Author Topic: The "A View from the Top of the World tour is awesome!" thread (spoilers)  (Read 41645 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Architeuthis

  • Posts: 3785
  • Gender: Male

"

Rush did the same with backing vocals :biggrin:
Yes indeed. When they played "Earthshine" on the Vapor Trails and R30 tours.   Nobody ever complained about those backing tracks being present..
You can do a lot in a lifetime if you don't burn out too fast, you can make the most of the distance, first you need endurance first you've got to last....... NP

Offline crystalstars17

  • Posts: 720
  • Gender: Female
Well everything we've discussed here aside, and in acknowledgement of the title of this thread, this US leg of the AVFTTOTW tour is now over. It went by so fast!

What is heartbreaking is that it feels as if nothing has come out of it except negativity and negative press. It's very sad.

Alright, so my "feeling" type personality is showing here but my heart is just slightly heavy today. I do not participate there as it's generally toxic and this is a far better place, but I've read/lurked on Reddit, and the conversation there is heartbreaking! Over 130 posts about the "controversy" and maybe ten posts each in actual threads which positively discuss the music itself or the positive tour experiences of the fans. Our favorite band deserves better!

So at the end of this "awesome" tour that if we're completely honest with ourselves we have all greatly enjoyed, can we at least try to bring some positivity and praise for our boys.

I for one enjoyed this tour immensely. My one regret is not having gone to more shows. I loved the setlist. If I had a time machine today the first place I would go would be back to my eighth row center aisle seat in Wallingford. I would once again be awestruck by every moment of Jordan's playing, hearing my favorite new songs live, and finally hearing The Count of Tuscany live for the first time. I would relive how happy I was to hear James's voice sounding stronger and healthy, soaring notes connected to the breath without screaming or pushing, on every song.

After two full years of stress and uncertainties, seeing this show was like coming back to life.

What else would I say to them except THANK YOU.  :heart

Let's turn this thread around, shall we? In keeping with the title of this thread, what were your favorite highlights of this tour? Come on, I know we can do this!

Offline KevShmev

  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 42015
  • Gender: Male
People demanding an honest performance from James and then when he does and end up not hitting the notes, they start posting he is the weakest link in the band and make threads of who is the best replacement vocalist.

Who has done that here, specifically?


"

Rush did the same with backing vocals :biggrin:
Yes indeed. When they played "Earthshine" on the Vapor Trails and R30 tours.   Nobody ever complained about those backing tracks being present..

IIRC, the part in Earthshine where Geddy sang along with the backing track was in the layered wordless vocals before each chorus, and I recall from the Rio video that he is barely even singing along, so I don't think he was trying to give the impression that he was singing it live to fool anyone.  I think that was just a case of them using the backing track of a part that was impossible to do live, kind of like when the harmonies were triggered in the call and response choruses of songs like Dreamline and Show Don't Tell.  The "earthshine" line in the chorus was likely one he sang along with to a backing track as well since that is a harmony, while the rest of the chorus is just one Geddy (if my memory serves me right). 

Offline MinistroRaven

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 3865
  • Gender: Male
Well everything we've discussed here aside, and in acknowledgement of the title of this thread, this US leg of the AVFTTOTW tour is now over. It went by so fast!

What is heartbreaking is that it feels as if nothing has come out of it except negativity and negative press. It's very sad.

Alright, so my "feeling" type personality is showing here but my heart is just slightly heavy today. I do not participate there as it's generally toxic and this is a far better place, but I've read/lurked on Reddit, and the conversation there is heartbreaking! Over 130 posts about the "controversy" and maybe ten posts each in actual threads which positively discuss the music itself or the positive tour experiences of the fans. Our favorite band deserves better!

So at the end of this "awesome" tour that if we're completely honest with ourselves we have all greatly enjoyed, can we at least try to bring some positivity and praise for our boys.

I for one enjoyed this tour immensely. My one regret is not having gone to more shows. I loved the setlist. If I had a time machine today the first place I would go would be back to my eighth row center aisle seat in Wallingford. I would once again be awestruck by every moment of Jordan's playing, hearing my favorite new songs live, and finally hearing The Count of Tuscany live for the first time. I would relive how happy I was to hear James's voice sounding stronger and healthy, soaring notes connected to the breath without screaming or pushing, on every song.

