*Official* A View from the Top of the World discussion thread

[The Letter M]

Finally got around to opening my deluxe box set. It's a beauty! I also pulled out my other deluxe sets for a collection shot.



I really like that these sets have improved with each album and the new one is probably the best one yet!

-Marc.

Is the top-left one BC&SL? I didn't realise that that & ADTOE had different covers for their boxsets.

Yep, the top left if BC&SL, which has a very felt/fuzzy outer box in black, but then lined with silver on the inside. I like the simplicity of the ADTOE boxset cover. Each boxset so far has had a bit of a different feel to them, tactile-y speaking. The new one has a kind of smooth but not glossy feel to it, and DOT has a lenticular cover where the image changes depending on the angle you view it. ADTOE and DT12 are kind of similar, but the former is a bit more glossy while the latter is a bit more matte and flat. And the TA boxes are just different altogether, with the NOMAC boxset being a different shape and the LP box being a rigid slipcover for the vinyl gatefolds.

-Marc.

[DeanTheater]

This is my first post in a few years.  I have listened to it a few times but in a disjointed way that comes with having 4 children.  I am not sure how to feel about it yet.  I did get goosies on some parts of ATM and TT.  Still working it it .  will get back with a review when I can sip some Rye and listen straight through.

[KevShmev]

Other than MM, JLB is the real MVP of this record.  One if his best performances of his career IMO.  Everybody is excellent on this album, but JLB and MM really stand out.

Agreed, JLB sounds amazing on this record!

To expand a bit on my JLB opinion I gave last night, while I still say his prime was decades ago, he still sounds very good in the studio, AND my feeling is that he doesn't necessarily have to belt it out to sound really good.  I am noticing some nice moments on this record where he sings in a very manageable tone and sounds good.  I think he has a naturally great sounding voice, so he can still bring it, just in different ways.  I think he takes so much criticism now because it often feels like he tries to do too much live, instead of recognizing that can't quite do the vocal gymnastics like he used to and adjusting accordingly, but that is a different topic. 

Back to the album, it is growing on me more and more.  Awaken the Master is one that really grabbed me today on my drive at lunch.  I could see that one ending up as my favorite here.

[The Letter M]

Shameless plug - now that the new album is out, I've brought back the Dream Theater Survivor (link in my signature below). The first rounds will go up tomorrow morning for WDADU and IAW. It's been over 4 years since I did it last, and since then we've gotten DOT and now AVFTTOTW, so I figured it was time to bring it back! Would love to see as many DT fans as possible voting out their least favorites from each album one-by-one to determine the consensus best songs. Then the best songs from each album will contend in the Finals (featuring 40 songs across the DT Discography).

According to my rough calculations, if there aren't any tie-breaker rounds holding things up, this survivor will take about 224 days, or around 7.5 months, so it will carry well into next year, but I would love to see a lot of active participation and discussion as we get through each album! Hope to see you all there!

-Marc.

[Peter Mc]

Interesting streaming figures from Spotify as of today.

The Alien - 1,145,243
Answering The Call - 140,825
Invisible Monster - 634,413
Sleeping Giant - 118,051
Transcending Time - 104,161
Awaken The Master - 143,440
A View From The Top Of The World - 106,009

The casual DT listener is really more into the metal, riff-driven songs.

Taking out the two singles which obviously have an advantage, the rest are all fairly even with ATC and ATM ahead of the rest.  ATC is not what I’d class as one of their most metal, riff driven songs.

I was going to say the same thing. Current sample size renders it virtually impossible to draw any type of conclusion based on those figures when the early releases of The Alien and Invisible Monster are taken into account. Could look at other albums in that way, though. I haven't checked but I'd imagine Erwin's statement would generally hold true.

When I made my comment, I did not take The Alien and Invisible Monster into consideration. I was instead looking at Awaken The Master and Answering The Call which are metal tunes compared to the proggy AOR Transcending Time which has the lowest number of streams. I was actually surprised that the epic has more streams than Transcending Time.

Ah, ok, we differ a little on Answer The Call which I consider quite a melodic, commercial, almost poppy tune in parts.  I suppose it does have a fair amount of metal riffing but I wouldn’t consider it to be one of the more metal songs on the album.

[erwinrafael]

ATC is metal along the vein of Fates Warning.

[JPX]

A Dramatic Turn of Events
Dream Theater
The Astonishing
Distance Over Time
A View From The Top Of The World

VS

Six Degrees
Train Of Thought
Octavarium
Systematic Chaos
Black Clouds & Silver Linings

That's not even fucking close. SDoiT alone is better than all those other albums combined.

