. I believe Carnal Knowledge is musically the best Sammey album, but those lyrics...Holy Shit...I know the DLR Era gets some grief, but there are no more cringey lyrics in their catalog than Carnal Knowledge. I think that's what has always held me back. But musically, it's one of their strongest albums in their entire catalog.

Tim was that the show at Great Woods where Wolfie ran out while Dad was playing 3:16 and started to dance then Valerie ran onstage to get him?  I was in the 6th row for that show.  Eddie threw a pick and 6 guys all went for it.  We all coconutted our heads.  I saw stars.  No one found the pic. :lol

I waved at Valerie, who was backstage in Charlotte, NC at the opening night of that non-album tour with Roth in what, 2006?

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5150 is not only my favorite VH album, but it's one of my favorite albums period.

Even though I prefer the Roth ones, I have great memories of riding around with a buddy in the summer of '86 with the 5150 cassette cranking away.

Offline bosk1

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I'll try to give this a go in the next few days.  I'm just not sure I can find 41 other Van Halen songs I actually like after ranking the songs on 5150.

Regarding the covers songs:  I'm glad they were included.  I might feel differently with covers by other bands, but two things stand out to me with a lot of the covers Van Halen did:  (1) Van Halen generally changed them up and made them their own.  (2) Many of them became featured songs that often charted pretty highly as singles rather that just being forgotten album filler.  I mean, take You Really Got Me, for example.  That became an iconic song.  And I would venture to go farther and say it became an iconic Van Halen song.  There's no way I wouldn't include that one in a discussion of Van Halen's best songs just because "it isn't really a 'Van Halen' songs since it's really 'just a cover' of a Kinks song."  Not saying others have to agree, but that's my take on it. 

Regarding VH III:  Hated it.  I was psyched that they got Cherone because I'm a fan, and thought he was (and still is) a great singer with both the range and the charisma to pull off the back catalog and take VH forward.  But the songs just weren't there.  And the title really left a bad taste in my mouth as well.  Eddie seemed to be saying, "Me and my brother are Van Halen.  If you stand behind the mic for us, you are just a number."  Maybe that's not what he meant, but that's how I took it. 
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Regarding the covers songs:  I'm glad they were included.  I might feel differently with covers by other bands, but two things stand out to me with a lot of the covers Van Halen did:  (1) Van Halen generally changed them up and made them their own.  (2) Many of them became featured songs that often charted pretty highly as singles rather that just being forgotten album filler.  I mean, take You Really Got Me, for example.  That became an iconic song.  And I would venture to go farther and say it became an iconic Van Halen song.  There's no way I wouldn't include that one in a discussion of Van Halen's best songs just because "it isn't really a 'Van Halen' songs since it's really 'just a cover' of a Kinks song."  Not saying others have to agree, but that's my take on it. 


I agree. It's an essential VH track.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline The Realm

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I'm not fully on board the 'including cover songs' in the top 50, however I have to concede that the VH version of You Really Got Me is pretty much an 'iconic' VH track. I think I will have to include this one. I know the same can be said about a couple of others as well, including Pretty Woman but I'm going to stick with one cover in the top 50.

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Tim was that the show at Great Woods where Wolfie ran out while Dad was playing 3:16 and started to dance then Valerie ran onstage to get him?  I was in the 6th row for that show.  Eddie threw a pick and 6 guys all went for it.  We all coconutted our heads.  I saw stars.  No one found the pic. :lol

I waved at Valerie, who was backstage in Charlotte, NC at the opening night of that non-album tour with Roth in what, 2006?


That's weird, but at least this post from another forum makes sense..


Quote from: Valerie
There was this one fucking weirdo in Charlotte a few years back. The creep kept waving at me like he knew me. I remember because he also had this nerdy oxford shirt on. I mean, was he doing his taxes between songs? Anyway, I just gave him the finger.





Oh, and Joe, I have zero recollection of little Wolfgang running on stage.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

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Even though I prefer the Roth ones, I have great memories of riding around with a buddy in the summer of '86 with the 5150 cassette cranking away.