After two full years of stress and uncertainties, seeing this show was like coming back to life.

What else would I say to them except THANK YOU.  :heart

Let's turn this thread around, shall we? In keeping with the title of this thread, what were your favorite highlights of this tour? Come on, I know we can do this!

With the use of technology I must say, LOL, I AM KIDDING!!!

I would have loved to see the band live, last time they toured Lima, Colombia or Venezuela was, yesterday 12 years ago exactly. And I remember the 3 times I saw the band I was living in a dream, watching them playing my favorite songs. Man, I also think they deserve better from us fans. Hopefully sometime soon they can come to this side of the woods for me to enjoy them one more time.

Offline TAC

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 75107
  • Gender: Male
  • Arthritic Metal Horns
Man, I also think they deserve better from us fans.

Wut??

I bought the album. All of the albums actually.
I bought the concert tickets. At least 20 shows.
I bought the concert t-shirt. At least 10 of them.
For almost 30 years, I have recommended Dream Theater to everyone I talk music with.

And I can't complain about something in their live show that I don't like?

Fuck that!
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline MinistroRaven

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 3865
  • Gender: Male
Man, I also think they deserve better from us fans.

Wut??

I bought the album. All of the albums actually.
I bought the concert tickets. At least 20 shows.
I bought the concert t-shirt. At least 10 of them.
For almost 30 years, I have recommended Dream Theater to everyone I talk music with.

And I can't complain about something in their live show that I don't like?

Fuck that!

Good for you!

I still think they deserve better, like or not.

Offline hefdaddy42

  • Et in Arcadia Ego
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 53478
  • Gender: Male
  • Postwhore Emeritus
Let's turn this thread around, shall we? In keeping with the title of this thread, what were your favorite highlights of this tour? Come on, I know we can do this!
Well, aside from the amazing musicianship (expected) and seeing a couple of songs I had not previously seen live (always a plus), at the Raleigh show there was a brief outbreak of goofiness between songs when JP threw a pick to JLB, who failed to catch it.  Then Mike told JP to throw one to HIM, but he also failed to catch it.  JP then threw a pick all the way across the stage to JR, who was the only band member to actually catch it, which brought applause from the crowd.  JM was, of course, off stage.

That, and the pre-show meetup, which was fantastic.
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Offline TAC

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 75107
  • Gender: Male
  • Arthritic Metal Horns
Man, I also think they deserve better from us fans.

Wut??

I bought the album. All of the albums actually.
I bought the concert tickets. At least 20 shows.
I bought the concert t-shirt. At least 10 of them.
For almost 30 years, I have recommended Dream Theater to everyone I talk music with.

And I can't complain about something in their live show that I don't like?

Fuck that!

Good for you!

I still think they deserve better, like or not.


How so? They put out product. I've consumed it and recommended it. What else do they deserve? What more can I do?
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline EPIC Outro

  • Posts: 419
My highlight of any DT tour is seeing a song played live that I have never seen before. So The Ministry of Lost Souls was my highlight of the evening.

I only knew a couple of their albums when I saw them live the first 2 or 3 times, a couple of decades ago. So there were some songs played then that I didn't know and couldn't appreciate at the time. Hopefully I will get another chance some day.

Offline WilliamMunny

  • Generation Mixtape
  • Posts: 1411
  • Gender: Male
A highlight for me was '6:00'

I love that they brought it back, and I really appreciate the way James tackled the melody, making it a song he could consistently deliver. Makes me feel like other Awake-era songs could be given a second life with a similar approach.

Otherwise, I'm just so grateful that these guys are all still alive and healthy—after the last couple of years, that's saying something!

Offline TAC

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 75107
  • Gender: Male
  • Arthritic Metal Horns
My highlight of any DT tour is seeing a song played live that I have never seen before. So The Ministry of Lost Souls was my highlight of the evening.

I was really happy to see it as well. I think the song is way underrated and live, it totally delivered.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Online Skeever

  • Posts: 2928
Man, I also think they deserve better from us fans.