[dream416]

Finally got around to opening my deluxe box set. It's a beauty! I also pulled out my other deluxe sets for a collection shot.



I really like that these sets have improved with each album and the new one is probably the best one yet!

-Marc.

Is the top-left one BC&SL? I didn't realise that that & ADTOE had different covers for their boxsets.

Yep, the top left if BC&SL, which has a very felt/fuzzy outer box in black, but then lined with silver on the inside. I like the simplicity of the ADTOE boxset cover. Each boxset so far has had a bit of a different feel to them, tactile-y speaking. The new one has a kind of smooth but not glossy feel to it, and DOT has a lenticular cover where the image changes depending on the angle you view it. ADTOE and DT12 are kind of similar, but the former is a bit more glossy while the latter is a bit more matte and flat. And the TA boxes are just different altogether, with the NOMAC boxset being a different shape and the LP box being a rigid slipcover for the vinyl gatefolds.

-Marc.

Happy that you have the new boxset. Inside 0ut just sent me an email that I may not get it until Nov.12th!!!!!

[Madman Shepherd]

Finally got around to opening my deluxe box set. It's a beauty! I also pulled out my other deluxe sets for a collection shot.



I really like that these sets have improved with each album and the new one is probably the best one yet!

-Marc.

Is the top-left one BC&SL? I didn't realise that that & ADTOE had different covers for their boxsets.

Yep, the top left if BC&SL, which has a very felt/fuzzy outer box in black, but then lined with silver on the inside. I like the simplicity of the ADTOE boxset cover. Each boxset so far has had a bit of a different feel to them, tactile-y speaking. The new one has a kind of smooth but not glossy feel to it, and DOT has a lenticular cover where the image changes depending on the angle you view it. ADTOE and DT12 are kind of similar, but the former is a bit more glossy while the latter is a bit more matte and flat. And the TA boxes are just different altogether, with the NOMAC boxset being a different shape and the LP box being a rigid slipcover for the vinyl gatefolds.

-Marc.

Happy that you have the new boxset. Inside 0ut just sent me an email that I may not get it until Nov.12th!!!!!

You should try posting "FU Century Media!!" a few times on this board like I did. I just got an email that mine shipped.

[estvel1]

My favorite track is Trascending Time, hands down. One of the most uplifting stuff they've made. I've seen a lot of comments saying that it's a Rush-inspired song, but my first thought after 10 seconds in the song was actually Fates Warning. Actually I noticed that the main riff of the song is very reminiscent of Fates Warning's "Eye to Eye" from Parallels album. Anyone catching that one out?

[jayvee3]

A Dramatic Turn of Events
Dream Theater
The Astonishing
Distance Over Time
A View From The Top Of The World

VS

Six Degrees
Train Of Thought
Octavarium
Systematic Chaos
Black Clouds & Silver Linings

The first group (MM) albums. Easily. Not even close for me.

[soupytwist]

While I appreciated the craft 'The Astonishing' wasn't my jam and Distance/Time fell out of rotation quicker than any other DT album (not called The Astonishing) for me, with probably less than 10 complete plays.  This new one however is right in my ballpark, personally this has connected me back with DT - a really good listen.

[Bertielee]

Ok, three listens in and I could totally do without Awaken the Master. Everything else I like. Favorite, title track for me. It's incredible. MM is obviously the MVP of the album, but JLB is a close second. To the people saying the album is not melodic or not prog, sorry guys, but buy yourself a pair of ears, because there's plenty of melody and prog. Granted, this may not be to your liking, but that's another story. All in all, a good album. Only criticism for me : it's the first time I've considerd JP solos not to be catchy and to be just there.

B.Lee

[Kotowboy]

What if Mike Portnoy played on the new album ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Av6tcJxx0kg

[Max Kuehnau]

What if Mike Portnoy played on the new album ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Av6tcJxx0kg

Please. No.

[Kotowboy]

Exactly ! 

ironically before the split - MP was my fave member of the band. Now I never want him back in the band.

[Art]

A Dramatic Turn of Events
Dream Theater
The Astonishing
Distance Over Time
A View From The Top Of The World

VS

Six Degrees
Train Of Thought
Octavarium
Systematic Chaos
Black Clouds & Silver Linings

MP era wins easily just with 6DOIT (and ToT). I only dislike SC from this MP selection. From the MM selection, I only dislike TA, but it's by far their worst record ever IMHO.