I'll say that the thing that both the DLR and Sammy eras have in common is that they were both great for rolling down the windows in the summer and cranking it. Great beach music, great keg party music, tailgating...
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline bosk1

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Even though I prefer the Roth ones, I have great memories of riding around with a buddy in the summer of '86 with the 5150 cassette cranking away.

I'll say that the thing that both the DLR and Sammy eras have in common is that they were both great for rolling down the windows in the summer and cranking it. Great beach music, great keg party music, tailgating...

Another thing they both had in common is that the DLR era largely sucked and the Sammy era was largely pretty good.
"The Supreme Court of the United States has descended from the disciplined legal reasoning of John Marshall and Joseph Story to the mystical aphorisms of the fortune cookie."

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Even though I prefer the Roth ones, I have great memories of riding around with a buddy in the summer of '86 with the 5150 cassette cranking away.

I'll say that the thing that both the DLR and Sammy eras have in common is that they were both great for rolling down the windows in the summer and cranking it. Great beach music, great keg party music, tailgating...

Another thing they both had in common is that the DLR era largely sucked and the Sammy era was largely pretty good.

That's crazy.

That's like taking Contageous, Down For The Count, and Ten over Earthshaker, Black Tiger and Mean Streak.

Of course, you probably would..
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline bosk1

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That's like taking Contageous, Down For The Count, and Ten over Earthshaker, Black Tiger and Mean Streak

No, it's nothing like that.  It's more like taking Departure, Escape, and Frontiers over Journey, Look Into the Future, and Next (keeping with the Herbie Herbert theme). 
"The Supreme Court of the United States has descended from the disciplined legal reasoning of John Marshall and Joseph Story to the mystical aphorisms of the fortune cookie."

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I'm not fully on board the 'including cover songs' in the top 50, however I have to concede that the VH version of You Really Got Me is pretty much an 'iconic' VH track. I think I will have to include this one. I know the same can be said about a couple of others as well, including Pretty Woman but I'm going to stick with one cover in the top 50.

This is a weird thing to fret about IMO. They are VH songs even if the band didn’t write them. It’s a big part of their early identity.

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That's like taking Contageous, Down For The Count, and Ten over Earthshaker, Black Tiger and Mean Streak

No, it's nothing like that.  It's more like taking Departure, Escape, and Frontiers over Journey, Look Into the Future, and Next (keeping with the Herbie Herbert theme).

er...you lost me.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline bosk1

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That's like taking Contageous, Down For The Count, and Ten over Earthshaker, Black Tiger and Mean Streak

No, it's nothing like that.  It's more like taking Departure, Escape, and Frontiers over Journey, Look Into the Future, and Next (keeping with the Herbie Herbert theme).

er...you lost me.

Oh, back to Y&T?  It's actually called "I'm Lost," and it was on the Struck Down album, which isn't one of the three you mentioned.
"The Supreme Court of the United States has descended from the disciplined legal reasoning of John Marshall and Joseph Story to the mystical aphorisms of the fortune cookie."

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That's like taking Contageous, Down For The Count, and Ten over Earthshaker, Black Tiger and Mean Streak

No, it's nothing like that.  It's more like taking Departure, Escape, and Frontiers over Journey, Look Into the Future, and Next (keeping with the Herbie Herbert theme).

er...you lost me.

Oh, back to Y&T?  It's actually called "I'm Lost," and it was on the Struck Down album, which isn't one of the three you mentioned.

Well, I was really just trying to show you.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline KevShmev

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I'll say that the thing that both the DLR and Sammy eras have in common is that they were both great for rolling down the windows in the summer and cranking it. Great beach music, great keg party music, tailgating...

For sure. That is why I like to call them "party rock," but "summer rock" works just fine as well.  :tup :tup

Offline The Realm

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I'm not fully on board the 'including cover songs' in the top 50, however I have to concede that the VH version of You Really Got Me is pretty much an 'iconic' VH track. I think I will have to include this one. I know the same can be said about a couple of others as well, including Pretty Woman but I'm going to stick with one cover in the top 50.

This is a weird thing to fret about IMO. They are VH songs even if the band didn’t write them. It’s a big part of their early identity.

Yeah, all good I totally agree the covers are a part of their early identity. It seems everyone is onboard including them so I'll do the same.