Wut??

I bought the album. All of the albums actually.
I bought the concert tickets. At least 20 shows.
I bought the concert t-shirt. At least 10 of them.
For almost 30 years, I have recommended Dream Theater to everyone I talk music with.

And I can't complain about something in their live show that I don't like?

Fuck that!

Good for you!

I still think they deserve better, like or not.


How so? They put out product. I've consumed it and recommended it. What else do they deserve? What more can I do?
Well, I understand your point of view, but there is no use banging your head against the wall to try and make a band you've stopped liking (as much as you used to) change. Life's so short, there are so many other bands out there that go unnoticed. Why not refocus the DT complaining to something more productive, like supporting a new band you can 100% get behind?

Offline Madman Shepherd

  • Posts: 3739
Man, I also think they deserve better from us fans.

Wut??

I bought the album. All of the albums actually.
I bought the concert tickets. At least 20 shows.
I bought the concert t-shirt. At least 10 of them.
For almost 30 years, I have recommended Dream Theater to everyone I talk music with.

And I can't complain about something in their live show that I don't like?

Fuck that!

Whoa man. Language. James said the F word in concert a week ago and people got thrown into a tizzy.  ;D


Let's turn this thread around, shall we? In keeping with the title of this thread, what were your favorite highlights of this tour? Come on, I know we can do this!

First, I was surprised I could go. I was on the verge of giving away my ticket on this board but covid numbers had gone down just enough, and I finally found a kn95 mask that fit my big dumb head so I took a shot. My family needed to be extra cautious so I was psyched it worked out.

Other than that, here's the thing, the DT concert was more or less what I've seen in the previous dozen plus times I've seen them. Awesome show. Great presentation.

I wasn't in love with the setlist BUT I do love how bold it was. Kind of like when they toured in 2014 and played half of Awake, half of SFAM, and none from I&W. Kind of cool.

Aside from the new songs, which was the main reason I went, I loved Endless Sacrifice. Forgot how much I loved that song actually. Also the Ministry of Lost Souls which I was surprised to hear people singing along to. Really came across great in a live setting and that surprised me. I loved the transition from About to Crash. So basically I've praised most of the setlist even though I said I wasn't a fan. I guess what I'm trying to say is, I could have done without TCOT. Even that I sucked it up and made myself enjoy it. Great show!

Offline gzarruk

  • Posts: 5230
  • Gender: Male
I would have loved to see the band live, last time they toured Lima, Colombia or Venezuela was, yesterday 12 years ago exactly. And I remember the 3 times I saw the band I was living in a dream, watching them playing my favorite songs. Man, I also think they deserve better from us fans. Hopefully sometime soon they can come to this side of the woods for me to enjoy them one more time.

We han hope :metal
It sounds like, "ruk, ruk, ruk, ruk, ruk." Instead of the more pleasing kick drum sound of, "gzarruk, gzarruk, gzarruk, gzarruk."

Online Ben_Jamin

  • Posts: 15742
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm just a man, thrown into existence by the gods
Oh yeah....

JLB did not sing the ending woahs to The Count of Tuscany. But, he did point the mic out to the audience and sang the last  couple of woahs. I could hear the audience singing at parts of the set too. I know this one guy in front of me was singing away as well. JLB was happy with our woahs. Which I did not hear people sing much of at the Mesa show.

I am glad the people in Austin sang the Woahs because that end section is one of the best live ending moments.



I don't know how they can be so proud of winning with them odds. - Little Big Man
Follow my Spotify:BjamminD

Online Ben_Jamin

  • Posts: 15742
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm just a man, thrown into existence by the gods
Man, I also think they deserve better from us fans.

Wut??

I bought the album. All of the albums actually.
I bought the concert tickets. At least 20 shows.
I bought the concert t-shirt. At least 10 of them.
For almost 30 years, I have recommended Dream Theater to everyone I talk music with.

And I can't complain about something in their live show that I don't like?

Fuck that!

But are you grateful that the band has been around long enough to give you that entitlement to criticize them.