[darkshade]

What if Mike Portnoy played on the new album ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Av6tcJxx0kg

Please. No.

Interestingly, that guy plays like it's peak MP from 2002 or 2003 or something. Not sure MP himself would play like this today.
Get THAT guy in the DT drummer seat. He puts the groove back into DT's music. Way more interesting that what Mangini laid down. Drums make or break rock related music.

[erwinrafael]

Way interesting than what Mangini laid down? Has he ever composed a drum part?

[jayvee3]

What if Mike Portnoy played on the new album ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Av6tcJxx0kg

Please. No.

Interestingly, that guy plays like it's peak MP from 2002 or 2003 or something. Not sure MP himself would play like this today.
Get THAT guy in the DT drummer seat. He puts the groove back into DT's music. Way more interesting that what Mangini laid down. Drums make or break rock related music.

Bullshit.

[darkshade]

Way interesting than what Mangini laid down? Has he ever composed a drum part?

I've composed drum parts.

[darkshade]

What if Mike Portnoy played on the new album ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Av6tcJxx0kg

Please. No.

Interestingly, that guy plays like it's peak MP from 2002 or 2003 or something. Not sure MP himself would play like this today.
Get THAT guy in the DT drummer seat. He puts the groove back into DT's music. Way more interesting that what Mangini laid down. Drums make or break rock related music.

Bullshit.

For a World Class Drummer, Mangini is way low on my list of drummers I enjoy listening to.
Speed and technicality alone is not impressive to me beyond getting into the record books.

[Peter Mc]

What if Mike Portnoy played on the new album ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Av6tcJxx0kg

Please. No.

Interestingly, that guy plays like it's peak MP from 2002 or 2003 or something. Not sure MP himself would play like this today.
Get THAT guy in the DT drummer seat. He puts the groove back into DT's music. Way more interesting that what Mangini laid down. Drums make or break rock related music.

Dude, it’s been 10 years or more since he quit and the band are clearly happier and more settled than ever.  How long will it be before you move on and accept the band as they are instead of constantly bringing Mike Portnoy into every conversation.  There’s zero indication that he’s coming back or that anyone wants him to.  The stuff he’s released since leaving (which doesn’t involve Neal Morse) ranges from exceedingly average to downright awful.  He’s not going to save Dream Theater, just as he hasn’t been able to do anything to save all the other unsuccessful bands he’s in, he’s just a drummer.  A very good drummer but a drummer all the same and the drums don’t make or break a song (provided they are at least competent obviously). 

He came back for LTE3, a hugely anticipated return including from my own perspective, and the world shrugged their shoulders as it turned out to be such a non-event.  That album did nothing to make me want him back, it was just LTE by numbers and made most people realise that his return to DT would not galvanise the band in any way, they would go backwards.  At least Mangini is constantly inventive and interesting in what he does, whether or not people like it, Portnoy sounded tired and stale by comparison.

I loved Portnoy when he was in the band but they have moved on, maybe it’s time we all did too.

[darkshade]

Keep in mind I thought MM's playing on the new album was superior to any previous DT album he's been on, and the youtube guy overplayed like hell.

From a writing standpoint, DT fell into an 'industry standard' sound since MM joined the band, so I don't think any one drummer could have saved DT.
MP may have been right about needing a break, even if he possibly had ulterior motives at the time. It took the band 5 attempts to give us an album like AV and even then I only rank it high in the lower tier of DT albums.

[TheBarstoolWarrior]

What if Mike Portnoy played on the new album ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Av6tcJxx0kg

Please. No.

Interestingly, that guy plays like it's peak MP from 2002 or 2003 or something. Not sure MP himself would play like this today.
Get THAT guy in the DT drummer seat. He puts the groove back into DT's music. Way more interesting that what Mangini laid down. Drums make or break rock related music.

Dude, it’s been 10 years or more since he quit and the band are clearly happier and more settled than ever.  How long will it be before you move on and accept the band as they are instead of constantly bringing Mike Portnoy into every conversation.  There’s zero indication that he’s coming back or that anyone wants him to.  The stuff he’s released since leaving (which doesn’t involve Neal Morse) ranges from exceedingly average to downright awful.  He’s not going to save Dream Theater, just as he hasn’t been able to do anything to save all the other unsuccessful bands he’s in, he’s just a drummer.  A very good drummer but a drummer all the same and the drums don’t make or break a song (provided they are at least competent obviously). 