Offline Trav86

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So, I copied my ranking from the pubmeeple ranking engine to my notes in my iPhone. Anyone know a shortcut to put it in reverse order without having to retype everything?
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My list has been sent!!
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

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would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

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Offline Stadler

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Tim was that the show at Great Woods where Wolfie ran out while Dad was playing 3:16 and started to dance then Valerie ran onstage to get him?  I was in the 6th row for that show.  Eddie threw a pick and 6 guys all went for it.  We all coconutted our heads.  I saw stars.  No one found the pic. :lol

I waved at Valerie, who was backstage in Charlotte, NC at the opening night of that non-album tour with Roth in what, 2006?


That's weird, but at least this post from another forum makes sense..


Quote from: Valerie
There was this one fucking weirdo in Charlotte a few years back. The creep kept waving at me like he knew me. I remember because he also had this nerdy oxford shirt on. I mean, was he doing his taxes between songs? Anyway, I just gave him the finger.





Oh, and Joe, I have zero recollection of little Wolfgang running on stage.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.  Unfortunately, that's me.  :)

Offline Stadler

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Even though I prefer the Roth ones, I have great memories of riding around with a buddy in the summer of '86 with the 5150 cassette cranking away.

I'll say that the thing that both the DLR and Sammy eras have in common is that they were both great for rolling down the windows in the summer and cranking it. Great beach music, great keg party music, tailgating...

Another thing they both had in common is that the DLR era largely sucked and the Sammy era was largely pretty good.

Funny enough... I traveled Wednesday and Thursday, so I did a big listen-through.  I got from VHI through most of For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge, and two things struck me right out of the gate:

- Eddie Van Halen is an American treasure.   He is (was?) so friggin' good.  EVERY SONG has some moment where you go "huh!?"  Even nine albums in, 13 years later, he's coming up with stuff that turns your head. 
- The Sammy years just don't hold up over time the way the Roth years do.  I get it, maybe it's me, but I put on "Atomic Punk" or "Panama" and I am TRANSPORTED.  I am 17 again, and I am living life large.   There isn't really any song in the Hagar portion that does just that.  MAYBE Cabo Wabo. 

I'm going to go back to what I wrote about the lyrics, but it just seems like Roth is (was?) a Cadillac, making love, Zack Effron as a cherubic high schooler in High School Musical, or Emeril slicing a fine cut of meat with a precision Henkel knife.  Sammy (in Van Halen, since his solo stuff is different) is (was?) a Humvee, fucking, Zack Effron as a frat boy in that movie with Seth Rogan, or Gallagher opening a watermelon with a sledgehammer.

Offline emtee

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Yep, not sure there has ever been a more summertime, roll the windows down, Frisbee at the park, hanging with friends band than DLR era VH. Possibly Boston's first two. So many great memories.

Offline Trav86

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Yep, not sure there has ever been a more summertime, roll the windows down, Frisbee at the park, hanging with friends band than DLR era VH. Possibly Boston's first two. So many great memories.

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Offline hefdaddy42

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Regarding VH III:  Hated it.  I was psyched that they got Cherone because I'm a fan, and thought he was (and still is) a great singer with both the range and the charisma to pull off the back catalog and take VH forward.  But the songs just weren't there.  And the title really left a bad taste in my mouth as well.  Eddie seemed to be saying, "Me and my brother are Van Halen.  If you stand behind the mic for us, you are just a number."  Maybe that's not what he meant, but that's how I took it.
These are, well, my EXACT feelings on VH III.
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Offline Max Kuehnau

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Regarding VH III:  Hated it.  I was psyched that they got Cherone because I'm a fan, and thought he was (and still is) a great singer with both the range and the charisma to pull off the back catalog and take VH forward.  But the songs just weren't there.  And the title really left a bad taste in my mouth as well.  Eddie seemed to be saying, "Me and my brother are Van Halen.  If you stand behind the mic for us, you are just a number."  Maybe that's not what he meant, but that's how I took it.
These are, well, my EXACT feelings on VH III.
IIRC, Ed and Al meant the III to represent the third official lineup of the band (after DLR and Sammy Hagar, respectively). I don't hate the album, but it's not among my favourites.
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Offline bosk1

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Even though I prefer the Roth ones, I have great memories of riding around with a buddy in the summer of '86 with the 5150 cassette cranking away.