I myself am grateful I even get to travel to see a Dream Theater show. Most people are and most fans are having a blast at the shows. Most don't even care about the live aspect as they mainly care about getting to hear a certain song being played by the band. This was the show where they did play a lot of my favorites.



Also, when that part of BITS came up, JLB made sure to face the audience and had a serious look on his face while doing it.

Also, the mix again is very subtle with his lead vocals and backing vocal difference that it can be hard to pick up what he is singing in a recorded video. But when you're there at the venue, you can hear the difference of his live vocals.


I don't know how they can be so proud of winning with them odds. - Little Big Man
Follow my Spotify:BjamminD

Offline geeeemo

  • Posts: 1041
  • Gender: Female
I loved every aspect of this show. I saw it 3 times. My highlights were:

ES. Is that a kick butt song live or what?
Epics (or not quite epics). I love the epics. I don't listen to MOLS much, but live it was fab and the middle rocking part is just awesome.
TCOT.  It is a top 5 song. It is a great closer. The middle solo is beautiful and emotional. It is my son's #1 DT song, he didn't know they
          were going to play it, so to see his excitement was The top moment. Rhapsody in Blue. I didn't notice it in Oakland or Denver. Did it get put
          in later, or was I just not paying attention..Even by the 3rd show, The Count lost none of its shine.
The middle and jamming part after on A View.
Taking by best girlfriend to her 1st show and the preshow I hosted. With 20 people! (if you haven't been to one, they are really fun!)
...and even the FU. DT shows are pretty predictable and this was out of the norm and funny! I am glad I was there.

I cannot wait for the next show, whenever that is!

Signed, fangirl.

Offline TAC

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 75107
  • Gender: Male
  • Arthritic Metal Horns
Man, I also think they deserve better from us fans.

Wut??

I bought the album. All of the albums actually.
I bought the concert tickets. At least 20 shows.
I bought the concert t-shirt. At least 10 of them.
For almost 30 years, I have recommended Dream Theater to everyone I talk music with.

And I can't complain about something in their live show that I don't like?

Fuck that!

But are you grateful that the band has been around long enough to give you that entitlement to criticize them.


Of course I am. I love Dream Theater. They've been my favorite band for my adult life. Does that mean I can't complain about something? Just because you go to the same pizza joint for 30 years, is it not OK to point out that geez, this pizza a little too well done.

I'm not entitled to jack shit.

I just take issue with the word "deserve". They got me to buy their product. They "deserve" nothing more or nothing less.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline Stadler

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 43822
  • Gender: Male
  • Pointing out the "unfunny" since 2014!
Man, I also think they deserve better from us fans.

Wut??

I bought the album. All of the albums actually.
I bought the concert tickets. At least 20 shows.
I bought the concert t-shirt. At least 10 of them.
For almost 30 years, I have recommended Dream Theater to everyone I talk music with.

And I can't complain about something in their live show that I don't like?

Fuck that!

Good for you!

I still think they deserve better, like or not.


How so? They put out product. I've consumed it and recommended it. What else do they deserve? What more can I do?
Well, I understand your point of view, but there is no use banging your head against the wall to try and make a band you've stopped liking (as much as you used to) change. Life's so short, there are so many other bands out there that go unnoticed. Why not refocus the DT complaining to something more productive, like supporting a new band you can 100% get behind?

Some people aren't wired that way.  There's not ONE band I am 100% behind in that way.  Genesis, top five band; yet I dislike several aspects of their music/concert presentation.  But when I hear Cul-de-sac, or One For The Vine and get goose-bumps, it's all forgotten.  I love Kiss more than anyone here, but Shandi BLOWS.  Carnival of Souls is not an album I will likely ever listen to again.  Hooligan (won't go to school again) is an embarrassing song.  Okay, so?  There are many people here that think Kiss is a joke; here's the deal:  when I'm driving down the road listening to Flaming Youth at 11, I'm not thinking of those people not one little bit.  It doesn't impact my life even one iota.  We can all coexist. 

Why is there so much push back on comments that aren't 100% glowing?  It doesn't affect anyone here; it's not an indictment of what anyone else likes, it's an opinion. 