He came back for LTE3, a hugely anticipated return including from my own perspective, and the world shrugged their shoulders as it turned out to be such a non-event.  That album did nothing to make me want him back, it was just LTE by numbers and made most people realise that his return to DT would not galvanise the band in any way, they would go backwards.  At least Mangini is constantly inventive and interesting in what he does, whether or not people like it, Portnoy sounded tired and stale by comparison.

I loved Portnoy when he was in the band but they have moved on, maybe it’s time we all did too.

I agree with almost every word of this. Only qualm is that I thought some of his non-DT releases were great. But yeah your point is spot on. He is gone from DT. The band has moved on. There’s no reason to believe he’d save DT (as though they need saving or a shot in the arm) from their alleged mundanity. We should all move on too. 

[Lonk]

I loved Portnoy when he was in the band but they have moved on, maybe it’s time we all did too.

Yeah, I've seen that guy and while he is a very good drummer and imitates MP style really well, his DT covers just make me realize how much I don't want MP back in the band.

[darkshade]

How come no one makes a video called "[post-Awake DT song] if Kevin Moore was playing" ?

[erwinrafael]

Way interesting than what Mangini laid down? Has he ever composed a drum part?

I've composed drum parts.

Let's hear it.

[TheBarstoolWarrior]

Keep in mind I thought MM's playing on the new album was superior to any previous DT album he's been on, and the youtube guy overplayed like hell.

From a writing standpoint, DT fell into an 'industry standard' sound since MM joined the band, so I don't think any one drummer could have saved DT.
MP may have been right about needing a break, even if he possibly had ulterior motives at the time. It took the band 5 attempts to give us an album like AV and even then I only rank it high in the lower tier of DT albums.

How is MM’s drumming any different in DT15 vs DoT or even DT12?

I am not a drummer but sounds like he’s the same guy doing the same stuff (which I personally find to be fantastic)

[darkshade]

Way interesting than what Mangini laid down? Has he ever composed a drum part?

I've composed drum parts.

Let's hear it.

What does it matter what it sounds like? I composed drum parts, so by your logic, my opinion is more important than someone who hasn't.

[darkshade]

Keep in mind I thought MM's playing on the new album was superior to any previous DT album he's been on, and the youtube guy overplayed like hell.

From a writing standpoint, DT fell into an 'industry standard' sound since MM joined the band, so I don't think any one drummer could have saved DT.
MP may have been right about needing a break, even if he possibly had ulterior motives at the time. It took the band 5 attempts to give us an album like AV and even then I only rank it high in the lower tier of DT albums.

How is MM’s drumming any different in DT15 vs DoT or even DT12?

I am not a drummer but sounds like he’s the same guy doing the same stuff (which I personally find to be fantastic)

Well, for one, he sounds better on AV, that helps a lot. The production on AV is the best since the 2000s. It's his style heard on all 5 DT albums he's on, but kicked up a notch, he plays a little bit looser like on ADTOE, while still being technical, (I feel his overall style is very stiff and clinical) and the songs themselves also help. The music is more energetic than the last few albums, so naturally the drums will carry the music more as well.

[Pettor]

What if Mike Portnoy played on the new album ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Av6tcJxx0kg

Wow. I am not a drummer and can only say when I like something vs not and this is definitely a NOT. He seems very talented etc. but damn do I appreciate Mangini more after this 😁 There's no finess or beauty in that playing just bashing furiously on all drums at all time to my ears haha. I do love Portnoy but didn't see the connection here more than this being a bit more melodic or whatever you call it. At the same time I don't want to call it melodic because it would be sounding like a positive thing.

[darkshade]

What if Mike Portnoy played on the new album ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Av6tcJxx0kg

Wow. I am not a drummer and can only say when I like something vs not and this is definitely a NOT. He seems very talented etc. but damn do I appreciate Mangini more after this 😁 There's no finess or beauty in that playing just bashing furiously on all drums at all time to my ears haha. I do love Portnoy but didn't see the connection here more than this being a bit more melodic or whatever you call it. At the same time I don't want to call it melodic because it would be sounding like a positive thing.

The dude definitely overplayed. MP and MM both know how to play for the music. But this guy could have overplayed to push the point of what would Alien sound like with MP.

[darkshade]

I loved Portnoy when he was in the band but they have moved on, maybe it’s time we all did too.

Many people can't get over the fact that Kevin Moore left, either.

[Peter Mc]

Yes but they are not spamming threads constantly about it, they eventually accepted it and moved on.