I'll say that the thing that both the DLR and Sammy eras have in common is that they were both great for rolling down the windows in the summer and cranking it. Great beach music, great keg party music, tailgating...

Another thing they both had in common is that the DLR era largely sucked and the Sammy era was largely pretty good.

Funny enough... I traveled Wednesday and Thursday, so I did a big listen-through.  I got from VHI through most of For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge, and two things struck me right out of the gate:

- Eddie Van Halen is an American treasure.   He is (was?) so friggin' good.  EVERY SONG has some moment where you go "huh!?"  Even nine albums in, 13 years later, he's coming up with stuff that turns your head. 
- The Sammy years just don't hold up over time the way the Roth years do.  I get it, maybe it's me, but I put on "Atomic Punk" or "Panama" and I am TRANSPORTED.  I am 17 again, and I am living life large.   There isn't really any song in the Hagar portion that does just that.  MAYBE Cabo Wabo. 

I'm going to go back to what I wrote about the lyrics, but it just seems like Roth is (was?) a Cadillac, making love, Zack Effron as a cherubic high schooler in High School Musical, or Emeril slicing a fine cut of meat with a precision Henkel knife.  Sammy (in Van Halen, since his solo stuff is different) is (was?) a Humvee, fucking, Zack Effron as a frat boy in that movie with Seth Rogan, or Gallagher opening a watermelon with a sledgehammer.

Yeah, you've said similar things several times about Dave/Sammy.  Repeating the same thing over and over doesn't strengthen the argument. 

To me, they are equally crass and disgusting.  There is nothing "Cadillac" or high brow about Dave's lyrics ("reach down between my legs and ease the seat back, and...") or his stage banter ("oh my God, I'm so drunk I forgot the f*&ng words, haha" or "this guy down here looks like he's having a good time...wait until I f*&k his girlfriend backstage").  He was just as much in the gutter as Sammy, if not moreso.  The difference to me is that Sammy was more "everyman"-ish about it.  Dave was more the preening rooster that thought it was all about him and his narcissism, whereas the Sammy vibe felt more to me like "hey, let's all just hang out and have a party together."  Or to put it anther way, the Dave performances feel more to me like they centered around Dave, with his attitude being that the crowd needed to put in the work to come and enjoy his art.  In contrast, the Sammy performances feel more like they centered around the collective of Sammy, the band, and the crowd, with Sammy and the band being the ones to put in the work to make sure the crowd were enjoying themselves.  You can like or prefer either approach.  But to me, the second is more relatable and enjoyable. 
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Offline hefdaddy42

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My exact thoughts.  AGAIN.

With anyone else, I would say "Get out of my head!"  But you?  You can stay.
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Offline Stadler

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Even though I prefer the Roth ones, I have great memories of riding around with a buddy in the summer of '86 with the 5150 cassette cranking away.

I'll say that the thing that both the DLR and Sammy eras have in common is that they were both great for rolling down the windows in the summer and cranking it. Great beach music, great keg party music, tailgating...

Another thing they both had in common is that the DLR era largely sucked and the Sammy era was largely pretty good.

Funny enough... I traveled Wednesday and Thursday, so I did a big listen-through.  I got from VHI through most of For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge, and two things struck me right out of the gate:

- Eddie Van Halen is an American treasure.   He is (was?) so friggin' good.  EVERY SONG has some moment where you go "huh!?"  Even nine albums in, 13 years later, he's coming up with stuff that turns your head. 
- The Sammy years just don't hold up over time the way the Roth years do.  I get it, maybe it's me, but I put on "Atomic Punk" or "Panama" and I am TRANSPORTED.  I am 17 again, and I am living life large.   There isn't really any song in the Hagar portion that does just that.  MAYBE Cabo Wabo. 