EDIT:  And I'm with TAC: what do any of us "deserve"?  "Deserve" is a made-up word to me.

Offline TAC

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 75107
  • Gender: Male
  • Arthritic Metal Horns
Oh, and another thing. Since MP left, DT and their product has been more "transactional" than ever. Gone are the little extras for the fans.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline TAC

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 75107
  • Gender: Male
  • Arthritic Metal Horns

How so? They put out product. I've consumed it and recommended it. What else do they deserve? What more can I do?
Well, I understand your point of view, but there is no use banging your head against the wall to try and make a band you've stopped liking (as much as you used to) change. Life's so short, there are so many other bands out there that go unnoticed. Why not refocus the DT complaining to something more productive, like supporting a new band you can 100% get behind?
I', not a negative person by nature. But it's a discussion point, and well, frankly a complaint. It's no big deal and won't stop me from loving Dream Theater.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Winger Theater Forums........or WTF.  ;D
TAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Offline Kram

  • Posts: 1244
Oh, and another thing. Since MP left, DT and their product has been more "transactional" than ever. Gone are the little extras for the fans.
That's for sure!  I love MM - and I think their recent output has been phenomenal for a band this late in their career.  So I'm not a bring back Portnoy guy in the least (I prefer MM stays in the band until they retire).  But all the little extra things that MP would do for us fans - to me that's what made Dream Theater special and helped to set them apart from other bands.  So MP deserves all that credit AFAIC. 

Offline Setlist Scotty

  • Posts: 4544
I thought the same thing about JP's vocals on When Day and Dream Reunite but at the time, I hadn't heard much of their live stuff and didn't realize how much backing vocals Portnoy did. Now I am wondering if that's mostly Portnoy we are hearing on The Ones Who Help To Set The Sun. Can anyone clarify?
Nope. It's JP:
https://youtu.be/j72Q0WiyoBc?t=298
 
 
Rush did the same with backing vocals :biggrin:
Yes indeed. When they played "Earthshine" on the Vapor Trails and R30 tours.   Nobody ever complained about those backing tracks being present..
IIRC, the part in Earthshine where Geddy sang along with the backing track was in the layered wordless vocals before each chorus, and I recall from the Rio video that he is barely even singing along, so I don't think he was trying to give the impression that he was singing it live to fool anyone.  I think that was just a case of them using the backing track of a part that was impossible to do live, kind of like when the harmonies were triggered in the call and response choruses of songs like Dreamline and Show Don't Tell.  The "earthshine" line in the chorus was likely one he sang along with to a backing track as well since that is a harmony, while the rest of the chorus is just one Geddy (if my memory serves me right).
Nevermind every thing they did was manually triggered - they weren't simply playing along to a recording. So while Geddy may not have been able to singing both vocal lines simultaneously, one of the guys would trigger that recorded vocal manually, and was thereby in a way still performing it.
As a basic rule, if you hate it, you must solely blame Portnoy. If it's good, then you must downplay MP's contribution to the band as not being important anyway, or claim he's just lying. It's the DTF way.

Online Ben_Jamin

  • Posts: 15742
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm just a man, thrown into existence by the gods
Man, I also think they deserve better from us fans.

Wut??

I bought the album. All of the albums actually.
I bought the concert tickets. At least 20 shows.
I bought the concert t-shirt. At least 10 of them.
For almost 30 years, I have recommended Dream Theater to everyone I talk music with.

And I can't complain about something in their live show that I don't like?

Fuck that!

Good for you!

I still think they deserve better, like or not.


How so? They put out product. I've consumed it and recommended it. What else do they deserve? What more can I do?
Well, I understand your point of view, but there is no use banging your head against the wall to try and make a band you've stopped liking (as much as you used to) change. Life's so short, there are so many other bands out there that go unnoticed. Why not refocus the DT complaining to something more productive, like supporting a new band you can 100% get behind?