I'm going to go back to what I wrote about the lyrics, but it just seems like Roth is (was?) a Cadillac, making love, Zack Effron as a cherubic high schooler in High School Musical, or Emeril slicing a fine cut of meat with a precision Henkel knife.  Sammy (in Van Halen, since his solo stuff is different) is (was?) a Humvee, fucking, Zack Effron as a frat boy in that movie with Seth Rogan, or Gallagher opening a watermelon with a sledgehammer.

Yeah, you've said similar things several times about Dave/Sammy.  Repeating the same thing over and over doesn't strengthen the argument. 

To me, they are equally crass and disgusting.  There is nothing "Cadillac" or high brow about Dave's lyrics ("reach down between my legs and ease the seat back, and...") or his stage banter ("oh my God, I'm so drunk I forgot the f*&ng words, haha" or "this guy down here looks like he's having a good time...wait until I f*&k his girlfriend backstage").  He was just as much in the gutter as Sammy, if not moreso.  The difference to me is that Sammy was more "everyman"-ish about it.  Dave was more the preening rooster that thought it was all about him and his narcissism, whereas the Sammy vibe felt more to me like "hey, let's all just hang out and have a party together."  Or to put it anther way, the Dave performances feel more to me like they centered around Dave, with his attitude being that the crowd needed to put in the work to come and enjoy his art.  In contrast, the Sammy performances feel more like they centered around the collective of Sammy, the band, and the crowd, with Sammy and the band being the ones to put in the work to make sure the crowd were enjoying themselves.  You can like or prefer either approach.  But to me, the second is more relatable and enjoyable.

I'm not suggesting that "repeating it makes it stronger"; it's more that it's an intangible that's hard to put into words and so I'm trying to sharpen my pencil. 

Even with the more serious topics, there just seemed a more carnival type humor to the Roth years that was lost for me in the Hagar years.  I don't expect anyone to change their minds on what I wrote, but I had hoped that someone would be able to identify with it.

I don't really go to "narcissism" when talking about rock stars; they're all narcissists to begin with.  I think I want to stew on that point about putting in the work; I hadn't thought about it that way before.  I know for me, as a young kid who looked up to some of these stars there was something different about the Gene Simmons' and David Lee Roth's of the world that, later, when I got older, wasn't as... I don't know what the word is, "pure"?...in Sammy.  I love Sammy, I have every one of his solo albums after Red, and the Geffen records are SOLID.  I get the "everyman" part of things.  But there was a frat-boy-ishness to the Van Hagar that didn't connect as much.  I'm not intending this to be universal, it's just my take.

Offline bosk1

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I don't really go to "narcissism" when talking about rock stars; they're all narcissists to begin with.

Yes, that's very true.  I guess it's just a matter of degree, and there are definitely artists out there who step far enough over the line where it becomes unpalatable for me.  Sammy also displays a fair degree of narcissism.  It's just not to quite the level of quantity or quality of Dave's, at least in the way it strikes me personally.  But that said, let me also say as a sidenote that I am somewhat of a hypocrite in that department, as are you, and as are most if not all music fans.  We can't stand artist A because of his/her self-centered, narcissistic behavior, while we tolerate and minimize the same thing in artist B just because we like him/her or identify with his/her music more.  Guilty as charged.

EDIT:  Since you like to mention Simmons a lot, I'll add something about him to the discussion.  First off, I'm not a Kiss fan at all.  Never have been.  But that aside, I put Gene and Dave in a similar category in a lot of respects.  But here's the difference for me:  Gene is a pure businessman, and to an extent, his public persona is an act, and he is not shy about that at all.  Notwithstanding how long he has been a public figure, and that fact that he did a "reality show," I don't think anyone outside of Gene's close circle of family, friends, and bandmates really knows the real Gene vs. the character.  But he is self aware of two important things:  (1) Gene Simmons is a character, and he is playing a role whenever he is in the public eye; and (2) while he isn't shy about the fact that everything he does is to earn every last penny he can from the fans, he is fully aware that the fans are 100% his bread and butter, that he owes them everything when it comes to the life he has led, and he will give 100% to the fans because he is grateful.  I don't really get either of those from Dave, at least not to the same degree as Gene.  In that regard, whether or not I like Gene, I have a certain degree of respect for him that I don't have for Dave.
« Last Edit: April 08, 2022, 01:06:19 PM by bosk1 »
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