Some people aren't wired that way.  There's not ONE band I am 100% behind in that way.  Genesis, top five band; yet I dislike several aspects of their music/concert presentation.  But when I hear Cul-de-sac, or One For The Vine and get goose-bumps, it's all forgotten.  I love Kiss more than anyone here, but Shandi BLOWS.  Carnival of Souls is not an album I will likely ever listen to again.  Hooligan (won't go to school again) is an embarrassing song.  Okay, so?  There are many people here that think Kiss is a joke; here's the deal:  when I'm driving down the road listening to Flaming Youth at 11, I'm not thinking of those people not one little bit.  It doesn't impact my life even one iota.  We can all coexist. 

Why is there so much push back on comments that aren't 100% glowing?  It doesn't affect anyone here; it's not an indictment of what anyone else likes, it's an opinion. 

EDIT:  And I'm with TAC: what do any of us "deserve"?  "Deserve" is a made-up word to me.

I agree with you and TAC about the word "deserve".

Man, I also think they deserve better from us fans.

Wut??

I bought the album. All of the albums actually.
I bought the concert tickets. At least 20 shows.
I bought the concert t-shirt. At least 10 of them.
For almost 30 years, I have recommended Dream Theater to everyone I talk music with.

And I can't complain about something in their live show that I don't like?

Fuck that!

But are you grateful that the band has been around long enough to give you that entitlement to criticize them.


Of course I am. I love Dream Theater. They've been my favorite band for my adult life. Does that mean I can't complain about something? Just because you go to the same pizza joint for 30 years, is it not OK to point out that geez, this pizza a little too well done.

I'm not entitled to jack shit.

I just take issue with the word "deserve". They got me to buy their product. They "deserve" nothing more or nothing less.

Oh...okay. That word is an issue because we fans don't deserve jack either.

There are situations where you won't truly understand unless your in those shoes or have a perspective of the experience. Being a singer in a consistently touring band is not an easy job. It's a lot of pressure and can be mentally exhausting when your voice performance is affected by many various factors. If people expect perfect vocals, why not utilize technology that makes that possible? If people expect a live performance to be 100% played by the musicians, don't expect an intricate show and for it to be flawless. No show is 100% flawless, it's why those shows are special and why Spinal Tap is the best movie made for musicians because it presents how everything can and will go wrong.

Example, something happened during the encore break in Austin and Maddie had to turn a piece of equipment by Jimmy T, to reset it and make sure it working.

But as was said. Jordan and the others are into that side of technology anf it's capabilities for musicians to utilize. It's like saying yard work should be 100% done by humans and not the machines called lawnmowers, Leafblowers. It just makes the job easier to perform.

I don't know how they can be so proud of winning with them odds. - Little Big Man
Follow my Spotify:BjamminD

Offline 425

  • Posts: 6910
  • Gender: Male

How so? They put out product. I've consumed it and recommended it. What else do they deserve? What more can I do?
Well, I understand your point of view, but there is no use banging your head against the wall to try and make a band you've stopped liking (as much as you used to) change. Life's so short, there are so many other bands out there that go unnoticed. Why not refocus the DT complaining to something more productive, like supporting a new band you can 100% get behind?
I', not a negative person by nature. But it's a discussion point, and well, frankly a complaint. It's no big deal and won't stop me from loving Dream Theater.

I also think it's worth bringing up because if fans never state their opinions on these issues, bands won't know what kind of response they're getting and what people prefer. Even though it sounds like DT is pretty much committed to their way of doing things, if they know that this is a concern some fans have, they can use that to think about how far they want to go with backing tracks. And people in other bands who are weighing these decisions can be informed by this feedback, too.

And I think it's perfectly possible to state your preference, your criticism, your complaint in a way that is respectful to the band and acknowledges the value you're gotten from their music—as TAC and many others in this thread have done.
And if spirit's a sign,
Then it's only a matter of time

Online hunnus2000

  • Posts: 2027
Well, I don't think that all backing vocals were triggered but I'm sure a good 80% were triggered by the band members. As an example, during the Counterparts tour Alex would sing the backing low octave parts during the chorus and one time he wasn't where he was supposed to be and you heard all Geddy. He made back to the mic and it made me wonder if his voice triggered the sound effect or that was the sound guy.

It could be that the backing vocals are programmed like JR programs his keyboard and that's why the need a click but I see no difference between DT and Rush as to their approach of how they present the backing vocals. I mean, doesn't Matti have the ability to punch a certain pedal if JP doesn't make it back in time?

Offline KevShmev

  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 42015
  • Gender: Male


Of course I am. I love Dream Theater. They've been my favorite band for my adult life. Does that mean I can't complain about something? Just because you go to the same pizza joint for 30 years, is it not OK to point out that geez, this pizza a little too well done.

I'm not entitled to jack shit.

I just take issue with the word "deserve". They got me to buy their product. They "deserve" nothing more or nothing less.

Agreed.  While we are fans, we are also customers, and I am not a fan of this idea that we should just shut up about any criticism and blindly support any and everything the band does. I don't do that with any band (even Rush).

Offline MoraWintersoul

  • Gloom Cookie
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 6773
  • Gender: Female
  • welcome to the wasteland
If people expect perfect vocals, why not utilize technology that makes that possible? If people expect a live performance to be 100% played by the musicians, don't expect an intricate show and for it to be flawless.
We don't and we don't, so that's a moot point.

I would say the band and James "deserve" not to be subject to pointless negativity in their own corners of the internet, but this is our corner. Sure, it's a bit unfortunate that the one thread where we're discussing the tour as a whole is titled "The View tour is awesome!" but that's just the thread name. DTF rules about discussing DT and its members respectfully exist to protect them and their sensibilities, but I can respect those rules and still type out "I wish they wouldn't rely on technology with the vocals to the point where metal press is discussing whether James is lip-syncing a section". I'm not sure what other more respectful route I can take in order not to create bad press for the guys other than discussing my opinions on a low traffic site with a few other people who have all bought tickets?

The questioning of other members about why they can't just leave the topic alone is a bit puzzling. We all know the guy who should lay off Dream Theater who hasn't heard one note by them in the past ten years who is still in every comment section talking about how much they sucked since [insert random time point]. None of us here are that guy.

Quote
Don't try to BS her about Kevin Moore facts, she will obscure quote you in the face.

type : mora : and delete the spaces for a surprise

Offline hefdaddy42

  • Et in Arcadia Ego
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 53478
  • Gender: Male
  • Postwhore Emeritus
None of us here are that guy.
We appreciate that.
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Offline Setlist Scotty

  • Posts: 4544
Well, I don't think that all backing vocals were triggered but I'm sure a good 80% were triggered by the band members. As an example, during the Counterparts tour Alex would sing the backing low octave parts during the chorus and one time he wasn't where he was supposed to be and you heard all Geddy. He made back to the mic and it made me wonder if his voice triggered the sound effect or that was the sound guy.

It could be that the backing vocals are programmed like JR programs his keyboard and that's why the need a click but I see no difference between DT and Rush as to their approach of how they present the backing vocals. I mean, doesn't Matti have the ability to punch a certain pedal if JP doesn't make it back in time?
The difference is that Rush never played to a click track aside from one track long ago, and during certain parts of the CA tour to help the string ensemble stay in sync with the band, but that was it. The guys even commented that they always triggered everything manually, which they prided themselves on doing, so that in essence they were still performing those parts.

Since DT plays to a click, all the extras can just be programmed to happen at specific spots - basically a digital version of playing to a tape. There might be a few things that JR might trigger on his own, but given the abundance of keyboard parts he has to worry about trying to replicate live on his own, I doubt he's triggering many other things, especially canned vocals.
As a basic rule, if you hate it, you must solely blame Portnoy. If it's good, then you must downplay MP's contribution to the band as not being important anyway, or claim he's just lying. It's the DTF way.

Offline pg1067

  • Posts: 12695
  • Gender: Male
Just for amusement and general mockery, the following is an actual post on the Dream Theater "sub" on Reddit yesterday:

"I went to see DT the other night and.....
I absolutely hated it, they only played new songs that no body knew too well. I would've loved it if they played classics but not even Pull Me Under was played, like c'mon. I get that they're trying to advertise their new ok album but just give the fans what they want..."

 :lol
"There's a bass solo in a song called Metropolis where I do a bass solo."  John Myung

Online Ben_Jamin

  • Posts: 15742
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm just a man, thrown into existence by the gods
Well, I don't think that all backing vocals were triggered but I'm sure a good 80% were triggered by the band members. As an example, during the Counterparts tour Alex would sing the backing low octave parts during the chorus and one time he wasn't where he was supposed to be and you heard all Geddy. He made back to the mic and it made me wonder if his voice triggered the sound effect or that was the sound guy.

It could be that the backing vocals are programmed like JR programs his keyboard and that's why the need a click but I see no difference between DT and Rush as to their approach of how they present the backing vocals. I mean, doesn't Matti have the ability to punch a certain pedal if JP doesn't make it back in time?

Apparently not, because JP forgot to change his patch both times I saw them on this tour.  :lol
I don't know how they can be so proud of winning with them odds. - Little Big Man
Follow my Spotify:BjamminD

Online hunnus2000

  • Posts: 2027
Well, I don't think that all backing vocals were triggered but I'm sure a good 80% were triggered by the band members. As an example, during the Counterparts tour Alex would sing the backing low octave parts during the chorus and one time he wasn't where he was supposed to be and you heard all Geddy. He made back to the mic and it made me wonder if his voice triggered the sound effect or that was the sound guy.

It could be that the backing vocals are programmed like JR programs his keyboard and that's why the need a click but I see no difference between DT and Rush as to their approach of how they present the backing vocals. I mean, doesn't Matti have the ability to punch a certain pedal if JP doesn't make it back in time?
The difference is that Rush never played to a click track aside from one track long ago, and during certain parts of the CA tour to help the string ensemble stay in sync with the band, but that was it. The guys even commented that they always triggered everything manually, which they prided themselves on doing, so that in essence they were still performing those parts.

Since DT plays to a click, all the extras can just be programmed to happen at specific spots - basically a digital version of playing to a tape. There might be a few things that JR might trigger on his own, but given the abundance of keyboard parts he has to worry about trying to replicate live on his own, I doubt he's triggering many other things, especially canned vocals.

The "click" songs you are referring to is The Weapon and Red Sector A and you could tell because Neil had headphones on. With the advent of in ear monitors, there is no telling what they are hearing but I would bet money that there was clickage happening. And isn't MM the only one that is getting the click in his monitors? Especially after the song begins because after all, the drummer is the timekeeper.

Online hunnus2000

  • Posts: 2027
Just for amusement and general mockery, the following is an actual post on the Dream Theater "sub" on Reddit yesterday:

"I went to see DT the other night and.....
I absolutely hated it, they only played new songs that no body knew too well. I would've loved it if they played classics but not even Pull Me Under was played, like c'mon. I get that they're trying to advertise their new ok album but just give the fans what they want..."

 :lol

Newbie......or troll -  :hat

Offline Setlist Scotty

  • Posts: 4544
The "click" songs you are referring to is The Weapon and Red Sector A and you could tell because Neil had headphones on. With the advent of in ear monitors, there is no telling what they are hearing but I would bet money that there was clickage happening.
I don't expect you to believe me, but here's what Neil himself said in a 2015 issue of DRUM! magazine:
Quote
Until the Clockwork Angels tour I had never used a click track live, except once years ago to stay in sync with a rear-screen film. For this tour it was helpful because we had eight string players in the Clockwork Angels String Ensemble, and they sometimes needed it when I wasn't playing. Even in certain passages when I was playing, it helped us all to stay together.

I was also required to stay in tempo with some long, legato sequences of keyboard or vocal effects, and the tambo-click helped with that, too. Even so, I am glad to say that the click appears in only a tiny percentage of the show, and only when absolutely necessary - or at least, "absolutely helpful."

On most songs, I prefer to hold it together myself, and let the band be a living, breathing organism that can push and pull naturally. These days many bands perform to a preprogrammed basic track, often a computerized software program. We always resisted that rigidity.

So if you want to accuse Neil of lying, be my guest, but that's one thing I don't imagine Neil would do when writing articles or doing interviews.
As a basic rule, if you hate it, you must solely blame Portnoy. If it's good, then you must downplay MP's contribution to the band as not being important anyway, or claim he's just lying. It's the DTF way.